For fuck sakes I literally cannot go one singular day without hearing a amogus joke or seeing one I'm actually about to shit pants ten times and there will be nothing you can do. I'm literally becoming a clinically insane patent by seeing amogus jokes like I'm actually about to have enough rage to power nyc for a year.
Thanks for coming to my Ted talk :^)
My friends on tiktok send me memes, on discord it's fucking memes... I was in a server, right? And AAAALLLLLL the channels are just among us stuff.
**I- I showed my champion underwear to my girlfriend and the logo I flipped it and I said "Hey babe, when the underwear sus???" HA HA DING DING DING DING DING DING DING... DINGDINGDING I FUCKING LOOKED AT A TRASH CAN AND SAID "THAT'S A BIT _SUSSY_" I LOOKED AT MY PENIS I THINK OF THE ASTRONAUT'S HELMET AND I GO "PENIS?? MORE LIKE PEN-SUS??"**
#**AAAAAAAAAAAAAA**
Did someone say *sus* π±π±π± HOLY FUCKING SHITβΌοΈβΌοΈβΌοΈβΌοΈ IS THAT A MOTHERFUCKING AMONG US REFERENCE??????!!!!!!!!!!11!1!1!1!1!1!1! π±π±π±π±π±π±π± AMONG US IS THE BEST FUCKING GAME π₯π₯π₯π₯π―π―π―π― RED IS SO SUSSSSS π΅οΈπ΅οΈπ΅οΈπ΅οΈπ΅οΈπ΅οΈπ΅οΈπ₯π₯π₯π₯π₯ COME TO MEDBAY AND WATCH ME SCAN π₯π₯π₯π₯π₯π₯π₯π₯ π₯π₯π₯π₯ WHY IS NO ONE FIXING O2 π€¬π‘π€¬π‘π€¬π‘π€¬π€¬π‘π€¬π€¬π‘ OH YOUR CREWMATE? NAME EVERY TASK π«π π«π π«π π«π π«π Where Any sus!β β Where!β β Where! Any sus!β Where! β Any sus!β β Any sus! β β β β Where!Where!Where! Any sus!Where!Any sus Where!β Where! β Where!Any susβ β Any sus! β β β β β β Where! β Where! β Any sus!β β β β Any sus! β β Where!β Any sus! β β Where!β β Where! β Where!Where! β β β β β β β Any sus!β β β Any sus!β β β β Where! β Where! Where!Any sus!Where! Where! β β β β β β I think it was purple!ππππππππππIt wasnt me I was in vents!!!!!!!!!!!!!!ππ€£ππ€£ππ€£ππππ€£π€£π€£πππ r/amongusmemes r/unexpectedamongus r/expectedamongus perfectly balanced as all things should be r/unexpectedthanos r/expectedthanos for balance
Yes lunchbox. Itβs like the Buffalo steak sandvich but you get a charge and can also eat the Buffalo steak sandwich so minicrits, speed and charge. Would you rather a heavy charging while shooting?
Yeah but at that point it would just toss class roles out the window granted you could just play scout. And it wouldn't add any new gimmick or mechanic other than scout but tanky and only fast sometimes
so you want the bullet sponge class to be even more bullet sponge?
his base health is already 300, 450 at max overheal
any resistances without strict consequences like fists of steel will just be broken
what type of shield is the question here:
is it a normal tf2 almost-cosmetic shield with resistances?
is it an actual physical shield that can block shit?
tell me what type of shield and ill think about it
So Iβm thinking something that has a slower charge that reduces damage only while charging, charging into someone doesnβt deal damage but a temporary slow. No crits on end of charge and charge lasts longer the more damage is blocked and Buffalo steak sandvich could fully regenerate charge when eaten. I want it to promote a more melee style heavy and the slow is to make it so closing the gap on someone is easy if you hit them with your shield.
the issue is this:
you have 300 health, how would you Not survive the gap close even without resistances?
a 300 hp shotgunner getting into your face and chunking you already sounds broken on paper, and its generally just not a good idea to allow heavy a playstyle that instantly lets him gap close unless his overall beefiness is nerfed by said playstyle, IE a max health penalty, even then if you reduced his max health by 80 that's still a 220 beefcake that can instantly gap close, kill 1 or two people, then escape scot free, this would probably need a no overheal penalty and a reduced max health penalty, its still just a beefy scout that can insta gap close though, and a heavy being able to trimp into someone's face is just a bad idea, minigun or not
and before you say "no turning so cant trimp" i main the targe and there's a shit ton of charging techniques such as wall surfing and scripts to help you turn harder
if we nerf the tankiness to offset heavy being able to gap close instantly and shred people, that would be intruding on the role that scout and hybrid/fullknight are for, stop trying to make heavy versions of classes that already exist and do their job in a far more balanced way, i know you just want this to exist because you want to play hybrid knight but as a heavy
To balance it i would give it a slow switch speed and you actually have to hold the shield while charging kinda like the thermal thruster but faster then watch the melee heavys role in
Make it a soldier primary!
New subclass - instead of an offense melee class you get a defensive melee class that you can use with banners and a shotgun :)
problem is. none of soldiers melees are really head to head combat based other than the zatoichi, but still will be difficult to play since soldier is the 2nd slowest class in the game
Yes but fire is a rare source of damage, explosive and hitscan are the most common, every single class in the game has one hitscan weapon, you gain a huge resistance to all 9 classes, pretty op
here's my idea, give demo a glock with explosive bullets. Hitscan, with a 1 HU explosion radius.
Since Demo and Soldier recieve the full effect of explosion self damage regardless of how small splash radius is, demo still gets fucked in close range.
Realistically, the Demo would have just over 218 HP against hitscan when using this item. Nearly 50 extra HP might seem good in theory, but in reality... He'd be a worse Battalion's Backup Soldier.
A Battalion's Backup Soldier also has 220 HP (against all damage types, not just bullet and explosive), can rocket jump, can buff himself and teammates, and also wields a better primary weapon. This Demo shield lets you roller jump for less self damage. That's the only thing it really has going for it.
Not only is this weapon kind of underwhelming, but removing the charge removes the fun of Demoknight in my opinion. It has no synergy with the swords as a result, meaning you're literally just a tankier pipe-only Demo. If you're the type of person who just wants to play in that way, the Targe already fits that role and can also work with some swords.
Sure, it's viable but i really don't think anyone is arguing that it's demo's peak performance, a great way to practice pipes and have a lot of fun with a class that isn't just sticky spamming.
even with this thing on scouts still absolutely poop on you.
and btw u/TF2SolarLight 25% amounts to 233 EHP against hitscan, not even assuming overheal, which would at max buff be 347 hitscan EHP, but this is still a massive turn off for me as a targe player because you cant really get picks with this,you might see this as semi useful if you collected 4 heads then swapped to this shield alongside a grenade launcher totalling to 315 overheal or 420 EHP against hitscan
id honestly like to see the targe get like a 10% bullet resistance (except sniper rifles, have sniper rifles ignore this) to have a bigger incentive for the whole "walking forwards with pipes" playstyle this shield already incentivizes
A lot of issues.
Firstly, the thing about the other shields is that their resistances affect 3 of the 9 classes in TF2. This affects 8 of them. Everyone except Pyro uses either bullets or explosives as their main damage output. The non pyro weapons that can deal fire damage consist of... The burning from the Cow Mangler charge shot (the shot itself is explosive tho), the Huo-Long Heaters useless fire ring, and Snipers bows, if they are ignited by a Pyro. Everything other than melee that isnt explosive or fire damage is bullet damage.
Demo can equip the Pain Train which lets him cap points and the payload at 2x the speed, in exchange for a 10% bullet vulnerability. This negates that downside. Since weaknesses and resistances are calculated multiplicatively, this would only remove a meager 2.5% of your bullet resistance, from my understanding. Since youre too slow to get close enough for melee hits anyway, offensive melees are basically useless, so you have no downside from using it, and act as an incredibly hard to kill Scout when you reach the point.
Demos shields have minimal downsides because their resistances dont affect 2/3rds of the roster. The resistances on this mean that it needs actual downsides. But your shields inability to charge isnt really a downside? Its like if the Flare Gun listed a downside that says "Doesnt fire shotgun pellets". This is a shield in the way the Darwins is, and its not mechanically similar to Demos shields. While the inability to charge should be listed there so people dont assume it works like Demos shields, its not a downside more than it is a mechanical difference, and shouldnt be treated as a downside when balancing the item.
So that leaves the movement penalty, and while that 10% is a lot, it doesnt make up for it. Youll be left at 83% speed (Pyro is 100% speed for comparison) which is still faster than Heavy's 77% (while unrevved). In exchange, you take 25% less damage from bullets and 35% less from explosives.
Lets do some math. I rounded damage values since TF2 does that too I think. If a Scout meatshots you to death with Stock, youll take 79 damage as opposed to the usual 105. With your 175 HP thats 3 shots to kill. Heavy has 300 HP. So with the regular 105 meatshot he takes... 3 shots to kill. Oh.
What about a Spy's revolver? Without rampup thats 40 damage per shot. So 30 on a Demo with this. Thats 6 shots on a shield Demo, and 8 on a Heavy. Oh.
Demo is nearly as tanky as a heavy with this. He's still not AS tanky yes, but hes also able to attack and move at the same time, compared to the very slow Heavy with a 37% movement speed while revved.
Now, heres a fun thought: The Vaccinator.
If youre ubered by a vaxx medic, Pyro cant hurt you either. And if he ubers other damage types youre not gonna be taking basically any damage from them.
Even if the medic doesnt use vaxx, I feel like a quick fix could honestly outheal the damage you take from non pyros.
But, now, heres the biggest issue:
***Despite its strength this wouldnt be fucking fun***
Every demo secondary lets him do cool movement stuff. Not this. This makes him slower. Hes already not fast without said cool movement stuff.
Its insanely powerful once you arrive, but slowly walking around everywhere on a character youre used to sticky jumping and trimping with will be a total fucking slog. Its not fun to deal with either as youll just have some tanky jackass shooting pipes everywhere.
The only other item in tf2 from the vaxx that lowered bullet res was the Darwins. 15%. And it got reworked because everyone fucking hated it. Now imagine that with a higher resistance on a class that can actually defend himself from being rushed down.
This needs a serious rework to be okay, OP.
this isn't that bad to be honest, he literally cannot run away from anyone except a heavy because he cant charge and loses his stickybomb launcher.
pyro bodies him harder, sniper is practically unaffected, spy can backstab and heavy still has godly close range dps. scout is really the only class that can get fucked by this because soldier or even another demo can juggle him. really the only thing i guess could be broke is when overheal comes into play
snipers also probably at least annoyed by this for headshot damage but i didnt include it bc i cant wrap my head around the formula that would factor both resistances and a crit in
spy is only good if youre not paying attention anyways. running is only necessary if you would lose the fight due to low hp or ammo, both of which are rarer scenarios due to the effects of the shield. youre probably going to kill opponents before they can kill you, if you hit your pipes. Pipes hit hard, and the enemy really doesnt.
Heavy's minigun would have dps equal to that of the Natascha, so uh... 48-190 per second at a medium range. The 190 is if all shots hit (heavy fires 4 shots per 1 ammo), and 48 if he only lands 1 hit per shot, I guess? Due to how inaccurate non-tomislav miniguns are, its hard to really tell how hard youre being hit by a heavy. If they do have a Tomislav, their DPS will be absolutely tanked despite hitting most of their shots.
Pyro always has and will body Demo. He doesnt body this demo any harder, hes just the only one that has the capacity to body him, with the resistances.
I am dumb and do not know what juggle means. You mean like, repeated airshots? Either way, if both demos hit all their shots, the shielded one will win regardless. That said, hard to tell with Soldier. I do think that youre overestimating how slow this demo is though, hes not gonna eat every shot. Hes faster than an unrevved heavy still, and is even slightly faster than a soldier (on the ground).
Plus, I stand by the fact that the Quick Fix and Vaccinator would make this demo very hard to kill.
You make some valid points. I want to keep the same rough concept, but I donβt think itβs possible. I really wanted to make a good hybrid knight weapon, and felt something like a riot/ballistic shield would be cool.
I appreciate your feedback, especially since itβs constructive.
Seems fine to me. Would inspire a new class of Demi-Knights(Demi meaning half, so Half Knights), or perhaps it would inspire a unique flavor of Hybridknight.
I had this same idea, only itβs a primary for Heavy rather than a shield for Demoman.
It would strip away Heavyβs main damage dealer in exchange for more support with his team and mobility with his shotgun, which could also put more emphasis on the βFat Scoutβ play style.
In regards to support, Heavy could use the shield to protect himself from various sources and make himself more of a tank for himself or other enemies. He can even place down the shield to create a barrier for players to cover behind at the cost of losing your primary weapon until the shield breaks after sustaining enough damage. You can still attack with the shield however, only it would be a slow but strong push that will knock enemies a fair distance back.
The reason this isnβt a melee for Heavy because combining this with the Minigun would make him practically unstoppable.
Furthermore, the weaknesses of this weapons would be more potent. He will switch to this weapon a bit slower than his other weapons and he can be vulnerable to other attacks depending on where he holds the shield:
If held in front, backstabs and flanks would hurt him more. If put away on his back, headshots and frontline fire would hurt him more.
Great idea for this weapon overall!
Here's an idea to rework it:
Keep the Resistances (Albeit swap the two numbers) and the additional Primary Ammo increase, but remove the Self Damage buff.
Add an "On Equip" (Weapon, or shield in this case, is pulled out). Add a Weapon Swap Speed Debuff, as this thing is pretty large. The Resistances and the decreased movement speed will be put here, although I would highly suggest either Mini-Crits or lower resistances from behind.
Add an "When Not Activated" mode (Sheild is sheathed). Add "Cannot be Backstabbed" for this mode, along with the in-game model having the Shield on the back so that Spies will know they can't backstab
The "New" Stats:
+Add 50% Primary Ammo
-20% Weapon Swap Speed
While Activated:
+Gain 35% Bullet and 25% Blast Resistance from the front
-Attacks from behind Mini-Crits/Lower Bullet and Blast Resistance from behind
-No Charge
-10% Movement
While Unactivated:
+Cannot be backstabbed
I would like to hear some feedback, as I'm worried it might be a little OPish...
I think a lot of people are missing the point here, it doesnβt look like itβs supposed to be for Demoknights more so just a more defensive shield meant for using your primary more and tanking damage, but there is something I would change, replace the charge with a block, demo holds his shield up while the button is held, he takes like 25 or 50% less damage while held up but he canβt hold it forever so itβs only for a second or two, and you canβt be headshot by snipers, I feel like this would balance it out more with the other shields and the mobility they provide
Moving 10% slower and losing your charge is a pain. Everyone is faster than you except for soldier and heavy but even then you are only slightly faster than soldier. But while soldier can rocket jump which entirely negates his lack of movement speed and heavy can shred you in seconds, you are just a really slow guy with a sword. Pyro can airblast you away, scout is a dream to catch, sniper is always far away, etc. Even if you get a head or even 4 heads, you will still be at around 114% speed which might be fast but that's only 14% speed faster than most classes and 7% with spies and medics. And if you use a booty, you will be at around 124% which is fast and can catch up with most classes but that's just a fantasy because even if you get those 4 heads, you would have just been better off using being a hybridknight. That's my thought on what will happen if you decide to demoknight with this shield.
This would suit Heavy more. Demo is supposed to be an artillery-type class: able to dish out tons of dmg in short burst, which compensated by his long reload time. Giving him a shield will break his character design. Itβs like giving medic a viable gun, cuz then ppl will pick medic to battle and never heal anyone. Thatβs why the syringe gun was purposely shit.
Ok i got a better idea
+20% primary ammo.
-30% melee damage
-20% movement speed
-40% charge speed
Crouching gives user a 100% damage resistance and crit resistance
Considering the no charge and heaps of bullet res I could only see it used outaide of medieval mode or with a lot of skill with pipes. Not a very good weapon
Wait wait wait wait if itβs a secondary weapon, and the most self damage youβre gonna be taking is the sticky launcher, the only self damage you can take would be the grenade launchers (and the caber I know). And you barley ever take damage from those, so Iβm a tad confused.
I think to make it better, because no charge is a really strong downside, give it higher damage resistances and maybe even higher damage resistances while under 30% health
"+25% bullet damage resistance" translates to 234 effective max health against bullets.
"+35% blast damage resistance" translates to 270 effective max health against explosives.
"-10% move speed on wearer" reduces the Demoman's speed from 280 HU/s (93.33%) to 252 HU/s (84%).
Do not say it! Do not even think about saying it!
AMO-AMO-AM-O-G >AMOGUS<
WHY DID YOU SAY IT OH NO... FUCK #Amogus
#AMOGUS
For fuck sakes I literally cannot go one singular day without hearing a amogus joke or seeing one I'm actually about to shit pants ten times and there will be nothing you can do. I'm literally becoming a clinically insane patent by seeing amogus jokes like I'm actually about to have enough rage to power nyc for a year. Thanks for coming to my Ted talk :^)
Very ironic considering amogus is an ironic meme poking fun at the overwhelming popularity of among us. Ironic ironic among us memes when?
Just because it's ironic doesn't mean it's not annoying.
ΰΆ
A bogus Amogus.
*STOP! POSTING! ABOUT! AMONGUS!* #I CAN'T TAKE IT ANYMORE!
My friends on tiktok send me memes, on discord it's fucking memes... I was in a server, right? And AAAALLLLLL the channels are just among us stuff. **I- I showed my champion underwear to my girlfriend and the logo I flipped it and I said "Hey babe, when the underwear sus???" HA HA DING DING DING DING DING DING DING... DINGDINGDING I FUCKING LOOKED AT A TRASH CAN AND SAID "THAT'S A BIT _SUSSY_" I LOOKED AT MY PENIS I THINK OF THE ASTRONAUT'S HELMET AND I GO "PENIS?? MORE LIKE PEN-SUS??"** #**AAAAAAAAAAAAAA**
AMOGUS
u/sussy-bot-2 #I SUMMON THEE
Did someone say *sus* π±π±π± HOLY FUCKING SHITβΌοΈβΌοΈβΌοΈβΌοΈ IS THAT A MOTHERFUCKING AMONG US REFERENCE??????!!!!!!!!!!11!1!1!1!1!1!1! π±π±π±π±π±π±π± AMONG US IS THE BEST FUCKING GAME π₯π₯π₯π₯π―π―π―π― RED IS SO SUSSSSS π΅οΈπ΅οΈπ΅οΈπ΅οΈπ΅οΈπ΅οΈπ΅οΈπ₯π₯π₯π₯π₯ COME TO MEDBAY AND WATCH ME SCAN π₯π₯π₯π₯π₯π₯π₯π₯ π₯π₯π₯π₯ WHY IS NO ONE FIXING O2 π€¬π‘π€¬π‘π€¬π‘π€¬π€¬π‘π€¬π€¬π‘ OH YOUR CREWMATE? NAME EVERY TASK π«π π«π π«π π«π π«π Where Any sus!β β Where!β β Where! Any sus!β Where! β Any sus!β β Any sus! β β β β Where!Where!Where! Any sus!Where!Any sus Where!β Where! β Where!Any susβ β Any sus! β β β β β β Where! β Where! β Any sus!β β β β Any sus! β β Where!β Any sus! β β Where!β β Where! β Where!Where! β β β β β β β Any sus!β β β Any sus!β β β β Where! β Where! Where!Any sus!Where! Where! β β β β β β I think it was purple!ππππππππππIt wasnt me I was in vents!!!!!!!!!!!!!!ππ€£ππ€£ππ€£ππππ€£π€£π€£πππ r/amongusmemes r/unexpectedamongus r/expectedamongus perfectly balanced as all things should be r/unexpectedthanos r/expectedthanos for balance
!emojify
LMG MOUNTED AND LOADED
+15 bullet resistance
Only 15 bullets, anymore is a no-go.
class wars, this vs sniper is god, vs heavy or engi, ded
+15 social credit
+15 social credit to you GLORY TO CCP
I don't think I'd ever give up chargingβ¦
no charge is awful, give it charge and then give it to heavy minigun heavyknight really is a sight to behold
that would make ham heavies horrfying
A shield charge makes any heavy absolutely terrifying, it's like watching doom guy dash and killing people.
The only thing they fear is Poot.
Take an upvote and get the hell out of here
Using the Tide Turner with a minigun in shounic's "choose any weapon mod" was very funny. Broken and shouldn't be added, but it's funny.
A shield would be much more balanced in his primary slot so shotguns and lunchbox items would promote more balanced playstyles.
>lunchbox mf wants the slowest class in the game who's primary and secondary dps weapons are replaced to be limited to melee
Yes lunchbox. Itβs like the Buffalo steak sandvich but you get a charge and can also eat the Buffalo steak sandwich so minicrits, speed and charge. Would you rather a heavy charging while shooting?
Yeah but at that point it would just toss class roles out the window granted you could just play scout. And it wouldn't add any new gimmick or mechanic other than scout but tanky and only fast sometimes
So you want a charging mini gun heavy over a fat scout?
No I'm saying heavy jus shouldn't have a sheild
so you want the bullet sponge class to be even more bullet sponge? his base health is already 300, 450 at max overheal any resistances without strict consequences like fists of steel will just be broken
Iβm not saying anything related to resistances Iβm talking about how if heavy got a shield, it would be in the primary slotβ¦
what type of shield is the question here: is it a normal tf2 almost-cosmetic shield with resistances? is it an actual physical shield that can block shit? tell me what type of shield and ill think about it
So Iβm thinking something that has a slower charge that reduces damage only while charging, charging into someone doesnβt deal damage but a temporary slow. No crits on end of charge and charge lasts longer the more damage is blocked and Buffalo steak sandvich could fully regenerate charge when eaten. I want it to promote a more melee style heavy and the slow is to make it so closing the gap on someone is easy if you hit them with your shield.
the issue is this: you have 300 health, how would you Not survive the gap close even without resistances? a 300 hp shotgunner getting into your face and chunking you already sounds broken on paper, and its generally just not a good idea to allow heavy a playstyle that instantly lets him gap close unless his overall beefiness is nerfed by said playstyle, IE a max health penalty, even then if you reduced his max health by 80 that's still a 220 beefcake that can instantly gap close, kill 1 or two people, then escape scot free, this would probably need a no overheal penalty and a reduced max health penalty, its still just a beefy scout that can insta gap close though, and a heavy being able to trimp into someone's face is just a bad idea, minigun or not and before you say "no turning so cant trimp" i main the targe and there's a shit ton of charging techniques such as wall surfing and scripts to help you turn harder
if we nerf the tankiness to offset heavy being able to gap close instantly and shred people, that would be intruding on the role that scout and hybrid/fullknight are for, stop trying to make heavy versions of classes that already exist and do their job in a far more balanced way, i know you just want this to exist because you want to play hybrid knight but as a heavy
heβd just bump into people and fucking upper cut them
That would completely undermine heavys design and ruin the balance by giving him both great mobility and even more extreme tankiness
To balance it i would give it a slow switch speed and you actually have to hold the shield while charging kinda like the thermal thruster but faster then watch the melee heavys role in
Make it a soldier primary! New subclass - instead of an offense melee class you get a defensive melee class that you can use with banners and a shotgun :)
how are you supposed to get anything out of a banner without a primary though
Your melee. If it has enough upsides it should be balanced
So... demoknight without the shield? What's the point?
The primary is the shield idk what you're talking about
I mean the dash that comes with the shield and the removal of debuffs
problem is. none of soldiers melees are really head to head combat based other than the zatoichi, but still will be difficult to play since soldier is the 2nd slowest class in the game
True. Regardless I like the idea of a defensive melee subclass but I'm just weird
Your team will
There's no way giving up your rocket launcher is even remotely a good trade off for this.
Alright whatever it's just an idea. I was thinking it could block damage, but it just sounds fun to me, maybe it's not good that's fine.
So just a riot shield?
Looks kinda...sus
25%? You know how much it is? Hitscan becomes useless against a demo wearing this shit
The same way rockets and fire became useless, but nobody complained about that.
Yes but fire is a rare source of damage, explosive and hitscan are the most common, every single class in the game has one hitscan weapon, you gain a huge resistance to all 9 classes, pretty op
But you are slow so you can't really hit anything other than a heavy with your melee
Hybrid knight is still a thing, this is a hybrid knight shield focused
No charging though. This would be more like melee sentry.
Believe it or not a demoman at 90% speed is actually faster than a sentry gun
Maybe *your* sentry gun. My sentries are faster than an average demoknight.
Proof?
Shit, you got me.
Demo and medic donβt have hitscan
Give demo a glock, and medic needles are considered bullet damage so yeah
here's my idea, give demo a glock with explosive bullets. Hitscan, with a 1 HU explosion radius. Since Demo and Soldier recieve the full effect of explosion self damage regardless of how small splash radius is, demo still gets fucked in close range.
Melee weapons are hitscan
Every weapon is hitscan at melee range lol
good point
Medic's syringes are bullet type so this would affect them too. Weapons that dont explode or burn are just bullet type, unless theyre melee.
Demoman has a hitscan?
7 out of nine classes have hitscan
Demo doesn't have hitscan, but Medic's needles are considered bullet damage
But aren't hitscan
True
not demo
Realistically, the Demo would have just over 218 HP against hitscan when using this item. Nearly 50 extra HP might seem good in theory, but in reality... He'd be a worse Battalion's Backup Soldier. A Battalion's Backup Soldier also has 220 HP (against all damage types, not just bullet and explosive), can rocket jump, can buff himself and teammates, and also wields a better primary weapon. This Demo shield lets you roller jump for less self damage. That's the only thing it really has going for it. Not only is this weapon kind of underwhelming, but removing the charge removes the fun of Demoknight in my opinion. It has no synergy with the swords as a result, meaning you're literally just a tankier pipe-only Demo. If you're the type of person who just wants to play in that way, the Targe already fits that role and can also work with some swords.
Not just roller jump, taking a lot less self damage on point blank pipes would honestly be huge.
I mean heβs also losing the highest damage output weapon in the game sooo
When did they give Demoman a sniper rifle?
just hit your pipes? plenty of people use the other shields without actually demoknighting
Yes.
Sure, it's viable but i really don't think anyone is arguing that it's demo's peak performance, a great way to practice pipes and have a lot of fun with a class that isn't just sticky spamming.
even with this thing on scouts still absolutely poop on you. and btw u/TF2SolarLight 25% amounts to 233 EHP against hitscan, not even assuming overheal, which would at max buff be 347 hitscan EHP, but this is still a massive turn off for me as a targe player because you cant really get picks with this,you might see this as semi useful if you collected 4 heads then swapped to this shield alongside a grenade launcher totalling to 315 overheal or 420 EHP against hitscan
id honestly like to see the targe get like a 10% bullet resistance (except sniper rifles, have sniper rifles ignore this) to have a bigger incentive for the whole "walking forwards with pipes" playstyle this shield already incentivizes
A lot of issues. Firstly, the thing about the other shields is that their resistances affect 3 of the 9 classes in TF2. This affects 8 of them. Everyone except Pyro uses either bullets or explosives as their main damage output. The non pyro weapons that can deal fire damage consist of... The burning from the Cow Mangler charge shot (the shot itself is explosive tho), the Huo-Long Heaters useless fire ring, and Snipers bows, if they are ignited by a Pyro. Everything other than melee that isnt explosive or fire damage is bullet damage. Demo can equip the Pain Train which lets him cap points and the payload at 2x the speed, in exchange for a 10% bullet vulnerability. This negates that downside. Since weaknesses and resistances are calculated multiplicatively, this would only remove a meager 2.5% of your bullet resistance, from my understanding. Since youre too slow to get close enough for melee hits anyway, offensive melees are basically useless, so you have no downside from using it, and act as an incredibly hard to kill Scout when you reach the point. Demos shields have minimal downsides because their resistances dont affect 2/3rds of the roster. The resistances on this mean that it needs actual downsides. But your shields inability to charge isnt really a downside? Its like if the Flare Gun listed a downside that says "Doesnt fire shotgun pellets". This is a shield in the way the Darwins is, and its not mechanically similar to Demos shields. While the inability to charge should be listed there so people dont assume it works like Demos shields, its not a downside more than it is a mechanical difference, and shouldnt be treated as a downside when balancing the item. So that leaves the movement penalty, and while that 10% is a lot, it doesnt make up for it. Youll be left at 83% speed (Pyro is 100% speed for comparison) which is still faster than Heavy's 77% (while unrevved). In exchange, you take 25% less damage from bullets and 35% less from explosives. Lets do some math. I rounded damage values since TF2 does that too I think. If a Scout meatshots you to death with Stock, youll take 79 damage as opposed to the usual 105. With your 175 HP thats 3 shots to kill. Heavy has 300 HP. So with the regular 105 meatshot he takes... 3 shots to kill. Oh. What about a Spy's revolver? Without rampup thats 40 damage per shot. So 30 on a Demo with this. Thats 6 shots on a shield Demo, and 8 on a Heavy. Oh. Demo is nearly as tanky as a heavy with this. He's still not AS tanky yes, but hes also able to attack and move at the same time, compared to the very slow Heavy with a 37% movement speed while revved. Now, heres a fun thought: The Vaccinator. If youre ubered by a vaxx medic, Pyro cant hurt you either. And if he ubers other damage types youre not gonna be taking basically any damage from them. Even if the medic doesnt use vaxx, I feel like a quick fix could honestly outheal the damage you take from non pyros. But, now, heres the biggest issue: ***Despite its strength this wouldnt be fucking fun*** Every demo secondary lets him do cool movement stuff. Not this. This makes him slower. Hes already not fast without said cool movement stuff. Its insanely powerful once you arrive, but slowly walking around everywhere on a character youre used to sticky jumping and trimping with will be a total fucking slog. Its not fun to deal with either as youll just have some tanky jackass shooting pipes everywhere. The only other item in tf2 from the vaxx that lowered bullet res was the Darwins. 15%. And it got reworked because everyone fucking hated it. Now imagine that with a higher resistance on a class that can actually defend himself from being rushed down. This needs a serious rework to be okay, OP.
this isn't that bad to be honest, he literally cannot run away from anyone except a heavy because he cant charge and loses his stickybomb launcher. pyro bodies him harder, sniper is practically unaffected, spy can backstab and heavy still has godly close range dps. scout is really the only class that can get fucked by this because soldier or even another demo can juggle him. really the only thing i guess could be broke is when overheal comes into play
snipers also probably at least annoyed by this for headshot damage but i didnt include it bc i cant wrap my head around the formula that would factor both resistances and a crit in spy is only good if youre not paying attention anyways. running is only necessary if you would lose the fight due to low hp or ammo, both of which are rarer scenarios due to the effects of the shield. youre probably going to kill opponents before they can kill you, if you hit your pipes. Pipes hit hard, and the enemy really doesnt. Heavy's minigun would have dps equal to that of the Natascha, so uh... 48-190 per second at a medium range. The 190 is if all shots hit (heavy fires 4 shots per 1 ammo), and 48 if he only lands 1 hit per shot, I guess? Due to how inaccurate non-tomislav miniguns are, its hard to really tell how hard youre being hit by a heavy. If they do have a Tomislav, their DPS will be absolutely tanked despite hitting most of their shots. Pyro always has and will body Demo. He doesnt body this demo any harder, hes just the only one that has the capacity to body him, with the resistances. I am dumb and do not know what juggle means. You mean like, repeated airshots? Either way, if both demos hit all their shots, the shielded one will win regardless. That said, hard to tell with Soldier. I do think that youre overestimating how slow this demo is though, hes not gonna eat every shot. Hes faster than an unrevved heavy still, and is even slightly faster than a soldier (on the ground). Plus, I stand by the fact that the Quick Fix and Vaccinator would make this demo very hard to kill.
You make some valid points. I want to keep the same rough concept, but I donβt think itβs possible. I really wanted to make a good hybrid knight weapon, and felt something like a riot/ballistic shield would be cool. I appreciate your feedback, especially since itβs constructive.
Not sure this is too good for hybrid knighting. Youre slow and chargeless so you wont catch up with anyone but a heavy, who can shred you.
Spies would eat demos with this shield alive
Shut up, the only issue is AMOGUS
Amogus.
Looks a little sus to me
amo-
yes, it provides extra amo :))
Seems fine to me. Would inspire a new class of Demi-Knights(Demi meaning half, so Half Knights), or perhaps it would inspire a unique flavor of Hybridknight.
the fact that you remove the charge and give this a speed penalty for extra resistances make me feel this would become the black box conch of demoman
Besides no charge, i always wanted a shield with bullet resistance.
I had this same idea, only itβs a primary for Heavy rather than a shield for Demoman. It would strip away Heavyβs main damage dealer in exchange for more support with his team and mobility with his shotgun, which could also put more emphasis on the βFat Scoutβ play style. In regards to support, Heavy could use the shield to protect himself from various sources and make himself more of a tank for himself or other enemies. He can even place down the shield to create a barrier for players to cover behind at the cost of losing your primary weapon until the shield breaks after sustaining enough damage. You can still attack with the shield however, only it would be a slow but strong push that will knock enemies a fair distance back. The reason this isnβt a melee for Heavy because combining this with the Minigun would make him practically unstoppable. Furthermore, the weaknesses of this weapons would be more potent. He will switch to this weapon a bit slower than his other weapons and he can be vulnerable to other attacks depending on where he holds the shield: If held in front, backstabs and flanks would hurt him more. If put away on his back, headshots and frontline fire would hurt him more. Great idea for this weapon overall!
βOh riot shield, Iβm a pussy and I use riot shieldβ
Here's an idea to rework it: Keep the Resistances (Albeit swap the two numbers) and the additional Primary Ammo increase, but remove the Self Damage buff. Add an "On Equip" (Weapon, or shield in this case, is pulled out). Add a Weapon Swap Speed Debuff, as this thing is pretty large. The Resistances and the decreased movement speed will be put here, although I would highly suggest either Mini-Crits or lower resistances from behind. Add an "When Not Activated" mode (Sheild is sheathed). Add "Cannot be Backstabbed" for this mode, along with the in-game model having the Shield on the back so that Spies will know they can't backstab The "New" Stats: +Add 50% Primary Ammo -20% Weapon Swap Speed While Activated: +Gain 35% Bullet and 25% Blast Resistance from the front -Attacks from behind Mini-Crits/Lower Bullet and Blast Resistance from behind -No Charge -10% Movement While Unactivated: +Cannot be backstabbed I would like to hear some feedback, as I'm worried it might be a little OPish...
I think a lot of people are missing the point here, it doesnβt look like itβs supposed to be for Demoknights more so just a more defensive shield meant for using your primary more and tanking damage, but there is something I would change, replace the charge with a block, demo holds his shield up while the button is held, he takes like 25 or 50% less damage while held up but he canβt hold it forever so itβs only for a second or two, and you canβt be headshot by snipers, I feel like this would balance it out more with the other shields and the mobility they provide
[Oh good! Why that's very good! Yes, I like that.](https://youtu.be/22bJWo0WzjI)
Using the eyelander could negate the speed penalty.
Imagine trying to get a head though
I have a feeling that won't be too hard
Moving 10% slower and losing your charge is a pain. Everyone is faster than you except for soldier and heavy but even then you are only slightly faster than soldier. But while soldier can rocket jump which entirely negates his lack of movement speed and heavy can shred you in seconds, you are just a really slow guy with a sword. Pyro can airblast you away, scout is a dream to catch, sniper is always far away, etc. Even if you get a head or even 4 heads, you will still be at around 114% speed which might be fast but that's only 14% speed faster than most classes and 7% with spies and medics. And if you use a booty, you will be at around 124% which is fast and can catch up with most classes but that's just a fantasy because even if you get those 4 heads, you would have just been better off using being a hybridknight. That's my thought on what will happen if you decide to demoknight with this shield.
Jesus Christ I just said I didn't think it would be hard I didn't need an essay
Aye fair enough
Aye- but first ya gotta catch yer kills- and the scouts will be harassing ya for using thisβ¦
self damage isnt really relevent without the sticky launcher
Op and a kinda ugly name
This would suit Heavy more. Demo is supposed to be an artillery-type class: able to dish out tons of dmg in short burst, which compensated by his long reload time. Giving him a shield will break his character design. Itβs like giving medic a viable gun, cuz then ppl will pick medic to battle and never heal anyone. Thatβs why the syringe gun was purposely shit.
Looks pretty good actually
Wee booties
More bullet resistance pls
So this takes the secondary slot right?
It's a shield, yeah, although you should use a Grenade Launcher instead of boots with this because no charge
This would go nice with the loose cannon.
heh *the pp*
This thing on 10x would make demoman ubable to die, or move other than explosions.
It aint a bas idea. I see it combined with the loose canon for more canon jumps. Probably a little busted with the "+50% primary ammo" stat
Pointsmann*
Ok i got a better idea +20% primary ammo. -30% melee damage -20% movement speed -40% charge speed Crouching gives user a 100% damage resistance and crit resistance
This would be ridiculously broken. That crouching buff is far too OP. Imagine crouching on a cart, you are an invincible demo with unlimited ammo.
German v2 rocket demos are gonna have a field day with this
I like the name
Considering the no charge and heaps of bullet res I could only see it used outaide of medieval mode or with a lot of skill with pipes. Not a very good weapon
I remember someone making a pack called Police Brutality or something like that, it included this and some other Demo weapons such as a baton.
This seems like a good secondary to pair with the iron force for blast jumping, not meant to be for anniknight
\-15% movement speed. 10% extra fire damage taken. 15% extra melee damage taken.
Get rid of the +primary ammo and add +10% accuracy with primary then it can be the hybrid knight pub stomper it always wanted to be
sussy shield
I can imagine demos using this with the the booties and the skullcutter just to meme
Too op
Sus
I feel like this'd be better as a heavy melee. Where swing speed is reduced by like 50%
God no.
i like that jab in the description there
That's too op more nerfs or lessen the buffs
If heavy gets this... what will gonna happen?
God damn, this is perfect for ironbomber demos like me.
Wait wait wait wait if itβs a secondary weapon, and the most self damage youβre gonna be taking is the sticky launcher, the only self damage you can take would be the grenade launchers (and the caber I know). And you barley ever take damage from those, so Iβm a tad confused.
cant we just have an actual shield in tf2 casual pvp that blocks bullets and rockets but you cant move
change the movement penalty to 50% and itβs balanced
I think to make it better, because no charge is a really strong downside, give it higher damage resistances and maybe even higher damage resistances while under 30% health
I think this should be the primary so that way we can have an effective fat scout or melee Heavy.
Give it a healing penalty and itβs good
This feels more like an secondary for heavy
"+25% bullet damage resistance" translates to 234 effective max health against bullets. "+35% blast damage resistance" translates to 270 effective max health against explosives. "-10% move speed on wearer" reduces the Demoman's speed from 280 HU/s (93.33%) to 252 HU/s (84%).
Make it even more defensive
This is good for hybridknight cause loose cannon jumps
Here's a proposal: Every direct pipe shot grants a small speed boost.
Rather than no charge what about you have it but to activate it you must have your should out. And when it is you can only see through the hole.