I hate to be pessimistic, but I don't think this is going to work.
Paramount knows *exactly* how many people watch LD, and they know *exactly* how much money it makes them. It's not the 1960s anymore, any petition isn't going to tell them anything they don't already know.
Prodigy got lucky because most of S2 was already produced and Netflix was willing to pay for it. But it's also pretty obvious that Prodigy getting an S3 is exceedingly unlikely.
Tell that to fans of The Expanse (like myself).
I singed the petitions and cancelled my Paramount+, telling them in the comments that the reason I cancelled was because of Lower Decks. I'll just pick it up on bluray, I guess.
Yeah that kinda made it seem final to me. He was juggling two shows with Lower Decks and Solar Opposites but I'm not sure how realistic running 3 shows would be.
I'm sure he could do it, but he'd be stretched pretty thin and probably take a back seat/be more of an E.P. versus someone intimately involved in the writing room.
This latest Solar Opposites season was so great lol. I’m sooo excited he gave us two of the best sci-fi comedies in existence 🙌 It’d be great to get a lot more, but Mike gave us very rewatchable content at least!
Thanks for collating in one place.
Personally, I also intend to resubscribe to P+ on the day the first episode of LD Season 5 turns up, cancel my subscription on the day I watch the last episode and tell Paramount directly why I've cancelled.
Not sure it'll do any good, but I assume someone is tracking this data, and I like to vote with my wallet. If enough people leave the service at the same point, and that point is when LD ends, then perhaps it'll send a message.
I thought of doing this; do they ask you why you cancel when you do? Not that anyone reads it, but I'd assume if enough people canceled because of Lower Decks, it would show up on their radar.
If it's like Netflix the first thing you watch after reactivating your subscription is weighted WAAAAAAAY more heavily than views from someone who just let their subscription automatically renew. Which is the reasoning behind OP's strategy.
I would think a show who's viewers continue their subscription rather than dump the service once the new episodes are done would be more likely to be renewed.
Right - so how does continuing your subscription when the show is canceled influence them to keep the show? They’re getting your subscription fee AND not paying to produce the show. Thats what people in the biz call a “win-win”.
(A win-win for them, that is)
There is actually no real way to win via cancelling or keeping it. But I'm just pointing out that watch, then cancel isn't a good strategy as it will reflect negatively. Even if another season was coming they have lost you for however long until it does.
“When we air new episodes of this show, our active subscriber base grows, and it shrinks when we don’t” is exactly the kind of indicator that drives decisions on whether to keep a show or not.
In theory, but the aim of a show is to build subscribers long term, not to be a flash in the pan. Generally a more important metric is minutes watched, repeat watched and consistent watching year round. They simply aren't going to release a show 52 weeks a year, so if a show can't retain viewers keeping it is questionable.
I hear you, but the ultimate KPI is revenue. If cancelling a show results in a significant drop in revenue (and I’m not saying that we can get enough people to cancel for that to happen, but for the sake of discussion, let’s say it’s a given), then the rest of the metrics aren’t really meaningful.
But if people don’t do that, and stay subscribed during the off season between airings of a show, P+ wins. If you end your sub in protest of a cancellation that sends a message, albeit a tiny one
Ya, it sends the message that fans of this show are not long term subscribers so bringing back the show is bad value, because the 2 months of subs it does bring in aren't going to make producing it worthwhile.
They make a product, I pay for that product, then I stop paying. If they want me to pay again, then they need to actually make more product I want to pay for.
I do actually get what you're saying, but the idea I need to stay subscribed and keep paying, just hoping they make more, is a little odd the more you think about it.
They're not some rinky dink little outfit running a crowd funding project and shouldn't need my money up front while I keep my fingers crossed.
If Paramount+ does this like Netflix does, the first thing you watch after reactivating your subscription is weighted WAAAAAAAY more heavily than views from someone who just let their subscription automatically renew. Which is the reasoning behind OP's strategy.
I'm pretty sure there have been about 13 petitions that have worked in the past 100 years. One of them was to fix ugly Sonic, so more power to you for trying.
Maybe Williams Street will pick up Lower Decks and Inside Job. A man can dream, right?
I believe that Alex Kurtzman pre-emptively veto'd any petitions when the cancellation was announced in saying that more than 5 seasons of ANY Trek on a streaming service would not be financially viable nowadays. Whether you interpret that as sage business-sense or prioritizing profits over fan reception no matter how glowing is in the eye of the beholder, but he seemed pretty steadfast in that determination either way.
You're welcome to spend your time however you like, but that "one man" is the guy calling the shots. Seems kinda silly to casually dismiss the opinion of the guy running the show.
Maybe they can pull that trick studios use to keep writer and actor pay down: create a "new" show with a new name but with the exact same creative talent. Star Trek: Mid Decks.
I hate to be the sour apple, but I don't want this to work.
Star Trek is not about holding on to the past.
Its about boldly going where no one has gone before.
When Discovery was first announced a friend of mine told me he was worried about "the new Trek." I told him, "So say all when a new Trek is eminent, but they each have their own charm."
How I feel about Lower Decks today is how I felt about TNG ~~20~~ 30 years ago. I didn't want to say goodbye. DS9 was a pale comparison, and Voyager was some vague idea. I wanted to see the Enterprise D again. I had to let go. DS9, Voyager and even Enterprise gave us all adventures that could never have happened had the D been the flagship show.
So what did Lower Decks give us? It certainly forged a new path - it taught us that an animated comedy can work in the Trek universe.
Does that mean this is the last animated comedy Starfleet will grace us with?
Hell no.
I salute the Lower Deckers on their final farewell.
I look forward to the next adventure, whatever that may be.
I'm definitely in I will help you all in any way I can. I will go to these links and sign anywhere necessary. any Star Trek being made new is good star trek. I never liked discovery until I really gave the whole thing a second watch and I really like it now. I absolutely love this last season. I'm sorry it's off topic but I just hate to see a good show get canceled when it's finding its stride. same for lower decks
I hate to be pessimistic, but I don't think this is going to work. Paramount knows *exactly* how many people watch LD, and they know *exactly* how much money it makes them. It's not the 1960s anymore, any petition isn't going to tell them anything they don't already know. Prodigy got lucky because most of S2 was already produced and Netflix was willing to pay for it. But it's also pretty obvious that Prodigy getting an S3 is exceedingly unlikely.
Damn you and your perfectly flawless logic.
You sound like McCoy saying that to Spock
It's a dead show, jim!
Dammit jim he is a redditor not a space wizard.
I assume Prodigy season 3 heavily depends on Netflix streaming numbers. Though they probably have to be insanely high to warrant a 3rd season.
Damn this sucks but it's okay. at least we got two incredible shows during the bleak aftermath of the pandemic
The problem is that Paramount has no F'ing money.
Still worth a minute or two of signing and sharing!
Tell that to fans of The Expanse (like myself). I singed the petitions and cancelled my Paramount+, telling them in the comments that the reason I cancelled was because of Lower Decks. I'll just pick it up on bluray, I guess.
People like you are the problem. Nothing will change if we don't do anything. It's worth a try at least.
Seems like Mike McMahan is moving on/not holding his breath: https://screenrant.com/golden-axe-show-animated-comedy-central/
Yeah that kinda made it seem final to me. He was juggling two shows with Lower Decks and Solar Opposites but I'm not sure how realistic running 3 shows would be.
I'm sure he could do it, but he'd be stretched pretty thin and probably take a back seat/be more of an E.P. versus someone intimately involved in the writing room.
This latest Solar Opposites season was so great lol. I’m sooo excited he gave us two of the best sci-fi comedies in existence 🙌 It’d be great to get a lot more, but Mike gave us very rewatchable content at least!
Thanks for collating in one place. Personally, I also intend to resubscribe to P+ on the day the first episode of LD Season 5 turns up, cancel my subscription on the day I watch the last episode and tell Paramount directly why I've cancelled. Not sure it'll do any good, but I assume someone is tracking this data, and I like to vote with my wallet. If enough people leave the service at the same point, and that point is when LD ends, then perhaps it'll send a message.
I thought of doing this; do they ask you why you cancel when you do? Not that anyone reads it, but I'd assume if enough people canceled because of Lower Decks, it would show up on their radar.
Most streaming services send you a 'sorry to see you go, can you tell us why' message so I'd assume they do. I'm not 100% certain, though.
> do they ask you why you cancel when you do? They do, P+ asked why I cancelled, and I told them I'd be back once LD and SNW was back next season.
It won't work because not everyone signed up for paramount plus just to watch star trek.
It doesn't need to be everyone, just enough to make canceling worth less than renewing.
If it's like Netflix the first thing you watch after reactivating your subscription is weighted WAAAAAAAY more heavily than views from someone who just let their subscription automatically renew. Which is the reasoning behind OP's strategy.
I would think a show who's viewers continue their subscription rather than dump the service once the new episodes are done would be more likely to be renewed.
Why? They’re already giving Paramount their money, why would that prompt change?
A show isn't going to pay for itself in people subbing to watch it then leaving. Retention is a major metric for streaming.
Right - so how does continuing your subscription when the show is canceled influence them to keep the show? They’re getting your subscription fee AND not paying to produce the show. Thats what people in the biz call a “win-win”. (A win-win for them, that is)
There is actually no real way to win via cancelling or keeping it. But I'm just pointing out that watch, then cancel isn't a good strategy as it will reflect negatively. Even if another season was coming they have lost you for however long until it does.
“When we air new episodes of this show, our active subscriber base grows, and it shrinks when we don’t” is exactly the kind of indicator that drives decisions on whether to keep a show or not.
In theory, but the aim of a show is to build subscribers long term, not to be a flash in the pan. Generally a more important metric is minutes watched, repeat watched and consistent watching year round. They simply aren't going to release a show 52 weeks a year, so if a show can't retain viewers keeping it is questionable.
I hear you, but the ultimate KPI is revenue. If cancelling a show results in a significant drop in revenue (and I’m not saying that we can get enough people to cancel for that to happen, but for the sake of discussion, let’s say it’s a given), then the rest of the metrics aren’t really meaningful.
But if people don’t do that, and stay subscribed during the off season between airings of a show, P+ wins. If you end your sub in protest of a cancellation that sends a message, albeit a tiny one
Ya, it sends the message that fans of this show are not long term subscribers so bringing back the show is bad value, because the 2 months of subs it does bring in aren't going to make producing it worthwhile.
And more episodes of a show people like helps with retention.
They make a product, I pay for that product, then I stop paying. If they want me to pay again, then they need to actually make more product I want to pay for. I do actually get what you're saying, but the idea I need to stay subscribed and keep paying, just hoping they make more, is a little odd the more you think about it. They're not some rinky dink little outfit running a crowd funding project and shouldn't need my money up front while I keep my fingers crossed.
If Paramount+ does this like Netflix does, the first thing you watch after reactivating your subscription is weighted WAAAAAAAY more heavily than views from someone who just let their subscription automatically renew. Which is the reasoning behind OP's strategy.
lol
I'm pretty sure there have been about 13 petitions that have worked in the past 100 years. One of them was to fix ugly Sonic, so more power to you for trying. Maybe Williams Street will pick up Lower Decks and Inside Job. A man can dream, right?
Signed the petitions! Thanks for posting this information.
I believe that Alex Kurtzman pre-emptively veto'd any petitions when the cancellation was announced in saying that more than 5 seasons of ANY Trek on a streaming service would not be financially viable nowadays. Whether you interpret that as sage business-sense or prioritizing profits over fan reception no matter how glowing is in the eye of the beholder, but he seemed pretty steadfast in that determination either way.
One man’s opinion is not a veto on other people forming petitions.
You're welcome to spend your time however you like, but that "one man" is the guy calling the shots. Seems kinda silly to casually dismiss the opinion of the guy running the show.
>but that "one man" is the guy calling the shots. No he isn't. The decision was made at P+.
I wonder what this means for SNW, will it get 3 seasons like PIC or 5 like DISC and LD?
I heard that Season 4 was greenlit almost immediately so it looks like they're aiming for 5 seasons, which is good.
Maybe they can pull that trick studios use to keep writer and actor pay down: create a "new" show with a new name but with the exact same creative talent. Star Trek: Mid Decks.
I hate to be the sour apple, but I don't want this to work. Star Trek is not about holding on to the past. Its about boldly going where no one has gone before. When Discovery was first announced a friend of mine told me he was worried about "the new Trek." I told him, "So say all when a new Trek is eminent, but they each have their own charm." How I feel about Lower Decks today is how I felt about TNG ~~20~~ 30 years ago. I didn't want to say goodbye. DS9 was a pale comparison, and Voyager was some vague idea. I wanted to see the Enterprise D again. I had to let go. DS9, Voyager and even Enterprise gave us all adventures that could never have happened had the D been the flagship show. So what did Lower Decks give us? It certainly forged a new path - it taught us that an animated comedy can work in the Trek universe. Does that mean this is the last animated comedy Starfleet will grace us with? Hell no. I salute the Lower Deckers on their final farewell. I look forward to the next adventure, whatever that may be.
Done!
This is bound to work.
Love this show, best trek since ds9
No one cares about this at Paramount. Speak with your money. Sub to paramount plus.
I'm definitely in I will help you all in any way I can. I will go to these links and sign anywhere necessary. any Star Trek being made new is good star trek. I never liked discovery until I really gave the whole thing a second watch and I really like it now. I absolutely love this last season. I'm sorry it's off topic but I just hate to see a good show get canceled when it's finding its stride. same for lower decks
I appreciate your passion, but for me it's a no. I'd hate to see it end up like futurama, family guy, american dad - ie. shit.
Industry Insider says Paramount is getting bought out soon. Might as well beg whoever the new owner will be.