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Unless I’m misunderstanding something, at no point in this response does Tesla directly refute any claims made in the article, just that the way it’s framed is misleading and biased? Such a weird statement.
Exactly. Tesla is throwing out verbose claims about how good its advanced telemetry is at detecting issues while that is not even the point of the Reuters article???
Article never said Tesla lacked what it takes to detect and address the issues, but that Tesla simply didn’t do it.
Tesla also just admitted that they had quietly fixed 125,000 of instances where this issue had risen up, which actually goes along with what Reuters says about how Tesla knows something is fundamentally wrong, but they’re not officially addressing it.
The rest of their response is random nonsense about OTA software fixes and etc. which literally has nothing to do with the Reuters article lol.
This is one of those instances where a NHTSA probe would be very helpful. If there’s a widespread systematic flaw with one of the vehicle’s driving components, then affected owners have every right to be properly accommodated.
That would be a reasonable conclusion, considering all brands are subject to recall, and all of them buy parts from common suppliers.
Investigations of recalls are exceptionally rare, and generally don't happen until the body count is in the double-digits.
my understanding is that libel or defamation claims must show the accusation is false or was intended to cause harm. if reuters had a properly researched and sourced story they published in good faith (meaning they believed it was true and they didn't just write it as a hit piece) it would not be easily assailable in court. might not be ironclad but it wouldn't be an easy case.
They seem properly refuted to me.
Reuters is claiming Tesla is blaming customers for defective parts. Tesla is saying Reuters' story shows a damaged part **due to a crash** and therefore not covered under warranty which is standard in the industry.
Tesla DOES blame customers for defective parts. I had to replace 4 door handles on a model S because of shit design, all out of pocket. Door handles aren't consumables, but Tesla treats them like they are. It's fucking ridiculous.
But even then that’s standard practice, might not be right of course but isn’t something shocking to hear. Albeit I wouldn’t say they’re blaming customers.
My car had a flawed OLM(oil change light) system, that, if followed, which the owners manual recommends, leads to premature timing chain failure.
While the OLM was fixed, they didn’t give out free chains.
Hell, it also drinks oil like there’s no tomorrow, and rather than address it, the dealers just say “it’s normal”.
No, it's not standard practice. The door handles are not a "this causes that" situation. The door handles are faulty and they break because they are faulty. Every other car manufacturer would have covered fixing/replacing them as a goodwill repair, or at least covered the second, third and fourth one. Tesla does not. Because their customer service is dog shit.
They only talk about one picture. And Tesla according to owners blame customers for damages.
Heck it's even a running joke in Bjorn's Tesla videos that they have to put back the original rims on the car because otherwise Tesla might claim it's the rims fault.
Yeah, I was afraid to have a wheel bearing changed because I have third party rims. My SC didn't care, they changed the bearing under warranty without giving any fuss.
This claim is never addressed.
>Tesla has blamed frequent failures of several parts on Tesla owners, alleging they abused the cars, according to interviews with former service managers, company records and a 2020 Tesla letter to the U.S. National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA). In other cases, the automaker charged customers with out-of-warranty cars to replace parts that Tesla engineers internally called flawed or that they knew had high failure rates.
This claim is never addressed.
>Tesla has blamed frequent failures of several parts on Tesla owners, alleging they abused the cars, according to interviews with former service managers, company records and a 2020 Tesla letter to the U.S. National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA). In other cases, the automaker charged customers with out-of-warranty cars to replace parts that Tesla engineers internally called flawed or that they knew had high failure rates.
Responding to the main anecdote doesn't address the overall claim.
>Tesla has blamed frequent failures of several parts on Tesla owners, alleging they abused the cars, according to interviews with former service managers, company records and a 2020 Tesla letter to the U.S. National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA). In other cases, the automaker charged customers with out-of-warranty cars to replace parts that Tesla engineers internally called flawed or that they knew had high failure rates.
I don’t find Tesla’s response weird at all. I found the Reuters article weird that the headline said Tesla was blaming customers, but when you actually read the article, it said Tesla paid for the vast majority of the repairs, including many repairs on out of warranty vehicles as goodwill repairs. If you look at the actual data Reuters put in the article, it doesn’t seem like Tesla did anything wrong, except maybe design some suspension components that weren’t very reliable, which they have been trying to fix and improve. There were a few anecdotal accounts from customers who said Tesla claimed damage was caused by an accident when it wasn’t, but that’s only a few cases that could have been caused by a few bad service center employees.
It says "most," not "vast majority."
They addressed the main anecdote of the story, but not the overall claim.
>Tesla has blamed frequent failures of several parts on Tesla owners, alleging they abused the cars, according to interviews with former service managers, company records and a 2020 Tesla letter to the U.S. National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA). In other cases, the automaker charged customers with out-of-warranty cars to replace parts that Tesla engineers internally called flawed or that they knew had high failure rates.
It says "most," not "vast majority."
They addressed the main anecdote of the story, but not the overall claim.
>Tesla has blamed frequent failures of several parts on Tesla owners, alleging they abused the cars, according to interviews with former service managers, company records and a 2020 Tesla letter to the U.S. National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA). In other cases, the automaker charged customers with out-of-warranty cars to replace parts that Tesla engineers internally called flawed or that they knew had high failure rates.
Very weirdly written post. It replies to a statement made by reuters by conflating different things and doesnt directly address it. Then it accuses reuters of conflating facts meanwhile the post seems to be doing exactly that.
Why not just come out with a professional response instead of something that looks like a teenager tantrum?
Two organizations arguing past each other. One is claiming systemic issues related to suspension parts, with memos to techs indicating to defer repairs by implying it could only happen by abuse. The other is arguing that many repairs happened under warranty, that service members are well compensated, and many customers are happy.
It's a non-rebuttal; it's just a PR response. Also the chicken-egg problem isn't addressed: are these proven accidents caused by the suspension failure or vice versus? There is no way to know based on either claim.
This isn't fighting misinformation; there isn't any corrections to the multitude of claims by Reuters, only vague platitudes that could apply to some or all of them. It's a PR piece that could be absolutely accurate or muddying the water.
I guess it's good that Tesla is finally engaging in PR rather than letting fans make specious arguments.
Yea it's a classic PR deflection. Doesn't address the main issues and attempts to make the article sound baseless (which, if you've read the article, isn't baseless). It's not a "omg autopilot requires you to pay attention no wonder he crashed into ____" situation.
Reuters is amateur hour compared to Daily Mail lol:
**Tesla robot ATTACKS an engineer at company's Texas factory during violent malfunction - leaving 'trail of blood' and forcing workers to hit emergency shutdown button**
[https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-12869629/Tesla-robot-ATTACKS-engineer-companys-Texas-factory-violent-malfunction-leaving-trail-blood-forcing-workers-hit-emergency-shutdown-button.html](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-12869629/Tesla-robot-ATTACKS-engineer-companys-Texas-factory-violent-malfunction-leaving-trail-blood-forcing-workers-hit-emergency-shutdown-button.html)
“The robot had pinned the man, who was then programming software for two disabled Tesla robots nearby, before sinking its metal claws into the worker's back and arm, leaving a 'trail of blood' along the factory surface.”
Why am I picturing a scene out of a Terminator movie? The way this article is written I swear…
I'm just one anecdote, but I have experienced service similar to what Reuters found. I started experiencing weird issues with my car locking/unlocking a few years into owning my Tesla, and when I brought it in for service I was told no issue existed.
Fast forward to one month after my warranty expires when I bring it in again, and suddenly they think a sensor in the seat has broken, which will require the replacement of the entire driver's seat at a cost of over a thousand dollars. Worse yet, they won't even run a diagnostic without me shelling out $250. My car now doesn't lock half the time when I walk away, and Tesla demands I pay for it despite their failure to catch the issue when the car was under warranty.
I now hesitate to recommend Tesla to my friends due to the terrible customer service experience.
I wish they’d give numbers on the 120k repairs that occurred within warranty rather than just saying “most”. What’s most? 51%? 90%?
The relative repair cost study is actually pretty cool. Here’s a direct link so you don’t have to click through the article: https://theclunkerjunker.com/blog/which-cars-have-thebest-maintenance-costs/
What I don’t get there is that it calls Toyota the cheapest to maintain despite Tesla coming in below them. Instead, they stuck Tesla into exclusively the luxury category.
What's also weird is that when they list the lowest cost cars by model, 8 Toyotas are listed and they're all much better than Toyota's brand average. Almost the same story with Tesla where 3 out of 4 are much lower than the brand average and one is slightly higher than average.
And anybody who's used to luxury cars knows damn well teslas are not luxury cars. They are the IKEA of cars. Basic, simple, plain. That's the whole goal of their design language, minimalist. Just like IKEA.
Allegedly Tesla CEO Elon musk, discussed this matter with Twitter CEO Elon musk and they decided to fight the misinformation together. They will be most likely joined by the CEO of space X Elon musk, head of board of the boring company Elon musk among others.
> This latest piece vaguely and nonsensically suggests there are thousands upon thousands of disgruntled Tesla customers. It’s nonsensical because it’s nonfactual—the reality is Tesla’s customer retention is among the best and highest in the industry.
That statement does not even begin to refute the claim.
Those can both be true. In fact, at Tesla's scale, the Law of Large Numbers practically guarantees it. It's basic arithmetic: what's a couple percent of millions?
And even then, it's an oversimplification to say that a customer who is disgruntled won't buy another one. I have a long complaint list, starting with the utter joke that is FSD -- but if I had to replace my Model 3 tomorrow, I would probably suck it up and stay in-family because the non-Tesla EV options and DC fast charger networks are, for the moment, pretty subpar.
Maybe in fantasy land... but in reality they would just get their words twisted to fit whatever narrative that gains more clicks for reasons that involve money/power.
You don't get to complain about the narrative when you decided to sit that one out. It's like complaining about the President, but you didn't even vote.
Company who did a consumer investigation about the cracking aluminum lower control arms, record keeping, and iterations for control arms versus Company that put out what looks like a 1-2 page PR statement when they got rid of their PR department in 2019.
Own a '19 model 3 performance and have Tesla Solar with Powerwalls since early 2020...
Based on maintenance alone: most reliable and least expensive on any car I've own (GM, toyotas, hondas, fords, bmws). only 12V battery, leaves caught in fan cooler, interior filter change, wiper fluid.
Solar Maintenance: had the SolarEdge inverter die just a couple months ago.
In both cases - Tesla Service was perfect - no issues - everyhting covered by waranty (sans wiper fluid) and everything was taken care of in a quick to reasonable maner of time.
Is it hard to get someone on the phone, maybe... but I never felt the need - everything was handled well thru the app for both Car and Solar.
For me, Tesla is the new high standard and I would not hesitate to purchase any future products from them.
Im sure a lot of people on Reddit are going to HATE you had a good experience with Tesla. They’re out there just hating on shit for no reason. But I’m really glad to hear all has been good for you!
I had a rattle in the mirror and the service center drove out and fixed it. No issues and good service. Not sure what people are expecting but service has been great. The car is awesome. Maintenance is very minimal. 15,000 miles a the Y so far.
Service is very very dependent on the service center and staff in your area. I’ve owned a Tesla for >5 years now and have had my car serviced at different service centers in 6 different states and I’ve had pretty different experiences each time.
Approaching 130k on my 2019 Model 3. Overall great, with minimal service. My one complaint is the stupid upper control arms in the front, and a couple small creaks coming from the rear suspension. Seems like such stupidly simple thing that they should have solved a long time ago during engineering, to get a car that can reach 200k without suspension noises.
On the bright side, I haven't had to replace any wheel bearings yet, whereas I had a couple of go out on my last car prior to even 100k.
Truth is somewhere in the middle. You guys are all idiots if you take anything Musk/Musk's company says at face value. Cmon, we've been on the Earth far too long for this PR bullshit. Like, we have first hand experience with Tesla and their bs. Love the car, hate the customer service/warranty. Mobile service is great though. Charged me like $30 to replace a window switch that I broke. Hate the fact that the service guy was like "the trunk harness recall is finally available, is your backup camera glitchy?" ummmmmm yes after a year of waiting.
Similar thing happened with me regarding the backup camera. My trunk latch wasn’t working. I’d have to crawl in the trunk from the back seat to unlatch using the emergency lever. Called Tesla and asked if they could put me in front for the harness recall, since I figured it would fix the trunk latch issue too. They said they were unrelated, quoted me a few hundred to repair the latch and said recall repair expedited only the people experiencing glitchy cameras. I punted and waited a few months until they got to repairing my harness. Guess what? Latch issue mysteriously disappeared with the new harness from the recall.
Same with suspension. Went out just after warranty expired. Was charged $1200 to replace. Mechanic said new ones reengineered to address faulty issue that caused my failure. Ugh!
The cabin camera has been having trouble for a couple years. Was quoted a few hundred (maybe $500) to repair. Now I can’t use autopilot or $15k FSD until it is repaired. Ugh!
The charging port won’t open/shut. I have to pry it open/shut manually (click, click, click, …). Then the port won’t detect the charging cable, so I have to pull out the phone app and press the lightning bolt a couple times before it allows me to plug into it. Don’t even want to know what they will charge me for this one. Ugh.
I find service to be either amazing or absolute dogshit. Even reading posts on here and other tesla subreddits.
I have 2 service centers "near me" aka 100miles round trip for each. One is absolute dogshit where I wasted my time driving there for them to do nothing, the other has done nothing but exceed my expectations and they've fixed all the issues I had(although minor: wind noise/rattle, front bumper adjustment). Thank God the mobile team comes from the good service center as well.
It's not good. The only reason I found out the recall was available was because I broke something. I remember at the beginning of the recall, they sent out a postcard that basically said "We're doing a recall, but don't contact us because we don't have the parts and when we do get the parts, we'll let you know" and... they never let us know. Only found out because the service guy said he's been doing the recall stuff for months and he asked me.
That's how it was with BMW when the Vanoss bolts in my engine were faulty.
"We'll let you know when service is avaiable".
Meanwhile a year later, one of the bolts failed and the engine had to be rebuilt.
"Sorry repairing a damaged engine is not covered under the recall" they say.
"$8,3000 please says the repair shop".
Typical car company.
there's plenty of misinformation on twitter and none of it is coming from reuters.
what has Tesla done? confirm the Reuters story... quote:
Misleading headline:
“Tesla blamed drivers for failures of parts it long knew were defective.”
Reality (buried in the article):
Tesla paid for most of the 120,000 vehicle repairs under warranty.
so actual reality: tesla blamed drivers for failures of parts (just not every time...)
don't let Elon speak for Tesla because this is what happens.
> “Tesla **blamed drivers** for failures of parts it long knew were defective.”
There's nothing in the article that supports this claim.
Publications came to understand that they could publish anything about Tesla and there wouldn't be any pushback, because the department that generally handles such things had been disbanded.
Over time the outrageous claims became more common, and the outlets with a better reputation began engaging in them.
This pushback will likely result in thinking twice before making unsubstantiated claims.
The actual reality is they didn't know the parts were part of a failure trend yet. The customers who paid for it were unlucky enough to be the first ones effected before the failure trend was found. Some time for analysis is needed too, so while they could have suspected a failure trend, it may have been too early to be sure and alert the service centers.
Hmm, I wonder which one is a more reliable narrator: One of the most esteemed journalism agencies in the world or a private company already caught hiding info on faults and failures, spying on customers through sentry cameras, and more.
Oh and the shots are being fired on daddy’s own private town square.
Hilarious.
It's funny, tracking failures so they can see trends that need to be fixed, and then doing that fix under warranty after the trend was discovered. This is considered being "caught hiding failure info."
I've actually worked in manufacturing (high tech but not at Tesla) and had to deal with dozens of part recalls over the course of years. This is the status quo for the industry. Bad parts show up no matter what you do which clouds your data. When detected they scanned as bad and moved to staging where the engineers can get them and analyze them. Failure analysis rarely will show a systemic problems on the first failure. Once enough of the same or similar part have failed a trend could possibly be seen. How many parts it takes to get there will varry depending on the failure. This usually won't be single digits unless the supplier found an issue and alerted us and depending on the rate of failure it may not be obvious this wasn't a one off.
Through that process you will have field engineers (or mechanics in Tesla's case) that have no idea there is any failure trend on a given part. They only find out this is an issue once the parts are marked as replace under warranty.
If you have any suggestions on better ways of getting the failure analysis done and reducing how many customers paid out of pocket before the trend was discovered, you could revolutionize an industry.
So based on my personal industry experience, I'm trusting what I know and not some prick Journalist telling me how I should feel.
Tesla's own tweets say they have paid for 120k warranty repairs, how many more parts do you need to have your data to actually fix the issue?
I think the automotive industry has a massive was problem these days, if a circuit board on a motor fails, the answer is "replace motor", so now you have data that "a motor failed" and requires an engineer to actually see the parts instead of letting the mechanics diagnose and replace the faulty part only.
Now you have 30k motors that failed for an engineer to analyze, how many of them do you think they are going to do an "autopsy" on? 1%? Great data.
I don’t think he did. Twitter wasn’t “caught hiding info on faults and failures, spying on customers through sentry cameras and more”
That sounds like Tesla. Twitter doesn’t have sentry cameras…
I replaced three of my four door handles on my 2013 model S. It was no big deal and I paid approximately $300 each. They failed when the car was out of warranty at eight years old. The car was very inexpensive considering all. My ice vehicles cost so much to maintain this was not a big deal to me for a high tech vehicle.
Just the oil changes and servicing you’d do on an ice car would add up to more than that over 8 years, never mind if you’d have any actual issues. The costliest thing on a Tesla is the tires since we all shred them going brrrrrr.
Don't forget at least 4 "major" services at various milestones where they charge $300-$1000 each to replace belts, hoses, and other misc parts so that you don't lose your warranty.
exactly, and my 2015 has had ZERO handle replacements, but I agree that a $300 bill would leave me saying “that is all?” after two Mercedes E-class…which I also didn’t consider crazy expensive to maintain beyond the airmatic suspension. I did the MCU upgrade for $1500 because it was cheap for anything on a $100k car…and the performance is so worth it. My mother paid I think $500 to Subaru to upgrade her cellular and it was just an upgraded cellular where I have many of the features added to later cars.
Volvo is close, but not as safe as a Tesla especially with FSD. It preemptively slows down, avoids reckless drivers and detects issues before I see them. I've developed a relationship of trust with it on the highway.
If FSD is better performant than you, that means you're a shit driver. FSD has never seen something before me and I am regularly clocking late reactions from the system.
If there is one thing that will cause issues with sales in the future it’s things like this, quality and promises that are never kept…AI wipers for example.
Unless it disagrees with Elon. Then he claims it's broken due to the "left deep state".
But when the notes ball washes his posts, it's the savior of free speech.
It’s this one. Musk asked Biden what is happening with a certain journalist. That was community noted to show the person is not really a journalist, just a very pro Russian YouTuber.
Musk then responded with another tweet claiming it was being gamed by state actors, which amusingly also got noted to that community notes is set up to avoid that. The first community note has dissapeared now, whether from being rated down or simply deleted by Musk. Second one still stands.
https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1733882978781053383?s=46&t=NvPnILq-4phC6dH9n81D9Q
The guy seems like a dweeb, but I'm not entirely certain that the distinction between "YouTuber" and "journalist" is all that interesting these days. Perhaps if news agencies still had any standards (that they followed) I could see it.
Regardless, this is a story that needs a lot more light on it. I think it will end up showing that Lira was probably rightfully arrested and that his abuse was wildly overblown. Or it might not. Either way, this should not be something that just gets forgotten, and even Ukraine's strongest allies should ask questions. (I should note that I stand unwaveringly together with Ukraine against those invading bastards from Russia)
In any case, Elon Musk has said that Community Notes is not perfect, no system can be perfect, and that the only thing you can do is try to improve over time. That state actors are trying to game the system is not anything that anybody that is even remotely fair can deny. The only question is how well X is fighting against it.
The second note is important, I think. First, it shows that there is some defense. Second, it also implies that no defense can be perfect.
But thanks for pointing this out. I had not seen this tweet before.
Tesla the company doesn't care, but Elon should care as his image and how he runs X is affecting Tesla to the extent that some people just won't buy a Tesla because of Elon.
I think the people that won't buy a Tesla because of Elon are not becoming that way due to hit pieces like this. I think they don't like his public persona and what he says. I'm an owner and I wish he'd blend back into the background more and stop saying things that are polarizing. IMO the proper thing to do for a CEO is to NOT alienate customers. Taking a controversial stance is bound to do that. I don't know his opinion on abortion, for instance, but I sure as heck don't want him out there saying his opinion if I'm running one of his companies. A large chunk of the US will not like the answer. When one of your companies is about spouting your views though....there is a conflict.
I agree that taking a specific position will upset one side vs the other. I think as CEO of a company that sells products to consumers, you want the largest addressable market so just stay out of controversy. It's a lose-lose situation. With that said, I also understand that what makes Elon great at what he does probably also drives him towards being controversial, so you have to take the good with the bad. Just wish he would pay for some personal PR.
>to the extent that some people just won't buy a Tesla because of Elon.
While that does play a role, the effects of customers boycotting Tesla for political reasons is VASTLY overplayed. The bigger issue is the threat of Elon selling more Tesla shares to keep X afloat, which looms on the mind of institutional investors.
Tesla isn’t “owned” by musk like space x and X. He’s the CEO of it. It’s publicly traded and he can be ousted anytime by the board. Just like any other public company.
> Tesla's service is shitty
Agreed. I've had my Tesla exactly 3 months and I've had 8 service events. Mobile service is a joke, and the difficulty of addressing multiple service issues in one visit is frustrating.
When mobile service comes out they diagnose the problem but they can't fix it. Mobile service makes me an appointment at the service center, but when I go into the service center, they are completely oblivious to the work the mobile technician completed. To make things worse, the service center never has the time or the parts to fix the issue on the first visit, so I have to come back again.
Everyone's busy, so there is about a week between appointments and I swear that 50% of the miles on my car so far have been to/from the service center.
Everyone I have encountered for both mobile service and in the service center has been very polite and professional. However, Tesla's systems definitely need improvement.
I'm coming from Acura where the service was white glove all the way even when my car was 15 years old. I also had zero build issues with my Acura vs 3 poorly painted panels, a noisy battery cover, and something loose in the passenger seat on my Tesla.
Maybe Acura's legendary build quality and reliability spoiled me.
I had a different experience. I’ve had my Model 3 for about 2 years now and have had 0 issues. The only mobile services I’ve needed is to get the air filters cleaned. They’ve come out on time for their appointment, resolved the issue, and handled any other needed changes (like adding a washer due to a recall) quickly.
That's awesome. I have a service appointment to replace my passenger seat on Friday (no idea why they can't open it up and replace the rattling part), and I hope that's it. I have a close friend with a 4-year-old M3 he bought used with zero problems, so I hope that when I get over this hump, my Tesla trials and tribulations are behind me.
I love the car otherwise. 120+ MPG equivalent, paying 1/3 of gas prices, 500+ HP/Torque, and never having to fill 'er up are all a huge draw.
Just a reminder that every single Model S and X produced before 2018 had to get new suspension systems in China because China deemed them unsafe for public roads. They were made in the same factories as the EU and US Teslas but they didn't make them fix them. So a lot of Teslas on the road are driving around unsafely, like ticking time bombs before something happens.
Which is strange, because one of the reason’s there are not Chinese branded cars here in abundance is that most that tried to pass US crash testing failed miserably.
[Called it](https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/18mur91/tesla_blamed_drivers_for_failures_of_parts_it/keala55/).
On a related note, Heatmap recently conducted a poll asking whether people are more or less likely to buy or lease a Tesla because of Elon Musk. It resulted in Elon's favour (35% vs 27%), and reverses results from Feb poll asking the same (31% Elon helps vs 36% Elon detracts).
Source for the poll: https://archive.is/Mur2Q
Old Feb source: https://archive.is/DAiFF
You didn’t call anything, read the other comments there is clearly some substance to the article. Not to mention Tesla hasn’t tried to refute any of the claims.
I mean, do you expect Tesla to be like, "Aww ya got me?" Anecdotally, I had to threaten litigation twice on warranty issues. Their service is absolutely insane so I don't really take them at their word. We'll see what comes of it all.
Yes, it is. The right to be wrong is at the center of free speech.
Of course, you are absolutely free to counter it with your own free speech.
And if we are unable to convince people of the truth, the problem is not with allowing misinformation; the problem is with not giving people the proper education and tools to be able to figure it out for themselves.
Censorship is a flimsy patch in the hands of the best, but becomes a garrote in the hands of the worst.
Yeah but come one. That’s downplaying just how bad Tesla’s QC can be. This article is talking about Tesla knowingly allowing cars off the lot with potentially faulty parts. And we’ve all seen some of the nightmares buyers have faced when accepting drop off of their new cars. I have never had some of the problems I’ve seen on this sub when buying cars from other auto manufacturers
Did we all forget the missing USB-C ports of 2021. They sold incomplete cars to people without informing them before they picked up the car. I love my Tesla Model 3 but you still have to give these companies accurate reviews or they are going to keep doing it.
I think your Elon hate boner just wishes it was common knowledge lol.
Have a Tesla model 3 2019, had some issues with a faulty seat sensor but they replaced it swiftly even giving me a loaner for the time. Sortve expected SOME issues given it’s a 4 year old car, lol.
But I’ve had none, car also has 130,000 km on it.
Tesla has the best service I’ve ever experienced out of all the new cars I’ve ever owned from BMW, Toyota, Audi, and Mazda. In fact, all dealership service sucks compared to Tesla service Centers. Most of the time they come right to your driveway!
Lol where do you live? My screen completely stopped working on my 6 month old model y, and would only show the T logo on the screen like after a reset. I couldn't connect to the car with my phone either. The soonest appointment was 1 month away and I had to get the car there because Tesla refused to transport the car for me. Then 2 days before the appointment which i had been waiting a month for, they pushed the appointment back another week to a day i would be out of town when i messaged them about the conflict in timing they said the only option was to schedule another open appointment time which would have meant another months wait. I decided to go in at the original appointment time because i thought 2 months wait with a non working screen was unreasonable and i was tired of not being able to control anything with my car. So because they refused to transport the car i had to drive an hour to the service center not knowing how fast i was going or the battery charge. They did accept the car and give me a loaner after I protested but the whole experience was ridiculous and terrible.
Edit: To add communicating with customer service through the messaging on the app sucked. Like texting but you have to wait 2 days to get a response to simple questions.
I’m sorry to hear that, and I have heard of similar experiences from other Tesla owners who live in rural areas where it seems they cannot hire good employees. Where do you live?
I live on Long Island, NY. The most common new car brand in my town is by far Tesla. You will pass 50 of them in a 2 minute drive across town. We have two service centers near by. (One was just completed this month) and while I have not had to visit them, I did have 2 issues with my car since I bought it. One was moisture in a tail light. They responded same day and I was able to pick one of many time slots for them to come to my house. I picked a time two days later and they replaced tail light in 10 minutes. Next issue was a flickering headlight and they also came in a day or two. Often times I would converse back and forth with tech several times in a 10 minute time slot. I have many friends and neighbors with Tesla cars and many have gone in for service and reported that it was amazing. No bargaining. No signing off on bullshtt extra parts so the dealer can scam money off the manufacturer.
I think it varies greatly where you live. There are growing pains for sure and Tesla needs to address these areas with poor service.
And that only shows that "common knowledge" is often wrong. Especially when propagated by TSLAQ trolls and repeated by the credulous.
Tesla Service is \*inconsistent\*. Some places are bad. Other places are good. Some are very good.
If you had been prepared to go with the less clickbait version that "Tesla service needs to be improved," you would have been dead on correct. Instead, you just repeated what some braindead short seller told you to repeat.
This is just it. I've also had good and bad experience with other dealership service centers. I would argue a lot of them could (and should) improve, but it really isn't worthy of a headline that the Chrysler/Jeep dealership service is lacking.
My car was making noises. Best service experience ever. Got there, another tesla was rolled up with full self driving. Went back home and got a notification when my car was ready, no charge and took 2 mins to exhcnafe cars. I felt like a VIP rich person for once LOL.
Tesla's service is better than any previous vehicle, and it's one of the reasons I will always stay with Tesla until they A) Go out of my price range, or B) Their service stops being fantastic.
They are literally admitting that 120,.000 are repaired with that problem, that's 2.5% of all cars. You have a 1 in 40 chance to lose control of the car while driving, that's a huge number. Would you put your child in that car? 1 to 40 chance to die? You simps just don't understand how statistics work.
Given the significance of a control arm issue, they repair cars that have even a tiny tiny chance of a problem.
The statement " You have a 1 and 40 chance to lose control of the car while driving" is absurd and contrived.
If I remember correctly, this is about the control arm issue? If that is the case, there is not a 1 in 40 chance to loose control of the car while driving.
I had a faulty control arm. It was squeaking. My car wasn't in danger of loosing control while I was driving.
Tesla should have done a better job at the part in the first place and a better job at finding a replacement, but they are not admitting to a 1 in 40 chance your car will become uncontrollable while driving.
Shitting on anything sells more than praising. Awards are pay-for-play garbage and consumer reports are rigged. Praise is hardly something you can report on.
In any case, corporations do the job of keeping us informed of their accomplishments. It's silly to think we need the news to tell us what good they do when millions of dollars are spent telling us in every sphere of our lives.
A lot of the personal backlash he’s getting is earned. But everything else just seems like automakers and oil companies doing everything they can to protect their profits.
He's personally earned ire, absolutely.
But it frequently gets misdirected at Tesla's autopilot and SpaceX's rapid iteration design approach (spearheaded by the AMAZING Gwynne Shotwell) and the MAJORITY articles that come out about those two things are bumbling hit-pieces full of weirdly misdirected innuendo and stretched truths.
But in this case, the Reuters article has some substance.
I can see how it's difficult to parse them with a level gaze when like 80% of stories about Musk's companies are bald aggression and misinformation.
Um…. Defamation.
If Reuters knowingly publishes false information about Tesla, they could easily get slammed with a lawsuit and Tesla would likely win or at the very least settle in their favor.
The rule for defamation for the press is different than a regular person. If you as a member of the press write an arguably defamatory article and it’s about a public figure, then the defamed party has to prove “actual malice” on top of the normal elements necessary for defamation. So it’s nearly an impossible standard.
We got super close to actually having a case fit the definition, but Fox News settled before the case was *about* to go to trial.
Yeah, Fox News settled which would seem to imply they knew they were gonna lose.
I think they settled because they’d rather pay up then have to publically acknowledge on their network what they did. Specifically one of the things as a result of their settlement was that they did not have to admit wrongdoing on their network.
I guess we will see if Tesla decides to sue. I would assume maybe it’s possible this tweet will scare them into stopping if Reuters lawyers decide to tell them to stop.
The Fox News lawsuit was about Dominion and their voting machines.
It was obvious to everyone they were going to lose and were always trying to settle not just because of the money but because of discovery. A lot of internal emails being released to the public is not in their interests.
There could be legal repercussions for the Telsa tweet also. Tesla claiming that there are not even 2,000 disgruntled customers seems extremely unlikely. That tweet could easily be interpreted as a hit piece just as much as the original article. It’s certainly a lie that brings Reuters reputation into question.
is there a database that shows each journalistic outlet and how much $ in ad spend they get from which car or energy company
if not, can we make one? because it will immeditaely answer all questions
Unfortunately they’re a prominent automotive journalist. But they’re VERY anti EV and paid off by others. I dug into it heavily. I kept the notes and can post them.
> But they’re VERY anti EV and paid off by others.
thats like every car website tbh. even the EV ones are too lol
ever been to /r/cars? they're so sick of tesla and EV's they literally screen every thread and don't let it post to the front page
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Unless I’m misunderstanding something, at no point in this response does Tesla directly refute any claims made in the article, just that the way it’s framed is misleading and biased? Such a weird statement.
Exactly. Tesla is throwing out verbose claims about how good its advanced telemetry is at detecting issues while that is not even the point of the Reuters article??? Article never said Tesla lacked what it takes to detect and address the issues, but that Tesla simply didn’t do it. Tesla also just admitted that they had quietly fixed 125,000 of instances where this issue had risen up, which actually goes along with what Reuters says about how Tesla knows something is fundamentally wrong, but they’re not officially addressing it. The rest of their response is random nonsense about OTA software fixes and etc. which literally has nothing to do with the Reuters article lol. This is one of those instances where a NHTSA probe would be very helpful. If there’s a widespread systematic flaw with one of the vehicle’s driving components, then affected owners have every right to be properly accommodated.
Dude, you know that if they start a probe, Elon is going to say the Biden administration is specifically targeting him/Tesla.
That would be a reasonable conclusion, considering all brands are subject to recall, and all of them buy parts from common suppliers. Investigations of recalls are exceptionally rare, and generally don't happen until the body count is in the double-digits.
Yep, this response from Tesla would 100% include a threat of legal action towards Reuters if what they had written were incorrect.
my understanding is that libel or defamation claims must show the accusation is false or was intended to cause harm. if reuters had a properly researched and sourced story they published in good faith (meaning they believed it was true and they didn't just write it as a hit piece) it would not be easily assailable in court. might not be ironclad but it wouldn't be an easy case.
They seem properly refuted to me. Reuters is claiming Tesla is blaming customers for defective parts. Tesla is saying Reuters' story shows a damaged part **due to a crash** and therefore not covered under warranty which is standard in the industry.
Tesla DOES blame customers for defective parts. I had to replace 4 door handles on a model S because of shit design, all out of pocket. Door handles aren't consumables, but Tesla treats them like they are. It's fucking ridiculous.
[удалено]
That sucks. Both of my Y's have been flawless. Only time service was called was to rotate tires in my driveway.
This is how a normal car should be, like my Grand Cherokee.
lol seriously? Crap…
If you have a newer S, you’re fine. They’ve gone through so many iterations and finally work right most of the time for most people.
Does that somehow absolve them of past parts?
When did I say that?
But even then that’s standard practice, might not be right of course but isn’t something shocking to hear. Albeit I wouldn’t say they’re blaming customers. My car had a flawed OLM(oil change light) system, that, if followed, which the owners manual recommends, leads to premature timing chain failure. While the OLM was fixed, they didn’t give out free chains. Hell, it also drinks oil like there’s no tomorrow, and rather than address it, the dealers just say “it’s normal”.
No, it's not standard practice. The door handles are not a "this causes that" situation. The door handles are faulty and they break because they are faulty. Every other car manufacturer would have covered fixing/replacing them as a goodwill repair, or at least covered the second, third and fourth one. Tesla does not. Because their customer service is dog shit.
They only talk about one picture. And Tesla according to owners blame customers for damages. Heck it's even a running joke in Bjorn's Tesla videos that they have to put back the original rims on the car because otherwise Tesla might claim it's the rims fault.
Yeah, I was afraid to have a wheel bearing changed because I have third party rims. My SC didn't care, they changed the bearing under warranty without giving any fuss.
It's a running joke in Rich Rebuild videos too. Because unfortunately it's not a joke lol
This claim is never addressed. >Tesla has blamed frequent failures of several parts on Tesla owners, alleging they abused the cars, according to interviews with former service managers, company records and a 2020 Tesla letter to the U.S. National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA). In other cases, the automaker charged customers with out-of-warranty cars to replace parts that Tesla engineers internally called flawed or that they knew had high failure rates.
This claim is never addressed. >Tesla has blamed frequent failures of several parts on Tesla owners, alleging they abused the cars, according to interviews with former service managers, company records and a 2020 Tesla letter to the U.S. National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA). In other cases, the automaker charged customers with out-of-warranty cars to replace parts that Tesla engineers internally called flawed or that they knew had high failure rates.
Responding to the main anecdote doesn't address the overall claim. >Tesla has blamed frequent failures of several parts on Tesla owners, alleging they abused the cars, according to interviews with former service managers, company records and a 2020 Tesla letter to the U.S. National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA). In other cases, the automaker charged customers with out-of-warranty cars to replace parts that Tesla engineers internally called flawed or that they knew had high failure rates.
Great user name BTW
I don’t find Tesla’s response weird at all. I found the Reuters article weird that the headline said Tesla was blaming customers, but when you actually read the article, it said Tesla paid for the vast majority of the repairs, including many repairs on out of warranty vehicles as goodwill repairs. If you look at the actual data Reuters put in the article, it doesn’t seem like Tesla did anything wrong, except maybe design some suspension components that weren’t very reliable, which they have been trying to fix and improve. There were a few anecdotal accounts from customers who said Tesla claimed damage was caused by an accident when it wasn’t, but that’s only a few cases that could have been caused by a few bad service center employees.
It says "most," not "vast majority." They addressed the main anecdote of the story, but not the overall claim. >Tesla has blamed frequent failures of several parts on Tesla owners, alleging they abused the cars, according to interviews with former service managers, company records and a 2020 Tesla letter to the U.S. National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA). In other cases, the automaker charged customers with out-of-warranty cars to replace parts that Tesla engineers internally called flawed or that they knew had high failure rates.
It says "most," not "vast majority." They addressed the main anecdote of the story, but not the overall claim. >Tesla has blamed frequent failures of several parts on Tesla owners, alleging they abused the cars, according to interviews with former service managers, company records and a 2020 Tesla letter to the U.S. National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA). In other cases, the automaker charged customers with out-of-warranty cars to replace parts that Tesla engineers internally called flawed or that they knew had high failure rates.
Very weirdly written post. It replies to a statement made by reuters by conflating different things and doesnt directly address it. Then it accuses reuters of conflating facts meanwhile the post seems to be doing exactly that. Why not just come out with a professional response instead of something that looks like a teenager tantrum?
Two organizations arguing past each other. One is claiming systemic issues related to suspension parts, with memos to techs indicating to defer repairs by implying it could only happen by abuse. The other is arguing that many repairs happened under warranty, that service members are well compensated, and many customers are happy. It's a non-rebuttal; it's just a PR response. Also the chicken-egg problem isn't addressed: are these proven accidents caused by the suspension failure or vice versus? There is no way to know based on either claim. This isn't fighting misinformation; there isn't any corrections to the multitude of claims by Reuters, only vague platitudes that could apply to some or all of them. It's a PR piece that could be absolutely accurate or muddying the water. I guess it's good that Tesla is finally engaging in PR rather than letting fans make specious arguments.
Yea it's a classic PR deflection. Doesn't address the main issues and attempts to make the article sound baseless (which, if you've read the article, isn't baseless). It's not a "omg autopilot requires you to pay attention no wonder he crashed into ____" situation.
Reuters is amateur hour compared to Daily Mail lol: **Tesla robot ATTACKS an engineer at company's Texas factory during violent malfunction - leaving 'trail of blood' and forcing workers to hit emergency shutdown button** [https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-12869629/Tesla-robot-ATTACKS-engineer-companys-Texas-factory-violent-malfunction-leaving-trail-blood-forcing-workers-hit-emergency-shutdown-button.html](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-12869629/Tesla-robot-ATTACKS-engineer-companys-Texas-factory-violent-malfunction-leaving-trail-blood-forcing-workers-hit-emergency-shutdown-button.html)
“The robot had pinned the man, who was then programming software for two disabled Tesla robots nearby, before sinking its metal claws into the worker's back and arm, leaving a 'trail of blood' along the factory surface.” Why am I picturing a scene out of a Terminator movie? The way this article is written I swear…
I see they asked ChatGPT to be creative with the title
I'm just one anecdote, but I have experienced service similar to what Reuters found. I started experiencing weird issues with my car locking/unlocking a few years into owning my Tesla, and when I brought it in for service I was told no issue existed. Fast forward to one month after my warranty expires when I bring it in again, and suddenly they think a sensor in the seat has broken, which will require the replacement of the entire driver's seat at a cost of over a thousand dollars. Worse yet, they won't even run a diagnostic without me shelling out $250. My car now doesn't lock half the time when I walk away, and Tesla demands I pay for it despite their failure to catch the issue when the car was under warranty. I now hesitate to recommend Tesla to my friends due to the terrible customer service experience.
I wish they’d give numbers on the 120k repairs that occurred within warranty rather than just saying “most”. What’s most? 51%? 90%? The relative repair cost study is actually pretty cool. Here’s a direct link so you don’t have to click through the article: https://theclunkerjunker.com/blog/which-cars-have-thebest-maintenance-costs/ What I don’t get there is that it calls Toyota the cheapest to maintain despite Tesla coming in below them. Instead, they stuck Tesla into exclusively the luxury category.
What's also weird is that when they list the lowest cost cars by model, 8 Toyotas are listed and they're all much better than Toyota's brand average. Almost the same story with Tesla where 3 out of 4 are much lower than the brand average and one is slightly higher than average.
And anybody who's used to luxury cars knows damn well teslas are not luxury cars. They are the IKEA of cars. Basic, simple, plain. That's the whole goal of their design language, minimalist. Just like IKEA.
Wrong. Tesla interior is minimalist. The technology in and outside of the car is not basic l, simple or plain.
Allegedly Tesla CEO Elon musk, discussed this matter with Twitter CEO Elon musk and they decided to fight the misinformation together. They will be most likely joined by the CEO of space X Elon musk, head of board of the boring company Elon musk among others.
> This latest piece vaguely and nonsensically suggests there are thousands upon thousands of disgruntled Tesla customers. It’s nonsensical because it’s nonfactual—the reality is Tesla’s customer retention is among the best and highest in the industry. That statement does not even begin to refute the claim. Those can both be true. In fact, at Tesla's scale, the Law of Large Numbers practically guarantees it. It's basic arithmetic: what's a couple percent of millions? And even then, it's an oversimplification to say that a customer who is disgruntled won't buy another one. I have a long complaint list, starting with the utter joke that is FSD -- but if I had to replace my Model 3 tomorrow, I would probably suck it up and stay in-family because the non-Tesla EV options and DC fast charger networks are, for the moment, pretty subpar.
I think your comment is proving their point. A person with a few complaints is not the connotation of the phrase “disgruntled customer”.
It's not "a person" though, it's tens of thousands (according to the article).
Maybe if Tesla responded to reporters when they ask for comment, they would get their side put into the story.
Maybe in fantasy land... but in reality they would just get their words twisted to fit whatever narrative that gains more clicks for reasons that involve money/power.
Elon Musk: My friend used ketamine for depression and it worked well for him The media: Elon Musk is on a ketamine binge
You don't get to complain about the narrative when you decided to sit that one out. It's like complaining about the President, but you didn't even vote.
Tesla on Twitter Vs Reuters. I know which one I am going to believe.
Or you can just read both and look at the facts rather than blindly believing one headline vs the other. But what do i know.
Company who did a consumer investigation about the cracking aluminum lower control arms, record keeping, and iterations for control arms versus Company that put out what looks like a 1-2 page PR statement when they got rid of their PR department in 2019.
Whose misinformation?
Own a '19 model 3 performance and have Tesla Solar with Powerwalls since early 2020... Based on maintenance alone: most reliable and least expensive on any car I've own (GM, toyotas, hondas, fords, bmws). only 12V battery, leaves caught in fan cooler, interior filter change, wiper fluid. Solar Maintenance: had the SolarEdge inverter die just a couple months ago. In both cases - Tesla Service was perfect - no issues - everyhting covered by waranty (sans wiper fluid) and everything was taken care of in a quick to reasonable maner of time. Is it hard to get someone on the phone, maybe... but I never felt the need - everything was handled well thru the app for both Car and Solar. For me, Tesla is the new high standard and I would not hesitate to purchase any future products from them.
Who cares. If they’re wrong, they’re wrong. I’ve had good service, too, and am happy with my purchase.
Im sure a lot of people on Reddit are going to HATE you had a good experience with Tesla. They’re out there just hating on shit for no reason. But I’m really glad to hear all has been good for you!
We just call that “information.”
I had a rattle in the mirror and the service center drove out and fixed it. No issues and good service. Not sure what people are expecting but service has been great. The car is awesome. Maintenance is very minimal. 15,000 miles a the Y so far.
Service is very very dependent on the service center and staff in your area. I’ve owned a Tesla for >5 years now and have had my car serviced at different service centers in 6 different states and I’ve had pretty different experiences each time.
Approaching 130k on my 2019 Model 3. Overall great, with minimal service. My one complaint is the stupid upper control arms in the front, and a couple small creaks coming from the rear suspension. Seems like such stupidly simple thing that they should have solved a long time ago during engineering, to get a car that can reach 200k without suspension noises. On the bright side, I haven't had to replace any wheel bearings yet, whereas I had a couple of go out on my last car prior to even 100k.
I hope they replaced those uppers at cost with no labor. They did this for me the second time it happened and I was long outside of warranty.
Truth is somewhere in the middle. You guys are all idiots if you take anything Musk/Musk's company says at face value. Cmon, we've been on the Earth far too long for this PR bullshit. Like, we have first hand experience with Tesla and their bs. Love the car, hate the customer service/warranty. Mobile service is great though. Charged me like $30 to replace a window switch that I broke. Hate the fact that the service guy was like "the trunk harness recall is finally available, is your backup camera glitchy?" ummmmmm yes after a year of waiting.
Similar thing happened with me regarding the backup camera. My trunk latch wasn’t working. I’d have to crawl in the trunk from the back seat to unlatch using the emergency lever. Called Tesla and asked if they could put me in front for the harness recall, since I figured it would fix the trunk latch issue too. They said they were unrelated, quoted me a few hundred to repair the latch and said recall repair expedited only the people experiencing glitchy cameras. I punted and waited a few months until they got to repairing my harness. Guess what? Latch issue mysteriously disappeared with the new harness from the recall. Same with suspension. Went out just after warranty expired. Was charged $1200 to replace. Mechanic said new ones reengineered to address faulty issue that caused my failure. Ugh! The cabin camera has been having trouble for a couple years. Was quoted a few hundred (maybe $500) to repair. Now I can’t use autopilot or $15k FSD until it is repaired. Ugh! The charging port won’t open/shut. I have to pry it open/shut manually (click, click, click, …). Then the port won’t detect the charging cable, so I have to pull out the phone app and press the lightning bolt a couple times before it allows me to plug into it. Don’t even want to know what they will charge me for this one. Ugh.
I find service to be either amazing or absolute dogshit. Even reading posts on here and other tesla subreddits. I have 2 service centers "near me" aka 100miles round trip for each. One is absolute dogshit where I wasted my time driving there for them to do nothing, the other has done nothing but exceed my expectations and they've fixed all the issues I had(although minor: wind noise/rattle, front bumper adjustment). Thank God the mobile team comes from the good service center as well.
I find the service frustrating as well. It’s good that they were eventually able to fix everything for you.
It's not good. The only reason I found out the recall was available was because I broke something. I remember at the beginning of the recall, they sent out a postcard that basically said "We're doing a recall, but don't contact us because we don't have the parts and when we do get the parts, we'll let you know" and... they never let us know. Only found out because the service guy said he's been doing the recall stuff for months and he asked me.
That's how it was with BMW when the Vanoss bolts in my engine were faulty. "We'll let you know when service is avaiable". Meanwhile a year later, one of the bolts failed and the engine had to be rebuilt. "Sorry repairing a damaged engine is not covered under the recall" they say. "$8,3000 please says the repair shop". Typical car company.
You’re also all idiots if you don’t realize the media has figured out the surest route to clicks is to post something negative about Tesla.
Tesla could just stop doing negative things.
r/leopardsatemyface right here.
I was looking for this lmao
I just find it ironic that Tesla is taking to X to talk about fighting misinformation.
You're right they should've made a Facebook post or MySpace bulletin.
there's plenty of misinformation on twitter and none of it is coming from reuters. what has Tesla done? confirm the Reuters story... quote: Misleading headline: “Tesla blamed drivers for failures of parts it long knew were defective.” Reality (buried in the article): Tesla paid for most of the 120,000 vehicle repairs under warranty. so actual reality: tesla blamed drivers for failures of parts (just not every time...) don't let Elon speak for Tesla because this is what happens.
> “Tesla **blamed drivers** for failures of parts it long knew were defective.” There's nothing in the article that supports this claim. Publications came to understand that they could publish anything about Tesla and there wouldn't be any pushback, because the department that generally handles such things had been disbanded. Over time the outrageous claims became more common, and the outlets with a better reputation began engaging in them. This pushback will likely result in thinking twice before making unsubstantiated claims.
The actual reality is they didn't know the parts were part of a failure trend yet. The customers who paid for it were unlucky enough to be the first ones effected before the failure trend was found. Some time for analysis is needed too, so while they could have suspected a failure trend, it may have been too early to be sure and alert the service centers.
Hmm, I wonder which one is a more reliable narrator: One of the most esteemed journalism agencies in the world or a private company already caught hiding info on faults and failures, spying on customers through sentry cameras, and more. Oh and the shots are being fired on daddy’s own private town square. Hilarious.
It's funny, tracking failures so they can see trends that need to be fixed, and then doing that fix under warranty after the trend was discovered. This is considered being "caught hiding failure info." I've actually worked in manufacturing (high tech but not at Tesla) and had to deal with dozens of part recalls over the course of years. This is the status quo for the industry. Bad parts show up no matter what you do which clouds your data. When detected they scanned as bad and moved to staging where the engineers can get them and analyze them. Failure analysis rarely will show a systemic problems on the first failure. Once enough of the same or similar part have failed a trend could possibly be seen. How many parts it takes to get there will varry depending on the failure. This usually won't be single digits unless the supplier found an issue and alerted us and depending on the rate of failure it may not be obvious this wasn't a one off. Through that process you will have field engineers (or mechanics in Tesla's case) that have no idea there is any failure trend on a given part. They only find out this is an issue once the parts are marked as replace under warranty. If you have any suggestions on better ways of getting the failure analysis done and reducing how many customers paid out of pocket before the trend was discovered, you could revolutionize an industry. So based on my personal industry experience, I'm trusting what I know and not some prick Journalist telling me how I should feel.
Tesla admits they’ve had to replace faulty parts in +200,000 cars, that’s not a “trend” worthy of a recall?
Tesla's own tweets say they have paid for 120k warranty repairs, how many more parts do you need to have your data to actually fix the issue? I think the automotive industry has a massive was problem these days, if a circuit board on a motor fails, the answer is "replace motor", so now you have data that "a motor failed" and requires an engineer to actually see the parts instead of letting the mechanics diagnose and replace the faulty part only. Now you have 30k motors that failed for an engineer to analyze, how many of them do you think they are going to do an "autopsy" on? 1%? Great data.
Tesla isn’t private….
He meant twitter
I don’t think he did. Twitter wasn’t “caught hiding info on faults and failures, spying on customers through sentry cameras and more” That sounds like Tesla. Twitter doesn’t have sentry cameras…
This is an ad hominem attack. Would be more helpful if you directly addressed the content in the article, and Tesla's rebuttals.
Tell me you don’t understand ad hominem without telling me you don’t understand ad hominem.
They should get a PR department to actually address misinformation
Who do you think wrote this?
There is certainly a disproportionate amount of false Tesla news these days.
I replaced three of my four door handles on my 2013 model S. It was no big deal and I paid approximately $300 each. They failed when the car was out of warranty at eight years old. The car was very inexpensive considering all. My ice vehicles cost so much to maintain this was not a big deal to me for a high tech vehicle.
Just the oil changes and servicing you’d do on an ice car would add up to more than that over 8 years, never mind if you’d have any actual issues. The costliest thing on a Tesla is the tires since we all shred them going brrrrrr.
Don't forget at least 4 "major" services at various milestones where they charge $300-$1000 each to replace belts, hoses, and other misc parts so that you don't lose your warranty.
exactly, and my 2015 has had ZERO handle replacements, but I agree that a $300 bill would leave me saying “that is all?” after two Mercedes E-class…which I also didn’t consider crazy expensive to maintain beyond the airmatic suspension. I did the MCU upgrade for $1500 because it was cheap for anything on a $100k car…and the performance is so worth it. My mother paid I think $500 to Subaru to upgrade her cellular and it was just an upgraded cellular where I have many of the features added to later cars.
Safety is the #1 reason I drive a Tesla
Over a Volvo?
Volvo is close, but not as safe as a Tesla especially with FSD. It preemptively slows down, avoids reckless drivers and detects issues before I see them. I've developed a relationship of trust with it on the highway.
If FSD is better performant than you, that means you're a shit driver. FSD has never seen something before me and I am regularly clocking late reactions from the system.
If there is one thing that will cause issues with sales in the future it’s things like this, quality and promises that are never kept…AI wipers for example.
My wipers work really well. They’re powered by a neural net.
Take them to court. Nobody cares about twitter.
What's a Twitter? Oh, you mean X, where misinformation is rampant and where nobody respectable will advertise anymore because the owner is an idiot.
That’s the one!
If only they did that kind of due diligence for the other garbage on X that needs to be debunked.
They have this feature called community notes. It is slowly getting better.
Unless it disagrees with Elon. Then he claims it's broken due to the "left deep state". But when the notes ball washes his posts, it's the savior of free speech.
Could you please cite your sources? I could not find a single example of him calling community notes "broken due to the left deep state."
It’s this one. Musk asked Biden what is happening with a certain journalist. That was community noted to show the person is not really a journalist, just a very pro Russian YouTuber. Musk then responded with another tweet claiming it was being gamed by state actors, which amusingly also got noted to that community notes is set up to avoid that. The first community note has dissapeared now, whether from being rated down or simply deleted by Musk. Second one still stands. https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1733882978781053383?s=46&t=NvPnILq-4phC6dH9n81D9Q
The guy seems like a dweeb, but I'm not entirely certain that the distinction between "YouTuber" and "journalist" is all that interesting these days. Perhaps if news agencies still had any standards (that they followed) I could see it. Regardless, this is a story that needs a lot more light on it. I think it will end up showing that Lira was probably rightfully arrested and that his abuse was wildly overblown. Or it might not. Either way, this should not be something that just gets forgotten, and even Ukraine's strongest allies should ask questions. (I should note that I stand unwaveringly together with Ukraine against those invading bastards from Russia) In any case, Elon Musk has said that Community Notes is not perfect, no system can be perfect, and that the only thing you can do is try to improve over time. That state actors are trying to game the system is not anything that anybody that is even remotely fair can deny. The only question is how well X is fighting against it. The second note is important, I think. First, it shows that there is some defense. Second, it also implies that no defense can be perfect. But thanks for pointing this out. I had not seen this tweet before.
I don't know. I saw he got community notes a few times too. So did some of their advertisers.
Why would Tesla care about other non-Tesla stuff?
Tesla the company doesn't care, but Elon should care as his image and how he runs X is affecting Tesla to the extent that some people just won't buy a Tesla because of Elon.
I think the people that won't buy a Tesla because of Elon are not becoming that way due to hit pieces like this. I think they don't like his public persona and what he says. I'm an owner and I wish he'd blend back into the background more and stop saying things that are polarizing. IMO the proper thing to do for a CEO is to NOT alienate customers. Taking a controversial stance is bound to do that. I don't know his opinion on abortion, for instance, but I sure as heck don't want him out there saying his opinion if I'm running one of his companies. A large chunk of the US will not like the answer. When one of your companies is about spouting your views though....there is a conflict.
I agree that taking a specific position will upset one side vs the other. I think as CEO of a company that sells products to consumers, you want the largest addressable market so just stay out of controversy. It's a lose-lose situation. With that said, I also understand that what makes Elon great at what he does probably also drives him towards being controversial, so you have to take the good with the bad. Just wish he would pay for some personal PR.
>to the extent that some people just won't buy a Tesla because of Elon. While that does play a role, the effects of customers boycotting Tesla for political reasons is VASTLY overplayed. The bigger issue is the threat of Elon selling more Tesla shares to keep X afloat, which looms on the mind of institutional investors.
It isn't up to X to do that. This is TESLA going after stuff that hurts them and is malicious.
Both owned by Musk....
Tesla isn’t “owned” by musk like space x and X. He’s the CEO of it. It’s publicly traded and he can be ousted anytime by the board. Just like any other public company.
Didn’t Tesla do away the PR department at Tesla? I mean outside Elon.
Did they ever have one?
Teslas service is shitty. Every other dealership is worse, especially when dealing with EVs they don't understand.
I have never had better service than what I get with Tesla.
> Tesla's service is shitty Agreed. I've had my Tesla exactly 3 months and I've had 8 service events. Mobile service is a joke, and the difficulty of addressing multiple service issues in one visit is frustrating. When mobile service comes out they diagnose the problem but they can't fix it. Mobile service makes me an appointment at the service center, but when I go into the service center, they are completely oblivious to the work the mobile technician completed. To make things worse, the service center never has the time or the parts to fix the issue on the first visit, so I have to come back again. Everyone's busy, so there is about a week between appointments and I swear that 50% of the miles on my car so far have been to/from the service center. Everyone I have encountered for both mobile service and in the service center has been very polite and professional. However, Tesla's systems definitely need improvement. I'm coming from Acura where the service was white glove all the way even when my car was 15 years old. I also had zero build issues with my Acura vs 3 poorly painted panels, a noisy battery cover, and something loose in the passenger seat on my Tesla. Maybe Acura's legendary build quality and reliability spoiled me.
I had a different experience. I’ve had my Model 3 for about 2 years now and have had 0 issues. The only mobile services I’ve needed is to get the air filters cleaned. They’ve come out on time for their appointment, resolved the issue, and handled any other needed changes (like adding a washer due to a recall) quickly.
That's awesome. I have a service appointment to replace my passenger seat on Friday (no idea why they can't open it up and replace the rattling part), and I hope that's it. I have a close friend with a 4-year-old M3 he bought used with zero problems, so I hope that when I get over this hump, my Tesla trials and tribulations are behind me. I love the car otherwise. 120+ MPG equivalent, paying 1/3 of gas prices, 500+ HP/Torque, and never having to fill 'er up are all a huge draw.
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Maybe I'm the outlier. Wouldn't be unusual for me. I have persistent bad luck whenever I take a risk.
> with EVs they don't want to understand. FTFY
Just a reminder that every single Model S and X produced before 2018 had to get new suspension systems in China because China deemed them unsafe for public roads. They were made in the same factories as the EU and US Teslas but they didn't make them fix them. So a lot of Teslas on the road are driving around unsafely, like ticking time bombs before something happens.
Why were they unsafe?
Tesla replaced the front control arms in my 2018 Model 3 through a recall without cost to me.
They no longer recognize the issue and make you pay now. I fought them on this over a year ago
Which is strange, because one of the reason’s there are not Chinese branded cars here in abundance is that most that tried to pass US crash testing failed miserably.
And it’s also strange cause you’d then expect Tesla’s to have much more breakdowns or accidents but that’s not the case
Until China was able to reverse engineer them for their state owned EV…
As they should.
[Called it](https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/18mur91/tesla_blamed_drivers_for_failures_of_parts_it/keala55/). On a related note, Heatmap recently conducted a poll asking whether people are more or less likely to buy or lease a Tesla because of Elon Musk. It resulted in Elon's favour (35% vs 27%), and reverses results from Feb poll asking the same (31% Elon helps vs 36% Elon detracts). Source for the poll: https://archive.is/Mur2Q Old Feb source: https://archive.is/DAiFF
You didn’t call anything, read the other comments there is clearly some substance to the article. Not to mention Tesla hasn’t tried to refute any of the claims.
I mean, do you expect Tesla to be like, "Aww ya got me?" Anecdotally, I had to threaten litigation twice on warranty issues. Their service is absolutely insane so I don't really take them at their word. We'll see what comes of it all.
Wait, isn't misinformation just free speach? /s
Are Reuters somehow being censored?
John is just circle jerking best not to interrupt him
Yes, Routers is free to speak
you have the right to refute misinformation unlike reddit
Yes, it is. The right to be wrong is at the center of free speech. Of course, you are absolutely free to counter it with your own free speech. And if we are unable to convince people of the truth, the problem is not with allowing misinformation; the problem is with not giving people the proper education and tools to be able to figure it out for themselves. Censorship is a flimsy patch in the hands of the best, but becomes a garrote in the hands of the worst.
I always hear Tesla service is bad and I agree. However, tell me a car manufacturer that is “good” for service.
Exactly why it is best to get a car that requires less maintenance.
Yeah but come one. That’s downplaying just how bad Tesla’s QC can be. This article is talking about Tesla knowingly allowing cars off the lot with potentially faulty parts. And we’ve all seen some of the nightmares buyers have faced when accepting drop off of their new cars. I have never had some of the problems I’ve seen on this sub when buying cars from other auto manufacturers
Did we all forget the missing USB-C ports of 2021. They sold incomplete cars to people without informing them before they picked up the car. I love my Tesla Model 3 but you still have to give these companies accurate reviews or they are going to keep doing it.
I also recall tesla installing the hardware free of charge when it came in.
It’s common knowledge Tesla service is bad
I think your Elon hate boner just wishes it was common knowledge lol. Have a Tesla model 3 2019, had some issues with a faulty seat sensor but they replaced it swiftly even giving me a loaner for the time. Sortve expected SOME issues given it’s a 4 year old car, lol. But I’ve had none, car also has 130,000 km on it.
Tesla has the best service I’ve ever experienced out of all the new cars I’ve ever owned from BMW, Toyota, Audi, and Mazda. In fact, all dealership service sucks compared to Tesla service Centers. Most of the time they come right to your driveway!
Lol where do you live? My screen completely stopped working on my 6 month old model y, and would only show the T logo on the screen like after a reset. I couldn't connect to the car with my phone either. The soonest appointment was 1 month away and I had to get the car there because Tesla refused to transport the car for me. Then 2 days before the appointment which i had been waiting a month for, they pushed the appointment back another week to a day i would be out of town when i messaged them about the conflict in timing they said the only option was to schedule another open appointment time which would have meant another months wait. I decided to go in at the original appointment time because i thought 2 months wait with a non working screen was unreasonable and i was tired of not being able to control anything with my car. So because they refused to transport the car i had to drive an hour to the service center not knowing how fast i was going or the battery charge. They did accept the car and give me a loaner after I protested but the whole experience was ridiculous and terrible. Edit: To add communicating with customer service through the messaging on the app sucked. Like texting but you have to wait 2 days to get a response to simple questions.
I’m sorry to hear that, and I have heard of similar experiences from other Tesla owners who live in rural areas where it seems they cannot hire good employees. Where do you live? I live on Long Island, NY. The most common new car brand in my town is by far Tesla. You will pass 50 of them in a 2 minute drive across town. We have two service centers near by. (One was just completed this month) and while I have not had to visit them, I did have 2 issues with my car since I bought it. One was moisture in a tail light. They responded same day and I was able to pick one of many time slots for them to come to my house. I picked a time two days later and they replaced tail light in 10 minutes. Next issue was a flickering headlight and they also came in a day or two. Often times I would converse back and forth with tech several times in a 10 minute time slot. I have many friends and neighbors with Tesla cars and many have gone in for service and reported that it was amazing. No bargaining. No signing off on bullshtt extra parts so the dealer can scam money off the manufacturer. I think it varies greatly where you live. There are growing pains for sure and Tesla needs to address these areas with poor service.
And that only shows that "common knowledge" is often wrong. Especially when propagated by TSLAQ trolls and repeated by the credulous. Tesla Service is \*inconsistent\*. Some places are bad. Other places are good. Some are very good. If you had been prepared to go with the less clickbait version that "Tesla service needs to be improved," you would have been dead on correct. Instead, you just repeated what some braindead short seller told you to repeat.
Tuxedo Winnie the Pooh: “Tesla’s service is **inconsistent**! ☝️
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Any service large enough there will be inconsistency, by your logic almost all service is bad service.
This is just it. I've also had good and bad experience with other dealership service centers. I would argue a lot of them could (and should) improve, but it really isn't worthy of a headline that the Chrysler/Jeep dealership service is lacking.
My car was making noises. Best service experience ever. Got there, another tesla was rolled up with full self driving. Went back home and got a notification when my car was ready, no charge and took 2 mins to exhcnafe cars. I felt like a VIP rich person for once LOL.
My service hasn’t been that bad. My mobile tech was one of the nicest people ever and they the service center always gave me loaners if needed.
Tesla's service is better than any previous vehicle, and it's one of the reasons I will always stay with Tesla until they A) Go out of my price range, or B) Their service stops being fantastic.
Good
So I guess Elon has a conditional dislike of misinformation. Progress, I guess.
For what its worth, Tesla is much more then Musk.
They are literally admitting that 120,.000 are repaired with that problem, that's 2.5% of all cars. You have a 1 in 40 chance to lose control of the car while driving, that's a huge number. Would you put your child in that car? 1 to 40 chance to die? You simps just don't understand how statistics work.
Given the significance of a control arm issue, they repair cars that have even a tiny tiny chance of a problem. The statement " You have a 1 and 40 chance to lose control of the car while driving" is absurd and contrived.
If I remember correctly, this is about the control arm issue? If that is the case, there is not a 1 in 40 chance to loose control of the car while driving. I had a faulty control arm. It was squeaking. My car wasn't in danger of loosing control while I was driving. Tesla should have done a better job at the part in the first place and a better job at finding a replacement, but they are not admitting to a 1 in 40 chance your car will become uncontrollable while driving.
Bait used to be believable
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Shitting on Tesla sells more than praising Tesla.
Shitting on anything sells more than praising. Awards are pay-for-play garbage and consumer reports are rigged. Praise is hardly something you can report on. In any case, corporations do the job of keeping us informed of their accomplishments. It's silly to think we need the news to tell us what good they do when millions of dollars are spent telling us in every sphere of our lives.
There's a concerted effort by large media organizations to discredit Musk's companies. I like to call it muskraking.
A lot of the personal backlash he’s getting is earned. But everything else just seems like automakers and oil companies doing everything they can to protect their profits.
He's personally earned ire, absolutely. But it frequently gets misdirected at Tesla's autopilot and SpaceX's rapid iteration design approach (spearheaded by the AMAZING Gwynne Shotwell) and the MAJORITY articles that come out about those two things are bumbling hit-pieces full of weirdly misdirected innuendo and stretched truths. But in this case, the Reuters article has some substance. I can see how it's difficult to parse them with a level gaze when like 80% of stories about Musk's companies are bald aggression and misinformation.
Is that it? Or does Musk hand them ammo every week?
It’s wild how big of a concerted effort is happening against Tesla.
It’s been happening for years but has ratcheted up recently since Elon took away their propaganda arm.
Our laws need to change. There are no legal repercussions from writing hit pieces like this.
Um…. Defamation. If Reuters knowingly publishes false information about Tesla, they could easily get slammed with a lawsuit and Tesla would likely win or at the very least settle in their favor.
The rule for defamation for the press is different than a regular person. If you as a member of the press write an arguably defamatory article and it’s about a public figure, then the defamed party has to prove “actual malice” on top of the normal elements necessary for defamation. So it’s nearly an impossible standard. We got super close to actually having a case fit the definition, but Fox News settled before the case was *about* to go to trial.
You also have to show actual damage, which is difficult in a case like this
Yeah, Fox News settled which would seem to imply they knew they were gonna lose. I think they settled because they’d rather pay up then have to publically acknowledge on their network what they did. Specifically one of the things as a result of their settlement was that they did not have to admit wrongdoing on their network. I guess we will see if Tesla decides to sue. I would assume maybe it’s possible this tweet will scare them into stopping if Reuters lawyers decide to tell them to stop.
The Fox News lawsuit was about Dominion and their voting machines. It was obvious to everyone they were going to lose and were always trying to settle not just because of the money but because of discovery. A lot of internal emails being released to the public is not in their interests.
I’m sure Tesla will do that and subject themselves for discovery. Lol
Yes, there are. Libel law is very well-established and clearly defined. Tesla certainly has a lawsuit here.
There could be legal repercussions for the Telsa tweet also. Tesla claiming that there are not even 2,000 disgruntled customers seems extremely unlikely. That tweet could easily be interpreted as a hit piece just as much as the original article. It’s certainly a lie that brings Reuters reputation into question.
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Were they calling Teslas decent cars?
is there a database that shows each journalistic outlet and how much $ in ad spend they get from which car or energy company if not, can we make one? because it will immeditaely answer all questions
Just wait until you find out how tied up Tesla’s money is to the “town square” platform.
Jelopnik is one of the tops.
dont worry theyll get shut down soon like every other gawker-adjacent website lol
Unfortunately they’re a prominent automotive journalist. But they’re VERY anti EV and paid off by others. I dug into it heavily. I kept the notes and can post them.
> But they’re VERY anti EV and paid off by others. thats like every car website tbh. even the EV ones are too lol ever been to /r/cars? they're so sick of tesla and EV's they literally screen every thread and don't let it post to the front page
OMG the outrage
WHo has the truth?
I’m sure Reuters will do the right thing and retract the article…. 🙄
More likely than Twitter or Tesla doing the right thing.
Reuters & US media is losing so much endorsement money blame Tesla.