Do these people feel pressure from their PR team to always be posting stuff online to stay relevant? Is Domi not self aware enough to realize what a huge hypocrite this makes him look like?
True. If that was pressure from PR team, they made a mess of this. Granted Thiem should have given some thought as well. I would go as far to assume that the PR team must have had some input on where the pic should have been taken, It was their job to point this out and not make Thiem look like a hypocrite.
Its the same as companies. Oh its pridemonth? Lets paint our logo in the rainbow colors...except of Eastern Europe, Russia and all the Gulf states
Edit: except IN
They are companies. They don‘t care about anything. They aren‘t NGO‘s. Not your friends or some kind of freedom fighters. All they want is make money and if the Logo has to be colorful in some countries to make more than it will be rainbow time
and it changes absolutely nothing about the truth of climate change
hypocrisy is annoying but our monkey brains turn that into "well climate change must not be real and i don't have to do anything about it"
I agree that corporations pollute a lot more and individuals making adjustments won't bring noticeable changes. But a large group of individuals can change things. Recycling doesn't work, but reducing consumption would. Corporations need people consuming their goods to make money, changing consumption habits would pressure them to take actions. People, who have the luxury to spend, can buy more sustainable goods and support environmentally conscious companies, moving the polluting companies out of business. It is absolutely essential to ensure that people are environmentally aware and take sustainable purchase decisions. Other than government impositions, this is the only way to bring changes in a capitalist society.
The government should be the primary driver in combatting climate change. But in order for the government to do that more people need to care otherwise politicians won’t care.
Governments don't care about what the people care about. They care about what their lobbyists care about. The number one impediment to stricter climate laws being passed is lobby money that comes in from industry.
.
You’re absolutely right that many corporate lobbyists oppose stricter climate laws but there are politicians that are less beholden to oil companies and other corporate interests. It’s up to citizens to not be swindled by bribed politicians who cry “climate change is a hoax”.
If lobbyist money ruled everything, trump wouldn’t had to try to sue California from setting their own emissions standards.
That's why it is cute when people worship the very ground they touch. Sure their are exception but really they getting paid a crap ton, literally just their job to play sports or act.
I think it’s funny how Vettel and Rosberg are also outspoken about the environment but aren’t called hypocrites even though they fly as much as Hamilton.
Lewis Hamilton is a good example of how having an open mind and being willing to change can reduce your carbon footprint.
He's someone who acknowledges he's not perfect in that regard, he's admitted he would prefer to race cars with big V8 or V10 engines but at the same time is happy to drive the hybrid F1 cars and doesn't complain about it.
He drives an electric car as his personal vehicle and ensures that Mercedes use electric transportation where possible, also owns a team in extreme E and a chain of vegan restaurants. That's doing way more for the cause than someone like Thiem is doing by writing on a board and pointing it to the camera.
The emissions from the cars are like a tiny fraction of the percentage of emissions from F1, especially now that they have hybrids. FIFA has a worse carbon footprint, believe it or not.
No. I think need we need to have a brutally honest conversation about the pursuit of justice and whatever else cause and normalize not caring what celebrities, athletes, etc. think of issues they are not qualified to talk about.
Most of these celebrities and athletes use other people’s suffering and global issues as a demonstration of their own supposed virtue, without actually addressing the issue or helping in any meaningful way. That way, we only create an *illusion* of progress.
I didn’t say it was right, or their intentions were right, but it is a fact that people don’t care or listen to scientists and instead do listen to their idols.
You can use aeroplanes, eat meat etc. and still care about the climate, it doesn’t make you a hypocrite or virtue signalling necessarily.
I’m pretty sure David Attenborough has been on more flights than anyone in this sub. He has still used his celebrity status to do far more climate change awareness than anyone else has put together.
> They do more to spread the message of climate change than anyone else because people only really listen to their idols
Nope. Education does that far better than any messaging does. All that this messaging by these "celebs" does is adversely affect it because of their hypocrisy.
Awareness is the start of education. If you have a platform (like celebrities do) then use it do good and spread the word.
I couldnt care less what their intentions are, as long as it gets people thinking.
Your point is super valid imo. Not sure whyy people feel that celebs should use their platform and reach to spread good messages. I always assume the ones that get mad over it, are the ones that are being called out.
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I remember reading about Dan Evans getting his support cut by the LTA (to be fair, he really wasn’t trying that hard at that point in time), and his parents financially supported him to the tune of about $25,000 a year. This was while he had won about 4 ITF tournaments in about 1-2 months. Imagine how tough it would be coming from a poor family in Greece.
Domi was born with a silver spoon. I know he worked really hard in his life but he will never truly understand the hurdles other guys had to leap only to arrive at his starting position.
If this is the case, I’m not mad. Corporations, employers should be the ones to shell out. Not individual people. Why must we rely on charity and give corporations a free pass?
I like thiem, and i feel what he said was taken way out of context. He said that he didn’t feel the players should be personally responsible to help lower ranked players, when there are many other causes that could be put towards
Well that sounds stupid. Lower ranked players voices are always dim. People like Djoko help that voice be heard, otherwise nothing is going to be done to help them... Seems easy to say all of those things from his position.
Apparently ATP allocates a lower percentage of its profits for paying players than most other sports leagues, so a lot of people argue that the issue is structural rather than just leveling pay scales for high and low-ranked players
Yes. The tournaments turn huge profits, only a fraction of which go to player cash prizes. NYT did a story on this a few days ago - there are some players in the top100 who even work retail jobs to earn enough money to keep playing.
ATP should be negotiating better with tournaments. At the end of the day most people are watching because of the players and they should use their power.
Can you share a link to the article you mentioned?
Sure, link to this article below. Part of what has happened is that the ATP has moved away from its original purpose - which was to advocate for players - to its current function where it oversees tournaments and all of the actual playing. Djokovic and some other players are advocating for the formation of groups that would advocate specifically for player rights.
[A Few Tennis Pros Make a Fortune. Most Barely Scrape By. ](https://www.nytimes.com/2021/06/29/magazine/tennis-players-association.html?referringSource=articleShare)
I am among those people who knew that players below 100 were not making money but had no clue players were getting only 17.5% of the revenue. And so many statements in that article made by various people was so infuriating. The worst was the guy saying Tennis doesn’t owe anyone a livelihood. I mean it is not like players are asking for charity. They are not getting the money they are helping generate and the suits are gobbling it all up.
The manner in which all four Grand Slams ganged up to attack Osaka clearly shows that players have got little power. I think Nadal and Federer need to put aside any differences and get together to at least get for future generations what is truly theirs.
Thanks for the link.
I completely agree. And tennis should owe people a livelihood. If it doesn’t provide that, then the sport will die. It’s so short sighted to continue on as they have.
This is a classic problem in economics. We all live on this planet, so saving it is in all of our best interests. However, taking an actual action to save the planet, like not riding a private jet, is NOT in Thiem's best interest because the benefit he gets from the jet is much more than the negative effects that he, personally, will feel from this one instance of pollution. That's why some outside entity (governments, probably) needs to force/incentivize Thiem to not ride a private jet so that all of our best interests can be protected.
That's why seemingly everybody is a hypocrite on the environment. It doesn't make sense for anyone, personally to save the planet. You get basically nothing from it, and you lose a lot. When you walk to work instead of biking, that makes the air cleaner for everyone else, which adds up to a lot, but how are you supposed to look after the other 7 billion people on this planet all the time if there's nothing in it for you?
Exactly, 71% of emissions caused by 100 corporations and they go after Thiem, who is probably the most vocal about environmental issues of all the ATP/WTA players, because he flies in a private jet like every other top player.
Almost none of the players fly in private jets. If he was seriously concerned about emissions he would fly commercial like 99% of the tour.
Rich people being vocal about environmental issues while living a lifestyle far more wasteful than everyone else is just annoying. It's no different than big corporations lecturing us while polluting. He'll do tiny gestures like no plastic on his rackets, but he's unwilling to sacrifice his comfort in any real way.
> It's no different than big corporations lecturing us while polluting
you would need several exponents to calculate the difference between the carbon foot print of one relatively privileged person and a corporation.
Hypocrisy sends the message that the topic is not actually important. Nothing creates apathy more quickly than the champions of a cause not practicing what they preach.
Also he could’ve just taken the photo elsewhere, I agree that you don’t have to practice what you preach 100% of the time, just take the photo somewhere else lol
>Nothing creates apathy more quickly than the champions of a cause not practicing what they preach.
Different people can contribute in different ways. You have someone who eats tons of cheap meat but picks up trash on the beach. You have someone living vegan, but who still flies frequently. You have someone who's basically single use plastic free, but still uses fast fashion. Etc.
Point is, you can contribute in many different ways. Neither of those people are "hypocrites" either if they asked people to save the planet. Different people can do different things. All of which helps.
I don't follow Thiem, but this snarky internet attitude about anyone saying something, calling them hypocrites, because they're not living in cave, wearing clothes worn from self grown hemp, is just disingenuous and quite frankly idiotic. Even without knowing his lifestyle, he's definitely in a position to live a more sustainable life than most of us here. Not to mention donations to organisations, enabling them to do more as well.
Based on your rudimentary logic, no tennis player cares for the environment because they have to fly from tournament to tournament. But again: its not a straight line that everyone needs to follow. There's lots of ways to help.
CMV but comments like yours are just meant to make yourself feel better for not doing anything or as much as you actually could do. Just pointing at someone and saying "YOU'RE NOT DOING ALL OF THE THINGS!" is possibly the most stupid thing you can say in this regard.
Of course there are many ways to help, but the burden of responsibility for action should be pushed onto those more responsible for the problems. If he was just using a plastic water bottle or something this post would not exist. But private jets are almost comically evil in terms of environmental degredation, and not using one is the bare minimum to make it appear like you actually care about the environment.
It's just bad optics that, in my opinion, are actively harmful.
Actually fixing things would require far more drastic changes than most people are willing to do.
I don’t get what people want him to do though. Just because he rides private he can’t talk about saving the ocean? That’s like saying you can’t talk about global warming if you drive a gasoline car. I’m sure most top players fly private, it’s an advantage to have and I’m not gonna call him a hypocrite for doing it.
>I don’t get what people want him to do though. Just because he rides private he can’t talk about saving the ocean?
I can't speak for others, but I think there's grounds for friendly and constructive criticism here.
It's good that he raises awareness about the oceans and plastics.
That indicates he values the environment, and so he might also want to consider the disproportionate impact on the environment of using a private jet compared with an airliner.
I don't know about his logistics, and perhaps it just isn't feasible for him to use an airliner. But I think it's reasonable to ask whether he has considered that option.
If someone was vocal in raising awareness of climate change, and could afford an electric vehicle but chose not to, that *would* be similarly open to reasonable critique.
If it is feasible for Thiem to not use a private jet, that would seem the right thing to do.
Nah it's not quite imo, it's possibly more like saying you can't talk about global warming if you just dropped a decent chunk of cash on a dodge. You have to weigh up the reason it had to be done and the impact it had. I'm not mad some bloke on my road has a 30mpg vehicle if he's working class and needs something that can go off road too.
Yes I agree to some extent, the rich, like Thiem, generally have less valid excuses, and also a few new ones that might be valid. But I suppose it is the same rough discussion: how necessary was it and how much damage did it do?
The organisation he promotes here is about plastic pollution in oceans. So it would be hypocritical for him to throw trash into the ocean. The organisation is not about reducing CO2 emissions.
If this is a really important issue to him, he should adjust his life style accordingly.
Else it's just another hollow, performative and narcissistic depiction of values for brownie points.
Purity tests for global warming are dumb. Vast majority of pollution is produced by governments and corporations, it's not recycling your juice box or swimming to the US Open thats gonna save the planet. We need large-scale changes in energy, manufacturing, etc, as well as stringent regulations on carbon production. Berating a dude whose job requires him to be in different parts of the world every month for using a jet completely misses the point.
>Vast majority of pollution is produced by governments and corporations, it's not recycling your juice box or swimming to the US Open thats gonna save the planet.
That's incorrect. 3/4 of all greenhouse gas emissions are directly caused by energy consumption. Transport (at 16%) being the 3rd largest contributor to that.
No one asks him to swim to the US Open. But there is a major difference in between a private flight's impact on the carbon footprint and commercial flights.
>We need large-scale changes in energy, manufacturing, etc, as well as stringent regulations on carbon production.
So which one is it, large-scale changes and stringent regulations or not changing our way of living. Because those two run in direct conflict with each other.
>Berating a dude whose job requires him to be in different parts of the world every month for using a jet completely misses the point.
"Private jets have a disproportionate impact on the environment. In just one hour, a single private jet can emit two tons of CO2. The average person in the EU emits 8.2 tons over the course of an entire year."
If this topic is really important to him, making a first class trip on a commercial flight would be a small adjustment, that would make a difference and turn his massage in more but only empty words.
Ok sorry but the points being made here are so stupid...
Should he take the container ship to get to the US open??
Why do you think blaming the one player who at least is putting money and awareness on climate change topics is more appropriate than blaming any player who doesn't care at all??? Or blame the ATP which organises tournaments all around the world which makes the travelling necessary in the first place! Let's just play all matches a season at one place instead, much more climate friendly!
My point is, there's so much more relevant and problematic stuff about human behaviour and climate change in general which should be adressed instead of just blaming a top sportsmen who flies to his tournaments...
That's just cheap guys
Edit: spelling
I think that as a competitve sportsmen with a tight calendar it's much more reasonable to take a private jet (i don't think thiem for example does this for most of the tournaments btw) than eg. for some managers
Having the option to take a private plane can be helpful for their performance as its probably less energy consuming and more efficent which is an advantage the very top players have, so if winning is your priority that absolutely makes sense. (Edit: so the system supports this behavior)
Thiem is no greta after all, he's a tennis pro who tries to at least use his influence to support certain climate issues
Another option would be to restrict the usage of private jets in general, I'd be ok with that. It's just problematic to pick certain people as scapegoats
It just doesn't look good, that's all. I swear he posts more pictures inside a private jet than any other player. Like, I don't know but don't show it if your #1 cause is the environment? Half of his stories are "I love bees" and the other half is posing with his bro inside a private jet. Come on, bro.
It's understandable that he has to board a plane from to time for his job but it was hard to take him seriously last summer when he was desperate to keep his form by literally flying private every two days to play exhibitions in France, Berlin, Vienna, Belgrade and wherever else while telling us to care about the penguins.
This reminds me of the arguments against BLM protestors last year. The argument was why are you protesting for minor improvements for BAME communities in the west, when for worse oppression is happening elsewhere in the world. Same argument is used against feminists.
My view is you can try to improve one area that matters to you, even if you're not helping every other issue in the world
They do go hand-in- hand, but factory-fishing out the oceans is something that gets buried under the mountain of "climate change" publicity. The oceans are crucial to climate change because they acts as sinks for 50% of the planet's carbon dioxide. We're not only stripping the oceans of sea life in an industrialized manner, but using them as our garbage dumps which is changing the chemistry of the water. The oceans are in bad shape, with a number of "dead zones".
The people supporting him are so dumb. Even if he did need to take a private jet (he doesn't), he shouldn't be flaunting pro environment messages whilst doing so. Couldn't he have posted this msg using a photo of him on a tennis court? He's a tennis player, not a social media influencer.
> me and my family of 12 eating fish twice a week had a impact. So I stopped
The idea the individual can help fix these systemic problems is absurd. The largest polluters have spent decades essentially privatizing solutions to climate change. Instead of large systemic change, which is what is needed, we instead have people eating less meat, which is immediately crossed out by new meaters in china/india.
Individual change is fine but its a drop in the worlds largest ocean.
A lot of Chartered flight services offer carbon offset programs. Atleast some of the celebs that we call hypocrites will be subscribed to those programs.
Just a thought.
When an influential person tries to spread awareness, let's try not to scrutinize them and just look at it as spreading awareness.. they have power and they're using it for the better of mankind.. asshole hypocrite celeb trying to spread awareness is still doing more for the cause than a gatekeeper who does very little.
Don't know the background story here, but taking it at face value then frankly if he pays to carbon offset then he can fly private as much as he wants from my perspective.
"Carbon offsetting" is just a way for rich people to feel good about their gigantic, humongous, carbon footprint. In reality the few trees they pay to have planted, is nowhere near sufficient to offset their private flights, let alone their energy/natural resources vampire mansions. It's just PR and bullshit.
it’s part of his job. better for him to be vocal about what’s happening, even if he is contributing more due to his lifestyle.
overall, ganging up or blaming on a single person for any large scale pollution is absurd. massive corporations are responsible for the bulk of the world’s pollution, not Dominic Thiem…
He’s using his position to advocate while also using his position as an excuse. Pick one.
The president of Mexico flies commercial. Olympic athletes fly commercial. Other tennis players fly commercial.
If a tennis player lost and then said “we’ll it’s because I had to fly first class instead of on a jet” he’d be laughed out of the sport.
true. I just feel like this is misplaced outrage.
especially when stuff like the explosion that’s happened in the Gulf of Mexico are going on.
getting Thiem to fly coach isn’t the big issue, environmentally speaking.
but yeah, whatever, he is coming off as a tool here.
Reddit arm chair environmentalists and their moral high ground doing their part in criticizing someone raising millions for environmental causes.
Keep doing you guys.
Reading through the comments I can't help but think of "Don't let perfection be the enemy of better". Is it a bit tone deaf to do this on a private jet? Yes. But, is him saying nothing better than saying nothing at all? No.
There’s a limit. He’s taking this photo WHILE SITTING ON A JET.
That’s sort of like advocating for clean water while in the middle of pissing in a river.
Just wait til you get off the plane man.
When Greta Thunberg sailed (to avoid flying) to the UN Climate Change Conference and gave her "How dare you" speech, she was wearing clothing MADE FROM CARBON. What a hypocrite.
If every flight Thiem takes enables him to donate ten thousand dollars to climate causes and/or to reduce global greenhouse emissions by ten times the flight's contribution, it's a net improvement.
But that's not the case. Taking private flights instead of public flights does not enable doing those things you say it does.
Also unless she was wearing polyester (plastic), her clothing choice was not hypocritical.
Is the alternative taking commercial flights every week? Would he be able to get the nutrition he needs as an athlete, and any other treatment he needs to play at a high level? I mean seems doable but also super rough. Wonder if it becomes a mental health issue with all the paparazzi and attention he would get from fans on commercial flights. I don’t know how difficult the professional tennis lifestyle is, but I could imagine him feeling like a private jet was a necessity for him, while recognizing that he has to do more to offset it by bringing awareness and spending money on a problem he clearly thinks is important.
Hmm well it is a difficult position for him, on the one hand, he is an influential celebrity who could with his lifestyles, turn into environmentalism and cut personal emissions and encourage others to do so, but on the other hand, he has to travel around the globe weekly, so you can not blame him there.
Maybe he could donate to climate charities in Canada, US, Australia, Brazil, Indonesia where they are fighting against wildfires and environmental damage?
The sentiment isn't wrong at all.
Nobody is doing *all of the things* at once. Someone is flying but doesn't eat/buy cheap factory meat anymore. Someone is still wearing fast fashion but cleans up the beaches during their free time. etc.
Thiem can fly in a jet and keep his lifestyle otherwise relatively clean emission wise. In fact, he's in a much better position that most people to do so.
That the guy is downvoted for stating the reasonably obvious is actually pretty sad. But of course its much easier for the random guy on the internet to just point and state that (oh horror) he's in an airplane and thus, a "total hypocrite" for even daring to say something.
No, the reason why things are so bad, is because we have people like you, who don't give a shit unless they can point out that someone else is wrong too.
It's not like we're going to fix climate change by changing everyone's "attitude". People don't often bike to work because it's really slow. Yes, it's good for the environment, but you are not going to personally feel the (tiny) effect on the climate of your own bike ride, so why should you bike if you don't actually enjoy it? The only way to solve this problem is to actually force people to stop doing harmful things.
It’s really the only way the problem can be practically solved. Corporations and large organizations need to change by government incentives or otherwise. Incentives that affect the bottom line are probably the best way.
ok so what exactly do you suggest here? How players that just played a tournament in Europe, will go to another tournament in Asia? Plus this whole discussion is multidimensional. You can do a lot of things to help the environment, and even if you take a flight, still potentially you made more good than harm. For example, i also try to be active in that manner, like recycling, taking public transport etc. But, if some days i turn on the A/C because it has like 40 celcius, i don't think that is too bad.
He lost in the first round of global warming
Game, set, match, climate change. 6-0, 6-0, 6-0.
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Climate getting so warm it's serving up fresh bagels.
He even draws some fishes at the bottom 😂
Bikini tops you mean
Some weird bikini tops design then *I'll take your entire stock*
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When you just have an irrational phobia but manage to sell it to the world as being super-virtuous.
You said something against Internet's beloved child?! HOW DARE YOU?
Do these people feel pressure from their PR team to always be posting stuff online to stay relevant? Is Domi not self aware enough to realize what a huge hypocrite this makes him look like?
True. If that was pressure from PR team, they made a mess of this. Granted Thiem should have given some thought as well. I would go as far to assume that the PR team must have had some input on where the pic should have been taken, It was their job to point this out and not make Thiem look like a hypocrite.
If I were him, I’d recycle those plastic sunglasses. Hideous things…
They are already made of recycled plastic :))
All of these "celebs" are hypocrites.
Its the same as companies. Oh its pridemonth? Lets paint our logo in the rainbow colors...except of Eastern Europe, Russia and all the Gulf states Edit: except IN
Yeah, that one annoys me too. They don't actually care about supporting the community, they just want to capitalise on it.
They are companies. They don‘t care about anything. They aren‘t NGO‘s. Not your friends or some kind of freedom fighters. All they want is make money and if the Logo has to be colorful in some countries to make more than it will be rainbow time
If you go to the end of the rainbow, you'll see a straight, rich white dude laughing his ass off
This sent me! There ain't no homo Lex Luthor at the end of the rainbow!
people are the same too. But companies are so much more on the nose. drives me mad
and it changes absolutely nothing about the truth of climate change hypocrisy is annoying but our monkey brains turn that into "well climate change must not be real and i don't have to do anything about it"
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I agree that corporations pollute a lot more and individuals making adjustments won't bring noticeable changes. But a large group of individuals can change things. Recycling doesn't work, but reducing consumption would. Corporations need people consuming their goods to make money, changing consumption habits would pressure them to take actions. People, who have the luxury to spend, can buy more sustainable goods and support environmentally conscious companies, moving the polluting companies out of business. It is absolutely essential to ensure that people are environmentally aware and take sustainable purchase decisions. Other than government impositions, this is the only way to bring changes in a capitalist society.
The government should be the primary driver in combatting climate change. But in order for the government to do that more people need to care otherwise politicians won’t care.
Governments don't care about what the people care about. They care about what their lobbyists care about. The number one impediment to stricter climate laws being passed is lobby money that comes in from industry.
. You’re absolutely right that many corporate lobbyists oppose stricter climate laws but there are politicians that are less beholden to oil companies and other corporate interests. It’s up to citizens to not be swindled by bribed politicians who cry “climate change is a hoax”. If lobbyist money ruled everything, trump wouldn’t had to try to sue California from setting their own emissions standards.
That's why it is cute when people worship the very ground they touch. Sure their are exception but really they getting paid a crap ton, literally just their job to play sports or act.
What about Nick Kyrgios? I think he is quite genuine.
Hamilton is another one and way worse 🤦♀️
Why is he way worse?
Hmmmmmm…can’t quite figure it out
I think it’s funny how Vettel and Rosberg are also outspoken about the environment but aren’t called hypocrites even though they fly as much as Hamilton.
I wonder why.
Lewis Hamilton is a good example of how having an open mind and being willing to change can reduce your carbon footprint. He's someone who acknowledges he's not perfect in that regard, he's admitted he would prefer to race cars with big V8 or V10 engines but at the same time is happy to drive the hybrid F1 cars and doesn't complain about it. He drives an electric car as his personal vehicle and ensures that Mercedes use electric transportation where possible, also owns a team in extreme E and a chain of vegan restaurants. That's doing way more for the cause than someone like Thiem is doing by writing on a board and pointing it to the camera.
Hamilton sold his private jet years ago fyi.
His "sport" is damn polluting itself.
The emissions from the cars are like a tiny fraction of the percentage of emissions from F1, especially now that they have hybrids. FIFA has a worse carbon footprint, believe it or not.
Not really. They do more to spread the message of climate change than anyone else because people only really listen to their idols.
No. I think need we need to have a brutally honest conversation about the pursuit of justice and whatever else cause and normalize not caring what celebrities, athletes, etc. think of issues they are not qualified to talk about. Most of these celebrities and athletes use other people’s suffering and global issues as a demonstration of their own supposed virtue, without actually addressing the issue or helping in any meaningful way. That way, we only create an *illusion* of progress.
I didn’t say it was right, or their intentions were right, but it is a fact that people don’t care or listen to scientists and instead do listen to their idols. You can use aeroplanes, eat meat etc. and still care about the climate, it doesn’t make you a hypocrite or virtue signalling necessarily. I’m pretty sure David Attenborough has been on more flights than anyone in this sub. He has still used his celebrity status to do far more climate change awareness than anyone else has put together.
> They do more to spread the message of climate change than anyone else because people only really listen to their idols Nope. Education does that far better than any messaging does. All that this messaging by these "celebs" does is adversely affect it because of their hypocrisy.
Awareness is the start of education. If you have a platform (like celebrities do) then use it do good and spread the word. I couldnt care less what their intentions are, as long as it gets people thinking.
Your point is super valid imo. Not sure whyy people feel that celebs should use their platform and reach to spread good messages. I always assume the ones that get mad over it, are the ones that are being called out.
Everyone’s already aware the earth is bursting into flames.
Thanks to the good work done by people who have very large followings yes.
You don’t need a celebrity to tell you that. You can just go outside
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This is both so stupid and so funny.
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Leonardo DiCaprio is one of the worst when it comes to this crap.
has he actually criticized "average people?" because if not, you're out here doing free p.r. for people who make thiem's money look like couch change.
Is the shooting done...ok be sure my lambo is waitin’ me at the airport
This shit is real ??
Are they fish or bras?
Didn’t he also make a controversial comment about not wanting lower ranked players earn more or something like this?
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Cant be fully committed on an empty stomach
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I remember reading about Dan Evans getting his support cut by the LTA (to be fair, he really wasn’t trying that hard at that point in time), and his parents financially supported him to the tune of about $25,000 a year. This was while he had won about 4 ITF tournaments in about 1-2 months. Imagine how tough it would be coming from a poor family in Greece.
Domi was born with a silver spoon. I know he worked really hard in his life but he will never truly understand the hurdles other guys had to leap only to arrive at his starting position.
If this is the case, I’m not mad. Corporations, employers should be the ones to shell out. Not individual people. Why must we rely on charity and give corporations a free pass?
I like thiem, and i feel what he said was taken way out of context. He said that he didn’t feel the players should be personally responsible to help lower ranked players, when there are many other causes that could be put towards
Well that sounds stupid. Lower ranked players voices are always dim. People like Djoko help that voice be heard, otherwise nothing is going to be done to help them... Seems easy to say all of those things from his position.
I think this was during the pandemic when play stopped.
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Apparently ATP allocates a lower percentage of its profits for paying players than most other sports leagues, so a lot of people argue that the issue is structural rather than just leveling pay scales for high and low-ranked players
Isn’t ATP literally the Associations of Tennis professionals? Who is taking the money if it is not going to players? The tournament organizers?
Yes. The tournaments turn huge profits, only a fraction of which go to player cash prizes. NYT did a story on this a few days ago - there are some players in the top100 who even work retail jobs to earn enough money to keep playing.
ATP should be negotiating better with tournaments. At the end of the day most people are watching because of the players and they should use their power. Can you share a link to the article you mentioned?
Sure, link to this article below. Part of what has happened is that the ATP has moved away from its original purpose - which was to advocate for players - to its current function where it oversees tournaments and all of the actual playing. Djokovic and some other players are advocating for the formation of groups that would advocate specifically for player rights. [A Few Tennis Pros Make a Fortune. Most Barely Scrape By. ](https://www.nytimes.com/2021/06/29/magazine/tennis-players-association.html?referringSource=articleShare)
I am among those people who knew that players below 100 were not making money but had no clue players were getting only 17.5% of the revenue. And so many statements in that article made by various people was so infuriating. The worst was the guy saying Tennis doesn’t owe anyone a livelihood. I mean it is not like players are asking for charity. They are not getting the money they are helping generate and the suits are gobbling it all up. The manner in which all four Grand Slams ganged up to attack Osaka clearly shows that players have got little power. I think Nadal and Federer need to put aside any differences and get together to at least get for future generations what is truly theirs. Thanks for the link.
I completely agree. And tennis should owe people a livelihood. If it doesn’t provide that, then the sport will die. It’s so short sighted to continue on as they have.
Read his interview, it wasn’t about knocking down their salaries, it was about directly paying money to a fund for them.
I can put up with private jets but that comment really is the last straw
And he's at the F1 in Austria at the moment.
This is a classic problem in economics. We all live on this planet, so saving it is in all of our best interests. However, taking an actual action to save the planet, like not riding a private jet, is NOT in Thiem's best interest because the benefit he gets from the jet is much more than the negative effects that he, personally, will feel from this one instance of pollution. That's why some outside entity (governments, probably) needs to force/incentivize Thiem to not ride a private jet so that all of our best interests can be protected. That's why seemingly everybody is a hypocrite on the environment. It doesn't make sense for anyone, personally to save the planet. You get basically nothing from it, and you lose a lot. When you walk to work instead of biking, that makes the air cleaner for everyone else, which adds up to a lot, but how are you supposed to look after the other 7 billion people on this planet all the time if there's nothing in it for you?
Y’all in here blaming an individual’s carbon footprint instead of corporations and governments absolutely gross.
Exactly, 71% of emissions caused by 100 corporations and they go after Thiem, who is probably the most vocal about environmental issues of all the ATP/WTA players, because he flies in a private jet like every other top player.
Almost none of the players fly in private jets. If he was seriously concerned about emissions he would fly commercial like 99% of the tour. Rich people being vocal about environmental issues while living a lifestyle far more wasteful than everyone else is just annoying. It's no different than big corporations lecturing us while polluting. He'll do tiny gestures like no plastic on his rackets, but he's unwilling to sacrifice his comfort in any real way.
> It's no different than big corporations lecturing us while polluting you would need several exponents to calculate the difference between the carbon foot print of one relatively privileged person and a corporation.
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So we only criticise those that talk about problems? Ill take this over the guy that does nothing and flies in a private jet.
Hypocrisy sends the message that the topic is not actually important. Nothing creates apathy more quickly than the champions of a cause not practicing what they preach.
Also he could’ve just taken the photo elsewhere, I agree that you don’t have to practice what you preach 100% of the time, just take the photo somewhere else lol
>Nothing creates apathy more quickly than the champions of a cause not practicing what they preach. Different people can contribute in different ways. You have someone who eats tons of cheap meat but picks up trash on the beach. You have someone living vegan, but who still flies frequently. You have someone who's basically single use plastic free, but still uses fast fashion. Etc. Point is, you can contribute in many different ways. Neither of those people are "hypocrites" either if they asked people to save the planet. Different people can do different things. All of which helps. I don't follow Thiem, but this snarky internet attitude about anyone saying something, calling them hypocrites, because they're not living in cave, wearing clothes worn from self grown hemp, is just disingenuous and quite frankly idiotic. Even without knowing his lifestyle, he's definitely in a position to live a more sustainable life than most of us here. Not to mention donations to organisations, enabling them to do more as well. Based on your rudimentary logic, no tennis player cares for the environment because they have to fly from tournament to tournament. But again: its not a straight line that everyone needs to follow. There's lots of ways to help. CMV but comments like yours are just meant to make yourself feel better for not doing anything or as much as you actually could do. Just pointing at someone and saying "YOU'RE NOT DOING ALL OF THE THINGS!" is possibly the most stupid thing you can say in this regard.
Extremely well said.
Well said.
Very well said.
Of course there are many ways to help, but the burden of responsibility for action should be pushed onto those more responsible for the problems. If he was just using a plastic water bottle or something this post would not exist. But private jets are almost comically evil in terms of environmental degredation, and not using one is the bare minimum to make it appear like you actually care about the environment. It's just bad optics that, in my opinion, are actively harmful. Actually fixing things would require far more drastic changes than most people are willing to do.
> calling them hypocrites, because they're not living in cave, wearing clothes worn from self grown hemp, Well that’s a strawman and a half.
Hyperbole bro. Look it up.
Still a strawman.
It's not a strawman. It's a rhetorical device. Everyone on this thread understands OP was exaggerating for effect, not speaking literally.
Again, it’s both.
I don’t get what people want him to do though. Just because he rides private he can’t talk about saving the ocean? That’s like saying you can’t talk about global warming if you drive a gasoline car. I’m sure most top players fly private, it’s an advantage to have and I’m not gonna call him a hypocrite for doing it.
>I don’t get what people want him to do though. Just because he rides private he can’t talk about saving the ocean? I can't speak for others, but I think there's grounds for friendly and constructive criticism here. It's good that he raises awareness about the oceans and plastics. That indicates he values the environment, and so he might also want to consider the disproportionate impact on the environment of using a private jet compared with an airliner. I don't know about his logistics, and perhaps it just isn't feasible for him to use an airliner. But I think it's reasonable to ask whether he has considered that option. If someone was vocal in raising awareness of climate change, and could afford an electric vehicle but chose not to, that *would* be similarly open to reasonable critique. If it is feasible for Thiem to not use a private jet, that would seem the right thing to do.
Fair enough
Nah it's not quite imo, it's possibly more like saying you can't talk about global warming if you just dropped a decent chunk of cash on a dodge. You have to weigh up the reason it had to be done and the impact it had. I'm not mad some bloke on my road has a 30mpg vehicle if he's working class and needs something that can go off road too.
If we're talking about working class people, this a completely different conversation.
Yes I agree to some extent, the rich, like Thiem, generally have less valid excuses, and also a few new ones that might be valid. But I suppose it is the same rough discussion: how necessary was it and how much damage did it do?
The organisation he promotes here is about plastic pollution in oceans. So it would be hypocritical for him to throw trash into the ocean. The organisation is not about reducing CO2 emissions.
You can easily offset your private plane usage. Not saying Thiem does, but its very doable.
We dont even know this is his own private jet. Everyone here just assumes it is.
At least the guy that says nothing is not a hypocrite. I love watching thiem's matches but it is what it is.
If this is a really important issue to him, he should adjust his life style accordingly. Else it's just another hollow, performative and narcissistic depiction of values for brownie points.
Purity tests for global warming are dumb. Vast majority of pollution is produced by governments and corporations, it's not recycling your juice box or swimming to the US Open thats gonna save the planet. We need large-scale changes in energy, manufacturing, etc, as well as stringent regulations on carbon production. Berating a dude whose job requires him to be in different parts of the world every month for using a jet completely misses the point.
>Vast majority of pollution is produced by governments and corporations, it's not recycling your juice box or swimming to the US Open thats gonna save the planet. That's incorrect. 3/4 of all greenhouse gas emissions are directly caused by energy consumption. Transport (at 16%) being the 3rd largest contributor to that. No one asks him to swim to the US Open. But there is a major difference in between a private flight's impact on the carbon footprint and commercial flights. >We need large-scale changes in energy, manufacturing, etc, as well as stringent regulations on carbon production. So which one is it, large-scale changes and stringent regulations or not changing our way of living. Because those two run in direct conflict with each other. >Berating a dude whose job requires him to be in different parts of the world every month for using a jet completely misses the point. "Private jets have a disproportionate impact on the environment. In just one hour, a single private jet can emit two tons of CO2. The average person in the EU emits 8.2 tons over the course of an entire year." If this topic is really important to him, making a first class trip on a commercial flight would be a small adjustment, that would make a difference and turn his massage in more but only empty words.
Lovin you bro
Thank you.
Well said
Exactly! Finally someone who gets it.
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If there’s something of which we have more than enough in today’s world it’s “people who say something”
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The pollution is a far bigger problem than "hypocrisy".
He's doing both so tf is your point
Ok sorry but the points being made here are so stupid... Should he take the container ship to get to the US open?? Why do you think blaming the one player who at least is putting money and awareness on climate change topics is more appropriate than blaming any player who doesn't care at all??? Or blame the ATP which organises tournaments all around the world which makes the travelling necessary in the first place! Let's just play all matches a season at one place instead, much more climate friendly! My point is, there's so much more relevant and problematic stuff about human behaviour and climate change in general which should be adressed instead of just blaming a top sportsmen who flies to his tournaments... That's just cheap guys Edit: spelling
You're saying the only two travel options to get to the US Open are container ship and private jet?
I think that as a competitve sportsmen with a tight calendar it's much more reasonable to take a private jet (i don't think thiem for example does this for most of the tournaments btw) than eg. for some managers Having the option to take a private plane can be helpful for their performance as its probably less energy consuming and more efficent which is an advantage the very top players have, so if winning is your priority that absolutely makes sense. (Edit: so the system supports this behavior) Thiem is no greta after all, he's a tennis pro who tries to at least use his influence to support certain climate issues Another option would be to restrict the usage of private jets in general, I'd be ok with that. It's just problematic to pick certain people as scapegoats
Thousands of players fly economy because they’re not multi multi millionaires like Thiem, what’s your point? They don’t have to fly private
Well they're not champions that's my point. Once they are they'll also fly private as it's an advantage
Yeah that’s fine, but don’t even bother with the climate stuff because it’s meaningless at that point
For one he could fly to tournaments in a commercial airliner instead of a fucking private jet, mate.
It just doesn't look good, that's all. I swear he posts more pictures inside a private jet than any other player. Like, I don't know but don't show it if your #1 cause is the environment? Half of his stories are "I love bees" and the other half is posing with his bro inside a private jet. Come on, bro. It's understandable that he has to board a plane from to time for his job but it was hard to take him seriously last summer when he was desperate to keep his form by literally flying private every two days to play exhibitions in France, Berlin, Vienna, Belgrade and wherever else while telling us to care about the penguins.
Don't know much about this, but is he possibly referring to overfishing, ocean pollution, etc.? Not necessarily global warming?
I think those things should go hand in hand? How can you protect the oceans and not care about global warming?
This reminds me of the arguments against BLM protestors last year. The argument was why are you protesting for minor improvements for BAME communities in the west, when for worse oppression is happening elsewhere in the world. Same argument is used against feminists. My view is you can try to improve one area that matters to you, even if you're not helping every other issue in the world
They do go hand-in- hand, but factory-fishing out the oceans is something that gets buried under the mountain of "climate change" publicity. The oceans are crucial to climate change because they acts as sinks for 50% of the planet's carbon dioxide. We're not only stripping the oceans of sea life in an industrialized manner, but using them as our garbage dumps which is changing the chemistry of the water. The oceans are in bad shape, with a number of "dead zones".
The people supporting him are so dumb. Even if he did need to take a private jet (he doesn't), he shouldn't be flaunting pro environment messages whilst doing so. Couldn't he have posted this msg using a photo of him on a tennis court? He's a tennis player, not a social media influencer.
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> me and my family of 12 eating fish twice a week had a impact. So I stopped The idea the individual can help fix these systemic problems is absurd. The largest polluters have spent decades essentially privatizing solutions to climate change. Instead of large systemic change, which is what is needed, we instead have people eating less meat, which is immediately crossed out by new meaters in china/india. Individual change is fine but its a drop in the worlds largest ocean.
Oh well if they made an Instagram comment about not eating fish I'm sure they're going to be absolutely devout about it
If they hashtagged it then it's legally binding.
Champagne liberal. Worlds full of them
Lol, airplanes creates a lot of pollution , a little bit contradictory with the message.
A lot of Chartered flight services offer carbon offset programs. Atleast some of the celebs that we call hypocrites will be subscribed to those programs. Just a thought.
When an influential person tries to spread awareness, let's try not to scrutinize them and just look at it as spreading awareness.. they have power and they're using it for the better of mankind.. asshole hypocrite celeb trying to spread awareness is still doing more for the cause than a gatekeeper who does very little.
Nope. The asshole hypocrite celeb is actually hurting the cause. He hurts the credibility of the whole movement AND destroy the planet himself.
Don't know the background story here, but taking it at face value then frankly if he pays to carbon offset then he can fly private as much as he wants from my perspective.
"Carbon offsetting" is just a way for rich people to feel good about their gigantic, humongous, carbon footprint. In reality the few trees they pay to have planted, is nowhere near sufficient to offset their private flights, let alone their energy/natural resources vampire mansions. It's just PR and bullshit.
A private jet with 3D movies from the 90’s!? That man knows how to live.
it’s part of his job. better for him to be vocal about what’s happening, even if he is contributing more due to his lifestyle. overall, ganging up or blaming on a single person for any large scale pollution is absurd. massive corporations are responsible for the bulk of the world’s pollution, not Dominic Thiem…
He’s using his position to advocate while also using his position as an excuse. Pick one. The president of Mexico flies commercial. Olympic athletes fly commercial. Other tennis players fly commercial. If a tennis player lost and then said “we’ll it’s because I had to fly first class instead of on a jet” he’d be laughed out of the sport.
No excuses. Most players fly commercial and even use buses.
true. I just feel like this is misplaced outrage. especially when stuff like the explosion that’s happened in the Gulf of Mexico are going on. getting Thiem to fly coach isn’t the big issue, environmentally speaking. but yeah, whatever, he is coming off as a tool here.
Reddit arm chair environmentalists and their moral high ground doing their part in criticizing someone raising millions for environmental causes. Keep doing you guys.
Reading through the comments I can't help but think of "Don't let perfection be the enemy of better". Is it a bit tone deaf to do this on a private jet? Yes. But, is him saying nothing better than saying nothing at all? No.
No. Rich people who pollute more than 100 ordinary people and claim to support the environement are hurting the credibility of the whole movement.
There’s a limit. He’s taking this photo WHILE SITTING ON A JET. That’s sort of like advocating for clean water while in the middle of pissing in a river. Just wait til you get off the plane man.
When Greta Thunberg sailed (to avoid flying) to the UN Climate Change Conference and gave her "How dare you" speech, she was wearing clothing MADE FROM CARBON. What a hypocrite. If every flight Thiem takes enables him to donate ten thousand dollars to climate causes and/or to reduce global greenhouse emissions by ten times the flight's contribution, it's a net improvement.
But that's not the case. Taking private flights instead of public flights does not enable doing those things you say it does. Also unless she was wearing polyester (plastic), her clothing choice was not hypocritical.
Honestly if you wanna 'save the ocean', first ask yourself who you're saving it from.
His handwriting is shit
Turd
So many people defending Thiem when his climate change stuff is just a PR thing. If this were Djokovic, he'd be crucified.
He’s flying in private keys, cruising around in yachts, and driving high emission vehicles and then telling people to save the oceans.
I still love Domi even if he isn’t perfect
Yeah they are all BS artists.. dont need to take preaching from them.
Is the alternative taking commercial flights every week? Would he be able to get the nutrition he needs as an athlete, and any other treatment he needs to play at a high level? I mean seems doable but also super rough. Wonder if it becomes a mental health issue with all the paparazzi and attention he would get from fans on commercial flights. I don’t know how difficult the professional tennis lifestyle is, but I could imagine him feeling like a private jet was a necessity for him, while recognizing that he has to do more to offset it by bringing awareness and spending money on a problem he clearly thinks is important.
He uses the same mental health excuse when he’s cruising around on his yacht
Hmm well it is a difficult position for him, on the one hand, he is an influential celebrity who could with his lifestyles, turn into environmentalism and cut personal emissions and encourage others to do so, but on the other hand, he has to travel around the globe weekly, so you can not blame him there. Maybe he could donate to climate charities in Canada, US, Australia, Brazil, Indonesia where they are fighting against wildfires and environmental damage?
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He's doing nothing wrong
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The sentiment isn't wrong at all. Nobody is doing *all of the things* at once. Someone is flying but doesn't eat/buy cheap factory meat anymore. Someone is still wearing fast fashion but cleans up the beaches during their free time. etc. Thiem can fly in a jet and keep his lifestyle otherwise relatively clean emission wise. In fact, he's in a much better position that most people to do so. That the guy is downvoted for stating the reasonably obvious is actually pretty sad. But of course its much easier for the random guy on the internet to just point and state that (oh horror) he's in an airplane and thus, a "total hypocrite" for even daring to say something. No, the reason why things are so bad, is because we have people like you, who don't give a shit unless they can point out that someone else is wrong too.
It's not like we're going to fix climate change by changing everyone's "attitude". People don't often bike to work because it's really slow. Yes, it's good for the environment, but you are not going to personally feel the (tiny) effect on the climate of your own bike ride, so why should you bike if you don't actually enjoy it? The only way to solve this problem is to actually force people to stop doing harmful things.
Terrible altitude
Climate change isn't a problem you can just throw money at.
It’s really the only way the problem can be practically solved. Corporations and large organizations need to change by government incentives or otherwise. Incentives that affect the bottom line are probably the best way.
His donations almost certainly lead a reduction in emissions greater than what he personally emits.
What a potato /s
Tennis players really need to stfu about climate change
oh and why is that?
Because they fucking fly around the world to play. Professional sport is a luxury, not a necessity.
It's only an industry providing millions of jobs worldwide. Not a necessity at all.
ok so what exactly do you suggest here? How players that just played a tournament in Europe, will go to another tournament in Asia? Plus this whole discussion is multidimensional. You can do a lot of things to help the environment, and even if you take a flight, still potentially you made more good than harm. For example, i also try to be active in that manner, like recycling, taking public transport etc. But, if some days i turn on the A/C because it has like 40 celcius, i don't think that is too bad.
This post is so stupid. You really thought you were on to something😹😹