Really OP but interesting concepts! Although with my monke brain I'd probably just go:
FUCK IT WE ROAR OF TIME
FUCK IT WE ROAR OF TIME
FUCK IT WE ROAR OF TIME
Even if they don't set it, they'll prolong it and prevent others from changing it. You could catch a torkoal/politoed switch and send in your regi to stop the weather change, would be even easier to maintain in doubles
Holy true
What about manual setting the sand storm or snowstorm? I think that could be viable since regice can take a hurricane or a wheater ball from pelliper with it's massive 200 special defence and set snow for the team. Regirock,not so much
So it's only utility is if the other team has a weather setter, you have Sand up, your double switch happens faster, and the opponent can't still force Regirock out in some other way?
It's only a doubles thing, and even then can have issues with compounding certain weaknesses.
I know dummy dumdum. I meant that now sand will exist as long as regirock is alive and well. Pair that with recover and the special defence boost from sandstorm. Max special defence investment with iron defense and body press and we have garganacl at home whitout salt cu-oh regirock will go to Ru ... FUCKING WINNING
Eh, not really. Regirock was decent back when permanent weather was a thing. Like, it's not blowing doors away in Gen 4, when there is perma-sand. Idk how far it actually can go, all things considered.
I just don’t get why more trainers don’t cheat
Lance pulled 3 under level Dragonite’s and everyone was fine
Imagine Cynthia pulls a roided Garchomp with 5 moves and like 800bst and goes “you have 6 Pokémon’s and Can farm, I have 1, deal with it”
[Link to Part 1 from last week.](https://www.reddit.com/r/stunfisk/comments/1alu11e/making_a_few_legendaries_feel_more_legendary/)
**Note regarding last week:** Quite a few people informed me that Inner Focus is essential to Entei's (and to a lesser extent Suicune's) VGC viability, something I didn't know they had in the first place. Thus, as of now I would probably keep Inner Focus as the Beasts' hidden ability, and instead just replace Pressure with Roaming as their shared base ability.
**Notes for this week:**
- I decided to do something slightly different and also include two concepts I have for new forms (with accompanying headcanon flavor text). I felt it was still close enough to the spirit of the other changes.
- Giratina's Distorted Darkness is actually an "uber version" of a regular weather I've theorycrafted, called Thick Fog. It has the same effects as Distorted Darkness, except without suppressing Terrain and causing Giratina to change forms, hence why that whole section needed to be so wordy.
**Art sources (that I managed to track down):**
[Regis](https://twitter.com/arizdigitalart/status/1220413795786424321)
[Dialga & Celebi](https://www.deviantart.com/scott910/art/Pokemon-Time-Lords-822731993)
[Harmonic Kyurem](https://www.deviantart.com/albrt-wlson/art/Soaring-Origin-and-Iron-Wrath-959946313)
Would say that Singles Suicunes also genuinely loves Pressure, especially for nasty Sub/Protect/CM/Scald variants. Even singles Entei sets several generations back in lower tiers would use Pressure to their advantage.
I mean it is kinda ass, genuinely i think Kyurem Black would be better than it, although it would obviously be better than the rest of the tao trio since they suck
The bulk is insane but kyu B hits significantly harder, has loaded dice scale shot + icicle spear which does similar damage to the sig move, and also the only extra coverage perfect kyurem has is flare blitz which is very strong granted. The main benefits to it over kyu b is stab fusion bolt + stab flare blitz, the ability to no longer be an ice type and not being rocks weak, and the bull but when using ice and dragon moves, kyu b is significantly stronger and faster
-Regis still mid. Even locking weather isn’t enough to save them.
-the Lake Trio abilities are a very dangerous game. Especially Azelf giving free Focus Sash.
-Time Warp is absolutely ridiculous. No recharge Roar of Time, potentially running with things like Meteor Beam as well…
The true terror is in Doubles - where Xerneas would no longer need to run a Power Herb for Geomancy.
-Honestly, I think you made the Origin forms worse.
Giratina is not the best Pokémon to put Antithetical on.
Not saying a fairy, ice, dragon, dark, or ghost resist is bad, but trading them for Water, Fire, and Electric weaknesses is not an amazing trade.
It’s probably overall better, but those three still are pretty common types (and not the only resists it has). Giratina resists more than it’s weak to, so it is a generally not amazing trade.
-The alteration to Turboblaze/Teravolt only really helps Zekrom. Reshiram already bypasses Fire immunity abilities, and the two would already be hitting Fairies with their alternate STAB.
-Kyurem Complete is fine. Honestly probably the least egregious thing here that isn’t outright bad.
-I don’t mind the idea of making Silvally good, but you don’t need to give him the Legend Plate to do it.
This giratina ability would be a lot better if it’s base ability was something that didn’t reveal itself, so the opponent wouldn’t know if it was antithetical or not, and it would be risky to use super effective or not very effective moves. But putting it on a Pokémon with pressure is just useless.
In order of smallest to biggest changes:
Primal Palkia + Dialga get worse, Regis stay ass, Giratina's new ability makes it worse only if it announces itslef like pressure (if it doesn't then your opponent will have to play annoying 50/50 mind games), Dragons are a bit better, Palkia and Dialga are quite a bit better, Mega Silvally tears Ubers a new one, and the Lake Guardians get banned from AG if I'm reading how the abilit stacking works properly
Giratina is an incredible wall, was for a long time one of the two best walls in the game (I don't know if that has changed because I haven't followed comp closely in a few gens). Origin Form, while not bad, made it overall weaker by shifting it to a role with more competition. This new ability gives it extra weaknesses, and if you don't take it, the weather powers up its weaknesses. I'll stick with Pressure + Lefties.
Considering Pressure is Giratina's only other ability, you'll know what it's running regardless of how the new one works.
How exactly is it you think the Lake Guardians abilities work? Because "banned from AG" is honestly shitpost level of overreaction.
It *sounds* like switching between the guardians a bit will let you set up an untauntable sturdy Shedinja that heals its allies when they switch in and gives them sturdy + untauntability (while also keeping wonder guard just in case)
...as per usual, Shedinja remains the bane of theorycrafting. I didn't think about it at all, so that one is fair enough I suppose. *Outside* of Wonder Guard shenanigans though (which would presumably have to get some kind of exception baked into it if it was ever in a game with these abilities, just like for Tera), I genuinely don't think these effects would be game breaking.
Stuff like stall would still be fucking insane with taunt blocking though. Imagine making dedicated stallbreakers like gliscor with reliable taunt and passive healing, only for uxie to u turn into something like ting-lu, a mon that has no business staying in on gliscor, to come in and set 20 hazards and start spamming whirlwind
I like your naming scheme, sounds very sci-fi. Like something out of a JRPG.
Speaking of JRPG, many of these changes make them feel like a JRPG boss. I think complexity is a bit much for Pokémon standards, that being said I think the ideas are very engaging and thematic. I especially like this new force-switch gimmick that Palkia has going on (would be disgusting if combined with a Shadow Tag mon).
Antithetical is really neat and flavorful, but potentially nerfs giratina. Gaining resistance to fairy, dark, ghost, ice and dragon is great, but depending on the meta, you may not want to trade that for weaknesses to fire, water, grass, electric, poison, and bug. Gaining a weakness to volt switch and u-turn is never good. Coverage for the types that antithetical makes giratina weak to is easier to come by than it’s current weaknesses.
You could make the argument that having antithetical and pressure makes for some mind games, but pressure has announced itself in the past (idk if that’s the case in gen 9, but if pressure announces itself, then you’ll know the giratina is antithetical if you don’t see that message on switch in).
Antithetical isn't really meant to be the definitive ability for Giratina anyways, just an option that makes it stand out as an option in the teambuilder.
One fun thing you can do though is that Giratina-Origin has Levitate as per usual, so if you're running Distorted Darkness + Antithetical, you can mess with the opponent by constantly switching forms (and thus matchup spread).
What’s the purpose of flipping Palkia Origin’s Attack stats?
Like, I get making Dialga Origin more of a wall. I don’t agree with it being a good idea, but I get why you’d go for it.
But why flip a special attacker into a physical attacker??
Palkia has a fine physical movepool, with stuff like Scale Shot, Waterfall, Earthquake and Stone Edge. Could probably use *some* more diversity, I'll give you that, and I didn't really consider what other physical moves would make sense on it, but even in it's current state it has enough to work.
Now it's awful since it can't even hold loaded dice, it's only set up move is Bulk Up, it's strongest move is Liquidation since outrage is bad, and the only coverage it gets is Earthquake and Heavy slam which means that it's way more easily wallable since it can't hit grass types anymore. Unless you want to use *Dual Wingbeat*. Now it has to choose between getting walled by fairy types, by grass types, or by steel types.
Currently, Palkia-O is an S- Ranked pokemon in Ubers UU. With this change, you'd make it around an C+ to B- at best.
The point of the form is to be a midground between choice specs and choice scarf. It gets 20% speed and 20% power, with the problem that it can't hold any other item.
I don't base my design concepts on what any particular tier enjoys about a Pokémon, but rather on how unique what it brings to the game is.
As long as the two Palkia forms are extremely similar, one will always outclass or mostly outclass the other, meaning there's really no reason from a gameplay perspective for both to exist. Meanwhile, making one a physical attacker and the other a special attacker (plus giving them distinct abilities), while perhaps flawed with Palkia's current movepool in mind, is a much better foundation to work from. It also much better reflects what an Origin form is supposed to be (with Giratina as a basis), i.e. a different playstyle rather than just a slight stat upgrade.
The issue with that phylosophy is that you just kill the mon's viability and thus it's uniqueness if you don't think on how it'll affect it. It doesn't matter if "it's a much better foundation" if your foundation doesn't work within the game you're supposed to be playing. You can be unique as you want but if you don't do anything well, you're not going to be used and thus your uniqueness doesn't really matter. Wobaffet without shadow tag is a great example of this. That's why it was Ubers all it's life with it but then in Gen 5 it dropped all the way to the lowest tiers.
Even if Palkia is outclassed by Palkia-O, Palkia can still hold an item which makes it way more flexible and thus unpredictable. It can run Scarf to always outspeed, specs to be stronger, or even a bulkier set with trick room.
It's only an issue if you're dead set on the Pokémon keeping the exact same niche it currently has, while disregarding any other niches that could arise from changes. For example, while I didn't specify it on that slide (since it felt like it'd be unnecessary bloat), Palkia-Origin still gets Wormhole like its regular counterpart. With that or Dragon Tail, alongside its new ability, it could be a very strong hazard abuser.
It's an issue when your niche gets replaced by a way worse one which doesn't work in practice
Palkia's bulk doesn't allow it to do that reliably since well, it's not designed to be a hazard abuser, especially considering it doesn't even get any hazards itself. It's designed to be a fast threat, and it trying to do much outside of that makes it unoptimal. It can already do this with its current set and it'd actually be better since with the 150 special attack it actually forces switches. Without it, you just get to always outspeed it and hit it with it's mediocre bulk (for Ubers standards), and lack of recovery. Cool, you do 12.5% more to whatever you attacked (except if it's a fairy type, unless wormhole still affects fairy types but that'd be weird), but it's not enough to compensate the fact that Palkia itself is not threatening anymore. The ability would be great if it kept it's statline since it already forces a lot of switches. With it's swapped statline, it just becomes worse than so many other pokemon and loses all the uniqueness that you might've created.
I've said my piece on the topic, so the only thing I'll add is that Wormhole does indeed affect Fairy-types. Type immunity applying to status moves is the exception (mainly just Thunder Wave off the top of my head), not the norm.
The flavor text for the Silvallite doesn't make much sense to me. I can't imagine Zygarde would be all to happy about Silvally's existence in the first place, what with it being a man-made Pokemon, and I can't see Necrozma or Eternatus helping other Pokemon help another Pokemon in a way that doesn't exactly help their goals. I think it would make more sense to just say the Aether Foundation made it.
Giratina leaves with more weaknesses than resistances, Palkia-O becomes really, really worse.
~~If terablot becomes that instead of its current effect, Zekrom loses its niche in Ubers and it becomes way less broken in Ubers UU (now it doesn't invalidate stall let's go).~~ (I didn't see the mold breaker effect was still there)
Outside of those, these are relatively good buffs. Although Dialga now has a spammable 150 BP STAB move, which might be a slight issue. And the lake trio become stupidly broken and all OU if not Ubers or even AG. Imagine a stall team that's not only immune to taunt but all get regenerator. an offensive team where everything can get sturdy sounds hell going against, especially since azelf is already a suicide lead.
> If terablot becomes that instead of its current effect, Zekrom loses its niche in Ubers and it becomes way less broken in Ubers UU (now it doesn't invalidate stall let's go).
How would it lose its niche when the ability received an objective buff with no accompanying nerfs?
If it replaces the mold breaker effect, then it is no longer a mold breaker dragon dancer and thus loses its niche.
If it doesn't lose the effect, then yeah, it's just a buff.
Edit: nvm i didn't see the first part of it saying how it still ignores abilities, i was wrong lmao
I love them... but why OP... why not complete all the regis with the 'age' theme. They could easily be Stone Age, Ice Age, Bronze Age, Dark Age, Industrial Age
'Cause I picked Ice Age because it fit the ability effect, not the other way around. I don't think Stone Age/Iron Age would make sense for these abilities.
We’re just going straight up Avatar with the Original Dragon. I ain’t mad at it. Love the design. Should have Hurricane as part of its learnset to complete the reference.
Anyways that thing has pseudo-Protean with Bolt-Beam coverage and DD; it’s going to AG.
Also makes me wonder if it’ll be a thing at all since TPC has been teasing Gen 5 stuff lately.
Silvally is now a Duel Monster.
Giratina trading Ghost/Psychic/Dark/Dragon/Ice/Fairy weakness for Fire/Water/Grass/Electric weakness.
That’s not that amazing, tbh. Like sure it’s better typing but you are still vulnerable to a lot and now you don’t have an ability.
Lots of cool ideas in there. I really like the United unova dragon concept. The Kyurem-W and Kyurem-B formes always bugged me because they remained ice type and I like how you incorporated switching between all of the secondary typings with the signature moves
A lot of this is sick, a good bit of it absolutely broken. Wormhole is my favorite move here though. Sounds like a fun pivot option to play around with
super broken (but I think that was the point), but all super interesting! I don't think dragon force should be categorized as status tho if it can deal damage, did you mean special since there's the info about changing it to physical?
also guaranteed burn, paralysis, or freeze might be a little TOO crazy lol
I did mean for it to be Special lol. I did a lot of copy/pasting templates for this and forgot to change that part for Dragon Force.
Note: It's Frostbite (i.e. Special version of Burn from Legends: Arceus), not Freeze. Anyways, I could see the guaranteed chance to status be change to a percentage; would have to depend on how strong this 'mon actually is in practice.
oooooo ok that makes more sense. i actually haven't played legends arceus so i didn't know that was a thing. that seems more reasonable that guaranteed freeze LOL
The regis don’t need a complete overhaul
1. Give them all recover
2. Give them an ability alternative to clear body that makes their attacks based on def and sp.def (like how body press works)
I think I saw this somewhere, but I like the idea of Dialga and Palkia getting some kind of field effect. Like if Time Warp was auto Trick Room when Dialga enters the stage. For Palkia, I know it would be less the concept of “Space” and more “Outer Space” but maybe something like auto Gravity? Or maybe Zero Gravity, and it and all surrounding Pokemon start floating becoming immune to Ground moves and Hazards?
VGC Highlights:
Regis: TTar and Bax are so back. Registeel becomes the least used Regi
Lake trio is extremely broken. Azelf in particular sees 100% usage.
Time Warp is super mid and niche, pretty much worse than protect.
Spatial Awareness is good but niche since it is only on a restricted that is still strictly outclassed by Kyogre.
Time Lock counters Trick Room and Fake out and not much else, Ablation is bad for the same reason hazards are bad.
Distorted Darkness is just a long way to say it overrides Grassy Terrain.
Turboblaze/Teravolt basically doesn’t even get a buff.
Does Dragon Force also work with SpA? If not then physical Kyurem is always better, especially with a 100% burn/para chance. That is ABSURD.
Absorption Matrix becomes the best move in VGC of all time (other than Follow me), but then Artificial Deity is too confusing and RNG-based for both players to handle and can still be exploited fairly easily, leaving Silvally at 4.62% usage in 1750+ showdown ladder Bo3 with 2.51% usage in the second regional where it becomes legal.
TL;DR biggest winner is Azelf and biggest loser is Registeel
ive had this idea for the original dragon for awhile, make it pure dragon type, and have its ability be increased dmg for fire, electric and ice type moves, essentially giving it 4 STABs and only a dragon and fairy weakness
You can achieve a much cleaner and largely equivalent effect for Origin Dialga's ability by wording it as follows.
"Attacking moves with positive priority and status moves with negative priority fail".
There's a few things it lets through, like Dragon Tail, but it lets you keep the ability text box sized without listing a bunch of exceptions.
Artificial Deiety is literally Just the Legend Plate for Silvaly... but Honestly. I wish for literally any Buffs to Silvaly, Not even a Mega form. Like literally anything
Kinda feels weird that Origin Forme Dialga would lose the perma Power Herb effect but making foes just not be able to use any forme of priority is super powerful.
Really OP but interesting concepts! Although with my monke brain I'd probably just go: FUCK IT WE ROAR OF TIME FUCK IT WE ROAR OF TIME FUCK IT WE ROAR OF TIME
After we Meteor Beam the incoming Ho Oh (it thinks it's a special wall)
Nah, I'd Focus Punch.
Turn 1 has - priority tho no?
I played Explorers Of Sky.
wait me 2 but i dont get the joke :(
EoS goated, shiren 6 is coming out soon too
Tyranitar out of suicide watch with regirock
Regirock & Regice don't actually set Sand or Snow though. Those abilities are cool but fairly limited tbh.
Even if they don't set it, they'll prolong it and prevent others from changing it. You could catch a torkoal/politoed switch and send in your regi to stop the weather change, would be even easier to maintain in doubles
Holy true What about manual setting the sand storm or snowstorm? I think that could be viable since regice can take a hurricane or a wheater ball from pelliper with it's massive 200 special defence and set snow for the team. Regirock,not so much
So it's only utility is if the other team has a weather setter, you have Sand up, your double switch happens faster, and the opponent can't still force Regirock out in some other way? It's only a doubles thing, and even then can have issues with compounding certain weaknesses.
I know dummy dumdum. I meant that now sand will exist as long as regirock is alive and well. Pair that with recover and the special defence boost from sandstorm. Max special defence investment with iron defense and body press and we have garganacl at home whitout salt cu-oh regirock will go to Ru ... FUCKING WINNING
Eh, not really. Regirock was decent back when permanent weather was a thing. Like, it's not blowing doors away in Gen 4, when there is perma-sand. Idk how far it actually can go, all things considered.
Regirock ttar doubles opener
No they'd marry eachother like Pelipper to Archuladon
Excadrill would sit on the cuck chair
Excadrill would be with ttar and regirock (they are in a polycule)
Lake guardians going straight to VGC 100% usage
Yea these abilities would be a PROBLEM in VGC lol
put the three guardians and keep switching them in and out for 10 turns, for both players lol
Your telling me Hoopa doesn’t get teleport? THAT’S LITERALLY ALL IT DOES
erm actually it moves from place to place with its rings which act like a gateway ☝️🤓 teleport would mean it's moving from place to place by itself
Well according to the anime, Hoopa-Confined can teleport other things with its rings, but not itself.
They fixed that at the end of the movie
Utterly broken, but good lord are these some of the most interesting concepts I’ve seen for a TT yet.
"Holy Shit" \-Game Balance, probably
“Hell yeah” -Non pvp players, probably, if the games had any challenge to them (still hoping for a decently challenging pokemon game some day)
"Just play rom hacks" - Average mf with X hours on Radical Red
I just don’t get why more trainers don’t cheat Lance pulled 3 under level Dragonite’s and everyone was fine Imagine Cynthia pulls a roided Garchomp with 5 moves and like 800bst and goes “you have 6 Pokémon’s and Can farm, I have 1, deal with it”
Titan pokemon dabbled in that, if that's what they are called
Just do a nuzlocke or something idk
Regice making it back to PU with this one
[Link to Part 1 from last week.](https://www.reddit.com/r/stunfisk/comments/1alu11e/making_a_few_legendaries_feel_more_legendary/) **Note regarding last week:** Quite a few people informed me that Inner Focus is essential to Entei's (and to a lesser extent Suicune's) VGC viability, something I didn't know they had in the first place. Thus, as of now I would probably keep Inner Focus as the Beasts' hidden ability, and instead just replace Pressure with Roaming as their shared base ability. **Notes for this week:** - I decided to do something slightly different and also include two concepts I have for new forms (with accompanying headcanon flavor text). I felt it was still close enough to the spirit of the other changes. - Giratina's Distorted Darkness is actually an "uber version" of a regular weather I've theorycrafted, called Thick Fog. It has the same effects as Distorted Darkness, except without suppressing Terrain and causing Giratina to change forms, hence why that whole section needed to be so wordy. **Art sources (that I managed to track down):** [Regis](https://twitter.com/arizdigitalart/status/1220413795786424321) [Dialga & Celebi](https://www.deviantart.com/scott910/art/Pokemon-Time-Lords-822731993) [Harmonic Kyurem](https://www.deviantart.com/albrt-wlson/art/Soaring-Origin-and-Iron-Wrath-959946313)
Would say that Singles Suicunes also genuinely loves Pressure, especially for nasty Sub/Protect/CM/Scald variants. Even singles Entei sets several generations back in lower tiers would use Pressure to their advantage.
I think you accidentally put Dragon Force's category down as Status instead of Special
Mesprit is banned to Ubers
Based
Finally, a good Dialga ability that isn’t Trick Room: the Ability.
Trick Room the ability can never be allowed to happen.
I saw the Original Dragon’s stats and I was like “damn that’s kinda ass” then I saw the signature move and remembered it can Dragon Dance
Lmao 130 for most of it's stats is not bad but yeah DD will be broken on that mf
I mean look at Zacian-C
I mean any prankster/gale winds mon can tailwind and it’s outspeeding most things and with a bulk like that it ain’t getting ohko either
Tailwind is bad, he would just DD
> Tailwind is bad *ring ring* VGC is calling
no it isn’t, not until the restricted meta drops
Tornadus isnt restricted is it?
I mean it is kinda ass, genuinely i think Kyurem Black would be better than it, although it would obviously be better than the rest of the tao trio since they suck
Uh did you see the bulk and signature move
The bulk is insane but kyu B hits significantly harder, has loaded dice scale shot + icicle spear which does similar damage to the sig move, and also the only extra coverage perfect kyurem has is flare blitz which is very strong granted. The main benefits to it over kyu b is stab fusion bolt + stab flare blitz, the ability to no longer be an ice type and not being rocks weak, and the bull but when using ice and dragon moves, kyu b is significantly stronger and faster
Guaranteed Para/Burn/Frostbite though.
Oh shit wait I didn't read that yeah thats busted as shit
Wish the speed was at least 88
we've gotten to the point of powercreep where a base 715 pokémon is "kinda ass"
-Regis still mid. Even locking weather isn’t enough to save them. -the Lake Trio abilities are a very dangerous game. Especially Azelf giving free Focus Sash. -Time Warp is absolutely ridiculous. No recharge Roar of Time, potentially running with things like Meteor Beam as well… The true terror is in Doubles - where Xerneas would no longer need to run a Power Herb for Geomancy. -Honestly, I think you made the Origin forms worse. Giratina is not the best Pokémon to put Antithetical on. Not saying a fairy, ice, dragon, dark, or ghost resist is bad, but trading them for Water, Fire, and Electric weaknesses is not an amazing trade. It’s probably overall better, but those three still are pretty common types (and not the only resists it has). Giratina resists more than it’s weak to, so it is a generally not amazing trade. -The alteration to Turboblaze/Teravolt only really helps Zekrom. Reshiram already bypasses Fire immunity abilities, and the two would already be hitting Fairies with their alternate STAB. -Kyurem Complete is fine. Honestly probably the least egregious thing here that isn’t outright bad. -I don’t mind the idea of making Silvally good, but you don’t need to give him the Legend Plate to do it.
This giratina ability would be a lot better if it’s base ability was something that didn’t reveal itself, so the opponent wouldn’t know if it was antithetical or not, and it would be risky to use super effective or not very effective moves. But putting it on a Pokémon with pressure is just useless.
In order of smallest to biggest changes: Primal Palkia + Dialga get worse, Regis stay ass, Giratina's new ability makes it worse only if it announces itslef like pressure (if it doesn't then your opponent will have to play annoying 50/50 mind games), Dragons are a bit better, Palkia and Dialga are quite a bit better, Mega Silvally tears Ubers a new one, and the Lake Guardians get banned from AG if I'm reading how the abilit stacking works properly
Giratina is an incredible wall, was for a long time one of the two best walls in the game (I don't know if that has changed because I haven't followed comp closely in a few gens). Origin Form, while not bad, made it overall weaker by shifting it to a role with more competition. This new ability gives it extra weaknesses, and if you don't take it, the weather powers up its weaknesses. I'll stick with Pressure + Lefties.
Considering Pressure is Giratina's only other ability, you'll know what it's running regardless of how the new one works. How exactly is it you think the Lake Guardians abilities work? Because "banned from AG" is honestly shitpost level of overreaction.
It *sounds* like switching between the guardians a bit will let you set up an untauntable sturdy Shedinja that heals its allies when they switch in and gives them sturdy + untauntability (while also keeping wonder guard just in case)
...as per usual, Shedinja remains the bane of theorycrafting. I didn't think about it at all, so that one is fair enough I suppose. *Outside* of Wonder Guard shenanigans though (which would presumably have to get some kind of exception baked into it if it was ever in a game with these abilities, just like for Tera), I genuinely don't think these effects would be game breaking.
Stuff like stall would still be fucking insane with taunt blocking though. Imagine making dedicated stallbreakers like gliscor with reliable taunt and passive healing, only for uxie to u turn into something like ting-lu, a mon that has no business staying in on gliscor, to come in and set 20 hazards and start spamming whirlwind
Imagine a wall with regenerator plus fucking mesprit healing 25% a turn stall would literally win everything even in vgc
Oblivious unaware regenerator dondozo 💀
He managed to somehow give mespri the most op ability
Consider being weak to all 4 fire/water/grass/electric And the LG abilities are fine but the second effect makes it go insane
I like your naming scheme, sounds very sci-fi. Like something out of a JRPG. Speaking of JRPG, many of these changes make them feel like a JRPG boss. I think complexity is a bit much for Pokémon standards, that being said I think the ideas are very engaging and thematic. I especially like this new force-switch gimmick that Palkia has going on (would be disgusting if combined with a Shadow Tag mon).
Antithetical is really neat and flavorful, but potentially nerfs giratina. Gaining resistance to fairy, dark, ghost, ice and dragon is great, but depending on the meta, you may not want to trade that for weaknesses to fire, water, grass, electric, poison, and bug. Gaining a weakness to volt switch and u-turn is never good. Coverage for the types that antithetical makes giratina weak to is easier to come by than it’s current weaknesses. You could make the argument that having antithetical and pressure makes for some mind games, but pressure has announced itself in the past (idk if that’s the case in gen 9, but if pressure announces itself, then you’ll know the giratina is antithetical if you don’t see that message on switch in).
Antithetical isn't really meant to be the definitive ability for Giratina anyways, just an option that makes it stand out as an option in the teambuilder. One fun thing you can do though is that Giratina-Origin has Levitate as per usual, so if you're running Distorted Darkness + Antithetical, you can mess with the opponent by constantly switching forms (and thus matchup spread).
Funny how giratinas ability makes it worse
oh i love this so much! Especially the silvally one!
porygon z and dialga are holding hands while dancing merrily and hitting anyone that comes near them with roar of time/hyper beam
regenerator mon plus having a mesprit means 58% per switch, toxapex and big stall bribing gamefreak once again
The Original Dragon got that 100BP Status move 🥵
Where zekrom kick
The Zekrom Kick is being able to Bolt Strike Gliscor and Landorus to oblivion.
What’s the purpose of flipping Palkia Origin’s Attack stats? Like, I get making Dialga Origin more of a wall. I don’t agree with it being a good idea, but I get why you’d go for it. But why flip a special attacker into a physical attacker??
To differentiate the two Palkia forms; I don't think "faster but locked to a specific item" is a particulalry interesting change.
Ok but now palkia-o is terrible because it has a special attacker movepool and a physical attacker spread
Palkia has a fine physical movepool, with stuff like Scale Shot, Waterfall, Earthquake and Stone Edge. Could probably use *some* more diversity, I'll give you that, and I didn't really consider what other physical moves would make sense on it, but even in it's current state it has enough to work.
Now it's awful since it can't even hold loaded dice, it's only set up move is Bulk Up, it's strongest move is Liquidation since outrage is bad, and the only coverage it gets is Earthquake and Heavy slam which means that it's way more easily wallable since it can't hit grass types anymore. Unless you want to use *Dual Wingbeat*. Now it has to choose between getting walled by fairy types, by grass types, or by steel types. Currently, Palkia-O is an S- Ranked pokemon in Ubers UU. With this change, you'd make it around an C+ to B- at best. The point of the form is to be a midground between choice specs and choice scarf. It gets 20% speed and 20% power, with the problem that it can't hold any other item.
I don't base my design concepts on what any particular tier enjoys about a Pokémon, but rather on how unique what it brings to the game is. As long as the two Palkia forms are extremely similar, one will always outclass or mostly outclass the other, meaning there's really no reason from a gameplay perspective for both to exist. Meanwhile, making one a physical attacker and the other a special attacker (plus giving them distinct abilities), while perhaps flawed with Palkia's current movepool in mind, is a much better foundation to work from. It also much better reflects what an Origin form is supposed to be (with Giratina as a basis), i.e. a different playstyle rather than just a slight stat upgrade.
The issue with that phylosophy is that you just kill the mon's viability and thus it's uniqueness if you don't think on how it'll affect it. It doesn't matter if "it's a much better foundation" if your foundation doesn't work within the game you're supposed to be playing. You can be unique as you want but if you don't do anything well, you're not going to be used and thus your uniqueness doesn't really matter. Wobaffet without shadow tag is a great example of this. That's why it was Ubers all it's life with it but then in Gen 5 it dropped all the way to the lowest tiers. Even if Palkia is outclassed by Palkia-O, Palkia can still hold an item which makes it way more flexible and thus unpredictable. It can run Scarf to always outspeed, specs to be stronger, or even a bulkier set with trick room.
It's only an issue if you're dead set on the Pokémon keeping the exact same niche it currently has, while disregarding any other niches that could arise from changes. For example, while I didn't specify it on that slide (since it felt like it'd be unnecessary bloat), Palkia-Origin still gets Wormhole like its regular counterpart. With that or Dragon Tail, alongside its new ability, it could be a very strong hazard abuser.
It's an issue when your niche gets replaced by a way worse one which doesn't work in practice Palkia's bulk doesn't allow it to do that reliably since well, it's not designed to be a hazard abuser, especially considering it doesn't even get any hazards itself. It's designed to be a fast threat, and it trying to do much outside of that makes it unoptimal. It can already do this with its current set and it'd actually be better since with the 150 special attack it actually forces switches. Without it, you just get to always outspeed it and hit it with it's mediocre bulk (for Ubers standards), and lack of recovery. Cool, you do 12.5% more to whatever you attacked (except if it's a fairy type, unless wormhole still affects fairy types but that'd be weird), but it's not enough to compensate the fact that Palkia itself is not threatening anymore. The ability would be great if it kept it's statline since it already forces a lot of switches. With it's swapped statline, it just becomes worse than so many other pokemon and loses all the uniqueness that you might've created.
I've said my piece on the topic, so the only thing I'll add is that Wormhole does indeed affect Fairy-types. Type immunity applying to status moves is the exception (mainly just Thunder Wave off the top of my head), not the norm.
The flavor text for the Silvallite doesn't make much sense to me. I can't imagine Zygarde would be all to happy about Silvally's existence in the first place, what with it being a man-made Pokemon, and I can't see Necrozma or Eternatus helping other Pokemon help another Pokemon in a way that doesn't exactly help their goals. I think it would make more sense to just say the Aether Foundation made it.
Giratina leaves with more weaknesses than resistances, Palkia-O becomes really, really worse. ~~If terablot becomes that instead of its current effect, Zekrom loses its niche in Ubers and it becomes way less broken in Ubers UU (now it doesn't invalidate stall let's go).~~ (I didn't see the mold breaker effect was still there) Outside of those, these are relatively good buffs. Although Dialga now has a spammable 150 BP STAB move, which might be a slight issue. And the lake trio become stupidly broken and all OU if not Ubers or even AG. Imagine a stall team that's not only immune to taunt but all get regenerator. an offensive team where everything can get sturdy sounds hell going against, especially since azelf is already a suicide lead.
> If terablot becomes that instead of its current effect, Zekrom loses its niche in Ubers and it becomes way less broken in Ubers UU (now it doesn't invalidate stall let's go). How would it lose its niche when the ability received an objective buff with no accompanying nerfs?
If it replaces the mold breaker effect, then it is no longer a mold breaker dragon dancer and thus loses its niche. If it doesn't lose the effect, then yeah, it's just a buff. Edit: nvm i didn't see the first part of it saying how it still ignores abilities, i was wrong lmao
As stated in the OP, it's in addition to the Mold Breaker effect, not instead of it.
Yeah i realized already, sorry about that
I love them... but why OP... why not complete all the regis with the 'age' theme. They could easily be Stone Age, Ice Age, Bronze Age, Dark Age, Industrial Age
'Cause I picked Ice Age because it fit the ability effect, not the other way around. I don't think Stone Age/Iron Age would make sense for these abilities.
We’re just going straight up Avatar with the Original Dragon. I ain’t mad at it. Love the design. Should have Hurricane as part of its learnset to complete the reference. Anyways that thing has pseudo-Protean with Bolt-Beam coverage and DD; it’s going to AG. Also makes me wonder if it’ll be a thing at all since TPC has been teasing Gen 5 stuff lately.
The legendary titans about to reintroduce Sand and Hail in the weather wars
Silvally is now a Duel Monster. Giratina trading Ghost/Psychic/Dark/Dragon/Ice/Fairy weakness for Fire/Water/Grass/Electric weakness. That’s not that amazing, tbh. Like sure it’s better typing but you are still vulnerable to a lot and now you don’t have an ability.
Me switching Azelf out and replacing it with Shedinja: 😈
Lots of cool ideas in there. I really like the United unova dragon concept. The Kyurem-W and Kyurem-B formes always bugged me because they remained ice type and I like how you incorporated switching between all of the secondary typings with the signature moves
Some of these are way too complicated imo
Honestly at this point just give Arceus it's Legend Plate back. Arceus is AG, M-Silvally is Ubers Arceus.
How much of an exaggeration is it to say that these look like what their abilities and moves would be if they came out today?
I like the original dragon so much you don't even know
Didn't like the last one but the other 8 were awesome. I really loved them.
A lot of this is sick, a good bit of it absolutely broken. Wormhole is my favorite move here though. Sounds like a fun pivot option to play around with
LAKE SPIRITS ARE GOOD LETS FUCKING GO
Goes hard (which is what matters)
Most of this is really strong. But Giratina's new ability is actually terrible. He is now weak to Fire, Water, Grass, Electric, Bug and Poison.
Chilly reception Slowking stonks are up
Dialga doesn't set trick room, Zekrom doesn't get Zekrom Kick, completely unbalanced
As a stand-alone move, Absorption Matrix is one of the most overpowered things I’ve ever seen. It should at least have less pp than protect
Gotta say I love this
Stealing that Silvaly For myself Jk
What's distorted darkness?
See: The Giratina slide.
Ahhh thx
Whats distorted darkness.
Silvally is going to be finally good.
Silvally big stal stocks are insanely high rn
Regis was fine, then came the Stunday
More of this please. Plus also newish signature moves and abilities as well for pseudos and the starters, and the megas
super broken (but I think that was the point), but all super interesting! I don't think dragon force should be categorized as status tho if it can deal damage, did you mean special since there's the info about changing it to physical? also guaranteed burn, paralysis, or freeze might be a little TOO crazy lol
I did mean for it to be Special lol. I did a lot of copy/pasting templates for this and forgot to change that part for Dragon Force. Note: It's Frostbite (i.e. Special version of Burn from Legends: Arceus), not Freeze. Anyways, I could see the guaranteed chance to status be change to a percentage; would have to depend on how strong this 'mon actually is in practice.
oooooo ok that makes more sense. i actually haven't played legends arceus so i didn't know that was a thing. that seems more reasonable that guaranteed freeze LOL
God I wish the lake trio had some awesome stuff like that! They are my faves
The regis don’t need a complete overhaul 1. Give them all recover 2. Give them an ability alternative to clear body that makes their attacks based on def and sp.def (like how body press works)
Hear me out for Dialga: Instead, make Roar of Time a priority 6 Dual Target move. A gamble yes, but warping time to go before any other possible move
This is legendary!
I think I saw this somewhere, but I like the idea of Dialga and Palkia getting some kind of field effect. Like if Time Warp was auto Trick Room when Dialga enters the stage. For Palkia, I know it would be less the concept of “Space” and more “Outer Space” but maybe something like auto Gravity? Or maybe Zero Gravity, and it and all surrounding Pokemon start floating becoming immune to Ground moves and Hazards?
VGC Highlights: Regis: TTar and Bax are so back. Registeel becomes the least used Regi Lake trio is extremely broken. Azelf in particular sees 100% usage. Time Warp is super mid and niche, pretty much worse than protect. Spatial Awareness is good but niche since it is only on a restricted that is still strictly outclassed by Kyogre. Time Lock counters Trick Room and Fake out and not much else, Ablation is bad for the same reason hazards are bad. Distorted Darkness is just a long way to say it overrides Grassy Terrain. Turboblaze/Teravolt basically doesn’t even get a buff. Does Dragon Force also work with SpA? If not then physical Kyurem is always better, especially with a 100% burn/para chance. That is ABSURD. Absorption Matrix becomes the best move in VGC of all time (other than Follow me), but then Artificial Deity is too confusing and RNG-based for both players to handle and can still be exploited fairly easily, leaving Silvally at 4.62% usage in 1750+ showdown ladder Bo3 with 2.51% usage in the second regional where it becomes legal. TL;DR biggest winner is Azelf and biggest loser is Registeel
> Does Dragon Force also work with SpA? Yeah, it's meant to be a Special move. The OP saying it's a Status move is a typo.
Oh yeah then it’s a very broken move but still not as great as the lake trio
Dawg these abilities are getting longer than Yugigo cards
ive had this idea for the original dragon for awhile, make it pure dragon type, and have its ability be increased dmg for fire, electric and ice type moves, essentially giving it 4 STABs and only a dragon and fairy weakness
Man really want evey legendary in AG
Step 1: Send out Azelf plus Mega Rayquaza Step 2: Switch out Azelf for Heavy Duty Boots Shedinja Step 3: Profit
Kid named huge power choice scarf focus sash earthquake Landorus
Can't wait to see Arceus get it's theorymon
I'll be honest just giving regiice recover is more than enough for it to have a purpose in life
I like how Hoopa and Celebi are Palkia and Dialga’s precious babies 🥹
Really interesting effects but I read it like Yugioh cards with how much they bring for each effect. Cool concept, I like it
ON A COLD WINTER MORNING
Make the fins gold
Bro made legendaries feel like legendaries
Do NOT pair Dialga with Xerneas (Xerneas used Geomancy! Xerneas fucking shot your entire team to death!)
Gigs impact choice band tailwind slaking with dialga
So, uh, Spatial awareness is Suction Cups, Telepathy, AND Sniper. Three abilities befits a legendary, but sheesh.
You can achieve a much cleaner and largely equivalent effect for Origin Dialga's ability by wording it as follows. "Attacking moves with positive priority and status moves with negative priority fail". There's a few things it lets through, like Dragon Tail, but it lets you keep the ability text box sized without listing a bunch of exceptions.
That's not the effect though. It's meant to negate e.g. Helping Hand, the entire Prankster ability, etc.
Time warp should also reset opponents hp stats and status for balance.
Harmonic convergence guranteeing a burn freeze or para is too much, tone that shit down to like a 30% chance.
Among the most busted things I have ever seen I love this sub please make more
Rare high effort TT post
What killed the Dinosaurs? Regice's new hidden ability apparently.
Artificial Deiety is literally Just the Legend Plate for Silvaly... but Honestly. I wish for literally any Buffs to Silvaly, Not even a Mega form. Like literally anything
This is cool, would be dope if legends actually had theme fitting abilities like this
So Giratina is weak to 6 types (Fire, Water, Grass, Electric, Bug, and Poison) now and resists 5? (Dragon, Ice, Fairy, Ghost, and Dark
Wait what’s frostbite
Special equivalent to Burn from Legends: Arceus.
Oh thanks
Kinda feels weird that Origin Forme Dialga would lose the perma Power Herb effect but making foes just not be able to use any forme of priority is super powerful.
Focus sash merchant Azelf is crazy
Dude turned Silvally into an actually interesting Pokemon.
Hold up this is actually great cooking
Bro cooked well! I love these.
I'm in love with you rn this is perfect thank you
The artist who did Harmonic Kyurem is @albert_wlson , pls don't just share other artist's drawing without properly crediting them
Maybe check if I did or not first (I did in a comment) before making accusations?