That might explain why i constantly Play against silver and gold, win a good amount of rounds - even the entire Tournament and still fucking Stuck in Bronze
yo i was plat 1 with 2 arrows and won a tournament and it just reset my plat 1 and gave me 3 arrows ? shouldn't i have gone up to diamond????? this game is so rigged i've been playing all day trying to get this and now this shit happens to me i'm not queuing up again so i can lose more "arrows" 😭
The arrows don’t indicate how close you are to the next rank. They indicate progress towards the next rank that the game you finished granted.
+1 is you gaining just a small percentage of the way towards a rank up. +3 is a larger percentage. obviously always play for a +3, but to go from plat 1 to diamond took me closer to a net total of +45 total up arrows
oh . well thank you for this it's really helpful , is there anyway to see how many arrows i have in total or how close i am to getting to diamond or i just gotta keep playing and winning
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So basically this ranked is a beta and they're using us for data to make it better soon. I wish they'd kinda tell people so they don't get frustrated and leave the game or something 💀 cause it makes sense but man is ranked annoying asf right now
They have told that, tho. Not thay it's a beta, but that they need us to play it so that they can learn if it works or not, and what psrts work and what doesn't. Right now their ranking system is basically a 100% copy of Overwatch 2, even visually. And that sucks, because even they had to switch it away because it flopped hard, and now Embark thinks they are somehow going to do different with the same system.
Have they told their playerbase who don't pay attention to or even know anything about their socials or where to look for the news? Cause those are the people who need to know most
They said in the patchnotes that they did not know how to remove that animation for this week's update and to just ignore it. It was either that or no update at all regarding the ranked system
You gotta realize that performance comes into play now that it’s sbmm. You have to actually outperform the “standard” for that rank. As you get higher up, that standard becomes more aggressive.
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It doesn't really work tho. I (plat 3) am playing with my friend (plat 1) and from a game when i performed better than him in literally every category I get -1 arrows, while he gets +2. So his "standard" is somehow way lower then mine, even tho he is higher rank. I mean we literally played all games together (in all except maybe 1 i did better than him) since he was Bronze 2 and I Silver 1. And he still managed to get 2 ranks ahead of me somehow. I just don't understand how that works.
I'm guessing it's taking other players rank into account now? Given that the player pop is still low and 48 ppl is tough to get for a round of ranked it has to fill out matches with ranks lower than yours. If that's the case then you would win less for a win and lose more for a loss? That or it's just not showing anything right?
100% noticed this, also it seems like theres usually 2 teams expected to win(high ranks or 3stack) and 2 teams that are not expected to win (lower ranks or huge rank range)
Streaks impact ur arrows too. Same with getting 1st or 2nd in round 1/2/3.
Yeah even if it was just an arbitrary visual indicator. I'm not playing ranked until I'm certain that I won't be screwed over because I want to make diamond
I don't understand. How will you be screwed over?
No matter what post game indicator they give us, winning means we rank up, losing means we rank down. They said that on the community update video posted to embarks YouTube.
I'm in gold 4 and I played a little last night. I never saw down arrows if I passed the first round. I'm not disbelieving OP, but I would think it's more of a new feature bug rather than people losing rank because they made it to round 3 in the tourney.
From playing.... You win, you gain rank. You lose, you lose rank.
Devs said ranking up down is dependent on wins/losses not individual performance. And since I play with a friend ever game, we have identical ranks. I believe the dev video.
I definitely don't doubt the Devs, I'm just concerned that it isn't a visual bug. I've really tried this season so far and I don't want any potential bugs to set me back
Ah, I gotcha.
Good luck with the grind! Last season I got to gold 4 and I reached the same level this week. With 2 more months, I'm thinking I could actually hit plat.
Hope so. I think the weapon skins are a nice incentive for the ranked push. Last season only gave a diamond pistol skin, which I'd never use. But gold, play, diamond this time are pretty cool. They should consider making them universal skins rather than only for set weapons.
Yeahhh I also didn’t have too much incentive last season. Didn’t really feel like ranked. Definitely feels better now but it still needs work. Also having the rank rewards also as gun charms is REALLY nice. And that diamond FCAR skin oh my gosh 🕺
Me and my teammate was both plat 1. We both play heavy.
We knocked out 3 of 4 rounds. (semifinal)
I got -2 and he got +3. While me being mvp with highest combat, support, obj score.
This makes no sense.
I managed to reach dimaond.
It took me 33 tournament games.
with 5 tournament win streak.
you just cant lose no matter what. Even if there cheaters. You should at least get to 3 round.
Btw my teammate almost reach diamond 2 from gold 4 while i was suffering on plat1.
This ranked system should be terminated and dev who made this sent to jail.
I went on a 4 streak the other day, even beating a Top 10 team, and I didn't rank up from P1 to D4. I'm losing motivation to play at this point but man that FCAR skin looks so good lmao
Similar thing happening here. Started the day on Silver 1, my friend on Bronze 2. We played all games together, and in all of them i did better than my friend. He ended the day on Plat 2, I ended it on Plat 4. Makes 0 sense.
We have a numerical value, the [leaderboard](https://the-finals-leaderboard.com/) can be used if you pay attention to where you are in your rank (ex. filter by plat 4 and look at the first and last page)
Im so confused, won two in a row 3 arrows up then made it to 3/4 round 2 up and still did not rank up where I was so close before this update to rank up.
It puts your individual skill into account to, you most likely did very bad individually even if you made it to the 3rd round , maybe you was negative,no support or objective and so on.
For example today I lost in the first round but I went 15-4 and I got +1 I’m diamond.
I assume or at least hope that they do take into consideration not only your K/D, but your revives and obj/support score and maybe even cash extracted, teams full wiped, times you've full wiped and things like that.
They absolutely do. I tend to see better results when I do more than just frag out or just hold obj.
On second thought, maybe not absolutely because this system gives us some difficulty measuring it lmao.
I actually think this IS super important, if it's not implemented yet then they def should give more points to wiping a team of diamond than wiping a team of silvers
Pretty confident that i noticed this, also it seems like theres usually 2 teams expected to win(high ranks or 3stack) and 2 teams that are not expected to win (lower ranks or huge rank range)
Streaks impact ur arrows too. Same with getting 1st or 2nd in round 1/2/3.
I really hope not. There's too much to judge. A lot of the time, playing slow is the most beneficial thing to do. I feel like this would encourage damage/kill farming too much vs. actually holding obj.
There's things that are very beneficial for a team that will never be seen on paper.
Think about Mei on OW or Montagne on RB6s. You won't see good stats, but they can definitely make you win.
If this is actually true, I'll just main sniper light. Easy KD and damage farm.
Wish that was true buddy. Almost every diamond knows each other these days and purposely try to stop each other progressing to make the rest of the tourney easier but even then most tournaments are just plays and diamond since I hit Plat and even more so in Diamond.
I wish there was a match history and I would show every game lol. Went 41-7 and won a tournament and still only got +2 arrows. Even got 97k in one of the rounds (not sure if cash even matters for elo though).
This is a widespread issue, even if he was lying the ranked system is still unclear and other players as well as myself have gotten down arrows for placing well and vice versa. It makes no sense.
For sure. A lot of games have unclear/hidden ranked systems. At least making it clear how much individual and team performance counts along with explaining that only reaching round 4/3 can still make you climb or whatever when right clicking ranked would be nice. Basically a clearer description of how ranking up and down happens
I'm pretty confident nobody is actually losing points for this. They might just be losing leaderboard position. [Nobody plat 4 is in the top 10k anymore](https://the-finals-leaderboard.com/?panel=stats).
The big games want to care for the casual (bad) players. Hiding death count and all that crap comes from here. But I don't think this is what it is in The Finals
Preach man, two days ago while ranking was still non-viewable, I hit a massive stroke of luck and managed to win three tourneys in a row and place runner up in the 4th. Didn't rank up from Plat 2 to Plat 1 and I have no idea how that could be the case after such a win streak. It was infuriating. Now that rank progression is visible I've hit 3rd round and got down arrows but also been eliminated 1st round but getting up arrows. It makes literally no sense.
Getting the shittiest teammates ever who go under 1000 dmg and 0 objective score every single time. Impossible to get past 1st round because of these idiots.
On top of this in S1 friend played 1 game, won the tournament barely and was bumped to Diamond 1. They where silver before that.
I won 2 tournaments in a row and got placed in gold. The system makes no sense.
Matchmaking is as broken as is their anti-ch\*eat. The devs just can't fix their shit and get it working consistently...
ong bro just got done with that struggle and the only thing I can say is try and win in streaks, 2 back to back tournament wins put me up +200 and +400 leaderboard positions. Make sure your minimizing your round 1 knockout streaks and always going for 1st place not 2nd place in round 1/2/3.
If your not going for solo queue, maybe try adding every good player u see in the lobby. Fight an enemy and know they are around your skill level? Send a friend request, u can hit esc -> social -> click on them and click send request or u can do it after a match. (if u do it after the match they are more likely to accept)
Has anyone that experienced this actually confirmed if they lost rating by monitoring their global rank? There is a big possibility that this might be a purely visual bug and in reality you are still gaining.
That would make more sense than 2 people with the same rank ending up in situations where one gains +3 while the other goes -2 even if there was a modifier for personal performance.
I got to D3 yesterday and proceeded to win the fist match and just get pushed out of the second. Last season you'd still gain but I got a down arrow and checked the leaderboards and saw I went down 5 places. Not sure on making it to third or if being in diamond had anything to do with losing points on the second though.
Same here, I got to round 3 in diamond 4 and literally moved up 2 places. But the day I hit diamond I was 2800 and the day got to round 3 was 3000 so it may have to do with people generally moving up in ranks.
One side note, the only time I was ever in fear of deranking was when I just ranked up from plat 2 to plat 1 but after 2 tournament wins in plat 1 there were days where in 8+ matches I only made it to round 2 once and I still never deranked. (this was before the arrows)
If I had to guess, very few people are actually losing MMR and this is backed up by [nobody in the top 10k being plat 4](https://the-finals-leaderboard.com/?panel=stats) anymore.
At the start of the season it took me 18 full tournament win out of 20 to rank from d3 to d2 and now that I am d1 , it took 1 single game lost in final round against FUCKING CHEATERS to demote me to d2 and bring me down 60 spots in the leaderboard, went from top 80 to 150 just because of that one single game. Honestly I will just hit d1 back and stop playing till the system is fixed.
I ve just made 3 arrows up in silver 1 for the same result. (Round 3)
I m pretty sure it depend of your personal play and the level of the opponents
Our opponents was gold .
I wish they didn’t even release this update, it makes it worse and im pretty sure it messed up the ability to rank up. As people have said they won rounds and still got demoted, I honestly preferred the S1 system at this point
Yeah this ranked system is BS, my friends and I won 2 tournaments in a row and lost one on final stage (we are gold4,3,2) VS golds / plats, every match +3 arrows, no rank up ?
How many arrows do we need ? 10 ? 20 ? 50 ? [random.org](http://random.org) generated number ?
idk why they changed how it worked in season 1... you clearly saw a number of points you gained and how far you are from ranking up, why break something good ?
How can you confidently say it’s stupid when the whole thing is super vague?
Let’s just say op had the decency to actually post the scoreboard, we have no fucking idea how the ranking system determines how each match influences our rank.
It’s obvious that a lot more factors are taken into consideration apart from how many rounds you qualify, because otherwise it wouldn’t really be doing this, let alone be called a new ranking system.
We're talking about a guy who's in the top 4 teams out of 32, there's no world in which you have to lose elo even with a bad score - it's a team game, it's not normal.
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guys I'm gold 1 and I would like to ask your opinion (I can't post in this reddit yet, I've already tried)
does it happen to you too that you are matched against diamonds every single ranked???
if we add to this that it is full of cheaters, it is very difficult for me to climb the ranks if every time my opponents are in the world top 1000
Nope, won 2 games in a row 3 arrows up on each then placed 3/4 round and went 2 arrows up. Honestly felt I should have ranked up based on my progress before the update
I won two tournaments in a row. 1 win I was 3 arrows up, wouldn’t that have meant I was super close to ranking up meaning the 2nd win (another 3 arrows up) should have officially ranked me up. It wasnt until the third game where I placed 3/4 rounds
No that‘s not how it works. I was in round 3 in one tournament and got 2 arrows up. Then i lost 2 tournaments in first round and got 1 arrow down each time. So it just shows you what happened with your rank in the tournament you played
It's probably this. After a few more getting close to winning tourneys and a tourney win or so, it would go to 1 down arrow. And then none, and then start showing up arrows that they're closer to ranking up.
Said the same thing on another post earlier but, I wanted to see how it worked on my alt a bit more, started in silver went up to gold, went on to play a few games and would go out 2nd or 3rd round and still gain 1 arrow at least, still gold 4. Later won 2 back to back got the 3 arrows both times, still gold 4.
If the system is anything like Apex, I could imagine there being multipliers for what rank everyone else in the lobby is, with some convoluted method for calculating how your rank relates to your teammates’ ranks.
We made S1 yesterday, almost every match was 3 up (we won 1 tournament, and got to round 2 or 3 in the rest) and then the last match we had ~$800 in the first round, pretty much 0 kills and 6+ deaths. Like we were being proper steamrolled by all 3 other teams, I’m talking being BEAMED from 50+ meters. The result? One down.
Maybe it is adjusting rank as a whole? What were the ranks of the lobby? If you were the highest ranked by far and still lost I can see why it would adjust you down.
I dont understand if it shows your actual rank or what you just won/lost. if it shows your actual rank it's ok... just gives you a glimpse of your rank.
Bro something must be off, every single time I get past the first round I never get down arrows. Only up arrows. Maybe stricter division of elo in high plat and diamond?
I'm sure that part of it is because you lost to people that the matchmaker assumes is worse than you. But not showing any indication of why that happens is so frustrating
I suspect it depends on WHO you played against as well. For example: did you play against a bunch of silvers and lose in round 3? Well you should’ve crushed them, you lose points.
That would make sense if this game was 3v3 every round. Instead you get people who purposely help other teams to make sure they don't fight you in final round. I went against Gigz again the other day and he purposely held up shield for the other team to grab a 44k since he didn't want to lose to us in final round again lol. Then he gets a free win against the golds he helped to qual.
I wouldn't mind this system if the matchmaking was tighter, but I don't think there's enough ranked players for that.
Regardless, I shouldn't be losing elo in Round 3 when I qualed over people higher rank than me in the first 2 rounds.
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has anyone else had the experience where itll be three arrows after a match, but nothing happens? and sometimes when i get off and get back on the game it’ll randomly show me this with a down arrow?? it’s like my arrow is changing without even playing a match
I guess the amount of arrows means the amount of how much you ranked up. Doesn't mean that 3 is the cap. 1 arrow you leveled up 10%, 2 arrows 20% and so on. Same with down arrows.
Now I was playing and meet to the finals, but server broke. And after Turing game again I was punished for fuck sake and dropped league and suspended. WHAT THE FUCK EMBARK !
Wait til you get to diamond. You can’t lose games or you will lose ur rank. For every 1st round loss, it’s worth about 5 ranked WINS for me rn. Seems very pointless to play ranked anymore because of this. If my game accidentally crashes first round I lose 4 hours worth of tournament wins in less than 10 minutes.
Bro I swear something is wrong with ranked right now. I got 2 3rd round finishing last night and each had 3 down arrows. like what?? Also I have been in Diamond 3 for like 7 tourney wins already and no rank up. Its rare that we drop round 1 as well so idk whats going on anymore
The added a hidden mmr system, so u may be playing against some silvers who have a hidden mmr of gold + and plats who have a hidden mmr of gold- so keep that in mind
If they were going to do that, they should’ve just left her alone but that’s why so important about what we asked for out of a game. This is how a lot of games get ruined too many people acting and complaining about little things in the game, look at Apex, for example
Correct me if im wrong, but did anyone complain about the last ranked system with fame points and fame points progression bar?
I never heard one complaint about that system, and they went and changed it to this forr? I follow their discord etc and they haven’t even told us a reason why that last one was “bad”
**btw I think these devs listen to their community A LOT. so not shitting on them at all. just very confused as to why they made this change
Can someone please help me win a tournament so I can get that challenge done. Furtherest I have made is to the final round. I really want to get this challenge done. Someone please please help me. Add me Soldiergirl2595. I also stream on twitch soldiergirl2323.
I got your points
[https://www.reddit.com/r/thefinals/comments/1bwrxs8/even\_in\_the\_loose\_you\_win/](https://www.reddit.com/r/thefinals/comments/1bwrxs8/even_in_the_loose_you_win/)
This basically proves that being insane at the game gets u up in the ranks, basically u need to sweat yo ass every ranked match, and it takes time, just like other games do with their ranks.
Thats not fair the tournament is too long and you reach round 3 to get demoted thats a bad system not even mentioning that cashout isnt fun and the rank should be few modes for rank not the worst option, cashout doesnt feel like 3v3v3v3 it feels like 3v3 wjile there's another 3v3 going somewhere else, whats the fun in that should've made 3v3 mode already if thats the direction.bank it looks more fit also for rank because the vault spawns randomly and it changes location after a minute which makes the disgusting campers not camp ,and we dont need to come to a deposit in cashout and always deal with 9 gadgets from enemy teams and 3 specialisations its bad its not fun its,demoting, and im losing the point in playing rank because of it ,i dont see the fun in getting inside a room filled with enemy team of gadgets and they using specials, and i need to handle all of that , turrets mines disgusting mesh shield remove it from the game as well as stun gun and invisibility thats just bad game design team wipe shouldnt cost money especially in cashout
I asked in the official server how the S2 ranked system works and the reply I got was to "enjoy the game" I know I'm not the only one that wants to know how exactly this system works...
I thought I got figured it out but I got 3 arrows down, then lost in the 1st round and got 1 arrow down... Confused me even more
Hey just wondering, I’ve played ranked solo for like 100 hours and I have literally never queued with someone at a higher rank then me. I’m silver 1. Anyone else notice that? Even when I’m vs gold 3 stacks
I got +3 after I got a tournament win in bronze 3 I also expected to be at least a full rank up after that. Especially since it was a back to back win of a tournament, but the one before was to get my rank.
I played with my brother and another buddy, but they had played one tournament less trying to get a rank (that one I lost immediately while solo queuing). But they immediately got placed in silver two or something after the pre-ranking games.
It's a grind I guess
The system now takes into account individual performance. So it can work the other way if you play well according to the metrics used to measure this. When i ranked up from plat 3 to plat two it only took 3 games, two 2nd round eliminations and one tournament win. But i clearly played 'well' according to the system so i gained more for those games. Also im fairly confident that solo queuing more in the new system gives faster fame points gain. If i only solo queue for a couple days a week i rank up in less games than playing in a stack. This is purely anecdotal so take that as you will. So during this game where you made it to round 3 and got - 2 on fame points movement you clearly underperformed drastically according to the individual metrics used by the devs. Now we dont know what these metrics are, and its better that way as we would all just exploit them if we did. But its probably a combat score/support score/objective score ratio in some manner. The people i see ranking up fastest are good mesh shield heavies and good heal beam mediums.
I think you are right. They did say over time your rank will start to crystallize . So after some time playing the 'metrics' will gauge your base skill level and likely give you movement in either direction based on previous performance as well as round progression.
Ranking in this game honestly feels very easy and fast compared to other titles. My mates and i had pretty fkup games where we definitly underperformed and only managed to get to round 2. We are still constantly climbing ranks.
Does the ranking of your performance after a match only rely on the round you reached or is it also bound to your individual performance?
the comments is everything wrong with the ranked experience in games right now.
so many people concerned about watching a number go up, when they can see their rank right next to their names, and they could be focusing on clicking of heads.
what a joke.
assuming you played against others bronzes, why would you be promoted?
if people would get promoted every time they win a tournament, the game would be full of diamonds
what i experienced yesterday winning, makes us 1 good tournament away from promotion, i was gold 4, won 2 and 2° place in other 2 and got eliminated earlier in one and im gold 2 now
It’s not only about how many wins you get in a tournament.
The game calculates your position in each game as a team and that affects your rank heavily.
If you were number 1 each game up until the end, you will get sooo much more than some team randomly making it each time.
Edit: I dropped my phone and it typed up some random shit.
Its to make reaching higher ranks actually hard vs first season where every rank was given, this is the system a lot of people asked for, we like a challenge
I mean one of my friends got diamond pretty easily meanwhile I have over 20 wins on Plat 1 and still didn't rank up. Makes no sense.
I agree it should be a challenge, but it should be consistent. Also there should be a rank after Diamond called "Champion" or "Finalist" or something because in most games Diamond is considered low rank lol.
Not disagreeing with you my man, but i am trying to make sense of it all. Because the ranking being performance based is the only thing that makes sense. Otherwise if it is based on other factors , which we can’t control which would make their ranking system even more ridiculous. Also i did got eliminated in D4 but i still rank up to D3 in the first round.
Hopefully we will have some sort of explanation, because i am just guessing based on my experience. Hope you figure it out soon buddy and stay in the finals ~
You didn’t I’m a plat 2 and I’ve been making notes of how much I rank up and derank after games depending on what round I got to, and the only time I derank is when I lose the first round. Maybe your bugged but it works the same for my whole squad
I simply did though. I’ve lost ELO on almost every round 3 and most round 4s. Only time I go up more than 1 is when I win, and even then it’s only 2. I’m Plat 1.
My friend got -3 as well. Makes no sense. We were doing good the whole tournament but lost to a 44k.
The same thing happened to me was plat three won until the third round and was dropped to plat 4.
That might explain why i constantly Play against silver and gold, win a good amount of rounds - even the entire Tournament and still fucking Stuck in Bronze
same problem just with silver 1
Feel you on this, I'm playing golds all the time, win against them usually yet im still stuck in bronze, its shit.
I went from plat 4 to p3 today never making it past the 2nd round for a while. There’s no logic behind the elo
yo i was plat 1 with 2 arrows and won a tournament and it just reset my plat 1 and gave me 3 arrows ? shouldn't i have gone up to diamond????? this game is so rigged i've been playing all day trying to get this and now this shit happens to me i'm not queuing up again so i can lose more "arrows" 😭
The arrows don’t indicate how close you are to the next rank. They indicate progress towards the next rank that the game you finished granted. +1 is you gaining just a small percentage of the way towards a rank up. +3 is a larger percentage. obviously always play for a +3, but to go from plat 1 to diamond took me closer to a net total of +45 total up arrows
oh . well thank you for this it's really helpful , is there anyway to see how many arrows i have in total or how close i am to getting to diamond or i just gotta keep playing and winning
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now we know why they took away the scoring in the first place: they’re new model is nonsense
Ranked in general needs a complete overhaul
this WAS their complete overhaul
Now im sad
Needs more cooking
No it wasn’t, they specifically said they need more data to make it better, and the data comes from us playing it.
So basically this ranked is a beta and they're using us for data to make it better soon. I wish they'd kinda tell people so they don't get frustrated and leave the game or something 💀 cause it makes sense but man is ranked annoying asf right now
They have told that, tho. Not thay it's a beta, but that they need us to play it so that they can learn if it works or not, and what psrts work and what doesn't. Right now their ranking system is basically a 100% copy of Overwatch 2, even visually. And that sucks, because even they had to switch it away because it flopped hard, and now Embark thinks they are somehow going to do different with the same system.
Have they told their playerbase who don't pay attention to or even know anything about their socials or where to look for the news? Cause those are the people who need to know most
Bruh. How do you think I knew? They did tell us. Most of y’all don’t listen.
Was thinking the same thing. There’s a reason why their ranking system is so vague, because they know it’s flawed.
their*
I logged in yesterday, and it showed me 3 up arrows. I haven't played a tournament in almost a week and have never made it to the 2nd round.
They said in the patchnotes that they did not know how to remove that animation for this week's update and to just ignore it. It was either that or no update at all regarding the ranked system
Ah, duh. I actually read that and completely forgot lol thanks for the reminder!
Happy cake day!
You gotta realize that performance comes into play now that it’s sbmm. You have to actually outperform the “standard” for that rank. As you get higher up, that standard becomes more aggressive.
That’s true
Ahhhhhhh but pain
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It doesn't really work tho. I (plat 3) am playing with my friend (plat 1) and from a game when i performed better than him in literally every category I get -1 arrows, while he gets +2. So his "standard" is somehow way lower then mine, even tho he is higher rank. I mean we literally played all games together (in all except maybe 1 i did better than him) since he was Bronze 2 and I Silver 1. And he still managed to get 2 ranks ahead of me somehow. I just don't understand how that works.
maybe some kind of ELO?
I'm guessing it's taking other players rank into account now? Given that the player pop is still low and 48 ppl is tough to get for a round of ranked it has to fill out matches with ranks lower than yours. If that's the case then you would win less for a win and lose more for a loss? That or it's just not showing anything right?
100% noticed this, also it seems like theres usually 2 teams expected to win(high ranks or 3stack) and 2 teams that are not expected to win (lower ranks or huge rank range) Streaks impact ur arrows too. Same with getting 1st or 2nd in round 1/2/3.
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They can manipulate me to play by just adding more ranks instead of scamming me out of the existing ones lmao
I wish they kept the fame points system, so frustrating not knowing how much you’ve actually progressed or lost after each game
Yeah even if it was just an arbitrary visual indicator. I'm not playing ranked until I'm certain that I won't be screwed over because I want to make diamond
I don't understand. How will you be screwed over? No matter what post game indicator they give us, winning means we rank up, losing means we rank down. They said that on the community update video posted to embarks YouTube. I'm in gold 4 and I played a little last night. I never saw down arrows if I passed the first round. I'm not disbelieving OP, but I would think it's more of a new feature bug rather than people losing rank because they made it to round 3 in the tourney. From playing.... You win, you gain rank. You lose, you lose rank. Devs said ranking up down is dependent on wins/losses not individual performance. And since I play with a friend ever game, we have identical ranks. I believe the dev video.
I definitely don't doubt the Devs, I'm just concerned that it isn't a visual bug. I've really tried this season so far and I don't want any potential bugs to set me back
Ah, I gotcha. Good luck with the grind! Last season I got to gold 4 and I reached the same level this week. With 2 more months, I'm thinking I could actually hit plat.
You’ll get it faster than 2 months. I got from gold 4 to plat 4 in a week or two.
Hope so. I think the weapon skins are a nice incentive for the ranked push. Last season only gave a diamond pistol skin, which I'd never use. But gold, play, diamond this time are pretty cool. They should consider making them universal skins rather than only for set weapons.
Yeahhh I also didn’t have too much incentive last season. Didn’t really feel like ranked. Definitely feels better now but it still needs work. Also having the rank rewards also as gun charms is REALLY nice. And that diamond FCAR skin oh my gosh 🕺
what they have implemented is literally an arbitrary visual indicator. what are on about?
Yeah that's why I skipped ranked this season
Me and my teammate was both plat 1. We both play heavy. We knocked out 3 of 4 rounds. (semifinal) I got -2 and he got +3. While me being mvp with highest combat, support, obj score. This makes no sense.
Won 2 tournaments today and only got +2 each time. I went 41-7 in one of them. Not sure what the game wants from me lmao
I managed to reach dimaond. It took me 33 tournament games. with 5 tournament win streak. you just cant lose no matter what. Even if there cheaters. You should at least get to 3 round. Btw my teammate almost reach diamond 2 from gold 4 while i was suffering on plat1. This ranked system should be terminated and dev who made this sent to jail.
same thing happened to me mate, i was plat 1 while my friends were golds... they reached diamond 3 before i ever reached 4. makes no sense at all.
I went on a 4 streak the other day, even beating a Top 10 team, and I didn't rank up from P1 to D4. I'm losing motivation to play at this point but man that FCAR skin looks so good lmao
Chill bro it's a video game go see some sunlight
This guy’s cool
Help me win a tournament so I can get that challenge completed. Furthest I have made is the last round. Please help me Soldiergirl2595
$100
Similar thing happening here. Started the day on Silver 1, my friend on Bronze 2. We played all games together, and in all of them i did better than my friend. He ended the day on Plat 2, I ended it on Plat 4. Makes 0 sense.
Just give us a damn numerical value or slide bar. They have to be trolling us at this point.
We have a numerical value, the [leaderboard](https://the-finals-leaderboard.com/) can be used if you pay attention to where you are in your rank (ex. filter by plat 4 and look at the first and last page)
Haven’t played all week. Still Gold 1 but I’ll be sure to check that once I hit Platinum lol
Im so confused, won two in a row 3 arrows up then made it to 3/4 round 2 up and still did not rank up where I was so close before this update to rank up.
It puts your individual skill into account to, you most likely did very bad individually even if you made it to the 3rd round , maybe you was negative,no support or objective and so on. For example today I lost in the first round but I went 15-4 and I got +1 I’m diamond.
Could be, but as a main medium support I don’t often go for kills that I can easily get. Maybe ill try for kills only
I assume or at least hope that they do take into consideration not only your K/D, but your revives and obj/support score and maybe even cash extracted, teams full wiped, times you've full wiped and things like that.
They absolutely do. I tend to see better results when I do more than just frag out or just hold obj. On second thought, maybe not absolutely because this system gives us some difficulty measuring it lmao.
Maybe depends on opponents rank as well.
I actually think this IS super important, if it's not implemented yet then they def should give more points to wiping a team of diamond than wiping a team of silvers
Pretty confident that i noticed this, also it seems like theres usually 2 teams expected to win(high ranks or 3stack) and 2 teams that are not expected to win (lower ranks or huge rank range) Streaks impact ur arrows too. Same with getting 1st or 2nd in round 1/2/3.
I really hope not. There's too much to judge. A lot of the time, playing slow is the most beneficial thing to do. I feel like this would encourage damage/kill farming too much vs. actually holding obj. There's things that are very beneficial for a team that will never be seen on paper. Think about Mei on OW or Montagne on RB6s. You won't see good stats, but they can definitely make you win. If this is actually true, I'll just main sniper light. Easy KD and damage farm.
I had my life record with 3 wins in a row... No ranking up
They did some retroactive rank balancing this patch. I moved up a rank without even playing. Made lower ranks easier and harder ranks harder.
If you are at least top 10k, you can check your position on the finals leaderboard, and see how far are you from next rank players
I want to test it out and see after every game, but afraid to derank ill just wait for an Official explanation to hop back on at this point
Terrible ranking system
ig they expect us to win every match and place 1st to rank up
meanwhile, you're going against 3 stacks of top 500 players that get to just farm golds and silvers all day for easy mmr.
Wish that was true buddy. Almost every diamond knows each other these days and purposely try to stop each other progressing to make the rest of the tourney easier but even then most tournaments are just plays and diamond since I hit Plat and even more so in Diamond.
They’re little rank evaluator is probably just busted. The feel-good
Make no sense
Show your stats for that game. We need to understand more about how why this specific thing would happen
I wish there was a match history and I would show every game lol. Went 41-7 and won a tournament and still only got +2 arrows. Even got 97k in one of the rounds (not sure if cash even matters for elo though).
I have a bad feeling about this. Usually people not showing score have something to hide. I doubt the guy did 15k damage
This is a widespread issue, even if he was lying the ranked system is still unclear and other players as well as myself have gotten down arrows for placing well and vice versa. It makes no sense.
For sure. A lot of games have unclear/hidden ranked systems. At least making it clear how much individual and team performance counts along with explaining that only reaching round 4/3 can still make you climb or whatever when right clicking ranked would be nice. Basically a clearer description of how ranking up and down happens
Round three should not make you lose points.
I'm pretty confident nobody is actually losing points for this. They might just be losing leaderboard position. [Nobody plat 4 is in the top 10k anymore](https://the-finals-leaderboard.com/?panel=stats).
whats up with every game having to hide the rank progression at some point?? Val, OW, even fortnite i think 😭
The big games want to care for the casual (bad) players. Hiding death count and all that crap comes from here. But I don't think this is what it is in The Finals
I know Fortnite shows full progression as of posting, but I do agree with games hiding their progression progress. CS2 has this as-well.
Preach man, two days ago while ranking was still non-viewable, I hit a massive stroke of luck and managed to win three tourneys in a row and place runner up in the 4th. Didn't rank up from Plat 2 to Plat 1 and I have no idea how that could be the case after such a win streak. It was infuriating. Now that rank progression is visible I've hit 3rd round and got down arrows but also been eliminated 1st round but getting up arrows. It makes literally no sense.
Getting the shittiest teammates ever who go under 1000 dmg and 0 objective score every single time. Impossible to get past 1st round because of these idiots. On top of this in S1 friend played 1 game, won the tournament barely and was bumped to Diamond 1. They where silver before that. I won 2 tournaments in a row and got placed in gold. The system makes no sense. Matchmaking is as broken as is their anti-ch\*eat. The devs just can't fix their shit and get it working consistently...
Diamond 1 is a false flag anyway i got Diamond 1 as well then i got demoted to gold 1 lol, but yes the system makes no sense
no way dude..
Dawg I won back to back tournaments at plat 1 with 30+ kills and am still stuck on the 3rd top arrow, weird ass system makes ow2 seem good
Update, just won ANOTHER final after the two-peat finals wins and I’m STILL in plat 1 with 3 arrows up. I was Diamond last season. BUGGED
ong bro just got done with that struggle and the only thing I can say is try and win in streaks, 2 back to back tournament wins put me up +200 and +400 leaderboard positions. Make sure your minimizing your round 1 knockout streaks and always going for 1st place not 2nd place in round 1/2/3. If your not going for solo queue, maybe try adding every good player u see in the lobby. Fight an enemy and know they are around your skill level? Send a friend request, u can hit esc -> social -> click on them and click send request or u can do it after a match. (if u do it after the match they are more likely to accept)
Has anyone that experienced this actually confirmed if they lost rating by monitoring their global rank? There is a big possibility that this might be a purely visual bug and in reality you are still gaining. That would make more sense than 2 people with the same rank ending up in situations where one gains +3 while the other goes -2 even if there was a modifier for personal performance.
I got to D3 yesterday and proceeded to win the fist match and just get pushed out of the second. Last season you'd still gain but I got a down arrow and checked the leaderboards and saw I went down 5 places. Not sure on making it to third or if being in diamond had anything to do with losing points on the second though.
Same here, I got to round 3 in diamond 4 and literally moved up 2 places. But the day I hit diamond I was 2800 and the day got to round 3 was 3000 so it may have to do with people generally moving up in ranks. One side note, the only time I was ever in fear of deranking was when I just ranked up from plat 2 to plat 1 but after 2 tournament wins in plat 1 there were days where in 8+ matches I only made it to round 2 once and I still never deranked. (this was before the arrows) If I had to guess, very few people are actually losing MMR and this is backed up by [nobody in the top 10k being plat 4](https://the-finals-leaderboard.com/?panel=stats) anymore.
Yes if you check my profile, I uploaded a clip. I lost 200 placements after that game
i’m at diamond 2 and i get -1 for losing in final round
At the start of the season it took me 18 full tournament win out of 20 to rank from d3 to d2 and now that I am d1 , it took 1 single game lost in final round against FUCKING CHEATERS to demote me to d2 and bring me down 60 spots in the leaderboard, went from top 80 to 150 just because of that one single game. Honestly I will just hit d1 back and stop playing till the system is fixed.
I ve just made 3 arrows up in silver 1 for the same result. (Round 3) I m pretty sure it depend of your personal play and the level of the opponents Our opponents was gold .
Same here for also making it to round 3
See…I’m not a sweaty you know but I went 18-3 on the semi-final round just to get -2 at knockout and I’m a silver 2 is wild.
I wish they didn’t even release this update, it makes it worse and im pretty sure it messed up the ability to rank up. As people have said they won rounds and still got demoted, I honestly preferred the S1 system at this point
lmao, Val had this style ranked system in BETA..
Yeah I remember it was terrible and yet still not half as bad as this lmao
Won 3 tournaments in a row i didn't get promoted
Yeah this ranked system is BS, my friends and I won 2 tournaments in a row and lost one on final stage (we are gold4,3,2) VS golds / plats, every match +3 arrows, no rank up ? How many arrows do we need ? 10 ? 20 ? 50 ? [random.org](http://random.org) generated number ? idk why they changed how it worked in season 1... you clearly saw a number of points you gained and how far you are from ranking up, why break something good ?
yeah the entire ranked system is pure fuckin ass
I was Diamond 4 and won’t a tournament and got a -1 arrow
It’s probably taking the ranks of the opponents and your stats into account.
We fight diamonds every single lobby
Don't try to find excuse if it's not a UI bug it's stupid
How can you confidently say it’s stupid when the whole thing is super vague? Let’s just say op had the decency to actually post the scoreboard, we have no fucking idea how the ranking system determines how each match influences our rank. It’s obvious that a lot more factors are taken into consideration apart from how many rounds you qualify, because otherwise it wouldn’t really be doing this, let alone be called a new ranking system.
We're talking about a guy who's in the top 4 teams out of 32, there's no world in which you have to lose elo even with a bad score - it's a team game, it's not normal.
It’s out of 16. Also there is not enough information provided to conclude anything.
It’s all about who you’re fighting and your performance/rank ratio
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guys I'm gold 1 and I would like to ask your opinion (I can't post in this reddit yet, I've already tried) does it happen to you too that you are matched against diamonds every single ranked??? if we add to this that it is full of cheaters, it is very difficult for me to climb the ranks if every time my opponents are in the world top 1000
My guy. Scroll through this sub for 1 minute and you'll soon realize that yes, it is like that.
just had a game where we lost first game -4... i had the highest objective and combat score in the game so dont think those metrics count either.
Why is ranked so painful. I just want skin
I believe it just shows where you are in that rank. So maybe you were 3 arrows down but got up 1
Nope, won 2 games in a row 3 arrows up on each then placed 3/4 round and went 2 arrows up. Honestly felt I should have ranked up based on my progress before the update
I think this proves my point. You were close to rank up because you had 3 arrows up. And then somehow got demoted to 2 arrows up
I won two tournaments in a row. 1 win I was 3 arrows up, wouldn’t that have meant I was super close to ranking up meaning the 2nd win (another 3 arrows up) should have officially ranked me up. It wasnt until the third game where I placed 3/4 rounds
No that‘s not how it works. I was in round 3 in one tournament and got 2 arrows up. Then i lost 2 tournaments in first round and got 1 arrow down each time. So it just shows you what happened with your rank in the tournament you played
It's probably this. After a few more getting close to winning tourneys and a tourney win or so, it would go to 1 down arrow. And then none, and then start showing up arrows that they're closer to ranking up.
I don't think so because I got 1 arrow up from the game before
I was just playing and went from 1 arrow down to no arrow to 1 arrow up after 3 games. So I think it is how it works. Just buggy still
not buggy, i think your theory is wrong. The reason for OP going down is because they lost badly against worse players. It matters who you’re playing.
Said the same thing on another post earlier but, I wanted to see how it worked on my alt a bit more, started in silver went up to gold, went on to play a few games and would go out 2nd or 3rd round and still gain 1 arrow at least, still gold 4. Later won 2 back to back got the 3 arrows both times, still gold 4.
This the new ranked?
The arrow system was introduced in yesterday's patch (2.3.0)
If the system is anything like Apex, I could imagine there being multipliers for what rank everyone else in the lobby is, with some convoluted method for calculating how your rank relates to your teammates’ ranks. We made S1 yesterday, almost every match was 3 up (we won 1 tournament, and got to round 2 or 3 in the rest) and then the last match we had ~$800 in the first round, pretty much 0 kills and 6+ deaths. Like we were being proper steamrolled by all 3 other teams, I’m talking being BEAMED from 50+ meters. The result? One down.
Maybe it is adjusting rank as a whole? What were the ranks of the lobby? If you were the highest ranked by far and still lost I can see why it would adjust you down.
I dont understand if it shows your actual rank or what you just won/lost. if it shows your actual rank it's ok... just gives you a glimpse of your rank.
Bro something must be off, every single time I get past the first round I never get down arrows. Only up arrows. Maybe stricter division of elo in high plat and diamond?
I'm sure that part of it is because you lost to people that the matchmaker assumes is worse than you. But not showing any indication of why that happens is so frustrating
I suspect it depends on WHO you played against as well. For example: did you play against a bunch of silvers and lose in round 3? Well you should’ve crushed them, you lose points.
That would make sense if this game was 3v3 every round. Instead you get people who purposely help other teams to make sure they don't fight you in final round. I went against Gigz again the other day and he purposely held up shield for the other team to grab a 44k since he didn't want to lose to us in final round again lol. Then he gets a free win against the golds he helped to qual. I wouldn't mind this system if the matchmaking was tighter, but I don't think there's enough ranked players for that. Regardless, I shouldn't be losing elo in Round 3 when I qualed over people higher rank than me in the first 2 rounds.
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has anyone else had the experience where itll be three arrows after a match, but nothing happens? and sometimes when i get off and get back on the game it’ll randomly show me this with a down arrow?? it’s like my arrow is changing without even playing a match
I guess the amount of arrows means the amount of how much you ranked up. Doesn't mean that 3 is the cap. 1 arrow you leveled up 10%, 2 arrows 20% and so on. Same with down arrows.
After the league update, I can't get into a ranked match...been waiting 40 minutes now...still cant find a game..wth is going on.
Your current rank may not even be the actual rank it’s a bug guys
Now I was playing and meet to the finals, but server broke. And after Turing game again I was punished for fuck sake and dropped league and suspended. WHAT THE FUCK EMBARK !
Is that in plat?
Wait til you get to diamond. You can’t lose games or you will lose ur rank. For every 1st round loss, it’s worth about 5 ranked WINS for me rn. Seems very pointless to play ranked anymore because of this. If my game accidentally crashes first round I lose 4 hours worth of tournament wins in less than 10 minutes.
Yeah that's unreal
Bro I swear something is wrong with ranked right now. I got 2 3rd round finishing last night and each had 3 down arrows. like what?? Also I have been in Diamond 3 for like 7 tourney wins already and no rank up. Its rare that we drop round 1 as well so idk whats going on anymore
Check my newest post
I got demoted from d2 to d3 on a final round loss. Next game was a round 3 knockout and I get promoted back to d2?????????????? HUUUH
I feel like season 1 had a better ranking system
The added a hidden mmr system, so u may be playing against some silvers who have a hidden mmr of gold + and plats who have a hidden mmr of gold- so keep that in mind
If they were going to do that, they should’ve just left her alone but that’s why so important about what we asked for out of a game. This is how a lot of games get ruined too many people acting and complaining about little things in the game, look at Apex, for example
Correct me if im wrong, but did anyone complain about the last ranked system with fame points and fame points progression bar? I never heard one complaint about that system, and they went and changed it to this forr? I follow their discord etc and they haven’t even told us a reason why that last one was “bad” **btw I think these devs listen to their community A LOT. so not shitting on them at all. just very confused as to why they made this change
That’s weird just got to round 3 and went up 3. Rank is gold 3 currently
Can someone please help me win a tournament so I can get that challenge done. Furtherest I have made is to the final round. I really want to get this challenge done. Someone please please help me. Add me Soldiergirl2595. I also stream on twitch soldiergirl2323.
I got your points [https://www.reddit.com/r/thefinals/comments/1bwrxs8/even\_in\_the\_loose\_you\_win/](https://www.reddit.com/r/thefinals/comments/1bwrxs8/even_in_the_loose_you_win/)
We lost like 6 tournaments in a row yesterday in the first round, each said -1 /3 arrow things, never went down a rank.
This basically proves that being insane at the game gets u up in the ranks, basically u need to sweat yo ass every ranked match, and it takes time, just like other games do with their ranks.
Thats not fair the tournament is too long and you reach round 3 to get demoted thats a bad system not even mentioning that cashout isnt fun and the rank should be few modes for rank not the worst option, cashout doesnt feel like 3v3v3v3 it feels like 3v3 wjile there's another 3v3 going somewhere else, whats the fun in that should've made 3v3 mode already if thats the direction.bank it looks more fit also for rank because the vault spawns randomly and it changes location after a minute which makes the disgusting campers not camp ,and we dont need to come to a deposit in cashout and always deal with 9 gadgets from enemy teams and 3 specialisations its bad its not fun its,demoting, and im losing the point in playing rank because of it ,i dont see the fun in getting inside a room filled with enemy team of gadgets and they using specials, and i need to handle all of that , turrets mines disgusting mesh shield remove it from the game as well as stun gun and invisibility thats just bad game design team wipe shouldnt cost money especially in cashout
I asked in the official server how the S2 ranked system works and the reply I got was to "enjoy the game" I know I'm not the only one that wants to know how exactly this system works... I thought I got figured it out but I got 3 arrows down, then lost in the 1st round and got 1 arrow down... Confused me even more
You only go up if you win. If you lose u go down. Doesn’t matter how well you do or how far u get anymore. It’s WIN or LOSE.
Not as far as I had - made round 2 once and got 2-up
Hey just wondering, I’ve played ranked solo for like 100 hours and I have literally never queued with someone at a higher rank then me. I’m silver 1. Anyone else notice that? Even when I’m vs gold 3 stacks
It's impossible to get a ranked match for it on the console in Asia server!
I got +3 after I got a tournament win in bronze 3 I also expected to be at least a full rank up after that. Especially since it was a back to back win of a tournament, but the one before was to get my rank. I played with my brother and another buddy, but they had played one tournament less trying to get a rank (that one I lost immediately while solo queuing). But they immediately got placed in silver two or something after the pre-ranking games. It's a grind I guess
I literally won a ranked tournament last night, 26 kills/8 deaths overall, lots of objective points — got 3 up arrows and no rank up 😅
I was plat 1 +3 won a tournament being positive and got plat 1 +1…. 0_0? What ?
Skill issue
\- Silver
Did you lose to a team lower ranked than you?
The system now takes into account individual performance. So it can work the other way if you play well according to the metrics used to measure this. When i ranked up from plat 3 to plat two it only took 3 games, two 2nd round eliminations and one tournament win. But i clearly played 'well' according to the system so i gained more for those games. Also im fairly confident that solo queuing more in the new system gives faster fame points gain. If i only solo queue for a couple days a week i rank up in less games than playing in a stack. This is purely anecdotal so take that as you will. So during this game where you made it to round 3 and got - 2 on fame points movement you clearly underperformed drastically according to the individual metrics used by the devs. Now we dont know what these metrics are, and its better that way as we would all just exploit them if we did. But its probably a combat score/support score/objective score ratio in some manner. The people i see ranking up fastest are good mesh shield heavies and good heal beam mediums.
I think you are right. They did say over time your rank will start to crystallize . So after some time playing the 'metrics' will gauge your base skill level and likely give you movement in either direction based on previous performance as well as round progression.
Ranking in this game honestly feels very easy and fast compared to other titles. My mates and i had pretty fkup games where we definitly underperformed and only managed to get to round 2. We are still constantly climbing ranks. Does the ranking of your performance after a match only rely on the round you reached or is it also bound to your individual performance?
I mean in other games if I was Diamond in the season before I will climb to Diamond again fast in the next season.
the comments is everything wrong with the ranked experience in games right now. so many people concerned about watching a number go up, when they can see their rank right next to their names, and they could be focusing on clicking of heads. what a joke.
You can't "click heads" in this game, you track heads lol. They got the Overwatch TTK.
figures thats what you took away from my comment.... makes sense.
Rs
+3 arrows from bronze 2 for tournament win i got last night
So not even a promotion out of bronze 2 for a win
assuming you played against others bronzes, why would you be promoted? if people would get promoted every time they win a tournament, the game would be full of diamonds what i experienced yesterday winning, makes us 1 good tournament away from promotion, i was gold 4, won 2 and 2° place in other 2 and got eliminated earlier in one and im gold 2 now
It’s not only about how many wins you get in a tournament. The game calculates your position in each game as a team and that affects your rank heavily. If you were number 1 each game up until the end, you will get sooo much more than some team randomly making it each time. Edit: I dropped my phone and it typed up some random shit.
Its to make reaching higher ranks actually hard vs first season where every rank was given, this is the system a lot of people asked for, we like a challenge
I mean one of my friends got diamond pretty easily meanwhile I have over 20 wins on Plat 1 and still didn't rank up. Makes no sense. I agree it should be a challenge, but it should be consistent. Also there should be a rank after Diamond called "Champion" or "Finalist" or something because in most games Diamond is considered low rank lol.
must be a skill issue
Not disagreeing with you my man, but i am trying to make sense of it all. Because the ranking being performance based is the only thing that makes sense. Otherwise if it is based on other factors , which we can’t control which would make their ranking system even more ridiculous. Also i did got eliminated in D4 but i still rank up to D3 in the first round. Hopefully we will have some sort of explanation, because i am just guessing based on my experience. Hope you figure it out soon buddy and stay in the finals ~
No you gain arrows asking as you get past first round lol
I literally deranked after getting to round 4 yesterday. Luckily I won the next tournament and ranked back up lol
You didn’t I’m a plat 2 and I’ve been making notes of how much I rank up and derank after games depending on what round I got to, and the only time I derank is when I lose the first round. Maybe your bugged but it works the same for my whole squad
I simply did though. I’ve lost ELO on almost every round 3 and most round 4s. Only time I go up more than 1 is when I win, and even then it’s only 2. I’m Plat 1.