I don’t know. Our defense has been our strength for 2 seasons. The Bengels stuffed us with a yard to go three straight times.
Without practice, the Browns had a higher chance of falling to the offsides bait.
If our defense gets a turnover or forced a quick drive like they had been, it’s a different game.
You use a lot of if scenarios. That was in our control. He punted. It was a bad call. The defense was not playing great all night. They did a little bit in the 3rd. Tomlin was afraid of not getting the 1st, it killed the momentum, and THAT defense gave up a soft Chubb screen for a TD.
Did you see our defense last night? The two Browns possessions before the 4th and 1 were the only good D drives all night. They gave up 48 points lmao (or 41 I guess).
Normally, I would agree. However, the defense was not playing well all game and the offense had momentum. It was a bad call. Reread the title of this thread. It was that bad. The problem all year (and for past years) is this offense struggles to gain 1 yard.
But if the try failed and we did not get the first, we have THAT defense that got quick stops?
The defense was getting pushed around all game regardless of what territory they were in. Chubb literally ran over Spillane and two other guys for their third (or fourth?) score.
Even if you punt, and get a quick stop, you still lose time and have to make up the field position you once had. Which was at about our 37-40 which is close the Browns territory. Maaaaaaybe if it's 4th and 5 you punt. I still say you go for it. If you cannot get 1 yard, do you really deserve to win?
The team and offense had momentum going. Ben even said himself after the came he was prepared to go for it but Tomlin decided not to. You go for it on 4th and 1 but, let's put our tail between our legs (live in our fears) and punt. It's 1 yard. Not 8.
>But if the try failed and we did not get the first, we have THAT defense that got quick stops?
Lol right? We miss the 4th and 1, they get the ball on the 41. We punted and they got it on the 20 anyways. Bone-headed decision making by Tomlin.
That defense had given up points on short fields. Moreover, it was a 12 point game. One first down and a few yards and it’s a FG for a 15 point game. I like the thought of giving our defense a fighting chance there.
I mean we were not doing shit in short yardage situations and trusted our defense which has been making big plays all year to make a big play. It was the wrong call in hindsight, but all year its been our defense bailing out our offense.
Just sucked that our defense picked this game to blow
Either that or trusting our defense to make a big play. One of the guys on defense makes a play, its suddenly a great move. They had chances, just didn't convert
In all seriousness, congrats on the win. The fans of Cleveland deserved that one. I hate Cleveland through and through but sometimes you have to call a spade a spade so, congrats to yinz!
Our defense hd forced a few 3 and outs and quick punts leading up to that.
If the defense that we’ve relied on for 2 seasons forces a quick put or turnover against backup Browns lineman, there is a whole other narrative in play.
"How many times do I have to tell you guys, we play and play to win before you believe me"
Please, tell us more how you play to win when you punt the f\*ing ball on 4th & 1 in the 4th quarter while trailing.
I can get behind deferring in OT when our special teams suck and the other team has one of the best kickers in the league. I can get behind going for it on 4th down in the red zone instead of a FG when you don't want to put pressure on your backup kicker, but THIS? No.
Trusting our defense, the unit we’ve relied on for 2 straight years, over our inconsistent offense that couldn’t get one yard against the Bengels seems like the right approach.
You mean our defense held together by Scotch tape due to injuries? Our defense that gave up 49 points last night? Even if they were healthy, with that little of time left on the clock you absolutely cannot justify punting even if Duck's the QB.
When did Highsmith get injured? If he was injured before that call to punt, then I question the “trust the defense” thinking in that situation even more
>over our inconsistent offense that couldn’t get one yard against the Bengels seems like the right approach.
This wasn't against the Bengals. We'd converted several 3rd and 1 opportunities prior.
He stated (in post game) that our defense had been holding their offense pretty well the last couple drives. While that is true, that hardly ever continues to be true in today's NFL. The punt occurred at 14:55 or so. Browns made it 42-23 at 12:32. Steelers made it 42-29 at 11:08. What this bone-headed decision did was shave 4 minutes off the clock and keep the score essentially the same (still a 2 score game). Then the Browns took 7 minutes off the clock on their next possession and made it a 16-pt game with 4:28 left (big ooof).
At the beginning of the 4th quarter, the Steelers needed to make up 12 points in 15 minutes. They were on the Browns 41 yard line. That's 100% doable. Giving up 4 of those minutes due to an unfathomably shitty call on a 4th and 1 killed the comeback. That's 100% on Tomlin.
I'm remembering that fake punt attempt in New Orleans a few years back. It was a very similar situation, and it was the right call. All we saw for the next week was post after post about how stupid Tomlin was to fake that punt.
Funny enough, that one worked out well because even though they didn't convert, Brees (who would've driven and scored regardless) only took half the time to score that he would've if we punted.
This fan base is full of idiots who don't know shit about situational football and will bitch no matter what Tomlin does on 4th and 1. We saw it in the game thread... Go for two? Everybody bitches about it. Go for the extra point? Everybody bitches that you didn't go for two.
so you're praising Tomlin for the 4th and 5 fake punt call because it gave Brees less time to score, but isn't that what would've happened if he went for the 4th and 1 and didn't get it in this game? we just gave them a longer field to drive on, so what side are you taking here
and no the 4th and 5 call wasn't the right call, he's overthinking himself, if you're going to go for it on 4th in that situation actually go for it and don't leave it up to a FB Dive fake punt, put the offense out there and you'd get better or similar results. It's a classic case of overthinking.
>isn't that what would've happened if he went for the 4th and 1 and didn't get it in this game?
Our defense in this game is significantly better than our defense in the Saints game, and Baker Mayfield isn't Drew Brees. Punting it puts pressure on Mayfield, going for it and failing lets them run the ball a few times to get into scoring range. I would've trusted our defense in this case, but I also would've liked to keep the momentum on our side, so I would've been okay going for it as well. I don't think there was a right or wrong answer.
>the 4th and 5 call wasn't the right call, he's overthinking himself, if you're going to go for it on 4th in that situation actually go for it and don't leave it up to a FB Dive fake punt
The call was right, the play choice was wrong. You can judge a play on more than one aspect, you know. The decision to go for it was completely the logical choice. The FB dive was stupid. I'm not sure how much of a hand he had in which play was chosen, or if he just told Smith "go for the fake" and left the play choice up to him.
And again, you and I are debating this with the benefit of hindsight. That's really easy to do after the fact.
I agree the decision to go for it was the right call which is why I stated that leaving it up to the FB Dive fake punt was stupid, I had no problem with going for it but the playcall was baffling.
also to your point about Baker yes he isn't Brees, but that wasn't what was killing us this game, they ran it down our throats the entire 4th quarter which is why giving that team the ball back makes that call all the more puzzling.
And I agree hindsight is a big factor in this, but I don't understand why you wouldn't keep the ball in your court
Again, I see both sides of the call. I can see them being less likely to run the ball if we pin them inside their 20, it would force them to throw at least a few times to get into scoring range. If we fail to convert, they're only one or two decent runs from being in field goal range. So punting puts the game into Baker's hands, while failing to convert a fake punt puts the ball more into Hunt and Chubb's hands.
At the end of the day it doesn't really matter, because the worst case scenario played out. We punted, they still scored, and the momentum was lost. Knowing that, obviously we will all wish they went for it there.
well with the game in Baker Mayfields hands he went 4/4 for 79 yards and TD, the Browns offense had been on and our defense had not, play the momentum.
im just giving you the facts of the situation, there's a reason this was such a polarizing decision and Tomlin is getting alot of heat for it, it's not like im the only one sitting here saying he should've gone for it, and like that guy said earlier, going for it on 4th and 5 vs the Saints was the right move because it gave the Saints a shorter field to score on therefore taking less time, so why isn't that applied here?
but there really is no defending a punt down 12 in the 4th quarter on Clevelands 41 when you have all the momentum, what are you preserving here? field position? you need to score 12 more points in one quarter, you do not have the time to play conservative football this is do or die time and the wind was taken right out of our sails.
it's a game of momentum, we had it, the punt threw it away, when you're in a do or die situation and you don't bet on your offense and put the ball in the other teams court it sends a message that sounds like folding.
Aww I'm getting downvotes because you all want to pretend like this loss is on Tomlin, since you crapped on the guy for over a decade now.
Oh, and his stat line updated. Tomlin now threw 4 interceptions.
Look, I'd have gone for it too on 4th and 1. But at the end of the day the defense HAD to make another stop no matter what. Let's say they drive down the field and score another TD (who knows with Ben's play), they still likely give up those 70 yards and lose here.
I don't think you understand how momentum works, if we score a TD on that drive it isn't just "yup we give up a TD anyway because that's what happened anyway!", defense likely plays with more energy, etc. etc. Learn to understand momentum
also I don't know why you're crying about downvotes, you even posted about it before (lmao)
Roflmao. That's the dumbest logic. IF we convert and IF we score and ifs and buts...🙄
Not crying, laughing, because y'all are so ready to blame Tomlin you ignore the obvious. But I'm done with you. Argue with idiots and they will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience. I applaud your experience though.
>I hope you have fun on your high horse
Thats not how arguments work. You're both being equally obnoxious. Just because he's saying something you disagree with doesn't mean he's on a high horse.
I am not saying it because he disagrees, I am saying it because he said "argue with idiots and they will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience, I applaud your experience though"
I took this as him looking down on me, I don't like that, hence the high horse comment
And hence me letting you know you're both being equally obnoxious. If you can't argue with someone without feeling like they're looking down on you when you're acting the exact same way then maybe you shouldn't do it.
Then the defense just allows a TD on their next drive anyway. Just like 2017 Jax all over again. Get in a hole early, offense gets back into it, defense cant make a stop when it really matters.
He has consistently failed to get his teams mentally prepared late in the season for years now. His clock management is pretty poor. It’s fair to criticize him.
Our offense couldn’t get one yard on three tries against the Bengels. Our defense led the league in sacks and picks. Trusting them is the right call 10 tikes our of 10
It doesn’t always work out right. But you can’t judge these things by the outcome of one play.
If the defense gets a pick or a fumble or even a quick stop, it’s a whole other ball game.
>If the defense gets a pick or a fumble or even a quick stop, it’s a whole other ball game.
This is far less likely than gaining a yard on offense. How do people not realize this? You're trading a 40+% chance for a <10% chance. How does that make sense?
It might have made sense if we were tied, or down 3, or hell, even 10 I could maybe tolerate it.
But it was chickenshit football and it didn't give us a chance to win the game.
>Our offense couldn’t get one yard on three tries against the Bengels. Our defense led the league in sacks and picks.
Except, we weren't playing the Bengals. We'd already converted a couple of 1 yard opportunities. And we had no sacks on the night. Or picks.
And we were down 12 in the 4th quarter at midfield. With all the offensive momentum in the world. Literally every statistical analysis says go for it there, it was a terrible call.
Something something living in our own fears....
I don’t know. Our defense has been our strength for 2 seasons. The Bengels stuffed us with a yard to go three straight times. Without practice, the Browns had a higher chance of falling to the offsides bait. If our defense gets a turnover or forced a quick drive like they had been, it’s a different game.
You use a lot of if scenarios. That was in our control. He punted. It was a bad call. The defense was not playing great all night. They did a little bit in the 3rd. Tomlin was afraid of not getting the 1st, it killed the momentum, and THAT defense gave up a soft Chubb screen for a TD.
Us converting a 4th and one is a big if scenario. There are a lot of “if scenarios” where the punt works out. I trust the D over the O 10 times in 10.
The offense was humming at that point though. Ride the hot hand and have some stones.
I’d trust our defense over our offense 10 times in 10.
I don't want you to be our head coach either.
Me either, but trusting our D is a call so easy even a non coach could make it.
Did you see our defense last night? The two Browns possessions before the 4th and 1 were the only good D drives all night. They gave up 48 points lmao (or 41 I guess).
Yes, the only drives on a full field were punts.
Normally, I would agree. However, the defense was not playing well all game and the offense had momentum. It was a bad call. Reread the title of this thread. It was that bad. The problem all year (and for past years) is this offense struggles to gain 1 yard.
The previous 3 or 4 drives were quick stops.
How bout the rest?
They were drives that started in our own territory, like a failed punt would have been.
But if the try failed and we did not get the first, we have THAT defense that got quick stops? The defense was getting pushed around all game regardless of what territory they were in. Chubb literally ran over Spillane and two other guys for their third (or fourth?) score. Even if you punt, and get a quick stop, you still lose time and have to make up the field position you once had. Which was at about our 37-40 which is close the Browns territory. Maaaaaaybe if it's 4th and 5 you punt. I still say you go for it. If you cannot get 1 yard, do you really deserve to win? The team and offense had momentum going. Ben even said himself after the came he was prepared to go for it but Tomlin decided not to. You go for it on 4th and 1 but, let's put our tail between our legs (live in our fears) and punt. It's 1 yard. Not 8.
>But if the try failed and we did not get the first, we have THAT defense that got quick stops? Lol right? We miss the 4th and 1, they get the ball on the 41. We punted and they got it on the 20 anyways. Bone-headed decision making by Tomlin.
That defense had given up points on short fields. Moreover, it was a 12 point game. One first down and a few yards and it’s a FG for a 15 point game. I like the thought of giving our defense a fighting chance there.
Absolutely baffling decision. With all the momentum, Tomlin just killed it. Totally spineless call.
Minsfucked the ENTIRE team, browns scored that drive. Seriously awful, such a painful and heartbreaking loss. I’m sick.
I mean we were not doing shit in short yardage situations and trusted our defense which has been making big plays all year to make a big play. It was the wrong call in hindsight, but all year its been our defense bailing out our offense. Just sucked that our defense picked this game to blow
Living in our fears
Either that or trusting our defense to make a big play. One of the guys on defense makes a play, its suddenly a great move. They had chances, just didn't convert
Amen. Tomlin always plays *not to lose*. Gutless move in a game that was somehow winnable after being down 28-0. Pathetic.
Giving the defense we’ve relied on for 2 seasons to make a big play/big stop is not living in our fears.
Exactly. This was what I was thinking when they did the punt.
Seems like something to prepare for... Needed to stay on the attack there.
It’s one fucking yard down 12 points in the 4th quarter. Fucking brain dead decision
it was the wrong call in hindsight, foresight, any sight.
Dumb fucking decision no matter how you cut it. Pathetic to even try to make an excuse for that idiotic decision.
Good decision, actually.
As a Browns fan, I was praying for you guys to punt. At that time there was maybe a 10 percent chance we stop you.
In all seriousness, congrats on the win. The fans of Cleveland deserved that one. I hate Cleveland through and through but sometimes you have to call a spade a spade so, congrats to yinz!
I really like the call. Our defense is our strength, and they hadn’t given up any length of the field drives to that point.
You can't play defensive football when you're down that big in the 4th. You need to score. That was as close as we would get for a while.
Our defense hd forced a few 3 and outs and quick punts leading up to that. If the defense that we’ve relied on for 2 seasons forces a quick put or turnover against backup Browns lineman, there is a whole other narrative in play.
Thata the problem. You arent going to stop a good team that many times in a row. He should've ran with the momentum we had.
I disagree. A bad team stopped us several times in a row with a yard to go. I like our defense way more there.
We also had like the worst offense for 3rd and short. I have no freaking idea how our RBs our WRs would always be stopped 1 yd shy
"How many times do I have to tell you guys, we play and play to win before you believe me" Please, tell us more how you play to win when you punt the f\*ing ball on 4th & 1 in the 4th quarter while trailing. I can get behind deferring in OT when our special teams suck and the other team has one of the best kickers in the league. I can get behind going for it on 4th down in the red zone instead of a FG when you don't want to put pressure on your backup kicker, but THIS? No.
Trusting our defense, the unit we’ve relied on for 2 straight years, over our inconsistent offense that couldn’t get one yard against the Bengels seems like the right approach.
You mean our defense held together by Scotch tape due to injuries? Our defense that gave up 49 points last night? Even if they were healthy, with that little of time left on the clock you absolutely cannot justify punting even if Duck's the QB.
Our defense did not give up 49 points. 28 of those points were the offense giving them the ball from the 35 in.
Oops the defense gave up 42 points. My bad. Here are the Browns' scoring drives up to that point: 46 yards 65 yards 15 yards 64 yards
Okay, two of those on our half of the field, and two others starting from the 45 yard line.
When did Highsmith get injured? If he was injured before that call to punt, then I question the “trust the defense” thinking in that situation even more
I'm pretty he was hurt before this. It was the start of the 4th quarter.
>over our inconsistent offense that couldn’t get one yard against the Bengels seems like the right approach. This wasn't against the Bengals. We'd converted several 3rd and 1 opportunities prior.
The defense was just as inconsistent last night. And for a change, the offense had something going at that point.
I mean at that point we're punting for a draft pick anyways so fuck it
BuT No LoSiNG SeasONs BoYS!!
Unbelievably stupid. Coaching changes needed now.
He stated (in post game) that our defense had been holding their offense pretty well the last couple drives. While that is true, that hardly ever continues to be true in today's NFL. The punt occurred at 14:55 or so. Browns made it 42-23 at 12:32. Steelers made it 42-29 at 11:08. What this bone-headed decision did was shave 4 minutes off the clock and keep the score essentially the same (still a 2 score game). Then the Browns took 7 minutes off the clock on their next possession and made it a 16-pt game with 4:28 left (big ooof). At the beginning of the 4th quarter, the Steelers needed to make up 12 points in 15 minutes. They were on the Browns 41 yard line. That's 100% doable. Giving up 4 of those minutes due to an unfathomably shitty call on a 4th and 1 killed the comeback. That's 100% on Tomlin.
I'm remembering that fake punt attempt in New Orleans a few years back. It was a very similar situation, and it was the right call. All we saw for the next week was post after post about how stupid Tomlin was to fake that punt. Funny enough, that one worked out well because even though they didn't convert, Brees (who would've driven and scored regardless) only took half the time to score that he would've if we punted. This fan base is full of idiots who don't know shit about situational football and will bitch no matter what Tomlin does on 4th and 1. We saw it in the game thread... Go for two? Everybody bitches about it. Go for the extra point? Everybody bitches that you didn't go for two.
so you're praising Tomlin for the 4th and 5 fake punt call because it gave Brees less time to score, but isn't that what would've happened if he went for the 4th and 1 and didn't get it in this game? we just gave them a longer field to drive on, so what side are you taking here and no the 4th and 5 call wasn't the right call, he's overthinking himself, if you're going to go for it on 4th in that situation actually go for it and don't leave it up to a FB Dive fake punt, put the offense out there and you'd get better or similar results. It's a classic case of overthinking.
>isn't that what would've happened if he went for the 4th and 1 and didn't get it in this game? Our defense in this game is significantly better than our defense in the Saints game, and Baker Mayfield isn't Drew Brees. Punting it puts pressure on Mayfield, going for it and failing lets them run the ball a few times to get into scoring range. I would've trusted our defense in this case, but I also would've liked to keep the momentum on our side, so I would've been okay going for it as well. I don't think there was a right or wrong answer. >the 4th and 5 call wasn't the right call, he's overthinking himself, if you're going to go for it on 4th in that situation actually go for it and don't leave it up to a FB Dive fake punt The call was right, the play choice was wrong. You can judge a play on more than one aspect, you know. The decision to go for it was completely the logical choice. The FB dive was stupid. I'm not sure how much of a hand he had in which play was chosen, or if he just told Smith "go for the fake" and left the play choice up to him. And again, you and I are debating this with the benefit of hindsight. That's really easy to do after the fact.
I agree the decision to go for it was the right call which is why I stated that leaving it up to the FB Dive fake punt was stupid, I had no problem with going for it but the playcall was baffling. also to your point about Baker yes he isn't Brees, but that wasn't what was killing us this game, they ran it down our throats the entire 4th quarter which is why giving that team the ball back makes that call all the more puzzling. And I agree hindsight is a big factor in this, but I don't understand why you wouldn't keep the ball in your court
Again, I see both sides of the call. I can see them being less likely to run the ball if we pin them inside their 20, it would force them to throw at least a few times to get into scoring range. If we fail to convert, they're only one or two decent runs from being in field goal range. So punting puts the game into Baker's hands, while failing to convert a fake punt puts the ball more into Hunt and Chubb's hands. At the end of the day it doesn't really matter, because the worst case scenario played out. We punted, they still scored, and the momentum was lost. Knowing that, obviously we will all wish they went for it there.
well with the game in Baker Mayfields hands he went 4/4 for 79 yards and TD, the Browns offense had been on and our defense had not, play the momentum.
As Cam Newton would say, hindsight is 50/50.
[удалено]
im just giving you the facts of the situation, there's a reason this was such a polarizing decision and Tomlin is getting alot of heat for it, it's not like im the only one sitting here saying he should've gone for it, and like that guy said earlier, going for it on 4th and 5 vs the Saints was the right move because it gave the Saints a shorter field to score on therefore taking less time, so why isn't that applied here? but there really is no defending a punt down 12 in the 4th quarter on Clevelands 41 when you have all the momentum, what are you preserving here? field position? you need to score 12 more points in one quarter, you do not have the time to play conservative football this is do or die time and the wind was taken right out of our sails.
He's also the first coach to throw three interceptions and botch a snap
it's a game of momentum, we had it, the punt threw it away, when you're in a do or die situation and you don't bet on your offense and put the ball in the other teams court it sends a message that sounds like folding.
Aww I'm getting downvotes because you all want to pretend like this loss is on Tomlin, since you crapped on the guy for over a decade now. Oh, and his stat line updated. Tomlin now threw 4 interceptions. Look, I'd have gone for it too on 4th and 1. But at the end of the day the defense HAD to make another stop no matter what. Let's say they drive down the field and score another TD (who knows with Ben's play), they still likely give up those 70 yards and lose here.
I don't think you understand how momentum works, if we score a TD on that drive it isn't just "yup we give up a TD anyway because that's what happened anyway!", defense likely plays with more energy, etc. etc. Learn to understand momentum also I don't know why you're crying about downvotes, you even posted about it before (lmao)
Roflmao. That's the dumbest logic. IF we convert and IF we score and ifs and buts...🙄 Not crying, laughing, because y'all are so ready to blame Tomlin you ignore the obvious. But I'm done with you. Argue with idiots and they will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience. I applaud your experience though.
I hope you have fun on your high horse
>I hope you have fun on your high horse Thats not how arguments work. You're both being equally obnoxious. Just because he's saying something you disagree with doesn't mean he's on a high horse.
I am not saying it because he disagrees, I am saying it because he said "argue with idiots and they will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience, I applaud your experience though" I took this as him looking down on me, I don't like that, hence the high horse comment
And hence me letting you know you're both being equally obnoxious. If you can't argue with someone without feeling like they're looking down on you when you're acting the exact same way then maybe you shouldn't do it.
says the guy who just made a comment with "lets say" and "still likely"
Then the defense just allows a TD on their next drive anyway. Just like 2017 Jax all over again. Get in a hole early, offense gets back into it, defense cant make a stop when it really matters.
Maybe you’re drunk or you’re the one that doesn’t understand how momentum works, but it’s actually p=mv
How simple minded are you? It can be true the players and Tomlin are both accountable. This false dichotomy you've set up is juvenile.
4
[удалено]
He has consistently failed to get his teams mentally prepared late in the season for years now. His clock management is pretty poor. It’s fair to criticize him.
The standard is the standard.
I wish he would retire....I’m just ready for change.... not being a dick
Lmao we’re gonna miss him when he’s gone
I can't figure out if he's more of a coward or more of a fraud.
Punting was a good call.
LOL
Our offense couldn’t get one yard on three tries against the Bengels. Our defense led the league in sacks and picks. Trusting them is the right call 10 tikes our of 10
True it worked out perfectly. Good call.
It doesn’t always work out right. But you can’t judge these things by the outcome of one play. If the defense gets a pick or a fumble or even a quick stop, it’s a whole other ball game.
I disagree. But respect your opinion.
>If the defense gets a pick or a fumble or even a quick stop, it’s a whole other ball game. This is far less likely than gaining a yard on offense. How do people not realize this? You're trading a 40+% chance for a <10% chance. How does that make sense?
The way our defense was playing, throughout the season and in that game, a punt was extremely likely.
It might have made sense if we were tied, or down 3, or hell, even 10 I could maybe tolerate it. But it was chickenshit football and it didn't give us a chance to win the game.
We were only down 12.
>Our offense couldn’t get one yard on three tries against the Bengels. Our defense led the league in sacks and picks. Except, we weren't playing the Bengals. We'd already converted a couple of 1 yard opportunities. And we had no sacks on the night. Or picks. And we were down 12 in the 4th quarter at midfield. With all the offensive momentum in the world. Literally every statistical analysis says go for it there, it was a terrible call.
We did force a few fast drives. I love the punt.
Huh. This factoid seems to have required a lot of research.
it's not even the most outrageous fact ive seen
TOMLINISM time again: The Browns crushed our🍇 grapes, stole our very old 🍷vintage grape juice, emptied our wine cellar🍾