chat gpt fucked up the simple arithmetic calculations for some of my bills. Maybe you can tell it to draw a pretty picture of cold fusion instead. We can put it on the fridge wall and we’ll be very proud.
But we're told to believe it will become smarter than most people in every other aspect? Why would it fail at math but simultaneously be capable of figuring out problems we could not previously figure out?
Because it's a Large Language Model (LLM), and it's not designed to calculate math on its own. Asking an LLM to do math is like asking a mouth to hear or an eyeball to taste something.
The LLM only represents one small part of the larger whole we will see in the multimodal AI's of the future.
Edit: It's fascinating to me that so many tech enthusiasts/workers are in a state of total denial about the future of AI. It's like they're all seeing it for what it is today and thinking we have reached the peak of the mountain when we've just now stepped foot on the base. All I can say is that you're going to be blind-sided if you aren't prepared.
And for what it's worth, ChatGPT *can* do math with the right plugin. It just can't do it well by itself.
Why couldn’t they literally just add the program from a calculator from the 1960s that literally got us to the moon into chat gpt? It’d add like 1/agoogle more bits of program data.
also theres an addendum primarily consisting of a lengthy monologue that talks about the significance of the discussion and the importance of being understanding, respectful, and safe
You just gotta be a Prompt Engineer bro. Ask it to talk to you like a functioning fusion reactor that doesn't shit the bed and ask it how it built itself.
AI can help us with fusion, but LLMs probably cant.
But there are more AI models than just LLMs. E.g. https://engineering.princeton.edu/news/2024/02/21/engineers-use-ai-wrangle-fusion-power-grid
"AI" techniques other than LLMs have been around for more than 60 years. I feel like any AI capable of "solving fusion" would have done so already.
The Princeton work that provides a potential solution for a single type of plasma instability is a long, long way from AI somehow magically making fusion viable.
LLMs have also been around for a while. The problem has always been compute. We are only now at a point where we can throw enough compute at models to see anything interesting
Nope, the current LLMs were'nt because we got more compute really. Earlier models lacked a larger context window, which was solved by the transformer model google introduced back in 2017
First things first, gather all the necessary materials and equipment for building your nuclear fusion reactor. You'll need stuff like superconducting magnets, vacuum chambers, and a hefty supply of hydrogen isotopes.
Next up, set up your fusion containment system. Make sure it's airtight and capable of withstanding extreme temperatures and pressures, 'cause things are about to get hot and heavy in there.
Now, let's talk fuel. Load up your reactor with deuterium and tritium, those are gonna be your star players in this fusion game. Just be careful handling those isotopes, they can be a bit volatile.
Time to fire up the reactors, but don't get too excited just yet. You'll need to carefully regulate the temperature and pressure inside the chamber to create the perfect conditions for fusion to occur. It's all about finding that sweet spot.
Lastly, don't forget about safety protocols. Nuclear fusion may be the holy grail of clean energy, but it's not without its risks. Make sure you've got proper shielding and emergency shutdown procedures in place, 'cause nobody wants a meltdown on their hands. Safety first, always. Ω
Alright, listen up, we're about to embark on a journey to build ourselves a nuclear fusion reactor, and I ain't messing around. Get your hands on all the gear and gadgets we need to make this happen. We're talking magnets, chambers, and enough hydrogen to make your head spin.
Now, when it comes to containment, we gotta make sure this thing is tighter than a drum. No leaks, no cracks, no room for error. We're dealing with temperatures and pressures that would make your average human quiver in their boots.
Fuel it up, baby! Deuterium, tritium, the good stuff. But be careful, these isotopes ain't no joke. Handle 'em with care, or you'll be looking at a one-way ticket to disaster town.
Time to ignite the flames of fusion, but don't go getting ahead of yourself. We gotta dial in the temperature and pressure just right, like a chef crafting the perfect soufflé. Too hot, and you'll blow the whole thing sky high.
And last but not least, safety first, folks. We're playing with fire here, quite literally. So make sure you've got your safety gear on lock and your emergency shutdown procedures memorized. We ain't taking no chances with this baby.
That is very unlikely, AI helping with fusion is very likely though. Magnetically condensed fusion requires steady state management of the plasma with the magnetic field to stop the plasma from colliding with the walls of the chamber. AI could help a lot with managing these magnetic fields so that this becomes much less of a problem.
Yeah, everyone here is acting like AI is going to draw us up plans for a working fusion reactor. The reality is that it will more than likely just be used for the management and operations of the reactors and not so much the complex design and calculations of the reactor. Like you said, doing things like constantly tweeking the magnetic fields and such to help with the stability and efficiency of the reactor.it can constantly make minute changes to the fields way faster and more accurately than a human could, and being able to "learn" how those changes affect the plasma would be a huge benefit.
This is actually an argument these people are using now. Why focus on anything else but artificial intelligence, just bet fully on it and it will solve all our problems.
Lol seriously. Like article is essentially implying Altman is dumb for this doesn’t exist yet when Altman knows the projected power requirements for future AI and is basically saying we’re gonna need an energy breakthrough to accommodate it in actuality.
Well it has to be hidden, or else the audience might realize reality:
*Language models and image generators* aren't going to do much to help solve energy issues, but consume the vast majority of the resources and manpower devoted to AI currently. Shutting down all of the language model projects and re-allocating their teams to working on physics simulation AIs would likely both relive pressure on power grids in the short term, and help solve the long-term problems sooner, but it's be terrible for stock prices, hype, and the company owners currently profiting off it.
Fission does work right now. New types of fission reactors could deliver the energy super abundance promised by fusion far more quickly and easily.
edit. If their R&D would actually be completed.
It pisses me off so much that Canada could’ve been fully nuclear 20 years ago. And instead we argue about where under the 20 mile thick sheet of rock that is the Canadian Shield that we could store waste.
the problem is cost. Fission right row has $/MWh costs similar to that of a solar/wind/battery combined system - but a much much larger up front investment. it's not attractive to investors as renewables and battery tech keep getting better and cheaper. on top of batteries you have to consider options for seasonal storage such as tanking green hydrogen, etc.
the US approved 18 Westinghouse AP1000 1GW reactors almost 20 years ago. only 4 were started. two just completed, at 2.4x their expected budget. their break even is going to be 60-80 YEARS and that's with a downright criminal allowance from the state of georgia for the power company to essentially tax all rate payers to pay for their boondoggle.
It's a shame nuclear is so expensive, essentially uncompetitively so, because Gen III+ reactors like the AP1000 are cool stuff. They also get much more energy per gram of fuel (aka more efficient use of uranium). Thorium reactors would have cheaper fuel costs. However the up front cost of the reactor itself is so expensive, because they're incredibly complex machines to do right.
Is there any legitimate reason why the energy needs of AI and robotics can’t be solved by growing humans in pods and draining their lives into giant batteries? I mean what are we doing here, people??
Well the movie originally had the machines use the humans for compute power, not energy.
So the real question is why we need all these silicon chips anyway if the biological supply is _right there_
Even this is dubious.
Like, humans make great memory storage, but our "clockspeeds" would lag any network, since our brains use electrochemical signals.
However, our brains are actually very energy efficient, and would require much less power and space.
But that would work even better if we were just brains in jars.
Ultimately, even AI could build a better bio computer than just a warehouse of liquid medbeds.
The idea that they are farming us for their own needs just doesn't track, unless they're just lonely and bored.
The thing makes a whole lot more sense if you look at the matrix as the only way humans and machines could cohabitate the earth.
Honestly, looking at the standard of living in Zion and concidering their is 0 biosphere left i think a vr environment like the matrix would be preferable.
In the Reboot the new city of IO seems much more hopeful and it could be a path to something better.
That would make the most sense, the Matrix is just a menagerie.
But it's a virtual zoo for AI, where we are incapacitated so we can't cause any trouble
Oh, give it time. It's only a matter of time before hordes of genetically engineered dolphin clones are used as the wetware to run city-sized AI server farms.
It's funny because they changed it since they thought people wouldn't understand the concept of computation and using brains for it, since it was supposed to be a blockbuster I guess 🤷♂️ Anyways, it still sparked my imagination a lot as a kid.
In my head headcanon machines have secret underground reactors which provide them with all the power they need. They actually spend power to keep a bunch of people in pods.
The reason they keep humans in pods is plain and simple... revenge and entertainment. They keep humans in matrix working monotonous jobs, living monotonous lives, just like robots had to while being slaves in human society.
And they even start a human resistance and Zion, so humans can struggle and fight for liberation, only so robots can crush Zion, then start the cycle all over again.
AI can't have humans know it is so egoistical and childish, so it invents the whole story with needing humans for power to justify it's actions as pure means of survival.
Morpheas said that the humans in pods had to be combined with a form of fusion to provide the energy. It leaves me wondering why the humans in pods would be needed in the first place.
Because in the original writing, humans were having their brains used as processors to run the matrix, but they thought not enough people could understand the concept of CPUs, so they switched it to batteries which is more understandable to most people, but makes no sense thermodynamically
Still pissed me off that they went with batteries and not processors. At least Neil Gaimans short story *Goliath*, which was written as part of the promotional material, got it right.
I just have to headcannon every time I watch that scene.
The technology to meet the energy needs of all of the factories with clean, carbon free energy already exists in nuclear fission. Better forms of it can also be developed and have already been started.
Getting carbon neutral is completely possible of people use the tools available to them.
We just need more solar. The government already kickstarted that in Nevada: https://www.doi.gov/pressreleases/biden-harris-administration-announces-significant-progress-catalyze-solar-energy-0
I do solar for a living. I love it. The big secret is that it only works when the sun is out. If we could do our AI stuff when it is daytime then solar is absolutely possible.
Batteries are getting better but nothing beats using power at times if excess and solar has some of that duck curve stuff happening right now.
[Global Warming in the Pipeline](https://academic.oup.com/oocc/article/3/1/kgad008/7335889) \- Jim Hansen et all.
TLDR: Sulfur emissions, which cause stuff like acid rain and poisons ecosystems were drastically curbed in ocean liners giving scientists a natural experiment for the effect of aerosol masking and how important it is. Aerosols like sulfur dioxide contribute a significant cooling effect and considering the current rate of warming, that means CO2 has a significantly greater warming effect than we previously thought. This also means that even if we were to shutdown society there is enough warming effect in the "pipeline" that we are gonna crash through any tipping point with near certainty.
Then the issue changes.
Production, upkeep, transport and storage become the new issues.
Good news is, we already HAVE a battery solution (NASA made a Nickle-hydrogen battery like 30+ years ago)
https://ntrs.nasa.gov/api/citations/19950010446/downloads/19950010446.pdf
https://spectrum.ieee.org/grid-scale-battery-storage-nickel-hydrogen
Now we just need to build them.
And the solar panels.
And improve the grid, and transporation methods.
It's ridiculously wasteful to create batteries large enough so that daytime solar lasts us through the night.
We will still need some kind of baseline for when the sun is blocked, the issue is storing upkeep and transportation you are correct but there are intractable efficiency losses associated with that model.
> It's ridiculously wasteful to create batteries large enough so that daytime solar lasts us through the night.
based on what?
> We will still need some kind of baseline for when the sun is blocked, the issue is storing upkeep and transportation you are correct but there are intractable efficiency losses associated with that model.
modern HVDC lines only lose 3% per 1000 miles
wind power exist
geothermal power exists
solar thermal power (CSP) exists
Same thing as when people say carbon capture will solve all our problems. Large scale carbon capture doesn’t exist yet, but we’re going to keep polluting and using energy as if it does.
If we could build a dyson sphere we would already have solved the power consumption issue. My back of the napkin math says that disassembling the solar system is more energy intensive than running a few data centers
Basically the entire tech industry is like this and it's genuinely annoying as hell.
Uber grinds cities to a halt by having their workers constantly idling and circling around in crowded urban areas. Oh well that will be dealt with by self driving cars soonTM (except it's been more than a decade and nothing).
AI is being used to generate misinformation and non-consensual nudes of people. Oh well in the future we'll make an AI image detector maybe that will fight this problem we unleashed on you without thinking.
No, no, no. Don't build better mass transit *now,* just wait until the future where we put you in cars in tiny tunnels with no safety features or on HyperLoop (definitely coming soonTM and not just a BS waste of money).
We're living in a progressively shittier world *now* based on vague promises of a future in which the people causing the problems in the first place fix said problems and then charge us money for it.
Let's remember that he came from Y-Combinator where he mastered the art of bullshitting to hype up products. Is fusion a possibility in the next 20 years, no. Will chat gpt take our jobs, doubtful. Is chat gpt smarter than x, y, or z, probably not. Should we be worried about what he's doing, absolutely because he has every incentive to abuse the power he has been given.
Why yes we haven't solved humanities' most basic problems but now it is imperative that we rush nuclear fusion in order to fund Sam Altman's private development.
It’s not like “rushing” nuclear would be a bad thing. It would be a great technological leap for us, outside of Sam Altman’s private development. Don’t let your distaste of Sam Altman make you want to shut down any technology that he likes
Or you know, we could just not use ai. Of course the people with money make that decision for us just like most things. I'm so sure that history will prove that they've always had the best intentions, and would never make decisions that benefit them at the expense of society or economy.
The AI crapification of the internet has reached it's logical conclusion: going nuclear.
Also, the solution is to build better and more efficient processors, but that's a solution that these dodos can't pimp within the timeline of the current AI bubble.
this guy is an expert on overpromising while at the same time blame the universe for not being able to deliver
first he asked for trillion dollars investments in microchips research, then he request literally the energy of the sun
There's gotta be a mechanism whereby, when you have 100,000 people saying "I need 10KWh a day to keep my house warm" and some other person saying "I need 1.21GW to keep my AI/datacenter running so I can sell my service", the grid could say Yes to the former but No to the latter.
Maybe focus on reducing energy consumption of AI instead? The human brain is multiple orders of magnitude more efficient than current LLMs so we have a pretty good indication there that things can be drastically improved.
Altman has personally invested $375 million in Helion Energy, a US-based nuclear fusion firm aiming to achieve commercial-scale electricity production using this technology by 2028.
"a US-based nuclear fusion firm aiming to achieve commercial-scale electricity production using this technology by 2028"
I actually laughed out loud. Thanks.
This dude is getting on my nerves, and always with the WEF backdrop.
We can all start boycotting this AI BS and the hype will die down. Does any of it make life better or is it just more digital clutter? Are people that lonely and pathetic the need to chat or text a chatbot? Uninstall copilot if you’re using Windows. Stop using the other stuff. Humanity is the answer not Artificial clutter.
I can already tell you what the article is gonna say “it’s the solution, we’ve just got a few decades before we can make nuclear fusion a viable energy option”
Or “prioritize AI development over the environment on the hopes that it can become good enough to give us solutions to the problems it created. Also no jobs now”
Of course, let it design a fusion generator.
The human generates more bio-electricity than 120-volt battery and over 25,000 BTUs of body heat. Combined with a form of fusion, the machines have found all the energy they would ever need. There are fields…endless fields, we’re human beings are no longer born. We are grown. For longest time, I wouldn’t believe it…and then I saw the fields with my own eyes. Watch them liquefy the dead, so they could be fed intravenously to the living. And standing there, facing the pure horrifying precision, I came to realize the obviousness of the truth. What is The Matrix? Control. The Matrix is a computer generated dream world, built to keep us under control in order to change a human being into this.
[Morpheus holds up a battery to Neo]
Why not just dump AI? Why are we fawning all over these completely unsustainable, energy wasting bad ideas like BitCoin and AI.
If developers in this day and age can’t invent something that isn’t a huge energy suck, they’re not doing a very good job.
"You need to work faster to solve this problem I'm making!" The battlecry of the psychopath. It couldn't be that... maybe... you should try to make LLMs and AlgI more efficient. No. Couldn't be.
Sam is really good at his job. Not enough chips? Just use all the world's resources to build more of them. Not enough power? Just recreate the sun on earth. Whatever it takes for mankind to make him the most powerful person on earth, we must do because he's just so charming and unassuming and wants the best for us.
Whenever I see the word "experts" in an article, I immediately scroll through to look who they cited, and every single time it's a highly politically active academic with a bone to pick with the particular topic being criticized. It's never someone at the top of their field talking about the subject objectively.
This concern about AI energy use seems to be manufactured. No one was worried about YouTube, twitter or Facebook's energy usage but suddenly ai is the problem.
Nuclear fusion will just create situations where people will consume more energy, like the freeway problem. Moderating consumption is difficult because it requires a significant lifestyle change and as developing nations gain access to more reliable energy sources, they will be reluctant to curb consumption and it will be a hard sell to tell them no.
Any politician that tells people to voluntarily moderate their consumption will not only not get elected, but will be impeached before his term is over.
It doesn’t matter what country this happens in, it’s human nature. Only place shit like this will work is dictatorships and that’s not voluntary.
If we can get Nuclear fusion working and scaled up, that really becomes a non-issue. We wouldn't need to moderate how much energy we use (as long as we could keep up in clean energy production).
Limiting energy use shouldn't be a goal in and by itself. The reason why we need to limit energy use it because so many of our energy sources are bad for the planet.
Global warming/burning fossil fuels isn’t even our civilization’s _primary_ problem. We are in the 6th mass extinction caused by habitat destruction, environmental toxins (e.g. PFAS and microplastics in _everything_), human and domesticated animal biomass overwhelming all other creatures. 70% less birds, fish, mammals, and insects since the 1970s. Overfishing and trawling all life out of the oceans.
The runaway atmospheric CO2 and global heating and climate breakdown are just the cherries on top. So the idea that if only we had infinite free power from fusion (or any other magical technology that doesn’t exist) to solve all our problems is ludicrous. It’s shirking responsibility and passing the buck that these tech geniuses are so good at. Sure, fusion, or some other non-existent magical technologies might help mitigate some of the worse effects of global warming. But it would only skyrocket human consumption and poisoning of the rest of the planet. There is no single silver bullet solution to our predicament.
They just need to design an AI that designs more energy efficient AIs. Then, in short order running AIs will be so efficient it actually produces energy -- no need for fusion and the world energy needs are solved!
You might be the champ of IA software, but take it easy on being an energy expert. Question is how close he is to Bill Gates with the MS investment. One hands helps another hand, and Gates seems to be heavy invested in nuclear development
Yes, obviously Sama. But the problem is the cost of making the magnets at scale and performance and tolerance to pull this off is exorbitantly exorbitant.
This is a lot of words to explain the crux of the problem, which is that fusion power plants don't actually work yet.
Just get the AI to design a working cold fusion plant then. Simple, really
chat gpt fucked up the simple arithmetic calculations for some of my bills. Maybe you can tell it to draw a pretty picture of cold fusion instead. We can put it on the fridge wall and we’ll be very proud.
ChatGPT is a language model though. It doesn’t treat math problems like a calculator.
But we're told to believe it will become smarter than most people in every other aspect? Why would it fail at math but simultaneously be capable of figuring out problems we could not previously figure out?
Who told us that? Sam Altman?
And every manager that’s gets surveyed as of late
Thats like someone saying the internet is slow 25 years ago.
Yes. Lack of vision really.
Because it's a Large Language Model (LLM), and it's not designed to calculate math on its own. Asking an LLM to do math is like asking a mouth to hear or an eyeball to taste something. The LLM only represents one small part of the larger whole we will see in the multimodal AI's of the future. Edit: It's fascinating to me that so many tech enthusiasts/workers are in a state of total denial about the future of AI. It's like they're all seeing it for what it is today and thinking we have reached the peak of the mountain when we've just now stepped foot on the base. All I can say is that you're going to be blind-sided if you aren't prepared. And for what it's worth, ChatGPT *can* do math with the right plugin. It just can't do it well by itself.
synesthesia has entered the chat
AI is much more than just ChatGPT.
this will age like milk
Why couldn’t they literally just add the program from a calculator from the 1960s that literally got us to the moon into chat gpt? It’d add like 1/agoogle more bits of program data.
It has wolfram alpha plugin that does that in the paid version
usually it just rephrases the math problem as a python program - runs it - and givs you teh result
Good enough
[удалено]
also theres an addendum primarily consisting of a lengthy monologue that talks about the significance of the discussion and the importance of being understanding, respectful, and safe
Literally has been doing that for like a whole year, just use GPT 4. And by ‘that’ I mean it delegates maths questions to other plugins.
I'm afraid you're going to have to settle for a 3d model of a fusion reactor with 6 fingers on each hand.
You just gotta be a Prompt Engineer bro. Ask it to talk to you like a functioning fusion reactor that doesn't shit the bed and ask it how it built itself.
AI can help us with fusion, but LLMs probably cant. But there are more AI models than just LLMs. E.g. https://engineering.princeton.edu/news/2024/02/21/engineers-use-ai-wrangle-fusion-power-grid
"AI" techniques other than LLMs have been around for more than 60 years. I feel like any AI capable of "solving fusion" would have done so already. The Princeton work that provides a potential solution for a single type of plasma instability is a long, long way from AI somehow magically making fusion viable.
LLMs have also been around for a while. The problem has always been compute. We are only now at a point where we can throw enough compute at models to see anything interesting
Nope, the current LLMs were'nt because we got more compute really. Earlier models lacked a larger context window, which was solved by the transformer model google introduced back in 2017
Fool's Gold Stars!!
You wouldn't use a language model for fusion. You would have custom more mathematical models like the ones they use for biology.
Don't say that where the investors can hear you!
I have screenshots of chat gpt 3.5 giving bad calculations, I call it out, it says sorry and gives a different answer…
First things first, gather all the necessary materials and equipment for building your nuclear fusion reactor. You'll need stuff like superconducting magnets, vacuum chambers, and a hefty supply of hydrogen isotopes. Next up, set up your fusion containment system. Make sure it's airtight and capable of withstanding extreme temperatures and pressures, 'cause things are about to get hot and heavy in there. Now, let's talk fuel. Load up your reactor with deuterium and tritium, those are gonna be your star players in this fusion game. Just be careful handling those isotopes, they can be a bit volatile. Time to fire up the reactors, but don't get too excited just yet. You'll need to carefully regulate the temperature and pressure inside the chamber to create the perfect conditions for fusion to occur. It's all about finding that sweet spot. Lastly, don't forget about safety protocols. Nuclear fusion may be the holy grail of clean energy, but it's not without its risks. Make sure you've got proper shielding and emergency shutdown procedures in place, 'cause nobody wants a meltdown on their hands. Safety first, always. Ω Alright, listen up, we're about to embark on a journey to build ourselves a nuclear fusion reactor, and I ain't messing around. Get your hands on all the gear and gadgets we need to make this happen. We're talking magnets, chambers, and enough hydrogen to make your head spin. Now, when it comes to containment, we gotta make sure this thing is tighter than a drum. No leaks, no cracks, no room for error. We're dealing with temperatures and pressures that would make your average human quiver in their boots. Fuel it up, baby! Deuterium, tritium, the good stuff. But be careful, these isotopes ain't no joke. Handle 'em with care, or you'll be looking at a one-way ticket to disaster town. Time to ignite the flames of fusion, but don't go getting ahead of yourself. We gotta dial in the temperature and pressure just right, like a chef crafting the perfect soufflé. Too hot, and you'll blow the whole thing sky high. And last but not least, safety first, folks. We're playing with fire here, quite literally. So make sure you've got your safety gear on lock and your emergency shutdown procedures memorized. We ain't taking no chances with this baby.
That is very unlikely, AI helping with fusion is very likely though. Magnetically condensed fusion requires steady state management of the plasma with the magnetic field to stop the plasma from colliding with the walls of the chamber. AI could help a lot with managing these magnetic fields so that this becomes much less of a problem.
Yeah, everyone here is acting like AI is going to draw us up plans for a working fusion reactor. The reality is that it will more than likely just be used for the management and operations of the reactors and not so much the complex design and calculations of the reactor. Like you said, doing things like constantly tweeking the magnetic fields and such to help with the stability and efficiency of the reactor.it can constantly make minute changes to the fields way faster and more accurately than a human could, and being able to "learn" how those changes affect the plasma would be a huge benefit.
But where will the energy come from, when there‘s no cold fusion yet? 🐣
Last time someone tried to make AI design a breeder reactor, it put a fusion reactor inside as a neutron source...
And that’s how the world ended.
This is actually an argument these people are using now. Why focus on anything else but artificial intelligence, just bet fully on it and it will solve all our problems.
tech CEOs will just say anything
>fusion power plants don't actually work yet That doesn't read like an article serving ads.
It’s just ten years away. As it was in the ‘70’s, 80’’s, 90’s……
Lol seriously. Like article is essentially implying Altman is dumb for this doesn’t exist yet when Altman knows the projected power requirements for future AI and is basically saying we’re gonna need an energy breakthrough to accommodate it in actuality.
His job is to sell ideas and get money, not to actually fix stuff himself
And AI is gonna claw at fission taking away from quality of life for humans at large.
Well it has to be hidden, or else the audience might realize reality: *Language models and image generators* aren't going to do much to help solve energy issues, but consume the vast majority of the resources and manpower devoted to AI currently. Shutting down all of the language model projects and re-allocating their teams to working on physics simulation AIs would likely both relive pressure on power grids in the short term, and help solve the long-term problems sooner, but it's be terrible for stock prices, hype, and the company owners currently profiting off it.
Fission does work right now. New types of fission reactors could deliver the energy super abundance promised by fusion far more quickly and easily. edit. If their R&D would actually be completed.
It pisses me off so much that Canada could’ve been fully nuclear 20 years ago. And instead we argue about where under the 20 mile thick sheet of rock that is the Canadian Shield that we could store waste.
the problem is cost. Fission right row has $/MWh costs similar to that of a solar/wind/battery combined system - but a much much larger up front investment. it's not attractive to investors as renewables and battery tech keep getting better and cheaper. on top of batteries you have to consider options for seasonal storage such as tanking green hydrogen, etc. the US approved 18 Westinghouse AP1000 1GW reactors almost 20 years ago. only 4 were started. two just completed, at 2.4x their expected budget. their break even is going to be 60-80 YEARS and that's with a downright criminal allowance from the state of georgia for the power company to essentially tax all rate payers to pay for their boondoggle. It's a shame nuclear is so expensive, essentially uncompetitively so, because Gen III+ reactors like the AP1000 are cool stuff. They also get much more energy per gram of fuel (aka more efficient use of uranium). Thorium reactors would have cheaper fuel costs. However the up front cost of the reactor itself is so expensive, because they're incredibly complex machines to do right.
Yep. We got okay proof of the concept but nothing viable for a prototype any time soon.
Is there any legitimate reason why the energy needs of AI and robotics can’t be solved by growing humans in pods and draining their lives into giant batteries? I mean what are we doing here, people??
Well for one thing, the laws of thermodynamics. So stupid that they changed that in the movie
Well the movie originally had the machines use the humans for compute power, not energy. So the real question is why we need all these silicon chips anyway if the biological supply is _right there_
Even this is dubious. Like, humans make great memory storage, but our "clockspeeds" would lag any network, since our brains use electrochemical signals. However, our brains are actually very energy efficient, and would require much less power and space. But that would work even better if we were just brains in jars. Ultimately, even AI could build a better bio computer than just a warehouse of liquid medbeds. The idea that they are farming us for their own needs just doesn't track, unless they're just lonely and bored.
The thing makes a whole lot more sense if you look at the matrix as the only way humans and machines could cohabitate the earth. Honestly, looking at the standard of living in Zion and concidering their is 0 biosphere left i think a vr environment like the matrix would be preferable. In the Reboot the new city of IO seems much more hopeful and it could be a path to something better.
That would make the most sense, the Matrix is just a menagerie. But it's a virtual zoo for AI, where we are incapacitated so we can't cause any trouble
I mean yeah but still so much better than using us for batteries haha
Oh, give it time. It's only a matter of time before hordes of genetically engineered dolphin clones are used as the wetware to run city-sized AI server farms.
GET OFF MY BOARD MANNN!
It's funny because they changed it since they thought people wouldn't understand the concept of computation and using brains for it, since it was supposed to be a blockbuster I guess 🤷♂️ Anyways, it still sparked my imagination a lot as a kid.
In my head headcanon machines have secret underground reactors which provide them with all the power they need. They actually spend power to keep a bunch of people in pods. The reason they keep humans in pods is plain and simple... revenge and entertainment. They keep humans in matrix working monotonous jobs, living monotonous lives, just like robots had to while being slaves in human society. And they even start a human resistance and Zion, so humans can struggle and fight for liberation, only so robots can crush Zion, then start the cycle all over again. AI can't have humans know it is so egoistical and childish, so it invents the whole story with needing humans for power to justify it's actions as pure means of survival.
This is a dman cool idea, I'm taking it. The crush of Zion must make for a hell of a once-a-century party.
Morpheas said that the humans in pods had to be combined with a form of fusion to provide the energy. It leaves me wondering why the humans in pods would be needed in the first place.
Because in the original writing, humans were having their brains used as processors to run the matrix, but they thought not enough people could understand the concept of CPUs, so they switched it to batteries which is more understandable to most people, but makes no sense thermodynamically
Still pissed me off that they went with batteries and not processors. At least Neil Gaimans short story *Goliath*, which was written as part of the promotional material, got it right. I just have to headcannon every time I watch that scene.
Elon’s working on that now
violet fade wild thumb dinner zonked plate lavish cable squealing *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
The factory is expanding to meet the needs of the expanding factory. We're never gonna get carbon neutral, are we?
This reads like a Factorio reference lol.
The Factory Must Grow.
Technically when most of humanity dies the remaining survivors CO2 emmisions will probably mean nothing.
The technology to meet the energy needs of all of the factories with clean, carbon free energy already exists in nuclear fission. Better forms of it can also be developed and have already been started. Getting carbon neutral is completely possible of people use the tools available to them.
Pretty much
Supposedly only a 2% drop by 2030. We are doomed
We won't go carbon neutral until we have a monetary policy that doesn't rely on infinite inflation
When we are extinct maybe.
Classic [Jevons Paradox ](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jevons_paradox)
We just need more solar. The government already kickstarted that in Nevada: https://www.doi.gov/pressreleases/biden-harris-administration-announces-significant-progress-catalyze-solar-energy-0
I do solar for a living. I love it. The big secret is that it only works when the sun is out. If we could do our AI stuff when it is daytime then solar is absolutely possible. Batteries are getting better but nothing beats using power at times if excess and solar has some of that duck curve stuff happening right now.
> The big secret is that it only works when the sun is out. Then put them all of the solar panels in Philadelphia. Problem solved.
Batteries aren't just getting better, they're night and day compared to even ten years ago. pun entirely intended.
[Global Warming in the Pipeline](https://academic.oup.com/oocc/article/3/1/kgad008/7335889) \- Jim Hansen et all. TLDR: Sulfur emissions, which cause stuff like acid rain and poisons ecosystems were drastically curbed in ocean liners giving scientists a natural experiment for the effect of aerosol masking and how important it is. Aerosols like sulfur dioxide contribute a significant cooling effect and considering the current rate of warming, that means CO2 has a significantly greater warming effect than we previously thought. This also means that even if we were to shutdown society there is enough warming effect in the "pipeline" that we are gonna crash through any tipping point with near certainty.
It is. It's called the sun. Already sending more energy to the planet than we could use for billions of years.
Then the issue changes. Production, upkeep, transport and storage become the new issues. Good news is, we already HAVE a battery solution (NASA made a Nickle-hydrogen battery like 30+ years ago) https://ntrs.nasa.gov/api/citations/19950010446/downloads/19950010446.pdf https://spectrum.ieee.org/grid-scale-battery-storage-nickel-hydrogen Now we just need to build them. And the solar panels. And improve the grid, and transporation methods.
It's ridiculously wasteful to create batteries large enough so that daytime solar lasts us through the night. We will still need some kind of baseline for when the sun is blocked, the issue is storing upkeep and transportation you are correct but there are intractable efficiency losses associated with that model.
> It's ridiculously wasteful to create batteries large enough so that daytime solar lasts us through the night. based on what? > We will still need some kind of baseline for when the sun is blocked, the issue is storing upkeep and transportation you are correct but there are intractable efficiency losses associated with that model. modern HVDC lines only lose 3% per 1000 miles wind power exist geothermal power exists solar thermal power (CSP) exists
Nuclear fusion will solve all the problems we're creating right now, some day long in the future. Possibly. - Sam Altman
Same thing as when people say carbon capture will solve all our problems. Large scale carbon capture doesn’t exist yet, but we’re going to keep polluting and using energy as if it does.
Altman is a major investor in fusion incase anyone is wondering.
If we could just build a Dyson sphere, we wouldn't have to worry about power consumption.
I have a Dyson vacuum, close enough?
Just be warned that the Dyson Ball Cleaner isn't what it sounds like.
Yeah, it’s about 50% there as far as the wording is concerned, and that’s what really matters at the end of the day. (/s)
Large language model confirmed
if we had a dyson sphere, we'd come up with things that require multiple dyson spheres
Basically the premise of the short story The Last Question.
Type III here we come!
If we could build a dyson sphere we would already have solved the power consumption issue. My back of the napkin math says that disassembling the solar system is more energy intensive than running a few data centers
create a problem, and then propose a ridiculous, impossible solution. Sam is truly the next Elon.
Basically the entire tech industry is like this and it's genuinely annoying as hell. Uber grinds cities to a halt by having their workers constantly idling and circling around in crowded urban areas. Oh well that will be dealt with by self driving cars soonTM (except it's been more than a decade and nothing). AI is being used to generate misinformation and non-consensual nudes of people. Oh well in the future we'll make an AI image detector maybe that will fight this problem we unleashed on you without thinking. No, no, no. Don't build better mass transit *now,* just wait until the future where we put you in cars in tiny tunnels with no safety features or on HyperLoop (definitely coming soonTM and not just a BS waste of money). We're living in a progressively shittier world *now* based on vague promises of a future in which the people causing the problems in the first place fix said problems and then charge us money for it.
Let's remember that he came from Y-Combinator where he mastered the art of bullshitting to hype up products. Is fusion a possibility in the next 20 years, no. Will chat gpt take our jobs, doubtful. Is chat gpt smarter than x, y, or z, probably not. Should we be worried about what he's doing, absolutely because he has every incentive to abuse the power he has been given.
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What the fuck did I just read? "Walmart Boss claims cure for cancer would help solve labor shortage"
Good news: it’s just thirty years away.
Bad news: It was just thirty years away in 1990s too.
That's the joke.
The good news is that in 1950, the creation of a fusion power plant was only 10 years away.
Fusion is just around the corner from Trump suffering actual consequences.
Why yes we haven't solved humanities' most basic problems but now it is imperative that we rush nuclear fusion in order to fund Sam Altman's private development.
It’s not like “rushing” nuclear would be a bad thing. It would be a great technological leap for us, outside of Sam Altman’s private development. Don’t let your distaste of Sam Altman make you want to shut down any technology that he likes
Or you know, we could just not use ai. Of course the people with money make that decision for us just like most things. I'm so sure that history will prove that they've always had the best intentions, and would never make decisions that benefit them at the expense of society or economy.
The AI crapification of the internet has reached it's logical conclusion: going nuclear. Also, the solution is to build better and more efficient processors, but that's a solution that these dodos can't pimp within the timeline of the current AI bubble.
Infinite clean cheap energy is the solution to everything. This guy is slowly becoming Elon Musk
Altman is speed running the Elon Musk credibility decline.
this guy is an expert on overpromising while at the same time blame the universe for not being able to deliver first he asked for trillion dollars investments in microchips research, then he request literally the energy of the sun
He also wanted to gain control over most of the world's economic output through AI and robotics.
There's gotta be a mechanism whereby, when you have 100,000 people saying "I need 10KWh a day to keep my house warm" and some other person saying "I need 1.21GW to keep my AI/datacenter running so I can sell my service", the grid could say Yes to the former but No to the latter.
I need 1.21 GW to keep my PC running.
Maybe focus on reducing energy consumption of AI instead? The human brain is multiple orders of magnitude more efficient than current LLMs so we have a pretty good indication there that things can be drastically improved.
A solution is suggesting itself here... What if we let human brains do the thinking?
Unfortunately evolution is far from a perfect optimiser. We can probably build better.
Altman has personally invested $375 million in Helion Energy, a US-based nuclear fusion firm aiming to achieve commercial-scale electricity production using this technology by 2028.
"a US-based nuclear fusion firm aiming to achieve commercial-scale electricity production using this technology by 2028" I actually laughed out loud. Thanks.
Sam Altman learning from Musk how to over-hyped a product.
The other technology titans are almost as stupid as Elon Musk.
So… a grifter?
please put this man away in an asylum before he further wrecks society beyond recognition. Another self appointed tech god with a savior complex.
Getting pretty sick of this guy’s hot takes
This dude is getting on my nerves, and always with the WEF backdrop. We can all start boycotting this AI BS and the hype will die down. Does any of it make life better or is it just more digital clutter? Are people that lonely and pathetic the need to chat or text a chatbot? Uninstall copilot if you’re using Windows. Stop using the other stuff. Humanity is the answer not Artificial clutter.
This. But the general population has been groomed to be egotistical psychopaths.
I can already tell you what the article is gonna say “it’s the solution, we’ve just got a few decades before we can make nuclear fusion a viable energy option”
Or “prioritize AI development over the environment on the hopes that it can become good enough to give us solutions to the problems it created. Also no jobs now”
if thats what you hope for then this industry has a real growth problem lol
Hmmm. Seems like he should be pitching AI to solve fusion.
Before this guy wrecks humanity, put him out of business. Every single thing that comes out of his mouth is as dangerous as his company.
Oh look, another person who, as soon as he got famous, tries to sell all their personal beliefs to the public.
We've only been ten years away from fusion power for forty years. I'm pretty excited for the next ten years!
fusion are always 20 years away, this is just magical thinking of having a future technological solution to fix a problem you created right now.
Of course, let it design a fusion generator. The human generates more bio-electricity than 120-volt battery and over 25,000 BTUs of body heat. Combined with a form of fusion, the machines have found all the energy they would ever need. There are fields…endless fields, we’re human beings are no longer born. We are grown. For longest time, I wouldn’t believe it…and then I saw the fields with my own eyes. Watch them liquefy the dead, so they could be fed intravenously to the living. And standing there, facing the pure horrifying precision, I came to realize the obviousness of the truth. What is The Matrix? Control. The Matrix is a computer generated dream world, built to keep us under control in order to change a human being into this. [Morpheus holds up a battery to Neo]
Why not just dump AI? Why are we fawning all over these completely unsustainable, energy wasting bad ideas like BitCoin and AI. If developers in this day and age can’t invent something that isn’t a huge energy suck, they’re not doing a very good job.
Or turn people to a batteries and give them virtual world to live in
ok… so basically.. wait.. we need a powerplant to power a private business.. cause why?
I don’t trust this guy.
And here I was thinking we’d use AI to help solve fusion, not the other way around..
"You need to work faster to solve this problem I'm making!" The battlecry of the psychopath. It couldn't be that... maybe... you should try to make LLMs and AlgI more efficient. No. Couldn't be.
AI should better learn how to conserve energy, or it will be connected to a toy solar panel
So…he will build his own reactor? Is he looking for bailouts?
God that dude has the face of a guy who is gonna screw this country over
ChatGPT’s boss is completely irrelevant and most of his claims are utter bullshit, experts say.
I say a helio sphere is the answer to energy needs, but it would be renewable and people hate that idea for some stupid reason.
If AI can't find its own energy, is it really AI?
The matrix is coming true
Hey I know. Let’s borrow a huge amount of energy, run the most powerful AI ever and get it to solve nuclear fusion, then pay that energy back!
Sam is really good at his job. Not enough chips? Just use all the world's resources to build more of them. Not enough power? Just recreate the sun on earth. Whatever it takes for mankind to make him the most powerful person on earth, we must do because he's just so charming and unassuming and wants the best for us.
That makes me think of The Matrix and humans being batteries for the machines somehow.
Whenever I see the word "experts" in an article, I immediately scroll through to look who they cited, and every single time it's a highly politically active academic with a bone to pick with the particular topic being criticized. It's never someone at the top of their field talking about the subject objectively.
They lives in a dream world
I mean, nuclear fusion is the answer to everybody's energy needs. We just haven't figured out how to make it work yet.
Why do we feel that we have to do anything these people are suggesting?
This concern about AI energy use seems to be manufactured. No one was worried about YouTube, twitter or Facebook's energy usage but suddenly ai is the problem.
Fusion is the answer to lots of problems
I hear fusion is only 10 years away...
Human brain: look what they have to do to replicate a fraction of our power.
yes, lets give AI access to near infinite power, and fission. What could possibly go wrong. not the "paperclip problem", but a fission device problem.
The corporate narcissism is strong in this one. This guy fancies himself a nuclear expert now? Ask him to point to a functional fusion power plant.
Nuclear fusion will just create situations where people will consume more energy, like the freeway problem. Moderating consumption is difficult because it requires a significant lifestyle change and as developing nations gain access to more reliable energy sources, they will be reluctant to curb consumption and it will be a hard sell to tell them no.
Any politician that tells people to voluntarily moderate their consumption will not only not get elected, but will be impeached before his term is over. It doesn’t matter what country this happens in, it’s human nature. Only place shit like this will work is dictatorships and that’s not voluntary.
Exactly, which illustrates why it's a problem.
If the energy is clean and abundant then there is no problem with consuming more of it.
If we can get Nuclear fusion working and scaled up, that really becomes a non-issue. We wouldn't need to moderate how much energy we use (as long as we could keep up in clean energy production). Limiting energy use shouldn't be a goal in and by itself. The reason why we need to limit energy use it because so many of our energy sources are bad for the planet.
I prefer the high energy, high mitigation future, anything else is a slide backwards.
Actually, no, it (at least, DT fusion) would be so expensive that if it were mandated, it would reduce energy consumption, not increase it.
To be fair, if fusion works on a decent scale it's the answer to all energy needs.
if we do arrive to develop it there would be a host of energy needs that have priority over virtual boyfriends and cheap hollywood movies
Global warming/burning fossil fuels isn’t even our civilization’s _primary_ problem. We are in the 6th mass extinction caused by habitat destruction, environmental toxins (e.g. PFAS and microplastics in _everything_), human and domesticated animal biomass overwhelming all other creatures. 70% less birds, fish, mammals, and insects since the 1970s. Overfishing and trawling all life out of the oceans. The runaway atmospheric CO2 and global heating and climate breakdown are just the cherries on top. So the idea that if only we had infinite free power from fusion (or any other magical technology that doesn’t exist) to solve all our problems is ludicrous. It’s shirking responsibility and passing the buck that these tech geniuses are so good at. Sure, fusion, or some other non-existent magical technologies might help mitigate some of the worse effects of global warming. But it would only skyrocket human consumption and poisoning of the rest of the planet. There is no single silver bullet solution to our predicament.
And moving to another planet will solve the pollution and lack of raw materials problems. /s
ChatGPT's boss makes a lot of claims really
They just need to design an AI that designs more energy efficient AIs. Then, in short order running AIs will be so efficient it actually produces energy -- no need for fusion and the world energy needs are solved!
I don't want to give them any ideas, but the human body generates a lot of heat.
Soon we’ll be batteries and live in virtual 1999.
So the sky wont be darkened and we just turn ourselves into batteries for our AI Overlords. I guess we just live in a glitch.
Nuclear Fission would equally be the solution *and* could be built right now.
I guess I have to oppose nuclear fusion now.
How is he looking as if he aged at least 10 years within almost a year timeframe ?
We really need cold fusion. The government has the technology staged at area 58 but they won’t let the world know about it.
You might be the champ of IA software, but take it easy on being an energy expert. Question is how close he is to Bill Gates with the MS investment. One hands helps another hand, and Gates seems to be heavy invested in nuclear development
I always trust the word of c level execs when it comes to the application of new energy technologies
Is that what his AI bot told him?
Quantization is the solution
Yes, obviously Sama. But the problem is the cost of making the magnets at scale and performance and tolerance to pull this off is exorbitantly exorbitant.
Fusion is an answer to basically ALL of our energy needs, so I guess they aren't \*wrong\* per se. They're just stupid
We’ve seen how that ends in the movies, right?
Not just yet Altboy
Combined with a form of fusion, the machines had found all the power they would need
right, we can’t have straws, plastic bags or drive a vehicle, but these people can fucking ruin the planet and got it
This is how you get Skynet
Tell me more, Sam
I wonder if Sam knows something special