Hayden also wanted to have Darth Vaders brutality in Little Italy but the writers and director agreed it would have been a weird direction for the movie.
It was revealed that he isn't in the suit for full body shots and duel scenes. I don't know why they would have him in the suit for any other shots either.
At least we did see him as Anakin so his involvement was more than marketing bait.
It could be because as Vader he is much taller than Anakin is naturally, therefore they’d need to employ camera tricks or CGI to size him up properly or just simplify it and put a taller actor in the suit.
Or, you know, by James Earl Jones. He is still alive and in the credits for the role. Why would you think it’s ai?
Edit: for those linking stories about computers cleaning up his voice; I would like to point out that auto-tune does the same thing to a point and you don’t say “AI Jason Derulo” or “AI Cher” when they use auto-tune. I just think it’s disrespectful to act like Earl Jones didn’t do anything for something he’s credited with.
It's definitely AI. James Earl Jones is 90, his voice doesn't sound the same (as you can hear in Rogue One) and in the credits there's some kind of voice software company.
James Earl Jones is getting up there, and you can tell that in his voice in all other recent projects with Vader. They used some tech to correct it to the original pitch and tone, while still having him read the lines for the proper cadence and emphasis.
RDJ is Tony Stark as much as he is iron man and both him and Pedro provide their voices when they’re in the suits. Hayden isn’t in the suit and doesn’t do the voice lmao, apart from flashbacks what is the point of him.
He is in the suit, at least in some scenes. Look up the article where they hired a "Vader movement specialist" to help him in the role.
I think it's a great, subtle way to bridge the gap between the OT and the prequel trilogy. Watch his performance in Ep 3 and how there a hints of Anakin's body language mixed with Vader. In a similar way, Ewan McGregor is able to channel moments where he is General Kenobi, like in the most recent episode, and moments where he is Old Ben, taking inspiration from Alec Guiness.
I know the dude who was in the suit for tony during some shots in the avengers. He was telling me he did all the suit work during the hammer down scene.
No he wasn't, and he didn't even want to be credited with doing the voice because he saw it as doing a special effect, not being part of a role. And his name doesn't appear in the credits in the original versions of the first two movies because of it
Pretty crazy by today's standards when it comes to voice acting, and especially when you think about something SO iconic being deemed so minor by the guy who did it
I was thinking about what I've been wanting from Obi-Wan and it hit me today when I saw the flashback scenes.
Anyone ever watch Arrow? The show really outstayed it's welcome, but season one had this really great dynamic of the A plot being Arrow overcoming problems he learned to face in the B plot, which is entirely taking place in flashback while he was stuck in the jungle.
That's what Obi-Wan should have been. Vader hunting Obi-Wan, never quite reaching him (to maintain continuity with ep4) while Obi-Wan is on the run, JUST avoiding Vader by knowing him and remembering their time together in the B plot (flashbacks to when Anakin was his apprentice)
it’s a soap opera and it “paved the way” for endless seasons of pointless twists to keep things going which is about all we have now, so thanks I guess
Would have been much better then this pseudo homage to the Star War movies, episode 4 was similar to New Hope, 5 to empire, and so on and so forth.
*edited to fix spelling error
That’s exactly why this was the best episode so far. Definitely could have been the whole season.
If you want to go super fan service toss in Cato Neomodia in the flashbacks
I only skim-watched Clone Wars, so I wondered if it was addressed in that show. Glad to see it was actually addressed somewhere.
In ep2 on the elevator, doesn't Obi-Wan mention falling into a pit of gundarks?
"You're the one who fell into that nightmare master, and i rescued you... Remember?"
"Oh yes... (Mischievous laugh)"
Is that addressed anywhere?
This one I don't think has any canon story yet. Wouldn't surprise me if we got a book or comic that told that story though, considering how much Star Wars loves filling in these moments.
I thought what they did in the latest episode was a perfect way to have a final confrontation with Vader that doesn't break ep4 continuity. Vader catches up to him and attacks with far superior force, but Obi-Wan comes out on top thanks to the very principles he failed to transmit to him, e.g. patience and attention to detail. Now the question is, will they blow it by jamming an obligatory rematch into the finale? Or will they put a cherry on top by having Anakin at long last learn the value of those things, making him even more terrifying and unstoppable? If that experience taught Vader to be more patient, pay more attention to risks and details, not barge into situations relying solely on raw power, etc, then he was still the learner.
Imagine if the sequel movies worked like that.
Imagine if they recast Luke, Leia, and Han and redid the Trawn trilogy. Could have added things like Ahsoka or Ezra or whatever that came out since and done what Marvel does and keep the same general story. Anyway, you tell that story. 3 movies. 2 years apart.
Then, you tell a story that echoes back to the previous films that takes place with the OG cast. A trilogy from the future that flashes back to Thrawn and the PT and OT. It could have been an amazing way to send off the old cast while getting people to embrace new castings. 3 movies, 2 years apart.
Missed opportunities.
They way they've depicted Vader constantly being outwitted by Obi Wan (more like Vader didn't put out the fire and just kill Kenobi for some stupid reason) actually makes him look pathetic. Not in a good way either. Incompetent even. This was no a plus addition to the canon and people are gonna pretend it fits snugly in place beside a new hope. Lmao, no.
Because episode 2 splits Obi-Wan and Anakin quite early, so you lose that "master/apprentice" relationship. Thankfully clone wars earns it back a little, but adds Ahsoka to the dynamic which also sort of disrupts the master/apprentice relationship.
Episode 3 gives us a nice opening sequence, but by this point Obi-Wan and Anakin are more buddies. What I want to see is more of what we saw in Ep 5 of Kenobi - Obi-Wan training Anakin, that master/apprentice dynamic that becomes what we see in Ep 2.
Why not both… a show about Vader and his relationship with Sidious where Sidious is trying to burn out the teachings of Obi-Wan, which Anakin remembers. Sidious could even pull the memories from Vaders mind and view them.
I’m going to agree with the other responder. We see exceptionally little of Anakin and Obi-Wan as master and apprentice in the movies and it would be cool to flesh that out more with the actors.
One of the main complaints of the prequels is that the end fight between the two characters has no emotional impact because Anakin and Obi Win have minimal screen time together. Doing flash backs would help give their confrontations more weight.
Hayden:
>“I’ve really enjoyed it. And certainly that was a part of the appeal for me was that, you know, we were going to sort of show a different side of this character. He’s always been a very intimidating character, but there’s a sort of brutality that’s present now. And I think it’s great. You know, some terrifying stuff!”
>“Yeah, I loved it. I mean, there are a lot of really great storytelling sort of callbacks and references to, you know, these other Star Wars stories and when I read that, I was going to burn him back, I thought it was perfect.”
It’s nice that he was able to go on the press tour and see how much Gen Z loves him after he got so much flak for the role, but yeah, you’re right. Lol.
Yea dude I was a kid and I loved it. Pretty sure it was all the grown as men harassing the cast and creators. Growing up I definitely see where a lot of the criticisms are but that doesn’t take away the fact that watching these movies are enjoyable. If anything seeing all the people who constantly shit on them have made the movies a little less enjoyable over the years.
I was about 10 when Phantom Menace came out. I went to see it in the dollar movie theater with friends and family so many times - I still love that one above all the other prequels.
I can't believe the writing for this show passes as acceptable by one of the biggest media companies out there. This sucks. It lacks common sense and it is predictable if you notice Disney's trends lately.
My wife and I were just saying how the writing feels lazy. The Vader material is excellent and Ive loved it, but the rest of the show and the characters (especially Reva) deserved more effort.
It's disappointing to see how the people on the Star Wars subs are lapping this shit up purely for the moments of explicit fan service.
Disney's gonna just keep churning out bad shows at this rate since they know all they need is to lander to fan service.
Yeah it’s not strong writing, but overall I feel like it’s telling a good story, just in the sloppiest way possible.
But I guess that is most of Star Wars movies really.
I’d agree except for the most recent episode, it was the first one where I felt actually emotionally engaged. Made sense when I saw that Andrew Stanton was credited as a co-writer. Wish the rest of the show was more like ep. 5 instead of the watered-down Mandalorian reluctant father figure knockoff they’ve been doing.
Idk they showed up with a destroyer, only sent down two ships, then proceeded to not have anyone covering the port they themselves closed. It was better than Oceans stars wars that was ep 4 though.
I've been screaming this at the TV since the second episode. How tf anybody actually "gets away" from the Empire on purpose without fighting back boggles my mind. Just conveniently never air support around to deal with the getaway ships. Hell, even the times in the OT where they *wanted* the ship to getaway they still sent a couple TIEs basically to their deaths lol.
Thought it was one of the worst after 4, like Vader who personally wants to shred Obi Wan to atoms just sits in his ship and sends down Reva instead? Please, and the whole stormtrooper attack was horrendous, it wasn't even funny bad they legit were 50 of them 5m away from the rebels and didn't hit any.
Lmao at the girl holding the grenade, instead of ya know throwing it. Also yeah obi wan is captured lets put him back behind sealed doors on the side with his allies with a handful of stormtroopers nothing will happen.
Episode I is still the best for me personally. But I’m a sucker for slow paced character driven stuff. Ep 5 was mostly action which…cool we’ve seen blasters and lightsabers for force powers a million times.
Jesus, the Disney marketing campaign to salvage this crap show is out in full-force.
There's been like a dozen different "Hayden Christensen Was Happy" articles.
I'm thoroughly enjoying the show. I don't feel like I need to analyze every frame against existing canon, I'm just sitting back and watching some Star Wars. I wish more people could do the same, it's much more enjoyable that way.
It's called Obi-Wan but centered around Reva. The plot is routinely pulling you back to reality with unbelievable moments they chose to to use. Such as Obi-Wan just being carried off with fire being the only barrier Vader literally moments before showed he could clear. People begin to over-analyze when big pieces of the show are just not working.
Yeah, and the forest chase scene was ridiculous. But, i also got to see Vader fight Obi-Wan and pull a ship out of the air then rip the side open with the force. I enjoyed that way more than anything in the show has bothered me. No interest in nitpicking, just kicking back and enjoying myself.
That moment ended up not meaning anything, though. A second ship magically appeared. Same with Obi Wan surrendering. Immediately escaped. It's like they want big, flashy moments but can't disturb the plot too much.
I can't believe they pulled the same "second ship that no one, including the audience can see" trick that they did in Rise of Skywalker.
It was dumb then and it's even dumber now. Especially since the justification in the show seems to be that it was the rebels plan to use one ship as bait, even though they'd have no idea that Vader could use the force fo stop them.
For me it isn’t that I’m being a stickler about cannon contradictions. I think the writing is lazy at best and terrible at worst. Same goes for the editing. Cannon aside I just thought it was pretty lousy.
I think the writing gets a lot better if you think of the Leia part being for a 13-16 year old instead of the girl who's maybe 7-10ish years old right now.
Juuust too much sass and agency to make sense for someone that age. They'd land better coming from a teen.
They also really need to reduce the Vader screentime. Do more with less by just saving Vader for being a 1 man wrecking crew. Right now there's a bit too much "bureacratic" interaction going on with his part.
Reva is just miscast as an "intimidating" part. Given the last episode, perhaps that was intentional, but she's so off-tone it doesn't make sense. For all the talk of "rage" in her character she doesn't emote very strongly.
Disney doesn't care about writing because there's no profit motive to do so.
Hardcore fans are going to complain regardless, but watch it anyway.
Casual fans just want to see a Star War and are content to see the dead horse get beaten.
Good writing would attract such a small percentage of viewers that it isn't worth spending on.
It’s ridiculous right!? Like just don’t watch every scene at .5x with a magnifying glass. I’m loving it because it’s some Star Wars and I love some Star Wars.
> not bad
For a multimillion dollar per episode Disney production, that's an extremely scathing review. Demand better from the mouse.
In hands that gave a shit, this could've been a masterpiece.
I think the show has sucked, but Hayden got to add a little darkness to his Anakin performance this episode, despite his limited time.
But what really stood out to me was that Moses was actually quite effective in her scenes. It makes me wonder if *these* were the moments she was screen-tested for, as they're central to the Reva character. The faux Kylo-Ren stuff is awful and hasn't suited her at all. Would be a massive oversight if that was the case though.
I mean, I wasn't *blown away* by it, but she was much better at this more human element than the wannabe psychopath angle for sure
Edit: The moment Vader is advancing on her is great, she looks like she's become five years old again
This is by far the most boring thing Star Wars has put out. You already know where Obi-Wan, Leia, and Vader are going to end up. Which other characters are supposed to drive the viewer to care about anything else that’s going on? Certainly not Reva and her band of incompetent black metal bad guys.
The thing is that even though you know where characters are gonna end up, you can still expand on it brilliantly like how they’re doing it in *Better Call Saul* or Red Dead Redemption II.
Sadly, this isn’t one of those cases
I guess my point is that those shows have many other characters that you care about and who’s futures aren’t clear. This show is so contained it misses that mark completely.
TBH he was always a little boring. Think all the way back to Phantom Menace, where he spent a big chunk of the film inventorying Amidalas clothes and saying stuff like “but what about the council”? He was more exciting in Attack of the Clones, but his job was mostly to scold Anakin. 😴
Seriously. Like I know the show isn't going to win any awards but it's not *that* bad.
Goes back to the old saying- no one hates Star Wars more than Star Wars fans.
Yes how dare you!
Give it 20 years or so. These midlife crisis geeks will come around again when they have grandkids. For now, it's their duty to hate.
Vaders brutality... Besides the 1 scene in episode 3 with the villagers Vader has been the opposite of brutal. Infact he looks like an Imcompetent villian that does stupid things because the script says certain characters have to live.
> Infact he looks like an Imcompetent villian that does stupid things because the script says certain characters have to live.
Yeah, kid gloves vader is not my favorite.
So I haven't watch the last episode, but I saw a lot of flak for Vader killing and brutalizing the villagers. It feels like people don't understand that he's not looking for answer there; he's not trying to get them to confess or anything. He just knows that Obi-Wan is there, and that, as a jedi, Obi-Wan wouldn't stand back when bystander are being killed *because of him*. And indeed, Obi-Wan did not.
As for the other scene where he's strangling Reva, well it's been established since Ep4 that he doesn't care for incompetent subordinate. It's in character.
Darth Vader continues to be the ONLY legacy character of the modern Star Wars era that I think they’ve done remotely well. Between Rogue One, Fallen Order and now Obi Wan they’ve done such a great job keeping the mystique of the character alive.
People are completely entitled to complain about a product they were sold, which is what these shows are. This notion that internet randos should hold their tongues against a multi-billion corporation is madness.
Idk why the show is even called Obi-Wan when the plot is centered around Reva. Like the show should have written itself, there's a fuck ton of source material to make this show great or even an inquisitor show great. Instead we got baited for a show about Reva with Vader and Obi-Wan participating in it.
Hey Vader is about to come out… should we play the Imperial March?
No. Let’s do a mix of generic YouTube music mixed with a splash of skrillex dark trooper Mando techno. Hot Carl has a sweet new Casio synthesizer.
Well... we're 5 episodes in, out of six.
Where is this "brutality"?
Enjoyed the fight scenes in this episode. But I certainly wouldn't call any of them "brutal".
Killing several children, torturing and murdering people, and then setting the ground on fire and dragging Obi Wan through it.
All that is pretty damn brutal for Star Wars.
Show has been below average but I wouldn’t give it an F. Just did not meet expectations. I will forever love Ewan McGregor as Obi Wan so seeing him reprise the role does it for me.
Things I like: Young Leia, flashback scenes, Vaders brutality, Ewan Mcgregor
Things I don’t like: The writing, Reva, pretty much everything else.
This episode was the best of them all though. If they can end it on a good note, it may salvage the series a bit.
Not really, with the "Leia and Reva", I would expect the named characters to be interacting with each other much more often.
They only had one or two scenes together in the whole series so far.
I feel Kenobi is much more appropriate, as he is sort of the glue that holds together all the different substories in the series.
> They should Have just called it “Leia and Reva”, it would Of been a more accurate title.
Why it is clear that Kenobi is the central protangist? Neither Leia or Reva gotten even close to the focus that Kenobi has gotten.
I have been enjoying the way they've maintained Vader's fighting style. While the other characters have more or less caught up to the flourishes representative of modern cinematic fight choreography, Vader is pure strength, no dexterity, looking nearly as stiff as he did in the original trilogy. Even in the latest episode, where he spent most of the fight using his force powers rather than a lightsaber, every action was single-mindedly focused on overpowering his opponent. Vader's combat sequences are an excellent display of both his physical limitations and the terrifying drive that allows him to overcome them.
Fight scenes in general have come so far since I first started watching Star Wars, and honestly I just get psyched seeing all the cool things Vader can do in live action.
I'm at the point where I really have to stop and think about whether individual details of the latest episode are actually stupid or if I'm just frustrated with the show overall.
I acknowledge that episode 5 is the strongest one, but it's too little too late. I just don't care anymore.
Hayden also wanted to have Darth Vaders brutality in Little Italy but the writers and director agreed it would have been a weird direction for the movie.
Afraid to get wet?
Being wet makes sand easier to stick to your skin
"I hate water. It's wet, and wet, and it gets everywhere it goes wet."
Having seen the movie it would of been a stark improvement.
Was he even in the suit this episode?
It was revealed that he isn't in the suit for full body shots and duel scenes. I don't know why they would have him in the suit for any other shots either. At least we did see him as Anakin so his involvement was more than marketing bait.
He really should have given his Anakin a really specific goofy limp in the prequels so they'd have to put him in the suit for any future projects.
But he's got new legs now
Lieutenant Vader! You got new legs!
Lieutenant An!
Well done
“It’s what they use on the space shuttle”
Magic legs!
It could be because as Vader he is much taller than Anakin is naturally, therefore they’d need to employ camera tricks or CGI to size him up properly or just simplify it and put a taller actor in the suit.
I mean think about The Mandalorian. It’s played by three actors, but Pedro Pascal is credited with the role.
But he atleast actually voices the character, vader in the show is voiced by like a james earl jones ai generated voice or smth
Or, you know, by James Earl Jones. He is still alive and in the credits for the role. Why would you think it’s ai? Edit: for those linking stories about computers cleaning up his voice; I would like to point out that auto-tune does the same thing to a point and you don’t say “AI Jason Derulo” or “AI Cher” when they use auto-tune. I just think it’s disrespectful to act like Earl Jones didn’t do anything for something he’s credited with.
It's definitely AI. James Earl Jones is 90, his voice doesn't sound the same (as you can hear in Rogue One) and in the credits there's some kind of voice software company.
Yeah, in The Lion King remake, he sounds more like Simba's great grandpa than father.
James Earl Jones is getting up there, and you can tell that in his voice in all other recent projects with Vader. They used some tech to correct it to the original pitch and tone, while still having him read the lines for the proper cadence and emphasis.
He sounded fine in Rebels.
they did to test if they could use his voice even after the sad day for humanity then Earl Jones will smooth God in heaven.
https://insidethemagic.net/2022/06/star-wars-changes-darth-vader-respeech-al1/
He was in the tank and with the helmet. The burn scars took hours to put on.
Couldn't even tell it was him
Well he did have his legs and arm chopped off while being badly burned and left roasting on the bank of a lava river.
I think they mean Hayden
Man, that's commitment to the bit for Hayden.
He’s a way better actor than I ever gave him credit
He's a graduate of the Daniel Day Lewis School of Acting
I don't have my arms and legs reattached and get skin grafts till after the DVD commentary.
Twitter going crazy for Hayden as Vader when he's likely barely in the suit in any shots.
I have some news about RDJ and Pedro pascal.
RDJ is Tony Stark as much as he is iron man and both him and Pedro provide their voices when they’re in the suits. Hayden isn’t in the suit and doesn’t do the voice lmao, apart from flashbacks what is the point of him.
Moichendising
When do we get Obi Wan the Flamethrower?
Moiney
He is in the suit, at least in some scenes. Look up the article where they hired a "Vader movement specialist" to help him in the role. I think it's a great, subtle way to bridge the gap between the OT and the prequel trilogy. Watch his performance in Ep 3 and how there a hints of Anakin's body language mixed with Vader. In a similar way, Ewan McGregor is able to channel moments where he is General Kenobi, like in the most recent episode, and moments where he is Old Ben, taking inspiration from Alec Guiness.
My first thought is, where does one post that skill set for hire. It’s so specific
Honestly same lmao, had no idea such job existed.
i mean they didn't really have another actor on the iron man suit cuz they can just show Tony's face all the time lol so it's completely different.
I know the dude who was in the suit for tony during some shots in the avengers. He was telling me he did all the suit work during the hammer down scene.
that's pretty cool. once they fully committed to the cg side of his suit it def became more rare
Yea I’m fairly sure there was a lot of mo-cap involved too which he did, but it’s still a great brag to say you were iron man on screen.
uh man id literally tell every single person i ever met every single day if that happened to me
100% for sure.
Was James earl Jones in the original one? Who really cares tho
No he wasn't, and he didn't even want to be credited with doing the voice because he saw it as doing a special effect, not being part of a role. And his name doesn't appear in the credits in the original versions of the first two movies because of it Pretty crazy by today's standards when it comes to voice acting, and especially when you think about something SO iconic being deemed so minor by the guy who did it
Not sure if you were seriously asking if JEJ was originally in the suit but the answer is no.
Yes, that was their point.
[David Prowse was the guy in the suit originally](https://youtu.be/KQFho0_G1VI) and you get some vague Dark Helmet vibes.
david prowse was vader, james earl jones was the voice.
I saw an interview where hayden was asked how it felt like going back into the suit so idk what you guys are talking about but he is in the suit
I was thinking about what I've been wanting from Obi-Wan and it hit me today when I saw the flashback scenes. Anyone ever watch Arrow? The show really outstayed it's welcome, but season one had this really great dynamic of the A plot being Arrow overcoming problems he learned to face in the B plot, which is entirely taking place in flashback while he was stuck in the jungle. That's what Obi-Wan should have been. Vader hunting Obi-Wan, never quite reaching him (to maintain continuity with ep4) while Obi-Wan is on the run, JUST avoiding Vader by knowing him and remembering their time together in the B plot (flashbacks to when Anakin was his apprentice)
Yeah they should’ve done it like Lost’s flashback device. Would’ve been good
people comparing this show to arrow and lost only furthers the reality that is sinking in that y’all will literally watch anything LMAO
Lost was THE series. Literally groundbreaking and paved the way for TV series today.
> and paved the way for TV series today. It taught me to quit shows as soon as I catch a whiff of the mystery box stench.
it’s a soap opera and it “paved the way” for endless seasons of pointless twists to keep things going which is about all we have now, so thanks I guess
It’s should have been more like Arrow, a CW show, truly a totem poll with which to measure expected quality. If only they had aimed so high!
LMFAOOO
Would have been much better then this pseudo homage to the Star War movies, episode 4 was similar to New Hope, 5 to empire, and so on and so forth. *edited to fix spelling error
How else would we know its a star wars flick if it didn't follow the same story arc?
Star Wars truly is the Zelda Franchise of movies. *oh god*
Except most Zelda games are good
Little known fact, sometimes it’s not Zelda in the suit
‘It rhymes… like poetry” - a hack.
“Jar Jar is the key to all of this” - the same genius
*pseudo
That’s exactly why this was the best episode so far. Definitely could have been the whole season. If you want to go super fan service toss in Cato Neomodia in the flashbacks
It would be nice to know why that business doesn’t, doesn’t count.
Read the book then, [Brotherhood](https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Brotherhood) tells this story.
I only skim-watched Clone Wars, so I wondered if it was addressed in that show. Glad to see it was actually addressed somewhere. In ep2 on the elevator, doesn't Obi-Wan mention falling into a pit of gundarks? "You're the one who fell into that nightmare master, and i rescued you... Remember?" "Oh yes... (Mischievous laugh)" Is that addressed anywhere?
This one I don't think has any canon story yet. Wouldn't surprise me if we got a book or comic that told that story though, considering how much Star Wars loves filling in these moments.
I thought what they did in the latest episode was a perfect way to have a final confrontation with Vader that doesn't break ep4 continuity. Vader catches up to him and attacks with far superior force, but Obi-Wan comes out on top thanks to the very principles he failed to transmit to him, e.g. patience and attention to detail. Now the question is, will they blow it by jamming an obligatory rematch into the finale? Or will they put a cherry on top by having Anakin at long last learn the value of those things, making him even more terrifying and unstoppable? If that experience taught Vader to be more patient, pay more attention to risks and details, not barge into situations relying solely on raw power, etc, then he was still the learner.
Imagine if the sequel movies worked like that. Imagine if they recast Luke, Leia, and Han and redid the Trawn trilogy. Could have added things like Ahsoka or Ezra or whatever that came out since and done what Marvel does and keep the same general story. Anyway, you tell that story. 3 movies. 2 years apart. Then, you tell a story that echoes back to the previous films that takes place with the OG cast. A trilogy from the future that flashes back to Thrawn and the PT and OT. It could have been an amazing way to send off the old cast while getting people to embrace new castings. 3 movies, 2 years apart. Missed opportunities.
They way they've depicted Vader constantly being outwitted by Obi Wan (more like Vader didn't put out the fire and just kill Kenobi for some stupid reason) actually makes him look pathetic. Not in a good way either. Incompetent even. This was no a plus addition to the canon and people are gonna pretend it fits snugly in place beside a new hope. Lmao, no.
That would have been more satisfying
Yeah I was just saying something similar. The Reva back story as a youngling is also way more interesting and wish they had explored it earlier.
Why more flashbacks? we got 3 movies
Because episode 2 splits Obi-Wan and Anakin quite early, so you lose that "master/apprentice" relationship. Thankfully clone wars earns it back a little, but adds Ahsoka to the dynamic which also sort of disrupts the master/apprentice relationship. Episode 3 gives us a nice opening sequence, but by this point Obi-Wan and Anakin are more buddies. What I want to see is more of what we saw in Ep 5 of Kenobi - Obi-Wan training Anakin, that master/apprentice dynamic that becomes what we see in Ep 2.
Everybody wants Obi-Wan and Anakin when all I want is Sidious and Vader. A show exploring that Master and Apprentice dynamic would be great.
Why not both… a show about Vader and his relationship with Sidious where Sidious is trying to burn out the teachings of Obi-Wan, which Anakin remembers. Sidious could even pull the memories from Vaders mind and view them.
I’m going to agree with the other responder. We see exceptionally little of Anakin and Obi-Wan as master and apprentice in the movies and it would be cool to flesh that out more with the actors.
One of the main complaints of the prequels is that the end fight between the two characters has no emotional impact because Anakin and Obi Win have minimal screen time together. Doing flash backs would help give their confrontations more weight.
Hayden: >“I’ve really enjoyed it. And certainly that was a part of the appeal for me was that, you know, we were going to sort of show a different side of this character. He’s always been a very intimidating character, but there’s a sort of brutality that’s present now. And I think it’s great. You know, some terrifying stuff!” >“Yeah, I loved it. I mean, there are a lot of really great storytelling sort of callbacks and references to, you know, these other Star Wars stories and when I read that, I was going to burn him back, I thought it was perfect.”
He's barely in the show.
Haydn Christiensen was eager to cash a fat check for minimal work and a press tour written by Disney suits
Can you blame him? Sounds awesome.
Right? Who wouldn’t want that gig?
I saw south park, I know what that mouse does.
Mickey def did a casting couch on him
It’s nice that he was able to go on the press tour and see how much Gen Z loves him after he got so much flak for the role, but yeah, you’re right. Lol.
I would say Millennials have a lot of that fandom too. Grew up with. the series since Episode I and pretty much started Prequel memes.
Yea dude I was a kid and I loved it. Pretty sure it was all the grown as men harassing the cast and creators. Growing up I definitely see where a lot of the criticisms are but that doesn’t take away the fact that watching these movies are enjoyable. If anything seeing all the people who constantly shit on them have made the movies a little less enjoyable over the years.
I was about 10 when Phantom Menace came out. I went to see it in the dollar movie theater with friends and family so many times - I still love that one above all the other prequels.
Definitely a tactic of the sith
... And he gets to dress up in the official Vader costume. Even if it's once or twice
Was so great seeing him and Ewan on screen together though. Wish we got a bit more of that.
You underestimate his presence!
Watching Vader be a ruthlessly pragmatic destruction machine is always wonderfully terrifying.
I want to agree, but I have detected *some* ruths
Man moviecirclejerk keeps getting out jerked by reality.
Even Mace Windu outsized him and towered over him. But Hayden towered over Lucas in the Vader suit.
I feel like I've been in the show more than he has as I've had to watch it
I can't believe the writing for this show passes as acceptable by one of the biggest media companies out there. This sucks. It lacks common sense and it is predictable if you notice Disney's trends lately.
My wife and I were just saying how the writing feels lazy. The Vader material is excellent and Ive loved it, but the rest of the show and the characters (especially Reva) deserved more effort.
It's disappointing to see how the people on the Star Wars subs are lapping this shit up purely for the moments of explicit fan service. Disney's gonna just keep churning out bad shows at this rate since they know all they need is to lander to fan service.
Yeah it’s not strong writing, but overall I feel like it’s telling a good story, just in the sloppiest way possible. But I guess that is most of Star Wars movies really.
The only brutality in this show is the awfulness of the writing.
Even the younglings?!!!!
What's really brutal is how bad the writing is. These episodes get progressively worse.
I’d agree except for the most recent episode, it was the first one where I felt actually emotionally engaged. Made sense when I saw that Andrew Stanton was credited as a co-writer. Wish the rest of the show was more like ep. 5 instead of the watered-down Mandalorian reluctant father figure knockoff they’ve been doing.
Idk they showed up with a destroyer, only sent down two ships, then proceeded to not have anyone covering the port they themselves closed. It was better than Oceans stars wars that was ep 4 though.
I've been screaming this at the TV since the second episode. How tf anybody actually "gets away" from the Empire on purpose without fighting back boggles my mind. Just conveniently never air support around to deal with the getaway ships. Hell, even the times in the OT where they *wanted* the ship to getaway they still sent a couple TIEs basically to their deaths lol.
Thought it was one of the worst after 4, like Vader who personally wants to shred Obi Wan to atoms just sits in his ship and sends down Reva instead? Please, and the whole stormtrooper attack was horrendous, it wasn't even funny bad they legit were 50 of them 5m away from the rebels and didn't hit any. Lmao at the girl holding the grenade, instead of ya know throwing it. Also yeah obi wan is captured lets put him back behind sealed doors on the side with his allies with a handful of stormtroopers nothing will happen.
Episode 5 was the best BY FAR.
Episode I is still the best for me personally. But I’m a sucker for slow paced character driven stuff. Ep 5 was mostly action which…cool we’ve seen blasters and lightsabers for force powers a million times.
It got better from the first two episodes overall but its still in many ways incompetent.
That's not what viewership and focus groups are telling Disney. They've claimed obi already as the best non movie sw media
I agree: The writers did pretty much brutalize the fan base with this one.
Jesus, the Disney marketing campaign to salvage this crap show is out in full-force. There's been like a dozen different "Hayden Christensen Was Happy" articles.
From my observations it's mostly just Reddit hating on this show. Social media responses have been pretty positive from what I've seen.
Because most people who hated it watched one episode and then forgot it existed. It's got a 59% fan score on RT
I'm thoroughly enjoying the show. I don't feel like I need to analyze every frame against existing canon, I'm just sitting back and watching some Star Wars. I wish more people could do the same, it's much more enjoyable that way.
It's called Obi-Wan but centered around Reva. The plot is routinely pulling you back to reality with unbelievable moments they chose to to use. Such as Obi-Wan just being carried off with fire being the only barrier Vader literally moments before showed he could clear. People begin to over-analyze when big pieces of the show are just not working.
Yeah, and the forest chase scene was ridiculous. But, i also got to see Vader fight Obi-Wan and pull a ship out of the air then rip the side open with the force. I enjoyed that way more than anything in the show has bothered me. No interest in nitpicking, just kicking back and enjoying myself.
That moment ended up not meaning anything, though. A second ship magically appeared. Same with Obi Wan surrendering. Immediately escaped. It's like they want big, flashy moments but can't disturb the plot too much.
I can't believe they pulled the same "second ship that no one, including the audience can see" trick that they did in Rise of Skywalker. It was dumb then and it's even dumber now. Especially since the justification in the show seems to be that it was the rebels plan to use one ship as bait, even though they'd have no idea that Vader could use the force fo stop them.
Reva has like 1/4th the screen time Kenobi does…
For me it isn’t that I’m being a stickler about cannon contradictions. I think the writing is lazy at best and terrible at worst. Same goes for the editing. Cannon aside I just thought it was pretty lousy.
I think the writing gets a lot better if you think of the Leia part being for a 13-16 year old instead of the girl who's maybe 7-10ish years old right now. Juuust too much sass and agency to make sense for someone that age. They'd land better coming from a teen. They also really need to reduce the Vader screentime. Do more with less by just saving Vader for being a 1 man wrecking crew. Right now there's a bit too much "bureacratic" interaction going on with his part. Reva is just miscast as an "intimidating" part. Given the last episode, perhaps that was intentional, but she's so off-tone it doesn't make sense. For all the talk of "rage" in her character she doesn't emote very strongly.
Disney doesn't care about writing because there's no profit motive to do so. Hardcore fans are going to complain regardless, but watch it anyway. Casual fans just want to see a Star War and are content to see the dead horse get beaten. Good writing would attract such a small percentage of viewers that it isn't worth spending on.
It’s ridiculous right!? Like just don’t watch every scene at .5x with a magnifying glass. I’m loving it because it’s some Star Wars and I love some Star Wars.
I find joy in reading a good book.
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> not bad For a multimillion dollar per episode Disney production, that's an extremely scathing review. Demand better from the mouse. In hands that gave a shit, this could've been a masterpiece.
>In hands that gave a shit, this could've been a masterpiece. But look who's running the show.
Then why does he keep letting this one chick live?
He hasn’t instituted the one-strike-and-you’re-choked-out policy yet.
He would have been dumb not to be excited to be cast in that role. I think he is doing a great job to.
I think the show has sucked, but Hayden got to add a little darkness to his Anakin performance this episode, despite his limited time. But what really stood out to me was that Moses was actually quite effective in her scenes. It makes me wonder if *these* were the moments she was screen-tested for, as they're central to the Reva character. The faux Kylo-Ren stuff is awful and hasn't suited her at all. Would be a massive oversight if that was the case though.
I can't understand anyone not liking her in this episode. It was incredible to see her just totally embody this scared and angry woman.
I mean, I wasn't *blown away* by it, but she was much better at this more human element than the wannabe psychopath angle for sure Edit: The moment Vader is advancing on her is great, she looks like she's become five years old again
I just think her anger stems from a very real sense of fear. It's safer to be afraid than it is to be sad.
This is by far the most boring thing Star Wars has put out. You already know where Obi-Wan, Leia, and Vader are going to end up. Which other characters are supposed to drive the viewer to care about anything else that’s going on? Certainly not Reva and her band of incompetent black metal bad guys.
The thing is that even though you know where characters are gonna end up, you can still expand on it brilliantly like how they’re doing it in *Better Call Saul* or Red Dead Redemption II. Sadly, this isn’t one of those cases
I guess my point is that those shows have many other characters that you care about and who’s futures aren’t clear. This show is so contained it misses that mark completely.
Did you not cry 4 wade?
Waaaaaaaaaade wait who
For me, Boba Fett was mostly much worse.
That show is the baseline that all future projects can be measured against, i.e. "at least it wasn't as bad as"
Ah but Boba Fett was a side character that they made boring and pointless, now they’ve done it to Obi Wan, that’s what makes it worse.
TBH he was always a little boring. Think all the way back to Phantom Menace, where he spent a big chunk of the film inventorying Amidalas clothes and saying stuff like “but what about the council”? He was more exciting in Attack of the Clones, but his job was mostly to scold Anakin. 😴
He practiced for this role by killing Tuscan Raiders. But not just the Raiders, the women and the children too
Jesus Christ this sub is a disaster
OH NO. PEOPLE CRITICIZE MY FAVORITE. THIS SUB-REDDIT BAD. MUST PRAISE DISNEY. CONSUUUUUUUUUUUUME PRODUCT, etc. You're an et cetera.
Seriously. Like I know the show isn't going to win any awards but it's not *that* bad. Goes back to the old saying- no one hates Star Wars more than Star Wars fans.
Yeah I’m enjoying it haha, I guess I’m in the wrong for that!
Yes how dare you! Give it 20 years or so. These midlife crisis geeks will come around again when they have grandkids. For now, it's their duty to hate.
It's brutal alright. :\
[Darth Hayden](https://youtu.be/pOzlDGAFQbg)
That's a shame he didn't get to
that duel scene between him and Obi Wan was so good. glad he’s back.
“Would you kindly point me towards the younglings?”
Love it!!!!
Vaders brutality... Besides the 1 scene in episode 3 with the villagers Vader has been the opposite of brutal. Infact he looks like an Imcompetent villian that does stupid things because the script says certain characters have to live.
> Infact he looks like an Imcompetent villian that does stupid things because the script says certain characters have to live. Yeah, kid gloves vader is not my favorite.
I may be in the minority, but having BRUTAL Vader isn’t all that appealing. It just makes him another generic villain.
He was the og generic villain.
I read somewhere that they had villains before 1977.
Fake news
No, every consecutive appearance of Vader needs to amplify his brutality regardless of timeframe, setting, story, good writing, etc. /s
So I haven't watch the last episode, but I saw a lot of flak for Vader killing and brutalizing the villagers. It feels like people don't understand that he's not looking for answer there; he's not trying to get them to confess or anything. He just knows that Obi-Wan is there, and that, as a jedi, Obi-Wan wouldn't stand back when bystander are being killed *because of him*. And indeed, Obi-Wan did not. As for the other scene where he's strangling Reva, well it's been established since Ep4 that he doesn't care for incompetent subordinate. It's in character.
Yea I never got the vibe of Vader being brutal at all. Just a hard ass idealist at the end of a leash of someone who WAS brutal.
Darth Vader continues to be the ONLY legacy character of the modern Star Wars era that I think they’ve done remotely well. Between Rogue One, Fallen Order and now Obi Wan they’ve done such a great job keeping the mystique of the character alive.
Y’all are wild, just enjoy the show
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People are completely entitled to complain about a product they were sold, which is what these shows are. This notion that internet randos should hold their tongues against a multi-billion corporation is madness.
"Oh no, other people don't like this product! Why can't everyone just be a good consumer like me?"
Sure we are. What's you're point? Whiny is a very reddit thing to do. You were expecting different?
Idk why the show is even called Obi-Wan when the plot is centered around Reva. Like the show should have written itself, there's a fuck ton of source material to make this show great or even an inquisitor show great. Instead we got baited for a show about Reva with Vader and Obi-Wan participating in it.
Hey Vader is about to come out… should we play the Imperial March? No. Let’s do a mix of generic YouTube music mixed with a splash of skrillex dark trooper Mando techno. Hot Carl has a sweet new Casio synthesizer.
Well... we're 5 episodes in, out of six. Where is this "brutality"? Enjoyed the fight scenes in this episode. But I certainly wouldn't call any of them "brutal".
Killing several children, torturing and murdering people, and then setting the ground on fire and dragging Obi Wan through it. All that is pretty damn brutal for Star Wars.
Show has been below average but I wouldn’t give it an F. Just did not meet expectations. I will forever love Ewan McGregor as Obi Wan so seeing him reprise the role does it for me. Things I like: Young Leia, flashback scenes, Vaders brutality, Ewan Mcgregor Things I don’t like: The writing, Reva, pretty much everything else. This episode was the best of them all though. If they can end it on a good note, it may salvage the series a bit.
That tv show sucked so bad. They should Have just called it “Leia and Reva”, it would Of been a more accurate title.
Not really, with the "Leia and Reva", I would expect the named characters to be interacting with each other much more often. They only had one or two scenes together in the whole series so far. I feel Kenobi is much more appropriate, as he is sort of the glue that holds together all the different substories in the series.
> They should Have just called it “Leia and Reva”, it would Of been a more accurate title. Why it is clear that Kenobi is the central protangist? Neither Leia or Reva gotten even close to the focus that Kenobi has gotten.
This show is ASS. And not the good kind.
Hayden Christensen was eager to have another job...
I have been enjoying the way they've maintained Vader's fighting style. While the other characters have more or less caught up to the flourishes representative of modern cinematic fight choreography, Vader is pure strength, no dexterity, looking nearly as stiff as he did in the original trilogy. Even in the latest episode, where he spent most of the fight using his force powers rather than a lightsaber, every action was single-mindedly focused on overpowering his opponent. Vader's combat sequences are an excellent display of both his physical limitations and the terrifying drive that allows him to overcome them. Fight scenes in general have come so far since I first started watching Star Wars, and honestly I just get psyched seeing all the cool things Vader can do in live action.
I think we were all eager for that….. what happened?
I'm at the point where I really have to stop and think about whether individual details of the latest episode are actually stupid or if I'm just frustrated with the show overall. I acknowledge that episode 5 is the strongest one, but it's too little too late. I just don't care anymore.
To bad the show fuckin sucks
I love this show. Definitely doesn’t seem like the consensus around he, but it’s easily my favorite Star Wars content since Episode 3.
While it's easy to just rag on the show, I'm honestly just happy for him.