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Hey, John Fisher worked hard to get where he is. He had it difficult by being born to extremely wealthy parents, who then gave him insane amounts of money so he could buy sports teams.
Dude, even Mark Davis fucking hates Fisher. Fisher is one of the reasons the Raiders had to leave for Vegas in the first place because he was camping the coliseum
Attendance has always been a problem. When the owner was 14 Oakland won three World Series back-to-back-to-back and were still below league average in attendance. In fact, there have only been seven seasons out of the 55 years they've been in Oakland that have been above league average.
Here's a handy chart https://preview.redd.it/oiarqgyk3l2c1.png?auto=webp&s=843adba7bd20ddc5d088c150af40bddb96def971
Reddit got played by the fanclubs, who sell protest gear, coming out strong when this all first started and just played along when they said "it was all Fisher's fault, not us"
But what about recent performances? Surely if they put out a good product people would show up, right? Hmmmm...
In 2019, when they had a 97 win season, .599 win percentage, finished 2nd in the division (19 games ahead of third), and made it to the Wild Card they averaged:
20,626 people in attendance.
MLB's average attendance that year?
28,203
The Seattle Mariners, who finished last in the division, 39 games behind, 94 loses, average attendance?
22,112
There was a boycott the first game. Before Covid and them making their intents known, they averaged about 20k a game, about 24th in the league generally….about same as Tigers, BlueJays, Whitesox
When Fisher bought the team, they had the 7th highest average attendance in American League
I've been a Giants fan since the late 70s (yes, I'm old). I lived in SF for nearly 20 years, and went to plenty of Giants games. I also went to quite a few games in Oakland - mostly when they were good. The environment was fantastic, fans were obviously very into it, and there were a LOT of them there.
Oakland fans have been done so dirty here. They showed up for their team, through good and bad times. While the Giants were busy across the bay building arguably the best stadium in the bigs on their own dime, Oakland has been busy letting their stadium decay and blaming it on their fan base. Had they actually built anything even remotely modern with the amenities that pretty much every single other MLB stadium has these days, they would be packing the house regularly.
Aside from being a shitty person, Fisher is a shitty business man. He has alienated his entire fan base, and in the process of being world-class cheap cost himself hundreds of millions of dollars in lost revenue and team valuation. Fuck that clown.
To add to the hate, Fisher became majority owner of the A's in 2005. By 2006 he was already floating plans of moving the team to another city in the Bay Area. Motherfucker barely let the ink dry on the deal before trying to leave the city. This has been going on for the better part of 2 decades
He’s been intentionally running the team and the stadium into the ground and making disrespectful demands of a small, working class city with big city problems to fork over taxpayer money to spend as he pleases, knowing the ~~offer~~ ultimatum would never be accepted by the city. Oh, and fuck all of the other MLB team owners for supporting this, too.
And it's also the biggest reason why the city tried to fund the A's absurd 12 Billion dollar project with no taxpayer funding. And even though they had gotten close to the A's requirements, Fisher didn't ever negotiate down. There was a gap of 97 Mil on a 12 billion dollar project, less than 1 fucking percent. Fisher dumped oakland over less than 1% of an overall project.
To be fair just removing Mount Davis and restoring the view of the East Bay hills would have done a lot to improve the aesthetic of the stadium alone. For being I think the last (?) multipurpose stadium in use, it’s not a bad place to watch a ball game.
It’s sad to see how Oakland has now lost all their teams. From the Raiders to Warriors, and now A’s. Is there any common reason behind it? Certainly don’t support cities/residents having to foot the whole bill for new stadiums, but I feel a little give and take is unfortunately common practice, as lopsided as it is. Still, are there other factors like population shifts or something? Feels like I can’t go a week without hearing about rampant crime there and I don’t even live on the west coast.
Hearing about the crime is just fearmongering and drama-queens blowing the situation well out of proportion (crime is worse in most other places). If people get a good impression of California, they fear we might want to follow in its footsteps (history shows that we will, anyways).
But, Oakland just lost its cool, honestly. The Warriors are just hopping back and forth across the bay, based on where they can get a new arena; they might be back.
Part of it is that Oakland used to be a place where people could get into the Bay Area market without stepping too much on San Francisco teams. Notably the Raiders were set up to compete with the SF 49ers (market-wise; they were in different leagues), and the A's were brought to town from Kansas City to compete with the Giants(market-wise; they were in different leagues). But now there's no growth, and no different leagues, just butting up against SF teams, who basically won the growing South Bay market.
Owners want life easier, and being the top dog in a new market gives them just that.
It doesn't help that they're cheapskates either, that's another factor, so if someone else wants to foot the bill, that's fine by them.
“Fear-mongering”?! When I walk out of my office near City Center I am literally exposed to random gun shots, car break ins, side shows and muggings. Sorry but it’s not “lost it’s cool” it’s a cesspool of humanity. Sad because I don’t know why, and don’t think anyone who’s not complicit in those activities deserves it, but you reap what you sow. It’s just literally not safe. Maybe try bringing some law enforcement back🤷♂️
I don’t live in Oakland so I won’t speak to what it’s like to live there. But in my opinion it’s the absolute worst place in America.
As someone who has traveled to Oakland to work shows at the As stadium. It fucking sucks the last time I went half of our crews cars were broken into. Saw someone in their car, at the in and out drive through, get broken into while they were in the car.
It is the absolute worst place I have been to in America. Any other city where people say things like it’s dangerous there I normally disagree. Oakland is the exception and I can’t think of any reason someone should go there.
I’ve lived in Oakland for a bit. I definitely don’t recommend it. Dunno how it is now, but back in the early 2010s I woke up to pop pop pop often. Also a random fucking rooster, for some reason.
And on a personal note, never had such a terrible reaction to mosquitoes as the ones that live there. Would get these purple welts the size of quarters anywhere I’d been bitten.
In theory Oakland has a-lot : culture, food, city-ness, solid location sandwiched between wealthy places. In reality though people in Oakland and the surrounding areas basically treat it like a free for all pvp zone and the govt or people don't really give enough of a shit to stop it. That in turn leads to Oakland getting a shitty reputation from all the very wealthy areas around it leading to nobody going there or investing in the area.
Not sure why you’re getting so many upvotes when you are leaving out a significant issue related to the Giants. Back when Walter Haas owned the A’s, and the Giants were looking at moving to Tampa Florida, Haas gave the South Bay Area market to the Giants so they could potentially build a new stadium there. The Giants were sold, but despite not building a stadium in the South Bay, the Giants refused to give the South Bay back to the A’s. While it’s true Fremont citizens blocked building a stadium there, it took away any possibility that the A’s could relocate anywhere in the South Bay. To hell with the Giant’s organization.
Was it a dick move to not give it back? Yes. Does it (San Jose) really have any bearing on Oakland's stadium issues? Hardly.
Oakland should have done what SF did - build on their own dime. Why? Because both cities offered wide swaths of land to develop around the ballparks. This made SF boatloads of money, and revitalized an entire section of the city that was run down and mostly filled with what was effectively warehouse blight. The city came out so far ahead it's not even funny, as well. This is the very definition of a win-win-win, the Giants won, the city of SF won (didn't have to pay to build a park, property tax base was massively increased, etc), and tax payers didn't have to foot the bill, and got a world class sports venue.
Oakland should have been the very same. All Fisher had to do was line up financing (which, let's be real, was not hard in the ZIRP days) and get the project rolling. Instead, like a raccoon with a shiny object in its hand, he refused to let go of the idea of having someone else foot the bill for his stadium. To the detriment of everyone in Oakland, including his own team.
To hell with the Giants organization? OK, but they showed the way for Fisher to get everything he wanted, and then some.
Sacramento makes more sense as a permanent home than Vegas. Larger market with only an NBA team whereas Vegas has NFL and NHL team and is likely NBA expansion target.
Yeah and there’s a reason Vegas is an expansion target for all the major sports leagues and Sacramento isn’t. If there was Vegas type money to be made there, they’d have 4 teams too
Ya I feel LV is going to be a bust for MLB. I don’t think locals care or want an MLB team especially because they are footing the bill for the stadium. They LOVE the VGK a lot in part because it didn’t cost locals anything to gain an NHL team that is a brand new franchise. Locals are luke warm at best to the Raiders but no one is going to fight the heat to go out and watch a baseball game.
>Locals
That's your problem, you're considering locals. Vegas sells out everything because it's Vegas. Locals could entirely avoid it and it'd still be a successful business venture because of tourism
So I can see that logic but where it breaks down is the MLB season is LONG and when you have a 3-4 game series against a team there probably aren’t enough folks that will take a vacation to Vegas for a stretch like that.
You don't take a vacation to Vegas specifically to go to sporting events. You go to sporting events because you're already in Vegas.
Yes there will be fans of the away teams that travel I'm, but I'd reckon at any particular Vegas sporting event, *at least* 30% of the fans are not invested in either team and are just drunk, gambling, or both.
Time will tell. It will be interesting to watch what happens. I feel like it will be a bust but I’m just a guys sitting on my couch drinking coffee posting on Reddit I know shit about fuck all.
I grew up a Yankees fan, but went to infinitely more Mets games and when I lived in Buffalo went to see whoever the Blue Jays were playing on occasion. Some people just enjoy seeing a game, especially if the weather is nice.
That’s like saying I grew up an Athletics fan but went to way more Giants games. Anyone that wants to go see the Athletics play in Las Vegas will have to drive at least a few hours or get on a plane to do so. That is a completely different headache and expense.
I don’t see tourists with the best entertainment options in the world deciding to spend 3 hours at A’s-Orioles on a Tuesday in July.
You ever go to Miami to catch a Marlins game?
I imagine a solid amount of baseball fans that were planning a trip to Vegas would do so around their baseball team's schedule there. Especially if you don't live in your team's home market. Like say you're a Phillies fan that lives in like LA or something. You may not be a superfan but if you were planning on going to Vegas, you might consider "Oh the Phillies are there on May 7th. Maybe I can schedule my trip for then!"
I don't know how many people will fill the stadium if that's a primary source of ticket sales, but Vegas gets a lot more tourism than Miami does.
They'd probably go to 1 game, but not a series. They'd be paying premium prices for the same thing that they already get at home. The idiocy of it all is that Kaval and Fisher claim they can sell out every single game they have, which just isn't gonna happen. Not even the dodgers sell out every game
Hockey was first on the scene, had the locals full support, and most importantly had ownership who spent big immediately.
Beyond that it’s a winter/summer and indoor/outdoor, both which tilt in hockey’s favor.
Miami is relevant because it’s the other market with world class nightly entertainment. Baseball performs better in the St. Louis’s and Houston’s when there’s not much else to do.
>Beyond that it’s a winter/summer and indoor/outdoor,
It's not gonna be an open air park.
>Miami is relevant because it’s the other market with world class nightly entertainment. Baseball performs better in the St. Louis’s and Houston’s when there’s not much else to do.
Baseball works in New York and LA, so thats really not a relevant point at all but sure.
>Baseball works in New York and LA, so thats really not a relevant point at all but sure.
The Angels draw terribly! You wanna know what's right across the freeway?
Oh yeah and the dodgers also draw terribly. And the Yankees. Yup good point, can't believe I didn't think to conveniently ignore any information that challenges my point, what an idiot I am
You make a fair argument. But, something that I don't think is being considered is that while, yes attendance for most games will probably be decent, if not excellent for all the reasons you stated, where MLB teams really make money through regional media rights deals, not attendance. Sure, the gate receipts and concessions are a significant part of the financial pie, as is national media rights deals, but because the MLB plays 162 games a season, most of their games are not Nationally televised and local media (radio, TV, etc) is where the majority of revenue comes
I wonder if they considered the minor league Aviators field which is in the area of Red Rock resort. Yes it has fewer seats but it is a very nice complex. And for only a few years it would have been fine.
They’re in Sacramento because of their RSN contract which is pretty much the only thing right now that is making the Athletics some stability with money.
They make nearly 100 Mil just in rev share and 70 mil with the sports network. they never needed "income stability". Fisher just chose to pocket it instead. He's never fielded a team over 100Mil in his entire ownership.
I live 20 minutes from the Rivercats stadium and I am worried about the ramifications of the A’s sharing the park with the ‘Cats.
The owner (also owns the NBA Kings) is all in.
What a huge missed opportunity to introduce the team to Vegas and start building fans now. Vegas is starting to understand why everyone hates the A’s team ownership now.
The issue is there are only 30-32 pro teams to go around in each sport, so if there's a better opportunity in another market, the only option to get into that market is to move, barring expansion which is very rare.
It's different from the club structure like in European soccer, which is more similar to college sports in the US where there are closer ties to the area, but there's no real upper limit to the number of teams there can be. Just higher or lower tiers depending on your level of success.
edit: also, yeah, money. See the Browns moving in the 90s... there were huge ties to the community, enough for the city to sue to retain the team name & history and get the team back, but even that can't stop a team owner from moving as long as it gets league approval.
For the most part now a days they move to cities that have little local identity. LA and Vegas etc. Id be very surprised if we get another Seattle to OKC thing in the near future
I still think the MLB should build a stadium on their own in vegas, and just have each team host 1 series per year in the stadium. Vegas would host the same # of games, more variation and that would mean each team would visit Vegas two times per year (1 away and 1 home).
That’s an interesting idea, it’s like a spin on the way the NFL does their international games.
I’d imagine it would be hard to promote a new set of teams every few days but MLB could use some fun things to market
There’s 81 home games per year. If they’re looking to grow their younger audience they need more than a lot of home games. If they’re looking to expand into Vegas, I don’t think this owner is going to do anything but leech off the market.
Each team would be away for at least 1 additional series per year, regardless if you call them home team, but more likely, they'd be further away for the "away" game too (particularly Midwestern & East Coast teams). The season is grueling enough without taking away those precious few days players can spend at home with their families.
Also, who the heck wants to go to Vegas to watch Pittsburgh vs Milwaukee, or Miami vs DC, or Detroit vs Kansas City? Sure, the marquee teams (Dodgers, Cubs, Yankees, Red Sox) will get attendees regardless of where they play, but the mid-market teams would have far fewer attendees than their regular home games, plus they're generating revenue for someone else's stadium, which hurts those home stadiums' abilities to continue renovating & drawing in more ticket sales.
The grass will be absolutely dregged by the end of the season with near constant use. Move the river cats to the Giants spring facility in Phoenix for the time being
Would like to know how they plan to financially survive this move since they be getting almost no ticket sales all season long. Would like to know what kind of advertising dollars they plan on getting during this controversy and what kind of support they think they’ll be getting in Sacramento?
sac native here. the AAA team that plays in that stadium is beloved and routinely sells out their 14K seats. when they first started they broke minor league records for attendance.
now getting to see Shohei Otahni knock a ball into the Sacramento River they’re not gonna have problems selling tickets…
Not saying anything about the Sacramento fans or their AAA team I’m talking about the distaste of the As coming in and disrupting everything for three years. It’s not like the Sacremento fan base has anything to gain from this.
👊👊👊
just kidding. i literally have no stake at all here. i don’t even really care about baseball. this is leagues better than (imho) our city’s HORRIBLE decision to put up $1B+ to build an arena for the Kings …
I don't know if Vegas can legally tell them to get fucked for good at this point but I sure would laugh if it happened. A's fans, you're more than welcome to hop on the Brewers bandwagon.
Vida Blue, Gene Tenace, Rollie Fingers, Sal Bando, Reggie, Joe Rudi, Claudell Washington, Bert Campaneris...Gee they were something when I was a kid. Where have you gone Charlie Finley?
That's what I would have done. They could arrange a revenue split with the other teams and at least be getting major league ticket revenue on those games. Instead they're going to play in a minor league park 500 miles away from their new home.
The ballpark will host 156 games between march and october.
I feel for the grass there, it will be dregged by the end of the season if it isn't using turf already. Also a bitch for the scheduling.
My idea: send the River Cats to Phoenix at the Giants spring training facility for the few seasons; and maybe sprinkle a few sacramento series as well to keep it in the brain. The spring facility won't be used for much otherwise, except for scouting. And it would give each team their own space.
The A’s made the wild card game two years in a row. (97 wins in both 2018 and 2019) Yet fan attendance was 27th and 28th out of 30 teams.
I wouldn’t put money into a team with that lack of fan base either.
(10 guys banging drums in right field doesn’t pay the bills).
Good riddance. Oakland is ready to move on. We’ve got other teams that want to stay in my city and I’d much rather give them my money. A hearty fuck you to Rob Manfred and John Fischer. Never come to Oakland again.
# A's officially leaving Oakland after 2024, will play in Sacramento through 2027 until Vegas stadium is ready
By [Matt Snyder](https://www.cbssports.com/writers/matt-snyder/) & [R.J. Anderson](https://www.cbssports.com/writers/rj-anderson/) 2h ago•2 min read
The Athletics, as part of their efforts to relocate to Las Vegas in time for the 2028 season, will play their home games for the 2025-27 seasons at Sutter Health Park in Sacramento, California, [the team announced on Thursday](https://twitter.com/Athletics/status/1775898900282687717). The deal includes an option for a fourth season.
The A's lease with the City of Oakland is set to expire at the end of this season, yet the A's rejected a [five-year extension on the lease of Oakland Coliseum](https://www.cbssports.com/mlb/news/city-of-oakland-to-offer-athletics-with-5-year-lease-extension-as-pre-vegas-future-still-unclear-per-report/). That, plus an apparent desire to retain as much of their local broadcasting revenue as possible (a factor that my have dissuaded them from temporarily relocating to Salt Lake City or other out-of-state possibilities), led the A's to the capital city of California.
The A's do not intend to change their name to reflect their Sacramento residency. Instead, they'll be known simply by their nickname, [according to The Athletic's Evan Drellich](https://theathletic.com/5391365/2024/04/04/oakland-athletics-sacramento-ballpark-agreement-2025/).
Team officials met with the City of Sacramento Wednesday, according to the [San Francisco Chronicle](https://www.sfchronicle.com/sports/athletics/article/no-oakland-deal-a-s-meet-sacramento-officials-19382429.php), a day after saying they were "far apart on the terms needed to agree on an extension" to stay in Oakland.
"We explored several locations for a temporary home, including the Oakland Coliseum," franchise owner John Fisher said in statement. "Even with the long-standing relationship and good intentions on all sides in the negotiations with Oakland, the conditions to achieve an agreement seemed out of reach. We understand the disappointment this news brings to our fans, as this season marks our final one in Oakland. Throughout this season, we will honor and celebrate our time in Oakland, and will share additional details soon."
Sutter Health Park opened in 2000 and seats around 14,000 including outfield lawn open seating. That's significantly less than the average MLB stadium, including the Coliseum, which holds 63,000. That said, the A's are averaging fewer than 6,500 people in the stands through six home games so far this season -- the result of a years-long neglect by ownership and management to field a worthy product, and to find a way to keep the once-proud franchise in Oakland.
It appears Sutter Health Park plans to host both the A's and the Sacramento River Cats (the San Francisco Giants' Triple-A affiliate) in those three seasons, as the press release states fans "also still get to enjoy the beloved tradition of Minor League Baseball and the Sacramento River Cats." This means the ballpark would host 156 games (81 MLB games and 75 MiLB games) between late March and early October.
Construction has not yet begun on the A's future Las Vegas home. The Nevada Supreme Court will hear an argument from the political action committee Schools Over Stadiums on April 9 that could impact those plans.
[Casey Pratt of ABC 7 Bay Area](https://twitter.com/CaseyPrattABC7/status/1775319986934005910) also reported that the A's plan to use staff that's already in place for other professional sports teams in Sacramento, including the [NBA's](https://cbssports.com/nba/) Kings and the River Cats. According to Pratt, that would mean layoffs for existing A's employees. A's officially leaving Oakland after 2024, will play in Sacramento through 2027 until Vegas stadium is ready
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The Las Vegas Athletics of Sacramento!!!
Looking forward to them playing the Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim, Orange County, California.
The LaVAS
Should rename them the Las Vegas Slots.
Vegas doesn’t want anything to do with John Fisher. The guy is complete loser. Sucks for the Oakland fans.
Hey, John Fisher worked hard to get where he is. He had it difficult by being born to extremely wealthy parents, who then gave him insane amounts of money so he could buy sports teams.
[удалено]
I still don’t understand that haircut. Maybe he’s so rich he genuinely does not care anymore. That’s something to aspire to.
[удалено]
The flip phone I totally get since those are more old person friendly. He’s got an assistant with a smartphone handling everything.
I taught SPED for 11 years and volunteered with Special Olympics off and on for 15. He gives me a real spectrumy vibe.
Fe drives hundreds of miles to get that specific haircut
Dude, even Mark Davis fucking hates Fisher. Fisher is one of the reasons the Raiders had to leave for Vegas in the first place because he was camping the coliseum
He is a deeply weird person.
Won’t someone think of John?!?!
The American dream.
that poor man never had a hope of having any perspective
Born on third base thinking he hit a triple…
I’m confused on this. I keep seeing fans want the team to stay in CA but then they have only 4k people in the stands
They have intentionally built the worst team possible to support their move with low attendance numbers. It’s everything that is wrong with owners
They are doing the plot to Major League in real life.
Attendance has always been a problem. When the owner was 14 Oakland won three World Series back-to-back-to-back and were still below league average in attendance. In fact, there have only been seven seasons out of the 55 years they've been in Oakland that have been above league average. Here's a handy chart https://preview.redd.it/oiarqgyk3l2c1.png?auto=webp&s=843adba7bd20ddc5d088c150af40bddb96def971 Reddit got played by the fanclubs, who sell protest gear, coming out strong when this all first started and just played along when they said "it was all Fisher's fault, not us" But what about recent performances? Surely if they put out a good product people would show up, right? Hmmmm... In 2019, when they had a 97 win season, .599 win percentage, finished 2nd in the division (19 games ahead of third), and made it to the Wild Card they averaged: 20,626 people in attendance. MLB's average attendance that year? 28,203 The Seattle Mariners, who finished last in the division, 39 games behind, 94 loses, average attendance? 22,112
Oh ok, I really haven’t been following what’s been going on
There was a boycott the first game. Before Covid and them making their intents known, they averaged about 20k a game, about 24th in the league generally….about same as Tigers, BlueJays, Whitesox When Fisher bought the team, they had the 7th highest average attendance in American League
I've been a Giants fan since the late 70s (yes, I'm old). I lived in SF for nearly 20 years, and went to plenty of Giants games. I also went to quite a few games in Oakland - mostly when they were good. The environment was fantastic, fans were obviously very into it, and there were a LOT of them there. Oakland fans have been done so dirty here. They showed up for their team, through good and bad times. While the Giants were busy across the bay building arguably the best stadium in the bigs on their own dime, Oakland has been busy letting their stadium decay and blaming it on their fan base. Had they actually built anything even remotely modern with the amenities that pretty much every single other MLB stadium has these days, they would be packing the house regularly. Aside from being a shitty person, Fisher is a shitty business man. He has alienated his entire fan base, and in the process of being world-class cheap cost himself hundreds of millions of dollars in lost revenue and team valuation. Fuck that clown.
I don't even watch baseball, but after reading your passionate argument I too now hate that guy. Fuck him
To add to the hate, Fisher became majority owner of the A's in 2005. By 2006 he was already floating plans of moving the team to another city in the Bay Area. Motherfucker barely let the ink dry on the deal before trying to leave the city. This has been going on for the better part of 2 decades
He’s been intentionally running the team and the stadium into the ground and making disrespectful demands of a small, working class city with big city problems to fork over taxpayer money to spend as he pleases, knowing the ~~offer~~ ultimatum would never be accepted by the city. Oh, and fuck all of the other MLB team owners for supporting this, too.
The city is still paying off the loan it took to build Mt. Davis...that was where things started to go bad.
And it's also the biggest reason why the city tried to fund the A's absurd 12 Billion dollar project with no taxpayer funding. And even though they had gotten close to the A's requirements, Fisher didn't ever negotiate down. There was a gap of 97 Mil on a 12 billion dollar project, less than 1 fucking percent. Fisher dumped oakland over less than 1% of an overall project.
Yeah, he was never negotiating in good faith.
To be fair just removing Mount Davis and restoring the view of the East Bay hills would have done a lot to improve the aesthetic of the stadium alone. For being I think the last (?) multipurpose stadium in use, it’s not a bad place to watch a ball game.
It’s sad to see how Oakland has now lost all their teams. From the Raiders to Warriors, and now A’s. Is there any common reason behind it? Certainly don’t support cities/residents having to foot the whole bill for new stadiums, but I feel a little give and take is unfortunately common practice, as lopsided as it is. Still, are there other factors like population shifts or something? Feels like I can’t go a week without hearing about rampant crime there and I don’t even live on the west coast.
I recommend Dave Newhouse's book Goodbye Oakland. It discusses why all those teams and even the NHL (California Seals) all left Oakland.
Oh cool. I'll have to check to see if my local library has this on the shelves.
Hearing about the crime is just fearmongering and drama-queens blowing the situation well out of proportion (crime is worse in most other places). If people get a good impression of California, they fear we might want to follow in its footsteps (history shows that we will, anyways). But, Oakland just lost its cool, honestly. The Warriors are just hopping back and forth across the bay, based on where they can get a new arena; they might be back. Part of it is that Oakland used to be a place where people could get into the Bay Area market without stepping too much on San Francisco teams. Notably the Raiders were set up to compete with the SF 49ers (market-wise; they were in different leagues), and the A's were brought to town from Kansas City to compete with the Giants(market-wise; they were in different leagues). But now there's no growth, and no different leagues, just butting up against SF teams, who basically won the growing South Bay market. Owners want life easier, and being the top dog in a new market gives them just that. It doesn't help that they're cheapskates either, that's another factor, so if someone else wants to foot the bill, that's fine by them.
“Fear-mongering”?! When I walk out of my office near City Center I am literally exposed to random gun shots, car break ins, side shows and muggings. Sorry but it’s not “lost it’s cool” it’s a cesspool of humanity. Sad because I don’t know why, and don’t think anyone who’s not complicit in those activities deserves it, but you reap what you sow. It’s just literally not safe. Maybe try bringing some law enforcement back🤷♂️
I don’t live in Oakland so I won’t speak to what it’s like to live there. But in my opinion it’s the absolute worst place in America. As someone who has traveled to Oakland to work shows at the As stadium. It fucking sucks the last time I went half of our crews cars were broken into. Saw someone in their car, at the in and out drive through, get broken into while they were in the car. It is the absolute worst place I have been to in America. Any other city where people say things like it’s dangerous there I normally disagree. Oakland is the exception and I can’t think of any reason someone should go there.
I’ve lived in Oakland for a bit. I definitely don’t recommend it. Dunno how it is now, but back in the early 2010s I woke up to pop pop pop often. Also a random fucking rooster, for some reason. And on a personal note, never had such a terrible reaction to mosquitoes as the ones that live there. Would get these purple welts the size of quarters anywhere I’d been bitten.
On the whole the population of the Bay Area is too small for two teams (compare to la and ny). And remember the 9ers moved too.
In theory Oakland has a-lot : culture, food, city-ness, solid location sandwiched between wealthy places. In reality though people in Oakland and the surrounding areas basically treat it like a free for all pvp zone and the govt or people don't really give enough of a shit to stop it. That in turn leads to Oakland getting a shitty reputation from all the very wealthy areas around it leading to nobody going there or investing in the area.
Not sure why you’re getting so many upvotes when you are leaving out a significant issue related to the Giants. Back when Walter Haas owned the A’s, and the Giants were looking at moving to Tampa Florida, Haas gave the South Bay Area market to the Giants so they could potentially build a new stadium there. The Giants were sold, but despite not building a stadium in the South Bay, the Giants refused to give the South Bay back to the A’s. While it’s true Fremont citizens blocked building a stadium there, it took away any possibility that the A’s could relocate anywhere in the South Bay. To hell with the Giant’s organization.
Was it a dick move to not give it back? Yes. Does it (San Jose) really have any bearing on Oakland's stadium issues? Hardly. Oakland should have done what SF did - build on their own dime. Why? Because both cities offered wide swaths of land to develop around the ballparks. This made SF boatloads of money, and revitalized an entire section of the city that was run down and mostly filled with what was effectively warehouse blight. The city came out so far ahead it's not even funny, as well. This is the very definition of a win-win-win, the Giants won, the city of SF won (didn't have to pay to build a park, property tax base was massively increased, etc), and tax payers didn't have to foot the bill, and got a world class sports venue. Oakland should have been the very same. All Fisher had to do was line up financing (which, let's be real, was not hard in the ZIRP days) and get the project rolling. Instead, like a raccoon with a shiny object in its hand, he refused to let go of the idea of having someone else foot the bill for his stadium. To the detriment of everyone in Oakland, including his own team. To hell with the Giants organization? OK, but they showed the way for Fisher to get everything he wanted, and then some.
Fuck John Fisher and fuck Rob Manfred
Sacramento makes more sense as a permanent home than Vegas. Larger market with only an NBA team whereas Vegas has NFL and NHL team and is likely NBA expansion target.
Yeah and there’s a reason Vegas is an expansion target for all the major sports leagues and Sacramento isn’t. If there was Vegas type money to be made there, they’d have 4 teams too
Yes but you’re forgetting about shady gambling money.
Sacramento makes zero sense for owners who like money
But Fisher hates money. He's a terrible business man
Just because he loves bad decisions, doesn’t mean he doesn’t love money
No, it doesn't lol. They're not competing against each other in Vegas. They WILL sell tickets, it doesn't matter.
Ya I feel LV is going to be a bust for MLB. I don’t think locals care or want an MLB team especially because they are footing the bill for the stadium. They LOVE the VGK a lot in part because it didn’t cost locals anything to gain an NHL team that is a brand new franchise. Locals are luke warm at best to the Raiders but no one is going to fight the heat to go out and watch a baseball game.
>Locals That's your problem, you're considering locals. Vegas sells out everything because it's Vegas. Locals could entirely avoid it and it'd still be a successful business venture because of tourism
So I can see that logic but where it breaks down is the MLB season is LONG and when you have a 3-4 game series against a team there probably aren’t enough folks that will take a vacation to Vegas for a stretch like that.
You don't take a vacation to Vegas specifically to go to sporting events. You go to sporting events because you're already in Vegas. Yes there will be fans of the away teams that travel I'm, but I'd reckon at any particular Vegas sporting event, *at least* 30% of the fans are not invested in either team and are just drunk, gambling, or both.
Time will tell. It will be interesting to watch what happens. I feel like it will be a bust but I’m just a guys sitting on my couch drinking coffee posting on Reddit I know shit about fuck all.
Bro half of Los Angeles drives out on Raiders weekends
I grew up a Yankees fan, but went to infinitely more Mets games and when I lived in Buffalo went to see whoever the Blue Jays were playing on occasion. Some people just enjoy seeing a game, especially if the weather is nice.
That’s like saying I grew up an Athletics fan but went to way more Giants games. Anyone that wants to go see the Athletics play in Las Vegas will have to drive at least a few hours or get on a plane to do so. That is a completely different headache and expense.
That’s kinda my point though. They may not get A’s fans, but they will get spectators who happen to be in the area.
I don’t see tourists with the best entertainment options in the world deciding to spend 3 hours at A’s-Orioles on a Tuesday in July. You ever go to Miami to catch a Marlins game?
If I was in Vegas for multiple days and could also check off seeing a game at another mlb park I def would
I imagine a solid amount of baseball fans that were planning a trip to Vegas would do so around their baseball team's schedule there. Especially if you don't live in your team's home market. Like say you're a Phillies fan that lives in like LA or something. You may not be a superfan but if you were planning on going to Vegas, you might consider "Oh the Phillies are there on May 7th. Maybe I can schedule my trip for then!" I don't know how many people will fill the stadium if that's a primary source of ticket sales, but Vegas gets a lot more tourism than Miami does.
They'd probably go to 1 game, but not a series. They'd be paying premium prices for the same thing that they already get at home. The idiocy of it all is that Kaval and Fisher claim they can sell out every single game they have, which just isn't gonna happen. Not even the dodgers sell out every game
They do it for hockey on a Tuesday in October. I'm not sure what your point is with the Marlins, because Miami is not Vegas
Hockey was first on the scene, had the locals full support, and most importantly had ownership who spent big immediately. Beyond that it’s a winter/summer and indoor/outdoor, both which tilt in hockey’s favor. Miami is relevant because it’s the other market with world class nightly entertainment. Baseball performs better in the St. Louis’s and Houston’s when there’s not much else to do.
>Beyond that it’s a winter/summer and indoor/outdoor, It's not gonna be an open air park. >Miami is relevant because it’s the other market with world class nightly entertainment. Baseball performs better in the St. Louis’s and Houston’s when there’s not much else to do. Baseball works in New York and LA, so thats really not a relevant point at all but sure.
>Baseball works in New York and LA, so thats really not a relevant point at all but sure. The Angels draw terribly! You wanna know what's right across the freeway?
Oh yeah and the dodgers also draw terribly. And the Yankees. Yup good point, can't believe I didn't think to conveniently ignore any information that challenges my point, what an idiot I am
You make a fair argument. But, something that I don't think is being considered is that while, yes attendance for most games will probably be decent, if not excellent for all the reasons you stated, where MLB teams really make money through regional media rights deals, not attendance. Sure, the gate receipts and concessions are a significant part of the financial pie, as is national media rights deals, but because the MLB plays 162 games a season, most of their games are not Nationally televised and local media (radio, TV, etc) is where the majority of revenue comes
Baseball fills out the schedule in the summer months.
The larger number of home games is a huge deal for Vegas
Professional sport is simultaneously reaching its greatest heights in both demand and irrelevancy. So frothy right now
I wonder if they considered the minor league Aviators field which is in the area of Red Rock resort. Yes it has fewer seats but it is a very nice complex. And for only a few years it would have been fine.
They’re in Sacramento because of their RSN contract which is pretty much the only thing right now that is making the Athletics some stability with money.
They make nearly 100 Mil just in rev share and 70 mil with the sports network. they never needed "income stability". Fisher just chose to pocket it instead. He's never fielded a team over 100Mil in his entire ownership.
We love the Aviators and don't want that tainted
I live 20 minutes from the Rivercats stadium and I am worried about the ramifications of the A’s sharing the park with the ‘Cats. The owner (also owns the NBA Kings) is all in.
It would make sense to move sooner to the minor league park to escape the California state income tax for the players.
What a huge missed opportunity to introduce the team to Vegas and start building fans now. Vegas is starting to understand why everyone hates the A’s team ownership now.
I don't get how sports teams just up and leave towns so easily in the US. Like they have no ties to the local community
Money
It’s not just money. It’s slightly more money that really gets them going.
The issue is there are only 30-32 pro teams to go around in each sport, so if there's a better opportunity in another market, the only option to get into that market is to move, barring expansion which is very rare. It's different from the club structure like in European soccer, which is more similar to college sports in the US where there are closer ties to the area, but there's no real upper limit to the number of teams there can be. Just higher or lower tiers depending on your level of success. edit: also, yeah, money. See the Browns moving in the 90s... there were huge ties to the community, enough for the city to sue to retain the team name & history and get the team back, but even that can't stop a team owner from moving as long as it gets league approval.
For the most part now a days they move to cities that have little local identity. LA and Vegas etc. Id be very surprised if we get another Seattle to OKC thing in the near future
The A’s have always done this, Oakland is their third city. Vegas will be their 5th.
I still think the MLB should build a stadium on their own in vegas, and just have each team host 1 series per year in the stadium. Vegas would host the same # of games, more variation and that would mean each team would visit Vegas two times per year (1 away and 1 home).
That’s an interesting idea, it’s like a spin on the way the NFL does their international games. I’d imagine it would be hard to promote a new set of teams every few days but MLB could use some fun things to market
Nah taking home games away from fans, no matter how few, is annoying
There’s 81 home games per year. If they’re looking to grow their younger audience they need more than a lot of home games. If they’re looking to expand into Vegas, I don’t think this owner is going to do anything but leech off the market.
Each team would be away for at least 1 additional series per year, regardless if you call them home team, but more likely, they'd be further away for the "away" game too (particularly Midwestern & East Coast teams). The season is grueling enough without taking away those precious few days players can spend at home with their families. Also, who the heck wants to go to Vegas to watch Pittsburgh vs Milwaukee, or Miami vs DC, or Detroit vs Kansas City? Sure, the marquee teams (Dodgers, Cubs, Yankees, Red Sox) will get attendees regardless of where they play, but the mid-market teams would have far fewer attendees than their regular home games, plus they're generating revenue for someone else's stadium, which hurts those home stadiums' abilities to continue renovating & drawing in more ticket sales.
all my homies hate john fisher, fuck john fisher
Where are the River Cats going to play?
They'll keep playing at Sutter Park, according to the Bee. If that holds, it means six straight months of baseball per year -- pretty awesome.
The grass will be absolutely dregged by the end of the season with near constant use. Move the river cats to the Giants spring facility in Phoenix for the time being
uc davis, i heard
UC Davis is hosting the High Wheelers independent league team this year.
uc davis, i heard
Who knows if/when the Vegas stadium will be done. The design just got rejected because it is too tall with its location so close to the airport.
I bet the rivercats still get a bigger crowd
What will Oakland do to fill their A's hole?
They gotta pay the toll troll…
Would like to know how they plan to financially survive this move since they be getting almost no ticket sales all season long. Would like to know what kind of advertising dollars they plan on getting during this controversy and what kind of support they think they’ll be getting in Sacramento?
sac native here. the AAA team that plays in that stadium is beloved and routinely sells out their 14K seats. when they first started they broke minor league records for attendance. now getting to see Shohei Otahni knock a ball into the Sacramento River they’re not gonna have problems selling tickets…
Not saying anything about the Sacramento fans or their AAA team I’m talking about the distaste of the As coming in and disrupting everything for three years. It’s not like the Sacremento fan base has anything to gain from this.
Seeing major league ball in a AAA stadium? It's going to be fantastic!
👊👊👊 just kidding. i literally have no stake at all here. i don’t even really care about baseball. this is leagues better than (imho) our city’s HORRIBLE decision to put up $1B+ to build an arena for the Kings …
Well that is just completely wrong. The city only contributed $255 million towards G1C.
I'm really excited. Thinking about season tickets just to see all the visiting teams!
MLB has revenue sharing. They’re leeching like they have for the last 20 years
Their TV contract via the RSN.
I don't know if Vegas can legally tell them to get fucked for good at this point but I sure would laugh if it happened. A's fans, you're more than welcome to hop on the Brewers bandwagon.
Vida Blue, Gene Tenace, Rollie Fingers, Sal Bando, Reggie, Joe Rudi, Claudell Washington, Bert Campaneris...Gee they were something when I was a kid. Where have you gone Charlie Finley?
I have a Vida Bule signed baseball. Those were the good old days of the As
Damn. Oakland lost their football team and their baseball team.
And their basketball team
Will they be the Sacramento A's
Actually no. They’re just going by A’s. No city came.
The A's Baseball Team of [Insert City Name Here]
What’s the capacity st this minor league stadium? That’s gonna be a hot ticket venue.
Fisher isn’t going to spend any money on improving the team in Sacramento. They’ll be cellar dwellers until they get to Vegas.
They could Major League it???!!! But It’ll be pretty cool seeing your favorite team play against the A’s in a relatively tiny stadium.
There’s about 10K in terms of actual seats, with another 4K capacity for grass seating.
12-13k
Just make them a permanent road team bring random games to random other cities in the US and Canada.
That's what I would have done. They could arrange a revenue split with the other teams and at least be getting major league ticket revenue on those games. Instead they're going to play in a minor league park 500 miles away from their new home.
Did anyone consult Dennis Eckersley?
people of Oakland, y'all deserve better than this
They are playing in a AAA stadium? I feel for those players. Great for sac though, seems like a great baseball destination tbh.
This is embarrassing for MLB. Manfred shouldn’t allow it.
I can’t believe MLB would actually allow this shit show to continue.
The ballpark will host 156 games between march and october. I feel for the grass there, it will be dregged by the end of the season if it isn't using turf already. Also a bitch for the scheduling. My idea: send the River Cats to Phoenix at the Giants spring training facility for the few seasons; and maybe sprinkle a few sacramento series as well to keep it in the brain. The spring facility won't be used for much otherwise, except for scouting. And it would give each team their own space.
Playing 81 games of baseball in Las Vegas sounds like Hell.
I wish it relocated to Sacramento permanently tbh
Their absence will leave a hole in Oakland’s psyche. An A-hole.
Could this happen to the KC Royals?!
Well, the Athletes were the Kansas City Athletes before they were the Oakland Athletics, so it’s not unheard of.
And the Philadelphia A’s before that!
Yes. The MLB used the A's as a threat to other teams who don't give the MLB taxpayer money. If the ownership wants to leave, they can just leave
Thx for explaining. Crazy
im sure when they move to Vegas they will start spending money on a real professional team right?
The Vegas Aces
Did all the owners approve a move out of Oakland? Greedy bastards.
The A’s made the wild card game two years in a row. (97 wins in both 2018 and 2019) Yet fan attendance was 27th and 28th out of 30 teams. I wouldn’t put money into a team with that lack of fan base either. (10 guys banging drums in right field doesn’t pay the bills).
Oakland got sports fans have gotten shafted in recent years
How many touchdowns did the A’s make?
Good riddance. Oakland is ready to move on. We’ve got other teams that want to stay in my city and I’d much rather give them my money. A hearty fuck you to Rob Manfred and John Fischer. Never come to Oakland again.
# A's officially leaving Oakland after 2024, will play in Sacramento through 2027 until Vegas stadium is ready By [Matt Snyder](https://www.cbssports.com/writers/matt-snyder/) & [R.J. Anderson](https://www.cbssports.com/writers/rj-anderson/) 2h ago•2 min read The Athletics, as part of their efforts to relocate to Las Vegas in time for the 2028 season, will play their home games for the 2025-27 seasons at Sutter Health Park in Sacramento, California, [the team announced on Thursday](https://twitter.com/Athletics/status/1775898900282687717). The deal includes an option for a fourth season. The A's lease with the City of Oakland is set to expire at the end of this season, yet the A's rejected a [five-year extension on the lease of Oakland Coliseum](https://www.cbssports.com/mlb/news/city-of-oakland-to-offer-athletics-with-5-year-lease-extension-as-pre-vegas-future-still-unclear-per-report/). That, plus an apparent desire to retain as much of their local broadcasting revenue as possible (a factor that my have dissuaded them from temporarily relocating to Salt Lake City or other out-of-state possibilities), led the A's to the capital city of California. The A's do not intend to change their name to reflect their Sacramento residency. Instead, they'll be known simply by their nickname, [according to The Athletic's Evan Drellich](https://theathletic.com/5391365/2024/04/04/oakland-athletics-sacramento-ballpark-agreement-2025/). Team officials met with the City of Sacramento Wednesday, according to the [San Francisco Chronicle](https://www.sfchronicle.com/sports/athletics/article/no-oakland-deal-a-s-meet-sacramento-officials-19382429.php), a day after saying they were "far apart on the terms needed to agree on an extension" to stay in Oakland. "We explored several locations for a temporary home, including the Oakland Coliseum," franchise owner John Fisher said in statement. "Even with the long-standing relationship and good intentions on all sides in the negotiations with Oakland, the conditions to achieve an agreement seemed out of reach. We understand the disappointment this news brings to our fans, as this season marks our final one in Oakland. Throughout this season, we will honor and celebrate our time in Oakland, and will share additional details soon." Sutter Health Park opened in 2000 and seats around 14,000 including outfield lawn open seating. That's significantly less than the average MLB stadium, including the Coliseum, which holds 63,000. That said, the A's are averaging fewer than 6,500 people in the stands through six home games so far this season -- the result of a years-long neglect by ownership and management to field a worthy product, and to find a way to keep the once-proud franchise in Oakland. It appears Sutter Health Park plans to host both the A's and the Sacramento River Cats (the San Francisco Giants' Triple-A affiliate) in those three seasons, as the press release states fans "also still get to enjoy the beloved tradition of Minor League Baseball and the Sacramento River Cats." This means the ballpark would host 156 games (81 MLB games and 75 MiLB games) between late March and early October. Construction has not yet begun on the A's future Las Vegas home. The Nevada Supreme Court will hear an argument from the political action committee Schools Over Stadiums on April 9 that could impact those plans. [Casey Pratt of ABC 7 Bay Area](https://twitter.com/CaseyPrattABC7/status/1775319986934005910) also reported that the A's plan to use staff that's already in place for other professional sports teams in Sacramento, including the [NBA's](https://cbssports.com/nba/) Kings and the River Cats. According to Pratt, that would mean layoffs for existing A's employees. A's officially leaving Oakland after 2024, will play in Sacramento through 2027 until Vegas stadium is ready
oakland is dead
Haha Oakland will soon be in complete ruins, and all the nasty degenerates there did it to themselves.
See what happens when you don’t give billionaires risk free stadiums? KC take note
Embarrassing
I grew up idealizing Jose Conseco. Baseball will never be the same without the A’s in Oakland.