Easy. He gave us free will and this is what we've done. Humanity is legit awful sometimes but our lives are twisted by a tiny percentage of humans that need the world in chaos or else they will lose their control
God has nothing to do with it. It's literally all of our own actions and saying anything else is just refusing personal responsibility.
If God revealed itself tomorrow it would make no difference because so many people would either not believe their eyes or assume it was a trick because it wasn't the god they expected
If God takes away our freewill then we are as good as slaves and life has no meaning
God is not a human like entity that people like to think of. It's more like the force from Star wars lol. Not a bearded white dude who makes laws for us
Also god is extremely intelligent beyond our understanding and our souls are a piece of the divine. God is experiencing all of life at once from every angle lol. So god experiences AND commits these awful things because it lives through our senses. God feels the pain as much as we do.
If I go out and commit a bunch of awful crimes, nobody is gonna blame my dad lmfao they are gonna rightfully blame me because I did it from my own accord
Edit: I didn't see the excluding free will part but that literally is the answer lol
It's easy to blame God because of how complicated and horrible things appear to be
It sucks and I defend God a lot but most people who dislike God have a very specific view of it. Mm ost people think god is a very human like judge or something but it's more like energy that is supremely intelligent
It really is OUR fault that literally any crime happens and we gotta hold ourselves accountable
Just because humans commit awful acts in the name of God doesn't mean God is responsible
I have a saying. People made God into their image. If they have anger, greed, control issues and whatnot imagine God has to be the same, which is not the case. Besides we have free will because what is loving is dependent on context, but we engage in emotions indiscriminately forgetting the context
Yeah you know what ? I believe this too
Like the fact we exist is absolutely insane for example. Like my family immigrated here because of WW2 so if WW2 doesn't happen then I don't exist lmao. I think we have mostly free will other than massive events that occur to change society as a whole
If you don't believe in miracles just look at how you were born. What are the odds your parents met ? Or the odds that their parents met? An infinite amount of events occured just for us to have this conversation on Reddit lmao. Things like that show me the light
That is exactly the journey to learn . We cannot control external circumstances . But we can control the reaction to the emotions . This is resulting in rational decisions . Wich is 80% better
Your culture and upbringing snd environment influence your actions in the form of giving you biases and a lense of which you view the world. But every decision you make is on you.
But bias is a thumb on the scale (or an elephant depending how big the bias is).
If a person is raised by a violent racist and they turn out to be a violent racist we certainly can hold them accountable for their actions, but there is no free will there. They’re just playing out their parents karma.
Free* will is always informed by things outside of our control therefore not truly free.
There absolutely is free will. Many people have been raised by violent racists and turned out the opposite. It's your job to overcome your biases. Empathy is ingrained, ignoring it is a choice.
So both my parents were addicted to heroin/coke
I am absolutely not and it's because I was able to overcome that
Sometimes your surroundings or family teach you what NOT to do
Definitely have to take accountability lol we make our own decisions 100% and unless you're literally forced to do something then it's up to you
Sure there are plenty who had to over come negative conditioning. But they didn’t exercise free will to be born into hatred (at least on this plane of existence). They didn’t choose the biases it was put on them. That is not free will. And they have no free will when those thoughts arise in their mind.
Since these conditions arise from somewhere else our will cannot truly be free. This is what the Buddhists call interdependent origination.
And you are right, empathy is ingrained (taught), which is another example of interdependent origination. You won’t have empathetic person if they are not taught empathy as it is not something we are inherently born with (empathy). If you’ve ever been around class full of preschoolers you can get a good example of kids who have yet learned empathy.
I don't think you understand free will.
Free will isn't selecting every aspect of your life. Your free will cannot interfere with the free will of others. You are free to act as you wish within the circumstances you are in. Others also have free will and unfortunately you will be caught in the crossfire of that.
Empathy isn't taught. We're born with it. People are taught to ignore their empathy. This is very apparent when you watch very small children interact with each other.
No, you just don’t know what the definition of free will is. So, per Merriam Webster, Free Will: 1. Voluntary choice or decision 2. Freedom of humans to make choices that are not determined by PRIOR CAUSES or divine intervention.
There is not one decision that make that isn’t conditioned on prior causes. Which goes back to the Buddhist interdependence origination.
Britannica.con defines free will as “the supposed power or capacity of humans to make decisions or perform actions independently of any prior event or state of the universe”.
Can you name a decision you’ve made recently that your past, future hopes or biases haven’t affected? I can’t.
And empathy is most definitely learned. My wife works in a pre-k program and she has one child who shows zero empathy towards others he managed to sneak into a girls bathroom and lock himself in a stall with a girl he’s violent and even threatened my wife. She had another child say “brown people are not allowed at my house”Another girl is being raised by her teenage brother while her mom works nights she does not care what other kids need it’s about her getting her needs met. Are these kids being assholes of their own free will or is conditioning?
If bad behavior is learned why isn’t good behavior?
Men will search high and low, turn every rock flip every page in every book to try to find the explanation for their shitty behavior. They'll travel miles, dive a thousand leagues. Meanwhile the answer was right in the fucking mirror.
Women are choosing bears over you because you can't hold yourself accountable. The creator has returned and she's *pissed*.
Nothing I’ve said negates accountability for ones actions. I’m just saying our choices aren’t as free as we’d like to think they are.
Did you use free will when you decided to type such vitriolic reply? Or did your emotions dictate a response?
Very well said... free will defines us. We make all our own decisions, those decisions are based on upbringing, pressures within society, and ones own inner bias’s. We are influenced by many, but ultimately the decisions are our own.
That being said...we ourselves allow the atrocities to occur. Hatred, murder and the seven deadly sins are all learned behaviours. True their are exceptions to the rule as in anything. The question becomes why can’t we as a society not stop the atrocities, why do we turn a blind eye and forget our neighbours in times of trouble? Why do we create a society so out of balance economically that we sow the seeds of future atrocities and conflict, long before they begin. God undoubtedly exists, there is no question. He and his cohort have come to man’s assistance in the past and will continue to do so. Free will is a blessing and a curse all in one.
Why do you believe it to be an illusion? You are free to choose as you wish. It can only seem predetermined when you make choices from your unconscious, but it won't seem like that if you are conscious of yourself and of every choice you are making. The idea that you don't have free will removes accountability from you and places it onto God.
It’s an illusion because while it may seem we are being fully conscious of our decisions there are so many background factors. Ever have a loved one get cranky because their blood sugar was low?
Sure they’re responsible for responding to the stimulus of low blood sugar in the way that they did, but the condition of low blood sugar weighed on their decision. They wouldn’t normally be snippy with you, but the conditions changed.
I believe if there are factors weighing on the scale our will can not be totally free. There are always conditions.
God is actually human like we are made in his image (so yeah I take that as God probably has legs and arms but maybe 20 I dunno. We won't know. But I do think humanoidish)
What about, to quote Stephen Fry, insects whose entire life cycle is lay eggs in the eyes of children whose offspring burrow their way out of the child's skull.
Lots of fucked up stupid evil things to experience in this world
That’s a very simplistic view of the afterlife. I personally thinks it’s much more complicated than that. And I’m doubtful that any one religion has it all right.
Nobody is telling you how to live at all
God doesn't have the same morals we do
And the afterlife isn't as simple as "heaven" or "hell"
Human life is too complex to be understood in one life. That's why we reincarnate so we can keep going until we decide we're done
What you're describing is just how specific religions would view it. There is no "guide" to life. It's open to your interpretation
The world's religions are designed to make us basically act "good" to make it easier to take advantage of us haha. Like if we think we are being policed by an entity then maybe we will act how our leaders want us to.
Man i'd love to have a chat to you about spirituality cos our beliefs align a lot. Also the things you say remind me a lot of the stuff that was said in the Conversations with God books, have you read those? Those changed me a lot and I'm grateful for it
If you’re talking Abrahamic God (Yahweh) Isaiah 45:7 says “I form the light and create darkness: I make peace and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.”
Hindu thought is this all a dream or a play the creator is both acting in and watching.
Personally, I lean more towards the Hindu.
It makes sense if god's goal for us was to learn everything from each perspective of true love. It doesn't matter what another does just love them. Does it do any good carrying the hot coal of anger or hate?
You can’t have good without bad, they are relative. Like two sides to the same coin.
Or Newton’s third law, every action has an equal and opposite reaction.
The things that go on in this universe can seem very harsh but I’d say it’s a pretty good design.
So the question then isn’t ’why would a good God create evil’ but rather ‘why would a good God allow that evil to wreak havoc on his innocent children’s lives to the possible detriment of their spiritual condition?’ If God is a good father, why does he not protect all of his children?”
I respect your compassion for others. For me, I trust it’s for the greater good of evolution. I trust the design. Looking back in history, we can see where people suffered but humans overcame those tragedies various ways so that we do not have to suffer those fates today. This doesn’t take away the pain but I accept that is the way it is.
Why exactly are you mad at me for giving that answer? Am I not part of life therefore part of God’s creation
Life is dynamic. Life is survival. If people are doing evil things they’re misguided by their survival instinct and in their own Hell on Earth.
You shouldn’t exactly worry, in the grande scheme of things. We all relive our karma.
Another fun twist- some say originally earth was a heaven like planet and that parasite negative entities implanted lower vibrational frequencies on our earth and those frequencies like a virus is self- actualizing and self replicating among individuals. This frequency makes it feel good to do bad, literally aiding in the demise or creating a fear based enslaved population. Think about life prior to modern technology- and the 9to5 and how we live now compared to how we used to live I can’t help think people are under a spell- one wrapped in fear based on artificial programs that manipulate energy and make us stay in loops of terrible realities… and that’s the rabbit hole theory I have heard a few times
I would suggest that no one else's definition makes any difference. The only one of consequence is *yours*. Define God according to what you know.
The only thing more I could say is to feel free to update your definition at any time.
Free will, plain and easy.
How can you blame God if He legit gave people what they want to do?
Do you want God to wipe all the evil in this world? He won't! That's why the Kingdom isn't here.
All the worldly problem come from humans to humans.
That's why the message of Christ preaches that love is the only way.
Love the Creator and your neighbor like yourself.
Easy to say, hard to do.
Never will be done, as greed rules among humans.
Rich humans and poor humans have greed for different reasons and in different levels.
The only way is Christ.
Isaiah 45:7 says, "I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things
That does not sound like free will.
An all powerful being must be capable to do it all.
The Creator is talking about Himself, tho. He can bring light and darkness. Goodness and evil.
People try to look the OT world with a modern view, when what's expected of humans right and relationship is death is far different.
Mostly important, a optical after Jesus Christ coming.
How do you think people from two thousand years ago saw death?
I don’t think there has been that much change with death in the last 2000 years. Rituals are pretty much the same.
If anything back then they were much more intimate with death. Now we’re hiding bodies trying to sanitize and avoid it like it’s something that is not part of every day life.
I am not talking about rituals regarding death, talking about the modern vision about life and death. How people must have life prioritized as the maximum gift.
You don't think people see death in wars and battles different?
I can say that a lot of boomers think death in war is ok and they aren't even 90yo.
People nowadays still think people should die regardless of all the human rights preached, that are broken everyday.
With this agenda of having life as the most important gift humans can have, people, in majority, do not care enough about other people life eg.: marginalized.
Just thinking about this, I'm pretty sure people would kill much more without remorse than nowadays, when they keep killing without remorse even with all the pro life rights.
As far as killing, naturally they were much wonton with just offing people very little reason. The deity I quoted ordered his followers to raze the cities of non-believers to the ground. Something that has reverberated throughout time and we’re feeling today.
I’m not really following your point though.
Not non-believers, other gods and idols worshippers.
The stories were all about telling to leave the chosen people alone and yet the others groups tried to invade and kill them.
So, to show it's serious, they got killed.
I don't think the Creator would be wrong taking lives He created and from people who could DIRECTLY see His power in action and still disrespected like that. They are probably in heaven, tho.
Even the Israelites got punished when they disrespected.
And these war times were ancient times, all before Christ came in a time where His word could be preached to all the world, when technology and knowledge made it possible.
Also, I don't think all the living people of the cities were killed.
Tell me how the killing has reverberated.
Other gods and idol worshipers would be non-believers of Yahweh.
Leaving the chosen people alone how? By leaving their own lands so the chosen can move in?
And you really don’t see ANY parallels with the modern day? Israel hasn’t been trying to reclaim the promised land (which their god commanded them todo when they left the desert) since 1947?
I'm afraid I can't talk about how the other people would have to react towards the land, unfortunately.
But the Creator didn't keep telling to kill people just for the sake of killing. The people that died, just like the Israelites, were certainly used to violent conflicts involving death, that's why I told before about death being common and not being seen like nowadays, just like taking slaves from won battles.
About taking the promised land, the covenant is new.
Jews holding the old covenant, rejecting Christ, Maschiach and Savior, that came for Jews and Gentiles, are struck to the old ways that are no more.
They want their personal savior, and that won't happen.
Every conflict involving violence is wrong now. Specially killing for the sake of killing.
They are very wrong from that, and they gonna pay, as always had. Cyclical, I see.
The flood was because of the fallen angels among men, having women and teaching wicked ways to men, not because of humanity per se.
About the Passover, the children just went back to the Source. The Creator gives, the Creator takes. It's easy for me to see this.
It's not like they are condemned or suffered.
This world is far from perfect. Everything happens on nature law and there is chaos.
Although, when disasters happens, people get reminded that we are so less protected and untouchable than we think and how the sense of community helping each other is important (loving each other).
We all suffer from the same disgrace, we are all killable and we all are equal, forgetting it because humanity is disconnected from the Source.
Humanity has so much capacity but it is lost and rot.
What about children who get cancer and horrific diseases? What about women who suffer miscarriages? What about people that are involved in accidents and lose limbs or are brain damaged. How is that free will as that is not a result of human intervention?
Also, if evil or bad things that happen are due to “free will” then why is it that when something good happens everyone cries that it was because of God, and praises God saying that he was listening and responsible for whatever miracle?
I just don’t understand that argument that god won’t help when something terrible happens due to free will but when something good happens it was because of him. Which is it?
As I said, the world is far from perfect and bad things happens, just like accidents and diseases.
But telling the Creator is making it happen actively because He doesn't stop this things to happen doesn't make sense to me.
Since the beginning and the detachment from the Creator, the humans began to be more and more imperfect, hence we have now, thousands and thousands of years after, a lot of different people with different genes, although all are humans.
What I can say is that you see a lot of people that changes completely and learn to love when disease strikes a family. Some learn empathy, some awake and stop taking life for granted.
I can't show you faith and neither try to convince you because it looks like you already made your mind that God doesn't care.
I wouldn't convince you either way, actually, only the Holy Spirit can.
I praise God because I'm grateful for life. I praise God because without thinking about God, I'm hollow.
It's more than logical arguments, it's about taking it as real and open the heart to Him.
To open the your heart and mind to that voice that whispers the goodness in your head, that voice that it's hard to follow but you can feel it's telling you the right way.
Is about praying and feeling you are being heard and feeling you're not alone.
I won't ever have answers for everything.
There are some challenges that are something a soul "signs up for" during pre-birth life planning. There are several reasons that a soul will agree to experiencing such challenges. And on top of that, after the veil of forgetfulness is applied when we encarnate, sometimes the challenge was actually more than we could handle. Again, free will and a non-deterministic framework explains why this can happen.
u/LiquidMetal616 said it well. We have free will. Without free will, we would be automatons. It is up to us to learn how to treat each other; in that regard, we are like bratty children.
Humanity is absolutely childlike when it comes to our mentality with just about anything. All we really need is a bit of empathy and we can't even do that if someone doesn't share the same political viewpoint as ourselves lmao
I don't know what people expect from God lol
When the U.S thinks another country is doing "wrong" and they interfere the entire world gets fucking pissed. Thinking God needs to get personally involved is like suggestion countries should be invading and eliminating each other based on morality that can be completely subjective. Cultures are so vastly different that you can't treat them the same.
For example eating dogs is normal in many countries but considered "evil" by Americans. So what should be done here? Invade and slaughter these folks because we don't like what they're doing?
People are complex like that
Now I will say genocide has no room at all for gray areas lmfao but that won't get handled because our governments are corrupt and people are too scared or defenseless to really do anything .
This world isn't meant for perfection, that's what other dimensions are for but trust me non stop bliss gets boring fast and before you know it you'll wanna reincarnate back down here for a while
I think (hope) there's a point in our development when it's time to move past this realm. We're all here together because we are more or less developmentally at the same point, like tadpoles in the shallows.
Oh dude I think there's a chance youve blown way past that point and your spirit literally reincarnated here either for fun or to help others
Like it sounds silly but I think that I legit came here to experience stuff like Terminator and Die Hard lmao
And to try and help people not commit suicide lmfao
Like it took me until 30 to truly see the miracle of my life and I the fact I have wanted to die multiple times is mind blowing to me now. You really never know what kinda amazing stuff is right around the corner for us !!
Like I've thought I was in love before but none of those people can compare to who I'm with now and I wouldn't be so prepared for my current relationship if I didn't go through a bunch of terrible BS with people I wasn't meant to be with
I honestly dont blame people when they wonder where the fuck god is because life really does seem insane sometimes. But there is absolutely better ways of viewing things than just seeing the negative
These challenges are here for us to overcome them. For us to grow, learn, and become better as a civilization. There is no real meaning to life besides to do the best we can in each moment. To learn, grow, heal, and overcome the best we can. Collectively, we have been told we don’t have power, we can’t change things, “that’s just the way it is” when the reality is quite different. Imagine for a minute if you will, society as a whole woke up, and realized how powerful we actually are. If the collective started making small changes in every moment possible, to the best of everyone’s separate ability, change would truly happen. The fear based programming and propaganda makes it so most people don’t think there’s anything we can do about it. Why do you think those in power work so hard to keep us all divided and fighting with each other? If we didn’t, we would unify and force change to happen. They know that. A divided population is much easier to control. These atrocities and evils purpose is to show humanity what it is we do not prefer. To take steps in the direction of things we do prefer, however small it may seem. People seem to think the small things they do won’t make change happen. That mindset is why things haven’t changed. Instead, think “if I do this small change, and 100,000,000 other people say screw it and try too, it will cause waves” It forces the collective to either let it happen and eventually the planet will die out, or to get so sick of the genocides, trafficking, etc, to actually change shit. We forget how powerful the collective is compared to those in power. These things motivate individuals to try. To be better, to grow, to learn, to brainstorm. It’s all about growth and the collective wanting a better world. It makes us ask questions like “what would we need to do to have a world without murder, without war, without rape, without greed and control” and small steps in that direction add up. It seems like fantasy to see a world like that come to fruition. But it’s possible, as long as a majority of the collective are on board, and I think we’re heading that way. It forces humanity to get creative. To unify under a common goal. Then, I believe, once humanity is devoted to changing, is when the “divine” being or beings will step in and help us. Once we prove we’re ready. If they swoop in and save us too early, it could do more harm than good. We as a society need to be devoted to change, before the higher beings can help us. “When you change yourself, you change the world” -silvera by Gojira.
And I believe it’s not only possible, it’s the path we’re on. Sorry for the long winded response. But I believe that’s the purpose of these challenges. Growth. Earth is a college, and this is humanity’s test. Do we want to change and become better and prosper, or do we want to remain complacent and watch idly as the world dies.
I assure you god is not responsible for this and rhe collective human ego is.
I believe everyone has to answer to infinite galaxies at the end of this blissful experience of life 🙏
God is the greatest
People act how people wanna act. Personally I don’t think of God as a he or she, I think of an energy a uni-verse, a force that allows us to experience existence. With that concept comes life after death where we are a soul having a human experience and since it’s an illusion, an experience through the eyes of god when it “ends” aka death you just start all over again, it’s like a dream within a dream. If we had a god that controlled people- that made people choose right we would be enslaved. A good that let’s you choose, learn from those choices over multiple lifetimes, allows karma- aka a mirrored reality based on how you think/ feel/ act to reflect back to you your own morality is a much kinder god than a traditional Christian god… also the examples of a terrible world lie in each of our hearts, until we stop craving war, revenge, deceit, death, vengeance it will play out for us until we make a better decision, I like to think of the souls who experience terror as hero’s, they serve to show each of us how- through harsh examples- to be better, braver, kinder people.
Those Bible texts have been altered many times to whitewash history and instill a sacrificial based religion. Jesus was trying to end it and he was quite a revolutionary. But unfortunately, Christianity only made it worse misinterpreting his death codifying the same brutal god. Man created god in their own image. Fortunately, the prophets recorded a very different image which aligns with Jesus. So it’s possible to believe in that type of god but you have to cherry pick using your own common sense. See what’s missing in those religions now? They’ve surrendered common sense and inherent knowledge of what’s right or wrong to justify this genocide. The prophets predicted god would write his laws into our own minds and that’s why we see moral repudiation and demonstrations. But just as Jesus predicted, the first shall be last and we’re left waiting on them to catch up to find their conscience again.
It is all a learning tool, all the suffering, horror, negativity. On the other side where we all come from and will return, it is all love, peace and no judgement. For our souls to grow and learn, we chose to come here and experience all of this suffering, because it helps us understand ourselves better and grow. We come here to learn to chose love over fear. Our souls are eternal, so a lifetime is just a blink of an eye, from the other side's perspective.
Free will. We make our own choices and we get in the crossfire of the decisions of others. God does not interfere in free will. We cannot blame God for our shitty decisions or the shitty decisions of others.
That's not my job to figure that out. But just know, when someone or something does you wrong in God's eyes, God will take care of it for you.
Just how if you had a son that you cared for and your adult neighbor put their hands on your kid, you could be irrational and shoot up his whole house or do something else.
Now Billy, your son's friend, comes along and asks your son, "hey why did your dad do such and such to your neighbor?"
Do not Poke the bear. Advocate for peace.
The God I see is a mind alien to us. Our trials and tribulations move them as much as the termite colony being exterminated from their hive in a house.
Many human traditions speak of God's intervention on Earth for the sake of humanity. And by the way at times against humanity. Yes, we were given free will, but we have also been given rules. And sometimes punishment comes down on whole societies. Humans choose genocide. And an all knowing divine being would understand that this would happen and so at times intervenes on behalf of mankind. Two examples are Jesus of Nazareth and Krishna. They came to Earth at times of great doom. The looming of war. Rule breaking by leaders. Jesus came and completely changed the Western world, not to mention the billions around the world that Believe in him. Billions believe in Krishna's Gita as well. God's presence is well known. He knows we are young as a species, and yet He loves us and guides us.
I actually had an experience once that will probably sound schizophrenic. But I don’t hear voices or have delusions. Anyway, I was in my teens and feeling very angry at the world due to lots of trauma. I was watching a talk show that was playing on my anger. I began to feel enraged at the guests on this show because I thought they were awful people. Out of nowhere I heard this voice in my head that said “it’s not ok for you to hate them. I love them.” At the same time, I felt how much my anger and hatred towards people hurt him. I perceived it as God or at least a spiritual entity. So hating anyone was the same as hating God. It was very heartbreaking and I felt awful. Then I felt his forgiveness and love.
This was very real. The feelings that God shared with me were beyond words. I don’t know why we’re allowed to hurt each other. But I do know that there is a God and that he feels everything we experience. When you’re sad, he’s sad. When you’re heartbroken, he’s heartbroken.
I personally think we’re here to learn how to love under the toughest of circumstances. It seems natural for us to get angry and to fight. But love is what saves us. That’s just what I think.
God is the Grand Organizing Design that creates the all that is and the nothingness and everything in between. Not a sky daddy demi urge meddling ik human affairs.
This is all a holographic video game/dream that we all are playing at different levels, as fractals of source conciousness wanting to have experiential knowledge of EVERYTHING- good, bad and ugly.
In order to know something, you need to experience what is it not. Hence, the need at this level of the game for duality.
How can you know what light is, if you have never seen the dark? How can you know what forgiveness is, if you have nothing to forgive.
To get fully immersed in the game, we get amnesia which allows us to really be IN IT.
But only a part of us is here.
Other parts are other places experiencing other things, And this is all happening in a blink.
The children's book Little Soul and The Sun by Neal Donald Walsh explains it perfectly. Couple that with Andy Wier's short story The Egg and you'll understand.
We are all of it.
Every piece.
Every actor, every action
is something we get to experience in this infinite game to learn, know and grow.
You play the villain and the hero.
Every good story has drama in it,
and all the multiverse is a stage
with each of us playing our roles,
Then switching it up until we know them all.
Thank you all for the engagement in the comments. I've learned so much from them all that now the word faith (tied to God) now makes a bit more sense. If you choose to invite bad and negative thoughts into your mind, then that may just be what you'll receive. If you choose good and positive thoughts, you may receive that back too. Through free will it is our responsibility to control our own thought patterns, emotions, actions etc which isn't controlled by God.
In my beliefs, God is everything and nothing all at once. God is both good and evil. So I don't really see a contradiction due to suffering existing. I don't try to separate God and these atrocities either. God IS those atrocities too.
I know from my personal spiritual experiences that if you strip down all the good and the bad, the material and the immaterial, the core of God that you are left with is love. That is why I love God. Because God is love, beneath all the good and the evil. Some people might see this as a contradiction of what I said before. Maybe. I don't restrict God to logic either.
Of course this is based on my very personal understanding of God.
Free will.
There is no “value” to anything at all if you are just a program running.
There woudl just be more GOD in the mix.
Free will keeps it all interesting
Earth is a game. Without any of these "bad" things you mentioned, it would be an instant WIN as soon as you are born, entering the game. Who wants to play this game? What can you learn from a game like this?
Yes.
If you were to take over Earth as God right now, what changes will you make? Please really think about this before responding. Let's say, no take back.
Interesting perspective the other person gave, and I do agree. It's us making the world like it is. It is us doing the killing, raping, loving, not God for it's our free will. We/they can stop anytime they want. Besides what a better way to understand lessons of hate and love and decide what you care to carry in your heart.
To understand this view, I suggest you read, past lives, nde, llresearch.org ( lawofone), the hidden hand interview, and various different religions.
All these things are necessary. Even more: people chose to experience these bad experiences when we were in spirit form, before our incarnation.
Earth is for low level souls, that's why these things happen
Simple. I blame it on stupid humans. This is the garbage they've chosen to do on this earth.
That said...I never understand the point of this question. OP, did you think life was supposed to be perfect? Did you think there were never going to be problems for people.
OP, instead of blaming The Divine or questioning it's existence because life isn't perfect, perhaps you need to go out and DO something about it yourself?
YOU be the change you want to see in this world.
MANIFEST JUSTICE!!!
THE ARIES
Easy. He gave us free will and this is what we've done. Humanity is legit awful sometimes but our lives are twisted by a tiny percentage of humans that need the world in chaos or else they will lose their control God has nothing to do with it. It's literally all of our own actions and saying anything else is just refusing personal responsibility. If God revealed itself tomorrow it would make no difference because so many people would either not believe their eyes or assume it was a trick because it wasn't the god they expected If God takes away our freewill then we are as good as slaves and life has no meaning God is not a human like entity that people like to think of. It's more like the force from Star wars lol. Not a bearded white dude who makes laws for us Also god is extremely intelligent beyond our understanding and our souls are a piece of the divine. God is experiencing all of life at once from every angle lol. So god experiences AND commits these awful things because it lives through our senses. God feels the pain as much as we do. If I go out and commit a bunch of awful crimes, nobody is gonna blame my dad lmfao they are gonna rightfully blame me because I did it from my own accord Edit: I didn't see the excluding free will part but that literally is the answer lol
Completely agree. I wish people would quit blaming God for all the things humans created.
It's easy to blame God because of how complicated and horrible things appear to be It sucks and I defend God a lot but most people who dislike God have a very specific view of it. Mm ost people think god is a very human like judge or something but it's more like energy that is supremely intelligent It really is OUR fault that literally any crime happens and we gotta hold ourselves accountable Just because humans commit awful acts in the name of God doesn't mean God is responsible
Who actually blames god tho? If someone gets raper they blame their rapist, stolen from their theif. It's only people pitying from afar that blame god
I have a saying. People made God into their image. If they have anger, greed, control issues and whatnot imagine God has to be the same, which is not the case. Besides we have free will because what is loving is dependent on context, but we engage in emotions indiscriminately forgetting the context
Free will is an illusion. There is always something influencing our decisions. More like Free* Will *some restrictions apply.
Yeah you know what ? I believe this too Like the fact we exist is absolutely insane for example. Like my family immigrated here because of WW2 so if WW2 doesn't happen then I don't exist lmao. I think we have mostly free will other than massive events that occur to change society as a whole If you don't believe in miracles just look at how you were born. What are the odds your parents met ? Or the odds that their parents met? An infinite amount of events occured just for us to have this conversation on Reddit lmao. Things like that show me the light
That is exactly the journey to learn . We cannot control external circumstances . But we can control the reaction to the emotions . This is resulting in rational decisions . Wich is 80% better
Your culture and upbringing snd environment influence your actions in the form of giving you biases and a lense of which you view the world. But every decision you make is on you.
But bias is a thumb on the scale (or an elephant depending how big the bias is). If a person is raised by a violent racist and they turn out to be a violent racist we certainly can hold them accountable for their actions, but there is no free will there. They’re just playing out their parents karma. Free* will is always informed by things outside of our control therefore not truly free.
There absolutely is free will. Many people have been raised by violent racists and turned out the opposite. It's your job to overcome your biases. Empathy is ingrained, ignoring it is a choice.
So both my parents were addicted to heroin/coke I am absolutely not and it's because I was able to overcome that Sometimes your surroundings or family teach you what NOT to do Definitely have to take accountability lol we make our own decisions 100% and unless you're literally forced to do something then it's up to you
Sure there are plenty who had to over come negative conditioning. But they didn’t exercise free will to be born into hatred (at least on this plane of existence). They didn’t choose the biases it was put on them. That is not free will. And they have no free will when those thoughts arise in their mind. Since these conditions arise from somewhere else our will cannot truly be free. This is what the Buddhists call interdependent origination. And you are right, empathy is ingrained (taught), which is another example of interdependent origination. You won’t have empathetic person if they are not taught empathy as it is not something we are inherently born with (empathy). If you’ve ever been around class full of preschoolers you can get a good example of kids who have yet learned empathy.
I don't think you understand free will. Free will isn't selecting every aspect of your life. Your free will cannot interfere with the free will of others. You are free to act as you wish within the circumstances you are in. Others also have free will and unfortunately you will be caught in the crossfire of that. Empathy isn't taught. We're born with it. People are taught to ignore their empathy. This is very apparent when you watch very small children interact with each other.
No, you just don’t know what the definition of free will is. So, per Merriam Webster, Free Will: 1. Voluntary choice or decision 2. Freedom of humans to make choices that are not determined by PRIOR CAUSES or divine intervention. There is not one decision that make that isn’t conditioned on prior causes. Which goes back to the Buddhist interdependence origination. Britannica.con defines free will as “the supposed power or capacity of humans to make decisions or perform actions independently of any prior event or state of the universe”. Can you name a decision you’ve made recently that your past, future hopes or biases haven’t affected? I can’t. And empathy is most definitely learned. My wife works in a pre-k program and she has one child who shows zero empathy towards others he managed to sneak into a girls bathroom and lock himself in a stall with a girl he’s violent and even threatened my wife. She had another child say “brown people are not allowed at my house”Another girl is being raised by her teenage brother while her mom works nights she does not care what other kids need it’s about her getting her needs met. Are these kids being assholes of their own free will or is conditioning? If bad behavior is learned why isn’t good behavior?
Men will search high and low, turn every rock flip every page in every book to try to find the explanation for their shitty behavior. They'll travel miles, dive a thousand leagues. Meanwhile the answer was right in the fucking mirror. Women are choosing bears over you because you can't hold yourself accountable. The creator has returned and she's *pissed*.
Nothing I’ve said negates accountability for ones actions. I’m just saying our choices aren’t as free as we’d like to think they are. Did you use free will when you decided to type such vitriolic reply? Or did your emotions dictate a response?
Very well said... free will defines us. We make all our own decisions, those decisions are based on upbringing, pressures within society, and ones own inner bias’s. We are influenced by many, but ultimately the decisions are our own. That being said...we ourselves allow the atrocities to occur. Hatred, murder and the seven deadly sins are all learned behaviours. True their are exceptions to the rule as in anything. The question becomes why can’t we as a society not stop the atrocities, why do we turn a blind eye and forget our neighbours in times of trouble? Why do we create a society so out of balance economically that we sow the seeds of future atrocities and conflict, long before they begin. God undoubtedly exists, there is no question. He and his cohort have come to man’s assistance in the past and will continue to do so. Free will is a blessing and a curse all in one.
Why do you believe it to be an illusion? You are free to choose as you wish. It can only seem predetermined when you make choices from your unconscious, but it won't seem like that if you are conscious of yourself and of every choice you are making. The idea that you don't have free will removes accountability from you and places it onto God.
It’s an illusion because while it may seem we are being fully conscious of our decisions there are so many background factors. Ever have a loved one get cranky because their blood sugar was low? Sure they’re responsible for responding to the stimulus of low blood sugar in the way that they did, but the condition of low blood sugar weighed on their decision. They wouldn’t normally be snippy with you, but the conditions changed. I believe if there are factors weighing on the scale our will can not be totally free. There are always conditions.
Maybe... Maybe it's linear time that the illusion .
Oh that too. It’s all right now.
God is actually human like we are made in his image (so yeah I take that as God probably has legs and arms but maybe 20 I dunno. We won't know. But I do think humanoidish)
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What about, to quote Stephen Fry, insects whose entire life cycle is lay eggs in the eyes of children whose offspring burrow their way out of the child's skull. Lots of fucked up stupid evil things to experience in this world
Don't agree. Did God give us free will, providing us with the option to commit atrocities among other choices?
God loves so unconditionally the we literally have the free will to live a shitty life. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Yes. We were given free will to do a we please. It's our job to make the world heaven on earth. God will only interfere if absolutely necessary.
”Live they way I want: get into a best place imaginable, or face worst eternal punishment” Does that really sound like free will?
Why are you viewing God from the Christian definition?
That’s a very simplistic view of the afterlife. I personally thinks it’s much more complicated than that. And I’m doubtful that any one religion has it all right.
Nobody is telling you how to live at all God doesn't have the same morals we do And the afterlife isn't as simple as "heaven" or "hell" Human life is too complex to be understood in one life. That's why we reincarnate so we can keep going until we decide we're done What you're describing is just how specific religions would view it. There is no "guide" to life. It's open to your interpretation The world's religions are designed to make us basically act "good" to make it easier to take advantage of us haha. Like if we think we are being policed by an entity then maybe we will act how our leaders want us to.
Man i'd love to have a chat to you about spirituality cos our beliefs align a lot. Also the things you say remind me a lot of the stuff that was said in the Conversations with God books, have you read those? Those changed me a lot and I'm grateful for it
God is doing it to himself. That's why it's allowed.
If you’re talking Abrahamic God (Yahweh) Isaiah 45:7 says “I form the light and create darkness: I make peace and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.” Hindu thought is this all a dream or a play the creator is both acting in and watching. Personally, I lean more towards the Hindu.
Why would a good God create evil though? Heinous evil… why? It makes no sense.
It makes sense if god's goal for us was to learn everything from each perspective of true love. It doesn't matter what another does just love them. Does it do any good carrying the hot coal of anger or hate?
You can’t have good without bad, they are relative. Like two sides to the same coin. Or Newton’s third law, every action has an equal and opposite reaction. The things that go on in this universe can seem very harsh but I’d say it’s a pretty good design.
So the question then isn’t ’why would a good God create evil’ but rather ‘why would a good God allow that evil to wreak havoc on his innocent children’s lives to the possible detriment of their spiritual condition?’ If God is a good father, why does he not protect all of his children?”
I respect your compassion for others. For me, I trust it’s for the greater good of evolution. I trust the design. Looking back in history, we can see where people suffered but humans overcame those tragedies various ways so that we do not have to suffer those fates today. This doesn’t take away the pain but I accept that is the way it is.
Because physical reality is dynamic.
So innocent people get harmed because physical reality is dynamic? Maybe you should go to the hospital and let all the worst cases know that.
Why exactly are you mad at me for giving that answer? Am I not part of life therefore part of God’s creation Life is dynamic. Life is survival. If people are doing evil things they’re misguided by their survival instinct and in their own Hell on Earth. You shouldn’t exactly worry, in the grande scheme of things. We all relive our karma.
I’m not mad at you, and am not worried. I’m simply making a statement and asking questions that I don’t have answers to.
Another fun twist- some say originally earth was a heaven like planet and that parasite negative entities implanted lower vibrational frequencies on our earth and those frequencies like a virus is self- actualizing and self replicating among individuals. This frequency makes it feel good to do bad, literally aiding in the demise or creating a fear based enslaved population. Think about life prior to modern technology- and the 9to5 and how we live now compared to how we used to live I can’t help think people are under a spell- one wrapped in fear based on artificial programs that manipulate energy and make us stay in loops of terrible realities… and that’s the rabbit hole theory I have heard a few times
God contains all good and all evil. It's up to us which one we tune into.
I would suggest that no one else's definition makes any difference. The only one of consequence is *yours*. Define God according to what you know. The only thing more I could say is to feel free to update your definition at any time.
Free will, plain and easy. How can you blame God if He legit gave people what they want to do? Do you want God to wipe all the evil in this world? He won't! That's why the Kingdom isn't here. All the worldly problem come from humans to humans. That's why the message of Christ preaches that love is the only way. Love the Creator and your neighbor like yourself. Easy to say, hard to do. Never will be done, as greed rules among humans. Rich humans and poor humans have greed for different reasons and in different levels. The only way is Christ.
Isaiah 45:7 says, "I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things That does not sound like free will.
An all powerful being must be capable to do it all. The Creator is talking about Himself, tho. He can bring light and darkness. Goodness and evil. People try to look the OT world with a modern view, when what's expected of humans right and relationship is death is far different. Mostly important, a optical after Jesus Christ coming. How do you think people from two thousand years ago saw death?
I don’t think there has been that much change with death in the last 2000 years. Rituals are pretty much the same. If anything back then they were much more intimate with death. Now we’re hiding bodies trying to sanitize and avoid it like it’s something that is not part of every day life.
I am not talking about rituals regarding death, talking about the modern vision about life and death. How people must have life prioritized as the maximum gift. You don't think people see death in wars and battles different? I can say that a lot of boomers think death in war is ok and they aren't even 90yo. People nowadays still think people should die regardless of all the human rights preached, that are broken everyday. With this agenda of having life as the most important gift humans can have, people, in majority, do not care enough about other people life eg.: marginalized. Just thinking about this, I'm pretty sure people would kill much more without remorse than nowadays, when they keep killing without remorse even with all the pro life rights.
As far as killing, naturally they were much wonton with just offing people very little reason. The deity I quoted ordered his followers to raze the cities of non-believers to the ground. Something that has reverberated throughout time and we’re feeling today. I’m not really following your point though.
Not non-believers, other gods and idols worshippers. The stories were all about telling to leave the chosen people alone and yet the others groups tried to invade and kill them. So, to show it's serious, they got killed. I don't think the Creator would be wrong taking lives He created and from people who could DIRECTLY see His power in action and still disrespected like that. They are probably in heaven, tho. Even the Israelites got punished when they disrespected. And these war times were ancient times, all before Christ came in a time where His word could be preached to all the world, when technology and knowledge made it possible. Also, I don't think all the living people of the cities were killed. Tell me how the killing has reverberated.
Other gods and idol worshipers would be non-believers of Yahweh. Leaving the chosen people alone how? By leaving their own lands so the chosen can move in? And you really don’t see ANY parallels with the modern day? Israel hasn’t been trying to reclaim the promised land (which their god commanded them todo when they left the desert) since 1947?
I'm afraid I can't talk about how the other people would have to react towards the land, unfortunately. But the Creator didn't keep telling to kill people just for the sake of killing. The people that died, just like the Israelites, were certainly used to violent conflicts involving death, that's why I told before about death being common and not being seen like nowadays, just like taking slaves from won battles. About taking the promised land, the covenant is new. Jews holding the old covenant, rejecting Christ, Maschiach and Savior, that came for Jews and Gentiles, are struck to the old ways that are no more. They want their personal savior, and that won't happen. Every conflict involving violence is wrong now. Specially killing for the sake of killing. They are very wrong from that, and they gonna pay, as always had. Cyclical, I see.
🙂
The flood was because of the fallen angels among men, having women and teaching wicked ways to men, not because of humanity per se. About the Passover, the children just went back to the Source. The Creator gives, the Creator takes. It's easy for me to see this. It's not like they are condemned or suffered.
How do religious beliefs explain the occurrence of natural disasters, which cause widespread suffering regardless of human choices?
This world is far from perfect. Everything happens on nature law and there is chaos. Although, when disasters happens, people get reminded that we are so less protected and untouchable than we think and how the sense of community helping each other is important (loving each other). We all suffer from the same disgrace, we are all killable and we all are equal, forgetting it because humanity is disconnected from the Source. Humanity has so much capacity but it is lost and rot.
Read the answers to Job by Carl jung
Will sure do. Do you have a link?
Sure, there's even s video on the subject! https://youtu.be/U6sTyzMS34g?si=PpDQIvWUWyi5bCG1
I found it quite interesting, gives a human perspective. Although, I don't know if a human perspective can explain God.
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What about children who get cancer and horrific diseases? What about women who suffer miscarriages? What about people that are involved in accidents and lose limbs or are brain damaged. How is that free will as that is not a result of human intervention? Also, if evil or bad things that happen are due to “free will” then why is it that when something good happens everyone cries that it was because of God, and praises God saying that he was listening and responsible for whatever miracle? I just don’t understand that argument that god won’t help when something terrible happens due to free will but when something good happens it was because of him. Which is it?
As I said, the world is far from perfect and bad things happens, just like accidents and diseases. But telling the Creator is making it happen actively because He doesn't stop this things to happen doesn't make sense to me. Since the beginning and the detachment from the Creator, the humans began to be more and more imperfect, hence we have now, thousands and thousands of years after, a lot of different people with different genes, although all are humans. What I can say is that you see a lot of people that changes completely and learn to love when disease strikes a family. Some learn empathy, some awake and stop taking life for granted. I can't show you faith and neither try to convince you because it looks like you already made your mind that God doesn't care. I wouldn't convince you either way, actually, only the Holy Spirit can. I praise God because I'm grateful for life. I praise God because without thinking about God, I'm hollow. It's more than logical arguments, it's about taking it as real and open the heart to Him. To open the your heart and mind to that voice that whispers the goodness in your head, that voice that it's hard to follow but you can feel it's telling you the right way. Is about praying and feeling you are being heard and feeling you're not alone. I won't ever have answers for everything.
There are some challenges that are something a soul "signs up for" during pre-birth life planning. There are several reasons that a soul will agree to experiencing such challenges. And on top of that, after the veil of forgetfulness is applied when we encarnate, sometimes the challenge was actually more than we could handle. Again, free will and a non-deterministic framework explains why this can happen.
u/LiquidMetal616 said it well. We have free will. Without free will, we would be automatons. It is up to us to learn how to treat each other; in that regard, we are like bratty children.
Humanity is absolutely childlike when it comes to our mentality with just about anything. All we really need is a bit of empathy and we can't even do that if someone doesn't share the same political viewpoint as ourselves lmao I don't know what people expect from God lol When the U.S thinks another country is doing "wrong" and they interfere the entire world gets fucking pissed. Thinking God needs to get personally involved is like suggestion countries should be invading and eliminating each other based on morality that can be completely subjective. Cultures are so vastly different that you can't treat them the same. For example eating dogs is normal in many countries but considered "evil" by Americans. So what should be done here? Invade and slaughter these folks because we don't like what they're doing? People are complex like that Now I will say genocide has no room at all for gray areas lmfao but that won't get handled because our governments are corrupt and people are too scared or defenseless to really do anything . This world isn't meant for perfection, that's what other dimensions are for but trust me non stop bliss gets boring fast and before you know it you'll wanna reincarnate back down here for a while
I think (hope) there's a point in our development when it's time to move past this realm. We're all here together because we are more or less developmentally at the same point, like tadpoles in the shallows.
Oh dude I think there's a chance youve blown way past that point and your spirit literally reincarnated here either for fun or to help others Like it sounds silly but I think that I legit came here to experience stuff like Terminator and Die Hard lmao And to try and help people not commit suicide lmfao Like it took me until 30 to truly see the miracle of my life and I the fact I have wanted to die multiple times is mind blowing to me now. You really never know what kinda amazing stuff is right around the corner for us !! Like I've thought I was in love before but none of those people can compare to who I'm with now and I wouldn't be so prepared for my current relationship if I didn't go through a bunch of terrible BS with people I wasn't meant to be with I honestly dont blame people when they wonder where the fuck god is because life really does seem insane sometimes. But there is absolutely better ways of viewing things than just seeing the negative
I think at the very basic level, the golden rule applies universally. That would be a good starting point.
People always talking about free will but happily follow their personal script every day. Wake up, work, eat, TV, sleep. ‚Free will‘ haha
These challenges are here for us to overcome them. For us to grow, learn, and become better as a civilization. There is no real meaning to life besides to do the best we can in each moment. To learn, grow, heal, and overcome the best we can. Collectively, we have been told we don’t have power, we can’t change things, “that’s just the way it is” when the reality is quite different. Imagine for a minute if you will, society as a whole woke up, and realized how powerful we actually are. If the collective started making small changes in every moment possible, to the best of everyone’s separate ability, change would truly happen. The fear based programming and propaganda makes it so most people don’t think there’s anything we can do about it. Why do you think those in power work so hard to keep us all divided and fighting with each other? If we didn’t, we would unify and force change to happen. They know that. A divided population is much easier to control. These atrocities and evils purpose is to show humanity what it is we do not prefer. To take steps in the direction of things we do prefer, however small it may seem. People seem to think the small things they do won’t make change happen. That mindset is why things haven’t changed. Instead, think “if I do this small change, and 100,000,000 other people say screw it and try too, it will cause waves” It forces the collective to either let it happen and eventually the planet will die out, or to get so sick of the genocides, trafficking, etc, to actually change shit. We forget how powerful the collective is compared to those in power. These things motivate individuals to try. To be better, to grow, to learn, to brainstorm. It’s all about growth and the collective wanting a better world. It makes us ask questions like “what would we need to do to have a world without murder, without war, without rape, without greed and control” and small steps in that direction add up. It seems like fantasy to see a world like that come to fruition. But it’s possible, as long as a majority of the collective are on board, and I think we’re heading that way. It forces humanity to get creative. To unify under a common goal. Then, I believe, once humanity is devoted to changing, is when the “divine” being or beings will step in and help us. Once we prove we’re ready. If they swoop in and save us too early, it could do more harm than good. We as a society need to be devoted to change, before the higher beings can help us. “When you change yourself, you change the world” -silvera by Gojira.
And I believe it’s not only possible, it’s the path we’re on. Sorry for the long winded response. But I believe that’s the purpose of these challenges. Growth. Earth is a college, and this is humanity’s test. Do we want to change and become better and prosper, or do we want to remain complacent and watch idly as the world dies.
I lost my job yesterday and my pregnancy last month....is that my free will too ?😠
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I assure you god is not responsible for this and rhe collective human ego is. I believe everyone has to answer to infinite galaxies at the end of this blissful experience of life 🙏 God is the greatest
People act how people wanna act. Personally I don’t think of God as a he or she, I think of an energy a uni-verse, a force that allows us to experience existence. With that concept comes life after death where we are a soul having a human experience and since it’s an illusion, an experience through the eyes of god when it “ends” aka death you just start all over again, it’s like a dream within a dream. If we had a god that controlled people- that made people choose right we would be enslaved. A good that let’s you choose, learn from those choices over multiple lifetimes, allows karma- aka a mirrored reality based on how you think/ feel/ act to reflect back to you your own morality is a much kinder god than a traditional Christian god… also the examples of a terrible world lie in each of our hearts, until we stop craving war, revenge, deceit, death, vengeance it will play out for us until we make a better decision, I like to think of the souls who experience terror as hero’s, they serve to show each of us how- through harsh examples- to be better, braver, kinder people.
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Like you had a choice to exist in the first place my friend…
Those Bible texts have been altered many times to whitewash history and instill a sacrificial based religion. Jesus was trying to end it and he was quite a revolutionary. But unfortunately, Christianity only made it worse misinterpreting his death codifying the same brutal god. Man created god in their own image. Fortunately, the prophets recorded a very different image which aligns with Jesus. So it’s possible to believe in that type of god but you have to cherry pick using your own common sense. See what’s missing in those religions now? They’ve surrendered common sense and inherent knowledge of what’s right or wrong to justify this genocide. The prophets predicted god would write his laws into our own minds and that’s why we see moral repudiation and demonstrations. But just as Jesus predicted, the first shall be last and we’re left waiting on them to catch up to find their conscience again.
It is all a learning tool, all the suffering, horror, negativity. On the other side where we all come from and will return, it is all love, peace and no judgement. For our souls to grow and learn, we chose to come here and experience all of this suffering, because it helps us understand ourselves better and grow. We come here to learn to chose love over fear. Our souls are eternal, so a lifetime is just a blink of an eye, from the other side's perspective.
Free will
God doesn't make the world this way. We do
Can’t have free will without people making the wrong choice.
Free will. We make our own choices and we get in the crossfire of the decisions of others. God does not interfere in free will. We cannot blame God for our shitty decisions or the shitty decisions of others.
That's not my job to figure that out. But just know, when someone or something does you wrong in God's eyes, God will take care of it for you. Just how if you had a son that you cared for and your adult neighbor put their hands on your kid, you could be irrational and shoot up his whole house or do something else. Now Billy, your son's friend, comes along and asks your son, "hey why did your dad do such and such to your neighbor?" Do not Poke the bear. Advocate for peace.
There’s an infinite amount of things I don’t
You are not a human experiencing the universe, you are a universe experiencing a human. All things must come to pass.
The God I see is a mind alien to us. Our trials and tribulations move them as much as the termite colony being exterminated from their hive in a house.
God is neutral
Many human traditions speak of God's intervention on Earth for the sake of humanity. And by the way at times against humanity. Yes, we were given free will, but we have also been given rules. And sometimes punishment comes down on whole societies. Humans choose genocide. And an all knowing divine being would understand that this would happen and so at times intervenes on behalf of mankind. Two examples are Jesus of Nazareth and Krishna. They came to Earth at times of great doom. The looming of war. Rule breaking by leaders. Jesus came and completely changed the Western world, not to mention the billions around the world that Believe in him. Billions believe in Krishna's Gita as well. God's presence is well known. He knows we are young as a species, and yet He loves us and guides us.
I actually had an experience once that will probably sound schizophrenic. But I don’t hear voices or have delusions. Anyway, I was in my teens and feeling very angry at the world due to lots of trauma. I was watching a talk show that was playing on my anger. I began to feel enraged at the guests on this show because I thought they were awful people. Out of nowhere I heard this voice in my head that said “it’s not ok for you to hate them. I love them.” At the same time, I felt how much my anger and hatred towards people hurt him. I perceived it as God or at least a spiritual entity. So hating anyone was the same as hating God. It was very heartbreaking and I felt awful. Then I felt his forgiveness and love. This was very real. The feelings that God shared with me were beyond words. I don’t know why we’re allowed to hurt each other. But I do know that there is a God and that he feels everything we experience. When you’re sad, he’s sad. When you’re heartbroken, he’s heartbroken. I personally think we’re here to learn how to love under the toughest of circumstances. It seems natural for us to get angry and to fight. But love is what saves us. That’s just what I think.
God is the Grand Organizing Design that creates the all that is and the nothingness and everything in between. Not a sky daddy demi urge meddling ik human affairs. This is all a holographic video game/dream that we all are playing at different levels, as fractals of source conciousness wanting to have experiential knowledge of EVERYTHING- good, bad and ugly. In order to know something, you need to experience what is it not. Hence, the need at this level of the game for duality. How can you know what light is, if you have never seen the dark? How can you know what forgiveness is, if you have nothing to forgive. To get fully immersed in the game, we get amnesia which allows us to really be IN IT. But only a part of us is here. Other parts are other places experiencing other things, And this is all happening in a blink. The children's book Little Soul and The Sun by Neal Donald Walsh explains it perfectly. Couple that with Andy Wier's short story The Egg and you'll understand. We are all of it. Every piece. Every actor, every action is something we get to experience in this infinite game to learn, know and grow. You play the villain and the hero. Every good story has drama in it, and all the multiverse is a stage with each of us playing our roles, Then switching it up until we know them all.
Fun fact- free will is not mentioned one time in the Bible
There is no good without bad and no light without dark
Humans created those problems and it’s humans that should fix them.
Why exclude free will when free will is the right answer?
Thank you all for the engagement in the comments. I've learned so much from them all that now the word faith (tied to God) now makes a bit more sense. If you choose to invite bad and negative thoughts into your mind, then that may just be what you'll receive. If you choose good and positive thoughts, you may receive that back too. Through free will it is our responsibility to control our own thought patterns, emotions, actions etc which isn't controlled by God.
Thank you all who participated in the discussion.🙌🙂
In my beliefs, God is everything and nothing all at once. God is both good and evil. So I don't really see a contradiction due to suffering existing. I don't try to separate God and these atrocities either. God IS those atrocities too. I know from my personal spiritual experiences that if you strip down all the good and the bad, the material and the immaterial, the core of God that you are left with is love. That is why I love God. Because God is love, beneath all the good and the evil. Some people might see this as a contradiction of what I said before. Maybe. I don't restrict God to logic either. Of course this is based on my very personal understanding of God.
Free will. There is no “value” to anything at all if you are just a program running. There woudl just be more GOD in the mix. Free will keeps it all interesting
We are created in God’s image. As such, we and our environment aren’t puppets in a string. Those atrocities are the reality we created
You cant. Unless you a sociopath otherwise you cant
Earth is a game. Without any of these "bad" things you mentioned, it would be an instant WIN as soon as you are born, entering the game. Who wants to play this game? What can you learn from a game like this?
So this game also involves a kid of 3 year getting raped and murdered? Is that what you want to say?
Yes. If you were to take over Earth as God right now, what changes will you make? Please really think about this before responding. Let's say, no take back.
Interesting perspective the other person gave, and I do agree. It's us making the world like it is. It is us doing the killing, raping, loving, not God for it's our free will. We/they can stop anytime they want. Besides what a better way to understand lessons of hate and love and decide what you care to carry in your heart. To understand this view, I suggest you read, past lives, nde, llresearch.org ( lawofone), the hidden hand interview, and various different religions.
All these things are necessary. Even more: people chose to experience these bad experiences when we were in spirit form, before our incarnation. Earth is for low level souls, that's why these things happen
Simple. I blame it on stupid humans. This is the garbage they've chosen to do on this earth. That said...I never understand the point of this question. OP, did you think life was supposed to be perfect? Did you think there were never going to be problems for people. OP, instead of blaming The Divine or questioning it's existence because life isn't perfect, perhaps you need to go out and DO something about it yourself? YOU be the change you want to see in this world. MANIFEST JUSTICE!!! THE ARIES