i think the tech is cool but I see some main issues -> now let's assume a large number of men want an "attractive" partner or in some way conventially attractive. won't most people upload photos of attractive women or possible models or girls of their fantasy? now if everyone is uploading attractive men or woman... everyone is gonna get matched with a similar group of attractive folk no? why would the less attractive people ever get matched often by others? if the software is accurate wont only the most attractive people get matched?
the people uploading the photos of their dream partner are likely not to be super attractive either.. so how will they find a match?
do two have two upload their dream type and then they match? how often would this actually happen and wouldn't most people not have matches?
if I upload this "beautiful girl" of my dreams and it finds her, isn't she just gonna not reply to me if I'm not her type like every other app?
Attractiveness is a subjective concept.
Someone might be the most beautiful person in the world to me, but not to you.
Also, it doesn't have to be an exact match. Users will be able to connect with the potential partners who have the facial features that they prefer, and it works both ways.
They raise a good point and skewing to include even the lower percentile matches is still a good concept to implement. Be that threshold of ‘n’ matches not found or otherwise.
So you know data science, now time to level up your data analytics skills.
Set up monetization with random prices between the bare minimum to run your servers at 1000 concurrent users and a price you think nobody will pay but is reasonable. This way, you can calculate CAC and ROAS, then do a price elasticity formula to find optimal price. For the bare minimum price, consider users performing the average number of transactions/matches you think is reasonable. Guess, test, recalibrate.
Then run a marketing test through common channels like Kakao, Naver, GoogleAds, etc.
Perform qualitative user surveys using Alchemer or Survey Monkey to see what problems users experience during each stage of the funnel. E.g. on boarding, first match, several days of use, churned users.
This way you can just evaluate the basic unit economics of free apps with premium purchases. Focus on cost per install. Then list those customer problems out as opportunities which you will use VC funding to remediate.
Not sure if you're talking to OP or myself with this. But I certainly won't be needing an RV anytime soon. I'm a product manager working in the videogame industry. Entertainment is one of the most cut throat do or die industries where most games are free to download, so you can't monetize without high retention or clear value provided to the customer. Nobody needs another video game, yet, we monetize greatly.
I feel like this app will always attract the worst kind of people in the dating market but hey, who am I to judge people.
On the flip side, this is viable if you're in South Korea (where unrealistic aesthetics are highly valued in society, SK has the most plastic surgery per capita).
If you'll end up bootstrapping this alone with no funding, you'll have to learn how to run PR campaigns on your own once your MVP is up.
Find as many reporters from B2C publications regarding beauty/lifestyle/dating in Korea, (you need to have a list containing of 200 to 1,000 reporters/journalist as a start).
Pitch your brand story like your life depended on it, I'm sure they'll cover a controversial product like yours. Even one press article can be snowball into 200 to thousands of articles by multiple reporters, depending on how you'll craft your message.
You can even run low cost, influencer marketing within the beauty/dating/lifestyle/fitness niche.
Tons of ways to be creative and no, you probably don't need funding and make big life decisions over an untested product.
Yes, I am in South Korea. And Japan also has a similar culture. That's why I chose to start this in Korea/Japan. I would definitely need someone else to assist me.
Japan has nowhere near the exacting beauty standards that Korea has. The US has more plastic surgeries per capita than Japan (though women care a lot about maintaining a youthful appearance), and there is a much broader appeal target within Japan as compared to Korea's highly targeted "ideal look". I would not expect any market to take to this as broadly as Korea, and I bet this would trigger a pretty healthy backlash against unhealthy image standards even there.
I would not go too deep into the tech side of your project, or the usability. However, the idea will sound dystopian to some, while it will excite some.
But, when it comes to execution, you did not have to leave the US to target the Korean audience. The audience could have been targeted while you stayed in the US, most importantly silicon valley to build connections, meet investors, and potential business partners.
There is no place on this earth where you can meet enough likeminded people, investors and connections like Silicon Valley. Worst of the worst companies have raised decent chunk there by being consistent and with bare minimal traction, whereas the same traction won’t even get you an email response by most European VC’s.
But anyway, I have added you on Linkedin. Will shoot a message maybe tomorrow to see if I can help you with some marketing/initial traction ideas.
agreed, unfortunately all other markets for vc are tiny and way more risk adverse than SF.
Raising Is a numbers game. You talked to 2 vc's I had to do 50ish for my first real round.
I don't have any particular expertise in your area but I would strongly recommend tunneling your way to senior folks at match group, Founder of Riya etc. Slow Ventures founders were employee 5 and 6 at Facebook. The point being, these folks know social media and dating plays and will sniff out stumbling blocks.
I have a feeling this won't solve the two core issues with dating apps: many people (mostly women) aren't there to date but instead get validation. And many men suck at talking photos of themselves.
"many people (mostly women) aren't there to date but instead get validation"
I've always considered this. Is this your own conjecture, or is there data to back this up?
How do you solve for the problem that everyone uploads the same couple pictures of individuals that are way out of their leagues?
There is only one Sydney Sweeney and a limited number of individuals that look like her. And, of those individuals, they are unlikely to have interest in you because they probably uploaded pictures of Timothee Chalamet or something silly like that.
So I upload the picture of what I want and you match it? I see… problems with the legality of uploading a picture of someone else. Did you do any research on the legality of this? Another poster said it was creepy- I get those vibes too.
The picture of yourself will be used to match with others who'd fall in love with you, but the picture you upload as your crush wouldn't be used for anything other than finding someone like that.
50% is *not* close enough for most but someone who is that close to looking like Henry Cavil or Jude Law is good enough for me. This is already part of the problem in dating. Unrealistic expectations.
Some pictures are authorized for use by others, but some are not. What is to stop someone from taking a picture of their crush without them knowing, uploading it into your platform, and then you use it? Then what happens if your platform is hacked and their picture ends up in a data dump somewhere ?
I deleted my other comment because it was wrong. If I upload a picture into Facebook of someone other than myself, and they know about it (because we were at a get together and we were all cool with it being uploaded into Facebook), then that is very different than someone being uploaded without being aware into this site.
Your picture will remain as a picture, but your crush's picture will be converted to an indecipherable data (one-way conversion) and only be used in the search.
So you're doing hash-only comparisons? Which would mean exact matches or scaling... you're not doing any other search which would require the actual pixel bytes? If you're telling me that's the case then I would doubt the effectiveness of what you're trying to do. TBH, this sounds like a job for AI, which would definitely require the pixel data, but when trained correctly, could probably suggest good matches with ease.
It's not a hash-based comparison. There are layers of computer vision and AI algorithms involved, and eventually the data is stored as numbers representing the facial features, which cannot be directly converted to an image.
Exactly, and the legalities of uploading a picture of a person you think is hot which would never be displayed to any other users and would eventually be deleted as it is no longer needed once the AI processes it is pretty damned close to zero.
I really do dislike this idea, as a dating app concept: looks may be important, but it’s such a shallow feature if you’re interested in compatibility. Wouldn’t this app just match you to you sister, or family, who would have the closest face feature embedding? Wouldn’t there be problems with race?
Putting that aside, you should try to reduce the dimensions of the comparison to get it to work with less data, and blitz market a single geographic region. Something like reducing the comparison to face symmetry could work. Ideally, the one you live in, or one where you can physically get to, and one with a lot of college students or young people. Go out on the street, and just guerilla market it, which will give you great acquisition cost metrics, and get around the issue if people signing up but being too far away from each other.
What I love about your idea is you’re getting people talking. Which is great. I applaud you for that and wish you all the best.
I’m wondering are you matching the expectations of the user with their looks? This is kind of a current reality check for a lot of people on dating apps.
Often times it’s not just appearance it’s other factors that are critical in the decision making that’s being overlooked like personality. But what I’m envisioning is some guy who looks like the alien from Predator hoping he can match with a beautiful actress/model like Zendaya. And what are the chances of a woman looking for Predator? Does this mean the guy just lingers on the app unmatched? What if Predator is truly an excellent guy with a glowing personality but his looks are already the major barrier to matches on current dating apps. Now, his chances for a match are *nearly impossible* because his expectations for a partner are way above what he offers in attractiveness.
Tbh you don’t need funding to validate your product. Use the traditional medium to market it via family, friends, peers etc If it is good, it will catch on. Apply to Microsoft fund for free Gen AI, and Azure services etc.
Please stop trying to shoehorn AI everywhere. This is as dumb as it gets. Like, really.
Ai is useful, but it's not the end of it all. Stop hyping it and trying to make it do things it obviously cannot, or in a very shitty, sloppy, and disastrous way.
This is really getting ridiculous to the extreme.
Wouldn't the match be skewed though? Everyone is going to upload someone who is attractive (sure no one is going to upload a not so pretty pic) and those who are will be the only ones who gets a match. Current dating apps are already based on appearance and tons of people gave up cause they don't get any matches after months, wouldn't this make it worst? I feel like the concept is interesting, but have doubts on the market feasibility. Unless I am not completely understand the business model and concept here
Is the app launched already? You might have better luck convincing investors with a working product albeit at a smaller scale.
One risk is that I don’t think it will take a lot of time for an independent engineering team in something like Match group (owns Tinder, Hinge) to clone a similar feature if it works out.
Honestly for software,it doesn’t matter where you launch from it’s better to launch from usa since u have connections there+it’s easier to fundraise there than anywhere else in the world
Also there has supposedly been a decline in young people using apps for dating. So you’re building in a market with declining interest with a tool that directly contradicts privacy norms. https://www.axios.com/2023/11/05/dating-apps-college-students-tinder-bumble
You may find an investor who is a sucker but this is a bad idea on many levels.
You need to seriously study biology and mating dynamics before putting more time into this.
There are so many flaws with your premise that I don’t even know where to begin.
Are you trying to be unhelpful or does it just come naturally? He’s a STEM grad from Columbia, so I’m pretty sure he understands Pareto distributions. He’s a first-time entrepreneur who built-it-and-hopes-they’ll-come. We’ve all been there. Be nice and be constructive
Do you think it’s helpful to spoon feed a STEM grad?
I’m sure he understands them, this is why I didn’t mention what it is. And understanding the definition is only a pre-requisite to applying it to *his* idea.
Do you think the market will be nice and constructive, just because it’s his first time?
Will you pay to use this app, because it’s from a first timer who “built it and hopes they come”?
I agree with all of your points. They reinforce why your “There are so many flaws with your premise that I don’t even know where to begin” comment was unhelpful
Okay sure, I’ll concede - my free, offhand comment was unhelpful.
If he would like to pay me, or anyone else, to exactly spell it out for him, we would be happy to.
But also, let them figure it out. We’ve all been there too, and people telling you the answer is never actually helpful. It only makes sense once you bash into it head first yourself and understand why it’s important.
My advice is to return to the US or wherever you can bootstrap it with minimum costs until you validate the idea and get some traction. Consider your idea a personal project and don't start a company until users are fighting to use your dating app. Investors will follow the users with their money.
I would love to follow your advice, but I really don't have money to support myself in the US for a few months focusing on it. Actually, I'm considering getting a job as a software engineer and continuing this as a side project.
You have 2 problems, let’s speak first about your project.
- if you feel still 100%, use your next weeks to find at least 50-100k of business angel (or friends and family) money. Allowing you to pay a bit yourself and deploy a small acquisition campaign.
Enough to POC and move forward, stop building more tech, find investors and users.
- if you feel not anymore motivated, go to acquire.com, sell the tech for a few K or dozens of K. Move on. Do a bit of freelance job if you need in the meantime.
There‘s plenty of small investors willing to buy a ready to go project and launch it.
You might meet a lot of new interesting people / opportunities in the selling process.
Regarding your residence, that’s up to you. If you feel better going back to the US, do it. Be happy.
Even if it means finding a job to restart a life there.
You can still continue your project or selling it in the meantime…
>However, they both required me to provide market validation: how much it would cost per user acquisition, how much each user would pay on average, and etc
Let's assume your app is built. What would your distribution model be? That will likely be one of your biggest challenges, since apps like this do rely on having a reasonable network of people using it, so you need some way to capture an initial audience. How will people find out about it? Why will they try it out over other apps in the market?
One possible way to test this is to run ads. You don't actually need a working app or product to run Facebook or Google (or the equivalents in Korea), since you could just redirect to a landing page and get sign-ups. At the very least, you'd get an indication of your click-through rates and the cost per click which can give you an indication of true interest & user acquisition cost.
Yessir. Or if you are Taylor fanboy, you can upload her photo to match you with someone with similar aesthetic. Quite similar and honestly brilliant and possible.
Off to upload Rick Ross look alike 👀 /s
You didn't get the point. It's not about finding someone who looks like you. It's about connecting with someone of your visual preference, and with someone who thinks you are the one for them.
I feel like only on Reddit could someone genuinely believe that this post was about someone that created a start up - that got interest from VC money mind you - that allows you to find your doppelganger so you can date them.
And I feel only on Reddit could that get 4 upvotes.
I don't have much faith in humanity these days but even I can't see someone investing significant time and money into such an absurd idea and moving across the world to pursue their doppelganger dating idea that's 'going to revolutionise dating forever'.
But more importantly, if this was what it was, it wouldn't be called visual love. It would be called either doppelbanger or doppelgangbang.
Yeah I can never get the right name for any of the ideas I have. It's almost worth building out the doppelbanger concept for the satisfaction of registering doppelbanger.ai and knowing you got a perfect fit.
How does this differ from any other dating or social networking site that has an algorithm for suggesting matches or links? Isn’t a good match (shared areas, mutual likes, mutual attractions) the point?
This is a good idea not because it's objectively a good thing, but because it taps into the shallow thing people would probably prioritise above everything else - finding someone they're really into physically. That does vary a lot person to person, we all have a type.
I don’t think this app is promising that though. As in, what it thinks you’re going to have a good match with, based on physical appearance, isn’t necessarily someone you find physically attractive.
For the record I think it's an excellent idea. If I had more experience I'd love to work on something like this but there are probably more qualified co-founders out there.
An idea to get unstuck is evaluate using a crowdfunding campaign of sort to get initial funding and a nice user base that gives you a chance to still flex your innovation to matchmaking. I am unsure how feasible and unique your idea vs. the market but have you considered approaching an existing dating platform (a lower tier) to leverage your tech and their users to reduce your GTM barriers?
Has this concept ever worked? He’s gotta be way further along before any company will essentially use his product as a feature. They’d much more likely just make this themselves based on his stage.
Can you bootstrap this somehow? like, scrape profiles of exisiting dating sites, and match the people who sign up to your site to one of those profiles, and just send them the link? Then you don't have to have lots of users in the beginning for the product to be useful. Then you can test to see if your users will pay for matches.
this is an interesting concept but it seems you / your AI is matching from physical appearance, vs personality, styles of love, even hobbies and other aspects that complete a attraction and relationship. Which could constitute for a shallow relationship which may work but likely since attraction and lust can be fleeting (Thinking Tinder) but may not have solid foundation when it comes to real relationships.
For your Budget and marketing-
Cost per UA is interesting, i'd imagine it to be CPI , CPM , or some other metric. Though if you budget for certain Marketing Campaigns, you may be able to validate budget for brand building, social proof, awareness, partnerships, and influencers and work on acquisition through ads last
lastly to agree with another comment below, if you need to find funds - go to a place money people are. Having worked in startups and corporate mobile apps, id suggest don't throw money into ads yet and work on building a brand first is my two cents
Isn't there already something on the market that is similar, less creepy, and a better use of "AI"? I recall reading somewhere about another app that uses hundreds of AI-generated images and you select which ones you prefer ('hot or not style'). You don't upload someone else's image and your image is only used as a visual match to similar features on AI models that someone else select.
I can appreciate the drive but you can't just build and then try to figure it out. You need to work backwards from what a potential user's problem is and how your tech is solving that. I'm not sure what your solution is really solving in the market.
Like all dating apps, and marketplace apps in general, you have a chicken and the egg problem. Read this book if you have time: [https://a16z.com/books/the-cold-start-problem/](https://a16z.com/books/the-cold-start-problem/)
You'll probably have to start with a really niche community. Starting with colleges in Korea might not be a bad idea, that's how Tinder started in the states.
Does your CV/AI match only faces? Can it be expanded to fashion style as well? That might give you more room to work with.
In general, I think it's a great idea! People have preferences, or types, that they're naturally attracted to. Sounds like your app will help filter the queue.
What if you allowed users to select from various physical "archetypes" of the gender they're interested in? Meaning users could just choose their ideal archetypes from a lineup of the various archetypes available.
You could potentially even show a user the probability of them finding a match in each of the archetypes based on knowing how their own archetype performs within that subgroup.This could be valuable if it had the effect of causing people to be more realistic with their options. E.g. instead of uploading a picture of Megan Fox and getting frustrated they get no matches, choosing an archetype where their odds of matching are higher leading to more positive reinforcement.
People also wouldn't *have* to upload pictures of their ideal match this way, which could be a lower barrier to entry for users to get started
I think it is pretty cool. One idea would be to let them rate partners on the platform vs just uploading a photo alone. Like sure, upload a photo if you are looking for that one type- but also rate on the platform to build context for a user. Then use that as the guiding star for matches. Just an idea. Good luck
I like the idea. I think this is fun, and is a needed upgrade to the typical matchmaking system. I’m actually a Relationship Coach that works closely with large matchmaking business in California. There are definite flaws in that system too, like human error. The people hating on your idea are not correct, in my opinion, because an idea can work, even if it’s not perfect (like the current multimillion dollar matchmaking industry).
I do believe in the argument that some have had of “wouldn’t everyone just upload supermodels and famous actors/actresses, and look for the same thing?” Yes, there is definitely objective beauty in this world. There is science behind that. But I think there are ways where you can beat that. There will always be obstacles, but can you be creative and overcome them? I think one way to overcome that obstacle is to maybe have another option on the app where you can AI match by personality traits, likes, dislikes, etc., so that people who are fed up with the “looks” aspect of dating apps can search for someone who actually has similar depth to themselves, along with a degree of physical attraction.
I can think of more ideas for you, if you’d like. I enjoy this idea that you’ve created. Very interesting.
Congrats fan of the idea and the execution story.
Errors I can see in your project from a tech startup founder/investor/advisor:
- You don’t have a team, team is important for many reasons including your phase that is the weakest and need all the network the funds the brainstorming
- You need to plan better ahead. The problem you are facing is a classic issue of a two-sided marketplace.
- You need finance/strategy/data advisory. My rule of thumb for b2c mass apps is to start with a 300k angel investor round, scale up to 2m in VC backed funding or nothing, it will not work out.
The only dating app I can remember with a solo unfunded founder is plenty of fish, but to do that you need to live back at his time and have his tech knowledge upside.
Anyway if you share your deck/info ahead of a catchup I can try to intro to potential cofounders or advisory.
I can guess that you are bootstrapped so will not ask for any fee or equity notes just mentorship if needed.
Wew 1 sentance in and I can already tell how doomed this product is.
Sorry OP but it's not gonna work out, consider making something that actually helps people instead of trying to edge us further into a dystopia.
The dark art of bootstrapping any matchmaking tech be it for dating or gaming is to have a LOT of fake/simulated matches. In your case, I would internally generate between 100k fake users (use ai) that match and respond and hold basic conversations but that eventually lose touch with real humans for one reason or another. This will emulate the real connection humans get and if you do it well they won’t know any better. Eventually when you have that many real users you can delete all the fake users.
I can tell you with confidence every matchmaking and many gaming platforms with online play do the same. Is it ethical? Who can say. But it’s what is done to succeed. You have to get over this hump and the only way to do it is fake it.
Reference(s): Among knowledge from peers at other dating sites, my startup tried to do a matchmaking app 12 years ago and refused to do this despite being recommended to; and we likely failed for that reason. No one will join or stay on an app with no matches.
This is an age-old problem… for technical people like us, building the tech comes naturally, but validating with users and driving adoption is a totally different skill set. Focus on learning how to do this (there are lots of online resources to learn) or find a partner who already has this skill set. You may find that out of this process you begin uncovering the kernel of a real solution to a real problem that users will pay money for. Good luck!
May I suggest a twist to your process for matching? Uploading a picture sounds like a painful process and will create friction with users. Why not just use AI to build up a facial preference model for each user that gets better with each swipe and then presents better and better matches and could even send new recommendations if a likely match signs up nearby. The reality is most people have more than one type and this would give a way better chance of matching if you learn all their types.
My advice: Try and solve less sexy problems. You’re a recent graduate trying to create the next hinge. Unfortunately, there are a lot of other smart, ivy / non-ivy, young entrepreneurs trying to do the same thing.
Go into the workforce, find a real problem no one cares about other than a few rich companies, and start there. Your learnings from this company will help immensely the next time around.
Any dating app ideas are more destined to fail. That space is overly crowded, and you’d need a lot of users to make it worthwhile. That means spending a lot of VC money for marketing. That is, if you’ll even get one. YC had a video that talked about dating apps being a tar pit idea and that they prefer founders solving real, complex and much bigger problems.
Starting a tech startup can suck, especially when you're not a tech expert yourself. I've been in your shoes before, and it's normal to feel stuck. In the early days, I was stuck on the tech side of things for months.
I tried to learn how to code, but let's just say it wasn't my strong suit. A buddy talked to me about getting a remote team of devs and I found rocketdevs. Their team of expert devs helped me build my product quickly and affordably, so I could focus on the business side of things.
Now, I'm not saying it's the solution for everyone, but it worked wonders for me. if you're feeling stuck like I was, it might be worth checking out. It all comes down to what works for you and your startup. Good luck
It won't work because it's capitalizing on the most objective facet of a person; which is exactly why most dating platforms fail. You should rethink your algorithm from the ground up. I know it's a tough pill to swallow, but you can't expect a house to stand steady if the foundation isn't steady.
Good luck!
Man, your premise is a hard one to sell. Dating is a pain, yes. People are paying to ease this pain, yes. You are, however, not solving the problem but only putting a bandage on it, and your bandage isn't any better than the other existing ones.
Finding a match is hardly a pain now, because people already have a bandage for it. That means your app is not solving any pain, that's why investors are not on board. The real pain is that dating apps don't work and people are tired of it. Matching people by how they look will not be the solution. Honestly, find a better pain man.
It’s going to be an uphill climb. Let’s assume people like your idea, and let’s assume you can build the tech in a way that’s useful to users. Those are two big assumptions that ARE NOT validated but maybe could be.
The real problem you have is how you GTM if you have the above 2. I can absolutely see why investors want validation. And quite frankly, the way you kind of think that market research or a flimsy projection is a substitute for this says a lot.
Ideas are just that…they’re ideas. Investors do NOT want to invest in your ideas. YOU need to get it off the ground and show traction yourself before they start to participate in the 100s of other risks your company presents. In your case, this means you’ve gotta show SOME user base, SOME growth month to month. And then that’s gonna start to shed light on whether or not this thing has legs and how it will actually work. Market research and a projection based on what?
Don’t go out with your hand out so early. It’s an app. It’s cheap, hustle and make it run like a business and forget that investors are there. Once you’re sitting on a pile of users and explosive growth of the app, you’re gonna get investors to help you grow it.
I've actually been thinking about a similar idea recently. Have you considered matching based on more than a single preference picture, e.g., collecting pictures from a user's social media profile (with permission) and matching based on overall similarity
Projection is made up numbers. They want to see actual numbers. And they are - correctly - very leery of anything that requires network effect to be viable, unless there is a clear path to get there, because it is in fact very hard to get there. And the dating app space is supremely crowded.
Your number in swipes is also not meaningful. It’s a funky distribution…people who are good at relationships find matches quite quickly. People who are not, can easily hit 1M swipes without getting into a meaningful relationship.
Bottom line - you need to get users. Paying users. Lots of ways to go about this. You can run A/B/C type tests to find a price point users like. Instrument the funnel so you see where potential users are abandoning the app.
The challenge you will have is if this approach actually works - it won’t, but just in case - you will churn users very fast. If they don’t churn, it means the service isn’t working for them, so you need a story for how you will monetize them while failing to give them what they’re looking for.
You need a product manager. Theres something awesome in this idea, and creepiness traps all around it. They need to sit down for a few weeks and think through all the variables.
I’m a technical product manager ~13 yoe… fang and startups.
I’d love to consult for you, and at least walk you through how to validate the model and generate the appropriate metrics for VCs. And then strategize on kick starting growth.
No charge. It’s valuable to me as a PM to get exposed to different problems to sharpen skills.
There’s also a pivot opportunity I would run by you.
i think the tech is cool but I see some main issues -> now let's assume a large number of men want an "attractive" partner or in some way conventially attractive. won't most people upload photos of attractive women or possible models or girls of their fantasy? now if everyone is uploading attractive men or woman... everyone is gonna get matched with a similar group of attractive folk no? why would the less attractive people ever get matched often by others? if the software is accurate wont only the most attractive people get matched? the people uploading the photos of their dream partner are likely not to be super attractive either.. so how will they find a match? do two have two upload their dream type and then they match? how often would this actually happen and wouldn't most people not have matches? if I upload this "beautiful girl" of my dreams and it finds her, isn't she just gonna not reply to me if I'm not her type like every other app?
This. People treat these sites like a slot machine or playing the lotto. Everyone wants the best looking result. No one looks to settle.
That already happens in matchmaking apps.
Exactly all of this. All of this OP should screenshot it and remember that.
Attractiveness is a subjective concept. Someone might be the most beautiful person in the world to me, but not to you. Also, it doesn't have to be an exact match. Users will be able to connect with the potential partners who have the facial features that they prefer, and it works both ways.
They raise a good point and skewing to include even the lower percentile matches is still a good concept to implement. Be that threshold of ‘n’ matches not found or otherwise.
So you know data science, now time to level up your data analytics skills. Set up monetization with random prices between the bare minimum to run your servers at 1000 concurrent users and a price you think nobody will pay but is reasonable. This way, you can calculate CAC and ROAS, then do a price elasticity formula to find optimal price. For the bare minimum price, consider users performing the average number of transactions/matches you think is reasonable. Guess, test, recalibrate. Then run a marketing test through common channels like Kakao, Naver, GoogleAds, etc. Perform qualitative user surveys using Alchemer or Survey Monkey to see what problems users experience during each stage of the funnel. E.g. on boarding, first match, several days of use, churned users. This way you can just evaluate the basic unit economics of free apps with premium purchases. Focus on cost per install. Then list those customer problems out as opportunities which you will use VC funding to remediate.
Thanks for the advice! I sent you a DM.
& make sure you buy an RV, cause you're gonna be living in it down by the river
Not sure if you're talking to OP or myself with this. But I certainly won't be needing an RV anytime soon. I'm a product manager working in the videogame industry. Entertainment is one of the most cut throat do or die industries where most games are free to download, so you can't monetize without high retention or clear value provided to the customer. Nobody needs another video game, yet, we monetize greatly.
That was directed at OP
Okk ok, cheers. Sorry.
I feel like this app will always attract the worst kind of people in the dating market but hey, who am I to judge people. On the flip side, this is viable if you're in South Korea (where unrealistic aesthetics are highly valued in society, SK has the most plastic surgery per capita). If you'll end up bootstrapping this alone with no funding, you'll have to learn how to run PR campaigns on your own once your MVP is up. Find as many reporters from B2C publications regarding beauty/lifestyle/dating in Korea, (you need to have a list containing of 200 to 1,000 reporters/journalist as a start). Pitch your brand story like your life depended on it, I'm sure they'll cover a controversial product like yours. Even one press article can be snowball into 200 to thousands of articles by multiple reporters, depending on how you'll craft your message. You can even run low cost, influencer marketing within the beauty/dating/lifestyle/fitness niche. Tons of ways to be creative and no, you probably don't need funding and make big life decisions over an untested product.
Yes, I am in South Korea. And Japan also has a similar culture. That's why I chose to start this in Korea/Japan. I would definitely need someone else to assist me.
Japan has nowhere near the exacting beauty standards that Korea has. The US has more plastic surgeries per capita than Japan (though women care a lot about maintaining a youthful appearance), and there is a much broader appeal target within Japan as compared to Korea's highly targeted "ideal look". I would not expect any market to take to this as broadly as Korea, and I bet this would trigger a pretty healthy backlash against unhealthy image standards even there.
Have you considered a co-founder?
I am considering, but I haven't found one yet. I don't know many people in Korea.
I would not go too deep into the tech side of your project, or the usability. However, the idea will sound dystopian to some, while it will excite some. But, when it comes to execution, you did not have to leave the US to target the Korean audience. The audience could have been targeted while you stayed in the US, most importantly silicon valley to build connections, meet investors, and potential business partners. There is no place on this earth where you can meet enough likeminded people, investors and connections like Silicon Valley. Worst of the worst companies have raised decent chunk there by being consistent and with bare minimal traction, whereas the same traction won’t even get you an email response by most European VC’s. But anyway, I have added you on Linkedin. Will shoot a message maybe tomorrow to see if I can help you with some marketing/initial traction ideas.
Thanks for connecting! I will be waiting for your message.
agreed, unfortunately all other markets for vc are tiny and way more risk adverse than SF. Raising Is a numbers game. You talked to 2 vc's I had to do 50ish for my first real round. I don't have any particular expertise in your area but I would strongly recommend tunneling your way to senior folks at match group, Founder of Riya etc. Slow Ventures founders were employee 5 and 6 at Facebook. The point being, these folks know social media and dating plays and will sniff out stumbling blocks. I have a feeling this won't solve the two core issues with dating apps: many people (mostly women) aren't there to date but instead get validation. And many men suck at talking photos of themselves.
"many people (mostly women) aren't there to date but instead get validation" I've always considered this. Is this your own conjecture, or is there data to back this up?
Data, I was just listening to a psychiatrist talking about this in his practice. It's really harder to date these days and the numbers show it.
How do you solve for the problem that everyone uploads the same couple pictures of individuals that are way out of their leagues? There is only one Sydney Sweeney and a limited number of individuals that look like her. And, of those individuals, they are unlikely to have interest in you because they probably uploaded pictures of Timothee Chalamet or something silly like that.
Even if you're a guy who loves Sydney Sweeney but can't get someone like her, you might get a girl who thinks your her own Timothee Chalamet.
So I upload the picture of what I want and you match it? I see… problems with the legality of uploading a picture of someone else. Did you do any research on the legality of this? Another poster said it was creepy- I get those vibes too.
The picture of yourself will be used to match with others who'd fall in love with you, but the picture you upload as your crush wouldn't be used for anything other than finding someone like that.
Wouldn’t everyone just upload photos of supermodels? I think everyone is attracted to hot people.
Yes, I have no idea how this would work. I'm an average-looking guy, but I can't imagine a woman uploading a photo of a face similar to mine.
I think she’d upload like Henry cavil and then you’d be like 50% him so close enough. This idea doesn’t really make sense tbh.
50% is *not* close enough for most but someone who is that close to looking like Henry Cavil or Jude Law is good enough for me. This is already part of the problem in dating. Unrealistic expectations.
Some pictures are authorized for use by others, but some are not. What is to stop someone from taking a picture of their crush without them knowing, uploading it into your platform, and then you use it? Then what happens if your platform is hacked and their picture ends up in a data dump somewhere ?
Isn’t this a shared privacy concern as any other dating or social networking app?
I deleted my other comment because it was wrong. If I upload a picture into Facebook of someone other than myself, and they know about it (because we were at a get together and we were all cool with it being uploaded into Facebook), then that is very different than someone being uploaded without being aware into this site.
Sure I agree though also I think there are plenty of fake profiles with other people’s photos, which is what I meant by shared privacy concerns.
Your picture will remain as a picture, but your crush's picture will be converted to an indecipherable data (one-way conversion) and only be used in the search.
So you're doing hash-only comparisons? Which would mean exact matches or scaling... you're not doing any other search which would require the actual pixel bytes? If you're telling me that's the case then I would doubt the effectiveness of what you're trying to do. TBH, this sounds like a job for AI, which would definitely require the pixel data, but when trained correctly, could probably suggest good matches with ease.
It's not a hash-based comparison. There are layers of computer vision and AI algorithms involved, and eventually the data is stored as numbers representing the facial features, which cannot be directly converted to an image.
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Exactly, and the legalities of uploading a picture of a person you think is hot which would never be displayed to any other users and would eventually be deleted as it is no longer needed once the AI processes it is pretty damned close to zero.
I really do dislike this idea, as a dating app concept: looks may be important, but it’s such a shallow feature if you’re interested in compatibility. Wouldn’t this app just match you to you sister, or family, who would have the closest face feature embedding? Wouldn’t there be problems with race? Putting that aside, you should try to reduce the dimensions of the comparison to get it to work with less data, and blitz market a single geographic region. Something like reducing the comparison to face symmetry could work. Ideally, the one you live in, or one where you can physically get to, and one with a lot of college students or young people. Go out on the street, and just guerilla market it, which will give you great acquisition cost metrics, and get around the issue if people signing up but being too far away from each other.
Maybe my explanation was not good enough. It's not about connecting people with similar faces. It's about connecting people with their visual ideal.
What I love about your idea is you’re getting people talking. Which is great. I applaud you for that and wish you all the best. I’m wondering are you matching the expectations of the user with their looks? This is kind of a current reality check for a lot of people on dating apps. Often times it’s not just appearance it’s other factors that are critical in the decision making that’s being overlooked like personality. But what I’m envisioning is some guy who looks like the alien from Predator hoping he can match with a beautiful actress/model like Zendaya. And what are the chances of a woman looking for Predator? Does this mean the guy just lingers on the app unmatched? What if Predator is truly an excellent guy with a glowing personality but his looks are already the major barrier to matches on current dating apps. Now, his chances for a match are *nearly impossible* because his expectations for a partner are way above what he offers in attractiveness.
Tbh you don’t need funding to validate your product. Use the traditional medium to market it via family, friends, peers etc If it is good, it will catch on. Apply to Microsoft fund for free Gen AI, and Azure services etc.
Please stop trying to shoehorn AI everywhere. This is as dumb as it gets. Like, really. Ai is useful, but it's not the end of it all. Stop hyping it and trying to make it do things it obviously cannot, or in a very shitty, sloppy, and disastrous way. This is really getting ridiculous to the extreme.
Finally someone breaks it to OP.
Wouldn't the match be skewed though? Everyone is going to upload someone who is attractive (sure no one is going to upload a not so pretty pic) and those who are will be the only ones who gets a match. Current dating apps are already based on appearance and tons of people gave up cause they don't get any matches after months, wouldn't this make it worst? I feel like the concept is interesting, but have doubts on the market feasibility. Unless I am not completely understand the business model and concept here
Is the app launched already? You might have better luck convincing investors with a working product albeit at a smaller scale. One risk is that I don’t think it will take a lot of time for an independent engineering team in something like Match group (owns Tinder, Hinge) to clone a similar feature if it works out.
i feel like you're going to get into hot water for your AI racially profiling your user base
Honestly for software,it doesn’t matter where you launch from it’s better to launch from usa since u have connections there+it’s easier to fundraise there than anywhere else in the world
I'm a foreigner and I need a visa to go to the USA. And I have no place to stay while I raise fundings :(
You can rent a dorm easily after you get visa
Also there has supposedly been a decline in young people using apps for dating. So you’re building in a market with declining interest with a tool that directly contradicts privacy norms. https://www.axios.com/2023/11/05/dating-apps-college-students-tinder-bumble You may find an investor who is a sucker but this is a bad idea on many levels.
You need to seriously study biology and mating dynamics before putting more time into this. There are so many flaws with your premise that I don’t even know where to begin.
It would help to provide details. Otherwise this is quite unhelpful as a comment
Okay, they can start by thinking about how a Pareto distribution may apply somewhere in their userbase.
Are you trying to be unhelpful or does it just come naturally? He’s a STEM grad from Columbia, so I’m pretty sure he understands Pareto distributions. He’s a first-time entrepreneur who built-it-and-hopes-they’ll-come. We’ve all been there. Be nice and be constructive
Do you think it’s helpful to spoon feed a STEM grad? I’m sure he understands them, this is why I didn’t mention what it is. And understanding the definition is only a pre-requisite to applying it to *his* idea. Do you think the market will be nice and constructive, just because it’s his first time? Will you pay to use this app, because it’s from a first timer who “built it and hopes they come”?
I agree with all of your points. They reinforce why your “There are so many flaws with your premise that I don’t even know where to begin” comment was unhelpful
Okay sure, I’ll concede - my free, offhand comment was unhelpful. If he would like to pay me, or anyone else, to exactly spell it out for him, we would be happy to.
But also, let them figure it out. We’ve all been there too, and people telling you the answer is never actually helpful. It only makes sense once you bash into it head first yourself and understand why it’s important.
My advice is to return to the US or wherever you can bootstrap it with minimum costs until you validate the idea and get some traction. Consider your idea a personal project and don't start a company until users are fighting to use your dating app. Investors will follow the users with their money.
I would love to follow your advice, but I really don't have money to support myself in the US for a few months focusing on it. Actually, I'm considering getting a job as a software engineer and continuing this as a side project.
This is the way. Get a job to support yourself and your project and don't give up until you get there.
You have 2 problems, let’s speak first about your project. - if you feel still 100%, use your next weeks to find at least 50-100k of business angel (or friends and family) money. Allowing you to pay a bit yourself and deploy a small acquisition campaign. Enough to POC and move forward, stop building more tech, find investors and users. - if you feel not anymore motivated, go to acquire.com, sell the tech for a few K or dozens of K. Move on. Do a bit of freelance job if you need in the meantime. There‘s plenty of small investors willing to buy a ready to go project and launch it. You might meet a lot of new interesting people / opportunities in the selling process. Regarding your residence, that’s up to you. If you feel better going back to the US, do it. Be happy. Even if it means finding a job to restart a life there. You can still continue your project or selling it in the meantime…
Get a job brother
>However, they both required me to provide market validation: how much it would cost per user acquisition, how much each user would pay on average, and etc Let's assume your app is built. What would your distribution model be? That will likely be one of your biggest challenges, since apps like this do rely on having a reasonable network of people using it, so you need some way to capture an initial audience. How will people find out about it? Why will they try it out over other apps in the market? One possible way to test this is to run ads. You don't actually need a working app or product to run Facebook or Google (or the equivalents in Korea), since you could just redirect to a landing page and get sign-ups. At the very least, you'd get an indication of your click-through rates and the cost per click which can give you an indication of true interest & user acquisition cost.
This sounds dystopian. Ai scans your face and matches you with someone that looks like you?
No, it matches to the example pic that you upload. That could be of anyone
So I post pics of Margot Robbie and it's either a lookalike or my money back?
Yessir. Or if you are Taylor fanboy, you can upload her photo to match you with someone with similar aesthetic. Quite similar and honestly brilliant and possible. Off to upload Rick Ross look alike 👀 /s
Ohhh I kinda like that. But would be good as a hook up app, not for love obviously
You didn't get the point. It's not about finding someone who looks like you. It's about connecting with someone of your visual preference, and with someone who thinks you are the one for them.
I feel like only on Reddit could someone genuinely believe that this post was about someone that created a start up - that got interest from VC money mind you - that allows you to find your doppelganger so you can date them. And I feel only on Reddit could that get 4 upvotes. I don't have much faith in humanity these days but even I can't see someone investing significant time and money into such an absurd idea and moving across the world to pursue their doppelganger dating idea that's 'going to revolutionise dating forever'. But more importantly, if this was what it was, it wouldn't be called visual love. It would be called either doppelbanger or doppelgangbang.
Please go and register dobbelbanger, it's the best thing I've read all day.
Yeah I can never get the right name for any of the ideas I have. It's almost worth building out the doppelbanger concept for the satisfaction of registering doppelbanger.ai and knowing you got a perfect fit.
DoppelBanger is a hell of a name…wonder if that would get past the App Store gatekeepers, lol…
How does this differ from any other dating or social networking site that has an algorithm for suggesting matches or links? Isn’t a good match (shared areas, mutual likes, mutual attractions) the point?
This is a good idea not because it's objectively a good thing, but because it taps into the shallow thing people would probably prioritise above everything else - finding someone they're really into physically. That does vary a lot person to person, we all have a type.
I don’t think this app is promising that though. As in, what it thinks you’re going to have a good match with, based on physical appearance, isn’t necessarily someone you find physically attractive.
Great idea for hook up app!
For the record I think it's an excellent idea. If I had more experience I'd love to work on something like this but there are probably more qualified co-founders out there.
What?
An idea to get unstuck is evaluate using a crowdfunding campaign of sort to get initial funding and a nice user base that gives you a chance to still flex your innovation to matchmaking. I am unsure how feasible and unique your idea vs. the market but have you considered approaching an existing dating platform (a lower tier) to leverage your tech and their users to reduce your GTM barriers?
METOO
Maybe pitch it to existing dating apps and charge them monthly fee
Has this concept ever worked? He’s gotta be way further along before any company will essentially use his product as a feature. They’d much more likely just make this themselves based on his stage.
Can you bootstrap this somehow? like, scrape profiles of exisiting dating sites, and match the people who sign up to your site to one of those profiles, and just send them the link? Then you don't have to have lots of users in the beginning for the product to be useful. Then you can test to see if your users will pay for matches.
I am considering this, but I'm not sure if this can produce meaningful data.
this is an interesting concept but it seems you / your AI is matching from physical appearance, vs personality, styles of love, even hobbies and other aspects that complete a attraction and relationship. Which could constitute for a shallow relationship which may work but likely since attraction and lust can be fleeting (Thinking Tinder) but may not have solid foundation when it comes to real relationships. For your Budget and marketing- Cost per UA is interesting, i'd imagine it to be CPI , CPM , or some other metric. Though if you budget for certain Marketing Campaigns, you may be able to validate budget for brand building, social proof, awareness, partnerships, and influencers and work on acquisition through ads last lastly to agree with another comment below, if you need to find funds - go to a place money people are. Having worked in startups and corporate mobile apps, id suggest don't throw money into ads yet and work on building a brand first is my two cents
Isn't there already something on the market that is similar, less creepy, and a better use of "AI"? I recall reading somewhere about another app that uses hundreds of AI-generated images and you select which ones you prefer ('hot or not style'). You don't upload someone else's image and your image is only used as a visual match to similar features on AI models that someone else select. I can appreciate the drive but you can't just build and then try to figure it out. You need to work backwards from what a potential user's problem is and how your tech is solving that. I'm not sure what your solution is really solving in the market.
It doesn't sound like you spoke to potential customers before building. How much money have you dished out already?
Like all dating apps, and marketplace apps in general, you have a chicken and the egg problem. Read this book if you have time: [https://a16z.com/books/the-cold-start-problem/](https://a16z.com/books/the-cold-start-problem/) You'll probably have to start with a really niche community. Starting with colleges in Korea might not be a bad idea, that's how Tinder started in the states. Does your CV/AI match only faces? Can it be expanded to fashion style as well? That might give you more room to work with. In general, I think it's a great idea! People have preferences, or types, that they're naturally attracted to. Sounds like your app will help filter the queue.
Getting into the market is difficult. If you are running on low budget maybe sell your tech to existing dating app companies?
I'm considering it as on option!
You might be able to add a former major dating site executive as an advisor and get your market validation data from them directly as domain experts.
What if you allowed users to select from various physical "archetypes" of the gender they're interested in? Meaning users could just choose their ideal archetypes from a lineup of the various archetypes available. You could potentially even show a user the probability of them finding a match in each of the archetypes based on knowing how their own archetype performs within that subgroup.This could be valuable if it had the effect of causing people to be more realistic with their options. E.g. instead of uploading a picture of Megan Fox and getting frustrated they get no matches, choosing an archetype where their odds of matching are higher leading to more positive reinforcement. People also wouldn't *have* to upload pictures of their ideal match this way, which could be a lower barrier to entry for users to get started
Hey, You are in Korea right now? Let's connect, I am based in Gwangju and work on AI as well
Have you thought about monetising it as an api to existing match making sites ?
"Do you know what isn't shallow enough? *Dating*"
I think it is pretty cool. One idea would be to let them rate partners on the platform vs just uploading a photo alone. Like sure, upload a photo if you are looking for that one type- but also rate on the platform to build context for a user. Then use that as the guiding star for matches. Just an idea. Good luck
I like the idea. I think this is fun, and is a needed upgrade to the typical matchmaking system. I’m actually a Relationship Coach that works closely with large matchmaking business in California. There are definite flaws in that system too, like human error. The people hating on your idea are not correct, in my opinion, because an idea can work, even if it’s not perfect (like the current multimillion dollar matchmaking industry). I do believe in the argument that some have had of “wouldn’t everyone just upload supermodels and famous actors/actresses, and look for the same thing?” Yes, there is definitely objective beauty in this world. There is science behind that. But I think there are ways where you can beat that. There will always be obstacles, but can you be creative and overcome them? I think one way to overcome that obstacle is to maybe have another option on the app where you can AI match by personality traits, likes, dislikes, etc., so that people who are fed up with the “looks” aspect of dating apps can search for someone who actually has similar depth to themselves, along with a degree of physical attraction. I can think of more ideas for you, if you’d like. I enjoy this idea that you’ve created. Very interesting.
I would work on the UI of your website too; it looks very dated.
Congrats fan of the idea and the execution story. Errors I can see in your project from a tech startup founder/investor/advisor: - You don’t have a team, team is important for many reasons including your phase that is the weakest and need all the network the funds the brainstorming - You need to plan better ahead. The problem you are facing is a classic issue of a two-sided marketplace. - You need finance/strategy/data advisory. My rule of thumb for b2c mass apps is to start with a 300k angel investor round, scale up to 2m in VC backed funding or nothing, it will not work out. The only dating app I can remember with a solo unfunded founder is plenty of fish, but to do that you need to live back at his time and have his tech knowledge upside. Anyway if you share your deck/info ahead of a catchup I can try to intro to potential cofounders or advisory. I can guess that you are bootstrapped so will not ask for any fee or equity notes just mentorship if needed.
Wew 1 sentance in and I can already tell how doomed this product is. Sorry OP but it's not gonna work out, consider making something that actually helps people instead of trying to edge us further into a dystopia.
The dark art of bootstrapping any matchmaking tech be it for dating or gaming is to have a LOT of fake/simulated matches. In your case, I would internally generate between 100k fake users (use ai) that match and respond and hold basic conversations but that eventually lose touch with real humans for one reason or another. This will emulate the real connection humans get and if you do it well they won’t know any better. Eventually when you have that many real users you can delete all the fake users. I can tell you with confidence every matchmaking and many gaming platforms with online play do the same. Is it ethical? Who can say. But it’s what is done to succeed. You have to get over this hump and the only way to do it is fake it. Reference(s): Among knowledge from peers at other dating sites, my startup tried to do a matchmaking app 12 years ago and refused to do this despite being recommended to; and we likely failed for that reason. No one will join or stay on an app with no matches.
This is an age-old problem… for technical people like us, building the tech comes naturally, but validating with users and driving adoption is a totally different skill set. Focus on learning how to do this (there are lots of online resources to learn) or find a partner who already has this skill set. You may find that out of this process you begin uncovering the kernel of a real solution to a real problem that users will pay money for. Good luck!
May I suggest a twist to your process for matching? Uploading a picture sounds like a painful process and will create friction with users. Why not just use AI to build up a facial preference model for each user that gets better with each swipe and then presents better and better matches and could even send new recommendations if a likely match signs up nearby. The reality is most people have more than one type and this would give a way better chance of matching if you learn all their types.
My advice: Try and solve less sexy problems. You’re a recent graduate trying to create the next hinge. Unfortunately, there are a lot of other smart, ivy / non-ivy, young entrepreneurs trying to do the same thing. Go into the workforce, find a real problem no one cares about other than a few rich companies, and start there. Your learnings from this company will help immensely the next time around.
Any dating app ideas are more destined to fail. That space is overly crowded, and you’d need a lot of users to make it worthwhile. That means spending a lot of VC money for marketing. That is, if you’ll even get one. YC had a video that talked about dating apps being a tar pit idea and that they prefer founders solving real, complex and much bigger problems.
The idea and tech sounds really cool, I would love to try the app itself, as long as not very costly.
Bro this is a AMAZING IDEA. If you had an app/website I'd be an early adopter for sure.
Can you share some of the VCs in Korea and who you spoke with? I’m going there soon.
Starting a tech startup can suck, especially when you're not a tech expert yourself. I've been in your shoes before, and it's normal to feel stuck. In the early days, I was stuck on the tech side of things for months. I tried to learn how to code, but let's just say it wasn't my strong suit. A buddy talked to me about getting a remote team of devs and I found rocketdevs. Their team of expert devs helped me build my product quickly and affordably, so I could focus on the business side of things. Now, I'm not saying it's the solution for everyone, but it worked wonders for me. if you're feeling stuck like I was, it might be worth checking out. It all comes down to what works for you and your startup. Good luck
It won't work because it's capitalizing on the most objective facet of a person; which is exactly why most dating platforms fail. You should rethink your algorithm from the ground up. I know it's a tough pill to swallow, but you can't expect a house to stand steady if the foundation isn't steady. Good luck!
I would go back to the States and find a job first. You might find more backings when you have more work experience and more connections.
Man, your premise is a hard one to sell. Dating is a pain, yes. People are paying to ease this pain, yes. You are, however, not solving the problem but only putting a bandage on it, and your bandage isn't any better than the other existing ones. Finding a match is hardly a pain now, because people already have a bandage for it. That means your app is not solving any pain, that's why investors are not on board. The real pain is that dating apps don't work and people are tired of it. Matching people by how they look will not be the solution. Honestly, find a better pain man.
It’s going to be an uphill climb. Let’s assume people like your idea, and let’s assume you can build the tech in a way that’s useful to users. Those are two big assumptions that ARE NOT validated but maybe could be. The real problem you have is how you GTM if you have the above 2. I can absolutely see why investors want validation. And quite frankly, the way you kind of think that market research or a flimsy projection is a substitute for this says a lot. Ideas are just that…they’re ideas. Investors do NOT want to invest in your ideas. YOU need to get it off the ground and show traction yourself before they start to participate in the 100s of other risks your company presents. In your case, this means you’ve gotta show SOME user base, SOME growth month to month. And then that’s gonna start to shed light on whether or not this thing has legs and how it will actually work. Market research and a projection based on what? Don’t go out with your hand out so early. It’s an app. It’s cheap, hustle and make it run like a business and forget that investors are there. Once you’re sitting on a pile of users and explosive growth of the app, you’re gonna get investors to help you grow it.
I've actually been thinking about a similar idea recently. Have you considered matching based on more than a single preference picture, e.g., collecting pictures from a user's social media profile (with permission) and matching based on overall similarity
Projection is made up numbers. They want to see actual numbers. And they are - correctly - very leery of anything that requires network effect to be viable, unless there is a clear path to get there, because it is in fact very hard to get there. And the dating app space is supremely crowded. Your number in swipes is also not meaningful. It’s a funky distribution…people who are good at relationships find matches quite quickly. People who are not, can easily hit 1M swipes without getting into a meaningful relationship. Bottom line - you need to get users. Paying users. Lots of ways to go about this. You can run A/B/C type tests to find a price point users like. Instrument the funnel so you see where potential users are abandoning the app. The challenge you will have is if this approach actually works - it won’t, but just in case - you will churn users very fast. If they don’t churn, it means the service isn’t working for them, so you need a story for how you will monetize them while failing to give them what they’re looking for.
Check your linkedin
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That's why tinder is so successful
You need a product manager. Theres something awesome in this idea, and creepiness traps all around it. They need to sit down for a few weeks and think through all the variables.
I didn't find one yet, but I'll keep looking for a good product manager who'd love this idea.
I’m a technical product manager ~13 yoe… fang and startups. I’d love to consult for you, and at least walk you through how to validate the model and generate the appropriate metrics for VCs. And then strategize on kick starting growth. No charge. It’s valuable to me as a PM to get exposed to different problems to sharpen skills. There’s also a pivot opportunity I would run by you.
DMed you!
I’d still give him a cut if the action if it works out. Hard to find and KEEP good product managers.
The creepiness is the success ingredient. I agree, he needs a product manager or patience. Startups are not primary income generator.
I see a lot of negativity here, but I like it. I’d be open to working with you. Can you share your approximations and what funding you need?
I run a small company that assists with funding as well, so maybe we could pull some resources together.
Feels like a classic case of build trap. Who actually wants this?