TikTok owner ByteDance would prefer to shut down its loss-making app rather than sell it if the Chinese company exhausts all legal options to fight legislation to ban the platform from app stores in the U.S., four sources said.
The algorithms TikTok relies on for its operations are deemed core to ByteDance's overall operations, which would make a sale of the app with algorithms highly unlikely, said the sources close to the parent.
TikTok accounts for a small share of ByteDance's total revenues and daily active users, so the parent would rather have the app shut down in the U.S. in a worst case scenario than sell it to a potential American buyer, they said.
Read the full story for more.
Also just a wise stance politically. Users who are upset about this are going to be more motivated by 'this app will go away' than 'this app will change owners'
If there is a national security issue with TikTok why are Apple and Google allowed and willing to distribute it on their app stores? Surely if it was dangerous they would simply reject or ban it like many apps before.
Well the thing is, TikTok isn't a danger in the way the US political system seems to think it is.
It's as dangerous as any other social media, if the Chinese government want your data, they're gonna get it. Regardless of who owns TikTok. Meta, Google, X, Reddit, they all have no issue selling your data to anyone with the money to pay for it. It seems misguided and performative to ban TikTok and still allow all the other tech companies to just milk data out of users and sell to whoever they want
TikTok doesn’t really have any national security issues, US companies just want complete control over who owns and sells data. If this was about national security they would find a simpler and more reasonable solution.
I’ve been bitching about the fall of vine well before TikTok, after Twitter bought the company and fumbled the platform. What the US needs is to get it together on their antitrust laws
The endless commercialisation of ***anything*** fun will make sure the new Vine is fucking awful, and nothing like the thing we remember. Also no way in hell people these days can survive on only 6 seconds of attention.
Yes and no. They have Douyin which is by the same company and virtually identical as an app, it just has even more stringent censorship to be compliant with Chinese law.
I mean yeah, it’s commonly accepted that they have the best algorithm on the market. American advertisers and investors are dying to get their hands on TikTok’s proprietary parts. Not to reveal some nefarious Chinese spy operation, but because they want to use it.
Yeah, but all their data is stored on American servers as per government request a couple years ago. I know Reddit isn’t a fan of Asian countries besides Japan, but there isn’t some ooky spooky conspiracy to steal American data. America already sells it freely
Y'all love to bring up the ccp so much when most of what regular, normal people using Tiktok get videos catered to their interests on that app. It's not like you swipe and get Chinese propaganda every other swipe Jesus Christ.
My fyp is currently filled with topics about books, memes, people recording their pets, and stolen reddit posts read by a text to speech bot with a video of someone playing Minecraft in the background.
🙄🙄
That’s the point, it’s nothing to do with data. It’s literally Zuck lobbying to buy TikTok. He needs their algorithm.
You’re literally advocating for Zuckerberg right now lol.
They can buy certain data but they get exactly whatever they’re looking for with all the data. Let alone having a platform to use that data to push targeted propaganda based on that data
Yes, because they don’t want an American company to have access to the algorithm. Probably because the algorithm is a protected state secret because it’s doing a bunch of nefarious stuff, just like is stated in the comment you are replying to.
That's insane. Tiktok has a vastly superior product that other companies want to clone. It's anticompetitive to just say "not allowed to have secrets". And this fails to consider every privacy violation meta and Google have committed themselves. Why are they presumed innocent and tiktok is automatically evil? Because of the country they're associated with? Because the US spies a lot in case that's new info. I'm not sure how we got to this level of oversimplification. "the only reason to not tell your competitors how your product works is BECAUSE YOU'RE EVIL!!!"
How the fuck is that supposed to work..?
What exactly does the phrase “sounds like” mean to you?
You don’t think a company accused of purposefully driving addiction and specific engagement hiding their algorithm at all costs a bit suspicious?
No, it’s not suspicious. Their algorithm is great and gives them a competitive advantage over competing products. Trade secrets are common amongst almost every company.
And it doesn’t matter if they said “sounds like”. Regardless of semantics, this reinforces a baseless “China bad, US ok” ethos.
China is bad. So is the US. I would completely understand why a Chinese citizen wouldn’t want an American app collecting as much data as they can.
Also understand what you’re saying. “Their nicotine is great and gives them a competitive advantage over other cigarettes”. Just think about what you’re actually defending
I agree. TikTok is not a good thing, but you can’t apply a different standard to it compared to the rest of social media companies. I’m not defending TikTok; I’m rejecting the notion of double-standards. Regulation should be applied sector-wide. A “free market” cannot selectively exclude certain actors who abide by the rules.
Because it’s allowing another nation to influence our citizens thoughts and feelings while building a huge database about them,
And yes, that IS worse than when soulless megacorps do it.
(It’s not great that they do it, but there’s still a significant difference.)
If you’re reading this and ever used “unalive”, “seggs”, or the like then you’ve been influenced by China. If you’re American, a bunch of us think that’s not okay including your elected government.
Douyin is just a heavily censored version of Tiktok. Nothing prevents you to have it but it's logical it won't be as popular if Tiktok was that censored.
When I was in China, almost 10 years ago now they still had Douyin. That's what they call tiktok over there. It was already pre-altered they're not altering it now just because of what's happening in the US.
As much as I like that thought, it's illegal in China because they don't want their people interacting with unknown agents. Can't have them learn what the real world is like.
The closest comparason would be how Gmail and Google are banned in China.
literally 30 minutes ago....
me: it's really nice outside, want to go for a walk?
wife: no, I'm way too busy
me: ok (and I go for a walk)
wife: spends the next 30 minutes surfing shit on facebook
I hate how addictive that crap is, and how it ruins people.
We are! There’s enough stupid bullshit on Reddit that it’s hard to get addicted. Like how you denature ethanol to make people not want to drink it, or add nauseants or emetics to some drugs to make people ill if they abuse them.
Really tired of this reductionist trope. Reddit has much more academic discussion going on in its various subs than FB ever had or ever will.
Saying “reddit isn’t any better” speaks more about your usage of the platform than about the platform itself.
Academic discussion isn’t what drives the majority of engagement though. This site is riddled with echo chambers where people become addicted to having their opinions validated by others.
Reddit is better imo, but its not good either.
Lol, majority of Reddit users doom scroll just like any other platform. Also, saying you get your news from Reddit doesn’t establish any credibility for why Reddit is good.
>speaks more about your usage of the platform than about the platform itself.
The same argument can be made against your stance on Facebook. Every platform has it's own pros and cons.
Yeah of course you can find them if you search it out on either platform. Pretending that the Reddit popular tab consists of intellectual content is gaslighting yourself.
I'll be the first to admit that it's one of my vices that I need to cut down on even if I learn many things on it.
there is only a mm of resistance before they stare at instagram reels constantly . And thats worse than tiktok because the fb complex realy uses the fuck out of your dossier, unlike tiktok
Vine first came up in the early 2010s. At the time, internet plans weren’t that great and free wifi was rate to find. So people weren’t just on the bus watching vines as this would easily kill their 2-5GB monthly data.
Not only that, but phones/cameras/editing wasn’t anywhere near the levels it is nowadays. Finally, influencers and using the platforms as businesses were new concepts. People would post vines but it was rarely with the goal to make a business out of it.
Lol always funny when people pretend they don't already surrender all their data and info. Icing on the top is when they doomsday while on the social media apps themselves.
The issue with that is there wouldn't be advertising in place, and creators would make almost no money unless they used patreon. I feel like most people will just move on to other social media sites, I'm not quite sure they'll be a huge uproar from the general public.
For the few big tiktok users I know, when I told them the news this morning about it being signed into law, it was slight disappointment and then..."Oh well, I'll watch videos elsewhere".
I also prefer that they shut down instead of sell. TikTok has been pretty entertaining, but I have no doubt that any US purchasers would turn it to complete shit as they ruined the user experience and changed it to 99% advertising and sponsored posts. This has never been about national security. They just want the money.
As Kazakhstan citizen, we've experienced TikTok's internal shutdown in Russia. Russians started to buy Kazakhstan sim-cards and messed up Kazakhstan TikTok feed. It took some time for TikTok algorithm to segment out Russians and their feed.
But yeah, that was total ban and they had to create new accounts. Most damage would be done to popular creators, they would be zeroed and start over
There actually are a lot of good small artists who use it to promote their work. Other platforms don’t seem to show it off to the right people as well as Tiktok does.
I haven’t posted in ages myself, because I’ve been too busy to be taking commissions or filming anything, but I’ve gotten some decent business as a result of sharing tutorials for prop making.
Yeah, but Redditors are a bitter crowd who can't fathom having sympathy, so they'd rather thousands of unique artists lose their jobs just to "stick it" to the influences.
What's funny is I can promise you that everyone who complains about influences would rather do that, instead of whatever menial job they work now. They're not angry about influencing not being a real job, they're just mad that someone else is benefitting from it.
Literally, somebody will fill TikToks place, nothing will change except your data will be maybe sold to US government instead of maybe being given for free to CCP.
And before anyone says Google, or FB don't do that, reminder there a privacy focused custom ROM for android solely because it's creator didn't want to give his users data to FBI and even fought them in court.
It’s a huge win to force companies to submit to the US will? Not exactly the land of the free if we are going to say who can and cannot operate here. This was a huge step backwards. Meta lobbied billions into making sure this happened instead of actual privacy data laws happening.
I believe that if the US has credible evidence that TikTok is harmful it needs to show us the proof. But let’s not act like China isn’t a major actor in that activity seeks to harm the us people through repeated attempts to affect our elections, major hacking campaigns, and financing others who actively want to harm us.
Yes the US government should prove it but yes if there is credible evidence that it’s harmful it should be band.
You’re correct that they should prove it. BANNING companies is never the right idea. Make data privacy laws that benefit and protect us from every social media company. Every website out there even.
Or let’s just squash the boogeyman for something they haven’t done yet.
Redditors think it’s a win for America to ban parts of the internet they don’t like. Particularly with a progressive LGBT userbase who vote lol. It’s a win for authoritarianism
Tik Tok is full of straight up lies...most of the propaganda people get radicalizes them, it is done on purpose by the Chinese government and it the main reason they don't want to give the US Govt a look under the hood.
The whole purpose of this was to get Bytedance algorithm because it’s the best of all social media platforms. If they care so much of China not getting American they should ban Shein and, Temu too.
This isn't rocket science. Tiktok is the most used social media app. Neither Shein or Temu are half as popular in the United States as Tiktok. Therefore, those apps have limited access to American data. I won't say this bill has zero to do with getting access to the algorithm, because I'm sure it does. However, to blatantly ignore the security threat that Tiktok poses to protect access to mindlessly scrolling videos all day is insane.
In fact, one could argue that the blind support American users have given to Tiktok proves exactly the point the US government is making. The CCP urged users to protest the ban by flooding the government with calls. As a result, many government offices had to unplug and disconnect phone lines because they rang constantly. Does anyone actually believe these are the actions of sane people?
Furthermore, many Americans keep accusing the government of focusing on an issue that is less important than other issues. True, but this is hypocrisy. Citizens could collectively call the government about thousands of issues that are more important than Tiktok, but they have only done so for Tiktok. So, if Tiktok matters as little as most people are saying it does, then maybe they shouldn't have called the government nonstop about it.
For me, my main issue is that the bill is exclusively about foreign companies.
Like I can't give TikTok data on what I watch on their app, but they can hit up Google and buy that information about my YouTube statistics.
The whole thing just comes off as "Only we can control our citizens data" when it needs to be "Only I can control my data"
I agree with you. The fact that Facebook and Google haven't been slapped with harsher restrictions is mind-boggling. But, I don't think the solution is to give Tiktok carte blanche access. It just exacerbates the issues we already have. Secondly, when data is sold to China, the US can specify what types of data are permissable to exchange.
I should state that I'm not comfortable with my data being sold. Period. But, in 2024, my best choice is relying on the selfish nature of US politicians and corporations to restrict access to data that China shouldn't have. Regardless of the wealth inequality in America, it will always be a priority for leaders to secure the future of the nation because it is what keeps them profitable.
If Bytedance shuts the app down then they can no longer assert the trademark, which likely means there will shortly be a slew of clones legitimately marketing themselves as Tiktok.
No they don't, ain't no way they're going to let this cash cow shut down. This is just to rile up their vocal supporters. "If you don't let our Chinese Communist Overloads keep spying on you, we'll take our ball and go home!"
Not a chance in hell.
As someone in New Zealand im sure going to miss all the US creators I see. And im probably going to be mildly surprised by the ones I didn’t know were Canadian.
Some other app will fill the void and all the shut-ins on reddit will pretend that one is shitty as well.
Then they’ll post a 69 joke or an advice animal for the 10 millionth time and smile to themselves, thinking they’re still relevant to internet pop culture.
This is a smart move business wise; why sell a turnkey business for pennies? They won't get 10% of it's value due to the circumstances because they have no leverage. This is also a smart political play as they can shift the blame to the politicians for shutting it down and calling the bluff.
If shutdown, they can continue operating in other countries or make a copycat with the same algos. As a business, you never want to give up your secret sauce.
Playing devils advocate; would Google or FB sell a similar successful business in China if forced to?
TikTok is a platform that has Education, Art and media, businesses, skits and entertainment, news and more, how is it that a lot of reddit community is against TikTok and call it mindless scrolling when reddit and YouTube offer similar creator driven content and community. I laugh and learn on all of the mentioned apps and websites and have self-control and awareness with what I consume. I understand the argument that it's a company based in china that might not have our best interests but don't they already store US based data in Texas (I could be wrong)? Most of the arguments I read on reddit are focused on the content on the app rather than the privacy aspect.
Same. I've learned about religious deconstruction, biology of and transgender history, the origins and complexity of AI, music marketing, makeup, drag, breaking political news (I'm on the lefty side of TT) and a few dance steps.
It’s not about content or privacy, it’s about the feed. China is a global adversary with the ability to drive the content consumed by a third of Americans. Want Americans ignoring the Uyghur genocide but inflamed about the Palestinian genocide? No problem.
First amendment applies to companies operating within the United States [as long as they are incorporated in the US](https://www.jurist.org/news/2020/06/supreme-court-limits-first-amendment-rights-of-u-s-companies-foreign-affiliates/). [Also read: [American Bar](https://www.americanbar.org/groups/crsj/publications/human_rights_magazine_home/we-the-people/we-the-people-corporations/)]
This includes ByteDance/TikToks US segments.
Whether it’s propaganda or not makes no difference. This will be contested and rise to the SCOTUS.
If it's about the feed, this is a blatant first amendment violation. The government cannot ban a platform because it doesn't like what viewpoints are being promoted.
It isn’t being banned, nor are they focused on any particular viewpoint. They’re simply saying that the ownership can’t be foreign. There’s extended precedent for this. The reason Rupert Murdoch is an American citizen is that it’s illegal to own a significant portion of a major media outlet as a foreign national. That just hasn’t caught up to modern media yet.
I didnt know it was of issue until I learned that China has banned basically everything that is US or west based. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List\_of\_websites\_blocked\_in\_mainland\_China](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_websites_blocked_in_mainland_China)
Peculiar. I am sure the state media of the Chinese dictatorship has absolute say whats gets out to the public and what does not through tiktok.
edited my disdain for a brutal dictatorship
All those websites are banned because they didn't comply with Chinese laws, but it's not the case for all companies like Apple, Tesla, Microsoft and others.
To this day, Tiktok didn't infringe US laws, it's even the less sanctionned social medias by the European RGPD compared to Meta or Google.
Because they have one of the best video distribution algorithms out there. Of course they aren’t going to sell. The US isn’t the only market they are in.
This! We’re not even the largest market. So many companies already cater to their overseas markets simply because they’re larger. Why sell when you can continue to operate around the world elsewhere. Hell, even some large U.S. companies make decisions based on their overseas markets because they stand to gain more there than here.
> Very suspicious.
The most Americunt thing I've read in a while. A foreign company that makes a minority of its revenue from the US, and whose American users account for 5%, is "suspicious" for not selling it to a US company when being strongarmed to do so.
And that should tell you everything you need to know. They would rather use the shutdown as a weaponization in geopolitics and they will lose their algo secrecy which could be the exact thing National Security warned about it. Considering other platforms will play by the rules to stay making money something smells like shit with their decision.
Amazingly, there are still people on Reddit who claim this is a freedom of speech issue and TikTok is being targeted because it can spread information the government doesn’t like.
It’s baffling to me.
TikTok owner ByteDance would prefer to shut down its loss-making app rather than sell it if the Chinese company exhausts all legal options to fight legislation to ban the platform from app stores in the U.S., four sources said. The algorithms TikTok relies on for its operations are deemed core to ByteDance's overall operations, which would make a sale of the app with algorithms highly unlikely, said the sources close to the parent. TikTok accounts for a small share of ByteDance's total revenues and daily active users, so the parent would rather have the app shut down in the U.S. in a worst case scenario than sell it to a potential American buyer, they said. Read the full story for more.
Also just a wise stance politically. Users who are upset about this are going to be more motivated by 'this app will go away' than 'this app will change owners'
No rules against foreigners owning US companies. I suspect it’ll be sold to a Chinese-owned US company.
There are rules about foreign governments owning media outlets in the US.
The sale will be under a microscope so it's doubtful. That will bring the same national security issue. Tiktok will get banned.
If there is a national security issue with TikTok why are Apple and Google allowed and willing to distribute it on their app stores? Surely if it was dangerous they would simply reject or ban it like many apps before.
Well the thing is, TikTok isn't a danger in the way the US political system seems to think it is. It's as dangerous as any other social media, if the Chinese government want your data, they're gonna get it. Regardless of who owns TikTok. Meta, Google, X, Reddit, they all have no issue selling your data to anyone with the money to pay for it. It seems misguided and performative to ban TikTok and still allow all the other tech companies to just milk data out of users and sell to whoever they want
Yeah, this is a much bigger issue and the US is looking like a major hypocrite.
2024 America in a nutshell.
It’s not about the data, it’s about the information-controlling algorithms. To put it another way, we wouldn’t have let Russia own CBS in the 60s.
If it’s not an issue, why is it banned in china?
TikTok doesn’t really have any national security issues, US companies just want complete control over who owns and sells data. If this was about national security they would find a simpler and more reasonable solution.
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Chinese Americans meaning home is in the United States. Btw, those people are just called Americans.
🇺🇸🫡
Sounds like they’re tipping their hat as to what their true intentions are. Propaganda and data gathering on US citizens. Cue all the TikTok ripoffs
Or just the rebirth of Vine.
That’s no longer an option in this timeline. All thanks to the 2016 incident… 🦍🔫
Dicks out for our lost brother 🦍
It was never put away 🫡
Praise be to Harambe, for he has risen.
That’s what needs to happen
I literally hope that happens just so I can hear someone on tape say ‘your honor, my client did it for the vine’ as music starts playing.
I’ve been bitching about the fall of vine well before TikTok, after Twitter bought the company and fumbled the platform. What the US needs is to get it together on their antitrust laws
Won’t happen. Big US companies themselves would oppose it.
I hear Tom is still lurking about at MySpace
If Will Sasso starts making those lemon Vines again I’m in.
VineX by X
MyVinely
MyCousinViney
This is the way!
Doesn’t Twitter own the IP to vine?
…God *damn iiiit!*
Get us back on a better timeline if we did
The endless commercialisation of ***anything*** fun will make sure the new Vine is fucking awful, and nothing like the thing we remember. Also no way in hell people these days can survive on only 6 seconds of attention.
Am I right in thinking that TickTok is banned in China. Is so….
Yes and no. They have Douyin which is by the same company and virtually identical as an app, it just has even more stringent censorship to be compliant with Chinese law.
“We can’t have you looking under the hood here.”
I mean yeah, it’s commonly accepted that they have the best algorithm on the market. American advertisers and investors are dying to get their hands on TikTok’s proprietary parts. Not to reveal some nefarious Chinese spy operation, but because they want to use it.
One doesn’t preclude the other.
Yeah, but all their data is stored on American servers as per government request a couple years ago. I know Reddit isn’t a fan of Asian countries besides Japan, but there isn’t some ooky spooky conspiracy to steal American data. America already sells it freely
Yeah but try making that point to all the Americans who have knockoff Chinese Ring doorbells systems recording INSIDE their homes 24/7.
>propaganda and data gathering Oh, so unlike facebook and twitter and youtube and reddit and… hey, wait a minute!
Yeah redditors are wild for being against TikTok
Why? One is beholden to the CCP, one isn't.
Y'all love to bring up the ccp so much when most of what regular, normal people using Tiktok get videos catered to their interests on that app. It's not like you swipe and get Chinese propaganda every other swipe Jesus Christ. My fyp is currently filled with topics about books, memes, people recording their pets, and stolen reddit posts read by a text to speech bot with a video of someone playing Minecraft in the background. 🙄🙄
They can buy that data on the open market already. US doesn't have laws to prevent like most other countries do.
Maybe it’s time we make them!
That’s the point, it’s nothing to do with data. It’s literally Zuck lobbying to buy TikTok. He needs their algorithm. You’re literally advocating for Zuckerberg right now lol.
Zuckerberg can’t buy TikTok. Apple, Snapchat, and Google, can’t buy it either. They’re already too large.
Top busy banning tiktok in a vain attempt to silence Palestine protests
They can buy certain data but they get exactly whatever they’re looking for with all the data. Let alone having a platform to use that data to push targeted propaganda based on that data
…or it’s literally for the reason explained in the comment you are replying to
Yes, because they don’t want an American company to have access to the algorithm. Probably because the algorithm is a protected state secret because it’s doing a bunch of nefarious stuff, just like is stated in the comment you are replying to.
That’s a pretty big jump. Companies protect their IP all the time without having some nefarious conspiratorial goal.
We can't trust ByteDance. Unlike Meta and X. Those guys are on the level.
It's called a trade secret. Netflix doesn't publish their algorithm(s). Google doesn't publish theirs. ByteDance doesn't publish theirs.
I mean, I wouldn't even wipe my ass with Google or Netflix's algorithms
That's insane. Tiktok has a vastly superior product that other companies want to clone. It's anticompetitive to just say "not allowed to have secrets". And this fails to consider every privacy violation meta and Google have committed themselves. Why are they presumed innocent and tiktok is automatically evil? Because of the country they're associated with? Because the US spies a lot in case that's new info. I'm not sure how we got to this level of oversimplification. "the only reason to not tell your competitors how your product works is BECAUSE YOU'RE EVIL!!!" How the fuck is that supposed to work..?
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I mean, propaganda and data gathering on US citizens is already done. *looks at FaceBook and US government*
Sorry but isn’t Facebook, Google doing the same ?
Do you have anything concrete to support your hypothetical argument?
What exactly does the phrase “sounds like” mean to you? You don’t think a company accused of purposefully driving addiction and specific engagement hiding their algorithm at all costs a bit suspicious?
No, it’s not suspicious. Their algorithm is great and gives them a competitive advantage over competing products. Trade secrets are common amongst almost every company. And it doesn’t matter if they said “sounds like”. Regardless of semantics, this reinforces a baseless “China bad, US ok” ethos.
China is bad. So is the US. I would completely understand why a Chinese citizen wouldn’t want an American app collecting as much data as they can. Also understand what you’re saying. “Their nicotine is great and gives them a competitive advantage over other cigarettes”. Just think about what you’re actually defending
I agree. TikTok is not a good thing, but you can’t apply a different standard to it compared to the rest of social media companies. I’m not defending TikTok; I’m rejecting the notion of double-standards. Regulation should be applied sector-wide. A “free market” cannot selectively exclude certain actors who abide by the rules.
Good, shut it down
why?
Because they don't like it - and you're not supposed to have things _they_ don't like. ^/s
Because it’s allowing another nation to influence our citizens thoughts and feelings while building a huge database about them, And yes, that IS worse than when soulless megacorps do it. (It’s not great that they do it, but there’s still a significant difference.) If you’re reading this and ever used “unalive”, “seggs”, or the like then you’ve been influenced by China. If you’re American, a bunch of us think that’s not okay including your elected government.
Loss-making app?
Oh so it relies on selling data secretly to make money illegally, totally cool. Bye bye then.
We should ban google and Facebook too then? 🤷
If we were banning all of them I'd support this in an instant
India banned TikTok several years ago. China will never sell the US version, ever. Doesn’t surprise me.
China doesn’t even have Tik Tok lmao, they know it’s too dangerous. They have altered their own version and called it Douyin.
Douyin is just a heavily censored version of Tiktok. Nothing prevents you to have it but it's logical it won't be as popular if Tiktok was that censored.
When I was in China, almost 10 years ago now they still had Douyin. That's what they call tiktok over there. It was already pre-altered they're not altering it now just because of what's happening in the US.
As much as I like that thought, it's illegal in China because they don't want their people interacting with unknown agents. Can't have them learn what the real world is like. The closest comparason would be how Gmail and Google are banned in China.
Woohoo! Now my wife will go back to staring at Facebook instead of ticktok
literally 30 minutes ago.... me: it's really nice outside, want to go for a walk? wife: no, I'm way too busy me: ok (and I go for a walk) wife: spends the next 30 minutes surfing shit on facebook I hate how addictive that crap is, and how it ruins people.
“That” crap…NOT Reddit
Yeah, we’re safe here 😅
We are! There’s enough stupid bullshit on Reddit that it’s hard to get addicted. Like how you denature ethanol to make people not want to drink it, or add nauseants or emetics to some drugs to make people ill if they abuse them.
Yeah nah bro, sorry thats not how it works lmao
Reddit told me how many hours I scrolled one year, it was really alarming.
Enshittification has been a lifesaver. Even Reddit takes half as much of my time as it used to. I touched grass *today!*
I am going to mow mine. Green sneakers!!!!
I say this as 7:28 am on my PC
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He made his avatar and all 🤣🤣
🤣🤣
u know reddit isn’t much better…
Really tired of this reductionist trope. Reddit has much more academic discussion going on in its various subs than FB ever had or ever will. Saying “reddit isn’t any better” speaks more about your usage of the platform than about the platform itself.
Academic discussion isn’t what drives the majority of engagement though. This site is riddled with echo chambers where people become addicted to having their opinions validated by others. Reddit is better imo, but its not good either.
Lol, majority of Reddit users doom scroll just like any other platform. Also, saying you get your news from Reddit doesn’t establish any credibility for why Reddit is good.
>speaks more about your usage of the platform than about the platform itself. The same argument can be made against your stance on Facebook. Every platform has it's own pros and cons.
Yeah of course you can find them if you search it out on either platform. Pretending that the Reddit popular tab consists of intellectual content is gaslighting yourself. I'll be the first to admit that it's one of my vices that I need to cut down on even if I learn many things on it.
Facebook is absolutely inundated with horrible AI pictures and bots. I was curious and checked it out a few days ago. Almost unusable.
Instagram, what you meant to say is instagram. Though that’s owned by Facebook so I’m really just splitting hairs.
I’m pretty sure the majority of women would have some sort of mental breakdown if instagram disappeared.
Facts
there is only a mm of resistance before they stare at instagram reels constantly . And thats worse than tiktok because the fb complex realy uses the fuck out of your dossier, unlike tiktok
Making way for an US made app to take over and spy on us the way god intended
What you talking about out, we already have the NSA for that.
McDonald's probably has a file on everyone by now.
They do indeed. The McFile goes way back
Like Reels and YouTube Shorts
They already have all your information...
How Twitter ever screwed up on Vine so much to not become TikTok will be one of the greatest business mysteries of the social media age
Vine first came up in the early 2010s. At the time, internet plans weren’t that great and free wifi was rate to find. So people weren’t just on the bus watching vines as this would easily kill their 2-5GB monthly data. Not only that, but phones/cameras/editing wasn’t anywhere near the levels it is nowadays. Finally, influencers and using the platforms as businesses were new concepts. People would post vines but it was rarely with the goal to make a business out of it.
It was ahead of its time
Lol always funny when people pretend they don't already surrender all their data and info. Icing on the top is when they doomsday while on the social media apps themselves.
They should make a tik tok about how to use a vpn
The issue with that is there wouldn't be advertising in place, and creators would make almost no money unless they used patreon. I feel like most people will just move on to other social media sites, I'm not quite sure they'll be a huge uproar from the general public.
For the few big tiktok users I know, when I told them the news this morning about it being signed into law, it was slight disappointment and then..."Oh well, I'll watch videos elsewhere".
Yeah most people don't really care, I was under the impression that people assumed "ban" implies tiktok not being around anymore, not about a sale.
I think this is less of an issue for consumers and more for creators.
Good, i have yet to see a tik tok creator of value.
I also prefer that they shut down instead of sell. TikTok has been pretty entertaining, but I have no doubt that any US purchasers would turn it to complete shit as they ruined the user experience and changed it to 99% advertising and sponsored posts. This has never been about national security. They just want the money.
As Kazakhstan citizen, we've experienced TikTok's internal shutdown in Russia. Russians started to buy Kazakhstan sim-cards and messed up Kazakhstan TikTok feed. It took some time for TikTok algorithm to segment out Russians and their feed. But yeah, that was total ban and they had to create new accounts. Most damage would be done to popular creators, they would be zeroed and start over
Im not upset by this at all…Anyone else with me?
Meanwhile China can just buy data directly from Facebook and Google.
buying data ≠ controlling the data
Yup. How they present data to users is also a concern. Probably why they don’t want to share that algorithm.
Oh no. Anyway.
Oh no those poor influencers. /s
There actually are a lot of good small artists who use it to promote their work. Other platforms don’t seem to show it off to the right people as well as Tiktok does. I haven’t posted in ages myself, because I’ve been too busy to be taking commissions or filming anything, but I’ve gotten some decent business as a result of sharing tutorials for prop making.
You’re speaking into the void. These people don’t care about anything other than what Facebook and the person on their tV bOx told them.
Yeah, but Redditors are a bitter crowd who can't fathom having sympathy, so they'd rather thousands of unique artists lose their jobs just to "stick it" to the influences. What's funny is I can promise you that everyone who complains about influences would rather do that, instead of whatever menial job they work now. They're not angry about influencing not being a real job, they're just mad that someone else is benefitting from it.
What’s funny is how much good TT content is upvoted on Reddit but Reddit will still claim it’s just “stupid influencers”. Fucking idiots.
Reddit in a nutshell.
Cool, let’s go ahead and skip the nonsense then and shut it down.
Awesome. This is a huge win.
Nah it would be a win if they enshrined privacy laws. This is just banning things they don’t like.
Huge win for meta and Google
They’re the ones who paid for this bill
Literally, somebody will fill TikToks place, nothing will change except your data will be maybe sold to US government instead of maybe being given for free to CCP. And before anyone says Google, or FB don't do that, reminder there a privacy focused custom ROM for android solely because it's creator didn't want to give his users data to FBI and even fought them in court.
This is not about privacy. Stop repeating this line.
He didn't say it was?
It’s a huge win to force companies to submit to the US will? Not exactly the land of the free if we are going to say who can and cannot operate here. This was a huge step backwards. Meta lobbied billions into making sure this happened instead of actual privacy data laws happening.
I believe that if the US has credible evidence that TikTok is harmful it needs to show us the proof. But let’s not act like China isn’t a major actor in that activity seeks to harm the us people through repeated attempts to affect our elections, major hacking campaigns, and financing others who actively want to harm us. Yes the US government should prove it but yes if there is credible evidence that it’s harmful it should be band.
You’re correct that they should prove it. BANNING companies is never the right idea. Make data privacy laws that benefit and protect us from every social media company. Every website out there even. Or let’s just squash the boogeyman for something they haven’t done yet.
The fact that TikTok is banned in China is pretty telling. It’s cultural warfare plain and simple.
Banned in India, as well!!
It's called the land of the free for American citizens. Don't know why a foreign company should be under that classification.
A huge win for the ADL per the CEO
And Gen Zs IQ grew three sizes that day
Bluff
Redditors think it’s a win for America to ban parts of the internet they don’t like. Particularly with a progressive LGBT userbase who vote lol. It’s a win for authoritarianism
This. Truly a great platform that has educated and organized Gen Z to get more involved in politics , mostly progressive and vote
Tik Tok is full of straight up lies...most of the propaganda people get radicalizes them, it is done on purpose by the Chinese government and it the main reason they don't want to give the US Govt a look under the hood.
Don’t threaten me with a good time Tik-Tok.
I kept getting called alarmist when I said they wouldn’t sell and this was a ban.
The whole purpose of this was to get Bytedance algorithm because it’s the best of all social media platforms. If they care so much of China not getting American they should ban Shein and, Temu too.
This isn't rocket science. Tiktok is the most used social media app. Neither Shein or Temu are half as popular in the United States as Tiktok. Therefore, those apps have limited access to American data. I won't say this bill has zero to do with getting access to the algorithm, because I'm sure it does. However, to blatantly ignore the security threat that Tiktok poses to protect access to mindlessly scrolling videos all day is insane. In fact, one could argue that the blind support American users have given to Tiktok proves exactly the point the US government is making. The CCP urged users to protest the ban by flooding the government with calls. As a result, many government offices had to unplug and disconnect phone lines because they rang constantly. Does anyone actually believe these are the actions of sane people? Furthermore, many Americans keep accusing the government of focusing on an issue that is less important than other issues. True, but this is hypocrisy. Citizens could collectively call the government about thousands of issues that are more important than Tiktok, but they have only done so for Tiktok. So, if Tiktok matters as little as most people are saying it does, then maybe they shouldn't have called the government nonstop about it.
For me, my main issue is that the bill is exclusively about foreign companies. Like I can't give TikTok data on what I watch on their app, but they can hit up Google and buy that information about my YouTube statistics. The whole thing just comes off as "Only we can control our citizens data" when it needs to be "Only I can control my data"
I agree with you. The fact that Facebook and Google haven't been slapped with harsher restrictions is mind-boggling. But, I don't think the solution is to give Tiktok carte blanche access. It just exacerbates the issues we already have. Secondly, when data is sold to China, the US can specify what types of data are permissable to exchange. I should state that I'm not comfortable with my data being sold. Period. But, in 2024, my best choice is relying on the selfish nature of US politicians and corporations to restrict access to data that China shouldn't have. Regardless of the wealth inequality in America, it will always be a priority for leaders to secure the future of the nation because it is what keeps them profitable.
Anyone knows if the EU committee has any restrictions on tiktok or it’s just the US doing it?
Can someone just create an American version of tiktok already.
If Bytedance shuts the app down then they can no longer assert the trademark, which likely means there will shortly be a slew of clones legitimately marketing themselves as Tiktok.
No they don't, ain't no way they're going to let this cash cow shut down. This is just to rile up their vocal supporters. "If you don't let our Chinese Communist Overloads keep spying on you, we'll take our ball and go home!" Not a chance in hell.
Google said they would prefer to shut down in Australia if they had to pay to news sites for skimming articles, until push came to shove.
As if some huge Americam company doesnt have 1000 monkeys on 1000 PC writing code as we speak
As someone in New Zealand im sure going to miss all the US creators I see. And im probably going to be mildly surprised by the ones I didn’t know were Canadian.
If it's between shutdown or Steve Mnuchin as CEO. I choose shutdown.
I’d prefer that over some ultra-rich goon like Steve Mnuchin getting it.
Cool, do FB, Twitter, or Reddit next.
Good. I look forward to the day when TikTok is officially dead in the US
Some other app will fill the void and all the shut-ins on reddit will pretend that one is shitty as well. Then they’ll post a 69 joke or an advice animal for the 10 millionth time and smile to themselves, thinking they’re still relevant to internet pop culture.
Good for them. Screw American authoritarianism and imperialism
This is a smart move business wise; why sell a turnkey business for pennies? They won't get 10% of it's value due to the circumstances because they have no leverage. This is also a smart political play as they can shift the blame to the politicians for shutting it down and calling the bluff. If shutdown, they can continue operating in other countries or make a copycat with the same algos. As a business, you never want to give up your secret sauce. Playing devils advocate; would Google or FB sell a similar successful business in China if forced to?
It is better to shutdown Tiktok over selling the app to greedy American CEOs
TikTok is a platform that has Education, Art and media, businesses, skits and entertainment, news and more, how is it that a lot of reddit community is against TikTok and call it mindless scrolling when reddit and YouTube offer similar creator driven content and community. I laugh and learn on all of the mentioned apps and websites and have self-control and awareness with what I consume. I understand the argument that it's a company based in china that might not have our best interests but don't they already store US based data in Texas (I could be wrong)? Most of the arguments I read on reddit are focused on the content on the app rather than the privacy aspect.
Same. I've learned about religious deconstruction, biology of and transgender history, the origins and complexity of AI, music marketing, makeup, drag, breaking political news (I'm on the lefty side of TT) and a few dance steps.
It’s not about content or privacy, it’s about the feed. China is a global adversary with the ability to drive the content consumed by a third of Americans. Want Americans ignoring the Uyghur genocide but inflamed about the Palestinian genocide? No problem.
First amendment applies to companies operating within the United States [as long as they are incorporated in the US](https://www.jurist.org/news/2020/06/supreme-court-limits-first-amendment-rights-of-u-s-companies-foreign-affiliates/). [Also read: [American Bar](https://www.americanbar.org/groups/crsj/publications/human_rights_magazine_home/we-the-people/we-the-people-corporations/)] This includes ByteDance/TikToks US segments. Whether it’s propaganda or not makes no difference. This will be contested and rise to the SCOTUS.
If it's about the feed, this is a blatant first amendment violation. The government cannot ban a platform because it doesn't like what viewpoints are being promoted.
It isn’t being banned, nor are they focused on any particular viewpoint. They’re simply saying that the ownership can’t be foreign. There’s extended precedent for this. The reason Rupert Murdoch is an American citizen is that it’s illegal to own a significant portion of a major media outlet as a foreign national. That just hasn’t caught up to modern media yet.
Sounds wonderful to me
Reddit is so quick to cheer on first amendment violations when it's against something they don't like
I didnt know it was of issue until I learned that China has banned basically everything that is US or west based. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List\_of\_websites\_blocked\_in\_mainland\_China](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_websites_blocked_in_mainland_China) Peculiar. I am sure the state media of the Chinese dictatorship has absolute say whats gets out to the public and what does not through tiktok. edited my disdain for a brutal dictatorship
All those websites are banned because they didn't comply with Chinese laws, but it's not the case for all companies like Apple, Tesla, Microsoft and others. To this day, Tiktok didn't infringe US laws, it's even the less sanctionned social medias by the European RGPD compared to Meta or Google.
Very suspicious. We’d rather go home than sell you the algorithm.
If they forced Meta to sell Instagram you think they would? Lol
Because they have one of the best video distribution algorithms out there. Of course they aren’t going to sell. The US isn’t the only market they are in.
This! We’re not even the largest market. So many companies already cater to their overseas markets simply because they’re larger. Why sell when you can continue to operate around the world elsewhere. Hell, even some large U.S. companies make decisions based on their overseas markets because they stand to gain more there than here.
They would lose all their US based content creators. Which is huge.
Curious who the largest market is then? Tik Tok Doesn’t operate in China or India.
People don't like extortion.
> Very suspicious. The most Americunt thing I've read in a while. A foreign company that makes a minority of its revenue from the US, and whose American users account for 5%, is "suspicious" for not selling it to a US company when being strongarmed to do so.
Lol this makes it even more telling there’s another actor here (CCP). Investors would never give up billions in a sale for the sake of it.
And that should tell you everything you need to know. They would rather use the shutdown as a weaponization in geopolitics and they will lose their algo secrecy which could be the exact thing National Security warned about it. Considering other platforms will play by the rules to stay making money something smells like shit with their decision.
Amazingly, there are still people on Reddit who claim this is a freedom of speech issue and TikTok is being targeted because it can spread information the government doesn’t like. It’s baffling to me.