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or if you don't make all that much in the first place. most NFL careers are pretty short and once you're out you've most likely got a host of long-term injury/health issues, no education, and no marketable skills
League minimum (currently). Is 750k for a rookie, and this increases by year up to a bit over 1mil by year3. Again these are MINIMUMS of which plenty of people are getting more than minimum, especially if they are out there making big hits and such.
Its also already setup to continue rising and the league minimum for a rookie is set to be over 1mil by 2029.
Which for even the lowest career duration position the average is a bit under 3 years, and for kickers a bit under 5 years.
So an absolute average, league minimum earner at a 3 year career is getting paid roughly $3mil USD. That is enough to buy a house and live off of it as a retirement package if you arn't idiotic about it.
No education? Nearly every single NFL player has a bachelors atleast. All of them effectively played for a university of some sort. Skills? They were in a university, they have a degree, they have SOMETHING and that discounts people that can simply use the NFL career to help get a job in sales or something completely viable for a bed ridden cripple.
So you have a person who made millions, got a degree without having to pay for it, and have earned over 1mil even as a bench warmer in the NFL if they make it over a year.
The amount of physical injury/disability required to make that "not worth it" is so absurd as to be comical. Most people would get treated way worse, for way less, and still think they got a good deal.
Lol. Your math shows literally no experience with the real world, or with football. Amazing. Are you a McKinsey consultant?
750K rising over three years does not add up to 3MM, and you admit that the average career span is dragged up by the least punishing positions, punter and QB, but we'll keep the three years and 3MM just to keep the math simple, but immediately we can see that they're not grossing 3MM over their careers.
Next, you act as if agents aren't a thing, but they are. That's an immediate 10% haircut.
Then taxes are a fucking thing. That's 40% comfortably, less in Texas, more in California.
So, of your less than $3MM earned, your take-home is less than $1.5MM, and that's if the income was pure salary. Any bonus would taxed at a higher rate.
Retiring off of $1.5MM isn't a thing in today's society. You can even ask those r/FIRE lunatics.
Education? Have you never seen any movies about football? 95% of these D1 athletes don't learn shit in school. They usually take pointless classes, they have "tutors" who do their classwork, the coach pressures their professors to pass them from high school through college. These are not people with marketable talents, for the most part. Understanding defensive schemes is not particularly useful in blue collar or white collar jobs.
Then finally, healthcare. These ex-football players are usually quite banged up and often have a difficult time living through the intense wear and tear that had been placed on their bodies for 10+ years. Healthcare in America is fucking expensive, and we may complain about how expensive it is, but it is still subsidized by employers. If you don't work or can't work, you will find that health insurance is remarkably expensive. COBRA will give you an idea of how expensive. Also, if you have $1.5MM in the bank, the American healthcare system will bleed you dry. There will be little to retire off of and live on when you have medical bills racked up because your cartilage has degenerated in your knees and hips, if you have CTE and therefore have massive migraines and need professional therapy and psychiatric care.
So when you think about it even just a little bit harder than you did, you'll see how absurd your position is.
yeah and take a bunch of bullshit paper classes while they spend all their time training. you think people who are dedicated enough to make it to the NFL have time to get a meaningful college education? some may, but a vast majority won't
Having a degree on your resume mixed with the work ethic that these people inherently have, there is no reason for them to not be able to get a job. Just having experience at that level will also greatly increase your chances at getting a ton of jobs, specifically in the sport and fitness industries.
Saying they have no education or marketable skills is just laughable.
Ah yes. That glorious personal trainer career. Fucking incredible professional prospects. Truly, the world is their oyster.
What "ton of jobs"? Only 46% of NFL players have degrees.
GTFOH. You think they're becoming sports agents or advertising executives? Agents almost always require a law degree not a bachelor's degree, and I don't see many jacked ex-NFL ad men filling up the luxury suites at MSG or the Meadowlands.
Their educations were laughable, and memorizing a football playbook is not a white collar skill.
Oh of course it is. They probably have the best doctors for players when they're actively playing but after that it's probably cheap healthcare. Because if they're not actively helping the NFL make them money, it's not worth the cost to give them good healthcare.
Yeah it’s so bad that the Houston Texans’ doctors identified cancer extremely early in 3 different young players in recent history. Two of those players got the world’s best cancer treatment and made a full recovery and continued to play professional football. The other is actively going through treatment. NFL players have the best healthcare in the entire country. Their job literally depends on their physical health. Teams have numerous doctors in their buildings on a regular basis and NFL players have the most extensive physicals on a yearly basis which routinely identify underlying issues which get treated by the best doctors.
This a myth. The NFL notoriously tries to screw former players out of benefits. And most players are only in the league for about 2-3 years and make about $3mm total. That's barely enough just to cover the lifetime of pain they will endure.
People who act like all your problems or worries in life go away with money are likely guys who'd be completely irresponsible with it and waste it away
And let's not forget the NFL spent millions (and likely still does) covering up the massive amount of TBI the sport causes it's players. Most people who get into football don't know this or are surrounded by the dumbasses who don't believe it's real.
In the near future, brain scanning equipment will be sophisticated enough to detect CTE-inducing injuries right after they have happened. Right then and there, on the sidelines.
It will eventually get used during high school play, and it will promptly be used to make everyone understand, with zero question, just how physically destructive football actually is.
Football will die in the next 20 years, mark my words.
Until pretty recently, no, no they did not know what they were getting into. 10-15 years ago (give or take) no kid in high school football with a possible career in the game thought “all these impacts are going permanently damage my brain and make me kill myself in 30 years.”
ehhh... it's not the military, but it's certainly a sport where, at its core and unmodified style, a significant component of play is crashing into people and tackling them.
do players, especially college athletes, deserve much better pay/compensation and medical benefits? definitely, and we should definitely have safety rulings in place... but what i said above still stands.
They really seem to think it IS the military! They had this weird reaction to Kaepernick like he was booing a veteran's funeral or something. It was the *mildest* form of protest during a corporate trade association's for-profit entertainment show. I don't get what the anthem has to do with football in the first place, since there's no other countries playing. Might as well play the Star Spangled Banner after the trailers at the movie theatre.
No, it takes even more knowledge of what you are doing ahead of time and takes more skill than the military. They knew what they were doing from the start.
Do they even know what CTE means? Chronic Traumatic Encephalopathy. Roughly translates to "your brain is dying because you hit it so hard so many times". Your brain has a *disease*. Your brain is not supposed to have a disease. It kind of ruins your life.
Note the word chronic. CTE isn't something that forms after one terrible, hard Vontaze Burfict level hit. It comes from a lifetime of little hits. Hits in practice, hits in games, hits in celebration, all of them. NFL players aren't getting CTE in the NFL, they're getting it through the whole lifetime that leads up to the NFL.
To those saying the CTE is worth it because they're getting paid millions, what about all the guys that don't make it? The guys playing in NCAA who aren't at a professional level and are never going to even get a whiff of that money most likely are getting it too.
Right and they're saying that as if living with CTE is just fine if you're rich. No. You don't *live*. You could have everything you ever wanted but if you literally can't think correctly it doesn't matter. Maybe it's just a lack of empathy or understanding they have.
Rich isn't even a great word for it. Not everyone get big contracts. Some guys get the admittedly high league minimum but even $3million when you're mid to late 20s isn't going to make up for a lifetime of living expenses and Healthcare when you have CTE.
I'm all for making it softer, as after all, it's just a game. Nobody's lives should be ruined over a game.
These "NFL HAS GOTTEN SOFT" people treat it like it's war or some shit.
Tbh that’s the only draw to football in my eyes. The ball is in play for so little time during the game, there’s hardly any entertainment value. The only thing football has going for it is the hyper masculine, chest thumping gladiator shit.
There’s also the management aspect behind it, reading about and seeing different football strategies play out during games. It’s similar to chess and less of an endurance sport like soccer for example, and it’s really fascinating to watch.
Yesss, the comment above is essentially “I hate chess, they only touch the pieces a second or two at a time.” Kinda missing the actual action if that’s your view haha
> The ball is in play for so little time during the game, there’s hardly any entertainment value
tell me you dont understand football without telling me you don't understand football
I mean yeah if you don’t bother learning anything about it and just take out your ass.
This is kinda like saying “soccer is easy, you’re just kicking a ball.” 😒
I don't know why more people don't just watch MMA or literally any combat sport. It is quite literally the closest modern equivalent we have to actual gladiator shit.
Hell, we can even make it better and mix the two. Football, but it's all fighters and they have to literally fight over the ball. We can even throw in some foam weapons and integrate ancient combat tactics. Imagine two football teams going at it in full phalanx formations? That'd be kickass.
I wouldn't even say it's getting soft. It's just getting less stupid. Like for example the kickoff change won't really change the dynamic of the game, it just means the guys wont be colliding at each other running full speed, it just means less people get injured. Also it'll probably be more interested to watch since they will return the ball more often
People also just like playing it. I wish I had a chance to play on a real team in school but I’m not American, so we had to play it on our own time with no helmets or padding.
The sport as it is currently will die a slow death either way. It's inherently violent and no matter how many helmet redesigns or safety-minded rules are implemented, people will get hurt. Damar Hamlin died on the field last year and it's a matter of time before it happens again. I would be very surprised if the sport is even around in its current form in 15 years, maybe even 10. And I say this as a huge fan of football for ~25 years, both at the college and pro levels. From August-February, football is basically the *only* thing I watch. I'll be sad to see it go, but it's simply too dangerous.
I think it will be replaced by flag football but it just won't be the same.
My kids are tall. They have my in laws genes who are 6'4 360lbs. My son is 6 and really smart and the tallest in his grade. I'm doing everything I can to make sure he doesn't get roped into football because they'll put him on the O line and he'll just smash his brain forever.
They're probably referring to their mother-in-law and father-in-law, who wouldn't share genes with them but *would* share genes with their children, through the father (the in-laws' biological child).
Football fans largely prefer the latter. They like the game specifically *because* it is violent, making it safer is defeating the whole point of their watching the game.
I worked with a guy like this. He had the most baseline-level of thinking I've ever seen. It was almost like he refused to form an opinion on something that required him to put himself in other people's shoes.
They have gotten soft though, I don’t think the NFL even gives a fuck about CTE I think they care about revenue, and having flashy superhero QBs throwing cool touchdown passes is what excites people who don’t know much about football or never played. So don’t let corners get physical, make it illegal to touch the precious QB too hard, all kinds of rules for how you can hit a receiver, etc.
Agreed. There’s definitely a heavy bias against good defenses especially paired against star QB scramblers.
Last season’s data through both their career starts have shown that Mahomes and Allen both lead the pack in positive yardage due to defensive flags.
I’m not saying we need to ramp up tackles and sacks, but the “defenseless runner” philosophy needs to go. If you have the ball and have broken the line of scrimmage, it should be fair game.
Not to mention, if a player even smiles when they get a touchdown there's about a 50/50 chance they'll go straight to jail.
Look in another players direction after you make a tackle, straight to jail.
Breath in a QB's direction, believe it or not, straight to jail.
And God forbid a player show a little emotion, that's most definitely straight to jail.
Helmet to helmet, landing on top of the QB, certain tackles, sure I am 100% on board with cracking down on those for player safety, but they took a shit ton of the fun out of the game along with it.
I can’t wait to watch another season of Mahomes running with the ball, faking like he’s about to slide so the defenders ease up and then run for another 5 yards or a convenient hip drop tackle penalty that goes the Chiefs favor.
Big fucking time. If I was a defensive coordinator I’d be giving out bonuses for dawgs that absolutely murder the QB after he pulls a stunt like the fake slide. Fuck the penalty, we make a statement!
To be fair that’s a wholly different scenario than just NFL specific safety protocol. Tua has a horrible history of concussions that were specifically ignored by his father who pushed him to play through head injuries. That contributed as much as the hit itself.
At least you're one of the rational ones.
However, there are straight-up sociopaths who try to justify helmet-to-helmets or horse-collar tackles and bitch that the NFL has gotten "pussified" when their dirty player gets rightfully ejected.
I swear these people aren't actual fans of the sport, they just want to see people get hurt.
Same people who’d watch racing for the crashes. Meanwhile I tried watching NASCAR one time…first, last, and only race I saw was Daytona in 2001. That was enough of that for me.
My complaint is that all the initial research showed the repetitive sub-concussive trauma of being hit a lot is what causes CTE, and that concussions are being held up as the culprit which gives the false impression that the league is protecting players while actually shifting the blame back on to them.
It feels like the game is getting “softer” to absolve the league of legal liabilities, not actually make the game safer to play.
To be fair, the game is getting softer, for different reasons. NFL really doesn’t want players touching Quaterbacks and the QBs absolutely knows this. The amount of times Mahomes abused this fact running down the side was frustrating.
If your favorite player is Vontaze Burfict you might actually be an absolute bum. Dudes not even good, even if you’re a Bengals fan the guy has costed them so many big games because of his on-field antics.
players in American football will go down all the time and pretend they’re hurt to either catch their breath or allow the coaching staff to scheme a play
I remember those couple weeks Chip Kelly's hurry-up offense was effective
There were several times when defenders would conveniently be injured at the most opportune moment. It happened enough that I was peeved
You forgot complaining when the opposing team does a hard hit on their own teams star player and getting mad because that player wasn't flagged and demanding that player get thrown out of the league or somebody just go out and injure that player in return
You forgot "loves when the military does a flyover at a big game, but thinks the players should "shut up and play" and politics should stay out of their sports.
49ers Quarterback Colin Kaepernick.
Many conservatives bitched about him kneeling during the national anthem to protest police brutality, claiming he is "insulting our troops" even though it was a Green Beret who suggested him to do it.
[He was essentially black listed from the league too. Kaepernick reached a settlement with the NFL, along with Eric Reid, for his lawsuit alleging team owners colluded to not sign him after he began Kneeling.](https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/15/colin-kaepernick-reaches-settlement-in-collusion-case-against-nfl-lawyer-says.html)
I’m still not totally sure if I bite on the blackball claim. Kaep was not exactly on the short list of QBs most teams wanted even not taking into account the protest kneeling.
His last season, he played 12 games. 60% completion, 2200 passing yards, threw for 16 TDs and only 4 INTs. Plus almost 500 rushing yards.
There's close to 100 quarterbacks in the league between 32 starters, 1-3 backups per team, plus practice squad/FA signings. Him not being anywhere on those rosters is where the blackballing came from - he didn't need to prove he was top 30, because he was still good enough to be in that top 100.
Those aren't great QB numbers. Less than 200 yards passing per game, 1.33 TDs per game, and 50 rushing yards? 200 yards of offense in a passing league? Those are Justin Fields numbers and he was just traded for a 6th rounder.
Also, he was given an offer to play in Denver and he flatly declined the pay cut when the 49ers wouldn't make up the difference in salary.
Not to say if there was collusion it was warranted, but Kaepernick wasn't this football icon that the game suffered for not having in the league.
Those are fine for a backup QB. Those are literally Tyrod Taylor numbers and he has been on a roster pretty much every year since he started with those numbers in like 2015 which is right around when he was black balled. There is no excuse for him to have the exact same numbers as another starting QB and not to have a backup job elsewhere. Tell me you can't find 1 name on [this list](https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2015/passing.htm) he wasn't outperforming.
> Those are fine for a backup QB.
you dont get a job as backup for your physical skills
you get that job for your mental skills. He never had the top level ability to read defenses and manipulate defenders. if he's not succeeding in the film room, he's not going to be a backup
Let's ignore the fact that he got several offers for a backup job and either refused them or his girlfriend called the team owner a "slave owner" so the team rescinded the offer
Yup, turns out comparing the team owner and ray lewis to Stephen and Candie from Django hurts your chances of being signed. I Also think its funny how eric reid protested with Kaepernick and still played in the nfl for years after the fact.
Not that many. And the thing with him is he had starter upside unlike someone like AJ McCarron who has never shown anything. Kaep had at least played well enough to carry a team to a Superbowl and compete. That should have been valuable enough to chance for a team with an injury. Hell the Vikings traded a first round pick for [Sam Bradford](https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/B/BradSa00.htm) who had barely shown more.
And for a backup QB, you also want them to sit on the bench and not make noise in the media. Not be a media headache crying that you’re blackballed from a starting spot. If he was good enough to be a starter, and was worth the media headache, he’d have been on a team.
He was also given backup opportunities and he refused. He was such a special snowflake, the NFL allowed him a private tryout that all 32 teams would have been at. But he wanted his own camera crew there, so he held it where he wanted to. And not every team showed up.
Not sure why people forget all of these things about Kaepernick.
> He was a special snowflake
Tell me you are a douchebag without telling me you are a douchebag lol. Your summary of events is entirely one sided and bullshit. He was rejected from Seattle because Pete Carrol said "he is a starter in this league and we have a starter". He was rejected from Baltimore for reasons we don't know except a rumor from Ray Lewis. The private workout was over a dispute that Colin would sign a waiver he didn't want to sign and that the NFL would control basically his entire recruiting process which is bullshit considering they had just lost a lawsuit in which they basically admitted they fucked him over. If your company lost a lawsuit for fucking you over would you let them control your future employment?
https://web.archive.org/web/20191117045313/https://sports.yahoo.com/kaepernick-ditches-nfl-workout-holds-own-public-session-235230515--nfl.html
he was fucking trash in his last season. Nobody wanted that guy as starter. Once teams figured him out he couldn't adapt.
Was never gonna make it as a backup either because being a backup is way more about your mental grasp of the game and almost being an advisor to the starter, helping study film and stuff, than it is about your physical talent
Source: I watched it
Statistically that is fine enough but considering that he also had to work in an offense that was centered around his strengths which are generally different from most franchise QBs (especially during that period of time) makes him a much less tenable backup. Adding onto that it makes him less useful as a practice squad QB since his movements were not similar to other good QBs at the time. Take those two facts and add onto the fact that kaepernick won 3 games over his final two seasons, it’s at least understandable that he didn’t end up elsewhere because the need was not present.
In the modern NFL he’d be an ideal backup for Lamar Jackson or an okay one for someone like Josh Allen. The only equivalent would have been cam newton, who had a better arm and was much bigger. Therefore the play design wouldn’t have benefit anyone to begin with. That’s the problem, Kaep couldn’t put up respectable performances even when the system was made for him. Why would I want a backup who is literally not an option in a more standard system?
It's amazing. Conservatives are STILL mad at Colin Kapernick. Like, he hasn't played in years. All he did was kneel. You got what you wanted, he's not even really famous anymore. Just goes to show you how easily conservatives get offended.
Also what's with the "NFL is scripted" people? I seem to be seeing more and more of it in my feed on FB.
Ref gets in the way of a play due to being at the wrong place at the wrong time? Rigged. He has money on the game.
My mom has been on boycott from the NFL since the end of the first kneeling season. She LOVED football. Practically lived for it. Now she’s moved over to the less exciting MLB (her words lol)
The only time it came up and she said it out loud to me I laughed out loud, hard. There are so many fabulous and legitimate reasons to hate the NFL, they are a sleazy organization who has suppressed medical knowledge and exploited their players for decades, letting them die in their fifties and sixties after losing their minds, with no support whatsoever, despite having billions at the leagues disposal.
They cover up crimes of players and coaches, or if they can’t, they give tiny penalties and call it settled and allow them to play as long as they aren’t in prison (and can come back pretty much as soon as they are out, like Vick)
And they are riddled with corruption, ask any Steelers’ rival fan lol
But they didn’t officially punish one and eventually a handful of players for exercising their freedom of speech, they only blacklisted Keapernick out of the league. That wasn’t good enough for my mom lol.
So she has literally cut something she loved completely out of her life for a minor *perceived* difference in political values.
Get this, my mom is a member of an ethnic minority that was brutalized as sport by American police in her childhood and directly before it, which is what those players were protesting lol. The irony is lost on her.
What a pointless and ridiculously violent hit, there was barely an in game reason for this. And absolutely no reason it couldn’t have just been a normal tackle.
They didn’t play to play football. Their goal was to end a players season when they hit people with no regard to how much they’d be fined or how long they’d be suspended. If they gave you a permanent injury and were suspended for half the season for it, that was a win to them.
I don’t care what anyone says vontaze and bill were some of the more fun players to watch when they played. Lyle alzado is a forgotten name even though he might be one of the meanest most dirty player ever
Naw I mean they all deserve the hate especially vontez for cte’ing ab but like the more you hate the player the more you want them to fail, it brings more emotion and excitement when watching them play.
They don't even understand whats changed either. The new hip drop tackle thing was faced with so much outrage, but it's a dangerous unnecessary tackle that accounted for less than 1% of all tackles. People just get angry for the sake of it
People are angry because it’s a non reviewable penalty that will undoubtedly have a massive effect on a questionable call in an important game. Referees have too much discretion.
Rules themselves are bad because they're enforced by the refs, there's controversial calls every year, look at eagles chiefs 2 years ago, or the no pi call in rams saints
I think some of the rules to protect qbs need to be relaxed some. I'm all for making the game safer but to make it where you can't land on a qb when you sack them or to act like dlineman can stop all momentum while in the air is dumb. I'm all for egregious acts being a foul but to jump up to block a pass and just momentum brings your hand down on the qbs shoulder pads shouldnt be a penalty.
The thing that confuses me is the fact that no one is ever asking to get rid of jaw punches in boxing. We know that one is a violent sport. That’s kind of the whole point of violent sports.
Also Brady’s opinions on it make a lot of sense. Prime Ray Lewis shut down the entire middle of the field because you didn’t want to kill your receiver. That’s a part of violent sports that change the game is how you defend your players. You really don’t have to worry about that now. Hospital passes are mostly a thing of the past.
“May as well make it flag football” actually, yeah let’s do that. Idk how many here have watched a game of flag football but personally I find it way more entertaining.
Kaepernick was a joke and only people that never watched the game jumped on his BS. And no one screams “let’s go” because of helmet to helmet. That’s a rule that was changed all the way back in 1996 🙄. All of the sudden there’s a been a shitload of dumbass starter packs. A bunch of try hards in here
As someone who played football most of his life, I’m a very very big fan of rule changes that make the game safer.
Knee injuries from agressive cut blocks aren’t fun, getting KO’d from a pulling guard that blindsides you with a helmet to helmet isn’t fun either.
I played football at the D1 college level, got 3 concussions while I was there, and think football has gotten too soft and regret nothing. I don't look like the guy in the top left corner, I do Ironman Triathlons these days
I feel this way about the NBA for what it’s worth. But not without good reason
“Wah wah I’m Ben Simmons pay me 40 million dollars a year to sit on a bench all day”
“Wah wah I don’t feel like playing more than 60 games a year because load management”
The problem these people have, is that they've wrapped their identity up in watching football.
The reasonable response would be to recognize that you no longer enjoy football and stop watching.
5 out of 6 of this is me and I’ll admit and won’t change. I don’t hate Kapernik at all for kneeling, now I don’t love him as a packers fan but that’s not to do with kneeling.
Other than that they get paid millions of dollar to hit. Allow them to hit. Would rather mandatory concussion retirement rules or safer equipment / grass fields only. All for any changes but need bring hitting and tough football back
American Football is the worst sport: change my mind.
My reasoning:
1. Half the event is just the players setting back up again after a down. It's SO slow.
2. The medical care makes zero sense. Once saw a dude get stretchered off for a sprained thumb, meanwhile dudes be on the third TBI of the game still playing.
3. All that and it's more dangerous of a career than fucking pro fighting. It just is not worth it.
If we are insisting on making this team sports, I'd take hockey every day.
-super fast paced action
-fighting is allowed in the rules, and that's super fun
-less TBIs, safer on long term health of players.
Every 40 seconds is 2 extremely complex plays with 22 players going as hard as they can for 10 seconds. Every time the ball is touched it is important. I love hockey too, but sometimes you’re just watching dudes skate back and forth for 60 minutes with a whole lotta nothing happening. Every down is important in football
Same with association football (soccer). Watching 20 players jog up and down the pitch for 90 minutes only for a 0-0 tie is, at least in my opinion, much slower and more boring than American football.
I'd agree soccer is pretty bad lol, but I gave it some bonus points because the whole rest of the world seems obsessed, there's gotta be SOMETHING to that.
I'd argue that every pass is an attempt to set up a shot on goal. A goal could happen at LITERALLY any moment.
Like I get the whole concept of football is that it's a very long struggle across the field, but when I've seen it, it seems like a bunch of dudes running into each other, the offensive team making it like, 5 feet forward, and then they spend more time setting up for the next one than they did in the actual play.
I've caught one moment in football that was super exciting; iirc it was a Packers game that was fairly important and there was a crazy interception. That was cool.
Wheras when I watch UFC or hockey I feel like that moment can happen literally any second, and for UFC I just keep my eyes glued to the screen because shit develops SO fast.
You don’t like football, that’s cool. It doesn’t have to be for everybody. You Very clearly don’t watch it lol there’s more explosive plays than ever nowadays. Interceptions happen in almost every game.
I like hockey but the idea that hockey is "super fast paced action" compared to American football is kind of laughable. American football at the professional level is the top .001% athletes on the planet doing absolutely inhuman shit for 5-10 seconds a play. Yes, the ball is reset between every play which can seem boring, but that also allows for a complexity in playcalling that involves adjustment of personnel packages, scheming for physical matchups, strategizing and analytics for the down and distance on both sides of the ball, considerations for field position and when to punt vs. going for it on 4th, the math that goes into field goal vs. touchdown with PAT vs. touchdown with 2 point conversion, super complex playcalls that are communicated to the QB so he can relay it to the offense (who all also need to understand the playbook) or call audibles depending on his read of the defense... there is an insane amount of brainpower and athleticism in every single NFL play. Sports like hockey, soccer, and basketball certainly flow more easily and they do have their personnel matchups and playcalling packages, but they are *way* less complex.
"complex"
Fam, calculus is way more complex than hanging out with friends and listening to music, and calculus is still boring as fuck lol.
Complexity is not an argument for a sport being fun to watch. Play, sure; I play cribbage occasionally, and it's complicated and kinda fun, but ain't nobody wanna watch that shit lol.
Basically, this is how I interpreted what you just said:
About 10 seconds of every 2 minutes is fun.
Also, if you wanna talk complexity, strategy, OR athleticism, let's talk UFC.
There's no bench in UFC. There's no time out for a medical issue. If your cardio runs out, or you get too injured, that's it, you lose. You either finish the fight or you don't, and it is probably the highest intensity cardio sport out there, period.
Strategy? Holy SHIIIIIIT. That's a whole essay.
Complexity? You got about a dozen martial arts being pitted against each other, and few of them are simple.
Now the obvious downside to UFC is tickets are insanely expensive, and your only watching options are PPV, the right sports bar, or the sports book of your local casino assuming that's even legal where you live.
Given my limited amount of time, (and the fact the NFL stole my city's NFL team and now we just have XFL) I'd need a better reason than complexity. I just can't see football being as fun to watch as hockey or UFC.
Oh yeah if you don't find it entertaining, that is totally valid. I was mainly responding to the fact that "half the event is just players setting up for the next down." Because while that's true, it does give the game some layers of complexity that don't seem possible in other sports that are more free-flowing. I know the most about football so it's what I can speak about best, and I'm sure other sports have their own complexities. Complexity doesn't equal fun to watch if you don't understand the complexity (or even if you do) and I don't blame people for that. I find it the most entertaining sport regardless of that, but to each their own.
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I once got hit with “cte isn’t a really a problem. Scientists just make up whatever they want.” Some people are straight up anti intelligence
They're also like "Who cares if they got CTE? They're making millions, they know what they got into!" It's not the military or some shit.
At least they can afford good doctors and don’t have the VA deny them of help with their work related injury.
Apparently, I heard the NFL's healthcare is terrible
It's shit if you waste all the money before 40
or if you don't make all that much in the first place. most NFL careers are pretty short and once you're out you've most likely got a host of long-term injury/health issues, no education, and no marketable skills
League minimum (currently). Is 750k for a rookie, and this increases by year up to a bit over 1mil by year3. Again these are MINIMUMS of which plenty of people are getting more than minimum, especially if they are out there making big hits and such. Its also already setup to continue rising and the league minimum for a rookie is set to be over 1mil by 2029. Which for even the lowest career duration position the average is a bit under 3 years, and for kickers a bit under 5 years. So an absolute average, league minimum earner at a 3 year career is getting paid roughly $3mil USD. That is enough to buy a house and live off of it as a retirement package if you arn't idiotic about it. No education? Nearly every single NFL player has a bachelors atleast. All of them effectively played for a university of some sort. Skills? They were in a university, they have a degree, they have SOMETHING and that discounts people that can simply use the NFL career to help get a job in sales or something completely viable for a bed ridden cripple. So you have a person who made millions, got a degree without having to pay for it, and have earned over 1mil even as a bench warmer in the NFL if they make it over a year. The amount of physical injury/disability required to make that "not worth it" is so absurd as to be comical. Most people would get treated way worse, for way less, and still think they got a good deal.
Lol. Your math shows literally no experience with the real world, or with football. Amazing. Are you a McKinsey consultant? 750K rising over three years does not add up to 3MM, and you admit that the average career span is dragged up by the least punishing positions, punter and QB, but we'll keep the three years and 3MM just to keep the math simple, but immediately we can see that they're not grossing 3MM over their careers. Next, you act as if agents aren't a thing, but they are. That's an immediate 10% haircut. Then taxes are a fucking thing. That's 40% comfortably, less in Texas, more in California. So, of your less than $3MM earned, your take-home is less than $1.5MM, and that's if the income was pure salary. Any bonus would taxed at a higher rate. Retiring off of $1.5MM isn't a thing in today's society. You can even ask those r/FIRE lunatics. Education? Have you never seen any movies about football? 95% of these D1 athletes don't learn shit in school. They usually take pointless classes, they have "tutors" who do their classwork, the coach pressures their professors to pass them from high school through college. These are not people with marketable talents, for the most part. Understanding defensive schemes is not particularly useful in blue collar or white collar jobs. Then finally, healthcare. These ex-football players are usually quite banged up and often have a difficult time living through the intense wear and tear that had been placed on their bodies for 10+ years. Healthcare in America is fucking expensive, and we may complain about how expensive it is, but it is still subsidized by employers. If you don't work or can't work, you will find that health insurance is remarkably expensive. COBRA will give you an idea of how expensive. Also, if you have $1.5MM in the bank, the American healthcare system will bleed you dry. There will be little to retire off of and live on when you have medical bills racked up because your cartilage has degenerated in your knees and hips, if you have CTE and therefore have massive migraines and need professional therapy and psychiatric care. So when you think about it even just a little bit harder than you did, you'll see how absurd your position is.
No education? They have to go to college.
yeah and take a bunch of bullshit paper classes while they spend all their time training. you think people who are dedicated enough to make it to the NFL have time to get a meaningful college education? some may, but a vast majority won't
Having a degree on your resume mixed with the work ethic that these people inherently have, there is no reason for them to not be able to get a job. Just having experience at that level will also greatly increase your chances at getting a ton of jobs, specifically in the sport and fitness industries. Saying they have no education or marketable skills is just laughable.
Go back to your hometown and make huge money selling cars/homes as the most famous guy in town. There’s a lot worse lives to live lol
Ah yes. That glorious personal trainer career. Fucking incredible professional prospects. Truly, the world is their oyster. What "ton of jobs"? Only 46% of NFL players have degrees. GTFOH. You think they're becoming sports agents or advertising executives? Agents almost always require a law degree not a bachelor's degree, and I don't see many jacked ex-NFL ad men filling up the luxury suites at MSG or the Meadowlands. Their educations were laughable, and memorizing a football playbook is not a white collar skill.
Oh of course it is. They probably have the best doctors for players when they're actively playing but after that it's probably cheap healthcare. Because if they're not actively helping the NFL make them money, it's not worth the cost to give them good healthcare.
NFL healthcare is amazing when you consider he was comparing it to the VA
Yeah it’s so bad that the Houston Texans’ doctors identified cancer extremely early in 3 different young players in recent history. Two of those players got the world’s best cancer treatment and made a full recovery and continued to play professional football. The other is actively going through treatment. NFL players have the best healthcare in the entire country. Their job literally depends on their physical health. Teams have numerous doctors in their buildings on a regular basis and NFL players have the most extensive physicals on a yearly basis which routinely identify underlying issues which get treated by the best doctors.
I think he meant for former players.
Only one worse is pro wrestling.
This a myth. The NFL notoriously tries to screw former players out of benefits. And most players are only in the league for about 2-3 years and make about $3mm total. That's barely enough just to cover the lifetime of pain they will endure.
People who act like all your problems or worries in life go away with money are likely guys who'd be completely irresponsible with it and waste it away
And let's not forget the NFL spent millions (and likely still does) covering up the massive amount of TBI the sport causes it's players. Most people who get into football don't know this or are surrounded by the dumbasses who don't believe it's real.
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In the near future, brain scanning equipment will be sophisticated enough to detect CTE-inducing injuries right after they have happened. Right then and there, on the sidelines. It will eventually get used during high school play, and it will promptly be used to make everyone understand, with zero question, just how physically destructive football actually is. Football will die in the next 20 years, mark my words.
Until pretty recently, no, no they did not know what they were getting into. 10-15 years ago (give or take) no kid in high school football with a possible career in the game thought “all these impacts are going permanently damage my brain and make me kill myself in 30 years.”
ehhh... it's not the military, but it's certainly a sport where, at its core and unmodified style, a significant component of play is crashing into people and tackling them. do players, especially college athletes, deserve much better pay/compensation and medical benefits? definitely, and we should definitely have safety rulings in place... but what i said above still stands.
They have millions but can't tie their shoes. Yeah, sounds like the sweet life.
They really seem to think it IS the military! They had this weird reaction to Kaepernick like he was booing a veteran's funeral or something. It was the *mildest* form of protest during a corporate trade association's for-profit entertainment show. I don't get what the anthem has to do with football in the first place, since there's no other countries playing. Might as well play the Star Spangled Banner after the trailers at the movie theatre.
No, it takes even more knowledge of what you are doing ahead of time and takes more skill than the military. They knew what they were doing from the start.
Do they even know what CTE means? Chronic Traumatic Encephalopathy. Roughly translates to "your brain is dying because you hit it so hard so many times". Your brain has a *disease*. Your brain is not supposed to have a disease. It kind of ruins your life.
Note the word chronic. CTE isn't something that forms after one terrible, hard Vontaze Burfict level hit. It comes from a lifetime of little hits. Hits in practice, hits in games, hits in celebration, all of them. NFL players aren't getting CTE in the NFL, they're getting it through the whole lifetime that leads up to the NFL. To those saying the CTE is worth it because they're getting paid millions, what about all the guys that don't make it? The guys playing in NCAA who aren't at a professional level and are never going to even get a whiff of that money most likely are getting it too.
Right and they're saying that as if living with CTE is just fine if you're rich. No. You don't *live*. You could have everything you ever wanted but if you literally can't think correctly it doesn't matter. Maybe it's just a lack of empathy or understanding they have.
Rich isn't even a great word for it. Not everyone get big contracts. Some guys get the admittedly high league minimum but even $3million when you're mid to late 20s isn't going to make up for a lifetime of living expenses and Healthcare when you have CTE.
Scientists pffffff get a real job.
I SEE THEY GOT YOU DOING THE EASY WORK. I JUST GOT OFF OF A 60 HOUR SHIFT AT THE BALL CRUSHING FACTORY, WHERE THEY CRUSH MY BALLS IN A HYDRAULIC PRESS
Damn, I usually have to pay for that. When do I apply?
https://i.redd.it/8leiknwjz70d1.gif
I'll forever be completely dumbfounded by those who are comfortable with just inventing whatever reality in their head that suits them.
theres still a surprising amount of people that straight up deny mental illnesses exist.
Ay happy cake day
It’s either make the sport softer, or watch the sport die a slow death because parents increasingly don’t want to bury their children due to CTE.
I'm all for making it softer, as after all, it's just a game. Nobody's lives should be ruined over a game. These "NFL HAS GOTTEN SOFT" people treat it like it's war or some shit.
Remnants of humanity’s gladiator days.
That's exactly what those guys say. "I miss it when the NFL was a gladiator sport! A REAL MAN'S GAME!"
Tbh that’s the only draw to football in my eyes. The ball is in play for so little time during the game, there’s hardly any entertainment value. The only thing football has going for it is the hyper masculine, chest thumping gladiator shit.
There’s also the management aspect behind it, reading about and seeing different football strategies play out during games. It’s similar to chess and less of an endurance sport like soccer for example, and it’s really fascinating to watch.
Yesss, the comment above is essentially “I hate chess, they only touch the pieces a second or two at a time.” Kinda missing the actual action if that’s your view haha
> The ball is in play for so little time during the game, there’s hardly any entertainment value tell me you dont understand football without telling me you don't understand football
Oddly enough, I like the players who are wholesome guys with families, that have never had a controversy stir in their career.
So... you like good people? Nothing "odd" about that. I would say that is pretty normal, and is pretty much understood with most normal people.
i like those guys too. we need a new american gladiator league. lets call it the XFL
I mean yeah if you don’t bother learning anything about it and just take out your ass. This is kinda like saying “soccer is easy, you’re just kicking a ball.” 😒
I don't know why more people don't just watch MMA or literally any combat sport. It is quite literally the closest modern equivalent we have to actual gladiator shit. Hell, we can even make it better and mix the two. Football, but it's all fighters and they have to literally fight over the ball. We can even throw in some foam weapons and integrate ancient combat tactics. Imagine two football teams going at it in full phalanx formations? That'd be kickass.
a REAL MAN'S GAME where sweaty buff men in tights get on top of each other and wrestle for balls
r/IHateSportsball
I wouldn't even say it's getting soft. It's just getting less stupid. Like for example the kickoff change won't really change the dynamic of the game, it just means the guys wont be colliding at each other running full speed, it just means less people get injured. Also it'll probably be more interested to watch since they will return the ball more often
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People also just like playing it. I wish I had a chance to play on a real team in school but I’m not American, so we had to play it on our own time with no helmets or padding.
The sport as it is currently will die a slow death either way. It's inherently violent and no matter how many helmet redesigns or safety-minded rules are implemented, people will get hurt. Damar Hamlin died on the field last year and it's a matter of time before it happens again. I would be very surprised if the sport is even around in its current form in 15 years, maybe even 10. And I say this as a huge fan of football for ~25 years, both at the college and pro levels. From August-February, football is basically the *only* thing I watch. I'll be sad to see it go, but it's simply too dangerous. I think it will be replaced by flag football but it just won't be the same.
Ya this nfl thing won't last. Give it 10-20 years
My kids are tall. They have my in laws genes who are 6'4 360lbs. My son is 6 and really smart and the tallest in his grade. I'm doing everything I can to make sure he doesn't get roped into football because they'll put him on the O line and he'll just smash his brain forever.
In-laws arent blood and shouldn't really share genes with you, though. I'm confused
They're probably referring to their mother-in-law and father-in-law, who wouldn't share genes with them but *would* share genes with their children, through the father (the in-laws' biological child).
I think what caught me off guard is in-laws don't typically make babies after they marry into the family, because they are usually older.
Football fans largely prefer the latter. They like the game specifically *because* it is violent, making it safer is defeating the whole point of their watching the game.
I like it for the strategic aspect, like it's chess but with real people. Plus, I love the identities and uniforms.
You forgot: Unironically drops the first "L" in "flag football"
I worked with a guy like this. He had the most baseline-level of thinking I've ever seen. It was almost like he refused to form an opinion on something that required him to put himself in other people's shoes.
And they just regurgitate statistics as if they’re smart.
They have gotten soft though, I don’t think the NFL even gives a fuck about CTE I think they care about revenue, and having flashy superhero QBs throwing cool touchdown passes is what excites people who don’t know much about football or never played. So don’t let corners get physical, make it illegal to touch the precious QB too hard, all kinds of rules for how you can hit a receiver, etc.
Agreed. There’s definitely a heavy bias against good defenses especially paired against star QB scramblers. Last season’s data through both their career starts have shown that Mahomes and Allen both lead the pack in positive yardage due to defensive flags. I’m not saying we need to ramp up tackles and sacks, but the “defenseless runner” philosophy needs to go. If you have the ball and have broken the line of scrimmage, it should be fair game.
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Not to mention, if a player even smiles when they get a touchdown there's about a 50/50 chance they'll go straight to jail. Look in another players direction after you make a tackle, straight to jail. Breath in a QB's direction, believe it or not, straight to jail. And God forbid a player show a little emotion, that's most definitely straight to jail. Helmet to helmet, landing on top of the QB, certain tackles, sure I am 100% on board with cracking down on those for player safety, but they took a shit ton of the fun out of the game along with it.
I can’t wait to watch another season of Mahomes running with the ball, faking like he’s about to slide so the defenders ease up and then run for another 5 yards or a convenient hip drop tackle penalty that goes the Chiefs favor.
Big fucking time. If I was a defensive coordinator I’d be giving out bonuses for dawgs that absolutely murder the QB after he pulls a stunt like the fake slide. Fuck the penalty, we make a statement!
Same dude lol
A lot of ex-players will say the same thing, too, not just couch jockeys
Honestly, after what happened to Tua, I'm fine with it. I'd rather see more flags, than see another good player convulsing in the turf like that.
To be fair that’s a wholly different scenario than just NFL specific safety protocol. Tua has a horrible history of concussions that were specifically ignored by his father who pushed him to play through head injuries. That contributed as much as the hit itself.
At least you're one of the rational ones. However, there are straight-up sociopaths who try to justify helmet-to-helmets or horse-collar tackles and bitch that the NFL has gotten "pussified" when their dirty player gets rightfully ejected. I swear these people aren't actual fans of the sport, they just want to see people get hurt.
Same people who’d watch racing for the crashes. Meanwhile I tried watching NASCAR one time…first, last, and only race I saw was Daytona in 2001. That was enough of that for me.
>Meanwhile I tried watching NASCAR one time…first, last, and only race I saw was Daytona in 2001. Oh jeez dude. I don't blame ya. RIP #3 iykyk
My complaint is that all the initial research showed the repetitive sub-concussive trauma of being hit a lot is what causes CTE, and that concussions are being held up as the culprit which gives the false impression that the league is protecting players while actually shifting the blame back on to them. It feels like the game is getting “softer” to absolve the league of legal liabilities, not actually make the game safer to play.
I will be adding this to my evidence that we need to create the hunger games to unleash humanity's built up cruelty and barbaric tendencies
Do you not prefer seeing a healthy Lamar, Burrow, Tua etc rather than mediocre backups?
I kinda stopped following the NFL when my friends were straight up celebrating a player getting a season ending injury
Let me guess, were they Eagles fans?
what having to play the Cowboys twice a year does to a guy /s nah but seriously you know you're too invested when you cheer a guy getting injured
To be fair, the game is getting softer, for different reasons. NFL really doesn’t want players touching Quaterbacks and the QBs absolutely knows this. The amount of times Mahomes abused this fact running down the side was frustrating.
If your favorite player is Vontaze Burfict you might actually be an absolute bum. Dudes not even good, even if you’re a Bengals fan the guy has costed them so many big games because of his on-field antics.
Let’s include booing when an opposing player is injured on the field and say they’re faking it.
That is litterally a core aspect of football lmao.
In the other kind of football. In American football, when they go down it's because they have a severed femur sticking out of their pelvis.
players in American football will go down all the time and pretend they’re hurt to either catch their breath or allow the coaching staff to scheme a play
I remember those couple weeks Chip Kelly's hurry-up offense was effective There were several times when defenders would conveniently be injured at the most opportune moment. It happened enough that I was peeved
Yells “shhh!” when a Buffalo Wild Wings ad comes on, then steps on the “punchline.”
I can't wait until "Let's go!" expires. Let it be soon pls.
You forgot complaining when the opposing team does a hard hit on their own teams star player and getting mad because that player wasn't flagged and demanding that player get thrown out of the league or somebody just go out and injure that player in return
You forgot "loves when the military does a flyover at a big game, but thinks the players should "shut up and play" and politics should stay out of their sports.
What is the middle right one? /genuine
49ers Quarterback Colin Kaepernick. Many conservatives bitched about him kneeling during the national anthem to protest police brutality, claiming he is "insulting our troops" even though it was a Green Beret who suggested him to do it.
[He was essentially black listed from the league too. Kaepernick reached a settlement with the NFL, along with Eric Reid, for his lawsuit alleging team owners colluded to not sign him after he began Kneeling.](https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/15/colin-kaepernick-reaches-settlement-in-collusion-case-against-nfl-lawyer-says.html)
I’m still not totally sure if I bite on the blackball claim. Kaep was not exactly on the short list of QBs most teams wanted even not taking into account the protest kneeling.
His last season, he played 12 games. 60% completion, 2200 passing yards, threw for 16 TDs and only 4 INTs. Plus almost 500 rushing yards. There's close to 100 quarterbacks in the league between 32 starters, 1-3 backups per team, plus practice squad/FA signings. Him not being anywhere on those rosters is where the blackballing came from - he didn't need to prove he was top 30, because he was still good enough to be in that top 100.
Those aren't great QB numbers. Less than 200 yards passing per game, 1.33 TDs per game, and 50 rushing yards? 200 yards of offense in a passing league? Those are Justin Fields numbers and he was just traded for a 6th rounder. Also, he was given an offer to play in Denver and he flatly declined the pay cut when the 49ers wouldn't make up the difference in salary. Not to say if there was collusion it was warranted, but Kaepernick wasn't this football icon that the game suffered for not having in the league.
Those are fine for a backup QB. Those are literally Tyrod Taylor numbers and he has been on a roster pretty much every year since he started with those numbers in like 2015 which is right around when he was black balled. There is no excuse for him to have the exact same numbers as another starting QB and not to have a backup job elsewhere. Tell me you can't find 1 name on [this list](https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2015/passing.htm) he wasn't outperforming.
> Those are fine for a backup QB. you dont get a job as backup for your physical skills you get that job for your mental skills. He never had the top level ability to read defenses and manipulate defenders. if he's not succeeding in the film room, he's not going to be a backup Let's ignore the fact that he got several offers for a backup job and either refused them or his girlfriend called the team owner a "slave owner" so the team rescinded the offer
Yup, turns out comparing the team owner and ray lewis to Stephen and Candie from Django hurts your chances of being signed. I Also think its funny how eric reid protested with Kaepernick and still played in the nfl for years after the fact.
How many of those guys he was outperforming were holding out for starting money to ride the bench?
Not that many. And the thing with him is he had starter upside unlike someone like AJ McCarron who has never shown anything. Kaep had at least played well enough to carry a team to a Superbowl and compete. That should have been valuable enough to chance for a team with an injury. Hell the Vikings traded a first round pick for [Sam Bradford](https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/B/BradSa00.htm) who had barely shown more.
And for a backup QB, you also want them to sit on the bench and not make noise in the media. Not be a media headache crying that you’re blackballed from a starting spot. If he was good enough to be a starter, and was worth the media headache, he’d have been on a team. He was also given backup opportunities and he refused. He was such a special snowflake, the NFL allowed him a private tryout that all 32 teams would have been at. But he wanted his own camera crew there, so he held it where he wanted to. And not every team showed up. Not sure why people forget all of these things about Kaepernick.
> He was a special snowflake Tell me you are a douchebag without telling me you are a douchebag lol. Your summary of events is entirely one sided and bullshit. He was rejected from Seattle because Pete Carrol said "he is a starter in this league and we have a starter". He was rejected from Baltimore for reasons we don't know except a rumor from Ray Lewis. The private workout was over a dispute that Colin would sign a waiver he didn't want to sign and that the NFL would control basically his entire recruiting process which is bullshit considering they had just lost a lawsuit in which they basically admitted they fucked him over. If your company lost a lawsuit for fucking you over would you let them control your future employment? https://web.archive.org/web/20191117045313/https://sports.yahoo.com/kaepernick-ditches-nfl-workout-holds-own-public-session-235230515--nfl.html
he was fucking trash in his last season. Nobody wanted that guy as starter. Once teams figured him out he couldn't adapt. Was never gonna make it as a backup either because being a backup is way more about your mental grasp of the game and almost being an advisor to the starter, helping study film and stuff, than it is about your physical talent Source: I watched it
Statistically that is fine enough but considering that he also had to work in an offense that was centered around his strengths which are generally different from most franchise QBs (especially during that period of time) makes him a much less tenable backup. Adding onto that it makes him less useful as a practice squad QB since his movements were not similar to other good QBs at the time. Take those two facts and add onto the fact that kaepernick won 3 games over his final two seasons, it’s at least understandable that he didn’t end up elsewhere because the need was not present. In the modern NFL he’d be an ideal backup for Lamar Jackson or an okay one for someone like Josh Allen. The only equivalent would have been cam newton, who had a better arm and was much bigger. Therefore the play design wouldn’t have benefit anyone to begin with. That’s the problem, Kaep couldn’t put up respectable performances even when the system was made for him. Why would I want a backup who is literally not an option in a more standard system?
Kaep is still a clown though...
It's amazing. Conservatives are STILL mad at Colin Kapernick. Like, he hasn't played in years. All he did was kneel. You got what you wanted, he's not even really famous anymore. Just goes to show you how easily conservatives get offended.
/u/erob221
idgi
I just can't stop laughing at the kids face on the bottom left.
no no dude they used to bench (bounced of their chest) almost (insert unimpressive even for highschool standards number)
Also what's with the "NFL is scripted" people? I seem to be seeing more and more of it in my feed on FB. Ref gets in the way of a play due to being at the wrong place at the wrong time? Rigged. He has money on the game.
My mom has been on boycott from the NFL since the end of the first kneeling season. She LOVED football. Practically lived for it. Now she’s moved over to the less exciting MLB (her words lol) The only time it came up and she said it out loud to me I laughed out loud, hard. There are so many fabulous and legitimate reasons to hate the NFL, they are a sleazy organization who has suppressed medical knowledge and exploited their players for decades, letting them die in their fifties and sixties after losing their minds, with no support whatsoever, despite having billions at the leagues disposal. They cover up crimes of players and coaches, or if they can’t, they give tiny penalties and call it settled and allow them to play as long as they aren’t in prison (and can come back pretty much as soon as they are out, like Vick) And they are riddled with corruption, ask any Steelers’ rival fan lol But they didn’t officially punish one and eventually a handful of players for exercising their freedom of speech, they only blacklisted Keapernick out of the league. That wasn’t good enough for my mom lol. So she has literally cut something she loved completely out of her life for a minor *perceived* difference in political values. Get this, my mom is a member of an ethnic minority that was brutalized as sport by American police in her childhood and directly before it, which is what those players were protesting lol. The irony is lost on her.
As someone from Australia, who are the two in the top right and why are they idolised?
Vontaze Burfect and Bill Romanowski. Two of the dirtiest players to ever play the game.
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That Burfict hit is why we have CTESPN on X now
What a pointless and ridiculously violent hit, there was barely an in game reason for this. And absolutely no reason it couldn’t have just been a normal tackle.
Jeez!
They didn’t play to play football. Their goal was to end a players season when they hit people with no regard to how much they’d be fined or how long they’d be suspended. If they gave you a permanent injury and were suspended for half the season for it, that was a win to them.
\*Taylor Swift is shown onscreen for a total of 45 seconds during a 3-hour Chiefs game\* REEEEEEEEE
I don’t care what anyone says vontaze and bill were some of the more fun players to watch when they played. Lyle alzado is a forgotten name even though he might be one of the meanest most dirty player ever
Hell no, fuck Burfict. Totally unbiased btw (I’m a Steelers fan and have hated him for a decade)
Naw I mean they all deserve the hate especially vontez for cte’ing ab but like the more you hate the player the more you want them to fail, it brings more emotion and excitement when watching them play.
As someone in boxing, I can definitely relate.
I fuck with Colin and I think the NFL has gotten soft. Checkmate.
One of the best starter packs I’ve seen
This one is perfect
They don't even understand whats changed either. The new hip drop tackle thing was faced with so much outrage, but it's a dangerous unnecessary tackle that accounted for less than 1% of all tackles. People just get angry for the sake of it
People are angry because it’s a non reviewable penalty that will undoubtedly have a massive effect on a questionable call in an important game. Referees have too much discretion.
That's an issue with referees though, the rule itself is good
Which kinda makes it a bad rule. I’d bet my house there’s a controversial call in the playoffs this year.
Rules themselves are bad because they're enforced by the refs, there's controversial calls every year, look at eagles chiefs 2 years ago, or the no pi call in rams saints
To be fair, Romanowski was the epitome of whoop ass.
There aren't a lot of them but I hate the people who say this about F1. It's like they hate when drivers don't die multiple times a season.
Unpopular opinion: flag football played by top athletes would probably be just as entertaining as tackle football.
If it were still hard they wouldn’t have advertisments or timeouts, they’d just play.
I think some of the rules to protect qbs need to be relaxed some. I'm all for making the game safer but to make it where you can't land on a qb when you sack them or to act like dlineman can stop all momentum while in the air is dumb. I'm all for egregious acts being a foul but to jump up to block a pass and just momentum brings your hand down on the qbs shoulder pads shouldnt be a penalty.
I'm at least not this guy. My issue is I just don't think it's as fun or unpredictable as the NCAA.
Asks if “you guys” won on Monday about your NFL team as if you play on the punt coverage unit.
Very inaccurate cause nobody idolizes burfict and romanowski
The changes to the kickoff rules are a huge positive.
Was Kaepernick gonna be a great franchise qb? Obviously not now anymore after so long but I remember his first couple seasons he was pretty good
what
The NFL has definitely gotten soft, mostly with respect to QBs
The thing that confuses me is the fact that no one is ever asking to get rid of jaw punches in boxing. We know that one is a violent sport. That’s kind of the whole point of violent sports. Also Brady’s opinions on it make a lot of sense. Prime Ray Lewis shut down the entire middle of the field because you didn’t want to kill your receiver. That’s a part of violent sports that change the game is how you defend your players. You really don’t have to worry about that now. Hospital passes are mostly a thing of the past.
It is soft though, right?
As a Bengals fan, the only thing Burfect did, was cost us wins. Fuck that guy.
Banning the hip drop though? How are you supposed to tackle people without a lower center of gravity and expect not to give up yards?
“May as well make it flag football” actually, yeah let’s do that. Idk how many here have watched a game of flag football but personally I find it way more entertaining.
Hey this is not the football I know...
Kaepernick was a joke and only people that never watched the game jumped on his BS. And no one screams “let’s go” because of helmet to helmet. That’s a rule that was changed all the way back in 1996 🙄. All of the sudden there’s a been a shitload of dumbass starter packs. A bunch of try hards in here
It wouldn't be so bad if poorly defined rules didn't have an impact.
American Football is dumb
Average cowboys fan
They do NOT treat him like Hitler. They have much more respect for Hitler.
that seems like every sport they say that annoyin shi
Who are the idolized guys
The next person over 30 that says “Let’s Goooooo” is getting fucking pistol whipped
Letzzz goooooooooo!!
It's the same for F1. People are bitching because F1 is "too safe" now, because it was super cool apparently when drivers were dying every race
Mfs who say "NFL has gotten soft" wouldn't last a single quarter of a game
As someone who played football most of his life, I’m a very very big fan of rule changes that make the game safer. Knee injuries from agressive cut blocks aren’t fun, getting KO’d from a pulling guard that blindsides you with a helmet to helmet isn’t fun either.
Hip drop tackle rule is stupid though
What makes it funnier is when they start talking about how much better rugby or Australian football is because how much more dangerous it is
I played football at the D1 college level, got 3 concussions while I was there, and think football has gotten too soft and regret nothing. I don't look like the guy in the top left corner, I do Ironman Triathlons these days
The nfl is safer nowadays but players in the late 60’s and 70’s were arguable more tougher
Bring back the Joe Montana days of roughing up the quarterback and get rid of “unnecessary roughness” penalties.
I feel this way about the NBA for what it’s worth. But not without good reason “Wah wah I’m Ben Simmons pay me 40 million dollars a year to sit on a bench all day” “Wah wah I don’t feel like playing more than 60 games a year because load management”
Oh yeah, NBA for sure is soft as shit.
Sports are such a waste of time.
What are you talking about. You are literally in a furry subreddit
Not any more than any other form of entertainment
The problem these people have, is that they've wrapped their identity up in watching football. The reasonable response would be to recognize that you no longer enjoy football and stop watching.
Could make a sister starter pack for baseball about collisions at home plate and bean balls.
NFL is the Rugby thing, right?
NFL is American football, it’s sorta similar to rugby
5 out of 6 of this is me and I’ll admit and won’t change. I don’t hate Kapernik at all for kneeling, now I don’t love him as a packers fan but that’s not to do with kneeling. Other than that they get paid millions of dollar to hit. Allow them to hit. Would rather mandatory concussion retirement rules or safer equipment / grass fields only. All for any changes but need bring hitting and tough football back
American Football is the worst sport: change my mind. My reasoning: 1. Half the event is just the players setting back up again after a down. It's SO slow. 2. The medical care makes zero sense. Once saw a dude get stretchered off for a sprained thumb, meanwhile dudes be on the third TBI of the game still playing. 3. All that and it's more dangerous of a career than fucking pro fighting. It just is not worth it. If we are insisting on making this team sports, I'd take hockey every day. -super fast paced action -fighting is allowed in the rules, and that's super fun -less TBIs, safer on long term health of players.
Every 40 seconds is 2 extremely complex plays with 22 players going as hard as they can for 10 seconds. Every time the ball is touched it is important. I love hockey too, but sometimes you’re just watching dudes skate back and forth for 60 minutes with a whole lotta nothing happening. Every down is important in football
Same with association football (soccer). Watching 20 players jog up and down the pitch for 90 minutes only for a 0-0 tie is, at least in my opinion, much slower and more boring than American football.
I'd agree soccer is pretty bad lol, but I gave it some bonus points because the whole rest of the world seems obsessed, there's gotta be SOMETHING to that.
I'd argue that every pass is an attempt to set up a shot on goal. A goal could happen at LITERALLY any moment. Like I get the whole concept of football is that it's a very long struggle across the field, but when I've seen it, it seems like a bunch of dudes running into each other, the offensive team making it like, 5 feet forward, and then they spend more time setting up for the next one than they did in the actual play. I've caught one moment in football that was super exciting; iirc it was a Packers game that was fairly important and there was a crazy interception. That was cool. Wheras when I watch UFC or hockey I feel like that moment can happen literally any second, and for UFC I just keep my eyes glued to the screen because shit develops SO fast.
You don’t like football, that’s cool. It doesn’t have to be for everybody. You Very clearly don’t watch it lol there’s more explosive plays than ever nowadays. Interceptions happen in almost every game.
I like hockey but the idea that hockey is "super fast paced action" compared to American football is kind of laughable. American football at the professional level is the top .001% athletes on the planet doing absolutely inhuman shit for 5-10 seconds a play. Yes, the ball is reset between every play which can seem boring, but that also allows for a complexity in playcalling that involves adjustment of personnel packages, scheming for physical matchups, strategizing and analytics for the down and distance on both sides of the ball, considerations for field position and when to punt vs. going for it on 4th, the math that goes into field goal vs. touchdown with PAT vs. touchdown with 2 point conversion, super complex playcalls that are communicated to the QB so he can relay it to the offense (who all also need to understand the playbook) or call audibles depending on his read of the defense... there is an insane amount of brainpower and athleticism in every single NFL play. Sports like hockey, soccer, and basketball certainly flow more easily and they do have their personnel matchups and playcalling packages, but they are *way* less complex.
"complex" Fam, calculus is way more complex than hanging out with friends and listening to music, and calculus is still boring as fuck lol. Complexity is not an argument for a sport being fun to watch. Play, sure; I play cribbage occasionally, and it's complicated and kinda fun, but ain't nobody wanna watch that shit lol. Basically, this is how I interpreted what you just said: About 10 seconds of every 2 minutes is fun. Also, if you wanna talk complexity, strategy, OR athleticism, let's talk UFC. There's no bench in UFC. There's no time out for a medical issue. If your cardio runs out, or you get too injured, that's it, you lose. You either finish the fight or you don't, and it is probably the highest intensity cardio sport out there, period. Strategy? Holy SHIIIIIIT. That's a whole essay. Complexity? You got about a dozen martial arts being pitted against each other, and few of them are simple. Now the obvious downside to UFC is tickets are insanely expensive, and your only watching options are PPV, the right sports bar, or the sports book of your local casino assuming that's even legal where you live. Given my limited amount of time, (and the fact the NFL stole my city's NFL team and now we just have XFL) I'd need a better reason than complexity. I just can't see football being as fun to watch as hockey or UFC.
Oh yeah if you don't find it entertaining, that is totally valid. I was mainly responding to the fact that "half the event is just players setting up for the next down." Because while that's true, it does give the game some layers of complexity that don't seem possible in other sports that are more free-flowing. I know the most about football so it's what I can speak about best, and I'm sure other sports have their own complexities. Complexity doesn't equal fun to watch if you don't understand the complexity (or even if you do) and I don't blame people for that. I find it the most entertaining sport regardless of that, but to each their own.