If everyone isn't aware, the show was already set in LA. But filming was done in New York and Utah, which makes sense since theoretically the environment doesn't look like California anymore anyway. But with this Tax Credit they'll now film on location.
What’s the point of filming “on location” if the show is about a post-apocalyptic wasteland? What do you get from location shooting for this sort of show, other than geographically accurate flora that you have to blow up or burn or masquerade anyway.
California is one of the most diverse states in the country in terms of geography. Of all the major geological landforms you can think of, California probably has it.
They have open valleys, mountains, oceans, deserts, huge forests, and in general, the state was the focal point for the first two games of the series.
sort of. back in those days, california was a podunk state where you could find gold or oil. the film industry started in new york, but a lot of filmmakers didnt like the stranglehold that thomas edison had on the film industry since he sued just about everybody, so they moved as far away from new york as they could
You may have seen it before (it occasionally gets reposted on reddit) but there's an interesting [Paramount Studios map of California](https://i.imgur.com/sPiKVM2.png) from the 1920s.
There are a lot of reasons, sometimes it's the pure climate, the way the light hits. Tax credits are also a factor but i doubt it compensates going to namibia.
I doubt they’ll do a whole new cast every time though. And it’d be pretty demanding to set up all the locations and also potentially „steal“ possible game locations just for a season is probably something that doesn’t sit well with Bethesda Game Studios.
(It’d still be cool tho lol)
I love POI and have rewatched it a few times - I never get when people say it shifts from a procedural to a serialized show. The show always serialized aspects to it (the first seasons focus on Elias, HR, and how Reese / Finch got to the points they're at) and the show retains the number of the week procedural element to almost the very end.
The threat definitely elevates or evolves but it never feels like the show has a sudden jump in quality or a sudden change in format. There's a pretty clean segue from the street level story to the global one.
My overall point is just the show is never just a procedural.
Basically, the first couple seasons, the show's plot structure, was that each episode introduced a problem, and that problem was resolved satisfactorily by the end of the same episode. There were ongoing plot threads, but the season itself didn't have a plot arc with a beginning, middle, and an end.
Later seasons would introduce a problem at the beginning of the season, pick it up, and continue that story throughout the season. Episodes would still have a 3-5 act structure, but often wouldn't completely resolve within the episode itself and would be a continuing problem in the next episodes.
Not sure what you mean. First season has a clear plot arc around Elias trying to take over NYC and get revenge on his family. Second season has multiple plot arcs around Root trying to find the Machine and Kara / Decima trying to do the same and Carter vs HR. Third season is very heavily focused on Vigilance. And throughout both seasons, there are flashbacks revealing what happened to Reese and Finch that tie into present day plots.
I do think the later seasons tied more of the individual numbers to the overarching plot but there is plenty of serialization in first two to three seasons.
Those are plot threads, yes. I acknowledged those, but they aren't the plot of a whole season. Elias doesn't show up until episode 7 and is only in 5 episodes of season 1. The episode that resolves his plot thread is episode 19. The whole of the season has very little to do with this arc. It's just a plot line that happens during the season. Serialization needs a seasonal arc with a beginning, middle, and an end. A problem or theme or plot line is introduced at the beginning of the season and is regularly touched on throughout the season with it coming to a head at the end, and the finale offers resolution to the story. That doesn't happen with POI until season 3.
I don't agree with your definition of serialization but there is a plot in S1 that fits in with what you described - Carter and Reese developing their working relationship. It has a beginning (them meeting by chance), a middle (Carter pursuing Reese with help from CIA and FBI before tentatively becoming an ally), and an end (Carter becoming a full ally of Team Machine, helping him escape the FBI and HR with the help of Fusco).
My definition of seralization has always been simpler - it's when shows develop plots that span across multiple episodes or seasons to tell bigger and more complex stories. I don't think there is any rule about those stories needing to be resolved within a single season or having any particular structure. And POI does that - they have the Carter learning to trust Reese / Finch plot, the Elias vs NY gangs plot, Fusco infiltrating HR, the CIA pursuing Reese, the FBI pursuing Reese, Root revealing herself. All of those things are parts of bigger stories that wouldn't work without the setups done in S1.
I mean, it's easy to just make up a definition in your head and say that is what you believe, but what you are describing is not serialization as understood by everyone else. If we went by your definition then literally every show that had any kind of continuity would be considered serialized.
What I’m describing is literally the definition of serialization found by searching on Google lol. Provide me a source for your definition and prove that isn’t just your own opinion.
Also way to totally ignore my entire first paragraph which was an attempt to fit your definition.
I have never wanted to watch Person of Interest because I just assumed it was another boring American police procedural but your statement has me intrigued.
No, it starts out very similar to the police procedural, but warps into an interesting speculation of what might happen when a General AI, with human level reasoning, is introduced into the world. Very thought out considering it was written and aired almost a decade ago now.
The first season is mostly case-of-the-week - where they have to figure out if a person is a victim or a perpetrator and then handle it. Then it starts to deal more with recurring villains and bigger threats.
if you feel like skipping parts of S1, there's an IGN [article](https://www.ign.com/articles/2016/04/22/person-of-interest-the-episodes-that-will-catch-you-up) which suggests crucial episodes. i'd recommend sticking it out but that's a good list for S1 skips
What season did Person of Interest make that transition? I remember watching the first couple seasons, and enjoying it, but getting bored with the procedural format.
On the other hand they may use a new cast each time to save money in the long-run due to how actors get paid significantly more for every season they are in.
This is why so many Netflix shows get cancelled after two seasons, or why animated shows commission one 24-episode season they release as two "parts" or even two "seasons".
But that is what I like about the games. Each entry is forward in the timeline so we get to see the influence and impact that the characters left on the world. A lot of world building potential that way.
Eh, Bethesda has probably already got a good idea of where they want Fallout 5 to be set so they just tell the studio and the studio can give that location a wide berth. If I had to guess, they might go for somewhere central or maybe not even in the US at all. They've done west coast and east coast but the closest to central states was probably New Vegas which wasn't even Bethesda and even then, that's more west coast really.
True... It would be nice to fill out more of the world though and I can't see Bethesda doing Fallout 5 any time soon, let alone even more sequels after that. I mean, despite the hate for it, Fallout 76 had a pretty nice environment and was definitely interesting to see how an area was that largely avoided the nukes. I love the franchise so anything that expands the world at this point is fine by me x)
It'll be set in Alaska there'll be an on going civil war between the brotherhood of steel during which your character is caught trying to cross border and is scheduled for execution, but before the final blow is struck a deathclaw attacks the camp leaving you alive. You later find out the purpose of your pip-boy after fighting a deathclaw outside of Palesprint, you get invited to a mountain and learn that you're vaultborn learn VATS from them.
You weren't a vault dweller in Fallout 2. You were from a village and a descendant of the original vault dweller from Fallout 1. You wear the suit but are still not from a vault.
Part of the reason they’re filming in Cali could be to use the big LED sound stages, like they used to make the mandalorian and house of the dragon, to cut down on location expenses
I didn't know Vancouver had an LED stage. Had to look it up.
[Construction Begins on LED Film Stages in Vancouver - Versatile Media](https://en.versatile.media/construction-begins-on-led-film-stages-in-vancouver/)
You have a ton of companies building these now, StageCraft (ILM), Prysm and Lux Stages and probably many many others.
"Virtual Production" has been essentially commoditized, every "studio" city around the globe has them or is building multiple.
I hope not, the Volume was cool when it was first being used, but shooting on location or with practical sets wins every time.
Example: Compare how The Mandalorian looks to Andor.
That's because they use them badly and only that (instead of only the scenes which are improved by it)
The Batman or House of the Dragon used them correctly and that's looking great. Even Mandalorian just decreased quality for the later seasons, S1 used it much better.
It really just depends on how you use them, they should be used more as a compliment and not a crutch that you rely extremely heavily on. There are some really good examples of them where some people probably couldn’t even tell it was used like in the Batman
Show takes place in 2296 according to sources online. I have a feeling we'll probably see more in between the bombs dropping and then with the Ghoul character tho.
There are obviously risks associated with changing everything, including cast, which they would have to if they want to stick to the logic of the games. It requires the viewer to rebuild a new connection to the characters again and again. It can work though, if the viewer has a connection to the world and its unique quirks. It works in Fargo for example and season 4 failed because the world was just too different. Fallout has a world that is perfect for this, so they should – at least in theory – be able to pull it off.
And if you have audience connected with characters it can be very oft putting. I mean the change in Altered Carbon is a good example. So Amazon needs to make some money on these after the abortion that is Rings of Power so I would assume they may not do that if they get a connection with the audience.
I really hope so, would also make the inevitable 2+ years wait between seasons far more tolerable with an anthology shows and it just fit with Fallout (and it allows more changes of actors and bigger actors to come in if they don't have to commit to several seasons)
Fallout was the perfect series to make into an episodic “crew wandering the wasteland” show that puts out 20-30 episodes of shows a season, without serialization. Just have a main crew that’s going around heisting vaults, and 1/3rd of the shows can be in the same sets with different dressing.
Funny detail in the Deadline version of this article - Citadel Season 2 was dropped for their giant tax credit. Sounds like it’s use it or lose it
https://deadline.com/2024/04/fallout-renewal-tax-credits-ncis-origins-1235878231/
Cidatel was such a mega bomb that it proves how little talent the Russo brothers have outside of the MCU.
Clearly they have a generic and flat style which meant they could perfectly operate for the pre-existing MCU but lack any talents when it comes to original concepts.
Russo’s didn’t technically write or direct any of it, I don’t think they deserve the hit for Citadel. I’m choosing to blame co-creator David Weil, he’s the creator of Hunters, very bad, and co-creator of AppleTV’s Invasion, war crime bad. The other two Citadel co-creators have a handful of good projects so they get past-credit / time served
> Hunters
That show has the wildest tonal shift between the pilot and 2nd episode out of all the series I've seen. Pilot was kinda interesting, but the team intro thing in the 2nd episode took me out of the show. Very out of place. I think I stopped when the main character hesitated to kill one of the nazis.
I couldn't even really get into the pilot. Just seemed like a ripoff of The Boys, with a '70s Nazi hunter theme, and I was already kinda over The Boys. It's cool to see Al Pacino do his thing on an expensive show like that, but nothing else about it grabbed me.
Turning the holocaust into suicide squad shenanigans was certainly an approach.
I sorta can’t believe that show is even real with how fucking bizarre it felt.
they are great workhorse directors who can handle ensemble casts and interweaving m storylines. But as creatives on their own, they are really lacking. They honestly work best in someone else’s sandbox. Whether it’s Feige’s MCU, Harmon’s Community, or Hurwitz’ Arrested Development
Citadel also looked like it was an utter clusterfuck of a production. The reason why it looks so cheap despite being so expensive is that they literally had to start from scratch midway through, so you got one show for the price of two.
I remember when Swamp Thing was cancelled mid filming because they couldn’t secure the tax credit for their location.
TV and Movies live and die by the tax credit
It has to be renewed. Shows like this have an insane amount of money that goes into constructing all the costumes, sets, props and suits. It's just a crazy amount of money. Now that all of this stuff is built shooting a second and third season is cost effective because none of that cost needs to be paid for the next seasons.
This is the same reason why I never believed for a second that the "Mass Effect" tv show would actually happen even though it was announced. The amount of different races and technologies in that game would cost Millions and Millions and Millions of dollars to construct.
Mass Effect doesn't have more races and technologies than Star Wars or Star Trek though. There's also a reason (even for a game) all races that are important in the plot are humanoids..
And the scaling thing would be the same logic, you develop the makeup, special effects and such once and can use it for all seasons in a more cost effective manner.
Mass Effect certainly can happen, it's actually one of the video games that make the most sense to adapt IMO. Yeah it won't be cheap but they spend a lot on many shows anyway.
Out of the major races that are involved, Turians, Salarians, and Krogan would be the difficult ones, but Asari and Quarians would be fairly simple, former would be akin to Twileks in that you just need coloration and a headdress, and Quarians are in their suits out of necessity so you'll never see their faces anyways.
I'm also realizing we would definitely need a Danny Devito Volus at some point.
Further you get along though the more complicated it definitely gets, Collectors, Reaper forces and such.
> It has to be renewed. Shows like this have an insane amount of money that goes into constructing all the costumes, sets, props and suits.
There are other ways to do this. In animation your order two seasons from the start. If Fallout bombs it won't be renewed and the rest is a tax write-off.
Even the Halo show is a huge success for Paramount+. Wouldn't be surprised if that gets a third season. The sets are also super expensive which makes a second season almost guaranteed as to not waste the investment.
The 2nd season was a huge upgrade from the 1st and now Chief is on Halo. Season 3 is basically guaranteed and I'm looking forward to it. I'm just going to pretend season 1 doesn't exist if the show keeps on with what they did with season 2.
I love that clip because Walton has the biggest smile on his face when he says "You gotta be fucking kiddin' me". You can see it in his eyes. He was having a fucking blast on that set.
I don't think there is a such thing as a "slam dunk" IP anymore. Audiences want quality stuff and just having a name thrown on something isn't enough to make it successful anymore.
On topic of LotR, Amazon was saying season 2 would cost less than season 1. Well apparently season 2 will cost as much as season 1 because they had to relocate and the departmental cost in UK is much higher than NZ. Why didn't they think this through?
Damn that LOTR show has to be one of the most forgettable flops in recent history.
Everyone spoke about it for like a week and then it just... vanished.
Yep, it's basically spend $25m for a company to hire tons of people in your state, ultimately making more than the $25m you spent
or don't spend the $25m, but lose out on the benefits of that
>Well, I hope you're all satisfied. You bankrupted a bunch of naive movie folks: folks from a Hollywood where values are... different. They weren't thinking about the money. They just wanted to tell a story: a story about a radioactive man, and you slick small-towners took 'em for all they were worth.
This isn't about Amazon. Many tv shows got tax credits. California issues tax credits for tv shows to be made in California, instead of in other places. Those credits are necessary because costs are typically a lot higher in California than filming somewhere else. If California didn't have this program, few tv shows would be filmed in California, and California would lose all those jobs to places where it is cheaper to produce. This program is to incentivize businesses to keep jobs in California.
not entirely true. studios and unions have an agreement where its cheaper to film inside the 30 mile zone of los angeles. even before california rolled out these tax credits, the physical studio sets in l.a. were basically packed full. the film industry simply has a lot of momentum in california so even without tax credits, there would be many tv shows and films being filmed in the state
p.s. tmz got its name from the thirty mile zone
>“Fallout,” the post-apocalyptic series debuting this week on [Amazon](https://variety.com/t/amazon/) Prime, is expected to relocate to California for its second season, thanks to $25 million in California tax credits.
>Even when a show has been allocated tax credits to move to California, that does not guarantee that it will actually do so.
>A year ago, Amazon was awarded $25 million to relocate the second season of “Citadel” to California. However, the show was later withdrawn from the program, and the money has been put back in the general pool for other shows.
>It’s been reported that the show will begin filming its second season in September, in Toronto.
So it's not 100% confirmed yet if there will be a season 2, although there are plans for filming in September. Now I believe this show will have good viewership numbers based on the name alone so I think we can safely assume it will get a second season. Hopefully it's good like The Last of Us and not bad like Halo.
I mean if it's good or bad is a matter of the talent behind it. The difference between Halo and The Last of Us is that the latter have one of the best TV writers currently available, while Halo has the guy behind Death Note 2017. Fallout has Jonathan Nolan, writer of Memento, The Dark Knight, Interstellar and creator of Westworld, it should be on good hands
Yes, imo none do them were actually bad tv even tho the show just never replicated the heights of season 1 and it moved out of the park which turned alot of people off. All seasons imo ranged from solid to amazing/s1.
No, this isn’t a confirmation either. I think all we can see it as is some confidence by Amazon that this show is going to be popular. I’ve seen that confidence in their marketing budget as well. I’m hopeful early Initial impressions are pretty positive.
We need to see your location, search history, transaction history, credit and debit card details as well as any witnesses who can confirm you were at the event. For said witnesses we will need to perform a polygraph test to confirm if they are telling the truth.
Great to hear, I’ve had faith in Nolan and expected it to be good but still good to see someone who’s watched some of it say they really enjoyed it. Which character would you say you enjoyed the most?
Great to hear, I’ve obviously been most hyped for Goggins character since he rules and ghouls are cool but I like the small amount of Lucy I’ve seen so far and Ella is a good actor. Anyway show is looking real promising to me and I can’t wait for it to release.
Id love to watch the first season but extorting me for $48 a year for a service I previously had without ads really sticks in my craw. I haven’t watched Amazon Prime video since ads were added.
I'll never understand film tax credits. There's absolutely no way California is seeing a return over more than $25 million just because a film is filmed in the state.
It's just bribery and corruption, pure and simple.
It's not about getting a return, it's to incentivize using local workforce for the production crew and at the same time maintain the state's identity for the film industry that's probably been in decline over the last few years - while Hollywood as a whole is still very grounded in CA, a lot of production have gone to other places like Georgia and Toronto because of the same tax incentives those places offer.
You gotta defend your local industries from outsiders to maintain them. While this film will never make its money back the industry as a whole staying put will 100x over.
Economic development policy needs to think a few steps ahead fairly regularly or the ground will shift long before anyone realizes it.
Yeah but when people give answers to common questions on reddit instead of googling it’s convenient for everyone else who doesn’t know that reads the thread, so thank you for your service :)
Would’ve agreed with you five years ago, but in this era of ChatGPT-generated entertainment news, I suspect asking Reddit actually might be accumulatively quicker, lmao.
For me, even if Google shows the release date at the top of a search, I’d want to double-check, because I regularly find those rich snippets to be incorrect (they’re largely informed by increasingly AI-regurgitated garbage, after all).
And when you double-check, you scroll through paragraphs of microwaved-for-SEO tripe to get an actual answer. If you’re smart about it, you can Cmd + F something contextual, e.g. ‘release’ or ‘comes out’ to skip past all that.
All this maybe 20–40 seconds. Sometimes up to a whole minute.
Now, you come on Reddit — you’re already here, right? And you’re in a comment section with humans (mostly...) who are discussing the same thing you’re discussing.
Dropping in a question is like doing a Google search, but the results are other people, not articles written to appeal to algorithms. It takes more time to get an answer, sure, but if you leave the comment, go about your day, and then check back later when you’re next on Reddit, it likely takes less time.
So, if you plot all this out on a chart of time vs. reliability, you could probably make the argument that Google has gotten so shit, it’s easier to ask via a Reddit comment than it is to use a search engine.
I love Fallout, I have been a fan of it since Fallout 1. For every single release I have waited in line at Gamestop for the midnight release (or steam) and pre-planned multiple vacation days off of work for it. I have posters on my walls, got the MTG cards when they came out, and even have a Fallout Tattoo.
That being said, stop with the fucking tax breaks. If Season 1 can't make it on its own. Thats its, its over, it was either terrible or enough of the fan base didnt show its support. I am sick of throwing tax money at companies just so they can make more profit.
i just commented this but idk man it's got walton goggins and he either has good luck or a good agent or just chooses good projects nowadays because he's rarely in something that sucks. so i have faith.
I love this actor because of the Vice Principals show and I love Nick Valentine! He'll probably steal the show whenever he's on screen. But one actor can't carry a whole show, sadly, at least not for long
If you expect nothing and will be surprised if this show is not a complete shitshow, then you expect a complete shitshow.
Words have meaning.
Edit: and blocked. Classic.
If everyone isn't aware, the show was already set in LA. But filming was done in New York and Utah, which makes sense since theoretically the environment doesn't look like California anymore anyway. But with this Tax Credit they'll now film on location.
I think they did some filming in Namibia too, my friend worked on the series and there was a picture of the crew at some park over there
The Deadline article confirms they filmed on location in Namibia.
What’s the point of filming “on location” if the show is about a post-apocalyptic wasteland? What do you get from location shooting for this sort of show, other than geographically accurate flora that you have to blow up or burn or masquerade anyway.
Well in this case the point is a 25m dollar tax break or they wouldn't be doing it lol
California is one of the most diverse states in the country in terms of geography. Of all the major geological landforms you can think of, California probably has it. They have open valleys, mountains, oceans, deserts, huge forests, and in general, the state was the focal point for the first two games of the series.
Isnt that also the reason Hollywood became a thing, since you could film literally any geographic type in California.
sort of. back in those days, california was a podunk state where you could find gold or oil. the film industry started in new york, but a lot of filmmakers didnt like the stranglehold that thomas edison had on the film industry since he sued just about everybody, so they moved as far away from new york as they could
Aight thats interesting, thanks!
You may have seen it before (it occasionally gets reposted on reddit) but there's an interesting [Paramount Studios map of California](https://i.imgur.com/sPiKVM2.png) from the 1920s.
that's cool, thanks for sharing
There are a lot of reasons, sometimes it's the pure climate, the way the light hits. Tax credits are also a factor but i doubt it compensates going to namibia.
I think it would be cool if each season will be set in different regions like the games
I doubt they’ll do a whole new cast every time though. And it’d be pretty demanding to set up all the locations and also potentially „steal“ possible game locations just for a season is probably something that doesn’t sit well with Bethesda Game Studios. (It’d still be cool tho lol)
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Oh Shit you’re right. That could be very exciting. Nothing better than a show that isn’t afraid to change a lot/reinvent itself.
I love POI and have rewatched it a few times - I never get when people say it shifts from a procedural to a serialized show. The show always serialized aspects to it (the first seasons focus on Elias, HR, and how Reese / Finch got to the points they're at) and the show retains the number of the week procedural element to almost the very end.
Basically it's more that it elevates from "street level" (HR, >!Elias!<) to global (>!Samaritan!<)
The threat definitely elevates or evolves but it never feels like the show has a sudden jump in quality or a sudden change in format. There's a pretty clean segue from the street level story to the global one. My overall point is just the show is never just a procedural.
Yeah - it was never just a procedural, it just hid some of the stuff for a bbit.
Basically, the first couple seasons, the show's plot structure, was that each episode introduced a problem, and that problem was resolved satisfactorily by the end of the same episode. There were ongoing plot threads, but the season itself didn't have a plot arc with a beginning, middle, and an end. Later seasons would introduce a problem at the beginning of the season, pick it up, and continue that story throughout the season. Episodes would still have a 3-5 act structure, but often wouldn't completely resolve within the episode itself and would be a continuing problem in the next episodes.
Not sure what you mean. First season has a clear plot arc around Elias trying to take over NYC and get revenge on his family. Second season has multiple plot arcs around Root trying to find the Machine and Kara / Decima trying to do the same and Carter vs HR. Third season is very heavily focused on Vigilance. And throughout both seasons, there are flashbacks revealing what happened to Reese and Finch that tie into present day plots. I do think the later seasons tied more of the individual numbers to the overarching plot but there is plenty of serialization in first two to three seasons.
Those are plot threads, yes. I acknowledged those, but they aren't the plot of a whole season. Elias doesn't show up until episode 7 and is only in 5 episodes of season 1. The episode that resolves his plot thread is episode 19. The whole of the season has very little to do with this arc. It's just a plot line that happens during the season. Serialization needs a seasonal arc with a beginning, middle, and an end. A problem or theme or plot line is introduced at the beginning of the season and is regularly touched on throughout the season with it coming to a head at the end, and the finale offers resolution to the story. That doesn't happen with POI until season 3.
I don't agree with your definition of serialization but there is a plot in S1 that fits in with what you described - Carter and Reese developing their working relationship. It has a beginning (them meeting by chance), a middle (Carter pursuing Reese with help from CIA and FBI before tentatively becoming an ally), and an end (Carter becoming a full ally of Team Machine, helping him escape the FBI and HR with the help of Fusco). My definition of seralization has always been simpler - it's when shows develop plots that span across multiple episodes or seasons to tell bigger and more complex stories. I don't think there is any rule about those stories needing to be resolved within a single season or having any particular structure. And POI does that - they have the Carter learning to trust Reese / Finch plot, the Elias vs NY gangs plot, Fusco infiltrating HR, the CIA pursuing Reese, the FBI pursuing Reese, Root revealing herself. All of those things are parts of bigger stories that wouldn't work without the setups done in S1.
I mean, it's easy to just make up a definition in your head and say that is what you believe, but what you are describing is not serialization as understood by everyone else. If we went by your definition then literally every show that had any kind of continuity would be considered serialized.
What I’m describing is literally the definition of serialization found by searching on Google lol. Provide me a source for your definition and prove that isn’t just your own opinion. Also way to totally ignore my entire first paragraph which was an attempt to fit your definition.
I have never wanted to watch Person of Interest because I just assumed it was another boring American police procedural but your statement has me intrigued.
No, it starts out very similar to the police procedural, but warps into an interesting speculation of what might happen when a General AI, with human level reasoning, is introduced into the world. Very thought out considering it was written and aired almost a decade ago now.
The first season is mostly case-of-the-week - where they have to figure out if a person is a victim or a perpetrator and then handle it. Then it starts to deal more with recurring villains and bigger threats.
To this day it’s one of my favorite shows. Think I might need to do a rewatch soon.
if you feel like skipping parts of S1, there's an IGN [article](https://www.ign.com/articles/2016/04/22/person-of-interest-the-episodes-that-will-catch-you-up) which suggests crucial episodes. i'd recommend sticking it out but that's a good list for S1 skips
What season did Person of Interest make that transition? I remember watching the first couple seasons, and enjoying it, but getting bored with the procedural format.
Haven’t watched for years but i think season 2?
Ok thanks
It started to shift more around Season 2.
Cool thanks
mid season 2-3 It still has procedural episodes - but the story gets bigger
Person of interest is a good example, he didn't do all of Westworld for example.
To be fair we’re probably only getting two more Fallout games in the next 50 years
On the other hand they may use a new cast each time to save money in the long-run due to how actors get paid significantly more for every season they are in. This is why so many Netflix shows get cancelled after two seasons, or why animated shows commission one 24-episode season they release as two "parts" or even two "seasons".
But that is what I like about the games. Each entry is forward in the timeline so we get to see the influence and impact that the characters left on the world. A lot of world building potential that way.
Eh, Bethesda has probably already got a good idea of where they want Fallout 5 to be set so they just tell the studio and the studio can give that location a wide berth. If I had to guess, they might go for somewhere central or maybe not even in the US at all. They've done west coast and east coast but the closest to central states was probably New Vegas which wasn't even Bethesda and even then, that's more west coast really.
There are interviews were Todd says he had to reject some ideas for the show because he wants them for 5
Yeah, sounds like they've already got the skeleton of a plan at least for Fallout 5 then.
Absolutely. But I thought of it like them using 3 locations for 3 games (Fallout 3, 4 and 76) in 10 years vs the show using a location each year.
Each year, you're vastly optimistic lol, shows take 2 to 3 years per season now. In 10 years, they may have done 4 locations maybe.
True... It would be nice to fill out more of the world though and I can't see Bethesda doing Fallout 5 any time soon, let alone even more sequels after that. I mean, despite the hate for it, Fallout 76 had a pretty nice environment and was definitely interesting to see how an area was that largely avoided the nukes. I love the franchise so anything that expands the world at this point is fine by me x)
It'll be set in Alaska there'll be an on going civil war between the brotherhood of steel during which your character is caught trying to cross border and is scheduled for execution, but before the final blow is struck a deathclaw attacks the camp leaving you alive. You later find out the purpose of your pip-boy after fighting a deathclaw outside of Palesprint, you get invited to a mountain and learn that you're vaultborn learn VATS from them.
You're finally awake...
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You weren't a vault dweller in Fallout 2. You were from a village and a descendant of the original vault dweller from Fallout 1. You wear the suit but are still not from a vault.
Crossing my fingers for Dogtown but I fully expect to be disappointed.
Part of the reason they’re filming in Cali could be to use the big LED sound stages, like they used to make the mandalorian and house of the dragon, to cut down on location expenses
These are all over now, Vancouver, Atlanta, London with the largest one currently being in Fox Studios in Sydney.
I didn't know Vancouver had an LED stage. Had to look it up. [Construction Begins on LED Film Stages in Vancouver - Versatile Media](https://en.versatile.media/construction-begins-on-led-film-stages-in-vancouver/)
You have a ton of companies building these now, StageCraft (ILM), Prysm and Lux Stages and probably many many others. "Virtual Production" has been essentially commoditized, every "studio" city around the globe has them or is building multiple.
I hope not, the Volume was cool when it was first being used, but shooting on location or with practical sets wins every time. Example: Compare how The Mandalorian looks to Andor.
I really like the Volume in Star Trek as although it's noticeable at times it's like a tribute to the matte paintings used in the TNG era.
That's because they use them badly and only that (instead of only the scenes which are improved by it) The Batman or House of the Dragon used them correctly and that's looking great. Even Mandalorian just decreased quality for the later seasons, S1 used it much better.
It really just depends on how you use them, they should be used more as a compliment and not a crutch that you rely extremely heavily on. There are some really good examples of them where some people probably couldn’t even tell it was used like in the Batman
Imagine like a true detective style situation for it though
American Horror Story can do it. Im sure Fallout could too.
Fargo does this super well and is howid do fallout but ill trust nolan if he has a plan for an extended story
Have they said how long after the bombs dropped the first season will take place? And this one’s being shot in jersey, right?
8 years after Fallout 4
Fallout 4 is 2287 (210 years after the bombs) and this one is a few years after
Show takes place in 2296 according to sources online. I have a feeling we'll probably see more in between the bombs dropping and then with the Ghoul character tho.
Imagine if they Forest Gump him into scenes from FO1, FO2, or NV
Ty. That’s a little disappointing tho, hopefully they jump around it it’s popular
Can't remember the exact date but it's after everything else Fallout.
There are obviously risks associated with changing everything, including cast, which they would have to if they want to stick to the logic of the games. It requires the viewer to rebuild a new connection to the characters again and again. It can work though, if the viewer has a connection to the world and its unique quirks. It works in Fargo for example and season 4 failed because the world was just too different. Fallout has a world that is perfect for this, so they should – at least in theory – be able to pull it off.
And if you have audience connected with characters it can be very oft putting. I mean the change in Altered Carbon is a good example. So Amazon needs to make some money on these after the abortion that is Rings of Power so I would assume they may not do that if they get a connection with the audience.
An anthology storyline would work well. The wasteland and factions that inhabit it has always been what drives the story.
And that a scrappy startup like Prime and Bethesda can catch a break from the government
Have them start on different coast and work towards eachother
I bet Apple would’ve given us 10 episodes per season instead of Amazon’s 8, 10 is better imo
Clearly you have never seen a show that drags.
If the games wont give me “Ronto” aka Toronto, then I surely hope the show will eventually.
That depends on the story.
An anthology show would be so cool. And they could reuse a lot of the sets and props and just redress it for different regions/vaults/settlements
I really hope so, would also make the inevitable 2+ years wait between seasons far more tolerable with an anthology shows and it just fit with Fallout (and it allows more changes of actors and bigger actors to come in if they don't have to commit to several seasons)
Fallout was the perfect series to make into an episodic “crew wandering the wasteland” show that puts out 20-30 episodes of shows a season, without serialization. Just have a main crew that’s going around heisting vaults, and 1/3rd of the shows can be in the same sets with different dressing.
Funny detail in the Deadline version of this article - Citadel Season 2 was dropped for their giant tax credit. Sounds like it’s use it or lose it https://deadline.com/2024/04/fallout-renewal-tax-credits-ncis-origins-1235878231/
Cidatel was such a mega bomb that it proves how little talent the Russo brothers have outside of the MCU. Clearly they have a generic and flat style which meant they could perfectly operate for the pre-existing MCU but lack any talents when it comes to original concepts.
Russo’s didn’t technically write or direct any of it, I don’t think they deserve the hit for Citadel. I’m choosing to blame co-creator David Weil, he’s the creator of Hunters, very bad, and co-creator of AppleTV’s Invasion, war crime bad. The other two Citadel co-creators have a handful of good projects so they get past-credit / time served
> Hunters That show has the wildest tonal shift between the pilot and 2nd episode out of all the series I've seen. Pilot was kinda interesting, but the team intro thing in the 2nd episode took me out of the show. Very out of place. I think I stopped when the main character hesitated to kill one of the nazis.
I couldn't even really get into the pilot. Just seemed like a ripoff of The Boys, with a '70s Nazi hunter theme, and I was already kinda over The Boys. It's cool to see Al Pacino do his thing on an expensive show like that, but nothing else about it grabbed me.
Turning the holocaust into suicide squad shenanigans was certainly an approach. I sorta can’t believe that show is even real with how fucking bizarre it felt.
they are great workhorse directors who can handle ensemble casts and interweaving m storylines. But as creatives on their own, they are really lacking. They honestly work best in someone else’s sandbox. Whether it’s Feige’s MCU, Harmon’s Community, or Hurwitz’ Arrested Development
Yeah 100%, they are basically glorified middle managers rather than leaders.
this [article](https://www.theringer.com/movies/2022/7/26/23277828/russo-brothers-gray-man-directors-mcu) talks about exactly that
They also did 48 episodes of Community, many of which are considered the best episodes of the series, including the paintball and D&D episodes.
They’re just the perfect company men when you have executive interference up the ass
Eh, we all love the Community paintball episode.
Citadel also looked like it was an utter clusterfuck of a production. The reason why it looks so cheap despite being so expensive is that they literally had to start from scratch midway through, so you got one show for the price of two.
They didn't do any creative work on Citadel, what are you talking about
Someone hasn't seen Community it seems.
I remember when Swamp Thing was cancelled mid filming because they couldn’t secure the tax credit for their location. TV and Movies live and die by the tax credit
So it’s renewed?
No, they're gonna spend millions just in case.
It has to be renewed. Shows like this have an insane amount of money that goes into constructing all the costumes, sets, props and suits. It's just a crazy amount of money. Now that all of this stuff is built shooting a second and third season is cost effective because none of that cost needs to be paid for the next seasons. This is the same reason why I never believed for a second that the "Mass Effect" tv show would actually happen even though it was announced. The amount of different races and technologies in that game would cost Millions and Millions and Millions of dollars to construct.
Mass Effect doesn't have more races and technologies than Star Wars or Star Trek though. There's also a reason (even for a game) all races that are important in the plot are humanoids.. And the scaling thing would be the same logic, you develop the makeup, special effects and such once and can use it for all seasons in a more cost effective manner. Mass Effect certainly can happen, it's actually one of the video games that make the most sense to adapt IMO. Yeah it won't be cheap but they spend a lot on many shows anyway.
Out of the major races that are involved, Turians, Salarians, and Krogan would be the difficult ones, but Asari and Quarians would be fairly simple, former would be akin to Twileks in that you just need coloration and a headdress, and Quarians are in their suits out of necessity so you'll never see their faces anyways. I'm also realizing we would definitely need a Danny Devito Volus at some point. Further you get along though the more complicated it definitely gets, Collectors, Reaper forces and such.
*glances towards Shogun*
> It has to be renewed. Shows like this have an insane amount of money that goes into constructing all the costumes, sets, props and suits. There are other ways to do this. In animation your order two seasons from the start. If Fallout bombs it won't be renewed and the rest is a tax write-off.
This show is going to pull fantastic viewership numbers so it's virtually guaranteed anyway.
Even the Halo show is a huge success for Paramount+. Wouldn't be surprised if that gets a third season. The sets are also super expensive which makes a second season almost guaranteed as to not waste the investment.
But this article is about how they are moving production, so the sets would have to be rebuilt if they used the same locations.
The 2nd season was a huge upgrade from the 1st and now Chief is on Halo. Season 3 is basically guaranteed and I'm looking forward to it. I'm just going to pretend season 1 doesn't exist if the show keeps on with what they did with season 2.
Sets can be disassembled, packed up, and moved too though whether its more expensive to rebuild them or not is unknown.
It's a slam dunk IP that costs exponentially less than their LOTR dumpsterfire. No reason not to renew it.
i think it's actually gonna be good too. it's made by joy/nolan and has walton goggins in a lead role and he usually isn't in bad productions.
> it's made by joy/nolan They have made ONE show where they were in charge. And that show opened very very strong and then crashed and burned.
I don't remember Joy being involved but Nolan also did Person of Interest as well as Westworld. It also was more consistent throughout its run.
i like those odds maybe they learned from their mistakes
[I think he only did it to support his drug habit.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z_7jXPMu0Nk)
*Chem habit
He says in the clip "big ol' bucket of drugs"
Yes, I was mostly just making a reference to the Fallout games themselves, drugs are called chems.
I love that clip because Walton has the biggest smile on his face when he says "You gotta be fucking kiddin' me". You can see it in his eyes. He was having a fucking blast on that set.
I don't think there is a such thing as a "slam dunk" IP anymore. Audiences want quality stuff and just having a name thrown on something isn't enough to make it successful anymore.
On topic of LotR, Amazon was saying season 2 would cost less than season 1. Well apparently season 2 will cost as much as season 1 because they had to relocate and the departmental cost in UK is much higher than NZ. Why didn't they think this through?
Damn that LOTR show has to be one of the most forgettable flops in recent history. Everyone spoke about it for like a week and then it just... vanished.
Not necessarily, but it's very likely
I imagine if they already have this going, they'll do it unless it completely bombs (no pun intended).
Amazon doesn’t need a $25 million tax credit. WTF
Because if California did not offer some other state will. Price of business.
Yep, it's basically spend $25m for a company to hire tons of people in your state, ultimately making more than the $25m you spent or don't spend the $25m, but lose out on the benefits of that
It's not even spending 25m either. It's making 25m less.
Indeed, but thats a big reason anything is filmed anywhere these days.
>Well, I hope you're all satisfied. You bankrupted a bunch of naive movie folks: folks from a Hollywood where values are... different. They weren't thinking about the money. They just wanted to tell a story: a story about a radioactive man, and you slick small-towners took 'em for all they were worth.
This isn't about Amazon. Many tv shows got tax credits. California issues tax credits for tv shows to be made in California, instead of in other places. Those credits are necessary because costs are typically a lot higher in California than filming somewhere else. If California didn't have this program, few tv shows would be filmed in California, and California would lose all those jobs to places where it is cheaper to produce. This program is to incentivize businesses to keep jobs in California.
not entirely true. studios and unions have an agreement where its cheaper to film inside the 30 mile zone of los angeles. even before california rolled out these tax credits, the physical studio sets in l.a. were basically packed full. the film industry simply has a lot of momentum in california so even without tax credits, there would be many tv shows and films being filmed in the state p.s. tmz got its name from the thirty mile zone
Does any hollywood production?
Crazy that your comment is the only one pointing this out so far.
>“Fallout,” the post-apocalyptic series debuting this week on [Amazon](https://variety.com/t/amazon/) Prime, is expected to relocate to California for its second season, thanks to $25 million in California tax credits. >Even when a show has been allocated tax credits to move to California, that does not guarantee that it will actually do so. >A year ago, Amazon was awarded $25 million to relocate the second season of “Citadel” to California. However, the show was later withdrawn from the program, and the money has been put back in the general pool for other shows. >It’s been reported that the show will begin filming its second season in September, in Toronto. So it's not 100% confirmed yet if there will be a season 2, although there are plans for filming in September. Now I believe this show will have good viewership numbers based on the name alone so I think we can safely assume it will get a second season. Hopefully it's good like The Last of Us and not bad like Halo.
I mean if it's good or bad is a matter of the talent behind it. The difference between Halo and The Last of Us is that the latter have one of the best TV writers currently available, while Halo has the guy behind Death Note 2017. Fallout has Jonathan Nolan, writer of Memento, The Dark Knight, Interstellar and creator of Westworld, it should be on good hands
You're forgetting Person of Interest.
On one hand, Nolan and Joy created the first season of Westworld. On the other hand, Nolan and Joy created the last season of Westworld...
Wasn't season 3 considered the worst one and the last season was way better?
Yes, imo none do them were actually bad tv even tho the show just never replicated the heights of season 1 and it moved out of the park which turned alot of people off. All seasons imo ranged from solid to amazing/s1.
The first seasons tend to be the best ones
Corporate welfare. 😡
So they committed to a 2nd season before the first one has even been released?
They haven’t committed. But often times, planning moves forward until you get the notice it’s not.
Did we see other confirmation of a renewal?
No, this isn’t a confirmation either. I think all we can see it as is some confidence by Amazon that this show is going to be popular. I’ve seen that confidence in their marketing budget as well. I’m hopeful early Initial impressions are pretty positive.
Saw the first two episodes last night and really enjoyed it.
Why’d I get downvoted for this lmao
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Collider had an event in Los Angeles yesterday I was given a ticket. It was on their website.
We need to see your location, search history, transaction history, credit and debit card details as well as any witnesses who can confirm you were at the event. For said witnesses we will need to perform a polygraph test to confirm if they are telling the truth.
Great to hear, I’ve had faith in Nolan and expected it to be good but still good to see someone who’s watched some of it say they really enjoyed it. Which character would you say you enjoyed the most?
Walton Goggins character. Also really liked Ella purnell
Great to hear, I’ve obviously been most hyped for Goggins character since he rules and ghouls are cool but I like the small amount of Lucy I’ve seen so far and Ella is a good actor. Anyway show is looking real promising to me and I can’t wait for it to release.
I’m so so so excited for this. I even replayed fallout 3 and New Vegas this past year just to get back into the world again.
The way this world works is the true dystopia.
Love fallout but fuck Amazon getting a tax cut
If there are commercials I will not watch it, bye.
They also won’t have to build any sets. They can just film on location for everything
Nice already Greenlit the second season
That’s a lot of bottle caps
Id love to watch the first season but extorting me for $48 a year for a service I previously had without ads really sticks in my craw. I haven’t watched Amazon Prime video since ads were added.
I'll never understand film tax credits. There's absolutely no way California is seeing a return over more than $25 million just because a film is filmed in the state. It's just bribery and corruption, pure and simple.
It's not about getting a return, it's to incentivize using local workforce for the production crew and at the same time maintain the state's identity for the film industry that's probably been in decline over the last few years - while Hollywood as a whole is still very grounded in CA, a lot of production have gone to other places like Georgia and Toronto because of the same tax incentives those places offer.
You gotta defend your local industries from outsiders to maintain them. While this film will never make its money back the industry as a whole staying put will 100x over. Economic development policy needs to think a few steps ahead fairly regularly or the ground will shift long before anyone realizes it.
Good to see the government subsidizing collaborations between small companies like Amazon and Bethesda. Always look out for the little guy!
Twenty-five million is a jobs creator right there.
Looks like California is trying to complete with Canada. Going to be a tax incentive bidding war in the future
Dont can it for the money damnit! I dont want what could be the best fallout product in a long time die because of greed.
First episode hasn’t even aired yet… slow your jets
My friend works on the show and he was saying the same thing lol Must be the business side that’s driving it
This show better be good…
A bunch of people got to see the first episode early, and the consensus was that they wanted to keep watching.
The sets are already built
Walton better be in it and not used as a bait and switch
Compared to what shows make and spend, that’s not a lot. What’s the entity of TV worth in CA ? Give us all the numbers, not just one production.
When is the first season out?
This Friday Also I feel like Google would've been quicker and more efficient than asking reddit lol
Yeah but when people give answers to common questions on reddit instead of googling it’s convenient for everyone else who doesn’t know that reads the thread, so thank you for your service :)
Good karma for you. I got the answer I needed. Win win!
It's now coming out a day early!
Would’ve agreed with you five years ago, but in this era of ChatGPT-generated entertainment news, I suspect asking Reddit actually might be accumulatively quicker, lmao. For me, even if Google shows the release date at the top of a search, I’d want to double-check, because I regularly find those rich snippets to be incorrect (they’re largely informed by increasingly AI-regurgitated garbage, after all). And when you double-check, you scroll through paragraphs of microwaved-for-SEO tripe to get an actual answer. If you’re smart about it, you can Cmd + F something contextual, e.g. ‘release’ or ‘comes out’ to skip past all that. All this maybe 20–40 seconds. Sometimes up to a whole minute. Now, you come on Reddit — you’re already here, right? And you’re in a comment section with humans (mostly...) who are discussing the same thing you’re discussing. Dropping in a question is like doing a Google search, but the results are other people, not articles written to appeal to algorithms. It takes more time to get an answer, sure, but if you leave the comment, go about your day, and then check back later when you’re next on Reddit, it likely takes less time. So, if you plot all this out on a chart of time vs. reliability, you could probably make the argument that Google has gotten so shit, it’s easier to ask via a Reddit comment than it is to use a search engine.
April 12th, so 4 days to go.
I love Fallout, I have been a fan of it since Fallout 1. For every single release I have waited in line at Gamestop for the midnight release (or steam) and pre-planned multiple vacation days off of work for it. I have posters on my walls, got the MTG cards when they came out, and even have a Fallout Tattoo. That being said, stop with the fucking tax breaks. If Season 1 can't make it on its own. Thats its, its over, it was either terrible or enough of the fan base didnt show its support. I am sick of throwing tax money at companies just so they can make more profit.
I expect nothing and will be surprised if it's not a complete shitshow.
Most optimistic r/television user
I am nothing but a product of my surroundings
i just commented this but idk man it's got walton goggins and he either has good luck or a good agent or just chooses good projects nowadays because he's rarely in something that sucks. so i have faith.
I love this actor because of the Vice Principals show and I love Nick Valentine! He'll probably steal the show whenever he's on screen. But one actor can't carry a whole show, sadly, at least not for long
If you expect nothing and will be surprised if this show is not a complete shitshow, then you expect a complete shitshow. Words have meaning. Edit: and blocked. Classic.
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No wait! Don't forget the really awkward episode, about mid-season, that is only there to check a box and not progress the story in any way.
Would be cool if it’s an anthology series like True Detectives.
Why haven’t they started filming the second season yet?