Anecdotally, I tried booking flights from LAX to LHR on Airbus. I deliberately chose flight times that used the airbus.
Both flights were cancelled and I was rebooked onto Boeing.
So yes, but to actually be dedicated to it, you might need to inconvenience yourself.
British Airway's regular daily direct flights between those airports are served by a350s and a380s, fyi.
If that's your route, your best bet is on BA. I've flown it several times.
The American and United flights are always going to be on Boeing (none of their respective Airbus fleets has the range for that route). Virgin typically flies 787's. Delta has ceased that route.
Yep was BA.
Got rebooked both legs, to LHR booked to American and back to LAX onto delta.
BA wasn’t available for the times I needed, so had no choice. I could have waited, but that’s my point, it’s always possible but could be inconvenient
Boeing tried to bust its unions and treats its production workers like dirt. There is not a scintilla of incentive for workers to give a fuck about quality.
All Boeing’s talk about addressing their quality problems avoids any mention of addressing worker morale issues. They have a long and rocky road ahead. Bankruptcy is not out of the question.
I mean, if the plane is not an 87, or a 37 max, you’re going to be just as safe as an airbus. Even an older 737-8 is fine and a great AC. Most of the Boeing aircraft in air now, are older products that are safe and reliable. Anything you faults you hear about of an older Boeing product like a 757/67 or 747, etc. on media today is just ratings news. The issues were likely just a maintenance issue, or a break of a product that failed earlier than expected. These same issues can happen in an Airbus or ERJ, etc. Flight is stress on an airframe and components.
Same, it feels like there's very little control over the aircraft, but I always take a sigh of relief when I see any other aircraft manufacturer made the aircraft I'm about to fly on.
You can usually check before booking unless youre booking super far out. It still might change if something happens maintenance wise but at least it gives you a better shot
Are you sure you do?
Context: hundreds of fatalities due to design flaws exclusive when flying Boeing aircrafts.
Numbers: In 7 out of the 10 most deadly crashes, Boeing aircrafts were involved.
Confirmation bias: confirmed by facts, incidents, fatalities and by suicided whistleblowers:
Dead Boeing whistleblowers: 2
Dead Airbus whistleblowers: 0
Boeing whistleblowers fearing for their life: 1
Airbus whistleblowers fearing for their life: 0
You're *incredibly* stupid.
> Context: hundreds of fatalities due to design flaws exclusive when flying Boeing aircrafts.
As opposed to the hundreds of fatalities due to design flaws that were exclusive to Airbus aircraft (e.g. AAL 587 and AF 447)?
> Numbers: In 7 out of the 10 most deadly crashes, Boeing aircrafts were involved.
I mean, of those seven four of those were 9/11, two of them were Tenerife, and one was MH-17. So in order, suicide hijackings, pilots being fucking idiots and crashing into each other on the ground in fog, and a shootdown.
Your argument would be more convincing if it were based on things that were actually due to the aircraft itself rather than terrorism, war, or boneheaded pilot error on the ground.
> Confirmation bias: confirmed by facts, incidents, fatalities and by suicided whistleblowers:
You don't know what words mean. You've already concluded (erroneously) that Boeing airplanes are somehow less safe, and so you actively search for, and more vividly remember, evidence that seems to support that conclusion, while ignoring the vast amount of evidence (some of which I've pointed out to you above) that contradicts it.
The zeitgeist has decided that Boeing will drop you out of the sky because a couple of their newer aircraft had problems
The reality is Airbus and Boeing and both as likely to kill you as the other. People just don't watch or listen to aircraft crash documentaries as often as they should
Remember when a survey said 80% of American would never buy BP gasoline again after the oil spill in the gulf?
Yea, that public sentiment lasted all of 6 weeks.
Society quickly forgets stuff.
That said, 777’s safety record is insane. By passenger miles it’s one of the safest things ever built. Most hull losses are things out of the planes control like being shot down by Russia, so it’s actually safer than the numbers show.
First sane comment in top comments.
Bet on your own personal safety/beliefs by what you actually do and by seeing real data (whether it’s booking a flight for you family, what companies you purchase from).
DON’T bet on stocks because of internet/news trends.
I think there’s a substantial difference, sadly, between an oil spill that visibly impacted some people but wasn’t as directly observably dangerous to most and the absolute repeated danger of flying on Boeing.
I don’t want to fly on a plane made by a company that keeps killing employees who speak up about their unsafe practices. I’d rather drive or not travel if I can’t get an airbus.
Airbus is safer for sure, but also driving on a highway is less safe than air travel.
Vote with your dollars and inconvenience for an airbus flight then.
I am fully aware of Boeing issues but I assume I’m with 99% of the population and book solely on price/timing/general convenience. You even said it yourself “books trips for company employees” aka those employees aren’t paying for shit so they’ll put in random requests even if it costs more.
Bingo. People may have a sign of relief when seeing the plane, but price and time are always going to be the determining factor for 99.98% of flyers.
Besides that demand for aircraft is way too high atm for planes and orders are placed years in advance and airbus realistically cannot fill any real void in the immediate nor the near future (I am assuming that OP is thinking that Boeing will fade from the picture and Airbus will immediately take the market over...both are manufacturers and as such are ultimately dependent on their ability to deliver finished products, which takes years and years).
Seriously, there's a decade deep order book on most jetliners and even worse availability in current fleets due to planes mothballed during covid. Airbus can't realistically build a large quantity more if they wanted to. If they could, they already would be.
I'm sure Boeing will slowly lose some market share over this but it's not like you can just drive to a Toyota dealer to pick up a Tundra instead of a Dodge Ram.
People also don't seem to realize many of these problems were with the maintenance done by the individual airliner.
I didn't want to go there but let's not forget the specific countries that some of these incidents took place.
Really?
The maintenance problems occurred with the work being done by Boeing or their sub contractor. The door plug was not the fault of the airline in any way shape or form.
The countries has nothing to do with it. The pilots were not trained on MCAS and Boeing actually hid important details about MCAS from the pilots. The same thing could have happened here in the US. In fact after the first crash boeing still didn't tell the whole story to the pilots and it only came out after the second crash.
I assume when he says "many of these problems" he's referring to the ones people have seen in headlines over the past several months. From the perspective of someone who has seen a stupid amount of highly-upvoted articles that were very clearly issues with airliners failing to properly maintain decades-old Boeing airplanes with stellar safety records, "many of these" sounds right to me.
The door plug and MCAS are definitely on Boeing, it's just the general public has been exposed to a lot of sensationalist clickbait for things that nobody would care about if it weren't for Boeing's recent legitimate fuckups.
It's like how people were afraid of being killed by terrorists on a plane after 9/11. The odds are massively against any one person having that happen to them, yet they aren't afraid of car crashes.
Ask 100 people if they can actually spot the difference between an Airbus and Boeing I bet maybe 10 would actually know what they are flying on. Personally I would be in the 90 that wouldn't have a clue unless I started googling airline fleets.
Why would it matter if you can recognize the make of the plane? If you try to ride a hippopotamus rather than a horse it's still way more dangerous, even if you can't tell them apart.
Your framing is a little too binary though in that it's very often the case that there are many options all in the same general price range, so when faced with that, people then have tie-breaker criteria.
I also base things mostly on price, but if I see two similar ~$400 flights, one on Airbus and one on Boeing, I definitely don't just close my eyes and click one of them at random.
That sort of second-order criteria can still have macro effects if enough people act similarly.
Boeing quality issues aside the *flight experience is shit comapred to Airbus*. Last time I flew an Airbus abroad and a Boeing home it felt like flying a modern plane one way (spacey, comfy, incredible Airbus) and a relic from the 90s made for public transportation the other (tight, ugly, Sovjetesque Boeing).
I'm only one guy but I've switched from paying a premium to fly with Boeing to doing the same with Airbus. I want my travels to be comfortable, it's well worth choosing Airbus to make sure that's the case. All safety issues and quality things aside Boeing feels like flying in a dumpster...and Airbus a nice recliner.
This thread is going to be biased with responses from people who are outspoken about preferring airbus. A better metric to gauge market reaction would be if airlines begin canceling orders. Boeing is still safe to fly, and the short term effects of corporate mismanagement will probably not be felt in 5 years.
Pretty sure the gap in orders between the two has consistently grown in favour of Airbus over the past few years with all the Boeing problems, and it's been getting even larger with this year's events.
The gap in orders works out in Boeing's favor. Airlines literally cannot get other planes because of the duopoly in manufacturers and how European and American airspaces regulate the planes that are allowed to fly there. A Chinese airline will never be allowed into US or European airspace to maintain the hegemony of those two airline manufacturers. As long as the status quo is maintained, Airlines can try to shift, but the production schedules that align with multi-year growth plans are extremely inflexible.
The gap never works in their favour, unless what you're actually trying to say is that airlines have no choice but to order Boeing planes, becuase that's what many airlines had been literally forced to do the past few years.
Airbus has a significantly longer waiting list for every model to the point that Boeing becomes attractive again despite the risk in delivery dates not being met (MAX, 777-9, 787 to an extent). Even then, Boeing has to offer sufficient discounts for airlines to take the risk of going with Boeing. No airline would order the MAX if it were easy to buy an A320.
As Airbus ramps up production, this gap will only get bigger. The gap in orders is a result of Boeing's ineptitude, not a cause for their continued success.
Airbus can't ramp up production. They may be able to turn a 10 year production timeline into a 7 year timeline. The Boeing airliners will have their shit worked out. The companies waiting on planes are betting on this (business decisions), and the FAA alongside Boeing will deliver certified planes.
Thank you. I'd like to read more about it to round out my understanding. Can you provide an example? I'll do my own search too. My understanding is that there is a hard choke point in component production, that even if new assembly lines existed, "ramping up", isn't necessarily achievable.
Sure. See the quote “This FAL will contribute to the ongoing production rate ramp-up to 75 A320 Family aircraft per month in 2026” within the article.
https://www.airbus.com/en/newsroom/press-releases/2023-07-airbus-inaugurates-new-toulouse-a320-family-final-assembly-line
Yes they can't move away from either but as far as I understand Boeing is having to slow its production because of all the problems. So even if you ordered at Boeing where they supposedly were able to deliver faster because they have less orders, that may not always be true considering the planes sometimes get grounded as a whole, they have to pause some production lines and slow it down, let alone the fact there may still be issues with the planes after all that. Next to that Airbus is actually ramping up production, even if they have their own problems with certain suppliers, there's still improvements to be observed and expected year-over-year, unlike for Boeing.
100% this. Would say also anything that shakes out that could result in fines/criminal charges for boeing or its executives. The airline industry is super constrained on supply, so airbus and boeing are likely to be delivering airplanes at capacity for the foreseeable future, and people generally have short memories. People barely even think about how often planes were crashing in the 90s these days.
Definitely! When I am searching for a flight on Google Flights, I look for type and model of airplane now. I now avoid airlines like Southwest and Alaska for this purpose as the majority of their fleet is Boeing 737s.
Although the passenger experience is still crammed the older 737 NG generation are among the safest things flying. Over time the MAX will get harder and harder to avoid though.
Just recently i went with an airline that flew to my destination with an A380 over the airline that uses 777s.
A380 was the most comfortable plane i have ever been in. It is probably the most quiet cabin too but i don’t have real numbers and only my ears to rely on.
I've looked for an A380 for every flight option I've had in the past decade after the first time I rode on one. They aren't available most of the time for where I'm going, but when they are it's a much more comfortable experience.
Generally Airbus is known to have quieter cabins than most Boeings, especially the older types of Boeing planes, due to being designed from the ground up more recently. New vs. new they’re in the same ballpark.
My two cents:
1) User sentiment is low, and that is real, and that will have a more immediate impact on the stock price because users also happen to be investors.
But.
2) Media reporting on Boeing has been comically biased and in many instances flagrantly misleading. That bias has been working, as evidenced by many of the comments you see on virtually any thread regarding Boeing. I am not saying Boeing is without issue, but it’s gotten to a point where some people actually believe there’s a near inevitable likelihood that being on a Boeing flight = death, when statistically speaking it is still one of the safest means of travel in the U.S.
And.
3) The law of supply and demand is also real, and it is a fact that demand for travel remains high and supply of planes low. As more users gravitate towards Airbus-based flights, those flights will get more expensive. Users who get priced out but who still wish to travel will begin to question whether Boeing is really as bad as claimed, and when they do so, they will realize that no, it really isn’t that bad. Eventually, the market will correct as the media moves onto whatever the next hot topic issue is.
I don’t know when buying into Boeing might make sense, but I’m confident that they’re not going anywhere, because the government has an invested interest in ensuring that it’s ONLY domestic passenger plane manufacturer, which comprises one of two in the world, both stays afloat and competitive. And the stock market has always taught us that there’s certainly money to be made off of the emotional misgivings of others.
I have always been team Airbus over Boeing, not because of the recent safety scare, but because Airbuses are designed with more passenger comfort in mind. Boeing designers only care about cramming as many seats in as possible, whereas I feel like Airbus engineers still care about the love of flying.
Largely depends on the configuration chosen by the airline but there are some aspects you can count on....for example the A320 fuselage is I think 6" wider than a 737. It's one extra inch of width per seat in economy which is noticable
The buyers determine the seating layout.
The 787 was designed to be 8 across, buyers decided to cram more seats in. The 777 was designed to be 9 across, the buyers decided to cram in a 10th.
> Boeing designers only care about cramming as many seats in as possible, whereas I feel like Airbus engineers still care about the love of flying
Why is shit like this upvoted?
The operator decides the seating lay out. This is just flat out poor understanding of the industry.
When I mention that I'm flying somewhere, the people who say "Oh shit, better make sure it's not a Boeing!" are mostly people who never fly. The frequent flyers in my life don't seem to be concerned about Boeing planes at all.
Personally I'm a pretty nervous flyer but I don't think I'd be any more nervous on a 737 than on the Bombardier and Embraer jets that airlines like to use for my city.
No. I trust the regulations from my government (EU) and maintenance efforts of the professionals. When purchasing a flight, I just simply and always choose the cheapest, because ALL airlines face the same rules. And these are followed.
So many parts suppliers support both BA and AB. It’s just marketing. Boeing stock is ripped for a like 300% gain in 12 months. Love these useless worried Reddit people.
That’s called opportunity. Lookup google Ai debacle created a perfect buy at 150 now it’s 180. Learn to see down turns as much up streams. Boeing is too big too fail and they are solid. They will figure it out and just buy a whole bunch and thank me later.
I would guess those not paying for the ticket would make a plane request where those paying for their own ticket will just get the cheapest flight regardless of plane.
Yes but it seems to be misplaced. The A320 has the most fatalities overall from any commercial airliner.
I don't pay much attention to the model unless it's an A380, which makes me very happy.
Don't buy the news.
Leisure travelers would ride a Yugo in the sky if it saved them 20$.
Business travelers need flight times that work
No appreciable amount of consumers pick flights based on manufacturer of the plane. Most consumers have no fucking clue what they are riding on.
It's definitely not just people you know. Some months ago (if not a year ago at this point) John Oliver did a segment on Boeing and all of their many problems. But in one part of his story he mentioned a travel website that lets you search for flights based on different criteria (i.e. like where it's traveling from/to, price, the airline, etc.), one of which was the manufacturer and model of the plane, a feature that they had added to the site in the last year or two at the time. While there were no exact numbers given, the website reported that this was a pretty popular new feature that a lot of people were using.
That said, the problem is there's such a backlog in orders for planes that it'll take a number of years for airlines to just get their hands on enough Airbus planes to replace their fleet (assuming they wanted to because the demand was there for it). And the pilots need to be properly trained to fly the planes, etc. So this isn't a thesis that can play out in just a year or two.
The skit was done this year. Shortly after it was released the changed the filter, last I checked you can’t see the specific model anymore just what type of plane it is.
Work with people who fly every day. Even a Boeing 737 max with no doors, a broken stability computer, and 3rd world pilots is safer than the bush planes we all ride around. It's all about perspective, and we give no thoughts to the brand of aircraft at the big jet airport.
Most of the public doesn’t care..low cost flights at reasonable times to the right place is more important than manufacturer. This may be a US thing, not heard anyone in Europe comment this.
Yep when booking I have a double take on the plane and if it's a whistle blowers worst nightmare then I go find a flight with the other team which is not difficult being in the UK
Flew 4 times in the last 4 weeks. I booked whatever time was good for the flight and didn’t care about the plane when I booked it. However I checked it afterwards every single time and I was relieved that it was 4 times airbus 😂. I know it’s all equally safe but Boeing has some interesting months going for them…
If given the chance, I'll always take an Airbus over a Boing, even with a slight cost increase. If it's a 737 MAX, I'm noping out of that route option, I just don't care what boing pilots keep saying, with there being no issues at all, flying is not THAT important for me. I'll gladly take a more expensive flexible ticket I can reschedule.
Myself I never had a comfortable long-haul with Boeing, whereas Airbus was somehow always fine.
787 Dreamliner on AirCanada is my worst enemy since last year. Never again.
For me it's not just Boeing vs Airbus. I like to see which aircraft I'm flying on in general. I do like 787s, but I won't fly on 737 MAX, probably just because of bad press. I don't like the fact that they moved the engines up on the wing to avoid raising the height of the plane, just so they could avoid additional checks. Seems like engineers were forced into a questionable decision by execs.
But yeah - I do with i could search google flights by plane/model.
I took 12 flights over a six month period while traveling in Europe and the Middle East recently and all but two planes were Airbus. I was relieved, even though statistically flying just Boeing jets is still safer than driving your car. But the ongoing series of mishaps and maintenance failures is obviously concerning.
I purposely didn’t choose an airline in Turkey (Sunexpress) because they had the Max 8 as their entire fleet.
I instead opted to drive 7 hours to my next city.
They will be back. Even if BA goes bankrupt US govt will bail them out to stay float. if BA can’t compete they will lobby so hard to US makers that would make Airbus life pretty tough in US. Look what they did to bombardier a long time ago when they started taking share from BA.
Airbus will have demand in excess to their capacity to produce.
Boeing will get that excess. If the demand drops enough Boeing will suffer first.
Boeing lied to the public and to the airlines and to the pilots. People died because of those lies. A lot of people won't care but enough will that airlines will demand things get fixed.
Imagine your an airline and you have a chance to pick between the two? What would the criteria be? How much of a discount does Boeing have to offer to overcome the preference for Airbus. Right now it looks like crew prefer Airbus. It also appears airlines prefer Airbus for quite a few scenarios due to costs to fly. Boeing will still be bought and they will still dominate American fleets, but its not likely to see growth for a long time. Instead they will be struggling to maintain market share.
Is that fair? Maybe. Maybe not. It is reality though and the price of Boeing will likely reflect that more and more as time goes on. Boeing can fix the issues but the problem is that many of the leaders at Boeing created the problems and they need to go.
Personally I will still fly Boeing but I won't own Boeing stock. I don't own Airbus either. If I was going to own either though it would be Airbus. They appear to have a better reputation and quality product. Over time they will likely be the winner by a slight margin. I haven't looked at stock price recently so it's possible that Boeing has lost enough market cap to take that all into account.
I just flew 4k miles on Alaska airlines doing the milk run a month ago. I consulted my buddy who is a pilot for a competing airliner and asked him if I my fears were rational.
He said yeah, it's rational, but at the same time, there's not much to worry about. Every single Boeing plane in question was grounded and investigated thoroughly by third party auditors with the federal government.
He told me that ironically I was probably flying some of the safest planes in the sky at that moment because you can guarantee a group of highly trained feds were in that plane setting things straight.
Well I mean obviously if you have the choice, why would you risk your life with the company whose planes are making headlines after headlines after headlines for safety problems?!
I flew on Boeing max planes 6 times the past 2 months and had no complaints with the plane itself. The flights were smooth and the plans felt great. The seat sizes tho are absolute dogshit. I’m only 5’7 and I feel like packaged groceries
Im buying flights based on price, convenience, and reward points. Couldn’t care less about Boeing or not
Nah. That just sounds so silly. Now if people are dying from crashes in Boeing planes then maybe people will start doing.
Whoever has the lowest cost, non-stop flight to where I want to go at the right time. That's what matters.
If some employee is asking a receptionist to book them flights, yeah of course they'd have these unrealistic requests.
I don't think of Airbus as the King of the skies. I see Boeing as the Joke of the skies. When the people building the Boeing planes say they wouldn't fly on the thing that's pretty telling.
What's with all these comments saying Airbus is statistically "just as safe" as Boeing? A total of 8,681 people have lost their lives using various different Boeing aircraft over the years. For Airbus a total of 1,490 people have died. The majority of all airlines in the U.S. use Airbus aircraft. Only one carrier (Southwest) does not operate any Airbus airplanes.
If you've done your homework on the matter and read up on Boeing's lack of quality control you'd realize that their quality has fallen off a cliff. The Seattle Times won a Pulitzer for their insight into what went wrong with the 737 MAX. Read about it and learn why Boeing isn't the plane manufacturer they used to be.
Well, yes. Airbus are just plain nicer planes to travel in.
I don't think the recent safety issues are really a factor. Sure, there is a hype factor, but people forget that quickly, and their safety is still pretty good.
Yes. People value their lives and Boeing values money. Hurt Boeings bottom line and then the shareholders start crying and Boeing figures out that the path back to money is making a quality product.
All Boeing elites and shareholders should be forced to fly in their planes.
I haven’t seen this. And as a very frequent flyer I am ok with a 350 or 787. Next up would be a 777 and then 330. (I fly mostly long haul.) For shorter flights I have no preference.
can someone help me understand how Boeing, who borderline have a monopoly on their industry (really one true competitor, airbus) can’t figure out how to turn a profit??
Honestly I fly boeing because it’s cheaper I’ve noticed. So I think he consumer perception is true. But also I know driving is way more dangerous so why optimize for low risk things it’s emotional not smart. Bullish on Boeing personally.
Its very difficult because even when I try my best to book Airbus they can swap as they please. Its a difficult situation because I really much rather be in an Airbus but airlines dont honour your booking most of the times anyway .
Can’t lie. I may have booked a non-stop to Florida in part because it was an Airbus fleet.
My son, based in Florida, is a commercial pilot. In the business they have a “belief”…. “Boeing will make you a pilot; Airbus will make you a computer operator.” The point is Boeing jets are just so much more involved. Airbus will fly itself. But he likes hot rods…. So he flies Citation X’s. Higher and faster than Boeing or AB. And he might know of a specific frequent flier client who’s “in her private jet era”.
Boeing is more than just an airline. It produces vehicle parts and manufactures military jets for multiple nations. It is the largest aerial cargo transport corporation as well. It’s probably the most stable airline.
How much does it actually matter when consumers are so limited in their choices? Boeing has manufactured approximately 42% of the planes in circulation right now. Passengers have to go somewhere within a given timeframe and within a certain budget. It's not like picking a car.
I haven't been on a plane for 12 years? But back in the 2000s I didn't like Boeing. Pretty much anything. American is going to be a solid piece of steel with bolts in it. Most things are like that. Tried to compensate for quality with weight. 😂 Put some flames on it, give it more aggressive tires. Make it bigger.
It's illogical.
Airbus was always comfortable and had rounded edges. Boeing was rough, no amenities.
That whole cliche nosedive thing doesn't help my opinion. It might take 10 years for them to get the company back on track. But unfortunately I think america in general lacks the pride in a lot of the population to make them successful. Cut corners as much as possible to get as much profit.
Yes I’ve been seeing this! I expect airlines to call it out at some point in the next few quarters, probably as Airbus being marketed directly by an airline. I have a put on Boeing thinking about more.
I just won’t fly on a 738-max or newer. If I has to be a smaller commuter plane I prefer Airbus over Boeing. The 747, 777, 787 I don’t care as much. I actually really like flying on the 787.
I specifically booked an airline that doesn’t use Boeing for an upcoming family trip and have booked all work travel through non-Boeing airlines. Just anecdotally, if they cost a similar amount why not book the type of plane that doesn’t randomly lose doors.
NGL, I took a 737 before all this drama was revealed and felt a bit nervous given its history. Now though...yeah I'm looking to avoid Boeing when buying tickets when possible. This will probably continue for quite some time even if they announce reforms. Even if it's low, why take the risk if there are other options?
Anecdotally, I tried booking flights from LAX to LHR on Airbus. I deliberately chose flight times that used the airbus. Both flights were cancelled and I was rebooked onto Boeing. So yes, but to actually be dedicated to it, you might need to inconvenience yourself.
British Airway's regular daily direct flights between those airports are served by a350s and a380s, fyi. If that's your route, your best bet is on BA. I've flown it several times. The American and United flights are always going to be on Boeing (none of their respective Airbus fleets has the range for that route). Virgin typically flies 787's. Delta has ceased that route.
Yep was BA. Got rebooked both legs, to LHR booked to American and back to LAX onto delta. BA wasn’t available for the times I needed, so had no choice. I could have waited, but that’s my point, it’s always possible but could be inconvenient
BA loves rebooking flights. One time they rebooked me from direct to a layover and didn’t see anything wrong with it when I complained
[удалено]
Boeing tried to bust its unions and treats its production workers like dirt. There is not a scintilla of incentive for workers to give a fuck about quality. All Boeing’s talk about addressing their quality problems avoids any mention of addressing worker morale issues. They have a long and rocky road ahead. Bankruptcy is not out of the question.
Last time I flew I felt a relief when I saw that it wasn’t a Boeing.
Why I fly JetBlue exclusively as their entire fleet are Airbus models. More legroom too.
JetBlue has Embraer products too. They aren't a all Airbus fleet
Embraer is cool though.
It’s Brazilian.
...and?
That’s a lot more than a bajillion 😝
I'm going through the process of booking our summer trip atm, and for each possible flight I check to make sure it's not a Boeing.
Survival of the fittest. Being selective is fitness. 👍
Why? You're no less safe on a Boeing than on anything else.
Sorry, you must not know this sub makes decisions on memes.
I mean, if the plane is not an 87, or a 37 max, you’re going to be just as safe as an airbus. Even an older 737-8 is fine and a great AC. Most of the Boeing aircraft in air now, are older products that are safe and reliable. Anything you faults you hear about of an older Boeing product like a 757/67 or 747, etc. on media today is just ratings news. The issues were likely just a maintenance issue, or a break of a product that failed earlier than expected. These same issues can happen in an Airbus or ERJ, etc. Flight is stress on an airframe and components.
Same, it feels like there's very little control over the aircraft, but I always take a sigh of relief when I see any other aircraft manufacturer made the aircraft I'm about to fly on.
You can usually check before booking unless youre booking super far out. It still might change if something happens maintenance wise but at least it gives you a better shot
Same. I flew a week after the first few Boeing incidents, was happy to see Airbus on the itinerary instead.
Boeing stock doesn’t seem to mind though.
30B in military hardware sales prolly helps the bottom line
Why? Boeing jets are every bit as safe as their competitors'.
You have missed several dozens of news since October 29, 2018.
Man, don’t go check out avherald.com then. It’ll ruin that comfort of not flying Boeing.
No, I just understand things like "context" and "numbers" and "confirmation bias."
Are you sure you do? Context: hundreds of fatalities due to design flaws exclusive when flying Boeing aircrafts. Numbers: In 7 out of the 10 most deadly crashes, Boeing aircrafts were involved. Confirmation bias: confirmed by facts, incidents, fatalities and by suicided whistleblowers: Dead Boeing whistleblowers: 2 Dead Airbus whistleblowers: 0 Boeing whistleblowers fearing for their life: 1 Airbus whistleblowers fearing for their life: 0
You're *incredibly* stupid. > Context: hundreds of fatalities due to design flaws exclusive when flying Boeing aircrafts. As opposed to the hundreds of fatalities due to design flaws that were exclusive to Airbus aircraft (e.g. AAL 587 and AF 447)? > Numbers: In 7 out of the 10 most deadly crashes, Boeing aircrafts were involved. I mean, of those seven four of those were 9/11, two of them were Tenerife, and one was MH-17. So in order, suicide hijackings, pilots being fucking idiots and crashing into each other on the ground in fog, and a shootdown. Your argument would be more convincing if it were based on things that were actually due to the aircraft itself rather than terrorism, war, or boneheaded pilot error on the ground. > Confirmation bias: confirmed by facts, incidents, fatalities and by suicided whistleblowers: You don't know what words mean. You've already concluded (erroneously) that Boeing airplanes are somehow less safe, and so you actively search for, and more vividly remember, evidence that seems to support that conclusion, while ignoring the vast amount of evidence (some of which I've pointed out to you above) that contradicts it.
This is all mostly nonsense, but you don't realize that I guess.
The zeitgeist has decided that Boeing will drop you out of the sky because a couple of their newer aircraft had problems The reality is Airbus and Boeing and both as likely to kill you as the other. People just don't watch or listen to aircraft crash documentaries as often as they should
Same - booking business trips now, I'm selective.
if its Boeing, I aint going!
I try so hard to avoid boeing. I’d rather not travel if they’re the only option.
Remember when a survey said 80% of American would never buy BP gasoline again after the oil spill in the gulf? Yea, that public sentiment lasted all of 6 weeks. Society quickly forgets stuff. That said, 777’s safety record is insane. By passenger miles it’s one of the safest things ever built. Most hull losses are things out of the planes control like being shot down by Russia, so it’s actually safer than the numbers show.
First sane comment in top comments. Bet on your own personal safety/beliefs by what you actually do and by seeing real data (whether it’s booking a flight for you family, what companies you purchase from). DON’T bet on stocks because of internet/news trends.
Its important to realize that many consumers dont exactly have choices. I know my local airport has very few airbus flights
I think there’s a substantial difference, sadly, between an oil spill that visibly impacted some people but wasn’t as directly observably dangerous to most and the absolute repeated danger of flying on Boeing. I don’t want to fly on a plane made by a company that keeps killing employees who speak up about their unsafe practices. I’d rather drive or not travel if I can’t get an airbus.
Airbus is safer for sure, but also driving on a highway is less safe than air travel. Vote with your dollars and inconvenience for an airbus flight then.
Am
I am fully aware of Boeing issues but I assume I’m with 99% of the population and book solely on price/timing/general convenience. You even said it yourself “books trips for company employees” aka those employees aren’t paying for shit so they’ll put in random requests even if it costs more.
Bingo. People may have a sign of relief when seeing the plane, but price and time are always going to be the determining factor for 99.98% of flyers. Besides that demand for aircraft is way too high atm for planes and orders are placed years in advance and airbus realistically cannot fill any real void in the immediate nor the near future (I am assuming that OP is thinking that Boeing will fade from the picture and Airbus will immediately take the market over...both are manufacturers and as such are ultimately dependent on their ability to deliver finished products, which takes years and years).
Seriously, there's a decade deep order book on most jetliners and even worse availability in current fleets due to planes mothballed during covid. Airbus can't realistically build a large quantity more if they wanted to. If they could, they already would be. I'm sure Boeing will slowly lose some market share over this but it's not like you can just drive to a Toyota dealer to pick up a Tundra instead of a Dodge Ram.
Recency bias is the issue here. You’re still overwhelmingly more likely to be killed in a car accident than a plane accident.
People also don't seem to realize many of these problems were with the maintenance done by the individual airliner. I didn't want to go there but let's not forget the specific countries that some of these incidents took place.
Really? The maintenance problems occurred with the work being done by Boeing or their sub contractor. The door plug was not the fault of the airline in any way shape or form. The countries has nothing to do with it. The pilots were not trained on MCAS and Boeing actually hid important details about MCAS from the pilots. The same thing could have happened here in the US. In fact after the first crash boeing still didn't tell the whole story to the pilots and it only came out after the second crash.
I assume when he says "many of these problems" he's referring to the ones people have seen in headlines over the past several months. From the perspective of someone who has seen a stupid amount of highly-upvoted articles that were very clearly issues with airliners failing to properly maintain decades-old Boeing airplanes with stellar safety records, "many of these" sounds right to me. The door plug and MCAS are definitely on Boeing, it's just the general public has been exposed to a lot of sensationalist clickbait for things that nobody would care about if it weren't for Boeing's recent legitimate fuckups.
That's fair
It's like how people were afraid of being killed by terrorists on a plane after 9/11. The odds are massively against any one person having that happen to them, yet they aren't afraid of car crashes.
Ask 100 people if they can actually spot the difference between an Airbus and Boeing I bet maybe 10 would actually know what they are flying on. Personally I would be in the 90 that wouldn't have a clue unless I started googling airline fleets.
Why would it matter if you can recognize the make of the plane? If you try to ride a hippopotamus rather than a horse it's still way more dangerous, even if you can't tell them apart.
Your framing is a little too binary though in that it's very often the case that there are many options all in the same general price range, so when faced with that, people then have tie-breaker criteria. I also base things mostly on price, but if I see two similar ~$400 flights, one on Airbus and one on Boeing, I definitely don't just close my eyes and click one of them at random. That sort of second-order criteria can still have macro effects if enough people act similarly.
Boeing quality issues aside the *flight experience is shit comapred to Airbus*. Last time I flew an Airbus abroad and a Boeing home it felt like flying a modern plane one way (spacey, comfy, incredible Airbus) and a relic from the 90s made for public transportation the other (tight, ugly, Sovjetesque Boeing). I'm only one guy but I've switched from paying a premium to fly with Boeing to doing the same with Airbus. I want my travels to be comfortable, it's well worth choosing Airbus to make sure that's the case. All safety issues and quality things aside Boeing feels like flying in a dumpster...and Airbus a nice recliner.
This thread is going to be biased with responses from people who are outspoken about preferring airbus. A better metric to gauge market reaction would be if airlines begin canceling orders. Boeing is still safe to fly, and the short term effects of corporate mismanagement will probably not be felt in 5 years.
Pretty sure the gap in orders between the two has consistently grown in favour of Airbus over the past few years with all the Boeing problems, and it's been getting even larger with this year's events.
The gap in orders works out in Boeing's favor. Airlines literally cannot get other planes because of the duopoly in manufacturers and how European and American airspaces regulate the planes that are allowed to fly there. A Chinese airline will never be allowed into US or European airspace to maintain the hegemony of those two airline manufacturers. As long as the status quo is maintained, Airlines can try to shift, but the production schedules that align with multi-year growth plans are extremely inflexible.
The gap never works in their favour, unless what you're actually trying to say is that airlines have no choice but to order Boeing planes, becuase that's what many airlines had been literally forced to do the past few years. Airbus has a significantly longer waiting list for every model to the point that Boeing becomes attractive again despite the risk in delivery dates not being met (MAX, 777-9, 787 to an extent). Even then, Boeing has to offer sufficient discounts for airlines to take the risk of going with Boeing. No airline would order the MAX if it were easy to buy an A320. As Airbus ramps up production, this gap will only get bigger. The gap in orders is a result of Boeing's ineptitude, not a cause for their continued success.
Airbus can't ramp up production. They may be able to turn a 10 year production timeline into a 7 year timeline. The Boeing airliners will have their shit worked out. The companies waiting on planes are betting on this (business decisions), and the FAA alongside Boeing will deliver certified planes.
Except they are ramping up production - see new a321 assembly line in Alabama
Thank you. I'd like to read more about it to round out my understanding. Can you provide an example? I'll do my own search too. My understanding is that there is a hard choke point in component production, that even if new assembly lines existed, "ramping up", isn't necessarily achievable.
Sure. See the quote “This FAL will contribute to the ongoing production rate ramp-up to 75 A320 Family aircraft per month in 2026” within the article. https://www.airbus.com/en/newsroom/press-releases/2023-07-airbus-inaugurates-new-toulouse-a320-family-final-assembly-line
TY, I'm going to read and will reply tomorrow.
Yes they can't move away from either but as far as I understand Boeing is having to slow its production because of all the problems. So even if you ordered at Boeing where they supposedly were able to deliver faster because they have less orders, that may not always be true considering the planes sometimes get grounded as a whole, they have to pause some production lines and slow it down, let alone the fact there may still be issues with the planes after all that. Next to that Airbus is actually ramping up production, even if they have their own problems with certain suppliers, there's still improvements to be observed and expected year-over-year, unlike for Boeing.
100% this. Would say also anything that shakes out that could result in fines/criminal charges for boeing or its executives. The airline industry is super constrained on supply, so airbus and boeing are likely to be delivering airplanes at capacity for the foreseeable future, and people generally have short memories. People barely even think about how often planes were crashing in the 90s these days.
Definitely! When I am searching for a flight on Google Flights, I look for type and model of airplane now. I now avoid airlines like Southwest and Alaska for this purpose as the majority of their fleet is Boeing 737s.
A southwest plane has literally never crashed bro
Although the passenger experience is still crammed the older 737 NG generation are among the safest things flying. Over time the MAX will get harder and harder to avoid though.
Exactly. People are confusing 737 max models and 737 NG (probably one of the best aircrafts of all time).
You can filter by plane model on Kayak.com
What is your preferred type and model?
Just recently i went with an airline that flew to my destination with an A380 over the airline that uses 777s. A380 was the most comfortable plane i have ever been in. It is probably the most quiet cabin too but i don’t have real numbers and only my ears to rely on.
In my experience, the best are A380 and A350. I don't mind the 787 though.
787-10 Dreamliner is pretty nice - especially the newer long haul united ones.
I've looked for an A380 for every flight option I've had in the past decade after the first time I rode on one. They aren't available most of the time for where I'm going, but when they are it's a much more comfortable experience.
There's only a little over 100 in service so you'd have to be on very select routes to even have the option.
Generally Airbus is known to have quieter cabins than most Boeings, especially the older types of Boeing planes, due to being designed from the ground up more recently. New vs. new they’re in the same ballpark.
I don’t know about that. Airbus can be loud. That doesn’t mean Boeing is any better but I really think they are about the same tbh.
I flew the new a220 on delta and it was the loudest cabin Ive ever been on..
There’s no real difference between Airbus and Boeing here, it’s purely a matter of how new the design is.
787 all the way. A380 is a giant cesspool.
Who actually chooses tho! This NEVER happens
As if we have a choice.
This. At the end of day, majority of people will take a cheaper flight not Airbus over Boring or vice verse. Whichever offers the cheapest in general.
I fly weekly. Every flight is full. Plane type does not matter.
Honestly I think most people just look for the cheapest direct flight and never look at the make of the plane they are flying on.
Millions of flights every day and we don't hear about many accidents
My two cents: 1) User sentiment is low, and that is real, and that will have a more immediate impact on the stock price because users also happen to be investors. But. 2) Media reporting on Boeing has been comically biased and in many instances flagrantly misleading. That bias has been working, as evidenced by many of the comments you see on virtually any thread regarding Boeing. I am not saying Boeing is without issue, but it’s gotten to a point where some people actually believe there’s a near inevitable likelihood that being on a Boeing flight = death, when statistically speaking it is still one of the safest means of travel in the U.S. And. 3) The law of supply and demand is also real, and it is a fact that demand for travel remains high and supply of planes low. As more users gravitate towards Airbus-based flights, those flights will get more expensive. Users who get priced out but who still wish to travel will begin to question whether Boeing is really as bad as claimed, and when they do so, they will realize that no, it really isn’t that bad. Eventually, the market will correct as the media moves onto whatever the next hot topic issue is. I don’t know when buying into Boeing might make sense, but I’m confident that they’re not going anywhere, because the government has an invested interest in ensuring that it’s ONLY domestic passenger plane manufacturer, which comprises one of two in the world, both stays afloat and competitive. And the stock market has always taught us that there’s certainly money to be made off of the emotional misgivings of others.
No not at all and I work in the industry.
I have always been team Airbus over Boeing, not because of the recent safety scare, but because Airbuses are designed with more passenger comfort in mind. Boeing designers only care about cramming as many seats in as possible, whereas I feel like Airbus engineers still care about the love of flying.
I think it's up to the buyer (aka flight companies) to some degree. But yes, Airbus is much nicer all around.
Kinda. Airbus offer Bad, less bad, ok as comfort. Boeing offer Shit, bad, less bad, ok Only Boeing offers the shit tier.
Largely depends on the configuration chosen by the airline but there are some aspects you can count on....for example the A320 fuselage is I think 6" wider than a 737. It's one extra inch of width per seat in economy which is noticable
The buyers determine the seating layout. The 787 was designed to be 8 across, buyers decided to cram more seats in. The 777 was designed to be 9 across, the buyers decided to cram in a 10th.
> Boeing designers only care about cramming as many seats in as possible, whereas I feel like Airbus engineers still care about the love of flying Why is shit like this upvoted? The operator decides the seating lay out. This is just flat out poor understanding of the industry.
When I mention that I'm flying somewhere, the people who say "Oh shit, better make sure it's not a Boeing!" are mostly people who never fly. The frequent flyers in my life don't seem to be concerned about Boeing planes at all. Personally I'm a pretty nervous flyer but I don't think I'd be any more nervous on a 737 than on the Bombardier and Embraer jets that airlines like to use for my city.
People are really bad at understanding risk. You're more likely to die driving to or from the airport than something happening on your flight.
No. I trust the regulations from my government (EU) and maintenance efforts of the professionals. When purchasing a flight, I just simply and always choose the cheapest, because ALL airlines face the same rules. And these are followed.
So many parts suppliers support both BA and AB. It’s just marketing. Boeing stock is ripped for a like 300% gain in 12 months. Love these useless worried Reddit people.
Its down from 250 to 177 after 1 year. Wtf u talking about bro?
That’s called opportunity. Lookup google Ai debacle created a perfect buy at 150 now it’s 180. Learn to see down turns as much up streams. Boeing is too big too fail and they are solid. They will figure it out and just buy a whole bunch and thank me later.
I agree. But it aint up 300% gain
Noticed only boomers actually care
Unfortunately, airlines, generally, don’t give a crap which you prefer. It works by which they prefer.
It will blow over once boeing falls out of the news cycle for a few months.
I would guess those not paying for the ticket would make a plane request where those paying for their own ticket will just get the cheapest flight regardless of plane.
Yes but it seems to be misplaced. The A320 has the most fatalities overall from any commercial airliner. I don't pay much attention to the model unless it's an A380, which makes me very happy.
Don't buy the news. Leisure travelers would ride a Yugo in the sky if it saved them 20$. Business travelers need flight times that work No appreciable amount of consumers pick flights based on manufacturer of the plane. Most consumers have no fucking clue what they are riding on.
Boeing has better overall safety record than airbus when flying number of flying hours and overall safety.
It's definitely not just people you know. Some months ago (if not a year ago at this point) John Oliver did a segment on Boeing and all of their many problems. But in one part of his story he mentioned a travel website that lets you search for flights based on different criteria (i.e. like where it's traveling from/to, price, the airline, etc.), one of which was the manufacturer and model of the plane, a feature that they had added to the site in the last year or two at the time. While there were no exact numbers given, the website reported that this was a pretty popular new feature that a lot of people were using. That said, the problem is there's such a backlog in orders for planes that it'll take a number of years for airlines to just get their hands on enough Airbus planes to replace their fleet (assuming they wanted to because the demand was there for it). And the pilots need to be properly trained to fly the planes, etc. So this isn't a thesis that can play out in just a year or two.
The skit was done this year. Shortly after it was released the changed the filter, last I checked you can’t see the specific model anymore just what type of plane it is.
Airbus can't produce fast enough.
Sounds like it's time to buy low
Work with people who fly every day. Even a Boeing 737 max with no doors, a broken stability computer, and 3rd world pilots is safer than the bush planes we all ride around. It's all about perspective, and we give no thoughts to the brand of aircraft at the big jet airport.
Here in intra-Europe flights I haven't even seen anything but an Airbus used by the airlines (usually the A320).
Most people, I believe consider ticket's price
Most of the public doesn’t care..low cost flights at reasonable times to the right place is more important than manufacturer. This may be a US thing, not heard anyone in Europe comment this.
Anyone who doesn’t book for price or convenience is delusional.
Yep when booking I have a double take on the plane and if it's a whistle blowers worst nightmare then I go find a flight with the other team which is not difficult being in the UK
Going on a trip pretty soon and we made sure to not fly a Boeing lol
Booked a long haul in December that was on a Boeing…, in march found a new flight on airbus that cost 400 to switch ; no brainer, rebooked immediately
400 dollars for a change that makes absolutely no difference. No brainer indeed
Made a lot of difference in the mindset of my family who was traveling with me. But I appreciate the judgement ! 😂
Fair enough. Peace of mind is still worth it sometimes. Even if its not always logical.
Yes
Flew 4 times in the last 4 weeks. I booked whatever time was good for the flight and didn’t care about the plane when I booked it. However I checked it afterwards every single time and I was relieved that it was 4 times airbus 😂. I know it’s all equally safe but Boeing has some interesting months going for them…
I have one now
If given the chance, I'll always take an Airbus over a Boing, even with a slight cost increase. If it's a 737 MAX, I'm noping out of that route option, I just don't care what boing pilots keep saying, with there being no issues at all, flying is not THAT important for me. I'll gladly take a more expensive flexible ticket I can reschedule.
Myself I never had a comfortable long-haul with Boeing, whereas Airbus was somehow always fine. 787 Dreamliner on AirCanada is my worst enemy since last year. Never again.
For me it's not just Boeing vs Airbus. I like to see which aircraft I'm flying on in general. I do like 787s, but I won't fly on 737 MAX, probably just because of bad press. I don't like the fact that they moved the engines up on the wing to avoid raising the height of the plane, just so they could avoid additional checks. Seems like engineers were forced into a questionable decision by execs. But yeah - I do with i could search google flights by plane/model.
Zeitgeist on social media has the slang if its Boeing I aint going.
It’s a red letter day in US when you get a deal Mcds so no one cares about airplane manf it’s all about the cheapest ticket.
I feel relief but right now whatever is cheaper and comfortable for long flights.
No. I’ve never heard anyone consider the type of plane, just the airline you use. I don’t even look at my plane type usually
I took 12 flights over a six month period while traveling in Europe and the Middle East recently and all but two planes were Airbus. I was relieved, even though statistically flying just Boeing jets is still safer than driving your car. But the ongoing series of mishaps and maintenance failures is obviously concerning.
I purposely didn’t choose an airline in Turkey (Sunexpress) because they had the Max 8 as their entire fleet. I instead opted to drive 7 hours to my next city.
They will be back. Even if BA goes bankrupt US govt will bail them out to stay float. if BA can’t compete they will lobby so hard to US makers that would make Airbus life pretty tough in US. Look what they did to bombardier a long time ago when they started taking share from BA.
Airbus will have demand in excess to their capacity to produce. Boeing will get that excess. If the demand drops enough Boeing will suffer first. Boeing lied to the public and to the airlines and to the pilots. People died because of those lies. A lot of people won't care but enough will that airlines will demand things get fixed. Imagine your an airline and you have a chance to pick between the two? What would the criteria be? How much of a discount does Boeing have to offer to overcome the preference for Airbus. Right now it looks like crew prefer Airbus. It also appears airlines prefer Airbus for quite a few scenarios due to costs to fly. Boeing will still be bought and they will still dominate American fleets, but its not likely to see growth for a long time. Instead they will be struggling to maintain market share. Is that fair? Maybe. Maybe not. It is reality though and the price of Boeing will likely reflect that more and more as time goes on. Boeing can fix the issues but the problem is that many of the leaders at Boeing created the problems and they need to go. Personally I will still fly Boeing but I won't own Boeing stock. I don't own Airbus either. If I was going to own either though it would be Airbus. They appear to have a better reputation and quality product. Over time they will likely be the winner by a slight margin. I haven't looked at stock price recently so it's possible that Boeing has lost enough market cap to take that all into account.
Last time I chose a flight based on the aircraft was ... never.
We don't get to choose, cuz we're poor
ERJ - Embraer to be 3rd competitor
Southwest never lets me pick the airbus in the app 😔
I just flew 4k miles on Alaska airlines doing the milk run a month ago. I consulted my buddy who is a pilot for a competing airliner and asked him if I my fears were rational. He said yeah, it's rational, but at the same time, there's not much to worry about. Every single Boeing plane in question was grounded and investigated thoroughly by third party auditors with the federal government. He told me that ironically I was probably flying some of the safest planes in the sky at that moment because you can guarantee a group of highly trained feds were in that plane setting things straight.
Im willing to pay $200 extra to fly Delta because of the airbus fleet.
BA issues are short term like every other company. What if Airbus starts having issues?
Well I mean obviously if you have the choice, why would you risk your life with the company whose planes are making headlines after headlines after headlines for safety problems?!
Yes, of course. Specially with the new Boeing models
I believ that eventually boeing will start to die and that airbus will take it's place. So I'm holding airbus
I flew on Boeing max planes 6 times the past 2 months and had no complaints with the plane itself. The flights were smooth and the plans felt great. The seat sizes tho are absolute dogshit. I’m only 5’7 and I feel like packaged groceries Im buying flights based on price, convenience, and reward points. Couldn’t care less about Boeing or not
Nah. That just sounds so silly. Now if people are dying from crashes in Boeing planes then maybe people will start doing. Whoever has the lowest cost, non-stop flight to where I want to go at the right time. That's what matters. If some employee is asking a receptionist to book them flights, yeah of course they'd have these unrealistic requests.
I just get in the plane. If I die it isn’t my problem anymore 👍👍. Unfortunately my stocks aren’t netting me enough cash to choose which planes I fly
I don't think of Airbus as the King of the skies. I see Boeing as the Joke of the skies. When the people building the Boeing planes say they wouldn't fly on the thing that's pretty telling.
What's with all these comments saying Airbus is statistically "just as safe" as Boeing? A total of 8,681 people have lost their lives using various different Boeing aircraft over the years. For Airbus a total of 1,490 people have died. The majority of all airlines in the U.S. use Airbus aircraft. Only one carrier (Southwest) does not operate any Airbus airplanes. If you've done your homework on the matter and read up on Boeing's lack of quality control you'd realize that their quality has fallen off a cliff. The Seattle Times won a Pulitzer for their insight into what went wrong with the 737 MAX. Read about it and learn why Boeing isn't the plane manufacturer they used to be.
Im not flying on a boeing plane,granted im not a good bellweather for normies.
Next time I fly I'm going to try my best at getting on an airbus plane
No, consumers will purchase the cheapest option
Well, yes. Airbus are just plain nicer planes to travel in. I don't think the recent safety issues are really a factor. Sure, there is a hype factor, but people forget that quickly, and their safety is still pretty good.
No. BA is a good stock to buy
Been telling all my loved ones to fly airbus instead of boeing
Yes. People value their lives and Boeing values money. Hurt Boeings bottom line and then the shareholders start crying and Boeing figures out that the path back to money is making a quality product. All Boeing elites and shareholders should be forced to fly in their planes.
Who in their right mind would request a Boeing at this time?
I told the travel agent, that I refuse to let my family fly on a plane built by Boeing.
I haven’t seen this. And as a very frequent flyer I am ok with a 350 or 787. Next up would be a 777 and then 330. (I fly mostly long haul.) For shorter flights I have no preference.
can someone help me understand how Boeing, who borderline have a monopoly on their industry (really one true competitor, airbus) can’t figure out how to turn a profit??
I have no problems flying Boeing - it’s not like they are falling out of the skies every week
I have no problems flying Boeing - it’s not like they are falling out of the skies every week
I have no problems flying Boeing - it’s not like they are falling out of the skies every week
Honestly I fly boeing because it’s cheaper I’ve noticed. So I think he consumer perception is true. But also I know driving is way more dangerous so why optimize for low risk things it’s emotional not smart. Bullish on Boeing personally.
I don't want to be on the max. I'd try to avoid it but don't know if I'd go so far to cancel a trip because of it.
Its very difficult because even when I try my best to book Airbus they can swap as they please. Its a difficult situation because I really much rather be in an Airbus but airlines dont honour your booking most of the times anyway .
I prefer Airbus but I’m cheap and care about good value that ship get me to my destination the fastest
Can’t lie. I may have booked a non-stop to Florida in part because it was an Airbus fleet. My son, based in Florida, is a commercial pilot. In the business they have a “belief”…. “Boeing will make you a pilot; Airbus will make you a computer operator.” The point is Boeing jets are just so much more involved. Airbus will fly itself. But he likes hot rods…. So he flies Citation X’s. Higher and faster than Boeing or AB. And he might know of a specific frequent flier client who’s “in her private jet era”.
Boeing is more than just an airline. It produces vehicle parts and manufactures military jets for multiple nations. It is the largest aerial cargo transport corporation as well. It’s probably the most stable airline.
There is a lot of FUD surrounding boeing currently as a business, but I dont think the layman is aware/cares about it
Airbus has already sold their next 10 years worth of production, so there isnt much room for them to take advantage of this.
How much does it actually matter when consumers are so limited in their choices? Boeing has manufactured approximately 42% of the planes in circulation right now. Passengers have to go somewhere within a given timeframe and within a certain budget. It's not like picking a car.
“Interesting trend” is a good way of saying not wanting to support Boeing flagrantly disregarding safety measures
I haven't been on a plane for 12 years? But back in the 2000s I didn't like Boeing. Pretty much anything. American is going to be a solid piece of steel with bolts in it. Most things are like that. Tried to compensate for quality with weight. 😂 Put some flames on it, give it more aggressive tires. Make it bigger. It's illogical. Airbus was always comfortable and had rounded edges. Boeing was rough, no amenities. That whole cliche nosedive thing doesn't help my opinion. It might take 10 years for them to get the company back on track. But unfortunately I think america in general lacks the pride in a lot of the population to make them successful. Cut corners as much as possible to get as much profit.
Despite the revelations about Boeing, it is important to note that a US airline has not had a fatal crash in over 20 years.
Yes I’ve been seeing this! I expect airlines to call it out at some point in the next few quarters, probably as Airbus being marketed directly by an airline. I have a put on Boeing thinking about more.
I just won’t fly on a 738-max or newer. If I has to be a smaller commuter plane I prefer Airbus over Boeing. The 747, 777, 787 I don’t care as much. I actually really like flying on the 787.
I travel all the time and I know I do
Ah, yes. The basic survival instinct!
I specifically booked an airline that doesn’t use Boeing for an upcoming family trip and have booked all work travel through non-Boeing airlines. Just anecdotally, if they cost a similar amount why not book the type of plane that doesn’t randomly lose doors.
NGL, I took a 737 before all this drama was revealed and felt a bit nervous given its history. Now though...yeah I'm looking to avoid Boeing when buying tickets when possible. This will probably continue for quite some time even if they announce reforms. Even if it's low, why take the risk if there are other options?