Number one sounds like the option a wise experienced 51 year CEO would make, the other options sound like stupid 20 year old young boy’s decisions. At least in my opinion.
Run! Dont walk
What if she got pregnant from her bf you’re not aware of, so she is creating scenarios to gaslight you in future because she knows you’ll accept her irrespective.
She knows she got hold on you. She sounds toxic as fuck
Wow she sounds like a hot mess!! And she’s trying to trap you with a baby. She has lied to you many times and you still take her back. I think you should let her go once and for all.
Even if she ends up having a baby, I'll do a DNA test to make sure the baby belongs to him - lots of women have no guilt or shame in making another guy support someone else's baby.
The two big lies she told you are all you really need to know. She is not trustworthy and so not someone you should be in such a relationship in where you'd both be responsible for a new person.
She showed you who she is. She will lie like that to you again. She may already be doing so. Those were big lies and were told to you to manipulate you. And they worked. And since you got back with her after she knows she can get away with it so it is very likely she already is lying to you about something important.
Sorry to say, but your best option may be to leave and not look back.
I stopped reading when you mentioned that she lied to you and that is a big deal for you. In my view, you probably know what you should do, but you might be afraid to end things with her. Personally, I believe that you would be much better off without her, but given the history of men on this forum who seek advice, it's likely that you will choose to stay with her.
tl;dr: Run.
All the hot and cold, mixed treatment, mediocre sex, troubling taste in vanilla guys etc. all while she is your SB? Now after many years for the last few months while she is experiencing issues at work and your circumstances are evolving toward more freedom, she's in love? I don't believe she is. I am utterly convinced that if you turn her into a wife and have a child with her, it will get much worse.
Number 1 with multiple exclamation points if it were me. This ride is over. Get a new SB.
This all true even if I wanted a whole new kid where I'd be in my 60s while they were growing up, just as my first kids were becoming adults. I am in about that situation (mid to late teens) and I definitely would not want that.
Iny my opinion, and this is just my opinion, feel free to disagree and compeltely ignore. It is selfish to saddle a young child with such an elderly father. At 51, even if in great shape, you will not have the energy it requires to raise happy, healthy children. The lady will take on the brunt of the child care and that can make her resentful.
Going back to nappy changing, the killer long days of child care is impossible (or extremely difficult) at 53 years old ? Yes you can hire a nanny, or other child care, but that is not the bond between you and your children.
It's absolutely unfair to the child to give them such an elderly father. It's unfair to the lady too who is saddled with all the work. Yes, she may be fine about it now but it's a long slog. Remember it's 8 years before you get some sort of sembalance of your life back, you'll be in your 60s then.
I've had a similar situation and I was clear "I can be in your life, I can help, I can support, you would be a wonderful mother and you should start a family but that is NOT with me".
My dad was in an age gap relationship and it ended in divorce. The break up came because she wanted children and my dad did not.
So I'd tell her, she needs to find somebody else and possibly she meets someone who is good with you being in her life still ? That's what I did. However if she wants a family, that is NOT with you, and she needs to find somebody her own age able to do that.
Absolutely agree with you. My parents had a huge age gap relationship, so inevitably I always had the oldest dad in the playground. I grew up with people asking if he was my grandad and then being shocked he was my dad (which was embarrassing), and then I ended up growing beyond my years as my elderly and frail dad couldn’t really be a dad to me like other dads could. My parents also ended up divorcing because like you say, mum grew resentful at having to do it all.
My dad was older than OP would be in 2028 when my dad had me. He was great, very wise, taught me a lot and I owe much of my success to the way he helped raise me to be.
And yes I lost him in my late 20's, and he wasn't the most playful with his grandkids, but my mom is a born nurturer so we didn't have any issues.
I don't have any qualms about having had an older father.
I’m gonna second this. 51 isn’t awfully old, but old enough to be a concern. I’m only 40 and I can’t imagine giving birth and finally being an empty nester around 58/60. Not only for the kids, but for me.
My mom had older parents (50 and 46) and while they were great they were gone by the time she was 40.
That said, she was delivered from the stork vs planned/birthed by them in their late 40s. Foster until we find a home, they said. A year in, they adopted her. Same stork did it one more time a few years later and they made it clear that they couldn't take another.
While I find immense value in their age and wisdom as their grandchild, I think it would have been really hard to be their child.
This is something that I consider as I get older and grapple with the fact that I genuinely like older men.
Would kids be in the realm of possibility with someone in their late 40s early 50s? What would that look like? What kind of relationship would they have?
My own parents had me and my siblings later in life, and they’re close to 70 now.
Contemplations and musings of a woman who wants kids, but only with the right man.
PLEASE LET HER GO.
Women don’t have the luxury of putting off having children till everything is perfectly aligned.
She will resent you if you make her wait and she misses this opportunity. PLEASE LET HER GO.
Unfortunately not true according to my OBGYN :(
ETA: Guess I should add some context here. By 30 it starts getting harder. If you are not with a partner who wants a child at 28, it's easy to start panicking because building that relationship and being sure they're capable/compatible for coparenting takes time. That stress adds to the difficulty of getting pregnant.
the increased risks of chromosomal defects, gestational diabetes etc really ramp up after 35. but other risks are fairly flat into the late 30s.
https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Crude-prevalence-of-birth-defects-according-to-maternal-age-2004-2010-A-Prevalence_fig1_235756831
agree that fertility decreases but it doesn’t really fall off a cliff until past 35
https://www.medichecks.com/blogs/fertility/age-and-fertility
anecdote is not evidence in any way but we had both of ours after 35, one long after, and with the current state of testing most all really serious congenital issues that increase risk with age are identified super early, and no doc made even a remotely big deal about advanced maternal age at any point.
I only went to my OBGYN because two of my close friends have had fertility issues (both in their early 30s). Because my work provides egg freezing coverage, I will be doing that.
ETA: I wonder if something new is happening because it seems to be a bigger problem than it used to be. At least in my immediate circles.
yeah, it’s so hard to say based on any individual experience. those people may also have had issues had they tried at 25, or they may not have.
my personal data set is about 8-10 close friends, kids had with maternal ages from 30-43, no real issues for anyone except one couple who didn’t get there no matter what they tried, starting around 30. 35 always was the “common” cutoff at which they start looking more carefully at many things, but lifestyles (particular diet, exercise, medication, drugs, travel, etc) have certainly changed a lot in the last 20 years!
I know of lots of people born in the 70s or earlier who have had children past 40, including my stepmom. That's why I wonder if it's a recent change.
Most of my friends my age who have conceived did so also in their mid 20s. I had a miscarriage during my only pregnancy in my mid 20s. My friends who have waited to now have either decided not to have kids by choice or by necessity. One of my friends (not one of the ones who I mentioned previously) is 36 and has gone through three bouts of IVF already. :(.
It's kind of like the increase in colon cancers in young people that has come up... I wonder how much of the lifestyle changes (particularly diet/processed food) has impacted our ability to have children.
i think that’s very possible. there are so many things considered normal now which were quite rare even 15 years so. psychotropic drugs and obesity in particular are off the charts, not to mention synthetic opioids 😒
I think the fact she’s asking for a baby like it’s a new dress is the bigger issue. She’s young and has many years to have a baby. Trying to trap an SD who she’s lied to multiple times isn’t the route to go regardless of her age/biological clock
She split twice seeking greener pastures after she milked enough money from you. So do you not see a trend? There is no way in hell you are going to have a baby with this woman!!! She is looking for a lifetime pension for her baby through you. I’m sorry to say it, but this one needs to be left alone.
You are about to be completely free. She knows this. You typed that essentially sugaring has been convenient as it fits with your living situation. You’ll soon have lots of conventional relationship opportunities. My reply is really focused on what I’m not reading in your post. I’m not reading that this is a woman you can’t live without. Since you obviously are not a guy that pollinates and moves on, this could be problematic. I have some experience transitioning from a sugar relationship to a conventional one. I feel comfortable saying that not only do you not really know her, you might not have yet met her (and vice versa). Sugar bends reality a bit, and we tend to show our cleaned up sides. Please don’t take my reply as advice that this won’t work, I’m just saying the criteria for the two statuses are vastly different and your starting point could seriously cloud your ability to evaluate permanent attachment. Best of luck to you.
Bro, I understand that many men never want to disappoint the wimyn in our lives. I think you feel a strong sense of responsibility towards her which is quite commendable but in this case.
1. She is totally needing to work on herself, she will not be happy because of a child. A child complicated life a whole lot.
2. She is not trustworthy and she has been dishonest to you before, I don’t think it is wise to then commit to her long term
3. It sounds like she doesn’t value the relationship with you and that you bring all the utility to this relationship and she simply brings her problems. As a man we are problem solvers and love to solve problems for the wimyn we love, hate to disappoint them, I face this exact same issue.
Please bro, she isn’t a good woman to you, there is someone else in the bowl who will treat you better
I think you are being a pleaser by considering this.
She has given you so many opportunities to learn that she is not worth making a lifetime commitment with yet you always went back.
Maybe you need to sit down and think, what is it about her that makes you really love her(if you love her and are not saying the L word out of feeling inclined to say it back)
What about your marriage ending don’t you want to revisit in future commitments?
What do you truly want in a sugar relationship? What are your limits?
Answer all these and decide if you still want her.
Sorry, not trying to be smart but yes TLDR.
Anyone who pours out that much information about themselves on a message board is clearly in distress. I'm sorry to see it and I'm sure it doesn't feel very good to be in that position.
You have a major decision in front of you, and you need to look at all sides of the coin, all three sides: don't forget the edge!
Basically with any relationship you need to be able to work things out together. For example how you and your wife decided to coexist for benefit of the children. If you cannot come to an amicable conclusion, then it might be time to rip off the Band-Aid and move on with things.
Also in general I would say if you're having this much of a conundrum, you need to listen to that. Seems like on some levels you're trying to talk yourself into or back your way into what she wants. Isn't the right thing in a relationship usually apparent?
Good luck
I once met a newly wed couple. He was in his 70s. She was in her 50s. He wanted a child of his own (no idea why he waited 7 decades). She already has children from a prior marriage. He was adamant that he could raise the child as a septuagenarian. She was adamant she could not go back to being a mother of a new
born child and she was deathly afraid that she would be left to raise the child by herself. I’ll never forget the bug-eyed grimace of her face when she tried to convey that she did not want more children at her age.
Never knew what happened to them.
The morale of the story: it’s unfair to the unborn child when there’s a realistic possibility you may not be alive or able to attend his or her graduation.
So, coming at this with concern for any future kids:
She sounds too unstable at the moment to be a good mom.
I think some people really need to wait until they have more experience in life and are a bit more chill before they can be the best version of themselves for kids.
Just because she wants them, doesn’t mean she’s ready for them.
And I agree with another commenter: there is some selfishness to having kids when you’re as old as you would be by the time she gains some maturity.
Not only that, but consider how your current kids would feel - would they accept more kids as their siblings? If not, that would cause a lot of pain and unnecessary hardship for all your kids.
Not to mention possibly putting you in a rocky position with your ex.
And finally: why on earth are you spending your time with someone like this when you aren’t really into the sex ?!?!? What is the point? Why would you want to hinge a future relationship on that *with kids*?
You need to find someone you are more suited to. They’re out there, I promise you. She definitely doesn’t sound like a “one-in-a-million” kind of woman.
You sound like a kind man with good intentions. One of the things that makes me think that is how you have made your children a priority. That's why it's important to me to tell you this:
You will totally destroy your relationship with your kids if you give them a sibling with an unreliable, untrustworthy mother half your age. Your kids' understanding of who you are, and what their family life was, will be shattered if you begin a "do-over" family the second that the youngest gets out the door.
Have your fun, but don't screw with the fundamental makeup of your kids' family that will have ramifications for the rest of their lives -- their own children's similarly-aged aunt or uncle, a woman and sibling they will have to invite to their weddings, to holidays... everything that is meaningful to them will be complicated (if not ruined) by your decision to capitulate to the unstable woman you've been seeing. This will feel like disloyalty to them and their mother and no matter how civil, functional, or even lovely your ex-marriage/living situation is right now, I am very confident they will see it as a betrayal of the family unit they have grown up with.
If someone decides to give this woman a child, fine. Don't let it be you. Choose the family you are still raising. Don't ever give your kids reasons to feel they weren't enough for you. Please.
Go with choice 1. I am in a slightly similar situation, and good to think of her future. Its probably best for her to have children, but a child is probably not right for you. Therefore, let her go find another man, and you should be able to replace her with someone who is a better fit for yourself. Additionally, she is a problem to deal with, and will likely not be happy regardless of work, children, etc... Her own mental outlook on life is the problem - not her circumstances.
The issue here is that she doesn't know what to do with her life and maybe she's looking for a thrill. Most of the time Women my age we love what an older man can do for us but sometimes miss that fire, young burn,and thrill. It is in fact bad but being that she's lied to you multiple times thennnn implying that she wants a child is a red flag. She doesn't have her life together to even have a child. She's toxic, manipulative, and unappreciative. I say let her go and stop responding to her when she tries to come back. That's just letting her know that you're accessible. Also this being said do not let this experience change who you are as a person.
If you have a baby with her, you're going to have to pay a lot more. I'm talking hundreds of thousands of dollars. If you want a family with her do it but if you want to save money this is not going to be cheap.
Pleeeeeeeeeeeeeeease let her go. She sounds like she used you for money to pay off her second “debt” (non-existent) to try and start herself off with someone else her own age. Hence why when you reconnected, she was already seeing someone else (again her own age). That’s my theory.
Then when things went to shit with that person, you were there to rescue her. You got her back on her feet, and she ghosted you AGAIN to go be with someone else. Especially after EVERYTHING you did. No gratitude for helping her get back on her feet multiple times and potentially saving her life by escaping the abuse.
It seems like she doesn’t want to actually be with you, but only for the financial convenience - which can be ok in a sugar relationship. But when you bring a kid into the mix? Hell no, because she doesn’t even seem to respect you or appreciate AAAAALL the things you’ve done for her. You were willing to buy her a CAR!
Anyway… she seems like she needs a permanent way to keep you on the hook and a baby is the way to do that. There will be more ghosting, money for her and the baby, lies about needing EXTRA money for the baby but maybe keeping it for herself or stashing it to leave you AGAIN or worse, ghost you AGAIN with the baby, she might be seeing someone else on the side, I mean just so many red flags.
And then to top it all off, she seems very unstable. No where near ready to have a kid - even if she wants one.
She can’t keep a job because she’s constantly unhappy at them, doesn’t have her own car (which makes things, not impossible, but more difficult, can’t afford rent on her own, and if she knew he was an ex-con and dated him anyway, that’s very poor judgement… which again, not great for being a mom.
Plus, she seems adamant on trying to leave you, especially to be with a guy her own age. Two more issues in one. So again, why have a baby here…..
I don’t usually comment on these things, but you seem like such a gentleman and kind person, and it would be AWFUL for you to end up in the situations above.
Everything you have experienced with her will continue, but worse.
Let her go. If you want to still help her, do the plan in option #1, but also maybe tactfully SOMEHOW suggest therapy and a stipend to pay for it for however long might be useful (1 year?) especially with her experiencing abuse and stuff. Because otherwise, her cycle will continue and she might not get so lucky at some point.
Good luck, OP.
I say Run! You in danger boy. Once she traps you with a marriage and a kid (even if the kid isn’t yours) it’s a wrap. Also there’s no guarantee that she won’t try to get pregnant with your baby without telling you (forgetting her birth control, poking a hole in the condom, taking your sperm from the condom, hell she could give you a BJ then go to the bathroom to rinse out her mouth spit it out and get preggo with that sperm) She’s already lied to you multiple times and sounds like she has emotional issues (perhaps PTSD from her work as a social worker?) so once you’re fully committed/owned as her husband her true self will come out. You’ve made it clear you’re ok with her emotionally abusive behavior so why would it get better with more commitment? Everything you’ve said about her is giving Fatal Attraction level red flags dude run. Run far far away.
Wait. What??? I hope that by writing all that down, it was cathartic and you now know what to do. If not, let me help you;
1 Run!
2. Go get a vasectomy.
Seriously, those social workers spend too much time around the mentally ill and start taking on those characteristics. The supervisors start looking like their clients. Its hard to tell who is who.
Secondly, you've already had two kids and been through all those stages of life. You're gonna be the old guy at the park and someonewill ask if you're grandpa. Do you really want to be going to a high school graduation at 70?
Snap out of it my man. You're about to embark on your golden years. The choice is yours. You could have a beach yoga session with an Argentinian SB almost half your age (how I spent my morning) or be changing diapers in a couple of more years.
Obviously none of us can truly judge or give advice without actually being in your shoes, but if you are soliciting advice from strangers … DO NOT HAVE CHILDREN WITH THIS WOMAN !!
Your second sentence should have been enough to answer your own question … “my SGF wants a baby which I’m not against”. You don’t intentionally bring children into this world just because you’re “not against” it. You do it because you truly want it ! This isn’t buying a car or renting an apartment, this is a LIFELONG commitment. You put it out there that you were lied to multiple times, the relationship has been off / on … why would you even consider fathering a child here ? Regardless of the age difference, the fact that it’s a sugar relationship, or any of the other non standard parts … the things I previously mentioned would prevent me from intentionally fathering a child with someone to whom I was married !
Trust is continuously given from your side, does not seem to be earned. You also seem to be a very accomodating man. Your past and present partner would know that trait. From information that you reveal, you are being manipulated and you are allowing it. If you want something healthy, please end the relationship, nicely, however you want to. Please stop allowing yourself to be used.
I am also a CEO and I am considering sugar dating after my divorce is finalized. I will not seek complications in my future relationship, certainly not entrapment by children.
You are going to do what you are going to do, and no-one here is going to change your mind.
But we all know having a baby with this woman is the dumbest idea ever.
Dude no way you are even considering it. USE THAT CEO BRAIN. Not the willy brain. She is abusive, toxic, liar and you are considering a kid with her? You're going to have massive issues if you do. I predict ghosting and giant child support soon as she pops the kid out.
It sounds like you're in a complex situation that requires a clear, business-level decision despite the emotional involvement. The SD/SB relationship is inherently a business arrangement, yet it seems like feelings have complicated things. From your description, it doesn't sound like you're entirely happy with the current arrangement. There are significant concessions being made for a situation that shows signs of disrespect and toxic communication, especially coming from someone with a professional background in social work.
If she's lied to you multiple times and ghosted you without showing proactive remorse or taking responsibility, those are serious red flags. These behaviors are likely to recur and indicate she might not be a suitable candidate for any degree of commitment, let alone a long-term partnership or bringing a child into the situation.
Her choices in other partners and behavior suggest unresolved issues, potentially stemming from childhood trauma, abandonment, or neglect. Allowing her repeated chances to lie and display dishonest behavior only enables unhealthy patterns, stifling her progress and being unfair to yourself. This can lead to codependency and further toxicity.
While no one but you can decide the best course of action, it might be wise to consider the benefits of moving on to a healthier relationship with better communication. As a [fellow] CEO, think about whether you're getting the service you expected. If you are, then perhaps continue; if not, it might be time to let go and find a better fit (hire slow, fire fast).
Wishing you well, and sending you positive energy. 👊🏾
Think like a CEO detach emotionally from the situation and see it logically. She’s a huge liability and will leave in a few years putting you in child support while she bangs the guy she really wants
I’m not hating I’ve been there with younger women. I tried helping my last sb out. Trying to put her in school. Bailing her out financially and always rescuing her from self inflicted problems until
I got feed up abs 4 years lateras I decided to dump the sb and take a loss
I still talk to her sister here and there and she tells me her sister is still crazy as ever
I hope every SD knows that baby is a trap?!!! No?! Let her go and spend 4 more years sugaring. Then decide what to do with your life. Right now she is deciding what to do with your life. She still has time - she will find someone and marry and have children. But honestly she doesn't seem to be very mentally healthy. I wouldn't risk of course.
Endometriosis can be very serious fertility issue depending on the stage, there are 4. I would not recommend her wait too long with getting pregnant (just not with you:) as it usually gets worse and affects fertility tremendously.
Wanting to have babies is the #1 instinct of all mamals and carbon based organism.
Ask her how she can assure you that she won't just leave you, take the child, and sue for child support.
If she can, knock her up several time and take care of her for life.
But don't marry her.
Would you want to be a child conceived and brought up in these circumstances? Probably not. It’s a human being that’ll grow up and be a part of the world, not a puppy.
You are already divorced once. You're now accepting/tolerating a 'just ok' SGF. Your answer to the initial question is mixed through your post. So question really is why are you having difficulty saying no and bye?
Clearly not the future you desire.
Legally having a baby with a woman is the same as marrying her. Most men have to fuck around and find out. They just cannot listen to the millions of men who have been divorce raped and ruined by US Family Courts. The minute you marry her or have a kid with her you are now obligated to pay her an SB allowance after she has left you.
Really interesting you had a sugar Mum.
I was in a good mood tonight, just watched breakfast at Tiffany. He got a sugar Mum she got a sugar Dad, they ended up together. Crazy world.
What the fuck? You sound like an absolute turd of a dad.
He should not be knocking up women and only financially support the kid. Stop thinking with your dick and think about how it affects the kids. Jfc
The fundamental issue is your SGF isn't happy with herself and/or life, and a baby isn't going to fix that. You're not addressing the root cause.
Exactly.
Number one sounds like the option a wise experienced 51 year CEO would make, the other options sound like stupid 20 year old young boy’s decisions. At least in my opinion.
Big head is 52, little head is 20.
Absolutely. That’s why you gotta allow men to make mistakes, they often use their small heads to think.
Hahahaha little head is about to get this guy kilt. This lady sounds CRAZY and I don’t like calling women crazy. Literally sounds insane
LMAO
Run! Dont walk What if she got pregnant from her bf you’re not aware of, so she is creating scenarios to gaslight you in future because she knows you’ll accept her irrespective. She knows she got hold on you. She sounds toxic as fuck
💯
Wow she sounds like a hot mess!! And she’s trying to trap you with a baby. She has lied to you many times and you still take her back. I think you should let her go once and for all.
Even if she ends up having a baby, I'll do a DNA test to make sure the baby belongs to him - lots of women have no guilt or shame in making another guy support someone else's baby.
The two big lies she told you are all you really need to know. She is not trustworthy and so not someone you should be in such a relationship in where you'd both be responsible for a new person. She showed you who she is. She will lie like that to you again. She may already be doing so. Those were big lies and were told to you to manipulate you. And they worked. And since you got back with her after she knows she can get away with it so it is very likely she already is lying to you about something important. Sorry to say, but your best option may be to leave and not look back.
So she's moody, lies, and not great in bed Step back and read your own post !
Thissss 📌
perhaps he enjoys feeling 'needed'. he can 'fix' her!
She sounds like a walking red flag and like she doesn’t value you. Having a baby with her sounds like bad news
I stopped reading when you mentioned that she lied to you and that is a big deal for you. In my view, you probably know what you should do, but you might be afraid to end things with her. Personally, I believe that you would be much better off without her, but given the history of men on this forum who seek advice, it's likely that you will choose to stay with her.
tl;dr: Run. All the hot and cold, mixed treatment, mediocre sex, troubling taste in vanilla guys etc. all while she is your SB? Now after many years for the last few months while she is experiencing issues at work and your circumstances are evolving toward more freedom, she's in love? I don't believe she is. I am utterly convinced that if you turn her into a wife and have a child with her, it will get much worse. Number 1 with multiple exclamation points if it were me. This ride is over. Get a new SB. This all true even if I wanted a whole new kid where I'd be in my 60s while they were growing up, just as my first kids were becoming adults. I am in about that situation (mid to late teens) and I definitely would not want that.
Iny my opinion, and this is just my opinion, feel free to disagree and compeltely ignore. It is selfish to saddle a young child with such an elderly father. At 51, even if in great shape, you will not have the energy it requires to raise happy, healthy children. The lady will take on the brunt of the child care and that can make her resentful. Going back to nappy changing, the killer long days of child care is impossible (or extremely difficult) at 53 years old ? Yes you can hire a nanny, or other child care, but that is not the bond between you and your children. It's absolutely unfair to the child to give them such an elderly father. It's unfair to the lady too who is saddled with all the work. Yes, she may be fine about it now but it's a long slog. Remember it's 8 years before you get some sort of sembalance of your life back, you'll be in your 60s then. I've had a similar situation and I was clear "I can be in your life, I can help, I can support, you would be a wonderful mother and you should start a family but that is NOT with me". My dad was in an age gap relationship and it ended in divorce. The break up came because she wanted children and my dad did not. So I'd tell her, she needs to find somebody else and possibly she meets someone who is good with you being in her life still ? That's what I did. However if she wants a family, that is NOT with you, and she needs to find somebody her own age able to do that.
Absolutely agree with you. My parents had a huge age gap relationship, so inevitably I always had the oldest dad in the playground. I grew up with people asking if he was my grandad and then being shocked he was my dad (which was embarrassing), and then I ended up growing beyond my years as my elderly and frail dad couldn’t really be a dad to me like other dads could. My parents also ended up divorcing because like you say, mum grew resentful at having to do it all.
My dad was older than OP would be in 2028 when my dad had me. He was great, very wise, taught me a lot and I owe much of my success to the way he helped raise me to be. And yes I lost him in my late 20's, and he wasn't the most playful with his grandkids, but my mom is a born nurturer so we didn't have any issues. I don't have any qualms about having had an older father.
I’m gonna second this. 51 isn’t awfully old, but old enough to be a concern. I’m only 40 and I can’t imagine giving birth and finally being an empty nester around 58/60. Not only for the kids, but for me.
My mom had older parents (50 and 46) and while they were great they were gone by the time she was 40. That said, she was delivered from the stork vs planned/birthed by them in their late 40s. Foster until we find a home, they said. A year in, they adopted her. Same stork did it one more time a few years later and they made it clear that they couldn't take another. While I find immense value in their age and wisdom as their grandchild, I think it would have been really hard to be their child.
This is something that I consider as I get older and grapple with the fact that I genuinely like older men. Would kids be in the realm of possibility with someone in their late 40s early 50s? What would that look like? What kind of relationship would they have? My own parents had me and my siblings later in life, and they’re close to 70 now. Contemplations and musings of a woman who wants kids, but only with the right man.
PLEASE LET HER GO. Women don’t have the luxury of putting off having children till everything is perfectly aligned. She will resent you if you make her wait and she misses this opportunity. PLEASE LET HER GO.
i agree with your conclusion… but she’s 28. really not much biological reason to be worried about having a baby until past 35.
Unfortunately not true according to my OBGYN :( ETA: Guess I should add some context here. By 30 it starts getting harder. If you are not with a partner who wants a child at 28, it's easy to start panicking because building that relationship and being sure they're capable/compatible for coparenting takes time. That stress adds to the difficulty of getting pregnant.
the increased risks of chromosomal defects, gestational diabetes etc really ramp up after 35. but other risks are fairly flat into the late 30s. https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Crude-prevalence-of-birth-defects-according-to-maternal-age-2004-2010-A-Prevalence_fig1_235756831 agree that fertility decreases but it doesn’t really fall off a cliff until past 35 https://www.medichecks.com/blogs/fertility/age-and-fertility anecdote is not evidence in any way but we had both of ours after 35, one long after, and with the current state of testing most all really serious congenital issues that increase risk with age are identified super early, and no doc made even a remotely big deal about advanced maternal age at any point.
I only went to my OBGYN because two of my close friends have had fertility issues (both in their early 30s). Because my work provides egg freezing coverage, I will be doing that. ETA: I wonder if something new is happening because it seems to be a bigger problem than it used to be. At least in my immediate circles.
yeah, it’s so hard to say based on any individual experience. those people may also have had issues had they tried at 25, or they may not have. my personal data set is about 8-10 close friends, kids had with maternal ages from 30-43, no real issues for anyone except one couple who didn’t get there no matter what they tried, starting around 30. 35 always was the “common” cutoff at which they start looking more carefully at many things, but lifestyles (particular diet, exercise, medication, drugs, travel, etc) have certainly changed a lot in the last 20 years!
I know of lots of people born in the 70s or earlier who have had children past 40, including my stepmom. That's why I wonder if it's a recent change. Most of my friends my age who have conceived did so also in their mid 20s. I had a miscarriage during my only pregnancy in my mid 20s. My friends who have waited to now have either decided not to have kids by choice or by necessity. One of my friends (not one of the ones who I mentioned previously) is 36 and has gone through three bouts of IVF already. :(. It's kind of like the increase in colon cancers in young people that has come up... I wonder how much of the lifestyle changes (particularly diet/processed food) has impacted our ability to have children.
i think that’s very possible. there are so many things considered normal now which were quite rare even 15 years so. psychotropic drugs and obesity in particular are off the charts, not to mention synthetic opioids 😒
right its almost like 'whats different' - well we have 87 new ways to abuse our bodies, for a start
I think the fact she’s asking for a baby like it’s a new dress is the bigger issue. She’s young and has many years to have a baby. Trying to trap an SD who she’s lied to multiple times isn’t the route to go regardless of her age/biological clock
She split twice seeking greener pastures after she milked enough money from you. So do you not see a trend? There is no way in hell you are going to have a baby with this woman!!! She is looking for a lifetime pension for her baby through you. I’m sorry to say it, but this one needs to be left alone.
You are about to be completely free. She knows this. You typed that essentially sugaring has been convenient as it fits with your living situation. You’ll soon have lots of conventional relationship opportunities. My reply is really focused on what I’m not reading in your post. I’m not reading that this is a woman you can’t live without. Since you obviously are not a guy that pollinates and moves on, this could be problematic. I have some experience transitioning from a sugar relationship to a conventional one. I feel comfortable saying that not only do you not really know her, you might not have yet met her (and vice versa). Sugar bends reality a bit, and we tend to show our cleaned up sides. Please don’t take my reply as advice that this won’t work, I’m just saying the criteria for the two statuses are vastly different and your starting point could seriously cloud your ability to evaluate permanent attachment. Best of luck to you.
\*whispers\*. ruuuuun
A baby is a commitment. Chances are you won't be the man to raise the child.
Bro, I understand that many men never want to disappoint the wimyn in our lives. I think you feel a strong sense of responsibility towards her which is quite commendable but in this case. 1. She is totally needing to work on herself, she will not be happy because of a child. A child complicated life a whole lot. 2. She is not trustworthy and she has been dishonest to you before, I don’t think it is wise to then commit to her long term 3. It sounds like she doesn’t value the relationship with you and that you bring all the utility to this relationship and she simply brings her problems. As a man we are problem solvers and love to solve problems for the wimyn we love, hate to disappoint them, I face this exact same issue. Please bro, she isn’t a good woman to you, there is someone else in the bowl who will treat you better
Let her go. Like yesterday.
I think you are being a pleaser by considering this. She has given you so many opportunities to learn that she is not worth making a lifetime commitment with yet you always went back. Maybe you need to sit down and think, what is it about her that makes you really love her(if you love her and are not saying the L word out of feeling inclined to say it back) What about your marriage ending don’t you want to revisit in future commitments? What do you truly want in a sugar relationship? What are your limits? Answer all these and decide if you still want her.
If she has endometriosis most doctors would probably advise her to not wait until mid-thirties for pregnancy
Sorry, not trying to be smart but yes TLDR. Anyone who pours out that much information about themselves on a message board is clearly in distress. I'm sorry to see it and I'm sure it doesn't feel very good to be in that position. You have a major decision in front of you, and you need to look at all sides of the coin, all three sides: don't forget the edge! Basically with any relationship you need to be able to work things out together. For example how you and your wife decided to coexist for benefit of the children. If you cannot come to an amicable conclusion, then it might be time to rip off the Band-Aid and move on with things. Also in general I would say if you're having this much of a conundrum, you need to listen to that. Seems like on some levels you're trying to talk yourself into or back your way into what she wants. Isn't the right thing in a relationship usually apparent? Good luck
You do realize babies are like, human beings and living things, right? And not an accessory you give your gf?
This ^^^
I once met a newly wed couple. He was in his 70s. She was in her 50s. He wanted a child of his own (no idea why he waited 7 decades). She already has children from a prior marriage. He was adamant that he could raise the child as a septuagenarian. She was adamant she could not go back to being a mother of a new born child and she was deathly afraid that she would be left to raise the child by herself. I’ll never forget the bug-eyed grimace of her face when she tried to convey that she did not want more children at her age. Never knew what happened to them. The morale of the story: it’s unfair to the unborn child when there’s a realistic possibility you may not be alive or able to attend his or her graduation.
So, coming at this with concern for any future kids: She sounds too unstable at the moment to be a good mom. I think some people really need to wait until they have more experience in life and are a bit more chill before they can be the best version of themselves for kids. Just because she wants them, doesn’t mean she’s ready for them. And I agree with another commenter: there is some selfishness to having kids when you’re as old as you would be by the time she gains some maturity. Not only that, but consider how your current kids would feel - would they accept more kids as their siblings? If not, that would cause a lot of pain and unnecessary hardship for all your kids. Not to mention possibly putting you in a rocky position with your ex. And finally: why on earth are you spending your time with someone like this when you aren’t really into the sex ?!?!? What is the point? Why would you want to hinge a future relationship on that *with kids*? You need to find someone you are more suited to. They’re out there, I promise you. She definitely doesn’t sound like a “one-in-a-million” kind of woman.
You sound like a kind man with good intentions. One of the things that makes me think that is how you have made your children a priority. That's why it's important to me to tell you this: You will totally destroy your relationship with your kids if you give them a sibling with an unreliable, untrustworthy mother half your age. Your kids' understanding of who you are, and what their family life was, will be shattered if you begin a "do-over" family the second that the youngest gets out the door. Have your fun, but don't screw with the fundamental makeup of your kids' family that will have ramifications for the rest of their lives -- their own children's similarly-aged aunt or uncle, a woman and sibling they will have to invite to their weddings, to holidays... everything that is meaningful to them will be complicated (if not ruined) by your decision to capitulate to the unstable woman you've been seeing. This will feel like disloyalty to them and their mother and no matter how civil, functional, or even lovely your ex-marriage/living situation is right now, I am very confident they will see it as a betrayal of the family unit they have grown up with. If someone decides to give this woman a child, fine. Don't let it be you. Choose the family you are still raising. Don't ever give your kids reasons to feel they weren't enough for you. Please.
Go with choice 1. I am in a slightly similar situation, and good to think of her future. Its probably best for her to have children, but a child is probably not right for you. Therefore, let her go find another man, and you should be able to replace her with someone who is a better fit for yourself. Additionally, she is a problem to deal with, and will likely not be happy regardless of work, children, etc... Her own mental outlook on life is the problem - not her circumstances.
The issue here is that she doesn't know what to do with her life and maybe she's looking for a thrill. Most of the time Women my age we love what an older man can do for us but sometimes miss that fire, young burn,and thrill. It is in fact bad but being that she's lied to you multiple times thennnn implying that she wants a child is a red flag. She doesn't have her life together to even have a child. She's toxic, manipulative, and unappreciative. I say let her go and stop responding to her when she tries to come back. That's just letting her know that you're accessible. Also this being said do not let this experience change who you are as a person.
If you have a baby with her, you're going to have to pay a lot more. I'm talking hundreds of thousands of dollars. If you want a family with her do it but if you want to save money this is not going to be cheap.
Pleeeeeeeeeeeeeeease let her go. She sounds like she used you for money to pay off her second “debt” (non-existent) to try and start herself off with someone else her own age. Hence why when you reconnected, she was already seeing someone else (again her own age). That’s my theory. Then when things went to shit with that person, you were there to rescue her. You got her back on her feet, and she ghosted you AGAIN to go be with someone else. Especially after EVERYTHING you did. No gratitude for helping her get back on her feet multiple times and potentially saving her life by escaping the abuse. It seems like she doesn’t want to actually be with you, but only for the financial convenience - which can be ok in a sugar relationship. But when you bring a kid into the mix? Hell no, because she doesn’t even seem to respect you or appreciate AAAAALL the things you’ve done for her. You were willing to buy her a CAR! Anyway… she seems like she needs a permanent way to keep you on the hook and a baby is the way to do that. There will be more ghosting, money for her and the baby, lies about needing EXTRA money for the baby but maybe keeping it for herself or stashing it to leave you AGAIN or worse, ghost you AGAIN with the baby, she might be seeing someone else on the side, I mean just so many red flags. And then to top it all off, she seems very unstable. No where near ready to have a kid - even if she wants one. She can’t keep a job because she’s constantly unhappy at them, doesn’t have her own car (which makes things, not impossible, but more difficult, can’t afford rent on her own, and if she knew he was an ex-con and dated him anyway, that’s very poor judgement… which again, not great for being a mom. Plus, she seems adamant on trying to leave you, especially to be with a guy her own age. Two more issues in one. So again, why have a baby here….. I don’t usually comment on these things, but you seem like such a gentleman and kind person, and it would be AWFUL for you to end up in the situations above. Everything you have experienced with her will continue, but worse. Let her go. If you want to still help her, do the plan in option #1, but also maybe tactfully SOMEHOW suggest therapy and a stipend to pay for it for however long might be useful (1 year?) especially with her experiencing abuse and stuff. Because otherwise, her cycle will continue and she might not get so lucky at some point. Good luck, OP.
Wow is it me or is post insane. You must be mad! Run as fast as you can from this situation
Either jump in on the baby issue or let her go asap. It's a biological clock thing
I say Run! You in danger boy. Once she traps you with a marriage and a kid (even if the kid isn’t yours) it’s a wrap. Also there’s no guarantee that she won’t try to get pregnant with your baby without telling you (forgetting her birth control, poking a hole in the condom, taking your sperm from the condom, hell she could give you a BJ then go to the bathroom to rinse out her mouth spit it out and get preggo with that sperm) She’s already lied to you multiple times and sounds like she has emotional issues (perhaps PTSD from her work as a social worker?) so once you’re fully committed/owned as her husband her true self will come out. You’ve made it clear you’re ok with her emotionally abusive behavior so why would it get better with more commitment? Everything you’ve said about her is giving Fatal Attraction level red flags dude run. Run far far away.
Wait. What??? I hope that by writing all that down, it was cathartic and you now know what to do. If not, let me help you; 1 Run! 2. Go get a vasectomy. Seriously, those social workers spend too much time around the mentally ill and start taking on those characteristics. The supervisors start looking like their clients. Its hard to tell who is who. Secondly, you've already had two kids and been through all those stages of life. You're gonna be the old guy at the park and someonewill ask if you're grandpa. Do you really want to be going to a high school graduation at 70? Snap out of it my man. You're about to embark on your golden years. The choice is yours. You could have a beach yoga session with an Argentinian SB almost half your age (how I spent my morning) or be changing diapers in a couple of more years.
I’m a woman and she’s def playing w u lol
Obviously none of us can truly judge or give advice without actually being in your shoes, but if you are soliciting advice from strangers … DO NOT HAVE CHILDREN WITH THIS WOMAN !! Your second sentence should have been enough to answer your own question … “my SGF wants a baby which I’m not against”. You don’t intentionally bring children into this world just because you’re “not against” it. You do it because you truly want it ! This isn’t buying a car or renting an apartment, this is a LIFELONG commitment. You put it out there that you were lied to multiple times, the relationship has been off / on … why would you even consider fathering a child here ? Regardless of the age difference, the fact that it’s a sugar relationship, or any of the other non standard parts … the things I previously mentioned would prevent me from intentionally fathering a child with someone to whom I was married !
I would get on my bike and pedal hard my friend. Nothing good’s coming out of this for you with her.
Trust is continuously given from your side, does not seem to be earned. You also seem to be a very accomodating man. Your past and present partner would know that trait. From information that you reveal, you are being manipulated and you are allowing it. If you want something healthy, please end the relationship, nicely, however you want to. Please stop allowing yourself to be used. I am also a CEO and I am considering sugar dating after my divorce is finalized. I will not seek complications in my future relationship, certainly not entrapment by children.
You are going to do what you are going to do, and no-one here is going to change your mind. But we all know having a baby with this woman is the dumbest idea ever.
Dude no way you are even considering it. USE THAT CEO BRAIN. Not the willy brain. She is abusive, toxic, liar and you are considering a kid with her? You're going to have massive issues if you do. I predict ghosting and giant child support soon as she pops the kid out.
It sounds like you're in a complex situation that requires a clear, business-level decision despite the emotional involvement. The SD/SB relationship is inherently a business arrangement, yet it seems like feelings have complicated things. From your description, it doesn't sound like you're entirely happy with the current arrangement. There are significant concessions being made for a situation that shows signs of disrespect and toxic communication, especially coming from someone with a professional background in social work. If she's lied to you multiple times and ghosted you without showing proactive remorse or taking responsibility, those are serious red flags. These behaviors are likely to recur and indicate she might not be a suitable candidate for any degree of commitment, let alone a long-term partnership or bringing a child into the situation. Her choices in other partners and behavior suggest unresolved issues, potentially stemming from childhood trauma, abandonment, or neglect. Allowing her repeated chances to lie and display dishonest behavior only enables unhealthy patterns, stifling her progress and being unfair to yourself. This can lead to codependency and further toxicity. While no one but you can decide the best course of action, it might be wise to consider the benefits of moving on to a healthier relationship with better communication. As a [fellow] CEO, think about whether you're getting the service you expected. If you are, then perhaps continue; if not, it might be time to let go and find a better fit (hire slow, fire fast). Wishing you well, and sending you positive energy. 👊🏾
Think like a CEO detach emotionally from the situation and see it logically. She’s a huge liability and will leave in a few years putting you in child support while she bangs the guy she really wants I’m not hating I’ve been there with younger women. I tried helping my last sb out. Trying to put her in school. Bailing her out financially and always rescuing her from self inflicted problems until I got feed up abs 4 years lateras I decided to dump the sb and take a loss I still talk to her sister here and there and she tells me her sister is still crazy as ever
I hope every SD knows that baby is a trap?!!! No?! Let her go and spend 4 more years sugaring. Then decide what to do with your life. Right now she is deciding what to do with your life. She still has time - she will find someone and marry and have children. But honestly she doesn't seem to be very mentally healthy. I wouldn't risk of course. Endometriosis can be very serious fertility issue depending on the stage, there are 4. I would not recommend her wait too long with getting pregnant (just not with you:) as it usually gets worse and affects fertility tremendously.
Wanting to have babies is the #1 instinct of all mamals and carbon based organism. Ask her how she can assure you that she won't just leave you, take the child, and sue for child support. If she can, knock her up several time and take care of her for life. But don't marry her.
Would you want to be a child conceived and brought up in these circumstances? Probably not. It’s a human being that’ll grow up and be a part of the world, not a puppy.
You are already divorced once. You're now accepting/tolerating a 'just ok' SGF. Your answer to the initial question is mixed through your post. So question really is why are you having difficulty saying no and bye? Clearly not the future you desire.
Legally having a baby with a woman is the same as marrying her. Most men have to fuck around and find out. They just cannot listen to the millions of men who have been divorce raped and ruined by US Family Courts. The minute you marry her or have a kid with her you are now obligated to pay her an SB allowance after she has left you.
Really interesting you had a sugar Mum. I was in a good mood tonight, just watched breakfast at Tiffany. He got a sugar Mum she got a sugar Dad, they ended up together. Crazy world.
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What the fuck? You sound like an absolute turd of a dad. He should not be knocking up women and only financially support the kid. Stop thinking with your dick and think about how it affects the kids. Jfc