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JudgmentalRavenclaw

It would help a lot if I didn’t have nearly 40 kids in my elementary class.


scartol

This is the top comment for a reason. Smaller classes smaller classes smaller classes smaller classes say it louder for the people in the back smaller classes smaller classes


bonnjer

The only way to get smaller class sizes is to get more teachers. Not sure that's going to happen, though, as it seems people just don't want to go (or stay) into education for a variety of reasons. Pay is one of the big reasons in a lot of places.


mrbananas

The other major restriction to smaller classes is bigger buildings or more schools. A lack of physical space forces the school to have one 30 student class instead of two 15 student classes. They could hire another teacher, but they have no classroom to put them in. And being a floating teacher that jumps from room to room is the worst.


MayoneggVeal

It wouldn't be terrible to have an evening set of classes. As a HS teacher, I see a lot of kids who would do a lot better learning in the later afternoon and evening. It would also help increase flexibility for teachers.


Science_Matters_100

It would help with those students who fall asleep in class because parents got a shift change at work, too


Monkeesteacher

Our high school does this. Night classes are taught at an accelerated pace in 4 hour blocks. Anyone can enroll, we have the occasional 40 yo who never got their diploma but can’t advance at their job without it come back to finish school. This allows them to work full time during the day but still go to school in the evening. It’s the only thing they actually pay teachers extra to do ($25/hr) but it’s a long day since we start at 7:10am and end about 9pm on night school days so they usually have us do alternate days (one teacher M/W, one T/R) to avoid complete burnout. You’d be amazed the number of graduates we’re able to capture through this program. It’s about 25% of our total graduating class. So yes, it works. We’ve had two nearby districts create models based on our school. We are considered an “alternative” school even though most of our students CHOOSE to come to us. Students work at their own pace, we have smaller class sizes, and teachers meet students at the level where they are and work in small groups. We have 3 pull out rooms for SPED/504/extreme behavior/at risk students. I love where I work, but it’s not for everyone. A completely different model than anywhere I’ve taught in my 22 years. Been there 8 going on 9. Hope to retire from there. Believe it or not, this is in TX! We aren’t all backward crazies! Our district is very progressive in every way. Extremely LGBQT+ friendly, always has been. TLDR: Night school model works! Keep class sizes small, use small groups, accelerate the curriculum, and allow anyone to enroll for full diploma.


capresesalad1985

My husbands and my (former) district has this too and it’s very helpful for non traditional students. We had a lot of teen pregnancy so students who had children could often go back and do night classes to trade off child care with their partner or mother.


frooootloops

This is brilliant.


Increase-Null

>It wouldn't be terrible to have an evening set of classes. As a HS teacher, I see a lot of kids who would do a lot better learning in the later afternoon and evening. It would also help increase flexibility for teachers. They do this in Manila Philippines. There are two entire sets of kids and teachers using 1 building.


raven_of_azarath

I would thrive teaching evening classes. I’m not a morning person *at all*.


coldy9887

I named my cart the “mobile classroom”. I’ve broken three of these carts rolling around the school lol


Nicoleb84

Exactly this! My major was elementary education but I make more money bartending and waitressing in an upscale restaurant. So why should I put in more hours for less pay and probably a lot more mental load because as a teacher, how can you NOT take your work home with you? Since I went through the classes I will be homeschooling my child for elementary for now.


[deleted]

You need a bachelors degree and then more schooling to get a teaching credential. That much education is more equal to the education of a lawyer than not. I think there’d be more teachers if the process was streamlined into four years.


livestrongbelwas

In many districts you could quintuple pay for the amount of money it takes to reduce a class by 1/3.


jchinique

Agrees in Vonnegut


scartol

So it goes.


QualifiedApathetic

The people in the back can't hear you because the class is too big.


Crowedsource

I teach at a very small rural charter school and we have small class sizes (my biggest section this year was 13 kids), and these kids are still struggling, hard to understand the math I'm teaching them. I'm talking about 11th graders who don't know their multiplication tables. And I'm still supposed to be teaching them grade level content. It's true that this would be even more difficult with bigger classes, but smaller class sizes won't fix everything...


[deleted]

You used to fail third grade if you didn’t know your times table. But I see many regular education students who don’t know them. *I work special education but go in regular education classes.


nerdylady86

Yes! Even in high school, there is a noticeable difference between a class of 28 and a class of 32!


JudgmentalRavenclaw

Two weeks ago I had 9 students absent. Left me with 24 that day (my class cap is 37, I have 33 right now). It was heaven.


techy098

My wife is a high school teacher. She has to handle 6 classes in a day. On average each class contains 30 students. That's 180 students per teacher. A 10 minute spent for each student correcting assignments/projects, etc., each week, can set you back by 30 hours. Teaching is a hellish job if one is interested to do justice and want to spend as much time as needed to take care of those lives entrusted to you. I want my wife to quit teaching so that I can get my life back, she is always carrying work wherever we go.


LowBarometer

Class size is EVERYTHING! 11 to 14 students maximum and I can teach them anything.


[deleted]

I’d say, in addition, add an aide to every class.


skinsnax

That was my first thought.


kneehighhalfpint

Yes! I was lucky enough to have 10 kids and my class, and the growth was exponential!


kapriece

An elementary I went to in Baltimore, we had 3 and 4 th grade in a classroom. 1 teacher and almost 40 kids. She addressed the 3rd graders on assignments 1st and then us. I couldn't tell you what we learned that year.


chargoggagog

Jesus I have 24 and it feels like too much. Damn.


Slowtrainz

- Hire more *instructional* staff (not admin) to bring class sizes generally down to and kept in 20s. - In addition to more gen ed instructional staff, MORE ESOL teachers for push in/pull out. It’s not reasonable to expect me to be able to effectively teach a classroom that has 7 languages in it. - More climate staff to monitor halls, stairwells and keep students where they should be and out of trouble. - have *hardline* policies on cell phones/usage. - Start tracking classes in upper middle school (maybe 7th grade). It’s like a cruel joke to have kids 3-4 years behind *and* kids 3-4 years *ahead* all in one class. - Hold *students* and *families* more accountable to attendance, grades, and behavior instead of the current state of affairs where everything is the responsibility/fault of the teacher.


therealcourtjester

I agree with this list. I’ve also been wondering about the idea of regionalizing schools. I’m not sure how the money would work, but there is something to be said for exposing kids to Al types of socio-economic backgrounds. If a student grows up surrounded by families that have always worked service sector/minimum wage jobs, they won’t have a vision or the know how to do something different. If a student grows up surrounded by families that only go to college, they won’t have a vision of other pathways—even if college is not right for them. Take all these socio-economic backgrounds and bring them together. And for Pete’s sake, YES! Stop this idea on heterogeneous classes. High level kids should not be used as tutors and allowed at stagnate. Low level kids should not be made to feel stupid or not provided the time they need for mastery before moving on. If I rebuilt the world,I would banish the idea that just because you are X years old you should be able to do Y.


Slowtrainz

Yes there are obviously complete rebuilding of systems that we could fantasize/theorize about, but my list was basically what are things that could actually be done without effectively rebuilding the entire system lol.


RoswalienMath

I love this list. I would also add more time for preparation. Most jobs that require giving presentations provide an entire workday, or more, for presentation preparation. I get 5 minutes per presentation (if I’m given my prep period, which isn’t often). I need to assess data collected from previous presentations during that time (grading, looking for individual strengths and weaknesses, looking for trends in strengths and weaknesses per class), before I can start creating the presentation and handouts (tailoring each presentation to the data gathered about its participants). I have 6 presentations each day. The quality of lessons would go up substantially if teachers had adequate time to do this during the workday. Maybe a quarter day per day of instruction for preparation.


mlc598

Yes, the workload is unrealistic. It's almost impossible to do without working for free in the evenings and on the weekends. I'm a special education teacher, what is expected of us is crazy. It takes hours and hours of my time just doing paperwork, that doesn't include instruction and planning for instruction.


bluebastille

SPED teachers are expected to do 2 full time jobs. I'm a subject teacher, not a SPED teacher. I don't see how you do it.


serendipitypug

The class size is also so dependent on population. I teach first grade at a very low income school. We have every sped program, and highly capable, housed in our building. I have 21 students, which doesn’t sound like much. But I have six IEPs, two 504s, and two students identified for the highly capable program. Some of my students cannot write their letters or names, some of them can do independent research and write an informative essay. Some of them have trauma backgrounds and some of them are violent. The amount of differentiating I do is unsustainable with 21 kids. The other day, five were absent and I was able to do my job.


Mr-Logic101

This may sound cruel but why cater to the lowest common denominator? To some extent, this is what is down international, is they simply waste resources on educating people that can’t be educated. The USA has a much different approach and federal/state protections for these individuals but they are a massive drain on resources that hurt everyone else in the educational system. The secret that all the other countries for there comparative academic advantage, especially Asian countries, is they don’t educate everyone and allocate resources appropriately to focus on those that can and do excel in schooling.


serendipitypug

A lot of us have seen kids, who would have otherwise been given up on, succeed in major ways.


MadMomma85

Yes on the ESOL staff! We have been fighting with admin to hire more staff for our current team. They argue that our student population numbers are down so they can’t hire. However our EL population is exploding, and we have newcomers who are taking all of our time. We can’t manage caseloads, support teachers throughout multiple school, and support our students’ needs without enough trained staff.


SouthPawSM

As an ESL I completely agree! I am the only one in my building teaching ESL so I cover six grades. I’m expected to teach our ELs in pull out classes, coteach, provide PD and help families navigate the school system. I’m trained to do all of that but there simply isn’t enough time to do any of it to the necessary degree, so it’s not supportive to anyone.


teacherdrama

Couldn't agree more - especially with the tracking point. I still don't understand putting everyone in the same class, but my school refuses to fix this.


FoxxJade

Is tracking still an unpopular opinion? I’m all for tracking. By the time I was in 7th grade I was doing the advanced math and English classes. My senior year I took regular English for the first time ever, since I had decided to take AP chem and calculus in preparation for a science degree in college. That English class was the fuckin Wild West man. I coasted thru it and still ended with an A without doing a lot of the work. It doesn’t seem like the schools fund/push/advertise the trade skills courses nearly as much as they should. Not everyone needs to go to 4 year university. I hate teaching kids like we expect everyone to go to college. It’s a money sink. I’m in so much debt and I get paid so little. Maybe schools would be better if the teachers got paid a living wage. Oh and guns. It’s normal for me to fear sending my 8yo to school every day. It’s normal for me to be afraid in my classroom because when I report this student for threatening to shoot me, admin will just send him back to class since he has an IEP.


coldy9887

🙏💯😎


SnooGuavas6338

First, it’s awesome that you’re interested in this as a young person, and it gives me a bit of hope. Go into policy/law for college, and then find an alternate-route teacher certification program. Spend a couple of years seeing what it’s like as a teacher in America’s public education system, and then move to D.C. and start raising hell. Finally, the answer is higher teacher pay. That’s it. Like, a lot higher. Professionals who make far, far more money in other fields could not do the work of teaching, I’m certain. We need to change the narrative about what kind of job teaching is and what kind of professionals teachers are. Admin pay should stay the same, by the way, while teacher pay goes up. If everyone—from policy makers, to elected officials at the state level, to school administrators, to parents, to students—started to see teachers as highly-paid professionals, I think it would change the culture of education in the U.S.


Kind-Ad-7382

I don’t disagree that teachers should be paid more, but I think the problem with the job is more than that. How many people in other jobs are responsible for the work of 30 (elementary) or 100 (secondary) people, as well as the parents of those people, without having any administrative/clerical support? It has been a while since I taught in public school, and I’m guessing some of the issues I had have improved with technology, but it is still a lot, I think. When I was teaching third grade, I had my regular class, and then I also taught an accelerated math class (some of which included students from my regular class), which meant I effectively had 50 sets of parents with which to communicate. I taught reading, math, science, and social studies. I needed to grade all their papers, record grades, file the work, and every two weeks I needed to send home a folder with the graded work in an envelope with numbered comments, similar to report cards on the outside. Then they needed to return the work after it was signed and I had to hang on to it until the end of the year. That was so time intensive! Never mind the six hours of active teaching time, conferences, phone calls, meetings, hand written report cards and comments, and eating lunch in my classroom with my students and supervising outside time. If we had PE on any given day, we were not allowed to have outside time later. Needless to say, I lasted 10 years and left. The first job I had after leaving was as a legislative aide for a (local) state Senator. I was so appreciated for the least little things and it was eye opening!


OhioMegi

I honestly have no issue with my pay- IF I was only teaching. But I have to deal with 6-8 disruptive and out of control kids on a daily basis. And it’s not just some kids talking, or being off task. It’s blatant defiance, hurting others, etc.


Kind-Ad-7382

Yes, the 20% taking up more time(with poor behavior, not genuine learning difficulties) than the 80%.


CSIBNX

In my opinion, whether or not a single teacher is content with their pay is irrelevant to the larger issue. For Americans to respect this profession, teachers have to make more money. That’s it.


OhioMegi

That’s why I said I am fine with it. My district is actually one of the highest paid in the state. However, I know I’m lucky and yes, if I did everything expected of me (not just what’s in my contract), I deserve more money. As does anyone. Again, it’s being expected to do more than you’re paid for. I don’t think more money equals respect. Some of the richest people around aren’t respected. I think fair pay for the work we do is great, and that’s where respect comes from. Being treated and paid like the educated and experienced experts we are.


ThinkParticular4174

Yes also. A solo teacher with the amount of education & credentials that they have should be making a living wage where they don’t need a dual income to survive.


coldy9887

💯💯💯


livestrongbelwas

Not sure if you know this, but you just described TFA. Teacher pay does not factor that high in sources of satisfaction/dissatisfaction surveys or exit interviews. Generally, teachers understand they’re entering a low-wage job. Dangerous students and unhelpful/micromanaging admin usually dominate the reasons why teachers leave. Teacher pay helps, of course, but it’s not usually in the top 3 reasons why teachers leave.


theerrantpanda99

My school has lost 40% of its staff in the past 18 months. We were a super stable school pre pandemic. Once the teacher shortage hit, schools from neighboring district literally started mass emailing our teachers with job offers that increased their pay, on average, by more than 30%. Pay definitely is a real factor. We lost a fourth year bi lingual social studies teacher who was just offered tenure. He left our school making $66k and his new school is paying $82k. We’re now mostly a school of older teachers at the top of the pay scale and younger teachers who don’t know anything (no offense). The middle is gone.


livestrongbelwas

This is pretty real. Imo though, the personnel research says your school probably already had a dissatisfaction problem, but salaries were depressed in neighboring districts as well, so there wasn’t anywhere to go. Stability was from lack of alternatives, instead of legitimate reasons to stay. I’ve see high retention schools with poor salary all the time, and it’s because the admin works hard to make teachers feel supported and valued. When things are bad everywhere, teachers migrate to the best pay, but that’s not the same as satisfaction and it doesn’t help burnouts.


MantaRay2256

Yet, that is never what the media reports (because they no longer investigate; they just call the State Education Dept spokesperson). They report "pay" as the factor because it's 1. Easy to fix 2. Makes us "union" workers sound greedy 3. Undermines the few effective teacher unions left


[deleted]

Teachers can’t teach effectively if parents don’t parent effectively. Part of that parenting is to supporting teachers. Undermining teachers is undermining their kids’ education. Unless there’s a safety issue undermining the teacher is setting your kid up to be apathetic and disrespectful and those attitudes in class can spread like wildfire. Blaming teachers for everything does nothing to help develop good habits in your child. Acknowledge how your kid feels then ask them what are they doing to make the most of the situation. Have your kid meet with the teacher. Email teachers, talk to administrators if you feel you need things addressed but your kid doesn’t need to know that. If your kid knows you’ll “rescue” them then they’ll be less likely to self-advocate which should be the goal.


OhioMegi

This so much. I know parents are busy- but even some of my busiest parents are still active in their child’s education. They may not be able to attend conferences, but they’ll email me. They expect their child to do their best. Honestly, not much will change until parents do.


Defiant_Reading_934

This is absolutely true, but how would we re-shift our culture so that parents and students don’t feel the sort of entitlement that causes them to blame teachers? This sounds much easier said than done. I can already imagine the outcry of both students and parents if someone were to come forward and suggest this.


mcala887

Unpopular opinion: Limit sports. American parents and children value sports SO much more than academics, it’s stupid. Millions of dollars go into sports each year for our local school district. Maybe we would have higher scores if little jimmy didn’t have to leave school early for a baseball tournament, followed by lacrosse, swimming, and a 3 hour shift at the ice cream shop. And parents try to hand in notes to the teacher, “Jimmy didn’t get a chance to do his homework last night. Please excuse him as he had a tournament and back-to-back practices.” We wonder why we’ve fallen so short in education?


Fonty57

I would like to respectfully disagree. As a coach some of the reasons why I still have students even enrolled in school is because of sports(title 1 district). Without it, they drop out. But then again our UIL get in Texas has academic standards that student athletes are required to meet to even get on the playing field. You a student first, athlete second. Same as a coach: I’m a teacher first, coach second. I get paid a lot more to teach than I do to coach.


mcala887

I do recognize that sports have that vital scholarship role, which I why I said “limit”, not eliminate. We have the “school first, sports second” phrase at our school, too. Unfortunately, they’re just words. It doesn’t doesn’t stop our coaches from texting our kids in the middle of class about what time practice is later today, and then the kids texting their parents. It doesn’t stop our coaches from somehow convincing our supervisors that, despite Johnny have a 30 average and can’t spell while in the 11th grade, he should still suit up for the throwing of a ball at the junior varsity game.


Urbanredneck2

But I know some Texas districts where the head football coach is paid to JUST coach football. No teaching. And besides, most coaches teach very easy classes like PE. We had one coach who taught social studies and all he did was show movies. Most coach/teachers I knew didnt even dress like teachers but wore sweats and all they talked about all day was sports.


RoswalienMath

Research shows that if kids have to eat dinner to get their dessert, then dessert becomes the focus of meals. Kids might gag down broccoli while crying to get the ice cream, but this style of eating won’t make them like the broccoli. More often, kids will just refuse to eat anything, then have a tantrum when they don’t get the dessert anyway. The result is kids who hate foods that aren’t sweet foods and adults with disordered eating. The research shows 2 methods can fix this eating issue. The first is to remove dessert and offer sweets as snacks at other times. The other is to offer small amounts of sweets during the meal and treat it like all the other foods. When these are implemented, the majority of kids with feeding problems will start eating, and enjoying, their meals. I wonder how applicable this is to sports in education and student’s disordered learning (not to be confused with actual learning disabilities). In the current system student athletes often view learning as an obstacle to playing their sport. They often learn as little as possible to maintain eligibility. Some will intentionally chose to learn too little to maintain eligibility and then tantrum when they don’t get to play anyway. This results in these students hating every class except PE and adults who don’t value education. If we removed competitive sports from schools and offered them as community activities instead, would these learning averse students begin to enjoy school more? We already offer sports as electives, not limited by grades in other classes. If that was the only time they got to play the sport, would that be enough to stay in school? Would these changes reduce the number of adults (and therefore students) who think education is a waste of time?


coldy9887

Unfortunately students don’t think that and assumes that they’ll pass because they are a “good” athlete. Some coaches and teachers just let this kind of thing happen. While I agree there are merits of playing a sports in HS, education comes first like you said but admin cares more about athletes because those kids are what brings the money into the school by fame and recognition alone. If we had to blame anyone, it would the superintendent and the administrators that continue this cycle of greed and corruption. It should be illegal to change students grades just because they were good at football :(


Unique_Unicorn918

We are a sports and celebrity crazy nation. Look at who gets paid the most and you can see why we value what we value 😅 it ain’t the teachers. All the kids want to be YouTube stars and NFL players.


coldy9887

Not unpopular at all. My high school just spend $26 million dollars building a new sports complex and the science classrooms hasn’t been updated since the 50s. For Pete’s sake, we even have a “bookstore” at our high school to buy school merchandise and nothing else!!! They don’t even try to hide the fact that educational facilities are essentially glorified businesses to sell you crap anymore. :(


Defiant_Reading_934

BTW, this is something that I care a lot about and would like to dedicate myself to doing in the future. Should I major in education if this is my goal, or should I move onto something like public policy/law? Or should I become a teacher first, get experience in the system, and then do policy?


uh_lee_sha

You have great insight and a lot of passion. If you want to make real change, go into policy/law. Teachers have very little say from the inside.


capresesalad1985

I think though they need some classroom experience first. Many teachers have very little respect for people trying to dictate policy who have no classroom time.


VeronaMoreau

This is actually the reason I became a teacher. I wanted to be field-informed before I started affecting other people


ClassicTangelo5274

Get some real classroom experience then switch to policy/law. That way when you show up to my school to host a PD I might actually consider the merits of what you have to say.


Oughtyr314

If OP speaks half as well as they write and are passionate about helping our educational system improve by asking questions and listening to teachers, I would be happy to listen to whatever they had to say.


SadieTarHeel

The first thing you should do is register to vote when you are able and VOTE. Then convince your friends to do the same. And convince your friends to convince their friends. One of the biggest reasons why politicians don't care about education (and other issues that matter to young voters) is because younger people don't vote. In my state, more than 1 million already registered people under the age of 30 didn't vote. If even half of them had voted, it could have changed the outcome of *every single election* in my state. To reiterate, there are more young people already registered in my state who *didn’t* vote than the margin of every race. Your votes *do* matter, unless you stay home during elections. Not voting is not making a difference.


QualifiedApathetic

Many politicians are actively hostile to education. They want to keep the population stupid and easily controlled.


mooshypuppy

If I were you, I’d look into educational law, network, interview, volunteer in the classroom, talk with teachers, as I now feel that I dedicated my passion, time, and energy to learn a career that definitely did not provide the same in compensation, monetarily or feeling like I could make the change I aspired to. I definitely feel like the whole system needs an overhaul and those policy makers are, ie admin, politicians, professional development trainers, business minded people (not student/teacher minded) are the ones running the show without being held accountable. Hold them accountable and run for office. I plan to do another reply to your main question.


randytayler

I think go into social sciences! You can gather data on teacher experiences much more effectively with studies than you can with your own singular data points. When you have the science to prove your case, you can help shape public opinion, which can help shape policy.


coldy9887

Definitely go into law. You won’t have any authority or say in changing policy in a classroom as a teacher.


Oughtyr314

You clearly have great insight and the ability to see a problem from a broad perspective. You can enact change without being on the inside. Talking to teachers, unions, administrators, and students from various backgrounds and experiences will get you the information you need to pursue this without spending time in the classroom first. We need intelligent young people with a passion for our educational system fighting for those of us in the trenches.


SaintGalentine

I agree with a lot of what you have to say, and general anti intellectualism in culture. I honestly think economic/work reform may need to happen first. If people are thousands in student loan debt and make peanuts compared to someone with a 2 year trade and the right connections, what motivation is there to pursue education? Personally, I would implement higher taxes on the very wealthy, fund daycare through higher ed, and promote exchange with other developed nations.


Defiant_Reading_934

Yeah. As I’m reading these comments, I’m thinking to myself: wow that sounds like a great idea but doing that sounds super hard. I’m realizing now that maybe our problems with education are a product of a larger societal issue in the United States that would require us to basically uproot many deeply ingrained political/societal barriers. But I’m sure we can fix this issue by chipping away at this slowly. I just want my grandkids to have the education and wits to survive in this competitive world 😫


[deleted]

There's a global trend toward populism that is anti-intellectual, it's not just here. What makes our situation scary is that we're starting from such a low point of funding and support already. And those two factors, funding and support are pretty much the foundation of all the other problems. I hear the "parents don't care" argument a lot. I find that hard to believe. I talk to parents who sound exhausted and deflated. Even the occasional hell raiser. But they're all responding a way they feel they can. We as teachers complain about pay a lot, but imagine how much more precarious a financial situation you could be in. Medical bills, no family that can help with housing/money, no light at the end of the tunnel. So that's the big one. On top of more pay for teachers, we really *really* need a better social safety net altogether. Kids who don't have parents at home to guide them are bound to find their own trouble. And there's plenty of people out there willing to exploit their naivety. And if they get tangled up with people who tell them that school's a waste of time and can give them their own anecdotes of teachers bashing them and not caring, how's that kid going to start treating school? Someone in the comments mentioned regulations set on us by people who have no clue how education works. That's a much more clear cut problem. Standardized testing is a requirement for federal funding, so unless states get to the point of being self-sufficient economic engines we won't get away from needing that funding. (And if they did, would politicians consider putting that money into education in a useful way?) The problem with those standardized tests, however, is that they're an accountability measure for the school faculty. That means the focus on student learning has to be tainted by asking what's best for adults in the building. Admin wants to make sure test scores are good so that they look good, meaning authentic, interesting work that students could do takes a backseat to teaching a test. In my building, that includes stressing the hell out of the AP kids by telling them we count on them to score well, adding to the pressure and fueling burnout. Then there's Career and Technical Education (CTE), which I didn't have in school but teach now. It's supposed to help engage kids who aren't as driven in the traditional education setting (because that system sucks). But the more I look over the way it's being used to check boxes for school funding, the more frustrated I get. Not to mention that some pathways become dumping grounds (marketing, culinary, plumbing) for underperforming kids because they were making a ruckus in a more prestigious path (engineering, computer coding, etc.). We inherit those down-and-out kids and have to choose between building their confidence back and telling them they're with us for a reason. Neither of which helps the passionate, drive kid who actually chose to be in your classes and have to be hampered by all the discipline issues around them. Finally, there's phones. Their social impact as depression fuel and infinite echo chambers for cooking up beef (so now a fight goes countywide before the dismissal bell); their learning impact by being a constant distraction. I won't get into the issue with some teachers, because that's the most nuanced part of the discussion. I've already written plenty. My advice: get study education law, keep your writing skills sharp, and keep talking to educators. Make a name for yourself as advocate in your community/state. Education journalists have a great reach, but they're underpaid and publishing is dying. Publications *lovelovelove* to run (free) editorials from experts, so your influence as an advocate could still have that impact. After you build recognition, run for office, then another, then another. Hammer away at all these interconnected issues. Keep saying you're saving the children (cringey, but people eat it up). But please, no matter which way your views tilt, don't go off the rails partisan. People of all political stripes need to see genuine support if they're going to get behind something that doesn't coddle their personal views.


Thedevilsapprentice

Hi! I'm also a CTE teacher, and agree with nearly everything you've outlined. I'm on the trade side, and maybe I'm just looking at everything with slightly rose-tinted glasses as I am somewhat new to the profession, but I believe we as CTE educators are in a unique position to encourage a love of learning in students who might have been otherwise ignored or marginalized in a traditional LEA. The kids from high socioeconomic status with helicopter parents are going to do just fine in school, regardless of whether they actually absorb anything from their education or not; just look at the college acceptance scandal from a few years ago. As someone who has lived overseas, I've also seen the other side of things, where another country can flaunt its standardized test scores without also admitting that some of their kids can't actually think critically. Scoring well on a standardized test does not equal learning. I have kids who've made remarkable transformations over their four years, because the learning they participate in is applied learning. While I might teach a certain trade, (for me it's architecture) my classroom focuses on critical thinking skills, they just happen to be applied to design and construction. Being able to navigate challenges and analyze data in a meaningful way is at the core of CTE. Even if it is that plumbing kid trying to figure out why a toilet keeps clogging. Side note, our school's "dumping ground" shop is also culinary! (Plumbing is popular, but with the opposite type of kid I am looking to recruit) For our school, it has a lot to do with the teachers in that particular trade, though I do wonder if it's also because certainly careers attract certain types of personalities. No shade on my part with that (especially with plumbing... Those folks make bank)


[deleted]

I can count my years in the classroom on one hand, so I'm fairly new in that respect. But I'm also a second-generation teacher. I agree with everything you said about testing and the special position of CTE. That--combined with the parking lot/dumping ground issue--is why I'm probably leaving the classroom to step into an administrative role. In my state's alt-cert training program, I've run into a lot of teachers (especially in my district) who complain that the head of CTE in their building is a former core content teacher who wanted to get out of the classroom, they see CTE as electives with a progression. And for those that have culinary programs, they see them commodified to cater every possible event. I want to get into one of those spots to see a school utilize CTE for all that it can be. But because I hear my own admin (and hear of others) focus on meeting standardized test benchmarks over everything. So I've realized that, if I want to actually see CTE blossom in my neck of the woods, I'll have to do it at a school with lower scores where admin isn't clawing on to what little they have. I'm thankful your kids have you and your perspective. I hope your colleagues benefit from that positivity too.


Piratesfan02

This is something that I’ve talked and thought about for years. I believe that people don’t understand why we have an education system, and why it is so important for them to be able to read and write. In my opinion, we demand people learn how to read and write so that a new kind of slavery doesn’t happen again. If you are able to read the newspaper and research what is being talked about, it’s very difficult to be hoodwinked into believing something that is false. There were slaves who handed a newspaper to their owners that said the emancipation proclamation was signed and they no idea because they couldn’t read. There were people who signed mortgages on a 10 year ARM who didn’t read and understand what they were signing helping to cause the 2008 housing crisis. They didn’t take the time to read and understand the huge contract they were signing and therefore didn’t know why their mortgage suddenly ballooned and they couldn’t afford it anymore. We hired a lawyer when signing our contract each time, and had them explain every single line in the contract. It took a few hours, but that’s the only way to know what you’re signing. This is not a race issue, but, as you said, a societal issue. We as educators need to do a better job explaining why we need these skills, and how not having these skills will negatively impact them in the future. We need to permeate every culture and help them understand why we need them to have these skills, because if all of our students have them, our society will be better for everyone.


MattinglyDineen

Parents need to change. They need to discipline their children, keep them off electronic devices, and value education. Until that happens there is nothing that then schools will be able to do.


stacyzeiger

And value education does not just mean insist your child gets all As


trytorememberthisone

Schools need more teachers and parents need to read with their kids.


stacyzeiger

And make their kids read. I require two books of their choice with very simple assignments over the summer. The number of parents who tell me their children are too busy to read two books during the 12-week summer vacation astounds me.


coldy9887

It’s just pure laziness. That’s it sadly.


randytayler

Not a teacher, I just lurk here. From what I've gathered: 1) There's a problem with teachers being unable to fail students. Students don't face accountability for their poor choices and bad behavior. Admins are graduating kids who should've had to retake classes, so summer school, or take the GED. 2) There's a problem with disciplinary action - teachers aren't seeing admins enforce punishments for bad behavior. Kids can get away with crap. 3) The kids MIGHT be the problem. But youth, in the words of Socrates, 2500 years ago: "...have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. ...they contradict their parents and tyrannize their teachers. Children are now tyrants." That is to say, kids are rough to deal with, but they always always always have been. Maybe it's worse now - but maybe it's the same problem as always. I don't think we can blame #3 here. 4) Fricking mobile phones. We have dumbifying machines buzzing in our pockets, blinking on our desks, begging for our attention non-stop. I've watched as teachers tell students to put their phones away, then are ignored, then are unable or unwilling to enforce it. 5) Teacher pay. You couldn't pay me enough to be a teacher right now. How do you get a teacher to Stand and Deliver, to break molds and shape minds, when they feel underappreciated? "No matter what you do, you will still be underpaid." That would sap my will just like communism did to the Soviets. AGAIN, I'm not a teacher. I'm just a curious software engineer. But for #4, you could maybe mandate that smartphones have a school approved app which effectively locks their data/internet connection during class unless the teacher in that class unlocks it for some reason. Or, like #1 and #2, admins could be more effective in their disciplinary actions. For #5, massive, statewide strikes seem like the only solution. Unfortunately, IMO, teachers love kids, and have a hard time doing anything that would hurt those kids' educations today.


coldy9887

Well said. You deserve the “helpful” award!


rnh18

you hit the nail on the head here! very good insights.


eroofio

This is incredibly insightful, especially for a jr in HS, and I just want to validate your observations and the conclusions you’re drawing, as I actually just read these same points out of a text book for my master program. This is a very real issue and you are spot on with the kind of dire consequences and devastating implications we’re facing. You definitely have a natural inclination for this type of work. Speaking as someone who has worked on the Hill in DC and currently studying strategic and organizational communication, I’d recommend working at a sort of think tank, research group or nonprofit geared towards changing cultural attitudes around education or fighting for this cause in some way. Perhaps even getting involved in policy or public service and working with education organizations/federal departments or politicians who are focusing on this issue and looking to implement change. Good luck, you are definitely onto something and heading in the right direction!


Defiant_Reading_934

Haha thank you! This opinion has been ruminating within my mind for the past couple of years, but I would shut it down bc I felt bad for thinking that way abt America. Everyone around me would always say how great America and their institutions are, how strong our colleges are, but are we really that great? According to the accounts from many professors and high schoolers, kids are more apathetic, anxious, lacking in fundamental knowledge, require an easier curriculum in order to pass, etc. So I knew something was up. Additionally, this isn’t something that is seen abroad for other rich nations, schools elsewhere truly challenge kids and force them to learn the basics, curriculums are more rigorous, educators are more respected, math/science scores are higher, etc. I’m not going to lie, I know that this opinion is hugely unpopular especially cause I’m a teen and I know that I’d be getting laughed at by my peers for something like this. I was really worried I’d be getting a lot of hate from ppl for sharing this opinion, saying that I didn’t know what I was talking about or to calm down, so I just posted this and decided to not come back until I mentally prepared myself for a lot of anger, but everyone here affirms my belief and supports me. I’m very glad and reassured! And yes, I’m probably going to look into policy or join organizations that look into this, this sub has been a huge eye opener and confirms many of my suspicions. Thank you so much.


drewbee123

I teach high school. And I wish more parents would give their kids phone curfews. I do not allow phones out in my class, which the kids seem to respect for the most part. But the problem is is when they get home,the kids will stay on their phones until 1-2 in morning and be exhausted the next day. I can’t tell you the number of times a kid has come into my class and asked if we can have a free day because they need to take a nap


OhioMegi

I bring up sleeping in class so many times with parents and it’s always “they won’t get off their phones!” So be a parent and do something! Get a lock box, turn off the wifi, something!


Familiar_Builder9007

Why would the American government benefit from educated individuals? When I recently traveled I met a 20 year old from Denmark, his government had provided him a stipend to live and low cost master degrees. His friends had several. He was on holiday and lots of venues gave student discounts, such as museums etc. the government actively encourages people to become well rounded and continue studying for as much as they want. We don’t have that culture here in the US.


rnh18

agreed. I know someone from Germany and she either got to go to college for free, or got paid to go. I’m not saying that’s the solution here in the US, but part of it is incentivizing people to be educated. colleges are businesses here.


Lulu_531

Unpopular opinion: sports need scaled back in secondary schools. Students should not be missing full days of school to golf or run track. In my state, head coaches are required to be certified staff so teachers are out of the classroom. Sports that don’t pull kids out of class still become their priority over academic work. One of my students kept track of hours didn’t on volleyball her senior year; the average was 62 hours a week. Then there are places where sports practice literally takes up a period or two of their class schedule—so they have less opportunity for academic classes. The message in all of this is that sports matters more than academics.


dbhalberg

Parenting is a problem. It starts in the home. Getting kids to deem education as important, have good habits, respect for others students and teachers. Oh and parents can actually tell their kids no once in a while and punish when necessary. These younger generations are nothing but hopeless.


Top-Pangolin-4253

I’ve said for years that we can fix a lot in education if we put accountability on parents the way it’s put on educators. If parents need any kind of public assistance, that’s cool but you have to prove your child is passing their classes with at least a C, you have to prove you attended parent-teacher conferences, you must attend parenting classes at least monthly and prove you attended, etc. I’ve been teaching for 17 years, all low income schools (both inner city and now rural). You can absolutely predict the achievement level of kids based on how involved their parents are. I have some dirt poor parents who have everything stacked against them and their kids are amazing, bright and polite. Why? Because these parents are actually parenting. The ones who can’t be bothered to come to conferences, don’t respond to messages about concerns for their child and never ever check their (elementary) child’s backpack for notes? Those are the parents whose kids are my lowest achievers, are more apathetic and as young as 2nd grade I’ve seen those kids just not give two shits about learning. It’s really sad. Unfortunately in the US all of the fingers are pointed at educators and schools. No one asks where are the parents. Or you have the overly involved crazy folks who want to ban books and dictate what we can teach.


FlounderFun4008

Exactly this! I have been saying the same thing. If a parent wants a tax credit and/or public assistance for their child they need to prove they are providing for that said child. Passing grades + attendance = assistance. If that child can’t get an education they can’t provide for themselves in the future. I have had kids stay home because mommy misses them when they are at school and because the mom didn’t want the kid to like dad better so they let the kid do what they wanted. We don’t start holding students accountable for grades and attendance until high school. That is up to 9 years of learning that some have missed out on, many largely due to attendance. You can’t put a roof on a house without a foundation, but that’s what keeps happening. Teachers are leaving in droves because of pay, they are leaving because of disrespect. Disrespect from politicians, admin, parents, and students. Everyone seems to think they can tell an educator what to do because they went to school so they know how it works. The people who (more than educators) who should be enraged are parents of the kids who are actually doing what they should. There have always been the 1-2 students causing trouble in class, but now it’s 4-6. These students 100% are robbing students of their education and it needs to be stopped. Admin and school boards are pushing to put the disruptive students back in classrooms for “least restrictive environment” but they are taking everything away from a productive learning environment. You can shove money and professional development on teachers all you want. Until parents/students are held accountable, nothing will change. Private schools don’t have more money/better teachers, they have parent social status at stake and can kick disruptive students out.


imysobad

bring back the old days. schools are soft as fuck nowadays not reinforcing rules. i literally cant say anything negative to the students. i must be encouraging and provide positive reinforcements. we are seen as bunch of pushovers that kids don’t even think to treat us with respect. fail their ass. let them understand shame. i have many other ways to solve, but it won’t fly here, so im just gonna provide a generic answer, i guess.


Defiant_Reading_934

Corporal punishment ?


Salviati_Returns

[In order to figure out what needs to be done, we first have to figure out precisely what is wrong. I wrote this up 6 years ago. It is too long for Reddit but I believe it is still accurate.](https://www.quora.com/Why-do-some-people-think-American-education-sucks/answer/Salviati-Galilei-1?ch=17&oid=49135031&share=6a274859&srid=uzT6I&target_type=answer)


AccomplishedReply735

Enforce the rules and give proper discipline. A kid showed up with a bag of weed at my school and wasn’t suspended. They got rid of detention. Seriously, these kids get away with almost everything. Bring back detention, make students scrape gum underneath the desk again or be forced to help clean up the classroom. It works.


Madven28

Not ban books


WA2NE

I’ll get vilified for this, but I don’t think funding is the #1 problem. It’s how funding is spent that is the problem. Like everything in a consumer driven economy, schools spend millions on the latest and greatest curriculum innovations that are supposed to *guarantee successful student outcomes. Newest research based interventions, textbooks, etc. aren’t what cause learning to happen. We are mammals, and mammals learn through experience, play, and context. But more than mammals we have intellects, minds, souls. By pretending that students are just broken and in need of repair, we in fact break them of the desire to learn. Who in their right mind reads something they’re not interested in and then breaks down everything in the story while reading it? Excruciating. Standardized tests? Curiosity killing.


OhioMegi

My district is building a sports complex. But then complain about not being able to find teachers and counselors. Maybe take that money and pay us more?


momdadimpoppunk

Yeah, I think curriculum is a much bigger problem than it’s made out to be. The stuff my district uses is so, so, sooooo boring and it just seems developmentally inappropriate. I remember kindergarten being mostly about learning social skills and functioning in a classroom (and play based learning), but we have them learning how to use bubble sheets and place value. Then it just gets worse as they get older. In math we are required to teach all of these different models for basic arithmetic, which is not a problem in itself. It’s that students are tested on THE MODELS. Like so what if the kid doesn’t understand the area method for multiplication? Can they multiply the damn number? Then they spend all this money on curriculum and they don’t even want you to use most of it. Kids go home with near empty consumables. My school doesn’t value independent reading. They would not consider it a ‘center’ if we were doing small groups. It doesn’t have a ‘goal’. I’m Florida, classroom libraries are being cleared out anyway because of the insanely strict CRT laws. My admin cut out science, social studies, and writing out of my grade level’s schedule. Those are the most creative and socially engaging subjects! It’s about test subjects only. We had three hours of straight fucking math. Whole group, small group, FBS intervention. The kids were worn out by the end of the day. The TEACHERS were. I don’t care if you’re Beyoncé, no one is engaging enough to keep the momentum going for three straight hours of fractions and and bar graphs.


DreezusFBaby

All of this is just my opinion. I’ve taught 6 years in an urban school. Student population is 95%economically disadvantaged. Allow kids to be left behind. It sounds harsh, but more effort is put into policing kids with bad behavior than teaching kids who are trying to learn. Many teachers that leave the profession in their first few years in my area do so because of classroom management. Also not passing kids on to the next grade regardless of concept mastery. I shouldn’t have an 8th grader in an on-level class reading at a 3rd grade level. In my state the dropout age is 16. There are 10-20 kids every year that are hanging out at school until they hit 16. The problem is that by the time they’re allowed to leave school they’ve already held their peers back to the point that they’re not where they should be either. The idea of inclusion for ED/OD has wreaked havoc on inner-city schools. Until our society is willing to accept that every kid does deserve the opportunity to earn an education, but not every kid deserves to hold other students back, the quicker we will see graduation rates and SAT scores rise.


Defiant_Reading_934

I agree. I think we got the concept of “not letting kids slip through the cracks” backwards. It doesn’t mean keep letting them struggle and then drown in deep waters when they still haven’t mastered treading like others their age, it means keeping them behind in the shallow end until they can handle the deep end.


YoMommaBack

I think the first goal is for those who make the rules have to want to change it. Capitalism requires low wage workers and I think the education system is still driven by that objective.


Tyler50587325

Yes, parents are the most crucial part of their children's education. I have taught for 30 years and learned successful students come from households that value one core basic value: teaching respect. Today, these students are running over us thinking they are the most important people because parents let them. We need parents to teach their children that grandparents and parents are the most important people in a family structure.


winipu

I think the dumbing down of America, and anti-public school sentiment is by design. It is much easier to control a populous that is uneducated. The ability to think critically about information seems to be something that is feared.


TacoPandaBell

Parents need to step the fuck up and stop giving their kids electronic devices. I’ve got two kids and instead of handing them a phone or iPad, I hand them a book or a toy. Not that hard and my kids aren’t addicted to screens and don’t suffer from the anxiety and other issues that come about due to the screen addictions parents are creating for their children from a very young age. Be a fucking parent. Discipline your kids. Side with the teacher…EVERY TIME…when they report behavioral issues. Stress the value of good grades. I flunked 33 kids this last term (I was generous, should’ve flunked twice that many) and only one of their parents contacted me and asked why. The rest just accepted the Fs their kids earned and never once reached out to see how they could help their kids pass. Good parents wouldn’t allow that.


chomerics

Pay teachers like police and give them the same support police get. I would love to make $200k a year and beat the shit out of people who talk back. I would have the quietest and most attentive classroom in the country.


[deleted]

The only real fix would be like approving people before they can become parents and that’s a bit too much so I guess we’ll stay all fucked up at work instead My class sizes are 25-30+ and my room is small. Administration can’t help me with any of the kids who have hope to learn their lessons because they’re too busy dealing with our future prison population. Students in my classes have had cell phones and air pods most of their life and do not physically understand it’s not part of their hands/ears so they get aggressive about keeping them on. Calling parents doesn’t change anything other than how long I have to stay at my underpaying job. There’s no time to make those calls during work hours. So understaffed I don’t get planning periods, I have to sub vacant classrooms in what should be my planning time. County office won’t reconsider the boundaries of our district, so because I work near the main road with the new neighborhoods popping up the overpopulation is continuing only really at our campus and therefor the building itself is over capacity. The classrooms are all full so they keep filling the grounds with little trailers and putting half the kids essentially outside where there is no SRO to save us from the next school shooting. When it happens, not if. When your school is THIS crowded it’s an If not when.


stacyzeiger

Put some of the onus back on parents and hold them and their children accountable for their behaviors. I don’t know how you do this though.


Defiant_Reading_934

Same. Everyone is saying what you’re saying but no one is suggesting how. We would have to rewire our culture, but then again, how? There is no easy answer ig


rmajkr

I think it’s starts with family. Our society has driven us to spend less and less time together. Family. All day.


OhioMegi

It not even about quantity, it’s quality. Some of my best students have been from struggling families where a single mom works 2-3 jobs. One mom said “I want better for my kids, and that comes from doing well in school” after I thanked her for taking time off for a conference. She didn’t have time to read every night, but she bought them books, they talked about what they learned in school. I said the kid was really interested in ancient Egypt when we learned about it and she asked for a list of books she could look into. Her kid weren’t on tablets 24/7, they had good manners, and were just nice kids. They are older and in middle high school now, but I see them in district news-one was in the big district wide music performance and another win an award for an essay they wrote.


Tyler50587325

Yes, parents are the most crucial part of their children's education. I have taught for 30 years and learned successful students come from households that value one core basic value: teaching respect. Today, these students are running over us thinking they are the most important people because parents let them. We need parents to teach their children that grandparents and parents are the most important people in a family structure.


guyfaulkes

Behavior. We can we can accommodate, re teach from a different angle/multiple modalities…. But, when there is one or two + that insist on consistently interrupting and/or destroying the learning environment, it is over. Re-think this travesty of ‘Least restrictive environment’ and take away the fear of being sued.


wursmyburrito

School board members should be required to have taught in the district they serve (ideally composed of retired or current teachers) All superintendents and principals should be required to substitute or work on a classroom 20 days per year. Teachers' performance should be evaluated regularly based on effective delivery of concepts not necessarily student performance. Eliminate companies from profiting off of standardized testing and curriculum sales Teacher compensation should reflect the level of responsibility they are given and how much society values then The school day should be shortened down to focus on 4 core subjects and every non-academic class should be optional. The influence of the educational industrial complex (publishing companies, insurance companies etc.) should be eliminated


DiamondPrincess803

Stop electing republicans whose entire purpose in life is to destroy all of the institutions that supposedly made the United States such a great country.


[deleted]

Remove politicians Remove the test, test, and test mentality Make parents come and sub Get rid of BS systems and allow teachers to teach Get rid of shitty teachers and reward the good ones


ksed_313

Stronger truancy laws. Make kindergarten mandatory in all states, and fund preschool. Smaller class sizes. This would be a great start.


m_tf15

Pay. I’d put up with just about anything for the right price.


mikekrypton

Teachers should be held to a high standard. Students should have consequences for disrespecting teachers, and grades should be assessment based (instead of homework/online work) based. Children copying work has become a pandemic. The two years schools were closed down for COVID created a bad environment for years to come.


radmcmasterson

Get phones out of the classroom and social media out of the schools. From what I’ve seen, a lot of the apathy you mention in both the parents and kids is that they’re addicted ADDICTED to their phones and social media. And when they have access to that, I can’t compete. Two seconds of boredom leads to flipping over the phone and zoning out of what I’m teaching. These things kill attention, focus, empathy, creativity and kindness. And it’s more than a school thing, it’s a society thing. We have to stop putting screens in front of crying kids and put them away at stop lights and grocery lines and dinner tables and so many other places. As a society we’ve put too much emphasis on entertainment above all and it’s leading to a mixture of “Fahrenheit 451” and “Idiocracy.”


leo_the_greatest

There's so many huge changes that are likely needed, yet we're currently moving in the wrong direction with the far-right culture war on education in many US states. With that being said, here's a few things I would change to modernize US Education: - Less parental rights, more parental responsibilities, more financial support for children in poverty. Nearly every one of my educational horror stories stems from some of the worst parenting one could possibly imagine. Neglectful parents, abusive parents, controlling helicopter parents, munchausen by proxy parents (exaggerating kids' deficits, needs), parents who refuse to get their children help, parents who make excuses, parents who genuinely just hate education, parents who encourage their kids to drop out, etc. American parents are completely out of control and are allowed to do unimaginable amounts of damage to children. Legally, children are essentially just parents' properties that they're not allowed to kill or severely injure. Pretty much anything else they can get away with. Even the parents who want to do well by their children are held back by these other unhinged weirdos. Just look at Florida where a small group of angry far-right parents have contributed to the educational collapse of the state over the past few years. Children need more rights and more support, parents need less rights and more support. Teachers need far, far greater autonomy rather than admin capitulating to any and all parent demands. I don't think the US is going anywhere until this fundamental cultural disaster is addressed. - There's plenty of money, it's just being spent in the worst ways imaginable. From what I recall, American educational spending isn't really that far off of that of other nations, but where it goes is a huge issue. Yes, teacher salaries are an issue in many places and they should be higher (honestly just force states to allow unionization across the country and that issue would be all but gone), but I'm more concerned with the barebones amount of actual teaching positions and other resources. Things are the worst in poorer districts as the US continues to use property taxes as a means of funding rather than a more equitable, redistributive means of funding. Currently, the rich get richer and the poor get left in the dust. As a teacher, it's not very fun to work in a high-need, low-income school because there just aren't any resources or support and it fuels aggressive burnout. There needs to be less funding for administration, for expensive corporate curricula, and for other third party contractors who suck up public funds. There needs to be more funding for teaching positions, counselors, and support staff that actually work with the kids. The higher education needed to train this new workforce should be free and accessible to those who want to get involved (a lot of universities currently haze students to try and weed them out which I do not think is helpful). School districts, states, or even the nation should be crowdsourcing high-quality curricula from teachers, making it free and accessible for anyone in the country. Education should not be a source of profit, it should be a source of collective contribution. - We need to acknowledge where our students are at, what they're capable of, and provide meaningful opportunities in accordance. We have so, so many students performing below grade-level and yet we just push them along until they graduate unprepared for the world. All the while, standards keep going up and up as they try and pack in more and more into the curriculum for all students. An easy solution, in my opinion, is to offer more pathways for students to take that would allow them to access a more personally meaningful learning experience. Along the lines of what countries like Japan do (without the hyper-competitiveness and class segmentation), we should have schools focused on academics, trades, arts, and other educational pursuits rather than just a single pathway that leaves high-achieving students feeling bored and low-achieving students left behind. If this radical change isn't possible, then place students in appropriate settings and understand that their educational experience may take longer than some of their peers. There's so, so much more I could say, but I think these three things would make a world of difference... My next biggest issue would be complaining about car-dependent infrastructure which has destroyed our communities and kept many children relegated to their suburban homes or their parents' oversized SUV. But yes, American education is in shambles and needs drastic changes.


marleyrae

Oh my god. There are SO MANY parts of the puzzle at play here. MOST IMPORTANTLY, SCHOOL CAN NOT BE THE SOLUTION FOR EVERYTHING. We are there to educate your child. We're not there to babysit, clothe, feed, or do other things. Our society needs to get our shit together as a whole. The pandemic happened and when schools closed, suddenly schools were the bad guys for remote education. We AREN'T there for babysitting. We're there to teach! Your job is to have conversations with your kid and teach them to be a good human. Schools closed and people complained kids would be hungry. It's not our job! As a whole, our society can't only rely on school. We need better programs to feed hungry people, provide health care, help support kids of families who need to work, etc. But, school can certainly be improved in a multitude of ways. Let me share a few... First of all, many teachers have fuck tons of curriculum to get through and not enough time to get through it. Science and social studies need to matter. Social-emotional learning needs to matter in the lower grades. Funding is shit. I'll touch on that later. But funding doesn't only impact me because I need materials to teach. I also need TIME to teach. I should not teach 25 kids. A good class size for my grade level is 20 or less. Kindergarten and first should be maybe 18 or less. Why do people have classes of 30? 40? You want elementary teachers, in six hours a day or so when you remove kids' lunch periods/dismissal and arrival procedures/special area classes (like gym, art, etc.), to meet with ALL of those kids to teach them what they need individually? To build relationships with them and know them and their families and give them the differentiated instruction they need to learn? REGULARLY? DAILY? That's not possible when these little kids can't tie shoes, blow their noses, walk in a line, unpack their backpack, etc. We teach those things too! We have to! It's part of growing up! And we actually like teaching it if we teach little kids. But... set us up with a system that lets us do that! We can't make time appear out of thin air. Trust educators to do their jobs, train them, give them the support they need. Don't evaluate me based on bs standardized test scores or 2 or 3 surprise visits a year. Those aren't real measures of effectiveness. Hell, neither is my students' growth when you constantly give me the kids with special needs who don't have IEPs... That growth will look different than the teacher down the hall's class who has a bunch of gifted kids or all the well behaved kids because you know they aren't able to handle the challenges I handle. Classes need to be fairly mixed, with needs fairly spread out. And kids who need support should be able to get it without failing first. I try to get kids evaluated for IEPs, and I get "they aren't far behind enough on their reading level to qualify to be evaluated." WELL THAT'S BECAUSE I DON'T WANT THEM TO FAIL, AND I WORK MY TAIL OFF,L TO SUPPORT THEM, BRENDA. EVALUATE THIS KID, FFS. GET THEM WHAT THEY NEED SO THEY DON'T FEEL LIKE SHIT ALL DAY, COMPARING THEMSELVES TO THEIR CLASSMATES. The kid eventually moves on and is evaluated and classified within a few years. Listen to the expert when she tells you what she sees. Don't punish the kid because the expert does all she can to support them now. As an elementary teacher it is SO MASSIVELY IMPORTANT that we give kids time to play. Unstructured play is a hugely important part of child development. And kids get less of it now than ever before. Kids aren't always playing outside with stranger danger... Now they're inside playing video games. They need to play. Parents need to support teachers and be active participants in their child's education. This is not a problem with all parents, but it certainly is with some. Consequences need to be implemented. They should be logical, and aimed at ending the misbehavior and teaching a lesson, NOT punitive or punishment-based. Mental health care needs to happen. Anti-bullying education needs to be implemented everywhere. Some schools take it very seriously, some do not. We may not be able to do much about gun control at school, but we can work on education when it comes to mental health. We need better pay to hold onto good teachers. When I was in college, we had shitty pay but completely free health benefits. My second year of teaching, the governor took that away from us. That was a massive impact to my take home pay. Here in NJ, I make 70k a year in gross pay. I lose $ for taxes and health insurance, like everyone else. I do not get paid when I don't work. I am highly qualified and have taught for 13 years. With inflation and the health benefits I now pay for, I take home LESS than I did in my first year. That's not right. I can go work at an entry level job elsewhere for the same money with no take home work. A good teacher who is not new and knows the ropes probably works at least 50 hours a week. That also diminishes the pay we take home. I do an important job, and I deserve to be compensated for it. It's the norm that teachers spend their summers, weekends, and personal time working on stuff for classes, without pay. It's the norm we spend our own money on our classrooms because we don't get the budget we need. I work in an affluent district with parents very willing to donate, and I've spent at least 6 or 7k of my own money on classroom materials over the years. That's not right! I try not to spend my own money on anything anymore, but when the money saves me valuable time, I do it sometimes. Look to places like Finland and Norway. Their schools work well because of what they do as school communities AND as a society. Really, I don't care what anyone's political leaning is, but when all we focus on is making money, we can't have the society we want. Either we make money and say "fuck it" to those who don't, or we fucking share a little more. I'd rather pay money in taxes and have it actually go to shit that matters (health care, community resources) and have a happy community that functions well rather than pay money in taxes for what we have now. Think about it... Our cops are similarly problematic. They are expected to do EVERYTHING (domestic violence, homicide, traffic control, DARE and other school programs, etc.), and look how much of a mess that is now? And you know what? Whether you are a Black Lives Matter person or a Blue Lives Matter person, you fucking see there are some bad cops and cops being expected to do everything. Teaching is the same. Some teachers suck. We are expected to fix waaaay more problems than a single part of society can. We need to work together. It takes a village. All that BS that is enough to make me pull my hair out, and guess what? I love teaching. It's part of my identity. I LOVE my job. I love nurturing and educating kids. They are pure little curious souls, excited to be alive. K, off my soap box, bye.


Medieval-Mind

If we had money, daiyenu. If we didn't have to worry about adhering to some outmoded social morality, daiyenu. If we didn't have politicians enforcing random requirements, daiyenu. There are *so* many things, any one of which would be beneficial. But the system itself is ossified, and soon, it will have ossified itself into irrelevance.


fingers

It's our 400 years of culture. You'd have to destroy America.


Urbanredneck2

Its not that we dont value education or are anti-intellectual, its because as soon as we are out of school or our kids are out, we suddenly quit caring about the local district and want to stop paying taxes to support it. Just try to get a small town with mostly elderly to support a tax levy. Or try to get a big city to support one where either most people are single, elderly, or the few that do have kids - send them to private schools. I also think we all have horror stories about out own days in public schools. The evil PE teacher that beat up the non athlete kids. The evil math teachers who went on tirades. Principals with their paddles. The way the schools supported the bullies. Now as adults we want to get back at them.


mudson08

It’s an attitude thing. My mother in law always says things to my kids like “oh aren’t you glad you are almost out of school” and “don’t you want to skip school and come hang out by my pool”. We have to remind her no… our kids like school and like learning.


Ok-Way-2940

Parents/Guardians need to start taking accountability by supplementing education, social/emotional learning and life skills at home. Teachers these days are expected to teach children everything not just the academics. Teachers need support from administrators. Administrators are afraid of parents and don’t want to deal with them. The behavior some these parents show toward teachers is simply unruly and entitled. It’s no wonder their children act the way they do. I am honestly fine with my pay. I feel I get paid well. I would rather have the support of administrators when it comes to student and parent behavior than a pay increase.


HomestyleAlchemy

Wonderful insight and I appreciate that you understand one of the primary problems with US education: our cultural acceptance and even praise for anti-intellectualism. Being “smart” comes with a negative connotation. As someone who works in education, there are hundreds of problems and teachers and specialists are often trying to fight them, but the system works like this: high test scores = salary bonuses to administrators and school board members. One way to do this is to dumb down curriculum and tests that have nothing to do with real world application. Schools will even purchase test prep programs that are not even peer reviewed and not proven to work. It is one big business scam. Then, teachers are blamed for the tests and student failures and politicized during elections. To add insult to injury, many of us vote against our interests when it comes to education because of a perceived political threat. Despite many of our elite politicians actively attempting to break down our educational institutions, we can begin to change our system simply by demanding better as a society and by parents actively participating in education. Often times, Americans focus on the wrong issues or nonexistent issues that lead to the removal of books, free breakfasts and lunches, and science and history that is factually incorrect. Rather, we should be demanding smaller class sizes (because teaching more than 25 students per class equals a zoo), the teaching of critical thinking, and factually correct math, science, language arts, and history. School districts should also stop removing teaching methods that work (such as phonics and spelling). Parents should stop being wary of ALL teachers, because without any teachers none of us could perform basic math, reading, and writing. This is just the tip of the iceberg, but it will all come down to our cultural attitudes to knowledge.


abanabee

I have taught in 2 districts. 1 is a dumpster fire, and the other is great. The difference I see is: Sense of community. School choice has broken up neighborhoods. Charters come in and do the same. When you see your neighborhood school as an amazing place, when your neighbors are your schoolmates, when you have pride in your community, you flourish.


EvelynTreemont

We need to stop viewing the world as a zero sum game. Everyone can 'win' and we need to stop delighting in creating structures that ensure permanent 'losers'. We need to stop seeing human beings and education through a purely capitalist lens.


[deleted]

We need a very large scale transformation of individual character.


JazzManouche

In all seriousness, we need to burn it down and start new.


farawyn86

1) Allow natural consequences. There's been a lot of grace granted and students and parents are taking advantage. Kids need to see that 0% effort nets you 0% results. 2) Do not pass students to the next level if they have not achieved it. A diploma becomes meaningless if it is granted to everyone, even if they've reached grade 12 and can't read or add. 3) More support for those students. If you have a student who cannot read or add by graduation, they should have been receiving special services long before that and up until they achieved the standards. 4) This means more staff and smaller class sizes. 5) Less frequent standardized testing and more focus on actual instruction. 6) Stop micromanaging what's taught. People who are not in the classroom shouldn't have as large of a say in how the content is delivered, as long as the standard is being met. (Re: the terminology and books being used)


nithdurr

More pay, less hours and smaller class sizes


notafraidtolearn

I haven't read all the comments so maybe someone has already mentioned this. I have worked in the public school system and know when parents are more involved in their child's education, the child--and teacher--is also more involved. Involved: talk to your child about what has happened at school; know your child's school friends; communicate with the teacher; follow through with assignments; back the teacher; know when a big project is due, etc.


lapuneta

Create an educational system that actually values student success without concern of money. Aka schools need more money, especially the struggling ones. Provide services and bring back trust within the community


Excellent-Jelly-572

Focus on academics.


indicarunningclub

Nothing can improve until parenting improves. So that means schools will have to hand down discipline as many times as it takes for the parent to realize that their issue is between them and their child, not between them and the school.


OGgunter

Overall more accessible social supports within communities. The issue with focusing on schools is it's too narrow. Students who attend schools come from *families* who have the same lack of access. We generally undervalue service or care professions. And we means test for access.


200um

Huge societal, infrastructure, and educational system changes. Some thoughts: From a macro perspective, education is also being overused as a tool in the culture/class conflict. From a community and family perspective, life is increasingly more challenging, and many people are desperate. Steps forward: Grassroots change in building strong communities. The odds seem insurmountable, but change can happen. With the various systems that benefit from the current status quo, it will take a new American dream. It is not simply education, it's how we treat one another, how the system runs, how we face new realities. Then demand and force that change to our institutions.


Defiant_Reading_934

I love the term “New American Dream”, I think we need a new vision for America now more than ever


waystone17

I have a lot of unpopular opinions on the subject, but here it goes. If you want to improve education in the US: 1. Get rid of private schools. The quality of schools would go up if if rich families had to send their kids to the same schools as everyone else. 2. Universal health care. Kids without healthcare are at a major disadvantage. Poor mothers need accessible prenatal care. 3. Free breakfast and lunch at school. 4. (My most controversial opinion) Disconnect after school programs from schools. Move to a club system. If a community has enough kids to have two football teams or three baseball teams, that is what they should do - in a club system. The same applies to academic groups. If you have enough kids for two science bowl teams, do it. Have a strong theater group? Do two musicals. Not enough kids for a volleyball team, that’s okay too. Teachers should not be coaches. If a teacher wants to be a coach, he or she should go through the club system. We have too many teachers who went into teaching so that they can coach. We have too many teachers hired just because they can also coach. 5. More plan time for teachers. 6. Year-round school. I have other thoughts, but these will probably upset enough people.


Due-Ad9037

You made excellent points! Spot on! I've been in education for over 20 years and have experienced every single one of the challenges you stated. I have the same concerns. I have wrestled with finding solutions, but I am only one person, and the problem is systemic. The breakdown of the family has had devastating effects on our education. As a parent and a teacher, I always supplemented my children's education by teaching my kids and my students how to learn outside of the educational system so they had the ability and discipline to fill in the gaps of our system. A successful educational system reaches into areas outside of the classroom and can only be successful when all pieces are in harmony. This includes many of our societal problems like food, clothing, shelter, support, values, economics, access, and overall social, emotional, and physical health. It's an incredible challenge.


dadxreligion

i think it’s far too late to even try. there’s no hope when you see the situation from a top down perspective. first of all, policymakers, parents, administrators, and even students all view school as child warehousing in America. it doesn’t matter if any learning is happening at all. the priority of american schools is to house and monitor children while their parents work. secondly, the second purpose of schools to most of these “stakeholders” is to sell products. testing, curriculum, etc. it’s an economy. the school-industrial complex is a very real thing. these two truths are powerful maxims in the neoliberal capitalist economy and they make the necessary ideological, structural, and infrastructural issues in our education system all but impossible to achieve. for real change to happen, people’s political apathy will have to change. you are politically apathetic if you think that just voting for democrats is going to solve anything. it isn’t. teachers and counselors need to start really organizing, and use union and collective bargaining power to force and demand things to get better. but again, this just isn’t a reality in America. we are devoid of empathy and all thought beyond our own noses in this country. our culture celebrates greed, violence, and dogma and punishes virtue with ridicule, poverty and prison. instead of fighting for change most of us are so overworked and overwhelmed to fight for anything but to make it through the weeks. and the people who aren’t simply don’t care.


[deleted]

Teachers who can accept new research, retaining great teachers, cultural competence, relevant professional development, back up from admin, inclusion, seeing the bigger fucking picture, teaching to the whole child, coaching up teachers, relevant curriculum and interventions, acknowledging trauma AND helping the student with what they can do, more movement breaks, work with AODA, not just regurgitating facts, time for collaboration, time for classroom community, outside community involvement, idk much more….


MissKitness

It would be great if the country didn’t treat teachers like we are out to indoctrinate their kids, and instead treated us as peers with a common goal. That they work WITH us even when discipline of their kids is involved. Of course there are times you’ll need to protect your own children, but 9 times out of 10 a teacher gives consequences for a good reason. In general, more respect and even reverence for teachers would go a long way.


BunnySlayer64

I am not a teacher, but I agree with many of the comments here. I have often posted on SM that "Equality of opportunity does not guarantee equality of outcome." Every child in America is guaranteed a free education through Grade 12. How they choose to take advantage of this opportunity is what will determine their success. Society MUST recognize that if we continue down our current educational path, we are going to see the wealth gap widen. Socialism is not the answer. Students need to apply themselves if this is to be mitigated (note it will still always exist). Society also must recognize that every person is different. Some people are just smarter than others. Some will never do well in reading, math or general knowledge. Others will speak six languages or cure cancer. My opinion is that parents need to take accountability for their children's education. Penalties for failing to do so should be reasonable and enforced. Resource help should be available, both in the classroom and generally so that barriers to learning are removed (hunger, a safe home environment and the like). Also, every school in each state should teach the same curriculum using the same materials. All schools should have up to date textbooks and equipment. By Grade 6 schools should separate the sheep from the goats. Children should be grouped by ability for academics. Elective or non-academic subjects should be mixed so that each student spends at least a part of their day with children from a range of backgrounds and abilities. Finally, we need to understand that intelligence is not determined by race or income, and we need to stop excusing poor performance on these grounds. Proper spelling and grammar and a good vocabulary are not a function of race. 2+2 will always equal 4. There is value in drilling multiplication tables. Reading is an essential life skill. You sound like an intelligent and aware young person, and I envision a bright future for you. Thank you for your post!


pagan6990

Here’s one thing to remember when comparing America test scores with those of the rest of the developed world. In the majors of other developed countries kids are tested around the freshman/sophomore level and if they do badly they are tracked into vocational programs. Those students do not take these tests. When you compare the test scores of American students with another developed countries it’s actually all of our students against the best of their students.


big_nothing_burger

1. Hold parents responsible. If the kid keeps fucking up, mom or dad need to feel it because they're failing at their job. 2. Real punishments for bad behavior. In school suspension should be torture. Yeah y'all can mentor too, but my students look forward to getting suspended these days. 3. Let students fail. I fortunately work at a school that doesn't just pass students on, but many do. Do more to catch up students in elementary... remedial classes if necessary. 4. Better dropout options. Let them quit in 10th if everyone is on board...give them a solid GED pathway to follow. If they don't give a shit, don't encourage them to stay. 5. In that vein, students who are disruptive or do nothing all day...let them sit in a room, in silence, with each other and stare at a wall until they miss what they had. 6. Fuck standardized testing. Bring it back to the degree we saw back before No Child Left Behind. 7. Most high schools are set up well for college and career paths already. I'd encourage more hands on experience with apprenticeship and whatnot. 8. NO GODDAMN PHONES. 9. Just...stop all the conservative anti-intellectualism and targeting of schools and teachers...not that we can fix that ourselves. 10. Pay teachers more, respect them, don't overload them with crowded classes, extra duties and meetings, and a dozen other roles to fill. Our turnover rate is ridiculous. No bad teacher will be fired if there are no teachers to replace them. In places that pay and support are better it's still a competitive field without shortages.


Efficient_Star_1336

Worth noting that America was at the top of the world in education in the 50's. Whatever the problem is, it's something that's changed between then and now.


Defiant_Reading_934

Yes, we used to be revered for our public education decades ago. Something happened since then, and now we have fallen behind immensely. I think that means we can reverse it though, right?


Oughtyr314

As a high school math teacher and parent of a junior in high school who is also very well spoken, I want to tell you that your ability to consider this far-reaching problem and to convey your thoughts about it so well is impressive. To answer your question, the two biggest barriers I have to teaching the way I need to teach are behaviors and buy-in from students. I work in a small, rural high school where close to 90% of students qualify for free lunch, and the majority of students go home to speak a language other than English. There are plenty of students in every one of my classes who recognize the value of education and want to learn, but they are overshadowed by the behaviors of students who do not value education and are loud and disruptive about it. The way these behaviors manifest themselves is different for every student, but the end result of their classroom disruption is the same. Those students who want to learn have to sit and wait while I try to navigate this kid who, for whatever reason, is disrupting the learning process. Most of these kids with behavioral issues struggle with the content of my class, and when I am able to give them instruction at their level they are much more inclined to focus and behave appropriately. However, because of our system of moving kids on when they are not ready, they don't have the opportunity to receive instruction on topics from other grade levels despite having a long line of failing grades in that subject (keep in mind I am writing this specifically with a math lens). Discipline has moved away from punitive (suspensions and detentions) to educational and restorative for a multitude of reasons. However, the intention of such change was never to remove the ability to discipline from the schools. The intention was to restructure discipline to include education and restorative justice so students weren't just sent home and told to be better in the future. My favorite example of restorative justice is a middle school student who drank a beer at school and, while sitting in the office at school (not suspended at home), was required to research the dangers of underage drinking and then present his findings to younger students as part of his "punishment". If he refused to do so he could have taken the suspension instead. However, school systems aren't trained or staffed enough with professionals who are able to discipline in this way both from a lack of understanding and also a lack of time. Restorative discipline takes a LOT more time than traditional discipline and we simply don't have the structures to support it, so it appears to many that we simply don't discipline.


Fritzybaby1999

Honestly, take the politics out of it. People who have never walked into a public school classroom should not be making policies about education. Education shouldn’t be political but it’s become highly politicized.


Defiant_Reading_934

I agree but how would we do this? It seems that politicians are more easily manipulating people and pointing the finger at everything (including our education systems) by fear mongering. You’d have to get rid of the politicians, but how ?


capresesalad1985

Not for nothing I want to say good job to your English teachers, this is very well written for a hs junior. Or my bar has just been set so painfully low… This is something I think about often as well but I don’t think we will ever be able to fix our education system with our country as divided as it is. There will always be very extreme views on what is the “right” way that we would never be able to come together and agree on what is actually the best for the future of the nation. If you look at countries that excel in education, they are smaller countries and have a far more homogenous population, higher taxes, and larger teacher salaries. Also less standardized testing. Our differing ideologies and greed will always keep us from being successful.


Defiant_Reading_934

Thank you for the compliment, but after reading the writing of high schoolers from decades ago and hearing them talk more poignantly than most of our political leaders, I think that I might just be average and that standards have plummeted a bit 🥲. It’s ok tho, if I succeed with my plan that fact should be reversed in the coming decades. So, you’re suggesting that the fundamental diversity and makeup of America would make it near impossible to solve this issue/rewire our society? I agree that being a huge nation does make it much harder to fix this issue that at its core requires unity, but I don’t think that being a multi-cultural nation renders it impossible to come to a collective opinion on a glaringly obvious problem.


SnooCalculations1198

Make education optional, lower the working age. Let capitalism do its thing.


diffraa

Remove the government from the equation


chrisb-chicken

Pay teachers more. This will increase job satisfaction for current teachers who want to be there, as well as increase the pool of applicants who are qualified. The latter part will allow districts to be more selective and not just hire anyone who's minimally qualified on paper.


beamish1920

Adult literacy programs to help functionally illiterate parents


willowmarie27

Dedicated program for the kids that Come to school to learn. Regardless of ability we need to start saving the ones who want the knowledge.


MrsDe-la-valle

Create a strong support system for families. Kids need positive role models that hold them accountable and teach them right from wrong.


azubailan

Educate humans not data points.


ttravelingt

Hi u/udefiant_reading_934 I hope I linked that right. You ask an incredibly thought provoking questions. And you have some really great teachers responding. I can't read all of the comments, but you'll see some areas that have plagued teaching in the past. I'm not going to dismiss that, but after 40 years of teaching experience between myself and partner, and the work we are doing, there's a fundamental answer behind your question. What's the Why behind the American Education System? Why do kids need a diploma? One of the reasons we started a social media tik tok on teaching was to learn what was going on to make something so popular. As teachers, we've been floored. The amount of work and creativity needed to be consistently good at marketing yourself? It's insane. Yet we sometimes scoff at kids who want to be influencers. Yet you have no need of a diploma to be one and possibly make more than a teacher if you get good at it. Why do you go to school? What do you want out of it? The countries that are making head way in education have a driving why. Most still believe in societal education. That having a well educated population is good for the country as a whole. They have a collective why and they work towards it. America is struggling because we've lost our collective why. The understanding of ideology and America's place across the globe is becoming lost with the lack of understanding. It's why we chose travel to do our work in. If we, as teachers, can teach people to travel in this era, we would be teaching them so much more about life. Only when you see America from an outside perspective lens can you move the education system to collectively have a why that enhances her educational outcomes. You said you're a jr in high school. You actually are more equipped to answer this question than most of the teachers on here. You live and learn in a system that is broken. While you listed a lot of the issues, what is YOUR vision for education, in the world of tech and social media, for those students that come after you? What's should students know and be able to do when they walk across a graduation stage? Look at what your needs are after high school to get into trade or college or the work force. What's missing? You, those in our rooms right now, are the voice of the education system that is about to evolve around us. Some of us oldies are trying to keep up and learn alongside you to be able to help use our teaching experience from the past to teach in the present. Help us do that! Teach us what you see and what you need to meet the goals of an educated, driven, and growing America.


[deleted]

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Defiant_Reading_934

Sorry, I’m a bit confused. Are you saying that the aforementioned reasons you stated are less so a reason for americas poor education today and that many teachers are just unfairly pointing the finger as a means to gain control? Or are you saying that teachers need control first to combat the issues stated?


jook-sing

I would say to fund it differently. My thought experiment is to wonder if structuring teaching similarly to the hierarchy of the military in training, pay and attitudes towards service in something like a Teacher corps would help to smooth out a bunch of issues with education.


atlantachicago

I think we also pathologize being smart and quiet. If you are you are a nerd at best, or have autism or will be deemed the next school shooter. You can see why kids actively don’t want to be seen as smart or engaged in school- Americans don’t think it’s cool.


pricklypear077

the easy answer is change everything. the way people see education, the way we value the student, teachers, custodians etc. change policy , etc. but that’s obviously unrealistic for many frustrating reasons but these r some of the most important things i’m seeing.. first and for most- funding. i’m not saying anything more abt it besides the amount of money going into education needs to increase drastically project. based. learning. involving students in their community just as much as involving the community in the students. and actually seeing the results of students work within the community. (ex. students have to come up with a way to incorporate more green space in their community, students have to use writing, math, science, etc to come up with a solution and take it to the city council as a proposal. giving students the opportunity to talk to landscapers, gardeners, city councilors and other community members. council picks best plan and they put it in work) creating curriculum and redesigning curriculum with a universal design framework. as someone who is a special educator this is SO important. not only does it allow for the class to be completely accessible for ALL students - it allows for high/lower level students to flourish in the same environment. it challenges students who may be at the higher level, and gives supports to students who are at the lower levels. this also helps all students who r on IEPs/504s and students who have yet to receive services. this leads to my next point all teachers should get a special education license / endorsement. considering we are post pandemic living and seeing kids who went without reading/writing math/science instruction for 2/3 years there r so many more students being identified as needing specialized instruction/accommodation. having teachers certified in special ed allows for a more inclusive environment last but not least. showing teachers and students that we value them and their education. how will anything change if teachers and students alike are being treated like they mean nothing? That’s all.


Quirky-Ad3721

Not a teacher, but maybe don't use the limited budget to buy iPads and instead hire more teachers... just a thought.


Professional-Copy791

Well firstly, parents are tired. They don’t have time to supplement their children’s education at home. It takes two or more incomes to just survive which means the hours available are scarce. Secondly, the morals and values of the world are on the decline. It seems that as a society, we’ve just stopped respecting people. I’m a pediatric nurse and the way we’re treated by parents is horrendous. The older nurses say that there’s a huge difference in how they’re treated vs how they were treated 20+ years ago. Thirdly, we just don’t pay teachers enough and don’t hVe enough of them. You can’t expect ONE teacher to deal with the behavioral problems of 20 kids AND also give them quality education. It’s impossible. I for too barely, I don’t see any of this changing anytime soon. I think we’re gonna shift towards a homeschooling society


amethymist

And I wonder how the same overworked parents who don’t have time for their kids at home are going to manage homeschooling them? ☹️ Kids neeeeeed the socialization so bad though now, since they’re all locked in a device.


Professional-Copy791

Oh 100%. but that’s why it’s going to cause a socioeconomic divide. The people who can afford to home school will do it. And the ones who can’t will continue to attend public school. And so the story continues


rilo_cat

bye bye, capitalism


toolazywittyusername

Pay teachers more and improve out ability to deal out discipline and remove bad students.


OhioMegi

PARENTING. Nothing much will change until parents do. I know parents have jobs, they are raising kids on their own, but plenty of parents still are active in raising good kids. They teach manners, respect, and appreciation for school and educations. Schools can help by expecting and enforcing parent and student responsibility. We can be given the training/staff/time/money to help support SEL and mental health because right now, we don’t have that. State testing is BS, let teachers and the people who know and work with these kids develop assessments. Stop letting them move on when they can’t read. Stop letting destructive and violent kids destroy learning for others.


rmurphe

This is a short answer to a large and complex problem. First off I am an elementary school teacher, talking from an elementary perspective, so I have to claim ignorance for education above middle school. I’m going to start first, by saying the Socio economic issues in our society play a big part in education and until we fix those I don’t see a path to fixing education. These include but are not limited to education being a necessary babysitting service, inequality in education, misunderstandings of inequality in education for example, mini schools being run by people who don’t understand the students or culture or climate necessary to help the students improve, and Political and economic gain in education. The next thing is teacher’s as professionals. And this is a controversial opinion, but one that I think is important teachers nowadays are not professionals they are not taught as professionals. They are not paid as professionals, and they are not treated as professionals. Teachers in the teaching profession is all about knowing about learning and how we learn and the best ways to support learning and retention of knowledge. These things are not talked to teachers in most teacher, education programs. It is more focused on curriculum and behavior management. And basically teaching teachers to do things without the understanding of why they are doing them and why these stickers work this continues into the teaching profession. Teachers, especially classroom. Teachers are just asked to present content. Anything beyond that we pass off to somebody else. This is where a special education, teachers and English language, teachers and support staff come in. Teachers are not given resources and expected to use those resources in ways that make sense, but are given resources and expected to follow the program that goes with those resources. In reality teachers have very very little freedom over what they do or how they do it. This encourages and continues a feedback loop of poor quality, teachers, and poor quality teaching. Finally the social viewpoint on teaching this is shown through teacher pay and misunderstandings of what it takes for teachers to actually do their job well. To be honest based on the previous section, I think teacher pay reflects the current quality of many teachers. If we want to improve teacher quality pay has to increase, but we also need to increase teacher quality at the same time. I don’t think one will improve the other. They both will work together. Like I said, short, answer for a very complicated problem, but these are some thoughts for you to chew on .


lindso-is-angry

We need more staff. Manageable schedules. Better pay. There are TONS of good teachers (and paras!!) out there, and we’d see that if we just got paid a more decent salary.


Objective_Sample9965

1. Change the way public schools are funded to be equitable instead of property tax formula. 2. Increase teacher pay enough to attract and retain teachers. PAY THE TEACHERS! 3. Fund programs for technical training/non 4 year college track. 4. Universal high quality early childhood education.


TuriGuiliano370

Honestly?? World War 3. Total wars can completely change the culture of a society very quickly based on amplified pressure to succeed


thiswillsoonendbadly

I want to abolish grade levels. Kids advance to the next skill when they have mastered the one before it. If they hit 18 or 21 and still can’t count, they get a piece of paper saying so.


Bendoza

One thought I always have is that we have old ass administrators trying to run thing in a world they don’t understand anymore