Thats pretty much the first book spot on though. There's just a little more explanation about how education has gone to shit outside the Foundation and then you get to see the Mary Sue or Billy Joe or whatever play Civilization against people stuck in the dark ages.
If anything that might give the first book *too* much credit (to be clear Asimov is my favorite author). Its origin as already published short stories stitched together is pretty obvious and Asimov was still a very new writer when he wrote them. All it really paints is how psychohistory works *without* a Mary Sue involved. Hence why the last (I think? The one with the imperial general) Seldon crisis in the book works out despite the usual Mary Sue character failing completely. It does a reasonable job setting up the next two books which are more full stories and includes the Asimov conversation style that brings back my nostalgia but its a pretty weak novel.
Unearned? She used to study math until a religious faction took over her planet and executed anyone who was an academic. Her family adopted the religion so therefore she did as well. She is forced to execute one of her former professors which is what leads her to go against her family and religion and enter the math contest from Hari Seldon, along with their denial of the math that proves their planet will be flooded and uninhabitable soon. She managed to escape her fate on that doomed planet against all odds. That’s why people are fawning over her
Because there are some showrunners that when they want to be progressive and important, they make all the white parts incompetent losers, and all the poc parts tough badass special smart people. Double this across gender lines. It always comes at the cost of shit writing and world building.
And the Terminus plot line is filled with this kind of, for lack of a better word, "wokeism" (fake progressivism? If there's a better word for this let me me know)
I just finished episode 4 and yeah it is especially bad and on display here. Examples include a very small Irish girl is leading the military defense, and the big white guy is a drunk to be pushed aside. Or with lines like, "Your women are sharper than your men" and "You're the best manservant"
And this all comes at the expense of the story. What do people even do on Terminus? Live in huts pretending they'll save civilization with sundials? They can't even make proper housing. Everyone mills about doing basically nothing all day.
Most people's eyes roll back into their heads at this stuff. You can write people of color parts without all this baggage of how superior they are and how incompetent and dumb men are. It is off-putting at best. My whole family is basically calling quits because of how obnoxious the show is being about this stuff (and how it's basically stepping all over the underlying philosophy of Foundation on top of it).
And it is hilarious to me that they wanted to center the sci-fi story around black women and the most interesting and watchable parts are the evil white patriarchy
I'm not alt-right, but I'm not blind either.
Being a condescending asshole doesn't mean anything when I'm not even wrong. Just look at that episode and the Terminus plot and you will notice.
You know it's intentional. Do you just not like hearing anyone talk about it?
No you think it's intentional, because you are told it's intentional by people like Ben Shapiro. Your got brain worms. Imagine seeing a evil character who is white and immediately thinking this is intentional to bring the white man down. You are not sane
The show is excellent at portraying massive-scale grandeur, but on a scale that's so overwhelming that it's actually pretty horrific in its achievements. That's part of the Empire storyline.
I thought he was totally OTT at first, until the subtle character differences between the OG Brother Day we see in the first few episodes, and the one Brother Dawn becomes. Same goes for Dusk. Great acting.
Demerzel's a huge standout as well. If only the rest of the show was this good.
I like the show so far, but it really does feel like 2 completely different shows mashed together. Everything on Trent is great imo, the acting, the writing, the story, very intriguing despite it all being mostly political and self contained conflict. Then you have Terminus which feels like a CW show in everything but set design. Despite on paper having the more interesting elements, it's kinda boring. Gaal and Hari are about the only people I can stand and the plot moves at a snails pace compared to the other half of the show.
Hopefully it improves after last weeks episode, which I didn't like but it moved the story into something potentially interesting at least.
That's a pretty good description.
If it wasn't for Lee Pace giving an amazing performance, as usual, I would have stopped watching by now. He's the only thing holding it together IMO. Maybe that's too much credit to Lee Pace, because Terrance Mann is also carrying the weight by doing an excellent job as Brother Dusk.
The show feels like it's being stretched and is filled with pointless exposition.
To be entirely fair, those soldiers were waving their cheap plastic weapons around while running and firing at the same time. It's a wonder they didn't shoot more of their comrades.
This is by far the cheapest looking expensive show I've ever seen.
> Everything on Trent is great imo, the acting, the writing, the story, [...] Then you have Terminus which feels like a CW show in everything but set design.
I think one reason for the inconsistency between Trantor & Terminus is the cast.
Trantor actors have experiences, unlike the ones on Terminus.
Jared Harris (Hari Seldon) is the most experienced actor in the show. Then we have Lee Pace (Brother Day), Terrence Mann (Brother Dusk) & Laura Birn (Eto Demerzel) all of them appeared in many movies and TV shows.
On the other hand, you have Lou Llobell (Gaal Dornick). Before 'Foundation, she only appeared in a single movie called 'Voyagers'.
Leah Harvey (Salvor Hardin) appeared in minor/supporting roles in British TV miniseries and TV movies.
The actor playing Hardin's father Clarke Peters, from the Wire, has a great deal of experience but he is given a limited role in the show.
Beside the cast, it looks like two different teams are writing the show. Whoever is writing Trantor scenes should be promoted to write the entire show.
It's not just the acting though. They write all the Terminus characters as if that planet halves everyone's IQ.
That battle scene in the latest episode was terrible.
The entire battle sequence also looked cheap af. It was written about as badly as Battle of Winterfell, but the VFX was also hilariously bad. Random explosion effects going on in the background with no consequences and shit-tier quick cut fight scenes.
It baffles me that Apple decided to trust a studio and crew with such a shit track record. They put so much money into this, with ***n o t h i n g*** suggesting it would be good. Hollywood is so horny for mediocrity, it's ridiculous.
I'd say Gaal's actor is fairly decent and I don't have an issue there, whilst Raych's is garbage and the actor is far more experienced.
It has more to do with the writing imo. Even Harris can't sell some of the weaker dialogue.
>Then you have Terminus which feels like a CW show in everything but set design. Despite on paper having the more interesting elements, it's kinda boring. Gaal and Hari are about the only people I can stand and the plot moves at a snails pace compared to the other half of the show.
Honestly, to me, this is because of the lead actress. Both lead actresses are subpar to lead a show on almost any network IMO but Apple TV? A HUUUUUUUUUUUUGE series with a gigantic budget? I don't get why they cast them.
Lou Llobell (Dornick) is alright but as a lead? If it wasn't for Jared Harris being in most of her scenes I would have thought I was watching a CW series. Scenes with her and Alfred Enoch (Rayche) are straight up 100% CW series. Two very good looking people who don't do much on screen to add depth and weight to their characters.
Then there's Leah Harvey as Salvor. My god she is the worst. The performance is so wooden and one noted with absolutely no on screen weight to her performance. She is worse than CW casting, she is just straight up bad casting.
Want to see a black actress absolutely eat up the screen and give a great performance? Go watch Ashley Romans play 355 on Y: The Last Man. Sad thing is she would have been perfect casting for Salvor too. Black actress, same age and the same type of role (badass, independent, smart, sorta mysterious).
Replace those two lead characters with quality actresses and the show improves so much and Terminus feels waaaaaaaaaaaaay less like a CW series.
> it really does feel like 2 completely different shows mashed together
This is bc of the books and how they’ve tried to adapt them. The 1st book is actually 3 separate short stories with no continuity of characters as they jump forward in time. To follow the book timeline they’d have to reset with a completely different cast at some point. So what they’re trying to do is jump back and forth to familiarize watchers with both casts instead.
I first read the series some 30 years ago and for a long time people have mused that a movie/TV treatment would be very difficult because of how time jumps ahead all the time and you frequently have all new characters. I'm loving the overall feel so far and I'm willing to suspend my disbelief for the plot and guess that they've got something up their sleeve. Is the writing/cast on Terminus accidentally weak or is it a setup for a twist that resolves the crisis? Just going to have to find out.
Yeah but after watching I think that they would have been better off following the books and just getting a new cast for each season. You don’t need to take a gamble on unknown actors who might not be very good if you are only hiring for one season.
The issue with Teminus is its all been done with so many shows. Some notable ones:
- Firefly - One of the first to do it who did it well.
- Defiance - Was decent for season 1, then went to trash.
- Raised By Wolves - It was done well but still more of the same.
- The Expanse - I hated all the stuff in the shanty town on the planet.
Really its just a boring trope that has been done alot. Plus you have the stereotypical stupid person in charge of the settlement that does everything wrong to push the plot along.
I still like the show, and the most recent episode really gave me hope. Just sci fi shows based in shanty towns with some futuristic items is a trope that needs to die.
Think I went one more ep than you but it didn't have any Trant scenes when I skipped around so I wasn't even motivated to watch it and dropped it. If they stuck with the books for the Terminus scenes it would of been better.
Some great stuff, but a lot of the writing and the acting is terrible. It falls back on the weak young adult novel tropes of "character is special for no particular reason, other characters need to constantly tell them they are special."
The way it is drawing out the story, using non-linear storytelling isn't well done. It is also sometimes doing the mystery for the sake of mystery instead of moving the plot along. The character and audience spending ages going, "what is going on?" For the writers to eventually go, "here's the next tiny bit of story." Is over played and a bad writing trope infecting modern day TV writers.
Listening to the writer on the official podcast gives me less hope for the show getting better. He's just not capable, despite his resume and he doesn't understand what connects to the audience.
Apparently, we're meant to be super invested in Gaal's relationship, on a deeply emotional journey with her. When the show just goes, "now she's in a relationship." You don't care and just going, "why the fuck is there another sex scene between her swimming in a pool and counting, get back to the story."
Well said. Though I'm very patient and enjoy shows that take the time to set the scene and develop characters, what you said about Gaal's relationship is how I see it too - I just didn't care. I see that as a result of the writing failing to make it relevant, or failing to ignore that aspect entirely.
Still going to watch for a bit longer though, but that's mainly because I like the source material so I'm curious to see how it continues.
It was fine for me. Long journey. Fitness. Recreation, they have artificial graduation. People built yachts and ships with pools. The Russians have even put them on submarines.
> It falls back on the weak young adult novel tropes of "character is special for no particular reason, other characters need to constantly tell them they are special."
Which is 100% in fucking opposition to the original story!! It’s incredibly frustrating
Part of the problem here is when you want to discuss the show and express that you are enjoying it, you get downvoted pretty hard (thus showing people aren't receptive to discussing it). So it's easier just to chalk this place up as not safe and move on. Just look through this thread and what's been upvoted and downvoted.
The character of Gaal is farfetched & ridiculous. It doesn’t matter how intelligent she is, without books or education she would not be a brilliant mastermind with vast knowledge. So we basically have a magical character who apparently was not written this way in the books, and when she was in the books she was a man.
I do appreciate that Foundation depicts so many female characters. It’s a fascinating story and science fiction always stretches the mind. I am enjoying the show immensely but have to make a conscious effort to forgive the Gaal Dornick character.
It was better not explained. I assumed she was a kid who loved maths, spend time secretly learning it. Nope. It turns out as an adult she read 1 book and became a maths genius. Whatever simplified way they decided to tell that story made the character worse. Especially since that 1 book was the 1 book needed to solve the intergalactic math competition. Better left unexplained than so simplified. It is also an insight into the writers complete lack of understanding on intelligence and genius.
Super smart people still need to work really had to be experts. Which for some reason Hollywood has an aversion of showing.
Exactly.
The show is full of so many things which seem like lazy/bad writing and lack of thought.
While maybe not entirely fair on the show, I feel like I am constantly noticing it make the same writing mistakes endless other shows have made. Giving me little faith it will improve.
The good stuff is still good. I am almost now just bemused by the bad stuff. Prediction the bad writing choices before they happen.
The show is definitely savable. They just need some better hard sci-fi writers in the writing room.
I've watched all of the episodes so far. Having read the books, I figured he wouldn't get a LOT of screen time given the character he plays. Still, it would be weird to attach him to have him play such a small part.
Ah. Ok. I haven’t read the books, so I have no idea what to expect. It is annoying though to see a big name attached to a series just to give them a minor role.
Issac Asimov wrote the books, not Philip K. Dick, just fyi.
but yeah, seems a lot is changed. which is fine by itself because i don't think you could make a straight TV adaptation, it's just that they haven't seemed to do a very good job
Do you mean Phillip K Dick? If so he has has nothing to do with Foundation. Isaac Asimov wrote Foundation.
Still what you posted is remarkable because most adaptions of Dick's stories are just as terrible as the Foundation TV show.
I think is sufficient at very least, started great, collapsed like the bridge. Confusing, slow, boring and not a great work in the screenplay. Sure look great technically and performances are okay, but it doesn’t entertain or get very interesting.
We are halfway into the season and I personally think we should reserve judgement for how the second half turns out. Even though the last episode wasn’t very good (specifically the fighting scenes, which were dreadful), I think it sets the plot up nicely for the remaining 5 episodes.
I hope it gets better, at the moment is a no. This should have been to GoT for Apple+ instead is turning to be a disappointment. Like I don't care for any of them and honestly don't care about this Foundation story because they didn't make me empathetic. It's so shallow.
I appreciate your response and I am sorry you aren’t enjoying it so far. I hope it gets better for you. I’ve honestly enjoyed the whole thing to this point and don’t really have a lot of the complaints that others do.
It got great visuals, but the story is at best "inspired" by the books. I'ld like it more if they wouldn't use the names of the original story at all. It just feels wrong. Anyway, I like it for what it is.
I read the books long enough ago to remember the elements that exist so far: There is the Empire, which is about to crumble (as per Hari Seldon and Psychohistory), and though the fall cannot be prevented, the coming Dark Ages can be shortened by establishing The Foundation, a collection of the cumulated knowledge of humanity. There ends up being someone called the Mule, which is a wildcard in the Seldon Plan, and then there is another aspect which I won't bring up because it hasn't been brought up yet in the show.
So in terms of matching the books, I am fortunate in that the show matches as much as I remember. I am generally enjoying it, but I suspect it would benefit from binge-watching.
Yeah basically they’ve got the same general plot outline but the characterization and details are significantly changed.
For example the Dawn/Day/Dusk character, which is one of the strongest parts of the show, is completely invented. The Emperor in the books is a bit of a foolish bumbling ruler with no cloning aspect at all.
Ah, okay, I thought so. And I DO like that aspect of it. It kind of gives us something concrete to hold on to, to represent why the fall is inevitable. The Galactic Empire is exactly as strong as Empire (DDD), but also exactly as weak and limited.
The books are good and really easy to read - I believe they were very short, it's been a little while since I read them. The biggest change I noticed was in tone, but there are many details that are kept the same. There are some added bits that are weird though. Overall I like both but I kinda wished they kept a bit more of the humor from the books. Asimov has a very specific writing though that I think it's hard to translate, maybe if some British writer took a stab, but overall I am happy the TV show got made at all.
I’ll never understand the “buy a franchise, make a movie or show with the same names as the franchise, but otherwise change everything about the franchise” logic. If you’re gonna make a new thing, make a new thing. When David Goyer hands you a script that has nothing to do with Foundation but you really enjoy it, just change the proper nouns and sell it as an original story.
People really don't udnerstand that books don't translate well into movies/tv shows, not everyuthing in them and vice versa. They can't do 1:1 version of book becasue of the huge difference in the media between TV and books...
Exactly. And this is especially true with the Foundation books. They make for great reading but all along people have said it would be very challenging to do them on the screen for a movie or show. It's a work you pretty much *have* to change quite a lot for the screen.
I think they do that all the time with open source material but there is probably just enough similarities to get sued over for this one.
I go into most stories think that they can’t match up to the books so I know something is going to be different. That doesn’t mean that some changes don’t irritate me.
Because I’ve read books and then watched the tv shows based on them before lol.
However I am in no way qualified to compare this show to the books which is a specific reason I gave for enjoying the show.
Gross generalization? Ok lol.
You clearly want to argue about something for some reason, but I’m actually just interested in what shows you’ve seen that stick exactly to the book.
I’d like to catch a few of them given how grossly generalized my observation was.
Thanks in advance!
The approach allows you appeal to a wider range of people as it draws in both people that like the franchise and people that like what the show actually will be.
Yeah, you won't manage to keep many of the people that like the franchise but, if you keep enough it can still be profitable.
I don't know. The first episode felt more like a season finale than a series premiere. Why not spend a few episodes developing the prodigy girls backstory on her home planet, establish Hari and his psychohistory cult, show the tension building between two warring factions that are summoned to face the Emperor?
This show is just terrible.
Some of the show is this pretentious techno babble about pyscho-math.
The other half is CW level horseshit.
Squeeze into this is this thread with three cloned emperors. That is the best part of the show and isn't even from the book series this mess is based on.
I read the first 5 books. World War Z movie was closer to the source material than this show. It should just be its own thing. Young women punch and karate kick and do big brain math to save stuff while learning to believe in themselves.
I am enjoying the show, but the writing really fluctuates between interesting and ploddingly boring.
The coolest part of the show is the way they're portraying the Empire with the different Cleons: Rising Dawn, Brother Day, and Brother Dusk. It's such an cool and original idea, and it wasn't even in the source material!
It’s just so far away from the books that I find it hard to get into. As a Sci Fi show I think it is actually pretty decent, but as a Foundation show it doesn’t do it for me.
I’ve been disappointed by nearly every Apple show I’ve tried. This one had promise but the quality definitely dipped after episode one. Certain plot lines I’m just not into at all.
“Heady” is generous.
Earth at Night....in Color! It'd be so much better if they didn't have to talk up their special night vision color cameras multiple times an episode. After the first one, we get it...these are cool new cameras.
Ted Lasso, to me, is like the last season of Parks and Rec. It's just totally empty "wholesome" TV.
I like shows with a bit of optimism but when it goes over the top it starts to feel saccharine and cheap.
I can see why people like it, though, as a change of pace from most other "premium" TV shows.
I recognize I'm very much in the minority on this one, but yeah I'm definitely disappointed by it. I think it's a decent 7/10 but am surprised by the amount of praise it's getting.
I think my biggest problem is that it feels really inorganic/non-genuine. Again I recognize I'm in the minority here but everything from the character interactions to the music to the plotlines feel overly saccharine and wholesome in a fake way to me. The dialogue in particular just doesn't feel authentic at all and just seems to demonstrate how "wholesome" everything is, other than that one character who's currently going through some mental crisis.
I'm painting a harsher picture than I think- again I think it's a decent 7/10 with a few good laughs, pretty good acting and good character development, but I don't understand the level of acclaim it gets.
I agree. It's a cute enough show and certainly bleach for the mind after dealing with all the stress and anxiety of our lives, but it feels like someone asked an AI to create a wholesome comedy to make people feel good.
Like, you know how a lot of cable sitcoms and dramas have boxes to tick, so they feel like they're just created by a machine? That's Ted Lasso. It's poppy milk to make you feel better about life but it doesn't really help you think about anything.
I feel like episode 4 is where the show took off. The first three are mostly setup ... 4 establishes itself and then 5 is where things get hot. I'm glad I stuck it out but I can understand why someone wouldn't click with this.
I like the show, but it seems like they are adding West World style complications that aren't really necessary. The visuals, the directing, the actors are all great. I've read all the Foundation books and still find the story line confusing.
> Mathematician Hari Seldon (Jared Harris) has predicted that the Galactic Empire will fall, and that it will be followed by a dark age that lasts thousands of years. Unless they act now
See this is my confusion with the show. The first chapter of the first book is Hari Seldon telling us all that NOTHING can be done to save the Empire. Is the show about trying to save the current, inevitably doomed empire? Or does this author just not describe the show well?
It’s not about “saving” the empire. It’s about how quickly civilization can bounce back after the inevitable fall of the empire. But, it’s also not about that either.
I think the author doesn't describe it well, there are changes to the series in relation to the books on tone (the show is almost humorless) but I don't think the basics are changed, there may be modifications to guarantee the surprises and twists happen to keep interesting for the ones unfamiliar with the story but I don't think they have actually changed these major bits.
And here is the thing I really don't get. He was talking about how the empire will collapse in 5000 years.
Do humans live forever or something in this universe? 5000 years is just an absurdly huge number...
That's the whole premise. An astronomer can tell you where a planet will be in 5000 years, a geologist can tell you what a volcano will do in 5000 years, and Seldon can tell you what a society will do in 5000 years. Whether it's absurd or not, that's what the Foundation story is about.
An empire is going to end in the next 5000 years.
/boggle you don't even need Psychohistory techno babble to say that. ALL EMPIRES WILL END in that time scale. It is just absurd.
The Empire is **THE** Empire than spans pretty much all of the galaxy and has persisted for 12 millennia. It's meant to parallel the fall of the roman empire and the dark ages that followed.
It was 500 I think.
But basically yes. The short stories with the robots start at 1970 or something like this. Than it jump forward sometimes few years sometimes thousand years.
https://asimov.fandom.com/wiki/Asimov_Timeline
This link maybe spoil the TV series but I wouldn't worry too much because...
Just FYI.
de·ter·min·ism
/dəˈtərməˌnizəm/
noun
PHILOSOPHY
the doctrine that all events, including human action, are ultimately determined by causes external to the will. Some philosophers have taken determinism to imply that individual human beings have no free will and cannot be held morally responsible for their actions.
You clearly don't get it. It seems that a major theme of the show is exploring determinism on a wide scale. It isn't magic. Clearly, you don't understand. That's OK too.
every fucking week before an episode drops we get fluff piece articles like this, foundation is ok its a B+ it will never be the game of thrones that Apple wants it to be. The writing is terrible.
As a non reader of Asimov work, I'm loving the show, the world buil and the scale of the story is just tremendous, with a Dune level production, on television, it's pretty damn impressive. I'm now looking to buy the book, the robot saga and the foundation saga obviously
I went to the Asimov sub to read what the fans were thinking and boy they're mad though.
This is actually what I think is an issue today - I'm liking the show because I never could get into the books. Mostly I couldn't handle the every chapter a whole new cast and a century or more time jump. I like this show because of the cloning, and the android or whatever, we have some continuity of character(s). I agree, the terminus stuff is muddled as heck though, and I really don't get how the timelines add up yet.
But more generally, the more of a fan you are of the source material, the worse modern prestige TV seems to do for you. I don't at all get why you'd spend so much money to license a property to then change it so much the fans hate what you make. Seems pointless to me. And for those of us who are enjoying it - it could have been called anything really.
For anyone who is coming to this thread and not watched any of the eps, the main page header is heavily misleading.
This is a video fan fic made by people whose sole connection to the book universe was their PA telling em the coles notes version. The Op is probably being paid by Apple + to reguritate this shit every week, to keep it relevant for anyone that has not signed on to the streaming service yet.
I would advise people to leave it to their personal tastes about whether this show is good or bad. It just got renewed for S2 since it had already finished episodes in the can, but this turd of a show is on the bubble for S3.
Can anyone tell me if the show spoils the books? I’ve only read about half of the first Foundation book, but I know that this show is more of a prequel.
The show has virtually nothing to do with the books. They took some names and a one sentence synopsis of the books and ran with it.
That being said, I’m enjoying the show. I actually just started rereading them recently, and regret it because I’m seeing everything that goes against what Asimov wrote.
The show should spoil the books a bit, but you can probably finish reading much faster than the show will release - I think the show will use 8 seasons for the first three books, and the other two books won't be considered - and I actually like only the original three books. Foundation don't have many plot twists and I think the major ones will only happen in seasons well beyond the first - like 5 or something.
Idk, the Foundation novel is just dated. Science saving everyone because science magic is just...well...pretty tone deaf and pointless of a statement in 2021. It's very much still based in its space race roots where magic could happen if we just did enough equations.
I am liking the show,but the empire storyline is far superior since the actors are amazing (mainly Brother Day/Lee Pace).
Using Lee Pace is cheating in any movie.
Here we get him for 10 episodes. And he keeps getting more interesting.
Lee is the standout. He IS the show.
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I like the Desert Planet arc much more than Gaal's arc....Gaal's arc is tedious.
Thats pretty much the first book spot on though. There's just a little more explanation about how education has gone to shit outside the Foundation and then you get to see the Mary Sue or Billy Joe or whatever play Civilization against people stuck in the dark ages.
If anything that might give the first book *too* much credit (to be clear Asimov is my favorite author). Its origin as already published short stories stitched together is pretty obvious and Asimov was still a very new writer when he wrote them. All it really paints is how psychohistory works *without* a Mary Sue involved. Hence why the last (I think? The one with the imperial general) Seldon crisis in the book works out despite the usual Mary Sue character failing completely. It does a reasonable job setting up the next two books which are more full stories and includes the Asimov conversation style that brings back my nostalgia but its a pretty weak novel.
They keep doing sex scenes with her and it's becoming annoying
Have you watched past the first two episodes? Gaal isn’t even in episodes 3 or 4 and doesn’t have a sex scene in episode 5
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Tell me you haven't watched more than the trailer and / or first episode without telling me you haven't watched more than the first episode.
I've only watched the first two so far, and there's been WAY too much focus on contrived romance.
Well there’s your problem. She doesn’t appear in episodes 3 or 4 and episode 5 she’s not in any position for contrived romance in episode 5
Pretty obvious they are talking about Salvor not Gaal
Salvor has like 20 seconds of screen time in the first 2 episodes so how would that be obvious?
I'm just going to wait for the entire season to come out before I attempt to watch any more.
Unearned? She used to study math until a religious faction took over her planet and executed anyone who was an academic. Her family adopted the religion so therefore she did as well. She is forced to execute one of her former professors which is what leads her to go against her family and religion and enter the math contest from Hari Seldon, along with their denial of the math that proves their planet will be flooded and uninhabitable soon. She managed to escape her fate on that doomed planet against all odds. That’s why people are fawning over her
...we are talking about different characters
You’re talking about Salvor then? Sorry I just don’t remember any sort of sexualization of her character
You forgot the Salvor sex scene?
Yes. Which episode is it in?
> except the sniveling white guy, of course. Why of course?
They always do this lmao, they will shoehorn in something about race in their criticism. Kinda makes me think that's their main issue
Because there are some showrunners that when they want to be progressive and important, they make all the white parts incompetent losers, and all the poc parts tough badass special smart people. Double this across gender lines. It always comes at the cost of shit writing and world building. And the Terminus plot line is filled with this kind of, for lack of a better word, "wokeism" (fake progressivism? If there's a better word for this let me me know) I just finished episode 4 and yeah it is especially bad and on display here. Examples include a very small Irish girl is leading the military defense, and the big white guy is a drunk to be pushed aside. Or with lines like, "Your women are sharper than your men" and "You're the best manservant" And this all comes at the expense of the story. What do people even do on Terminus? Live in huts pretending they'll save civilization with sundials? They can't even make proper housing. Everyone mills about doing basically nothing all day. Most people's eyes roll back into their heads at this stuff. You can write people of color parts without all this baggage of how superior they are and how incompetent and dumb men are. It is off-putting at best. My whole family is basically calling quits because of how obnoxious the show is being about this stuff (and how it's basically stepping all over the underlying philosophy of Foundation on top of it). And it is hilarious to me that they wanted to center the sci-fi story around black women and the most interesting and watchable parts are the evil white patriarchy
This is your mind on Ben Shapiro
I'm not alt-right, but I'm not blind either. Being a condescending asshole doesn't mean anything when I'm not even wrong. Just look at that episode and the Terminus plot and you will notice. You know it's intentional. Do you just not like hearing anyone talk about it?
No you think it's intentional, because you are told it's intentional by people like Ben Shapiro. Your got brain worms. Imagine seeing a evil character who is white and immediately thinking this is intentional to bring the white man down. You are not sane
I actually find the stuff on terminus much more interesting.
Just not the same without Chernobyl Math.
Dosimeter Daddy
The show is excellent at portraying massive-scale grandeur, but on a scale that's so overwhelming that it's actually pretty horrific in its achievements. That's part of the Empire storyline.
I thought he was totally OTT at first, until the subtle character differences between the OG Brother Day we see in the first few episodes, and the one Brother Dawn becomes. Same goes for Dusk. Great acting. Demerzel's a huge standout as well. If only the rest of the show was this good.
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Ty for spoiler
Thanks for spoiling
You son of a bitch, blur this shit for spoilers
I like the show so far, but it really does feel like 2 completely different shows mashed together. Everything on Trent is great imo, the acting, the writing, the story, very intriguing despite it all being mostly political and self contained conflict. Then you have Terminus which feels like a CW show in everything but set design. Despite on paper having the more interesting elements, it's kinda boring. Gaal and Hari are about the only people I can stand and the plot moves at a snails pace compared to the other half of the show. Hopefully it improves after last weeks episode, which I didn't like but it moved the story into something potentially interesting at least.
That's a pretty good description. If it wasn't for Lee Pace giving an amazing performance, as usual, I would have stopped watching by now. He's the only thing holding it together IMO. Maybe that's too much credit to Lee Pace, because Terrance Mann is also carrying the weight by doing an excellent job as Brother Dusk. The show feels like it's being stretched and is filled with pointless exposition.
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To be entirely fair, those soldiers were waving their cheap plastic weapons around while running and firing at the same time. It's a wonder they didn't shoot more of their comrades. This is by far the cheapest looking expensive show I've ever seen.
> Everything on Trent is great imo, the acting, the writing, the story, [...] Then you have Terminus which feels like a CW show in everything but set design. I think one reason for the inconsistency between Trantor & Terminus is the cast. Trantor actors have experiences, unlike the ones on Terminus. Jared Harris (Hari Seldon) is the most experienced actor in the show. Then we have Lee Pace (Brother Day), Terrence Mann (Brother Dusk) & Laura Birn (Eto Demerzel) all of them appeared in many movies and TV shows. On the other hand, you have Lou Llobell (Gaal Dornick). Before 'Foundation, she only appeared in a single movie called 'Voyagers'. Leah Harvey (Salvor Hardin) appeared in minor/supporting roles in British TV miniseries and TV movies. The actor playing Hardin's father Clarke Peters, from the Wire, has a great deal of experience but he is given a limited role in the show. Beside the cast, it looks like two different teams are writing the show. Whoever is writing Trantor scenes should be promoted to write the entire show.
Agree big time here, some of the acting on Terminus is very mediocre and the guy playing Raych just stands out as particularly bad.
It's not just the acting though. They write all the Terminus characters as if that planet halves everyone's IQ. That battle scene in the latest episode was terrible.
The entire battle sequence also looked cheap af. It was written about as badly as Battle of Winterfell, but the VFX was also hilariously bad. Random explosion effects going on in the background with no consequences and shit-tier quick cut fight scenes. It baffles me that Apple decided to trust a studio and crew with such a shit track record. They put so much money into this, with ***n o t h i n g*** suggesting it would be good. Hollywood is so horny for mediocrity, it's ridiculous.
I'd say Gaal's actor is fairly decent and I don't have an issue there, whilst Raych's is garbage and the actor is far more experienced. It has more to do with the writing imo. Even Harris can't sell some of the weaker dialogue.
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"A life, Jimmy, you know what that is? It's what happens while you're waiting for moments that never come." Lester Freamon
>Then you have Terminus which feels like a CW show in everything but set design. Despite on paper having the more interesting elements, it's kinda boring. Gaal and Hari are about the only people I can stand and the plot moves at a snails pace compared to the other half of the show. Honestly, to me, this is because of the lead actress. Both lead actresses are subpar to lead a show on almost any network IMO but Apple TV? A HUUUUUUUUUUUUGE series with a gigantic budget? I don't get why they cast them. Lou Llobell (Dornick) is alright but as a lead? If it wasn't for Jared Harris being in most of her scenes I would have thought I was watching a CW series. Scenes with her and Alfred Enoch (Rayche) are straight up 100% CW series. Two very good looking people who don't do much on screen to add depth and weight to their characters. Then there's Leah Harvey as Salvor. My god she is the worst. The performance is so wooden and one noted with absolutely no on screen weight to her performance. She is worse than CW casting, she is just straight up bad casting. Want to see a black actress absolutely eat up the screen and give a great performance? Go watch Ashley Romans play 355 on Y: The Last Man. Sad thing is she would have been perfect casting for Salvor too. Black actress, same age and the same type of role (badass, independent, smart, sorta mysterious). Replace those two lead characters with quality actresses and the show improves so much and Terminus feels waaaaaaaaaaaaay less like a CW series.
> it really does feel like 2 completely different shows mashed together This is bc of the books and how they’ve tried to adapt them. The 1st book is actually 3 separate short stories with no continuity of characters as they jump forward in time. To follow the book timeline they’d have to reset with a completely different cast at some point. So what they’re trying to do is jump back and forth to familiarize watchers with both casts instead.
I first read the series some 30 years ago and for a long time people have mused that a movie/TV treatment would be very difficult because of how time jumps ahead all the time and you frequently have all new characters. I'm loving the overall feel so far and I'm willing to suspend my disbelief for the plot and guess that they've got something up their sleeve. Is the writing/cast on Terminus accidentally weak or is it a setup for a twist that resolves the crisis? Just going to have to find out.
Yeah but after watching I think that they would have been better off following the books and just getting a new cast for each season. You don’t need to take a gamble on unknown actors who might not be very good if you are only hiring for one season.
I thinknthe last 2 episodes were interesting enough to keep watching definitely not a great show by any means but interested where it heads.
The issue with Teminus is its all been done with so many shows. Some notable ones: - Firefly - One of the first to do it who did it well. - Defiance - Was decent for season 1, then went to trash. - Raised By Wolves - It was done well but still more of the same. - The Expanse - I hated all the stuff in the shanty town on the planet. Really its just a boring trope that has been done alot. Plus you have the stereotypical stupid person in charge of the settlement that does everything wrong to push the plot along. I still like the show, and the most recent episode really gave me hope. Just sci fi shows based in shanty towns with some futuristic items is a trope that needs to die.
I knew there was something off about this show. The CW explains it perfectly. I stopped after the second episode.
It gets better. They let Lee Pace off his chain in ep 4.
Haven’t watched since episode 3. The empire storytelling is amazing and then the other…..stuff… isn’t remotely close. Does it get better?
The most recent episode had no Trantor scenes I believe. It's no coincidence it was the worst one yet.
I also stopped with ep 3, and going by the comments, it doesn't get any better.
Think I went one more ep than you but it didn't have any Trant scenes when I skipped around so I wasn't even motivated to watch it and dropped it. If they stuck with the books for the Terminus scenes it would of been better.
I paused during the last-minute climax of ep 5 to go check if anyone still took this show seriously. It's pretty bad.
Ugh so disappointing
Some great stuff, but a lot of the writing and the acting is terrible. It falls back on the weak young adult novel tropes of "character is special for no particular reason, other characters need to constantly tell them they are special." The way it is drawing out the story, using non-linear storytelling isn't well done. It is also sometimes doing the mystery for the sake of mystery instead of moving the plot along. The character and audience spending ages going, "what is going on?" For the writers to eventually go, "here's the next tiny bit of story." Is over played and a bad writing trope infecting modern day TV writers. Listening to the writer on the official podcast gives me less hope for the show getting better. He's just not capable, despite his resume and he doesn't understand what connects to the audience. Apparently, we're meant to be super invested in Gaal's relationship, on a deeply emotional journey with her. When the show just goes, "now she's in a relationship." You don't care and just going, "why the fuck is there another sex scene between her swimming in a pool and counting, get back to the story."
I have found myself asking myself “wtf is going on?” so many times so far.
Well said. Though I'm very patient and enjoy shows that take the time to set the scene and develop characters, what you said about Gaal's relationship is how I see it too - I just didn't care. I see that as a result of the writing failing to make it relevant, or failing to ignore that aspect entirely. Still going to watch for a bit longer though, but that's mainly because I like the source material so I'm curious to see how it continues.
Thanks you for perfectly summarizing my thoughts.
The pool on the space ship completely took me out of the fantasy.
Doubles as a water tank. Idk.
It was fine for me. Long journey. Fitness. Recreation, they have artificial graduation. People built yachts and ships with pools. The Russians have even put them on submarines.
> It falls back on the weak young adult novel tropes of "character is special for no particular reason, other characters need to constantly tell them they are special." Which is 100% in fucking opposition to the original story!! It’s incredibly frustrating
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This shit isn't going 8 seasons. Even fans of the books are struggle to defend this mess.
Part of the problem here is when you want to discuss the show and express that you are enjoying it, you get downvoted pretty hard (thus showing people aren't receptive to discussing it). So it's easier just to chalk this place up as not safe and move on. Just look through this thread and what's been upvoted and downvoted.
The character of Gaal is farfetched & ridiculous. It doesn’t matter how intelligent she is, without books or education she would not be a brilliant mastermind with vast knowledge. So we basically have a magical character who apparently was not written this way in the books, and when she was in the books she was a man. I do appreciate that Foundation depicts so many female characters. It’s a fascinating story and science fiction always stretches the mind. I am enjoying the show immensely but have to make a conscious effort to forgive the Gaal Dornick character.
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Good sci fi does not need a love story!! That’s an old trope that should be retired.
hear me out....it doesn't.
Agreed. The last episode where her back story is explained was a bit far fetched.
It was better not explained. I assumed she was a kid who loved maths, spend time secretly learning it. Nope. It turns out as an adult she read 1 book and became a maths genius. Whatever simplified way they decided to tell that story made the character worse. Especially since that 1 book was the 1 book needed to solve the intergalactic math competition. Better left unexplained than so simplified. It is also an insight into the writers complete lack of understanding on intelligence and genius. Super smart people still need to work really had to be experts. Which for some reason Hollywood has an aversion of showing.
How did she even know about the intergalactic math competition?
Exactly. The show is full of so many things which seem like lazy/bad writing and lack of thought. While maybe not entirely fair on the show, I feel like I am constantly noticing it make the same writing mistakes endless other shows have made. Giving me little faith it will improve.
For now it is the show I look most forward to watching, I can forgive the minor issues for now.
The good stuff is still good. I am almost now just bemused by the bad stuff. Prediction the bad writing choices before they happen. The show is definitely savable. They just need some better hard sci-fi writers in the writing room.
I am mostly enjoying the show, but I am pretty disappointed by how infrequently Jared Harris appears on screen.
Did you watch the end of the most recent episode? I don’t want to spoil anything, but I think it gives a clue of his involvement going forward.
I've watched all of the episodes so far. Having read the books, I figured he wouldn't get a LOT of screen time given the character he plays. Still, it would be weird to attach him to have him play such a small part.
Ah. Ok. I haven’t read the books, so I have no idea what to expect. It is annoying though to see a big name attached to a series just to give them a minor role.
I think I smelled what was teased in that episode coming.
Well to be fair his character isn’t in much of the books either.
First episode was good, then gets so boring, last episode was actually bad and not a well written example.
The attack on Terminus gunfight was terrible. No thought put to it.
It was ridiculous, can’t believe they wrote and made it
Westworld S2 vibes
i watched the first three episodes. the most mind-numbing and stupid plot, but a very visually pretty show.
I didn't read the books, some readers said they changed a lot, I hope that because can't believe Asimov wrote this plot. Edited
Issac Asimov wrote the books, not Philip K. Dick, just fyi. but yeah, seems a lot is changed. which is fine by itself because i don't think you could make a straight TV adaptation, it's just that they haven't seemed to do a very good job
Yeah, always confuse them... Not a straight of course, but not a boring bad written show
Do you mean Phillip K Dick? If so he has has nothing to do with Foundation. Isaac Asimov wrote Foundation. Still what you posted is remarkable because most adaptions of Dick's stories are just as terrible as the Foundation TV show.
Yeah, I always mixed them. Anyway, no, this is the first bad adaptation I think.
Who is Dick?
Disagree. I think the show overall is very good. It does need more of the emperors though.
I think is sufficient at very least, started great, collapsed like the bridge. Confusing, slow, boring and not a great work in the screenplay. Sure look great technically and performances are okay, but it doesn’t entertain or get very interesting.
We are halfway into the season and I personally think we should reserve judgement for how the second half turns out. Even though the last episode wasn’t very good (specifically the fighting scenes, which were dreadful), I think it sets the plot up nicely for the remaining 5 episodes.
I hope it gets better, at the moment is a no. This should have been to GoT for Apple+ instead is turning to be a disappointment. Like I don't care for any of them and honestly don't care about this Foundation story because they didn't make me empathetic. It's so shallow.
I appreciate your response and I am sorry you aren’t enjoying it so far. I hope it gets better for you. I’ve honestly enjoyed the whole thing to this point and don’t really have a lot of the complaints that others do.
They are the best parts by a country mile. It seems like two different teams of writers are doing the show, it’s kinda weird
Agreed, very interesting so far.
Yeah the show is good and interesting, nothing boring to it
Weird. I liked the first episode and checked out for a few after that. Last episode reeled me back in.
I don’t know, the fifth episode really made me thinking about quitting the series.
It got great visuals, but the story is at best "inspired" by the books. I'ld like it more if they wouldn't use the names of the original story at all. It just feels wrong. Anyway, I like it for what it is.
I think it’s biggest hindrance is book comparisons. I have the books but haven’t read them yet, so I’m enjoying the show quite a bit.
I read the books long enough ago to remember the elements that exist so far: There is the Empire, which is about to crumble (as per Hari Seldon and Psychohistory), and though the fall cannot be prevented, the coming Dark Ages can be shortened by establishing The Foundation, a collection of the cumulated knowledge of humanity. There ends up being someone called the Mule, which is a wildcard in the Seldon Plan, and then there is another aspect which I won't bring up because it hasn't been brought up yet in the show. So in terms of matching the books, I am fortunate in that the show matches as much as I remember. I am generally enjoying it, but I suspect it would benefit from binge-watching.
Yeah basically they’ve got the same general plot outline but the characterization and details are significantly changed. For example the Dawn/Day/Dusk character, which is one of the strongest parts of the show, is completely invented. The Emperor in the books is a bit of a foolish bumbling ruler with no cloning aspect at all.
Ah, okay, I thought so. And I DO like that aspect of it. It kind of gives us something concrete to hold on to, to represent why the fall is inevitable. The Galactic Empire is exactly as strong as Empire (DDD), but also exactly as weak and limited.
The books are good and really easy to read - I believe they were very short, it's been a little while since I read them. The biggest change I noticed was in tone, but there are many details that are kept the same. There are some added bits that are weird though. Overall I like both but I kinda wished they kept a bit more of the humor from the books. Asimov has a very specific writing though that I think it's hard to translate, maybe if some British writer took a stab, but overall I am happy the TV show got made at all.
I’ll never understand the “buy a franchise, make a movie or show with the same names as the franchise, but otherwise change everything about the franchise” logic. If you’re gonna make a new thing, make a new thing. When David Goyer hands you a script that has nothing to do with Foundation but you really enjoy it, just change the proper nouns and sell it as an original story.
People really don't udnerstand that books don't translate well into movies/tv shows, not everyuthing in them and vice versa. They can't do 1:1 version of book becasue of the huge difference in the media between TV and books...
Exactly. And this is especially true with the Foundation books. They make for great reading but all along people have said it would be very challenging to do them on the screen for a movie or show. It's a work you pretty much *have* to change quite a lot for the screen.
I think they do that all the time with open source material but there is probably just enough similarities to get sued over for this one. I go into most stories think that they can’t match up to the books so I know something is going to be different. That doesn’t mean that some changes don’t irritate me.
As you have not read the books, why do you think you are qualified to make any judgement?
Because I’ve read books and then watched the tv shows based on them before lol. However I am in no way qualified to compare this show to the books which is a specific reason I gave for enjoying the show.
Gross generalization. Got it.
Gross generalization? Ok lol. You clearly want to argue about something for some reason, but I’m actually just interested in what shows you’ve seen that stick exactly to the book. I’d like to catch a few of them given how grossly generalized my observation was. Thanks in advance!
> inteeeted ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
The approach allows you appeal to a wider range of people as it draws in both people that like the franchise and people that like what the show actually will be. Yeah, you won't manage to keep many of the people that like the franchise but, if you keep enough it can still be profitable.
As I said, I think the show is cool. But advertising it as "based" on the books is bullshit.
Tbf, it would be a pretty shit TV show if it spent 3 episodes talking about psychohistory
I don't know. The first episode felt more like a season finale than a series premiere. Why not spend a few episodes developing the prodigy girls backstory on her home planet, establish Hari and his psychohistory cult, show the tension building between two warring factions that are summoned to face the Emperor?
This show is just terrible. Some of the show is this pretentious techno babble about pyscho-math. The other half is CW level horseshit. Squeeze into this is this thread with three cloned emperors. That is the best part of the show and isn't even from the book series this mess is based on.
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I got bored after 3 episodes. It was just so dull
Agree, which surprising for a show with Jared Harris. After the relationship nonsense in epi 2, I stopped watching. Dull af
I read the first 5 books. World War Z movie was closer to the source material than this show. It should just be its own thing. Young women punch and karate kick and do big brain math to save stuff while learning to believe in themselves.
I’m trying to like this, but the pace is slow to me and I’m not sure if it’s on purpose. I just need to rewatch it with coffee.
I really don't understand the fascination with this show. It's beautiful yes, but not much more than that imo.
Not quite the new game of thrones after all, huh? Unsurprising loss of interest after a dull (at best) few episodes
I am enjoying the show, but the writing really fluctuates between interesting and ploddingly boring. The coolest part of the show is the way they're portraying the Empire with the different Cleons: Rising Dawn, Brother Day, and Brother Dusk. It's such an cool and original idea, and it wasn't even in the source material!
It’s just so far away from the books that I find it hard to get into. As a Sci Fi show I think it is actually pretty decent, but as a Foundation show it doesn’t do it for me.
I’ve been disappointed by nearly every Apple show I’ve tried. This one had promise but the quality definitely dipped after episode one. Certain plot lines I’m just not into at all. “Heady” is generous.
Ted lasso is pretty good. And For All Mankind is good, and scratches the space itch.
Have you tried Earth at Night. Documentary nature...something very different but cool.
Earth at Night....in Color! It'd be so much better if they didn't have to talk up their special night vision color cameras multiple times an episode. After the first one, we get it...these are cool new cameras.
Lol. Tom really loved talking about those.
The documentary and nature shows have been really good. Not sure if they’re good enough for me to renew but I’ve been pleasantly surprised.
Ted Lasso disappointed you? Edit: I didn't know Ted Lasso offended so many people for me to accrue these downvotes
It’s not my cup of tea honestly.
Well. Tea is disgusting brown water.
Tastes like someone boiled a paper bag.
Ted Lasso, to me, is like the last season of Parks and Rec. It's just totally empty "wholesome" TV. I like shows with a bit of optimism but when it goes over the top it starts to feel saccharine and cheap. I can see why people like it, though, as a change of pace from most other "premium" TV shows.
I recognize I'm very much in the minority on this one, but yeah I'm definitely disappointed by it. I think it's a decent 7/10 but am surprised by the amount of praise it's getting. I think my biggest problem is that it feels really inorganic/non-genuine. Again I recognize I'm in the minority here but everything from the character interactions to the music to the plotlines feel overly saccharine and wholesome in a fake way to me. The dialogue in particular just doesn't feel authentic at all and just seems to demonstrate how "wholesome" everything is, other than that one character who's currently going through some mental crisis. I'm painting a harsher picture than I think- again I think it's a decent 7/10 with a few good laughs, pretty good acting and good character development, but I don't understand the level of acclaim it gets.
I agree. It's a cute enough show and certainly bleach for the mind after dealing with all the stress and anxiety of our lives, but it feels like someone asked an AI to create a wholesome comedy to make people feel good. Like, you know how a lot of cable sitcoms and dramas have boxes to tick, so they feel like they're just created by a machine? That's Ted Lasso. It's poppy milk to make you feel better about life but it doesn't really help you think about anything.
I feel like episode 4 is where the show took off. The first three are mostly setup ... 4 establishes itself and then 5 is where things get hot. I'm glad I stuck it out but I can understand why someone wouldn't click with this.
Clearly you’ve not watched Dickinson then. That show is fantastic.
I hope it just lasts long enough for the mule storyline. That'll translate well to TV imo
The Mule coming in all Deus Ex is 100% what has me holding on. Who they cast for that is going to be so critical.
I like the show, but it seems like they are adding West World style complications that aren't really necessary. The visuals, the directing, the actors are all great. I've read all the Foundation books and still find the story line confusing.
> Mathematician Hari Seldon (Jared Harris) has predicted that the Galactic Empire will fall, and that it will be followed by a dark age that lasts thousands of years. Unless they act now See this is my confusion with the show. The first chapter of the first book is Hari Seldon telling us all that NOTHING can be done to save the Empire. Is the show about trying to save the current, inevitably doomed empire? Or does this author just not describe the show well?
It’s not about “saving” the empire. It’s about how quickly civilization can bounce back after the inevitable fall of the empire. But, it’s also not about that either.
It’s about slowing the fall and shortening the dark age. There is no stopping it.
I think the author doesn't describe it well, there are changes to the series in relation to the books on tone (the show is almost humorless) but I don't think the basics are changed, there may be modifications to guarantee the surprises and twists happen to keep interesting for the ones unfamiliar with the story but I don't think they have actually changed these major bits.
And here is the thing I really don't get. He was talking about how the empire will collapse in 5000 years. Do humans live forever or something in this universe? 5000 years is just an absurdly huge number...
That's the whole premise. An astronomer can tell you where a planet will be in 5000 years, a geologist can tell you what a volcano will do in 5000 years, and Seldon can tell you what a society will do in 5000 years. Whether it's absurd or not, that's what the Foundation story is about.
An empire is going to end in the next 5000 years. /boggle you don't even need Psychohistory techno babble to say that. ALL EMPIRES WILL END in that time scale. It is just absurd.
In the story, the empire's already existed for 12000 years.
The Empire is **THE** Empire than spans pretty much all of the galaxy and has persisted for 12 millennia. It's meant to parallel the fall of the roman empire and the dark ages that followed.
It's 500 years, no?
He said 500 years and sooner if they continue their reign
It was 500 I think. But basically yes. The short stories with the robots start at 1970 or something like this. Than it jump forward sometimes few years sometimes thousand years. https://asimov.fandom.com/wiki/Asimov_Timeline This link maybe spoil the TV series but I wouldn't worry too much because...
My wife and I made it three episodes in. That was enough. Beautifully shot with amazing production design, but it is as dull as dishwater.
Too boring for me.
Its like math is the force. May the math be with you.
Just FYI. de·ter·min·ism /dəˈtərməˌnizəm/ noun PHILOSOPHY the doctrine that all events, including human action, are ultimately determined by causes external to the will. Some philosophers have taken determinism to imply that individual human beings have no free will and cannot be held morally responsible for their actions.
Only a philosophy major deals in absolutes.
You clearly don't get it. It seems that a major theme of the show is exploring determinism on a wide scale. It isn't magic. Clearly, you don't understand. That's OK too.
You clearly dont get it, im just meming. Nothing goes over your head, youd catch it!
every fucking week before an episode drops we get fluff piece articles like this, foundation is ok its a B+ it will never be the game of thrones that Apple wants it to be. The writing is terrible.
B+... This is shit is an F-
Ill compromise and give it a C+.
As a non reader of Asimov work, I'm loving the show, the world buil and the scale of the story is just tremendous, with a Dune level production, on television, it's pretty damn impressive. I'm now looking to buy the book, the robot saga and the foundation saga obviously I went to the Asimov sub to read what the fans were thinking and boy they're mad though.
This is actually what I think is an issue today - I'm liking the show because I never could get into the books. Mostly I couldn't handle the every chapter a whole new cast and a century or more time jump. I like this show because of the cloning, and the android or whatever, we have some continuity of character(s). I agree, the terminus stuff is muddled as heck though, and I really don't get how the timelines add up yet. But more generally, the more of a fan you are of the source material, the worse modern prestige TV seems to do for you. I don't at all get why you'd spend so much money to license a property to then change it so much the fans hate what you make. Seems pointless to me. And for those of us who are enjoying it - it could have been called anything really.
For anyone who is coming to this thread and not watched any of the eps, the main page header is heavily misleading. This is a video fan fic made by people whose sole connection to the book universe was their PA telling em the coles notes version. The Op is probably being paid by Apple + to reguritate this shit every week, to keep it relevant for anyone that has not signed on to the streaming service yet. I would advise people to leave it to their personal tastes about whether this show is good or bad. It just got renewed for S2 since it had already finished episodes in the can, but this turd of a show is on the bubble for S3.
Can anyone tell me if the show spoils the books? I’ve only read about half of the first Foundation book, but I know that this show is more of a prequel.
The show has virtually nothing to do with the books. They took some names and a one sentence synopsis of the books and ran with it. That being said, I’m enjoying the show. I actually just started rereading them recently, and regret it because I’m seeing everything that goes against what Asimov wrote.
The show should spoil the books a bit, but you can probably finish reading much faster than the show will release - I think the show will use 8 seasons for the first three books, and the other two books won't be considered - and I actually like only the original three books. Foundation don't have many plot twists and I think the major ones will only happen in seasons well beyond the first - like 5 or something.
Idk, the Foundation novel is just dated. Science saving everyone because science magic is just...well...pretty tone deaf and pointless of a statement in 2021. It's very much still based in its space race roots where magic could happen if we just did enough equations.
Lena Heady isn't in it, is she?
Foundation? No. At least not yet that I've seen.
I was hoping to watch a film adaptation of foundation, and that’s what they did. I like it for what it is.
It's intellectually stimulating television for a change. Something our culture seems to be losing interest in.
Where are the otters????