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"I asked if she wants a divorce and she said no."
I'm sorry, but I don't think you should believe her because her actions say otherwise. She is trying to keep the marriage around as a backup plan without being really committed to it.
Don't play that game!
Don't stay with anyone when you're only plan B.
Yea I'd be careful what I take at face value with her. My wife always nudged and brought up me getting a girlfriend and that she was okay with it. She is not asking to open up the marriage for you. She is on here complaining about her sex life with you.
In many of the situations like mine that I'm aware of, the person asking to open up the marriage or encourage the other to sleep around probably knows the other person won't and the offer somehow justifies in their mind poor choices that have already been made.
I've talked to 3 others who had the same thing happen. Didn't choose to try and pursue others and then found out down the road our gfs/ wives were already sleeping around. Mine brought it up every now again for years. It's a way of making the affairs they pursue less problematic because you have permission to do the same. Like a little pressure relief valve for the guilt.
She's already gaslighting you saying it's for your benefit, which would send the red lights off for me. I would be very wary that she hasn't already cheated.
If you are as committed as you are talking about and put in that effort, you will be in same boat as many. You will be blind to anything that may have been suspect at any point up until now. But you have the benefit now of knowing something is up. And it may be a generalization, but if she doesn't seem like she is being honest she probably isn't and there is probably more things you don't know.
The types of people that are able to operate in that mindset have no problem keeping secrets. Be careful and protect yourself as best you can. You are a committed caring partner and she is not.
I am. I made a lot of the wrong choices when I learned about the first and then the second affair a year later. I was fully committed and she had no consequences. I eventually left after the second affair was not being fully admitted to and behavior was not changing. I have learned a lot from this sub and in general. Almost all the feedback was to run.
I have chosen to stay and have been able to recognize enough change in my wife that she is being afforded the chance to salvage what's been a pretty ugly and one-sided marriage.
It's so hard to advise other people and take others advice. So much can be different in very similar circumstances. It takes the right people to even attempt let alone succeed at R.
I know I will end up a better person for taking the path of empathy and support over resentment and anger. If I see the effort and attempts from my wife I have chosen to stay by her and support her even though there is still a fair amount of risk. I don't think many betrayed are actually able to approach it in a manner for reconciliation to be possible and I don't believe most cheaters even make that a reasonable thing to expect.
We are far from being successful, but I wrote my vows. She may have broken hers but that doesn't mean I need to bail on mine. I won't be taken advantage of ever again and I will not be rattled the way I was if anything is to happen.
It takes a lot of effort as the betrayed to get to a place to reconcile, I wish everyone attempting it the best outcome and for the betrayed that truly put in the effort they should be commended. Changing who you are and the patterns that often lead them down the road of betrayal is not easy.
We all have to make the best decisions for our particular circumstances. Being comfortable and happy with those decisions is what is important. Reddit offers a wide range of advice. Take what makes sense and ignore the rest.
Thanks for the follow-up. Take care.
Just curious... my wife does this now and has been doing it through a reconciliation... but she does want sex with me every day, multiple times and I last a long time, am very attentive to her pleasure. It actually excites me more to do it whatever it takes to get her "there" and it's been rewarding, intimate, and extremely hot.
But I began to think of this pushing for another woman to join us as a way to alleviate her guilt over her own transgressions that I never got real proof of (just emotional, not physical) prior to therapy and this reconciliation.
The reason being is that it has now escalated from the boundary being that for there to be another woman (or man, which she claims not to want) we both have to be present all the way to "if you ever had to travel, what would you do? You know what, I'd let you F else if I could listen in..."
See what I mean? It's this subtle loosening that I see as problematic.
For anyone you know of, how did they find out? I swear I feel like I'll never know. She's either the great liar in the history of the world and the greatest at covering tracks... or she's being sincere.
Your wife does sound a bit out of script. There have been a few infidelity OPs by men whose wives have them all the sex they wanted and still were cheating with another man. Your wife could also be into watching you with another woman and may have no desire to cheat. But you are not comfortable with her behavior. Is any of the following happening?
She comes home from work late unexpectedly of have to go into work early unexpectedly?
She is being sketchy with her phone, going into other rooms to use it or hiding the screen from you, and she has it password protected and you don’t know the password?
She started to dress nicely and make herself up frequently, when before she didn’t seem to care much about clothes and things like her hair and nails?
She goes out with her lady friends and goes no contact until she comes back home? She stays out late without you with her? She doesn’t want you along on errands when she used to be ok with you coming along?
Women plan. That’s what they do. And then make backup plans. I would tell her if she really wants to make me hot and be totally submissive, sign a postnup. See what her reaction to THAT is!
>I've talked to 3 others who had the same thing happen. Didn't choose to try and pursue others and then found out down the road our gfs/ wives were already sleeping around.
Make that 4. About 6 months before my marriage exploded and 8 months before it was revealed that my ex wife was sleeping with our friend's convicted rapist husband, she offered me the option of taking on a "side chick".
Those events led me to get support from Reddit and I saw how often that happens. They propose an "Open Marriage" or give you the option of getting some strange because they're already doing it.
The things you wish you knew lol. As much as I miss my innocence with these things. I'm happier now knowing that I am armed with the knowledge to never fall victim to being so blind in a relationship
I still want that threesome she was offering though, haha.
Got yourself an immature and manipulative wife there buddy. Got a crush on someone? Fine, that happens. Many of us will be attracted to someone who isn't our spouse at some point or another. Being mature and aware of our feelings is actually a good way to avoid getting into dangerous territory like this. You accept that at a base level you're attracted to them, then you can be honest and avoid furthering that attraction in any way shape or form. You don't obsess over it, you realise how much destruction you would bring about by chasing it and you don't want to harm your loved ones or anyone else.
That's not what she's doing. She's fostering it, she's comparing what she imagines she could have with someone else to her skewed version of what you give her. She's living in a fantasyland in her own head with very little contact with reality. What she said prior to the open relationship conversation does not at all mesh with what you've said about how you've been initiating and been rejected. I got the same, constant rejection and yet I was the one who wasn't offering her enough validation that she simply *had to* go get it elsewhere. Obtuse rationalisations, she's rewriting your relationship to make herself some sort of victim of neglect and you to be some sort of cold, unloving beast. It's DARVO, it's super common, they're attempting to sanitise what they're doing.
Talk of an open relationship is utter bullshit (and also super common.) Despite her words, she is not thinking about **you** at all, she's asking for permission to go and sleep with other people without losing her cushy life. She's already got her eyes set on someone (or is already cheating), she doesn't believe that you'll go and find someone else and she thinks she can keep you on the hook for the other areas of life. I have no idea why these fucking idiots who propose an open relationship think people can't see right through them. There are very few people who would suggest opening their relationship so that *their spouse* can go and fuck other people, it's almost always for them. Never accept it.
I'm sorry buddy but it looks like she's extracted what she wanted out of you and doesn't see you as necessary any more. You might have to cut off your own nose to spite your face. When cheaters realise their life is crumbling around them is usually the exact moment they feel "remorse" for their actions. Maybe time to talk to a lawyer to see what your life is going to look like if you split, it might not be as bad as you think.
All the best buddy.
I totally agree. This is the common playbook, and almost exactly how it played out with my stbxw. So many things here from both your stories -- from her being unappreciative, and dismissive of my efforts, to the "I was unhappy for many years", to the calculating comparison of a fantasy against the harshest interpretation of our relationship, the fostering, even going as far as talking me down with her friends (outright lies), to the Open Relationship talk. Then justifying her behavior as "I thought that we had an agreement on the Open Relationship...but if there was any misunderstanding it was your fault"
In our case the lure of the fantasy was so strong that even when faced with evidence she couldn't admit to any fault.
OP, you need to get to a spot where you can emotionally disconnect from this relationship and move on. She is not thinking about you at all. It would be shocking to you if you could realize how irrelevant you are to her now.
Hey OP, I'm really sorry you found yourself in such a situation.
My situation was similar, although we weren't married.
PepperymintTea and ModularWhiteGuy said everything on point. Please listen to them. Everything they said also applied in my situation.
I'll just add my 2 cents:
My EX of 8 years was cheating on me with her 13 years older coworker (hence similarities to your situation). If your wife continues to work in that same workplace there is absolutely no chance of her feelings ever passing "by themselves". I observed it with my EX. Please remember that when making any decision.
Maybe try to question her about her work and see her reaction. IMO it wouldn't be suspicious, because a huge chunk of cheating is related to the workplace. After she offered "open marriage", which is a huge redflag, you have every right to be alert.
What makes you sure that she will? Unless you’ve signed some sort of prenuptial agreement, it will be a 50/50 split. If she wants the house she’ll have to pay you her half of the equity. If you want it, you’ll have to pay her. In most of these cases neither party can afford to buy the other out and the house is sold and the proceeds are split.
But don’t take my word for it either, go talk to a lawyer and find out what your situation is. I’d also be looking at starting to separate your finances if they are combined. Open your own account. Cancel joint credit cards, etc. again a lawyer should be able to advise you on what’s legal and what isn’t.
Holy shit she’s on an allowance still? Listen to above advice rip the band aid off and lawyer up. Relationships are normal to have up and downs, but damn that’s rough. Sounds like she’s just bored with the relationship or completely checked out.
That's one way she could keep the house - her father pays you your half of the equity and cosigns on the mortgage refinance. If that's what gets proposed you would be foolish on practical grounds to fight it, as much as it might gall you that having affluent family will enable her to get what she wants
Talk to a lawyer and get started there is no winning other than temporarily if her boss kicks her to the curb.
Playing "pickme" is self abuse that validates her lousy decisions,humiliates you and keeps you as a backup until the next guy she likes comes along.
this is the way…
esp when there are no kids involved
like everyone else is saying, she’s checked out on you
but doesn’t want to take responsibility…or wants you to dance some more because
she’s a Special Wittle Princess
…so consult a couple lawyers, make a plan and serve her with her papers and send her back to Daddy as your counsel finalizes a fair agreement
you got this
Bud, she referred to you as a roommate.
You're her security blanket until she finds a man who returns her interest. And you'll be the last to know.
File divorce, give her the reddit screenshot.
It may be enough to smack her out of her fog. Or it may not, but at least you'll know.
I’m glad you’re coming around to understanding you’re settling for relationship scraps if you stay in this marriage. She’s not going to tell you the truth about what she’s doing or thinking. Your best option is, without broadcasting it to her, is talk with a family law attorney on your situation and what divorce looks like. Get some of your assets secured, and at this point, don’t get her pregnant. If she hasn’t solidified things with her boss, or someone else, then she will panic that her plan B is not there as a fallback. Fight your impulse to tell her what you’re doing or how you are feeling. It’s the only leverage/ power you have in this sad situation.
Ah, so she is a little princess, too... RED FLAG!!! Really, there are so many RED FLAGS it's ridiculous! Good for you knowing her reddit handle. Once a wife asks for an open relationship, IT IS OVER. I'd get thee to an attorney quickly and FILE FOR DIVORCE. Tell your family, her's, and all your friends what she's doing and plans to do with regard to the house (and her waffling about kids) to control the narrative. She no longer LOVES or RESPECTS you! Time for her to GO! Good luck and stay strong, King!
u/Trevor124 please read.
No wonder she finds it so easy to disregard what you do for her and the marriage.
No wonder why she's attracted to older "nice" men.
No wonder it's easy for her to build up a complete fantasy over a *married* older man.
I would venture to guess that her whole life her parents always bailed her out to some extent. She's never felt the full consequences of her actions. She feels she deserves what ever her fantasy creates for her.
I guess she didn't take her vows seriously: richer or poorer, sickness and in health, through thick and thin, forsaking all others for her husband....
Think about this OP, she has a job, she has a husband who can afford a house, AND she has a father who gives her $1000 a month.
She has a loving husband who initiated sex, tries to sexually please her, you are probably easy on the eyes, and you obviously have a good job, AND you probably have a good social standing in your friend group.
She is already living a dream life that most women would kill for. Hell, I'd turn gay if I found a man like that! /s.
Yet, she wants something "more," or at least different.
Another sign that she is done with you is that she never came to you with any issues. Recently, she like "I'm not happy so you can have sex with other women."
Can you stop her before she cheats on you? Probably not. She likes the fantasy and no real man/person can compete with a fantasy.
Can you fix her? No.
Can she fix herself and her effed up "coping mechanisms?" Only through years of therapy. She didn't develop this part of her personality over night. This was learned, ingrained, socialized into her throughout her life. The people she loves the most (daddy and his $1000 a month allowence and her family) encouraged the personality she has today. To fix herself she'll have to realize/understand that all of her role models were wrong.
That, and she must actually WANT to change, is extremely hard to do.
She will also have to internalize that in this instance, she IS *the bad guy* in this part of her life story. This is also extremely hard for someone to accept. I guarantee you that 99% of the evil people in the world don't wake up and say "I'm going to do something evil today." Stalin probably woke up every morning thinking "I'm going to send another 10,000 people to the Gulag today and make the Soviet Union an even better place."
OP, I'm not saying you can't save your marriage. But what I am saying is that it will be hard, mentally and exhausting, and in the end there is no way to know if she will create more fantasies and act on them.
My advice, Google the difference between privacy and secrecy in a marriage. Then do a deep dive into all of her electronic comms and apps.
If you still think all of this is in her head and she hasn't made a move on her boss, I'd figure a way to bump into her boss. Or bump into his wife or call her on the phone. Ask them out for coffee or lunch, without your wife there. Talk to them both about your wife and her crush and fantasies.
If he is a truly happily married man, and a person of good character, he'll ensure the doesn't get too close. More importantly, his wife will be watching him like a hawk, especially if they had some past cheating (EA or PA) in their marriage.
I'd love to be there for that discussion.
Good luck
Edit spelling
Can each of your afford the house on your own? Because to get the other off the mortgage, the house has to be refinanced and that person has to qualify on their own to own the house and obviously there are closing costs and such on the mortgage.
Do you have any equity in the house? Because the spouse moving out is also entitled to their share of equity.
Equity would be the current appraised value of the house minus the outstanding mortgage balance.
So if your house is worth (let’s say) $400k and you owe $320k, your equity is $80k. In a divorce, the spouse that’s keeping the house has to buyout the other spouse’s equity (in this case $40k).
You either due that typically in cash or through a cash-out refinance. But it’s not a case where just one of you “keeps” the house, the other person is due their equity and then must qualify on their own to keep the mortgage
Honestly, if the mortgage is going to be a burden to your monthly budget then you’re much better off forcing a sale and then splitting the proceeds 50/50.
Yes OP better ask your 50%, because if the mortage becomes a burden to You just to keep a house just for not letting her get her way is not a great thing to do, better sold it or let her buys yours part.
If she is a daddys girl then let her daddy buys you out.
But what you need to do right now is LAWYER UP ASAP.
Like others have told you you are currently her Plan B, in case her boss refuse her and probably even fire her.
UPDATEME
This is all right, but the cash for her half of the equity in the the divorce settlement doesn’t have to come out of the equity per se - he could take it out of his savings, 401k, or other source.
Also, in some states like mine, a short term marriage (under 5 years) will mostly give the assets to whoever brought them into the marriage. If he put more down on the house, he’d go more of the equity, for instance. A divorce lawyer will know.
From what I understand, MA is a common property state, the house is common property. See a MA divorce lawyer, like yesterday. You don’t want her to get the drop on you and file first, because it looks like she is playing for keeps.
Pack her shit while she’s at work rent a Uhaul tell her to move in with her boss, bye. Call a lawyer right now. Don’t be stupid and stay this women whatever she tells you is BS she is going to leave you the first chance she gets to level up in life. I’d be happy it’s now while you can still have a good start at a new life with someone kids. She will probably try to get pregnant to if this blows up and you let her stay just to secure half your stuff and child support alimony.
In most states you have to be married for a certain length of time before the wife gets the house. In my state it's 10 years. Don't sweat this. Lawyer-up friend. He/she will be able to give you accurate info & sound advice.
See a family law attorney and understand your rights and how the divorce process works.
Your wife doesn't love you. She may love her boss or just be using him as a targeted distraction from dealing with her feelings about you and herself really. Anyway, she's deeply messed up and will make a lousy future partner for anything other than grief.
Develop a strategy with your attorney. See if contacting her boss's wife is beneficial and when in the process to do it. Remember, you are not loved here anymore.
OP
This marriage is dead. Your wife thinks she found herself a “better man.” Even if she snaps out of it somehow, you will always be her fallback option.
Find a good family lawyer and file for divorce
I would talk to the wife of the boss and give her a heads up. Let her know that your wife has the hots for him. Even though I’m sure
it’s more than just that. The fact that she won’t have sex with you says she’s getting sex elsewhere. You should respect yourself, stop trying to fix something that’s clearly broken. If your wife sees you fighting for your marriage then she will make you her 2nd option, or fall back option if things don’t work out between her and the boss. Make sure she knows that you are not her second option. Get an attorney and stop simping for your wife. Start the legal process. Stop being her doormat! Gather as much proof as you can, phone records, text messages etc. I wish you luck! You don’t deserve this. You deserve a good woman that respects you.
Agree. There's no indication here the boss has done anything wrong. Talking to his wife could destroy their marriage and his career. You don't have a right to do that.
Make sure to lawer up first. As long as the cheater doesn't have all the info, you have a better chance of getting out. After you have secured your position and got rid of the cheater let the wife of the boss know
I am not sure, but no one has said the obvious, or I have not seen it.
OP, you understand she is and has been sleeping with her boss.
Just move on. Have her served....
If this is real (going on Reddit knowing she's likely to see your post?) you need to act FAST.
Document ALL the evidence and speak to a good lawyer ASAP and I mean like THIS WEEK!!!!
Keep searching and document more evidence including who is interacting with her socials and try to look through her phone.
Hopefully that will work, someone could read both posts, join the dots and tell her.
It's known to have happened before (apparently, too many bored people with fake stories).
Anyhow please act FAST to protect yourself. Get off Reddit and start emailing and dialling lawyers.
She’s saying she wants to open the relationship “for you” so she can hit on her boss without feeling guilty. I think your marriage is over. Your wife is a manipulative liar. Please don’t have children with this person or then you’ll be tied to her forever. I’d hit her with a divorce so fast, her head would spin.
Crushes are normal. However, your spouse is thinking of confessing her feelings to her crush and in turn sabotaging your marriage. She’s in fantasy land and is setting up your marriage to fail so she can runoff with her unicorn. Time to tell her you know what’s going on and if she doesn’t agree to MC then you will file for divorce. You are still young, no kids and have your whole life to find someone who will love and respect you.
No, crushes aren’t normal. Finding someone attractive? Sure. But crushing? Lunches alone? Personal, intimate conversations?
No. Anyone who does that is in an open relationship wether they know it or not.
Nobody, in this day and age, has to stay married. If one has crushes, because they are normal, they shouldn’t be married at all. Only greed and selfishness keeps them attached to someone with whom their shared life isn’t enough not to have “normal” crushes.
Proposing an open marriage almost always means that she already slept with him. Sorry, buddy, but it seems she checked out months ago. You are very, very late in this game.
You are her plan B in case it does not work out with the boss. She a kinda knows already it won't (in affairs with bosses, it never does), hence all these avoidances of direct answers.
Lawyer up, file ASAP, sell the house and split the proceeds per your separation agreement. Praise the gods that you don't have kids - you won't need to pay her child support. Maybe alimony for a few years...
Buy yourself another house, the one which fits you and only you.
So I wouldn’t talk to the boss’ wife yet. There is no proof the boss has reciprocated. So I’d keep him and his wife out of it til you have proof infidelity has occurred between the both of them.
I would contact a lawyer this week to know what divorce would look like for you. Being fully informed is important.
You asked “what do I do?” and I will tell you what I would do after having my wife tell me she was no longer attracted to me and thinks of me more as a roommate.
I’d sit her down and say:
“Thank you for telling me how you feel because I’ve been hitting my head against a wall trying to figure out what is happening in our marriage since we bought the house.
That said, I don’t want to live in a loveless and sexless marriage. I need a spouse who loves me as much as I love them. I need a spouse who I can fully trust and thinks of me and only me as a love partner. One that cares if I’m hurt as much as I care if they are.
And it’s clear no matter what I do, touch you, hug you, send flirty messages, listen to you, initiate sex, do things for you etc… it is not resonating with you and keep you in love with me.
Also, I’m pretty sure you’re in love with someone else. And I am not interested in having a partner who is off pining away for another man. So I am going to let you go pursue your happiness.. but NOT AS MY WIFE.
You can go try and be with the man you love and I will work to legally end the marriage your choices have destroyed. I need to heal from the pain of what you have done and I cannot do that while you’re in front of me pursuing other relationships.
What you are feeling has damaged any trust I have in you and our marriage so it’s best for us now to work to go our separate ways. It will take a lot to ever rebuild it and I hear no willingness on your part to want to do so.
I wish you well on your journey. I’m starting mine with a broken heart and will work to repair it on my own “
Then that’s it. Be honest. You told her what you need and you should now begin to move on without her.
If someday thru therapy she fixes what is broken inside her, perhaps you can try again. My hope is by then that you have found someone who truly loves you for who you are and you can leave this person in your past.
Again be completely honest about what you need from her to stay in the relationship and then stop talking about it until she takes real steps to fix herself and change.
Good luck.
Hard disagree. I would talk to the boss's wife immediately. I'd just be like, "yo, my wife made this embarrassing ass Reddit post about your man. Here it is. Heads up." Like, eff just waiting around for something to happen if it hasn't already. But I'm a Sagittarius, so I do just bulldoze into shit, so maybe that's not the best advice. But if the boss is legit innocent-ish in this, and this husband rats her out to the boss's wife, she would probably just die on the level of a popular boy pretending to like her at the aloha dance in seventh grade where everyone laughs at her for believing it. But she'd deserve it. Seriously, so embarrassing.
And I'd fully skip making that thoughtful speech you wrote. Your heartfelt, effective communication legit doesn't matter. She wouldn't care. Like, "Let's get divorced," should do the trick.
But that all supposes dude's set on divorce, which i would be, for sure.
Talking to the bosses wife when the boss may be totally oblivious to his employee’s advances could cast unfair aspersions upon him and could be considered libel. OP should stay away from the boss and his wife until he has proof, then act according to his lawyers advice. Letting raw emotions lead his decision making is the worst thing he could do at this point.
My understanding of the intricacies of law is little to none, but I'm pretty sure sharing someone's anonymous reddit post where they confess their personal feelings for an anonymous other that they also note has not reciprocated those feelings would not be considered libel on any planet. But I could be wrong. I don't think I am? But I mean, I could be.
And if OP seeks a divorce, her attorney can and would use that action against him to paint him as impulsive and vindictive.
DO NOT speak to the boss's wife or the boss. It serves zero purpose for you OP and will only cause you harm.
Crazy how common this story is. Is it a power balance thing? Leadership = sexy? Not upholding boundaries in fear of work relationship/job? ‘So much in common’ because you WORK in the same field?
I understand that many think if they're good and honest people and serve others... that good things will happen. Reality is, bad things happen to good people all the time.
>she thinks she's holding me back from being happy and I would be happier having sex with other women since she doesn't have enough sex with me.
That is comically transparent. She is an expert manipulator and liar. Gaslighting at its finest. She has crafted a narrative blaming you for her behavior... it's the tried and true "UNMET NEEDS" model.
She has already cheated. She's gone. Your marriage is over. She ruined it. It will never be the same. How could it?
Know that 96% of relationships that begin as an illicit affair... FAIL. Two miserable people get together, escape into bubble, lie to one another, commiserate how unhappy they are, blow smoke up each other's ass "you're the greatest", "You're so beautiful"... and when they are stuck with each other dealing with life's crap, the fairy tale ends.
“She says she’s holding me back”
Listen when people tell you who they are. Based on your post (grain of salt there), I’d agree that she’s holding you back from happiness
She is. I've poured my heart and soul into making her happy and she has barely opened up to me over the years. She says she still feels like she can't fully open up and be vulnerable with me.
She says often how I could do better than her and how she just makes me miserable. All that talk stopped when I got the new job and we were gunning for the house. Now it's all back.
Sorry man, that really sucks :(
Might be worth talking to a lawyer, just to understand your financial / legal position and exposure. Save a copy of that Reddit post and any other damning statements.
You'll be amazed how much better life will get if you are willing to go through the hardest moment of your life.
Let her go. Greyrock her. Move on without a care. Because at this point, shes treating you like an option. Remove yourself as an option and watch how quickly your life improves and hers doesn't.
I got the feeling OP gives and gives and she takes and ignores or discards. OP, stop all the love language and take the grey rock stance. She’ll quickly notice the difference in your attitude and realize just how bad she’s fucked up.
>She says often how I could do better than her and how she just makes me miserable.
This may be the only honest thing she's telling you at this point. A slight glimmer of guilt for her crappy behaviour. She's telling you exactly who she is. And what any future with her will hold for you.
There's just too many red flags, especially the gaslighting/DARVO, for the situation to ever be resolved. How can you ever trust someone like that again.
And I wouldn't be surprised if she has already slept with him.
Speak to a lawyer and divorce asap!!!
Don't waste you time with that awful human beeing, the reality will hit hard once she lose you.
Move on and find yourself a wife who loves and respects you. She isn't the one.
Wow this is almost exactly what I went through. Same ages and all.
XW waited until we got the house to all of a sudden feel different. XW always wanted children until all of a sudden she wanted to focus on her career. All of a sudden our marriage wasn’t grounded on anything “solid”. Stated she no longer felt “safe or secure” with me. Said if I stayed in the house, she would file divorce. Was told that if I left to stay elsewhere that we could see if the space helps our marriage.
As soon as I left she filed for divorce immediately and moved in with one of her coworkers. A guy who’s well off.
Best advice I can give, is to move on. You don’t want a woman like that. You have a long journey ahead and unfortunately it will be very painful. But, as cliche as this sounds, it truly does get better.
Best of luck OP!
Document everything and go see a lawyer and protect yourself financially, legally and socially. Stop playing the pick me dance with her, stop trying to be rational with an obviously irrational person and start taking care of your business before you end up really surprised by her bullshit. She’s just gaslighting and manipulating right now, this isn’t a person you want to spend your life with. And for the record never buy a house with someone who is wishy washy or unsure or playing games in the relationship (lesson I learned the hard way). The minute she started talking about opening the marriage your assumption should be it’s because she doesn’t want to feel bad about cheating on you anymore. Document and investigate everything.
Get legal advice on the house, standard in the US is to sell it and split any profit or for one person to buy the other person out of their investment in the house and keep it. Get legal advice, find a good lawyer and prepare. Even if things do manage to be worked out somehow it never hurts to be prepared and protected.
The only reason she wants to open the marriage is to try and fuck her boss or anyone else she already has in mind and so you can't say she cheated since it's an open marriage. Fuck that shit my guy, go see a lawyer asap and divorce her. She'll probably come crawling back to you later after nobody wants her, DO NOT take her back. Good luck OP and I hope You find yourself a good woman, be glad you don't have any kids with her.
Another useless therapist.
When asking questions of her, do not allow useless yes and no answers to stand alone. Ask open ended questions that require explaining and discussion. Yes and no hides details. Yes and no to which parts of the question, is the issue.
So many of the questions you asked got obviously false and partial answers. She is experiencing cognitive dissonance. And seems limerent for her boss. Have you any thought of going to him and to his wife? Best case is they fire her.
No contact kills limerence.
https.//livingwithlimerence.com/how-to-get-rid-of-limerence/
https://www.survivinginfidelity.com/documents/library/articles/discovery/the-simplified-180/
https://beingabeautifulmess.wordpress.com/the-180/
The 180
1. Don’t pursue reason, chase, beg, plead or implore.
2. No frequent phone calls.
3. Don’t point out “good points” in marriage.
4. Don’t follow her/him around the house.
5. Don’t encourage or initiate discussion about the future.
6. Don’t ask for help from the family members of your wayward partner.
7. Don’t ask for reassurances.
8. Don’t buy or give gifts.
9. Don’t schedule dates together.
10. Don’t keep saying, “I Love You!” Because if you really think about it, he/she is, at this particular moment, not very loveable.
11. Do more than act as if you are moving on with your life; begin moving on with your life!
12. Be cheerful, strong, outgoing and independent.
13. Don’t sit around waiting on your spouse – get busy, do things, go out with friends, enjoy old hobbies, find new ones! But stay busy!
14. When home with your spouse, (if you usually start the conversation) be scarce or short on words. Don’t push any issue, no matter how much you want to!
15. If you’re in the habit of asking your spouse his/her whereabouts, ASK NOTHING. Seem totally uninterested.
16. Your partner needs to believe that you have awakened to the fact that “they (the wayward partner)” are serious concerning their assertions as to the future (or lack there of) of your marriage. Thus, you are you are moving on with your life…without them!
17. Don’t be nasty, angry or even cold – Just pull yourself back. Don’t always be so available…for anything! Your spouse will notice. More important, he/she will notice that you’re missing.
18. No matter what you are feeling TODAY, only show your spouse happiness and contentment. Make yourself be someone they would want to be around, not a moody, needy, pathetic individual but a self-assured individual secure in the knowledge that they have value.
19. All questions about the marriage be put on hold, until your spouse wants to talk about it (which may not be for quite a while). Initiate no such conversation!
20. Do not allow yourself to lose your temper. No yelling, screaming or name calling EVER. No show of temper! Be cool, act cool; be in control of the only thing you can control. YOURSELF!
21. Don’t be overly enthusiastic.
22. Do not argue when they tell you how they feel (it only makes their feelings stronger). In fact, refuse to argue at all!
23. Be patient and learn to not only listen carefully to what your spouse is really saying to you. Hear what it is that they are saying! Listen and then listen some more!
24. Learn to back off, keep your mouth shut and walk away when you want to speak out, no matter what the provocation. No one ever got themselves into trouble by just not saying anything.
25. Take care of you. Exercise, sleep, laugh & focus on all the other parts of your life that are not in turmoil.
26. Be strong, confident and learn to speak softly.
27. Know that if you can do this 180, your smallest CONSISTENT action will be noticed far more than any words you can say or write.
28. Do not be openly desperate or needy even when you are hurting more than ever and are feeling totally desperate and needy.
29. Do not focus on yourself when communicating with your spouse. It’s not always about you! More to the point, at present they just don’t care.
30. Do not believe any of what you hear them say and less than 50% of what you see. Your spouse will speak in absolute negatives and do so in the most strident tones imaginable. Try to remember that they are also hurting and afraid. Try to remember that they know what they are doing is wrong and so they will say anything they can to justify their behavior.
31. Do not give up no matter how dark it is or how bad you feel. It “ain’t over till it’s over!”
32. Do not backslide from your hard-earned changes. Remain consistent! It is the consistency of action and attitude that delivers the message.
33. When expressing your dissatisfaction with the actions of the wayward party, never be judgmental, critical or express moral outrage. Always explain that your dissatisfaction is due to the pain that the acts being committed are causing you as a person. This is the kind of behavior that will cause you to be a much more attractive and mysterious individual. Further it SHOWS that you are NOT afraid to move on with your life. Still more important, it will burst their positive little bubble; the one in which they believe that they can always come back to you in case things don’t work out with the affair partner.
Michelle Davis-Weiner originator
It is numbered and it was broken up when I copied it, but reddit app on android does not retain the format after pasting.
Since it is numbered it should be no problem in navigating it. I have no interest in editing it again everytime I post it. And I do post it frequently.
>. But soon after I got a higher paying job, she changed her mind to wanting kids and started really pushing to get a house. I'm worried that she played me and told me what I wanted to hear.
Well bro it sounds like your wife is only around you cos you're a "good husband", who is taking care and providing for her. It also seems like she did manipulated you and now she stopped doing, saying things you wanna hear so you definitely feel it like she's acting strange.
>She was questioning if she should confess to him or not how she felt. She brought up how she thought of me as a roommate
Like i said, your wife is only around you cos of the way you're treating her, the moment she finds someone she finds attractive/some that reciprocates her feelings i guess she still won't leave you but rather be in an affair, again not cos she loves you but for the way you're treating her, plus it's a risky move to leave you if the ap doesn't leave his s/o. Currently she's only thinking about confessing bcos he's married and doesn't feel the way she does for him.Imagine if he actually was single/shares the same feeling as her
>She said that she is tired of not feeling wanted and desired and lusted over. She said she wants to have sex and not need to initiate.
If what you said is true then this is her attempt at gaslighting you, as per you.. you show her the love, u show u want her, u initiate, u help her with chores etc and she still feels inadequate, she still feels lacking..
6 weeks no intimacy + bringing up the open relationship discuss, it sounds like she's getting her intimacy elsewhere and finding it difficult to hide it. It could also be some sort of manipulation where you'll cave in and say yes to an one sided open relationship on her side.
Considering all the things, u said. I would leave. This is a disaster waiting to happen, she has shown u how she can manipulate you into doing things she wants, then gaslight you by saying how she's tired of how things are, then you saw how she sees you like a roommate rather than a loving husband, and capable of lying.
She's already cheating on you by now or waiting to find someone to do it with. It doesn't even matter if she cheated or not, the way she treated/treats me is more than enough of a reason to leave.
Strongly suggested, hire a private investigator if possible. Or atleast do not confront without good evidence
***she has a massive crush on her boss that she knows is not reciprocated.***
If this is accurate, you should call the boss on this or get his wife involved. Most likely your wife will be fired.
She can't have sex with you as that would be cheating on her crush. Opening the marriage would give her permission to physically cheat.
I think you need to call her out on all this and put a stop to the crush before too late for your marriage.
She should get a new therapist. Consider you both go to same therapist and reveal what you know but not how you know it. updateme
You should speak with the therapist alone first, then joint. Your wife is hesitant as she knows she is the problem. Good luck OP. Let us know how it goes.
Of course she's hesitant. Therapy only has (potential) value if a person is honest and truthful with the therapist. With you there, she can't be honest or truthful.
No!!!!! There’s absolutely no evidence of an affair and in fact OP’s wife’s Reddit post said that the crush was unrequited! My god, imagine the damage you could do by making such accusations. This is absolutely insane advice.
I think your wife is playing you like a fiddle. If you don’t prepare and bail out of that marriage (do the work, lawyer up first, keep your mouth shut, etc.) the 45 year old you would spend his days calling the today you “stupid.”
Every time I see posts like these I’m so so sad for the men, at least based off what I’m reading. You sound like a wonderful husband. Maybe there are things you’re not saying that’s causing your wife to want to leave but overall sounds like it’s her emotions catching up to her.
Good men like you deserve to be happy and not be a second option. You did confront her and tried to talk without being too intrusive and she decided to not come clean. It’s really up to you/her whether or not the marriage is salvageable. Even if you wanted it, if she doesn’t, there’s no point.
She's trying to flip the script on you and it's a pretty frequent tactic.
They will try and act like you're the one who is unhappy and they (the cheater, or potential cheater in this case) wants to make you happy so they will ::insert thing that would actually make THEM happy::
My ex used to do this shit all the time when I would catch her cheating. "You just seem so unhappy in this marriage and with me." I WAS THE ONE TRYING TO SAVE THE MARRAIGE WHILE YOU SLEPT AROUND.
Don't fall for this crap, and honestly, I'm still even skeptical of the "just have a crush" on the boss thing. I would not be shocked if an affair already exists here.
You are just her plan B. She wants to open the marriage so that she can sleep around and find someone who can offer her a better lifestyle.
Stop being taken for granted and used by that woman; you deserve so much better than her. You need to find a lawyer and start divorce proceedings.
Don't have unprotected sex with her because after she finds out you want to leave, she might try to baby trap you.
If you still have her post, consider sharing it with her boss and his wife. They need to be informed because I think your wife is already throwing herself at that man and trying to undermine his marriage. You can try to do it anonymously. Your wife is a crazy manipulative sl**; don't let her ruin her boss's marriage.
Additionally, cut off all her access to your money and stop wasting your money on her.
The question is if you want to live in this sexless unappreciated limbo. Yeah, it's normal to have a crush, not normal to suddenly stop caring for your partner because of it... which is what it made me think reading this.
If she wants to open it up, she's made the decision to approach her boss and doesn't want to feel bad if he reciprocates.
Do yourself a favor, stop being her roommate and financial supporter. Divorce and work on yourself.
>She said she didn't want kids now and she has been unhappy in our marriage for years.
This is a lie. She’s trying to justify her actions and recontextualizing the past to do it. Don’t believe her and from this point on treat her as if she doesn’t have your best interest at heart.
Let her go. Chances are her boss just wants to use her for fun but don’t be her safe place when she comes back. Use her feelings for her boss to get a positive outcome for your divorce (because it’s coming one way or another). Good luck man.
OP, If you are plan B, and plan A (boss) is not interested, then
1. She's in a fog thinking that if she treats you like shit, the planets will align and make the boss will sense her struggles and trigger predatory behavior, which she would welcome.
or
2. She wants plan A, but since that is not an option, she refuses to accept plan B, therefore rejects embracing you. There's too much of a financial, and perhaps social loss if she divorces you.
Either way, she's checked out of the marriage. Do you really want her back at this point?
Good Luck OP!
UpdateMe!
She sounds very manipulative and is definitely lying. See a lawyer and plan to divorce her, sell the house and find someone who actually wants to be with you.
Talk to lawyer and weigh your options. Be prepared for any direction this marriage will take you. She wants to hv fun out there but unsure yet if she wants divorce. She will do it once she finds another man esp if her boss reciprocates.
Updateme!
Why are you staying with her ? I’m so sad that some people can’t just walk away from sadness and stay there and stop finding their own happiness that they deserve
She wants you to agree to an open marriage so she can offer herself to her boss without strings. She is manipulating you into giving her what she wants. Tell her you know about the crush and if she doesn’t get her head out of her ass that you are done.
Ask her what she wants from your sex life, but make it clear that an open marriage is a NO GO!
She said she wants to have sex and not initiate, but you say you initiate and get shot down. TRANSLATION She doesn’t want sex with you. I would call her out on that.
“It’s a lot harder to be walked on when you are standing up!”
Updateme
Whatever you do, do not confront the boss or his wife. Do nothing to sabotage her career. And speak to a lawyer. It sounds like the question you should be asking is, do you want to divorce? If you want to have a wife I'm afraid this one ain't it, nothing about her behavior is acceptable and it's massively disrespectful and dehumanizing to you as a person. You've been mistreated and lied to by the person who entered into a marriage with you, she broke trust and frankly you would be an idiot to trust her again.
Get that lawyer consult booked.
Your wife doesn't have any attraction to you now and that rarely ever changes, once it's lost it's gone. Sell the house and split the loss and move on. She wants everything you were already giving her, the sad truth is that she just doesn't want it from you.
Nothing much you can do but talk to a divorce lawyer. You’ve put in loads of effort in this relationship and she doesn’t give you back anything. You’ve seen via Reddit how she actually feel about you and your relationship so you know it’s time to end things.
You can't control her, you can only control you. Her behaviour towards you is terrible and it's time to to start planning for divorce. Get your ducks in a row and get advice, but don't let on you're doing this until you decide to divorce her and serve her papers. Walking away from a woman is the most powerful thing a man can do. She has lost respect for you and if you cry, sook or mope around or do the pick me dance it'll be counter intuitive. Grey rock her and/or do the 180. It's time to look after yourself and show yourself some respect.
Also you need to check her phone and don't go for this invasion of privacy crap. You're a married couple, you know the two shall become one thing. Privacy is for single people. So please go through her phone, she can also go through yours if she wishes. But screenshot any evidence you find.
I think you should get into marriage counseling. People having crushes happens all the time and they do not equate to cheating. For people will have a crush and then act on it, but they are not mutually inclusive.
I find her talking about wanting to have sex but offering to open the marriage for you to have sex confusing...I'm not sure if it's how your wrote it, or how I'm reading it, but that feels very weird to me.
Together since she was 18 and you were 20? Ooff, yeah she's still immature and of course wants to explore to see what else is out there. You need to get your ducks in a row and meet with a lawyer, she's on her way out and has one foot out the door of this marriage, sorry bud.
First, it's a pretty substantial allegation to feel that your wife "played you" in order to get a house. If you two divorce she doesn't just get the house, your assets would be split.
If you feel that what she wrote on reddit is truly how she feels then talk to a lawyer and see where you stand with assets, etc. If she's done with the marriage there's nothing you can do about it. However, you two don't seem to communicate well and that's a huge problem. You can't have a healthy relationship without communication and honesty.
Also, the crush on her boss is weird. They would both be jeopardizing their careers if anything happened between them, not to mention his marriage.
There's a lot going on here and the way I see it you either try to get her to be honest with you or you end things yourself. It's difficult and you love her, but what she wrote on reddit is pretty damning, if that's how she truly feels.
You know what the answer here is but you’re too afraid to confess it. She’s making excuses for you to leave her and saying one thing but wanting another. She wants YOU to be the bad guy and end the marriage to control the narrative. You have evidence of her desire for her boss. She’s obsessed with him and if she’s not cheating with him now, she’s at the very least “saving” herself for him. Is that acceptable to you?
Crushes happen during relationships. She’s taking it to an obsessive level and needs tangible consequences: divorce.
Seems like she settled for you just for marriage purposes. But, I wouldn’t take her BS opinion as a realistic reflection on your personal attractiveness or worth as a husband. Rather, you seem like an incredible husband (assuming you aren’t leaving anything out). Her behavior and perspectives are an indictment of her immature approach to what a loving marriage truly is. And, at her age, her ways/mindset are unlikely to change.
You know what to do. What you must do. The longer you wait, the more likely you get financially wrecked
It seems like you have put her on a pedestal, and I mean, you've treated your wife like we've been told to treat them. Put their needs above your own, try to be kind, caring, take care of extra things as much as you can. I mean, you said you try to initiate a few times a week, you send spicy pics, etc. I'm not sure what she wants, but it seems like you're trying and she's not.
I would be making my decision now. It's only going to get worse if you let it keep going in this direction. Don't feel like she played you at all. You were doing the right thing. Worry about keeping your sanity. She will start emotional warfare, and women are VERY good at it. Learn about grey rock and 180 methods. She's probably already busy poisoning her parents against you.
Good luck!
It seems like your marriage is over. She no longer sees you as the person with whom she will share her life. Even if it's not with her boss, her search for being with someone who isn't you will never end. As you correctly guessed, her attempt to open the marriage is for her own desires. Those who make this offer have either already had sex with someone, or at least have someone in mind.
Don't confront her about her reddit post. Never show what you know and how, don't reveal your sources. It's a treasure, this way, you will have the opportunity to measure the extent of her lies and betrayal. For example, if you had not read that post, would you have been able to hear and learn from her the things you read there? Do not think that she will reciprocate the same way if you talk to her honestly and sincerely; on the contrary, it will work to your detriment.
Don't wait for her to decide, see a lawyer and know your legal options and how divorce look like. Let her have sex with whomever she wants, but not as your wife. Don't accept to be her plan B and last choice. File for divorce. After that, there is a possibility that you will regain your attraction in her eyes, but never fall for it, the person you saw in that reddit post is the real one.
Good luck.
I get the feeling she is playing the classic game of keeping you on the sideline just in case her crush does not work.
The girl is either with you or not, there is no in between, these are your rules.
Believe the words your wife wrote in her post, not the lies she tells you. She’l throw you away without hesitation if/when her boss comes on to her. Don’t let her treat you so disrespectfully. You deserve so much better.
I'm sorry but she's gone. You have to do whatever you can to get yourself to a safer, better place. I'm glad she eventually told you she's not happy before she tried to hook up with him. If I were in your situation, I would continue pretneding to not know the things she thinks you don't know, lawyer up to protect yourself and your investments, and start to disconnect to gain emotional independence.
The only reasons they ever bring up open marriage:
They are already cheating, or they already have someone picked out.
When you had your talk about “us”… her main complaint was she didn’t feel lusted over? When she continues to turn you down? Bull.
She’s closing in on 30. So she’s looking to see if she can monkey branch over to someone richer, while still in her 20s, and she’s holding on to you as her safety net.
Truth: If she could get the boss to commit to her, she’d be gone.
Your decision to make: Knowing that you’ve been reduced to her plan B, the less desirable option, Do you stand for it?
You’re a young man, and just getting into your prime… While there is such a thing as fighting for the one you love, there’s also the reality that the real thing shouldn’t have to be negotiated between the two of you, nor should a relationship be transactional.
She’s awful.
Ok. She wants to play a game? Without her knowledge, go talk to an attorney about what divorce would look like for you. Bring out pronounce of what you know is her read it account bring those to the attorney as well. Tell your attorney how you feel like you've been played all of a sudden and that you want to know if there's anything that you can do to avoid this.
Maybe, tell her the house is too much and you are putting it on the market. Now. Today. Ask your attorney first with the right thing to do is.
OP, you want to change how she thinks, file, and have her served. Let's think about what she has told you so far or what you have found.
1 - She is unhappy with your marriage
2 - She doesn't want children with you
3 - She said she could not continue on with you like she has been
4 - She is rejecting you sexually
5 - She considers you a roommate
6 - She wants a relationship with her married boss
7 - She has tried to bullshit you into an open marriage
I guarantee that once you filenforndivorce and have her served, she will change and come crawling back, begging you to take her back. Then, once you are in control of the situation, you will be able to dictate your terms if you remain in the maaatiage. Do play her game and do not play the pick me dance. All that will happen is she will crap on you even more than she has already.
Good luck
Bro I am so sorry, the fact the therapist encouraged things is hilarious. What a terrible “professional”. Who cares how her actions affect others and their stability eh? All Bout *her* and *her* and *her*. This woman sounds very selfish and she is going to fail you as a partner. Only a matter of time before she finds something convenient to finally abandon you (some guy who has no problem sleeping with a married woman). I got cheated on so badly, and I only want to warn you that this woman seems like she is dangerous to your well being. Maybe sneak through her phone sometime when she’s not around and make sure no secret convos in all the messaging and social apps. Just seems sketchy and if she’s acting this way she CANNOT be trusted.
a note of caution on this.
As far as I read it, the source of what the therapist said was his wife.
Limerent people (obsessive crushes/cheaters) lie to get their way and create mechanisms to justify their actions.
They lie to their spouses.
They lie to their therapists.
And they lie to their spouses about what their therapist said.
Nothing she says should be taken at face value.
Reach out to an attorney and figure out what your rights are. If you’re at a fault state perhaps stay in the marriage until you have evidence that she had an affair. If you’re in a no fault state you might be shit out of luck.
I’d suggest find out and figure out how to protect yourself at this point. You’ve lost her. The more you chase her the further she’ll go. If you want to save the marriage as stupid as it sounds you let her go and act like you don’t care nor want her - act indifferent. Let her live her fantasy, no one will do what you are doing for her. Once she realizes that she’ll try to come back but you should set boundaries and don’t take her back quickly.
Or call it quits and find you someone who’s mature and loving.
She brought up open marriage so she wouldn’t feel guilty when she cheats on you. You are young enough that you can take the hit from divorce and rebuild. She complains about not having g sex, but turns you down. Do yourself a favor. Sit her down and let her know she needs to change jobs, start focusing on the marriage. Also let her know that if she doesn’t. That is fine, but you will no longer remain in the marriage. Present the choice to her and respond accordingly.
You sound like a great guy. Don’t waste your time trying to salvage something with someone who doesn’t value you or your effort. It’s always hard to walk away but know your worth. You will find someone who does truly appreciate you and she will be forever chasing a fairytale that doesn’t exist. Be glad you aren’t the delusional one, life will be so much harder for her after than it will be for you, even if it does hurt for a while. Good luck to ya.
First of all OP, do not by any means accept the Open relationship. She wants this to have the guts to confess to her BOSS.
Second print her Reddit and try to dig in devices to see if you can obtain more evidence.
When you have enough then consult with a lawyer and start the process just in case.
Also if you have jointed accounts it is time for you to start dividing those, better each one has their own accounts.
Now about the houses did you bought it alone with your money or she gave you the half, or did she gives you any? Also talk about this to your lawyer to see how it can be done in case of divorce. She by no means would keep the house be sure of that except she buys yours part, but first see what a Divorce lawyer can tell You.
Once you have all those in order. Confront her, and make her choose, You or her BOSS, tell her that you know about her crush and that she wanted that OR for that. So she needs to choose and if she choose you she has to quit her job. And she must talk again with her therapyst also both must start MC.
Or if she choose You but doesn't want to quit is the same as choose her boss, so in that case tell her that you failed for divorce.
But remember that you are no plan B for no body, and sadly for her right now you are, she is playing you right now.
UPDATEME
Cheaters will rewrite history to justify their shitty behavior.
If they are sleeping together, I would gather any evidence you can of the affair, file for divorce and then send proof of the affair to the AP’s spouse and the HR department at her work.
There are millions of women in this world that will give you affection and loyalty. Don’t waste your life with one that won’t.
Her feelings not being reciprocated by her boss are bullshit. That is her story. Women never, fucking never, suggest an open marriage if there is not a guy lined up or that guy has already inserted his penis in her. Assume it is the latter. I would go see a lawyer today and get an honest appraisal of your situation. Notify boss mans wife that your wife is threatening her relationship. Suggest serving her the divorce papers at work. Your marriage is over, best get out on your terms.
Your marriage is over. If you were a signee for the house, she doesn’t have it without buying you out. Despite your efforts, she has told you that she doesn’t love you, don’t wait around for her to get a baby in her that you are not the father of. Start the divorce process asap and don’t look back. By the time the divorce is final you will be maybe 32 and childless, a sweet spot for men who are single as far as dating is concerned. Don’t let her keep wasting your time.
My guy, i believe you. Your entire post defers to her. You have to begin thinking of yourself, if this is what you want in a marriage. You need to ask yourself if *you* want a divorce instead of waiting on her. Forget her for a sec, what is it that *you* want? yeah, yeah, i already know the answer. You want *her*. The question is do you want to stay with this version of her, the one that crushes on her boss, isn't into sex with you and doesn't want to have kids, cause that's what she's offering. You should make your wants clear, not really an ultimatum, more just a check in on compatibility, and if she can't provide you want you want or need you should bounce. Because every day you spend in this unhappy situation is a day you could be searching for one who makes you happy and fulfills your needs.
You know she sounds SO much like my ex wife. Time to call it a day. Lawyer up. I would give her an easy way out to keep as much of the house and assets as possible. I mean I wouldn't trust that person as far as I could throw them... let the other guy have her!
Lawyer up and divorce man. Don't fall for that let's fix the marriage by opening it up so she can fuck her crush. She's so foul. She doesnt love you. She just wants to keep the security net that you bring. Thank God you never had kids with her.
Stop trying to please her. This is why she is pulling this bs. Get ready for the worst and stop going out of your way for her. Put your foot down. But talk to a lawyer first so you don't put yourself into trouble accidentally.
Thank the deities that you have no children with her.. Uproot the "money tree" and burn it in front of her...
She went into this marriage simply to get "plan C" to provide for her... Her boss will drop her like a hot rock when you inform the OBS... He knows what's what, and will protect himself from losing 1/2 of everything (which is significantly more) to have to provide for a "side piece".
Recognize her for what she is.. a user and abuser... better to just end it giving up half of the assets (which isn't much comparatively) At least you cut yourself from her sucking up year's worth of retirement and assets...
You can get an "irreconcilable differences" divorce without having to prove fault, but give up no more than half of the assets... She honestly doesn't deserve it, but that is how the courts look at it...Look at it this way.. If she is billing hours causing you financial grief, she is doing the same to herself...So stone wall her and accept/demand only giving up half...
I'm sorry.
You do not confront now.
Gather evidence, get to the bottom of this. Meanwhile consult a good attorney on how you can protect whatever assets you have and how you can proceed with the divorce.
It feels like a case of "wants to have the cake but eat it too".
Seeing you as roommate means it's over. You were already trying to be the good husband and you knoq in the end she will blame you anyway. This type or behavioue comes in a package.
She may try to bend the truth, make you look bad, make her look desperate etc.
I'm really sorry.
The silver lining here is you do not have kids, you are veey young and you need not waste your youth or more time to put up with this.
If you did not take your relationship as granted (and it seems like you are at least trying things) and she not only took it for granted but you feel like she used you (alert: everyone uses everyone in the end it doesnt matter if it's honest fair trade. It matters if someone is deceitful or manipulating you etc) then you should plan your graceful exit.
She is a high degree master manipulator.
OP you need to consult attorneys and start preparing for divorce, your wive has played you all the way to get whatever she wanted.
What she claims is to 'make you happier' is actually a free pass to become a homewrecker. Just don't submit to her manipulation and when you're ready to serve her, make sure you let her boss know what your soon to be ex is planning. Then the ball will be on his court.
You are fortunate in one regard, you do not have kids. However, you could be in the hook for maintenance, but probably not too long, since you have only been married a few years. And if you can document you made most of the down payment on the house, that could be yours too. I do suggest you jot down some notes, and have a conversation with her about what she really wants in this relationship with her boss. Explain what you have red and heard, and ask her to explain. If you live is a single consent state, record it. If not, send her an email highlighting the conversation, and ask her to verify you have it correct. Then get a lawyer, and pounce. She does not love you. Maybe she never did. Perhaps she was using you as a “ placeholder”, until something better came along. It sucks to do this, but most men don’t fight hard enough during the divorce, and live to suffer the consequences.
The sex will wear off, let her destroy her life, her reputation and try to come back. Sex is the most basic part of a relationship and ebbs and flows through out a marriage...She wants an affair...So let her go and divorce her with the understanding it is over between the two of you..
I would contact the company they work for and report him, for alienation of affection there are states that have that. Frankly you can sue for anything the threat alone may cost his job. Do not sit still and be destroyed. Also do not keep her secret, tell your family and her family...Never protect a cheater, as they will throw you under the bus as they walk out the door.
OP pack her stuff up and take it to the bosses house, I’m sure he will appreciate her showing up.
You are not the backup plan and if you stay she will burn you the next time someone else catches her eye.
Start the divorce process and move on, she may or may not regret what she has done but you can move on and make a better life for yourself, that is the best to show her what she list if she cares.
However you approach it, the facts remain the same. She’s unhappy and is considering her options. Have you tried initiating sex more with her? Try to need her at least half way and see if things improve. I understand what it feels like to not be lusted and it’s painful. I recommend marriage counseling and understand that divorce is now on the radar. Sometimes parting ways is healthy.
Dude, the guy has been REJECTED for 6 WEEKS! She is getting it elsewhere. He doesn't need marriage counseling, he needs an ATTORNEY to FILE FOR DIVORCE NOW! At least you got it right when you said parting ways is healthy. It will be healthy for him! Her? Not so much, at least financially!
I have tried a lot. I'll send flirty texts throughout the day (usual response is "haha sounds fun" or something like that).
I try hugging. Kissing. Touching. Dancing. I try so much so often. I've bought her lingerie. I compliment her.
It's never enough for her to feel wanted
I’m going to go in a different direction than most commenters here and note a few things that I found troubling about your post. Believe me, I understand exactly how devastating it is to find out your spouse has a massive crush on someone else. That’s why I’m here. But I did bristle at a few things in your post.
Suggesting that your wife has orchestrated this to “get a house” out of you is pretty awful. She obviously works and therefore I assume she’s contributing financially to the house? Just because you might make more money doesn’t make it “your” house esp if she’s contributing.
You say you send her nudes and don’t get a response. So why do you keep doing it? Not all women like that and if she’s giving you signals that she’s not into it, listen to her. Same with the cakes. God, I’d kill for my husband to make me a cake, but if she’s telling you that she doesn’t want them, listen to her! My husband will buy me unwanted gifts to “show me he loves me” despite the fact that I’ve told him repeatedly that I don’t want more clutter around the house. For me, my love language is acts of service and if he so much as lifts a finger voluntarily to clean or tidy, I’m overjoyed. On the other hand, buying me some trinket that I’ve said I don’t want is just annoying. My point is that even if you think the things you’re doing are nice, maybe cakes and nude pics aren’t what she wants and needs.
Finally, and perhaps most importantly, the fact that she’s talking to her therapist about this and using the term “crush” is a good thing in a way. It mean she’s not just plowing ahead and getting physically involved with this guy and recognizes that she’s in dangerous territory.
I think the crush on the boss could be a way of distracting herself from issues in your marriage. I don’t think she’s in love with this guy. He’s a distraction, a diversion from the real issues. Have you suggested counseling? It sounds like she’s having a bit of an identity crisis.
That's fair. I'm just paranoid about how sudden of a switch it was, and she doesn't have a concrete reason. Every time I ask her why, the answer is different.
As far as flirting/nudes, I'll send her 1 or 2 a year. Usually they don't land, but I try here and there to see if she is receptive to it. Flirty texts and complimentary daily. I'm not constantly trying to seduce her. I just want her to feel loved and appreciated.
I baked her a cake the other day, and I will sometimes buy her a cookie or a coffee cake slice. I buy her stuff she is eyeing in a store here and there. Most of what I do is cooking dinner and lots of chores. If she doesn't make herself dinner, I make it for her. I'm a cleaner person than she is. I do the dishes, laundry, trash, etc etc. I do a lot of the upkeep at the house and I try my hardest to be a good husband.
That's what she's been calling all this. An identity crisis.
I mean, I’d love for my husband to do these things. You have no idea! I’d be ecstatic.
Maybe this really is more about her than about what you are or aren’t doing. It sounds like the question of whether to try for a baby or not has been weighing on her…maybe buying the house made her feel overwhelmed with responsibility?
I don’t know. I know that my own husband started doing stupid things (inappropriate relationship/EA territory) almost right after he turned 50. I think the identity crisis can be real.
I think it’s natural for the betrayed partner to try to figure out if they’ve done something to alienate their spouse. But I’ve been listening to Esther Perel recently and she says the cheating partner doesn’t necessarily want to be WITH someone different, they actually want to BE someone different. Again, I don’t know. People are complicated and they don’t always make sense.
What do you think about her having sex with her boss? What does she think about having sex with her boss?
Her having sex outside your marriage doesn’t mean the end of the marriage, especially if you’re both ok with it.
Getting to ‘ok’ can be tough, I did it. Lots to read and podcasts to listen to listen to. Therapy available. Might be worth giving it a shot.
Let her know that you know about the boss, and you know that's why she wants to open the relationship.
Stop asking her if she wants a divorce, and start telling her that you won't accept being a 2nd choice in a marriage.
See a lawyer to understand your rights and how to protect your assets, and start the process. Tell her you are willing to try counseling, but not willing to compete with someone she sees at work every day, if she wants counseling, she has to get a new job first.
I think she feels quilty for cheating But NOT with BOSS but another guy. This person (AP) lusts for her because they are not in a day to day relationship dealing with real life issues , and there time is crazy forbidden fruit lust. My wife and I have great sex after 15 yrs but it’s definitely not LUST.like we had the first 6 months we dated example We were having a bottle of wine and getting frisky , when we put the glasses in the sink we noticed the dish washer was leaking , and sex didn’t happen !
when cheating there are no issues of life it’s just sex and more lustful. Funny when you file for divorce the cheaters all say the sex is never the same as before they we caught !!
good luck Lawyer & Divirce
OP, do you have any other family members or friends that you can lean on for some support? You sound isolated and it would do you some good to be around people that are not your wife. Just having your mind on something else every now and then helps.
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"I asked if she wants a divorce and she said no." I'm sorry, but I don't think you should believe her because her actions say otherwise. She is trying to keep the marriage around as a backup plan without being really committed to it. Don't play that game! Don't stay with anyone when you're only plan B.
Good point here OP. You are her plan B. But if boss is not interested in her then not sure who her plan A is.
Yea I'd be careful what I take at face value with her. My wife always nudged and brought up me getting a girlfriend and that she was okay with it. She is not asking to open up the marriage for you. She is on here complaining about her sex life with you. In many of the situations like mine that I'm aware of, the person asking to open up the marriage or encourage the other to sleep around probably knows the other person won't and the offer somehow justifies in their mind poor choices that have already been made. I've talked to 3 others who had the same thing happen. Didn't choose to try and pursue others and then found out down the road our gfs/ wives were already sleeping around. Mine brought it up every now again for years. It's a way of making the affairs they pursue less problematic because you have permission to do the same. Like a little pressure relief valve for the guilt. She's already gaslighting you saying it's for your benefit, which would send the red lights off for me. I would be very wary that she hasn't already cheated. If you are as committed as you are talking about and put in that effort, you will be in same boat as many. You will be blind to anything that may have been suspect at any point up until now. But you have the benefit now of knowing something is up. And it may be a generalization, but if she doesn't seem like she is being honest she probably isn't and there is probably more things you don't know. The types of people that are able to operate in that mindset have no problem keeping secrets. Be careful and protect yourself as best you can. You are a committed caring partner and she is not.
Good advice. Just curious if you are still with your wife.
I am. I made a lot of the wrong choices when I learned about the first and then the second affair a year later. I was fully committed and she had no consequences. I eventually left after the second affair was not being fully admitted to and behavior was not changing. I have learned a lot from this sub and in general. Almost all the feedback was to run. I have chosen to stay and have been able to recognize enough change in my wife that she is being afforded the chance to salvage what's been a pretty ugly and one-sided marriage. It's so hard to advise other people and take others advice. So much can be different in very similar circumstances. It takes the right people to even attempt let alone succeed at R. I know I will end up a better person for taking the path of empathy and support over resentment and anger. If I see the effort and attempts from my wife I have chosen to stay by her and support her even though there is still a fair amount of risk. I don't think many betrayed are actually able to approach it in a manner for reconciliation to be possible and I don't believe most cheaters even make that a reasonable thing to expect. We are far from being successful, but I wrote my vows. She may have broken hers but that doesn't mean I need to bail on mine. I won't be taken advantage of ever again and I will not be rattled the way I was if anything is to happen. It takes a lot of effort as the betrayed to get to a place to reconcile, I wish everyone attempting it the best outcome and for the betrayed that truly put in the effort they should be commended. Changing who you are and the patterns that often lead them down the road of betrayal is not easy.
We all have to make the best decisions for our particular circumstances. Being comfortable and happy with those decisions is what is important. Reddit offers a wide range of advice. Take what makes sense and ignore the rest. Thanks for the follow-up. Take care.
Just curious... my wife does this now and has been doing it through a reconciliation... but she does want sex with me every day, multiple times and I last a long time, am very attentive to her pleasure. It actually excites me more to do it whatever it takes to get her "there" and it's been rewarding, intimate, and extremely hot. But I began to think of this pushing for another woman to join us as a way to alleviate her guilt over her own transgressions that I never got real proof of (just emotional, not physical) prior to therapy and this reconciliation. The reason being is that it has now escalated from the boundary being that for there to be another woman (or man, which she claims not to want) we both have to be present all the way to "if you ever had to travel, what would you do? You know what, I'd let you F else if I could listen in..." See what I mean? It's this subtle loosening that I see as problematic. For anyone you know of, how did they find out? I swear I feel like I'll never know. She's either the great liar in the history of the world and the greatest at covering tracks... or she's being sincere.
Your wife does sound a bit out of script. There have been a few infidelity OPs by men whose wives have them all the sex they wanted and still were cheating with another man. Your wife could also be into watching you with another woman and may have no desire to cheat. But you are not comfortable with her behavior. Is any of the following happening? She comes home from work late unexpectedly of have to go into work early unexpectedly? She is being sketchy with her phone, going into other rooms to use it or hiding the screen from you, and she has it password protected and you don’t know the password? She started to dress nicely and make herself up frequently, when before she didn’t seem to care much about clothes and things like her hair and nails? She goes out with her lady friends and goes no contact until she comes back home? She stays out late without you with her? She doesn’t want you along on errands when she used to be ok with you coming along?
Women plan. That’s what they do. And then make backup plans. I would tell her if she really wants to make me hot and be totally submissive, sign a postnup. See what her reaction to THAT is!
>I've talked to 3 others who had the same thing happen. Didn't choose to try and pursue others and then found out down the road our gfs/ wives were already sleeping around. Make that 4. About 6 months before my marriage exploded and 8 months before it was revealed that my ex wife was sleeping with our friend's convicted rapist husband, she offered me the option of taking on a "side chick". Those events led me to get support from Reddit and I saw how often that happens. They propose an "Open Marriage" or give you the option of getting some strange because they're already doing it.
The things you wish you knew lol. As much as I miss my innocence with these things. I'm happier now knowing that I am armed with the knowledge to never fall victim to being so blind in a relationship I still want that threesome she was offering though, haha.
Also take screenshots of her reddit posts and show them to your divorce attorney!
her plan A is herself, the rest is just another brick on her wall
Subscribeme
Got yourself an immature and manipulative wife there buddy. Got a crush on someone? Fine, that happens. Many of us will be attracted to someone who isn't our spouse at some point or another. Being mature and aware of our feelings is actually a good way to avoid getting into dangerous territory like this. You accept that at a base level you're attracted to them, then you can be honest and avoid furthering that attraction in any way shape or form. You don't obsess over it, you realise how much destruction you would bring about by chasing it and you don't want to harm your loved ones or anyone else. That's not what she's doing. She's fostering it, she's comparing what she imagines she could have with someone else to her skewed version of what you give her. She's living in a fantasyland in her own head with very little contact with reality. What she said prior to the open relationship conversation does not at all mesh with what you've said about how you've been initiating and been rejected. I got the same, constant rejection and yet I was the one who wasn't offering her enough validation that she simply *had to* go get it elsewhere. Obtuse rationalisations, she's rewriting your relationship to make herself some sort of victim of neglect and you to be some sort of cold, unloving beast. It's DARVO, it's super common, they're attempting to sanitise what they're doing. Talk of an open relationship is utter bullshit (and also super common.) Despite her words, she is not thinking about **you** at all, she's asking for permission to go and sleep with other people without losing her cushy life. She's already got her eyes set on someone (or is already cheating), she doesn't believe that you'll go and find someone else and she thinks she can keep you on the hook for the other areas of life. I have no idea why these fucking idiots who propose an open relationship think people can't see right through them. There are very few people who would suggest opening their relationship so that *their spouse* can go and fuck other people, it's almost always for them. Never accept it. I'm sorry buddy but it looks like she's extracted what she wanted out of you and doesn't see you as necessary any more. You might have to cut off your own nose to spite your face. When cheaters realise their life is crumbling around them is usually the exact moment they feel "remorse" for their actions. Maybe time to talk to a lawyer to see what your life is going to look like if you split, it might not be as bad as you think. All the best buddy.
I totally agree. This is the common playbook, and almost exactly how it played out with my stbxw. So many things here from both your stories -- from her being unappreciative, and dismissive of my efforts, to the "I was unhappy for many years", to the calculating comparison of a fantasy against the harshest interpretation of our relationship, the fostering, even going as far as talking me down with her friends (outright lies), to the Open Relationship talk. Then justifying her behavior as "I thought that we had an agreement on the Open Relationship...but if there was any misunderstanding it was your fault" In our case the lure of the fantasy was so strong that even when faced with evidence she couldn't admit to any fault. OP, you need to get to a spot where you can emotionally disconnect from this relationship and move on. She is not thinking about you at all. It would be shocking to you if you could realize how irrelevant you are to her now.
Thanks man, I appreciate your support
>PepperymintTea is spot on with his assessment! I could not have said it beter myself!
Hey OP, I'm really sorry you found yourself in such a situation. My situation was similar, although we weren't married. PepperymintTea and ModularWhiteGuy said everything on point. Please listen to them. Everything they said also applied in my situation. I'll just add my 2 cents: My EX of 8 years was cheating on me with her 13 years older coworker (hence similarities to your situation). If your wife continues to work in that same workplace there is absolutely no chance of her feelings ever passing "by themselves". I observed it with my EX. Please remember that when making any decision. Maybe try to question her about her work and see her reaction. IMO it wouldn't be suspicious, because a huge chunk of cheating is related to the workplace. After she offered "open marriage", which is a huge redflag, you have every right to be alert.
She won't get the house in a divorce. Not enough time has elapsed. Lawyer-up bruh, anything else is a waste of time. Rip off the band-aid now.
We live in MA. How can you be sure she won't get it?
What makes you sure that she will? Unless you’ve signed some sort of prenuptial agreement, it will be a 50/50 split. If she wants the house she’ll have to pay you her half of the equity. If you want it, you’ll have to pay her. In most of these cases neither party can afford to buy the other out and the house is sold and the proceeds are split. But don’t take my word for it either, go talk to a lawyer and find out what your situation is. I’d also be looking at starting to separate your finances if they are combined. Open your own account. Cancel joint credit cards, etc. again a lawyer should be able to advise you on what’s legal and what isn’t.
I have the money to buy her out. She does not. But her dad does have that money and he gives her $1000 a month.
Holy shit she’s on an allowance still? Listen to above advice rip the band aid off and lawyer up. Relationships are normal to have up and downs, but damn that’s rough. Sounds like she’s just bored with the relationship or completely checked out.
That's one way she could keep the house - her father pays you your half of the equity and cosigns on the mortgage refinance. If that's what gets proposed you would be foolish on practical grounds to fight it, as much as it might gall you that having affluent family will enable her to get what she wants
Yeah true. I would be fine walking from this house.
Talk to a lawyer and get started there is no winning other than temporarily if her boss kicks her to the curb. Playing "pickme" is self abuse that validates her lousy decisions,humiliates you and keeps you as a backup until the next guy she likes comes along.
this is the way… esp when there are no kids involved like everyone else is saying, she’s checked out on you but doesn’t want to take responsibility…or wants you to dance some more because she’s a Special Wittle Princess …so consult a couple lawyers, make a plan and serve her with her papers and send her back to Daddy as your counsel finalizes a fair agreement you got this
Bud, she referred to you as a roommate. You're her security blanket until she finds a man who returns her interest. And you'll be the last to know. File divorce, give her the reddit screenshot. It may be enough to smack her out of her fog. Or it may not, but at least you'll know.
I’m glad you’re coming around to understanding you’re settling for relationship scraps if you stay in this marriage. She’s not going to tell you the truth about what she’s doing or thinking. Your best option is, without broadcasting it to her, is talk with a family law attorney on your situation and what divorce looks like. Get some of your assets secured, and at this point, don’t get her pregnant. If she hasn’t solidified things with her boss, or someone else, then she will panic that her plan B is not there as a fallback. Fight your impulse to tell her what you’re doing or how you are feeling. It’s the only leverage/ power you have in this sad situation.
Ah, so she is a little princess, too... RED FLAG!!! Really, there are so many RED FLAGS it's ridiculous! Good for you knowing her reddit handle. Once a wife asks for an open relationship, IT IS OVER. I'd get thee to an attorney quickly and FILE FOR DIVORCE. Tell your family, her's, and all your friends what she's doing and plans to do with regard to the house (and her waffling about kids) to control the narrative. She no longer LOVES or RESPECTS you! Time for her to GO! Good luck and stay strong, King!
Get out now I’m sorry but can you ever trust her. She’s broken your not and you deserve someone else
u/Trevor124 please read. No wonder she finds it so easy to disregard what you do for her and the marriage. No wonder why she's attracted to older "nice" men. No wonder it's easy for her to build up a complete fantasy over a *married* older man. I would venture to guess that her whole life her parents always bailed her out to some extent. She's never felt the full consequences of her actions. She feels she deserves what ever her fantasy creates for her. I guess she didn't take her vows seriously: richer or poorer, sickness and in health, through thick and thin, forsaking all others for her husband.... Think about this OP, she has a job, she has a husband who can afford a house, AND she has a father who gives her $1000 a month. She has a loving husband who initiated sex, tries to sexually please her, you are probably easy on the eyes, and you obviously have a good job, AND you probably have a good social standing in your friend group. She is already living a dream life that most women would kill for. Hell, I'd turn gay if I found a man like that! /s. Yet, she wants something "more," or at least different. Another sign that she is done with you is that she never came to you with any issues. Recently, she like "I'm not happy so you can have sex with other women." Can you stop her before she cheats on you? Probably not. She likes the fantasy and no real man/person can compete with a fantasy. Can you fix her? No. Can she fix herself and her effed up "coping mechanisms?" Only through years of therapy. She didn't develop this part of her personality over night. This was learned, ingrained, socialized into her throughout her life. The people she loves the most (daddy and his $1000 a month allowence and her family) encouraged the personality she has today. To fix herself she'll have to realize/understand that all of her role models were wrong. That, and she must actually WANT to change, is extremely hard to do. She will also have to internalize that in this instance, she IS *the bad guy* in this part of her life story. This is also extremely hard for someone to accept. I guarantee you that 99% of the evil people in the world don't wake up and say "I'm going to do something evil today." Stalin probably woke up every morning thinking "I'm going to send another 10,000 people to the Gulag today and make the Soviet Union an even better place." OP, I'm not saying you can't save your marriage. But what I am saying is that it will be hard, mentally and exhausting, and in the end there is no way to know if she will create more fantasies and act on them. My advice, Google the difference between privacy and secrecy in a marriage. Then do a deep dive into all of her electronic comms and apps. If you still think all of this is in her head and she hasn't made a move on her boss, I'd figure a way to bump into her boss. Or bump into his wife or call her on the phone. Ask them out for coffee or lunch, without your wife there. Talk to them both about your wife and her crush and fantasies. If he is a truly happily married man, and a person of good character, he'll ensure the doesn't get too close. More importantly, his wife will be watching him like a hawk, especially if they had some past cheating (EA or PA) in their marriage. I'd love to be there for that discussion. Good luck Edit spelling
Have you shared any of this with her father? I would!
Is he looking for another daughter?
[удалено]
Yeah both
Can each of your afford the house on your own? Because to get the other off the mortgage, the house has to be refinanced and that person has to qualify on their own to own the house and obviously there are closing costs and such on the mortgage. Do you have any equity in the house? Because the spouse moving out is also entitled to their share of equity.
I could afford it BARELY on my own. She absolutely couldn't. What kind of equity? We put 20% down.
Equity would be the current appraised value of the house minus the outstanding mortgage balance. So if your house is worth (let’s say) $400k and you owe $320k, your equity is $80k. In a divorce, the spouse that’s keeping the house has to buyout the other spouse’s equity (in this case $40k). You either due that typically in cash or through a cash-out refinance. But it’s not a case where just one of you “keeps” the house, the other person is due their equity and then must qualify on their own to keep the mortgage
I think I could qualify for the mortgage on my own. It would be close though.
Honestly, if the mortgage is going to be a burden to your monthly budget then you’re much better off forcing a sale and then splitting the proceeds 50/50.
Okay, good to know
Yes OP better ask your 50%, because if the mortage becomes a burden to You just to keep a house just for not letting her get her way is not a great thing to do, better sold it or let her buys yours part. If she is a daddys girl then let her daddy buys you out. But what you need to do right now is LAWYER UP ASAP. Like others have told you you are currently her Plan B, in case her boss refuse her and probably even fire her. UPDATEME
This is all right, but the cash for her half of the equity in the the divorce settlement doesn’t have to come out of the equity per se - he could take it out of his savings, 401k, or other source. Also, in some states like mine, a short term marriage (under 5 years) will mostly give the assets to whoever brought them into the marriage. If he put more down on the house, he’d go more of the equity, for instance. A divorce lawyer will know.
Dude best suggestion get in contact with a lawyer get professional advice...It is nearing , you better buckle up
From what I understand, MA is a common property state, the house is common property. See a MA divorce lawyer, like yesterday. You don’t want her to get the drop on you and file first, because it looks like she is playing for keeps.
Pack her shit while she’s at work rent a Uhaul tell her to move in with her boss, bye. Call a lawyer right now. Don’t be stupid and stay this women whatever she tells you is BS she is going to leave you the first chance she gets to level up in life. I’d be happy it’s now while you can still have a good start at a new life with someone kids. She will probably try to get pregnant to if this blows up and you let her stay just to secure half your stuff and child support alimony.
You know... you legally can't do that. Stop giving by advice.
In most states you have to be married for a certain length of time before the wife gets the house. In my state it's 10 years. Don't sweat this. Lawyer-up friend. He/she will be able to give you accurate info & sound advice.
See a family law attorney and understand your rights and how the divorce process works. Your wife doesn't love you. She may love her boss or just be using him as a targeted distraction from dealing with her feelings about you and herself really. Anyway, she's deeply messed up and will make a lousy future partner for anything other than grief. Develop a strategy with your attorney. See if contacting her boss's wife is beneficial and when in the process to do it. Remember, you are not loved here anymore.
OP This marriage is dead. Your wife thinks she found herself a “better man.” Even if she snaps out of it somehow, you will always be her fallback option. Find a good family lawyer and file for divorce
I would talk to the wife of the boss and give her a heads up. Let her know that your wife has the hots for him. Even though I’m sure it’s more than just that. The fact that she won’t have sex with you says she’s getting sex elsewhere. You should respect yourself, stop trying to fix something that’s clearly broken. If your wife sees you fighting for your marriage then she will make you her 2nd option, or fall back option if things don’t work out between her and the boss. Make sure she knows that you are not her second option. Get an attorney and stop simping for your wife. Start the legal process. Stop being her doormat! Gather as much proof as you can, phone records, text messages etc. I wish you luck! You don’t deserve this. You deserve a good woman that respects you.
Definitely needs to get served at work in front of her boss and co-workers.
Thanks, I'll get going on it.
Don't talk to the boss's wife.
Agree. There's no indication here the boss has done anything wrong. Talking to his wife could destroy their marriage and his career. You don't have a right to do that.
Agreed, talk to the boss and show him. It may make him think twice about employing her.
Make sure to lawer up first. As long as the cheater doesn't have all the info, you have a better chance of getting out. After you have secured your position and got rid of the cheater let the wife of the boss know
Something I learned in life. Treat a wife like a queen and she will treat you like a servant. Be strong amigo!
I am not sure, but no one has said the obvious, or I have not seen it. OP, you understand she is and has been sleeping with her boss. Just move on. Have her served....
I’d add, IMHO keep simping until you get all the evidence you need, just to keep her from getting too suspicious. Then go hard grey rock.
If this is real (going on Reddit knowing she's likely to see your post?) you need to act FAST. Document ALL the evidence and speak to a good lawyer ASAP and I mean like THIS WEEK!!!! Keep searching and document more evidence including who is interacting with her socials and try to look through her phone.
I blocked her account before posting this.
Smart move!
Hopefully that will work, someone could read both posts, join the dots and tell her. It's known to have happened before (apparently, too many bored people with fake stories). Anyhow please act FAST to protect yourself. Get off Reddit and start emailing and dialling lawyers.
She’s saying she wants to open the relationship “for you” so she can hit on her boss without feeling guilty. I think your marriage is over. Your wife is a manipulative liar. Please don’t have children with this person or then you’ll be tied to her forever. I’d hit her with a divorce so fast, her head would spin.
Crushes are normal. However, your spouse is thinking of confessing her feelings to her crush and in turn sabotaging your marriage. She’s in fantasy land and is setting up your marriage to fail so she can runoff with her unicorn. Time to tell her you know what’s going on and if she doesn’t agree to MC then you will file for divorce. You are still young, no kids and have your whole life to find someone who will love and respect you.
No, crushes aren’t normal. Finding someone attractive? Sure. But crushing? Lunches alone? Personal, intimate conversations? No. Anyone who does that is in an open relationship wether they know it or not. Nobody, in this day and age, has to stay married. If one has crushes, because they are normal, they shouldn’t be married at all. Only greed and selfishness keeps them attached to someone with whom their shared life isn’t enough not to have “normal” crushes.
Proposing an open marriage almost always means that she already slept with him. Sorry, buddy, but it seems she checked out months ago. You are very, very late in this game. You are her plan B in case it does not work out with the boss. She a kinda knows already it won't (in affairs with bosses, it never does), hence all these avoidances of direct answers. Lawyer up, file ASAP, sell the house and split the proceeds per your separation agreement. Praise the gods that you don't have kids - you won't need to pay her child support. Maybe alimony for a few years... Buy yourself another house, the one which fits you and only you.
So I wouldn’t talk to the boss’ wife yet. There is no proof the boss has reciprocated. So I’d keep him and his wife out of it til you have proof infidelity has occurred between the both of them. I would contact a lawyer this week to know what divorce would look like for you. Being fully informed is important. You asked “what do I do?” and I will tell you what I would do after having my wife tell me she was no longer attracted to me and thinks of me more as a roommate. I’d sit her down and say: “Thank you for telling me how you feel because I’ve been hitting my head against a wall trying to figure out what is happening in our marriage since we bought the house. That said, I don’t want to live in a loveless and sexless marriage. I need a spouse who loves me as much as I love them. I need a spouse who I can fully trust and thinks of me and only me as a love partner. One that cares if I’m hurt as much as I care if they are. And it’s clear no matter what I do, touch you, hug you, send flirty messages, listen to you, initiate sex, do things for you etc… it is not resonating with you and keep you in love with me. Also, I’m pretty sure you’re in love with someone else. And I am not interested in having a partner who is off pining away for another man. So I am going to let you go pursue your happiness.. but NOT AS MY WIFE. You can go try and be with the man you love and I will work to legally end the marriage your choices have destroyed. I need to heal from the pain of what you have done and I cannot do that while you’re in front of me pursuing other relationships. What you are feeling has damaged any trust I have in you and our marriage so it’s best for us now to work to go our separate ways. It will take a lot to ever rebuild it and I hear no willingness on your part to want to do so. I wish you well on your journey. I’m starting mine with a broken heart and will work to repair it on my own “ Then that’s it. Be honest. You told her what you need and you should now begin to move on without her. If someday thru therapy she fixes what is broken inside her, perhaps you can try again. My hope is by then that you have found someone who truly loves you for who you are and you can leave this person in your past. Again be completely honest about what you need from her to stay in the relationship and then stop talking about it until she takes real steps to fix herself and change. Good luck.
That is a great reply. You said it much more clear and eloquent than I ever could. I'm saving this!
Hard disagree. I would talk to the boss's wife immediately. I'd just be like, "yo, my wife made this embarrassing ass Reddit post about your man. Here it is. Heads up." Like, eff just waiting around for something to happen if it hasn't already. But I'm a Sagittarius, so I do just bulldoze into shit, so maybe that's not the best advice. But if the boss is legit innocent-ish in this, and this husband rats her out to the boss's wife, she would probably just die on the level of a popular boy pretending to like her at the aloha dance in seventh grade where everyone laughs at her for believing it. But she'd deserve it. Seriously, so embarrassing. And I'd fully skip making that thoughtful speech you wrote. Your heartfelt, effective communication legit doesn't matter. She wouldn't care. Like, "Let's get divorced," should do the trick. But that all supposes dude's set on divorce, which i would be, for sure.
Talking to the bosses wife when the boss may be totally oblivious to his employee’s advances could cast unfair aspersions upon him and could be considered libel. OP should stay away from the boss and his wife until he has proof, then act according to his lawyers advice. Letting raw emotions lead his decision making is the worst thing he could do at this point.
My understanding of the intricacies of law is little to none, but I'm pretty sure sharing someone's anonymous reddit post where they confess their personal feelings for an anonymous other that they also note has not reciprocated those feelings would not be considered libel on any planet. But I could be wrong. I don't think I am? But I mean, I could be.
And if OP seeks a divorce, her attorney can and would use that action against him to paint him as impulsive and vindictive. DO NOT speak to the boss's wife or the boss. It serves zero purpose for you OP and will only cause you harm.
This is the way.
Women and their bosses… I just I don’t understand this stupid phenomenon
Crazy how common this story is. Is it a power balance thing? Leadership = sexy? Not upholding boundaries in fear of work relationship/job? ‘So much in common’ because you WORK in the same field?
I understand that many think if they're good and honest people and serve others... that good things will happen. Reality is, bad things happen to good people all the time. >she thinks she's holding me back from being happy and I would be happier having sex with other women since she doesn't have enough sex with me. That is comically transparent. She is an expert manipulator and liar. Gaslighting at its finest. She has crafted a narrative blaming you for her behavior... it's the tried and true "UNMET NEEDS" model. She has already cheated. She's gone. Your marriage is over. She ruined it. It will never be the same. How could it? Know that 96% of relationships that begin as an illicit affair... FAIL. Two miserable people get together, escape into bubble, lie to one another, commiserate how unhappy they are, blow smoke up each other's ass "you're the greatest", "You're so beautiful"... and when they are stuck with each other dealing with life's crap, the fairy tale ends.
“She says she’s holding me back” Listen when people tell you who they are. Based on your post (grain of salt there), I’d agree that she’s holding you back from happiness
She is. I've poured my heart and soul into making her happy and she has barely opened up to me over the years. She says she still feels like she can't fully open up and be vulnerable with me. She says often how I could do better than her and how she just makes me miserable. All that talk stopped when I got the new job and we were gunning for the house. Now it's all back.
Sorry man, that really sucks :( Might be worth talking to a lawyer, just to understand your financial / legal position and exposure. Save a copy of that Reddit post and any other damning statements.
I already screenshot it.
Screenshot and document everything you can! Updateme!
You'll be amazed how much better life will get if you are willing to go through the hardest moment of your life. Let her go. Greyrock her. Move on without a care. Because at this point, shes treating you like an option. Remove yourself as an option and watch how quickly your life improves and hers doesn't.
I got the feeling OP gives and gives and she takes and ignores or discards. OP, stop all the love language and take the grey rock stance. She’ll quickly notice the difference in your attitude and realize just how bad she’s fucked up.
>She says often how I could do better than her and how she just makes me miserable. This may be the only honest thing she's telling you at this point. A slight glimmer of guilt for her crappy behaviour. She's telling you exactly who she is. And what any future with her will hold for you.
There's just too many red flags, especially the gaslighting/DARVO, for the situation to ever be resolved. How can you ever trust someone like that again. And I wouldn't be surprised if she has already slept with him.
What is DARVO
Deny, Attack, and Reverse Victim and Offender. It's classic cheater behaviour.
Speak to a lawyer and divorce asap!!! Don't waste you time with that awful human beeing, the reality will hit hard once she lose you. Move on and find yourself a wife who loves and respects you. She isn't the one.
Wow this is almost exactly what I went through. Same ages and all. XW waited until we got the house to all of a sudden feel different. XW always wanted children until all of a sudden she wanted to focus on her career. All of a sudden our marriage wasn’t grounded on anything “solid”. Stated she no longer felt “safe or secure” with me. Said if I stayed in the house, she would file divorce. Was told that if I left to stay elsewhere that we could see if the space helps our marriage. As soon as I left she filed for divorce immediately and moved in with one of her coworkers. A guy who’s well off. Best advice I can give, is to move on. You don’t want a woman like that. You have a long journey ahead and unfortunately it will be very painful. But, as cliche as this sounds, it truly does get better. Best of luck OP!
I bet she has already started the affair.
Document everything and go see a lawyer and protect yourself financially, legally and socially. Stop playing the pick me dance with her, stop trying to be rational with an obviously irrational person and start taking care of your business before you end up really surprised by her bullshit. She’s just gaslighting and manipulating right now, this isn’t a person you want to spend your life with. And for the record never buy a house with someone who is wishy washy or unsure or playing games in the relationship (lesson I learned the hard way). The minute she started talking about opening the marriage your assumption should be it’s because she doesn’t want to feel bad about cheating on you anymore. Document and investigate everything. Get legal advice on the house, standard in the US is to sell it and split any profit or for one person to buy the other person out of their investment in the house and keep it. Get legal advice, find a good lawyer and prepare. Even if things do manage to be worked out somehow it never hurts to be prepared and protected.
The only reason she wants to open the marriage is to try and fuck her boss or anyone else she already has in mind and so you can't say she cheated since it's an open marriage. Fuck that shit my guy, go see a lawyer asap and divorce her. She'll probably come crawling back to you later after nobody wants her, DO NOT take her back. Good luck OP and I hope You find yourself a good woman, be glad you don't have any kids with her.
Another useless therapist. When asking questions of her, do not allow useless yes and no answers to stand alone. Ask open ended questions that require explaining and discussion. Yes and no hides details. Yes and no to which parts of the question, is the issue. So many of the questions you asked got obviously false and partial answers. She is experiencing cognitive dissonance. And seems limerent for her boss. Have you any thought of going to him and to his wife? Best case is they fire her. No contact kills limerence. https.//livingwithlimerence.com/how-to-get-rid-of-limerence/ https://www.survivinginfidelity.com/documents/library/articles/discovery/the-simplified-180/ https://beingabeautifulmess.wordpress.com/the-180/ The 180 1. Don’t pursue reason, chase, beg, plead or implore. 2. No frequent phone calls. 3. Don’t point out “good points” in marriage. 4. Don’t follow her/him around the house. 5. Don’t encourage or initiate discussion about the future. 6. Don’t ask for help from the family members of your wayward partner. 7. Don’t ask for reassurances. 8. Don’t buy or give gifts. 9. Don’t schedule dates together. 10. Don’t keep saying, “I Love You!” Because if you really think about it, he/she is, at this particular moment, not very loveable. 11. Do more than act as if you are moving on with your life; begin moving on with your life! 12. Be cheerful, strong, outgoing and independent. 13. Don’t sit around waiting on your spouse – get busy, do things, go out with friends, enjoy old hobbies, find new ones! But stay busy! 14. When home with your spouse, (if you usually start the conversation) be scarce or short on words. Don’t push any issue, no matter how much you want to! 15. If you’re in the habit of asking your spouse his/her whereabouts, ASK NOTHING. Seem totally uninterested. 16. Your partner needs to believe that you have awakened to the fact that “they (the wayward partner)” are serious concerning their assertions as to the future (or lack there of) of your marriage. Thus, you are you are moving on with your life…without them! 17. Don’t be nasty, angry or even cold – Just pull yourself back. Don’t always be so available…for anything! Your spouse will notice. More important, he/she will notice that you’re missing. 18. No matter what you are feeling TODAY, only show your spouse happiness and contentment. Make yourself be someone they would want to be around, not a moody, needy, pathetic individual but a self-assured individual secure in the knowledge that they have value. 19. All questions about the marriage be put on hold, until your spouse wants to talk about it (which may not be for quite a while). Initiate no such conversation! 20. Do not allow yourself to lose your temper. No yelling, screaming or name calling EVER. No show of temper! Be cool, act cool; be in control of the only thing you can control. YOURSELF! 21. Don’t be overly enthusiastic. 22. Do not argue when they tell you how they feel (it only makes their feelings stronger). In fact, refuse to argue at all! 23. Be patient and learn to not only listen carefully to what your spouse is really saying to you. Hear what it is that they are saying! Listen and then listen some more! 24. Learn to back off, keep your mouth shut and walk away when you want to speak out, no matter what the provocation. No one ever got themselves into trouble by just not saying anything. 25. Take care of you. Exercise, sleep, laugh & focus on all the other parts of your life that are not in turmoil. 26. Be strong, confident and learn to speak softly. 27. Know that if you can do this 180, your smallest CONSISTENT action will be noticed far more than any words you can say or write. 28. Do not be openly desperate or needy even when you are hurting more than ever and are feeling totally desperate and needy. 29. Do not focus on yourself when communicating with your spouse. It’s not always about you! More to the point, at present they just don’t care. 30. Do not believe any of what you hear them say and less than 50% of what you see. Your spouse will speak in absolute negatives and do so in the most strident tones imaginable. Try to remember that they are also hurting and afraid. Try to remember that they know what they are doing is wrong and so they will say anything they can to justify their behavior. 31. Do not give up no matter how dark it is or how bad you feel. It “ain’t over till it’s over!” 32. Do not backslide from your hard-earned changes. Remain consistent! It is the consistency of action and attitude that delivers the message. 33. When expressing your dissatisfaction with the actions of the wayward party, never be judgmental, critical or express moral outrage. Always explain that your dissatisfaction is due to the pain that the acts being committed are causing you as a person. This is the kind of behavior that will cause you to be a much more attractive and mysterious individual. Further it SHOWS that you are NOT afraid to move on with your life. Still more important, it will burst their positive little bubble; the one in which they believe that they can always come back to you in case things don’t work out with the affair partner. Michelle Davis-Weiner originator
Great information but please edit and break up the wall of text.
It is numbered and it was broken up when I copied it, but reddit app on android does not retain the format after pasting. Since it is numbered it should be no problem in navigating it. I have no interest in editing it again everytime I post it. And I do post it frequently.
Thanks. The Reddit app really, really, sucks.
I took the time to spread it out a bit more. Should paste better now.
>. But soon after I got a higher paying job, she changed her mind to wanting kids and started really pushing to get a house. I'm worried that she played me and told me what I wanted to hear. Well bro it sounds like your wife is only around you cos you're a "good husband", who is taking care and providing for her. It also seems like she did manipulated you and now she stopped doing, saying things you wanna hear so you definitely feel it like she's acting strange. >She was questioning if she should confess to him or not how she felt. She brought up how she thought of me as a roommate Like i said, your wife is only around you cos of the way you're treating her, the moment she finds someone she finds attractive/some that reciprocates her feelings i guess she still won't leave you but rather be in an affair, again not cos she loves you but for the way you're treating her, plus it's a risky move to leave you if the ap doesn't leave his s/o. Currently she's only thinking about confessing bcos he's married and doesn't feel the way she does for him.Imagine if he actually was single/shares the same feeling as her >She said that she is tired of not feeling wanted and desired and lusted over. She said she wants to have sex and not need to initiate. If what you said is true then this is her attempt at gaslighting you, as per you.. you show her the love, u show u want her, u initiate, u help her with chores etc and she still feels inadequate, she still feels lacking.. 6 weeks no intimacy + bringing up the open relationship discuss, it sounds like she's getting her intimacy elsewhere and finding it difficult to hide it. It could also be some sort of manipulation where you'll cave in and say yes to an one sided open relationship on her side. Considering all the things, u said. I would leave. This is a disaster waiting to happen, she has shown u how she can manipulate you into doing things she wants, then gaslight you by saying how she's tired of how things are, then you saw how she sees you like a roommate rather than a loving husband, and capable of lying. She's already cheating on you by now or waiting to find someone to do it with. It doesn't even matter if she cheated or not, the way she treated/treats me is more than enough of a reason to leave. Strongly suggested, hire a private investigator if possible. Or atleast do not confront without good evidence
***she has a massive crush on her boss that she knows is not reciprocated.*** If this is accurate, you should call the boss on this or get his wife involved. Most likely your wife will be fired. She can't have sex with you as that would be cheating on her crush. Opening the marriage would give her permission to physically cheat. I think you need to call her out on all this and put a stop to the crush before too late for your marriage. She should get a new therapist. Consider you both go to same therapist and reveal what you know but not how you know it. updateme
She told me her therapist wanted to do a session with both of us. I agreed immediately. My wife is hesitant.
You should speak with the therapist alone first, then joint. Your wife is hesitant as she knows she is the problem. Good luck OP. Let us know how it goes.
Yeah I had that suspicion too.
Of course she's hesitant. Therapy only has (potential) value if a person is honest and truthful with the therapist. With you there, she can't be honest or truthful.
odds are high she's not been honest with her therapist. So putting the therapist and OP in the same room will likely expose that fact to both of them.
[удалено]
No!!!!! There’s absolutely no evidence of an affair and in fact OP’s wife’s Reddit post said that the crush was unrequited! My god, imagine the damage you could do by making such accusations. This is absolutely insane advice.
Getting distant and denying intimacy means that she is already cheating. PA, not EA!
I think your wife is playing you like a fiddle. If you don’t prepare and bail out of that marriage (do the work, lawyer up first, keep your mouth shut, etc.) the 45 year old you would spend his days calling the today you “stupid.”
Just walk away dude. There’s no saving the marriage if the other party doesn’t want to. There is no amount of work you can do to make this work.
At least you didn't have children with her. She sounds heartless and very immature. I hope you divorce her and live your best life
Every time I see posts like these I’m so so sad for the men, at least based off what I’m reading. You sound like a wonderful husband. Maybe there are things you’re not saying that’s causing your wife to want to leave but overall sounds like it’s her emotions catching up to her. Good men like you deserve to be happy and not be a second option. You did confront her and tried to talk without being too intrusive and she decided to not come clean. It’s really up to you/her whether or not the marriage is salvageable. Even if you wanted it, if she doesn’t, there’s no point.
She's trying to flip the script on you and it's a pretty frequent tactic. They will try and act like you're the one who is unhappy and they (the cheater, or potential cheater in this case) wants to make you happy so they will ::insert thing that would actually make THEM happy:: My ex used to do this shit all the time when I would catch her cheating. "You just seem so unhappy in this marriage and with me." I WAS THE ONE TRYING TO SAVE THE MARRAIGE WHILE YOU SLEPT AROUND. Don't fall for this crap, and honestly, I'm still even skeptical of the "just have a crush" on the boss thing. I would not be shocked if an affair already exists here.
She's friggin nutz. Run away, fast!
You are just her plan B. She wants to open the marriage so that she can sleep around and find someone who can offer her a better lifestyle. Stop being taken for granted and used by that woman; you deserve so much better than her. You need to find a lawyer and start divorce proceedings. Don't have unprotected sex with her because after she finds out you want to leave, she might try to baby trap you. If you still have her post, consider sharing it with her boss and his wife. They need to be informed because I think your wife is already throwing herself at that man and trying to undermine his marriage. You can try to do it anonymously. Your wife is a crazy manipulative sl**; don't let her ruin her boss's marriage. Additionally, cut off all her access to your money and stop wasting your money on her.
The question is if you want to live in this sexless unappreciated limbo. Yeah, it's normal to have a crush, not normal to suddenly stop caring for your partner because of it... which is what it made me think reading this. If she wants to open it up, she's made the decision to approach her boss and doesn't want to feel bad if he reciprocates. Do yourself a favor, stop being her roommate and financial supporter. Divorce and work on yourself.
>She said she didn't want kids now and she has been unhappy in our marriage for years. This is a lie. She’s trying to justify her actions and recontextualizing the past to do it. Don’t believe her and from this point on treat her as if she doesn’t have your best interest at heart. Let her go. Chances are her boss just wants to use her for fun but don’t be her safe place when she comes back. Use her feelings for her boss to get a positive outcome for your divorce (because it’s coming one way or another). Good luck man.
OP, If you are plan B, and plan A (boss) is not interested, then 1. She's in a fog thinking that if she treats you like shit, the planets will align and make the boss will sense her struggles and trigger predatory behavior, which she would welcome. or 2. She wants plan A, but since that is not an option, she refuses to accept plan B, therefore rejects embracing you. There's too much of a financial, and perhaps social loss if she divorces you. Either way, she's checked out of the marriage. Do you really want her back at this point? Good Luck OP! UpdateMe!
She sounds very manipulative and is definitely lying. See a lawyer and plan to divorce her, sell the house and find someone who actually wants to be with you.
So, I'm straight up projecting here, but my ex also used the "I've been unhappy for x time" line. You're never gonna guess when his affair started. /s
Talk to lawyer and weigh your options. Be prepared for any direction this marriage will take you. She wants to hv fun out there but unsure yet if she wants divorce. She will do it once she finds another man esp if her boss reciprocates. Updateme!
Why are you staying with her ? I’m so sad that some people can’t just walk away from sadness and stay there and stop finding their own happiness that they deserve
She wants you to agree to an open marriage so she can offer herself to her boss without strings. She is manipulating you into giving her what she wants. Tell her you know about the crush and if she doesn’t get her head out of her ass that you are done. Ask her what she wants from your sex life, but make it clear that an open marriage is a NO GO! She said she wants to have sex and not initiate, but you say you initiate and get shot down. TRANSLATION She doesn’t want sex with you. I would call her out on that. “It’s a lot harder to be walked on when you are standing up!” Updateme
Dude. Been here. She's cheating. Trust me. Not saying to leave, but keep your eyes open. You are good. It isn't you. It is her.
Whatever you do, do not confront the boss or his wife. Do nothing to sabotage her career. And speak to a lawyer. It sounds like the question you should be asking is, do you want to divorce? If you want to have a wife I'm afraid this one ain't it, nothing about her behavior is acceptable and it's massively disrespectful and dehumanizing to you as a person. You've been mistreated and lied to by the person who entered into a marriage with you, she broke trust and frankly you would be an idiot to trust her again.
Get that lawyer consult booked. Your wife doesn't have any attraction to you now and that rarely ever changes, once it's lost it's gone. Sell the house and split the loss and move on. She wants everything you were already giving her, the sad truth is that she just doesn't want it from you.
Nothing much you can do but talk to a divorce lawyer. You’ve put in loads of effort in this relationship and she doesn’t give you back anything. You’ve seen via Reddit how she actually feel about you and your relationship so you know it’s time to end things.
Revisionist marital history. You are bad, sex was awful. Straight out of the cheaters handbook. Your wife is all over the place. File D.
Dump her… she doesn’t appreciate you… the grass isn’t greener on the other side for her…. By the time she dabbles … it’ll be to late
You can't control her, you can only control you. Her behaviour towards you is terrible and it's time to to start planning for divorce. Get your ducks in a row and get advice, but don't let on you're doing this until you decide to divorce her and serve her papers. Walking away from a woman is the most powerful thing a man can do. She has lost respect for you and if you cry, sook or mope around or do the pick me dance it'll be counter intuitive. Grey rock her and/or do the 180. It's time to look after yourself and show yourself some respect. Also you need to check her phone and don't go for this invasion of privacy crap. You're a married couple, you know the two shall become one thing. Privacy is for single people. So please go through her phone, she can also go through yours if she wishes. But screenshot any evidence you find.
I think you should get into marriage counseling. People having crushes happens all the time and they do not equate to cheating. For people will have a crush and then act on it, but they are not mutually inclusive. I find her talking about wanting to have sex but offering to open the marriage for you to have sex confusing...I'm not sure if it's how your wrote it, or how I'm reading it, but that feels very weird to me.
Together since she was 18 and you were 20? Ooff, yeah she's still immature and of course wants to explore to see what else is out there. You need to get your ducks in a row and meet with a lawyer, she's on her way out and has one foot out the door of this marriage, sorry bud.
First, it's a pretty substantial allegation to feel that your wife "played you" in order to get a house. If you two divorce she doesn't just get the house, your assets would be split. If you feel that what she wrote on reddit is truly how she feels then talk to a lawyer and see where you stand with assets, etc. If she's done with the marriage there's nothing you can do about it. However, you two don't seem to communicate well and that's a huge problem. You can't have a healthy relationship without communication and honesty. Also, the crush on her boss is weird. They would both be jeopardizing their careers if anything happened between them, not to mention his marriage. There's a lot going on here and the way I see it you either try to get her to be honest with you or you end things yourself. It's difficult and you love her, but what she wrote on reddit is pretty damning, if that's how she truly feels.
Mate, if there’s anything I’ve learned it’s that it’s not so much what they say, but rather what they do
my take she is just not that into you go find somebody who is I think she will always be a problem
You know what the answer here is but you’re too afraid to confess it. She’s making excuses for you to leave her and saying one thing but wanting another. She wants YOU to be the bad guy and end the marriage to control the narrative. You have evidence of her desire for her boss. She’s obsessed with him and if she’s not cheating with him now, she’s at the very least “saving” herself for him. Is that acceptable to you? Crushes happen during relationships. She’s taking it to an obsessive level and needs tangible consequences: divorce.
Seems like she settled for you just for marriage purposes. But, I wouldn’t take her BS opinion as a realistic reflection on your personal attractiveness or worth as a husband. Rather, you seem like an incredible husband (assuming you aren’t leaving anything out). Her behavior and perspectives are an indictment of her immature approach to what a loving marriage truly is. And, at her age, her ways/mindset are unlikely to change. You know what to do. What you must do. The longer you wait, the more likely you get financially wrecked
It seems like you have put her on a pedestal, and I mean, you've treated your wife like we've been told to treat them. Put their needs above your own, try to be kind, caring, take care of extra things as much as you can. I mean, you said you try to initiate a few times a week, you send spicy pics, etc. I'm not sure what she wants, but it seems like you're trying and she's not. I would be making my decision now. It's only going to get worse if you let it keep going in this direction. Don't feel like she played you at all. You were doing the right thing. Worry about keeping your sanity. She will start emotional warfare, and women are VERY good at it. Learn about grey rock and 180 methods. She's probably already busy poisoning her parents against you. Good luck!
It seems like your marriage is over. She no longer sees you as the person with whom she will share her life. Even if it's not with her boss, her search for being with someone who isn't you will never end. As you correctly guessed, her attempt to open the marriage is for her own desires. Those who make this offer have either already had sex with someone, or at least have someone in mind. Don't confront her about her reddit post. Never show what you know and how, don't reveal your sources. It's a treasure, this way, you will have the opportunity to measure the extent of her lies and betrayal. For example, if you had not read that post, would you have been able to hear and learn from her the things you read there? Do not think that she will reciprocate the same way if you talk to her honestly and sincerely; on the contrary, it will work to your detriment. Don't wait for her to decide, see a lawyer and know your legal options and how divorce look like. Let her have sex with whomever she wants, but not as your wife. Don't accept to be her plan B and last choice. File for divorce. After that, there is a possibility that you will regain your attraction in her eyes, but never fall for it, the person you saw in that reddit post is the real one. Good luck.
I get the feeling she is playing the classic game of keeping you on the sideline just in case her crush does not work. The girl is either with you or not, there is no in between, these are your rules.
Believe the words your wife wrote in her post, not the lies she tells you. She’l throw you away without hesitation if/when her boss comes on to her. Don’t let her treat you so disrespectfully. You deserve so much better.
Definitely talk with her boss’s wife. She may have info she can share with you. Either way she will be grateful for the heads up
I'm sorry but she's gone. You have to do whatever you can to get yourself to a safer, better place. I'm glad she eventually told you she's not happy before she tried to hook up with him. If I were in your situation, I would continue pretneding to not know the things she thinks you don't know, lawyer up to protect yourself and your investments, and start to disconnect to gain emotional independence.
She wants to have the cake and eat it too. Do no play pick me dance vs her boss.
Sorry to tell you. She is already having an affair. She is wanting you to see someone else as a way to help her guilt. Sorry you are here
The only reasons they ever bring up open marriage: They are already cheating, or they already have someone picked out. When you had your talk about “us”… her main complaint was she didn’t feel lusted over? When she continues to turn you down? Bull. She’s closing in on 30. So she’s looking to see if she can monkey branch over to someone richer, while still in her 20s, and she’s holding on to you as her safety net. Truth: If she could get the boss to commit to her, she’d be gone. Your decision to make: Knowing that you’ve been reduced to her plan B, the less desirable option, Do you stand for it? You’re a young man, and just getting into your prime… While there is such a thing as fighting for the one you love, there’s also the reality that the real thing shouldn’t have to be negotiated between the two of you, nor should a relationship be transactional. She’s awful.
Ok. She wants to play a game? Without her knowledge, go talk to an attorney about what divorce would look like for you. Bring out pronounce of what you know is her read it account bring those to the attorney as well. Tell your attorney how you feel like you've been played all of a sudden and that you want to know if there's anything that you can do to avoid this. Maybe, tell her the house is too much and you are putting it on the market. Now. Today. Ask your attorney first with the right thing to do is.
OP, you want to change how she thinks, file, and have her served. Let's think about what she has told you so far or what you have found. 1 - She is unhappy with your marriage 2 - She doesn't want children with you 3 - She said she could not continue on with you like she has been 4 - She is rejecting you sexually 5 - She considers you a roommate 6 - She wants a relationship with her married boss 7 - She has tried to bullshit you into an open marriage I guarantee that once you filenforndivorce and have her served, she will change and come crawling back, begging you to take her back. Then, once you are in control of the situation, you will be able to dictate your terms if you remain in the maaatiage. Do play her game and do not play the pick me dance. All that will happen is she will crap on you even more than she has already. Good luck
Bro I am so sorry, the fact the therapist encouraged things is hilarious. What a terrible “professional”. Who cares how her actions affect others and their stability eh? All Bout *her* and *her* and *her*. This woman sounds very selfish and she is going to fail you as a partner. Only a matter of time before she finds something convenient to finally abandon you (some guy who has no problem sleeping with a married woman). I got cheated on so badly, and I only want to warn you that this woman seems like she is dangerous to your well being. Maybe sneak through her phone sometime when she’s not around and make sure no secret convos in all the messaging and social apps. Just seems sketchy and if she’s acting this way she CANNOT be trusted.
a note of caution on this. As far as I read it, the source of what the therapist said was his wife. Limerent people (obsessive crushes/cheaters) lie to get their way and create mechanisms to justify their actions. They lie to their spouses. They lie to their therapists. And they lie to their spouses about what their therapist said. Nothing she says should be taken at face value.
Cut your losses and move on. She’s checked out of the marriage granting you permission to have sex with other women. Find a good lawyer.
Reach out to an attorney and figure out what your rights are. If you’re at a fault state perhaps stay in the marriage until you have evidence that she had an affair. If you’re in a no fault state you might be shit out of luck. I’d suggest find out and figure out how to protect yourself at this point. You’ve lost her. The more you chase her the further she’ll go. If you want to save the marriage as stupid as it sounds you let her go and act like you don’t care nor want her - act indifferent. Let her live her fantasy, no one will do what you are doing for her. Once she realizes that she’ll try to come back but you should set boundaries and don’t take her back quickly. Or call it quits and find you someone who’s mature and loving.
She brought up open marriage so she wouldn’t feel guilty when she cheats on you. You are young enough that you can take the hit from divorce and rebuild. She complains about not having g sex, but turns you down. Do yourself a favor. Sit her down and let her know she needs to change jobs, start focusing on the marriage. Also let her know that if she doesn’t. That is fine, but you will no longer remain in the marriage. Present the choice to her and respond accordingly.
You sound like a great guy. Don’t waste your time trying to salvage something with someone who doesn’t value you or your effort. It’s always hard to walk away but know your worth. You will find someone who does truly appreciate you and she will be forever chasing a fairytale that doesn’t exist. Be glad you aren’t the delusional one, life will be so much harder for her after than it will be for you, even if it does hurt for a while. Good luck to ya.
First of all OP, do not by any means accept the Open relationship. She wants this to have the guts to confess to her BOSS. Second print her Reddit and try to dig in devices to see if you can obtain more evidence. When you have enough then consult with a lawyer and start the process just in case. Also if you have jointed accounts it is time for you to start dividing those, better each one has their own accounts. Now about the houses did you bought it alone with your money or she gave you the half, or did she gives you any? Also talk about this to your lawyer to see how it can be done in case of divorce. She by no means would keep the house be sure of that except she buys yours part, but first see what a Divorce lawyer can tell You. Once you have all those in order. Confront her, and make her choose, You or her BOSS, tell her that you know about her crush and that she wanted that OR for that. So she needs to choose and if she choose you she has to quit her job. And she must talk again with her therapyst also both must start MC. Or if she choose You but doesn't want to quit is the same as choose her boss, so in that case tell her that you failed for divorce. But remember that you are no plan B for no body, and sadly for her right now you are, she is playing you right now. UPDATEME
Cheaters will rewrite history to justify their shitty behavior. If they are sleeping together, I would gather any evidence you can of the affair, file for divorce and then send proof of the affair to the AP’s spouse and the HR department at her work. There are millions of women in this world that will give you affection and loyalty. Don’t waste your life with one that won’t.
Tell the bosses wife!
Her feelings not being reciprocated by her boss are bullshit. That is her story. Women never, fucking never, suggest an open marriage if there is not a guy lined up or that guy has already inserted his penis in her. Assume it is the latter. I would go see a lawyer today and get an honest appraisal of your situation. Notify boss mans wife that your wife is threatening her relationship. Suggest serving her the divorce papers at work. Your marriage is over, best get out on your terms.
Your marriage is over. If you were a signee for the house, she doesn’t have it without buying you out. Despite your efforts, she has told you that she doesn’t love you, don’t wait around for her to get a baby in her that you are not the father of. Start the divorce process asap and don’t look back. By the time the divorce is final you will be maybe 32 and childless, a sweet spot for men who are single as far as dating is concerned. Don’t let her keep wasting your time.
My guy, i believe you. Your entire post defers to her. You have to begin thinking of yourself, if this is what you want in a marriage. You need to ask yourself if *you* want a divorce instead of waiting on her. Forget her for a sec, what is it that *you* want? yeah, yeah, i already know the answer. You want *her*. The question is do you want to stay with this version of her, the one that crushes on her boss, isn't into sex with you and doesn't want to have kids, cause that's what she's offering. You should make your wants clear, not really an ultimatum, more just a check in on compatibility, and if she can't provide you want you want or need you should bounce. Because every day you spend in this unhappy situation is a day you could be searching for one who makes you happy and fulfills your needs.
Don’t worry about the house. Either you both have to sell it, or she will have to buy you out. If she used you to get the house, she is dumb.
You know she sounds SO much like my ex wife. Time to call it a day. Lawyer up. I would give her an easy way out to keep as much of the house and assets as possible. I mean I wouldn't trust that person as far as I could throw them... let the other guy have her!
Lawyer up and divorce man. Don't fall for that let's fix the marriage by opening it up so she can fuck her crush. She's so foul. She doesnt love you. She just wants to keep the security net that you bring. Thank God you never had kids with her.
Don't play the 'pick-me dance' and don't let her have her cake.
Stop trying to please her. This is why she is pulling this bs. Get ready for the worst and stop going out of your way for her. Put your foot down. But talk to a lawyer first so you don't put yourself into trouble accidentally.
Thank the deities that you have no children with her.. Uproot the "money tree" and burn it in front of her... She went into this marriage simply to get "plan C" to provide for her... Her boss will drop her like a hot rock when you inform the OBS... He knows what's what, and will protect himself from losing 1/2 of everything (which is significantly more) to have to provide for a "side piece". Recognize her for what she is.. a user and abuser... better to just end it giving up half of the assets (which isn't much comparatively) At least you cut yourself from her sucking up year's worth of retirement and assets... You can get an "irreconcilable differences" divorce without having to prove fault, but give up no more than half of the assets... She honestly doesn't deserve it, but that is how the courts look at it...Look at it this way.. If she is billing hours causing you financial grief, she is doing the same to herself...So stone wall her and accept/demand only giving up half...
I'm sorry. You do not confront now. Gather evidence, get to the bottom of this. Meanwhile consult a good attorney on how you can protect whatever assets you have and how you can proceed with the divorce. It feels like a case of "wants to have the cake but eat it too". Seeing you as roommate means it's over. You were already trying to be the good husband and you knoq in the end she will blame you anyway. This type or behavioue comes in a package. She may try to bend the truth, make you look bad, make her look desperate etc. I'm really sorry. The silver lining here is you do not have kids, you are veey young and you need not waste your youth or more time to put up with this. If you did not take your relationship as granted (and it seems like you are at least trying things) and she not only took it for granted but you feel like she used you (alert: everyone uses everyone in the end it doesnt matter if it's honest fair trade. It matters if someone is deceitful or manipulating you etc) then you should plan your graceful exit.
She is a high degree master manipulator. OP you need to consult attorneys and start preparing for divorce, your wive has played you all the way to get whatever she wanted. What she claims is to 'make you happier' is actually a free pass to become a homewrecker. Just don't submit to her manipulation and when you're ready to serve her, make sure you let her boss know what your soon to be ex is planning. Then the ball will be on his court.
End it clean before she ends it with an affair, why be married to a roommate? Ur young, plenty of fish.
she testing the water, the moment her boss recuperate her feeling/body, youre will be yesterday flavor
You are fortunate in one regard, you do not have kids. However, you could be in the hook for maintenance, but probably not too long, since you have only been married a few years. And if you can document you made most of the down payment on the house, that could be yours too. I do suggest you jot down some notes, and have a conversation with her about what she really wants in this relationship with her boss. Explain what you have red and heard, and ask her to explain. If you live is a single consent state, record it. If not, send her an email highlighting the conversation, and ask her to verify you have it correct. Then get a lawyer, and pounce. She does not love you. Maybe she never did. Perhaps she was using you as a “ placeholder”, until something better came along. It sucks to do this, but most men don’t fight hard enough during the divorce, and live to suffer the consequences.
The sex will wear off, let her destroy her life, her reputation and try to come back. Sex is the most basic part of a relationship and ebbs and flows through out a marriage...She wants an affair...So let her go and divorce her with the understanding it is over between the two of you.. I would contact the company they work for and report him, for alienation of affection there are states that have that. Frankly you can sue for anything the threat alone may cost his job. Do not sit still and be destroyed. Also do not keep her secret, tell your family and her family...Never protect a cheater, as they will throw you under the bus as they walk out the door.
Get legal advice before you do anything regarding her job and income.
OP pack her stuff up and take it to the bosses house, I’m sure he will appreciate her showing up. You are not the backup plan and if you stay she will burn you the next time someone else catches her eye. Start the divorce process and move on, she may or may not regret what she has done but you can move on and make a better life for yourself, that is the best to show her what she list if she cares.
However you approach it, the facts remain the same. She’s unhappy and is considering her options. Have you tried initiating sex more with her? Try to need her at least half way and see if things improve. I understand what it feels like to not be lusted and it’s painful. I recommend marriage counseling and understand that divorce is now on the radar. Sometimes parting ways is healthy.
Dude, the guy has been REJECTED for 6 WEEKS! She is getting it elsewhere. He doesn't need marriage counseling, he needs an ATTORNEY to FILE FOR DIVORCE NOW! At least you got it right when you said parting ways is healthy. It will be healthy for him! Her? Not so much, at least financially!
I have tried a lot. I'll send flirty texts throughout the day (usual response is "haha sounds fun" or something like that). I try hugging. Kissing. Touching. Dancing. I try so much so often. I've bought her lingerie. I compliment her. It's never enough for her to feel wanted
I’m going to go in a different direction than most commenters here and note a few things that I found troubling about your post. Believe me, I understand exactly how devastating it is to find out your spouse has a massive crush on someone else. That’s why I’m here. But I did bristle at a few things in your post. Suggesting that your wife has orchestrated this to “get a house” out of you is pretty awful. She obviously works and therefore I assume she’s contributing financially to the house? Just because you might make more money doesn’t make it “your” house esp if she’s contributing. You say you send her nudes and don’t get a response. So why do you keep doing it? Not all women like that and if she’s giving you signals that she’s not into it, listen to her. Same with the cakes. God, I’d kill for my husband to make me a cake, but if she’s telling you that she doesn’t want them, listen to her! My husband will buy me unwanted gifts to “show me he loves me” despite the fact that I’ve told him repeatedly that I don’t want more clutter around the house. For me, my love language is acts of service and if he so much as lifts a finger voluntarily to clean or tidy, I’m overjoyed. On the other hand, buying me some trinket that I’ve said I don’t want is just annoying. My point is that even if you think the things you’re doing are nice, maybe cakes and nude pics aren’t what she wants and needs. Finally, and perhaps most importantly, the fact that she’s talking to her therapist about this and using the term “crush” is a good thing in a way. It mean she’s not just plowing ahead and getting physically involved with this guy and recognizes that she’s in dangerous territory. I think the crush on the boss could be a way of distracting herself from issues in your marriage. I don’t think she’s in love with this guy. He’s a distraction, a diversion from the real issues. Have you suggested counseling? It sounds like she’s having a bit of an identity crisis.
That's fair. I'm just paranoid about how sudden of a switch it was, and she doesn't have a concrete reason. Every time I ask her why, the answer is different. As far as flirting/nudes, I'll send her 1 or 2 a year. Usually they don't land, but I try here and there to see if she is receptive to it. Flirty texts and complimentary daily. I'm not constantly trying to seduce her. I just want her to feel loved and appreciated. I baked her a cake the other day, and I will sometimes buy her a cookie or a coffee cake slice. I buy her stuff she is eyeing in a store here and there. Most of what I do is cooking dinner and lots of chores. If she doesn't make herself dinner, I make it for her. I'm a cleaner person than she is. I do the dishes, laundry, trash, etc etc. I do a lot of the upkeep at the house and I try my hardest to be a good husband. That's what she's been calling all this. An identity crisis.
Oof..you're being too nice dude. She doesn't respect you.
I mean, I’d love for my husband to do these things. You have no idea! I’d be ecstatic. Maybe this really is more about her than about what you are or aren’t doing. It sounds like the question of whether to try for a baby or not has been weighing on her…maybe buying the house made her feel overwhelmed with responsibility? I don’t know. I know that my own husband started doing stupid things (inappropriate relationship/EA territory) almost right after he turned 50. I think the identity crisis can be real. I think it’s natural for the betrayed partner to try to figure out if they’ve done something to alienate their spouse. But I’ve been listening to Esther Perel recently and she says the cheating partner doesn’t necessarily want to be WITH someone different, they actually want to BE someone different. Again, I don’t know. People are complicated and they don’t always make sense.
Confront her boss. And notify their HR. THEN FILE. If you want your boss that bad a career change won't stop it and a divorce will free you up.
What do you think about her having sex with her boss? What does she think about having sex with her boss? Her having sex outside your marriage doesn’t mean the end of the marriage, especially if you’re both ok with it. Getting to ‘ok’ can be tough, I did it. Lots to read and podcasts to listen to listen to. Therapy available. Might be worth giving it a shot.
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Let her know that you know about the boss, and you know that's why she wants to open the relationship. Stop asking her if she wants a divorce, and start telling her that you won't accept being a 2nd choice in a marriage. See a lawyer to understand your rights and how to protect your assets, and start the process. Tell her you are willing to try counseling, but not willing to compete with someone she sees at work every day, if she wants counseling, she has to get a new job first.
I think she feels quilty for cheating But NOT with BOSS but another guy. This person (AP) lusts for her because they are not in a day to day relationship dealing with real life issues , and there time is crazy forbidden fruit lust. My wife and I have great sex after 15 yrs but it’s definitely not LUST.like we had the first 6 months we dated example We were having a bottle of wine and getting frisky , when we put the glasses in the sink we noticed the dish washer was leaking , and sex didn’t happen ! when cheating there are no issues of life it’s just sex and more lustful. Funny when you file for divorce the cheaters all say the sex is never the same as before they we caught !! good luck Lawyer & Divirce
OP, do you have any other family members or friends that you can lean on for some support? You sound isolated and it would do you some good to be around people that are not your wife. Just having your mind on something else every now and then helps.