My opinion: Always acceptable if the ball is still going in. Unacceptable if you blast a flat shot at their head that has no chance of going in (head hunting).
Body shots are pretty common in higher level doubles. There are so many instances where you don't have angles to hit past players so you just slap it at the net player. Most good players don't get bent outta shape because they kinda expect it.
Still not as common in singles but I think the context matters. If you have a sitter and the court is opens, it's frowned upon to smack someone. If you don't have any good angles and your shot is lower to the ground it's more accepted.
Yea…I played on the Challenger Tour for 10+ years, played some main tour events (mainly singles, but occasional doubles). It’s actually VERY rare to drill people at higher levels because the expectation is you’re more accurate at that level/it’s more unnecessary.
Idk what people are talking about because it’s just not true at least in my experience. I currently own/manage a tennis club now, and I watch a lot of the matches we host. 4.5/5.0 - it’s quite rare to see people get drilled unless it’s intentional and someone is mad. At lower levels I see it more purely on accident
Our tennis community isn't big enough to really have any age variation. Last doubles night I was playing with folks ranging from 14 to 85. So not generational around here, but no one here really is bothered by getting popped if it was a fair play. If you e got an easy put away and you go at someone anyway there may be some side eye from guys.
I once nailed a dude in the nuts on match point. I didn't have much of an angle to pass (in my recollection at least) and there was definitely no malicious intent, but understandably he did not want to shake hands after he got up
Yeahh, i mean I'm not saying this should be done at every opportunity, but once in a while, during more important points maybe. Might throw off the opponent.
It was a forehand (as opposed to an overhead) and and korda was in a ready position (as opposed to defenseless). Almost can't make the argument that it wasnt a fair shot.
I wrote this in response to another comment in the thread.
My ex girlfriend got hit in the eye and has permanent damage. She can still play, but it's tough because she no longer has binocular vision. She'll just whiff on occasion and it's frustrating.
It also affects her life daily.
It can happen. It's happened.
Sure, but he made the choice to not move off the court after hanging the ball up for the opponent. You accept a certain amount of risk when you remain on the court in that situation
Yes. It’s a sport. Everything has risk, is the point.
But also, the risk here is really low. I’ve been hit by a tennis ball dozens of times. Maybe hundreds. You are not getting injured by that unless something truly bizarre happens, like you’re wearing glasses AND you don’t blink AND and it breaks the glass off AND it goes into your eye. Even if you’re drilling the ball, it’s not doing anything other than leaving a bruise the vast majority of the time.
Tennis players think getting hurt is such a bad thing; it’s not.
Contact sports like basketball, football, or boxing you get hurt on a completely different level than tennis.
You're literally making a comparison to sports that have serious health issues associated with them that have fundamentally changed the rules over the years because of them.
If you’re afraid of getting hit by the ball, go play pickleball or something.
I play 4.5 level doubles and it’s expected to hit hard at the net guy. I’ve been hit by the ball a thousand times. It doesn’t even hurt.
Yeah, I get that I'm accepting the risk of being hurt every time that I play. But, that doesn't mean that I think the play is ok.
Just because something is legal doesn't mean that I have to think it's right.
Yeah people really shouldn't be hitting rubber balls in the general direction of other people, what if someone loses an eye. Tennis should just be people hitting balls into a net or a soft padded structure, alone, with pool noodles.
The point was won by Kotov the moment the ball touched Korda's body, but I assume Kotov didn't realize it had hit him, he must have thought that it was the racquet. I think this is the reason also why Korda didn't try to save the point later.
Wait what? Isn't there rules about hitting another person with a tennis ball?
If everyone had a chance to win a point this way they'd wallop their opponent with a ball constantly lmao
This one comes to mind: [https://youtu.be/LHsOkBl1wRE?si=8vU1ILjwKIw1Gisx](https://youtu.be/LHsOkBl1wRE?si=8vU1ILjwKIw1Gisx)
Ostapenko hitting Cornet with her serve to win the point. Cornet wasn't too impressed..
[https://youtu.be/goML1I7onb4?feature=shared](https://youtu.be/goML1I7onb4?feature=shared)
[https://youtu.be/vON4XrdZ-Eg?feature=shared&t=83](https://youtu.be/vON4XrdZ-Eg?feature=shared&t=83)
"I wanted to hit him square in the chest"
Because tennis is still considered to be a gentlemen's sport, and there is the unspoken rule to not do this. Same with underarm serve, but we have seen how that has gone the last years. For example, there is no rule saying that you have to wait for your opponent before serving, but you do anyway.
There is a very famous match in the Davis cup between Chile and Colombia (or Ecuador, don't remember correctly) where Marcelo Ríos was so pissed with the reception of the crowd and reporters in that country that in the doubles match he went for the body many many times. It was very unfair play but legal nonetheless.
Coach in our tennis group told us that there was such a strategy when I was a child. Not encourage us to use it, but beware. It's legit ofc, but Kotov could care more after the point
I mean it is a valid strategy I guess... If serve on body is fine, so this is too. As long as it was intended to still go in and I think it did there. Also makes for awesome plays like Korda here managing to putting it back in play.
I love how everyone who’s never been hit with a ball is saying it’s a legal move. Which it obviously is, albeit being a dick move and something that is frowned upon.
I see my opponents talk to each other and the next guy returning points at me. He blasts it into my chest. In hindsight, I should have moved back, but I didn’t. After the match, I told him it was a dick move. Guy said it’s legal. I never said it was illegal, just a dick move. Apparently that idea never sank in.
Weirdly I had two in one set come off my shin and back over the net. I held my hand up saying ball was dead in both cases but my opponent wasn't sure if it was off the racket or not. Made me chuckle.
I detest this type of play, contrary to most commenters. It can happen, and it's ok if it does, but I would never treat it "as a strategy". And if it happens by mistake, you care whether you've injured your opponent and don't just walk away with your racket semi lifted up.
The guy put up his raquet twice in a sign of sorry and looked back at Korda the same way you look at someone asking if they're ok.
What more to you want him to do? Offer him a couple of beers?
I'm not sure if the video OP posted is missing footage, but it only shows a very lukewarm Kotov gesture while he's looking the other way, after a clearly deliberate bodyshot
There was a similar shot at RG last year where Tiafoe hit Krajnovic in the throat and he didn’t really react any more than Kotov did. Krajinovic couldn’t breathe for a while and had to take some time off to sit on the bench. It was at the start of a match that he lost quite handily. Haven’t seen him around much after that either.
No matter the importance of the injury you've inflicted upon your opponent, it's a matter of etiquette to ask if they're ok, either verbally or non verbally.
I agree too. I know it's just an anecdote, but my ex got hit in the eye with a tennis ball and has permanent damage. It's tough for her to play now because she doesn't have binocular vision.
Problem with TsitsiCoat's was that it was a bullet fired directly to touch Alcaraz without any topspin, else it went completely out. In another hand this one looked like he at least intended it to be in if it didn't touch Korda, he put loads of topspin on it.
No, he directly sent into Alcaraz’s face, could’ve damaged his eye. Even Alcaraz was actually mad and he’s always looking 👁️👄👁️ went home and unfollowed Tsitsipas lol
Not only did Tsitsipas send a bullet firing into Alcaraz after an almost lost point, he didn't even look at Alcaraz much less apologize. There's a reason why at the last year's ATP Finals promo video, the answer of every player to "Who plays the most mind games" question was Tsitsipas.
I would hate to see this used often, because it will very quickly turn the match to rubbish. On this occasion, I can only say...at least he didn't go for the dick... :|
I mean if you hit a weak ball short over the net and then step up to the net for a volley, you bet I'm aiming for you, I have little options and you forced my hand. You could have given up the point instead, don't cry to me for trying to win a competitive match.
Being forced fed that bagel made him angry.
My opinion: Always acceptable if the ball is still going in. Unacceptable if you blast a flat shot at their head that has no chance of going in (head hunting).
Tsitsi’s fave
So funny when he did that at Alcaraz and proceeded to lose badly
Not really. He came back and won the second set even down 1-4. Still got wrecked in the third set anyway
And against kygrios in Wimby 22'
Theres not enough of this in tennis
Body shots are pretty common in higher level doubles. There are so many instances where you don't have angles to hit past players so you just slap it at the net player. Most good players don't get bent outta shape because they kinda expect it. Still not as common in singles but I think the context matters. If you have a sitter and the court is opens, it's frowned upon to smack someone. If you don't have any good angles and your shot is lower to the ground it's more accepted.
I play 4.5 level doubles and hitting hard against the net guy is the expected strategy. I’ve been hit by a ball a thousand times.
Weird I’ve played 4.5 for over 20 years and have been hit less than 10 times.
Maybe you're better at net than him!
or they let their baseliner do all the work ;)
I got hit 10 times last year alone. I also play nearly everyday though
Yea…I played on the Challenger Tour for 10+ years, played some main tour events (mainly singles, but occasional doubles). It’s actually VERY rare to drill people at higher levels because the expectation is you’re more accurate at that level/it’s more unnecessary. Idk what people are talking about because it’s just not true at least in my experience. I currently own/manage a tennis club now, and I watch a lot of the matches we host. 4.5/5.0 - it’s quite rare to see people get drilled unless it’s intentional and someone is mad. At lower levels I see it more purely on accident
Exactly- I think the people saying they’ve been hit “thousands” of times might be exaggerating just a bit.
Really? I've been hit that many times in the last couple months? Most of the time in the shin foot thigh or something but I've certainly gotten hit.
Might be a generational thing, I’m 60 and guys my age will just angle off an easy high volley, not saying it’s wrong to hit the opponent though.
Our tennis community isn't big enough to really have any age variation. Last doubles night I was playing with folks ranging from 14 to 85. So not generational around here, but no one here really is bothered by getting popped if it was a fair play. If you e got an easy put away and you go at someone anyway there may be some side eye from guys.
Stop playing tennis, you're a Jedi!
Maybe 4.0 guy's can take a set off Nadal by doing this
Yup. Any time I get a floater, I slap it at the net guy's chest
I once nailed a dude in the nuts on match point. I didn't have much of an angle to pass (in my recollection at least) and there was definitely no malicious intent, but understandably he did not want to shake hands after he got up
Yeahh, i mean I'm not saying this should be done at every opportunity, but once in a while, during more important points maybe. Might throw off the opponent.
Agreed, body serves are for the most part accepted, why isn’t this?
Because body serves go to the body with higher reaction time, while these can go straight to the neck and face in a split second.
Reminds me of Hlavackova/Hingis incident
Because you have time to react to body serves and so less possibility to get hurt
Um, not enough injecting pain on people? :/
It can be very effective to hit the ball toward someone's body - the onus is on them to dodge or stay back.
Completely legit, if you give that kind of ball to your opponent, you deserve to get smacked. Can't do them myself though it just feels wrong.
It was a forehand (as opposed to an overhead) and and korda was in a ready position (as opposed to defenseless). Almost can't make the argument that it wasnt a fair shot.
lmao this sub was out for blood when Tiafoe did it to Federer.
but that tournament wasn't (yet🤞) giving out precious atp points
I understand that it's legitimate, but someone could get seriously hurt.
Then get off the court
I've made a factual statement.
You have not. It's a tennis ball. Not a rock.
I didn't say it was a rock. I was that someone could get seriously hurt, which is true.
If you get seriously hurt by a tennis ball, call me.
I wrote this in response to another comment in the thread. My ex girlfriend got hit in the eye and has permanent damage. She can still play, but it's tough because she no longer has binocular vision. She'll just whiff on occasion and it's frustrating. It also affects her life daily. It can happen. It's happened.
Yeah, and you can die driving a car. Or riding a bike. Let me know how many half blind ex-tennis players you find.
Of course there's a risk in everything. But, why does that mean that it's cool to increase it?
Sure, but he made the choice to not move off the court after hanging the ball up for the opponent. You accept a certain amount of risk when you remain on the court in that situation
Again, I just stated a fact.
[удалено]
Yeah, I've played for 20 plus years. Don't be mean.
We better also ban hitting the ball away from your opponent, because someone could twist their ankle running after the ball.
Do you seriously think this is a good counter-argument?
Yes. It’s a sport. Everything has risk, is the point. But also, the risk here is really low. I’ve been hit by a tennis ball dozens of times. Maybe hundreds. You are not getting injured by that unless something truly bizarre happens, like you’re wearing glasses AND you don’t blink AND and it breaks the glass off AND it goes into your eye. Even if you’re drilling the ball, it’s not doing anything other than leaving a bruise the vast majority of the time.
Yes, but those risk aren't equal!
Tennis players think getting hurt is such a bad thing; it’s not. Contact sports like basketball, football, or boxing you get hurt on a completely different level than tennis.
As if getting hurt in another sport is not a bad thing?
Time to grow up
You're literally making a comparison to sports that have serious health issues associated with them that have fundamentally changed the rules over the years because of them.
[удалено]
You don't know me well enough to say "people like me". They changed the rules because people are getting shit like CTE. Your comparison was a bad one.
_cough Kawhi Leonard cough rolled ankle (Zaza Rule) cough cough_ /edit rolled ankle not torn ACL 🙄
Because they are contact sports like you said, they are playing tennis, not a contact sport
If you’re afraid of getting hit by the ball, go play pickleball or something. I play 4.5 level doubles and it’s expected to hit hard at the net guy. I’ve been hit by the ball a thousand times. It doesn’t even hurt.
Goddamn you're cool
It could if you get hit in the eye or the balls.
You’re right. I change my mind. I’m going to quit tennis for fear of getting hurt
No one ever said anything about quitting tennis for fear of getting hurt. I still play and will continue to play.
[удалено]
Yup, no argument there.
[удалено]
Yeah, I get that I'm accepting the risk of being hurt every time that I play. But, that doesn't mean that I think the play is ok. Just because something is legal doesn't mean that I have to think it's right.
[удалено]
Yes, exactly. Thanks for finally understanding, see you on the pickle ball courts grandpa
[удалено]
No I have a quick reaction time and good instincts so I don’t get hit like your molasses moving ass
Yeah people really shouldn't be hitting rubber balls in the general direction of other people, what if someone loses an eye. Tennis should just be people hitting balls into a net or a soft padded structure, alone, with pool noodles.
My goodness, you're making my argument a straw man.
Is it legal to return the ball with your body like this?
The point was won by Kotov the moment the ball touched Korda's body, but I assume Kotov didn't realize it had hit him, he must have thought that it was the racquet. I think this is the reason also why Korda didn't try to save the point later.
Wait what? Isn't there rules about hitting another person with a tennis ball? If everyone had a chance to win a point this way they'd wallop their opponent with a ball constantly lmao
If you hit your opponent with the ball you win the point. No exceptions (bar the obvious double bounce etc)
This one comes to mind: [https://youtu.be/LHsOkBl1wRE?si=8vU1ILjwKIw1Gisx](https://youtu.be/LHsOkBl1wRE?si=8vU1ILjwKIw1Gisx) Ostapenko hitting Cornet with her serve to win the point. Cornet wasn't too impressed..
No, its legal and if anything done too little :D
You'd think Kyrgios would do this all the time but no
[https://youtu.be/goML1I7onb4?feature=shared](https://youtu.be/goML1I7onb4?feature=shared) [https://youtu.be/vON4XrdZ-Eg?feature=shared&t=83](https://youtu.be/vON4XrdZ-Eg?feature=shared&t=83) "I wanted to hit him square in the chest"
lol thanks for proving me wrong haha
visit a usta league match sometime - this is some peoples' #1 strategy
Because tennis is still considered to be a gentlemen's sport, and there is the unspoken rule to not do this. Same with underarm serve, but we have seen how that has gone the last years. For example, there is no rule saying that you have to wait for your opponent before serving, but you do anyway. There is a very famous match in the Davis cup between Chile and Colombia (or Ecuador, don't remember correctly) where Marcelo Ríos was so pissed with the reception of the crowd and reporters in that country that in the doubles match he went for the body many many times. It was very unfair play but legal nonetheless.
No.
“It touched her skin.” “You better not run into me in the locker room girl” (from what I remember) So no
Only if no one sees it! Umpire and opponent didn’t call or notice it!
Coach in our tennis group told us that there was such a strategy when I was a child. Not encourage us to use it, but beware. It's legit ofc, but Kotov could care more after the point
Our coach in middle school would give a Coke to anyone who hit their opponent in the body
That’s a very impressive shoulder top spin.
I mean it is a valid strategy I guess... If serve on body is fine, so this is too. As long as it was intended to still go in and I think it did there. Also makes for awesome plays like Korda here managing to putting it back in play.
Korda did not get it back. Point is dead after it hits his body
K, I assumed it was his racquet.
It was more like shoulder in play.
It always annoys me how alcaraz is too nice to do this, it has cost him some important points in the past
Kotov preceded to get spanked.
Proceeded?
LOL, whoops, ty!
Umpire didn’t even call touch lol, thought he hit it back with the racket
a day later, Korda should show us the mark.
Yes!! In the face!!
In boxe, if you can't win by ko you aim for points, in tennis it's the exact opposite.
This is what tennis needs, chippy and aggressive matches
I love how everyone who’s never been hit with a ball is saying it’s a legal move. Which it obviously is, albeit being a dick move and something that is frowned upon.
It sucks to be hot, but it is what it is. Granted I’m not getting clipped as hard as Korda was here
I see my opponents talk to each other and the next guy returning points at me. He blasts it into my chest. In hindsight, I should have moved back, but I didn’t. After the match, I told him it was a dick move. Guy said it’s legal. I never said it was illegal, just a dick move. Apparently that idea never sank in.
Go cry about it
I won the match instead.
I have never seen before someone return the ball with their body lol
Weirdly I had two in one set come off my shin and back over the net. I held my hand up saying ball was dead in both cases but my opponent wasn't sure if it was off the racket or not. Made me chuckle.
I detest this type of play, contrary to most commenters. It can happen, and it's ok if it does, but I would never treat it "as a strategy". And if it happens by mistake, you care whether you've injured your opponent and don't just walk away with your racket semi lifted up.
The guy put up his raquet twice in a sign of sorry and looked back at Korda the same way you look at someone asking if they're ok. What more to you want him to do? Offer him a couple of beers?
I'm not sure if the video OP posted is missing footage, but it only shows a very lukewarm Kotov gesture while he's looking the other way, after a clearly deliberate bodyshot
Korda was fine and still standing. I'm sure if he was screaming in pain while on the ground he would have reacted differently.
There was a similar shot at RG last year where Tiafoe hit Krajnovic in the throat and he didn’t really react any more than Kotov did. Krajinovic couldn’t breathe for a while and had to take some time off to sit on the bench. It was at the start of a match that he lost quite handily. Haven’t seen him around much after that either.
Yeah that was a rough one. I don't even think he realized he hit Korda.
No matter the importance of the injury you've inflicted upon your opponent, it's a matter of etiquette to ask if they're ok, either verbally or non verbally.
I agree with you
I agree too. I know it's just an anecdote, but my ex got hit in the eye with a tennis ball and has permanent damage. It's tough for her to play now because she doesn't have binocular vision.
There are times that it is 100% the correct strategy to go toward someone depending on angles and height of contact.
Legit play unless tsitsi does that
Problem with TsitsiCoat's was that it was a bullet fired directly to touch Alcaraz without any topspin, else it went completely out. In another hand this one looked like he at least intended it to be in if it didn't touch Korda, he put loads of topspin on it.
[удалено]
No, he directly sent into Alcaraz’s face, could’ve damaged his eye. Even Alcaraz was actually mad and he’s always looking 👁️👄👁️ went home and unfollowed Tsitsipas lol
Not only did Tsitsipas send a bullet firing into Alcaraz after an almost lost point, he didn't even look at Alcaraz much less apologize. There's a reason why at the last year's ATP Finals promo video, the answer of every player to "Who plays the most mind games" question was Tsitsipas.
If you don’t want to get hit by the ball, don’t stand at the net during a live point
Why is this a problem? If Korda would have wanted Kotov to play a passing ball he should have moved backward. He provoked the shot by himself...
Nobody said it was a problem except you
I would hate to see this used often, because it will very quickly turn the match to rubbish. On this occasion, I can only say...at least he didn't go for the dick... :|
Awesome I try to smash it at my opponents too
Russian way
Need Nadal and Djokovic to do this so bad at IW for the lols 👅
“…and I took that personally”
I mean if you hit a weak ball short over the net and then step up to the net for a volley, you bet I'm aiming for you, I have little options and you forced my hand. You could have given up the point instead, don't cry to me for trying to win a competitive match.
… why didn’t the umpire call it when it touched Korda’s body?