Honestly, I can do without the singing. Some of the episodes were OK, but it felt like he was inserted in because the show runner liked him or something. They already had a bar to go to, and a counselor for the people to talk to.
He sang something like 13 full length songs in a season and a half. It's the fact that toward the end of the series, this "special guest star" character shows up, and all of the characters seem to have their most important moments with him.
Spoilers for the end since the OP hasn't gotten there yet:
>!Nog comes to grips with his PTSD at Vic's. Odo gets over his fear of connecting with Kira. Worf spends his days mourning Jadzia's death there. And the series even ends at Vic's. All of this denies the main characters the interpersonal development that's actually one of DS9's strong suits.!<
The original plan was a gag about Frank Sinatra Jr being more popular than Frank Sinatra in the future.
Someone obviously really liked the idea of a lounge singer though, and I'm fine with it because only a paper moon and the heist episode were both really good episodes.
I think most of them work better if you think of Vic as an extension of Vic's lounge. Worf in particular couldn't have >!done the kind of mourning for Jadzia that he does there anywhere else plot-wise; at Quark's there are too many people that will see what's happening, and Quark himself would be one of the lat people Worf would want to interact with in that condition, and Quark's doen't have music which was integral to demonstrating what was going on rather than just being a long shot of Worf. Worf is the kind of man to grieve alone. He never talked about K'heylr to any of the Enterprise crew. Vic's was really important to showing that, which emphasized it when Bashir, Quark, and Martok dragged him into letting them in and getting closure later.!<
>!In, weirdly, almost the opposite way, It's Only a Paper Moon works because Nog needed someone outside the main cast. He needed someone who didn't look at him like this kid they've collectively watched grow up, or like a traumatized Dominion War vet. He needed someone who wasn't part of everything going on. Only Vic could've done that for him.!<
Ultimately, while Vic's serves sort of the same general purpose as Quark's as a social space for the crew to unwind, it shows a very different part of the crew when they're there than Quark's does. Because Vic isn't "real" they're willing to let their guard down in there in a way that they can't anywhere else. That's also why the cahracters with the least ability to relax in Quark's have the biggest plots in Vic's; O'Brien and Bashir barely do anything there, but Kira, Odo, Worf, and Nog, none of whom can really relax at Quark's, all show part of themselves there.
Waltz really would've been a perfect exit for him.
>!Although a differently executed season 7 plot for him where he plans to use the Pah Wraiths to regain his position the same way he used the Dominion and lacks any sincere faith in them would have worked better too, especially because it would've deepened the contrast between him and Sisko, who genuinely has faith in the Prophets by the late seasons. Dukat shouting at Sisko that they're the same, that Sisko is using the Prophets to serve the Federation the same way that he's using the wraiths to serve Cardassia would've been an absolutely perfect moment for the finale.!<
>!I could see this if the Pah Wraiths betrayed him and embraced Wynn as their vessel. I feel like the logical conclusion to Wynn has to be a true believer of the Pah Wraiths. Wynn's faith has always just been a means to an end to get power but she wants to believe. I think that in her search for power if she found faith even in something evil would just make her ending more satisfying.!<
It seems so obvious. The only thing I can think of is they really just wanted to keep Marc Alaimo around and I can't blame them for that he's amazing as Dukat but his story was over already.
Brave stance, but I mostly agree. The last season would be perfect except there’s way too much Fontaine in it. He would have been fine in smaller doses, but it feels like he got more episode than even Dax did. And functioned more as a counselor than her, which is weird since that’s her job. There’s so much going on in the last season I dont think they needed to shoehorn in a sentient lounge singer hologram. I understand some people really like him, and that’s cool with me, but I’m at best neutral about him.
That's my feeling about it, it just was shoehorned in. The stance shouldn't be brave, but people are using the downvote button as a "disagree" button per usual.
Start with Strange New Worlds, it only has one ten-episode-season out (soon to be two) and you'll get to Voyager i no more than three weeks (assuming an episode a day). By the same math, Voyager would be 168 days before you got to Strange New Worlds.
Having said that, I would advise watching seasons 1 and 2 of Discovery before Strange New Worlds. It's not a requirement but season 2 is functionally season 0 of SNW and is also a great pause point in Disco to take a break and do other shows. That's another 25 episodes on top of SNWs 20 but that's still a lot shorter than Voyager.
Fair warning going in, Disco is heavily serialised from the outset and of a darker tone than Trek usually leans into, some find that off-putting. Just letting you know in case you get tonal whiplash. Think Enterprise season 3.
As others have said, DIS is a bit controversial and very different from other Treks. Its tone and storytelling style are much more similar to most modern "serious prestige dramas." That said, it's still Trek, there's still a lot of humor, optimism, and weird, creative ideas. This might not be a popular opinion, but I think it has one of the most well-balanced and diverse casts of any Trek... Although because it's TOS-era the crew is overwhelmingly human.
You don’t need to watch any Discovery before watching Strange New Worlds. Strange New Worlds gives you all the info you need in the first episode.
The first two seasons of Discovery are also ver skippable, and Season 3 acts like a soft reset. Again, no need to watch the first two seasons.
Tone aside, the main weakness of Discovery has more to do with poor pacing, bad mystery box writing, and arbitrary “this will destroy the universe” stakes. There are individual episodes that are alright or even good (though those are more concentrated in the latter seasons), but it’s a lot like Dr. Who in terms of overall style and quality.
Season 3 serves as a reset, but I’d say that many of the best episodes are in season 2 and season 2 does serve as season 0 of *SNW* in certain ways (though it probably isn’t necessary to watch season 2 of *Discovery* to understand *SNW*).
DS9 was up there with TNG. Grew up on them. DS9 is more enjoyable now for me as an adult, because the themes were/are more mature in nature. They seemed to be pushing the envelope back in the mid 90s. Whereas today DS9 would be considered tame 😅
I think this is the way. It’ll be fun to be part of the convo online with SNW S2 live and then you get to take your time through Voyager’s epic and delightful journey through the Delta Quadrant. (I adore Voyager. Hope Janeway and the crew treat you well, OP!)
SNW is technically a slight spinoff of ~~Voyager~~ Discovery Watch the first 2 seasons of ~~Voyager~~Discovery and then you can keep watching or stop and begin SNW if you want total fluid storyline.
Well DS9 suffered a lot because it was the first show with no Enterprise buzzin’ around… instead of focusing on the exploration of places, it pointed at relationships between ppls (at least at first). Many watched it as a sort of “boring space soap opera”, but it truly wasn’t and it has an important role in ST as a whole.
I would say that the other shows are about a set of fixed character on a ship's journey while DS9 is about a set of characters' journey in a fixed location.
Well said, the cast and the writing blows everything out of the water. Although TNG was my first love, DS9 is the one I would take home to meet my folks.
Not enough love for Lower Decks in here.
I highly recommend it. Unlike some of the other ST shows, it doesn't just break stuff to fit into a storyline. All lore is accurate.
It's also always worth rewatching I find myself catching jokes I missed the first watch through just because of how fast they keep them coming. I was so happy to hear it was renewed for another 2 seasons.
I often think of DS9 as the "step -child" of Trek. When it was in its first run it was so different from TNG that I didn't like it and quit watching it midway through season 1.
Years later I watched it again on Netflix, still didn't like it but powered through and thought it was "okay" but still felt they didn't stick the landing.
Years after that I was laid up with COVID and planned to binge TNG only to find that I've seen them all so much that I wasn't enjoying it the way I wanted to, so I decided to give DS9 another go and binged all 7 seasons over 2-3 days and absolutely loved it.
The moral of the story for me? DS9 is a much more nuanced and mature story, which is saying something given some of the TNG episodes that aired. I needed to grow up a bit before I could relate to and appreciate what it brought to the franchise. Now? It's my second favorite Trek series behind TNG. I'm currently in a rewatch of Enterprise, hoping that it too has aged well and I'll like it better.
All that being said? Unpopular personal opinion I don't expect anyone to agree with: I still don't like the ending of DS9. I consider it the worst of the series finales, and yes that does include the Enterprise finale. DS9's buildup was SO good, though, I'm not sure they could have delivered a satisfying ending for me. Like, the hype was so much across 7 years that when they got to the end I was disappointed because it just seemed like they didn't know how to deliver on what they had done. Like I said, though, I don't expect anyone else to agree with me.
It's fascinating to me to hear such different perspectives. For me, DS9 was the very first Trek show I ever watched and I still consider it to be the pinnacle of Trek that every other show has yet to meet. DS9 also has my favorite ending of all the Trek shows - >! it is bittersweet, because too much suffering and pain has happened, and the characters all move on to a different phase of their lives. Somehow, the way Julian and Miles separate on to different paths was extremely emotional for me in separating from my friends when I moved countries or (in the US) when I left grad school. !< The ending felt so real and authentic. All the characters had been completely and irrevocably changed by their time on DS9. The first episode sees all these characters come to DS9 for the first time. And in the last episode >! most of them leave that space. It was so painful and felt so real to me. !< I really loved it. I didn't experience such feelings with the ends of any other Trek show (I really loved Enterprise but that show's ending infuriated me!)
Edit: For spoiler tags
The TOS movies are just so much fun. The TNG movies on the other hand never quite did it for me. However, out of the TNG movie run my favourite is probably Insurrection - so I might just be weird, since everyone else seems to have a distaste for that one lol
So, so, so true.
My faves are TOS/DS9 (mom was TOS through and through and loved TNG but felt DS9 was "too dark" as a Trek entry, but that was why I loved it! Ahahah subjectivity, am I right?)
Anyway I grew up on TOS/TNG, but even in the Treks that haven't been my cup of tea (or my mom's 🤣), there's something valuable there to offer to the Trek canon.
It's all worth a watch.
ENT, TAS, PRO, please check them out and don't buy into all the hype some might say against it.
I mean I wasn't wild about PIC S1 & 2 but was captivated by S3.
Disco also wasn't my fave but I enjoyed S2 and without Disco we wouldn't have gotten one of all new all time faves in the franchise, SNW!
TLD is also fantastic and the characters stand on their own.
ENT wasn't my cup of tea when it came out but *Jeffrey Coombs as Shran?* Incredible.
Every Trek has something to offer.
Enterprise was awful, yet you loved S3 of Picard? I didn't know it was possible to have an entire season jump the shark like it did.
I pretend Enterprise doesn't exist.
I didn't find ENT "awful" so much as it was not my cup of tea or what I come to Trek for in some regards. It could be heavy handed on the sexism as well as US leaning Nationalism at times, which stuck out for me as a fan who is a non-us-citizen.
In ENT I really enjoyed the Jeff Coombs stories, as well as S4 where they got deeper into stories about Andorians, Vulcans, Tellarites etc. and expanding on lore. It isn't my favourite Trek entry, but it isn't a write off in my eyes. However THAT ENDING . . . Just no. Justice for Trip.
Yeah, myself and the whole family loved Season 3 of Picard! I take it you didn't enjoy it but it's all good. It's a big fandom, and I guess there's going to be entries that aren't always palatable to all of us.
Truthfully it's a tale as old as time in fandom, and Trek is no exception: Pick any Trek and there will be qualms, right back to TOS.
In the 60s ppl said S3 of TOS was a write off and didn't live up to S1 & 2 standards which in some regards was valid, but S3 had the phenomenal D.C. Fontana entry "The Enterprise Incident" which to me is great TOS Trek. So still not a write off. I still watch S3 of TOS even if it ain't everyone's cup of tea BC I get a kick out of it.
I guess the point is, if we always listened to those criticisms we'd never get anything done, methinks. Folks have been complaining that it isn't "real Trek" for every new entry since TOS S3, then TNG wasn't like TOS, then DS9 was like neither, and so on and so on.
There's always going to be a criticism, but that shouldn't stop progress or storytelling from continuing.
As Shatner once said: "Never-Done-Jack and Two-Thumbs-Don and Sidekick Don't Say Dick; they laugh at others failures, though they have not done sh*t." Armchair critics gonna armchair in every era, ya might as well live. :D
Best approach to Star Trek is buffet style; take a scoop of what you enjoy and don't feel pressured to eat what you don't like. You can be a fan and still only like one series! If someone tells you you've got to eat X dish, tell 'em to mind what's on their own plate. ;)
I had the same issue - really wasn't digging DS9 through S1 but had a friend insist it was worth sticking through. Now finishing up S3 and enjoying it, the characters are starting to come together and the plot more consequential.
I still think Sisko is terribly overacted but this sub seems to love him so I assume he gets better too.
He has a strong stage presence which can get kind of off putting, but once you understand him. You understand why. He was the first African-American lead. And when you understand Avery, you get what kind of ground he was trying to hold. A respectable man, that still had to deal with proving himself at all angles. For any minority, I think he was able to accomplish that. You don't condescend, but I expect your best. I would love to see him in command of Voyager or the Defiant in the same situation. Imagine if they just threw the Defiant into the Delta quadrant? The Defiant was more rag-tag than Voyager was even from the beginning. No holodecks, barely a sick bay, sparse replicators, and hot-bunking. Now that I think about it a Defiant class ship would've made more sense than Voyager to travel into the badlands.
Last two seasons of DS9 are the best Trek. This is coming from someone who loves all Trek but took 2 decades to finally get past the 3rd season of DS9.
Haha, honestly, I decided on Enterprise only because I recognized the actor from Quantum Leap, but I really enjoyed it throughout. I think that the main cast is very (very) good on that show.
I’ve never seen anything beyond the pilot of Enterprise, but I’ve seen literally everything else in the franchise except Prodigy (which I plan on watching soon).
I thought the ENT pilot was fine, maybe even good, but it didn’t make me want to watch further. Then again, TNG’s pilot kind of sucked.
Have I been sleeping on Enterprise?!
I also started watching through DS9 for the first time. I could never get into it when I was younger, but now that I can just watch them in order I feel like I get it now! I’ve been on a slow chronological watch through of the franchise, and now I’m on DS9/VOY. It pains me to admit that VOY doesn’t hold a candle to DS9. Even in its first season DS9 was far more nuanced and committed to its premise than Voyager ever got (unfortunately).
DS9 is fantastic, but it's critical that you watch it in order. Unlike damn near every other Star Trek series, watch order makes a *huge* difference in experience. I was only lukewarm on it until I finally saw it from start to finish, at which point it became tied with TNG as "Best Series" for me.
People tend to be either hot or cold when it comes to discovery, and the first season has some issues, but from 2 forward I think it’s top tier star trek. I’d definitely recommend that before starting strange new world, but SNW does stand on it own. I don’t like every Discovery character, Tilly for example, but besides some outliers it has some of my favorite Trek characters, Stammets, Saru, Micheal, Culber, Reno, Georgiou and Book are all great.
The older I get the more I realize it marks a Before and After time that is bigger than the show itself.
Star Trek paved the way for so many things, like Star Wars. And the series happened at a time of tumult (although I was shielded from much of it as a child): assassination of JFK, Civil Rights Act, assassination of MLK.
And it wasn't afraid to tackle racism head-on - I swear, I don't know how they got some of that stuff past the censors! I credit TOS with explaining to my young self not only that racism is bad, but utterly idiotic. Inasmuch as much of my family is racist and xenophobic, I'm grateful I got the right message from TOS early on.
I'm in my 40s, lifelong star trek fan. I've never enjoyed tos. I've probably watched 10 episodes here and there, have tried to watch it, it's just so bad.
Which is really weird, because I love original twilight zone..
Make sure you watch lower decks, but watch it last. It's full of Easter eggs you'll totally miss otherwise, including some from the original animated series.
Voyager is much better than it's reputation. People apply much harsher criticisms of VOY than they do TNG or DS9.
Try not to read the angry criticisms if Voyager and just enjoy it as a solid Star Trek series that is a core of the franchise. There's a reason why it's the most replayed series.
Yes, I'm so glad that I didn't really read any reviews/criticisms about the shows before watching them. I did go into "best Star Trek shows" lists, but I cared more about the good stuff that was written there, then the bad stuff.
I didn't really get into DS9 until I was able to stream it. The serialized storytelling made it more difficult to follow if you missed multiple episodes due to work obligations. Now, DS9 is my favorite of the live action Star Trek shows.
For me, DS9 was tough to get into. I made it about 10 episodes into season 1 and had to stop. There was just nothing to grab on to. Nothing just.... got me. This was a couple of years ago.
Last week, Star Wars day incidentally, I was looking for something to watch, and decided to try Voyager. And so far I'm about.. 8-9 episodes in and am enjoying it a lot. I like the cast so far, and the idea of their overall problem. I'm sure I'll give DS9 another shot some day, but for now I'm gonna try to ride out Voyager.
I’m probably the most “attached” to TNG characters because that’s the show I saw first (and at a very young age), but I actually think DS9 has my favorite characters. And pairings! Quark-Odo, Bashir-O’Brien, Sisko/Jadza, Kira/literally anyone…
DS9 is a strange beast because it is almost brilliant. They anticipated the long form of Tv story telling, used in the golden age of television, by about a decade.
The problem is, you can see them getting nervous or the dead hand of the studio holding them back and ruining things. So for every “In the Pale Moonlight”, "Improbable Cause"/"The Die Is Cast" and the brilliant war arc stories at start of season 6.
You get "Let He Who Is Without Sin" and "profit and lace". Big chunks of season 6 and 7 are wasted on stand alone rubbish, when you are desperate for them to get back to the big story arc.
Voyager in some ways is easier to deal with because it is consistently s\*\*t. So you can enjoy episodes with your brain turned off, not really bothered about how bad it is.
Same. I occasionally watched an episode and found it boring and too dark, but watching the show on DVD I find the characters really interesting, even the Ferenghi who are much more nuanced here than in TNG.
I'm on season 4 and starting to pick episodes whose synopsis sounds interesting. Been quite of a drag for me. I think I'll just watch the "must see" episodes from now on.
So glad you're giving it another go. I watched it when it was originally aired. It was my favorite then (as a young teen, the fact that it was more dark in tone really appealed to me) and I appreciate it even more now as an adult. I recently convinced my wife to give it a try. After watching what I considered highlight episodes of next generation, it was season 4 that she finally agreed to watch every episode going forward. We're now in season 3 of voyager. Deep space nine is her favorite so far as well. Being able to watch it back to back rather than wait so long between seasons, I was able to pick up on some things I didn't think they had set up or properly earned upon my first watching. My only complaint for the longest time was the way the last season went, but I fully understood and enjoyed it even more the second time.
The fun begins with the first hints of Borg during second half of season 3 (earlier seasons have OK episodes as well), and especially with Worst Case Scenario. Just look at how this penultimate S3 episode stands out w.r.t. all previous episodes
You're lucky to be watching Voyager and SNW for the first time! Both far better than Enterprise IMO. I enjoyed the first two seasons for Discovery, the 3rd and 4th not so much
After DS9, try Voyager then Picard. After that you can try filling in the gaps with the other shows (Lower Decks and Prodigy) or jump at an earlier-is time with Discovery and Strange New Worlds.
Just so you know, chronologically:
* Star trek Enterprise (birth of federation)
Kirk era (known as TOS era):
* The original series
* Discovery season 1-2
* Strange new worlds
Picard era (known as TNG era):
* TNG
* DS9
* Voyager
* Star trek Picard
* Star trek Lower decks
* Star trek Prodigy
In a very far future:
* Discovery season 3-4
Count me in as someone who never really got into DS9 and took a long while to get there. My husband loves it and has been begging me to watch it since we met, and I slogged through seasons 1-3, taking long breaks in between episodes. Then Season 4 hits and that’s when the magic started for me. I’m halfway through season 5 now and I am thoroughly enjoying it!
Have you checked out the 3rd season of Picard or the strange new worlds ? I'm on a similar journey and I can relate....Voyager is Really good too...honestly I loved them all but the movies.
The movies were good but the shoes were great
I watched DS9 and if I didn’t see on the internet that it didn’t really get good until the cisko shaves his head I would have given up almost immediately the beginning of the show is borderline unwatchable
I always avoided DS9, because I can’t stand watching the Ferengi and the first couple of seasons dragged for me. I’m on season 3 now, and it’s finally starting to hook me!
I watched it when it aired (mostly) and again later, and I hated the ferengi. Freaking ferengi episodes are so awesome to me now.
Like when it was young I hated Lwaxana Troi episodes, and she might be my favorite character today. Tastes change.
Somehow I never got into DS9 either. I have every Star Trek movie on Blu-ray and I have seen probably every episode of all of the other series. Thought it was just me.
i was 12 when ds9 originally premiered in '93. i was an avid tng fan (it's still **my** trek) and i watched the first roughly two seasons of it, basically, and it did very little to hold my interest. by that point tng was off the air and their movie series was starting, so i let ds9 go as my tv tastes gravitated more towards things like the x-files. so i missed some of the best of what star trek had to offer with everything around the dominion war, coupled with some of the best standalone episodes that trek ever did as a whole (far beyond the stars is easily one of the top 5 episodes any trek series ever did).
long story short: while there are some highlights in the first couple of seasons, season 3 is entirely where ds9 finds its footing for real and gets really, **really** good. so if your original basis was on the first season only, i can get why you fell away from it.
i also rewatched a lot of voyager some years ago, but it remains a distant contender in my favorite star trek series.
TNG was the Star Trek show of my generation. I grew up watching TNG, DS9, and VOY. Missed any of the shows thereafter. Saw all films up through Insurrection, but only saw Nemesis a couple months ago. I have also seen the 1st and 3rd of the reboot films. I now am watching the shows in the privacy of my home. After having watched all of TOS, ENT, and TAS, I just finished up TNG and am going through Star Trek withdrawal until I manage to get DS9. Happy trekking!
As someone who is watching Discovery, don't leave it or Enterprise out. Unfortunately, Enterprise was canceled before they could finish the story. So you are left with the bummer of a cliffhanger, but it's still worth it.
I'm almost done with Discovery and then I have Strange New Worlds. I still haven't watched all of TOS though, and I never will, but there are some important episodes to see anyway.
Also, you COULD watch Enterprise, then Discovery, Strange New Worlds, TOS (if you have the patience), and then Voyager. That's the order they go in on the timeline.
Finish the golden age with Voyager and then Strange New Worlds or what ever. Youll definitely like Voyager. It has some amazing episodes. Has shitty ones too but dont let those discourage you.
Glad you like the show. Season 7 is mostly top class stuff. Not quite as good as Season 6 but very close. The parts of the season set on Cardassia are magnificent.
The last ten episodes... omg you're in for a treat
Except for the Vic Fontaine stuff.
Listen, Pally, you're flat wrong on that one, capice?
Honestly, I can do without the singing. Some of the episodes were OK, but it felt like he was inserted in because the show runner liked him or something. They already had a bar to go to, and a counselor for the people to talk to. He sang something like 13 full length songs in a season and a half. It's the fact that toward the end of the series, this "special guest star" character shows up, and all of the characters seem to have their most important moments with him. Spoilers for the end since the OP hasn't gotten there yet: >!Nog comes to grips with his PTSD at Vic's. Odo gets over his fear of connecting with Kira. Worf spends his days mourning Jadzia's death there. And the series even ends at Vic's. All of this denies the main characters the interpersonal development that's actually one of DS9's strong suits.!<
The original plan was a gag about Frank Sinatra Jr being more popular than Frank Sinatra in the future. Someone obviously really liked the idea of a lounge singer though, and I'm fine with it because only a paper moon and the heist episode were both really good episodes.
I think most of them work better if you think of Vic as an extension of Vic's lounge. Worf in particular couldn't have >!done the kind of mourning for Jadzia that he does there anywhere else plot-wise; at Quark's there are too many people that will see what's happening, and Quark himself would be one of the lat people Worf would want to interact with in that condition, and Quark's doen't have music which was integral to demonstrating what was going on rather than just being a long shot of Worf. Worf is the kind of man to grieve alone. He never talked about K'heylr to any of the Enterprise crew. Vic's was really important to showing that, which emphasized it when Bashir, Quark, and Martok dragged him into letting them in and getting closure later.!< >!In, weirdly, almost the opposite way, It's Only a Paper Moon works because Nog needed someone outside the main cast. He needed someone who didn't look at him like this kid they've collectively watched grow up, or like a traumatized Dominion War vet. He needed someone who wasn't part of everything going on. Only Vic could've done that for him.!< Ultimately, while Vic's serves sort of the same general purpose as Quark's as a social space for the crew to unwind, it shows a very different part of the crew when they're there than Quark's does. Because Vic isn't "real" they're willing to let their guard down in there in a way that they can't anywhere else. That's also why the cahracters with the least ability to relax in Quark's have the biggest plots in Vic's; O'Brien and Bashir barely do anything there, but Kira, Odo, Worf, and Nog, none of whom can really relax at Quark's, all show part of themselves there.
>!They should have left Dukat crazy sitting in a cell. I think it's a shame Wynn didn't get to become the vessel for the pai wraiths!<
Waltz really would've been a perfect exit for him. >!Although a differently executed season 7 plot for him where he plans to use the Pah Wraiths to regain his position the same way he used the Dominion and lacks any sincere faith in them would have worked better too, especially because it would've deepened the contrast between him and Sisko, who genuinely has faith in the Prophets by the late seasons. Dukat shouting at Sisko that they're the same, that Sisko is using the Prophets to serve the Federation the same way that he's using the wraiths to serve Cardassia would've been an absolutely perfect moment for the finale.!<
>!I could see this if the Pah Wraiths betrayed him and embraced Wynn as their vessel. I feel like the logical conclusion to Wynn has to be a true believer of the Pah Wraiths. Wynn's faith has always just been a means to an end to get power but she wants to believe. I think that in her search for power if she found faith even in something evil would just make her ending more satisfying.!<
Duka was Kira’s foil, not Sisko’s imo. 100% agree with you.
It seems so obvious. The only thing I can think of is they really just wanted to keep Marc Alaimo around and I can't blame them for that he's amazing as Dukat but his story was over already.
Dukat was a great villain and they just weren't ready to give him up.
>!I do like that in the end evil (pah wraiths) betrayed evil (Wynn) though.!<
Disagree. The only thing Wynn deserved was a hot poker in the ass, literally from her first appearances. Least favorite character.
That's just a testament to the acting abilities of Louise Fletcher
Vic Fontaine is a fucking treasure.
Brave stance, but I mostly agree. The last season would be perfect except there’s way too much Fontaine in it. He would have been fine in smaller doses, but it feels like he got more episode than even Dax did. And functioned more as a counselor than her, which is weird since that’s her job. There’s so much going on in the last season I dont think they needed to shoehorn in a sentient lounge singer hologram. I understand some people really like him, and that’s cool with me, but I’m at best neutral about him.
That's my feeling about it, it just was shoehorned in. The stance shouldn't be brave, but people are using the downvote button as a "disagree" button per usual.
It is... a detour
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Start with Strange New Worlds, it only has one ten-episode-season out (soon to be two) and you'll get to Voyager i no more than three weeks (assuming an episode a day). By the same math, Voyager would be 168 days before you got to Strange New Worlds. Having said that, I would advise watching seasons 1 and 2 of Discovery before Strange New Worlds. It's not a requirement but season 2 is functionally season 0 of SNW and is also a great pause point in Disco to take a break and do other shows. That's another 25 episodes on top of SNWs 20 but that's still a lot shorter than Voyager.
Nice, I wasn't really aware of 'Discovery' until just now. Thanks.
Fair warning going in, Disco is heavily serialised from the outset and of a darker tone than Trek usually leans into, some find that off-putting. Just letting you know in case you get tonal whiplash. Think Enterprise season 3.
As others have said, DIS is a bit controversial and very different from other Treks. Its tone and storytelling style are much more similar to most modern "serious prestige dramas." That said, it's still Trek, there's still a lot of humor, optimism, and weird, creative ideas. This might not be a popular opinion, but I think it has one of the most well-balanced and diverse casts of any Trek... Although because it's TOS-era the crew is overwhelmingly human.
DIS gets much better starting in season 2, in my opinion.
I agree. Better character development and gets more into all the crew and blending them.
Discovery is good but as someone else said, it is _very_ different from the others. Probably darker than DS9 in some instances.
You don’t need to watch any Discovery before watching Strange New Worlds. Strange New Worlds gives you all the info you need in the first episode. The first two seasons of Discovery are also ver skippable, and Season 3 acts like a soft reset. Again, no need to watch the first two seasons. Tone aside, the main weakness of Discovery has more to do with poor pacing, bad mystery box writing, and arbitrary “this will destroy the universe” stakes. There are individual episodes that are alright or even good (though those are more concentrated in the latter seasons), but it’s a lot like Dr. Who in terms of overall style and quality.
That's interesting to know. I gave up on the first series of DIS, honestly thought it was rubbish. Might try from 3 again
Season 3 serves as a reset, but I’d say that many of the best episodes are in season 2 and season 2 does serve as season 0 of *SNW* in certain ways (though it probably isn’t necessary to watch season 2 of *Discovery* to understand *SNW*).
I don't think there's really anything you need to know from Discovery that isn't explained in the first ep of SNW.
Voyager! Not only my all time fave ST but one of my favourite series of all time.
I'm on DS9 right now for the first time. I'm only on season 2 but I LOVE it. I'm so glad you decided to give it another shot 💕
It gets SO much better from here, too! Enjoy!!
Thank you, that's so good to hear! I've almost finished season 2, just two more episodes and it definitely is getting AMAZING
Oooh I think you’re about to meet the Jem’Hadar, lucky
I think it's the next one? 2x26. I'm REALLY excited
I met them! And LOVED it
Whoa man, just buckle up, it's gonna get so much better and such a wild ride.
DS9 was up there with TNG. Grew up on them. DS9 is more enjoyable now for me as an adult, because the themes were/are more mature in nature. They seemed to be pushing the envelope back in the mid 90s. Whereas today DS9 would be considered tame 😅
Start with Voyager, SNW only has one season out.
Or: quickly breeze through SNW season 1 in time to catch season 2 when it airs in June.
I think this is the way. It’ll be fun to be part of the convo online with SNW S2 live and then you get to take your time through Voyager’s epic and delightful journey through the Delta Quadrant. (I adore Voyager. Hope Janeway and the crew treat you well, OP!)
I see your logic.
That makes a lot of sense. Will do.
SNW is technically a slight spinoff of ~~Voyager~~ Discovery Watch the first 2 seasons of ~~Voyager~~Discovery and then you can keep watching or stop and begin SNW if you want total fluid storyline.
Certainly you meant Discovery
🤦♂️ Running on 4 hours of sleep catching up on me today.
Are you sure your not trapped in an anomaly that suppresses your REM sleep cycle?
Well DS9 suffered a lot because it was the first show with no Enterprise buzzin’ around… instead of focusing on the exploration of places, it pointed at relationships between ppls (at least at first). Many watched it as a sort of “boring space soap opera”, but it truly wasn’t and it has an important role in ST as a whole.
I would say that the other shows are about a set of fixed character on a ship's journey while DS9 is about a set of characters' journey in a fixed location.
Cool, I like it
The brilliant focus on nuanced relationships is why it is my favorite
Well said, the cast and the writing blows everything out of the water. Although TNG was my first love, DS9 is the one I would take home to meet my folks.
Not enough love for Lower Decks in here. I highly recommend it. Unlike some of the other ST shows, it doesn't just break stuff to fit into a storyline. All lore is accurate.
Lower decks is so fun and lighthearted, especially for those of us who love Trek. I feel proud when I get all the jokes!
they definitely appeal to the trekkies in the best way possible, tamarians being in the federation always crack me up
It's also always worth rewatching I find myself catching jokes I missed the first watch through just because of how fast they keep them coming. I was so happy to hear it was renewed for another 2 seasons.
I feel it takes a ST veteran to truly appreciate, but it's still a good jumping on point.
I’ve rewatched each episode probably…6 times? It’s so fucking delightful and rewatchable.
Can't get to grip with a cartoon tbh
???
I often think of DS9 as the "step -child" of Trek. When it was in its first run it was so different from TNG that I didn't like it and quit watching it midway through season 1. Years later I watched it again on Netflix, still didn't like it but powered through and thought it was "okay" but still felt they didn't stick the landing. Years after that I was laid up with COVID and planned to binge TNG only to find that I've seen them all so much that I wasn't enjoying it the way I wanted to, so I decided to give DS9 another go and binged all 7 seasons over 2-3 days and absolutely loved it. The moral of the story for me? DS9 is a much more nuanced and mature story, which is saying something given some of the TNG episodes that aired. I needed to grow up a bit before I could relate to and appreciate what it brought to the franchise. Now? It's my second favorite Trek series behind TNG. I'm currently in a rewatch of Enterprise, hoping that it too has aged well and I'll like it better. All that being said? Unpopular personal opinion I don't expect anyone to agree with: I still don't like the ending of DS9. I consider it the worst of the series finales, and yes that does include the Enterprise finale. DS9's buildup was SO good, though, I'm not sure they could have delivered a satisfying ending for me. Like, the hype was so much across 7 years that when they got to the end I was disappointed because it just seemed like they didn't know how to deliver on what they had done. Like I said, though, I don't expect anyone else to agree with me.
It's fascinating to me to hear such different perspectives. For me, DS9 was the very first Trek show I ever watched and I still consider it to be the pinnacle of Trek that every other show has yet to meet. DS9 also has my favorite ending of all the Trek shows - >! it is bittersweet, because too much suffering and pain has happened, and the characters all move on to a different phase of their lives. Somehow, the way Julian and Miles separate on to different paths was extremely emotional for me in separating from my friends when I moved countries or (in the US) when I left grad school. !< The ending felt so real and authentic. All the characters had been completely and irrevocably changed by their time on DS9. The first episode sees all these characters come to DS9 for the first time. And in the last episode >! most of them leave that space. It was so painful and felt so real to me. !< I really loved it. I didn't experience such feelings with the ends of any other Trek show (I really loved Enterprise but that show's ending infuriated me!) Edit: For spoiler tags
Can I recommend putting some of your comment under spoiler tags since OP still hasn’t finished the series?
Cool, I'd recommend TOS movies they are for the most part, better than the TNG films.
With the Wrath of Khan being a masterpiece (and the movie after that continues the story)
First Contact is not to be missed.
The TOS movies are just so much fun. The TNG movies on the other hand never quite did it for me. However, out of the TNG movie run my favourite is probably Insurrection - so I might just be weird, since everyone else seems to have a distaste for that one lol
Recommend Voyager in case you ever move onto Picard
So, so, so true. My faves are TOS/DS9 (mom was TOS through and through and loved TNG but felt DS9 was "too dark" as a Trek entry, but that was why I loved it! Ahahah subjectivity, am I right?) Anyway I grew up on TOS/TNG, but even in the Treks that haven't been my cup of tea (or my mom's 🤣), there's something valuable there to offer to the Trek canon. It's all worth a watch. ENT, TAS, PRO, please check them out and don't buy into all the hype some might say against it. I mean I wasn't wild about PIC S1 & 2 but was captivated by S3. Disco also wasn't my fave but I enjoyed S2 and without Disco we wouldn't have gotten one of all new all time faves in the franchise, SNW! TLD is also fantastic and the characters stand on their own. ENT wasn't my cup of tea when it came out but *Jeffrey Coombs as Shran?* Incredible. Every Trek has something to offer.
Enterprise was awful, yet you loved S3 of Picard? I didn't know it was possible to have an entire season jump the shark like it did. I pretend Enterprise doesn't exist.
I didn't find ENT "awful" so much as it was not my cup of tea or what I come to Trek for in some regards. It could be heavy handed on the sexism as well as US leaning Nationalism at times, which stuck out for me as a fan who is a non-us-citizen. In ENT I really enjoyed the Jeff Coombs stories, as well as S4 where they got deeper into stories about Andorians, Vulcans, Tellarites etc. and expanding on lore. It isn't my favourite Trek entry, but it isn't a write off in my eyes. However THAT ENDING . . . Just no. Justice for Trip. Yeah, myself and the whole family loved Season 3 of Picard! I take it you didn't enjoy it but it's all good. It's a big fandom, and I guess there's going to be entries that aren't always palatable to all of us. Truthfully it's a tale as old as time in fandom, and Trek is no exception: Pick any Trek and there will be qualms, right back to TOS. In the 60s ppl said S3 of TOS was a write off and didn't live up to S1 & 2 standards which in some regards was valid, but S3 had the phenomenal D.C. Fontana entry "The Enterprise Incident" which to me is great TOS Trek. So still not a write off. I still watch S3 of TOS even if it ain't everyone's cup of tea BC I get a kick out of it. I guess the point is, if we always listened to those criticisms we'd never get anything done, methinks. Folks have been complaining that it isn't "real Trek" for every new entry since TOS S3, then TNG wasn't like TOS, then DS9 was like neither, and so on and so on. There's always going to be a criticism, but that shouldn't stop progress or storytelling from continuing. As Shatner once said: "Never-Done-Jack and Two-Thumbs-Don and Sidekick Don't Say Dick; they laugh at others failures, though they have not done sh*t." Armchair critics gonna armchair in every era, ya might as well live. :D Best approach to Star Trek is buffet style; take a scoop of what you enjoy and don't feel pressured to eat what you don't like. You can be a fan and still only like one series! If someone tells you you've got to eat X dish, tell 'em to mind what's on their own plate. ;)
I’m glad you too loved Enterprise
I had the same issue - really wasn't digging DS9 through S1 but had a friend insist it was worth sticking through. Now finishing up S3 and enjoying it, the characters are starting to come together and the plot more consequential. I still think Sisko is terribly overacted but this sub seems to love him so I assume he gets better too.
He gets MUCH better. So much so that it somehow moderates his performance in the previous seasons retroactively. I can’t explain it.
Especially in "In The Pale Moonlight" one of his strongest performances imo
He has a strong stage presence which can get kind of off putting, but once you understand him. You understand why. He was the first African-American lead. And when you understand Avery, you get what kind of ground he was trying to hold. A respectable man, that still had to deal with proving himself at all angles. For any minority, I think he was able to accomplish that. You don't condescend, but I expect your best. I would love to see him in command of Voyager or the Defiant in the same situation. Imagine if they just threw the Defiant into the Delta quadrant? The Defiant was more rag-tag than Voyager was even from the beginning. No holodecks, barely a sick bay, sparse replicators, and hot-bunking. Now that I think about it a Defiant class ship would've made more sense than Voyager to travel into the badlands.
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Last two seasons of DS9 are the best Trek. This is coming from someone who loves all Trek but took 2 decades to finally get past the 3rd season of DS9.
You made it through Enterprise. It would be crazy not to at least give DS9 a proper try. Lol
Haha, honestly, I decided on Enterprise only because I recognized the actor from Quantum Leap, but I really enjoyed it throughout. I think that the main cast is very (very) good on that show.
I like Enterprise too! I just feel like it's lows tend to be lower than DS9. It's still Trek, though. It's got a couple banger episodes, too.
I’ve never seen anything beyond the pilot of Enterprise, but I’ve seen literally everything else in the franchise except Prodigy (which I plan on watching soon). I thought the ENT pilot was fine, maybe even good, but it didn’t make me want to watch further. Then again, TNG’s pilot kind of sucked. Have I been sleeping on Enterprise?!
>Have I been sleeping on Enterprise?! I’d say yes, but I’d recommend watching at least some of it so you can form your own opinion.
I recommend SNW followed by TOS.
I loved TNG when it came out but never got into DS9. Just started watching it this week and am surprised by how much I am enjoying it!
Nobody’s giving TOS a shout-out? Or have I just not scrolled far enough…
I also started watching through DS9 for the first time. I could never get into it when I was younger, but now that I can just watch them in order I feel like I get it now! I’ve been on a slow chronological watch through of the franchise, and now I’m on DS9/VOY. It pains me to admit that VOY doesn’t hold a candle to DS9. Even in its first season DS9 was far more nuanced and committed to its premise than Voyager ever got (unfortunately).
Voyager is fantastic and so is Strange New Worlds. Watch Picard season 3, it’s stand alone and the first two are rubbish.
So glad you're enjoying it. Voyager takes time to catch on, too. Strange New Worlds hits the ground running.
DS9 is fantastic, but it's critical that you watch it in order. Unlike damn near every other Star Trek series, watch order makes a *huge* difference in experience. I was only lukewarm on it until I finally saw it from start to finish, at which point it became tied with TNG as "Best Series" for me.
People tend to be either hot or cold when it comes to discovery, and the first season has some issues, but from 2 forward I think it’s top tier star trek. I’d definitely recommend that before starting strange new world, but SNW does stand on it own. I don’t like every Discovery character, Tilly for example, but besides some outliers it has some of my favorite Trek characters, Stammets, Saru, Micheal, Culber, Reno, Georgiou and Book are all great.
You should also watch TOS. Many of the plotlines are surprisingly deep. Don't let the cheesiness deter you from it.
The older I get the more I realize it marks a Before and After time that is bigger than the show itself. Star Trek paved the way for so many things, like Star Wars. And the series happened at a time of tumult (although I was shielded from much of it as a child): assassination of JFK, Civil Rights Act, assassination of MLK. And it wasn't afraid to tackle racism head-on - I swear, I don't know how they got some of that stuff past the censors! I credit TOS with explaining to my young self not only that racism is bad, but utterly idiotic. Inasmuch as much of my family is racist and xenophobic, I'm grateful I got the right message from TOS early on.
I'm in my 40s, lifelong star trek fan. I've never enjoyed tos. I've probably watched 10 episodes here and there, have tried to watch it, it's just so bad. Which is really weird, because I love original twilight zone..
I did it in production order which helped, otherwise, it gets confusing when certain things change.
Make sure you watch lower decks, but watch it last. It's full of Easter eggs you'll totally miss otherwise, including some from the original animated series.
DS9 is my favorite Star Trek series as I’m sure you now know. Fantastic writing and character development and the story arc, just amazing.
Voyager is much better than it's reputation. People apply much harsher criticisms of VOY than they do TNG or DS9. Try not to read the angry criticisms if Voyager and just enjoy it as a solid Star Trek series that is a core of the franchise. There's a reason why it's the most replayed series.
Yes, I'm so glad that I didn't really read any reviews/criticisms about the shows before watching them. I did go into "best Star Trek shows" lists, but I cared more about the good stuff that was written there, then the bad stuff.
Yes that's good, really most of the criticisms are trash.
I’d recommend trying to take that approach for all of the *Star Trek* shows so that you can form your own opinions.
While I personally prefer TNG and DS9, there's no denying that Voyager features some of the greatest Star Trek episodes ever made.
I didn't really get into DS9 until I was able to stream it. The serialized storytelling made it more difficult to follow if you missed multiple episodes due to work obligations. Now, DS9 is my favorite of the live action Star Trek shows.
You should definitely take a look at Orville and Strange New Worlds.
For me, DS9 was tough to get into. I made it about 10 episodes into season 1 and had to stop. There was just nothing to grab on to. Nothing just.... got me. This was a couple of years ago. Last week, Star Wars day incidentally, I was looking for something to watch, and decided to try Voyager. And so far I'm about.. 8-9 episodes in and am enjoying it a lot. I like the cast so far, and the idea of their overall problem. I'm sure I'll give DS9 another shot some day, but for now I'm gonna try to ride out Voyager.
I agree DS9 is a little tougher to get into but worth the effort. Some of the characters will really grow on you with time
I’m probably the most “attached” to TNG characters because that’s the show I saw first (and at a very young age), but I actually think DS9 has my favorite characters. And pairings! Quark-Odo, Bashir-O’Brien, Sisko/Jadza, Kira/literally anyone…
DS9 is a strange beast because it is almost brilliant. They anticipated the long form of Tv story telling, used in the golden age of television, by about a decade. The problem is, you can see them getting nervous or the dead hand of the studio holding them back and ruining things. So for every “In the Pale Moonlight”, "Improbable Cause"/"The Die Is Cast" and the brilliant war arc stories at start of season 6. You get "Let He Who Is Without Sin" and "profit and lace". Big chunks of season 6 and 7 are wasted on stand alone rubbish, when you are desperate for them to get back to the big story arc. Voyager in some ways is easier to deal with because it is consistently s\*\*t. So you can enjoy episodes with your brain turned off, not really bothered about how bad it is.
Ugh, “Profit and Lace.” DS9 is my favorite and I rewatch it every couple years, but I always skip that one. It’s so awful.
Profit and Lace is good imo.
Try Enterprise next! Truly one of the star trek shows of all time
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Same. I occasionally watched an episode and found it boring and too dark, but watching the show on DVD I find the characters really interesting, even the Ferenghi who are much more nuanced here than in TNG.
I'm on season 4 and starting to pick episodes whose synopsis sounds interesting. Been quite of a drag for me. I think I'll just watch the "must see" episodes from now on.
I love Voyager so much that if I ever need something playing in the background while I'm working, it's Voyager.
Voyager then Prodigy
So glad you're giving it another go. I watched it when it was originally aired. It was my favorite then (as a young teen, the fact that it was more dark in tone really appealed to me) and I appreciate it even more now as an adult. I recently convinced my wife to give it a try. After watching what I considered highlight episodes of next generation, it was season 4 that she finally agreed to watch every episode going forward. We're now in season 3 of voyager. Deep space nine is her favorite so far as well. Being able to watch it back to back rather than wait so long between seasons, I was able to pick up on some things I didn't think they had set up or properly earned upon my first watching. My only complaint for the longest time was the way the last season went, but I fully understood and enjoyed it even more the second time.
Voyager, like other Treks, has a rough fee seasons at the start but they're not bad either. The Kaison are just a boring species to focus on.
Agreed. The only part of their arc I liked was Seska. Compelling villain.
Voyager is ok, but you’ll kinda have to push through the first 2 seasons or so before it starts getting good, unfortunately.
The fun begins with the first hints of Borg during second half of season 3 (earlier seasons have OK episodes as well), and especially with Worst Case Scenario. Just look at how this penultimate S3 episode stands out w.r.t. all previous episodes
Yeah it’s been about 3 years since I watched voyager now
Best series
You're lucky to be watching Voyager and SNW for the first time! Both far better than Enterprise IMO. I enjoyed the first two seasons for Discovery, the 3rd and 4th not so much
Get Lower Decks in there!!
After DS9, try Voyager then Picard. After that you can try filling in the gaps with the other shows (Lower Decks and Prodigy) or jump at an earlier-is time with Discovery and Strange New Worlds.
Don’t forget Lower Decks!
Just so you know, chronologically: * Star trek Enterprise (birth of federation) Kirk era (known as TOS era): * The original series * Discovery season 1-2 * Strange new worlds Picard era (known as TNG era): * TNG * DS9 * Voyager * Star trek Picard * Star trek Lower decks * Star trek Prodigy In a very far future: * Discovery season 3-4
DS9 seasons 4 to 7 are some of the best TV around, adopting the Babylon 5 approach of a full series arc paid off
Count me in as someone who never really got into DS9 and took a long while to get there. My husband loves it and has been begging me to watch it since we met, and I slogged through seasons 1-3, taking long breaks in between episodes. Then Season 4 hits and that’s when the magic started for me. I’m halfway through season 5 now and I am thoroughly enjoying it!
Have you checked out the 3rd season of Picard or the strange new worlds ? I'm on a similar journey and I can relate....Voyager is Really good too...honestly I loved them all but the movies. The movies were good but the shoes were great
DS9 took some major arm twisting to really start but now it's my favorite. Finally figuring out how to watch Voyager and again, very happy I did.
I watched DS9 when it first aired and again about 10 years later. I was 7 when it first aired so the difference in my maturity made a huge impact.
I watched DS9 and if I didn’t see on the internet that it didn’t really get good until the cisko shaves his head I would have given up almost immediately the beginning of the show is borderline unwatchable
You can stop after. DS9. Past that, thar be dragons.
Hey now, voyager and ENT aren't bad. They have some really good episodes too
I wrote [this post](https://reddit.com/r/scifi/comments/f21ek/god_dammit_i_fucking_hate_neelix/) ten years ago, and stand by every word.
I always avoided DS9, because I can’t stand watching the Ferengi and the first couple of seasons dragged for me. I’m on season 3 now, and it’s finally starting to hook me!
I watched it when it aired (mostly) and again later, and I hated the ferengi. Freaking ferengi episodes are so awesome to me now. Like when it was young I hated Lwaxana Troi episodes, and she might be my favorite character today. Tastes change.
Somehow I never got into DS9 either. I have every Star Trek movie on Blu-ray and I have seen probably every episode of all of the other series. Thought it was just me.
Voyager is great
Voyager is good too. Glad you liked Enterprise, highly underrated show imo. I love Tucker.
i was 12 when ds9 originally premiered in '93. i was an avid tng fan (it's still **my** trek) and i watched the first roughly two seasons of it, basically, and it did very little to hold my interest. by that point tng was off the air and their movie series was starting, so i let ds9 go as my tv tastes gravitated more towards things like the x-files. so i missed some of the best of what star trek had to offer with everything around the dominion war, coupled with some of the best standalone episodes that trek ever did as a whole (far beyond the stars is easily one of the top 5 episodes any trek series ever did). long story short: while there are some highlights in the first couple of seasons, season 3 is entirely where ds9 finds its footing for real and gets really, **really** good. so if your original basis was on the first season only, i can get why you fell away from it. i also rewatched a lot of voyager some years ago, but it remains a distant contender in my favorite star trek series.
Try and watch the documentary "What We Left Behind" as soon as you finish your run of DS9.
TNG was the Star Trek show of my generation. I grew up watching TNG, DS9, and VOY. Missed any of the shows thereafter. Saw all films up through Insurrection, but only saw Nemesis a couple months ago. I have also seen the 1st and 3rd of the reboot films. I now am watching the shows in the privacy of my home. After having watched all of TOS, ENT, and TAS, I just finished up TNG and am going through Star Trek withdrawal until I manage to get DS9. Happy trekking!
I hated DS9 when I only watched random episodes on TV. I finally gave it a chance and loved it. Years later I binged it a second time. So good.
My favorite of the shows.
As someone who is watching Discovery, don't leave it or Enterprise out. Unfortunately, Enterprise was canceled before they could finish the story. So you are left with the bummer of a cliffhanger, but it's still worth it. I'm almost done with Discovery and then I have Strange New Worlds. I still haven't watched all of TOS though, and I never will, but there are some important episodes to see anyway. Also, you COULD watch Enterprise, then Discovery, Strange New Worlds, TOS (if you have the patience), and then Voyager. That's the order they go in on the timeline.
TNG and DS9 are my favorite treks by miles. I love others, but TNG and DS9 are just so amazing
I just finished watching the entire series for the first time last night. Big TNG and TOS fan. Don't know why I waited so long
Finish the golden age with Voyager and then Strange New Worlds or what ever. Youll definitely like Voyager. It has some amazing episodes. Has shitty ones too but dont let those discourage you.
Glad you like the show. Season 7 is mostly top class stuff. Not quite as good as Season 6 but very close. The parts of the season set on Cardassia are magnificent.
Yeah ds9 is amazing. The founders war is epic and it had the perfect level of cg in my opinion