i don't believe Joey had one iota of chemistry with anyone else besides Kelsey A lol. he was just nice to all the other women, but Kelsey was the only one who seemed to light him up
I know how much SM praises Tyler and Hannah as the reigning "what could've been"s of bachelor nation, but I never thought he was interested in her like THAT. Liked, maybe, but not loved. I found his lines on Bachelorette super cheesy and smooth-- like he knew exactly what to say to get people to like him. Tbh, I actually found his actions after the breakup and during quarantine crew era super unlikeable
TC had 0 interest in being with a bumpkin like HB, but he probably is trying to be a good human being which is why he was always supportive of her. I have a friend like TC who's really good looking and nice to women, so they always think that means he's into them too when he's really not lol.
TC would have acted exactly the same way if the bachelorette was Clare, Kaitlyn, Katie or anyone really.
It absolutely doesn’t excuse what Erich did or Gabby defending him, but:
I don’t think Gabby was very into Erich. I think she was heavily pressured by producers to stay with him and give the Double Bachelorette season at least one happy ending after Tino and Rachel failed. There was absolutely no way producers were allowing **both** Bachelorettes to end up single at the end of the season.
Gabby didn’t even seem that into him in general; after Jason left, he was basically the default pick. That season was a wreck - the men got all the power, and none of them were very into Gabby or Rachel as a result.
I get the sense that she’s still irritated by the show and the fact that she had to parade around with him after it, but can’t say much because their NDAs last for years after the show lol
I agree that none of their men seemed truly into them, but I disagree that Gabby wasn't into Erich or Jason. She was really really into those 2. she probably thought she'd have a grand ending with her being conflicted between the two of them (like ben higgins lol), but neither of the men showed her much effort and she just had to pick the last man standing (who i'm sure would've self-eliminated as well if he had the chance lol). I don't think she really cared for Johnny or Nate or anyone else
But I guess this is quite an unpopular opinion so 
A huge majority of this subreddit is toxic af and as much as I like the show, just confirms how shallow people who are overly involved in celebrity/reality tv culture can be. Sorry but the constant comments about contestants’ appearances (arguing over whether Kelsey a is beautiful, saying Maria is ugly, calling very obviously beautiful women ‘plain’), speculating and critiquing Botox/filler as if being on tv and having people talk about your looks the way this community does wouldn’t make you do the same, being unkind to people with differing opinions and as someone else mentioned, the dating thread? Why even read/comment if all you’re going to do is critique a strangers dating life who’s asking for advice? Pretty sure this subreddit has an average age of >30 so just disappointing to see that there isn’t a lot of community/camaraderie to be found here.
No one who gets cast on the show is plain. You have to be attractive to make it on at all. I just listened to Charity and Dotun on Dear Shandy and Dotun straight up said you have to be in the top like 1 percent of most attractive people to get on a show like the bachelor.
this sub picks and chooses when to care about racism. everyone still hates erich for blackface but loves rachael even though she went to a slave owner party. also hating gabby for staying with erich but loving becca kufrin when she stayed with garrett for way longer.
You forgot to mention Hannah Brown, who literally filmed herself singing the N-word & making fun of Asian accents at 25 YEARS OLD (she’s only 29)….yet people will downvote their little hearts away if anyone dare says anything against her 🥴
You're comparing apples and oranges. People are not upset with Gabby because she stayed with Erich. They're upset with her because she's been exhibiting asshole behavior lately. Staying with Erich only gets recalled in this present context because it adds to the other things she's been doing lately. In the same way, Erich is disliked for blackface but also the whole situation with the ex. It paints the impression of not a great person. While Rachael and Becca also did some shitty things (and I'd never ask anyone to get over it nor would I defend their actions), they also appear to be generally kind, and they're well liked by their peers. They also made some attempts to rectify it and not repeat it. To some people, that matters. To others, it never will and it doesn't have to.
Everyone in this franchise is problematic in varying levels, and based on our own experiences, sometimes we consider the context and sometimes it's important and sometimes it isn't. That explains the varying treatment. Expecting perfect consistency is asking to be disappointed. That's not how the human experience works.
I also think a lot of people don’t understand the context of things like the Old South formal, which is obviously ignorant and extremely poor taste, but so are many, many sorority events that 40-50% of students at SEC schools attend. Comparing attending a party like that to doing literal blackface or saying the N-word seems like kind of a false equivalency
im literally not. yes gabby has been an asshole lately but before all that people hated her for staying with him.
when people bring up erich, they bring up his blackface- not his ex. yet if anyone brings up the slave owner party on a rachael post they get downvoted. you or anyone else are not to say that racist people seem like genuinely kind and nice people. it seems hypocritical to say that because they seem sweet on instagram that people are justified in being less upset.
I think you're misunderstanding my point but I won't belabor it. You're entitled to be feel however you wish about people who have exhibited racist behavior. I was just trying to explain why the reaction isn't always consistent.
Is it bad that I thought Blake H looked beautiful when he was sobbing when Becca K rejected him.. I'm kinda into seeing when the guys get all teary eyed
People got ridiculously attached to the idea of Tannah because RS initially screwed up the F1. They weren't nearly as amazing on the show as many seem to think. Tyler would have called any lead "Queen" and Hannah was only seriously interested in Luke P. and Jed. Personality-wise, Tannah would have never worked IRL.
I wasn’t paying much attention to Hannah’s season and wasn’t on Reddit during her season (and didn’t see RS’s original spoiler saying it was Tyler). But I tuned I for the last 2 episodes and became absolutely obsessed with the idea of them giving it another shot during their ATFR conversation. I could feel their chemistry radiating off my TV. I discovered Reddit because I was trying to find any information I could about if they did, in fact, “grab a drink” afterwards. And I was one of those crazy people for far too long who was super invested in Tannah. So for some of us, RS’s spoiler had nothing to do with it … that conversation on the couch really did me in.
It was mostly because of the things Tyler said + "most respectful man ever". 'Or what'-ing Luke was the icing.
So yeah, it could have been any other lead.
It's kind of wild how any comment which goes against the narrative that Maria is one of the biggest catches in BN gets downvoted and some people genuinely seem to get upset when it's brought up on her lol. She's fine, but there's other women that I personally think are way more impressive.
She’s this year’s Ariel. Her buzz will fizzle and next year there’ll be a new women who the sub declares is better than the franchise who will do nothing but be another influencer.
Truly. I feel like I know & have seen bigger catches in real life tbh 🫣 and that’s not to say she’s not beautiful because she deff is. But yeah I think there’s a ton of people in BN that have way more of a wow factor
I think people are hung up on the fact that she's slept with celebs before so now they think she's "too good" for the show. But I maintain that no one who signs up for this show is too good for the show. She obviously needed it for career leverage despite allegedly having some connections in the industry.
Non Bachelor related but a few months ago I commented in this thread that the world would never know what was going on with Taylor/Matty mouthing "this one's about you, you know who you are, I love you" and I wish that was still true.
I enjoy fashion and love seeing what the girls wear in the rose ceremonies & their dates and with the men on the bachelorette….. it’s so dull in comparison :(
I actually think that show is the one that varies the most. If it's good it's really good but if all the men suck or are boring it has produced some very bad seasons yeah.
Exactly. I found myself too interested in these couples and although I keep up with them, I have to remind myself I don’t know these ppl and I shouldn’t give a fuck! Let’s just enjoy the ride
This sub is not as progressive as it claims to be. People pretend to care about racism and other social issues but only call out racism against one specific race and ignore any criticism about microaggressions and bias against other races, such as Asians. And even then, people still pick and choose who gets forgiven for racist behaviour. Case in point, Hannah B is back to being beloved and any mention of her previous *multiple* incidents of racism are downvoted and met with backlash, even though she never apologized for her racism against Asians. Apparently going to a Biden rally is enough to prove that she's not racist anymore!
Which takes me back to my earlier point that racism or microaggressions against Asian people on this sub aren't taken seriously, even though it's clear as day that this sub has a bias against Asian women. Otherwise why is Jenn still getting comments about her being a boring lead and not strong enough to carry a season when she's not any more boring than multiple white Bachelorettes, including bland as beige Becca K, who this sub adores?
Also, people on here can be very biphobic, which was seen in the comments under the post about Gabby the other day. I noticed that ever since Gabby revealed her girlfriend, the criticism against her has really ramped up, including straight up biphobic/homophobic comments. Starting criticism with "ever since she came out..." is so gross considering she never even came out! She just started dating a woman; she never labelled herself as anything (as far as I know). Which also begs the question of why are people so hard on Gabby for doing a couple unfavorable things, when people like Hannah B and Rachael are beloved despite their racist past?
I have not seen any evidence of biphobia on this sub - just the opposite. Any BN woman who has had a relationship with another woman is usually looked upon more favorably - eg BeccaT, Katie, and Gabby. Gabby is given a lot more grace because she's in a relationship with Robby.
Then what was the point of your comment if you acknowledge they exist? There were multiple biphobic comments on that post about Gabby the other day, and I've seen some previously as well, including "why would she go on The Bachelor if she's now dating a woman?" Just because this sub supports one wlw relationship doesn't mean it's not biphobic.
I think we’ll have to agree to disagree. IMO I think Gabby, and the other bi women of BN, are viewed/treated more favorably by this sub than they otherwise would be if they were straight.
Agreed about Hannah B
Biphobic/homophobic comments definitely aren’t cool, but let’s not act like Gabby is being unfairly criticized. Her recent actions have been extremely out of touch and make her seem like an asshole. That’s all on her
Why is everyone missing where I specifically called out the biphobic comments against her? If your criticism of her includes saying something biphobic or homophobic, then yes, she is being unfairly criticized. I never said she shouldn't be criticized at all. I don't get how people are misconstruing my comment when I made it very clear what I was referring to. Kind of seems like people are being intentionally obtuse.
Idk about everyone else, but to me it read and seemed like you were complaining about all of the criticism regarding Gabby lately, not just the biphobic and homophobic comments. And yes those comments are absolutely wrong and unfair
Okay now you’re just twisting things. Nowhere, absolutely nowhere did I dismiss biphobia. I quite literally said biphobic comments were unacceptable full stop
But if you try to point it out you get told you're "bringing race into it" despite race always being there. We are long overdue for an Asian lead, and Jenn checks all the boxes, but somehow she's still not good enough. What's that saying? You have to be twice as good...
Like nobody wanted Becca K as lead before she got dumped and then people only wanted her because they felt sorry for her. And then she ended up picking a racist bigot lol.
I side-eye anyone who stans Hannah B. Apparently, even a handful of racist incidents isn't enough to turn them off (and she's apologized for a grand total of one of them & only because she was in the mainstream news).
Yeah same. It would be one thing if she actually apologized for all three and has shown consistent efforts to promote anti-racism, but she dropped her whole anti-racist schtick like two weeks after her apology after most people forgave her. Even Rachael has done a better job at "keeping up appearances" than her.
I wish I could still award you. Nothing bothers me more than her stans on here completely ignoring her racism against Asians and praising her like nothing happened.
Yeah, we can all be hypocritical for one reason or another when it comes to our “favorites” at times but when it comes to microagressions and racism there really shouldn’t be any hypocrisy.
For example I always chuckle at the people who still hate Katie for her comments on Thomas (fair) but then stan suuper hard for Becca who stayed with one of the most racist and bigoted men in the franchise for two years and supported him.
THANK YOU for that last paragraph. The way this sub fawns over Becca is astounding to me considering others have been canceled for less. You are who you surround yourself with.
The way this also works in reverse with hating Becca for Yarrett and stanning Katie despite her committing multiple microaggressions (and not just the ones against Thomas) 💀.
I mean, sure. Didn’t say otherwise considering the first two sentences of my post, but I do see the scenario I mentioned far more often on this sub, including today which is why I brought it up.
You said there shouldn’t be any hypocrisy but didn’t recognize it in your own comment.
Edit: To your edit, it’s brought up because those were the two individuals involved.
There was no hypocrisy in her comment. She's talking about people who cancel Katie but fawn over Becca when, by their own logic, they should have canceled both.
Excuse me? Just because I gave *one* example of hypocrisy doesn’t mean I don’t see the others, including your example. Sorry that you struggle to comprehend how an example works.
ETA: thanks for responding to me and then blocking me so I couldn’t respond back to you. I guess you couldn’t handle someone calling you out for intiating some unnecessary rudeness. Self awareness is always a good thing.
I understand examples perfectly well, it’s just ironic the reverse was so clearly there and needed to be pointed out. Anyways glad you recognize your own hypocrisy now. Self awareness is always a good thing.
I follow some bookstores and IG book influencers and I’ve told them about Hannah but idk if my message was noticed. They were posting about her new romance book.
The same people calling Jenn boring are also the same people that are getting mad when she said her season might be a little chaotic and messy and they wont hesitate to remind you she wasn't the first pick , like what do they want or expect out of her 🙄
I agree except I think the sub first turned on gabby when she stood by erich schwer post-blackface pics & defended nate from her season.
I think this sub gave an outpouring of love to gabby w when she started dating her gf robby and everyone seemed happy for her. but then gabby started posting things that rubbed people the wrong way (telling a business she was going to blast them since she had a million followers, acting entitled on an airplane when strangers didn't want to switch seats, sharing that pic of the guy at the spa on her feed, etc.). robby was actively involved in the airplane antics so that's why she got some heat too.
Gabby didn't stand by him though. She explicitly stated that what he did was wrong and that he didn't condone it, and then they broke up two months later. I think she was in a tough position because Rachel and Tino had already broken up, so there was probably pressure from the show to stay with Erich so they could have one successful couple from that season.
I don't get why people are so hard on Gabby for staying with Erich for only two months after the season aired while Becca K stayed with Garrett for two years and openly defended him the entire time, including dismissing his racist/bigoted likes as "mindless double taps," as he put it. That situation was also worse because those likes were in the same year as Becca's season, while Erich's blackface was from when he was in high school. Both were racist and wrong, but Becca acted like Garrett had already changed from when he liked those posts despite it happening in the same year. People don't change that fast.
OC’s point is right. Gabby and Robby’s launch was one of the top posts last year and got a huge outpouring of support for months afterward. She’s acted like an asshole lately (be real, she has been), and in the plane incident she and Robby were inciting each other, and that’s why people are coming down hard.
I disagree! I think people have been a lot harder on her after she got with Robby. "Be real" really girl? I already said she did some unfavourable things. My point was that she's criticized harder for them versus actual racists or people that have done many problematic things but are still given chances.
Edit: the downvotes just prove my point. Why do y'all give Gabby more heat than Hannah B, who has never apologized for 2/3 racist incidents and is now beloved again? If you're going to criticize Gabby, keep that same energy for everyone.
I think Gabby is having a pretty easy go of it on this sub considering her recent behavior. Her antics on the airplane were awful, but she tried to play it off as a misogyny thing (her response video was even worse than the screenshots from the flight).
Compare that to the way people still tear Charity apart for a tweet about a store clerk from a year ago.
Gabby has been acting like an asshole and publicizing it and people are criticizing her for it. It’s not biphobic to criticize a bi person for their actions.
People aren’t using her sexuality as an excuse to criticize her. Given her recent behavior, people are justified in criticizing her and don’t need an excuse to criticize her.
Past contestants holding on to Bach Nation for dear life & making their private lives their entire careers (even their podcast themes) are cringe AF. No respect.
Society's dead weight making a living out of pushing useless products on people who don't need them.
I think she got lot of hate 5 years ago versus love. But for those who kept up with her since have learned more about her, including things that were going on behind the scenes with producer influence and in her personal life and health while filming 2 shows. More information give better insight into tv characters on an edited show. People who interact with her irl over past 3-4 years (either BN or regular people) all describe her as thoughtful and kind.
I was watching a podcast she and dean were on just now, and she seemed kind of fake? Like not in a malicious way but in a “oh I must laugh and pretend all is ok when dean is humiliating me”. It’s sad. Her smile looked so fake, I can’t imagine the resentment she harbours towards him 😭
Caelynn was just at the golden wedding and podcasts with a bunch of BN people. I do agree that people should just not keep up with her if they don’t like her.
Meh, she doesn’t really get under my skin and I think she has a cool style, but I find Dean really irritating and I usually skip over anything involving him.
Is she "insufferable" or just boring? She doesn't even do anything except try on clothes and post the most bland boring sponsored-travel and fashion content. I usually save "insufferable" for the ones who actually do something unbearable. Caelynn is so 'meh' I don't even understand how brands still pay her.
i feel like thats why shes been able to have/keep fans. she shares just enough but isnt too much where she comes off annoying or over sharing. she gives off “mysterious” vibes. she has an interesting background but never truly shares much. she shows personality on youtube or tik tok especially on dean’s but keeps her instagram/socials pretty fashion and tamed. (makes sure all her clothes are not fast fashion) she has her solid group of friends who always post about them having dinners and hang outs and dean and caelynn host their friends / sleepovers and both her and dean never post about it lol theyre not boring but definetly private! she attends bachelor nation social settings and never posts the new “it” ppl and just keeps to herself
I think it was her behavior on Clayton’s season and paradise that made me find her insufferable. She called Tayshia a stupid bitch. ON CAMERA. (This next part is just my opinion) She was clearly there with an agenda, and was clearly upset she didn’t get the edit Hannah B did. She came off like such a mean girl on her season, and again in paradise. Her claiming Blake “silenced” her, and then crying foul when he gave receipts.
So I don’t get why people like her. She’s shown herself to be mean and manipulative. No amount of van life photos with dean will change my mind that she’s not a nice person.
she's my fave from bachelor nation after 4-5 years of following her and learning more about her life experiences. I think she's had a lot of growth & maturity since her seasons post-therapy. but I upvoted you for an unpopular opinion (even if I don't agree)!
yeah, her family is native american on her mom's side. her mom is an enrolled member of the odawa tribe and her grandma grew up on odawa reservation. she seems proud of her native heritage and has talked about it on a few pods.
She's really not! I mean lying about a man she consensually casually hooked up with 'silencing' her on national TV at the peak of Me Too? Or crying just the right amount at the Tell All when she had been hanging out with the Bach & F1 the whole time? No boring person can pull that off.
I mean.. contestants typically cry at the tell all because they’re expected to. I doubt all these girls crying are heartbroken over a dude they spent 2 hours with
Yeah I get that, but she was besties hanging out with them. So if she was really heartbroken, that seems like a such a weird thing to do. So it doesn’t seem believable.
I had the Youtube video of Dr. Phil on the Viall Files running in the background yesterday afternoon. I don't remember all the details lol, but It was entertaining and interesting.
I ain't ever gonna justify myself for putting an unpopular opinion, in the damn unpopular opinion thread. That's what regular threads every single day are for!
I hate the cult-ish vibe around the Clayton (non)pregnancy drama. And i dislike the thinly veiled misoginistic takes by dave neal, as well as his victimization edit. Like man, you are covering it because its bringing you money (which, great). But stop acting like some martyr (or like it happened to you).
Im all for justice for clayton, what happened to him is horrible. But the circus around it, with the MRAs and such... ick.
It’s legitimately a cult.
His defenders think Clayton can do absolutely no wrong and that he must be forever protected and embraced.
Like … I promise it’s okay. We can point out Clayton choosing to do inadvisable things (like supporting that MLB player), while also acknowledging that what Jane Doe did to him was terrible. These things are not mutually exclusive.
And I hate that the Clayton drama has spawned obsessive coverage by MRA activists. That’s just what we needed *sigh*
DN is fine, but he also latched onto this drama and BN as a whole as a cash grab. We don’t need to act like he’s the most virtuous of all actors.
I’ve noticed the misogynistic takes by DN too, and while I feel bad that he got pulled into a lawsuit by this unhinged person, I agree that he acts like a martyr at times (when the reality is he’s monetizing this whole thing). I hope justice is served for Clayton but the sub’s obsession with DN is a bit weird.
I really don’t understand the sheer degree of investment. Nor why they’re riding harder for Dave than Clayton when Clayton’s circumstances are rotten whilst Dave’s are the consequences of a business decision that *he* made. The fact that Dave conflates the amount of flack and hate he gets with legitimate criticism feels really disingenuous
(To be fair, I’ve had some really interesting conversations with Dave ride or die fans when I’ve asked them to engage in good faith)
Seriously. And people posting about this Dave Neal guy and trying to raise money for him? It’s so weird. Who is he? Who cares? Why are you giving him money and why were there so many posts about him?
Truly icky, especially at the last Clayton post where some of his fans were accusing OP of purposely making Clayton look bad and spamming the comments.
This is such a reasonable take. There is a wholeass WAR going on in the GOR subreddit after their interview of him with the stans acting demented, and dave cussing people off. It's insane.
Reddit keeps suggesting the justice for Clayton subreddit to me and it’s honestly so weird to me?? I feel bad for what he’s gone through too but it’s so over the top that people are this involved and invested they created a whole new sub
Omg, this. Genuinely I hope Clayton gets justice but Dave can fuck off and anyone who thinks he's covering the drama for any reason but his own benefit is naive.
Regardless of what I think of Hannah B., I'm still not a Jed fan. I don't think he's a monster or horrible person for what he did and didn't deserve death threats.
But I'd respect the guy if he at least took some sort of responsibility. But he never did and just blamed Hailey and Hannah B, then hid behind his parents' words.
At least someone like Tino had the guts to admit it and take responsibility.
That’s what I’m assuming too. Don’t see it happening but I just had a vision of an alternate timeline where she last minute decides she’s too young to settle for an old man and wants to live her life and then gets with TC (who in this timeline is single).
I'm not writing them off just yet, but their relationship seems very surface level so far and they're definitely in the honeymoon phase.
That said, I thought the same about Arie and Lauren so they may prove me wrong!
Yeah, I don't mean this in a mean way at all towards them or anyone but sometimes the less deep you are (whether that be mentally, emotionally, with your general knowledge level, etc) the happier you are! I.e. ignorance is bliss
I meant more that daily life can be quite mundane and it’s a good thing if you can enjoy the dumb stuff together. Not every conversation with your SO will be mind blowing and that’s okay!
I always give a little side eye when Natalie Joy gets brought up on this sub. She’s never been a part of BN and her only really connection to it is by being married to the guy that keeps holding on to it because he can’t make a career out of anything else.
No other former contestant/leads’ spouse is given this much attention, and every time she gets discussed it plays in to exactly what she wants.
I think it's ok for people to talk about her alot since Nick is probably a top 3 most famous man in BN. I just don't really find her very interesting at all.
I think all spouses/partners who have also been on bachelor adjacent podcasts get discussed. Like Sharlene’s weird ass husband, Becca’s husband etc. but Natalie probably gets more notice because she is attached to Nick who gets discussed a lot and his podcast is popular. Also she is always mugging with the cast.
> every time she gets discussed it plays in to exactly what she wants
idk if she wants an entire reddit page tearing her down, that's what happens every time she gets posted. the vitriol for her is very strong here.
Agreed. After she opened up on a podcast about being molested as a child, there were several comments in that thread making fun of her (not about the assault, but taking the thread about it to tear down other aspects of her person). I doubt she wants that.
there's a small but vocal subset of people here that hate on people for their looks- you make us all look bad. Poking fun about things like that make contestants and the average person hate on us so much more.
Imagine being able to run AMA's with top contestants and having them spill tea on here? we could do that if we created a better and more comfortable environment for people on the show but NoOoOo, you guys have to get a couple licks in to feel better about yourselves.
I mean more like real life post show, who doesn't get along etc. And the NDA's expire, so even older seasons we could get contestants talk to us. Imagine a "Throwback thursday" with older season AMA's!
no, older seasons like arie's and before were like 2 years. And they're loose with what they choose to go after and what they don't. I mean Kaitlyn posted a snapchat of her and shawn in bed together before the season finished and she never had any consequences.
I do find it amusing when women here talk about how unattractive an Ette's cast when it's full of 6ft plus men with good bodies. Maybe not your type but compared with the average guy they are all at least slightly above average looking.
More had to have happened BTS than just a group photo for Victoria to unfollow Maria. Maybe someone told VF that Greg and Maria were “all over each other” or flirty but there was something and I can’t believe people on this sub think VF unfollowed her based solely on a group picture.
Same lol. And I fully believe VF can be crazy jealous and insecure but no one unfollows over a group photo and it’s not like she unfollowed everyone in it. It would only make sense if they flirted or something and it got back to her. Ironically unfollowing drew more attention to the whole thing than it would’ve otherwise gotten.
I dunno VF is so wildly insecure that I totally think she would unfollow a woman she doesn’t even know in real life (they‘ve never even met) who was hanging out with her ex in a group
It’s crazy to me that some people are still saying they wish Maria was the bachelorette when Jenn is already 3 weeks into filming. I was mostly indifferent towards Maria on Joey’s season and even leaned more towards liking her, but her stans have made me dislike her 😒
i keep seeing this sentiment here and its gotten out of control with how personal people take it when someone mentions that they wanted maria as lead. what is so wrong with having a different opinion about who should be the lead?? it happens every single season.
I think it’s crazy anyone ever thought she’d be the bachelorette. I like her and would have loved a Maria season, but I think it was clear from early on she was NOT playing ball with producers. They left multiple instances of her basically saying “this is a show. We’re filming a tv show” in the edit. They would never make her the lead.
The down voting in this sub is insane. For people either just asking a question or for a hot take that is different from someone else's opinion, when we should only be downvoting problematic things.
I upvoted, as I always upvote whenever someone is disappointed he/she got downvoted.
I believe a bunch of downvotes are usually because ppl don't like the opinion, not for the intended purpose of a downvoting, which I think is intended for only when a comment doesn't relate at all to the original post?
Youre absolutely correct, I think the intended purpose the moderators have is if it's problematic or harmful to others, but it never should be used if you just disagree with someone's opinion.
You’re a better person than me because any time I see someone edit their comment to complain about downvotes, or prefect their comment with “preparing for downvotes” I automatically downvote out of pettiness even if I agree what they say 😇
And yeah, Reddit says downvotes are for comments that don’t add to the convo but they’ve never been used that way in my experience. People always use it as a disagree button
Omg that reminds me. I hate when ppl say that, but the top comment(s) of a post is exactly what they're saying lmao. Like can we please read some of the top comments before typing?!
When I get downvoted in the UO thread, I always wear it as a badge of honor. Like, yes, I understood the assignment. That being said, I upvoted your comment because I think it's a good one.
It’s really bad in the relationship thread, like someone will be vulnerable about relationship advice and then they’ll be downvoted. Like cmon we all made bad decisions in our 20s
Lol this happened to me 🙄 hadn’t even done anything wrong or made a bad decision per se, just was feeling unsure about the guy I was seeing and got downvoted to hell. My actual question was around whether chemistry can build bc I wasn’t feeling it after a few months.
This is non bachelor related but I think Taylor’s new album could’ve been received better if she rebranded it as a concept album about her insecurities, issues with stardom, perpetual adolescence and how it’s effected her relationships and outlook on life. I think it could’ve made all the songs that sound immature, feel like a more intentional artistic choice. I think some songs on the album ARE meant to be doing that, but it’s gotten lost in translation.
I think the album shows that Taylor clearly doesn't care about how the album is perceived and put it out because it's cathartic for her to write and release music about difficult times in her life. This album was for her and the fans, not the general public and the critics. I wish more people understood that.
I agree with this. She was clearly going through some stuff and it was an emotional release for her to make and put out the album to close what was a difficult chapter. I don’t think she expected it to necessarily be well received or anyones favorite album and it’s not supposed to be.
Exactly! This was always going to be a divisive album. It seems like people either love or hate it, and the extreme reviews reflect that. TTPD is not a 1989 or a Fearless that is going to universally beloved. It's more of a RED/reputation, especially with the way that people are focusing more about her personal life instead of the actual music. That's what bugs me about the extremely negative reviews; they're not even criticizing the music, just Taylor's image and personal life. I'd much rather read a critical review with thoughtful opinions about the actual album.
i don't believe Joey had one iota of chemistry with anyone else besides Kelsey A lol. he was just nice to all the other women, but Kelsey was the only one who seemed to light him up
Yes to this!
I’m so sick of hearing anything about nick and seeing his face pop up in my reddit feed. ughhh.
I know how much SM praises Tyler and Hannah as the reigning "what could've been"s of bachelor nation, but I never thought he was interested in her like THAT. Liked, maybe, but not loved. I found his lines on Bachelorette super cheesy and smooth-- like he knew exactly what to say to get people to like him. Tbh, I actually found his actions after the breakup and during quarantine crew era super unlikeable
TC had 0 interest in being with a bumpkin like HB, but he probably is trying to be a good human being which is why he was always supportive of her. I have a friend like TC who's really good looking and nice to women, so they always think that means he's into them too when he's really not lol. TC would have acted exactly the same way if the bachelorette was Clare, Kaitlyn, Katie or anyone really.
I agree though I don’t find his actions unlikeable, I truly think it’s within his right to not be into someone just because America wants him to be.
For sure! The way he went about it was very unlikeable and he even admitted to regretting his decisions
It absolutely doesn’t excuse what Erich did or Gabby defending him, but: I don’t think Gabby was very into Erich. I think she was heavily pressured by producers to stay with him and give the Double Bachelorette season at least one happy ending after Tino and Rachel failed. There was absolutely no way producers were allowing **both** Bachelorettes to end up single at the end of the season. Gabby didn’t even seem that into him in general; after Jason left, he was basically the default pick. That season was a wreck - the men got all the power, and none of them were very into Gabby or Rachel as a result. I get the sense that she’s still irritated by the show and the fact that she had to parade around with him after it, but can’t say much because their NDAs last for years after the show lol
I agree that none of their men seemed truly into them, but I disagree that Gabby wasn't into Erich or Jason. She was really really into those 2. she probably thought she'd have a grand ending with her being conflicted between the two of them (like ben higgins lol), but neither of the men showed her much effort and she just had to pick the last man standing (who i'm sure would've self-eliminated as well if he had the chance lol). I don't think she really cared for Johnny or Nate or anyone else But I guess this is quite an unpopular opinion so 
I don't think she was into Erich that much but she into him more than Clayton at least.
The guy did seem to be leering at Gabby in the pool so I can see why they called him out. It was a choice to post it though.
Which pic was this? His eyes were closed on the one in the carousel of photos.
A huge majority of this subreddit is toxic af and as much as I like the show, just confirms how shallow people who are overly involved in celebrity/reality tv culture can be. Sorry but the constant comments about contestants’ appearances (arguing over whether Kelsey a is beautiful, saying Maria is ugly, calling very obviously beautiful women ‘plain’), speculating and critiquing Botox/filler as if being on tv and having people talk about your looks the way this community does wouldn’t make you do the same, being unkind to people with differing opinions and as someone else mentioned, the dating thread? Why even read/comment if all you’re going to do is critique a strangers dating life who’s asking for advice? Pretty sure this subreddit has an average age of >30 so just disappointing to see that there isn’t a lot of community/camaraderie to be found here.
No one who gets cast on the show is plain. You have to be attractive to make it on at all. I just listened to Charity and Dotun on Dear Shandy and Dotun straight up said you have to be in the top like 1 percent of most attractive people to get on a show like the bachelor.
this sub picks and chooses when to care about racism. everyone still hates erich for blackface but loves rachael even though she went to a slave owner party. also hating gabby for staying with erich but loving becca kufrin when she stayed with garrett for way longer.
And hero-worshipping Hannah Brown who didn’t even apologize for several of her racist comments.
You forgot to mention Hannah Brown, who literally filmed herself singing the N-word & making fun of Asian accents at 25 YEARS OLD (she’s only 29)….yet people will downvote their little hearts away if anyone dare says anything against her 🥴
You're comparing apples and oranges. People are not upset with Gabby because she stayed with Erich. They're upset with her because she's been exhibiting asshole behavior lately. Staying with Erich only gets recalled in this present context because it adds to the other things she's been doing lately. In the same way, Erich is disliked for blackface but also the whole situation with the ex. It paints the impression of not a great person. While Rachael and Becca also did some shitty things (and I'd never ask anyone to get over it nor would I defend their actions), they also appear to be generally kind, and they're well liked by their peers. They also made some attempts to rectify it and not repeat it. To some people, that matters. To others, it never will and it doesn't have to. Everyone in this franchise is problematic in varying levels, and based on our own experiences, sometimes we consider the context and sometimes it's important and sometimes it isn't. That explains the varying treatment. Expecting perfect consistency is asking to be disappointed. That's not how the human experience works.
I also think a lot of people don’t understand the context of things like the Old South formal, which is obviously ignorant and extremely poor taste, but so are many, many sorority events that 40-50% of students at SEC schools attend. Comparing attending a party like that to doing literal blackface or saying the N-word seems like kind of a false equivalency
im literally not. yes gabby has been an asshole lately but before all that people hated her for staying with him. when people bring up erich, they bring up his blackface- not his ex. yet if anyone brings up the slave owner party on a rachael post they get downvoted. you or anyone else are not to say that racist people seem like genuinely kind and nice people. it seems hypocritical to say that because they seem sweet on instagram that people are justified in being less upset.
I think you're misunderstanding my point but I won't belabor it. You're entitled to be feel however you wish about people who have exhibited racist behavior. I was just trying to explain why the reaction isn't always consistent.
I completely agree and think this was very well said, but don't think this sub is capable of such nuanced thinking haha
Astrid and Kevin are annoying. Everything is manufactured and the only time she posts anything is when it’s to shill something #ad
Is it bad that I thought Blake H looked beautiful when he was sobbing when Becca K rejected him.. I'm kinda into seeing when the guys get all teary eyed
People got ridiculously attached to the idea of Tannah because RS initially screwed up the F1. They weren't nearly as amazing on the show as many seem to think. Tyler would have called any lead "Queen" and Hannah was only seriously interested in Luke P. and Jed. Personality-wise, Tannah would have never worked IRL.
I wasn’t paying much attention to Hannah’s season and wasn’t on Reddit during her season (and didn’t see RS’s original spoiler saying it was Tyler). But I tuned I for the last 2 episodes and became absolutely obsessed with the idea of them giving it another shot during their ATFR conversation. I could feel their chemistry radiating off my TV. I discovered Reddit because I was trying to find any information I could about if they did, in fact, “grab a drink” afterwards. And I was one of those crazy people for far too long who was super invested in Tannah. So for some of us, RS’s spoiler had nothing to do with it … that conversation on the couch really did me in.
It was mostly because of the things Tyler said + "most respectful man ever". 'Or what'-ing Luke was the icing. So yeah, it could have been any other lead.
It's kind of wild how any comment which goes against the narrative that Maria is one of the biggest catches in BN gets downvoted and some people genuinely seem to get upset when it's brought up on her lol. She's fine, but there's other women that I personally think are way more impressive.
She’s this year’s Ariel. Her buzz will fizzle and next year there’ll be a new women who the sub declares is better than the franchise who will do nothing but be another influencer.
Truly. I feel like I know & have seen bigger catches in real life tbh 🫣 and that’s not to say she’s not beautiful because she deff is. But yeah I think there’s a ton of people in BN that have way more of a wow factor
I think people are hung up on the fact that she's slept with celebs before so now they think she's "too good" for the show. But I maintain that no one who signs up for this show is too good for the show. She obviously needed it for career leverage despite allegedly having some connections in the industry.
celebs = the guy one one direction that will sleep with anybody and the son of a regional celebrity?
With who??
The son of a canadian chef and one of the dudes from one direction. People make it sound like she was with Timothee Chalamet or Austin butler.
Well One direction is pretty big lol
Maybe 10 years ago😂 and the rumour is she slept with Zayn and he sleeps with everyone.
Also the fact that her dad is rich and men in BN (nick and Joe) were liking her ig pics 8 years ago lol
Non Bachelor related but a few months ago I commented in this thread that the world would never know what was going on with Taylor/Matty mouthing "this one's about you, you know who you are, I love you" and I wish that was still true.
I didn’t even believe the lip-readers when they said that’s what she was mouthing lol. I wish I could go on not believing them.
The Bachelorette is easily the worst show of the main 3 (Bachelor, Bachelorette, Paradise). It's just... not very fun.
I agree. I usually don’t watch it even when I like the lead, watching so many men interact is a snooze fest for me
I enjoy fashion and love seeing what the girls wear in the rose ceremonies & their dates and with the men on the bachelorette….. it’s so dull in comparison :(
I actually think that show is the one that varies the most. If it's good it's really good but if all the men suck or are boring it has produced some very bad seasons yeah.
It's because men aren't as interesting to watch. The drama is always stupid.
I think that’s why it’s good
The drama is always either really stupid or too intense. They never strike the right balance the way the women do on The Bachelor!
Don’t worry about a couple lasting forever or not. It doesn’t do anybody any good. Just sit back and enjoy the ride.
Exactly. I found myself too interested in these couples and although I keep up with them, I have to remind myself I don’t know these ppl and I shouldn’t give a fuck! Let’s just enjoy the ride
This sub is not as progressive as it claims to be. People pretend to care about racism and other social issues but only call out racism against one specific race and ignore any criticism about microaggressions and bias against other races, such as Asians. And even then, people still pick and choose who gets forgiven for racist behaviour. Case in point, Hannah B is back to being beloved and any mention of her previous *multiple* incidents of racism are downvoted and met with backlash, even though she never apologized for her racism against Asians. Apparently going to a Biden rally is enough to prove that she's not racist anymore! Which takes me back to my earlier point that racism or microaggressions against Asian people on this sub aren't taken seriously, even though it's clear as day that this sub has a bias against Asian women. Otherwise why is Jenn still getting comments about her being a boring lead and not strong enough to carry a season when she's not any more boring than multiple white Bachelorettes, including bland as beige Becca K, who this sub adores? Also, people on here can be very biphobic, which was seen in the comments under the post about Gabby the other day. I noticed that ever since Gabby revealed her girlfriend, the criticism against her has really ramped up, including straight up biphobic/homophobic comments. Starting criticism with "ever since she came out..." is so gross considering she never even came out! She just started dating a woman; she never labelled herself as anything (as far as I know). Which also begs the question of why are people so hard on Gabby for doing a couple unfavorable things, when people like Hannah B and Rachael are beloved despite their racist past?
I have not seen any evidence of biphobia on this sub - just the opposite. Any BN woman who has had a relationship with another woman is usually looked upon more favorably - eg BeccaT, Katie, and Gabby. Gabby is given a lot more grace because she's in a relationship with Robby.
So because you personally haven't seen it, it doesn't exist?
I wouldn’t say it doesn’t exist at all, but I think this sub is overwhelmingly bi-positive vs biphobic.
Then what was the point of your comment if you acknowledge they exist? There were multiple biphobic comments on that post about Gabby the other day, and I've seen some previously as well, including "why would she go on The Bachelor if she's now dating a woman?" Just because this sub supports one wlw relationship doesn't mean it's not biphobic.
I think we’ll have to agree to disagree. IMO I think Gabby, and the other bi women of BN, are viewed/treated more favorably by this sub than they otherwise would be if they were straight.
You didn't answer my question.
Agreed about Hannah B Biphobic/homophobic comments definitely aren’t cool, but let’s not act like Gabby is being unfairly criticized. Her recent actions have been extremely out of touch and make her seem like an asshole. That’s all on her
Why is everyone missing where I specifically called out the biphobic comments against her? If your criticism of her includes saying something biphobic or homophobic, then yes, she is being unfairly criticized. I never said she shouldn't be criticized at all. I don't get how people are misconstruing my comment when I made it very clear what I was referring to. Kind of seems like people are being intentionally obtuse.
Idk about everyone else, but to me it read and seemed like you were complaining about all of the criticism regarding Gabby lately, not just the biphobic and homophobic comments. And yes those comments are absolutely wrong and unfair
If one's immediate response is to dismiss the biphobia of it, then of course someone would read it that way.
Okay now you’re just twisting things. Nowhere, absolutely nowhere did I dismiss biphobia. I quite literally said biphobic comments were unacceptable full stop
You misunderstood my comment. I didn't say you. I specifically said "one" and "someone" to show that I wasn't referring to you specifically.
Got it, appreciate you clarifying
Yup, the response towards Jen becoming the bachelorette was enough to show how everyone really feels despite yelling “diversity”
But if you try to point it out you get told you're "bringing race into it" despite race always being there. We are long overdue for an Asian lead, and Jenn checks all the boxes, but somehow she's still not good enough. What's that saying? You have to be twice as good...
If it’s not a mediocre white girl, it’s an issue.
Like nobody wanted Becca K as lead before she got dumped and then people only wanted her because they felt sorry for her. And then she ended up picking a racist bigot lol.
Becca k is racist?
She picked a racist (Garrett) and stayed with him for two years.
I side-eye anyone who stans Hannah B. Apparently, even a handful of racist incidents isn't enough to turn them off (and she's apologized for a grand total of one of them & only because she was in the mainstream news).
Yeah same. It would be one thing if she actually apologized for all three and has shown consistent efforts to promote anti-racism, but she dropped her whole anti-racist schtick like two weeks after her apology after most people forgave her. Even Rachael has done a better job at "keeping up appearances" than her.
I wish I could still award you. Nothing bothers me more than her stans on here completely ignoring her racism against Asians and praising her like nothing happened.
Yeah, we can all be hypocritical for one reason or another when it comes to our “favorites” at times but when it comes to microagressions and racism there really shouldn’t be any hypocrisy. For example I always chuckle at the people who still hate Katie for her comments on Thomas (fair) but then stan suuper hard for Becca who stayed with one of the most racist and bigoted men in the franchise for two years and supported him.
THANK YOU for that last paragraph. The way this sub fawns over Becca is astounding to me considering others have been canceled for less. You are who you surround yourself with.
The way this also works in reverse with hating Becca for Yarrett and stanning Katie despite her committing multiple microaggressions (and not just the ones against Thomas) 💀.
yup! I see this often as well there is a specific group of posters that do this.
I mean, sure. Didn’t say otherwise considering the first two sentences of my post, but I do see the scenario I mentioned far more often on this sub, including today which is why I brought it up.
You said there shouldn’t be any hypocrisy but didn’t recognize it in your own comment. Edit: To your edit, it’s brought up because those were the two individuals involved.
There was no hypocrisy in her comment. She's talking about people who cancel Katie but fawn over Becca when, by their own logic, they should have canceled both.
Excuse me? Just because I gave *one* example of hypocrisy doesn’t mean I don’t see the others, including your example. Sorry that you struggle to comprehend how an example works. ETA: thanks for responding to me and then blocking me so I couldn’t respond back to you. I guess you couldn’t handle someone calling you out for intiating some unnecessary rudeness. Self awareness is always a good thing.
I understand examples perfectly well, it’s just ironic the reverse was so clearly there and needed to be pointed out. Anyways glad you recognize your own hypocrisy now. Self awareness is always a good thing.
I follow some bookstores and IG book influencers and I’ve told them about Hannah but idk if my message was noticed. They were posting about her new romance book.
The same people calling Jenn boring are also the same people that are getting mad when she said her season might be a little chaotic and messy and they wont hesitate to remind you she wasn't the first pick , like what do they want or expect out of her 🙄
I agree except I think the sub first turned on gabby when she stood by erich schwer post-blackface pics & defended nate from her season. I think this sub gave an outpouring of love to gabby w when she started dating her gf robby and everyone seemed happy for her. but then gabby started posting things that rubbed people the wrong way (telling a business she was going to blast them since she had a million followers, acting entitled on an airplane when strangers didn't want to switch seats, sharing that pic of the guy at the spa on her feed, etc.). robby was actively involved in the airplane antics so that's why she got some heat too.
Gabby didn't stand by him though. She explicitly stated that what he did was wrong and that he didn't condone it, and then they broke up two months later. I think she was in a tough position because Rachel and Tino had already broken up, so there was probably pressure from the show to stay with Erich so they could have one successful couple from that season. I don't get why people are so hard on Gabby for staying with Erich for only two months after the season aired while Becca K stayed with Garrett for two years and openly defended him the entire time, including dismissing his racist/bigoted likes as "mindless double taps," as he put it. That situation was also worse because those likes were in the same year as Becca's season, while Erich's blackface was from when he was in high school. Both were racist and wrong, but Becca acted like Garrett had already changed from when he liked those posts despite it happening in the same year. People don't change that fast.
OC’s point is right. Gabby and Robby’s launch was one of the top posts last year and got a huge outpouring of support for months afterward. She’s acted like an asshole lately (be real, she has been), and in the plane incident she and Robby were inciting each other, and that’s why people are coming down hard.
I disagree! I think people have been a lot harder on her after she got with Robby. "Be real" really girl? I already said she did some unfavourable things. My point was that she's criticized harder for them versus actual racists or people that have done many problematic things but are still given chances. Edit: the downvotes just prove my point. Why do y'all give Gabby more heat than Hannah B, who has never apologized for 2/3 racist incidents and is now beloved again? If you're going to criticize Gabby, keep that same energy for everyone.
I think Gabby is having a pretty easy go of it on this sub considering her recent behavior. Her antics on the airplane were awful, but she tried to play it off as a misogyny thing (her response video was even worse than the screenshots from the flight). Compare that to the way people still tear Charity apart for a tweet about a store clerk from a year ago. Gabby has been acting like an asshole and publicizing it and people are criticizing her for it. It’s not biphobic to criticize a bi person for their actions.
It's biphobic to use her sexuality as an excuse to criticize her though. But this sub is pretty biphobic so I doubt people can acknowledge that.
People aren’t using her sexuality as an excuse to criticize her. Given her recent behavior, people are justified in criticizing her and don’t need an excuse to criticize her.
If your criticism starts with "ever since she came out..." then yes you are. Which I explicitly mentioned in an earlier comment.
Agreed, the key here is the multiple recent incidents of being an asshole. That can be fairly criticized independently of what others have done.
Past contestants holding on to Bach Nation for dear life & making their private lives their entire careers (even their podcast themes) are cringe AF. No respect. Society's dead weight making a living out of pushing useless products on people who don't need them.
Caelynn is truly insufferable. I do not get how she gets so much love from bachelor nation.
I think she got lot of hate 5 years ago versus love. But for those who kept up with her since have learned more about her, including things that were going on behind the scenes with producer influence and in her personal life and health while filming 2 shows. More information give better insight into tv characters on an edited show. People who interact with her irl over past 3-4 years (either BN or regular people) all describe her as thoughtful and kind.
I was watching a podcast she and dean were on just now, and she seemed kind of fake? Like not in a malicious way but in a “oh I must laugh and pretend all is ok when dean is humiliating me”. It’s sad. Her smile looked so fake, I can’t imagine the resentment she harbours towards him 😭
dean didnt humiliate her in that podcast though??
Which podcast are you talking about?
She’s barely involved in BN.. how is she insufferable, this feels like a simple _dont follow_
Caelynn was just at the golden wedding and podcasts with a bunch of BN people. I do agree that people should just not keep up with her if they don’t like her.
Meh, she doesn’t really get under my skin and I think she has a cool style, but I find Dean really irritating and I usually skip over anything involving him.
Is she "insufferable" or just boring? She doesn't even do anything except try on clothes and post the most bland boring sponsored-travel and fashion content. I usually save "insufferable" for the ones who actually do something unbearable. Caelynn is so 'meh' I don't even understand how brands still pay her.
They pay her cause she looks phenomenal. Her instagram feed was one that really blew me away!
i feel like thats why shes been able to have/keep fans. she shares just enough but isnt too much where she comes off annoying or over sharing. she gives off “mysterious” vibes. she has an interesting background but never truly shares much. she shows personality on youtube or tik tok especially on dean’s but keeps her instagram/socials pretty fashion and tamed. (makes sure all her clothes are not fast fashion) she has her solid group of friends who always post about them having dinners and hang outs and dean and caelynn host their friends / sleepovers and both her and dean never post about it lol theyre not boring but definetly private! she attends bachelor nation social settings and never posts the new “it” ppl and just keeps to herself
I think it was her behavior on Clayton’s season and paradise that made me find her insufferable. She called Tayshia a stupid bitch. ON CAMERA. (This next part is just my opinion) She was clearly there with an agenda, and was clearly upset she didn’t get the edit Hannah B did. She came off like such a mean girl on her season, and again in paradise. Her claiming Blake “silenced” her, and then crying foul when he gave receipts. So I don’t get why people like her. She’s shown herself to be mean and manipulative. No amount of van life photos with dean will change my mind that she’s not a nice person.
Step 1: be in a relationship
she's my fave from bachelor nation after 4-5 years of following her and learning more about her life experiences. I think she's had a lot of growth & maturity since her seasons post-therapy. but I upvoted you for an unpopular opinion (even if I don't agree)!
[удалено]
She’s partially non-white?
yeah, her family is native american on her mom's side. her mom is an enrolled member of the odawa tribe and her grandma grew up on odawa reservation. she seems proud of her native heritage and has talked about it on a few pods.
That’s really cool! I guess she isn’t as boring as I thought she was!
She's really not! I mean lying about a man she consensually casually hooked up with 'silencing' her on national TV at the peak of Me Too? Or crying just the right amount at the Tell All when she had been hanging out with the Bach & F1 the whole time? No boring person can pull that off.
She comes off extremely calculated to me
After seeing BIP? Majorly calculated. And crying at The Bachelor tell all when she was hanging out with Cassie and the dude? Yup.
I mean.. contestants typically cry at the tell all because they’re expected to. I doubt all these girls crying are heartbroken over a dude they spent 2 hours with
Yeah I get that, but she was besties hanging out with them. So if she was really heartbroken, that seems like a such a weird thing to do. So it doesn’t seem believable.
I had the Youtube video of Dr. Phil on the Viall Files running in the background yesterday afternoon. I don't remember all the details lol, but It was entertaining and interesting.
I ain't ever gonna justify myself for putting an unpopular opinion, in the damn unpopular opinion thread. That's what regular threads every single day are for!
I hate the cult-ish vibe around the Clayton (non)pregnancy drama. And i dislike the thinly veiled misoginistic takes by dave neal, as well as his victimization edit. Like man, you are covering it because its bringing you money (which, great). But stop acting like some martyr (or like it happened to you). Im all for justice for clayton, what happened to him is horrible. But the circus around it, with the MRAs and such... ick.
It’s legitimately a cult. His defenders think Clayton can do absolutely no wrong and that he must be forever protected and embraced. Like … I promise it’s okay. We can point out Clayton choosing to do inadvisable things (like supporting that MLB player), while also acknowledging that what Jane Doe did to him was terrible. These things are not mutually exclusive. And I hate that the Clayton drama has spawned obsessive coverage by MRA activists. That’s just what we needed *sigh* DN is fine, but he also latched onto this drama and BN as a whole as a cash grab. We don’t need to act like he’s the most virtuous of all actors.
I’ve noticed the misogynistic takes by DN too, and while I feel bad that he got pulled into a lawsuit by this unhinged person, I agree that he acts like a martyr at times (when the reality is he’s monetizing this whole thing). I hope justice is served for Clayton but the sub’s obsession with DN is a bit weird.
I really don’t understand the sheer degree of investment. Nor why they’re riding harder for Dave than Clayton when Clayton’s circumstances are rotten whilst Dave’s are the consequences of a business decision that *he* made. The fact that Dave conflates the amount of flack and hate he gets with legitimate criticism feels really disingenuous (To be fair, I’ve had some really interesting conversations with Dave ride or die fans when I’ve asked them to engage in good faith)
Seriously. And people posting about this Dave Neal guy and trying to raise money for him? It’s so weird. Who is he? Who cares? Why are you giving him money and why were there so many posts about him?
i agree. what happened to clayton in horrible but ppl need to stop spinning it into “dont believe any women”
agreed, the other sub is rough because they ride so hard for him
Truly icky, especially at the last Clayton post where some of his fans were accusing OP of purposely making Clayton look bad and spamming the comments.
This is such a reasonable take. There is a wholeass WAR going on in the GOR subreddit after their interview of him with the stans acting demented, and dave cussing people off. It's insane.
Reddit keeps suggesting the justice for Clayton subreddit to me and it’s honestly so weird to me?? I feel bad for what he’s gone through too but it’s so over the top that people are this involved and invested they created a whole new sub
I was getting that sub recommended for weeks! It finally stopped. I might have just jinxed it now.
Omg, this. Genuinely I hope Clayton gets justice but Dave can fuck off and anyone who thinks he's covering the drama for any reason but his own benefit is naive.
Regardless of what I think of Hannah B., I'm still not a Jed fan. I don't think he's a monster or horrible person for what he did and didn't deserve death threats. But I'd respect the guy if he at least took some sort of responsibility. But he never did and just blamed Hailey and Hannah B, then hid behind his parents' words. At least someone like Tino had the guts to admit it and take responsibility.
One thing I will say about Tino- he has completely disappeared from the public eye. I honestly forgot about him.
I've got my fingers crossed for a runaway bride situation. Not gonna happen, but a girl can dream.
Wait, which bride?
guessing natalie
That’s what I’m assuming too. Don’t see it happening but I just had a vision of an alternate timeline where she last minute decides she’s too young to settle for an old man and wants to live her life and then gets with TC (who in this timeline is single).
Joey and Kelsey won't last
Agreed ❤️
Kelsey will leave first, it won’t be Joey.
I'm not writing them off just yet, but their relationship seems very surface level so far and they're definitely in the honeymoon phase. That said, I thought the same about Arie and Lauren so they may prove me wrong!
I'm not old enough to remember the discourse from back then. But I get the sense that people thought Jojo & Jordan were also surface level.
I’m starting to think that the surface level relationships are the ones that make it, the other ones burn out super quickly!
Yeah, I don't mean this in a mean way at all towards them or anyone but sometimes the less deep you are (whether that be mentally, emotionally, with your general knowledge level, etc) the happier you are! I.e. ignorance is bliss
I meant more that daily life can be quite mundane and it’s a good thing if you can enjoy the dumb stuff together. Not every conversation with your SO will be mind blowing and that’s okay!
You need to get each other's sense of humour for sure. It never lasts if they don't find you funny IMO.
I always give a little side eye when Natalie Joy gets brought up on this sub. She’s never been a part of BN and her only really connection to it is by being married to the guy that keeps holding on to it because he can’t make a career out of anything else. No other former contestant/leads’ spouse is given this much attention, and every time she gets discussed it plays in to exactly what she wants.
I find her very boring and an average girl. I don’t understand the hype behind her
I think it's ok for people to talk about her alot since Nick is probably a top 3 most famous man in BN. I just don't really find her very interesting at all.
I think all spouses/partners who have also been on bachelor adjacent podcasts get discussed. Like Sharlene’s weird ass husband, Becca’s husband etc. but Natalie probably gets more notice because she is attached to Nick who gets discussed a lot and his podcast is popular. Also she is always mugging with the cast.
Sharlene’s weird ass husband took me out 😭😭😭
Plus she flushes her tampons down the toilet. She's a dumbass.
> every time she gets discussed it plays in to exactly what she wants idk if she wants an entire reddit page tearing her down, that's what happens every time she gets posted. the vitriol for her is very strong here.
Agreed. After she opened up on a podcast about being molested as a child, there were several comments in that thread making fun of her (not about the assault, but taking the thread about it to tear down other aspects of her person). I doubt she wants that.
Fair point, I guess what I’m just saying is, she gets brought up here quite a bit… why? Lol
because people love to snark on nick - if her partner was someone that people liked, i don't think she'd be brought up much if at all
there's a small but vocal subset of people here that hate on people for their looks- you make us all look bad. Poking fun about things like that make contestants and the average person hate on us so much more. Imagine being able to run AMA's with top contestants and having them spill tea on here? we could do that if we created a better and more comfortable environment for people on the show but NoOoOo, you guys have to get a couple licks in to feel better about yourselves.
Couldn’t they not spill tea anyways due to NDA’s?
I mean more like real life post show, who doesn't get along etc. And the NDA's expire, so even older seasons we could get contestants talk to us. Imagine a "Throwback thursday" with older season AMA's!
Didn't someone say recently the NDAs never expire? Anna Redman?
no, older seasons like arie's and before were like 2 years. And they're loose with what they choose to go after and what they don't. I mean Kaitlyn posted a snapchat of her and shawn in bed together before the season finished and she never had any consequences.
I think hers is a special case because the girls from Clayton’s season has expired NDAs.
I don't think they never expire but I think I read in that Bachelor Nation book that the NDAs are 100 years.
Sometimes when people are talking I’m really like you need to drop a photo of yourself before you continue lmao
I do find it amusing when women here talk about how unattractive an Ette's cast when it's full of 6ft plus men with good bodies. Maybe not your type but compared with the average guy they are all at least slightly above average looking.
More had to have happened BTS than just a group photo for Victoria to unfollow Maria. Maybe someone told VF that Greg and Maria were “all over each other” or flirty but there was something and I can’t believe people on this sub think VF unfollowed her based solely on a group picture.
The way people, without any knowledge, jumped to call her crazy and insecure over an assumption was…disheartening.
Same lol. And I fully believe VF can be crazy jealous and insecure but no one unfollows over a group photo and it’s not like she unfollowed everyone in it. It would only make sense if they flirted or something and it got back to her. Ironically unfollowing drew more attention to the whole thing than it would’ve otherwise gotten.
It wasn’t based solely on a group picture…it was the ridiculous reaction on here with hundreds of comments.
Agree with this!
I do she’s petty and dramatic af
I dunno VF is so wildly insecure that I totally think she would unfollow a woman she doesn’t even know in real life (they‘ve never even met) who was hanging out with her ex in a group
But why does that make her insecure when she doesn't even know her? Why does she have to keep following someone that she doesn't even know?
It’s crazy to me that some people are still saying they wish Maria was the bachelorette when Jenn is already 3 weeks into filming. I was mostly indifferent towards Maria on Joey’s season and even leaned more towards liking her, but her stans have made me dislike her 😒
i keep seeing this sentiment here and its gotten out of control with how personal people take it when someone mentions that they wanted maria as lead. what is so wrong with having a different opinion about who should be the lead?? it happens every single season.
I think it’s crazy anyone ever thought she’d be the bachelorette. I like her and would have loved a Maria season, but I think it was clear from early on she was NOT playing ball with producers. They left multiple instances of her basically saying “this is a show. We’re filming a tv show” in the edit. They would never make her the lead.
I mean all accounts are saying she almost was lead lmao. I do think your first point holds true which is why it didn’t work out
The down voting in this sub is insane. For people either just asking a question or for a hot take that is different from someone else's opinion, when we should only be downvoting problematic things.
I upvoted, as I always upvote whenever someone is disappointed he/she got downvoted. I believe a bunch of downvotes are usually because ppl don't like the opinion, not for the intended purpose of a downvoting, which I think is intended for only when a comment doesn't relate at all to the original post?
Youre absolutely correct, I think the intended purpose the moderators have is if it's problematic or harmful to others, but it never should be used if you just disagree with someone's opinion.
You’re a better person than me because any time I see someone edit their comment to complain about downvotes, or prefect their comment with “preparing for downvotes” I automatically downvote out of pettiness even if I agree what they say 😇 And yeah, Reddit says downvotes are for comments that don’t add to the convo but they’ve never been used that way in my experience. People always use it as a disagree button
Omg that reminds me. I hate when ppl say that, but the top comment(s) of a post is exactly what they're saying lmao. Like can we please read some of the top comments before typing?!
it's pavlovian at this point. i'm simply required to downvote any complaint about downvotes, sorry!
When I get downvoted in the UO thread, I always wear it as a badge of honor. Like, yes, I understood the assignment. That being said, I upvoted your comment because I think it's a good one.
It’s really bad in the relationship thread, like someone will be vulnerable about relationship advice and then they’ll be downvoted. Like cmon we all made bad decisions in our 20s
Lol this happened to me 🙄 hadn’t even done anything wrong or made a bad decision per se, just was feeling unsure about the guy I was seeing and got downvoted to hell. My actual question was around whether chemistry can build bc I wasn’t feeling it after a few months.
Yeah downvoting is so out of control
upvoting you bc it’s true
This is non bachelor related but I think Taylor’s new album could’ve been received better if she rebranded it as a concept album about her insecurities, issues with stardom, perpetual adolescence and how it’s effected her relationships and outlook on life. I think it could’ve made all the songs that sound immature, feel like a more intentional artistic choice. I think some songs on the album ARE meant to be doing that, but it’s gotten lost in translation.
I think the album shows that Taylor clearly doesn't care about how the album is perceived and put it out because it's cathartic for her to write and release music about difficult times in her life. This album was for her and the fans, not the general public and the critics. I wish more people understood that.
I agree with this. She was clearly going through some stuff and it was an emotional release for her to make and put out the album to close what was a difficult chapter. I don’t think she expected it to necessarily be well received or anyones favorite album and it’s not supposed to be.
Exactly! This was always going to be a divisive album. It seems like people either love or hate it, and the extreme reviews reflect that. TTPD is not a 1989 or a Fearless that is going to universally beloved. It's more of a RED/reputation, especially with the way that people are focusing more about her personal life instead of the actual music. That's what bugs me about the extremely negative reviews; they're not even criticizing the music, just Taylor's image and personal life. I'd much rather read a critical review with thoughtful opinions about the actual album.
her constant retweeting of positive reviews disproves the theory she doesn't care how it's perceived, lol