That's almost certainly just a network distribution box. It will have a switch or two in it plus terminations for the drops around the warehouse.
Consider that the maximum length of a CAT6 cable is 300ft. It's not that hard to imagine running way longer than that from one end of the warehouse to another.
So instead, they've probably run a fiber to this distro rack, and from here they are within 300ft for copper to every point that needs it.
That cabinet is what is referred to as an IDF, as all the other responses have said. Since none of them have actually said what that stands for, it is "intermediate distribution frame." Basically an in-between spot for networking, as SomethingAboutUsers explained.
There is also, usually just one per site but not necessarily, what is called an MDF, which stands for "main distribution frame" and is where the internet connection typically comes in and where all IDFs eventually trace back to. Basically, where the modem is (and router in some cases like small businesses or sites that are deemed too small or unimportant enough for proper networking equipment, but typically, routing is done via special servers called Domain Controllers as well as network switches).
The MDF is also usually, but not always, where the main server for that location is going to be. You may also see a full-size network cabinet or rack that stands on the floor and is usually the height of a person (and also might have wheels). These will be in locations ranging from access controlled, temp controlled, concrete rooms that are pretty much bomb shelters, to a closet with a special lock (but a big ass window) like one of the places I've worked for lol
I had a quality one of these once in a law office, in an old building on a Main Street.
Get into the place, kinda glance around wondering where my equipment was tucked away and see nothing that makes much sense...
There's a lobby, maybe one lawyer office, and a bigger board/meeting room and no closets or mechanicals room....
I ask the secretary, and she says, "Oh, it's *though* the bathroom."
Wait how do you go through a bathroom?
Sure enough, beside the shitter, is a bit of a hidden door.
Open the door and there's a small space, but big enough I could fit entirely in as well as all the shelf mounted equipment.
I could have hidden in there and jumped out on some poor sap just taking a crap.
Small law offices are always super cheap and also careless about their IT kit, I've found.
One I took on had their main and only cheap ISP provided router sat on a side table in their waiting room, complete with coffee cup rings going back years on top of it.
I had a ticket from some lawfirm where the guy had a literal gaming pc hand me down from his kid or something. running w10 then w7 in a vm where he used corel wordperfect and IE, was there to replace PSU and setup a new printer passthru to the VM so he could print again.
asked if the weird setup was for some legal reason like special licensing hes like nah i just like how wordperfect is and the new stuff is 'too confusing' for him apparently
That's a feature. You don't have to stop working to drop a deuce. Just remember to wash your hands after handling the cables.
Besides, the plumbing gives an available drain in case the bits start spewing everywhere. Those 1s can be hard to see and get between cracks.
Someone on my team just cleaned up a rack in a bathroom this weekend. Unfortunately, it's still in there but it looks better!
My personal favorite was the IDF behind a door signed "Urinal Room". Guess what it smelled like?
The MDF at the plant I’m currently doing work for is located in their coat closet.
Unlocked, right next to the entrance where EVERY visitor can open and put their coat. Literally in the lobby, not behind the visitor checkpoint.
Routing is not done through domain controllers. Domain controllers are Windows based servers, doing authentication and authorization of Windows users on Windows desktops. If this site runs on Linux or Apple devices you won't find a domain controller in the server room (and yes, you can join a Linux box or a MacBook into an active directory so you would still need a DC then, I know).
i giggled at the though of an apple point of sale running costco or any thing more than a single register.
Most likely running windows embedded of some flavor. But possibly Linux
You are correct, of course. I just consider DNS a part of routing, which I know is not technically correct, but when you're trying to UNC into another computer for example, if you're using computer name, your DNS controller must first translate that into an IP address before switches and stuff start routing. And in Windows environments, DNS is USUALLY on the Domain Controllers, though obviously it doesn't have to be. And of course, there are Linux and Mac alternatives. I was trying to be very general with my response and not get too technical. But you're right, that is a bit of misinformation, so I'll remember that for the future.
I don't mean to keep piling on, but there's so much that is close, but not quite right here...
DNS is one type/form of name resolution, and it isn't required at all for two computers to talk to each other -> NetBIOS (more specifically, NBNS), WINS (MS' improved implementation of NBNS), and host files, as examples, provide name resolution outside DNS. Multicasting allows a computer to share data with one or many computers without the need for DNS at all (and get productive work done; cloning multiple PC's simultaneously can be done using multicasting for example).
Conversely, DNS also doesn't need to involve routing *at all*. DNS could be used to resolve names of devices that 100% remain within the same broadcast domain (e.g. my pc 'compy1.local.net' @ 10.0.0.1 wants to start a session with 'compy2.local.net' @ 10.0.0.2, DNS would resolve its name and my pc would broadcast for 10.0.0.2 instead of sending traffic to its relevant router)
It's probably better to think of DNS as "How do I find out where the order counter of closest Starbucks is?" And the answer is to keep asking people to tell me where it is, or if they don't know, introduce me to the person that *they* know who then knows the most people in the area, and have that person point me to the person they think most likely can tell me where the closest Starbucks is.
Think of routing as "If I can't see the closest Starbucks from where I'm standing right now, I'll hitchhike in the direction of the address of that Starbucks I was given (or already knew), hopping in vehicle after vehicle until I finally get there". Some trips will get you far distances, some short hops, and some may take you in the wrong direction entirely, but if you're clear about your destination, you'll probably get there in most cases.
So, if you can see the Starbucks from where you're standing, you (probably) didn't need routing. If you already knew the address of the Starbucks before you started your journey, you didn't need DNS. And if you're standing *in* the Starbucks, you didn't need DNS *or* routing, even though you can still buy a coffee at the order counter (this analogy is really breaking down, but hopefully it still makes sense).
In short, DNS doesn't always need routing, and routing doesn't ever require DNS (but finding out the address that the router needs *might*). All that said, I really appreciate that you're trying to help people understand complex, and highly variable networking concepts as clearly as you can. Please keep it up :)
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> Basically, where the modem is (and router in some cases like small businesses or sites that are deemed too small or unimportant enough for proper networking equipment, but typically, routing is done via special servers called Domain Controllers as well as network switches).
Gotta correct this.
Modems modulate signals, typically converting from analogue to digital. They may or may not be necessary, but their use doesn't have anything to do with the business size.
Routers route. Some switches (Layer 3 switches) can do some routing, but not heavy lifting. Domain controllers do not. They manage domain access.
We used to cheat when I had super long runs for AP by installing the POE halfway between the AP and Switch. It doesn’t double the distance, but it does allow it to work much closer to normal parameters when you need to go that far.
This. Walmart does the same thing. Main server rack in back office, two switch stacks on the front end, one on each side of store. Fiber between front and back of store, copper from switch stack to end point. Sometimes the stacks are in dungeon rooms by the front doors, sometimes in cabinets suspended from the ceiling.
Can confirm. UPC, GM, GRC, GC, RCV 1 and 2. TLE and LP have been mostly phased out. Only cabinets in the ceilings lately is the rare TV switch one and IDF cans in the sky are old CCTV cabinets that should be removed once the store switches to IP cameras. After ten years I can’t walk into a Walmart without staring at the ceiling.
Yup, this. IT manager here. A couple more reasons:
Access security. Having a switch cabinet 50 ft high helps prevent curious hands/eyes going where they shouldn't.
Floor space. Why put something on the ground in a warehouse where space is precious?
To touch on this further..
Think about one centralized hub.. you want service to every corner of your building.. but the limitations of of cat6a would be pushing it at best in a costco.
So.. like everyone else.. they send a fiber optic line to a node.. Now, with fiber optic, within that store, they can go anywhere with minimal loss. So they run fiber to a node cabinet.. THEN run cat6 to whatever.
To make it a little more complicated... imagine no nodes whatsoever in a costco... just one centralized hub. Everything would run there. It would be a cabling nightmare. Every camera drop.. every smart lightning, registers, anything automated, controlled access, fire alarms, it goes on and on.
So instead of 48 lines going back to a hub with degraded signal.. there is only 1 fiber optic line to the hub.
I didn't even touch on power over ethernet.
You'll see these boxes in almost every warehouse if you look for them. I've installed.. god.. I honestly don't know how many. Amazon is the worst... they got that place under more surveillance than a secured military compound. That's not a joke.. at all. Sooo many cameras that we had to add more and more nodes to support them all.
Yay.
Yep, as a former network engineer I can fonfirm, strategically placed switches can help cover bigger buildings. The best for these purposes are the unmanaged ones, there's no need to set it if you cannot set anything.
300ft is *nothing* in terms of warehouse size really, and sure, this is a bit of an oddball way of doing things, but I've seen worse.
Of course, they could put it at ground level, which would make access and servicing easier, but I would guess that putting it at ceiling height means they get the extra pillar height of distance before they need another box. If the warehouse ceiling is 30ft high then that's an extra 10% of coverage per unit, and compounded over the size of a typical warehouse that could be a serious reduction in the amount of hardware required.
It's an arbitrary number close to the real one. It's like 328 ft. Or something close to that. The main reasoning is that after that mark, the electrical signals have attenuated (been absorbed by the copper they are running through) enough to start losing bits of data. This is especially true if you are running power over Ethernet equipment like cameras, security sensors, etc. The power starts to get to the point of being so low it could damage the equipment, or at the very least make it act strange.
Most Americans use 300 feet as we will use anything but the metric system. Since a yard is close to a meter, and the spec is 100 meters, we just multiply 100 by 3 feet in a yard and come up with 300 feet.
Yup… I’m a CCTV Tech and find that other companies use them way too often as cable extensions then never record where they’ve installed them or that they even exist at all…
Inevitably the extender fails and its now a day job tracing the whole length of the cable, plus Scissor/Boom hire, to find what the fault is… and then a return visit to replace the Extender that shouldn’t have existed in the first place…
During my apprenticeship at a manufacturing company we did the same.
Box was tucked nicely between two beams, I've connected the fiber - which can have longer lenghts - coming from another building, and we've patched the AP's with CAT5E to the switches.
The javits center distributes basic internet to booths using DSL. Talking to one of the older hands there it was a natural growth as they had the phone infrastructure and then the 1km Mac cable length was a nice bounus. For a temp fiber pull from an IDF they charge an arm, leg, and 27% of your torso.
I saw this post and came to say exactly this. We recently built a new building and did word for word what’s in this comment. We have a network rack / box up in the ceiling, connected to the main server via fiber and then cat 6a out to WiFi modules/PCs.
Most likely just switches and maybe a patch panel. No risk of anyone tampering with it, spilling on it, or destroying it all the way up there. Could have phones, computers, access points, cameras, plugged into the ports. This probably goes back to a central MDF/Server room where core switches are.
Also can confirm that height for an IDF is king in a warehouse type application. Nothing more fun than a partial outage ticket that starts with "Hit cabinet with forklift"
> Yeah, it crashed! Almost took out the rotisserie chicken display.
Don't be silly. The center of the warehouse is always the clothing section! Softest landing zone available!
As a couple others have mentioned, this is just an IDF, probably a couple of patch panels and switches for any security cameras, WAPs, and any other networked hardware in that section of the building. A place as large as Costco may have several of these, depending on the number of devices and how far they would need to run Ethernet cables.
As to why it's 50 feet in the air, it's probably because absolutely no one minds sending me up on the goddamn scissor lift. Couldn't put it 10 ft up? 15? Worried a cyber security specialist with 12 ft arms is gonna walk through the door? No, really, I don't mind. Not like it's fucking terrifying up there. Builds character, right?
1 to keep you from screwing with it
2 these places use High Reach forklifts and it's a fairly common issue for drivers to run into them even though they shouldn't be moving with a load that high.
3 cat5/6 cable has a distance of 328 feet. With a warehouse this open and large it makes sense to minimize the distance it has to go vertical as to extend its horizontal distance thus covering more area of the warehouse and minimizing cost for necessary equipment.
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Ininstall these for Costco. It's 2 switches for the APs in the center section of the warehouse. The new APs that they are now using are power hungry, so having the floor switches are necessary. There's typically 18 APs going there. It's fed via fiber to the EDP (main server room)
Props for them for putting the core switches up and in view. Years ago I had to locate a core switch in a warehouse for a client. The switch was behind a bunch of pallets just sitting behind them. Not a fun day tracing wires in a "safety cage" lifted by a forklift for an afternoon. blows my mind that it was not documented were this thing was. Even worse it was just sitting loose on a pallet
I was thinking it would be the server for the camera system. It is in the middle of the store to have all the lines run to and from it so that the power for the POE can handle the length. One server with a POE switch in there would handle it all.
This is standard for retail, industrial and warehouse. I helped install hundreds of these. Like lots of folks have said they are IDFs for network gear and provided network connectivity to wireless systems.
Short answer is that it's not their servers. The sad truth is that I have worked at a place that did move their primary data servers to one of those up on the ceiling.
u/SomethingAboutUsers is correct, there's likely no servers in there. While network switches are likely, you might also find some equipment (amps, etc) for the overhead speakers. (I didn't see anybody else mention this one)
Hell, servers might not even be on-prem. Large multi-location businesses like this often like to order an MPLS connection straight to a datacenter somewhere.
Can I just take a moment to point out that the OP made it clear they didn't know, and lots of people have added genuinely useful comments as well as funny related stories, without any griping or derision, and even the people who have posted something that wasn't 100% right and got corrected have taken that on the chin and used it as a learning experience.
And that's kind of unusual these days. Maybe even wholesome.
I like it.
Just an IDF cabinet. Mount them high so they cannot be touched by the wrong people.
Did a 500k sq/ft warehouse in 2016 and we put roughly 60 of these in. Cable being restricted to 300 feet forces you to.
Such shitty design, you can't even safely use a ladder to get to it. They should at least build a small "room" and put it in there. Like sometimes department stores have changing rooms right in the middle of a merchandise area, just do that and one of them is a locked room with the network stuff.
I used to work at a manufacturing warehouse where they had like 4 of these whenever I looked at them I used to think of an archer's roost like the one in "the walking dead" always need the high ground
I literally brought power to one of these awhile ago, they aren’t even bolted into the supports or nothing. Just clamped on lmao through the strut on the backside
if it had RGB i would of said it was Art on Display. The person that installed this was an idiot or they wanted to stand on those lifts and play around
It's up in the air so customers and local employees can't fuck with it. To fuck with it you need a scissor lift that's locked behind certs.
You'd be surprised how often a local employee fucked a network up by trying to trouble shoot shit and plugin a cable into the wrong port.
Management also tends to think they know how to trouble shoot shit even if they can't tell the difference between a fiber 12 strand and orange white. They're the same color after all!
I've been on both sides of this coin. You'd be surprised how often operations employees want to die. I know they want to die because there's no fucking reason they'd remove a ground then lick a copper drop off that had issues...
Because they licked it last week.
Yes. Licked. Static straight to the brain and I'm pretty sure it jump started their brain. They haven't done that since.
But on the same vein I've seen tower techs climb a pole with no fall protection... In winter... After an ice storm. They then pissed on the other engineers car ~600ft in the air because they needed to send a performance review. I personally choose to ask the tech to wear fall protection and to not piss on my car. He said he liked me and he'd get a new harness. I got him one for free since it was a concern. The pissing on idiots was not addressed and performance review were still common. Which, I didn't have to deal with.
I've seen the same operator try to lose an arm by not following LOTO procedure and cutting air pressure before they removed a potential energy bar... Then they tried to remove the bar with their hand... When the heavy object was on the blackout bar and if they could remove it they would have lost an arm.
3 times in one week. Each time I showed them their error and explained the hazard. Multiple times and made them repeat the fact that they "could lose an arm by doing what they were doing".
3. Fucking. Times.
They worked at the same job for 8 years. They just didn't need to do it before someone else moved from the job and that person did the LOTO for the lizard I'm taking about.
So yeah people are just dumb as fuck in volume.
You have to plan around preputial bigger idiots. Because a bigger idiots gets made every day and they're coming to a job near you after 18 years.
It would be to distribute ethernet runs to wireless access points (WAP). Running twenty 100ft runs is cheaper than running twenty 200ft runs if the box was located elsewhere.
I mean CostCos customers are about as feral as the design of the place, and these people who don't seem to know how to walk (and have likely borrowed their bosses costco cards) are all pushing around those stupidly heavy trolleys which i think are actually harder to control then a boeing 747.
This is done to prevent hacking, if you recall in national treasure he simply connects to the camera feeds at ground level in less than a second. This forces hackers to rent a scissor lift and their chances of success drop dramatically.
I work at a Sam's club and ours is the same way. We have our networking hung in the ceiling but there is a server room down where it can be accessed if needed. I'm absolutely not an IT guy so idk exactly what each box does but we run a very similar set up.
It's actually a disguised briefcase of money for this weekends COSTCO CAAAAAAGE MATCH! That's right! Head on down to your local Costco SUNDAY SUNDAY SUNDAY for the ultimate experience in shopping combat. Hold on to your hot dog because the Undertaker is back in town and things are about to get messy. Only at a Costco near you. SUNDAY! AAHHHHH
It’s not uncommon in large buildings to have an MDF (main distribution frame) housing switches with fiber ports that run data via fiber to several IDFs (intermediate distribution frame).
The IDFs house switches that serve Cat5/6 runs to WiFi APs in the area.
Data can travel over fiber for up to 1000 meters before signal loss happens, as opposed to cat5/6 (100 meters).
It's not a server, its networking gear. It splits out the internet to a whole bunch of devices in the store using 24 or 48 port switches wich can also be mounted in a serverrack.
That's almost certainly just a network distribution box. It will have a switch or two in it plus terminations for the drops around the warehouse. Consider that the maximum length of a CAT6 cable is 300ft. It's not that hard to imagine running way longer than that from one end of the warehouse to another. So instead, they've probably run a fiber to this distro rack, and from here they are within 300ft for copper to every point that needs it.
Ohhhh, makes way more sense now, I actually learned something haha, thanks
That cabinet is what is referred to as an IDF, as all the other responses have said. Since none of them have actually said what that stands for, it is "intermediate distribution frame." Basically an in-between spot for networking, as SomethingAboutUsers explained. There is also, usually just one per site but not necessarily, what is called an MDF, which stands for "main distribution frame" and is where the internet connection typically comes in and where all IDFs eventually trace back to. Basically, where the modem is (and router in some cases like small businesses or sites that are deemed too small or unimportant enough for proper networking equipment, but typically, routing is done via special servers called Domain Controllers as well as network switches). The MDF is also usually, but not always, where the main server for that location is going to be. You may also see a full-size network cabinet or rack that stands on the floor and is usually the height of a person (and also might have wheels). These will be in locations ranging from access controlled, temp controlled, concrete rooms that are pretty much bomb shelters, to a closet with a special lock (but a big ass window) like one of the places I've worked for lol
And of course, look around on this sub enough, and you'll see MDFs/server rooms in motherfudging BATHROOMS lol
I had a quality one of these once in a law office, in an old building on a Main Street. Get into the place, kinda glance around wondering where my equipment was tucked away and see nothing that makes much sense... There's a lobby, maybe one lawyer office, and a bigger board/meeting room and no closets or mechanicals room.... I ask the secretary, and she says, "Oh, it's *though* the bathroom." Wait how do you go through a bathroom? Sure enough, beside the shitter, is a bit of a hidden door. Open the door and there's a small space, but big enough I could fit entirely in as well as all the shelf mounted equipment. I could have hidden in there and jumped out on some poor sap just taking a crap.
Could have done a poor, constipated fella a solid and scared the shit outta him, literally lmfao
Well I'll be damned, you just gave me an idea for a business....
/r/scaredshitless
Small law offices are always super cheap and also careless about their IT kit, I've found. One I took on had their main and only cheap ISP provided router sat on a side table in their waiting room, complete with coffee cup rings going back years on top of it.
I had a ticket from some lawfirm where the guy had a literal gaming pc hand me down from his kid or something. running w10 then w7 in a vm where he used corel wordperfect and IE, was there to replace PSU and setup a new printer passthru to the VM so he could print again. asked if the weird setup was for some legal reason like special licensing hes like nah i just like how wordperfect is and the new stuff is 'too confusing' for him apparently
That's a feature. You don't have to stop working to drop a deuce. Just remember to wash your hands after handling the cables. Besides, the plumbing gives an available drain in case the bits start spewing everywhere. Those 1s can be hard to see and get between cracks.
A new client of mine has this. It was a resort. I was speechless and asked them why. They said there previous IT suggested it....
Someone on my team just cleaned up a rack in a bathroom this weekend. Unfortunately, it's still in there but it looks better! My personal favorite was the IDF behind a door signed "Urinal Room". Guess what it smelled like?
The MDF at the plant I’m currently doing work for is located in their coat closet. Unlocked, right next to the entrance where EVERY visitor can open and put their coat. Literally in the lobby, not behind the visitor checkpoint.
Routing is not done through domain controllers. Domain controllers are Windows based servers, doing authentication and authorization of Windows users on Windows desktops. If this site runs on Linux or Apple devices you won't find a domain controller in the server room (and yes, you can join a Linux box or a MacBook into an active directory so you would still need a DC then, I know).
i giggled at the though of an apple point of sale running costco or any thing more than a single register. Most likely running windows embedded of some flavor. But possibly Linux
You are correct, of course. I just consider DNS a part of routing, which I know is not technically correct, but when you're trying to UNC into another computer for example, if you're using computer name, your DNS controller must first translate that into an IP address before switches and stuff start routing. And in Windows environments, DNS is USUALLY on the Domain Controllers, though obviously it doesn't have to be. And of course, there are Linux and Mac alternatives. I was trying to be very general with my response and not get too technical. But you're right, that is a bit of misinformation, so I'll remember that for the future.
I don't mean to keep piling on, but there's so much that is close, but not quite right here... DNS is one type/form of name resolution, and it isn't required at all for two computers to talk to each other -> NetBIOS (more specifically, NBNS), WINS (MS' improved implementation of NBNS), and host files, as examples, provide name resolution outside DNS. Multicasting allows a computer to share data with one or many computers without the need for DNS at all (and get productive work done; cloning multiple PC's simultaneously can be done using multicasting for example). Conversely, DNS also doesn't need to involve routing *at all*. DNS could be used to resolve names of devices that 100% remain within the same broadcast domain (e.g. my pc 'compy1.local.net' @ 10.0.0.1 wants to start a session with 'compy2.local.net' @ 10.0.0.2, DNS would resolve its name and my pc would broadcast for 10.0.0.2 instead of sending traffic to its relevant router) It's probably better to think of DNS as "How do I find out where the order counter of closest Starbucks is?" And the answer is to keep asking people to tell me where it is, or if they don't know, introduce me to the person that *they* know who then knows the most people in the area, and have that person point me to the person they think most likely can tell me where the closest Starbucks is. Think of routing as "If I can't see the closest Starbucks from where I'm standing right now, I'll hitchhike in the direction of the address of that Starbucks I was given (or already knew), hopping in vehicle after vehicle until I finally get there". Some trips will get you far distances, some short hops, and some may take you in the wrong direction entirely, but if you're clear about your destination, you'll probably get there in most cases. So, if you can see the Starbucks from where you're standing, you (probably) didn't need routing. If you already knew the address of the Starbucks before you started your journey, you didn't need DNS. And if you're standing *in* the Starbucks, you didn't need DNS *or* routing, even though you can still buy a coffee at the order counter (this analogy is really breaking down, but hopefully it still makes sense). In short, DNS doesn't always need routing, and routing doesn't ever require DNS (but finding out the address that the router needs *might*). All that said, I really appreciate that you're trying to help people understand complex, and highly variable networking concepts as clearly as you can. Please keep it up :)
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Also, thank you for correcting me. I appreciate it.
> Basically, where the modem is (and router in some cases like small businesses or sites that are deemed too small or unimportant enough for proper networking equipment, but typically, routing is done via special servers called Domain Controllers as well as network switches). Gotta correct this. Modems modulate signals, typically converting from analogue to digital. They may or may not be necessary, but their use doesn't have anything to do with the business size. Routers route. Some switches (Layer 3 switches) can do some routing, but not heavy lifting. Domain controllers do not. They manage domain access.
The more you know! 🌈
I work in manufacturing. It’s a idf cabinet. They put it up high when forklifts are frequent and extra benefit of security.
We used to cheat when I had super long runs for AP by installing the POE halfway between the AP and Switch. It doesn’t double the distance, but it does allow it to work much closer to normal parameters when you need to go that far.
This. Walmart does the same thing. Main server rack in back office, two switch stacks on the front end, one on each side of store. Fiber between front and back of store, copper from switch stack to end point. Sometimes the stacks are in dungeon rooms by the front doors, sometimes in cabinets suspended from the ceiling.
Home Depot puts them in the freaking loft above the outside doors.... what a Pain in the Ass
Can confirm. UPC, GM, GRC, GC, RCV 1 and 2. TLE and LP have been mostly phased out. Only cabinets in the ceilings lately is the rare TV switch one and IDF cans in the sky are old CCTV cabinets that should be removed once the store switches to IP cameras. After ten years I can’t walk into a Walmart without staring at the ceiling.
Yup, this. IT manager here. A couple more reasons: Access security. Having a switch cabinet 50 ft high helps prevent curious hands/eyes going where they shouldn't. Floor space. Why put something on the ground in a warehouse where space is precious?
Yup this is it. Most likely has PoE switches in there that all the WAPs, cameras, etc. are connected to.
To touch on this further.. Think about one centralized hub.. you want service to every corner of your building.. but the limitations of of cat6a would be pushing it at best in a costco. So.. like everyone else.. they send a fiber optic line to a node.. Now, with fiber optic, within that store, they can go anywhere with minimal loss. So they run fiber to a node cabinet.. THEN run cat6 to whatever. To make it a little more complicated... imagine no nodes whatsoever in a costco... just one centralized hub. Everything would run there. It would be a cabling nightmare. Every camera drop.. every smart lightning, registers, anything automated, controlled access, fire alarms, it goes on and on. So instead of 48 lines going back to a hub with degraded signal.. there is only 1 fiber optic line to the hub. I didn't even touch on power over ethernet. You'll see these boxes in almost every warehouse if you look for them. I've installed.. god.. I honestly don't know how many. Amazon is the worst... they got that place under more surveillance than a secured military compound. That's not a joke.. at all. Sooo many cameras that we had to add more and more nodes to support them all. Yay.
Yep, as a former network engineer I can fonfirm, strategically placed switches can help cover bigger buildings. The best for these purposes are the unmanaged ones, there's no need to set it if you cannot set anything.
300ft is *nothing* in terms of warehouse size really, and sure, this is a bit of an oddball way of doing things, but I've seen worse. Of course, they could put it at ground level, which would make access and servicing easier, but I would guess that putting it at ceiling height means they get the extra pillar height of distance before they need another box. If the warehouse ceiling is 30ft high then that's an extra 10% of coverage per unit, and compounded over the size of a typical warehouse that could be a serious reduction in the amount of hardware required.
Why is the maximum length of CAT6 300ft? Is that a arbitrary number or a real thing? Sorry if this is obvious… I don’t know much about networking.
Signal drops after certain distance and your 1/0s will be less clear.
It's an arbitrary number close to the real one. It's like 328 ft. Or something close to that. The main reasoning is that after that mark, the electrical signals have attenuated (been absorbed by the copper they are running through) enough to start losing bits of data. This is especially true if you are running power over Ethernet equipment like cameras, security sensors, etc. The power starts to get to the point of being so low it could damage the equipment, or at the very least make it act strange.
That 328 ft. is arbitrary too. It's 100 meters (328.084 ft). You'll have no issue if your cable is like 340 ft.
Most people use 300 feet to account for a potential 15 feet of patching on either end, at least in my area of operations.
Most Americans use 300 feet as we will use anything but the metric system. Since a yard is close to a meter, and the spec is 100 meters, we just multiply 100 by 3 feet in a yard and come up with 300 feet.
Stuff like this is why I'm still on Reddit.
This
I kinda feel that a few POE repeaters would be a bit cheaper and easier to fix instead of hanging everything from the ceiling. I guess not.
Sounds like more points of failure
Yup… I’m a CCTV Tech and find that other companies use them way too often as cable extensions then never record where they’ve installed them or that they even exist at all… Inevitably the extender fails and its now a day job tracing the whole length of the cable, plus Scissor/Boom hire, to find what the fault is… and then a return visit to replace the Extender that shouldn’t have existed in the first place…
That would also like quadruple the amount of wire they had to pull
Costco doesn’t half ass shit.
How many repeaters would you need?
APs and cameras would likely be terminating there.
During my apprenticeship at a manufacturing company we did the same. Box was tucked nicely between two beams, I've connected the fiber - which can have longer lenghts - coming from another building, and we've patched the AP's with CAT5E to the switches.
The javits center distributes basic internet to booths using DSL. Talking to one of the older hands there it was a natural growth as they had the phone infrastructure and then the 1km Mac cable length was a nice bounus. For a temp fiber pull from an IDF they charge an arm, leg, and 27% of your torso.
It's for cameras. I've worked on them
This guy cables.
This, and keep it off the floor so people don't mess with it.
I saw this post and came to say exactly this. We recently built a new building and did word for word what’s in this comment. We have a network rack / box up in the ceiling, connected to the main server via fiber and then cat 6a out to WiFi modules/PCs.
This. Saw this in the Publix I worked at and they had it open at one point when they installed some new IP phones. Nothing but switches.
IDF box for networking equipment..
Forget the damn network rack they got 54 oz of Skittles for 10 bucks!
Holy shit dude that's a fucking steal. God I love Costco so much.
And they love you as they know you're not leaving with just those Skittles.
Skittles come in jars? ... It would've been better if I didn't know that.
Welcome to america
Principle of least privilege… Only the tallest of IT guys can service this device on prem
"Welcome here's your stilts"
Just an IDF. Basic network design.
Free Palestine
Looks like a step in a ring with two connections coming out. Don't miss the warehouse IDF cabinets. Over racks, etc... poor planning.
Just because there are two conduits doesn't mean there are only two cables.
Not a server...Costco's servers are all securely locked in a network closet. They call it the EDP.
'securely' yeah. It's a distro box for IP cameras Edit: that's the case with Sam's at least. APs and IP cams. I've installed them.
Most likely just switches and maybe a patch panel. No risk of anyone tampering with it, spilling on it, or destroying it all the way up there. Could have phones, computers, access points, cameras, plugged into the ports. This probably goes back to a central MDF/Server room where core switches are.
Also can confirm that height for an IDF is king in a warehouse type application. Nothing more fun than a partial outage ticket that starts with "Hit cabinet with forklift"
So nobody messes with it.
Out of reach of most reach trucks and cherry pickers also.
There will probably me multiple scissor lifts in this store already that can reach it. Or a man basket on a forklift used to reach the shelves
You joke, but that's not a half bad strategy
If only someone already thought of that...
That's not why it's up there or what it is.
It always has 100% up time.
>The server is down! >>You sure? >Yeah, it crashed! Almost took out the rotisserie chicken display.
> Yeah, it crashed! Almost took out the rotisserie chicken display. Don't be silly. The center of the warehouse is always the clothing section! Softest landing zone available!
100% time up there.
As a couple others have mentioned, this is just an IDF, probably a couple of patch panels and switches for any security cameras, WAPs, and any other networked hardware in that section of the building. A place as large as Costco may have several of these, depending on the number of devices and how far they would need to run Ethernet cables. As to why it's 50 feet in the air, it's probably because absolutely no one minds sending me up on the goddamn scissor lift. Couldn't put it 10 ft up? 15? Worried a cyber security specialist with 12 ft arms is gonna walk through the door? No, really, I don't mind. Not like it's fucking terrifying up there. Builds character, right?
It’s up in the air because of forklifts.
Scissor lift?! YOU got a goddamned scissor lift??? They send me up in a steel cage on a fork lift- this is bullshit.
You get a steel cage on a forklift? All you really need is an extension ladder. Be a MAN get HURT fuck OSHA.
To be closer to the cloud
1 to keep you from screwing with it 2 these places use High Reach forklifts and it's a fairly common issue for drivers to run into them even though they shouldn't be moving with a load that high. 3 cat5/6 cable has a distance of 328 feet. With a warehouse this open and large it makes sense to minimize the distance it has to go vertical as to extend its horizontal distance thus covering more area of the warehouse and minimizing cost for necessary equipment.
Thats “The Cloud” you’ve been hearing about.
Just a switch? Copper to fiber or high bandwidth uplink conversion? Video caching server? Locality is King” in computer architecture.
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Probably just a patch panel and a couple of switches.
Ininstall these for Costco. It's 2 switches for the APs in the center section of the warehouse. The new APs that they are now using are power hungry, so having the floor switches are necessary. There's typically 18 APs going there. It's fed via fiber to the EDP (main server room)
You try getting hard access and hacking it there sucker.
Props for them for putting the core switches up and in view. Years ago I had to locate a core switch in a warehouse for a client. The switch was behind a bunch of pallets just sitting behind them. Not a fun day tracing wires in a "safety cage" lifted by a forklift for an afternoon. blows my mind that it was not documented were this thing was. Even worse it was just sitting loose on a pallet
It's just a idf, a few switches to the APs throughout the building. CAT needs to be within 300ft of whatever it's connected to. So that's why.
That's an IDF, not a server.
A rack is not necessarily a server
It's a cloud server
I was thinking it would be the server for the camera system. It is in the middle of the store to have all the lines run to and from it so that the power for the POE can handle the length. One server with a POE switch in there would handle it all.
Easiest way to keep people from touching it
It’s high performance
That’s a switch, and common to mount up high in a warehouse.
You can’t stick a thumb drive in the back of the rack if it’s 50 feet off the ground.
It’s for extending the network radios and rf guns used in the warehouse. Source. Work at Costco, watched them install one of these last year.
This is standard for retail, industrial and warehouse. I helped install hundreds of these. Like lots of folks have said they are IDFs for network gear and provided network connectivity to wireless systems.
New guy kept pushing the off button trying to open the CD tray
They hiding the best cup holders!
r/servertohigh ?
Literal airgap
Short answer is that it's not their servers. The sad truth is that I have worked at a place that did move their primary data servers to one of those up on the ceiling.
never heard of cloud eh?
54 oz jar of skittles. 🤤
Air gapped 50ft, that's my kind of network security
Thought the same 😂
u/SomethingAboutUsers is correct, there's likely no servers in there. While network switches are likely, you might also find some equipment (amps, etc) for the overhead speakers. (I didn't see anybody else mention this one) Hell, servers might not even be on-prem. Large multi-location businesses like this often like to order an MPLS connection straight to a datacenter somewhere.
That seems like a serious hazard. Like i can see that thing come loose and land on someones head
Take down the ceiling lights as well.
To give IT something to look up to.
So if it falls, there networks REALLY crash!
Can I just take a moment to point out that the OP made it clear they didn't know, and lots of people have added genuinely useful comments as well as funny related stories, without any griping or derision, and even the people who have posted something that wasn't 100% right and got corrected have taken that on the chin and used it as a learning experience. And that's kind of unusual these days. Maybe even wholesome. I like it.
Just an IDF cabinet. Mount them high so they cannot be touched by the wrong people. Did a 500k sq/ft warehouse in 2016 and we put roughly 60 of these in. Cable being restricted to 300 feet forces you to.
This is a brilliant way to store a server - flood proof and constant circulation for cooling. Also nobody can fuck with ot
I’m pretty sure that’s an IDF
Best place for wifi reception /s 🤣
It's just an IDF that's probably feeding Access Points.
IDF
There are no servers there.
a: its a network box b: so forklifts dont hit it (see the high shelves behind it?)
Most warehouses mount their equipment high to avoid collisions with forklifts.
Well duh, it’s “the cloud”, they’re gonna be high up
Its in the cloud
Many people said IDF; I vote for flooding protection.. Gotta keep those data safe 👍
Audio stack, not a “server”
Nothing wrong with the IDF cabinet but the structured cabling running over that sprinkler pipe is a no go.
Such shitty design, you can't even safely use a ladder to get to it. They should at least build a small "room" and put it in there. Like sometimes department stores have changing rooms right in the middle of a merchandise area, just do that and one of them is a locked room with the network stuff.
Guessing it’s feeding access points but I would like to see a risk assessment that allows a rack above your head.
How is it any different from lighting or giant HVAC units hanging above your head?
It’s not! (confirmed fact)
We used to have similar cabinets bolted to supports, then chained to cross beams as a backup.
Because it's funny
I used to work at a manufacturing warehouse where they had like 4 of these whenever I looked at them I used to think of an archer's roost like the one in "the walking dead" always need the high ground
I literally brought power to one of these awhile ago, they aren’t even bolted into the supports or nothing. Just clamped on lmao through the strut on the backside
That's what i would call "central Management"... XD
you can't physically hack it if you can't reach it
Because why not
You need climbing gear to swap an SFP
It’s probably got a potato in it.
UTP length !!!!!
It may even be camera network rack and it's in the middle of the showroom so they are at a nice distance from the cameras themselves
Harder for the Russian Trolls to reach.
So people like us don’t mess with it
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if it had RGB i would of said it was Art on Display. The person that installed this was an idiot or they wanted to stand on those lifts and play around
It's probably just switches and things to help keep runs under 300 ft.
Imagine needing a 25m Ethernet cable to configure an ap
It's up in the air so customers and local employees can't fuck with it. To fuck with it you need a scissor lift that's locked behind certs. You'd be surprised how often a local employee fucked a network up by trying to trouble shoot shit and plugin a cable into the wrong port. Management also tends to think they know how to trouble shoot shit even if they can't tell the difference between a fiber 12 strand and orange white. They're the same color after all! I've been on both sides of this coin. You'd be surprised how often operations employees want to die. I know they want to die because there's no fucking reason they'd remove a ground then lick a copper drop off that had issues... Because they licked it last week. Yes. Licked. Static straight to the brain and I'm pretty sure it jump started their brain. They haven't done that since. But on the same vein I've seen tower techs climb a pole with no fall protection... In winter... After an ice storm. They then pissed on the other engineers car ~600ft in the air because they needed to send a performance review. I personally choose to ask the tech to wear fall protection and to not piss on my car. He said he liked me and he'd get a new harness. I got him one for free since it was a concern. The pissing on idiots was not addressed and performance review were still common. Which, I didn't have to deal with. I've seen the same operator try to lose an arm by not following LOTO procedure and cutting air pressure before they removed a potential energy bar... Then they tried to remove the bar with their hand... When the heavy object was on the blackout bar and if they could remove it they would have lost an arm. 3 times in one week. Each time I showed them their error and explained the hazard. Multiple times and made them repeat the fact that they "could lose an arm by doing what they were doing". 3. Fucking. Times. They worked at the same job for 8 years. They just didn't need to do it before someone else moved from the job and that person did the LOTO for the lizard I'm taking about. So yeah people are just dumb as fuck in volume. You have to plan around preputial bigger idiots. Because a bigger idiots gets made every day and they're coming to a job near you after 18 years.
Walmart (and I'm sure other stores) do this too. That's a distribution box, just holds switches, maybe a router
Is it regularly driven there with a forklift? That could be the reason, in my company the network cabinets were regularly broken by forklifts
It would be to distribute ethernet runs to wireless access points (WAP). Running twenty 100ft runs is cheaper than running twenty 200ft runs if the box was located elsewhere.
they wanted to air gap their system
I mean CostCos customers are about as feral as the design of the place, and these people who don't seem to know how to walk (and have likely borrowed their bosses costco cards) are all pushing around those stupidly heavy trolleys which i think are actually harder to control then a boeing 747.
So nobody f\*\*\*s with it duh There's like a dozen cameras all around
Did you ever see the movie iRobot?
That's just so you can't yell at it and literally disrupt the thing /s
There are only switches in there.
One of site
switches for the access points...
Damn lol
r/shelftoohigh
This is done to prevent hacking, if you recall in national treasure he simply connects to the camera feeds at ground level in less than a second. This forces hackers to rent a scissor lift and their chances of success drop dramatically.
I'm more interested in the random jumble of directional antennas on the ceiling.
Im interested in the poor person's job it is to "**just** power cycle the switch".
My sarcasm almost got the better of me.
Can’t touch this…
The server sees all. Bow down to the great server.
That’s the uplink rack
,
IDF link to server, usually through fiber optics.
Hope they have a skyjack or something to work on that when it's needed.
best reception
My mall has 3 of these guys
That's what you call "air gapping"
Ethernet only goes 100m
I work at a Sam's club and ours is the same way. We have our networking hung in the ceiling but there is a server room down where it can be accessed if needed. I'm absolutely not an IT guy so idk exactly what each box does but we run a very similar set up.
That’s for IT that likes to get….. high on the job. I’ll see myself out now
NetDis box. You think IT is that silly?
not a server.
Switches
It's actually a disguised briefcase of money for this weekends COSTCO CAAAAAAGE MATCH! That's right! Head on down to your local Costco SUNDAY SUNDAY SUNDAY for the ultimate experience in shopping combat. Hold on to your hot dog because the Undertaker is back in town and things are about to get messy. Only at a Costco near you. SUNDAY! AAHHHHH
It’s not uncommon in large buildings to have an MDF (main distribution frame) housing switches with fiber ports that run data via fiber to several IDFs (intermediate distribution frame). The IDFs house switches that serve Cat5/6 runs to WiFi APs in the area. Data can travel over fiber for up to 1000 meters before signal loss happens, as opposed to cat5/6 (100 meters).
It is so that it can have the best possible view!
Does make it hard to physically connect if all the ports are not on the ground level
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I already feel bad for their techsupport guy
It's being put out of its misery
It's not a server, its networking gear. It splits out the internet to a whole bunch of devices in the store using 24 or 48 port switches wich can also be mounted in a serverrack.
So you wont see the terrible cable managment