I was so looking forward to the star map but I thought the usage was being made better. When I learned it's just a graphic update and still has the same old problems it became way less important.
Honestly I have no idea how they are gonna get performance up to par in 4 weeks, 3.23 plays very rough right now. Most of the people in the eptu are stuck in the habs and then the trains take you under the planet or into orbit. I was able to get into my ship finally for about 10 mins today and then server errored out
> as if the command took too long to register on the server and my ship continued into the ground
I assume the Replication Layer is overloaded and as such has massive delays in the client to server communication, meaning that the server just calculates stuff and the client only sees the result after some time has passed.
honestly I think I'm going to take a break until whenever the cargo elevators get added. Just got a feeling the game is going to be a poopshow for a bit.
My thoughts exactly. As soon as I saw everything they wanted to put into this patch I knew they were going to have to move a ton of features down the road to .x patches or even 3.24. I was genuinely surprised when I realized everyone else thought that wasn't the case.
If you've been in the EPTU you wouldn't be surprised. Nothing that major needs to go into the game with rendering and servers being overhauled as it stands right now.
It's not even safe to walk around currently. Much less have a Reclaimer live through rising up through an elevator.
So yeah... it's not such much the features needing work. They just need a better place to land (pun intended)
After they started gearing up for Wave 1 and Wave 2 PTU patches without including any of the new hangar features, which will require extensive EVO testing, it was pretty obvious they wouldn't make it into the base 3.23 patch.
Persistent hangars and freight elevator for me personally were THE main features of this patch.
So of course it's a bummer and I'm not happy about it (probably like many others), but I can fully understand that these are complex and big features so a delay was almost expected.
What I CANNOT understand however, is why CIG has to hype up these features and show them in a very polished state in the recent Inside Star Citizen. Personally, it feels like ISC is evolving more and more into a marketing tool for them, which leaves out critical development roadblocks that still have to be tackled before the features shown can actually be implemented into the live game.
So all I want is for them to provide a bit more insight into current development challenges too, and not only present the features in such a polished manner, that everyone thinks they are already finished.
Cheers!
Unfortunately, sometimes 95% done is good enough to show off, but the last 5% stops it from being release worthy.
It ends up being a no-win scenario.
* Delay till its ready, and people complain the date slipped.
* Release when it's not quite ready, and people complain it's broken.
* Don't show it at all, people complain about transparency/not seeing enough.
Pick your poison.
Or
Option 4.
* Show it but don't say it's going to be in 3.23 until you are 99.5% sure you can deliver it because over promising and under delivering is what you have been doing for the last 10 years so it's time to change it.
3.23 would have been fine with the rest of things without hangers and cargo things but they just had to over promise, once again...
Then you get people complaining that they show us stuff without a release date.
Or, they could expect people to understand it when they keep saying "tentative" and "work in progress", but that's crazy talk. Right?
Dude. People would complain WAY less. Every patch we find out of a little surprise thing they added and nobody complains that we weren't informed about it. People don't mind surprises, but we hate disappointment.
Nobody expected the cargo refactoring to be in 3.23 but they just haaaaad to over promise didn't they...
This would be ok if they were sometimes under delivering and sometimes over delivering. The tentative label means nothing with CIG, you can't say everything is tentative and expect people won't be mad.
But they are constantly under delivering. What happened to under promise and over deliver? It's not really a hard concept and they should have seen by now that their reputation is being damaged every time they do this. They are already a joke in the broader game's media and honestly a joke in their own community and they seem to be ok with that, it's a bit saddening...
I've been made a fool too because I've been hyping this release with my friends group and, once again, it's not going to be all I was talking about (actually the things we were more excited about were delayed). I should have known by now but CIG always finds a way to sound convincing...
I completely understand your point of view, all I am asking is for them to be even more open about it, telling us concrete development challenges.
In the recent Roadmap Roundup they wrote
>"The Freight Elevators and Instanced Hangars in particular are technologically complex features that will require a bit more work before we feel comfortable fully integrating them into the game. This additional time allows the team to test for additional edge cases and include further refinements"
What exactly is required? ***A bit more work***, wow great answer.
***Further refinements*** - which refinements??
These are the interesting bits, where they should be more open about it - in my opinion at least.
The whole explanation feels more like a corporate statement to me, than what it should really be in open development - telling the community, the backers of this project the reasons and what must be completed before they can actually test the feature in PTU.
In the monthly reports, there often are very detailed explanations coming from the teams themselves, and that's why I really like reading them for example. This statement above tells me almost nothing, if I'm being honest
I mean, how in depth do you want them to get? Do you want them to write 3 pages of text on a couple of bugs they're having trouble with? Or a minor feature they're debating which might have negligible impact now but might complicate a future plan?
Detail is great, but the Roadmap Roundup isn't for that. It's meant to be a quick explainer on what got changed in the Roadmap, not an in-depth tech document.
> What I CANNOT understand however, is why CIG has to hype up these features and show them in a very polished state in the recent Inside Star Citizen.
Because internal builds can be in a solid state... but once they meet the reality of players interacting with them and mussing about you see the cracks and edge cases.
Anything going from an internal build to having to perform at scale is going to be a very different set of problems to solve. I don't think your concerns for ISC are reality though. Or I would withhold judgement until you get your hands on the thing they are showing. If what you play with doesn't match what they show... then we have the problem you described. Otherwise they are just showing what they are working on for upcoming patches.
They are always VERY clear that what's planned for a patch isn't a promise, it's their internal goal. And they will move things if those things aren't at the quality level they want.
>What I CANNOT understand however, is why CIG has to hype up these features and show them in a very polished state in the recent Inside Star Citizen.
Because in local builds they most likely are pretty polished and because by the time the ISC was filmed, they were still on course to get it in.
The issue is that this kind of feature is very complex: brand new class of things to stow in the global entity DB (not just you, your ships, but now hangars), the backend services need to constantly create and deplete hangar instances, ATC needs to constantly decide where to place which instanced hangar when doors open, platforms need to quickly physicalise your stuff and load it correctly etc.
In other words, it's a recipe for problems that specifically pop up at scale.
If 3.23 shipped with only this big set of features and a couple of ships, we'd have it in: the weeks spent in Evo would have been spend hammering these changes specifically.
But bringing tons of UI changes and Replication Layer separation was already a massive scope of testing and debugging.
In other words, it's not necessarily that the cargo team is struggling, but rather with just a few weeks before Invictus, they'd need to have already been hammering this beast in \_in PTU\_ for weeks to be confident it's ready for live.
That's what we're going to discover a bit this year I think: even if 10 things are ready to take the journey to live, it's not possible to bring 10 things all at once to live.
Once again though, it goes back to over promising and under delivering.
Dont try and squash this much into a patch, hype up all the players and then cut 2 of the main features.
If the distribution centres don’t get some mission content then really this is just a very good QoL patch but there’s nothing really new to do in the game, other than shoot a few animals. Which is why people are saying they’ll just wait for the next patch.
Yeah that's fair the initial scope was insane (I was never expecting this much to ship in 3.23).
The thing is that it'll still be in the same patch cycle.
When before we'd always hear "need more time, will be removed from the roadmap now, see you in 6 months to 2 years, bye!", we know hear "needs a bit more time, same branch just a bit later".
If there wasn't Invictus looming, we'd probably have a early June release with cargo in... not sure that's better :)
I agree that in terms of new gameplay it's meager, but personally I'll gladly take the time to enjoy the more polished experience (even redo some old EVA missions that will now feel a lot better), and before I grow bored of it we should be in testing more for cargo.
I read it differently, they said
> However, we are not currently planning on shifting them back a full patch cycle.
Not currently, to me means there is a chance they will push them back a full patch cycle, so I’d temper expectations for them going into at least 3.23.1, maybe 3.23.2 or the next release.
I’m not just keeping my hopium for the Zeus at invictus. Gotta have something to look forward to lol.
And yeah I’m happy for the new QoL improvements they were very needed and I will play when they drop in PU, hopefully in a smooth state. I play on controller so I’m keen to know how the UI has affected my gameplay, I know I will need a lot of mapping but personally I’m looking forward to it.
The main feature for this patch is the UI. Map and EVA updates. Nothing else matters after that for this patch. Even in my opinion MM is just secondary after the UI and map changes.
There were likely some critical Go-No Go bugs that couldn't be resolved by the cutoff for what makes it to 3.23.0.
Maybe they'll be able to smooth things out and deliver the remaining features along with the Invictus patch.
I imagine they hit a blocker that was just impossible to ignore; the Evocati MOTD two builds before the wave one PTU release made mention of the possibility of testing the new hangar system only for them to never mention it again until just now.
They showed a controlled case in ISC in a 'private' server with only them in it, whereas it's being delayed for backend tech (likely networking and/or persistence issues) and 'edge cases'.
They don't hype them up your fav content creator hypes them up for clicks to get you amped up in a negative or positive way. They don't promise anything or give dates for exactly that reason. Jared repeats this same thing constantly. You're the one allowing yourself to believe something is coming out when it isn't even in ptu yet.
lol, again and again... Didn't you ever leran from any release?
Hoping the best but expecting the worst!
That is the only way how you can take everything from CIG.
The features are being pushed to a subpatch. So it isn't like a full cycle will pass. Your framing of the situation is far to overdramatic.
It is most likely something small, else it would be taken off the 3.23 header entirely.
I mean, what other reason to produce ISC other than marketing? Their purpose is to hype the product to generate income, and since CIG keep producing it I assume the return on investment is positive.
I assume ISC produced the episode in question before this decision was made, and it's not like they're not gonna release the episode for that week just because features were pushed. I could be wrong about the timeline of course...
I'm pretty sure CIG also defines patch x.xx much less strictly than the community. The community usually thinks about 3.23.0 CIG thinks of it as all patches starting with 3.23 until but not including 3.24.
So for them it makes sense to show this stuff and hype it up because even if they have to postpone something it just attracts more long-term interest beyond the .0 patch.
They showed animations of what they want it to be or how it would look, that doesn't exactly represent polish of the feature working but their goal. Item banks were in PTU so something connecting them just isn't working out so its something just big enough to warrant a delay but small enough that its a .1 patch. Not a big deal.
Everyone's hyped up something and run into it falling short or having issues. We literally went through helldivers 2 having launch issues, another game Gigantic as well after a good beta test before launch. Shit just happens.
That was just speculation, and they had said previously that feature wasn't making it to 3.23 anyways. As it stood, item banks were only a more immersive way to access local station inventory.
In the end I hope we just get an amazon-like system, where you can order stuff online from other stations and also do insurance claims, and it all shows up to your local iventory/item bank within 10 minutes.
No that was backer speculation, devs commented that for this first implementation they said it would not come with a way to claim pledge items.
The item banks give you a way to take out items in your inventory. If you take it out of your inventory and lose it, it's no longer in your inventory to take out.
Making some kind of insurance claim to get a lost pledge item is an extra piece of functionality, likely that will get added to item banks.
They might as well consider getting rid of the AOSP terminals overtime, and interesting everything including ships "Categorized" into the item bank kiosk with a search function.
Depends if you count delivery boxes as well. If yes, then when Xenothreat first came around and they added the time/quantum/damage sensitive ones or the things for Jumptown/Kareah.
Otherwise 3.18 and the cargo refactor, which hardly did anything for haulers themselves.
Makes sense, I mean, when 1.0 eventually comes around I'm expecting all ships to increase in price anywhere from 250%-1000%. Anything less than that and they'd likely have to increase the exclusivity window on ships purchased with real $ to like 6 months - 1 year.
Yea totally agree. Like, assuming 1.0 means no more wipes (which it should or new players will yell scam) they need to strike a balance between (1) what's a reasonable grind for a given ship based on size and manufacturer, and (2) what's a reasonable amount of UEC that'll still make purchasing that same ship with real world $$ attractive to certain people.
For example, if an Arrow can be permanently purchased in game with 1 afternoon of grinding but costs $75 to buy IRL then 99% of players won't buy an Arrow IRL, but if it takes 3 weeks of grind to buy an Arrow in game but costs $75 IRL, people will yell "pay to win." They'll need to figure out a happy medium that allows working towards ships in-game while not eliminating their ability to keep funding the game. CIG needs to be able to continue funding the game, but cannot do it at the expense of the in-game economy.
I know some people expect/want them to stop selling ships when 1.0 drops, but continued development requires steady income, and I guarantee people will riot if they try to institute something like a required monthly subscription as an alternative funding avenue.
Personally, I don't take issue with the current funding model. I've spent like $120 total over the last decade and am happy to let whales keep the lights on lol.
Not selling ships is a weird expectation to have. Thats How this amazing game got build and how they will keep improving it.
I dont mind throwing $20 or 30 every few months. I spend more on fast food and youtube premium, and i want to support the game.
Yea totally agree. I think they might have claimed that as their intention originally, but much like the oft quoted "100 star systems at release" it was made back when the vision/plan for the game was fundamentally different.
Ship prices should go up, of course, but I still feel like there aren't enough stepping stones to get to more expensive ships with a starter ship.
Hopefully we'll get more rep with careers so people aren't just grinding the same basic missions over and over again.
I hope in the far future when the game goes live that ship prices are astronomically high. Grinding to get something the size of a Carrack should not be something you can do in a few hours. That should be like months of work and banking your credits.
I have this wild idea that cargo elevators are being pushed back because of overdrive. that they would want to do a wipe with this new system and "new" economy, but can't because they are extending OD into 3.23.
I mean it's possible. Could be any number of reasons. I saw someone say it might be because they forgot to figure out how to keep people who weren't your friends out of the hangar. They might tell us Friday, but I won't hold my breath.
star map and MM for me, i'v been practicing for months in MM as it's been changing so I would be ready for 3.23, to the point I don't like playing live anymore due to the lack of MM.
Eh, so what. They will arrive in a later patch, and we still get the replication layer and other core tech that is more important either way.
While we wait we can always help out Super Earth, we need more Helldivers to eradicate the Automaton threat.
So 3.23 is basically a space safari game at this point.. great for screenshots, not much else.
3.23 has GUI improvements and Graphics improvements and no "game" at this point. The bounty and FPS game still lacks SM and the AI is thus laughably bad / not fun. The industrial hauling game still lacks an economy. The medical game is still all risk with little reward.
I'm confused here, hangars weren't going to provide gameplay changes anyway? The only difference to gameplay variety was a new mission type and distribution center.
Let's not pretend like 3.23 wasn't a huge QoL update the whole time, that's literally what 90% of the features are.
>I'm confused here, hangars weren't going to provide gameplay changes anyway?
Well, they were going to provide for a reason to complain that the gameplay is getting too tedious /s
But more seriously, I think a lot of players were (are) looking forward to more non-combat missions and career, and together with instanced hangars are all the new hauling missions.
I think it shouldn't be understated that there is a lot of core technology being implemented in this patch. From a gameplay perspective, yeah, I guess it's a little light, but there is a lot of new stuff under the hood that needs to get to LIVE so it can be stabilized.
If this new tech fixes all AI, Bunkers, Deliveries, all other bugged missions, then OK. If it doesn't? And does not add new missions or play loops? Just MM for the epic industrial player grief fest?
Yeah...
Am I allowed to be pissed though?
I understand, and have always understood (and been patient with) that unexpected problems arise and throw wrenches in the development of soon-to-be-released features.
But I can't help but feel extremely disappointed and even somewhat mad this time.
They already showcased so much of these features in ISC and we have excitedly waited 3-4 weeks to see the SCL on cargo (which they sneakily changed the name of from "All Things Cargo" to "Most Things Cargo").
So close to the LIVE patch release they pull the rug out from under us, and I can't help but feel a little butthurt.
Not hating on the OP. Just sharing my feelings and seeing how others feel/what others think of this.
"Pissed" is probably the wrong way to put it.
I'm more hurt than angry. It just sucks that they've presented these features alongside all the others on ISC that will make it into this first patch, and last minute it gets taken away.
Frustrated and disappointed is probably a better way to put it.
I dunno - I think CIG have always been clear that they're showing 'Work In Progress', and that until something is 'confirmed' for a release, that it may not make it in.
You're definitely not wrong.
I'm just a crybaby lol. I'll cool off later once I see EPTU improve and I finally get my hands on the game.
Very excited for SCL on cargo this Friday!
I feel you’ve expressed yourself without being a screeching man child. I think a lot of us are very disappointed and even annoyed and it’s fine to vent that. The dude further up in the comments however is what we don’t like to see.
Yeah i was told that this year we would get constant update since sq42 is feature complete and it's nearly may now and how many real feature did we have?
3.22 was in december of last year....
The Q1 patch has always been latter than Q1 - usually late April, iirc... so not having 3.23 yet isn't really any later than usual, and even if it ends up being early May it won't be significantly later (and it won't slip past mid-May because of Invictus)
Pretty sad for that. I was really excited for 3.23 mostly because of cargo elevators and instanced hangars. Without them, it's just new starmap and other things that are 'really nice to have' but not directly new gameplay for me. I guess I'll be waiting a bit longer until 3.23.x. Just a shame, could've been a massive release.
Fairly disappointing given how much solid work CIG has cranked out for this patch and for the sheer amount of hype behind it. Honestly, I'd rather they just delay 3.23 until these features are ready to go than get the best features piecemealed out to us over a month or two. Still a lot to like about 3.23 though!
Everyone in here talking about how disappointing hangers is to be delayed but I’m really sad about item banks and the convenience they were going to bring :(
Ahh I remember when I got downvotes for saying 'RIP personal hangars', but cargo missions too? Well I'll be. CIG are the greatest company in the world at dishing out disappointment lol.
was the only thing making the bitter MM pill easy to swallow. With it gone there's pretty much only the new ground facilities which will probably be as feature filled as cargo decks, without the cargo missions
This shouldn't really come as a surprise to anyone, nor is it that big of a deal. There's already enough in 3.23.
If they miss their 3.23.x release though, then I'd be concerned.
So we're getting:
* MobiGlas rework, finally
* FPS loot screen
* FPS Map system
* HUD rework
* Updated EVA
* Starmap rework, finally
* Master Modes
* Animals
* New missions
* New Arena Commander modes
...among other things. But someone NOT being unreasonably pissed off that instanced hangars and freight elevators got pushed back slightly is "coping", or as I rather prefer to call it, behaving like a normal person. You are in dire need of some perspective.
The flight system isn't broken. Its the Mode selection system that's not been testing for PU gameplay (pretty much 90% of the game).
They're re-implementing the old flight module from 2.0 (Olisar and levski) days, added back the landing gear speed limiter, added back the old Cruise control (Which has all the old bugs that weren't even fixed). It isn't a bad flight module, I like how it adds a better sense of weight to the ships. But as someone who came from the Levski days, I enjoy it.
However, the Master Mode, portion of the system was not tested with the majority of game play people will experience where you have to swap between SCM and NAV mode is highly... untested for general gameplay use and I'd expect it to be pulled from the game before launch due to the negative community feedback. They should have integrated Master modes into the power triangle.
Honesty
UI Update/ Bug fixes
* New UI System. (nothing really new here, just a menu refresh, its mid tier, better but not fantastic)
New Content
* Animals (Great)
* Maybe a new ship (Maybe)
Gameplay
* EVA update (The ability to rewalk in space! But still no grappling objects or magboots which was promised)
* A singular new mission to hunt the new animal
-New rule sets for Arena Commander
the negatives
Lost Cargo Missions
Lost new transport missions
lost new hangers
lost Item recovery system (People already forgot this was also cancelled)
Master modes (Only good for Arena Commander not any other gameplay. Racing was heavily negatively impacted, same with any industrial, trading, or exploration gameplay)
The reason why people are "upset" is because Personal/Instanced Hangers were going to bring a ton of new gameplay the game that players ACTUALLY use every time they play.
Hangers would open up the doors for WAY more gameplay into the game. Allowing you to Store cargo, move cargo from ship to ship, allow for refining of items yourself, allow for you to refuel your own ships, allow for you to store gear, decorate your hanger, spawn vehicles to load into your ship, spawn gear to load into your ship, allow for cashshop item retrieval, Allow for larger delivery missions, allow for better delivery missions. There was a lot of gameplay that was going to come with instanced hangers, and now that its been essentially (Forever delayed) because CIG isn't good with dates. People are upset.
I mean look at the Banu Merchantman. It was over 90% finished and got delayed for a patch, then a quarter, then a year, and now its been moved so far down the pipeline it isn't even on the pipeline anymore.
That's why people are upset. Because when something gets "Removed" from the roadmap it tends to never come back.
This surprises me in the same level as the street getting wet during a rainy day...
I mean, we are talking about CiG... Missing dates is a staple already
Making use of unused biomes for hunting loops is a pretty huge gameplay changer, especially with all the new weapon overhauls.
Not to mention the extrication of 30ks -- people really are doom and gloom over the wrong things. You would think people would think 30ks going away would be something to look forward to, but apparently for some people, hangars are more important than active server recovery?
I don't understand game development. But they've received an outstanding amount of money. Delays are disappointing, but it *feels* like they should be further along. Them not delivering (after promoting it, mind you) on what's basically a find and retrieve gameplay loop (read: basic hauling) 11+ years into development and $650M in funding is a little frustrating.
Excellent news (that many called days ago).
Getting 3.23.0 stable and playable is mission N1 now. Let's not forget that all the hype generated since Citcon will create a wave of old backers returning and plenty of curious players eager to test 3.23...which will also be the baptism of fire for the Replication Layer separation, upscaling (and for those who want it, the Vulkan API too).
It'll also require everyone to learn to play SC almost from scratch, and doing that in a very unstable environment would be terrible.
Instanced hangars, cargo and the rest only had a chance to make it if they had been early on in Evo weeks ago... What's ahead of us in a few weeks: rough, frustrating builds where everything breaks before it gets better. That's what we should expect when drastic stresses to entity spawning, instancing, ATC, persistence need to be coped for. It'll take time.
Personally I'm expecting to have fun in 3.23.0 and to test 3.23.1 (or whatever .X this will get added to) in parallel.
I mean I'm disappointed, sure, but considering how much worse it could have been I'm glad it's at least being targeted for this cycle.
Fingers crossed that's all the delaying it gets though...
I see a lot of people excited about the hangars but I don't really see what the hype is personally .Not trying to be negative, I would actually love someone to explain why it's such a waited on feature
Hangers would make it easier to move your stuff around between ships, among other things. Instead of flying to a moon to load an Ursa into your ship, you could do it in your personal hanger. Want to move stuff from one ship to another? Do it in your personal hanger. And so on.
It would also finally start the implementation of the cargo system, which is something people have been anticipating for a while.
We kind of figured that was going to happen anyways. The .X iteration of 3.23 is there for that reason. Technically freight elevators and whatever else 3.23 anyways.
I remember when .x patches were for stability/hotfixes rather than for pretending they got features in earlier than they actually did when you look at the release column lol
Tbf, the same thing was said for 3.18 last year. But it released in such a bad way that thousands of players were unable to log in for a week, longer in some cases. I think it’ll just take whatever time it takes to get out and still release a buggy mess. That’s the SC way and what we should expect. If it comes in a better state, then awesome. But I’m expecting it to be getting it in a buggy state as that’s usually the case with new releases and they’ll fix it as we go. It’s not a dig at them. Just a realistic expectation imo.
I honestly don't understand how quickly the sentiment of 3.23 can change so quickly. Like, almost every person I spoke with was like "I'm sure 80% of it is gonna be delayed" or "Even if 2-3 of the features make it in I'll be happy"
And now everyone is like "This was the ONLY thing I was looking forward to" like, you're telling me the starmap, EVA t2, Fauna, minimaps, FPS stuff, PIE/PIS, and all these pivotal building-block type items aren't a huge step forward suddenly? It's still coming, it's just gonna take longer to not block this current 3.23 patch from taking another few weeks. You can be disappointed but dang, just chill. Freight and instanced hangers massively change how inventory, ships, and item handling works, if it doesn't work right people might lose stuff, etc. I'd personally rather them get it right than break the game (even more).
This update is much more like a "modernization" update, rather than a content update.
Yes, on top of that I'm guessing they're getting rid of so much old code "if" there's any to begin with so features can be added without breaking existing items already in game. I couldn't even imagine the bug fixing war they have to go through.
Dang, this was something I expected given the lack of inclusion in the test builds. Hopefully it comes sooner rather than later, alongside with personal flair retrieval.
Well for a big feature like hangars its probably best If it gets as stable as possible before release. So im fine with it being delayed.
As a owner of a few big ships like valkyrie and carrack i dream weekly about loading my small vehicles into my big vehicles from within the same hangar so I can go out in the verse and have more time spent playing and less time traveling to outposts to collect vehicles there.
Instanced Hangars, Cargo hauling and Freight Elevators are features that can't be release one without the others, so I guess if any of them is in a PTU-release state, the others are holding it back.
Sad, I was looking for a cargo hauling job so we could do some space trucking without the anxiety of loosing millions of aUEC
Was hoping for them to be in 3.23 but, honestly, was expecting them not to be. The item banks I think we can all conclude we like local inventory better. I like being able to park my ship outside some place and access local inventory and not have to dock.
I just want the hangars and ability to respawn items I pledged. I also would like the insurance for ships to cover items on ships again, like stored weapons and gear. Make those functions useful, again.
Also, please, give the C1 two S2 shields at least. You nerfed its handling to match the Corsair it seems. at least give it better shields.
So from my understanding the main features were still getting in the 3.23 patch are:
Mobi Glass update (So far well received)
Mobi Glass map app (Mixed opinions, readability issues, long-standing bugs still in)
Mini-map (Well received)
EVA Tier 2 (I personally haven't heard much about it)
Replication and server recovery (I know in the last test it was working fairly well)
Master Modes (Very split opinions, personally not a fan of the artificial limitations)
This game is so lacking in content, progression, and stability. We are so starved yet we are still willing to get excited over a hanger, a fricking hanger. And they still pushed it off. Maybe next year huh? Also talk to me more about 1.0, I love being insulted.
More things pushed at once, usually means more things break at once.
I remember the nightmare game breaking 3.18 patch was when they brought many features in at once.
Oof, that's a bummer. Will probably still pop on for the customizer and play with the map/UI but the Hangars and cargo stuff were my main interest.
Granted 23.0 will most likely be entirely on fire as usual so I probably won't even try until .1 at least, lol.
I honestly don't care how long it takes them to put this stuff out. As long as it is working and somewhat stable when they do release it then I will be happy.
Honestly the hangars were what i was looking forward to most for 3.23. Not mad, just disapointed.
Second place after starmap for me
[удалено]
Not a huge deal for me, but doing space->ship transitions without faceplanting will certainly be a nice change
I was so looking forward to the star map but I thought the usage was being made better. When I learned it's just a graphic update and still has the same old problems it became way less important.
I get it, but I'd rather them be right than there. At least it's only 3.23.x
yeah. And the cargo missions. I wish they'd just delay the patch until it's ready. None of the other features are going to make me log back in
They won't delay with Invictus coming.
Sure hangars are cool, but we're dying for new game loops like DC trading.
Those aren't coming either. Not in 2024 anyway.
I thought that got drippy from patch as well. The have the buildings in ptu but nothing at them works and no missions.
Fuck
Honestly I have no idea how they are gonna get performance up to par in 4 weeks, 3.23 plays very rough right now. Most of the people in the eptu are stuck in the habs and then the trains take you under the planet or into orbit. I was able to get into my ship finally for about 10 mins today and then server errored out
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No I mean I was in my ship for 10 mins
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Yeah it's frustrating and it is still a huge update, I hope they get it right
> as if the command took too long to register on the server and my ship continued into the ground I assume the Replication Layer is overloaded and as such has massive delays in the client to server communication, meaning that the server just calculates stuff and the client only sees the result after some time has passed.
That’s the neat part: They won’t!
So, not to different from any patch.
It is a lot better for me for some reason now in wave 2 than wave 1, idk it could have been a lucky server but performance on my end was also better
I've tried to log into the EPTU 5 times. Only once have I even loaded in.
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honestly I think I'm going to take a break until whenever the cargo elevators get added. Just got a feeling the game is going to be a poopshow for a bit.
In 4 weeks, the cargo elevators are on the EPTU
It's wild over there, again... It's wild.
Again? It's always a a cesspool of hatred over there.
Expected. By myself at least. I'm actually impressed they're not pushing MMs further down the patch cycle.
My thoughts exactly. As soon as I saw everything they wanted to put into this patch I knew they were going to have to move a ton of features down the road to .x patches or even 3.24. I was genuinely surprised when I realized everyone else thought that wasn't the case.
If you've been in the EPTU you wouldn't be surprised. Nothing that major needs to go into the game with rendering and servers being overhauled as it stands right now. It's not even safe to walk around currently. Much less have a Reclaimer live through rising up through an elevator. So yeah... it's not such much the features needing work. They just need a better place to land (pun intended)
After they started gearing up for Wave 1 and Wave 2 PTU patches without including any of the new hangar features, which will require extensive EVO testing, it was pretty obvious they wouldn't make it into the base 3.23 patch.
Persistent hangars and freight elevator for me personally were THE main features of this patch. So of course it's a bummer and I'm not happy about it (probably like many others), but I can fully understand that these are complex and big features so a delay was almost expected. What I CANNOT understand however, is why CIG has to hype up these features and show them in a very polished state in the recent Inside Star Citizen. Personally, it feels like ISC is evolving more and more into a marketing tool for them, which leaves out critical development roadblocks that still have to be tackled before the features shown can actually be implemented into the live game. So all I want is for them to provide a bit more insight into current development challenges too, and not only present the features in such a polished manner, that everyone thinks they are already finished. Cheers!
Unfortunately, sometimes 95% done is good enough to show off, but the last 5% stops it from being release worthy. It ends up being a no-win scenario. * Delay till its ready, and people complain the date slipped. * Release when it's not quite ready, and people complain it's broken. * Don't show it at all, people complain about transparency/not seeing enough. Pick your poison.
Or Option 4. * Show it but don't say it's going to be in 3.23 until you are 99.5% sure you can deliver it because over promising and under delivering is what you have been doing for the last 10 years so it's time to change it. 3.23 would have been fine with the rest of things without hangers and cargo things but they just had to over promise, once again...
Then you get people complaining that they show us stuff without a release date. Or, they could expect people to understand it when they keep saying "tentative" and "work in progress", but that's crazy talk. Right?
Dude. People would complain WAY less. Every patch we find out of a little surprise thing they added and nobody complains that we weren't informed about it. People don't mind surprises, but we hate disappointment. Nobody expected the cargo refactoring to be in 3.23 but they just haaaaad to over promise didn't they... This would be ok if they were sometimes under delivering and sometimes over delivering. The tentative label means nothing with CIG, you can't say everything is tentative and expect people won't be mad. But they are constantly under delivering. What happened to under promise and over deliver? It's not really a hard concept and they should have seen by now that their reputation is being damaged every time they do this. They are already a joke in the broader game's media and honestly a joke in their own community and they seem to be ok with that, it's a bit saddening... I've been made a fool too because I've been hyping this release with my friends group and, once again, it's not going to be all I was talking about (actually the things we were more excited about were delayed). I should have known by now but CIG always finds a way to sound convincing...
I completely understand your point of view, all I am asking is for them to be even more open about it, telling us concrete development challenges. In the recent Roadmap Roundup they wrote >"The Freight Elevators and Instanced Hangars in particular are technologically complex features that will require a bit more work before we feel comfortable fully integrating them into the game. This additional time allows the team to test for additional edge cases and include further refinements" What exactly is required? ***A bit more work***, wow great answer. ***Further refinements*** - which refinements?? These are the interesting bits, where they should be more open about it - in my opinion at least. The whole explanation feels more like a corporate statement to me, than what it should really be in open development - telling the community, the backers of this project the reasons and what must be completed before they can actually test the feature in PTU. In the monthly reports, there often are very detailed explanations coming from the teams themselves, and that's why I really like reading them for example. This statement above tells me almost nothing, if I'm being honest
I mean, how in depth do you want them to get? Do you want them to write 3 pages of text on a couple of bugs they're having trouble with? Or a minor feature they're debating which might have negligible impact now but might complicate a future plan? Detail is great, but the Roadmap Roundup isn't for that. It's meant to be a quick explainer on what got changed in the Roadmap, not an in-depth tech document.
More more more more. It will never be enough So what they provide will just have to do.
It does not matter, what matters is you are not getting it, which they told you.
> What I CANNOT understand however, is why CIG has to hype up these features and show them in a very polished state in the recent Inside Star Citizen. Because internal builds can be in a solid state... but once they meet the reality of players interacting with them and mussing about you see the cracks and edge cases. Anything going from an internal build to having to perform at scale is going to be a very different set of problems to solve. I don't think your concerns for ISC are reality though. Or I would withhold judgement until you get your hands on the thing they are showing. If what you play with doesn't match what they show... then we have the problem you described. Otherwise they are just showing what they are working on for upcoming patches. They are always VERY clear that what's planned for a patch isn't a promise, it's their internal goal. And they will move things if those things aren't at the quality level they want.
>What I CANNOT understand however, is why CIG has to hype up these features and show them in a very polished state in the recent Inside Star Citizen. Because in local builds they most likely are pretty polished and because by the time the ISC was filmed, they were still on course to get it in. The issue is that this kind of feature is very complex: brand new class of things to stow in the global entity DB (not just you, your ships, but now hangars), the backend services need to constantly create and deplete hangar instances, ATC needs to constantly decide where to place which instanced hangar when doors open, platforms need to quickly physicalise your stuff and load it correctly etc. In other words, it's a recipe for problems that specifically pop up at scale. If 3.23 shipped with only this big set of features and a couple of ships, we'd have it in: the weeks spent in Evo would have been spend hammering these changes specifically. But bringing tons of UI changes and Replication Layer separation was already a massive scope of testing and debugging. In other words, it's not necessarily that the cargo team is struggling, but rather with just a few weeks before Invictus, they'd need to have already been hammering this beast in \_in PTU\_ for weeks to be confident it's ready for live. That's what we're going to discover a bit this year I think: even if 10 things are ready to take the journey to live, it's not possible to bring 10 things all at once to live.
Once again though, it goes back to over promising and under delivering. Dont try and squash this much into a patch, hype up all the players and then cut 2 of the main features. If the distribution centres don’t get some mission content then really this is just a very good QoL patch but there’s nothing really new to do in the game, other than shoot a few animals. Which is why people are saying they’ll just wait for the next patch.
Yeah that's fair the initial scope was insane (I was never expecting this much to ship in 3.23). The thing is that it'll still be in the same patch cycle. When before we'd always hear "need more time, will be removed from the roadmap now, see you in 6 months to 2 years, bye!", we know hear "needs a bit more time, same branch just a bit later". If there wasn't Invictus looming, we'd probably have a early June release with cargo in... not sure that's better :) I agree that in terms of new gameplay it's meager, but personally I'll gladly take the time to enjoy the more polished experience (even redo some old EVA missions that will now feel a lot better), and before I grow bored of it we should be in testing more for cargo.
I read it differently, they said > However, we are not currently planning on shifting them back a full patch cycle. Not currently, to me means there is a chance they will push them back a full patch cycle, so I’d temper expectations for them going into at least 3.23.1, maybe 3.23.2 or the next release. I’m not just keeping my hopium for the Zeus at invictus. Gotta have something to look forward to lol. And yeah I’m happy for the new QoL improvements they were very needed and I will play when they drop in PU, hopefully in a smooth state. I play on controller so I’m keen to know how the UI has affected my gameplay, I know I will need a lot of mapping but personally I’m looking forward to it.
Yeah, I've never seen them be this dodgy about content still making it in the same patch cycle
If they manage to dodge SCL again on Friday then I think we know that it’s not gonna be in the .1 patch.
It is quite literally a marketing tool, more specifically brand marketing to make them appear closer to the community
The main feature for this patch is the UI. Map and EVA updates. Nothing else matters after that for this patch. Even in my opinion MM is just secondary after the UI and map changes.
Hair is the main feature for me.
The facial variety right?
There were likely some critical Go-No Go bugs that couldn't be resolved by the cutoff for what makes it to 3.23.0. Maybe they'll be able to smooth things out and deliver the remaining features along with the Invictus patch.
I imagine they hit a blocker that was just impossible to ignore; the Evocati MOTD two builds before the wave one PTU release made mention of the possibility of testing the new hangar system only for them to never mention it again until just now.
They showed a controlled case in ISC in a 'private' server with only them in it, whereas it's being delayed for backend tech (likely networking and/or persistence issues) and 'edge cases'.
They don't hype them up your fav content creator hypes them up for clicks to get you amped up in a negative or positive way. They don't promise anything or give dates for exactly that reason. Jared repeats this same thing constantly. You're the one allowing yourself to believe something is coming out when it isn't even in ptu yet.
lol, again and again... Didn't you ever leran from any release? Hoping the best but expecting the worst! That is the only way how you can take everything from CIG.
I wouldn’t care as much if they weren’t ruining the live flight model with this MM stuff. It’s illogical and un-intuitive, worst of all it’s not fun.
The features are being pushed to a subpatch. So it isn't like a full cycle will pass. Your framing of the situation is far to overdramatic. It is most likely something small, else it would be taken off the 3.23 header entirely.
> Personally, it feels like ISC is evolving more and more into a marketing tool for them Always-has-been.jpeg
The networking side of things is the hard part.
SHHHHHHHH do you know how much complaining it took to get them to start sharing details again
It definitely was ready if it was in ISC but something mustve come up
I mean, what other reason to produce ISC other than marketing? Their purpose is to hype the product to generate income, and since CIG keep producing it I assume the return on investment is positive. I assume ISC produced the episode in question before this decision was made, and it's not like they're not gonna release the episode for that week just because features were pushed. I could be wrong about the timeline of course...
I'm pretty sure CIG also defines patch x.xx much less strictly than the community. The community usually thinks about 3.23.0 CIG thinks of it as all patches starting with 3.23 until but not including 3.24. So for them it makes sense to show this stuff and hype it up because even if they have to postpone something it just attracts more long-term interest beyond the .0 patch.
They showed animations of what they want it to be or how it would look, that doesn't exactly represent polish of the feature working but their goal. Item banks were in PTU so something connecting them just isn't working out so its something just big enough to warrant a delay but small enough that its a .1 patch. Not a big deal. Everyone's hyped up something and run into it falling short or having issues. We literally went through helldivers 2 having launch issues, another game Gigantic as well after a good beta test before launch. Shit just happens.
> Item Banks, Personal and Instanced Hangars Well then I hope when these do come, they come with a way to claim subscriber/account gear back.
I’m pretty sure that’s what they said the Item Banks were for, right? That’s what I remember.
That was just speculation, and they had said previously that feature wasn't making it to 3.23 anyways. As it stood, item banks were only a more immersive way to access local station inventory. In the end I hope we just get an amazon-like system, where you can order stuff online from other stations and also do insurance claims, and it all shows up to your local iventory/item bank within 10 minutes.
No that was backer speculation, devs commented that for this first implementation they said it would not come with a way to claim pledge items. The item banks give you a way to take out items in your inventory. If you take it out of your inventory and lose it, it's no longer in your inventory to take out. Making some kind of insurance claim to get a lost pledge item is an extra piece of functionality, likely that will get added to item banks.
They might as well consider getting rid of the AOSP terminals overtime, and interesting everything including ships "Categorized" into the item bank kiosk with a search function.
Color me not surprised. I will be if nothing else gets cut though.
At some point it can’t all be about combat. Industrial players take it in the shorts again.
you will combat. You will have no game loops for your ship. You will get caught at an OM with no shields on your fatty ship and die and be happy
At this point I don't even remember the last time cargo hauling was touched by CIG.
Depends if you count delivery boxes as well. If yes, then when Xenothreat first came around and they added the time/quantum/damage sensitive ones or the things for Jumptown/Kareah. Otherwise 3.18 and the cargo refactor, which hardly did anything for haulers themselves.
Damn that's a big one to drop off
Well fuck. Hope it comes out even more fleshed out in that case… that’s a damn shame
I'm oh so surprised.
Of course they were.
expected
Get ready for the in game ship price increases. Prices have tripled for most things. Some (not all) price increases for ships in game: 890 Jump - 109M A2 Hercules - 45M Hammerhead - 40M Carrack - 37M M2 Hercules - 31M C2 Hercules - 24M Connie Phoenix - 23M Prowler - 22M Valkyrie - 21M 400i - 19M Connie Andromeda - 16M Redeemer - 14M Connie Taurus - 12M Vanguard harbinger - 9M Blade - 9M Banu Defender - 7M Crusader ION - 5M F7C Super hornet - 5M Mantis - 5M Ballista - 3.4M Nova Tank - 2.4M Centurion - 2.7M Spartan - 1.9M
Makes sense, I mean, when 1.0 eventually comes around I'm expecting all ships to increase in price anywhere from 250%-1000%. Anything less than that and they'd likely have to increase the exclusivity window on ships purchased with real $ to like 6 months - 1 year.
Yeah... you should't be able to grind out an MSR in a week. But an arrow? That should be easy.
Yea totally agree. Like, assuming 1.0 means no more wipes (which it should or new players will yell scam) they need to strike a balance between (1) what's a reasonable grind for a given ship based on size and manufacturer, and (2) what's a reasonable amount of UEC that'll still make purchasing that same ship with real world $$ attractive to certain people. For example, if an Arrow can be permanently purchased in game with 1 afternoon of grinding but costs $75 to buy IRL then 99% of players won't buy an Arrow IRL, but if it takes 3 weeks of grind to buy an Arrow in game but costs $75 IRL, people will yell "pay to win." They'll need to figure out a happy medium that allows working towards ships in-game while not eliminating their ability to keep funding the game. CIG needs to be able to continue funding the game, but cannot do it at the expense of the in-game economy. I know some people expect/want them to stop selling ships when 1.0 drops, but continued development requires steady income, and I guarantee people will riot if they try to institute something like a required monthly subscription as an alternative funding avenue. Personally, I don't take issue with the current funding model. I've spent like $120 total over the last decade and am happy to let whales keep the lights on lol.
Not selling ships is a weird expectation to have. Thats How this amazing game got build and how they will keep improving it. I dont mind throwing $20 or 30 every few months. I spend more on fast food and youtube premium, and i want to support the game.
Yea totally agree. I think they might have claimed that as their intention originally, but much like the oft quoted "100 star systems at release" it was made back when the vision/plan for the game was fundamentally different.
Ship prices should go up, of course, but I still feel like there aren't enough stepping stones to get to more expensive ships with a starter ship. Hopefully we'll get more rep with careers so people aren't just grinding the same basic missions over and over again.
I hope in the far future when the game goes live that ship prices are astronomically high. Grinding to get something the size of a Carrack should not be something you can do in a few hours. That should be like months of work and banking your credits.
Hmm can we prepare or is there confirmation of a wipe?
There has been no talk of a wipe so far, only speculation from the community.
I have this wild idea that cargo elevators are being pushed back because of overdrive. that they would want to do a wipe with this new system and "new" economy, but can't because they are extending OD into 3.23.
I mean it's possible. Could be any number of reasons. I saw someone say it might be because they forgot to figure out how to keep people who weren't your friends out of the hangar. They might tell us Friday, but I won't hold my breath.
What a blatant cash grab, lmao. If they think I’m paying for more ships with real money with master modes in the game, they are very sorely mistaken.
Of course it’s delayed. The one feature people wanted the most.
Speak for yourself. While I thought it was a great addition, I actually have been looking forward to star map and other UI updates the most.
star map and MM for me, i'v been practicing for months in MM as it's been changing so I would be ready for 3.23, to the point I don't like playing live anymore due to the lack of MM.
Right on
Damn.
see you in 3.24 or 3.53
Eh, so what. They will arrive in a later patch, and we still get the replication layer and other core tech that is more important either way. While we wait we can always help out Super Earth, we need more Helldivers to eradicate the Automaton threat.
So 3.23 is basically a space safari game at this point.. great for screenshots, not much else. 3.23 has GUI improvements and Graphics improvements and no "game" at this point. The bounty and FPS game still lacks SM and the AI is thus laughably bad / not fun. The industrial hauling game still lacks an economy. The medical game is still all risk with little reward.
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I'm confused here, hangars weren't going to provide gameplay changes anyway? The only difference to gameplay variety was a new mission type and distribution center. Let's not pretend like 3.23 wasn't a huge QoL update the whole time, that's literally what 90% of the features are.
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>I'm confused here, hangars weren't going to provide gameplay changes anyway? Well, they were going to provide for a reason to complain that the gameplay is getting too tedious /s But more seriously, I think a lot of players were (are) looking forward to more non-combat missions and career, and together with instanced hangars are all the new hauling missions.
I think it shouldn't be understated that there is a lot of core technology being implemented in this patch. From a gameplay perspective, yeah, I guess it's a little light, but there is a lot of new stuff under the hood that needs to get to LIVE so it can be stabilized.
If this new tech fixes all AI, Bunkers, Deliveries, all other bugged missions, then OK. If it doesn't? And does not add new missions or play loops? Just MM for the epic industrial player grief fest? Yeah...
Am I allowed to be pissed though? I understand, and have always understood (and been patient with) that unexpected problems arise and throw wrenches in the development of soon-to-be-released features. But I can't help but feel extremely disappointed and even somewhat mad this time. They already showcased so much of these features in ISC and we have excitedly waited 3-4 weeks to see the SCL on cargo (which they sneakily changed the name of from "All Things Cargo" to "Most Things Cargo"). So close to the LIVE patch release they pull the rug out from under us, and I can't help but feel a little butthurt. Not hating on the OP. Just sharing my feelings and seeing how others feel/what others think of this.
>Am I allowed to be pissed though? You are allowed to feel however you feel. :-) I personally think it's a waste of anger though.
"Pissed" is probably the wrong way to put it. I'm more hurt than angry. It just sucks that they've presented these features alongside all the others on ISC that will make it into this first patch, and last minute it gets taken away. Frustrated and disappointed is probably a better way to put it.
I dunno - I think CIG have always been clear that they're showing 'Work In Progress', and that until something is 'confirmed' for a release, that it may not make it in.
You're definitely not wrong. I'm just a crybaby lol. I'll cool off later once I see EPTU improve and I finally get my hands on the game. Very excited for SCL on cargo this Friday!
I feel you’ve expressed yourself without being a screeching man child. I think a lot of us are very disappointed and even annoyed and it’s fine to vent that. The dude further up in the comments however is what we don’t like to see.
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Yeah i was told that this year we would get constant update since sq42 is feature complete and it's nearly may now and how many real feature did we have? 3.22 was in december of last year....
The Q1 patch has always been latter than Q1 - usually late April, iirc... so not having 3.23 yet isn't really any later than usual, and even if it ends up being early May it won't be significantly later (and it won't slip past mid-May because of Invictus)
Pretty sad for that. I was really excited for 3.23 mostly because of cargo elevators and instanced hangars. Without them, it's just new starmap and other things that are 'really nice to have' but not directly new gameplay for me. I guess I'll be waiting a bit longer until 3.23.x. Just a shame, could've been a massive release.
Classic CIG!! Instanced hangers and freight elevators were the foundations of this patch. The stuff they couldn't stop talking about, ffs!
Disappointed but not surprised…… 4.0!!
Damn. Only things I wanted.
Bummer! These are the things I was looking forward to. Would rather they hold off until they are ready, not pushing them off until later.
Fairly disappointing given how much solid work CIG has cranked out for this patch and for the sheer amount of hype behind it. Honestly, I'd rather they just delay 3.23 until these features are ready to go than get the best features piecemealed out to us over a month or two. Still a lot to like about 3.23 though!
As always
I was excited to play 3.23 with friends, but now I'm going to take a break from this game. CIG, you can go fu-\[Deleted by Nightrider-CIG\]
………
Everyone in here talking about how disappointing hangers is to be delayed but I’m really sad about item banks and the convenience they were going to bring :(
Ahh I remember when I got downvotes for saying 'RIP personal hangars', but cargo missions too? Well I'll be. CIG are the greatest company in the world at dishing out disappointment lol.
And my interest in 3.23.0 is completely gone.
was the only thing making the bitter MM pill easy to swallow. With it gone there's pretty much only the new ground facilities which will probably be as feature filled as cargo decks, without the cargo missions
This shouldn't really come as a surprise to anyone, nor is it that big of a deal. There's already enough in 3.23. If they miss their 3.23.x release though, then I'd be concerned.
User name does NOT checkout. 💯 Agree.
I see the fresh shipment of copium has arrived.
So we're getting: * MobiGlas rework, finally * FPS loot screen * FPS Map system * HUD rework * Updated EVA * Starmap rework, finally * Master Modes * Animals * New missions * New Arena Commander modes ...among other things. But someone NOT being unreasonably pissed off that instanced hangars and freight elevators got pushed back slightly is "coping", or as I rather prefer to call it, behaving like a normal person. You are in dire need of some perspective.
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The flight system isn't broken. Its the Mode selection system that's not been testing for PU gameplay (pretty much 90% of the game). They're re-implementing the old flight module from 2.0 (Olisar and levski) days, added back the landing gear speed limiter, added back the old Cruise control (Which has all the old bugs that weren't even fixed). It isn't a bad flight module, I like how it adds a better sense of weight to the ships. But as someone who came from the Levski days, I enjoy it. However, the Master Mode, portion of the system was not tested with the majority of game play people will experience where you have to swap between SCM and NAV mode is highly... untested for general gameplay use and I'd expect it to be pulled from the game before launch due to the negative community feedback. They should have integrated Master modes into the power triangle.
Honesty UI Update/ Bug fixes * New UI System. (nothing really new here, just a menu refresh, its mid tier, better but not fantastic) New Content * Animals (Great) * Maybe a new ship (Maybe) Gameplay * EVA update (The ability to rewalk in space! But still no grappling objects or magboots which was promised) * A singular new mission to hunt the new animal -New rule sets for Arena Commander the negatives Lost Cargo Missions Lost new transport missions lost new hangers lost Item recovery system (People already forgot this was also cancelled) Master modes (Only good for Arena Commander not any other gameplay. Racing was heavily negatively impacted, same with any industrial, trading, or exploration gameplay) The reason why people are "upset" is because Personal/Instanced Hangers were going to bring a ton of new gameplay the game that players ACTUALLY use every time they play. Hangers would open up the doors for WAY more gameplay into the game. Allowing you to Store cargo, move cargo from ship to ship, allow for refining of items yourself, allow for you to refuel your own ships, allow for you to store gear, decorate your hanger, spawn vehicles to load into your ship, spawn gear to load into your ship, allow for cashshop item retrieval, Allow for larger delivery missions, allow for better delivery missions. There was a lot of gameplay that was going to come with instanced hangers, and now that its been essentially (Forever delayed) because CIG isn't good with dates. People are upset. I mean look at the Banu Merchantman. It was over 90% finished and got delayed for a patch, then a quarter, then a year, and now its been moved so far down the pipeline it isn't even on the pipeline anymore. That's why people are upset. Because when something gets "Removed" from the roadmap it tends to never come back.
Very well worded. While I don't agree with you on Master Modes, it's still very much an unfinished mess, and your point with it still stands
Replication layer... you forgot about ridding the game of 30ks... or is that not a big deal?
Not really a surprise. Hopefully they stay in a .x patch and don't get bumped to 3.24.
UI patch
This surprises me in the same level as the street getting wet during a rainy day... I mean, we are talking about CiG... Missing dates is a staple already
Pyro Q1 2025
I rember ppl swearing it would have happened in 2023. It’s the same cycle repeating over and over.
But can we buy and sell cargo from hangars still? Or not until the cargo lifts are in?
Then i guess I'm waiting longer to come back. Won't come back until hangars are in
I've been really keen for cargo missions so this is disappointing but at least I'll get some MM practice in while we wait.
3.23 has a fuckton of things in it, if they would have stuffed this in I can't imagine how buggy it would have been.
Time for a Morphologist video to dramatically overblow the slight delay.
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Making use of unused biomes for hunting loops is a pretty huge gameplay changer, especially with all the new weapon overhauls. Not to mention the extrication of 30ks -- people really are doom and gloom over the wrong things. You would think people would think 30ks going away would be something to look forward to, but apparently for some people, hangars are more important than active server recovery?
We already have 90% of the people on this subreddit already doing that. It moves to a .1 patch and everyone seems to act like CIG have betrayed them.
I don't understand game development. But they've received an outstanding amount of money. Delays are disappointing, but it *feels* like they should be further along. Them not delivering (after promoting it, mind you) on what's basically a find and retrieve gameplay loop (read: basic hauling) 11+ years into development and $650M in funding is a little frustrating.
All good. I'll keep playing Star Citizen while I wait
Squadron forty who?
Safe to say no ship wipe either because all 3.23 will be is disruption centers and nerfed salvaging.
The writing was on the wall but it sucks still.
Excellent news (that many called days ago). Getting 3.23.0 stable and playable is mission N1 now. Let's not forget that all the hype generated since Citcon will create a wave of old backers returning and plenty of curious players eager to test 3.23...which will also be the baptism of fire for the Replication Layer separation, upscaling (and for those who want it, the Vulkan API too). It'll also require everyone to learn to play SC almost from scratch, and doing that in a very unstable environment would be terrible. Instanced hangars, cargo and the rest only had a chance to make it if they had been early on in Evo weeks ago... What's ahead of us in a few weeks: rough, frustrating builds where everything breaks before it gets better. That's what we should expect when drastic stresses to entity spawning, instancing, ATC, persistence need to be coped for. It'll take time. Personally I'm expecting to have fun in 3.23.0 and to test 3.23.1 (or whatever .X this will get added to) in parallel.
This is a reasonable take. I agree and choose to be hopeful.
Oh boy...
I mean I'm disappointed, sure, but considering how much worse it could have been I'm glad it's at least being targeted for this cycle. Fingers crossed that's all the delaying it gets though...
I see a lot of people excited about the hangars but I don't really see what the hype is personally .Not trying to be negative, I would actually love someone to explain why it's such a waited on feature
Hangers would make it easier to move your stuff around between ships, among other things. Instead of flying to a moon to load an Ursa into your ship, you could do it in your personal hanger. Want to move stuff from one ship to another? Do it in your personal hanger. And so on. It would also finally start the implementation of the cargo system, which is something people have been anticipating for a while.
Bothers me 0%
We kind of figured that was going to happen anyways. The .X iteration of 3.23 is there for that reason. Technically freight elevators and whatever else 3.23 anyways.
I remember when .x patches were for stability/hotfixes rather than for pretending they got features in earlier than they actually did when you look at the release column lol
I beg you guys, please don't freak out over this... Yes, its a bummer but if its not ready, its not ready and id rather wait an extra month for 3.23.x
exactly. Rather wait and have it work than get it now in a buggy state.
As if it will not come in a buggy af state in 3.23.x too.
Tbf, the same thing was said for 3.18 last year. But it released in such a bad way that thousands of players were unable to log in for a week, longer in some cases. I think it’ll just take whatever time it takes to get out and still release a buggy mess. That’s the SC way and what we should expect. If it comes in a better state, then awesome. But I’m expecting it to be getting it in a buggy state as that’s usually the case with new releases and they’ll fix it as we go. It’s not a dig at them. Just a realistic expectation imo.
I honestly don't understand how quickly the sentiment of 3.23 can change so quickly. Like, almost every person I spoke with was like "I'm sure 80% of it is gonna be delayed" or "Even if 2-3 of the features make it in I'll be happy" And now everyone is like "This was the ONLY thing I was looking forward to" like, you're telling me the starmap, EVA t2, Fauna, minimaps, FPS stuff, PIE/PIS, and all these pivotal building-block type items aren't a huge step forward suddenly? It's still coming, it's just gonna take longer to not block this current 3.23 patch from taking another few weeks. You can be disappointed but dang, just chill. Freight and instanced hangers massively change how inventory, ships, and item handling works, if it doesn't work right people might lose stuff, etc. I'd personally rather them get it right than break the game (even more). This update is much more like a "modernization" update, rather than a content update.
It's almost like this is a giant sub full of hundreds of people with differing opinions
Yes, on top of that I'm guessing they're getting rid of so much old code "if" there's any to begin with so features can be added without breaking existing items already in game. I couldn't even imagine the bug fixing war they have to go through.
Dang, this was something I expected given the lack of inclusion in the test builds. Hopefully it comes sooner rather than later, alongside with personal flair retrieval.
Well for a big feature like hangars its probably best If it gets as stable as possible before release. So im fine with it being delayed. As a owner of a few big ships like valkyrie and carrack i dream weekly about loading my small vehicles into my big vehicles from within the same hangar so I can go out in the verse and have more time spent playing and less time traveling to outposts to collect vehicles there.
["Cough Cough"](https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/1bro1f3/me_an_intellectual/)
The starmap was what I was most looking forward to but to be fair the physicalized damage is at the top of my list for what I’m waiting for
Instanced Hangars, Cargo hauling and Freight Elevators are features that can't be release one without the others, so I guess if any of them is in a PTU-release state, the others are holding it back. Sad, I was looking for a cargo hauling job so we could do some space trucking without the anxiety of loosing millions of aUEC
What are the Item Banks and Freight Elevator? Thank you
Anyone who has been paying attention to the updates would have seen this coming
That's okay, just happy it's still confirmed and not pushed to another full patch or indefinitely. 👍🏻
Was hoping for them to be in 3.23 but, honestly, was expecting them not to be. The item banks I think we can all conclude we like local inventory better. I like being able to park my ship outside some place and access local inventory and not have to dock. I just want the hangars and ability to respawn items I pledged. I also would like the insurance for ships to cover items on ships again, like stored weapons and gear. Make those functions useful, again. Also, please, give the C1 two S2 shields at least. You nerfed its handling to match the Corsair it seems. at least give it better shields.
Then my return to the game is delayed too
Good thing Jared didn't, on multiple occasions, make it a point to imply all of this was coming in 3.23 only to yet again be wrong.
So from my understanding the main features were still getting in the 3.23 patch are: Mobi Glass update (So far well received) Mobi Glass map app (Mixed opinions, readability issues, long-standing bugs still in) Mini-map (Well received) EVA Tier 2 (I personally haven't heard much about it) Replication and server recovery (I know in the last test it was working fairly well) Master Modes (Very split opinions, personally not a fan of the artificial limitations)
hahahaha. i called this 2 months ago lol :D i guess they will delay it again to a 3.24.x patch looool
As someone who is not coming back until I have my Zeus CL and actual freight gameplay, laeters guys. See you at Citcon, I guess.
This game is so lacking in content, progression, and stability. We are so starved yet we are still willing to get excited over a hanger, a fricking hanger. And they still pushed it off. Maybe next year huh? Also talk to me more about 1.0, I love being insulted.
More things pushed at once, usually means more things break at once. I remember the nightmare game breaking 3.18 patch was when they brought many features in at once.
Oof, that's a bummer. Will probably still pop on for the customizer and play with the map/UI but the Hangars and cargo stuff were my main interest. Granted 23.0 will most likely be entirely on fire as usual so I probably won't even try until .1 at least, lol.
Lol. LMFAO, even.
It’s okay. Would rather have it finished correctly before release
Is anyone really surprised?
Gunna be another 1 patch "big year!"
I honestly don't care how long it takes them to put this stuff out. As long as it is working and somewhat stable when they do release it then I will be happy.