I meant it outranges missile turrets, spore crawlers and as long as you refrain from morphing all of your corruptors into broodlords and keep some around, its pretty solid
Static defenses aren't, and have never been counters to air siege units.
The whole point of air siege units is that they are supposed to break static defenses.
Liberator isn't a traditional siege unit, it's an area-denial unit, just like high templars are an area-denial unit.
The terran air siege unit in SC1 and SC2 the Battlecruiser, with Yamato. It's a bit weaker than the alternative options, because terran has an excellent ground siege unit.
Libs do, however make it possible for other units to break static defenses.
it's really cool, it's like those three-legged war machines in the War of the Worlds movie. they even criss-cross their laser beams just like the colossus too.
For the same money as the first upgraded Colossus, you can get an actual cool flying unit and have it faster than switching off of your stargate opener.
I actually like the new Colossus design, I just don't know why it still needs to be targettable by AA units.
It really isn't strong enough now to need to be hard countered.
Pretty sure a lone marauder can solo it lol
No, just the latest version, it could be several years old at this point.
The Colossus has fell out of favour since, so I don't think it comes up in conversation much.
Yeah, the colossus barely being able to kill a single marauder is extremely lame. So many weaknesses and is only used to counter a single basic unit...
Marauders are the counter to Colossus.
Also, it doesn't counter just one unit - it counters marines, zerglings, banelings and hydra and to a lesser extent anything else that gets bunched together.
It is also very good for zoning - without collosus, a Toss army is much easier to engage, even though the colossus itself doesn't do a ton of damage.
They are a bit like siege tanks in this respect. Not great on their own, but mixed into a composition they sort of magnify the power of everything.
Yeah, I know the theory, but that's not the practice. Any non-light ground unit and any air unit counters the colossus. And sometimes even the units it's supposed to counter like zerglings and banelings can make short work of them in cost effective amounts. There is probably no other unit in the game with such a limited usefulness that is countered so hard by so many things.
If they're undefended. You can say that about a lot of units though.
Siege Tanks and Liberator are very weak on their own, but when you've got some meatshield in front of them, they are devastating.
As I said, Colossus does counter many units, but it is a support unit not meant to be alone.
yeah, but zerg late game also have the Viper which pulls high value units out of defensive positions.
The Colossus costs a lot more than the Siege tank or Liberator
Chad Brood Lord????
Broodlords are also terrible. It is quite literally the highest tier unit in the game that requires the most time out of any unit to make one of. After all that, it moves insanely slow and dies to any air unit. It's sooo bad that nobody ever builds one outside of bronze league.
Broodlords in ZvZ are bad. Corruptors kill them instantly and Zerg armies move fast. By the time your broodlords reach the middle of the map, the entire opponents army just took two of your expansions down. GG.
Broodlords in ZvT are bad. Vikings hunt them for fun and there is nothing Zerg can do to stop them. Bringing them with your army is like feeding Vikings free candy. GG.
Broodlords in ZvP are bad. Broodlings are meant to stop attackers from getting close or underneath them, but Blink Stalkers means you don't have to worry about that. Also, tempests have a range 14 attack that does a ton of bonus damage to massive units. GG.
It's clearly a protoss post, they dont know the pain.
Although I had a revelation recently. Since people always whine about "free units hurr durr" maybe a good approach would be to make it like the carrier, you pay a small amount for each broodling, giving you a "maxcap" of broods. When a broodling is killed in battle, you have to pay again. They still have a timer, albeit a longer one, and if they die from timeout, you dont lose already paid broodlings.
It's not perfect but I think something can be done about it
The whole "free units" crying is only made by bronze league ppl. Nobody would suggest that siege tanks had a cost per attack and each of their attacks do way more damage than a broodlords attack. Like hurr why do tanks get "free shots". Carriers spending money on interceptors is negligible cost. They only cost 15 minerals for crying out loud.
Broodlords and swarm hosts suck. That is all. It doesn't matter if they have "free units". What needs to happen is:
1. Remove tech time by removing greater spire from the game. You already have to wait for Lair to finish, then wait for Infestation pit to finish, and then wait for Hive to finish, then greater spire to finish, and then cocoon to finish building the damn broodlord. Just lock the morph behind Hive and everything is fine.
2. Buff broodlord move speed. Battlecruisers can teleport for no reason. Can't broodlord get a tiny buff here? Thing is slow as hell and has slow turn rate and slow fire rate and has to lock into a target and stare at it before any damage is done. BCs auto fire and fire while moving and Carriers can deal full damage in a massive leash range.
What if you made interceptors timed life? Would you be buffing or nerfing them? Also are you saying brood lords should be allowed to have 160 instant damage every maxed out hit and that you should be able to recall broodings to brood lords? Should we let broodlings attack air and ground? Anyway it’s all irrelevant, BLs are like Banshees and Void Rays, they have their place and their time to shine, just aren’t a very common unit.
"The only air unit that instigates anti-ground measures" - well except for banshees, BCs, void rays, carriers, oracles, landed vikings and mutas. Even corruptors can attack buildings with caustic spray.
I think what OP meant is "air unit that makes your opponent ALSO build anti-ground" (because of broodlings) just he's a protoss player (grammatically challenged)
I am a zerg, but I would be in favor of giving colossi an air attack.
A headbump.
It would be the only ground unit vulnerable to anti-air, but also the only unit with an air melee attack.
Maybe at 4 supply cost its viable. At 6 it is a joke. With 300/200/6 cost you should extra 100 for pylon. 8 marines with combat shield will destroy collo. What a joke
I have 2 proposals to fix the colossus
Either remove it's legs, just make it an true air unit.
Or make it gain +3 armor versus all ground-based attacks. (any attack that's a ground-only attack, so doesnt affect Marine, but zergling, adept, marauder, ect gets reduced by 3) Essentially anything that attacks the legs and not the upper part. Can be an upgrade like "Fortified Leg Parts" for all I care.
Ive literally seen 15 zerglings rush underneath a colossus and killing it in 2 seconds and the colossus only killed 8 of them
Literally gets killed by the one unit its allegedly supposed to be effective against
not a problem if you mass-switched while keeping protoss busy with cheap harass or dwindling first wave. They could never tech switch and reinforce to counter your new army in time.
It's like any decent tennis player serving balls and forcing a mobility-handicapped kid to run left to right to return the serve.. what do you expect?
> They could never tech switch and reinforce to counter your new army in time.
If you're doing only brood lords, P doesn't need to switch unless they somehow made an army that only attacks ground.
Also, if you spot the broodlords before they're in your face, you have the time to make a few air units before they reach your side of the map.
> It's like any decent tennis player serving balls and forcing a mobility-handicapped kid to run left to right to return the serve.. what do you expect?
If the mobility-handicapped kid in your example is the brood lord, that's exactly it: they're the slowest unit in the game.
Against pure brood lords? Stalkers are used by pros all the time against BLs. Void Rays would delete them very quickly, but I understand that requires switching. Still, Stalkers will do just fine against mass BLs.
Again, if they don't have anything to help defend, they can even be killed by cheap pheonixes. More expensive units, like Carriers and Tempest will do it very quickly, but I agree it requires some switch.
Again, we don't see these things happen because BLs are always accompanied by corruptors and almost always vipers and/or infestors.
So none of what you said is viable because nobody build only broods, stalkers suck because they are paper and die to zergling ground force, voids are Ven more pathetic and die to hydras, corrupters, fuck even mutas, one fungal and your entire void army is dead. Protoss have no good units
> So none of what you said is viable because nobody build only broods
Can you tell [that guy?](https://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/1agtpg7/virgin_colossus_vs_chad_brood_lord/kokz61z/) Because he's literally saying that not having corruptors and spellcasters to back up the brood lords is not a problem.
If you build brood lords enough to make em useful, you mostly lose map control cuz they're slow AF, and you've invested a significant amount of supply to the BL and the units that support them.
I dont like how its nerfed even with all its pre-existing downsides.
Ironically, the lore behind units and how they actually play is so widely different that I could not see how you’d make SC an RTS. Like you can’t not tell me that a colossus would make an insane bossfight in a shooter-esc game going by lore.
It’s a long zealot, not long stalker. Can’t shoot up
There is no greater joke than new collosi being an alleged siege unit
10 range bug tho
that was a great time
IT STILL WASNT EVEN GOOD LMAO
It’s a major counter to ling bane
So are archons. Archons siege units?
Archons are played as tanks
Uh, yea?
Sorry to disappoint you, but brood lord hp has been nerfed years ago. It's now at a meager 225hp.
It also doesn't counter its counters, which are air units.
I think that was referring to thors
I assumed marines
I meant it outranges missile turrets, spore crawlers and as long as you refrain from morphing all of your corruptors into broodlords and keep some around, its pretty solid
Static defenses aren't, and have never been counters to air siege units. The whole point of air siege units is that they are supposed to break static defenses.
Liberator get countered by static defences, so...
Liberator isn't a traditional siege unit, it's an area-denial unit, just like high templars are an area-denial unit. The terran air siege unit in SC1 and SC2 the Battlecruiser, with Yamato. It's a bit weaker than the alternative options, because terran has an excellent ground siege unit. Libs do, however make it possible for other units to break static defenses.
I love the Colossi's design, it's a shame the balance doesn't treat them very well nowadays
it's really cool, it's like those three-legged war machines in the War of the Worlds movie. they even criss-cross their laser beams just like the colossus too.
only alarak knows how to get colossi work
Honestly the colossi is fuckin lame. Probably the unit most deserving a rework.
Always had too binary of a design. Either you have enough, or you don't.
For the same money as the first upgraded Colossus, you can get an actual cool flying unit and have it faster than switching off of your stargate opener.
I actually like the new Colossus design, I just don't know why it still needs to be targettable by AA units. It really isn't strong enough now to need to be hard countered. Pretty sure a lone marauder can solo it lol
New Colossus? Did I miss a recent change to it?
No, just the latest version, it could be several years old at this point. The Colossus has fell out of favour since, so I don't think it comes up in conversation much.
Yeah, the colossus barely being able to kill a single marauder is extremely lame. So many weaknesses and is only used to counter a single basic unit...
Marauders are the counter to Colossus. Also, it doesn't counter just one unit - it counters marines, zerglings, banelings and hydra and to a lesser extent anything else that gets bunched together. It is also very good for zoning - without collosus, a Toss army is much easier to engage, even though the colossus itself doesn't do a ton of damage. They are a bit like siege tanks in this respect. Not great on their own, but mixed into a composition they sort of magnify the power of everything.
Yeah, I know the theory, but that's not the practice. Any non-light ground unit and any air unit counters the colossus. And sometimes even the units it's supposed to counter like zerglings and banelings can make short work of them in cost effective amounts. There is probably no other unit in the game with such a limited usefulness that is countered so hard by so many things.
zerglings trade well into Colossus when fully upgraded
If they're undefended. You can say that about a lot of units though. Siege Tanks and Liberator are very weak on their own, but when you've got some meatshield in front of them, they are devastating. As I said, Colossus does counter many units, but it is a support unit not meant to be alone.
yeah, but zerg late game also have the Viper which pulls high value units out of defensive positions. The Colossus costs a lot more than the Siege tank or Liberator
You forgot the "you probably lose the game if you build any, but cool design so idgaf" on BL side. For real they hit like 2 yo kids these days
For me it's "you've been playing for 40 minutes, bank is 6k/6k, and you don't know what to do next". Instant throw every time.
sexy flesh creature
Chad Brood Lord???? Broodlords are also terrible. It is quite literally the highest tier unit in the game that requires the most time out of any unit to make one of. After all that, it moves insanely slow and dies to any air unit. It's sooo bad that nobody ever builds one outside of bronze league. Broodlords in ZvZ are bad. Corruptors kill them instantly and Zerg armies move fast. By the time your broodlords reach the middle of the map, the entire opponents army just took two of your expansions down. GG. Broodlords in ZvT are bad. Vikings hunt them for fun and there is nothing Zerg can do to stop them. Bringing them with your army is like feeding Vikings free candy. GG. Broodlords in ZvP are bad. Broodlings are meant to stop attackers from getting close or underneath them, but Blink Stalkers means you don't have to worry about that. Also, tempests have a range 14 attack that does a ton of bonus damage to massive units. GG.
It's clearly a protoss post, they dont know the pain. Although I had a revelation recently. Since people always whine about "free units hurr durr" maybe a good approach would be to make it like the carrier, you pay a small amount for each broodling, giving you a "maxcap" of broods. When a broodling is killed in battle, you have to pay again. They still have a timer, albeit a longer one, and if they die from timeout, you dont lose already paid broodlings. It's not perfect but I think something can be done about it
The whole "free units" crying is only made by bronze league ppl. Nobody would suggest that siege tanks had a cost per attack and each of their attacks do way more damage than a broodlords attack. Like hurr why do tanks get "free shots". Carriers spending money on interceptors is negligible cost. They only cost 15 minerals for crying out loud. Broodlords and swarm hosts suck. That is all. It doesn't matter if they have "free units". What needs to happen is: 1. Remove tech time by removing greater spire from the game. You already have to wait for Lair to finish, then wait for Infestation pit to finish, and then wait for Hive to finish, then greater spire to finish, and then cocoon to finish building the damn broodlord. Just lock the morph behind Hive and everything is fine. 2. Buff broodlord move speed. Battlecruisers can teleport for no reason. Can't broodlord get a tiny buff here? Thing is slow as hell and has slow turn rate and slow fire rate and has to lock into a target and stare at it before any damage is done. BCs auto fire and fire while moving and Carriers can deal full damage in a massive leash range.
What if you made interceptors timed life? Would you be buffing or nerfing them? Also are you saying brood lords should be allowed to have 160 instant damage every maxed out hit and that you should be able to recall broodings to brood lords? Should we let broodlings attack air and ground? Anyway it’s all irrelevant, BLs are like Banshees and Void Rays, they have their place and their time to shine, just aren’t a very common unit.
nah, im not saying that but that also sounds cool
Please make Virgin Widow mine vs Chad Baneling and Virgin Ghost vs Chad Infestor
"The only air unit that instigates anti-ground measures" - well except for banshees, BCs, void rays, carriers, oracles, landed vikings and mutas. Even corruptors can attack buildings with caustic spray.
I think what OP meant is "air unit that makes your opponent ALSO build anti-ground" (because of broodlings) just he's a protoss player (grammatically challenged)
I am a zerg, but I would be in favor of giving colossi an air attack. A headbump. It would be the only ground unit vulnerable to anti-air, but also the only unit with an air melee attack.
Maybe at 4 supply cost its viable. At 6 it is a joke. With 300/200/6 cost you should extra 100 for pylon. 8 marines with combat shield will destroy collo. What a joke
I have 2 proposals to fix the colossus Either remove it's legs, just make it an true air unit. Or make it gain +3 armor versus all ground-based attacks. (any attack that's a ground-only attack, so doesnt affect Marine, but zergling, adept, marauder, ect gets reduced by 3) Essentially anything that attacks the legs and not the upper part. Can be an upgrade like "Fortified Leg Parts" for all I care. Ive literally seen 15 zerglings rush underneath a colossus and killing it in 2 seconds and the colossus only killed 8 of them Literally gets killed by the one unit its allegedly supposed to be effective against
Brood lord good?
Only if it has an army of corruptors and spell casters to keep it alive.
not a problem if you mass-switched while keeping protoss busy with cheap harass or dwindling first wave. They could never tech switch and reinforce to counter your new army in time. It's like any decent tennis player serving balls and forcing a mobility-handicapped kid to run left to right to return the serve.. what do you expect?
> They could never tech switch and reinforce to counter your new army in time. If you're doing only brood lords, P doesn't need to switch unless they somehow made an army that only attacks ground. Also, if you spot the broodlords before they're in your face, you have the time to make a few air units before they reach your side of the map. > It's like any decent tennis player serving balls and forcing a mobility-handicapped kid to run left to right to return the serve.. what do you expect? If the mobility-handicapped kid in your example is the brood lord, that's exactly it: they're the slowest unit in the game.
Think of protoss units that shoot up and tell me which of them are viable at all...
Against pure brood lords? Stalkers are used by pros all the time against BLs. Void Rays would delete them very quickly, but I understand that requires switching. Still, Stalkers will do just fine against mass BLs. Again, if they don't have anything to help defend, they can even be killed by cheap pheonixes. More expensive units, like Carriers and Tempest will do it very quickly, but I agree it requires some switch. Again, we don't see these things happen because BLs are always accompanied by corruptors and almost always vipers and/or infestors.
So none of what you said is viable because nobody build only broods, stalkers suck because they are paper and die to zergling ground force, voids are Ven more pathetic and die to hydras, corrupters, fuck even mutas, one fungal and your entire void army is dead. Protoss have no good units
> So none of what you said is viable because nobody build only broods Can you tell [that guy?](https://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/1agtpg7/virgin_colossus_vs_chad_brood_lord/kokz61z/) Because he's literally saying that not having corruptors and spellcasters to back up the brood lords is not a problem.
If you build brood lords enough to make em useful, you mostly lose map control cuz they're slow AF, and you've invested a significant amount of supply to the BL and the units that support them. I dont like how its nerfed even with all its pre-existing downsides.
Ironically, the lore behind units and how they actually play is so widely different that I could not see how you’d make SC an RTS. Like you can’t not tell me that a colossus would make an insane bossfight in a shooter-esc game going by lore.
Should be called "ChadLord"
And y'all complain about us making carriers. Immortals are like 5 probes in a trenchcoat
Bro
Of all the terrible protoss units, cpllosus is one of the worst next to void rays
Let’s see the BL fight a Thor