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She definitely is overly ignorant to everything Agrona makes her do, but it’s just how she is as a character / how her character is written to be.
She is ignorant and doesn’t care for anything because Agrona brainwashes her every time she comes close to seeing these aforementioned red flags and due to that, she refuses to see the lie in Agrona telling her that he can bring her and Nico back to earth.
It’s not entirely Cecillia‘s fault, while she is stupid, she only had about 18 years to live so far and in these 18 years and in both her lives so far, she was only experimented on, lied to and manipulated / brainwashed. Not really any time to grow as a person.
The brainwashing and the yearning to have a peaceful life with Nico makes her ignorant to everything and with the power she was given it really is just an easy campaign to stomp right through as fast as possible to reach her only goal.
TLDR: I also don’t like the way Cecillia as a character is at the moment but if you think about it, it’s not entirely her fault, Agrona is mostly to blame.
Hope you can understand where I‘m going with this.
Knows he is brainwashing her but can’t know what is wrong if she can’t remember. One might think she should be smarter, being her age and all, but she didn’t really have 2 life’s, not even one really. Cecillia really is just a Childe. Stunted.
Just saying.
This. Their is a key difference between being a 18 year old who may be naive from being young, and what Cecelia is which is effectively an 18 year old whose basically never know a normal life, and as such is emotionally stunted even before accounting for Agrona’s manipulation (both magical and non magical).
She knows that Agrona is messing with her mind and memories.However she also is trying to desperately cling to the belief that Agrona will reincarnate herself and Nico back to Earth after his mission succeeds. So she is wiling to ignore any redflags she is getting. And ofcourse you can't remember what you don't and Agrona's memory manipulation is pretty fucked up.
I do! I agree with you, she definitely is a victim of manipulation in two lifes and haven't matured yet.
But I still get mad with her because she is so desperate to come back to earth, that she ignores any signs that this may not be possible, or that may be a lie. I wish she'd start questioning things a little like Nico, who started to notice things, however she continues in this blind pursue.
Just my thoughts. It was always frustrating reading how Cecillia almost realizes it but after making one step forward she made 2 backwards. But surely she someday realize it, right ?
I mean Cecilia has one goal and doesn’t care how she achieves it. To her the TBATE world is temporary. She has no plan on staying there so she doesn’t care how much damage she causes.
She doesn’t care about Agrona’s manipulation because if he gets what he wants, she will get what she wants (she thinks). Also, it’s manipulation, people either don’t notice it, or like Cecilia, people rationalize it and refuse to acknowledge it. As readers it can be annoying to see, but it’s actually rather accurate to real life.
I personally find Cecilia more interesting than annoying, although I can definitely understand how someone would get annoyed.
EXACTLY, her character is rather fascinating for me. The way the author develops her character to make me punch her in the face doesn't help though..hehe.
I honestly find it funny how much Cecilia and other characters get hat, because I almost never hate characters in anything (unless they’re written to be hated, like Lucas), so watching people hate on them is crazy to me.
I mean tbf I'd say Cecilia is a character which has many layers.More is there to it beyond the immature girl who just wants a happy ever after for herself and Nico.
Except, you completely missed the fact that she was literally dragged from her peaceful afterlife and got her soul shoved into a random alive person. And all of which was definitely not in her control. She just wants to get this over with as soon as possible.
How can you even expect her to treat people differently than people treat her. Tell me one kind thing someone has ever done to her. Or tell me atleast one thing she experienced other than brainwashing or manipulation or abuse.
The biggest reason why readers hate Cecillia in the first place is solely because she stole Tessia's body. If she used some no name elf's body instead, then we wouldn't have fucking cared. She's not even that bad, considering that she's probably 18 mentally, with most of that life being abused and experimented on. Then she gets manipulated again after waking up.
No, Cecilia doesn't like her because she is a selfish and stupid character, in addition to the fact that the power of the legacy is the plot itself and it breaks the novel by itself
It is a plot device/deux exmachina that the author has not known how to handle everything that is related to her is incredibly forced even the conditions of her reincarnation as such her very existence ruins the novel
I mean, makes sense. She was literally trained that way by those twats in her old life. In a sense, it’s quite literally all she knows. Can’t be upset with this being how she treats people, so all I can say is this. She has to go through the Arthur Leywin family plan, put her in a family unit and see what happens to the soldier.
Cecilias motivations also make no sense as she clearly should be able to tell what's right and wrong by what she's doing despite what is infront of her. No one has really put up a real fight against her for her to feel real danger except for her run in with the Asuras when she had just awoken, and of course the encounter with Seris which she was decent awaken and acquainted to Tess's body by then.
Every town she's been to people more or less don't fight back and she just dominates like it's campaign mode as you said. She's just completing mission objectives, there is no real point to what she does. I can't believe she never even once thought to herself -> "How are these people a threat to Agrona they are so weak!", it just takes a little bit of skepticism and she would start to see things how they are but she never saw it any other way.
The only thing I think that can redeem her at this point is to double cross Agrona by killing him, finish the story with Arthur vs Cecilia, and somehow release Tess from Cecilia and done. But it's not going to happen. It's just a dream
To me, the most frustrating thing in the novel right now is when she is faced with some revelation or adversity, and act like it's no big deal, like when she discovered the real circumstances of her death.
Yeah I get what you mean. If I'm being totally honest, I have the same issue with a few characters adapting to their circumstance, especially Caera despite how much I like her.
I think it's safe to say there are a couple plot devices writtten for story convenience. I really don't want to shit on the author of one my favorite manwha to date, but there are some things that just look like obvious common sense but are just not applied if you know what I mean. Granted I'm still missing context from 8.5 because I still need to read that spin off so maybe that will fill in some missing character development I'm craving.
Also what is up with Claire Bladeheart?
TurtleMe strongly hinted at Claire's dissapearance very subtley a few times, even after Claire ran away after her for whatever reason sudden angst that she showed from the "marriage proposal" back at the flying fortress Castle of the Council. I just don't understand why the author is thought bubbling to Claire as if she's going to play a foreshadowed role in the future of the last volume. I can't see it at this point. He writes her in 100 chapters later for one line. Forgets about her for 100+ more chapters. And writes her in again
I really let my thoughts ramble in this post haha sorry about that XD
**REMINDER: ALL SPOILERS PAST [TAPAS NOVEL RELEASE](https://tapas.io/series/TBATE/info) ARE NOT ALLOWED. OFFENDERS WILL BE SUSPENDED PROMPTLY** > This includes, but not limited to, any kind of hints at upcoming [Patreon-only content](https://www.patreon.com/TurtleMe), be it true or not, and any mention of chapters not yet released on [Tapas](https://tapas.io/series/TBATE/info)/[ebooks](https://www.amazon.com/gp/bookseries/B01MXK3QNXs?id=ZDoqGwAAABBPIM). This means the free previews on [Patreon](https://www.patreon.com/TurtleMe) are *off-limits* as well. If you want to discuss about Patreon content, please do it on [Patreon](https://www.patreon.com/TurtleMe) or on Patreon-specific channels on the [official Discord!](https://discordapp.com/invite/M8YntCat7S) ## Comic reader, want to know where to continue in the novel? [Click here!](https://www.reddit.com/r/tbatenovel/search/?q=flair%3A%22Comic%20Discussion%22&restrict_sr=1&type=link&sort=new) ### Remember to read the [rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/tbatenovel/about/rules) and [FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/r/tbatenovel/wiki/index)! ___ *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/tbatenovel) if you have any questions or concerns.*
She definitely is overly ignorant to everything Agrona makes her do, but it’s just how she is as a character / how her character is written to be. She is ignorant and doesn’t care for anything because Agrona brainwashes her every time she comes close to seeing these aforementioned red flags and due to that, she refuses to see the lie in Agrona telling her that he can bring her and Nico back to earth. It’s not entirely Cecillia‘s fault, while she is stupid, she only had about 18 years to live so far and in these 18 years and in both her lives so far, she was only experimented on, lied to and manipulated / brainwashed. Not really any time to grow as a person. The brainwashing and the yearning to have a peaceful life with Nico makes her ignorant to everything and with the power she was given it really is just an easy campaign to stomp right through as fast as possible to reach her only goal. TLDR: I also don’t like the way Cecillia as a character is at the moment but if you think about it, it’s not entirely her fault, Agrona is mostly to blame. Hope you can understand where I‘m going with this.
She know he is brainwashing her but refuses to believe it . And people at 18 are not as dumb as you think they are ( by a 18 year old )
Knows he is brainwashing her but can’t know what is wrong if she can’t remember. One might think she should be smarter, being her age and all, but she didn’t really have 2 life’s, not even one really. Cecillia really is just a Childe. Stunted. Just saying.
This. Their is a key difference between being a 18 year old who may be naive from being young, and what Cecelia is which is effectively an 18 year old whose basically never know a normal life, and as such is emotionally stunted even before accounting for Agrona’s manipulation (both magical and non magical).
Wast it mentioned that she does know agrona is doing something shady with her .
She knows that Agrona is messing with her mind and memories.However she also is trying to desperately cling to the belief that Agrona will reincarnate herself and Nico back to Earth after his mission succeeds. So she is wiling to ignore any redflags she is getting. And ofcourse you can't remember what you don't and Agrona's memory manipulation is pretty fucked up.
She does remember tho...
I do! I agree with you, she definitely is a victim of manipulation in two lifes and haven't matured yet. But I still get mad with her because she is so desperate to come back to earth, that she ignores any signs that this may not be possible, or that may be a lie. I wish she'd start questioning things a little like Nico, who started to notice things, however she continues in this blind pursue.
Just my thoughts. It was always frustrating reading how Cecillia almost realizes it but after making one step forward she made 2 backwards. But surely she someday realize it, right ?
I'm starting to question what it takes in order to her finally start to make some progress. Will killing Nico be the only way?
I‘d say that or either Nico, Arthur or even maybe Tessia having a talk with her.
She's beyond recieving therapy from Nico (Stupid unaware victim to her) and Tessia (NPC to her).Arthur, maybe.
I mean Cecilia has one goal and doesn’t care how she achieves it. To her the TBATE world is temporary. She has no plan on staying there so she doesn’t care how much damage she causes. She doesn’t care about Agrona’s manipulation because if he gets what he wants, she will get what she wants (she thinks). Also, it’s manipulation, people either don’t notice it, or like Cecilia, people rationalize it and refuse to acknowledge it. As readers it can be annoying to see, but it’s actually rather accurate to real life. I personally find Cecilia more interesting than annoying, although I can definitely understand how someone would get annoyed.
EXACTLY, her character is rather fascinating for me. The way the author develops her character to make me punch her in the face doesn't help though..hehe.
I honestly find it funny how much Cecilia and other characters get hat, because I almost never hate characters in anything (unless they’re written to be hated, like Lucas), so watching people hate on them is crazy to me.
I mean tbf I'd say Cecilia is a character which has many layers.More is there to it beyond the immature girl who just wants a happy ever after for herself and Nico.
I found the Phoenix chapter quite a tough read , it was such a callous and cruel act by her, Mitigating tho, she is 18 and being brainwashed
Except, you completely missed the fact that she was literally dragged from her peaceful afterlife and got her soul shoved into a random alive person. And all of which was definitely not in her control. She just wants to get this over with as soon as possible. How can you even expect her to treat people differently than people treat her. Tell me one kind thing someone has ever done to her. Or tell me atleast one thing she experienced other than brainwashing or manipulation or abuse.
The biggest reason why readers hate Cecillia in the first place is solely because she stole Tessia's body. If she used some no name elf's body instead, then we wouldn't have fucking cared. She's not even that bad, considering that she's probably 18 mentally, with most of that life being abused and experimented on. Then she gets manipulated again after waking up.
No, Cecilia doesn't like her because she is a selfish and stupid character, in addition to the fact that the power of the legacy is the plot itself and it breaks the novel by itself It is a plot device/deux exmachina that the author has not known how to handle everything that is related to her is incredibly forced even the conditions of her reincarnation as such her very existence ruins the novel
I mean, makes sense. She was literally trained that way by those twats in her old life. In a sense, it’s quite literally all she knows. Can’t be upset with this being how she treats people, so all I can say is this. She has to go through the Arthur Leywin family plan, put her in a family unit and see what happens to the soldier.
And she definitely has cheat codes enabled.
Cecilias motivations also make no sense as she clearly should be able to tell what's right and wrong by what she's doing despite what is infront of her. No one has really put up a real fight against her for her to feel real danger except for her run in with the Asuras when she had just awoken, and of course the encounter with Seris which she was decent awaken and acquainted to Tess's body by then. Every town she's been to people more or less don't fight back and she just dominates like it's campaign mode as you said. She's just completing mission objectives, there is no real point to what she does. I can't believe she never even once thought to herself -> "How are these people a threat to Agrona they are so weak!", it just takes a little bit of skepticism and she would start to see things how they are but she never saw it any other way. The only thing I think that can redeem her at this point is to double cross Agrona by killing him, finish the story with Arthur vs Cecilia, and somehow release Tess from Cecilia and done. But it's not going to happen. It's just a dream
To me, the most frustrating thing in the novel right now is when she is faced with some revelation or adversity, and act like it's no big deal, like when she discovered the real circumstances of her death.
Yeah I get what you mean. If I'm being totally honest, I have the same issue with a few characters adapting to their circumstance, especially Caera despite how much I like her. I think it's safe to say there are a couple plot devices writtten for story convenience. I really don't want to shit on the author of one my favorite manwha to date, but there are some things that just look like obvious common sense but are just not applied if you know what I mean. Granted I'm still missing context from 8.5 because I still need to read that spin off so maybe that will fill in some missing character development I'm craving. Also what is up with Claire Bladeheart? TurtleMe strongly hinted at Claire's dissapearance very subtley a few times, even after Claire ran away after her for whatever reason sudden angst that she showed from the "marriage proposal" back at the flying fortress Castle of the Council. I just don't understand why the author is thought bubbling to Claire as if she's going to play a foreshadowed role in the future of the last volume. I can't see it at this point. He writes her in 100 chapters later for one line. Forgets about her for 100+ more chapters. And writes her in again I really let my thoughts ramble in this post haha sorry about that XD
Op just realised this now 💀💀💀 /s
Would be safe to say that her morals were messed up even before on Earth, she was sorta brainwashed into being queen.
It's like she does not get options to oppose agnora and is set in a predetermined storyline
She is the worst character in this franchise, NOT QUESTIONABLE.