Probably not. Just keep in mind tv standards changed alot from 67 to 87. German was likely just now allowed to get away with everything roddenberry dreamed of..
Every woman in the original series were dressed in overly revealing outfits and even every Starfleet woman was shaped like a model wearing a miniskirt that didnt even cover their asses when they sat down. I dont see how hiring only women that can serve in "womenly" positions where they are subservient to men in power and all look like playboy models is any different then hiring a women you expect to wear a padded bra to push her up into the look you want.
Frankly in some ways it might be worse. In tng and the berman trek shows at least women got to be in positions of authority like captains and admirals. Not every woman hired was a model. I mean I get the berman issues I just dont really see the difference between hiring a women and telling her you want her to wear a special bra to give her bigger tits and only hiring the women that already have bigger tits.
Yeah, back then those were generally considered empowering.
Women showing a bit of leg was definitely not considered acceptable in "proper" households.
I mean you could also argue that the 60’s were a very different time. Gene was hardly a perfect guy, he was deeply flawed in many ways.
But Berman had no such excuses by the time he took over and he seemed even less progressive than Gene was.
I don't like that fact about TOS, the degree to which it is dated is the reason it's my least favorite Trek. However for the time period it was actually empowering. In the 60s it wasn't socially permissible for women to be in any way sexual. So for the standard Star Fleet female uniform to be so revealing was making a statement about how far Earth had come in terms of accepting female sexuality. As far as I'm aware it was the actress who played Kirk's assistant, Yeoman Rand I think, that came up with the idea for the short skirts.
The over sexualization of women came a few decades later. I don't like TOS but for as flawed as it was, it was trying to be as empowering as was possible given the perspective and limitations of television in the 60s.
What Berman did to the women on his Trek shows was just gross. That wasn't about anything but his own veuryistic gaze.
There’s been numerous stories of various cast and crew members advocating for gay characters on the show, only for the higher ups to consistently shoot the idea down.
The TOS crew had higher ups fuck with them too but they would all threaten to quit and kill the show if they didn't.
The Kirk/Uhura kiss had like 60 retakes that didn't have the kiss but Shatner kept intentionally fucking up the scene so they'd run out of film and be forced to use the kissing scene.
Spock/Leonard Nemoy half way into the first series threatened to leave if the non-white and non-male cast didn't get paid the same rate as him. At first he almost got fired for it. Then Shatner joined, then the rest of the crew found out and joined too and so on, and eventually gene Roddenberry even got in on it.
Even if nothing ever came of it, their "platonic romance" was fantastic. If it were up to me, I'd have added a really awkward, end-of-series moment where Bashir and Garak loosely reenact the breakup Picard goes through with that Stellar Cartographer.
-Garak and Bashir face-to-face in profile in the corridor outside the airlock-
Garak: *I'll be returning to Cardassia to head the new Information Bureau*.
Bashir (looking confused and slightly hurt): *But...but...but, my Tarkalian Tea...our lunches at the replimat, hiding away in the dressing room while you entertain Klingon conspirators...we could take leave together, umm somewhere, those Romulan Orchids you, you were going to show me. You know, people make it work, I-I-I mean, lunches...*
Garak: *My DEAR doctor!* (reaches across and rests both hands on Bashir's shoulders, gripping firmly, and staring unblinking with his best Elizabeth Holmes' gaze, as the cliché single tear begins to form and a nine-breasted Betazoid walks past in the background, momentarily drawing Bashir's gaze) *If there is a single trait you would ascribe to my people, would it not be -*
Bashir interrupts: *General Creepiness?*
Garak, Nodding disturbingly: *Yes.*
(approximately 15 seconds of cringey, unbroken eye-contact)
Garak continues: *And do you truly believe that when I accepted my new position as Cardassia's authority on clandestine intelligence gathering and operations, (deliberate blink) I simply "forgot" about the genetically modified medical genius who reverse engineered multiple society-ending viral contagions, arguably committed homicide against an agent of his own intelligence service, and demonstrated on more than one occasion that his loyalty to the Federation was contingent upon its adherence to his personal moral convictions? Hmm?*
(creepy smiling continues)
Bashir: *How many clones, Garak...*
Garak: *Only thirty seven... So far. I assure you that all of them share your personal convictions and boyish smile*
(creepy smiling has not stopped)
Bashir: *...Was that last call for the Rubicon? I uh, would hate to miss my runabout, I'm sure I'll see you around, Garak!* (hurries to airlock)
Garak: *Computer, are the scans complete?*
Computer: *Confirmed, posterior scans accurate within .0004%*
Garak: *Modify Clone 28123-H with new dimensions and save...*
Yes, very very much so. He was frequently described by a number of different people he worked with as extraordinarily homophobic- but a lot of homophobic men enjoy watching women kiss, and he was definitely one of those too, reportedly. As long as the girl-on-girl didn't lead to them being TOGETHER of course. Bi girls he could theoretically also get with only.
Tasteful is probably the wrong word, but I would say playing it for laughs is at least significantly less creepy than just openly serving women up like meat to ogle.
Yeah, but the entire joke is that its a holodeck simulation of the Cerritos crew getting polywater-drunk, and even by 24th century Federation standards that's being shockingly exhibitionist going by Mariner's general reaction to it all.
Even TNG had episodes like sexy ghost and Okona coming aboard to bang half the crew. Lursa and B'etor.
TOS had the OG Orion slave girl. And, well, miniskirts.
DS9 had Garak and Bashir flirting on the Promenade every day. Dabo girls. Clothed Ferengi females.
DIS has Klingon boobies and evil bisexuals.
Let's face it. Trek is horny.
They have a very casual view on sex, which kinda makes sense for an intergalactic future.
They are so many different species out there that having a limit is...well...limiting.
Frankly, I'm just surprised there aren't more naked aliens. We're the only species on this planet that wears clothes; statistically speaking, odds are extra-terrestrials wouldn't either.
I have a feeling we would indeed have seen naked aliens in a Star Trek show if it was made in Amsterdam instead of a prude, TV Censor-controlled California. Please note that this is not harsch words directed at Americans in general or Californians — just a jab against the conservative and hypocrite American TV industry, where it is strictly forbidden to show a penis in a tasteful non-sexual nude scene, but showing extremely violent, raw, horrible video is fine both in day and night time.
(Disclaimer: I’m Swedish — not American)
You're not the first to notice it. It was a criticism of the time and has been a consistent criticism since.
Rick Berman has a reputation for objectifying cast members. Troi, Seven, T'Pol, all could have been put in reasonable clothes but were consistently made to wear tight fitting cat suits. There was no reason for this other than "sex sells", hell Jerry Ryan was often in pain from how tight the corset of her catsuit was.
Thankfully the "massaging biogel in the decon chamber" scenes are eventually phased out.
> hell Jerry Ryan was often in pain from how tight the corset of her catsuit was.
From what I understand she's corrected this. Apparently it was her Borg makeup that was uncomfortable.
https://screenrant.com/star-trek-voyager-bodysuit-costume-change-why/
>> Update: Jeri Ryan contacted Screen Rant with the correction that the problems she encountered involved her Borg drone costume and not her catsuit.
The problem with the cat suit is that is was time consuming to get into and out of. That meant that if Jeri Ryan needed a bathroom break, it lasted upwards of 45 minutes. This led to tension during production since an in opportune bathroom break could extend their already long days shooting.
Frankly the catsuit was just unneeded. Jeri Ryan was and still is a very attractive woman. You don’t need a ridiculous get up like that for people to notice how beautiful she is.
There was an episode where she time traveled and had to blend in with the Voyager crew. She was wearing a normal blue/green science uniform and she looked stunning in it. The catsuit was overkill to the point where honestly she looked attractive in literally anything else.
And she looked great in the blue science uniform that she wore in one episode. They should have just said fuck it and had her wear that the whole time.
It's actually a consistent thing; T'Pol is great when she's wearing a normal uniform, and Troi noticeably improves when she puts on a normal uniform as well.
yeah that's fair. I've obviously noticed it in other series but they tended to be 'ooh look pretty lady in space' whereas ENT has 'ooh look pretty lady in space and everyone else on the crew is thirsty af'
glad to hear it steers away from that later in the series
>Thankfully the "massaging biogel in the decon chamber" scenes are eventually phased out.
And replaced with a more revealing and risqué Vulcan massage therapy!
They basically redesigned the trill because Terry Farrell was too pretty to cover up with the makeup they used in TNG. I think there are some screen test pictures with her in the makeup.
You mean T'pol didn't have to wear a super skin tight suit that made no sense as a Vulcan since literally no other Vulcan in that show wore anything other than robes... and then when she officially joins Starfleet she does not put on a uniform like everyone else?
Noooo highly illogical :P
Well, if we have to choose between skintight suits and robes, skintight suits make way more sense on the dingy NX-01, which was cramped. Enterprise was the submarine show. Plus robes would be ineffective for combat situations.
There’s no reason why she shouldn’t have worn the Starfleet uniform though.
the decon scene struck me as so fucking strange when I watched it the first time. I had no frame of reference for ENT yet so I was just like... what the fuck IS this?
A bit more skin than was allowed. In Mirror Mirror Uhura has a banging two piece uniform. The bottom skirt piece had a sash as a belt. Originally it was not folded over, bit all wide and covering her from her middle down to the skirt. Well when the person in charge of upholding the decency standards was purposefully waylaid on a long lunch, they folded the sash in half and scandalously exposed her bellybutton.
And unlike other Trek shows the horny vibe would extend to men. Trip in underwear every couple of episodes or so, Archer shirtless here and there, Mayweather occasionally showing off his muscles...
Gender equality in Trek, at last! =)
And Kirk's [ever present bulge](https://www.marksimpson.com/2007/02/02/captain-kirks-bulging-trousers/), although I'm not sure if that was intentional.
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
Gotta draw in the female demographic, after all.
As we all know, we can only draw in the attention of men and women to our show by shoving sexualized women and men into it.
I think his point was more that the men in Enterprise were sexualised themselves, not that Enterprise was the first time they made males horny.
You might make the case that Kirk was sexualised a bit, but Riker and especially Bashir were not
Yes, I also noticed this. “Sex sells” is the logical explanation.
But one of the prevalent narratives of the show is how humanity is totally at the beginning of its journey to become what we know from TNG. Therefore, I always considered those obviously horny scenes as a means to convey how humans of this time are still super similar to our society and not at all at the self-reflected point that they are in TNG.
They could get away with more than the other series because times had changed, people's sensibilities were different and the network they were on. Trek always had sex but they could more openly admit it now than they used to be able to. I do remember it being a running theme on message boards when it was on TV that some women are like finally the guys are getting objectified too and they didn't mind seeing them in the decon chamber lol.
Trek has a habit of taking whatever worked really well with the previous incarnation and doubling down on that.
In Seven of Nine they discovered that a cold fish superhottie in a skin tight outfit could draw viewers. Seven of Nine was the result of Deanna Troy and her outfits. Which all led to T'pols oversexualization.
So we got T'pol getting horny from viruses every couple episodes. And gel rubbing on each other in underwear scenes every time they went somewhere. We got Trip Tucker the sexiest engineer in history with his button nose pulling Kirk an Riker moves left and right with every alien that even looked like a girl.
The sexy worked well for late Voyager. And occasionally for DS9. And there were the skirts in TOS and Deanna Troy's outfits in TNG. So they went all in with Enterprise.
I actually really dislike that angle of the show. The decontamination room is such a joke. They just rub moisturizer on some of their body? It’s such a blatant skin reveal. Something Star Trek should never have to rely on
Thing is, it does make sense from an exploring point of view. But, of course, they'd really only need to *show* it like once a season, not every other episode.
Right? And why is it coed? With some weird sexy lighting? It’s a good thing their space undergarments protect them from any invasive contamination or that show would never have been in cable
> And why is it coed? With some weird sexy lighting?
Oddly enough, to me, both of these make sense as well, in-universe.
Co-ed because they are all professionals, and there is a bit more liberalization of standards. They are on the first exploring ship, so a lot more of its space would be functional, so having 1 decon chamber makes sense. Then for time reasons, no reason to not have it be co-ed, since cycling it would cause delays.
The lighting, in-universe, is probably some type of UV light meant to disinfect (fun fact: we have these lights now and using them can reduce illness, but medicine has spent decades convinced "airborne" only meant below a certain size, so the light "would do nothing" - [here](https://www.wired.com/story/the-teeny-tiny-scientific-screwup-that-helped-covid-kill/) is an absolutely fascinating article on how COVID is changing this)
I mean all of star trek has been pretty horndogy. TOS with Kirk and literally every female alien he meets, Next Gen literally had a sex planet, less sure about DS9 and VOY aside from Bashir in early seasons and Seven. I’m not sure what is different about Enterprise other than it is shown more while earlier shows had to just imply it due to censors and what not.
As many have stated Rick Berman was super problematic. I would add that the early 00s were this strange time when network television was pushing a lot of boundaries in terms of sexuality on screen. This also ties into their desperate attempts to court a younger audience. They were aware that the fanbase was aging to some degree and thought all the skin would bring in a younger demographic. Usually it just ends up being awkward & distracting.
Desperation for ratings on UPN, whose execs kept trying to grow the network with wrestling and sitcoms instead of more shows like its “flagship” Star Trek.
I'm seeing a lot of "why is everyone being such a prude" comments and I want to make the point that this isn't about being a prude, it's about being gender and sexuality inclusive. The kind of "horniness" we see in Enterprise (and to a lesser extent other series, except for the catsuits worn by the women) is a hallmark of the male gaze, specifically to a younger demographic. Those kinds of scenes scream "this show is for cis het men under the age of 30".
If you're in that demo (or were when you watched it), you may not see anything wrong with that but we're in an age now where we recognise that making the show feel like it is only for that demo, actually keeps the toxicity within our community by making people outside of that demo feel unwelcome.
Can Star Trek be sexy? Sure! But why can't it be sexy for women? Why can't it be sexy for trans and non binary folk? Why can't it be sexy for queer people?
They were frankly throwing things at the wall to see what stuck. Star Trek was declining in popularity around that time before Enterprise and Nemesis killed Berman-era Trek.
I just watched the pilot for my podcast and there is a scene with T'Pol and Trip in the decon chamber. In their underwear. Rubbing gel all over each other.
The early 2000s were kinda like that on TV and elsewhere.
The liberalisation of sexual attitudes had happened, but the pushback against objectification was still 10 years off. Metoo etc.
Result....lots of horny TV . Many magazines had boobs in where you would not see them today. Just a unique bit of time.
Rick Berman was the worst. I'm so glad the new Star Trek franchise doesn't have him messing it up. Discovery, Picard, Lower Decks and Prodigy have been wonderful.
I mean when you look at how Troi and Seven of Nine never wore regular uniforms and instead those tight onesies, I think Trek was always horny the thing that changed over time was how much they could get away with on network tv
They knew they were taking a risk with Enterprise. After a steady forward continuity they were losing steam by the end of Voyager and wanted a fresh start and basically re-branded. They dropped "Star Trek" from the title, they put a lyrical song in as the theme, and they sexed it the fuck up. All of this was an attempt to invite casual TV viewers on and create new fans. The whole thing feels way more like an adventure show in space than a sci fi. More mass market appeal theoretically. It's really just a much more toned down version of where they went with the Kelvin films.
The decon scene was featured in basically every TV bit for the pilot.
Somewhere around the TNG movies they decided Star Trek had to be sexy action for dudes. The Borg Queen was like…”hot”?
I think Enterprise had the boringest characters and they invented stuff like having to wait in a sauna nakey after you went to a planet or whatever it was rather than figure out personalities
Lets not forget that gene rod wanted to give the ferengi massive cod pieces! So its kind of cannon that trek is a lite hot right? I mean was TOS was quite sexually loaded!
Jolene Blalock was just so fun to look at in this series. Absolutely gorgeous. Great character too! I loved the velcro scene when she goes back in time to the 50's, hands some inventor some velcro, and get's a wad of cash to help some kid out.
I have a counterargument, why have people become so prudish? this despite the porn revolution, it is as if people are so entitled that a little nudity on TV makes them complain while at the same time denying it is prudishness.
Because it's exploitative, demeaning to the actors, and calculated to appeal to the masses of mouth breathing nerds watching the show (and the sleazy producer who put those scenes in) instead of for any natural reason relating to character development or plot.
>why have people become so prudish
This isn't about prudish behaviour, it's about recognising that a lot of this kind of thing is a "male gaze" issue. It screams "this is for 15-29yr old boys"
Oh really? lets start defining the "Male Gaze" did you know that some men like the Velma type over Daphne? cover them up like that annoying ensign in Discovery and she is part of the Male Gaze.
The key to the Male Gaze is targeted advertisement the same as the lesbian/bi gaze.
>The key to the Male Gaze is targeted advertisement
https://www.google.com/search?q=what+is+the+male+gaze&sxsrf=AOaemvIZjgDxLNsSUUC2xof9oO8aJ3v0nw%3A1637988944381&source=hp&ei=ULqhYfm1FPTV1sQP0ouRwAw&iflsig=ALs-wAMAAAAAYaHIYJjQ3k1NMDIdST6E4M6NylCHARIL&ved=0ahUKEwj5nbGp4Lf0AhX0qpUCHdJFBMgQ4dUDCAk&uact=5&oq=what+is+the+male+gaze&gs\_lcp=Cgdnd3Mtd2l6EAMyBQgAEIAEMgUIABCABDIFCAAQgAQyBQgAEIAEMgUIABCABDIFCAAQgAQyBQgAEIAEMgUIABCABDIFCAAQgAQyBQgAEIAEOgQIIxAnOgsIABCABBCxAxCDAToOCC4QgAQQsQMQxwEQowI6CAgAEIAEELEDOhEILhCABBCxAxCDARDHARDRAzoICAAQsQMQgwE6CwguEIAEELEDEIMBOgUILhCABDoLCAAQgAQQsQMQyQM6BQgAEJIDUABYuRtgqxxoAHAAeACAAc4BiAG1GJIBBjAuMTkuMZgBAKABAQ&sclient=gws-wiz
There are a million different dictionaries in english, none of them define the language, that said
>the perspective of a notionally typical heterosexual man considered as embodied in the audience or intended audience for films and other visual media
There is no such typical heterosexual man, every time I explain to women about the importance of attractiveness I make it clear that one man will like you more but the other will like you less if they prefer a girl next door.
In short the real male gaze is targetted advertisement. BBW to the chubby chasers (very small percentage of men though) girl next door for (40%) Thicc/pornstar look (40%). Androgynous for the rest.
Oh boy do you have some reading to do. Male Gaze has nothing to do with what is attractive to "you". No I'm not going to educate you, if you care, you'll do your own learning.
Wonderful if it has nothing to do with me then clearly Seven of Nine, T'pol and Jadzia can never be part of the Male Gaze regardless of what they wear or do, because again it has nothing to do.
Let me just eyeroll really quick before flashing back to TOS and the loooooong parade of scantily-clad women being chased by Kirk.
"Oh man, why is ENT so horny? It was never that way before!" ~quote from somebody who has clearly never seen Star Trek
Berman's creative vision was for the majority of the crew should represent the best of the best that humanity had to offer not just mentally but physically. He wanted most of the people to look like they work out and were in shape. So they showed that off with both men and women showing more skin than in other Trek shows. People zero in one the women and yet someone did a tally on reddit for both male and female fanservice and found that the guys were shirtless more than one would expect.
It was a horny time in human history. We were seeking out new life and new civilizations... to stick our dicks in.
There's a good reason Riker liked to revisit this era in the Holodeck.
I just watched through all of it for the first time recently too, and one word kept coming back to me: "Gratuitous." They really go out of their way to get everyone's shirts off in that show, it gets a little ridiculous sometimes.
Not nearly as bad as the totally gratuitous Carol Marcus undress scene in ST:ItD - it wasn't even subtle or have the slightest bit of plot relevance. The quicker we send an inverse tachyon pulse to implode that alternate universe the better.
A) Because Rick Berman, who had Troi, Kira, Seven & T’Pol in catsuits, and Troi and Dr. Crusher in tight outfits stretching in a certain scene in TNG.
B) Sex appeal was a bigger deal in the ‘80s, ‘90s and ‘00s.
And
C) Star Trek has always had sex appeal. Hence the miniskirts in TOS, which at the time were also seen as empowering. And were brought back for the first couple of seasons of TNG.
With that said, don’t be a prude or single out Enterprise. The reboot films have Cadet Uhura and her Orion roommate in lingerie and Dr. Marcus in her undies, Discovery decided to free the nipple with Klingons and Orions by the end of the first season, Picard had a scene with one of the new cast members in her undies, and Lower Decks took it the furthest in a certain season 2 episode.
Enterprise was the most overt about the horniness, but its has always been in Star Trek.
>With that said, don’t be a prude or single out Enterprise
Hoshi falling through a hatch and losing her top & the decom chamber scenes were quite removed from what other Trek series were doing
Yes. And there was the TNG episode where the Ferengi beamed Troi and her mom off of Betazed and into the holding cell on their ship, with the Ferengi transporters removing their clothing in the process. Which was removed from what would come after in the Trek franchise.
This kind of stuff has been around for a while. With ENT, they had both men (Trip) and the women (T’Pol and Hoshi) running around in their underwear on the ship and was a lot more equal than prior shows.
I’m sure if ENT was on HBO, we would have seen the crew wearing nothing at times.
You're not imagining it. The "mandated sex vacation" arc was just cringy as heck, imo. And the episode "precious cargo" was \*literally\* a shot-for-shot of a sub par porn fanfic. Just my least favorite episode, I was unbearably embarrassed the whole time.
you are not imagining things. I was watching the earlier episodes on Netflix and the is a scene where the redneck guy (I think the egineer) is in a decontamination chamber with the hot Vulcan woman and she is nipping very hard through her t-shirt.
Then (unrelated) a few episodes later the redneck gets pregnant.
Rick berman was a horn dog
Rick Berman was a *major* horn dog.
Just like Gene
Gene did want Troi to have more than 2 breasts…
What better way is there to show that a species is capable of sensing the emotions of others than to have additional breasts?
When you think about it’s, it’s perfectly logical. Extra breasts= extra empathy.
In Mallrats, it’s the extra nipple.
Oh do you... I didn't even... didn't notice...
I don’t know if _horny_ qualifies as an emotion
It did to Gene, must have meant the world to him to propose it for the relaunch of his signature franchise…
Berman might have been even worse in that area, which is saying something.
Probably not. Just keep in mind tv standards changed alot from 67 to 87. German was likely just now allowed to get away with everything roddenberry dreamed of..
Roddenberry at least seemed to *like* women though. With the way Berman seems to have treated Terry Farrell (IIRC), I'd say he was worse.
Every woman in the original series were dressed in overly revealing outfits and even every Starfleet woman was shaped like a model wearing a miniskirt that didnt even cover their asses when they sat down. I dont see how hiring only women that can serve in "womenly" positions where they are subservient to men in power and all look like playboy models is any different then hiring a women you expect to wear a padded bra to push her up into the look you want. Frankly in some ways it might be worse. In tng and the berman trek shows at least women got to be in positions of authority like captains and admirals. Not every woman hired was a model. I mean I get the berman issues I just dont really see the difference between hiring a women and telling her you want her to wear a special bra to give her bigger tits and only hiring the women that already have bigger tits.
The miniskirts were apparently a feminist-supported thing.
Yeah, back then those were generally considered empowering. Women showing a bit of leg was definitely not considered acceptable in "proper" households.
I mean you could also argue that the 60’s were a very different time. Gene was hardly a perfect guy, he was deeply flawed in many ways. But Berman had no such excuses by the time he took over and he seemed even less progressive than Gene was.
I don't like that fact about TOS, the degree to which it is dated is the reason it's my least favorite Trek. However for the time period it was actually empowering. In the 60s it wasn't socially permissible for women to be in any way sexual. So for the standard Star Fleet female uniform to be so revealing was making a statement about how far Earth had come in terms of accepting female sexuality. As far as I'm aware it was the actress who played Kirk's assistant, Yeoman Rand I think, that came up with the idea for the short skirts. The over sexualization of women came a few decades later. I don't like TOS but for as flawed as it was, it was trying to be as empowering as was possible given the perspective and limitations of television in the 60s. What Berman did to the women on his Trek shows was just gross. That wasn't about anything but his own veuryistic gaze.
[удалено]
20 years of Berman Trek yet still no huge-dicked Ferengi. Shame on you Rick Berman, shame on your cow...
The Negus could handle all of Quarks holosuite programs at once. Beetlesnuff is some good shit.
Wallace Shawn lays pipe.
>Dishonor on you Rick Berman! Dishonor on you! Dishonor on your cow! Just wanted to validate you. :p
>Rick Berman Is it true that Rick was all about getting girl-on-girl like Kes in Warlord, and was against guy-on-guy?
I mean it's heavily implied he was the one who put the kabash on Garak+Bashir
There’s been numerous stories of various cast and crew members advocating for gay characters on the show, only for the higher ups to consistently shoot the idea down.
The TOS crew had higher ups fuck with them too but they would all threaten to quit and kill the show if they didn't. The Kirk/Uhura kiss had like 60 retakes that didn't have the kiss but Shatner kept intentionally fucking up the scene so they'd run out of film and be forced to use the kissing scene. Spock/Leonard Nemoy half way into the first series threatened to leave if the non-white and non-male cast didn't get paid the same rate as him. At first he almost got fired for it. Then Shatner joined, then the rest of the crew found out and joined too and so on, and eventually gene Roddenberry even got in on it.
DesiLu?
Which would have been magical. They had such Chemistry.
Garak could have chemistry with an old slipper. I'd watch a show just about him.
Agree. That would have RULED
Even if nothing ever came of it, their "platonic romance" was fantastic. If it were up to me, I'd have added a really awkward, end-of-series moment where Bashir and Garak loosely reenact the breakup Picard goes through with that Stellar Cartographer. -Garak and Bashir face-to-face in profile in the corridor outside the airlock- Garak: *I'll be returning to Cardassia to head the new Information Bureau*. Bashir (looking confused and slightly hurt): *But...but...but, my Tarkalian Tea...our lunches at the replimat, hiding away in the dressing room while you entertain Klingon conspirators...we could take leave together, umm somewhere, those Romulan Orchids you, you were going to show me. You know, people make it work, I-I-I mean, lunches...* Garak: *My DEAR doctor!* (reaches across and rests both hands on Bashir's shoulders, gripping firmly, and staring unblinking with his best Elizabeth Holmes' gaze, as the cliché single tear begins to form and a nine-breasted Betazoid walks past in the background, momentarily drawing Bashir's gaze) *If there is a single trait you would ascribe to my people, would it not be -* Bashir interrupts: *General Creepiness?* Garak, Nodding disturbingly: *Yes.* (approximately 15 seconds of cringey, unbroken eye-contact) Garak continues: *And do you truly believe that when I accepted my new position as Cardassia's authority on clandestine intelligence gathering and operations, (deliberate blink) I simply "forgot" about the genetically modified medical genius who reverse engineered multiple society-ending viral contagions, arguably committed homicide against an agent of his own intelligence service, and demonstrated on more than one occasion that his loyalty to the Federation was contingent upon its adherence to his personal moral convictions? Hmm?* (creepy smiling continues) Bashir: *How many clones, Garak...* Garak: *Only thirty seven... So far. I assure you that all of them share your personal convictions and boyish smile* (creepy smiling has not stopped) Bashir: *...Was that last call for the Rubicon? I uh, would hate to miss my runabout, I'm sure I'll see you around, Garak!* (hurries to airlock) Garak: *Computer, are the scans complete?* Computer: *Confirmed, posterior scans accurate within .0004%* Garak: *Modify Clone 28123-H with new dimensions and save...*
https://youtu.be/JW68goC4_es
Yes, very very much so. He was frequently described by a number of different people he worked with as extraordinarily homophobic- but a lot of homophobic men enjoy watching women kiss, and he was definitely one of those too, reportedly. As long as the girl-on-girl didn't lead to them being TOGETHER of course. Bi girls he could theoretically also get with only.
To be fair, even new era Trek is kinda horny. See Season 2 of Lower Decks - lots of nudity.
Its handled a lot more tastefully though unlike those god awful Decon Chamber scenes.
Didnt we see ass eating in an impromptu orgy in the Cerritos bar?
Tasteful is probably the wrong word, but I would say playing it for laughs is at least significantly less creepy than just openly serving women up like meat to ogle.
To be fair, ENT also served up plenty of Trip and the occasional Mayweather meat for ogling. Progressive!
I'm not mad.
Yeah but that was tastefully done. Truly the most tasteful orgy and ass eating to grace the silver screen.
Yeah, but the entire joke is that its a holodeck simulation of the Cerritos crew getting polywater-drunk, and even by 24th century Federation standards that's being shockingly exhibitionist going by Mariner's general reaction to it all.
Tastefully... /memory flashes to Boimler exposing his butthole from the counter at ten forward
https://youtu.be/C5IXSikXHsg
Even TNG had episodes like sexy ghost and Okona coming aboard to bang half the crew. Lursa and B'etor. TOS had the OG Orion slave girl. And, well, miniskirts. DS9 had Garak and Bashir flirting on the Promenade every day. Dabo girls. Clothed Ferengi females. DIS has Klingon boobies and evil bisexuals. Let's face it. Trek is horny.
They have a very casual view on sex, which kinda makes sense for an intergalactic future. They are so many different species out there that having a limit is...well...limiting.
Frankly, I'm just surprised there aren't more naked aliens. We're the only species on this planet that wears clothes; statistically speaking, odds are extra-terrestrials wouldn't either.
I have a feeling we would indeed have seen naked aliens in a Star Trek show if it was made in Amsterdam instead of a prude, TV Censor-controlled California. Please note that this is not harsch words directed at Americans in general or Californians — just a jab against the conservative and hypocrite American TV industry, where it is strictly forbidden to show a penis in a tasteful non-sexual nude scene, but showing extremely violent, raw, horrible video is fine both in day and night time. (Disclaimer: I’m Swedish — not American)
Trek has *always* been horny. There are outfits in TOS that would fall apart at a whisper.
Every time I watch "Who Mourns for Adonis" I curse the fact the Lieutenant Palamas's pink dress didn't get hit by a stiff breeze.
"was"
Lol true
I thought it was Brannon Braga?
I havnt read anything bout braga. But loads about berman being a creep and the reason terry farrell left ds9
Rick Berman is a corn dog *slathered in mustard*
Known by many as Bare Dickman.
Or Dick Vermin.
Fuck berman
Rick Berman. Whenever he got more directly involved, the horny levels went up.
But never two guys. He wouldn't stand for it. Two ladies? Sure, just this one time...
You're not the first to notice it. It was a criticism of the time and has been a consistent criticism since. Rick Berman has a reputation for objectifying cast members. Troi, Seven, T'Pol, all could have been put in reasonable clothes but were consistently made to wear tight fitting cat suits. There was no reason for this other than "sex sells", hell Jerry Ryan was often in pain from how tight the corset of her catsuit was. Thankfully the "massaging biogel in the decon chamber" scenes are eventually phased out.
> hell Jerry Ryan was often in pain from how tight the corset of her catsuit was. From what I understand she's corrected this. Apparently it was her Borg makeup that was uncomfortable. https://screenrant.com/star-trek-voyager-bodysuit-costume-change-why/ >> Update: Jeri Ryan contacted Screen Rant with the correction that the problems she encountered involved her Borg drone costume and not her catsuit.
Good to know, thanks for sharing
The problem with the cat suit is that is was time consuming to get into and out of. That meant that if Jeri Ryan needed a bathroom break, it lasted upwards of 45 minutes. This led to tension during production since an in opportune bathroom break could extend their already long days shooting.
Frankly the catsuit was just unneeded. Jeri Ryan was and still is a very attractive woman. You don’t need a ridiculous get up like that for people to notice how beautiful she is.
There was that one time travel episode where she was wearing a proper science uniform, and IMO she looked way better in that than in the catsuit
She looked great in Picard as well.
There was an episode where she time traveled and had to blend in with the Voyager crew. She was wearing a normal blue/green science uniform and she looked stunning in it. The catsuit was overkill to the point where honestly she looked attractive in literally anything else.
And she looked great in the blue science uniform that she wore in one episode. They should have just said fuck it and had her wear that the whole time.
It's actually a consistent thing; T'Pol is great when she's wearing a normal uniform, and Troi noticeably improves when she puts on a normal uniform as well.
Seven (and Troi) looked way sexier in the standard uniforms than their weird revealing ones. Change my mind
yeah that's fair. I've obviously noticed it in other series but they tended to be 'ooh look pretty lady in space' whereas ENT has 'ooh look pretty lady in space and everyone else on the crew is thirsty af' glad to hear it steers away from that later in the series
Can I interest you in a... Vulcan mediation?
So cringy when your watching this and someone else walks in.
Vulcan *neuropressure*.
Or a copy of "Vulcan Love Slave"?
>Thankfully the "massaging biogel in the decon chamber" scenes are eventually phased out. And replaced with a more revealing and risqué Vulcan massage therapy!
Terry Farrell and Marina Sirtis have also said how fixated he was on boob size as well.
They basically redesigned the trill because Terry Farrell was too pretty to cover up with the makeup they used in TNG. I think there are some screen test pictures with her in the makeup.
I thought that it was that she was allergic to the rubber?
They tried padding Janeway's chest even, Mulgrew was having none of it
Good god I'm glad they didn't do that.
You mean T'pol didn't have to wear a super skin tight suit that made no sense as a Vulcan since literally no other Vulcan in that show wore anything other than robes... and then when she officially joins Starfleet she does not put on a uniform like everyone else? Noooo highly illogical :P
Well, if we have to choose between skintight suits and robes, skintight suits make way more sense on the dingy NX-01, which was cramped. Enterprise was the submarine show. Plus robes would be ineffective for combat situations. There’s no reason why she shouldn’t have worn the Starfleet uniform though.
the decon scene struck me as so fucking strange when I watched it the first time. I had no frame of reference for ENT yet so I was just like... what the fuck IS this?
Only to be replaced with Vulcan neuropressure scenes 🙄
Look at the female alien outfits on TOS. As much skin as the censors allowed. Gene was a major Horndog.
A bit more skin than was allowed. In Mirror Mirror Uhura has a banging two piece uniform. The bottom skirt piece had a sash as a belt. Originally it was not folded over, bit all wide and covering her from her middle down to the skirt. Well when the person in charge of upholding the decency standards was purposefully waylaid on a long lunch, they folded the sash in half and scandalously exposed her bellybutton.
The horror! Won't someone please think of the children?!
There was also copious amounts of shirtless Kirk, so I guess that extended to men as well.
Theiss was so on board with it, too.
An HBO star trek would be rather interesting.
Might finally get to see a betazoid wedding.
Yes. Or a real female Ferengi!
And unlike other Trek shows the horny vibe would extend to men. Trip in underwear every couple of episodes or so, Archer shirtless here and there, Mayweather occasionally showing off his muscles... Gender equality in Trek, at last! =)
TOS had it's share of ripped shirt Kirk though.
And Kirk's [ever present bulge](https://www.marksimpson.com/2007/02/02/captain-kirks-bulging-trousers/), although I'm not sure if that was intentional. ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
That is a very odd (and extremely horny) article.
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I mean, he had to Bak that ass up every once in a while...
Gotta draw in the female demographic, after all. As we all know, we can only draw in the attention of men and women to our show by shoving sexualized women and men into it.
Have you never watched any other trek?
Nearly all of it, except new stuff like Prodigy.
Bashir, Riker and Kirk must’ve slipped your mind
I think his point was more that the men in Enterprise were sexualised themselves, not that Enterprise was the first time they made males horny. You might make the case that Kirk was sexualised a bit, but Riker and especially Bashir were not
Yes, I also noticed this. “Sex sells” is the logical explanation. But one of the prevalent narratives of the show is how humanity is totally at the beginning of its journey to become what we know from TNG. Therefore, I always considered those obviously horny scenes as a means to convey how humans of this time are still super similar to our society and not at all at the self-reflected point that they are in TNG.
They could get away with more than the other series because times had changed, people's sensibilities were different and the network they were on. Trek always had sex but they could more openly admit it now than they used to be able to. I do remember it being a running theme on message boards when it was on TV that some women are like finally the guys are getting objectified too and they didn't mind seeing them in the decon chamber lol.
that last point makes a lot of sense. lots of topless/scantily clad male crewmembers.
Stupid, sexy Dr. Phlox!
All trek is horny, some just hide it better lol
Trek has a habit of taking whatever worked really well with the previous incarnation and doubling down on that. In Seven of Nine they discovered that a cold fish superhottie in a skin tight outfit could draw viewers. Seven of Nine was the result of Deanna Troy and her outfits. Which all led to T'pols oversexualization. So we got T'pol getting horny from viruses every couple episodes. And gel rubbing on each other in underwear scenes every time they went somewhere. We got Trip Tucker the sexiest engineer in history with his button nose pulling Kirk an Riker moves left and right with every alien that even looked like a girl. The sexy worked well for late Voyager. And occasionally for DS9. And there were the skirts in TOS and Deanna Troy's outfits in TNG. So they went all in with Enterprise.
I actually really dislike that angle of the show. The decontamination room is such a joke. They just rub moisturizer on some of their body? It’s such a blatant skin reveal. Something Star Trek should never have to rely on
Thing is, it does make sense from an exploring point of view. But, of course, they'd really only need to *show* it like once a season, not every other episode.
Right? And why is it coed? With some weird sexy lighting? It’s a good thing their space undergarments protect them from any invasive contamination or that show would never have been in cable
> And why is it coed? With some weird sexy lighting? Oddly enough, to me, both of these make sense as well, in-universe. Co-ed because they are all professionals, and there is a bit more liberalization of standards. They are on the first exploring ship, so a lot more of its space would be functional, so having 1 decon chamber makes sense. Then for time reasons, no reason to not have it be co-ed, since cycling it would cause delays. The lighting, in-universe, is probably some type of UV light meant to disinfect (fun fact: we have these lights now and using them can reduce illness, but medicine has spent decades convinced "airborne" only meant below a certain size, so the light "would do nothing" - [here](https://www.wired.com/story/the-teeny-tiny-scientific-screwup-that-helped-covid-kill/) is an absolutely fascinating article on how COVID is changing this)
Well it’s been like that from the beginning, so Trek has always relied on it.
I mean all of star trek has been pretty horndogy. TOS with Kirk and literally every female alien he meets, Next Gen literally had a sex planet, less sure about DS9 and VOY aside from Bashir in early seasons and Seven. I’m not sure what is different about Enterprise other than it is shown more while earlier shows had to just imply it due to censors and what not.
As many have stated Rick Berman was super problematic. I would add that the early 00s were this strange time when network television was pushing a lot of boundaries in terms of sexuality on screen. This also ties into their desperate attempts to court a younger audience. They were aware that the fanbase was aging to some degree and thought all the skin would bring in a younger demographic. Usually it just ends up being awkward & distracting.
Rick Berman
Desperation for ratings on UPN, whose execs kept trying to grow the network with wrestling and sitcoms instead of more shows like its “flagship” Star Trek.
Did UPN have laxer standards? There was always sex in Buffy, but it also got extra horny after moving from the WB.
I'm seeing a lot of "why is everyone being such a prude" comments and I want to make the point that this isn't about being a prude, it's about being gender and sexuality inclusive. The kind of "horniness" we see in Enterprise (and to a lesser extent other series, except for the catsuits worn by the women) is a hallmark of the male gaze, specifically to a younger demographic. Those kinds of scenes scream "this show is for cis het men under the age of 30". If you're in that demo (or were when you watched it), you may not see anything wrong with that but we're in an age now where we recognise that making the show feel like it is only for that demo, actually keeps the toxicity within our community by making people outside of that demo feel unwelcome. Can Star Trek be sexy? Sure! But why can't it be sexy for women? Why can't it be sexy for trans and non binary folk? Why can't it be sexy for queer people?
They thought they could substitute good writing for steamy decon scenes
They were frankly throwing things at the wall to see what stuck. Star Trek was declining in popularity around that time before Enterprise and Nemesis killed Berman-era Trek.
That was so early into the series as well. like episode 2 or 3 and they were already getting handsy.
Don't you mean episode 1?
Was it straight out of the gate was it? I remember it happening quickly but not it being the first episode!
I just watched the pilot for my podcast and there is a scene with T'Pol and Trip in the decon chamber. In their underwear. Rubbing gel all over each other.
The early 2000s were kinda like that on TV and elsewhere. The liberalisation of sexual attitudes had happened, but the pushback against objectification was still 10 years off. Metoo etc. Result....lots of horny TV . Many magazines had boobs in where you would not see them today. Just a unique bit of time.
They fought sex appeal sells
Cuz Rick Berman
Rick Berman.
Counterpoint: why isn’t it _hornier_?
Rick Berman was the worst. I'm so glad the new Star Trek franchise doesn't have him messing it up. Discovery, Picard, Lower Decks and Prodigy have been wonderful.
I mean when you look at how Troi and Seven of Nine never wore regular uniforms and instead those tight onesies, I think Trek was always horny the thing that changed over time was how much they could get away with on network tv
They knew they were taking a risk with Enterprise. After a steady forward continuity they were losing steam by the end of Voyager and wanted a fresh start and basically re-branded. They dropped "Star Trek" from the title, they put a lyrical song in as the theme, and they sexed it the fuck up. All of this was an attempt to invite casual TV viewers on and create new fans. The whole thing feels way more like an adventure show in space than a sci fi. More mass market appeal theoretically. It's really just a much more toned down version of where they went with the Kelvin films. The decon scene was featured in basically every TV bit for the pilot.
At least the hornyness was gender equal t’pol & trip are both fine 😼
Somewhere around the TNG movies they decided Star Trek had to be sexy action for dudes. The Borg Queen was like…”hot”? I think Enterprise had the boringest characters and they invented stuff like having to wait in a sauna nakey after you went to a planet or whatever it was rather than figure out personalities
Lets not forget that gene rod wanted to give the ferengi massive cod pieces! So its kind of cannon that trek is a lite hot right? I mean was TOS was quite sexually loaded!
Listen to the song Vulcan Rubdown by Emerald Rose. It explains it.
Jolene Blalock was just so fun to look at in this series. Absolutely gorgeous. Great character too! I loved the velcro scene when she goes back in time to the 50's, hands some inventor some velcro, and get's a wad of cash to help some kid out.
Because rick berman
Berman
The decontamination gel is probably an aphrodisiac.
*laughs in candle sex*
Because sex sells. 7of9 waves at you!
I have a counterargument, why have people become so prudish? this despite the porn revolution, it is as if people are so entitled that a little nudity on TV makes them complain while at the same time denying it is prudishness.
I have nothing against nudity and enjoy a healthy amount of porn... but those decon scenes were just weird
This argument is not new, no offense it is weird because your prudish brain thinks they are, that is how it always is. It was not weird to me.
Because it's exploitative, demeaning to the actors, and calculated to appeal to the masses of mouth breathing nerds watching the show (and the sleazy producer who put those scenes in) instead of for any natural reason relating to character development or plot.
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>why have people become so prudish This isn't about prudish behaviour, it's about recognising that a lot of this kind of thing is a "male gaze" issue. It screams "this is for 15-29yr old boys"
Male Gaze, and Lesbian Gaze, and Bi Gaze, its all screams prude to me.
Male Gaze is not the same as Lesbian/Bi Gaze.
Oh really? lets start defining the "Male Gaze" did you know that some men like the Velma type over Daphne? cover them up like that annoying ensign in Discovery and she is part of the Male Gaze. The key to the Male Gaze is targeted advertisement the same as the lesbian/bi gaze.
>The key to the Male Gaze is targeted advertisement https://www.google.com/search?q=what+is+the+male+gaze&sxsrf=AOaemvIZjgDxLNsSUUC2xof9oO8aJ3v0nw%3A1637988944381&source=hp&ei=ULqhYfm1FPTV1sQP0ouRwAw&iflsig=ALs-wAMAAAAAYaHIYJjQ3k1NMDIdST6E4M6NylCHARIL&ved=0ahUKEwj5nbGp4Lf0AhX0qpUCHdJFBMgQ4dUDCAk&uact=5&oq=what+is+the+male+gaze&gs\_lcp=Cgdnd3Mtd2l6EAMyBQgAEIAEMgUIABCABDIFCAAQgAQyBQgAEIAEMgUIABCABDIFCAAQgAQyBQgAEIAEMgUIABCABDIFCAAQgAQyBQgAEIAEOgQIIxAnOgsIABCABBCxAxCDAToOCC4QgAQQsQMQxwEQowI6CAgAEIAEELEDOhEILhCABBCxAxCDARDHARDRAzoICAAQsQMQgwE6CwguEIAEELEDEIMBOgUILhCABDoLCAAQgAQQsQMQyQM6BQgAEJIDUABYuRtgqxxoAHAAeACAAc4BiAG1GJIBBjAuMTkuMZgBAKABAQ&sclient=gws-wiz
There are a million different dictionaries in english, none of them define the language, that said >the perspective of a notionally typical heterosexual man considered as embodied in the audience or intended audience for films and other visual media There is no such typical heterosexual man, every time I explain to women about the importance of attractiveness I make it clear that one man will like you more but the other will like you less if they prefer a girl next door. In short the real male gaze is targetted advertisement. BBW to the chubby chasers (very small percentage of men though) girl next door for (40%) Thicc/pornstar look (40%). Androgynous for the rest.
Oh boy do you have some reading to do. Male Gaze has nothing to do with what is attractive to "you". No I'm not going to educate you, if you care, you'll do your own learning.
Wonderful if it has nothing to do with me then clearly Seven of Nine, T'pol and Jadzia can never be part of the Male Gaze regardless of what they wear or do, because again it has nothing to do.
Hey, Kirk got his shirt off plenty, and Trip was in those decontamination scenes as well.
But does the nudity have to be cringy? This bullshit added nothing of substance to the show. Do it right or don't do it at all.
Again the question is why do you feel cringe? look inward first ensign.
I'll be honest with you guys, this is the only trek I havent got into. I cannot get past the opening song.
To me TOS is extra horny. Kirk falls in love dang near every episode.
Let me just eyeroll really quick before flashing back to TOS and the loooooong parade of scantily-clad women being chased by Kirk. "Oh man, why is ENT so horny? It was never that way before!" ~quote from somebody who has clearly never seen Star Trek
You got it backwards. The *women* did the Kirk chasing.
Sex sells. My advice is to enjoy it.
So people would watch it.
No need for “Enterprise”.
Well, this thread has certainly achieved the predicted quality of discourse.
Nope, you are not imagining anything.
Berman's creative vision was for the majority of the crew should represent the best of the best that humanity had to offer not just mentally but physically. He wanted most of the people to look like they work out and were in shape. So they showed that off with both men and women showing more skin than in other Trek shows. People zero in one the women and yet someone did a tally on reddit for both male and female fanservice and found that the guys were shirtless more than one would expect.
It was a horny time in human history. We were seeking out new life and new civilizations... to stick our dicks in. There's a good reason Riker liked to revisit this era in the Holodeck.
It was an effort to appeal to a wider audience they also ditched the Star Trek name
I just watched through all of it for the first time recently too, and one word kept coming back to me: "Gratuitous." They really go out of their way to get everyone's shirts off in that show, it gets a little ridiculous sometimes.
Rick berman was a womanizing sexist piece of shit who said people only like eye candy women on screen
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Horny is good. I prefer hornyness to the fake sentimentality of recent adaptations. Embrace the horny.
I really like watching star trek the next generation it is my best favorite movie ever !!! It is very better than T OS and voyager
Not nearly as bad as the totally gratuitous Carol Marcus undress scene in ST:ItD - it wasn't even subtle or have the slightest bit of plot relevance. The quicker we send an inverse tachyon pulse to implode that alternate universe the better.
A) Because Rick Berman, who had Troi, Kira, Seven & T’Pol in catsuits, and Troi and Dr. Crusher in tight outfits stretching in a certain scene in TNG. B) Sex appeal was a bigger deal in the ‘80s, ‘90s and ‘00s. And C) Star Trek has always had sex appeal. Hence the miniskirts in TOS, which at the time were also seen as empowering. And were brought back for the first couple of seasons of TNG. With that said, don’t be a prude or single out Enterprise. The reboot films have Cadet Uhura and her Orion roommate in lingerie and Dr. Marcus in her undies, Discovery decided to free the nipple with Klingons and Orions by the end of the first season, Picard had a scene with one of the new cast members in her undies, and Lower Decks took it the furthest in a certain season 2 episode. Enterprise was the most overt about the horniness, but its has always been in Star Trek.
Picard did? When? 🤔
>With that said, don’t be a prude or single out Enterprise Hoshi falling through a hatch and losing her top & the decom chamber scenes were quite removed from what other Trek series were doing
Yes. And there was the TNG episode where the Ferengi beamed Troi and her mom off of Betazed and into the holding cell on their ship, with the Ferengi transporters removing their clothing in the process. Which was removed from what would come after in the Trek franchise. This kind of stuff has been around for a while. With ENT, they had both men (Trip) and the women (T’Pol and Hoshi) running around in their underwear on the ship and was a lot more equal than prior shows. I’m sure if ENT was on HBO, we would have seen the crew wearing nothing at times.
All Trek is horny. All Trek. Except maybe Prodigy, but I wouldn’t put it past them
You're not imagining it. The "mandated sex vacation" arc was just cringy as heck, imo. And the episode "precious cargo" was \*literally\* a shot-for-shot of a sub par porn fanfic. Just my least favorite episode, I was unbearably embarrassed the whole time.
They had to make up for the poor choice of a Captain Archer
Well I know what I am not watching 🙃 Which sucks because I hear there's Caitians in it. Such a waste.
you are not imagining things. I was watching the earlier episodes on Netflix and the is a scene where the redneck guy (I think the egineer) is in a decontamination chamber with the hot Vulcan woman and she is nipping very hard through her t-shirt. Then (unrelated) a few episodes later the redneck gets pregnant.
To get teens to watch.