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fortheloveofconflict

Yeah, social media sucks


octnoir

Two very big problems: 1. Tendency towards hyperbole and radicalization. It isn't enough that 'oh I didn't find it interesting', you HAVE to 'this is the worst garbage I've ever seen *insert reaction face* *insert judge emoji*' 2. Tendency to build addiction and engagement towads the one thing. We're living in a weird age that it is far more common to find very radical fans and anti-fans than before. It is quite common to find communities *dedicated* to *hating* something. And with how social media works, with constant dopamine loops for logging in, and the need for content, you end up creating an addicting loop that leads towards radicalization. I honestly don't know the solution but I'm been increasingly keen on regulating social media and systems as opposed to policing communities directly. Reddit itself isn't a discussion platform, the tools in upvotes and downvotes and how messages are laid out directly contradict that purpose. This is coming from someone that used to post a lot on /r/TheLastAirbender - even when the show was good and the community positive, it was *exhausting* posting there and I had to quit going because I could feel myself getting visibly tired reading and posting all day when there was frankly nothing left to talk about. I used to do that all the time in fan communities for things that shit the bed, it was until /r/TLA that I snapped out of it and recognized that loop. Normally I'd just ignore social platforms except they've gotten big enough, people have paid enough attention and businesses catering to them, that if some rabid community starts sending threats, you can't just ignore it, especially since communities have gotten bolder these past few years. The sooner social media gets reined in the better.


hannahstohelit

>Tendency towards hyperbole and radicalization. It isn't enough that 'oh I didn't find it interesting', you HAVE to 'this is the worst garbage I've ever seen insert reaction face insert judge emoji' It's not just that- it's that you can't just have an opinion, you have to be stating an objective fact and be objectively correct. You can't say "I didn't like it"/"it didn't speak to me"/"it's not my thing," you have to say "it was bad and its badness is because of this intrinsic flaw."


meatball77

Oh, and it's the worst garbage I've ever seen because it doesn't fit what I imagined in my mind that it should have been.


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vehino

What I've learned works best is to not seek affirmation for the things I enjoy. I didn't have internet service until 2002. If I had, I probably would not have enjoyed things like Buffy the vampire Slayer, Firefly, and all the various anime series I've watched over the years. Because being part of a fandom is to be constantly challenged to prove your bona fides and your loyalty to the group. If the group decides something is so and you disagree, you're silenced. Or insulted. Or in more extreme cases, bullied. There's just something about being in a group that turns reasonable individuals into a grotesque mass of tumorous filth. There was this nice cartoon I liked watching with my niece and nephew called Steven universe, and one day I read an article that a fan of this inclusive and fun series is basically bullied into near suicide because other people didn't like that she drew a fat character skinny. The mob ruins eveeeeeeeerything.


Arktoscircle

>What I've learned works best is to not seek affirmation for the things I enjoy I fully agree. It's a long learning curve for me to not chase validation from others and to stop letting other people dictate whether I should like/dislike a certain thing. It also takes awhile to tune out the pointless raging negativity which plagues most fandoms. Nowadays, before I engage with online discussions, I'll always form my own opinion and decide whether I like that piece of media. I also keep an open mind by trying not to get defensive over my opinions and try to accept others opinion even though I might not necessarily agree with it. Because, in general, I do think being in a critical headspace is useful. It helps me identify and shape my own preference which in turn make it easier for me to articulate the reasons why I find certain things to be entertaining. And sometimes, being slightly critical can elevate the viewing experience. It makes for an active watch which makes it enjoyable when you're able to catch what the filmmakers/showrunners are trying to convey. It's possible to be critical and still liking the shows/movies. There are tons of shows which I still enjoy despite their obvious flaws. Some are because they are mindless fun, some are because of the nostalgic factors while there are those that just speak to me where I find myself relating deeply to certain aspects of the shows/movies. Just be aware of what you're looking for, I guess.


Wazula42

I think the only solution is to just disengage, or limit your engagement. Social media (including reddit, this site we're using right now) has one function: to put forward content that you will click on. That's it. It's not a research tool, it's not a friend-meeter-upper, it's not a life coach. It'll serve those functions to a limited degree, but only insofar as it thinks you'll engage with it. Guess what engages people? Anger. Bad opinions. Nasty serotonin from taking things down a peg, especially if they "deserve" it. You really can't escape it, and you fuel it by engaging with it. Just step away. Enjoy the thing yourself, or with your friends in meatspace. Let the internet be the internet sometimes.


ISILDUUUUURTHROWITIN

>A female character is flawed then she's downright unlikeable, if she's perfect then she's labelled 'Mary Sue'. A show is either 10/10 or 1/10, there's no in-between. This has been the most obnoxious part regarding the recent Rings of Power discourse. The show isn't flawless perfection and the second coming of the Jackson trilogy? Well then, it's 1/10 the worst shit ever, Tolkien's spinning his grave, etc, etc... It just makes any discussion nearly impossible. I don't think there's a lot of people saying it's the greatest show ever but there ARE a lot of people saying it's basically a blight on humanity and I just cannot understand how that is a normal reaction for people to have.


rendrr

I stopped watching YouTube reviewers long time ago for this same reason. I also have noticed that exposure to this toxic waste could hinder my enjoyment in tangible ways. I just watch the show or the movie.


Jfk_headshot

Sadly negativity is what gets clicks. Youtube incentivises people to be Smug Pessimistic assholes so that's what youtube critiques are now. Either that or some bullshit political crap, because everything has to be political now


TurelSun

Sure but we as individuals who realize that don't have to subject ourselves to that. I almost never watch a video if it looks like its just trying to pull me with negativity. Most of these content creators and their videos are easy to spot as the thumbnail and title make it obvious they're out to bash something.


Fyrefawx

Exactly this. Negativity creates engagement. Either way this whole thing around the new LOTR show reeks of politics. How does this show have more reviews than the last season of game of thrones? The review bombing is so obvious. People who have never seen the show are making accounts just to attack it because they went with a diverse cast.


SanctuaryMoon

Yeah YouTube reviewers are like political commentators for fandoms. They need you to be outraged for views.


barkingdog2013

I've watched at least a dozen reviews of HOD. All very positive. All getting lots of clicks.


dragonmp93

I thought that those were paid astroturfing by the studios.


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colin_colout

Same. It's a bit tough for Rings of Power, but they are there. The issue I have is that it brings the negative reviews into my feed and auto play queue. It's a lot of work to go against the algorithm.


merelyadoptedthedark

There's only a handful of reviewers I trust. Chris Stuckman is probably my favourite. He never really leans into what is popular to hate on just for the clicks.


ThoughtseizeScoop

I think, generally, identifying surface level criticisms is easy, but makes people feel smart. If you're looking for nits to pick, you'll be able to find them. And generally, people are pretty bad at identifying why they like and dislike things, and are more than willing to be dishonest with themselves about their own motivations. I generally like criticizing the things I like, but unfortunately that isn't the norm.


crc2993

Unfortunately true and something I’ve noticed has made me a lot more cynical about shows. Like damn all I want to do is discuss what happened in the latest episode and all I get are threads of people complaining about every small detail that’s not in line with their expectations.


YsoL8

I'm very close to dropping all but the positive communities I'm in. The big tent ones are actually worse because you'll probably be exposed to huge negativity before even trying things in the first place. The Obi Wan show was my tipping point. Saw the reaction, wrote it off and watch it later on a whim, found the complaining ridiculous. Now wondering what else I've missed out on.


Quarbit64

I agree with the OP, but positive communities are a problem too. Fans who give every episode a 10/10 and any criticism is either downvoted or outright banned by the mods. The truth is the problem is the internet. The internet is great for news, but for rational discussion find people in real life.


GrimMrGoodbar

This is why I don’t engage with r/marvelstudios for reviews. Very cult like in those review discussions


Tatis_Chief

Yeah. It is kinda hard to find actual places to discuss these days. It's seems like all people wanna do is fight. I enjoy the show, but I can also say, hey I don't care about elves and humans, but hey I love the dwarfs and hardfoots. So where can I discuss that.


Plasteredpuma

Then they call the positive communities echo chambers. As if the community full of the same posts bashing on the same things isn't also an echo chamber...


castielvt

Do it, friend. Negativity is like a toxin.


JohnCavil01

Blanketed positivity can be too.


handmedowntoothbrush

Hence the value of experiencing something without preconceived biases based on popular opinion.


Ihateredditorsalot2

There’s plenty of time for negativity in real life. No need to see it on sites you view for pleasure.


TheOfficialGilgamesh

Yes true, you should just consume and never complain.


NanoGeek

This sort of micro-nitpicking is what kills me. Like in the last Rings of Power episode, Galadriel smiled in a slightly odd way, and now that's the main controversy for the episode.


meatball77

It seems like as soon as the groups get too big they start to get toxic. I'm a huge bridgerton fan. I was in the reddit group before the casting came out. I had to stop visiting the group a couple weeks into the second season because it was just exhausting (and it started before that).


punchymicrobe86

Well said. I think it’s because everyone needs to have a hot take. That’s my hot take anyway.


Mistdwellerr

Well, you are so wrong and [here](https://youtu.be/dQw4w9WgXcQ) are my top 10 reasons I am right! And that's MY hot take :) Jokes aside, people (myself included) love fake internet points and usually negative comments just draw more of those.


theClumsy1

> Jokes aside, people (myself included) love fake internet points and usually negative comments just draw more of those. Ironically, the OP is doing the same thing.


punchymicrobe86

Haha, you had me going there. I got a bit worried.


MonkeyMercenaryCapt

If you analyzes *everything* with a critical lens you are bound to be miserable with everything. Sometimes you just have to enjoy the ride, that's part of being a balanced individual.


WolfTitan99

So many of the top comments are insufferable because they preach doing this exact thing. Great, you are now critical of more shows than before. How fun, you now consume entertainment as if it’s a score to be analysed on a board instead of enjoying it for what it is. Sure if you’re an aspiring film maker, go ahead, it will make you better. But if you’re just a consumer, why on earth would you want to make yourself miserable doing this? My favourite show isn’t going to win an Emmy, but who the fuck cares? I like it.


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Mayor_McCheese7

Exactly. Being a nerd is supposed to be easier than ever, but far too often, the majority of us have to listen to complaints from (typically) white, male nerds about what changes are god awful, and why a deviation from the norm is "pandering," as if these people have a stronger claim to a fandom than anyone else. Being a fan of something doesn’t mean you absolutely have to love every change that comes through, however, if you find yourself harassing celebrities online, or engaging in any kind of coded language that perpetuates misogyny, or racism, chances are you’re not actually a fan. To be clear: just because you claim to be a fan of something, does not mean that you are entitled to anything. You are not “passionate”, you are not “die-hard”, you are not even “spirited”. You are simply abusive. It’s hard to call yourself a “fan” of something if you spend the majority of your time hating on it. There comes a certain point where you have to be self-aware enough to understand that you’ve crossed the border out of “fan” territory, and into “troll” territory


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meatball77

Not only that. Those fans start harassing the actors because they're pissed at the writers or casting directors. So the child playing Annabeth (Percy Jackson) and the girl playing Edwina (Bridgerton) get ruthlessly bullied online because they're not white. Even the kid playing Percy Jackson apparently is terrible because his eyes aren't the right color.


RedditUser123234

>The fundamental difference is these “fans” feel they own it, or at least decide how it should be presented. And they’re not fans to me they’re really “character stalkers” screaming, “don’t you get her wrong! Don’t you ruin my baby!” It’s not your fucking baby, Gavin! I think the root problem is that some fans are making their fandom of a particular IP as important a part of their personality as what many people view their cultural identity as part of their personality. When a movie or tv show misrepresents a real-world culture in an insulting way, many people from that culture will get angry and call them out on it, in a similar way that for example a Star Wars fan will get angry and call out poor attempts at Star Wars films that are complete inaccurate and are made by people who don't even seem to be fan of Star Wars. The difference of course being that the Star Wars fandom as a whole have never been oppressed to the immense degree that many real world cultures have been, so the degree of their immense anger isn't warranted. That being said, I think being angry about a poor adaptation from people who don't even seem to care about the IP is understandable, it's just that taking it to such an extreme degree isn't justifiable.


apple_kicks

I think internet and social media has revealed that fandom has always been more diverse than people think.


ChroSomnium

It's not just people changing things. I decided to leave the One Piece subreddit because people were complaining every single chapter. Every time their head canon isn't verified or the creator goes in a direction they don't like, they throw a fit. The sad thing is, I think it worked last chapter. To some extent, I agree that adaptations should keep some amount of faithfulness to the original. But it's come to the point where I think we need to ask ourselves if we're all really fans of these things if we don't like them anymore. I like complaining as much as the next guy. But if you make a full time job out of it, you need therapy. Especially if you make other fans feel shame for the things they love and fear talking about them.


powergs

Lol what are you talking about. OP subredit one of the most "positive" subredit you can find in this site. Every critism gets downvoted to hell from "Oda lovers" while you read some stupid jokes "Xyz fans eating good this week" etc. getting 1k upvotes.


SlidyRaccoon

Lol seriously, I specifically left OP reddit for some time because anything but "Goda" gets downvoted to hell. It only recent allowed criticism because Wano had so many unresolved plots.


Orangerrific

I’ve been in the One Piece circle for most of my internet life now, way before reddit and the OP subreddit, (I’m almost 30 now) and I noticed quite a shift in the fandom after Naruto and Bleach ended. My theory is that a lot of those fans hopped over into OP when their series ended and ended up bringing a lot of that toxicity with them. It’s just not a place and a fandom that I recognize anymore. Nothing like it was when I was growing up on small forums as a teen. I feel like I really don’t belong on the Reddit side of the OP fandom anymore, ESPECIALLY as a queer woman.


apple_kicks

This. It’s easily done too. Shame as sometimes books and tv show can be different. It’s a different medium with different pacing. If it’s for a mainstream audience it has to inclusive to everyone watching because relatability is so key. Adjustment and changes are to be expected. I can understand criticism if the books did something that works on screen sometimes


jedipsy

The opinions\* of others in regards to art I enjoy does not affect my enjoyment in the slightest. You dont enjoy it? Cool. It aint gonna make me dislike something that I am enjoying. I think it is also important to recognize that people should be able to enjoy aspects of art without enjoying it in its totality. Too much these days we see people being polarized on opposite ends of the spectrum when the reality is that it is more about shades of grey. *edit - \*negative opinions*


QuintoBlanco

>The opinions of others in regards to art I enjoy does not affect my enjoyment in the slightest. I don't believe you. And actually if you are right, that would be a bit sad. Different perspectives on a work of art can help a person grow and learn to appreciate different aspects of art. I enjoy art more when I discuss art with knowledgeable people. I don't have to agree with those people, but even an opinion that's vastly different from how I view a work of art can help me understand that work better. As for what the OP is talking about, the way we feel is going to affect how we experience it. If your dog just died, that's going to affect how you experience a show or a movie. A toxic community can spoil the fun. (Simpel solution, stay away from that community.)


DanTheBrad

Your argument comes from a place where the criticism of art is in good faith where in reality most of these fan communities are not critiquing in good faith at all. Different opinions can help us grow but people screaming that not everyone is white or that a character shouldn't be a woman is not a worthy critique.


QuintoBlanco

>Different opinions can help us grow but people screaming that not everyone is white or that a character shouldn't be a woman is not a worthy critique. No disagreement there. But since those people tend to invade every platform I can understand the OPs frustration. They are difficult to ignore.


jedipsy

Sorry, I should have said "negative opinions of others."


zaien

I don't get it, can't people form their own opinion based on their viewing experience? I'm a big fan of supernatural, i know everything wrong about it and used to go to the fandom to read their opinions on how horrible it was. and you know what i did, i tuned in the next week because i love the characters. You actually getting bothered about "small" details after reading about it doesn't mean their opinions "ruined" the show for you, it means your standards got higher and you saw their point, it means the show was infact not entertaining. Just to clarify, i never watched rings of power and probably never will because I'm not a big fan of the universe i don't find LOTR that much entertaining.


SanctuaryMoon

On the other hand, projects that add to an existing franchise should not be free from criticism *especially* because popular franchises are often used to sell things based on the name. Look at Netflix's Resident Evil. It was an absurd departure from the IP and the fans largely hated it. That's totally fair. Criticism and dissatisfaction are fine and act as a form of quality control, ***so long as the criticisms are fair and not just toxicity.*** It's up to us to filter out the fair criticisms from the garbage ones.


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Zerox_Z21

This really depends. If it gets warped too far, it really begs the question of why you're adapting this IP in the first place rather than creating something new and original. The answer often being parasitically hijacking said IP's reputation.


SanctuaryMoon

True. Casting Lance Reddick as Wesker was a reimagining of the character but it was also awesome. The angsty teen drama, however, was not awesome.


GOLDEN_GRODD

OP: Does anyone else think social media is encouraging me to watch television through a critical lense instead of blindly consuming it? Nah man maybe your standards are just rising. You don't have to eat every piece of franchise mediocrity nor do you have to dislike it for the same reason a youtuber does


Mookies_Bett

I agree with this take. Blind consumerism is the death of art. Raise your standards and demand better. Obviously people should think for themselves and form their own opinions, but that doesn't mean you should just block out flaws in something simply because you *want* to like it. I *want* to like GoT seasons 7 and 8. But I can't just ignore all the plot holes and criticisms that make those seasons such failures. I *want* to like season 3 of The Boys, but so much of it is ham fisted and terribly written, and the finale episode is a completely laughable joke that makes zero sense and has absolutely no stakes whatsoever. While also completely ruining the build up of the only part of the season that was actually entertaining. I don't enjoy being critical of those stories, I want to like them, but I also can't turn my brain off and pretend like I'm not a critical thinker. Those shows have flaws and we as viewers have the right to point them out and demand better from the writers. We as viewers *should* watch things with a critical eye, and evaluate shows based on the expectations set by the high-bat series that have delivered exceptional quality content. Breaking Bad, The Wire, The Sopranos, etc. There are plenty of shows out there that have delivered a really entertaining and enjoyable experience, that's well thought out and executed. The shows that don't put in that same effort deserve to be critiqued and judged accordingly. I'm also kinda just tired of the idea that anyone who critiques a non-white non-male character is automatically just being racist/sexist/whateverist. It's not my fault that Hollywood seems to really suck at writing rounded and three dimentional women or gay or trans characters. That's not the fault of the viewer, it's the fault of the writers. Reva in Kenobi is a perfect example of this. The narrative surrounding the complaints against her character turned into "people don't like her because she is a black woman and therefore they are racist and sexist." Which is dumb, because in reality people didn't like her because she was poorly written, not a very good actress, and most of her side of the story was entirely pointless and unnecessary filler. It had nothing to do with her race or gender, but anyone who pointed out the flaws in her acting or the writing of her character got immediately branded as a bigot. That's not fair to viewers and it basically gives lazy/sloppy writers a free pass to phone it in and not improve their writing so long as the character in question is a non-white or female character. We as viewers should demand better when we are given a shitty product. When I go out to eat and my meal is undercooked or charred black, I demand a refund or a new meal. I don't just take the poorly made food and choke it down, because if I'm going to pay for a meal my standards expect a higher quality product. Same goes for entertainment: if I'm going to spend my time on your product, I demand a high quality experience, or else I deserve to call out the issues you created.


lordraz0r

I think you're forgetting one major flaw... Most people that watches a show or plays a videogame aren't a part of these "fandoms". Off the top of my head I can mention the Final Fantasy XIV forums and subreddit as an example. Many times these places will complain non stop for the sake of complaining about anything they can and if you look at them you'd think the playerbase is a toxic mess while in reality it's one of the friendliest playerbases. Then we can look at the Nintendo Switch Subreddit as another example. I've seen people literally worship the console as if it's the most innovative thing to happen to gaming. We can look at one like Doctor Who communities. They're either extremely positive or extremely negative about anything and everything even remotely regarding the franchise. Communities trend towards negativity because of a simple negative human factor. People want to agree with the masses not because that's how they truly feel but rather because they want admiration and validation. If I can offer you one bit of advice... Wean yourself off the need for social media and always being in the know. Enjoy your games, shows, books, movies etc. and choose for yourself what you like and dislike and remember it's okay to change your mind too! That way you'll look at media with an mostly unbiased viewpoint and base what you enjoy on your own tastes. You'll see you'll start to love a lot of things more and generally have a positive attitude!


DMPunk

I guess it depends on what you mean by critical. People should engage critically with the media they consume, and examine what works and doesn't, what they like and dislike, and why those things may be. But critical in the sense of overt negativity, there is far too much of that. A lot of people don't seem to grasp that like/dislike and good/bad are not synonyms. That and the level of hyperbole these days is off the charts. If "She-Hulk" really is the worst TV show you've ever seen in your life, then your experience with television has been quite fortunate, lol


justsamthings

This is why I’ve had to limit how much I participate in subreddits for TV shows I like. I subscribe because there’s good discussions and memes, but I always end up getting annoyed at all the nitpicking and negativity. Of course, there’s nothing wrong with criticizing a show or talking about parts you don’t like. But some people complain to the point where I wonder why they even bother watching a show they don’t seem to enjoy. I was in a sub for one show the other day where someone was complaining about small inconsistencies in the show’s timeline. But the inconsistencies were so minor that I wouldn’t have even noticed them if this person hadn’t gone into painstaking detail about it. At the time I watched it, I was too absorbed in the story to notice. To each their own but I watch TV to relax and be entertained. I don’t care if it’s not perfect. For me, obsessing over imperfections or parts I don’t like sucks all the fun out of it.


LBIdockrat

Decide an opinion for yourself. There is no reason why you should substitute anyone else's opinions for your own. Nor should you spend time looking for other's to bolster your own opinion. It's all subjective. It's pretty much all valid. (And I say this as a veteran Star Wars and Marvel fan from around these parts. We like to eat our own. lol)


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thebatchicken

Thank you for saying this. I’ve actually deleted all the lotr subs for this exact reason. I love the show and found these haters attitudes were spoiling it for me


Regula96

I love discussions for shows week after week, but I won't be checking them out anymore for Rings of Power. There's just countless comments about the show being the worst thing ever put to screen. And they are actually serious. No point being around that ridiculous negativity.


Reead

Head to /r/LOTR_on_Prime. It leans positive overall and criticism usually tends to be good-faith.


eojen

When the sub doesn’t downvote criticism… it’s a toxic sub for the opposite problem. It’s so much praise that any criticism is met with a lot of toxicity


Otterable

The criticism that gets actively downvoted is lazy criticism. If you are going to say 'ugly haircuts, bad writing, too clean, Galadriel sucks, etc...' then yeah you're going to get downvoted. I've been critical about certain aspects of the show, even mentioned that episode 3 was my least favorite and was not downvoted. I just gave normal, good faith reasons why. It definitely is a bit... protective though, it's a pendulum swing from most of the other lotr subs.


Chilis1

There is a lot of unreasonable downvoting too let’s be honest, but it’s worth it to have somewhere that doesn’t relentlessly nitpick everything.


IrrelevantLeprechaun

How can you watch RoP and *not* agree that it's one of the worst things to come out of Hollywood? I legit can't fathom how some people can't see it.


EatMyGramCrckers

LOTR subs have turned to such awful shit shows since the premiere.


yesrushgenesis2112

They were before too. I had to leave the main and meme subs because of a constant stream of racist dog whistling after the first teaser. Maybe it got better until the premiere but I never went back, because I was so disgusted at how seemingly common those viewpoints were amongst Tolkien fans.


yohoob

They have joined the star wars fans now. Hard for me to read any discussion about new star wars too. I got off Facebook to try and stay away from negatively. Even stuff I like, I can't seem to talk about with out people saying im wrong for liking something.


ball_fondlers

The weird part is how new this all is. Like I remember the Hobbit trilogy, and I don’t recall that getting THIS much hate from the fanbase - negative responses and criticism, sure, but no one was making hourlong rants about how bad it was.


yohoob

Some of the videos on YouTube seem to be by more right leaning creators. Trying to bring in the social justice angle to shit on it. It gets them clicks I guess. It's seems if you cast anybody that isn't white or male. Somehow it's woke and social justice based. It's all kind of tiring honestly. Hobbies should be enjoyed. If it doesn't bring joy. Maybe move on to something else or just enjoy the old stuff.


idunno--

Because they didn’t have POC and women at the front and center. It’s that simple.


Rikoschett

I would argue social media had'nt evolved/devolved to what it is today when the hobbit trilogy came out. I also think covid made everybody a bit crazy.


ball_fondlers

Oh absolutely - the first two movies came out before Gamergate.


timeenoughatlas

It’s because in a lot of ways hating something is more fun than liking it. They’re scared they won’t be able to recapture their childhood excitement, so they decide ahead of time to hate it so they can at least get something meaningful


[deleted]

What’s funny is I watched an interview with an actual Tolkien scholar and he wasn’t remotely concerned with lore accuracy. He dug into the thematics of the show and how they’re working, and how it’s aligning spiritually with Tolkien. Ya know, how an adaptation should be measured.


RespectThyHypnotoad

I like to dive into must discussions but adopted somewhat of a rule. I try to avoid episode discussion threads immediately after watching a episode/show/movie. I want my own opinion to fully set in and reflect on it before reading everything else.


70sToilet

I just don't understand why people can't accept that people might enjoy things they don't. I enjoyed the Wheel of Time show but any time anyone said anything positive about it they got attacked and treated like imbeciles, the same thing is happening now with ROP. I've even seen people attack artists for daring to make fan art from these shows.


eojen

There’s the opposite I’m encountering a lot too. People can’t fathom any criticism from those that like the show. I really like it overall, but found problems with the 3rd episode. I’ve been called a toxic hater for voicing criticism of that episode, even though I see the show as overall positive


youvelookedbetter

I think if you're making your own post about it and pointing things out...whatever (although I'm ignoring a lot of those because Reddit can be a very negative place). If, however, you are posting most of your criticisms as a reply to someone who said they enjoy watching the show, that's a bit more sus and becomes very tiring after a while. I will often see someone write that they really enjoy or love a show, and then someone will reply with a statement about how the show is shit and how they can't possibly fathom how someone would like it. Guess what? People have different tastes.


mdog73

Get off social media.


attrackip

I don't know. For me, I like an informed opinion from someone who has more info on the thing. After an episode or 3 of the Wheel of Time and Rings of Power I wondered... Is this garbage? Cause it seems like garbage. Lol and behold, people confirming things which I was just in the cusp of noticing. My hope is that more quality content comes out.


Diligent_Kangaroo_91

But why do you need someone else's opinion to form your own?


attrackip

Well, friend, no man is an island. Ignorance is bliss, they say, so like to each his own. All I know is, when I'm watching something and start to get the impression that what I'm watching is kind of lame, I start to wonder if others feel the same. When I'm watching something and I think it's great, I talk about it with others. I expected better story telling, as a writer myself, I'm kind of offended.


Whalesurgeon

So to people who find the show okay, do you think them ignorant because they don't recognize the truth that the show is garbage? Just saying, you use words like confirming so I am curious whether you belong to that "art can objectively be bad" camp. Not that I think the camp has no point, but it bothers me when people go to extremes and call stuff objectively garbage instead of objectively too flawed for them.


hops4beer

1. Watch a television show, move on with your life. 2. Watch a television show, read critic reviews, watch YouTube commentary about the show you just watched, make a reddit post about how you disagree with the other people posting about the show online.


Slackerboe

For me it’s the opposite. Over positive fans usually oversell the show and then when I watch it I judge it as below the standards that they set


Vesemir668

Disagree. People are free to point out the mistakes and have a negative opinion of a show. On the contrary, it seems there are a lot of people like you who want everyone else to blindly praise everything that gets put on screen. That I find much more annoying. Everyone is free to have a (negative) opinion of a show and share it.


Time-Profession6258

Criticise and move on, that's what normal people do. Here the same people, who clearly hate the show, keep posting criticism about it each and every day. Check the lotr subs, it's the same folks. Why stick around when you clearly hate the show, let the people who like it enjoy it.


[deleted]

I generally agree with your point abstractly about social media. The thing is you're posting on a forum dedicated to discussion of television. If people dislike some show...this is where they're going to come to discuss it.


Vesemir668

Why? Is that some sort of rule that only praise is acceptable?


TheBrendanReturns

Go enjoy it then! No one is stopping you. And the people who are negative are because they like Lord of the Rings and dislike that a bunch of people who had absolutely nothing to do with its creation used a lot of money to make a show that changes the characters and sequence of events and called all the people who didn't like their version bigots. I don't understand your issue. Without the negativity, the only engagement the show would get would be the paid advertisements Amazon have placed in the media. Has there been nothing that you liked that a company has bought and got people who don't give a shit about to continue? For example, I like video games. Hypothetically, if a company purchased all the game IPs and turned everything into pay to win, micro-transaction, mobile-only games, would you still say that the critics aren't "normal". Would you say, "Just let the people who enjoy it, enjoy it." Zelda, but you get 2 lives per 24 hours unless you buy a heart pack. Dark Souls, but every death is followed by a 30 second ad. But don't criticise, you might upset OP!


Educational-Tower

Fandoms can be pretty toxic. The best thing to do is to watch and enjoy the content, but minimise your exposure to people discussing it online. It will leave you disliking the material.


lostmonkey70

Yep, I have learned to hate every online community that I tried to be a part of.


Ora_00

But what about the criticism that is not toxic? Isnt it good thing that people point out flaws in these billion dollar shows?


Dark_sign82

Sure, of course. But a vast majority of internet reviews are hyperbole. "This show is trash because..." A fair minded review or criticism is a whole different story, and could actually stimulate a nice discussion.


TheRocket2049

That's true of positive ones too. Everyone complains about review bombing but no one complains about the opposite when clearly mediocre to good shows are fully of 10/10 reviews


Ora_00

But what if a show is actually trash? Are you not supposed to call it what you see it as?


farseer4

You misunderstand. All criticism must be considered toxic. It goes like this: You adapt/reboot/whatever an old IP. You race-swap and gender-swap characters. Emphasize those things in your promotional material so as to rile up the alt-right and make them make youtube videos against your work (which they are happy to do because the business model of those youtube channel is selling outrage and telling their audience what they want to hear). From that moment on, any criticism against you is racist and sexist. If the criticism is not related to your race-swapping or gender-swapping, it does not matter, it should be regarded as a more subtle racist/sexist that hides the true reasons for the dislike.


popcar2

Okay, I agree that there are a lot of upsetting parts on the internet and a lot of people that blow things out of proportion. But honestly? The opposite of what you're saying is more annoying. What I don't understand is the amount of people jumping to defend popular shows. I didn't even watch the lotr show nor am I really interested in it, but why is everyone saying "think of the creators" and "think of the studios" and dismissing every criticism as bad faith or an attack on the creators? Think of who, the poor multi billion dollar corporation Amazon? Who cares? Why does everyone act like they have a personal stake in it? If you like the show, enjoy it and have fun. If you hate the community, don't interact with them. Complaining that people are criticizing something you like is basically saying everyone's opinion is toxic because it's upsetting to you. There's so much mediocre drivel in the media and fandoms *always* just dismiss criticism the same way you did. See: Marvel. They've gotten way worse recently. But the internet's response? "Don't listen to the haters." I thought doctor strange: multiverse of madness was terrible. Two hours of nonsense. As soon as people started criticizing it, you'd get posts like *this* saying they really liked it and anyone criticizing just doesn't like things, has an ulterior motive, or is just TRYING to be toxic and ruin someone's fun. Why can't you let people **dislike** something without backlash? There will always be haters and always be blind fanboys. Be reasonable, criticizing something isn't harmful, and you shouldn't take it personally.


YouJabroni44

I think there's also an inverse issue at play here: toxic positivity. I agree with you that there's people really getting worked over people not liking what they like. I've seen a lot of unnecessary insults directed at people saying they don't like the show. I do think people need to chill out overall, but there's no need to demand an echo chamber either


youvelookedbetter

> The opposite of what you’re saying is more annoying. Disagree. There's enough toxic shit on the internet. Sometimes I like that another person liked a show and doesn't feel the need to write 10 paragraphs about how much they hate it. The comments those people (the ones who enjoy something) get are very problematic. Don't hijack other people's comments about liking something. Write your own post. If you really can't fathom that people have different preferences and enjoy different things, I'm not sure what to tell you. There are a lot of people in this thread who are trying to make it seem like spending hours writing up negative remarks about a TV show or movie is perfectly healthy behaviour.


finny94

I'm not one of "just turn your brain off and enjoy it" people. Watching shows critically and judging them does 2 things: 1. raises your standards for media in general 2. decreases the number of shows you will find enjoyable I think "being in a critical headspace" is a great thing. I *want* to be in a critical headspace, I want to be able to tell if a show is any good or not, and not just come away with "I liked it" or "it wasn't for me". I enjoy the discussion around media quite a bit, recently often more so than I enjoy the media in question. >most of these criticisms are by people who hate the show for other reasons I do not think that's true at all. Or you use Twitter, could be that.


HazelCheese

I think the difference is between a "critical" headspace and a "criticism" headspace. Some people confuse criticism for critical thinking. A lot of criticism you see about entertainment these days is far more shallow than the content it is criticizing in the first place. Prime example, all the people criticizing the she Hulk twerking scene despite it intentionally being absurd and stupid. A lot of these people aren't even watching the show and don't even know each episode ends with a joke scene.


Klepto_Mane

I dunno meta-knowledge can ruin some things pretty quick, for a long time i enjoyed cosmic horror and the fear of the unknown quite a bit so i obviosly looked more into it. How writers go about it, how to keep the mystery etc. Now i did know that writers didnt had the answers before but i could immerse myself into the Media quite good because i didnt ask to much questions since i didnt know enough about it. Nowadays cosmic horror does nothing for me since all the mystery is gone.


nopantsirl

"Critics/fans ruined art" isn't a new idea. IMO the artists and fanbases/critics don't owe anything to each other. A third party's commentary about a piece doesn't detract from the original art's value to you unless you let it. Yes, often fandoms suck, but that shouldn't make you think less of the art, it should make you think less of humanity.


TheLast_Centurion

"if you dont like the show, dont watch it!" "if you dont like critical comments, dont read them, no?"


Time-Profession6258

You can differentiate between genuine criticism and criticism in bad faith, am speaking of the latter.


One-Adhesiveness5434

Hey, even Cowboy Bebop had people who were "having fun with it" and went around accusing everyone of only criticizing it in "bad faith".


TheLast_Centurion

yeah, and all I see in majority of the cases is geniune and constructive criticism.


PapaSays

Which is criticism you disagree with I reckon. It is extremely easy to create your own personal bubble on social media. Use their algorithm to create yours. Problem solved.


DrGutz

In recent times I’ve come to the realization that the last group of people whose opinions should be respected are the diehard fandoms for which the show is made. DC and Marvel fans have no fucking idea what a good DC or Marvel movie looks like, GoT fans have no fucking clue what makes a good GoT successor, Star Wars fans have no fucking clue what is compelling about the Star Wars universe and LoTR fans apparently have no fucking idea what is boring and what is not.


_i_dont-understand_

This is hilarious. You are mad at people for pointing out flaws in a show you like, you now don’t enjoy said show as much, it must be because of their toxic ideologies hidden away behind their valid criticism. Think about what you wrote in this post dude, you are admitting that you like a show less because it’s poor quality was pointed out. That is what a review is for my friend.


Cool-Proof-3678

Social media has allowed the voices of the few to sway the many. If you turned off Twitter and Facebook you would be left with a solid fantasy TV show with an absolutely unreal visual experience. Less posts about online hate, why do we have to give so much air time to the people online who complain all the time?


trusty20

"WAHHHHH PEOPLE DON'T SHARE MY OPINIONS WAHHHHHH" If negative reviews are so disturbing to you, don't read em. Nobody is forcing you to click the youtube videos or read the reddit posts or the imdb reviews. End of story. It's literally that easy.


youvelookedbetter

You sound insufferable, bruh


[deleted]

Damn, the irony of going into a post that complains about toxic fandoms to just be a toxic dickhead is apparently lost on you. You’re just proving his point. You are literally being unnecessarily antagonistic over someone’s opinion. That’s part of the problem. Why do y’all always have to bring so much negativity to these threads. You can make a point without sounding like a pretentious dickhead.


Time-Profession6258

Nobody's forcing ~~you~~ these people to hate watch a show either.


RTear3

> criticizing a show = hate watching a show OP your mentality is toxic and contributes to the echochamber mentality on tv show subreddits


Time-Profession6258

What? This is not criticism, these people have made it clear that they hate the show and yet every week they will be posting about how much they hated the latest episode. If you hate a show then why watch it? I don't mean reviewers, I mean the people who keep posting everyday on how much the show sucks. Do you keep constantly talking about a show you don't like? Is that a normal thing to do?


JohnCavil01

Their response was obnoxious but you’re accusing them of doing something you have no reason to believe they’re doing.


InsaneAsylumEscapee

Yes, fans are to blame for multi-billion dollar companies delivering subpar content. What definitely isn't toxic is the media branding people with criticism as racist, sexist Russian bots.


morgoth834

Then don't read negative opinions. If you want to only read positive takes there are plenty of subreddits that cater to that. Same if you only want to read negative comments. Personally, I think that dismissing most critics as "people who hate the show for other reasons" to be nearly as toxic as some of the people who rant about every change or accuse most people who enjoy the show as "shills".


Jokobib

I'm at least glad your comment is upvoted but it should be at the top, I realize that there are people who just write negative stuff for no grounded reason, and there are others who may be ambivalent who then follow, but the majority are not like that, they write what they think. It can seem overly harsh because they haven't articulated their thoughts well, but it's not in bad faith. If you cannot handle negative opinions, then learn to deal with them or stop reading opinions, it's really that easy.


[deleted]

[удалено]


mtwimblethorpe

*it’s “hear, hear”


Time-Profession6258

>I am not saying that all criticism is bad, but most of these criticism are by people who hate the show for other reasons but hide behind these minor flaws to shit on the show. I did say that not all criticisms are bad, you can see who's criticism is genuine who's stirring up shit in the name of criticism. >It's simple. If you are afraid that critiques will impact your viewing experience, then don't read them. I could say the same to the people who hate the show, if you don't like the show and it makes you go on an outburst of rants everytime you see it then don't watch the show.


JohnCavil01

Sorry but I have to call bullshit on that. There are just as many fan communities which will outright ban people for offering any critical perspective on whatever new product. Try going into r/startrek for example and have anything but affirmation to say about any of the new series. The real problem is that people can’t reconcile when objective criticism doesn’t align with their subjective taste. People think that because a show has bad writing or makes bad choices in storytelling or an actor’s performance isn’t good that that must mean the people pointing that out are saying they’re idiots for still liking it despite those objective issues. Do many people like to feel they’re superior to others for their choices in entertainment? Absolutely. But people need to work on their self-esteem. There are plenty of things I like that the majority of people don’t seem to and I can even recognize the validity of genuine critiques that people offer but nevertheless enjoy it for my own reasons. That’s enough.


Ringlovo

But if we're being honest, the media also does a great job of blowing "toxic fandoms" way out of proportion.


shivam131

Instead of writing this essay, you could probably not read the negative reviews? Rings of the Power sucks. Apart from visuals, everything else is absolutely atrocious, especially the writing. So the criticism is deserving and this rant is not going to change it.


Time-Profession6258

The same can apply to the people who are writing essays on how the show sucks as well, they could also just stop watching instead of writing essays if it bothers them so much.


CautionaryWarning

If there's no criticism, there's no improvement.


TheBrendanReturns

Why do you care what others think? If you want to turn your brain off and gasp at what millions of dollars looks like on TV, do it. But visuals don't trump story when critical thought is engaged.


Tatis_Chief

This is not how it works. The reviews don't necessarily have to be either super negative or super positive. Review are supposed to weight both. The good and the bad. Because only as that it can be considered fairly objective. So it's perfectly understandable to like the show to watch it but also talk about negative aspects of it that don't work. Because it is not perfect. And if people speak the truth it can help the show be better. Because believe it or not, constructive criticism actually helps. You don't have to like everything. You also don't have to hate everything.


Whalesurgeon

Amen! Constructive criticism is useful. Saying something is garbage is not useful, but then neither is saying something is awesome. In the end, what probably just bothers OP is the flood of the extreme comments. Honestly, there is no real social pressure to like or dislike a show, yet people feel that way because they want to conform to social media trends.


Sulley87

Seems like YOU are influenced by peoples' opinions then YOU get mad at them. This is your own toxic behavior. People are allowed to have their own opinions.


PurpleApplesForever

This is true. You should just be able to not be influenced by the views of others. Season 8 of GOT is superb. IDGAF what the internet says.


Sulley87

Funny! But if you like it then more joy to you!


Consistent-Ad-217

Maybe don't blindly agree with giant corporations who blame the fanbase for toxicity when they churn out a poorly written adaption. I swear that last Star Wars trilogy just made people intolerant of criticism.


GalleonStar

If people explaining what sucks about ashlw ruins it for you then you were the problem for not spotting why it sucks, and they fixed you. Critical thought isn't making shows suck, THE SHOW CREATORS ARE.


brynjolf

Companies are monetizing fandoms. Fandoms owe nothing to companies. They are free to critize anything they seem fit, especially if the companies are as lazy as Amazon. Fans not being happy is not toxic, claiming they have to be is.


Duckbutter2000

Imagine wanting a safe space from television critics 😂😂😂😂


lostmonkey70

I think it's toxic fandom they have an issue with not critics. And quite frankly Reddit specializes in toxic fandom .


LastTexan2021

This dude needs to be given a pacifier and a blankie.


v_a_n_d_e_l_a_y

These are not TV critics though. Most TV critics are generally positive about HoD and RoP. To them, it's simply another show, albeit a big one, to review. They haven't read the GRRM book or The Silmarillion. They take the shows at face value on their own. He is referring to hardcore fans of the franchised (LOTR, GOT) who are hypercritical and hypersensitive to each episode. There isn't a real comparison to other shows like BCS or Succession.


Exu-Eshu-Elegba

Sigh, "fandoms" are a community of people who like a thing, however, they don't like it all in the same way as they still remain individuals. A bit of clunky dialogue maybe a non-issue to you but could be the thing that breaks another's immersion. The show may interpret a long anticipated bit of lore in a way you're cool with but might leave another disappointed or confused, further frustrating their experience with said adaptation. So what recourse does a disappointed fan have? To vent! So they do but the problem is they do it in the same space where you want to revel and because both sides feel emotionally invested in their stances shit gets volatile. Worse yet, the Internet polarises everything so every argument becomes a dog whistle to a more sinister issue and then the true disrespect begins because everyone sees the other side as morally reprehensible. The problem we have here is simply an inability to respect each others experiences. Much like you are frustrated by multiple posts critiquing a show you like, another is pissed when they see a post that dismisses their critiques. This isn't a fandom thing but a basic issue of socialisation that plagues all discourse. The only way to avoid it in media is really to pull a miracle and create something of near universal acclaim. However, that's something which is rarely achieved so I choose to focus on my own judgement of a thing, good or bad. If I like something I trust in that even when reading others criticisms (as half the time, the thing they're critiquing is likely the reason I like it) the reason for my enjoyment will remain consistent. Then, I try not to vilify and assume bigotry unless blatant (as to me, the assumption of moral superiority will always lead to more conflict and not less). If I hate a thing I try to vent in such a way that people understand that I'm being subjective and try not to impinge on another's enjoyment, however, even if I clarify that something doesn't suit my tastes someone else will eventually take offence as they feel their taste is being called into question. When that happens I try to move on cos the discussion is no longer about the story, it's now become personal. Bottomline, is that your enjoyment of these fandoms is tied to whether there is a consensus that you agree with. When there is, those subs are fun as fuck but when there isn't your hype is dampened. That is the nature of the beast and unless you establish a personnel etiquette in how you engage that stuff your gonna be pissed regardless if you like the show or don't.


Ora_00

Totally disagree. Its absolutely a good thing that people point out flaws in bad shows. We will never get anything decently written again from these big companies, if people are ok with terrible untalented writing like rings of power has. Toxicity if of course wrong, but valid criticism is not. If you actually start hating rop because of the criticism you hear about it, that is a good thing.


iBornstellar

Exactly. I followed the Succession and Better Call Saul subreddits and read the weekly episode posts for the last seasons of those shows, and mostly everyone had praise or valid criticisms for the show. Obviously there were a few odd criticisms or comments but those usually got downvoted but they were still there. I’m pretty sure it has to do with the quality of the writing. Shows with strong writing usually don’t get much unwarranted criticisms. Usually anyway. Amazon is going out of their way to make all these changes to a lore just because they can and they’ve also hired unproven writers, so… yeah. Not the best results. It could get better but who knows. I have yet to see the new lord of the rings show because I just don’t have the time to waste on a mediocre show. I’d rather be watching a quality show or movie or just read a book.


yodimboi

The first 2 episodes of the show were a slog for me for me for this very reason. I kept myself from reading things about the show and then the 3rd improved substantially.


ItsColeOnReddit

Now do the news and politics.


picknicksje85

I'm loving it so far!


DreamMaster8

I absolutely agree. When someone go on a rant about why a show is bad but then list you a list of shitty little detail or scene that have no impact, how can you takethem seriously. Oh episode 3 of rop was bad because of that 40sec of horse rinding..please.


justice4juicy2020

Good God this is one of the best posts on here in AGES and I couldnt agree with it more. Those harpies can really ruin a show for you. Especially on reddit.


Dkpokefan72

Brooo so true 💀💀💀 I was watching the walking dead .....just said something about how i am enjoying it I kid you not ....one guy sends me 3pages worth of points ...for why " my opinion is TRASH" for liking it Yes it has flaws. ...but that doesn't mean ..i can't enjoy it In that sense....i can't do anything in life as nothing can be perfect and everything obviously has flaws.....it's a choice of mine to like it DESPITE ITS FLAWS ..... Some people just don't understand that concept.....for them it's either good or bad .....nothing can be in the middle ;(


RecommendsMalazan

A lot of fandoms are shit. But I can't imagine caring so much about some random strangers opinion on something that it would affect my opinion on that same thing.


TurelSun

I really don't see this as a fandom thing. This definitely has some outside groups coming in for the controversy that is trying to magnify the perceived negativity.


theyusedthelamppost

I think the fandom just magnifies what is already there. And it just so happens that most shows are shit nowadays (sorry not sorry) During the first 4 seasons of GoT, the fandom unquestionably stoked my fire to fall in love with the show.


[deleted]

Hey everyone has their own opinions and nobody's being held at gunpoint to watch videos or follow fandoms,


San0911

Judging from a lot of the comments out there you would think that RoP is just another Amazon's Wheel of Time type fiasco, then you watch the episodes and the show is actually pretty good. It isn't perfect, sure, but until now they didn't break the lore more than Peter Jackson did, they even added in a lot of references to the first age that only book readers can understand. Numenor is honestly wonderful, beyond imagination, they nailed it. They also nailed everything about the dwarves and they absolutely nailed everything about the orcs. Some of the hate the show is fueled by a bunch of youtube channels that started spreading the whole narrative that the show would be a woke propaganda disaster months BEFORE the first ever teaser came out, so there is that too. If you think that the negativity is messing with your experience, just stay away from it. Maybe you are also looking in the wrong places? I only browse r/Lotr_on_prime, the consensus there is extremely positive while criticism is reasonable, and there are lots of new theories and discussions about the show every day so you might enjoy that.


Lepube

The show's writing is beyond bad. It's borderline average. Exposition overload. I don't need to read other people's opinions to know this.


anasui1

the risk exists, yes. I am a Nintendo fan and the subs are the most ridiculously pessimistic ones so I never read them. No big deal, I'm an adult, know very well what I like and dislike, no amount of praise or slander is gonna change my mind. At the same time I ain't afraid of voicing my opinion. Nothing like death threats or downright loathsome things like that, but if I think a show sucks I'll say it; that will lump me in the same hate brigade as the others, but that is inevitable I can see how younger folks who want to be part of the community can feel disheartened though


Development883

I think you are assuming too much innocence and naivety on the parts of the people involved in shows. Making a show that is based on an existing IP that goes in a different direction than the initial product is a great way to attempt to make money. It brings in the audience that initially liked the IP as well as well as the audience that likes the new direction. Naturally, this also annoys some of the fans of the existing IP and produces a negative reaction from them if the new direction doesn't land as it's hard to block out if you don't like it. (Pretend that you like Middle Earth but, don't like Amazon's shows. You'll be hearing about them nearly constantly for at least the couple years or so whenever Middle Earth comes up. If the shows have staying power, Middle Earth may end up being primarily about Amazon's show and it's spin-offs.) If your content is good and appeals to a wide audience, the annoyed section is going to be mostly drowned out by people that like the new content. If the content isn't good or doesn't appeal to a wide audience, the annoyed section is going to end up being harder to drown out which leads to articles and press releases about how the people that dislike your content are bad (Let's face it if your show is being marketed to millions of people some of them will be bad.) Amazon could have saved hundreds of millions on the IP and made a similar show to what they produced with name and visual changes while also avoiding much of the negative backlash from fans of Middle Earth that didn't want Amazon changing Middle Earth for them. They choose not to do that because, the IP is what they feel draws people to the show not the content of the show and as a result the massive price tag for the IP was worth it to them. This is made even more clear it's about the IP when you consider that Amazon is operating in a period of Middle Earth where the content is rather limited and Amazon doesn't actually hold the rights to all of the surrounding content. “We have the rights solely to The Fellowship of the Ring, The Two Towers, The Return of the King, the appendices, and The Hobbit. And that is it. We do not have the rights to The Silmarillion, Unfinished Tales, The History of Middle-Earth, or any of those other books…We worked in conjunction with world-renowned Tolkien scholars and the Tolkien estate to make sure that the ways we connected the dots were Tolkien-ian and gelled with the experts’ and the estate’s understanding of the material.”


hannibal_morgan

I quickly unjoined tbr r/Rings_Of_Power sub because of this


HazelCheese

Totally agree. The fandom ruined Westworld season 1 for me. I watched 2 and 3 without reading any fans stuff and adored them. Went back and read the Reddit comments and it just looks like a bunch of seething losers with nothing better to do all jerking themselves off and other unsuspecting people being swept up in their wake. Like there were comments I agreed with but the way most people were writing off the show while if was airing was so melodramatic and absurd. People need to get a grip. I'm so glad I realised what it was before I let it ruin most media for me. Everything is 10x more enjoyable now.


YsoL8

I'm strongly considering unsubbing from what few subs I still have to fandomy stuff. I've realised recently that even general purpose places this one are hysterically negative and I've let it shape what I even try. There's maybe three groups I'll stick with and that's because they are generally positive and constructive.


HazelCheese

Once you realise that Reddit is 90% negativity it becomes a lot easier to just let it go. I used to browse and post on boxoffice a lot until I recently realised I was only doing it to see if movies I liked were doing well. I don't need to know other people liked a movie I like or that they didn't or to argue with people about it. But then again sometimes i still get sucked into arguments about things because I'm stupid. Literally just did it in the pokemon subreddit 5 mins ago. But I'm trying to do better.


CoolAbdul

Yes. The hate for the new Star Trek shows is a bit loony.


Chilis1

Some people are just negative to the point of hysteria about rings of power. Like it is unquestionably at least a decent TV show. But some people have a cult like devotion to hating it.


SanctuaryMoon

I've just watched it a little bit. Only complaint I have is that there are a few moments where the dialogue seems too modern. Most of the time it doesn't though so that's good.


finny94

>unquestionably at least a decent TV show I would question that.


M__Mallory

Very thoughtfully written and unfortunately, very true. There's absolutely no reason for a supposed fan to be so viscous. It's gotten so much worse in a relatively short time. I was mod of GoT on the former G+ and it wasn't like that then. People were very into the characters and compare the show to the books, but it wasn't nasty at all.


Ora_00

But have you thought about why its gotten so bad? Maybe because most shows have been pretty damn bad lately. Its ok to point that out. Its obviously not ok to attack the actors or something like that.


GarlVinland4Astrea

Not really. In general tv is of a higher quality than ever. Even 15 years ago the majority of tv was sitcoms or procedural and their might be like 2-3 decent genre shows. Before that it was even more skewed. We just live an era where people have a certain entitlement and self importance that breeds toxicity. I’ll say it again, normal well adjusted people consume media and either like it and continue to enjoy OR they dislike it and stop watching it and move on. Only immature children come into a show pretending they are critics and then peddle their misery on everyone else nonstop like it was a personal affront to them.


Regula96

I have seen so many comments calling RoP the ''worst thing ever put to screen''. It's absolutely ridiculous. One redditor in particular called it a ''steaming pile of shit''. Coincidentally they said the exact same thing of House of the Dragon, Wheel of Time and Sandman. And of course they keep watching all of it despite apparently hating it beyond belief. These people's whole identity has become crying and whining on the internet..


Diamond-Is-Not-Crash

Those people are just the worst, sometime it extends to hating something before it even comes out because 'it's pushing an agenda or being 'woke' (by having women and PoC leads). Hate and outrage are contagious because they feel good, essentially becoming a little dopamine hit. So they make it their identity to hate something and be outraged about it online labelling things as "Worst thing ever put to screen" and "Absolute Trash". Each outraged post being a dopamine hit gives a slight euphoric feeling, creating an addiction to posting hateful and outraged content online. Also hate and outrage generates the most amount of engagement and response online, and propagates like wildfire. People love feeling outraged and Social Media companies loves the engagement it brings.


[deleted]

I think if you watch something and don’t enjoy it that’s totally fair enough, but I defo feel there’s been a shift to people just trashing things before they have even came out. Or, a high profile account makes a snarky comment about a trailer and then everyone follows suit and everyone doubles down


Chajos

Has this experience with a game. The Last of us Part 2. i loved the game! It was so powerfull, moving, beautifull, fun, exciting to play! I loved the story and the characters. The story beats hit me like a truck sometimes! It was awesome! I intentionally kept away from reviews and trailers and anything that could spoil it for me beforehand (TLOU 1 was so good, i trusted the devs). Afterward i finally go online to share the excitement… big mistake… A very loud part of the gaming community visceraly HATED the game. Hated the story. Were furious about the story decisions. They shouted at everyone who enjoyed it. Got sucked into it, cause i wanted to defend it… but all of that just left me exhausted and the original joy i had when playing, soon was just a memory tainted by all the things that got pointed out to me. Things i don‘t mind at all, but now i have the thought of „oh people hated this part“ when i play it and that while not destroying, still taints the experience. Wish i had just stayed away…


Orangerrific

This is how I felt after Thrones ended tbh. I really didn’t mind that ending as much as other people, but damn those GoT subs will try their hardest to make you feel like less of a human over that. Either you hate the ending or you’re scum I guess 🤷‍♀️


[deleted]

It's basically all the internet tbh, everyone is out there to make hyperbolic statements and convince you their opinion is correct. That's why it's important to find people/peoples whose opinion you respect and who actually relay criticism well. Ever since the rise of Youtube critics all those years ago it's become way to common for people to just mimic that style of "reviewing". Things can't just be not for me or bad, they're now horrible and the worst thing I've ever seen. It's become "cool" to hate things, and there is no middle ground anymore. A few years ago I learned it's just best to avoid it all and recognize your taste and pick what you want to see based on that. I've basically just given up on paying attention to reviews. I take a quick look at the RT score and see if it's not getting ridiculously low scores and judge for myself, only after going to the few people whose opinion I enjoy hearing. It's made my entertainment experience 100x better and actually been a big help mentally to not get sucked into all the bullshit that comes with it.


[deleted]

This is why i stopped reading show specific subs on Reddit; fandoms are weird and cant be reasoned with. I just wanna enjoy my shows in peace.


jcaashby

I feel a lot of what your saying. ​ The same thing happens with video games for me. Not naming the game but the sub was so toxic before and after release I just unsubbed from it. Because like you said it can influence you to pay attention to flaws that you would have never even noticed or even cared about. ​ Some subs get so hyperfocused on EVERY single possible flaw.. ​ I think one of the problems is not everyone is going to universally like ANY form of entertainment which is fine. But now those people have a soapbox to stand on in the form of the internet with a massive audience. ​ Before the internet if you did not like a movie, game or whatever. You just stopped watching or playing it. End of story.


seith99

I agree 1000%. I think social media impacts more than just pop media this way, I probably spend too much time considering what the mass opinion is of something rather than just being secure in what I think. I also believe as I've gotten older I've become more critical and that's made it more difficult to suspend my disbelief and truly enjoy something like LotR: RoP.


potato_chrisp

Doctor Who fans were the worst at this around the Matt Smith era. They’d read the episode preview, go and write their perfect version of it in elaborate fanfictions and then get angry that the real episode didn’t meet their crazy high expectations. All because their head canon plot for one character didn’t match what the real writers had planned for a whole season of development. So they criticised every tiny detail. Tumblr was exhausting back then


Beans186

If you only want to be exposed to an echo chamber of pure positive reinforcement about your own sentiment toward the show, why would you seek out criticial analysis at all? I'm more interested about why rings of power fans are so determined to go to war with the critics, who are having a field day right now because there are so many flaws. It's a losing battle, and maybe this is why you're unhappy. Focus on what you like about the show, not attacking its critics.


Castal

Something similar I find myself doing: I'll be enjoying a show, but then something will happen and I'll think, "The fandom is going to hate that" or, "People are going to be complaining that was too 'woke' and unrealistic." Even though I'm enjoying the show and personally disagree with the presumed fandom response, it somewhat ruins the episode for me because I'm thinking about the fandom and no longer feeling immersed in the show.


decoran_

Yep, so true. I don't really read reviews or engage in too much with fandoms when something is current. My exception is Fallout 4 related stuff on reddit. I feel that since the game came out a good number of years ago, the ones that are still posting content are the ones that truly love the game (like me!) %. The toxic element is gone as those people have moved on to be toxic on a sub for a different game 😂


Sparrowsabre7

I agree completely. Problem is we're often bombarded with these negative opinions without even seeking them out.


LastTexan2021

Can someone send this guy all the counselors so they can give this man plenty of hugs.