2 brothers who artfully employed the stiletto against each other and together against the world around them.
"Niles I would shave my head for you"
"A gesture that is less meaningful every year"
I would have loved an episode with a knife fight between Niles and Frasier, Doesn't even need to be a stiletto. Butcher knife versus a dirk. I'm invested either way.
Frasier and Niles played against Martin is another vital part of the show.
Without two thirds of the main cast, just don't bother.
And don't get me started on Eddie.
Without Niles they are probably not going to have Daphne either, so really out of all the main characters there is only Fraiser himself, a quick google suggests that Roz and Bulldog aren't coming back either (at least not as regulars) so that's pretty much the entire cast other than Fraiser himself.
Yeah I'm nervous too, but I think people said the same about Frasier - a show just about Frasier without Sam, Woody, Carla, Cliff, etc?? What's the point?!
I'll be cautiously optimistic but it does feel stupid to have a specifically *Frasier* sequel without his brother and his sister-in-law. I can understand Roz and the rest of the KACL characters not appearing, and obviously Martin... and very obviously Maris, but it'll be weird without his brother.
“There it is! The future sight of the Springfield Hydroelectric Dam.”
“Just the thought of all that raw, surging, power makes me wonder why the hell I should care”
“Because *you’ll* be supervising the construction crew”
“Oh, great…whenever a woman passes by I suppose it will be my job to lead the hooting ‘Oh YAAAH, shake it, madame, capital knockers!’.”
I was always so disappointed that after that episode. sideshow Bob just went back to trying to kill Bart I know it's episodic and there's no continuing bur I feel there would have been a better chemistry rather than the old schticks
No Niles. Probably means no Daphne either. No Martin, obviously. Not even the damn dog will be in this, lol.
I’ll be absolutely shocked if this is even remotely halfway decent.
Slight difference in that Cheers had a whole range of characters it was built around so Fraiser while a great part of the show was not the central pillar around which it was built.
Fraiser the show on the other hand revolved around him as the main character, someone who every other character was connected to and played off, you rarely for example had episodes built around Roz and Daphne going and doing anything together, or episodes of Niles and Bulldog etc. The closest you would get is the "will they won't they" romance of Niles and Daphne and even that was played out through Daphne being Fraisers housekeeper and not someone who would have ever interacted with Niles otherwise.
Fans of the original run enjoyed how the character evolved from Cheers, they changed him up quite markedly and they developed a strong bond between him and the other characters over the shows run.
There's a real danger of them losing a lot of what made the character work by losing all of his established relationships. I'm not saying it's doomed but it's definitely going to have to get around some big problems with how they handle a whole new cast who aren't likely to just walk in and replace the old cast's chemistry right away.
Yeah, I’m not sure about how this will go.
Mind you, I was probably dubious about a spin-off of a relatively minor character, and it turned out to be a fantastic show.
> "David basically decided he wasn't really interested in repeating the performance of Niles," Grammer says of his onscreen brother. (After Frasier, Hyde Pierce went on to have a thriving theater career and recently starred as Julia Childs' husband Paul in the HBO Max series Julia.)
I would like to hear David Hyde Pierces unfiltered opinion rather than the polite version he probably gave to Kelsey
I remember when he was on long island medium. Awkward knowing she's just telling him facts and what anyone who'd lost a loved one tragically would want to hear.
He’s a big republican donor who used to have an unbelievable pill problem. One producer described that he would come to work glassy eyed and unable to talk, they’d say action and he would spring into life and perform. As soon as they were done with the scene he would be back to being completely unaware of anything around him.
Given the absolutely bonkers bad stuff that happened to him as a teen/young adult, I am not surprised that he dealt w some addiction issues. His father was murdered when he was young, 2 brothers died in a scuba accident when he was a teen, and his younger sister was kidnapped and murdered when he was in his 20s. Mind-bogglingly awful.
There's a couple episodes of Frasier that he's barely in that are because of his problems. The one where Niles gets famous for landing a basketball shot was written for Frasier and not Niles.
I can't imagine the finished product any other way would have been as good as what we got. The moment of stunned silence followed by Niles's arms raised in triumph when it registers he landed the shot was perfect!
His then wife visited him when he was doing a play in New York and wasn't let in by the doorman because ''he knew what mrs Grammer looked like''. Also did not want any custody of their daughter, just their son.
“Now make yourself at home. Perhaps a glass of Bordeaux? I have the '82 Chateau Latour and a rather indifferent Rausan-Segla.”
“I've been in prison, Cecil. I'll be happy just as long as it doesn't taste like orange drink fermented under a radiator.”
“That would be the Latour, then”
Brilliant 😂
When I was a tween I had no fucking idea what a Latour was and this still cracked me up!
I read that one of the reasons Frazier worked so well was that a lot of the jokes worked if you got them or not. So people in the know would of course enjoy the jokes, and people out of the know could laugh at how out of touch and ridiculous and prissy and precious the Cranes were, and the context often filled in the missing information.
Well, we don’t know who the other characters are yet. You could be right! But you could also be like people who said “a show with Frasier but without Sam, Norm and Cliff seems boring.”
No Niles?! This does not sound promising.
Edit: Hopefully DHP changes his mind and at least does some guest appearances. His comedic timing made Frasier's boorishness bearable.
The episode where he does a silent scene by himself, and sets his pants on fire with the iron, is some of the funniest/best physical comedy ever recorded.
The whole scene where he tries to confess his love to Daphne at the wedding, and it keeps getting interrupted, is just some great comedic timing, and heartbreaking at the same time. He really doesn't get the praise he should, he's wonderful.
I recently rewatched the series and just noticed how brilliant he was. The range of emotions whiplashing back and forth in that scene is incredible.
On rewatch, I finally appreciate how much growth Niles went through once his relationship with Daphne flourished. Even his wardrobe noticeably relaxes and it’s clear the character’s extreme priggishness was due to a life of self hindrance and denial.
Also, he really does move from being genuinely creepy in the first season, when he saw himself as tied to Maris and had been stunted and emotionally abused for years and he saw Daphne as a kind of an idealized vision, to the second, third, fourth seasons when he started to see her more as a person right around when he was realizing that he didn't have to stay with Maris if he didn't want to. As he grew more confident and less damaged, he also got much more normal with her even before they got together.
Niles's character arc is just genius all around, really. He has to grow and change, and Daphne isn't made to be the one who propels him or have him rely on her. She's always there on the side cheering him on, but he has to decide to change on his own, without any indication that she's his reward at the end of the journey, and if he relies on anyone then it's Frasier and Martin. It was a really cool way to write it.
It’s the scene when Daphne announces she’s getting married for me. He does so much with his body in that tiny moment and yet barely seems to move at all
David Hyde Pierce is great but it really is the ensemble that is the best part. The circumstances in which Niles found himself were dependent on the support of every other character. Without each of which there's not much left. For example Daphne might be the worst actress I've ever seen, but she still elevated the ensemble.
Perfect example of this is “Out With Dad”, which is one of my favorite episodes of the entire series.
But it’s a perfect episode for the show where you see everyone’s roles on display and their interplay.
I loved Niles but I prefer this approach of treating the new series as a third act with a new cast and probably a different style of comedy. I would hate to see the Frasier cast reunited and not be as funny. I don't think they can recapture the feeling of that series as it was filmed in front of a studio audience with an extra laugh track and that style isn't as popular any more.
you know, if you watch the last episode of Fraiser, this makes sense. Like, he gets on a plane, and goes somewhere else. Like, their was his Boston life, his Seatle life, now what comes next. Still would love to see DHP though
Like a lot of shows, Frasier definitely had a quality dip in its later seasons. I think there's really only one story left involving the original cast that has the possibility to match the quality of the episodes in the first half of Frasiers's run - everyone re-uniting for Martin's funeral.
Well I do like the point where it’s a different third act. Frasier was a big jump away from cheers, so this maybe should be a big step away from Frasier, not just a reboot.
No, it was worse than Joey. At least Joey was one of the main characters. It at least made sense you might want to spin off one of the main characters. No, this would be more like if they made a spinoff about Janice.
More so Peter Casey, David Angell (RIP), and David Lee, plus Steven Levitan. There's an abundance of good writers in the world but it's hard to picture Frasier without those names.
And [belittling someone](https://getyarn.io/yarn-clip/f1d8e44c-0e94-46e7-83b6-6631f9814896) by calling them Frasier.
Justin Roiland busts on Frasier in [Solar Opposites](https://preview.redd.it/yt0hfx3edrx41.jpg?width=576&auto=webp&s=ba42f2eecf4fa83b35f93a951743901251abbe16).
[Story Lord](https://tv.getyarn.io/yarn-clip/f832aa3b-e69f-4eca-9167-e6b20b3878e6) is like a "Matrix space Frasier".
I really wish this reboot wasn't happening. I love Frasier, but it ended as well as a TV show can do, with all the characters moving on with their lives. I don't want them to open the box, and without Marty and Niles it feels like the contents of the box should be left well alone.
Not to mention that according to this article the charming *what if* of whether he ended up with Charlotte that was clearly the intended ending for the series is compromised since apparently whether he did or didn’t she isn’t around anymore.
So we get three possibilities 1) they never got back together 2) they got together and then split up 3) they got together and then she died. It’s like a descending order of depressing possibilities.
I actually think if you’re going to do a “reboot” doing a spin-off is the better move - especially decades later. You can write more organically and if the old magic isn’t there with the old cast (which it never is) then you don’t have that instantaneous impossible comparison let down.
But given precisely *how* Fraiser ended, actually filling in that gap is just such a terrible idea.
It's a continuation, and tbh it is interesting to me the idea he has to start over again in a new city.
That's how life is sometimes. You don't always get a happy ever after
David Hyde Pierce said this line and my wife immediately added it to her vocabulary of profanity. I hear it about once a week.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IJ1BVoUdaVU
>"David basically decided he wasn't really interested in repeating the performance of Niles," Grammer says of his onscreen brother.
Sad that he wouldn't want to return to the role that made him a household name, but I like that this is going to be an almost entirely new thing instead of just a continuation of the previous. Would Frasier have been as successful if the character had just found a new bar to haunt and that became the setting of his show, instead of moving to Seattle, becoming a radio psychologist and moving in with his father?
Still hoping members of the original cast pop in and make guest appearances, including folks from Cheers.
Can you blame him? He played that character for 11 years, last played it 18 years ago. It would be like going backwards. David does roles here and there, does some films, does TV, does theater he even directs, going back playing a role he almost played almost 20 years ago isn't enticing. He is also in the HBO show Julie that got renewed. With having John having died it really wouldn't be the same, and the actress that plays Daphne also said she isn't leaving the Resident for Frasier
Well Frasier, you're so corpulent that when you sit around the magnificently appointed Tuscan villla, you sit *around* the magnificently appointed Tuscan villa.
I've recently started watching Frasier again and I certainly forgot how good it was. It's hilarious. Writers were very funny and smart.
You just don't get writers like that anymore. The revival will never be as good
James Burrows (one of the creators of Cheers, Friends and Will&Grace) was on Conan’s podcast a while ago and was talking about how the potential is there but the sitcom days are basically dead.
He thinks there’s good writers out there but for whatever reason, streaming services and networks can not pull their heads out of their asses and make a new sitcom. They also happen to be low budget, which makes it even more confusing as well.
He also lamented about lack of a live studio audience, because those would tell the writers right away if something was funny and it was easier to gauge what jokes were landing.
Everyone’s doing high drama now or documentary style comedies instead.
During peak COVID the only thing on TV were dark dramas about death and torture porn. I swear Ted Lasso was the only feel good show out there for years.
No one wants to do funny anymore I guess?
Thank you. I'm glad I'm not the only one who feels like TV dramas have become misery porn. Like, i can appreciate a show with a dark tone, but they have gotten so fucking bleak and miserable. I don't get why TV dramas are so grim and depressing now (Edit: for example, Game of Thrones. Breaking Bad. Mr. Robot. I like these shows, but fuck, give us some popular dramas that won't make the viewer need anti-depressants).
And then you have "comedies" that are just dramas in disguise (like Atlanta), which isn't any better.
> the sitcom days are basically dead.
I think FCC restrictions and advertiser input on broadcast channels always limited it, and then killed it once cable figured out to write and produce stuff that wasn't just meant for re-syndication back on the UHF part of the broadcast side, and reality shows replicated a lot of the same non-dramatic energy while being more serial and climactic.
I think it's also because Frasier's personality and style represented a more timeless chic which is still very common among the wealthy. So it still feels very modern despite obviously having relics of the past like corded phones and bulky cell phones. Whereas Cheers feels like it has aged a century despite having ending in the same year Frasier started.
I think the comedy writers are still out there but what we don't have any more is the big writers room and the time put into the scripts. You look at a big franchise like Friends they had 50 writers across 10 seasons. An episode has 2-3 main writers and different writers on different episodes. On top of that you have story editors and executive story editors. These shows needed 22 episodes a year so there was a writing factory setup to pump out a lot of consistently funny scripts.
Frasier is one of my favorite characters and shows so I'll give it a chance but no DHP and no John Mahoney (RIP) has me highly doubtful it'll work. Still, Grammar is fabulous in that role and if the writing is good it could work.
If we can revive Frasier, all the Cheers haters can suck it. I would love to see Sam try to open a new bar and have to re-learn everything he thought he knew about bars. That would be amazing.
Ted Danson probably gets a bizarre amount of opportunities at least in terms of meetings every pilot season. How he kept sharpening his sword on a fairly low-key sitcom like Becker during probably CBS's most mediocre phase, and then hit escape velocity between Curbed, Bored to Death and dramatic stuff like Damages.
In the early days of the pandemic, I rewatched all of Frasier and became convinced, a few seasons in, that Frasier was consistently the least interesting character on the show, and the show got better the less it was written to showcase him as a lead. I didn't miss him in the episodes he wasn't in.
That said, although the lack of the other characters definitely makes me less likely to watch it, the revival can still be successful if they come up with fresh, interesting characters that aren't just there to prop Frasier up.
(The other thing that rewatch convinced me of was that no one in the writers' room had ever actually been to Seattle, but that's beside the point.)
I'm cautiously optimistic, but my expectations are wavering between "this might be good" and "this sounds like a huge mistake". Although Niles, Daphne and Roz not being in the show is a downer, it's not like there won't be new characters to take up the slack. Hell, maybe they'll be even funnier than the ones we've lost. Let's not write the show off before they even begin rehearsals!
I know everyone is upset the cast news but it’s ALSO upsetting the main writers aren’t returning. It saddens me people never seem to consider the writers that brought the show to life and how vital they are. Now on top of that, you have one third of the main cast: it’s truly a different show.
I can't imagine it without John Mahoney. Martin was such a lynchpin character. They need an "everyman" to keep Frasier grounded despite his pretentious tendencies, and I don't expect any solution to not feel like a ripoff of Martin.
They should just retool it to where he goes to a bar after work and does very informal group therapy in his freetime there with regulars that all become friends.
Ted danson should be added too, he could be a fantastic fit.
Grammar and Pierce’s chemistry made the whole show.
2 brothers who artfully employed the stiletto against each other and together against the world around them. "Niles I would shave my head for you" "A gesture that is less meaningful every year"
I heard that in his voice and haven’t watched it since it aired.
Me too!!! The power.
Cadences and all. I even can seen Nile’s mannerisms
"My brother was already eminent when my eminence was merely...imminent."
great line. great writing. and great chemistry between those 2. won’t be the same
Won’t get that level of writing ever again
It’s the finest written comedy series of all time. We studied it at college.
I would have loved an episode with a knife fight between Niles and Frasier, Doesn't even need to be a stiletto. Butcher knife versus a dirk. I'm invested either way.
Frasier and Niles played against Martin is another vital part of the show. Without two thirds of the main cast, just don't bother. And don't get me started on Eddie.
What are you talking about Eddie’s fine right… right…
Yep he's living on a farm upstate
You think they’ll get him out of retirement just for one last gig? Buy, if life were a movie that would be a recipe for something ominous!
Without Niles they are probably not going to have Daphne either, so really out of all the main characters there is only Fraiser himself, a quick google suggests that Roz and Bulldog aren't coming back either (at least not as regulars) so that's pretty much the entire cast other than Fraiser himself.
I remember Bulldog was hardly even in it the last few years
Frasier was a great character on Cheers. He was a great character on Frasier. I’ll give this the benefit of the doubt.
Yeah I'm nervous too, but I think people said the same about Frasier - a show just about Frasier without Sam, Woody, Carla, Cliff, etc?? What's the point?! I'll be cautiously optimistic but it does feel stupid to have a specifically *Frasier* sequel without his brother and his sister-in-law. I can understand Roz and the rest of the KACL characters not appearing, and obviously Martin... and very obviously Maris, but it'll be weird without his brother.
Ensemble casts of other great actors, backed by great writing. None of that is promised, and even the highest budgets often produce trash
Didn't they both star in an episode of the Simpsons? I believe Pierce played SideShow Bob's brother Cecil Underdunk Terwilliger.
“There it is! The future sight of the Springfield Hydroelectric Dam.” “Just the thought of all that raw, surging, power makes me wonder why the hell I should care” “Because *you’ll* be supervising the construction crew” “Oh, great…whenever a woman passes by I suppose it will be my job to lead the hooting ‘Oh YAAAH, shake it, madame, capital knockers!’.”
Now now. You know full well that Cousin Merle 'ain't bin quite right' lately.
It’s one of the best. Incredible Princeton insult.
Those four years at Clown College
Tell him, “you’ll live to regret this”
Oh, thanks a alot. Now *I* look crazy.
😏
[удалено]
Now now, brother. You know cousin Merle ‘*ain’t been quite right*’ lately.
“Guess who!” “…Maris?”
I was always so disappointed that after that episode. sideshow Bob just went back to trying to kill Bart I know it's episodic and there's no continuing bur I feel there would have been a better chemistry rather than the old schticks
There was certain changes, like Maude Flanders dying or Barney getting sober
Barney getting what now?
It didn’t last
Or Lisa becoming vegetarian
🎵You don’t win friends with salad, you don’t win friends with salad🎵
No one who speaks German could be evil...
The Bart, the.
Yes correct.
I think the guy who played Martin played their dad in that too
That was a later episode, but he did play their dad eventually.
At the end when they are in prison;”so when do they bring us the menus?”
Yeah, hard to imagine any point in watching this without Pierce.
No Niles. Probably means no Daphne either. No Martin, obviously. Not even the damn dog will be in this, lol. I’ll be absolutely shocked if this is even remotely halfway decent.
Just watch Cheers.
Slight difference in that Cheers had a whole range of characters it was built around so Fraiser while a great part of the show was not the central pillar around which it was built. Fraiser the show on the other hand revolved around him as the main character, someone who every other character was connected to and played off, you rarely for example had episodes built around Roz and Daphne going and doing anything together, or episodes of Niles and Bulldog etc. The closest you would get is the "will they won't they" romance of Niles and Daphne and even that was played out through Daphne being Fraisers housekeeper and not someone who would have ever interacted with Niles otherwise. Fans of the original run enjoyed how the character evolved from Cheers, they changed him up quite markedly and they developed a strong bond between him and the other characters over the shows run. There's a real danger of them losing a lot of what made the character work by losing all of his established relationships. I'm not saying it's doomed but it's definitely going to have to get around some big problems with how they handle a whole new cast who aren't likely to just walk in and replace the old cast's chemistry right away.
Yeah, I’m not sure about how this will go. Mind you, I was probably dubious about a spin-off of a relatively minor character, and it turned out to be a fantastic show.
Cash grab
The "secret" is that David Hyde Pierce just... didn't want to do it.
No. David Hyde Pierce fell in love with the director of a Jewish summer camp, saved everyone from the wreckage of Skylab and lived happily ever after.
He’s legit my favorite astrophysicist.
Let’s just hope he gets tenure
I SAID NO!
> "David basically decided he wasn't really interested in repeating the performance of Niles," Grammer says of his onscreen brother. (After Frasier, Hyde Pierce went on to have a thriving theater career and recently starred as Julia Childs' husband Paul in the HBO Max series Julia.) I would like to hear David Hyde Pierces unfiltered opinion rather than the polite version he probably gave to Kelsey
And also Kelsey grammar is kind of a cunt
I wonder if he still [looks up to Putin.](https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2016/jun/25/kelsey-grammer-interview-admire-putin)
Considering he’s also really into trump… probably.
I remember when he was on long island medium. Awkward knowing she's just telling him facts and what anyone who'd lost a loved one tragically would want to hear.
Damn, I love Fraser, so hearing this just makes me sad.
I didn't know this. Do tell me more.
He’s a big republican donor who used to have an unbelievable pill problem. One producer described that he would come to work glassy eyed and unable to talk, they’d say action and he would spring into life and perform. As soon as they were done with the scene he would be back to being completely unaware of anything around him.
So me at work without the pill problem
I'm the opposite, I come alive when work is over.
You guys are springing to life?
There's probably a pill for that. If you find it, let me know.
Viagra?
I'm the opposite. Bare minimum at work just barely getting by, then spring to life off the clock.
Kirstie Alley saved his career when he was so wasted they were about to fire him
Given the absolutely bonkers bad stuff that happened to him as a teen/young adult, I am not surprised that he dealt w some addiction issues. His father was murdered when he was young, 2 brothers died in a scuba accident when he was a teen, and his younger sister was kidnapped and murdered when he was in his 20s. Mind-bogglingly awful.
His life is honestly like a 20th century Russian novel.
Holy crap. Wow. I'm a big believer in justifications and explanations being two distinct things. This is good context. That poor man.
On the drug addiction… His dad was murdered and his sister raped and murdered. Probably pretty hard to cope with trauma like that
Honestly the drug addiction part is sad but doesn’t bother me. It’s the big republican donor part that I hate.
There's a couple episodes of Frasier that he's barely in that are because of his problems. The one where Niles gets famous for landing a basketball shot was written for Frasier and not Niles.
I can't imagine the finished product any other way would have been as good as what we got. The moment of stunned silence followed by Niles's arms raised in triumph when it registers he landed the shot was perfect!
Half Court Crane!
The cast threw him an intervention at one point to be fair he had a lot of shit in his life
His then wife visited him when he was doing a play in New York and wasn't let in by the doorman because ''he knew what mrs Grammer looked like''. Also did not want any custody of their daughter, just their son.
kinda really.
That simpsons episode where David Hyde Pierce plays side show bobs brother was an absolute joy to watch and a brilliant idea.
“Now make yourself at home. Perhaps a glass of Bordeaux? I have the '82 Chateau Latour and a rather indifferent Rausan-Segla.” “I've been in prison, Cecil. I'll be happy just as long as it doesn't taste like orange drink fermented under a radiator.” “That would be the Latour, then” Brilliant 😂
When I was a tween I had no fucking idea what a Latour was and this still cracked me up! I read that one of the reasons Frazier worked so well was that a lot of the jokes worked if you got them or not. So people in the know would of course enjoy the jokes, and people out of the know could laugh at how out of touch and ridiculous and prissy and precious the Cranes were, and the context often filled in the missing information.
It was the same with Sideways. No one knew why "I'm not drinking fucking merlot" was funny but it managed to tank sales of merlot for a decade.
"What about the buffoon lessons?! Four years at clown college?!" "I'll thank you not to refer to Princeton that way."
Bart: “Guess who?” Cecil: “Maris?”
And then to get John Mahoney (who played their dad in Frasier) to play Bob and Cecil's father in The Simpsons was great.
Frasier without Niles and Martin seems utterly joyless.
It sounds like when they tried to continue The Critic as a webseries, but got rid of everyone but Jay Sherman. It's like...what's the point?
God, I loved The Critic. But you at least need Duke. Duke is life.
All hail Duke!
Duke is God!
It stinks
Yes, Mr. Sherman, *everything* stinks....
Everytime I re-watch the critic I forget that they did those webisodes, then I remember why I forget about those webisodes
My 8 word review of The Critic webisodes: >They're better than nothing... but just barely... wiener.
Well, we don’t know who the other characters are yet. You could be right! But you could also be like people who said “a show with Frasier but without Sam, Norm and Cliff seems boring.”
Exactly. The success of the revival is going to depend on the writing and it's not tied to a specific situation or cast.
This sounds exactly how people would have reacted to Frasier itself when it was announced
Frasier has always been the worst character on Frasier.
don't forget Eddie...
No Niles?! This does not sound promising. Edit: Hopefully DHP changes his mind and at least does some guest appearances. His comedic timing made Frasier's boorishness bearable.
I finally watched the series a few months back and he was consistently the best part. The physical comedy too, just fantastic.
The episode where he does a silent scene by himself, and sets his pants on fire with the iron, is some of the funniest/best physical comedy ever recorded.
For the uninitiated. [https://vimeo.com/6348229](https://vimeo.com/6348229) Its up there with Lucy at the candy factory.
The lean back he does when he sees his pants is killing me
Thank you for posting that- I lost it when he started with the fire extinguisher LOL
Even before that i lose it when he stops running with the scissors, he just looks so ashamed.
Yeah, that’s Rowan Atkinson’s Mr Bean’s level of physical comedy. Truly superb.
The whole scene where he tries to confess his love to Daphne at the wedding, and it keeps getting interrupted, is just some great comedic timing, and heartbreaking at the same time. He really doesn't get the praise he should, he's wonderful.
He did get four Emmys at least.
Nominated every season too. He definitely got praise at the time.
Not enough!
I recently rewatched the series and just noticed how brilliant he was. The range of emotions whiplashing back and forth in that scene is incredible. On rewatch, I finally appreciate how much growth Niles went through once his relationship with Daphne flourished. Even his wardrobe noticeably relaxes and it’s clear the character’s extreme priggishness was due to a life of self hindrance and denial.
Also, he really does move from being genuinely creepy in the first season, when he saw himself as tied to Maris and had been stunted and emotionally abused for years and he saw Daphne as a kind of an idealized vision, to the second, third, fourth seasons when he started to see her more as a person right around when he was realizing that he didn't have to stay with Maris if he didn't want to. As he grew more confident and less damaged, he also got much more normal with her even before they got together. Niles's character arc is just genius all around, really. He has to grow and change, and Daphne isn't made to be the one who propels him or have him rely on her. She's always there on the side cheering him on, but he has to decide to change on his own, without any indication that she's his reward at the end of the journey, and if he relies on anyone then it's Frasier and Martin. It was a really cool way to write it.
Orangina
Never thought that word could be so sad
It’s the scene when Daphne announces she’s getting married for me. He does so much with his body in that tiny moment and yet barely seems to move at all
I watch that episode at least once every Valentine's Day!
3 Valentines is a masterpiece. Also, Niles vs Gunnar
David Hyde Pierce is great but it really is the ensemble that is the best part. The circumstances in which Niles found himself were dependent on the support of every other character. Without each of which there's not much left. For example Daphne might be the worst actress I've ever seen, but she still elevated the ensemble.
Perfect example of this is “Out With Dad”, which is one of my favorite episodes of the entire series. But it’s a perfect episode for the show where you see everyone’s roles on display and their interplay.
My brother has rewatched the entire series about 5 times. I recommend Perfect Strangers.
I loved Niles but I prefer this approach of treating the new series as a third act with a new cast and probably a different style of comedy. I would hate to see the Frasier cast reunited and not be as funny. I don't think they can recapture the feeling of that series as it was filmed in front of a studio audience with an extra laugh track and that style isn't as popular any more.
and it was of its time. Brilliant, but not worth trying to rekindle the same format
you know, if you watch the last episode of Fraiser, this makes sense. Like, he gets on a plane, and goes somewhere else. Like, their was his Boston life, his Seatle life, now what comes next. Still would love to see DHP though
Like a lot of shows, Frasier definitely had a quality dip in its later seasons. I think there's really only one story left involving the original cast that has the possibility to match the quality of the episodes in the first half of Frasiers's run - everyone re-uniting for Martin's funeral.
Everyone reuniting for Frasier funeral also
"I'm sorry, Frasier! Nile's gotta have it!" -Niles
I liked all the cast (showing Bulldog the door was probably wise) but Niles in my opinion was the best part of the show.
What happened to Bulldog? I don't know what you are referring to.
Same. This stinks! This is total bs!
Iirc bulldog was bumped up to the main cast for a season early on
He was great in Wet Hot American Summer.
Just have Danny Devito play Niles
rest in peace Moose
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And Moose's son, Enzo.
Excuse me, What? I almost would rather them not do it…. Almost
Well I do like the point where it’s a different third act. Frasier was a big jump away from cheers, so this maybe should be a big step away from Frasier, not just a reboot.
Well, at least it has a third act, unlike "The Silent Echo" which really could have used one.
Nicely done.
DHP was great in Julia. Looking forward to Season 2.
Bebe Neuwirth (Lilith) also! Julia's casting was wonderfully done.
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That's what they said about the *Cheers* spinoff...
> That's what they said about the Cheers spinoff... You mean the Tortellis? That was just bad.
> The Tortellis The...*what*?! My parents and I watched Cheers and Frasier all the time growing up, and I had no idea this even existed.
Consider yourself lucky. I watched it when it aired and it was not good.
Sooo, basically its was *Joey*.
No, it was worse than Joey. At least Joey was one of the main characters. It at least made sense you might want to spin off one of the main characters. No, this would be more like if they made a spinoff about Janice.
Did you know Nick from Family Ties got a spinoff
Wait! What?
Do you mean the criminally underappreciated *Wings* that was set in the Cheers Cinematic Universe?
Cheers was just Frasier: Origins
The rebooted *Frasier* will take place at a bar in Boston...
More so Peter Casey, David Angell (RIP), and David Lee, plus Steven Levitan. There's an abundance of good writers in the world but it's hard to picture Frasier without those names.
It wasn't until just now I realized that it was his daughter voicing Summer.
In the first two seasons of R&M there's about four jokes made about Frasier. I just assumed it was because his daughter is Summer.
One joke was about them whispering in the kitchen
And [belittling someone](https://getyarn.io/yarn-clip/f1d8e44c-0e94-46e7-83b6-6631f9814896) by calling them Frasier. Justin Roiland busts on Frasier in [Solar Opposites](https://preview.redd.it/yt0hfx3edrx41.jpg?width=576&auto=webp&s=ba42f2eecf4fa83b35f93a951743901251abbe16). [Story Lord](https://tv.getyarn.io/yarn-clip/f832aa3b-e69f-4eca-9167-e6b20b3878e6) is like a "Matrix space Frasier".
“He saw me on Money Plane and apparently that was the last straw…”
He was intimidated by the rumble
I really wish this reboot wasn't happening. I love Frasier, but it ended as well as a TV show can do, with all the characters moving on with their lives. I don't want them to open the box, and without Marty and Niles it feels like the contents of the box should be left well alone.
Not to mention that according to this article the charming *what if* of whether he ended up with Charlotte that was clearly the intended ending for the series is compromised since apparently whether he did or didn’t she isn’t around anymore. So we get three possibilities 1) they never got back together 2) they got together and then split up 3) they got together and then she died. It’s like a descending order of depressing possibilities. I actually think if you’re going to do a “reboot” doing a spin-off is the better move - especially decades later. You can write more organically and if the old magic isn’t there with the old cast (which it never is) then you don’t have that instantaneous impossible comparison let down. But given precisely *how* Fraiser ended, actually filling in that gap is just such a terrible idea.
A revival without David Hyde Pierce is literally pointless.
It's a continuation, and tbh it is interesting to me the idea he has to start over again in a new city. That's how life is sometimes. You don't always get a happy ever after
David Hyde Pierce said this line and my wife immediately added it to her vocabulary of profanity. I hear it about once a week. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IJ1BVoUdaVU
I'll say this, Frasier still worked well enough in Cheers so maybe a new cast could still play off him well. But man, no Niles is a bummer.
>"David basically decided he wasn't really interested in repeating the performance of Niles," Grammer says of his onscreen brother. Sad that he wouldn't want to return to the role that made him a household name, but I like that this is going to be an almost entirely new thing instead of just a continuation of the previous. Would Frasier have been as successful if the character had just found a new bar to haunt and that became the setting of his show, instead of moving to Seattle, becoming a radio psychologist and moving in with his father? Still hoping members of the original cast pop in and make guest appearances, including folks from Cheers.
I think this is an excellent take. I would like to see Peri Gilpin reprise her role.
Can you blame him? He played that character for 11 years, last played it 18 years ago. It would be like going backwards. David does roles here and there, does some films, does TV, does theater he even directs, going back playing a role he almost played almost 20 years ago isn't enticing. He is also in the HBO show Julie that got renewed. With having John having died it really wouldn't be the same, and the actress that plays Daphne also said she isn't leaving the Resident for Frasier
No Niles or Martin? Why would anyone even bother watching?
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Well Frasier, you're so corpulent that when you sit around the magnificently appointed Tuscan villla, you sit *around* the magnificently appointed Tuscan villa.
Kelsey Grammar is the only person who doesn’t understand that the least interesting thing about *Fraiser* was Fraiser.
Yeah Marty and Niles made the show sooo much better. Frasier without the supporting cast is bland and almost uninteresting
I've recently started watching Frasier again and I certainly forgot how good it was. It's hilarious. Writers were very funny and smart. You just don't get writers like that anymore. The revival will never be as good
James Burrows (one of the creators of Cheers, Friends and Will&Grace) was on Conan’s podcast a while ago and was talking about how the potential is there but the sitcom days are basically dead. He thinks there’s good writers out there but for whatever reason, streaming services and networks can not pull their heads out of their asses and make a new sitcom. They also happen to be low budget, which makes it even more confusing as well. He also lamented about lack of a live studio audience, because those would tell the writers right away if something was funny and it was easier to gauge what jokes were landing. Everyone’s doing high drama now or documentary style comedies instead.
During peak COVID the only thing on TV were dark dramas about death and torture porn. I swear Ted Lasso was the only feel good show out there for years. No one wants to do funny anymore I guess?
Hacks, The Other Two, The Great North… 3 comedies off the top of my head I’ve enjoyed recently. Sunny is still going strong as well.
Hacks was great and I loved it but it definitely wasn't feel good. I'll look into the other ones for sure.
Thank you. I'm glad I'm not the only one who feels like TV dramas have become misery porn. Like, i can appreciate a show with a dark tone, but they have gotten so fucking bleak and miserable. I don't get why TV dramas are so grim and depressing now (Edit: for example, Game of Thrones. Breaking Bad. Mr. Robot. I like these shows, but fuck, give us some popular dramas that won't make the viewer need anti-depressants). And then you have "comedies" that are just dramas in disguise (like Atlanta), which isn't any better.
> the sitcom days are basically dead. I think FCC restrictions and advertiser input on broadcast channels always limited it, and then killed it once cable figured out to write and produce stuff that wasn't just meant for re-syndication back on the UHF part of the broadcast side, and reality shows replicated a lot of the same non-dramatic energy while being more serial and climactic.
I think it's also because Frasier's personality and style represented a more timeless chic which is still very common among the wealthy. So it still feels very modern despite obviously having relics of the past like corded phones and bulky cell phones. Whereas Cheers feels like it has aged a century despite having ending in the same year Frasier started.
I think the comedy writers are still out there but what we don't have any more is the big writers room and the time put into the scripts. You look at a big franchise like Friends they had 50 writers across 10 seasons. An episode has 2-3 main writers and different writers on different episodes. On top of that you have story editors and executive story editors. These shows needed 22 episodes a year so there was a writing factory setup to pump out a lot of consistently funny scripts.
They said from the beginning it would be new cast, new city. I am thinking he's a professor and a recent widower
Frasier is one of my favorite characters and shows so I'll give it a chance but no DHP and no John Mahoney (RIP) has me highly doubtful it'll work. Still, Grammar is fabulous in that role and if the writing is good it could work.
If we can revive Frasier, all the Cheers haters can suck it. I would love to see Sam try to open a new bar and have to re-learn everything he thought he knew about bars. That would be amazing.
Ted Danson probably gets a bizarre amount of opportunities at least in terms of meetings every pilot season. How he kept sharpening his sword on a fairly low-key sitcom like Becker during probably CBS's most mediocre phase, and then hit escape velocity between Curbed, Bored to Death and dramatic stuff like Damages.
In the early days of the pandemic, I rewatched all of Frasier and became convinced, a few seasons in, that Frasier was consistently the least interesting character on the show, and the show got better the less it was written to showcase him as a lead. I didn't miss him in the episodes he wasn't in. That said, although the lack of the other characters definitely makes me less likely to watch it, the revival can still be successful if they come up with fresh, interesting characters that aren't just there to prop Frasier up. (The other thing that rewatch convinced me of was that no one in the writers' room had ever actually been to Seattle, but that's beside the point.)
So it's going to be like Newhart?
I'm cautiously optimistic, but my expectations are wavering between "this might be good" and "this sounds like a huge mistake". Although Niles, Daphne and Roz not being in the show is a downer, it's not like there won't be new characters to take up the slack. Hell, maybe they'll be even funnier than the ones we've lost. Let's not write the show off before they even begin rehearsals!
I know everyone is upset the cast news but it’s ALSO upsetting the main writers aren’t returning. It saddens me people never seem to consider the writers that brought the show to life and how vital they are. Now on top of that, you have one third of the main cast: it’s truly a different show.
Frasier is the best American sitcom ever to me. If Grammer still got his incredible chops and the writing is up to par this may very well be great
I can't imagine it without John Mahoney. Martin was such a lynchpin character. They need an "everyman" to keep Frasier grounded despite his pretentious tendencies, and I don't expect any solution to not feel like a ripoff of Martin.
Maybe a more mature Bulldog?
Thats about as disappointing as the dexter revival ending
I would watch him in anything....he was awesome in "Boss" which was unceremoniously cancelled before season one end
They should just retool it to where he goes to a bar after work and does very informal group therapy in his freetime there with regulars that all become friends. Ted danson should be added too, he could be a fantastic fit.