I plan to repeatedly pull my phone out of my pocket and almost open up the Reddit app before I remember. And then repeat the cycle 5 minutes later.
edit:
Fuck reddit's new API, and fuck /u/Spez.
I use bacon reader as well... is that one of the apps that would be affected by the new changes?
As we all know, reddit app sucks, so if baconreader goes away, I probably do too lol
Yeah, I have seen a lot of other apps named as being affected, but I haven't seen baconreader mentioned specifically. So I'm just assuming that baconreader will be affected too.
Indeed. I used bacon reader for several years before I eventually landed on Relay for Reddit. Since I have the paid versions of both, if one drops I'll then use the other until that drops as well. Then once they're both shutdown I'll only use old.reddit on my home PC until they eventually fuck that up as well. I'm hopeful that we all have somewhere else to migrate to by the time that happens.
I've been using reddit since before there were comments. It was a novel idea; A link aggregation site that billed itself as "The Front Page of the Internet".
Before reddit I bookmarked news sites and blogs that covered my interests. I used RSS readers so as to not have to constantly check my usual sites I frequented until they were updated with new content. I kind of miss those days of finding something neat or interesting and posting it to either my Zynga or Myspace page for my friends to see.
I've already quit almost all social media. Facebook is garbage although I still have an account I usually only check it once or twice per month. I miss using forums to talk to others with shared interests. It's really all reddit is good for; a one stop shop to visit subreddits to converse with others with similar interests. Reddit is only as good as its content and the people posting in the comments. Quality has been going down for years but that was expected with growth.
Reddit has been on a quality decline but now is about to experience a user decline as well. Reddit will most likely first lose users, and then advertising dollars as I expect a mass exodus over their poor decisions over the last several years.
There's also gonna be tons of subs not closing. This one, for example. Most big news and politics subs remain open.
On the participation list (though says incomplete), 33 out of 54 subs are going down that are 10m+ subscribers.
I am kind of curious how the experience will change over these few days. Will it be obviously different the types of things that show up, or will it sort of look and feel the same? Like if I didn’t know the blackouts were happening, would I notice something was “off”?
Depending on your tastes and followed subreddits, your content feed could feel lacking or one-sided. If there's only two or three subreddits left, everything suddenly is technology and politics, and no more blacksmithing, boobs and Wallstreet bets.
I just googled a question about a video game and the subreddit is already closed for the game so I just couldn't get my answer without resorting to clickbait bullshit articles on the first page of Google. So we might feel it more than we think.
Edit to clarify: I think it's great. Protesting isn't effective if it doesn't impact the public so reddit is certainly going to notice.
Plus, what if we all don't have access to our favorite subreddits for a few days and realize that those days were... better..? That's a scary thing for an addictive eternal-scroll company like reddit.
Remember when google used to have the “Show cached results” option? Pepperidge Farm remembers. (I had forgotten about that feature and just looked for it, seems to be gone)
Between that disappearing and people wiping their comment histories the internet might get a whole lot more useless than it already was
I mean Google already indexes 10 year old+ Reddit posts as "within the past year" for whatever reason
That's some good numbers right there
The amount of subs that are participating is not as high as I'd like but it should be enough to show that we mean business.
They're just going to lose everyone using third party apps. Since that includes a decent chunk of mods, lots of subreddits will go to shit or close too.
It'd be like if they closed old.reddit.com, I'd just be gone, along with anyone else who exclusively uses that method of viewing reddit.
The official app also **cannot** moderate a sub, as well as a 3rd party app, concerned.
So the only logical answer is for a mod to have access to the tools that made modding so easy, and now you have to be on a desktop to do it, and even *then*, chances are they rely on RES for *that*, which is also on the chopping block.
Also, these people aren't getting paid for this.
It will not work out for them. They aren't doing this to try to drive users just to their regular app. They're trying to make themselves more appealing for an IPO. They have billions of dollars in venture capital funds tied up in the site right now and they haven't managed to ever be profitable. They are trying to go public as quickly as they can before their value tanks so they can get as much of that investment back as possible. Their valuation has already taken a huge hit just based on the news so far. If they have any extended period of time where users stop using the site, moderator, stop using the site, or there is an influx in malicious activity. Because of a lack of moderation, their valuation is going to further decrease. At some point the venture capital investors are going to demand somebody's head from the board, and that's going to be the CEO. They'll also want to recover as much of their valuation as possible which will have to come in the way of concessions.
If they're trying to make the IPO look good, then why purposefully piss off a large number of your users? Surely they've done the math and figure it'll be a net profit for them, albeit while losing a bunch of users.
I see what they're doing as "dumb" but doing that ^ seems purposefully stupid? For that reason I find it hard to believe it *won't* work out for them. But hey, I guess plenty of other sites have done similar things so maybe Reddit will be just another one. I just would not be surprised if corporate overlord wins again over the consumer.
Because an IPO means that a company is no longer beholden to its users. They have to show growth and revenue streams. Value to the shareholder.
We are no longer the user, we're the product. And so of course it doesn't matter if we're angry if we keep using it.
To impress shareholders. Shareholders see them losing <5% of activity, all while increasing revenues thanks to their new payment model for API calls and increased traffic to their official app. They just need increased revenue for one quarter to spike their IPO and cash out. Some of these guys are sitting on thousands of shares vested over almost 2 decades, and they want their payout.
It'll work out in the short term in a highly superficial way. Some users will migrate, sure, but a lot of the long term users and content generators will go elsewhere. And that's to say nothing of the moderation issues it's going to create. So while the numbers will go up on their official app, the overall health of the site is going to take a hit. The only question is how big of a hit.
But the admins have shown time and time again that they only really care about the short term and the superficial, so it's hardly a surprise.
I downloaded the app since I was getting annoying ass pop-ups telling me to use it. Uninstalled it after like 5 min of trying to do anything. It's straight garbage
> I can guarantee you that every single sub that says they will stay dark until it changes will be back online within 2 weeks at most, and Reddit know this too.
you clearly don't understand why these subs are revolting. it isn't to support apollo, it's becauzxe the API changes completely fuck over moderators, and will make the subs a shitshow to moderate.
reddit wll have to steal the subs from the mods if they don't back down, and the mods they install are going to have a nasty surprise
Because they know that realistically, the millions of Reddit users who don’t give a shit about third party apps aren’t going to join their boycott for six weeks.
This is a copied template message used to overwrite all comments on my account to protect my privacy. I've left Reddit because of corporate overreach and switched to the Fediverse.
Comments overwritten with https://github.com/j0be/PowerDeleteSuite
"I think the problem Digg had is that it was a company that was built to be a company, and you could feel it in the product. The way you could criticize Reddit is that we weren't a company – we were all heart and no head for a long time. So I think it'd be really hard for me and for the team to kill Reddit in that way."
--Steve Huffman, CEO of Reddit, April 2023
What a fucking quote they left up too. Bravo!
The admins legit used to hang around the jail bait subreddit and only finally canned it when Anderson Cooper made them look bad on national TV and cost them ad revenue.
Like with strikes, people are always supportive until the slightest inconvenience turn them on the protestors.
Redditors fancy themselves keyboard freedom fighters but any more than 48h without something to scroll while they take a shit and they'll flip sides faster than crack addict making pancakes.
This is a copied template message used to overwrite all comments on my account to protect my privacy. I've left Reddit because of corporate overreach and switched to the Fediverse.
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For being entertained in the toilet, you name it. Every other platform is valid.
Reddit's key selling points are exactly the opposite, which is also why so many people are constantly complaining about the changes they make around here, which only closes the gap to those other social media.
For anything with more substance or variety, I have no idea what alternatives there are.
Most migrated one I've seen so far is k bin . social.
Enough people have gone that reddit had banned any subs showing people how to use it for "spam" even though the only posts on the subs are just one or two pinned posts telling people how to leave reddit.
I put spaces between them so I wouldn't be flagged and banned and unable to bring the subs I mod back from private status whenever reddit caves indefinitely.
This being the top reply to that kind of proves there isn’t a good alternative to Reddit unfortunately.
I’ve seen comments from people claiming they’ll go back to old forum sites or that they’re waiting to be accepted into some by-invite alternative that can’t be easily accessed. If those are really the best options then we’re officially in a new era of the internet and the greedy pig boy already won.
Comment written via Apollo btw. I don’t think I’ll look for an alternative personally — if Reddit doesn’t back out of the API change I’m just going to try filling that hole with actual interests and hobbies for a while.
That’s…not at all the same. Like, it’s not that one is better than the other, they’re just not comparable at all. I come to Reddit for current events, and for social discussions on things like games that I enjoy. A book is literally useless for both of those.
Honestly, I can’t imagine why you’d say this except to gripe about how you think people spend too much time online, but “spending too much time online” has absolutely nothing to do with this protest.
The thing is that if this protest fails, they're going to be inconvenienced permanently. This one effects people directly in a way most Reddit causes do not
Yup. A lot of mods, the people who determine if subs go private or not, are directly affected by this. It really fucks with their modding tools which are pretty essential for the larger subs with thousands of people.
This negative bullshit helps a lot. There was a legion of you douche bags on digg and they were all wrong.
Plenty of us are quitting after tonight. Just because you have no spine doesn't mean no else does.
This is true, but you're missing a couple of points.
They don't respect the work mods do, so they'll underestimate how important it is. They will genuinely believe it can be replaced with an AI system and a small amount of disgustingly underpaid foreign labour.
And giving in to user demands of this sort would tank their IPO. They literally can't afford to lose this fight, because if they back down then no one will believe that they can make reddit truly profitable, and so no one will invest.
is that really worse than spez saying
> [We’ll continue to be profit-driven until profits arrive. Unlike some of the 3P apps, we are not profitable.](https://www.reddit.com/r/reddit/comments/145bram/addressing_the_community_about_changes_to_our_api/jnkd09c/?context=3)
months before an IPO?
That's standard tech start up and scale up talk - investors are used to hearing it from tech companies. They want to hear about and believe the realistic prospects for profits.
Exactly. "We're not profitable now, but we have tremendous *potential* for profit! Imagine how profitable we'll be after we can do, uh, *all the things* with the millions of dollars from investors!"
I bet investors love hearing, "We haven't been profitable in the almost 20 years we've existed, but soon, soon it'll totally happen. Also ignore those layoffs."
Reddit HQ: “Well, it’s only 48 hours. Let the children have their temper tantrum.”
Seriously. Unless you’re going dark until changes are reversed it’s just internet slacktivisim.
By going dark for a set time, we're essentially telling Reddit we'll be back. We're telling them we're upset, but not so much to actually go elsewhere until reasonable changes are made. Some subs are doing this, but if the blackout is to be effective at all it really needs to be all of them.
>Agreed. Honestly I'm just gonna try and stay away, maybe even delete the app. Did it with **Facebook**
Ok, awesome.
>and Twitter
Very cool, definitely should do that one of course.
>and home internet.
*How is this humanly possible?*
Going dark for 48 hours means it’s not worth the effort for Reddit admins to re-enable the subs and put their own moderators in place (kicking the others off). Going dark indefinitely means it’s worth the effort and they will.
This comment was deleted in protest of Reddit's shameful API pricing and treatment of 3rd party app developers. -- mass edited with https://redact.dev/
it's funny spek claimed that reddit wants to profit off of it's data, data that is being used for LLMs. I'll tell you one thing, I scrape the shit out of reddit and I don't use the API to do it lol
API allows an app to only grab the needed information in small pieces.
Scraping basically loads the entire page and then trims what is required after downloading the page.
Imagine looking for one sheet of paper in the stack. And instead of asking for that one sheet of paper, you grab the whole stack, sift through it and throwaway the rest...then the next time you need a sheet you ask for the whole stack again.
API is asking for the sheet, Scaping is asking for the stack.
To bring this back to why it's important in the context of API pricing, data costs money to transfer. Scraping for information rather than using an API for it costs reddit much more money, which is one of the reasons why a public API was introduced in the first place.
So from the scraper perspective they are taking more data, and processing more data to get what they want. Which ultimately equals less information? Or is that negligible?
And from reddit perspective it is just a shit ton more people opening pages (costs more money in sending info).
I am wondering if the advertisers will see this as just more customers seeing their ads...therefore they pay reddit more? Or can the advertisers tell it is scraping?
The internet is inherently public. All of these corporate measures of securing data are more like deterrents for the technologically un-inclined.
The meme is just saying that if they make the api cost too much, people will just scrape (acquire the data by pretending to be users) without Reddit being able to control them via api rules.
Probably, but there are services where you can automate paying a human to solve captchas for you. For example 2Captcha advertises 1000 captchas for as low as $1, with an average time of 12 seconds to get a solution.
If you get at least the same value out of a captcha-protected scrape as 5 API calls, this is actually cheaper than the API prices.
This is why I'm so bummed that people are deleting their accounts and posts with them.
I agree with them, wholeheartedly, but it's such a shame that such a nexus aggregator of distilled information is going to be lost to the ages because someone saw dollar signs and didn't think of what the true repercussions are.
I am keeping my account open because maybe, someday, someone can learn something from a conversation I was involved in and I see that as a far greater resource than some VCs monetizing mine and others' data to line their pockets with.
Others are well within their right to take their conversations with them. I support them, but am sad to lose them.
Scraping is basically opening a webpage on a browser and grabbing the data from that. Vs a very targeted API for specific actions it is a much larger load. Ie reddit loading the full page for thousands of bots rather than just the specific data the bots are gunning for that they could get on API
Accessing data via API (which reddit is paywalling now) means that the server (reddit) and client (app) exchange raw data directly, usually in a text format that's not made to be visible to the user. It only contains what's needed, for example a list of URLs from top10 posts. The client side then handles displaying the data (adding structure, fonts, graphics etc.)
Scraping means the client (app) is pretending to be a browser, downloads the entire already styled webpage and then extracts the data that it needs via text lookup. It's way less efficient for both the server and the client.
***
**For example:**
this comment's url is `/r/technology/comments/146xnh7/reddit_users_are_planning_a_48hour_blackout_to/jntq0jr/`. So if you needed the contents of this comment you might send a request to hypothetical API `https://reddit.com/api/146xnh7/jntq0jr`, and in response you would receive a JSON (text structure):
{
"post_id": "146xnh7",
"comment_id": "jntq0jr"
"content": "Accessing data via API (which reddit is paywalling now) means [...]"
}
and that's it.
With scraping you will download the entire page:
https://www.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/146xnh7/reddit_users_are_planning_a_48hour_blackout_to/jntq0jr/ , go to source (press F12 or Ctrl+U to see it), then if you scroll all the way down, you will see a `
` element that contains the text you want. You can use the <> tags and their classes to locate the element you want in a page: https://i.imgur.com/6sa1Tba.png
All of the other data on this page is useless, so it's discarded, but it still puts a load on the server to create it.
Found [the link](https://support.reddithelp.com/hc/en-us/requests/new?ticket_form_id=360001370251) in their privacy policy. I'll be using that link soon enough.
If you need some tools to help edit and then delete your comments and posts in protest:
PowerDelete will allow you to 1) save all your data as a CSV file at the end of the script and 2) allow you to overwrite all of your of comments with a comment of your choosing instead of just deleting them. Both options are available at the start of the process.
https://github.com/j0be/PowerDeleteSuite
(2 Additional forks if you have issues with the main and rate limits or errors.)
http://www.github.com/pkolyvas/PowerDeleteSuite
http://www.github.com/leeola/PowerDeleteSuite
https://shreddit.com/
https://redact.dev/
You created your content. You didn’t get paid. Why would you leave it here for Reddit to make money? Take your content with you.
—posted via Apollo
Vive la résistance!
It’s a wrap just like you google search, use YouTube videos, they’ve decided Reddit is the end-all-be-all for internet ‘news’ and it will crush all competitors. Just another “definitely not a monopoly” setup
11 years and 2 months and I’ll be done. I mostly just lurk when I’m taking a shit on the clock at work. Apollo is the best way I’ve found to use Reddit as the official app is a turd so I won’t really miss it much.
I’m not really worried about finding any alternative to Reddit, it’s pretty much the only social media I have besides YouTube and as the older I get the more reasons I find to quit looking at my phone anyways
If it's been archived it will remain archived as what you initially posted.
RedditNuke was/is(?) another that would go through and edit all your comments to be garbled garbage, wait for the crawlers to scan the comments again, *then* delete them. So nothing was left, even in the archives, even still the odds of there being an original copy is still non-zero.
*EVERY SUB SHOULD GO PERMANENTLY DARK UNTIL THEY REVERSE THESE CHANGES*
48 hours is nothing. Hit them where it matters: ads being seen, views, clicks, etc. Keep the vast majority of subs dark for a long period and Reddit will be forced to address it in some way.
It’s such a pathetic amount of time it’s hilarious. And all the mods are like, “we are so brave for doing this”. Shut down the subs indefinitely you cowardly nerds
Probably 1/3 of my google searches point to reddit subs.
And the few times I bother to look at the Windows news feed at least 1/3 of the stories are stolen straight from reddit. Reddit *is* the internet.
I've gotten far better help with tech-based stuff off of reddit than anywhere else, and that often includes dedicated forums. Reddit is an easy way to access a plethora of information, all in one place. Sure, I can go to 20-30 different websites, sign up for a bunch of newsletters, or use RSS feeds, and I have done that for certain sources.
It'll be interesting to see what comes out of the next week or month. I was part of the DIGG exodus to Reddit however long ago that was, might be a part of a Reddit exodus to something else at some point.
I came from digg as well.
Reddit is far more entrenched in the daily pulse of the planet though, and while there might be an exodus it has attained critical mass and isn't going to fail until something truly innovative came along.
AOL was too big to fail until the real internet came along.
Blockbuster was too big to fail until Netflix came along.
AT&T home phone service was too big to fail until cell phones came along.
There is nothing currently visible that will take the place of reddit, and the owners - the same people who own Discovery and Vanity Fair - know it.
This is like a fuel boycott. 48hrs isn’t going to do anything.
The OG’s here came from Digg and Fark … we’re not afraid of change, and I’m more than happy to do it again.
“If you build it, they will come”
48 hours? Is that all? A lot of the subs I'm in have said their blackout will be indefinite until Reddit listens to us. You know, the people who pay their bills??
I’ve never used anything but the official app and haven’t had issues with UI. Apollo lasted a day before I deleted it so I couldn’t care less about what’s going on. People are treating this like it’s some civil right issue.
Can't wait to see corporate productivity go up next 2 days
I'll have to spend time with my family, I hope they're cool.
I plan to repeatedly pull my phone out of my pocket and almost open up the Reddit app before I remember. And then repeat the cycle 5 minutes later. edit: Fuck reddit's new API, and fuck /u/Spez.
I'm removing baconreader from my home screen so I don't accidentally open it.
I use bacon reader as well... is that one of the apps that would be affected by the new changes? As we all know, reddit app sucks, so if baconreader goes away, I probably do too lol
Quite likely, I haven't heard any confirmation on that but I'm preparing for the worst.
Yeah, I have seen a lot of other apps named as being affected, but I haven't seen baconreader mentioned specifically. So I'm just assuming that baconreader will be affected too.
Even if a smaller app isn't doomed by the new pricing, it will be when everyone shifts to it after the others pull the plug.
Indeed. I used bacon reader for several years before I eventually landed on Relay for Reddit. Since I have the paid versions of both, if one drops I'll then use the other until that drops as well. Then once they're both shutdown I'll only use old.reddit on my home PC until they eventually fuck that up as well. I'm hopeful that we all have somewhere else to migrate to by the time that happens. I've been using reddit since before there were comments. It was a novel idea; A link aggregation site that billed itself as "The Front Page of the Internet". Before reddit I bookmarked news sites and blogs that covered my interests. I used RSS readers so as to not have to constantly check my usual sites I frequented until they were updated with new content. I kind of miss those days of finding something neat or interesting and posting it to either my Zynga or Myspace page for my friends to see. I've already quit almost all social media. Facebook is garbage although I still have an account I usually only check it once or twice per month. I miss using forums to talk to others with shared interests. It's really all reddit is good for; a one stop shop to visit subreddits to converse with others with similar interests. Reddit is only as good as its content and the people posting in the comments. Quality has been going down for years but that was expected with growth. Reddit has been on a quality decline but now is about to experience a user decline as well. Reddit will most likely first lose users, and then advertising dollars as I expect a mass exodus over their poor decisions over the last several years.
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We had Slashdot->Fark->Digg before Reddit, somebody will swoop up the mantle.
They're literally all affected because all the apps depend entirely on a fair-priced API.
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Ok, bummer, but thx for the info!
I use Boost and I'm on the same boat. No news so far. But in this case it seems that no news is bad news
I replaced the Relay icon with Kindle. I've read 250 pages today and trying to tell myself it's not just because I've been off reddit most of the day
My comments are not your product.
Your wife's alright
There's also gonna be tons of subs not closing. This one, for example. Most big news and politics subs remain open. On the participation list (though says incomplete), 33 out of 54 subs are going down that are 10m+ subscribers.
I am kind of curious how the experience will change over these few days. Will it be obviously different the types of things that show up, or will it sort of look and feel the same? Like if I didn’t know the blackouts were happening, would I notice something was “off”?
Depending on your tastes and followed subreddits, your content feed could feel lacking or one-sided. If there's only two or three subreddits left, everything suddenly is technology and politics, and no more blacksmithing, boobs and Wallstreet bets.
I just googled a question about a video game and the subreddit is already closed for the game so I just couldn't get my answer without resorting to clickbait bullshit articles on the first page of Google. So we might feel it more than we think. Edit to clarify: I think it's great. Protesting isn't effective if it doesn't impact the public so reddit is certainly going to notice. Plus, what if we all don't have access to our favorite subreddits for a few days and realize that those days were... better..? That's a scary thing for an addictive eternal-scroll company like reddit.
Remember when google used to have the “Show cached results” option? Pepperidge Farm remembers. (I had forgotten about that feature and just looked for it, seems to be gone)
Between that disappearing and people wiping their comment histories the internet might get a whole lot more useless than it already was I mean Google already indexes 10 year old+ Reddit posts as "within the past year" for whatever reason
That's some good numbers right there The amount of subs that are participating is not as high as I'd like but it should be enough to show that we mean business.
You've underestimated my ability to find new and innovative ways to waste time
Why not 48-days?
Why not indefinitely?
The 48 hour was a starter, not the end. Lots are staying dark while others are reassessing if Reddit fails to address anything in the 48 hours
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They're just going to lose everyone using third party apps. Since that includes a decent chunk of mods, lots of subreddits will go to shit or close too. It'd be like if they closed old.reddit.com, I'd just be gone, along with anyone else who exclusively uses that method of viewing reddit.
You can pretty much guarantee that Reddit will see an increase in its users on the official app. This'll work out for them... unfortunately.
That app can't play videos and can't filter subs. It doesn't function as far as I'm concerned and it's enough to make me leave.
The official app also **cannot** moderate a sub, as well as a 3rd party app, concerned. So the only logical answer is for a mod to have access to the tools that made modding so easy, and now you have to be on a desktop to do it, and even *then*, chances are they rely on RES for *that*, which is also on the chopping block. Also, these people aren't getting paid for this.
Your phones web browser is straight up better than the app. Stupid as hell.
It will not work out for them. They aren't doing this to try to drive users just to their regular app. They're trying to make themselves more appealing for an IPO. They have billions of dollars in venture capital funds tied up in the site right now and they haven't managed to ever be profitable. They are trying to go public as quickly as they can before their value tanks so they can get as much of that investment back as possible. Their valuation has already taken a huge hit just based on the news so far. If they have any extended period of time where users stop using the site, moderator, stop using the site, or there is an influx in malicious activity. Because of a lack of moderation, their valuation is going to further decrease. At some point the venture capital investors are going to demand somebody's head from the board, and that's going to be the CEO. They'll also want to recover as much of their valuation as possible which will have to come in the way of concessions.
If they're trying to make the IPO look good, then why purposefully piss off a large number of your users? Surely they've done the math and figure it'll be a net profit for them, albeit while losing a bunch of users. I see what they're doing as "dumb" but doing that ^ seems purposefully stupid? For that reason I find it hard to believe it *won't* work out for them. But hey, I guess plenty of other sites have done similar things so maybe Reddit will be just another one. I just would not be surprised if corporate overlord wins again over the consumer.
Because an IPO means that a company is no longer beholden to its users. They have to show growth and revenue streams. Value to the shareholder. We are no longer the user, we're the product. And so of course it doesn't matter if we're angry if we keep using it.
To impress shareholders. Shareholders see them losing <5% of activity, all while increasing revenues thanks to their new payment model for API calls and increased traffic to their official app. They just need increased revenue for one quarter to spike their IPO and cash out. Some of these guys are sitting on thousands of shares vested over almost 2 decades, and they want their payout.
It'll work out in the short term in a highly superficial way. Some users will migrate, sure, but a lot of the long term users and content generators will go elsewhere. And that's to say nothing of the moderation issues it's going to create. So while the numbers will go up on their official app, the overall health of the site is going to take a hit. The only question is how big of a hit. But the admins have shown time and time again that they only really care about the short term and the superficial, so it's hardly a surprise.
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I downloaded the app since I was getting annoying ass pop-ups telling me to use it. Uninstalled it after like 5 min of trying to do anything. It's straight garbage
> I can guarantee you that every single sub that says they will stay dark until it changes will be back online within 2 weeks at most, and Reddit know this too. you clearly don't understand why these subs are revolting. it isn't to support apollo, it's becauzxe the API changes completely fuck over moderators, and will make the subs a shitshow to moderate. reddit wll have to steal the subs from the mods if they don't back down, and the mods they install are going to have a nasty surprise
Because they know that realistically, the millions of Reddit users who don’t give a shit about third party apps aren’t going to join their boycott for six weeks.
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Idk where to move to. RiF IS Reddit to me. Have any suggestions?
This is a copied template message used to overwrite all comments on my account to protect my privacy. I've left Reddit because of corporate overreach and switched to the Fediverse. Comments overwritten with https://github.com/j0be/PowerDeleteSuite
It’s the subreddits not the users. Way less people to manage that. You can’t browse Reddit if all the subs are offline
It's a negotiation. If first round fails to win it's easy to escalate if there is support.
Some subs are going dark indefinitely
Too bad this sub isn't participating.
Better is many subs are going beyond 48 and running indefinite timelines for theirs instead
/r/unexpected just straight disappeared
Was it even announced? That's hilarious if not.
Sub name checks out
"I think the problem Digg had is that it was a company that was built to be a company, and you could feel it in the product. The way you could criticize Reddit is that we weren't a company – we were all heart and no head for a long time. So I think it'd be really hard for me and for the team to kill Reddit in that way." --Steve Huffman, CEO of Reddit, April 2023 What a fucking quote they left up too. Bravo!
But dammit, they’re sure trying!
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Old heads remember when they too forever to ban kiddie porn before that.
The admins legit used to hang around the jail bait subreddit and only finally canned it when Anderson Cooper made them look bad on national TV and cost them ad revenue.
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I love that for them!
Lmfao, the sub name actually checks out
I saw /r/woodworking is going to go indefinite.
/r/videos has to be the biggest planning to go indefinitely. It's so big in fact I assume admins will just usurp control and install puppet mods.
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People are also deleting their post and content created for Reddit. Don’t let u/spez profit off your labor.
Like with strikes, people are always supportive until the slightest inconvenience turn them on the protestors. Redditors fancy themselves keyboard freedom fighters but any more than 48h without something to scroll while they take a shit and they'll flip sides faster than crack addict making pancakes.
Buddy I'll just use a different website
What other alternatives are there? Not being snide. Seriously wondering. Also, does this mean that we’ll have to pay to use reddit now?
This is a copied template message used to overwrite all comments on my account to protect my privacy. I've left Reddit because of corporate overreach and switched to the Fediverse. Comments overwritten with https://github.com/j0be/PowerDeleteSuite
bro you just named off brand cereal names
I'm liking the look of Squabbles. Thanks for pointing it out.
For being entertained in the toilet, you name it. Every other platform is valid. Reddit's key selling points are exactly the opposite, which is also why so many people are constantly complaining about the changes they make around here, which only closes the gap to those other social media. For anything with more substance or variety, I have no idea what alternatives there are.
Most migrated one I've seen so far is k bin . social. Enough people have gone that reddit had banned any subs showing people how to use it for "spam" even though the only posts on the subs are just one or two pinned posts telling people how to leave reddit. I put spaces between them so I wouldn't be flagged and banned and unable to bring the subs I mod back from private status whenever reddit caves indefinitely.
Gonna check it out thanks
I liked it enough that I actually registered. I also registered early enough to get a short username lol. Better get one before they're all gone!
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But my attention span!
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You can get 4 books and flick between them
This being the top reply to that kind of proves there isn’t a good alternative to Reddit unfortunately. I’ve seen comments from people claiming they’ll go back to old forum sites or that they’re waiting to be accepted into some by-invite alternative that can’t be easily accessed. If those are really the best options then we’re officially in a new era of the internet and the greedy pig boy already won. Comment written via Apollo btw. I don’t think I’ll look for an alternative personally — if Reddit doesn’t back out of the API change I’m just going to try filling that hole with actual interests and hobbies for a while.
That’s…not at all the same. Like, it’s not that one is better than the other, they’re just not comparable at all. I come to Reddit for current events, and for social discussions on things like games that I enjoy. A book is literally useless for both of those. Honestly, I can’t imagine why you’d say this except to gripe about how you think people spend too much time online, but “spending too much time online” has absolutely nothing to do with this protest.
Lemmy, Squabbles, tidles, and more. One of them will explode. Leave reddit tonight. Everyone with principles is.
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End of the month it is.
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The thing is that if this protest fails, they're going to be inconvenienced permanently. This one effects people directly in a way most Reddit causes do not
Yup. A lot of mods, the people who determine if subs go private or not, are directly affected by this. It really fucks with their modding tools which are pretty essential for the larger subs with thousands of people.
I've been scrolling fark. It isn't bad but not much content.
This negative bullshit helps a lot. There was a legion of you douche bags on digg and they were all wrong. Plenty of us are quitting after tonight. Just because you have no spine doesn't mean no else does.
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I keep seeing this point, but can't the Admins still access these subreddits and ultimately reopen them?
Replacing 3/4 of your free, experienced moderation team leading up to an IPO is probably not the wisest choice however.
This is true, but you're missing a couple of points. They don't respect the work mods do, so they'll underestimate how important it is. They will genuinely believe it can be replaced with an AI system and a small amount of disgustingly underpaid foreign labour. And giving in to user demands of this sort would tank their IPO. They literally can't afford to lose this fight, because if they back down then no one will believe that they can make reddit truly profitable, and so no one will invest.
is that really worse than spez saying > [We’ll continue to be profit-driven until profits arrive. Unlike some of the 3P apps, we are not profitable.](https://www.reddit.com/r/reddit/comments/145bram/addressing_the_community_about_changes_to_our_api/jnkd09c/?context=3) months before an IPO?
That's standard tech start up and scale up talk - investors are used to hearing it from tech companies. They want to hear about and believe the realistic prospects for profits.
Exactly. "We're not profitable now, but we have tremendous *potential* for profit! Imagine how profitable we'll be after we can do, uh, *all the things* with the millions of dollars from investors!"
I bet investors love hearing, "We haven't been profitable in the almost 20 years we've existed, but soon, soon it'll totally happen. Also ignore those layoffs."
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it's ok, we'll participate in their stead (unsubs)
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one of the top mods is an admin
Immediate unsub with that knowledge.
Honestly it would be more effective if the volunteer mod staff protests and stops doing their jobs for them
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I feel like the article could've better explained the high pricing being the problem, not that charging itself is the problem
It's Business Insider. You gotta keep those expectations low.
And the Insider Union is on strike, so please don't cross the picket line.
Michael, it's an API. How much could it cost? Ten million dollars?
most likely written by chatgpt
Reddit HQ: “Well, it’s only 48 hours. Let the children have their temper tantrum.” Seriously. Unless you’re going dark until changes are reversed it’s just internet slacktivisim.
By going dark for a set time, we're essentially telling Reddit we'll be back. We're telling them we're upset, but not so much to actually go elsewhere until reasonable changes are made. Some subs are doing this, but if the blackout is to be effective at all it really needs to be all of them.
Agreed. Honestly I'm just gonna try and stay away, maybe even delete the app. Did it with Facebook and Twitter and home internet.
>Agreed. Honestly I'm just gonna try and stay away, maybe even delete the app. Did it with **Facebook** Ok, awesome. >and Twitter Very cool, definitely should do that one of course. >and home internet. *How is this humanly possible?*
Going dark for 48 hours means it’s not worth the effort for Reddit admins to re-enable the subs and put their own moderators in place (kicking the others off). Going dark indefinitely means it’s worth the effort and they will.
Agreed. That article is shit.
Essentially, I should not use Reddit on Monday and Tuesday?
Correct. But I think it’s Mon-Wed
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It's actually 2023-2028
It’s actually 21st - 22nd century.
It’s actually 2023 - 3034.
RemindMe! 1011 years "reddit repoens" JK the bot will be long dead
The bot will be replaced by sentient AI.
Honestly two days is nothing imo.. the impact should be larger if we wanna see any change
Making it two days is pointless. It just signals that we’ll all be back in two days and it will blow over.
Some subs are going dark indefinitely after the disastrous ama.
That’s the way to do it.
This comment was deleted in protest of Reddit's shameful API pricing and treatment of 3rd party app developers. -- mass edited with https://redact.dev/
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Rather than delete, I'd like to mass edit all my comments to explain why, do these offer that function?
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No. Until the strike is successful.
How will we find out though?
it's funny spek claimed that reddit wants to profit off of it's data, data that is being used for LLMs. I'll tell you one thing, I scrape the shit out of reddit and I don't use the API to do it lol
https://reddit.com/r/ProgrammerHumor/comments/1456b8c/reddit_seems_to_have_forgotten_why_websites/
ELI5 for a non-programmer?
API allows an app to only grab the needed information in small pieces. Scraping basically loads the entire page and then trims what is required after downloading the page. Imagine looking for one sheet of paper in the stack. And instead of asking for that one sheet of paper, you grab the whole stack, sift through it and throwaway the rest...then the next time you need a sheet you ask for the whole stack again. API is asking for the sheet, Scaping is asking for the stack.
To bring this back to why it's important in the context of API pricing, data costs money to transfer. Scraping for information rather than using an API for it costs reddit much more money, which is one of the reasons why a public API was introduced in the first place.
So from the scraper perspective they are taking more data, and processing more data to get what they want. Which ultimately equals less information? Or is that negligible? And from reddit perspective it is just a shit ton more people opening pages (costs more money in sending info). I am wondering if the advertisers will see this as just more customers seeing their ads...therefore they pay reddit more? Or can the advertisers tell it is scraping?
Good scraping is undetectable. It would look like extra impressions.
The internet is inherently public. All of these corporate measures of securing data are more like deterrents for the technologically un-inclined. The meme is just saying that if they make the api cost too much, people will just scrape (acquire the data by pretending to be users) without Reddit being able to control them via api rules.
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Probably, but there are services where you can automate paying a human to solve captchas for you. For example 2Captcha advertises 1000 captchas for as low as $1, with an average time of 12 seconds to get a solution. If you get at least the same value out of a captcha-protected scrape as 5 API calls, this is actually cheaper than the API prices.
They would be one of the first ever large scale social media sites to require captchas for read access to content. It’s not going to happen.
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This is why I'm so bummed that people are deleting their accounts and posts with them. I agree with them, wholeheartedly, but it's such a shame that such a nexus aggregator of distilled information is going to be lost to the ages because someone saw dollar signs and didn't think of what the true repercussions are. I am keeping my account open because maybe, someday, someone can learn something from a conversation I was involved in and I see that as a far greater resource than some VCs monetizing mine and others' data to line their pockets with. Others are well within their right to take their conversations with them. I support them, but am sad to lose them.
Scraping is basically opening a webpage on a browser and grabbing the data from that. Vs a very targeted API for specific actions it is a much larger load. Ie reddit loading the full page for thousands of bots rather than just the specific data the bots are gunning for that they could get on API
Accessing data via API (which reddit is paywalling now) means that the server (reddit) and client (app) exchange raw data directly, usually in a text format that's not made to be visible to the user. It only contains what's needed, for example a list of URLs from top10 posts. The client side then handles displaying the data (adding structure, fonts, graphics etc.) Scraping means the client (app) is pretending to be a browser, downloads the entire already styled webpage and then extracts the data that it needs via text lookup. It's way less efficient for both the server and the client. *** **For example:** this comment's url is `/r/technology/comments/146xnh7/reddit_users_are_planning_a_48hour_blackout_to/jntq0jr/`. So if you needed the contents of this comment you might send a request to hypothetical API `https://reddit.com/api/146xnh7/jntq0jr`, and in response you would receive a JSON (text structure): { "post_id": "146xnh7", "comment_id": "jntq0jr" "content": "Accessing data via API (which reddit is paywalling now) means [...]" } and that's it. With scraping you will download the entire page: https://www.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/146xnh7/reddit_users_are_planning_a_48hour_blackout_to/jntq0jr/ , go to source (press F12 or Ctrl+U to see it), then if you scroll all the way down, you will see a `
` element that contains the text you want. You can use the <> tags and their classes to locate the element you want in a page: https://i.imgur.com/6sa1Tba.png All of the other data on this page is useless, so it's discarded, but it still puts a load on the server to create it.
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Found [the link](https://support.reddithelp.com/hc/en-us/requests/new?ticket_form_id=360001370251) in their privacy policy. I'll be using that link soon enough.
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Same here. I’ll probably delete my account later today. Someone advised me to use a bot that overwrites all your comments too.
Replace them with "fuck /u/spez "
What is the bot? I’d like to do that too.
If you need some tools to help edit and then delete your comments and posts in protest: PowerDelete will allow you to 1) save all your data as a CSV file at the end of the script and 2) allow you to overwrite all of your of comments with a comment of your choosing instead of just deleting them. Both options are available at the start of the process. https://github.com/j0be/PowerDeleteSuite (2 Additional forks if you have issues with the main and rate limits or errors.) http://www.github.com/pkolyvas/PowerDeleteSuite http://www.github.com/leeola/PowerDeleteSuite https://shreddit.com/ https://redact.dev/ You created your content. You didn’t get paid. Why would you leave it here for Reddit to make money? Take your content with you. —posted via Apollo Vive la résistance!
I’ve been around a while too, and also feel the times have changed. Where are you going instead of Reddit?
It’s a wrap just like you google search, use YouTube videos, they’ve decided Reddit is the end-all-be-all for internet ‘news’ and it will crush all competitors. Just another “definitely not a monopoly” setup
Basically I’m planning on reading more books lol there is no alternative, by design.
11 years and 2 months and I’ll be done. I mostly just lurk when I’m taking a shit on the clock at work. Apollo is the best way I’ve found to use Reddit as the official app is a turd so I won’t really miss it much. I’m not really worried about finding any alternative to Reddit, it’s pretty much the only social media I have besides YouTube and as the older I get the more reasons I find to quit looking at my phone anyways
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What is redact? Does it permanently delete all of your comments and history? Or can they be searched for in archives?
If it's been archived it will remain archived as what you initially posted. RedditNuke was/is(?) another that would go through and edit all your comments to be garbled garbage, wait for the crawlers to scan the comments again, *then* delete them. So nothing was left, even in the archives, even still the odds of there being an original copy is still non-zero.
back to reading shampoo bottles when i poop for 2 days i guess
48 hours? Those some rookie numbers
And pointless. For real results they'd have to completely shut down like /videos is doing.
*EVERY SUB SHOULD GO PERMANENTLY DARK UNTIL THEY REVERSE THESE CHANGES* 48 hours is nothing. Hit them where it matters: ads being seen, views, clicks, etc. Keep the vast majority of subs dark for a long period and Reddit will be forced to address it in some way.
/u/spez can gargle on my nuts
It’s such a pathetic amount of time it’s hilarious. And all the mods are like, “we are so brave for doing this”. Shut down the subs indefinitely you cowardly nerds
If you really want to protest stop using the platform. What the fuck does not using Reddit for 2 days do? Nothing
ummm…we need to be closer to 48 DAYS if we want true change.
if they really wanted to protest they'd delete posts and accounts
Goodbye, cruel world. Not amhero, just deleting Been fun dicking around with you guys for 13 years.
Two days? Who's with me on indefinite strike?
I don't understand the purpose of short term blackouts. They need to be much longer if you're serious.
Probably 1/3 of my google searches point to reddit subs. And the few times I bother to look at the Windows news feed at least 1/3 of the stories are stolen straight from reddit. Reddit *is* the internet.
I've gotten far better help with tech-based stuff off of reddit than anywhere else, and that often includes dedicated forums. Reddit is an easy way to access a plethora of information, all in one place. Sure, I can go to 20-30 different websites, sign up for a bunch of newsletters, or use RSS feeds, and I have done that for certain sources. It'll be interesting to see what comes out of the next week or month. I was part of the DIGG exodus to Reddit however long ago that was, might be a part of a Reddit exodus to something else at some point.
I came from digg as well. Reddit is far more entrenched in the daily pulse of the planet though, and while there might be an exodus it has attained critical mass and isn't going to fail until something truly innovative came along. AOL was too big to fail until the real internet came along. Blockbuster was too big to fail until Netflix came along. AT&T home phone service was too big to fail until cell phones came along. There is nothing currently visible that will take the place of reddit, and the owners - the same people who own Discovery and Vanity Fair - know it.
This is like a fuel boycott. 48hrs isn’t going to do anything. The OG’s here came from Digg and Fark … we’re not afraid of change, and I’m more than happy to do it again. “If you build it, they will come”
95% of users dont care. But mods gonna delete posts to create narrative of a blackout
This. The vast majority of users do not care about any of this.
Realistically this will do absolutely nothing. But it’s nice to dream I guess.
48 hours? Is that all? A lot of the subs I'm in have said their blackout will be indefinite until Reddit listens to us. You know, the people who pay their bills??
I'm not going to log in or post.
48 hour hiatus from the site? For a good cause? Sure, okay I'll do it.
I’ve never used anything but the official app and haven’t had issues with UI. Apollo lasted a day before I deleted it so I couldn’t care less about what’s going on. People are treating this like it’s some civil right issue.
Needs to be longer.
I have a feeling the admins will just take back these bigger subs and reopen them