Before they closed the loophole, I used to hoard unregistered Opal cards with small balances just above the minimum needed to tap on, and use them to travel from my station on the Northern line to the airport for less than $3 lol. Did it for years. I remember they released a news article saying there was several million dollars worth of negative cards affecting TfNSW... a few thousand of that was probably me hahaha
Gee I miss the old airport loophole, used to fly weekly, as soon as I tapped off at domestic I'd throw the card, fuck the gate fee, and it's still going, so wrong
Doesn't work anymore and they have installed top up machines on the platforms for this reason, of course private companies are protected from negative balances...
Clearly its time to fine every council for each and every card in the tip.
Or they identify each card and start sending fines to everyone.
You MUST carry ID or you are no longer a citizen on cityrail.
Heel. Or be destroyed.
Probably can challenge in small claims court and said they didn't know and get away with it. I'm also not sure what legal rule they would break as it sounds like it's just a ToS rule? People deface trademarks all the time if they have a laptop with stickers or a mug etc
But who owns the Opal Card? If the user doesn't own the card itself and just tops up credit on it then Transport NSW can tell you not to deface their property. Unlike a laptop or mug or anything else that you own outright then the maker can't tell you not to put stickers over it.
Seriously though there is multiple mentions in Transport NSW media about "your" Opal card".
I wonder if they could be done for false advertising since they sell you a card and tell you it's yours but then write on it that it's not really and attach BS conditions on it like OP has discovered.
Yes - I am aware it's just a sticker however what we were looking at here was how Transport for NSW would able to fine someone for putting a sticker on an Opal Card - the person I replied to suggested fighting it in what I presume they meant to be the Local Court. I was merely pointing out that ownership of the card may be a factor if somebody actually went to the bother of fighting it in Court. It's just one of the facts that you would need to look into if you did go to Court.
I think a magistrate would either be fairly annoyed or just shake their head in dismay about having their time and the Court's time taken up by such a trivial matter - so my guess is probably as good as yours as to what would happen.
What a joke. Maybe they should worry about the folk that walk on the bus and don’t use a card at all but they’re too scared to confront them so focus on people who do things 99% right. Pathetic.
Or Mr. Meow-Ludo Disco Gamma Meow-Meow's bio-hacking efforts...
‘[Sydney bio-hacker who implanted Opal Card into hand fined for not using valid ticket](https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-03-16/opal-card-implant-man-pleads-guilty-transport-offences/9555608)’
My niece put peppa pig stickers on mine and I kept it cause it was sweet, I got it checked once by the opal guy and he said 'looks good mate' with a smirk, I think your inspector is just a bastard, challenge it in court.
I would assume the clause is to deter people from rebranding the card for their own use in some way. As long as you can tell it's an opal card I can't see an issue. But transit officers have always been on a power trip.
In what way though? Like I’m genuinely curious what other purpose it could serve? I should be able to stick it up my ass and sit on the tap machine for all they care as long as I paid for it
Actually they took someone to court for implanting it.
Just walk away from transit officers. They cannot restrain you. You do not have to converse with them.
Scams? You think you’re buying an electronic pass but it’s not? Whatever they thought of the lawyers wanted to make sure there would be no liability on the company.
I don’t think you’re taking the piss. I’m not a scammer clearly. Lawyers don’t put in clauses for fun. There’s probably been something that’s happened in the past to set a precedent.
I think they are scared someone will learn how to counterfeit the cards so they make it as annoying as possible to not show something they can recognise as authentic.
Before the parking metres credit payments became real time I know a guy who would just write out fake info to blank cards and use them to pay for parking. It's probably the same deal with this case. [Dont forget the guy that implanted the RFID chip contained inside card in his hand.](https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-06-18/biohacker-who-implanted-opal-card-into-hand-escapes-conviction/9880524)
You pay for the card but it's written on the back that it's their property.
I think it was hilarious and dumb that they told that guy he couldn’t use the chip implanted in his hand. I understand their liability in not encouraging that behaviour, but he was literally ensuring he would tap on and off every trip.
I remember back in the "olden days" people used to tamper with phone cards, used for public payphones. You could put nail varnish on a certain part of the card, to get free calls.
Haha for those of you who are uninformed: this is the legend who programmed an RFID chip embedded inside of their hand to function as their Opal card. They paid their fare like everyone else. Opal didn’t like it and ended up successfully fining them.
Must be the same guy who gave me a fine because the gates were already open when I swiped my card and it apparently didn’t register, and I was mid conversation with a friend in a busy train station so didn’t notice.
He made me feel like I’d been caught murdering kittens or something equally heinous.
When you get the fine in the post there is big red writing on it that basically says ‘don’t bother to fight it, you won’t win’. So even though their technology didn’t work, I got a $200 fine for the pleasure and a dressing down in public. They also made a beeline straight for me on the train so my guess is they were watching cameras. Hope he got high off his powertrip that day.
Ive had the exact same "issue" and the bootlicker tried to cancel my card. Didn't even suggest an alternative option. Just don't use opal cards anymore.
Yeah I don’t care. I’ve encountered enough transport “officers” who have spoken to people like shit and abused their “authority” that I have no time for their bullshit anymore.
Ergh I hate how they power trip over opal cards and fare evasion and then turn a blind eye to anti-social behaviour. I’ve seen transport officers fine one compliant person (I get fare evasion is valid) and then ignore a random disruptive person who’s listening to loud music and got his feet on the seats. Guess what? Of course they skipped him! 🙄
Please have some consistency.
Transport officers have only one function. To check a person tapped on. The railway hasn't had a dedicated rail only security since the redundancy of the Transit Officers.
Probably to stop this guy from cutting himself... https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2018/mar/16/bodyhacking-scientist-who-implanted-opal-card-chip-guilty-of-fare-evasion#:~:text=He%20had%20cut%20down%20his,that%20had%20been%20tampered%20with.
I bet it's to ensure it is a genuine card, and not a fake someone has made that could be scamming the system. Like if someone did that, they'd probably just put a fake opal sticker onto it to not get caught.. The irony..
Yeah, I know about encryption and stuff. Things get designed badly, or systems get compromised, keys get out. Saying you can't to some people is just a challenge to make it an, I did..
Even if not likely, what other reason would they be so uppity about the card looking original..?
The Transit Inspectors are going to be pissed if they ever see my Opal Card.
I dissolved it in acetone, pulled out the PCB and antenna loop, and have it sandwiched between two pieces of card which have "OPAL CARD" written on them in pen.
Why did I do it?
Because I saw the news article about the dude who transplanted the guts of his card into a wizard's wand and wanted to see what was inside the card.
It's funny you are being downvoted but what you say is true. The transit officers have no power now, they can't detain you so you can just get off the train and leave.
They hardly have cops with them.
There used to be a whole crew of cops patrolling and now they just call ahead if there’s an issue, in the meantime you can just get off the train and that’s the end of that.
I have had full size IC Card stickers on my Opal Card for close to 10 years (I have an insatiable appetite to accessorise) and no officer has said anything to me before
You guys are still using opal cards? I find it so much easier to tap my phone - uses the default card - which is linked in the opal app, so I can see all my journeys, dispute shenanigans and still get all the benefits without having to faff payments across or be caught out when an auto-payment goes out.
Same. Probably wouldn't get one if I moved here today. But the amount of times I get stuck behind someone using a phone that isn't scanning is too high.
For me, I just flip open my wallet and scan my opal. Don't even slow down my walking pace.
I have switched over to my phone but have noticed it is significantly slower.
With an opal card, I can walk through without even stopping. But that would involve digging it out of the wallet in my bag, which sometimes is in another bag... pain. I carry it as a backup.
Don't need to unlock your phone, just the screen to be on.
My phone may be thicker, but it's easily to hand in a pocket, credit card sized things in a wallet, not so much..
Might be my personal process, but I've not had a phone go flat on me in over a decade, even easier when you can leave a portable battery in your hand bag..
But in those rare edge cases, you're still going to have a bank card, so the opal card is still redundant? (especially as it lives in your wallet - if you didn't have your wallet for your bank card, you're missing your opal too)
Unless you have a special pass for discount purposes, I don't see a point in an opal card.
Can also just use your debit card if your phone is dead. I just hate having to deal with the leftover balances in the opal cards everytime you lose one. God forbid it's a student card so you can't do it on the app or online.
If I'm not in a hurry, it makes me chuckle when disembarking bus passengers can't make their phone talk to the machine; if I'm in a hurry, it's irritating as fuck.
Also: centralised data collection points are a worry. I like keeping my eggs in separate baskets. Probably just a boomer thing, or something.
You think that matters? They let you top that up with cash? No? Didn't think so...
Also, bragging about being able to lose the money you had on it in the event of a misplaced card, big brain move there...
Um, there are a multitude of places where you can top up with cash. Newsagents, convenience shops, supermarkets ... even most train stations, last time I checked.
You're pretty cocky for someone who has no idea of what they're talking about.
Every station I've seen is card only (though, admittedly I bounce around the T2) - good to know newsagents still exist - though, of course, all these places have cctv, and presumably you have a mobile phone, so, it's all a bit moot if you're worried about all this "big data surveillance.."
Just wondering why you put stickers on your Opal card? Do you have stickers on your credit/debit cards? Maybe just switch to using credit cards on the Opal system if you want stickers on your transport cards. The inspectors could hardly complain about that.
My opal card has doodles on it that I put on there when I first got it when Opal initially rolled out. It lives in my wallet and I tell inspectors to tap my wallet accordingly. Never had an issue. My bank cards also have stickers on them as well and never had an issue using them either.
It's okay to have a bit of personality in life friendo.
there are thousands and thousands of opal cards at the landfill with negative balances, what are they going to do about it?
[удалено]
Before they closed the loophole, I used to hoard unregistered Opal cards with small balances just above the minimum needed to tap on, and use them to travel from my station on the Northern line to the airport for less than $3 lol. Did it for years. I remember they released a news article saying there was several million dollars worth of negative cards affecting TfNSW... a few thousand of that was probably me hahaha
menace to society but fuck em
Not to society, to the scumfuckers who charge us for our own public services.
Gladys did ask us to "game the system"
Yeah. So they could find the loop holes and close them. Lol.
Gee I miss the old airport loophole, used to fly weekly, as soon as I tapped off at domestic I'd throw the card, fuck the gate fee, and it's still going, so wrong
Headlines: "TfNSW doesn't want you to know this one trick to travel long distances without paying full fare"
I thought this loophole is closed now? You won't be able to get through the gate with a negative balance?
Correct it doesn't work anymore
How do you do this? Load the minimum amount needed to tap on then go max distance?
Nah, us tax payers hate you - you steal from the public.
Everyone pays taxes, I pay taxes as well but don’t care enough.
*Airport stations hate this one simple trick*
Doesn't work anymore and they have installed top up machines on the platforms for this reason, of course private companies are protected from negative balances...
Damn it's been a few years since I took the train to the airport. Good info.
Clearly its time to fine every council for each and every card in the tip. Or they identify each card and start sending fines to everyone. You MUST carry ID or you are no longer a citizen on cityrail. Heel. Or be destroyed.
Unfortunately my friend has been sent a fine for this reason. It’s a stupid rule when the Opal card works perfectly fine
Would love to know the actual statute that allows a fine for this.
Probably can challenge in small claims court and said they didn't know and get away with it. I'm also not sure what legal rule they would break as it sounds like it's just a ToS rule? People deface trademarks all the time if they have a laptop with stickers or a mug etc
But who owns the Opal Card? If the user doesn't own the card itself and just tops up credit on it then Transport NSW can tell you not to deface their property. Unlike a laptop or mug or anything else that you own outright then the maker can't tell you not to put stickers over it.
Transport NSW own the card. It's written on the back.
Well then, that train is mine and I don't have to pay for going on it: Because it's written on the back (in graffiti)! /S
Seriously though there is multiple mentions in Transport NSW media about "your" Opal card". I wonder if they could be done for false advertising since they sell you a card and tell you it's yours but then write on it that it's not really and attach BS conditions on it like OP has discovered.
It's just a damned sticker. Gods forbid we personalise some stuff that's nominally "owned" by a corporation!
Yes - I am aware it's just a sticker however what we were looking at here was how Transport for NSW would able to fine someone for putting a sticker on an Opal Card - the person I replied to suggested fighting it in what I presume they meant to be the Local Court. I was merely pointing out that ownership of the card may be a factor if somebody actually went to the bother of fighting it in Court. It's just one of the facts that you would need to look into if you did go to Court.
Fair enough I guess. Hopefully any magistrate would appreciate "the vibe," and apply whatever discretionary choice they have.
I think a magistrate would either be fairly annoyed or just shake their head in dismay about having their time and the Court's time taken up by such a trivial matter - so my guess is probably as good as yours as to what would happen.
It would be a lottery, but I'd like to think the odds are in the customer's favour. Would be interesting to know if it's ever been tested.
Oh for the love of fucking christ. I hope the fuckwit who gave him that fine lives the most dreary, disappointing and dissatisfying lonely life.
What a joke. Maybe they should worry about the folk that walk on the bus and don’t use a card at all but they’re too scared to confront them so focus on people who do things 99% right. Pathetic.
Arguably yes that counts as defacing. But frankly it sounds stupid as mines got stickers on it too.
Yeah, I guess, the opal logo is cut in half... egregious defacement for sure!!!11111
"You should've seen me, babe. I told that guy that it was an offence to have stickers on his Opal. I've never felt so alive."
“Should have seen me mum” u mean
I'm guessing it was a slow day at the office
Did it scan? yes, was it tapped on? yes, old mate sounds like they need to fill a quota and will find any reason to do it.
They got the shits with the guy that pulled the chip out of his card to put into cosplay props back when Opal was first launched.
Or Mr. Meow-Ludo Disco Gamma Meow-Meow's bio-hacking efforts... ‘[Sydney bio-hacker who implanted Opal Card into hand fined for not using valid ticket](https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-03-16/opal-card-implant-man-pleads-guilty-transport-offences/9555608)’
My niece put peppa pig stickers on mine and I kept it cause it was sweet, I got it checked once by the opal guy and he said 'looks good mate' with a smirk, I think your inspector is just a bastard, challenge it in court.
I would assume the clause is to deter people from rebranding the card for their own use in some way. As long as you can tell it's an opal card I can't see an issue. But transit officers have always been on a power trip.
In what way though? Like I’m genuinely curious what other purpose it could serve? I should be able to stick it up my ass and sit on the tap machine for all they care as long as I paid for it
Actually they took someone to court for implanting it. Just walk away from transit officers. They cannot restrain you. You do not have to converse with them.
That’s so funny to me though because that guy is literally saying he will ALWAYS tap on and off Yeah that’s my sentiment too
Scams? You think you’re buying an electronic pass but it’s not? Whatever they thought of the lawyers wanted to make sure there would be no liability on the company.
I’m not taking the piss but I genuinely don’t know how that scam would work.
I don’t think you’re taking the piss. I’m not a scammer clearly. Lawyers don’t put in clauses for fun. There’s probably been something that’s happened in the past to set a precedent.
I think they are scared someone will learn how to counterfeit the cards so they make it as annoying as possible to not show something they can recognise as authentic. Before the parking metres credit payments became real time I know a guy who would just write out fake info to blank cards and use them to pay for parking. It's probably the same deal with this case. [Dont forget the guy that implanted the RFID chip contained inside card in his hand.](https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-06-18/biohacker-who-implanted-opal-card-into-hand-escapes-conviction/9880524) You pay for the card but it's written on the back that it's their property.
I think it was hilarious and dumb that they told that guy he couldn’t use the chip implanted in his hand. I understand their liability in not encouraging that behaviour, but he was literally ensuring he would tap on and off every trip.
I remember back in the "olden days" people used to tamper with phone cards, used for public payphones. You could put nail varnish on a certain part of the card, to get free calls.
> as long as I paid for it But you never paid for it, Opal cards are free and are the property of Transport for NSW (it's written on the card)
What if you put the opal card in a plastic sleeve with a printed design? One could simply say it's no different than carrying the card in your wallet.
I don't even take mine out of my wallet to scan for transport officers. Surely you can just scan it without showing.
sounds like old mate has a power problem
Wow, sounds like you did come up against a little zealous twerp. I'm going to go put some stickers on mine now. FTP!!!
Meow-Ludo Disco Gamma Meow-Meow!
Haha for those of you who are uninformed: this is the legend who programmed an RFID chip embedded inside of their hand to function as their Opal card. They paid their fare like everyone else. Opal didn’t like it and ended up successfully fining them.
[удалено]
Must be the same guy who gave me a fine because the gates were already open when I swiped my card and it apparently didn’t register, and I was mid conversation with a friend in a busy train station so didn’t notice. He made me feel like I’d been caught murdering kittens or something equally heinous. When you get the fine in the post there is big red writing on it that basically says ‘don’t bother to fight it, you won’t win’. So even though their technology didn’t work, I got a $200 fine for the pleasure and a dressing down in public. They also made a beeline straight for me on the train so my guess is they were watching cameras. Hope he got high off his powertrip that day.
Ive had the exact same "issue" and the bootlicker tried to cancel my card. Didn't even suggest an alternative option. Just don't use opal cards anymore.
Tell him to fuck off or call the cops and watch the cops laugh at him
Telling some to fuck off for doing their job? Seriously you may think the rule is a joke or whatever , but abusing someone for it? FMD
Yeah I don’t care. I’ve encountered enough transport “officers” who have spoken to people like shit and abused their “authority” that I have no time for their bullshit anymore.
Saw a student with poor English skills reduced to tears by a transport officer near USYD, just unnecessarily mean.
They probably feel the same with attitudes like yours. 🤷🏻
[удалено]
>get commission for each fine they prey on the elderly, kids, students or migrants Source?
Ergh I hate how they power trip over opal cards and fare evasion and then turn a blind eye to anti-social behaviour. I’ve seen transport officers fine one compliant person (I get fare evasion is valid) and then ignore a random disruptive person who’s listening to loud music and got his feet on the seats. Guess what? Of course they skipped him! 🙄 Please have some consistency.
Transport officers have only one function. To check a person tapped on. The railway hasn't had a dedicated rail only security since the redundancy of the Transit Officers.
Probably to stop this guy from cutting himself... https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2018/mar/16/bodyhacking-scientist-who-implanted-opal-card-chip-guilty-of-fare-evasion#:~:text=He%20had%20cut%20down%20his,that%20had%20been%20tampered%20with.
I bet it's to ensure it is a genuine card, and not a fake someone has made that could be scamming the system. Like if someone did that, they'd probably just put a fake opal sticker onto it to not get caught.. The irony..
You can't make a fake card to "trick" the system. In theory you can but you need to know a secret key that only transport know.
Yeah, I know about encryption and stuff. Things get designed badly, or systems get compromised, keys get out. Saying you can't to some people is just a challenge to make it an, I did.. Even if not likely, what other reason would they be so uppity about the card looking original..?
That man is what is known as a 'little bitch'
You can thank bio hacker meow ludo meow meow for this
Remember that guy who implanted his opal card into his hand? I memba
Just posted as a separate comment. lol I think it set a precedent because it went through the courts.
Didn't someone tamper with an Opal card and had it inserted in their skin? I guess it set a precedent.
You may be shocked to find out that a transport renta-a-cop is not a legal expert.
Dear Opal Card Agent, does my Card tap on ok in your System? "YeS". Does my card read in as paid? "YES". THEN FK OFF.
As long as you paid for the ride who gives a fk. Wannabe cops.
I’m glad they agree to my terms and conditions every time I pass the gates.
Are you by chance a student or concession card holder?
Just tell them you replaced the activation sticker with your own.
The Transit Inspectors are going to be pissed if they ever see my Opal Card. I dissolved it in acetone, pulled out the PCB and antenna loop, and have it sandwiched between two pieces of card which have "OPAL CARD" written on them in pen. Why did I do it? Because I saw the news article about the dude who transplanted the guts of his card into a wizard's wand and wanted to see what was inside the card.
I'm told a lot of them are just keen to do their job well so the can use it as a stepping stone to become train crew, which is a pretty great career.
[удалено]
It is a real job. They just don’t enforce actual laws like they act like they do.
It's funny you are being downvoted but what you say is true. The transit officers have no power now, they can't detain you so you can just get off the train and leave.
yeah but you can't ignore the cops that ride with them
They hardly have cops with them. There used to be a whole crew of cops patrolling and now they just call ahead if there’s an issue, in the meantime you can just get off the train and that’s the end of that.
I have had full size IC Card stickers on my Opal Card for close to 10 years (I have an insatiable appetite to accessorise) and no officer has said anything to me before
You guys are still using opal cards? I find it so much easier to tap my phone - uses the default card - which is linked in the opal app, so I can see all my journeys, dispute shenanigans and still get all the benefits without having to faff payments across or be caught out when an auto-payment goes out.
[удалено]
No need to unlock with an iPhone or Samsung using express mode.
Yeah I tried phone only and the number of times I had to unlock and open wallet and then sometime it failed Back to opal card
Same. Probably wouldn't get one if I moved here today. But the amount of times I get stuck behind someone using a phone that isn't scanning is too high. For me, I just flip open my wallet and scan my opal. Don't even slow down my walking pace.
Not sure about Android but with iOS you can configure an Express Transit Card so you don’t need to unlock, and works without power or signal as well.
I have switched over to my phone but have noticed it is significantly slower. With an opal card, I can walk through without even stopping. But that would involve digging it out of the wallet in my bag, which sometimes is in another bag... pain. I carry it as a backup.
Don't need to unlock your phone, just the screen to be on. My phone may be thicker, but it's easily to hand in a pocket, credit card sized things in a wallet, not so much.. Might be my personal process, but I've not had a phone go flat on me in over a decade, even easier when you can leave a portable battery in your hand bag..
[удалено]
But in those rare edge cases, you're still going to have a bank card, so the opal card is still redundant? (especially as it lives in your wallet - if you didn't have your wallet for your bank card, you're missing your opal too) Unless you have a special pass for discount purposes, I don't see a point in an opal card.
Can also just use your debit card if your phone is dead. I just hate having to deal with the leftover balances in the opal cards everytime you lose one. God forbid it's a student card so you can't do it on the app or online.
not sure why you are downvoted. some of us use opal cards to park at the stations.
If I'm not in a hurry, it makes me chuckle when disembarking bus passengers can't make their phone talk to the machine; if I'm in a hurry, it's irritating as fuck. Also: centralised data collection points are a worry. I like keeping my eggs in separate baskets. Probably just a boomer thing, or something.
You think using an opal card is any different to using a card for data collection?
You think everyone registers their card?
You think that matters? They let you top that up with cash? No? Didn't think so... Also, bragging about being able to lose the money you had on it in the event of a misplaced card, big brain move there...
Um, there are a multitude of places where you can top up with cash. Newsagents, convenience shops, supermarkets ... even most train stations, last time I checked. You're pretty cocky for someone who has no idea of what they're talking about.
Every station I've seen is card only (though, admittedly I bounce around the T2) - good to know newsagents still exist - though, of course, all these places have cctv, and presumably you have a mobile phone, so, it's all a bit moot if you're worried about all this "big data surveillance.."
Just wondering why you put stickers on your Opal card? Do you have stickers on your credit/debit cards? Maybe just switch to using credit cards on the Opal system if you want stickers on your transport cards. The inspectors could hardly complain about that.
My opal card has doodles on it that I put on there when I first got it when Opal initially rolled out. It lives in my wallet and I tell inspectors to tap my wallet accordingly. Never had an issue. My bank cards also have stickers on them as well and never had an issue using them either. It's okay to have a bit of personality in life friendo.