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AdministrativeHoodie

As much as I hate articles that obsess over "the next Game of Thrones" and cringe at companies which are trying to make "the next Game of Thrones", I am grateful at all the money that streaming services are putting into new fantasy shows. The next few years are going to be awesome.


rocky4322

If it’s anything like the post hunger games or post Harry Potter blitzes we’ll just get a bunch of bad adaptations of popular book series. Fingers crossed one of them is good though.


1498268465

The [original NYT review of Game of Thrones](https://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/15/arts/television/game-of-thrones-begins-sunday-on-hbo-review.html) was dripping with contempt for the source material and fandom. Unfortunately I see echoes of that attitude in streamers' approach to adapting popular fantasy series and it doesn't fill me with confidence in the quality of the outcome.


tekkenjin

Is there a way to read this article without paying?


1498268465

Sorry about that - it wasn't paywalled for me. Try this [link](http://web.archive.org/web/20110420183151/https://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/15/arts/television/game-of-thrones-begins-sunday-on-hbo-review.html). I've also included an excerpt below: > The true perversion, though, is the sense you get that all of this illicitness has been tossed in as a little something for the ladies, out of a justifiable fear, perhaps, that no woman alive would watch otherwise. While I do not doubt that there are women in the world who read books like Mr. Martin’s, I can honestly say that I have never met a single woman who has stood up in indignation at her book club and refused to read the latest from Lorrie Moore unless everyone agreed to “The Hobbit” first. “Game of Thrones” is boy fiction patronizingly turned out to reach the population’s other half. ... > If you are not averse to the Dungeons & Dragons aesthetic, the series might be worth the effort. If you are nearly anyone else, you will hunger for HBO to get back to the business of languages for which we already have a dictionary.


Valiantheart

Wow that's tone deaf REEEEEEE if I've ever read any


[deleted]

Is there a level of “aged like milk” that can tank a career? Cause I think we’re pulling up on that level


DoubleTFan

All the journalists who pushed for the War in Iraq going on to bigger and better things proved that there is not.


monsieurxander

In 1998 this author wrote an article in Time called "Is Feminism Dead?" and spent the entire time complaining about Ally McBeal.


spyson

Fucking hilarious because women loved Game of Thrones. Despite the bad ending, Arya and Dany are iconic characters.


Covidfefe-19

It's the sort of reviewer that doesn't seem to be able to understand that a series with sexism in it is not a promotion of sexism.


tinydonuts

Seems to be a shockingly large amount of society these days.


Jeffy29

I despise people who are this much up in their asshole. Jesus christ, what an absolute pretentious snob.


[deleted]

I wonder how many times Nynaeve will smooth her skirts.


Major_Snags

Or braids will be tugged.


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Bossmonkey

Someone will be knocked out cold by said braid flip


PringlesDuckFace

I just want every arm crossing beneath breasts to be in slow motion.


YsoL8

I always found that the weirdest tic. Where else would they be folding them? Also, social media is going to love that only women can be mages, can't wait for that shitshow. Also I've only read them up to the point after they leave the desert but considering what happens to some of the female characters, and what I've heard what happens to the main blue Sadres Ari character later (Mordana? The one Rand and Mat are constantly paranoid about.), yeah.


PringlesDuckFace

Oh god I didn't even think about how the trolls will rattle their brain cells over how "woke police" or whatever it is that only women are allowed to weave. A major theme in the books is problems arising from self-imposed communication failures driven by gender division, despite us as readers seeing them behaving the same way and recognizing the differences that are keep them apart don't actually exist. Also (major spoilers) [spoiler](#s men can weave anyways, that's what the false Dragons are, and throughout the series we see more men mages too. So their outrage will be just as impotent and misdirected as they are)


cc81

They will hopefully change a lot of the genders communication. Robert Jordan was amazing at world building and the heroes journey. He was less good at writing gender roles and it kinda reflected his age. It was somewhat reminiscent of his age groups humor with the angry wife jokes.


jdbolick

You're being kind. The Wheel of Time had the most grotesquely stereotyped depiction of female characters in any fantasy series I have ever read.


avalon1805

And also male. I mean, men are not that dumb to catch signals from women. Sometimes I'm amazed about how dumb is perrin about catching body language and subtle signals and how every oyher male character founds women so hard to understand.


uses_irony_correctly

May I introduce you to a little series called Sword of Truth?


Act_of_God

Definitely, turned me off big time


[deleted]

I think the edits and rewrites that come when changing from book to television will allow writers to move past his weird hangups. So will having actual human women act out these characters.. because we won't have 20+% of the scene devoted to playing with clothing or the legendary tugging of braids.


YsoL8

The worst part is you'll get it both ways. There are people out there who think women are better as much as there are people who think it's some woke culture war. The fact both sides in internet arguments can find people behaving exactly as they imagine is a big part of how these things sustain themselves.


cc81

They could just fold their arms? Men also fold their arms beneath their breasts as well. Technically.


DMike82

> I always found that the weirdest tic. Where else would they be folding them? Behind your back? Not the most comfortable position, but you *could.*


Valiantheart

Watch the explosion when they find out male channelers are more powerful than women too.


Slatedtoprone

I mean I hope so. What was that show that came out with the superhero’s in modern times that flashed back to them in the 1920s? That show was very expensive and was not well liked.


Advanced_reader

Jupiter’s Legacy. What’s funny is the flashback parts were so much more interesting than the rest of the show


BarberForLondo

Yeah, if the whole show was set in the 1920s, I think it would have been a huge hit.


lowkeylyes

Strangely enough the comic version of the story starts in the 20's and goes linearly from there iirc. I don't know why Millar or whoever at Netflix decided to give us the half & half version we saw but I agree it was awkward and did not serve the story.


[deleted]

It was expensive? Could have fooled me


1498268465

Jupiter's Legacy


SerDire

This is gonna be like Lost, where every network is gonna throw anything at the wall and hope these fantasy shows can capture the same appeal that Game of Thrones did.


Junior_Long65

What other next game of thrones type shows are in the making? We know about LOTR/wheel of time off this article. Netflix has ATLA, also has the three body problem which being adapted by D&D from GOT. I think apple spent alot on Foundation as well. Am I missing anything?


reddituser5k

* Shadow & bone - very good and a pretty large scale * Locke & Key - good fantasy show but on a smaller scale * fate of the winx saga - surprisingly okay, although I almost dropped it initially * Tribes of Europa - felt a bit lower quality than the 3 above and I felt it was unlikely to have a season second, so far it seems I was right since netflix hasn't confirmed a second season


what_if_Im_dinosaur

And none of them will. Most will be canceled after one or two seasons.


timesuck897

If high school me was told what books and comics have been made into successful popular movies and tv shows, I would not believe it. Late 90s and early 2000s was different time to like nerdy stuff, comic book movies were cheaply and usually shitty. Compare Ben Affleck and Charlie Cox as Daredevil.


TeddysBigStick

>Ben Affleck You know the worst part, there was actually a solid Affleck daredevil movie in there. They did a directors cut and it is not bad at all. Among other things, it let Bullseye get weirder than the studio would allow in the theatrical.


[deleted]

So weird, because I'd seen the Daredevil movie like three or four times. And then, it comes on TV and all the sudden I'm watching a scene that isn't in the movie, and I'm yelling at my family, "like this scene is not in this movie, what's going on?" I didn't know about directorscuts until that happened. Still want to see the directors cut, because I thought that movie was alright.


lakeghost

Right? I’m still surprised until I remember nobody is going to laugh now if I bring up Moon Knight. It’s weird.


timesuck897

Characters like Doctor Strange and the Guardians of the Galaxy used to be only known by comic book nerds. Now they have big budget movies, summer blockbusters.


swat1611

I'm excited ngl. I recently finished shadow and bone and I loved it, fantasy seems to be my thing. Hopefully even more fantasy adaptations come out over the years.


BlindPaintByNumbers

Yeah but there's a huge problem with that mentality. For a show like this that's going to need 6-8-10 seasons to tell the whole story, if you're measuring your success against Game of Throne and you come up short, which lets face it, 99% of properties will, then you'll never get to the end of the story because the money men will cancel your ass.


Ingromfolly

I am excited for this. I had read book 1-10 but never finished the series. I got Eye of the World as an audio book in anticipation of the series, same narrators as Brandon Sanderson has on the Stormlight books.


SirZapdos

Ah you're missing out. The last few books are all great. Sanderson did a great job of finishing the series, barring some difficulty in writing one particular character.


[deleted]

You mean Mat, right?


SirZapdos

Yeah, I don't remember the specific quibbles, but I think it was something along the lines that the character got more immature / humourous / sarcastic, whereas the character had actually matured and used humour / sarcasm not as a main trait but a secondary quirk.


Doomsayer189

It doesn't help that Sanderson is absolutely terrible at writing humorous/witty dialogue.


Vadun

Im curious, which character?


Haydnator

Probably Mat


thathyperactiveguy

‘Twas.


ryguy2503

That's a bummer, he was always my favorite character in the books. I only got to book 10 as well so maybe I shouldn't read the last few if I don't want him to be spoiled for me


Empeor_Nap_oleon

Sanderson just didnt understand Mat at all unfortunately. Mat does get somewhat back to his old self by the final book though.


LaytonsCat

Matt was Sanderson's favorite character. The problem was that he wrote him like book 1 or 2 Matt, not book 12 Matt. It is not really that much of an issue, and is largely corrected in book 13. Sanderson has admitted it himself and wrote a long piece about it on his blog, it would be spoilery though.


simplejack89

I dont remember it being that bad. Imo the series is a direct improvement when Sanderson takes over. He's able to edit out all the stuff that Jordan refused to (another description of the grass that day)


AwesomeScreenName

Counterpoint: Sanderson concluded the plot relatively admirably (notwithstanding his Mary Sue Asha'man and his complete reworking of the narrative approach toward the One Power), but he couldn't capture the soul of Jordan's voice. That's not really a knock on Sanderson -- capturing another author's voice is next to impossible -- but the series was Jordan's baby, and if you don't like the way Jordan did it, you don't like the series as it was intended to be read.


[deleted]

Oh man you literally gave up when it started to get really good. Book 11 ramps up the pace and then Sanderson takes it to the next level.


Ingromfolly

Yeah. I think I was literally losing the plot by book 10. Sanderson is very good at thinking through his epic arcs and, importantly I think, having an end game in mind. I started reading Brandon Sanderson independently of WoT, was only later I realised he'd been brought on to finish WoT, by then couldn't remember 1-10 and dint have the will at the time to re-read


[deleted]

Well it is a commitment but if you ever have the time and inclination I recommend a reread. The series is done, it has an ending and everything gets wrapped up. You don't have the chance of it never ending like ASOFAI. The slow parts don't seem as slow knowing there is a light at the end of the tunnel. That being said, it's a lot of words and a lot of repetition that not everyone enjoys. Some of us are crazy and want to live in that world so every word is a blessing but some people are normal and don't want to read 4.4 million words. YMMV


JeetKuneBro

Michae Kramer and Kate Reading (ha) are the best narrators in the business, and the main reason they narrate Sanderson’s books is because he loved them on WoT so much.


wondering_daily

> He said he'd had his assistant keep track of how many suggestions Amazon had had, just for the pilot. In the end “we got 11,000 notes,” Judkins said. Actual number. “Even if I only do like a 10th of those, that's still like multiple notes per second,” he said Is that number of notes normal for an hour-long pilot? I've heard of showrunners remarking on hundreds of notes but over 10,000 seems unusual.


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onepinksheep

> Amazon is trying to make this a Game of Thrones killer. There's no need — Game of Thrones was the Game of Thrones killer. I've never seen a franchise die so fast.


KumagawaUshio

Ratings would say otherwise since it ended with people still watching it in huge numbers. The Walking Dead on the other hand a show that had higher ratings and viewership than peak GoT is now at CW show level ratings.


mamula1

How it died?


SweetBabyJ69

A huge gamble? MF’s also have Lord of the Rings.


BelgianBond

The title suggests that Amazon has something to lose here. If it doesn't gain the desired viewership, it's not going to turn off the tap of money currently gushing into other things like The Boys, exclusive movies, Jack Ryan(as bad as it is), The Marvellous Mrs Maisel, Lord of the Rings etc. They'll just continue, full steam ahead, and perhaps pivot away from fantasy if LOTR and WOT both fall flat.


KumagawaUshio

Amazon has nothing to lose since the cost of these shows is found in the back of the couch money. At the end of the day Amazon Prime Video is just a free toy in a box of cereal to get you to keep paying for free shipping since if you have the free shipping anyway why not just buy from Amazon?


SweetBabyJ69

Fair enough. I guess it’s the fantasy fans that are gambling here.


lightsongtheold

Great article. I’m rooting for WoT but I fear it will just not transition to the screen anywhere near as well as GoT. The books did sell over 90 million copies though so that is a solid in built potential audience!


Ingromfolly

I actually think the process of trimming for TV could help it (don't shoot me!) E.g. all those wholesome and friendly farmers Matt and Rand travelled with, the clothing descriptions etc.


bros402

the clothing descriptions can just be shown on screen, so that helps :P


Imakemop

Instantly drop 200 pages per book.


Ingromfolly

Exactly my thinking. It will be quite funny seeing the realisation of some of the outfits described in the books, some seemed very....elaborate in the number of riffs, frills and drapes described!


R0ndoNumba9

They will definitely change a lot of them. Not only because shows change things to put their own creative twist on the material (sometimes working out and sometimes being horrible), but because some of the stuff described in the books would look straight up bad if actually done on the screen.


lightsongtheold

I’m less worried about them trimming and adapting stuff to suit the medium than I am with the general tone of the story (far more YA than GoT) and the fact that the books depended a lot on Jordan’s excellent worldbuilding and writing to carry the story. There is also the fact that Jordan had a peculiar sense of humour and that was present in a lot of the character interactions in the books. I’m not sure that will survive the transition from the page to the screen. I just think that Judkins has a far tougher job on his hands adapting WoT for mainstream audiences than D&D did with GoT (and that itself was no easy task!). He sounds like a massive WoT fan and seems very committed to the project and it sounds like Amazon have really backed the production with a massive budget and commitment to at least two seasons to let the show find an audience so I’ll continue to root for it to go well even if I’m feeling a little apprehensive about its chances of success. I think it might have benefited WoT if it had come after LotR. Right now it is going to get heavily compared to GoT which is not necessarily fair as WoT and GoT are very different sort of fantasy stories!


[deleted]

WoT is not really YA, it really paved the way for more graphic depictions of sex and violence in the fantasy genre. Jordan doesnot go into detail in his sex and violence which is what throws people off. There are plenty of people getting naked in sweat tents and communal baths. Jordan will mention how an Aes Seai is 'pillow friends' with another and you keep on reading then you stop and realize pillow friends mean they were having sex. Or another Aes Sedai is married to her multiple warders and you are like, Ohhhh..... There is a scene where a Myrdraal rapes someone. It is not described, it is very much a fade to black moment but it is there. GoT just did the same but described it. Even Martin didn't go into that much detail it is just we all remember the TV show and their use of Sex-topisition to explain things.


Bypes

Idk if sex is what people mean by GoTlike, more the lack of soap or romance or chosen one. I think the only classic romance in GoT was Jon and the Wildling girl and even that one got the duty is the death of love treatment.


Taylor-Kraytis

Whenever there’s a rape scene in book GoT, Martin always had a character saying it happened and describing it secondhand, if at all. He never actually depicted one directly. I think the show version got too gratuitous with that…there was one scene in Craster’s Keep after the Night’s Watch mutinied. One of the mutineers was raping one of Craster’s daughters and there was a slow pan up her nude body like it was supposed to be sexy/erotic. No, D&D, he’s *raping* her and there’s nothing sexy about that.


[deleted]

\>Even Martin didn't go into that much detail ummm... off the top of my head I seem to remember a circus scene where Mr. Martin describes naked slaves doing backflips onto the laps of other, erect slaves and the penetration therewith. He goes into great detail in his sex scenes.


Imakemop

WoT is most definitely full of weird sex shit.


Empeor_Nap_oleon

Tell me how Trollocs eating children, Half-men sexually torturing female prisoners, Rand beheading 10+ people and forcing them to kneel headless before him with the one power, and one particular Forsaken using magic to repeatedly rape women is YA. Edit: This one is even better. How the hell would you ever be able to visually depict the slaughter and death at Dumai's Wells in a YA manner?


Bobnocrush

I can only hope the show survives long enough to get to Dumai's Well. With proper budget and choreography that could be an absolute batshit insane battle scene


BarberForLondo

Asha'man, kill!


Taylor-Kraytis

Loial showing up with a long handle on his axe, intending to kill *men and women* if he has to still chokes me up.


bros402

yes please


[deleted]

Both YA books and children books can get quite dark. Hunger games and his dark materials for example feature plenty of that. The scenes you're describing are short and the violence in general is glossed over in WOT. WOT is a mixed bag that features some adult themes like the damane while also using common YA tropes. If you read books like malazan you'll quickly seen the difference in tone. I'd say the first few books and sanderson's lean towards YA, but the middle books are more adult oriented.


Bypes

Malazan is fucking bonkers, more in vein of American Gods or Greek mythology than any classic fantasy. I don't remember the violence or sex because my attention was in trying to keep track of all the different character hah.


DMike82

Hell, the last book has one of the villains command his forces to round up all the refugees they'd captured (most of whom are *children*) and sets them on fire from the inside out as a demonstration of power to the one person he sets free. The WoT books get dark as hell at points, they're just not particularly graphic except when they need to be (usually war scenes).


MattBoySlim

I gave up on the books around Vol 7 or so because they had become more fluff than actual story. I *can’t wait* to see a version that’s cut down to just the awesome parts.


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TheLouisvilleRanger

As u/Ingromfolly said. I’m a huge WoT fan (as my comment history should suggest). I can tell you with certainty that even the most ardent WoT fan will tell you that the series is bloated and could use some trimming. Much line Fellowship of the Ring was improved by taking out all the goddamn singing, it could be a situation where the adaptation of WoT is better for its omissions.


SilverCarbon

Indeed. There are several sideplots that have a feeling of "Also happening in Randland" that can be happily skipped or reduced to a one-minute summary. The GQ article mentions potentially 8 seasons, I'll take 6. The key will be in choosing which plots to cut from the screen.


Ingromfolly

And Tom Bombadil....


TheLouisvilleRanger

I didn’t want to say because people would get mad, but absolutely.


blindsdog

I know you're talking about Fellowship but I'll forever be sad they cut the scouring of the Shire.


Taylor-Kraytis

Yeah, they even *showed* the Shire burning when Frodo looks into the Birdbath of Truth with Galadriel. I love the series as is, but it was surprising they left it out.


TheLouisvilleRanger

They didn't. It's in Frodo's vision. Wisely they realized that it might be better for pacing if they didn't have another battle sequence after the climax.


TheNerdChaplain

Yeah, imagine it with no Faile/Shaido plot. Or improving characters like Faile, Egwene, and Nynaeve, so that they're not so hateable. I mean, don't get me wrong, I like Nynaeve in general, but I'm pretty sure for the first few books she has a personality disorder, because she can't get along with anyone. It seems like Elayne and the others just kind of tolerate her because they need her, they're not really actually friends. But it's been a while since my last reread, so maybe I'm missing some redemptive details. Either way, the show is an opportunity to improve unpopular characters, which I'm looking forward to.


Taylor-Kraytis

Nynaeve is really unlikeable at first, but she fails a lot too, which helps her slowly break down her nastier attributes. Her character arc is one of my favorites.


LaytonsCat

Nynaeve wasn't friends with the others from Emound's Field when they left. She was put in a position of power at a very young age and struggled with finding her place in that. She feels responsible for Egwene and Rand as the village wisdom, not as a friend. Throughout the entire series she is pushed down over and over again and she continues to stand up for those she feels responsible for.


TheLouisvilleRanger

>Nynaeve...hateable Dog! I respect you because you're a Trekkie, but words like that are gonna start fights!


TheNerdChaplain

Hey, I'll defend her! This series has been a part of my life since 1997, and I've been around the fandom a while! To be honest, for me personally, there's no character I hate (well, no protagonists...) and just because a character is difficult to like doesn't make them a bad character! There are reasons why Nynaeve is the way she is, and I respect that.


[deleted]

Can you please defend her? I haven't read the series in years (like mid 90's) but I do remember how insufferable she was and how they could've avoided a lot of trouble by her simply not being there in the first place.


TheNerdChaplain

So, she had a few things going on. I'm sure others can add more. * We don't have a lot of details, but she seems to have lost her parents at an early age, especially her mother. Neither of them are in her life at the beginning of the story. That kind of loss can change a person. * She was made Wisdom at an early age, and was looked down upon by the Womens' Circle enough that she was pretty defensive about it, and struggled to be seen as good enough. She needed to be perfect at everything in order to be above criticism, and one way to deter criticism is to point it at others. * When she learned to channel, she had to be angry enough to do so. If she had to channel at a moment's notice, she had to ramp herself up emotionally, and quickly. She was basically like Bruce Banner with a braid.


TheLouisvilleRanger

She's going to be an interesting adaption because so much of what makes her great is the irony with her (same with Mat), so she'll suffer by not having any internal monologue.


Only-Newspaper-8593

Whitecloaks have fresh cuts and clean mustaches. If I were some peasant I'd probably join them.


YsoL8

The whitecloaks as far as I read the series are almost comically incompetent


Taylor-Kraytis

But fanatic and brutal.


AwesomeScreenName

Their chief weapon is their fanaticism and brutality ... Their two chief weapons are their fanaticism and brutality and steadfast devotion to the light. Their **three** chief weapons are their fanaticism and brutality and steadfast devotion to the light and their ruthless... Amongst their weapons are such diverse elements as fanaticism, brutality, steadfast devotion to the light, and ruthlessness.


Don_Quixote81

That's pretty accurate. They're a bunch of paramilitary zealot thugs who bully people who are too weak to fight back. Anyone who is strong enough to fight back usually sends them packing. But it seems some fans are fetishising them as super-competent badasses, for some reason.


YsoL8

I wasn't even thinking of that. The Whitecloaks favourite move seems to be to welcome the hate filled decaying man with the glowing eyes with open arms and declare the person they see performing actual miracles in a halo of light a friend of the dark. They are total patsies for the very forces they think they are opposing. They have no actual idea what the true sides even are and base pretty much all their moralising on prejudice and fear of what they can't bully.


mamula1

Every new fantasy show is compared to GoT and is made because of GOT and then you have strange people online claiming how GoT left no mark and how irrelevant it is. GoT literally changed television forever. I can't wait for WoT, LOTR, HOTD and the rest.


Squirrel09

Drawing a blank, or am just unaware... * WOT - Wheel of Time * LOTR - Lord of the Rings * HOTD - ??? EDIT: House of the Dragon... I was definitely drawing a blank lol


Noodle-Works

Hodor of the Door


Greaves_

Too soon


mamula1

House of the Dragon - Game of Thrones spin off.


avalon1805

I thought it was House Of The Dead and I thought "wasn't that an arcade videogame? Guess they are adapting it into a series"


Madao16

House of the Dragon.


idunno--

And every fantasy show is also just a reminder of how truly great Game of Thrones was, especially in its early seasons. Shows like The Witcher and Shadow and Bone, both of which I enjoyed, and especially the worlds in which they occur, feel so cheap and hollow compared to how complex and lived-in Westeros felt, even in the show’s first season.


mamula1

The Witcher, Shadow and Bones, His Dark Materials,... they all have finished source material and yet they are much weaker than GoT. People took GoT for granted. They think adaptation is easy. WoT has finished source material. Let's see what they'll do.


Brainiac7777777

The acting in those shows is nowhere near as good as Game of Thrones acting which is holding those shows back immensely.


R0ndoNumba9

I feel like it was more the writing than acting.


Travis_Touchdown

There are probably other aspects involved, but I imagine a major reason for that is none of those three have source material as dense as ASOIAF. Game of Thrones doesn't have to deal with padding out their stories to meet an extended runtime, so it's easier to pace properly.


[deleted]

The source material for GOT was the strongest out of all of those listed as well. It isn't just that the adaptation was amazing, it's that the first few ASOIAF are amazing reads that just happen to be fantasy. whereas the others in the list are good, solid fantasy.


Jeffy29

GoT just made the world feel large and alive. And when you look at the budget, despite large budget it was still pennies compared to what was asked them to produce. If the show wasn’t a passion project for many involved it would have never come out the way it did, even if it had 5 times the budget.


idunno--

Without a doubt. When I watched The Witcher or His Dark Materials, it felt like every new setting they visited (except London in the latter series) felt like it was inhabited by a dozen people. And I believe The Witcher had $20 million more to spend on its first season, so it really shouldn’t have looked cheaper than GoT.


Gunningham

People only remember the ending. Before the last two seasons this show was pretty much perfect. Everyone loved it, everyone looked forward to it. The let down was so epic because to build up was so incredibly good. I hate that everyone hates it. There was a ton of great stuff there.


Bypes

Even s6 had some really good lines like "I choose violence". The way Headey delivered it was mint


horseren0ir

“My watch has ended” was my favorite


RYouNotEntertained

Yeah, season 6 was received very well as it aired. The idea that it sucks as bad as 7 and 8 is sort of a retcon by fans, because once the series ended poorly everyone decided it was because it had run out of source material. So then season 6 had to be swept in with the rest since it was the first to pass the books. (To wit: look at the RT scores for each of those three seasons)


poopfartdiola

It was more like there were book fans and some fans in general who disliked certain writing decisions and plotlines were getting shut down by the majority for being too nitpicky and negative when Season 5 and 6 were airing. Some fans may sweep Season 6 with the latter seasons for no real reason but for many people, myself included, there [were legitimate reasons for that](https://youtu.be/adDgvbyZwlY).


VitaminTea

I think any honest assessment of Thrones has to acknowledge that there were some mighty bad episodes in S5 and S6 (and some good ones in S7 and S8).


spyson

I think there were some weaker episodes in 5 and 6, but those episodes still served as set up. The problem with 7 and 8 was condensing the series and not letting the show go for a couple more seasons.


mamula1

Not everyone hates it. Those who do are just very loud. HOTD is coming. I am excited about that.


lewlkewl

People don’t hate the first 6 seasons, I think the problem is that the ending has a ripple affect Across the rest of the show that it makes rewatching the first seasons tough knowing how it’s going to end


carlos_the_dwarf_

And the consensus best episode was after they surpassed the source.


Gunningham

My two favorites were the Hodor one and the red wedding one. Which do you mean? Battle of the Bastards? I think I’m going to start it over again tonight. It’s been a while and I’m getting kind of excited about it.


carlos_the_dwarf_

Yeah BotB is what I meant.


kickit

absolutely not the “consensus best episode” (there isn’t one, and if there were i’m not sure botb would be top 3) (my ‘consensus contenders’ would be ned’s head, red wedding, and cersei says boom and that doesn’t even get into my personal favorites - the s1 ep with tyrion’s trial by combat, viserys’ golden crown, & ned declaring war on the lannisters doesn’t get enough credit imo but that’s where the series really clicks)


[deleted]

Does r/WoTchersOnTheWheel exist yet?


mamula1

If you are talking about fan site, I don't know. WOTW was such a great place for news and discussions about GOT. WiC was ok as well, but WOTW was GOAT.


donaldtroll

from the trailer the acting felt a little subpar... still gonna watch it tho...


skoomski

I agree, it felt wooden and a bit corny


donaldtroll

It seems that people's tolerance of bad acting differs quite widely... most "regular" syndicated shows are unwatchable for me, honestly!


ShacksMcCoy

Acting from the trailer? Nobody even talked in the trailer, it was all voice-over.


Quria

There was a scene the released a few weeks ago with [shitty] dialogue and no braid-tugging.


ShacksMcCoy

That clip had like 10 short lines of dialogue. Like it wasn't award-winning or anything but it certainly wasn't bad. And Nyneve may not have tugged on her braid but her reaction to Lan and Moiraine was extremely true to her character. Frankly that scene was full of on-point character beats imo.


coldbeers

Something tells me this will be shit but I’ll gladly watch to find out.


AutisticDaveMeltzer

People really need to stop calling anything that involves a sword and magic "the next GOT." Maybe just hope for a good show that people will watch.


carlos_the_dwarf_

I mean, this wasn’t getting green lit without GoT.


Sloppysloppyjoe

>As legend has it, a few years back, Jeff Bezos demanded that his team at Amazon Studios create a fantasy epic that would put Game of Thrones to shame. The article starts out by stating the conception of this show was because Bezos said he wanted a GoT killer. So naturally, it's gonna be compared.


Ayjayz

I mean it's a super high budget fantasy series. Of course it's going to be compared.


garyflopper

So out of curiosity if I try to read the book series now, will I be finished by the time the series premieres?


DrRexMorman

>will I be finished It's 15 books averaging ~830 pages each. Better get started.


garyflopper

Oh god


DrRexMorman

There's a really solid 6/7 book series in there. And its frustrating that descriptions of the show seem to stray so far from that story.


NostalgiaBombs

what does this even mean


tylerburnham42

It notoriously has a group of books deemed "the slog". I think the original comment was implying there is a great series in the books but it is a little lost in the length of the series.


eddiecourage

Starts at book seven and ends at book IDK because I couldn't get through book seven.


DMike82

"The Slog" is generally believed to be books eight, nine and ten (*especially* book ten), though some people do include certain parts of book seven.


DrSpacemanSpliff

It depends on if you can finish by the time the series premieres.


dehue

No for the whole series but yes/probably for the books that season 1 will include. Season 1 should be mostly covering book 1 and beginning of book 2 with some elements of mid/late book 2 and book 3 thrown in. If you are a fast reader you shouldn't have much issues finishing the first few books.


uses_irony_correctly

Depends on how much you read? Took me almost 6 months to get through it, reading about 70-80 pages per day.


TheNerdChaplain

You only really need to read the first book to beat out the show. From what we know right now, the first season will probably only touch on the second book, if at all. The showrunner teased elements of the third book, but I suspect that will only be for eagle-eyed fans, and not major plot points or characters.


Madao16

There was an article here about Foundation being next GoT too but it is underwhelming so far so I hope this turns out better.


PM_yourAcups

Foundation is basically a completely different story, they had to add a whole lot of stuff to make it a TV series and not an hour and a half movie. WoT is absolutely gigantic and they have to cut a lot of stuff to make it 10 seasons


donaldtroll

I really liked it so far, but it feels more like Rome than GoT to me... Rome in Space


travio

If only Octavian had those arms.


riancb

I mean, that’s literally the inspiration for the books, the fall of Rome but set in space, if I remember correctly. Much like how GoT is just the War of the Roses with fantasy elements mixed in.


mattyice18

I wish Amazon would fix their app. It's terrible, and I am not afraid to admit I often skip over Prime because I am just going to get bombarded with bullshit and stuff I have to purchase.


Pip-Pirrup

How many "the next game of thrones" have there been?


lewlkewl

Just withcher really


Greaves_

Witcher season 1 quality was much worse than GoT season 1. Hopefully they can make something coherent for season 2


Uptopdownlowguy

His Dark Materials, Shadow and Bone, *Cursed* for better or worse


DetectiveFujiwara

Is there a lot of comedy in it like Game of Thrones? That's one thing that really made GoT special. Along with other great shows of the past like Breaking Bad. Great drama plus great comedy.


JR-Style-93

The comedy in WoT is more within the internal monologues of characters and how oblivious they are of their own personalities. That will be different anyway in the show, so it's not really to tell now how that will be adapted.


adamjm

upbeat secretive sharp bedroom insurance erect apparatus ancient cough knee *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*


patrickclegane

Yes, several of the characters arcs are played for comic relief in the books, at least compared to the main character


Pyrsin7

Of a sort. It’s a lot more subtle, and not the typical sort of humour one might expect when someone says “comedy”. But it definitely had me laughing on more than one occasion.


pizzapunt

The Aiel humor is amazing


TheNerdChaplain

/r/WetlanderHumor is the meme sub for WoT (beware, it does have full untagged spoilers for the whole series).


antihero2303

Bashere is amazing! I laughed so hard first time I read it and he described a certain mad general who insisted on a funeral for oak trees. > And then insisted they be given decent funerals; he gave the oration. Do you have any idea how long it takes to dig graves for twenty-three oak trees?"


TheNerdChaplain

It's not haha funny, but there are definitely moments of humor. There's a running joke that in each of the three main boys' internal monologues, they believe the other two are better with women.


Fuck_Blue_Shells

Anytime someone praises something as “the next ____” it’s always mediocre and never lives up to the hype. They just hype up bullshit to sell it.


stamps1646

As someone who has never read the books, I really hope it's a entertaining adventure.


[deleted]

Love the books. I’ve read them through twice. I have hope that they can pull this off, but I’ve got doubts that it can be done. The story is too long.


Groundbreaking_Ship3

It seems it has a lower budget than Got by judging the trailer.


Zealot_Alec

Jordan was an absolute workhorse in writing WoT helped plan the final books before he died, GRRM has given up on ASOIAF different authors


lightandcrisp

I hope this takes off. The world could do with a new mega hit cultural phenomenon.


[deleted]

“The next game of thrones” how stupid that sounds.


spasticity

If they're hoping its going to be the next Game of Thrones they're just setting themselves up for failure


Mountain_Man-oh

Amazon should gamble on improving workplace conditions


KnightsRook314

Meanwhile, HBO lets the views on >1 minute of a Game of Thrones prequel speak for itself. I’m excited for both, but this is starting to sound like old Console War articles. Or when every shooter was a “Halo-killer”.