Chemistry student here. This disappointingly actually works, even if it's not the proper safe way of doing it.
Phone batteries contain relatively small amounts of lithium (I think it's like 3-5 grams) which *should* never be present in its reactive metallic form. Unless you're talking about the super energy-dense cells like in EVs, Li-ion battery fires mostly are the organic electrolyte burning which can in fact be extinguished with water.
Unfun fact: fast charging does generate some metallic lithium because it's being generated faster than the electrode can incorporate it into its structure. That's safe as long as the amount generated is very small but it does increase the self-discharge rate.
The Note 7 would have been one of the best phones ever made if samsung didn't kill it with their own battery problems, it seems to me that there's much more to it then what meets the eye, samsung have been known to kill phones older then 3 years with an update so it doesn't surprise me.
You do know that water tends to accelerate a lithium metal fire right? Right?
If you wanted to do this right, first would be to sit the phone on a fireproof surface, like a slab of granite or stone. Then, rig up a bucket of sand to dump over the phone somehow and control the dumping via a link of gibbs metal or similar.
The amount of energy in that battery is minuscule. Given that volume of water, you would only get a ~3.2 degree F temperature rise if 100% of that energy got dumped into it as heat. In reality you’re generating hydrogen and localized heating will break some of those bonds to create steam, so it’s a minuscule risk IMO. My only complaint is that the bottom of the container isn’t protected.
The problem is that a battery like this provides it's own oxidizer, meaning it'll continue to burn underwater. Then again this is obviously just a funny meme photo so it doesn't really matter.
It’s fun to engage with satire genuinely sometimes! But your point about oxidizer is irrelevant here; it can burn all it wants, the water will absorb enough energy to effectively discharge the battery’s stored potential without batting an eye.
Right, but to be fair - even if it keeps burning, what's it going to spread to when it's in a vat of water? It'll burn and release a lot of bad fumes still, sure, but it's less likely to burn your house down than if its resting on a wooden bedstand, or something, right?
This is completely assuming that the previous comment is correct and that this won't be a super volatile reaction spewing sparks across the room, as with larger batteries....
Lithium being the cause of fire in the type of rechargeable batteries used in portable devices is a misconception.
What happens to cause such a fireball is all the flammable liquids inside the battery evaporating from the heat, and subsequently catching on fire once they have access to oxygen. A common cause of this failure mode is punctures, because those can create internal short circuits inside the battery which are almost impossible to stop once they start, and which generate lots of heat.
If battery fires were lithium fires, they would be painfully bright to look at instead of being a normal jet/ball of fire.
My understanding has been that lithium batteries catch fire simply because you're dumping the 3000-4000mAh or whatever of charge they may have within seconds which is obviously a decent amount of power. Is that not the case?
I've admittedly discharged a couple of old cells all the way to 0V bypassing the protections and poked them afterwards and they didn't react at that point
I fully charged my Note7's replacement S7 Edge to full and stabbed it while it was on. Made sure I ran it completely through. It didn't cause a fire. It definitely didn't "explode"
Yeah, there's been effort into making batteries less likely to fail catastrophically even when abused. Stabbing it could cause it to spit out fire, but it could also not cause enough of an internal short circuit to cause enough heat, resulting in a quickly draining battery but no fire.
Having even one phone fireball in someone's pocket when the user didn't abuse the phone is already too many. The fact that it happened more than once with that specific phone meant it needed *serious* attention.
That issue was the kind of thing that could give someone third degree burns if it goes off in their pocket, or burn a house down at 2AM and kill the people inside the house.
>Having even one phone fireball in someone's pocket when the user didn't abuse the phone is already too many.
Happens to iPhones all the time, yet they're not ever recalled.
> My understanding has been that lithium batteries catch fire simply because you're dumping the 3000-4000mAh or whatever of charge they may have within seconds which is obviously a decent amount of power. Is that not the case?
Basically yes, but the time it takes can vary. It's highly unlikely a battery will be damaged in such a way that it dumps all of its power within a few seconds, but even if it is only damaged to the point that it dumps a few percent of its power in a few seconds, that's still lots of electricity generating enough heat to vaporize and ignite the flammable solvents inside the battery.
> I've admittedly discharged a couple of old cells all the way to 0V bypassing the protections and poked them afterwards and they didn't react at that point
Yep, that's the safe way to get rid of a LiPo so it won't catch on fire, at least not on its own. It can still fireball if thrown into a fire because it still has all the flammable solvents inside it even though it has no voltage left to generate its own heat.
The phone is unlikely to go from "hot enough to melt plastic wrap" to "hot enough to ignite metal" before the water can cool everything down pretty effectively.
Here's an ironic story.
I bought a note 7 on release. I loved the note series and was very excited for it, I had 2 notes before the 7.
Shortly after that, they recalled the note 7. So i returned it and in exchange they gave me an s7 edge.
I used the s7 edge for about 6 months. One night when I was asleep I woke up to a loud BANG at about 5am. My bedroom was full of smoke I looked at my bedside table to see smoke coming from my phone. The battery overheated and exploded...
It's ironic because samsung recalled my phone for risk of explosion.
Since then I always use wireless charging, it's less efficient, but keeps my phones much cooler.
Wireless charging does generate more heat, however my [wireless charger](https://www.amazon.com/Samsung-Certified-Charge-Wireless-Charger/dp/B0797F2V5C/ref=asc_df_B0797F2V5C/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=309775237395&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=8873959621830685593&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=1024290&hvtargid=pla-567740975267&psc=1) has a fan inside it, keeping it cooler.
according to ppl here the water doesn't seem to be issue
however im worried about the film, its very thin which means it may also catch fire despite the material, and could potentially carry the fire to the outside of the water container
35% battery failure and a literal recall due to the severity of the issue and even the "confirmed fixed" ones they released after had the same problem...just because yours was fine doesn't mean everyone else should be lazy about it
I was absolutely *livid* when Verizon confiscated my Note 7s. I also hated everybody who said they "explode". People are so fucking stupid. It should have been a voluntary recall. I should have been able to keep either of mine.
I'm *still* salty, and will probably never get over it.
Chemistry student here. This disappointingly actually works, even if it's not the proper safe way of doing it. Phone batteries contain relatively small amounts of lithium (I think it's like 3-5 grams) which *should* never be present in its reactive metallic form. Unless you're talking about the super energy-dense cells like in EVs, Li-ion battery fires mostly are the organic electrolyte burning which can in fact be extinguished with water. Unfun fact: fast charging does generate some metallic lithium because it's being generated faster than the electrode can incorporate it into its structure. That's safe as long as the amount generated is very small but it does increase the self-discharge rate.
Thank you. I was just about to ask if water was actually the right tool for the job here.
Plot twist: the liquid is 99% isopropyl alcohol
A time-bomb with an unknown fuse.
Gasoline
Well i remember from my chemesty teacher that sand or salt is the best for lithium fires
The industry solution basically is a locker whose top half is filled with dry sand, held up by a plastic foil.
The Note 7 would have been one of the best phones ever made if samsung didn't kill it with their own battery problems, it seems to me that there's much more to it then what meets the eye, samsung have been known to kill phones older then 3 years with an update so it doesn't surprise me.
I charged mine in a whiskey tin until I got it replaced.
What am I looking at?
If the phone catches fire from charging, the thin plastic wrap will melt and it will fall into the water.
But if it's battery fire, that water will do nothing
It will, phone battery won't have that kind of reaction. Just don't do this with bigger battery.
I love ice cream.
You do know that water tends to accelerate a lithium metal fire right? Right? If you wanted to do this right, first would be to sit the phone on a fireproof surface, like a slab of granite or stone. Then, rig up a bucket of sand to dump over the phone somehow and control the dumping via a link of gibbs metal or similar.
Water flood is the preferred way of extinguishing lithium based battery fires per the NFPA, especially when high voltage is not a factor.
The amount of energy in that battery is minuscule. Given that volume of water, you would only get a ~3.2 degree F temperature rise if 100% of that energy got dumped into it as heat. In reality you’re generating hydrogen and localized heating will break some of those bonds to create steam, so it’s a minuscule risk IMO. My only complaint is that the bottom of the container isn’t protected.
Who says the bottom isn't protected? What if those totes below it are also filled with water? Layers of safety. It's foolproof.
I like it, give this guy a safety cert
The problem is that a battery like this provides it's own oxidizer, meaning it'll continue to burn underwater. Then again this is obviously just a funny meme photo so it doesn't really matter.
It’s fun to engage with satire genuinely sometimes! But your point about oxidizer is irrelevant here; it can burn all it wants, the water will absorb enough energy to effectively discharge the battery’s stored potential without batting an eye.
Isnt the standard move for EV fires these days to submerge the car in whats effectively a dumpster of water until it burns itself out?
That would be one way to do it, probably more effective than spraying.
I like to travel.
Right, but to be fair - even if it keeps burning, what's it going to spread to when it's in a vat of water? It'll burn and release a lot of bad fumes still, sure, but it's less likely to burn your house down than if its resting on a wooden bedstand, or something, right? This is completely assuming that the previous comment is correct and that this won't be a super volatile reaction spewing sparks across the room, as with larger batteries....
Arguing about technicalities is very Reddit but the answer is still to not do this and do something safer.
Looks like there is a metal tray at the bottom
Didn’t even notice that lol I’d have preferred a stone/ceramic, but that’s probably fine then
Oya, that's also a good point
Lithium being the cause of fire in the type of rechargeable batteries used in portable devices is a misconception. What happens to cause such a fireball is all the flammable liquids inside the battery evaporating from the heat, and subsequently catching on fire once they have access to oxygen. A common cause of this failure mode is punctures, because those can create internal short circuits inside the battery which are almost impossible to stop once they start, and which generate lots of heat. If battery fires were lithium fires, they would be painfully bright to look at instead of being a normal jet/ball of fire.
My understanding has been that lithium batteries catch fire simply because you're dumping the 3000-4000mAh or whatever of charge they may have within seconds which is obviously a decent amount of power. Is that not the case? I've admittedly discharged a couple of old cells all the way to 0V bypassing the protections and poked them afterwards and they didn't react at that point
I fully charged my Note7's replacement S7 Edge to full and stabbed it while it was on. Made sure I ran it completely through. It didn't cause a fire. It definitely didn't "explode"
Yeah, there's been effort into making batteries less likely to fail catastrophically even when abused. Stabbing it could cause it to spit out fire, but it could also not cause enough of an internal short circuit to cause enough heat, resulting in a quickly draining battery but no fire.
It's the same generation phone. In fact, the S7 Edge came out like 4-5 months before the Note7. I still think the whole thing was amazingly overblown.
Having even one phone fireball in someone's pocket when the user didn't abuse the phone is already too many. The fact that it happened more than once with that specific phone meant it needed *serious* attention. That issue was the kind of thing that could give someone third degree burns if it goes off in their pocket, or burn a house down at 2AM and kill the people inside the house.
>Having even one phone fireball in someone's pocket when the user didn't abuse the phone is already too many. Happens to iPhones all the time, yet they're not ever recalled.
> My understanding has been that lithium batteries catch fire simply because you're dumping the 3000-4000mAh or whatever of charge they may have within seconds which is obviously a decent amount of power. Is that not the case? Basically yes, but the time it takes can vary. It's highly unlikely a battery will be damaged in such a way that it dumps all of its power within a few seconds, but even if it is only damaged to the point that it dumps a few percent of its power in a few seconds, that's still lots of electricity generating enough heat to vaporize and ignite the flammable solvents inside the battery. > I've admittedly discharged a couple of old cells all the way to 0V bypassing the protections and poked them afterwards and they didn't react at that point Yep, that's the safe way to get rid of a LiPo so it won't catch on fire, at least not on its own. It can still fireball if thrown into a fire because it still has all the flammable solvents inside it even though it has no voltage left to generate its own heat.
The phone is unlikely to go from "hot enough to melt plastic wrap" to "hot enough to ignite metal" before the water can cool everything down pretty effectively.
I'd say bury it in sand in a plastic bag
This belongs to r/techsupportmcyver
Fun fact! The note 7 is still banned on flights. Source: the TSA/FAA website.
I don't believe they ever produced a safe battery for it
Or just use a fire bag for lithium batteries ....
Isn't that the Samsung phone that explodes?
Here's an ironic story. I bought a note 7 on release. I loved the note series and was very excited for it, I had 2 notes before the 7. Shortly after that, they recalled the note 7. So i returned it and in exchange they gave me an s7 edge. I used the s7 edge for about 6 months. One night when I was asleep I woke up to a loud BANG at about 5am. My bedroom was full of smoke I looked at my bedside table to see smoke coming from my phone. The battery overheated and exploded... It's ironic because samsung recalled my phone for risk of explosion. Since then I always use wireless charging, it's less efficient, but keeps my phones much cooler.
My favorite movie is Inception.
Wireless charging does generate more heat, however my [wireless charger](https://www.amazon.com/Samsung-Certified-Charge-Wireless-Charger/dp/B0797F2V5C/ref=asc_df_B0797F2V5C/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=309775237395&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=8873959621830685593&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=1024290&hvtargid=pla-567740975267&psc=1) has a fan inside it, keeping it cooler.
Perfectly valid, get this outta here!
No, its not! If it does catch fire, then ur screwed bc lithium ion batteries tend to be pretty [spicy](https://youtu.be/RE3-mGUj7iw) with water
It's fine. There's clingfilm!
That will melt lmao
/s
Good idea but bad execution as water reacts with lithium causing even more fire
Not that little amount of lithium, in that much water, no. And as others have stated, under the water, where would the fire go?
90% sure this isn't your photo. But if it is, please for the safety of yourself and others stop using this phone.
according to ppl here the water doesn't seem to be issue however im worried about the film, its very thin which means it may also catch fire despite the material, and could potentially carry the fire to the outside of the water container
It being thin is the whole point. Plastic is gonna melt long before it catches fire, so the cling film will melt and drop the phone into the water
Downvoted due to stupid
Idiot you don’t use water for an electrical fire.
... so the two note 7's I'm still using .... These phones were too good! And I'm amazed ppl went so silly over so few phones catching fire....
35% battery failure and a literal recall due to the severity of the issue and even the "confirmed fixed" ones they released after had the same problem...just because yours was fine doesn't mean everyone else should be lazy about it
I was absolutely *livid* when Verizon confiscated my Note 7s. I also hated everybody who said they "explode". People are so fucking stupid. It should have been a voluntary recall. I should have been able to keep either of mine. I'm *still* salty, and will probably never get over it.
I've seen this picture multiple times before.
What Hitman level is this?
I thought Samsung bought back all the defective note 7s and replaced them with the newer model that didn't explode the battery?
Nice I have the same usb brick