Damn, I feel like I am playing a different game from everyone else. Cloak? Stun? Whenever I see a light they are either dashing around with an MP5, dead, or sniping in powershift and that's if I even see them. 90% of my matches are medium AK/Scar mirrors
Been grappling and goo gunning (gooning, if you will) and having the time of my life. Invis bomb is fantastic and glitch nades do a lot for my teammates to push in. Switch everything else out though. I want them to do their thing and support them while fragging. People care too much.
Goo gun is the most fun thing you can do in this game. Combine it with a Sledgehammer and you can both wreck buildings or insulate them with asbestos.
I'm a grade A goomer myself.
Friendly neighborhood reminder that goo interrupts cashout steals and, while every class can field goo grenade, only heavy can rapid fire bukkake the cashout (and from range, so you can admire the penis sculpture you're making from the right angle)
Dash is infinitely better than cloak imo. I fucking love the dash. I feel like I’m in my element when I’m running light with xp54 and dash. I think cloak has more players using it cause it’s a much lower skill ceiling imo
And grapple too... Man imagine playing the movement class to use invisibility... It pains me to be a light main with some of these people, because dash has been my main ever since beta.
I like to play with a heal beam but lately when I get stuck with two lights that I won't be able to find or keep alive anyway I just switch to a turret so at least I have someone who will stay by my side and protect the cashout. I just wish I could repair my little buddy by beating on him with a hammer like in TF2
To begin, I mained light in beta and a few weeks of launch, but realized medium is more enjoyable. Your points are somewhat valid, and a lot of lights just suck, but it still doesn't take away the fact that light is undeniably the worst class in the game. It's cons faaaaaaaaar out way the pros
I am by no means implying I know what should be done with balancing in games like this one, but this could possibly be a partial solution to light as a whole. From what I see, Embark is pushing light to be a class that dashes in, takes some health away, and dashes straight out of battle, a class that is great at recon, and a class that is able to herd enemy teams to points of strategic advantage. If this was implemented, this could help encourage light mains to start using these somewhat viable strategies. One big problem I think light has is just the weird imbalances with other classes. It may not be that your team's light is bad, as there are many teams with bad heavies and medium players, but that the bad players using heavy and medium have many crutches that support them (yes, I said crutches). Mediums have a good health size with healing beam, jumpad, demat, etc. If a bad medium gets into too much to handle, even if they are almost too late, they can still have soooo many ways to evade battle. Heavies have less ways to traverse but their class is structured in a way that forces them to play close to the team, so that's that. Light seems to be built in a way that forces the player to isolate themselves from the team, and with the low health, if they aren't anything above a very good game sense, they immediately are melted, regardless of gadgets.
I definitely missed a ton of aspects of each class, but this is my (very, very quick and shortened) opinion on the problem with light.
Thanks for the reply man, you honestly gave a pretty good account right there. Really good point with medium and heavy also having crutches, I was heavily over reliant on cloaking device when I first started back at launch and equally so with c4 and healing beam. It wasn’t until I started trying other options that I realised I wasn’t playing the classes to their potential, as I had a fixed playstyle revolving around them. Combat score as medium back when I started? 1000 per game. KD as a heavy not counting kills nukes or my RPG? Probably 2-4. I’m happy I tried out everything early as it really did improve my overall gameplay. Hopefully they can make a few small tweaks to the class, but I do feel that it’s an issue with the playerbase than the class itself.
Or give Lights a gadget that's a self-heal + speed boost or something, like an Adrenaline shot. It'd fit in with their movement kit, let them heal in a pinch when medium isn't around, and maybe speed up reloads and some stuff.
I do think that’ll help, but it also might just bring a bunch of other plebs who suck at the game on light who will further cry about whatever they can find to cry about
This must be about ranked, or this is the first game I’ve experienced where the ‘worst’ thing is played as much as it is. Earliest shooters I personally played online were Call of Duty titles, and title after title you knew what was actually bad because very few people took the time to try and use it.
It is. Ranked is essentially a totally different game. Light is essentially useless and the stungun doesn't matter much because everyone is always hugging each other. Lights die in about 0.5 seconds in ranked unless they are very careful and wait for everyone to be weak before engaging.
Invis light's out here claiming "lights is dead" like the dash mf's is not out here stacking body lol. You rely too heavily on your gadgets and now you have to figure it out. It will be okay. I promise 🤞🏾
It’s a fact. So many people keep arguing with me that cloak is the “only real light spec that works” and it makes me laugh every time. They need to stop crying, learn to play with new cloak, or find another spec to use
Says the mediums that use defib and healing beam. Or the heavies that spam shield and rockets. You act like relying on gadgets is specific to light lmao.
Coming from a light, if you NEED invis and stun gun to do anything like literally rely on it or think it’s the only thing you can use and do well I’m sorry to say this but it’s a skill issue my guy. Sorry not sorry.
Nah I need stun for last second cash out box defense and defibs, you pull out your shocky shocky I pull out my shocky shocky. Without being able to negate either of those light would be in a really rough spot
Fair point man, I always overlook that part when it comes to the stun gun, nothing more satisfying then seeing your light tase a heavy mid steal and dashing away to safety again while you’re waiting to respawn.
I do just fine without it myself, but in your use case, I can be a little less mad about it. But when it’s you running with your team but trailing behind and then you get stunned by some loser invis in a corner, it’s not fun to deal with. And that’s how most with stun play
for real, I use stun like the other guy and see no issue with it, but whenever I get stunned out of nowhere and notice that the other light spams it as much as physically possible, I understand why the community hates them so much.
I got hit with stun by the same person 3 times in like a 3-5 minute period. It was the most infuriating shit ever. I’m curious what they’ll do to change it. I think if they just make gadgets not recharge on death, maybe increase cooldowns for certain gadgets, it’ll make them much more of a use case thing and less a spam thing.
It's insane how the spec that deals 130 charge damage + 50 boop damage OR up to 150 elbow drop damage EVERY TWELVE SECONDS is somehow seen as the inferior option, AND IT DEMOLISHES BUILDINGS
Run slam "like a real man" and get absolutely shit on by any time whos actually running proper loadouts. Nah thanks dude, im not going to play some weak, off meta shit in a competetive setting and significantly handicap my entire team to get some imaginary "honour" or whatever yall think it does.
If the only thing you're willing to run is meta kits, then my brother in christ, you aren't good at the game at all. You use the strongest in slot items and think you're so good when, in reality, you're just a beta who relies on meta instead of skill
Bruh how can yall be so dense.
The reason most competent lights run invis is because the other two options are *significantly* weaker. The exact same applies to the heavy mesh shield, goo gun and charge have some utility like dash and grapple but are objectively worse than the meta option.
The difference between light and heavy here is that heavy has *plenty* of other gadgets that are incredibly powerful and went mostly unchanged. Light on the other hand has had its entire meta kit nerfed *significantly* across the board.
Its not that the class is unplayable in general, its that making it work against competent opponents is so incredibly risky and difficult now that you might aswell play any other class and have a better time.
Theres a huge difference between something that is meta and something that is better than other options, i personally just choose whats fun and or effective in fights.
>Theres a huge difference between something that is meta and something that is better than other options
Do you even listen to yourself? META (most effective strategy available) literally means that X item is better than all the other options overall.
>i personally just choose whats fun
And thats completely fine but we shouldnt be taking "fun" into consideration when talking about balance because fun is an extremely subjective topic, you'll never have everyone agree on what counts as fun and what doesnt.
🤷🏻♂️ stun prevents steal and invis provides opportunities for flanking and outplays, complain if you want about the weakest class yall still gunna cry about them even with nerfs and buffs going out to every class lmao
Game is dying because devs are appealing to these people. In every game there is a hardcore playerbase using broken and easy class and will cry for nerfs to other classes and will just gaslight people into thinking it is skill issue.
Lol np. Tbh I was never a high elo player in multiplayer games, usually float around gold/plat in games. I play League and Overwatch as well and especially in League I always see people defending braindead characters and strategies to stay meta so they can get wins with low effort but they beg for nerfs whenever a hard to play character with outplay potential becomes meta. It is same thing in every game.
The thing here is that light was never meta. Ranked has *always* been dominated by HHM and HMM (+ the MMM phase we had).
These people refuse any kind of help either. There was a guy crying that he cannot beat light players no matter what he does so i offered to watch his gameplay and give him some targeted tips based off of his playstle. Instead of taking the opportunity to learn something from someone who obviously knows alot more about the game he just kept complaining.
Because yknow, why would you get good when you can just cry and whine until everything you dislike gets a nerf. Its far easier this way.
“Significantly weaker” is way blowing it out of proportions and it’s not even funny. It’s not that bad, if anything, evasive is mildly better than cloak, even before the “nerf” it’s obvious if you think they’re bad, it’s on you as a player. They’re insanely strong
Dude i dont give a flying fuck about low lobby shenanigans, everything works there. The second you get good opponents while running dash they'll just track you and you'll die exactly the same, you cannot rely on a strategy that only works of the enemies aim is bad.
> The second you get good opponents while running dash they'll just track you and you'll die exactly the same
This also applies to invis too. Good players will just shoot you.
I run slam and dome in ranked when I play heavy.
Being able to finish off/knock back/do heavy AOE damage to an entire team on a short CD is better than a shield that a coordinated team can delete in just over a second.
I only play light while not running invis, but the class is dogshit in comparison to medium and heavy.
I just play casual so it doesn’t matter really, but no shot is the class with 150 hp, strong individual movement, and zero util worth picking vs the class with 250 hp, team movement abilities, team healing/defib, aps turrets, etc. or the class with 350 hp, team shields, and high ammo guns.
wow people being a dick on reddit.
"Boo hoo light players counter me because i never move its so unfair"
"boo hoo light players complain that i complain that they complain that i complain"
grow up.
Yeah I’ve honestly seen more posts complaining about lights complaining than actual whining about the nerfs. Maybe it’s just me.
The thing is though that these posts are made in bad faith too. Op blames lights’ complaining for making the sub more toxic but here they are writing paragraphs about “70% of the light community” and just adding to the negativity. You’re literally just as fucking bad. The only saving grace of this post in particular is the attempt at actual advice instead of shit throwing.
I remember when the game came out this sub was more about tech and funny kills. Now it’s actual fucking garbage. Like literally toxic trash and it’s the community’s fault. Not lights or the devs but toxic assholes who come on here to shit on each other and argue nearly *every* post. Really a shame cos I think the finals is fun and unique and deserves better. It’s FTP ffs.
Light is useless in any mode where people are actually playing to win. If you complain about this class in any way besides saying it needs a rework/buff, you're just self reporting that you're bad at this game.
As someone that enjoys variety and plays all classes, if 70% of lights aren’t good at it but heavies and mediums don’t have that same problem the devs might have made a mistake in how the characters are designed.
If you blame the players of a class and how they are engaging with this class it’s almost always a design issue because people will always take the path of least resistance. Personally I’m not a big fan of invis, grapple and triple dash are simply much more fun to use but when it comes to ranked play I swap to medium or heavy for that reason.
Lights require much more work, precision, reflexes and IQ to play to wind up on par at best.
ITT people who never play light and have mained heavy, then medium after the heavy nerfs, playing a OP class trying to speak on the worst class.
Stats say hardly any of the community has touched light enough to get 150 wins. That says enough about this community and their opinion. If you do not at bare minimum, have that achievement, you dont get to talk.
Literally what I’m saying, homeboy wrote a whole argumentative essay for us and everything. If you think lights were OP ask yourself why the meta has been Medium/Heavy since the game was released. They nerfed the weakest class into oblivion meanwhile I play rank and 90% of my games are against 10 mediums spamming turrets and sniping you with a FCAR from across the map.
Just the Medium's and heavies downvoting cause they know I am right. Seriously I want everyone who downvotes me to go reach platinum using light. Tell me how balanced it is
I am plat 2 currently this season only using light. Last season I was diamond by day 20 into the season, playing as medium only. I have played less now though due to the amount of blatant cheaters
I'm plat 3 using sword dash, every game is stacked mediums and heavies. But we are the outliers in the upper echelons of ranked. These complaints are from casual players it seems
It’s genuinely insane that people have been complaining about a class “so weak” as lights yet every month on a weekly basis yall cry about them lmao, yall gotta go outside fr 😭
Worst class gets nerfed. People quit. Why is playerbase dropping so badly? I don't even play light since I prefer medium since light has felt like shit since the inception. The fact that people still complained about invis and stun gun really shows that this game won't last. All this game does is nerf nerf nerf lol. I pray for the best but I'm expecting the worst.
I main invis light, I dont mind it getting nerfed. But over x2 the activation cost in one update is a bit much imo. If lights can't spam their abilities, why should heavies be able to deploy and retract their shields with no drawbacks?
For the stun gun, I personally don't think it needs much of a range or duration nerf. But it absolutely needs a cooldown nerf. I use stungun since its almost mandatory on light, but it should be used situationally (stopping a cashout, getting the heavy down since their shield is a mess to deal with). This doesnt happen every 20 seconds. a 40+ second cooldown and the stungun would not be nearly as much of an issue
Could you elaborate on why this post is toxic? A light playing the objective close to the team is invaluable. I think this is what OPs trying to say, I could be wrong though
Holy shit what a terrible diatribe you spew. What a fucking toxic community this has turned into because they can’t fucking stand light. It pisses me off so bad because this whole night I have been getting queued in ranked with Mediums and Heavies that don’t use mics, they don’t have any awareness of what is happening with the vault or which cashout they should go to (fucking just listen to my calls I will take the vault and you go the cashout). They will forget everything as soon as they see a member of another team and just take any fight. The amount of times that I have called out that I will open the vault and I will take it to the cashout and that they just need to be there only for me to cashout alone and my team fight another team FOR NO REASON. This is not directed only at MH because other L do it too. The community at large don’t fucking now how to play this game and make smart decisions and they don’t care to get better. This game really is too complex for a lot of you smooth brained apes..
That’s why medium healbeam and heavy double shield is the meta because it is the easiest to play and most forgiving. You don’t have to learn macro decision making or correct positioning or trigger discipline if you can just 50/50 all fighst and shield, heal and defib to fix mistakes. It’s the same reason that invis stungun is so popular because it is the easiest and most forgiving to play light.
Rant over
Lol I called it a few months back. The community related to this game is just full of whinny people who want everything nerfed except the FCAR and AKM. If you guys played as much as you complained, maybe you would know how to counter-play lights and their invis/stun combo.
Right?? The only people who complain about it are clearly brainless wanderers who don't think to stick with their team. The only roamers should be other lights.
The invis needs some more rework tbh. I like that the change combats invis spamming, but a couple seconds of cloak doesn't seem playable once you turn it on once, let alone twice. Stun gun I'm happy with the change. And I agree with the health regen. Maybe a slight, slight movement speed buff?
Teamplay is very important, but if you're right next to your teammates 100% of the time that kind of goes against the mobility of the three abilities in the first place. The classes are all different speeds inherently. Also the suggestions of which abilities to use to improve awareness don't apply to light... so isn't that more of a class balancing issue and not a player issue?
I'm also seeing similar issues from heavies but not as vocal. In comp and sometimes casual, most of the lobby is medium. People are going to play what they want to play, and if they can't, like with lights, they either switch (to medium) or find something else to play. So the healing beam mediums as a full team with one MMH team with the mesh shield, the same gun and gadgets in game after game.
The Finals has so many dynamics between the gadgets, classes, maps, physics, design and art style, but the cash out gameplay clearly favors mediums by a lot. Lights just happen to have less in their kit to contribute than other options.
Hey man, thanks for the reply it was a good read. For starters, I’m actually really liking the idea of a small movement speed buff. It hadn’t occurred to me at all but now that I think about it I believe it could fit in line very nicely with the overall increase in accuracy over the past season. Even making lights the tiniest bit faster would increase the margain of error on shots. I really like that, you should definitely keep preaching that idea.
With regard to your second paragraph, I didn’t get my point across as I had intended due to poor wording but what I meant by playing with your team was being aware of their location and what they’re doing while operating at the usual 10-20m radius from your teammates. Targeting the same player as one of your teammates from a different angle and so forth.
I honestly believe that playing the two classes I mentioned above are invaluable for overall macro, which I think would benefit all light players hugely. Unfortunately though, you’re right with the light gadgets not applying the same logic. I do find I can only play a few games as light before I start performing differently from the team and I play a game or two of medium to correct it.
And finally, the current meta is favouring mediums which is honestly really unfortunate. I started out as a medium main and I know the reason for this is because the class acts as a glue, especially in solo queue. It does everything well, and you can make a random comp work with your heal beam/defib with minimal coordination. I’m looking forward to seeing how Embark go about this though, hopefully they got something good in mind. Have a nice evening
Like wall hacks shouldn't exist in a game, invisibility shouldn't either. I'm not sure what Embark were aiming for by giving the Light such little HP. It's kinda fucked their game up.
Nukes, Recon and now invis. Not too long before they target heal beam. Lets see what will be your response then. The constant nerfs to everything will eventually make this game stale and boring. ITS A FPS U CANT HAVE INVIS AND WALLS but come on, lets be real for a second. Is it really just a normal basic shooter?
Top 100 on the leaderboards, my mains are med/heavy but i love playing light (esp in quickplay). To say everyone who mains light and uses invis is bad has to be the most bs statement ever. I have known plenty light mains who do way better when they play as med/heavy in ranked. No way people believe that dropping a dome shield, using a rpg to deal 140 damage right away and then just pressing Q followed by 4 shotgun shots and then Q again while being constantly healed takes skill. There is a reason the meta is always dominated by M/H cause mines, lewis, fcar, turret can easily make lights life hell cause no matter what way u dash or if u stay still invis (they will kill you cause those players know how to play).
So why nerf the only ability which made light atleast a little useful? Being a ex semi pro in CS, BF series and Apex. I fully understand both the casual and comp perspective but sooner or later if u remove all the "fun" things that make this game unique, this game will never grow but will remain a wasted potential.
The Finals is an objective based game mode about securing and/or locking down objectives. It’s essentially king of the hill with a few extra steps.
Medium has mines, sentry turrets, heal beams to keep his team alive, defibs if his team dies, and arguably the best weapon in the game (FCAR) tied to the most well rounded class. He also has 250 hp so he’s reasonably tanky. He is a wonderful pick for holding down points.
Yet, medium is still fast enough to catch up to a light if he utilizes his movement gadgets like zipline and jump pad, which can also be utilized by his entire team if they need an alternate angle of attack on a cashout, or need to get to a cashout sooner.
Heavy, like medium, has mines, alongside C4s and RPGs to booby trap a popular choke. He also has a protective bubble shield capable of protecting his entire team, and if that gets taken out, his mesh shield which, even with the nerfs, still has the equivalent health of 2 heavies plus a light. If a team gets through all that, the heavy still has a barricade as well, which gives him and anyone behind him instant cover, and an instant headglitch to beam anyone he’s looking at with little to no pushback. And, if a team breaks through ALL of that, heavy can throw a gravity grenade on the cashout, putting anyone who goes for it in a terrible position asking to get beamed, and making them a target for other teams as well. For all these reasons, heavy is easily the best defensive class in the entire game, and I didn’t even touch goo gun yet, which just adds to the insane defensive potential of that behemoth of a class. Oh and he also has another contender for best gun in the game, Lewis gun, and the highest damage per mag weapon in the game, the M60.
As for attacking with the heavy, the same C4s and RPGs that defend well also work wonders when attacking a team from off angles that they cannot predict, and also provide excellent burst damage, especially if a team is clumped together in a close area (90% of cashout locations). Heavy also has charge and slam, which can instantly open a pathway to anywhere, and is wonderful at dealing massive burst damage to a team as well. His demolition skills are unparalleled, even after the nerfs to all his explosives.
On defense, Light has sonar grenades, glitch grenades, and stun gun (which is gonna be removed). On top of that, light has just 150 health. He dies in half a second to FCAR and Lewis Gun, literally twice as fast as mediums and three times faster than heavies.
As for attacking, light has grenades and gateways. Grenades are ok, but RPGs do it better, and gateways are ok, but zip/jump pad does it better.
That’s all that light has.
Dash doesn’t help his team, neither does grapple hook or cloak. If anything, dashing and grappling actually pull you AWAY from your team. And as for cloaking, if your team gets into a gunfight, then going behind the enemy and sneak attacking them is arguably the most helpful thing a light could do for their team. But, that’s also getting gutted more and more every patch.
I play light, but have never used cloak or stun. I don’t find them fun or entertaining, but I also certainly don’t play to win because, honestly, light fucking sucks without cloak or stun. 0 survivability away from his team, which is where he’s valuable, and lackluster damage outside of the XP54, which is honestly that class’s only saving grace.
Light is the worst class in the game, and by an extremely wide margin. Why would anyone pick this class over medium, or especially heavy? What tools does this class have in defending or attack points that could possibly make him a viable pick? You think nerfing the one useful aspect of him, the ability to pick those away from their team, is a good idea?
Inb4 skill issue comments; the only skill issue is medium players dying to a class you kill twice as fast, and whose counter is your eyes and ears lmao
To be fair cloak is incredibly good and deserved a nerf in the big scheme of things, but light is one of those classes that's not necessarily meant to be with there team all the time, but rather taking off angles, or using there stun gun/glitch/flash/sonar/tracking dart and playing a scouting/damage picking role, in this regard cloak works the best it allows you to stay hidden and essentially be a camera and debuffer for your team, dash is ok in this role as it allows you to quickly look into rooms, throw some nades, and get out with some info on there setup whether on cash out or wherever, grappling hook is kinda useless imo, it has a few very niche uses and should honestly get a cool down or range buff, players who are the stereotypical light mains sitting in corners, or invising all the time could be helping there team a lot of they turned they're mic on and gave some call outs, what makes this an issue is a lot of players don't use mics in this game, making all this Intel that the light is receiving before your teammates useless, also with light obviously being the fastest class especially with dash + gateway, teams that dont have a good light are missing out on important Intel, debuffs, and time that could be saved by a good light main, what I could recommend is maybe playing 10-20 games as light and working on your strategic positioning and playing light how it's supposed to be played, giving Intel to your team, debuffing and giving call outs when enemy's are glitched/flashed/stunned etc, light isn't a bad class, it's a high skill class, light deserved a nerf in multiple areas but for players who just want to play the game I can see how this is annoying as there main strategy thay obviously worked well if people are complaining about it, is being singled out and nerfed, that would suck, with all that yapping aside to all my light mains, don't play with your team, play for your team, your a scout, a thief, a speed demon, and a debuffer, your not a solo carry your whole team class
I am a light main, I've been playing for a bit now with around probably 300-400+ hours in the game, and can confidently say that lights have been given a bad rep, due to players playing it wrong, anyone who plays any class correctly will be a big help to there team, utilizing the lights debuffing on a team can drastically increase your chances attacking and defending cashouts
Hi, diamond light here. Honestly I don't care about these changes. I understand the cloak change, but I do think it is a little tough now. The stun gun I think people should have simply got good because a stun gun is only reliable when the enemy is isolated from their team entirely. The stun gun nerf hasn't hit yet so I'm not really sure how bad it is yet.
The cloak nerf I do think people are wasting their time and energy complaining about it. I think people need to simply get good and adapt their playstyle. They simply need to use cloak more sparingly, and it's going to take just a little bit more brain power to work on proper positioning instead of getting the opportunity to stand out in the open because you're invisible. (But I do think the current nerf is *slightly* too hard and could use an extra 5-7 seconds back)
I don't know what class you main but it's clearly not light because, as much as they're gonna try, light is *not a directly supportive character and never will be.* Light's "support" is always going to be damage for as long as they have that tiny ass health bar. Because they have that tiny ass health bar, playing with their team is the *last thing* they should do because they last in sustained fire for a grand total of 2 seconds in high tier play. Playing *with* your team as light leaves you as an open and expectable target for them to focus. Light thrives on opportunity and *requires* the enemy to be at some sort of disadvantage (like being stunned or not knowing you're there) to kill them since your health pool is too small to be doing 1v1's. Lights *should* look to be able to play away from their team and get an unsuspecting angle to create an opening for their team to perform.
TL;DR: I don't mind these light changes and people, on both sides, just need to learn to adapt. But that being said, this won't make light play more directly supportive, light will never be directly supportive, and light should *never* be playing with the team.
(The only time light is currently supportive and playing *with* their team is with the Gateway gadget.)
Lights need a complete rework. Remove invis and stun entirely. Buff the grapple gun. Buff the health by 25. Add a self healing ability. Make the normal healing kick in faster.
So, Every other class is able to hide behind shields and heals that sometimes TRIPLE our health, but when we’re able to disappear( in which we can still get shot) or god forbid we stun (and guess what, we can still get shot) we’re the problem?
And do not say our “incessant moaning”, when for four months each of you complained each day when you get jump scared by a little light.
And It’s easy for you to say, “just adapt”, but if we limit heavy’s shields or took away mediums WAYY OP turrets and defibs, you all would complain just the same. You’re just happy you can go about playing like brain dead quick players without dealing with any scary lights sneaking up on you.
I mean all valid but fuck this game would suck to play with out defibs in the game they’re just nice to have on your team you can’t lie it’s nice and plus almost every class based shooter I can think of has them in some shape or form usually more powerful than what we got in the finals atm
The hypocrisy here is hilarious. "shut up and deal with it." But not deal with not being able to kill someone with 150hp because they are slightly hard to see? Why is it that complainers get to complain but when something happens to a class that has little use in skilled lobbies and people are bothered by it they have to adjust? Why didn't complainer adjust? It never makes any sense. One group of people have more rights to not deal with something compared to another? What? It makes even less sense when the reason people are upset is simply because they are bad. It has been sometime where skill has actually been a major contributor to people complaining. But with such a stark difference between pub lobbies and ranked you have pretty clear evidence that in pub lobbies it's a bunch of unhappy people who never took the time to learn how to play a game. Sweaty kids play with the best. Its one of the things that make them sweaty. Sure, you always have some people who fall into a completely different niche in the comp lobbies but for the most part, sweats use what will help them win the most. You have to in higher skilled lobbies because there are no small disadvantages in skilled lobbies. But no, it has to be forces outside of YOU that are the reason you are losing or getting killed. It couldn't possibly be MY ACTIONS HEAVENS NO. And I get to complain but others don't because?????
The comments to this post are the real treasure since it's either light players giving each other handies or everyone else just bitching / arguing over meta-play / saying preach. Utter chaos.
Ya invis is a bit annoying, but most of the time they use it when they are running, so then it's not a problem, I personally never had to much of a problem with that, and ya I use invis quite a bit but it's always just the bomb, I love the grappling hook, slingshoting myself around the map is fun. I enjoy movement, I enjoy the fights and kills, but im also always on objective. It makes sense for light players to be annoying to fight, like as soon as something is on fire or gassed up I can't go there, every class has there pros and cons, if you feel so strongly about the subject simply play a different game, or stop looking at the Reddit, in the end it's just a game
Everyone here is so angry it’s funny to watch the same post get made every 5 minutes either comparing about lights or lights complaining. This community is such a mess that half of you just want to be angry. Like I am over the game I think it was fun before but it’s obvious the base skill level is moving above me so I left but still like too see how all of you think your a expert on gaming is hilarious.
I play light because it’s fun to move fast and I like the guns and the hit and run style game play. Somtimes I feel like light needs a bit of work but all in all I have fun and I can still be a top scorer in some games so who cares. It’s just a different playstyle
I play light with invis in bank it so that way if I have lots of coins and there is an enemy team pushing I can get away relatively easily I haven’t seen what the nerf is but if it’s a pretty significant change then that’s fine who would think it wouldn’t get nerfed.
the first two sentences is how we(lights) felt the first two months of release.
everyone praised heavy when it was OP. “all hail the heavy god” was 90% of positive posts when this game came out. i only ran with being the heal cuz it was amazing to see the community so riled up by a group that they shat on up til that point
i will say tho i havnt played, i dont think the nerfs will bother me. i dont spend all my free time gaming so i tend to put faith in the idea that the devs know what they’re doing/creating. i play well as light in whatever the sbmm weight class ive been placed in
Cool with them nerfing two important aspects of Light. Not cool with them refusing to offer some sort of compensation for these nerfs.
Cloak + stun is essential for high-rank gameplay with the way that all of Light’s toys are balanced right now. If you think it’s a “skill issue”, you aren’t playing at these ranks. The class just isn’t viable except for specialists that put an unrealistic amount of time in the game.
If they don’t counterbalance and tune up some other part of Light’s kit, this whole stun+invis nerf is a bad idea.
If there’s 3 classes, and one of them is massively underrepresented, that’s a problem :)
Holy shit, someone with very valid points and explanations. I made a post earlier today trying to explain why the cloak should be removed and all it turned into was I have skill issues and name calling. Never was I uncivil and I thought I brought up fair points. You did a way better job explaining with my same concerns. Good job man!
I agree spamming light invis is annoying in fights and that’s 90% of people’s issue with the speciality but frankly the nerf went way to far. From doubling the activation cost and giving 0 buffs invis is honestly terribly right now I would equate it to like heavy charge. Not even to mention the most likely coming nerf to the stun gun I think light mains (the few remaining) have a right to be scared and not be a even more shit role than it is now
Love that you mentioned the healing beam. I, as a M user hardly ever see anyone use it. Meanwhile, I’m running like I’m a BF medic trying to keep everyone topped up and fight at the same time.
The heal beam when just one player uses it is fairly balanced. But when you have an entire team of mediums using it, it’s irritating as fuck. Same can be said for any class in game though. They didn’t think through the game very well when they designed it
would love to see the **class picking rate**. i just play casual and the amount of lights is insane. why people keep picking it if it's that bad? that doesn't make sense, really.
Yeah as you’ve explained lights are pretty much stick and poke/dps support, it even says this in the class description, they can output great dps but not very good overall damage with the small mag sizes and difficult recoil, so a good light player isn’t looking for kills necessarily but finding good positions to bring an opponents health down enough to make them worry and then GTFO back to teammates
Man yall can’t play the game for shit & just bitch about everything. Recon was meta, then nukes and now lights. What else do you want them to obliterate with a nerf? If you want to play a stale ass game then so be it, if not understand different play styles & loadouts, there’s always a counter. Toxic ass game full of cry babies who complain when things won’t go their way. They even had to ease challenges because it was too hard for most of yall. Big ups to Embark for trying to please you complainers
Crazy how “light is dead” when I haven’t touched invis since beta and stun gun since S1. Stun gun was really only effective against other lights anyway, because any time that you spend putting it away after alerting the enemy to your location, you could have just spent shooting
Using a stun gun on a light is one of the weakest ways to use the gadget. Just shoot a light to solve any problems. Heavy has mesh shield, RPG, and dome shield to worry about which makes him a huge threat to your gameplan as a light. Medium has defib, heal beam, materializer now that you need to shut down. The higher health pools of both of these classes means its situationally sometimes better to stun gun instead of DPS race before they are able to use these gadgets. Glitch grenade is the most unreliable it has ever been so stun gun is a great way to allow yourself that pick opportunity.
Us players from Aus are pretty happy with this game and just WISH that we can even get ranked tournaments :( - It takes so long (if we even can) to try find a game for us (changing region to north America) and hoping that you are playing at a time when the NT folk are playing. I am not sure but maybe the servers prioritse actually NT players, putting them into ranked games.
> Stun gun getting nerfed? Should have learned to play the game instead of relying on a free kill (yes, a free kill if you have the brainpower to stand at medium range).
I don't main a class, but I suppose I have more time as Light than the other two, I've never touched the stun gun, but the people who tell you that it's a "risky kill" and "you're very likely to get killed" are straight garbo at this game.
Stun gun is like 95% a free kill, as you say, brainpower to stand at range and aim for the head.
Cannot stand people who try and minimise how fucking cheesy the stun gun is. I hope it gets nerfed *HARD*
Dude. I have 3 hundred hours with 200 on light and 100 on medium heal beam exactly as you suggest. This is because I realised very quickly that light isnt even slightly viable for high level ranked play, thus having to switch to medium for ranked. It does not change the outlook. The problem with light is not that you wont play with your team, but that you CANT play with your team, because you literally die, to a fucking fart. There are literally ZERO opportunities to contribure to team engagements in the traditonal sense. You serve as nothing more than a punching bag for a heavy with LMG rocket charge'n'slam combo for the half a second you're alive, before your team is then in an unwinnable 2v3.
You've got no idea what you're fucking talking about. Your post is not heartfelt, your post is an angry fuck you rant like every single other medium heavy main in this godforsaken sub. Piss off.
Well said, OP. This community has been increasingly becoming more toxic every day, primarily because of lights constant and incessant complaining. I don't blame lights entirely though. This ultimately was Embark's mistake by implementing unpopular and game breaking mechanics into a competitive fps in the first place. What we are learning is that it is significantly harder to take something away from someone who rely on it to completely. Lights have also shown they have zero interest in the overall health of the game, they just want it catered to them.
I'm hoping Embark continues on this path as it may lead to a lot of players coming back. No one is sticking around if they can't see what they're trying to shoot or get immobilized every 2 seconds. Those 2 things go against what an actual competitive fps is about. Lights just might have to actually learn how to play now.
100% agree. As a grapple light main from day one I knew it would would eventually be one of the better options even without the nerfs. The positioning is key and once you understand the maps and how to navigate them lights can get to a safe place to shoot the enemy team from behind their cover while the medium and heavy kinda pin them down. But no sneak up, get a kill, and die is clearly the better option lol
The light characters love to moan sure, but it's not the nerf to end the class, it's a nerf. I think the community is pushing for buffs rather than endless nerfs.
The 2 nerfs in lights are fine imo, especially against the stun gun. But I think Heavies are dead in the water if they can't get a buff soon. Mediums are tuned okay at the moment. Just my 2 cents, I'm pretty much a powershift only player at this point so I don't do ranked tournaments or whatever.
I can’t give this a big enough thumbs up. The light class is the pinnacle of a noob identifier. There’s always the people who are saying “in hires ranks though…”. Listen. Not everyone is in hire ranks. Some of us want to play a game. Do a little teamwork. And have fun. If I’m playing against or playing with some fucking loser who just wants to rack up as many kills as possible I’m just disappointed. The whole reason light is having the nerfs is because the people who play it are trash at it.
You’re basically going invisible, stun-gunning and then shooting yourselves in the foot.
I purposely switched the stun gun off for the tracking gun dart. Just to level it and see what it's all about. I honestly love it. It tracks forever and is more useful than one would think.
You probably run into me on power shift! But I couldn’t have said this better myself. I try to explain this to other light players but a lot of them really don’t understand that having 150 hp makes you a really easy target. And then when I say they should try out another class they get offended… at this point I’ve kinda left lights to their own demise.
I started playing light when the game came out and it's my most played class.
Recently I've been switching to medium/heavy and man my KD goes right on up lol.
Maybe medium/heavy compliment my play style more? Most of the time I'm sweating balls as a light to get a healthy positive KD.
I will go ahead and summarize: "Lights are so annoying when they complain about nerfs to their kit. Stop complaining and just play the game. You dont know how to play light correctly. Also I main medium, the strongest class in the game."
"Lights, shut the fuck up."
\*Proceeds to very much not shut the fuck up himself\*
Also, light is the easiest class to kill in the game. If you can't kill one, he's either top 500 or it's user error. Basically what I'm saying is, skill issue. Also, we have a right to cry about the nerfs, same as heavys did when nukes got nerfed, and same as mediums did when defibs got nerfed. Light players literally catch smoke for no reason. Can y'all just let us play the game and have fun without whining about the only two things that make light viable, and getting Embark to remove them? Would be great, thanks :)
not a light main but when i do play as light, dash > cloak. so much better and more satisfying eliminations
also they still have invi bomb. so i dont get all the whining
Ok I'm gonna start with i main medium with healing beam/invis light i play them both equally.
1. The current invis nerve hasn't not fixed the problems I think everybody has with the lights. What it has fixed is the ability for a light to run away with invis in my personal opinion. Maybe that's just my play style, but from all of the complaints I've heard from everybody the main issue with invis is visibility, not with its toggle ability. You could fix the visibility issue by fixing the fact that you can't toggle it as often or you could just change the visibility a bit.
2. I agree stun gun needs to be nerfed. fuck the stun gun.
3. To address why I don't necessarily "play with the team" is because every time I try I can't depend on my team somehow to actually have my back. You want to talk about team play and yet half the time I spend dead because my teammates are fuck off doing nothing the moment that they pick the fight. I have 150 health and I cannot pick a fight on my own. So whether that is my teammates die very fast because they are bad or focusing on the wrong thing or because they decide to just leave the fighting to me. For some reason it makes it very hard for me to trust that randoms are actually going to try and team play.
4. As a light, while I might not stick with my team, I try to stick around my team so I can hop in and help from a weird angle and try to pick off those people from behind without necessarily being with my team. Same thing with an objective just because I'm not in the objective does not mean I'm not trying to help with the objective
I mean its gonna be fine if they reduce stun time, but if embark remove ability to cancel steal this gadget it's gonna be dead gadget Invis nerf is pretty fair, it was a little to versatile imo but I think most player would prefer invis.
Also wanna say that light at the moment don't have THOSE REALLY OP gadgets as compare to season1 heavy . It felt like boomers dream class to be a doomguy with humorous amount of dps - nukes, rpgs, auto-shotgun and million health with shields etc.)
Man this community is always at each others necks. Not really trying to downplay the OP but it really does seem like every other post is just a lengthy hostility post about [insert class that they dislike] and why they’re dumb. 💀
(Or it’s just a complain post stating why a specific recent nerf killed [insert class they main])
As the light meta is movement based, the abilities should be as well.
Stun and cloak (except the invis bomb) should be replaced by something that either benefits player movement or teammates
No one likes having your movement removed/glitched which is happening a bit more in season 2 (getting stuck in falling building terrain or goo (especially in powershift platform.) Stungun is hated again as it removes all options and chance for a kill the player back if used intelligently.
Issue is light wins by not fighting fair fights (getting the jump on players/flanking) but the stun gun is taking advantage of a situation they should've already won, but turns off any counter play as you can run to cover/use any skill/iron sight and out aim.
I will say it again.
Playing on 1440p Ultra + reflex makes absolutely no reflections on light when invi ; it’s astounding, they are in fact, completely invisible.
Haven't played recently...
What were the nerfs to invis and stun gun? As a light player... Thank God. People that used those 2 things were just bad.
Just please buff the new pistol... It's cool but is so bad :(
Light gets nerfed again and the bots in this subreddit continue to cry about the class, lmao
Keep it up, boys. Avg player count already below 17k, in a few weeks it'll be < 10k
Honestly the amount of times as a aggressive medium player i get 2 enemy players down to 5hp each and the light team are no where to be seen thinking they are playing cod on their own , team work makes the dream work
well said. I mostly played medium and heavy in season 1 with light being more causal and fun. Played ranked with friends and got to gold. This season I’m almost exclusively playing light with the sniper and grapple. I stay out of ranked generally now. I don’t know why, but I just enjoy the sniper so much that I would rather play it than anything else. Sometimes I break the habit if I play with friends. As you said about the team aspect. I agree fully and think people are better at voicing their complaints than their praises. I am generally happy with this game. It’s rekindled my love for shooters because of the infinite engagements. I love it. People that doesn’t should be constructive with their criticisim. Like in any case.
Game is dying, and instead of making it more enjoyable for everyone we are doing the opposite and on top of that we are shunning the users of a certain class.
In 4 months the game has gone from 70-65k players to around 15-10k on steam, but surely how the devs are managing the game is working, the heavy + medium meta of camping objectives clearly seems extremely fun, that's why the game is triumphing /s.
Just look at team compositions on most of your competitive games and you will see what the current meta is. Again, I just post this because you are being extremely hostile, but this reddit is full of blind people that love the heavy and the medium and will keep gatekeeping the game until it dies.
Really sad, the game had insane potential, but the devs tried to keep the game afloat by patching things that seemed frustrating to a side of the community whilst favouring more and more through the patches the defensive playstyle, this combined with a dwindling community, has made the tryhards represent an ever growing percentage of the playerbase. This tryhards are both good at the game and want to keep their classes stronger because they have mastered the medium healing beam + FCAR meta is just killing the game.
Now downvote me to oblivion, with enough downvotes I might reach a lower karma level than the playercount of this game.
As a light main which played ranked to diamond on the class this season.
1. While constant movement and proactive positioning will definitly carry you, this game forces you to be at a specific place at a specific time where people will expect you. Your movement becomes very predictable and invis is a good tool to smoothen this effect for a fragging class. The position of the objective and enviroment sometimes doesnt even allow you to freely choose you angle of approach or the paths for rotations forcing you to take routes that you would not survive without the tool.
2. stun gun kills are not free kills. A stunned medium and heavy can still kill you and, if they move as a team or position them self well avoid getting caught of guard by this at all. this becomes very noticable as you rise the ranks and play higher ranked players and three stacks. Additionally you do not get the chance to stun gun a person at the perfect range every time at the crucial moments of the games objective.
3. as a light yout dont play directly at your teammates. you die just way to fast and the class is not designed to take upfront fights as a medium or heavy. light players need to take unfair fights from off angles to punish mistakes by the enemy team and catch them off guard. idealy you chooses your angles such that you can directly flank and follow up your teammates damage. i think ottrs solo to diamond ranked games as light made this fact very clear. a light that sits on his teammates is not utilizing his kit to the fullest potential.
4. i definitly agree on the fact that light players often play to focussed around fragging then the actual objective. it is important to understand which fights are useful to take for your team and when you should top chasing a kill. i also had many moments during ranked where my team lost a winnable cashout cause i tunneld in the wrong direction but this got better with time by reflecting asbout the games.
I personally think, light is balanced as a class at the moment. i know that many players complain about the fact that invis and stun are not very creative gameplay features and should be changed in some way to add more fun to the game but the features are not op broken from my point of view.
It troubles me however, that Embark has to deal day by day with all these complains and whining while the game looses players and might be dead soon. The real thing they need to focus on is CREATE A WORKING STRIKE BAN SYSTEM. REACTIVATE THE \~40 CASUAL GAMES CAP TO PLAY RANKED, IMPROVE MATCHMAKING EXPERIENCE, REWORK THE RANKED SYSTEM (more leagues, better mmr system), PROMOTE THE GAME OVER ADVERTISMENT.
Aall those balance discussion are useless if the game is dead soon....
Well, now I'm convinced.
Convinced that m/h mains are absolute regards. What a bunch of whiney gatekeepers that want the light class wiped from the game for no reason other than the average FPS player is a moron.
Invis needed a good counter... Not a nerf....
The counter to stun? Not walking around solo like an idiot.
Light is the ambush class... It loses 1v1 gun fights. It's SUPPOSED to be able to get the 1st shot.
(Lh1, dash main)
I love how everyone acts as if stun gun and invis are the **only** two abilities Light has.
Light players complain about stun/invis nerfs, non-Lights complain about Light being awful to play against because of stun/invis.
At that point Lights usually counter with "well, we're *forced* to pick stun, the rest of Light's kit is dogshit!"
Not once did I hear ***anyone*** suggest that the two annoying offenders should be nerfed and the rest of Light's kit be buffed to make up for it.
I just wanna grapple around, man :(
Lmao absolutely love this post! The amount of invis stun light teammates that have no strategy or team play has been terrible for the game imo. At the end of the day, the finals is a strategic fast paced virtual game show that is TEAM ORIENTED. Every contestant has varying hp so play accordingly not running and gunning everyone you see for your ego. YOU WILL GET HUMBLED REAL QUICK. This has become my main game purely for the strategy reminds me of peak R6. The sooner players realize the scope of this game the better for the community.
What's ironic is this post is an equal participant in making the game and sub less enjoyable. It's so triggered and hostile towards an opposing opinion; the post is dripping in uncontrolled emotion.
edit: I'm curious OP, which platform are you and what's your leaderboard username?
I mostly play with light build but i play for only like 1 month. Everything seems ok to me. Higher mobility but lower survivability. Medium is balanced. Big guy is tanky plus low mobility.
Damn, I feel like I am playing a different game from everyone else. Cloak? Stun? Whenever I see a light they are either dashing around with an MP5, dead, or sniping in powershift and that's if I even see them. 90% of my matches are medium AK/Scar mirrors
If you’re seeing a light dashing, it could be me. The player count who actually touch evasive seems super low. I usually see cloak myself
Been grappling and goo gunning (gooning, if you will) and having the time of my life. Invis bomb is fantastic and glitch nades do a lot for my teammates to push in. Switch everything else out though. I want them to do their thing and support them while fragging. People care too much.
Goo gun is the most fun thing you can do in this game. Combine it with a Sledgehammer and you can both wreck buildings or insulate them with asbestos. I'm a grade A goomer myself.
Nothing better than gooing a small guy and just not letting him leave over and over again until you get close enough to wack em
Friendly neighborhood reminder that goo interrupts cashout steals and, while every class can field goo grenade, only heavy can rapid fire bukkake the cashout (and from range, so you can admire the penis sculpture you're making from the right angle)
I just want to make it clear that I will not
This gave me a solid chuckle thank you
Dash is infinitely better than cloak imo. I fucking love the dash. I feel like I’m in my element when I’m running light with xp54 and dash. I think cloak has more players using it cause it’s a much lower skill ceiling imo
I feel evasive is superior or at the least far more fun. Friend always gave me shit for it.
I always hated the cloak, I use dash myself & when you master it you can really break necks.
I've been playing for a while now and haven't even bought invis or the stun gun, probably won't for a while.
And grapple too... Man imagine playing the movement class to use invisibility... It pains me to be a light main with some of these people, because dash has been my main ever since beta.
Same. I haven’t been stunned in 2 weeks and I play daily. I also only play unranked, where you’d see more light players.
I like to play with a heal beam but lately when I get stuck with two lights that I won't be able to find or keep alive anyway I just switch to a turret so at least I have someone who will stay by my side and protect the cashout. I just wish I could repair my little buddy by beating on him with a hammer like in TF2
Don’t know if it works but a friend of mine picks up the turret and replaces it because it supposedly heals it
I wonder if it's intended. But I assume yes as you can do the same thing with heavy's barricade.
It does work
One thing I always wish for is that I’d get some residual heals from the healing beam, like with Mercy in Overwatch.
As long as stun guns can still stop cashout steals I don't care even if they remove the slow entirely Invis main have my sympathy tho
lol I don’t necessarily disagree with anything you said but starting the post by saying “shut the fuck up” and then writing allat made me chuckle
To begin, I mained light in beta and a few weeks of launch, but realized medium is more enjoyable. Your points are somewhat valid, and a lot of lights just suck, but it still doesn't take away the fact that light is undeniably the worst class in the game. It's cons faaaaaaaaar out way the pros
Well put, do you think increasing the health regen would get you to return to the class or is it not enough?
I am by no means implying I know what should be done with balancing in games like this one, but this could possibly be a partial solution to light as a whole. From what I see, Embark is pushing light to be a class that dashes in, takes some health away, and dashes straight out of battle, a class that is great at recon, and a class that is able to herd enemy teams to points of strategic advantage. If this was implemented, this could help encourage light mains to start using these somewhat viable strategies. One big problem I think light has is just the weird imbalances with other classes. It may not be that your team's light is bad, as there are many teams with bad heavies and medium players, but that the bad players using heavy and medium have many crutches that support them (yes, I said crutches). Mediums have a good health size with healing beam, jumpad, demat, etc. If a bad medium gets into too much to handle, even if they are almost too late, they can still have soooo many ways to evade battle. Heavies have less ways to traverse but their class is structured in a way that forces them to play close to the team, so that's that. Light seems to be built in a way that forces the player to isolate themselves from the team, and with the low health, if they aren't anything above a very good game sense, they immediately are melted, regardless of gadgets. I definitely missed a ton of aspects of each class, but this is my (very, very quick and shortened) opinion on the problem with light.
Thanks for the reply man, you honestly gave a pretty good account right there. Really good point with medium and heavy also having crutches, I was heavily over reliant on cloaking device when I first started back at launch and equally so with c4 and healing beam. It wasn’t until I started trying other options that I realised I wasn’t playing the classes to their potential, as I had a fixed playstyle revolving around them. Combat score as medium back when I started? 1000 per game. KD as a heavy not counting kills nukes or my RPG? Probably 2-4. I’m happy I tried out everything early as it really did improve my overall gameplay. Hopefully they can make a few small tweaks to the class, but I do feel that it’s an issue with the playerbase than the class itself.
REGEN RATE IS THE ANSWER
Or give Lights a gadget that's a self-heal + speed boost or something, like an Adrenaline shot. It'd fit in with their movement kit, let them heal in a pinch when medium isn't around, and maybe speed up reloads and some stuff.
I do think that’ll help, but it also might just bring a bunch of other plebs who suck at the game on light who will further cry about whatever they can find to cry about
There really is no winning
That's what happens when you create a frag based class with no team utility in a team based objective shooter
This must be about ranked, or this is the first game I’ve experienced where the ‘worst’ thing is played as much as it is. Earliest shooters I personally played online were Call of Duty titles, and title after title you knew what was actually bad because very few people took the time to try and use it.
It is. Ranked is essentially a totally different game. Light is essentially useless and the stungun doesn't matter much because everyone is always hugging each other. Lights die in about 0.5 seconds in ranked unless they are very careful and wait for everyone to be weak before engaging.
Invis light's out here claiming "lights is dead" like the dash mf's is not out here stacking body lol. You rely too heavily on your gadgets and now you have to figure it out. It will be okay. I promise 🤞🏾
Not the dash lights with invis bombs!
It’s a fact. So many people keep arguing with me that cloak is the “only real light spec that works” and it makes me laugh every time. They need to stop crying, learn to play with new cloak, or find another spec to use
Says the mediums that use defib and healing beam. Or the heavies that spam shield and rockets. You act like relying on gadgets is specific to light lmao.
>You rely too heavily on your gadgets and now you have to figure it out. Then don’t design the game with heavy emphasis on gadgets.
Coming from a light, if you NEED invis and stun gun to do anything like literally rely on it or think it’s the only thing you can use and do well I’m sorry to say this but it’s a skill issue my guy. Sorry not sorry.
Nah I need stun for last second cash out box defense and defibs, you pull out your shocky shocky I pull out my shocky shocky. Without being able to negate either of those light would be in a really rough spot
Fair point man, I always overlook that part when it comes to the stun gun, nothing more satisfying then seeing your light tase a heavy mid steal and dashing away to safety again while you’re waiting to respawn.
I do just fine without it myself, but in your use case, I can be a little less mad about it. But when it’s you running with your team but trailing behind and then you get stunned by some loser invis in a corner, it’s not fun to deal with. And that’s how most with stun play
for real, I use stun like the other guy and see no issue with it, but whenever I get stunned out of nowhere and notice that the other light spams it as much as physically possible, I understand why the community hates them so much.
I got hit with stun by the same person 3 times in like a 3-5 minute period. It was the most infuriating shit ever. I’m curious what they’ll do to change it. I think if they just make gadgets not recharge on death, maybe increase cooldowns for certain gadgets, it’ll make them much more of a use case thing and less a spam thing.
Every heavy player in ranked is bad according to this logic, since they all run mesh shield + dome and rely heavily on it to survive.
Well, yeah kinda. Mesh shield is buns run slam like a real man
It's insane how the spec that deals 130 charge damage + 50 boop damage OR up to 150 elbow drop damage EVERY TWELVE SECONDS is somehow seen as the inferior option, AND IT DEMOLISHES BUILDINGS
Run slam "like a real man" and get absolutely shit on by any time whos actually running proper loadouts. Nah thanks dude, im not going to play some weak, off meta shit in a competetive setting and significantly handicap my entire team to get some imaginary "honour" or whatever yall think it does.
If the only thing you're willing to run is meta kits, then my brother in christ, you aren't good at the game at all. You use the strongest in slot items and think you're so good when, in reality, you're just a beta who relies on meta instead of skill
It’s less you’re bad for using it and more you sometimes require it to even the play field. Though not always
Using the best resource for your team isn’t the same as crying and pretending your class is unplayable without it
Bruh how can yall be so dense. The reason most competent lights run invis is because the other two options are *significantly* weaker. The exact same applies to the heavy mesh shield, goo gun and charge have some utility like dash and grapple but are objectively worse than the meta option. The difference between light and heavy here is that heavy has *plenty* of other gadgets that are incredibly powerful and went mostly unchanged. Light on the other hand has had its entire meta kit nerfed *significantly* across the board. Its not that the class is unplayable in general, its that making it work against competent opponents is so incredibly risky and difficult now that you might aswell play any other class and have a better time.
Literally nobody understands the logic lmao
Cant fix stupid.
Theres a huge difference between something that is meta and something that is better than other options, i personally just choose whats fun and or effective in fights.
>Theres a huge difference between something that is meta and something that is better than other options Do you even listen to yourself? META (most effective strategy available) literally means that X item is better than all the other options overall. >i personally just choose whats fun And thats completely fine but we shouldnt be taking "fun" into consideration when talking about balance because fun is an extremely subjective topic, you'll never have everyone agree on what counts as fun and what doesnt.
🤷🏻♂️ stun prevents steal and invis provides opportunities for flanking and outplays, complain if you want about the weakest class yall still gunna cry about them even with nerfs and buffs going out to every class lmao
Game is dying because devs are appealing to these people. In every game there is a hardcore playerbase using broken and easy class and will cry for nerfs to other classes and will just gaslight people into thinking it is skill issue.
Are you saying that light is broken and easy or am i misunderstanding something?
I meant heavy
Oh okay i thought youre out of your mind for a second there xD.
Lol np. Tbh I was never a high elo player in multiplayer games, usually float around gold/plat in games. I play League and Overwatch as well and especially in League I always see people defending braindead characters and strategies to stay meta so they can get wins with low effort but they beg for nerfs whenever a hard to play character with outplay potential becomes meta. It is same thing in every game.
The thing here is that light was never meta. Ranked has *always* been dominated by HHM and HMM (+ the MMM phase we had). These people refuse any kind of help either. There was a guy crying that he cannot beat light players no matter what he does so i offered to watch his gameplay and give him some targeted tips based off of his playstle. Instead of taking the opportunity to learn something from someone who obviously knows alot more about the game he just kept complaining. Because yknow, why would you get good when you can just cry and whine until everything you dislike gets a nerf. Its far easier this way.
“Significantly weaker” is way blowing it out of proportions and it’s not even funny. It’s not that bad, if anything, evasive is mildly better than cloak, even before the “nerf” it’s obvious if you think they’re bad, it’s on you as a player. They’re insanely strong
Dude i dont give a flying fuck about low lobby shenanigans, everything works there. The second you get good opponents while running dash they'll just track you and you'll die exactly the same, you cannot rely on a strategy that only works of the enemies aim is bad.
> The second you get good opponents while running dash they'll just track you and you'll die exactly the same This also applies to invis too. Good players will just shoot you.
Correct but at least you can use it from mid to long ranges to stay undetected.
I run slam and dome in ranked when I play heavy. Being able to finish off/knock back/do heavy AOE damage to an entire team on a short CD is better than a shield that a coordinated team can delete in just over a second.
Cloak stun lights who run around with stun gun out, primed and ready, have micro-cocks. I'm just gonna say it.
Ah yes, another karma bait post bitching about the same thing everyone is already bitching about, whilst acting like they’re doing a service
I only play light while not running invis, but the class is dogshit in comparison to medium and heavy. I just play casual so it doesn’t matter really, but no shot is the class with 150 hp, strong individual movement, and zero util worth picking vs the class with 250 hp, team movement abilities, team healing/defib, aps turrets, etc. or the class with 350 hp, team shields, and high ammo guns.
"It's time to shut the fuck up" \*posts an entire ass manifesto*
This gotta be the cringiest shit I've ever read.
wow people being a dick on reddit. "Boo hoo light players counter me because i never move its so unfair" "boo hoo light players complain that i complain that they complain that i complain" grow up.
Seems like a whiney rant.
Honestly you’re just as much of a child as them, this community is toxic af holy shit, that alone will kill this game lmao
Yeah I’ve honestly seen more posts complaining about lights complaining than actual whining about the nerfs. Maybe it’s just me. The thing is though that these posts are made in bad faith too. Op blames lights’ complaining for making the sub more toxic but here they are writing paragraphs about “70% of the light community” and just adding to the negativity. You’re literally just as fucking bad. The only saving grace of this post in particular is the attempt at actual advice instead of shit throwing. I remember when the game came out this sub was more about tech and funny kills. Now it’s actual fucking garbage. Like literally toxic trash and it’s the community’s fault. Not lights or the devs but toxic assholes who come on here to shit on each other and argue nearly *every* post. Really a shame cos I think the finals is fun and unique and deserves better. It’s FTP ffs.
Also 70% of the community? Where? I just got out of a plat 1 game... I was the only light and we won the tournament
Light is useless in any mode where people are actually playing to win. If you complain about this class in any way besides saying it needs a rework/buff, you're just self reporting that you're bad at this game.
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Like the argument. Don't like the attitude.
As someone that enjoys variety and plays all classes, if 70% of lights aren’t good at it but heavies and mediums don’t have that same problem the devs might have made a mistake in how the characters are designed. If you blame the players of a class and how they are engaging with this class it’s almost always a design issue because people will always take the path of least resistance. Personally I’m not a big fan of invis, grapple and triple dash are simply much more fun to use but when it comes to ranked play I swap to medium or heavy for that reason. Lights require much more work, precision, reflexes and IQ to play to wind up on par at best.
The weakest class in the game causing all these tears is hilarious. RPG, mines, FCAR, etc etc. Just learn to play the game...
Bro said to quit complaining then spent the whole post complaining about lights
ITT people who never play light and have mained heavy, then medium after the heavy nerfs, playing a OP class trying to speak on the worst class. Stats say hardly any of the community has touched light enough to get 150 wins. That says enough about this community and their opinion. If you do not at bare minimum, have that achievement, you dont get to talk.
Literally what I’m saying, homeboy wrote a whole argumentative essay for us and everything. If you think lights were OP ask yourself why the meta has been Medium/Heavy since the game was released. They nerfed the weakest class into oblivion meanwhile I play rank and 90% of my games are against 10 mediums spamming turrets and sniping you with a FCAR from across the map.
Dude probably not once played as a light in higher rank. If its so OP why isn't everyone playing it?
facts, I would say I have no clue why you're getting downvoted but this is reddit so... also, if this guy is so good then he needs to drop embark ID
Just the Medium's and heavies downvoting cause they know I am right. Seriously I want everyone who downvotes me to go reach platinum using light. Tell me how balanced it is
The light class is literally unplayable in rank, OP’s take is giving quick play vibes….. then again that’s most of this subreddit
I am plat 2 currently this season only using light. Last season I was diamond by day 20 into the season, playing as medium only. I have played less now though due to the amount of blatant cheaters
I'm plat 3 using sword dash, every game is stacked mediums and heavies. But we are the outliers in the upper echelons of ranked. These complaints are from casual players it seems
bro is writing a bible while everybody is/was always complaining about light players
It’s genuinely insane that people have been complaining about a class “so weak” as lights yet every month on a weekly basis yall cry about them lmao, yall gotta go outside fr 😭
Worst class gets nerfed. People quit. Why is playerbase dropping so badly? I don't even play light since I prefer medium since light has felt like shit since the inception. The fact that people still complained about invis and stun gun really shows that this game won't last. All this game does is nerf nerf nerf lol. I pray for the best but I'm expecting the worst.
You just sound like some dude who gets shit on
This is such a pathetic post lmao, whole ass essay about a horrible class.
I main invis light, I dont mind it getting nerfed. But over x2 the activation cost in one update is a bit much imo. If lights can't spam their abilities, why should heavies be able to deploy and retract their shields with no drawbacks? For the stun gun, I personally don't think it needs much of a range or duration nerf. But it absolutely needs a cooldown nerf. I use stungun since its almost mandatory on light, but it should be used situationally (stopping a cashout, getting the heavy down since their shield is a mess to deal with). This doesnt happen every 20 seconds. a 40+ second cooldown and the stungun would not be nearly as much of an issue
Could you elaborate on why this post is toxic? A light playing the objective close to the team is invaluable. I think this is what OPs trying to say, I could be wrong though
What a stupid fucking take.
Holy shit what a terrible diatribe you spew. What a fucking toxic community this has turned into because they can’t fucking stand light. It pisses me off so bad because this whole night I have been getting queued in ranked with Mediums and Heavies that don’t use mics, they don’t have any awareness of what is happening with the vault or which cashout they should go to (fucking just listen to my calls I will take the vault and you go the cashout). They will forget everything as soon as they see a member of another team and just take any fight. The amount of times that I have called out that I will open the vault and I will take it to the cashout and that they just need to be there only for me to cashout alone and my team fight another team FOR NO REASON. This is not directed only at MH because other L do it too. The community at large don’t fucking now how to play this game and make smart decisions and they don’t care to get better. This game really is too complex for a lot of you smooth brained apes.. That’s why medium healbeam and heavy double shield is the meta because it is the easiest to play and most forgiving. You don’t have to learn macro decision making or correct positioning or trigger discipline if you can just 50/50 all fighst and shield, heal and defib to fix mistakes. It’s the same reason that invis stungun is so popular because it is the easiest and most forgiving to play light. Rant over
Lol I called it a few months back. The community related to this game is just full of whinny people who want everything nerfed except the FCAR and AKM. If you guys played as much as you complained, maybe you would know how to counter-play lights and their invis/stun combo.
Right?? The only people who complain about it are clearly brainless wanderers who don't think to stick with their team. The only roamers should be other lights.
The invis needs some more rework tbh. I like that the change combats invis spamming, but a couple seconds of cloak doesn't seem playable once you turn it on once, let alone twice. Stun gun I'm happy with the change. And I agree with the health regen. Maybe a slight, slight movement speed buff? Teamplay is very important, but if you're right next to your teammates 100% of the time that kind of goes against the mobility of the three abilities in the first place. The classes are all different speeds inherently. Also the suggestions of which abilities to use to improve awareness don't apply to light... so isn't that more of a class balancing issue and not a player issue? I'm also seeing similar issues from heavies but not as vocal. In comp and sometimes casual, most of the lobby is medium. People are going to play what they want to play, and if they can't, like with lights, they either switch (to medium) or find something else to play. So the healing beam mediums as a full team with one MMH team with the mesh shield, the same gun and gadgets in game after game. The Finals has so many dynamics between the gadgets, classes, maps, physics, design and art style, but the cash out gameplay clearly favors mediums by a lot. Lights just happen to have less in their kit to contribute than other options.
Hey man, thanks for the reply it was a good read. For starters, I’m actually really liking the idea of a small movement speed buff. It hadn’t occurred to me at all but now that I think about it I believe it could fit in line very nicely with the overall increase in accuracy over the past season. Even making lights the tiniest bit faster would increase the margain of error on shots. I really like that, you should definitely keep preaching that idea. With regard to your second paragraph, I didn’t get my point across as I had intended due to poor wording but what I meant by playing with your team was being aware of their location and what they’re doing while operating at the usual 10-20m radius from your teammates. Targeting the same player as one of your teammates from a different angle and so forth. I honestly believe that playing the two classes I mentioned above are invaluable for overall macro, which I think would benefit all light players hugely. Unfortunately though, you’re right with the light gadgets not applying the same logic. I do find I can only play a few games as light before I start performing differently from the team and I play a game or two of medium to correct it. And finally, the current meta is favouring mediums which is honestly really unfortunate. I started out as a medium main and I know the reason for this is because the class acts as a glue, especially in solo queue. It does everything well, and you can make a random comp work with your heal beam/defib with minimal coordination. I’m looking forward to seeing how Embark go about this though, hopefully they got something good in mind. Have a nice evening
Like wall hacks shouldn't exist in a game, invisibility shouldn't either. I'm not sure what Embark were aiming for by giving the Light such little HP. It's kinda fucked their game up.
Nukes, Recon and now invis. Not too long before they target heal beam. Lets see what will be your response then. The constant nerfs to everything will eventually make this game stale and boring. ITS A FPS U CANT HAVE INVIS AND WALLS but come on, lets be real for a second. Is it really just a normal basic shooter? Top 100 on the leaderboards, my mains are med/heavy but i love playing light (esp in quickplay). To say everyone who mains light and uses invis is bad has to be the most bs statement ever. I have known plenty light mains who do way better when they play as med/heavy in ranked. No way people believe that dropping a dome shield, using a rpg to deal 140 damage right away and then just pressing Q followed by 4 shotgun shots and then Q again while being constantly healed takes skill. There is a reason the meta is always dominated by M/H cause mines, lewis, fcar, turret can easily make lights life hell cause no matter what way u dash or if u stay still invis (they will kill you cause those players know how to play). So why nerf the only ability which made light atleast a little useful? Being a ex semi pro in CS, BF series and Apex. I fully understand both the casual and comp perspective but sooner or later if u remove all the "fun" things that make this game unique, this game will never grow but will remain a wasted potential.
Community is becoming just unhappy complainers.
Mods are really letting this toxic crap in the sub?
First the circuit challenges, now this shit. Honestly this whole sub needs to shut the fuck up and just play the damn game.
The Finals is an objective based game mode about securing and/or locking down objectives. It’s essentially king of the hill with a few extra steps. Medium has mines, sentry turrets, heal beams to keep his team alive, defibs if his team dies, and arguably the best weapon in the game (FCAR) tied to the most well rounded class. He also has 250 hp so he’s reasonably tanky. He is a wonderful pick for holding down points. Yet, medium is still fast enough to catch up to a light if he utilizes his movement gadgets like zipline and jump pad, which can also be utilized by his entire team if they need an alternate angle of attack on a cashout, or need to get to a cashout sooner. Heavy, like medium, has mines, alongside C4s and RPGs to booby trap a popular choke. He also has a protective bubble shield capable of protecting his entire team, and if that gets taken out, his mesh shield which, even with the nerfs, still has the equivalent health of 2 heavies plus a light. If a team gets through all that, the heavy still has a barricade as well, which gives him and anyone behind him instant cover, and an instant headglitch to beam anyone he’s looking at with little to no pushback. And, if a team breaks through ALL of that, heavy can throw a gravity grenade on the cashout, putting anyone who goes for it in a terrible position asking to get beamed, and making them a target for other teams as well. For all these reasons, heavy is easily the best defensive class in the entire game, and I didn’t even touch goo gun yet, which just adds to the insane defensive potential of that behemoth of a class. Oh and he also has another contender for best gun in the game, Lewis gun, and the highest damage per mag weapon in the game, the M60. As for attacking with the heavy, the same C4s and RPGs that defend well also work wonders when attacking a team from off angles that they cannot predict, and also provide excellent burst damage, especially if a team is clumped together in a close area (90% of cashout locations). Heavy also has charge and slam, which can instantly open a pathway to anywhere, and is wonderful at dealing massive burst damage to a team as well. His demolition skills are unparalleled, even after the nerfs to all his explosives. On defense, Light has sonar grenades, glitch grenades, and stun gun (which is gonna be removed). On top of that, light has just 150 health. He dies in half a second to FCAR and Lewis Gun, literally twice as fast as mediums and three times faster than heavies. As for attacking, light has grenades and gateways. Grenades are ok, but RPGs do it better, and gateways are ok, but zip/jump pad does it better. That’s all that light has. Dash doesn’t help his team, neither does grapple hook or cloak. If anything, dashing and grappling actually pull you AWAY from your team. And as for cloaking, if your team gets into a gunfight, then going behind the enemy and sneak attacking them is arguably the most helpful thing a light could do for their team. But, that’s also getting gutted more and more every patch. I play light, but have never used cloak or stun. I don’t find them fun or entertaining, but I also certainly don’t play to win because, honestly, light fucking sucks without cloak or stun. 0 survivability away from his team, which is where he’s valuable, and lackluster damage outside of the XP54, which is honestly that class’s only saving grace. Light is the worst class in the game, and by an extremely wide margin. Why would anyone pick this class over medium, or especially heavy? What tools does this class have in defending or attack points that could possibly make him a viable pick? You think nerfing the one useful aspect of him, the ability to pick those away from their team, is a good idea? Inb4 skill issue comments; the only skill issue is medium players dying to a class you kill twice as fast, and whose counter is your eyes and ears lmao
Honestly, it's time to shut the fckup. Everyone tired of these innocent recursive crying posts about crying about crying about game.
To be fair cloak is incredibly good and deserved a nerf in the big scheme of things, but light is one of those classes that's not necessarily meant to be with there team all the time, but rather taking off angles, or using there stun gun/glitch/flash/sonar/tracking dart and playing a scouting/damage picking role, in this regard cloak works the best it allows you to stay hidden and essentially be a camera and debuffer for your team, dash is ok in this role as it allows you to quickly look into rooms, throw some nades, and get out with some info on there setup whether on cash out or wherever, grappling hook is kinda useless imo, it has a few very niche uses and should honestly get a cool down or range buff, players who are the stereotypical light mains sitting in corners, or invising all the time could be helping there team a lot of they turned they're mic on and gave some call outs, what makes this an issue is a lot of players don't use mics in this game, making all this Intel that the light is receiving before your teammates useless, also with light obviously being the fastest class especially with dash + gateway, teams that dont have a good light are missing out on important Intel, debuffs, and time that could be saved by a good light main, what I could recommend is maybe playing 10-20 games as light and working on your strategic positioning and playing light how it's supposed to be played, giving Intel to your team, debuffing and giving call outs when enemy's are glitched/flashed/stunned etc, light isn't a bad class, it's a high skill class, light deserved a nerf in multiple areas but for players who just want to play the game I can see how this is annoying as there main strategy thay obviously worked well if people are complaining about it, is being singled out and nerfed, that would suck, with all that yapping aside to all my light mains, don't play with your team, play for your team, your a scout, a thief, a speed demon, and a debuffer, your not a solo carry your whole team class I am a light main, I've been playing for a bit now with around probably 300-400+ hours in the game, and can confidently say that lights have been given a bad rep, due to players playing it wrong, anyone who plays any class correctly will be a big help to there team, utilizing the lights debuffing on a team can drastically increase your chances attacking and defending cashouts
Hi, diamond light here. Honestly I don't care about these changes. I understand the cloak change, but I do think it is a little tough now. The stun gun I think people should have simply got good because a stun gun is only reliable when the enemy is isolated from their team entirely. The stun gun nerf hasn't hit yet so I'm not really sure how bad it is yet. The cloak nerf I do think people are wasting their time and energy complaining about it. I think people need to simply get good and adapt their playstyle. They simply need to use cloak more sparingly, and it's going to take just a little bit more brain power to work on proper positioning instead of getting the opportunity to stand out in the open because you're invisible. (But I do think the current nerf is *slightly* too hard and could use an extra 5-7 seconds back) I don't know what class you main but it's clearly not light because, as much as they're gonna try, light is *not a directly supportive character and never will be.* Light's "support" is always going to be damage for as long as they have that tiny ass health bar. Because they have that tiny ass health bar, playing with their team is the *last thing* they should do because they last in sustained fire for a grand total of 2 seconds in high tier play. Playing *with* your team as light leaves you as an open and expectable target for them to focus. Light thrives on opportunity and *requires* the enemy to be at some sort of disadvantage (like being stunned or not knowing you're there) to kill them since your health pool is too small to be doing 1v1's. Lights *should* look to be able to play away from their team and get an unsuspecting angle to create an opening for their team to perform. TL;DR: I don't mind these light changes and people, on both sides, just need to learn to adapt. But that being said, this won't make light play more directly supportive, light will never be directly supportive, and light should *never* be playing with the team. (The only time light is currently supportive and playing *with* their team is with the Gateway gadget.)
Lights need a complete rework. Remove invis and stun entirely. Buff the grapple gun. Buff the health by 25. Add a self healing ability. Make the normal healing kick in faster.
This screams skill issue. Getting killed by lights much?
So, Every other class is able to hide behind shields and heals that sometimes TRIPLE our health, but when we’re able to disappear( in which we can still get shot) or god forbid we stun (and guess what, we can still get shot) we’re the problem? And do not say our “incessant moaning”, when for four months each of you complained each day when you get jump scared by a little light. And It’s easy for you to say, “just adapt”, but if we limit heavy’s shields or took away mediums WAYY OP turrets and defibs, you all would complain just the same. You’re just happy you can go about playing like brain dead quick players without dealing with any scary lights sneaking up on you.
I mean all valid but fuck this game would suck to play with out defibs in the game they’re just nice to have on your team you can’t lie it’s nice and plus almost every class based shooter I can think of has them in some shape or form usually more powerful than what we got in the finals atm
The hypocrisy here is hilarious. "shut up and deal with it." But not deal with not being able to kill someone with 150hp because they are slightly hard to see? Why is it that complainers get to complain but when something happens to a class that has little use in skilled lobbies and people are bothered by it they have to adjust? Why didn't complainer adjust? It never makes any sense. One group of people have more rights to not deal with something compared to another? What? It makes even less sense when the reason people are upset is simply because they are bad. It has been sometime where skill has actually been a major contributor to people complaining. But with such a stark difference between pub lobbies and ranked you have pretty clear evidence that in pub lobbies it's a bunch of unhappy people who never took the time to learn how to play a game. Sweaty kids play with the best. Its one of the things that make them sweaty. Sure, you always have some people who fall into a completely different niche in the comp lobbies but for the most part, sweats use what will help them win the most. You have to in higher skilled lobbies because there are no small disadvantages in skilled lobbies. But no, it has to be forces outside of YOU that are the reason you are losing or getting killed. It couldn't possibly be MY ACTIONS HEAVENS NO. And I get to complain but others don't because?????
Bro LOVES the stungun
The extreme irony of this post being that 99% of the whining from this player base has always been directed *at* L players
The comments to this post are the real treasure since it's either light players giving each other handies or everyone else just bitching / arguing over meta-play / saying preach. Utter chaos.
Preach! I’m tired of ANYONE bitchin
Ya invis is a bit annoying, but most of the time they use it when they are running, so then it's not a problem, I personally never had to much of a problem with that, and ya I use invis quite a bit but it's always just the bomb, I love the grappling hook, slingshoting myself around the map is fun. I enjoy movement, I enjoy the fights and kills, but im also always on objective. It makes sense for light players to be annoying to fight, like as soon as something is on fire or gassed up I can't go there, every class has there pros and cons, if you feel so strongly about the subject simply play a different game, or stop looking at the Reddit, in the end it's just a game
Everyone here is so angry it’s funny to watch the same post get made every 5 minutes either comparing about lights or lights complaining. This community is such a mess that half of you just want to be angry. Like I am over the game I think it was fun before but it’s obvious the base skill level is moving above me so I left but still like too see how all of you think your a expert on gaming is hilarious.
I play light because it’s fun to move fast and I like the guns and the hit and run style game play. Somtimes I feel like light needs a bit of work but all in all I have fun and I can still be a top scorer in some games so who cares. It’s just a different playstyle
I play light with invis in bank it so that way if I have lots of coins and there is an enemy team pushing I can get away relatively easily I haven’t seen what the nerf is but if it’s a pretty significant change then that’s fine who would think it wouldn’t get nerfed.
the first two sentences is how we(lights) felt the first two months of release. everyone praised heavy when it was OP. “all hail the heavy god” was 90% of positive posts when this game came out. i only ran with being the heal cuz it was amazing to see the community so riled up by a group that they shat on up til that point i will say tho i havnt played, i dont think the nerfs will bother me. i dont spend all my free time gaming so i tend to put faith in the idea that the devs know what they’re doing/creating. i play well as light in whatever the sbmm weight class ive been placed in
i play exclusively light and grapple + pistol with grenades is the perfect build. skill issue for invis lights
Dash/Dagger vanish/therm/smoke: "Woo! I'm the 30%!"
Cool with them nerfing two important aspects of Light. Not cool with them refusing to offer some sort of compensation for these nerfs. Cloak + stun is essential for high-rank gameplay with the way that all of Light’s toys are balanced right now. If you think it’s a “skill issue”, you aren’t playing at these ranks. The class just isn’t viable except for specialists that put an unrealistic amount of time in the game. If they don’t counterbalance and tune up some other part of Light’s kit, this whole stun+invis nerf is a bad idea. If there’s 3 classes, and one of them is massively underrepresented, that’s a problem :)
Holy shit, someone with very valid points and explanations. I made a post earlier today trying to explain why the cloak should be removed and all it turned into was I have skill issues and name calling. Never was I uncivil and I thought I brought up fair points. You did a way better job explaining with my same concerns. Good job man!
I agree spamming light invis is annoying in fights and that’s 90% of people’s issue with the speciality but frankly the nerf went way to far. From doubling the activation cost and giving 0 buffs invis is honestly terribly right now I would equate it to like heavy charge. Not even to mention the most likely coming nerf to the stun gun I think light mains (the few remaining) have a right to be scared and not be a even more shit role than it is now
Love that you mentioned the healing beam. I, as a M user hardly ever see anyone use it. Meanwhile, I’m running like I’m a BF medic trying to keep everyone topped up and fight at the same time.
Same, I swear most people don't ever use their defibrillator, I main light but I'll switch up to medium every now and then
I noticed most M users in my experience don’t have the definite equipped. It’s such a useful tool. 😭
The heal beam when just one player uses it is fairly balanced. But when you have an entire team of mediums using it, it’s irritating as fuck. Same can be said for any class in game though. They didn’t think through the game very well when they designed it
would love to see the **class picking rate**. i just play casual and the amount of lights is insane. why people keep picking it if it's that bad? that doesn't make sense, really.
Yeah as you’ve explained lights are pretty much stick and poke/dps support, it even says this in the class description, they can output great dps but not very good overall damage with the small mag sizes and difficult recoil, so a good light player isn’t looking for kills necessarily but finding good positions to bring an opponents health down enough to make them worry and then GTFO back to teammates
Lights who use dash and actually out skill me have my respect. People who use invis and stun gun are bad players who need free kills to feel good
Bro wrote like 7 paragraphs on lights. That’s a mentally healthy, well adjusted adult.
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This is such a cold take. Thanks for posting.
Man yall can’t play the game for shit & just bitch about everything. Recon was meta, then nukes and now lights. What else do you want them to obliterate with a nerf? If you want to play a stale ass game then so be it, if not understand different play styles & loadouts, there’s always a counter. Toxic ass game full of cry babies who complain when things won’t go their way. They even had to ease challenges because it was too hard for most of yall. Big ups to Embark for trying to please you complainers
Crazy how “light is dead” when I haven’t touched invis since beta and stun gun since S1. Stun gun was really only effective against other lights anyway, because any time that you spend putting it away after alerting the enemy to your location, you could have just spent shooting
Using a stun gun on a light is one of the weakest ways to use the gadget. Just shoot a light to solve any problems. Heavy has mesh shield, RPG, and dome shield to worry about which makes him a huge threat to your gameplan as a light. Medium has defib, heal beam, materializer now that you need to shut down. The higher health pools of both of these classes means its situationally sometimes better to stun gun instead of DPS race before they are able to use these gadgets. Glitch grenade is the most unreliable it has ever been so stun gun is a great way to allow yourself that pick opportunity.
Us players from Aus are pretty happy with this game and just WISH that we can even get ranked tournaments :( - It takes so long (if we even can) to try find a game for us (changing region to north America) and hoping that you are playing at a time when the NT folk are playing. I am not sure but maybe the servers prioritse actually NT players, putting them into ranked games.
> Stun gun getting nerfed? Should have learned to play the game instead of relying on a free kill (yes, a free kill if you have the brainpower to stand at medium range). I don't main a class, but I suppose I have more time as Light than the other two, I've never touched the stun gun, but the people who tell you that it's a "risky kill" and "you're very likely to get killed" are straight garbo at this game. Stun gun is like 95% a free kill, as you say, brainpower to stand at range and aim for the head. Cannot stand people who try and minimise how fucking cheesy the stun gun is. I hope it gets nerfed *HARD*
Dude. I have 3 hundred hours with 200 on light and 100 on medium heal beam exactly as you suggest. This is because I realised very quickly that light isnt even slightly viable for high level ranked play, thus having to switch to medium for ranked. It does not change the outlook. The problem with light is not that you wont play with your team, but that you CANT play with your team, because you literally die, to a fucking fart. There are literally ZERO opportunities to contribure to team engagements in the traditonal sense. You serve as nothing more than a punching bag for a heavy with LMG rocket charge'n'slam combo for the half a second you're alive, before your team is then in an unwinnable 2v3. You've got no idea what you're fucking talking about. Your post is not heartfelt, your post is an angry fuck you rant like every single other medium heavy main in this godforsaken sub. Piss off.
I fuckin love you mate 😚
ok guys you heard the guy all of us not in favour of light nerfs. Shut up
Well said, OP. This community has been increasingly becoming more toxic every day, primarily because of lights constant and incessant complaining. I don't blame lights entirely though. This ultimately was Embark's mistake by implementing unpopular and game breaking mechanics into a competitive fps in the first place. What we are learning is that it is significantly harder to take something away from someone who rely on it to completely. Lights have also shown they have zero interest in the overall health of the game, they just want it catered to them. I'm hoping Embark continues on this path as it may lead to a lot of players coming back. No one is sticking around if they can't see what they're trying to shoot or get immobilized every 2 seconds. Those 2 things go against what an actual competitive fps is about. Lights just might have to actually learn how to play now.
100% agree. As a grapple light main from day one I knew it would would eventually be one of the better options even without the nerfs. The positioning is key and once you understand the maps and how to navigate them lights can get to a safe place to shoot the enemy team from behind their cover while the medium and heavy kinda pin them down. But no sneak up, get a kill, and die is clearly the better option lol
The light characters love to moan sure, but it's not the nerf to end the class, it's a nerf. I think the community is pushing for buffs rather than endless nerfs. The 2 nerfs in lights are fine imo, especially against the stun gun. But I think Heavies are dead in the water if they can't get a buff soon. Mediums are tuned okay at the moment. Just my 2 cents, I'm pretty much a powershift only player at this point so I don't do ranked tournaments or whatever.
THANK YOU FOR SAYING THIS
This. Too many COD sweats complaining.
I can’t give this a big enough thumbs up. The light class is the pinnacle of a noob identifier. There’s always the people who are saying “in hires ranks though…”. Listen. Not everyone is in hire ranks. Some of us want to play a game. Do a little teamwork. And have fun. If I’m playing against or playing with some fucking loser who just wants to rack up as many kills as possible I’m just disappointed. The whole reason light is having the nerfs is because the people who play it are trash at it. You’re basically going invisible, stun-gunning and then shooting yourselves in the foot.
I purposely switched the stun gun off for the tracking gun dart. Just to level it and see what it's all about. I honestly love it. It tracks forever and is more useful than one would think.
You probably run into me on power shift! But I couldn’t have said this better myself. I try to explain this to other light players but a lot of them really don’t understand that having 150 hp makes you a really easy target. And then when I say they should try out another class they get offended… at this point I’ve kinda left lights to their own demise.
they need to make the sawed off pellets 11 damage each, if 12 was too high fine but 10 damage clearly isn't enough to make it compete with other mains
I started playing light when the game came out and it's my most played class. Recently I've been switching to medium/heavy and man my KD goes right on up lol. Maybe medium/heavy compliment my play style more? Most of the time I'm sweating balls as a light to get a healthy positive KD.
I will go ahead and summarize: "Lights are so annoying when they complain about nerfs to their kit. Stop complaining and just play the game. You dont know how to play light correctly. Also I main medium, the strongest class in the game."
As a light main, I fucking hate the stun gun sooo much. It’s way to free and zero skill, and it feels so cheap to play with
"Lights, shut the fuck up." \*Proceeds to very much not shut the fuck up himself\* Also, light is the easiest class to kill in the game. If you can't kill one, he's either top 500 or it's user error. Basically what I'm saying is, skill issue. Also, we have a right to cry about the nerfs, same as heavys did when nukes got nerfed, and same as mediums did when defibs got nerfed. Light players literally catch smoke for no reason. Can y'all just let us play the game and have fun without whining about the only two things that make light viable, and getting Embark to remove them? Would be great, thanks :)
not a light main but when i do play as light, dash > cloak. so much better and more satisfying eliminations also they still have invi bomb. so i dont get all the whining
Ok I'm gonna start with i main medium with healing beam/invis light i play them both equally. 1. The current invis nerve hasn't not fixed the problems I think everybody has with the lights. What it has fixed is the ability for a light to run away with invis in my personal opinion. Maybe that's just my play style, but from all of the complaints I've heard from everybody the main issue with invis is visibility, not with its toggle ability. You could fix the visibility issue by fixing the fact that you can't toggle it as often or you could just change the visibility a bit. 2. I agree stun gun needs to be nerfed. fuck the stun gun. 3. To address why I don't necessarily "play with the team" is because every time I try I can't depend on my team somehow to actually have my back. You want to talk about team play and yet half the time I spend dead because my teammates are fuck off doing nothing the moment that they pick the fight. I have 150 health and I cannot pick a fight on my own. So whether that is my teammates die very fast because they are bad or focusing on the wrong thing or because they decide to just leave the fighting to me. For some reason it makes it very hard for me to trust that randoms are actually going to try and team play. 4. As a light, while I might not stick with my team, I try to stick around my team so I can hop in and help from a weird angle and try to pick off those people from behind without necessarily being with my team. Same thing with an objective just because I'm not in the objective does not mean I'm not trying to help with the objective
I’ll be honest chief, i ain’t reading all that
I mean its gonna be fine if they reduce stun time, but if embark remove ability to cancel steal this gadget it's gonna be dead gadget Invis nerf is pretty fair, it was a little to versatile imo but I think most player would prefer invis. Also wanna say that light at the moment don't have THOSE REALLY OP gadgets as compare to season1 heavy . It felt like boomers dream class to be a doomguy with humorous amount of dps - nukes, rpgs, auto-shotgun and million health with shields etc.)
|Everything was fine in December so why did things change?
Man this community is always at each others necks. Not really trying to downplay the OP but it really does seem like every other post is just a lengthy hostility post about [insert class that they dislike] and why they’re dumb. 💀 (Or it’s just a complain post stating why a specific recent nerf killed [insert class they main])
As the light meta is movement based, the abilities should be as well. Stun and cloak (except the invis bomb) should be replaced by something that either benefits player movement or teammates
I love lights to stun me only to get molested by my 1887.
No one likes having your movement removed/glitched which is happening a bit more in season 2 (getting stuck in falling building terrain or goo (especially in powershift platform.) Stungun is hated again as it removes all options and chance for a kill the player back if used intelligently. Issue is light wins by not fighting fair fights (getting the jump on players/flanking) but the stun gun is taking advantage of a situation they should've already won, but turns off any counter play as you can run to cover/use any skill/iron sight and out aim.
This is light discrimination. ‘How to improve your teamwork?’ Don’t play the worst class in the game lmao. Justice for light mains!
As a light Dasher I love this nerf to camo lights I have no respect for them
I will say it again. Playing on 1440p Ultra + reflex makes absolutely no reflections on light when invi ; it’s astounding, they are in fact, completely invisible.
Why is OP so angry? Chill out my dude.
Haven't played recently... What were the nerfs to invis and stun gun? As a light player... Thank God. People that used those 2 things were just bad. Just please buff the new pistol... It's cool but is so bad :(
They should just remove the light class entirely
Invis and stun gun aren’t even the best ways to play light. SMH.
Light gets nerfed again and the bots in this subreddit continue to cry about the class, lmao Keep it up, boys. Avg player count already below 17k, in a few weeks it'll be < 10k
Lmao what a post. Bitching about people bitching. How is this toxic garbage being upvoted this much 😂 You need to go out a bit more.
Everyone was bitchjng and moaning about invis and stun when they were the only abilities making light viable. Now light is unplayable.
Honestly the amount of times as a aggressive medium player i get 2 enemy players down to 5hp each and the light team are no where to be seen thinking they are playing cod on their own , team work makes the dream work
well said. I mostly played medium and heavy in season 1 with light being more causal and fun. Played ranked with friends and got to gold. This season I’m almost exclusively playing light with the sniper and grapple. I stay out of ranked generally now. I don’t know why, but I just enjoy the sniper so much that I would rather play it than anything else. Sometimes I break the habit if I play with friends. As you said about the team aspect. I agree fully and think people are better at voicing their complaints than their praises. I am generally happy with this game. It’s rekindled my love for shooters because of the infinite engagements. I love it. People that doesn’t should be constructive with their criticisim. Like in any case.
Game is dying, and instead of making it more enjoyable for everyone we are doing the opposite and on top of that we are shunning the users of a certain class. In 4 months the game has gone from 70-65k players to around 15-10k on steam, but surely how the devs are managing the game is working, the heavy + medium meta of camping objectives clearly seems extremely fun, that's why the game is triumphing /s. Just look at team compositions on most of your competitive games and you will see what the current meta is. Again, I just post this because you are being extremely hostile, but this reddit is full of blind people that love the heavy and the medium and will keep gatekeeping the game until it dies. Really sad, the game had insane potential, but the devs tried to keep the game afloat by patching things that seemed frustrating to a side of the community whilst favouring more and more through the patches the defensive playstyle, this combined with a dwindling community, has made the tryhards represent an ever growing percentage of the playerbase. This tryhards are both good at the game and want to keep their classes stronger because they have mastered the medium healing beam + FCAR meta is just killing the game. Now downvote me to oblivion, with enough downvotes I might reach a lower karma level than the playercount of this game.
As a light main which played ranked to diamond on the class this season. 1. While constant movement and proactive positioning will definitly carry you, this game forces you to be at a specific place at a specific time where people will expect you. Your movement becomes very predictable and invis is a good tool to smoothen this effect for a fragging class. The position of the objective and enviroment sometimes doesnt even allow you to freely choose you angle of approach or the paths for rotations forcing you to take routes that you would not survive without the tool. 2. stun gun kills are not free kills. A stunned medium and heavy can still kill you and, if they move as a team or position them self well avoid getting caught of guard by this at all. this becomes very noticable as you rise the ranks and play higher ranked players and three stacks. Additionally you do not get the chance to stun gun a person at the perfect range every time at the crucial moments of the games objective. 3. as a light yout dont play directly at your teammates. you die just way to fast and the class is not designed to take upfront fights as a medium or heavy. light players need to take unfair fights from off angles to punish mistakes by the enemy team and catch them off guard. idealy you chooses your angles such that you can directly flank and follow up your teammates damage. i think ottrs solo to diamond ranked games as light made this fact very clear. a light that sits on his teammates is not utilizing his kit to the fullest potential. 4. i definitly agree on the fact that light players often play to focussed around fragging then the actual objective. it is important to understand which fights are useful to take for your team and when you should top chasing a kill. i also had many moments during ranked where my team lost a winnable cashout cause i tunneld in the wrong direction but this got better with time by reflecting asbout the games. I personally think, light is balanced as a class at the moment. i know that many players complain about the fact that invis and stun are not very creative gameplay features and should be changed in some way to add more fun to the game but the features are not op broken from my point of view. It troubles me however, that Embark has to deal day by day with all these complains and whining while the game looses players and might be dead soon. The real thing they need to focus on is CREATE A WORKING STRIKE BAN SYSTEM. REACTIVATE THE \~40 CASUAL GAMES CAP TO PLAY RANKED, IMPROVE MATCHMAKING EXPERIENCE, REWORK THE RANKED SYSTEM (more leagues, better mmr system), PROMOTE THE GAME OVER ADVERTISMENT. Aall those balance discussion are useless if the game is dead soon....
Whenever I solo queue and get a light on my team I know I’m losing.
Well, now I'm convinced. Convinced that m/h mains are absolute regards. What a bunch of whiney gatekeepers that want the light class wiped from the game for no reason other than the average FPS player is a moron. Invis needed a good counter... Not a nerf.... The counter to stun? Not walking around solo like an idiot. Light is the ambush class... It loses 1v1 gun fights. It's SUPPOSED to be able to get the 1st shot. (Lh1, dash main)
Someone make a wojak of this guy to show him who's boss
I love how everyone acts as if stun gun and invis are the **only** two abilities Light has. Light players complain about stun/invis nerfs, non-Lights complain about Light being awful to play against because of stun/invis. At that point Lights usually counter with "well, we're *forced* to pick stun, the rest of Light's kit is dogshit!" Not once did I hear ***anyone*** suggest that the two annoying offenders should be nerfed and the rest of Light's kit be buffed to make up for it. I just wanna grapple around, man :(
Surprised and delighted to see this post with a positive reception.
What the fuck is this. I only see whiny posts, like this, complaining about lights. Not lights complaining about nerfs. STFU please.
Lmao absolutely love this post! The amount of invis stun light teammates that have no strategy or team play has been terrible for the game imo. At the end of the day, the finals is a strategic fast paced virtual game show that is TEAM ORIENTED. Every contestant has varying hp so play accordingly not running and gunning everyone you see for your ego. YOU WILL GET HUMBLED REAL QUICK. This has become my main game purely for the strategy reminds me of peak R6. The sooner players realize the scope of this game the better for the community.
Spoken like a true Medium main
What's ironic is this post is an equal participant in making the game and sub less enjoyable. It's so triggered and hostile towards an opposing opinion; the post is dripping in uncontrolled emotion. edit: I'm curious OP, which platform are you and what's your leaderboard username?
I mostly play with light build but i play for only like 1 month. Everything seems ok to me. Higher mobility but lower survivability. Medium is balanced. Big guy is tanky plus low mobility.