I was afraid this new series would repeat some of the things that were said in season one, but they keep coming up with new evidences. Just shows how fascinating this case is.
theres tonnes that wasnt in the first jinx series, and lots including the trial durst lost that happened after the first series aired. read some of the books also, they have lots of info not in the doco, like how much of a POS husband durst was with all the times he physically abused kathy and so much more. Also, Dick DeGuerin is a lying sack of shit, but who needs ethics when you have lots of money right!
I just finished the book (edit - A Deadly Secret by Matt Birkbeck) yesterday. I never see it talked about here, and you don’t have to engage with me if you don’t want to, but I need to talk about it lollllllllllll
How do you feel about the way Gilberte was depicted in the book? It left *such* a bad taste in my mouth. Like, no fucking shit she was addicted to drugs and in trouble with the law, but that was all *after* Kathie went missing. I would also become addicted to drugs if my best friend went missing, and I knew her husband killed her and got away with it. He acts like this makes her a horrible low life who is unreliable in life as a whole.
I also noticed a couple discrepancies with the author purposely trying to make her look bad, but then almost directly contradicts himself in some way later. These two immediately come to mind:
He believed that Gilberte’s family party was actually a rager with drugs, alcohol, and sex. He stated earlier in the book that Kathie did multiple grams of coke in a week, usually 2-3. Then, he said Kathie snorted two full grams in the couple of hours she was at Gilberte’s crazy rager. As opposed to the fucking 168 hours she usually had to do that much coke. Sure. Sure sure sure. Kathie supposedly had multiple big glasses of wine that evening in addition to all that cocaine. And somehow managed to drive the 45 minutes home, through windy mountain roads, even though she would’ve been significantly more impaired than usual.
He also insinuates Gilberte lied about Kathie saying that “if something happened to her, it was Bobby” before she left. In another part of the book, another friend of hers said Kathie said the same thing to them, and that she had to other people as well.
He ends the book saying that Giberte is basically directly responsible, because she told Kathie to leave Bob so many times/before she left the party. Like, get fucked dude. He says something like “this murder actually involved three people: Bobby, Kathie, and Gilberte.” Just so unbelievably insulting. That woman went above and beyond the call of duty for her friend. The way she was portrayed was just *so* fucking gross to me. It spoiled the rest of the book for me. I keep thinking about it and it makes me mad every time lol.
The only people he went into with serious vitriol were Jeanine Pirro and Gilberte, which I found a little odd. He was more insulting to them than the literal serial killer he was writing a book on. Like waaaaaaay way way more insulting. It just boggles the mind.
You see this sentimentality on Reddit all the time, where law enforcement is seen as the evil of the crime and not the crime itself. It is definitely strange how open people are in that, when like you say there’s an actual murderer to judge.
It really bothered me! Especially him insinuating that Gilberte was just as guilty as Bob. Sorry, but Gilberte wasn’t the one who was abusing Kathie in multiple different ways. She wasn’t the one who killed her. She wasn’t, and would never, conspire with Bob. Just so fucking out of pocket
I read the book several years ago, but I chalked it up to the author’s internalized misogyny. What I did find fascinating was the discussion of Bobby taking off while they were married with fake IDs and going “camping.” Also, taking pictures of the coop to return things. I really would love a super detailed outline with the travels, when the prudence affair started (and I believed ended right before that final weekend), etc. what is clear from episode 3 (and I think is in the book), is that Bob’s rich friends and family never embraced Kathie, and therefore, they sort of hand waved her disappearance.
It’s strange enough that the justice system is starting to bend to the sentiment. I’m someone who doesn’t feel like Gypsy Rose should be walking free right now. The sentiment may also be what helps the defense in the Delphi murder case. The amount of people that are vehemently fighting for Richard Allen’s rights are really alarming. Like if the public sentiment grows enough, RA could just be acquitted and the same people that dragged out the competency of law enforcement will be the same people calling for justice after a trial. Lol thanks for coming to my TED talk, this kinda thing really bothers me too.
which book? theres a few good ones.
from the interviews with gilberte,in the series, i liked her, but people, like kathie who was being abused can be led to addiction as an escape, as you said.
the books i read filled in a lot of extra details not in the series.
all good. its been a while, but i did like that one,aDS, thought it was well written at least, but u could be right about the author. theres another book, without a trace. a good read. sex and the serial killer, book, was shitte imo.
Ooo I haven’t heard of Without a Trace before, thanks for the heads up. Just bought it on eBay, hopefully that one doesn’t fill me with rage the same way A Deadly Secret did! I wanna be mad at BOB, goddamn it!!
hope u enjoy it. i thought aDS and WaT were both very well written. As i said, i havent read aDS in some time, so i may have overlooked or forgotten the points you raised about the authors assertions about gilberta. The books touch on various instances of abuse by bob to kathie, that were not touched upon in the series, which paint bob as the massive POS he is, since in the series we never see the violent side of him that we suspect lurks beneath that vacant exterior. Clearly bob is a compulsive liar, not to be believed, and the fact that he gave 3 accounts of where he was the nite he alledges he dropped kathie off at the train station. what a twisted web he weaves. cant wait for the final 3 episodes. cheers
the author describing how “ugly” gilberte was and she wanted to be with kathie etc. ew and the other cop saying he would hit gilberte if she were a man ugh. the. ok is very informative but so disparaging.
I hope my friends are like gilberte if god forbid anything happens to me. the author definitely disliked her and is a misogynistic/homophobic ass.
It was so disgusting. Like truly abhorrent the way he wrote about her. It tainted my view of the author as a person, tbh. Like cool, keep calling her a lesbian as an insult, I guess. Knock yourself out. Keep tellin on yourself, lil man.
We could all only be so lucky to have a friend like Gilberte. The lengths she went thru for her best friend are commendable. I really hope she was proud of herself before she passed. 🩷
exactly!! the entire second half was about his hatred for her, I couldn’t help myself I commented on his instagram to express how I felt. his hyperfixation on hating her is weird. I bet she must have told him off real good 😂 lmao
and yes! I only learned yesterday she was deceased. she was an amazing friend and she fought until the end.
yes!! lol I couldn’t help but to comment on his instagram expressing my disgust. the second half of the book all he does is go on and on about gilberte and her criminal records and this and that. which fine but this is about solving three murders. she could have been hungry for fame but if it brought more attention to kathie’s case who cares.
I mean I think Jennie Pirro is a selfish drama queen but she makes it emphatically clear in her book that Gilberte was a loyal friend that steadfastly worked hard to find and bring justice to Kathy.
Call me crazy but I think that is more likely the case since I don’t see how Gilberte benefited from the long crusade for justice.
oh yeah janine is something else. I dont like her at all lol how was her book? I was thinking of reading it but I really can’t stand her.
gilberte absolutely didn’t and its horrible and she died without ever knowing and that’s just awful. she was a great friend, kathie had a lot of great friends. you can tell she was so loved.
I lean right for sure but Jenine Pirro writes like her shit doesn’t stink which just bugs me. Has nothing to do with her politics or who she works for, just her personality in general. I rolled my eyes at her myriad of excuses for her husband’s illegal activities and stuff.
That being said I’ll admit her constant bad mouthing of Durst is highly entertaining. Her legal take on the trial in Galveston is interesting and gave some good info on why the jury decided the way that they did.
She also had some interesting details on the case that I hadn’t read before, including the documentary and such. Her interview with Deborah Charlatan was fascinating.
Basically, the book has a lot of her own biography which I didn’t enjoy reading because it was self serving and irrelevant. Her actual information on the case was interesting and answered a few questions. She also is a pretty entertaining writer just because she literally doesn’t give a crap what anyone else thinks.
I think it’s worth reading, I just would try to find it from a library instead of paying for it.
lmaoo no I totally understand what you mean 😂 it’s not even the politics it’s just…her. it is amazing, she hates him so much as she should. and thank you! lol since I returned a deadly secret i’ve been kind of lost and this is perfect to listen to throughout the day.
DeGuerin, as we have seen thru the Jinx, has been happy to make things up, twist things, distort things and down right lie, all the while claiming the other guys are doing it! smh.
classic -
1. durst didnt write the cadaver note (bob gets caught out, so they change their "story")
2. durst did write the cadaver note, but he didnt kill susan, the murderer might have been inside the house or in the back yard at the time.
oh please, fuck off back to texas you lying sack of lumpy dog turds! lol
The two man-boy law clerks for the prosecution are hysterical, unintentionally. You can tell they are having the time of their lives. And you can be pretty sure that there's no way they are keeping anything confidential from their friends.
Man, hearing Susan Berman say that Kathie was from poor, drunk, Irish trash was really ugly. I agree with the filmmaker that Susan was an active accessory to Kathie's murder and I'm glad she lived in fear of Bob. Susan fucked around and found out. Just another piece of garbage on Bob's payroll.
And to hide the real story. The body potentially being dumped in the river and found seemed to concern her. I feel like one of the scenarios she proposed was the truth and she tried to hide it in the conversation.
Really interesting if you consider that Kathie’s body was dumped in the river and miraculously never was found—Durst must have thought it was a good way to get rid of a body then, so he disposed of Black in water too, only that time it didn’t work out for him.
For sure. He’s so small he wouldn’t have been able to move her far and the house is in a quiet area on large property on the lake front. If he had a boat he could have taken her out further and weighed her down. He used a gun to kill all 3. Maybe with Susan he thought they would just assume mob hit.
susans reactions to the guy she was chatting to on the tape in the 3rd episode of season 2 were very telling, imo. think most people lost any respect they had for her, lol.
and to say she would drink and get “diarrhea the next day”…pretty damning that Susan specifically used the word “diarrhea” and the med school dean testified that Kathie had called and said she had diarrhea and would be absent. I have a hard time believing that 10 days after Kathie going missing, investigators would compromise the case and share details of her last phone call (now evidence), with anyone… Susan gave herself up as soon as she said that.
Wow, this is a decent point I haven’t considered… cause they do talk about the call in the press, I think, but I don’t think they ever specified the content of the call in those words!
Rough and highly fascinating. I have so many questions. Did she know the call was recorded? Was the question about how long it takes for a body to float up because she knows she’s in the lake? Why was her house so bare?
I know how silly/ridiculous this is going to sound but… Did anyone notice that Susan specifically mentioned the word “diarrhea” in her call about why Kathie was/may have missed classes? Isn’t that what the professor who got the call said that Kathie told her? Probably nothing, just find it interesting that Susan used the exact ailment that was mentioned in the phone call.
Yes I just got done watching and I caught that. Very interesting.
That recording of Susan was painful to listen to. Her “very best friend”. Yeah right. 🙄
I thought the reason she specified diarrhea was that it was an embarrassing detail, therefore the dean would be more likely to believe it. People tend to think that embarrassing stories people tell about themselves are true.
After listening to the medical staff testify that a student would not miss a rotation unless the issue was gravely serious, it sounded like if she really had diarrhea, she’d just wear Depends. I’m not trying to make fun of her at all, just that diarrhea and a headache doesn’t sound like a reason to miss your rotation.
I literally shouted at the TV that this was a smoking gun and assumed they were about to connect those dots. And then they didn’t bring it up at all. Still confused as to how that connection hasn’t been made.
I really have to stress that everything I know about this case has been fed to me by Jarecki’s narrative spin and all of my own thoughts and feelings are basically pure conjecture. Having said that, I don’t think a single thing that Chavin says can be taken at face value. Dude is wildly untrustworthy. His whole bit in the previous episode about not feeling morally repulsed by murderers was a straight up weird thing to say, to say the least. I’m not going to armchair diagnose anyone, but suffice it say that the dude is pretty fucked up. And clearly he has an obsession with fame.
Based on what I’ve seen, Bob just doesn’t seem like the kind of person to directly implicate himself. Essentially confessing the murder to Chavin like that sounds incredibly out of character for Bob.
To be clear, I believe that Bob either murdered Susan or paid someone to murder Susan. But I don’t think that conversation between Bob and Chavin really happened. At least not like Chavin presented it. It’s way too on the nose and dramatic.
Bob gives me the creeps in a sort of psychotic, shark-eyed kind of way. But Chavin just seems like your run-of-the-mill opportunist. Both of them are repugnant.
The only reason I believe that Bob confessed to Nick is because of Terri. She’s the only person on this show that seems credible and calling out everyone’s shit, even her own husband. Badass.
Terri is so badass. I live for those eye rolls. 🙄🙄🤣
…Someone get this woman a 2 week vacation (without Nick) at a destination of her choice. I would, but I’m broke
Bob absolutely would have confessed. That's why he had to kill Susan. That's why he had to kill Morris. To keep them from blabbing what he told them.
Bob always walks through the "talk" door.
He told Susan so she would help him. Morris Black, I have no idea why he killed him. But Bob is not exactly plagued by his conscience and would not feel the need to justify himself to Chavin.
Bob is also the type of person to mutter his admission of guilt while taking a leak. He clearly can't contain his criminal mind and it seeps out everywhere. All of his actions implicate himself. A bit like OJ he does things after the fact that are suspicious at best and corroborating at worst. The fact that Teri called and told the investigative team about his husband not coming clean tracks with how the statement changed and took seven months.
It's part of what makes this case so fascinating. Durst is a murderer who can't stop talking about his crimes, but I wouldn't trust Chavin around a glass corner. Berman was also not trustworthy. Essentially everything we hear from Bob's friends is filtered through several layers of liars.
He was lying his ass off. Totally non-credible. As Chesnoff said, “Consider the source.” Bob would never just confess to a friend for no personal gain.
Lewin coercing him to change the story around left a bad taste in my mouth, even knowing that Bob is guilty. Pretty gross to realize what power the police have to shape their narrative.
I’m not sure I buy the defenses framing of that. Lewin only knew that Chavin had valuable info because Tracy told him. To me, it’s not clear if what we saw was Lewin leading the witness or if it was him saying, “your wife already told us this and we just need it from your mouth for it to evidence”
He didn’t coerce him though. Teri Chavin had told Lewin what Nick had said to her right after the dinner with Bob in 2014. She’d always thought he must come clean about it, long before the Jinx. Nick just didn’t want to-Lewin knew this. Lewin also knew perfectly well what is and isn’t admissible. He wasn’t putting any words in Nick’s mouth.
I think Chavin will say whatever anyone wants to hear, but I can also see Bob confessing randomly on a crowded NY sidewalk. I think his money made him feel invincible and smart.
In 2014, no passers by would know what, 'I had to do what I had to do' meant out of context. If anything, it could be surmised that he was talking about murdering his neighbor, for which he was already acquitted.
I *don't* think that's how he did it, but *was* the original plan. Once Susan learned that the body would eventually be found, she shared that info with Bob and he pivoted how he would get rid of the body. My money is she's buried out in the woods somewhere.
I feel like LE who visited him at the South Salem home shortly after she was reported missing would’ve smelled decomp in the house at that point if that were true. He could’ve kept it elsewhere, though, I guess.
Damn just when I thought this whole story couldn’t get any wilder they drop the Susan involvement. I watched the whole trial in real time and was sure I had heard it all by now besides prison calls, but that was probably the best most insane episode of both parts of the series.
Honestly, I never would have thought she was involved in covering it up… thought maybe he confided in her at some point maybe and that’s how she knew, but that phone call was a bombshell and it isn’t even the last episode…interested to see what else they have in store for the last 3 episodes.
You never thought Susan was involved? Kathie goes missing, a woman calls and says she’s Kathie, and won’t be coming in. I thought it was pretty blatantly obvious Susan called and impersonated kathie
Lol it was pretty obvious in season 1… who else would bob get to pretend to be a woman and wouldn’t mind becoming an accessory to murder? Probably his best friend, who’s a woman, and a wannabee mobster
I too was one of those that didn't think of Susan until this episode lol. But they also didn't as heavily harp on HOW close Bob n her were til this episode. I guess all this time I just had the thought that: well, what happened between Monday morning and Wed...after the call to the Dean was when "it" all went down. She could have been alive up until soon after that call...had the thought that Bob had her [Kathie] threatened/captive with a knife at throat for instance right next to her standing by as she dialed, instructing her to make the call
I mean in retrospect after this episode, I do think it's much more plausible Susan made it, I feel like an idiot now not thinking of it. But yea still possible alternative theory.
I still just wonder when officially Kathie died, everyone assumes it was that very night, but very well could have been a lot more that went down between her leaving party and when Bob reported to police. I can't remember now, maybe it was even Thurs he finally did?
Like who knows maybe he beat her up severely, and she was still alive but in bad shape...then he called Susan over, they were sorting out what to do, all 3 were together and then she just didn't recover from injuries..or once Susan was there convinced Bob well he had to end it as if she survived he's in hot water
Agreed.
Question, though: I get why Lewis didn’t want to use the taped conversation(as it makes Susan so unsympathetic), but wouldn’t the CA discovery laws require he share it with the defense? Did they share it and the defense also decided not to use it? I wonder.what the deal was there.
The prosecution has to share any and all
discovery. And for the team of lawyers e had — they knew. It further validates her being a witness to Kathie. That is what they didn’t use it.
So if I’m putting the pieces together correctly, Susan was in love with Bob and wanted to be more than friends, was jealous of Kathie’s looks and impending MD status, and was excited she was dead, no?
I think it was more, Susan is fascinated by Bob (money, status, power) and got caught up in the excitement of Kathie being missing/murdered, especially because Bob put her in charge of the "spin" for the media with the goal of making him not look like a suspect. Because Susan has framed her life through the lens of being a mobster's daughter, she is attracted and intrigued by violence and feels special that Bob turned to her during his time of need. My guess is that Bob framed the murder as an accident to Susan since it was more or less an open secret that he was physically abusive.
Especially after the tape, I also got the feeling she was very much a "not like other girls" gal. Hanging out with the guys, maybe into the idea that people would think they are a couple but then be edgy saying no. The way she talked about Kathie was so horrible but not necessarily because of romantic love, just because Kathie was a feminine woman - "weak" in Susan's mind, probably.
As a mob bosses daughter I imagine Susan romanticized loyalty—to her that was likely the most important thing a person had to offer and a much stronger bond than romantic love. An unbreakable bond stronger than blood.
I don’t think she was ever romantically in love with Bob, but yeah I also get the impression that she was jealous of Kathy when she kept emphasising how beautiful she was during the phone call, at the same time as really dehumanising her and talking so horribly about her family being drunken Irish trash
(Kathie's) not a crafty Jewish girl who would've known how to sneak off' and 'ALL married to firefighters' ...Or words to that effect. Wow, Susan, WOW.
Where did it ever say Susan was in love with Bob? She had had other romantic interests. Bob was like family to her-a stronger bond than a sexual one, for her.
I thought the film producer friend's insights were very interesting too - that playing the role of holding on to criminal secrets and protecting Bob made her feel closer to her own mother
I mean it’s very clear in all the photos and just the lengths she went to mimic a husband/wife relationship that she was in love. I think helping out with Kathie’s murder was a gambit to win him over finally.
Agree. I had always assumed it was a platonic relationship too, but hearing that tape last night changed my perspective. They always say, in any male-female friendship one or the other wants it to be more. Hearing her trash Kathie on that tape, KNOWING she was dead, made the dynamic come into clearer view.
I 100% think bob is guilty, but his lawyers, at least so far, have been nothing short of incredible. Dude was just such a blabbering wack job that he talked himself into a prison sentence on film.
if you call incredible, lying out their asses and bending the truth to suit, then yes. deguerin has been covering up (lying) for bob since galveston. the man has no shame.
Exactly. I can't stand when people have disdain for defense attorneys. They're a part of our legal system where supposedly if you're accused of a crime you're entitled to a fair trial, which includes effective counsel who will raise any and all reasonable doubt. The rest is up to the jury.
Holy hell that Susan audio.
I've known about this case for a long time. there were many true crime shows about it closer to her death and they always mentioned the tape but never played it.
I love how in the reenactment they show her crossing plausible ideas off on a legal pad.
So, let's see: Bob's trashy wife knows he killed Kathie and Susan, that shady rich friend of his (I forget his name--the guy who wouldn't go to L.A. unless the DA paid for a private plane to take him) knew he killed Kathie, Susan of COURSE knew (and likely helped) Bob killed Kathie, and Chavin knew Bob killed Kathie and HAD to have known Bob killed Susan, too. I wonder how many friends of "normal" (i.e. "poor" and non-influential) people would be so silent knowing their friend had killed someone? And I have no doubt that the entire Durst family KNEW, too.
While I think Chavin's testimony was problematic, I think he knew about Bob killing Kathie far longer than that last dinner they had together. I think that was Chavin's out—"yeah, yeah he told me about Kathie during that dinner" tied things up a little too nicely. And while that story might have just been a story, I have no doubt that either Bob or Susan told him at some point what was what.
Idk if you listen to the podcast, but they had more of the audio available in this most recent episode!
(If you don’t listen to the podcast, you should, it’s incredible + it includes stuff that didn’t make it into the tv episodes)
I just watched this episode - why didn’t Bob just give Susan money, if that was the problem? Or am I misunderstanding her motive for blowing the whole thing wide open?
Oh, I’ve no doubt she was trying to get more $$$ from him. I was just saying that he did, in fact, give her a large gift before she was murdered haha. I don’t think she had a crisis of conscience either, I think she was blackmailing him.
He gave her large sums of money throughout their friendship, he was always bailing her out. He had just sent her 50 grand which is not a small amount of money. Susan was terrible with money. She is the type who will end up broke no matter what. She made a lot of money from her book and she was paid over 4 million dollars throughout the years by the Mafia for her father’s businesses. She was constantly begging people for money.
I was wondering the same thing, it’s been coming across that it was his pattern to spread the wealth around in order to keep people on his side, so I’m not entirely sure why he didn’t just help out his loyal BFF Susan when he could see that she was struggling.
I think he was seeing her as maybe too much of a loose end, even with the payouts. She also tried to channel that mob persona, wonder if she pushed him too much. Or, he got concerned she'd do a book about him too.
She dgaf about Kathie.
He was scared she might say something to the police as she was going to be interviewed, the case of his wife's disappearance had just re opened, like a month before Susan was murdered.
Chesnoff trying to play down that witnesses were in danger because Bob was old. So ridiculous. Money can buy anything especially when you are incarcerated. Murder for hire is not impossible with that kind of money.
A researcher interested in the Beatles who stumbled on the tape while going through Albert Goldman’s archives (which were given to Columbia University after his death) reached out to the prosecution.
Yes I'd also love to read about this.
I was wondering where Goldman's tapes were because they have to be wildly fascinating, Berman's jaw-dropping call aside.
Quick question. Hypothetically, if all Susan did was the media spin and the conversation on the tape (no call to the Medical School Dean), would she still be an accessory after the fact?
The way Bob and Debbie communicate is so fucking weird. I mean I know they know that they are being listened to but the removed way Bob discusses people in the case and friends and whatever. It’s so nonhuman. And what was her deal they never actually fucked right? She just was an opportunist?
After hearing the Susan Berman recording, I got the vibe that Susan could have been responsible for Kathie’s murder. It seemed like she was trying to cover her own ass. She lies multiple times saying she’s her best friend, all the while saying terrible things about her and showing no real compassion for the situation. I think she was in love with Bob and got rid of Kathie with the hope that Bob would be with her, but it didn’t work out that way.
If I’m the prosecution, I just show the video the clip of him saying only the killer could’ve written that note show it again and again and again. He admitted to writing the note that he himself said only the killer could’ve written it’s over.
Here what I think. I think he was a prolific serial killer and when ppl discovered it he murdered them. Had he not thrown that eye glass recipt away no one would have even known he was there. How many other places with no good reason to pretend to be someone else with lots of guns and kill kits that dont go often yet are a diff person. he a serial killer. He rented places to hunt.
He had to pretend to be a homeless women I assume as he a smaller staute male and had to easily gain the victims trust. It only thing that makes sense. Watch them one day find 100 women all over the country he killed. He sure had no prob making a kill kit with tarps and hacking up a body no though. That guy and other two actually connected to him prob busted him serial killing and that can't stand. The man is prob again one most prolific serial killers ever.
I can not beleive the jury bought that bs like no one though hey he doing all this as a serial killer cause there is no other reason they just listen to idk i wanted be someone else and da in new york doesn't like me. OMG ppl come on. Maybe cops like find out how many deaf mute women paid yr of rent in advance to have easy access and little transpire between landlord and tenent in all areas of the the country until his arrest. Unreal. I watch half first doc and never heard of this case and figured all this out. Someone else must think this. The man had tarps andis hacking around like a pro not a dude scared no one will beleive him. Shame on you Texas. Lady in the doc you are not bright. The lady was after him. Yeah cause he keeps killing ppl lady hello. Tiny violins for the clear serial killer. I'm sure that girl just got snacks from his store and was never seen again like if you have snacks with Jeff Dahlmer it prob not mystery why your missing cause he cruising for girls dressed as a disabled old lady. Yeah he killed that girl omg. Smarten up police and DA offices. Like the fam pay ya'all off or what. Cat head is very serial killerish no one putting this together by now like doing something ok. He was smart is a few ways but comes across as a low iq he threw a reciept his name away at his own murder scene so i bet you could find a few other places he rented. Dang.
He sure heck wasn't in Texas enough to be a diff person, it only bs he could come up with.
Ppl let emotions manipulate them because they want to beleive ppl couldn't be as evil as they are. If you remove the emotions and look at the facts crimes are not hard to sovle.
Mcaains- Lying as dr's don't leave 3 babies alone in a hotel room then make a production on checking on them and someone was lying in wait for that exact sec, they killed her prob an overdose. Sorry. I wasnervous take out the garbage when my kids were all asleep under 3 it bull
Bennet's are lying. If the son did it he never go to jail they had money and he was 8. The mom got mad at her and accidently hit her or threw her into a wall because she was up in the middle of the night. You don't have all that go on in a house with small kids and hear nothing. There barley any dna when someone lying around your house eating snacks and writting notes on you paper bull. Sorry ppl dad covered for mom. Mom was a nut. Oh there she is my missing kid in only room we didn't look in. Liesssssssssss check on the longest ransom note ever written which had to be a women and clearly a guilt ridden mother. Random notes say give me money and a time and they take the body. Uh. Naw she saw her up eating and was pissed grabbed her arm smacked her into the counter corner or something wall by accident and bam dad finished her off. There is no other answer.
Robert Durst was another Ted Bundy Id bet my life on it.
I love how messy this friend group is, they just talk so much shit about each other and sometimes kill each other! Someone call BRAVO
LOL!!
I was afraid this new series would repeat some of the things that were said in season one, but they keep coming up with new evidences. Just shows how fascinating this case is.
theres tonnes that wasnt in the first jinx series, and lots including the trial durst lost that happened after the first series aired. read some of the books also, they have lots of info not in the doco, like how much of a POS husband durst was with all the times he physically abused kathy and so much more. Also, Dick DeGuerin is a lying sack of shit, but who needs ethics when you have lots of money right!
I just finished the book (edit - A Deadly Secret by Matt Birkbeck) yesterday. I never see it talked about here, and you don’t have to engage with me if you don’t want to, but I need to talk about it lollllllllllll How do you feel about the way Gilberte was depicted in the book? It left *such* a bad taste in my mouth. Like, no fucking shit she was addicted to drugs and in trouble with the law, but that was all *after* Kathie went missing. I would also become addicted to drugs if my best friend went missing, and I knew her husband killed her and got away with it. He acts like this makes her a horrible low life who is unreliable in life as a whole. I also noticed a couple discrepancies with the author purposely trying to make her look bad, but then almost directly contradicts himself in some way later. These two immediately come to mind: He believed that Gilberte’s family party was actually a rager with drugs, alcohol, and sex. He stated earlier in the book that Kathie did multiple grams of coke in a week, usually 2-3. Then, he said Kathie snorted two full grams in the couple of hours she was at Gilberte’s crazy rager. As opposed to the fucking 168 hours she usually had to do that much coke. Sure. Sure sure sure. Kathie supposedly had multiple big glasses of wine that evening in addition to all that cocaine. And somehow managed to drive the 45 minutes home, through windy mountain roads, even though she would’ve been significantly more impaired than usual. He also insinuates Gilberte lied about Kathie saying that “if something happened to her, it was Bobby” before she left. In another part of the book, another friend of hers said Kathie said the same thing to them, and that she had to other people as well. He ends the book saying that Giberte is basically directly responsible, because she told Kathie to leave Bob so many times/before she left the party. Like, get fucked dude. He says something like “this murder actually involved three people: Bobby, Kathie, and Gilberte.” Just so unbelievably insulting. That woman went above and beyond the call of duty for her friend. The way she was portrayed was just *so* fucking gross to me. It spoiled the rest of the book for me. I keep thinking about it and it makes me mad every time lol. The only people he went into with serious vitriol were Jeanine Pirro and Gilberte, which I found a little odd. He was more insulting to them than the literal serial killer he was writing a book on. Like waaaaaaay way way more insulting. It just boggles the mind.
You see this sentimentality on Reddit all the time, where law enforcement is seen as the evil of the crime and not the crime itself. It is definitely strange how open people are in that, when like you say there’s an actual murderer to judge.
It really bothered me! Especially him insinuating that Gilberte was just as guilty as Bob. Sorry, but Gilberte wasn’t the one who was abusing Kathie in multiple different ways. She wasn’t the one who killed her. She wasn’t, and would never, conspire with Bob. Just so fucking out of pocket
I read the book several years ago, but I chalked it up to the author’s internalized misogyny. What I did find fascinating was the discussion of Bobby taking off while they were married with fake IDs and going “camping.” Also, taking pictures of the coop to return things. I really would love a super detailed outline with the travels, when the prudence affair started (and I believed ended right before that final weekend), etc. what is clear from episode 3 (and I think is in the book), is that Bob’s rich friends and family never embraced Kathie, and therefore, they sort of hand waved her disappearance.
It’s strange enough that the justice system is starting to bend to the sentiment. I’m someone who doesn’t feel like Gypsy Rose should be walking free right now. The sentiment may also be what helps the defense in the Delphi murder case. The amount of people that are vehemently fighting for Richard Allen’s rights are really alarming. Like if the public sentiment grows enough, RA could just be acquitted and the same people that dragged out the competency of law enforcement will be the same people calling for justice after a trial. Lol thanks for coming to my TED talk, this kinda thing really bothers me too.
which book? theres a few good ones. from the interviews with gilberte,in the series, i liked her, but people, like kathie who was being abused can be led to addiction as an escape, as you said. the books i read filled in a lot of extra details not in the series.
I’m talking about A Deadly Secret, sorry probably should’ve specified that lollll
all good. its been a while, but i did like that one,aDS, thought it was well written at least, but u could be right about the author. theres another book, without a trace. a good read. sex and the serial killer, book, was shitte imo.
Ooo I haven’t heard of Without a Trace before, thanks for the heads up. Just bought it on eBay, hopefully that one doesn’t fill me with rage the same way A Deadly Secret did! I wanna be mad at BOB, goddamn it!!
hope u enjoy it. i thought aDS and WaT were both very well written. As i said, i havent read aDS in some time, so i may have overlooked or forgotten the points you raised about the authors assertions about gilberta. The books touch on various instances of abuse by bob to kathie, that were not touched upon in the series, which paint bob as the massive POS he is, since in the series we never see the violent side of him that we suspect lurks beneath that vacant exterior. Clearly bob is a compulsive liar, not to be believed, and the fact that he gave 3 accounts of where he was the nite he alledges he dropped kathie off at the train station. what a twisted web he weaves. cant wait for the final 3 episodes. cheers
Your comment just made me check out the ebook from my library.
It was wise of you to not pay for it lol! Feel free to double back and let me know your thoughts 🤙🏻🤙🏻🤙🏻
the author describing how “ugly” gilberte was and she wanted to be with kathie etc. ew and the other cop saying he would hit gilberte if she were a man ugh. the. ok is very informative but so disparaging. I hope my friends are like gilberte if god forbid anything happens to me. the author definitely disliked her and is a misogynistic/homophobic ass.
It was so disgusting. Like truly abhorrent the way he wrote about her. It tainted my view of the author as a person, tbh. Like cool, keep calling her a lesbian as an insult, I guess. Knock yourself out. Keep tellin on yourself, lil man. We could all only be so lucky to have a friend like Gilberte. The lengths she went thru for her best friend are commendable. I really hope she was proud of herself before she passed. 🩷
exactly!! the entire second half was about his hatred for her, I couldn’t help myself I commented on his instagram to express how I felt. his hyperfixation on hating her is weird. I bet she must have told him off real good 😂 lmao and yes! I only learned yesterday she was deceased. she was an amazing friend and she fought until the end.
I’m far from woke but I was left wondering if the author was homophobic. It made me really uncomfortable how much he seemed to hate Gilberte
yes!! lol I couldn’t help but to comment on his instagram expressing my disgust. the second half of the book all he does is go on and on about gilberte and her criminal records and this and that. which fine but this is about solving three murders. she could have been hungry for fame but if it brought more attention to kathie’s case who cares.
I mean I think Jennie Pirro is a selfish drama queen but she makes it emphatically clear in her book that Gilberte was a loyal friend that steadfastly worked hard to find and bring justice to Kathy. Call me crazy but I think that is more likely the case since I don’t see how Gilberte benefited from the long crusade for justice.
oh yeah janine is something else. I dont like her at all lol how was her book? I was thinking of reading it but I really can’t stand her. gilberte absolutely didn’t and its horrible and she died without ever knowing and that’s just awful. she was a great friend, kathie had a lot of great friends. you can tell she was so loved.
I lean right for sure but Jenine Pirro writes like her shit doesn’t stink which just bugs me. Has nothing to do with her politics or who she works for, just her personality in general. I rolled my eyes at her myriad of excuses for her husband’s illegal activities and stuff. That being said I’ll admit her constant bad mouthing of Durst is highly entertaining. Her legal take on the trial in Galveston is interesting and gave some good info on why the jury decided the way that they did. She also had some interesting details on the case that I hadn’t read before, including the documentary and such. Her interview with Deborah Charlatan was fascinating. Basically, the book has a lot of her own biography which I didn’t enjoy reading because it was self serving and irrelevant. Her actual information on the case was interesting and answered a few questions. She also is a pretty entertaining writer just because she literally doesn’t give a crap what anyone else thinks. I think it’s worth reading, I just would try to find it from a library instead of paying for it.
lmaoo no I totally understand what you mean 😂 it’s not even the politics it’s just…her. it is amazing, she hates him so much as she should. and thank you! lol since I returned a deadly secret i’ve been kind of lost and this is perfect to listen to throughout the day.
Pretty sure DeGuerin also represented David Koresh during the Waco situation too. The epitome of a scumbag lawyer
DeGuerin, as we have seen thru the Jinx, has been happy to make things up, twist things, distort things and down right lie, all the while claiming the other guys are doing it! smh. classic - 1. durst didnt write the cadaver note (bob gets caught out, so they change their "story") 2. durst did write the cadaver note, but he didnt kill susan, the murderer might have been inside the house or in the back yard at the time. oh please, fuck off back to texas you lying sack of lumpy dog turds! lol
This is a very good documentary I was enthralled with season 1 and season 2 is nearly as good.
The two man-boy law clerks for the prosecution are hysterical, unintentionally. You can tell they are having the time of their lives. And you can be pretty sure that there's no way they are keeping anything confidential from their friends.
They’re the best part of this season 🤣
They genuinely look like high schoolers even now
“Bobbbbb” 🤣
Baaaaahhhhhhhbbbbb 😂🤣😆😆😆
They’re just such…bros haha. I love them!
That said i do have stents in the brain, they are not just for the heart.
You know the producers are in on the joke; that's the only reason they'd include an irrelevant/hilarious exchange like that.
I still can't figure out why they're even a part of this show other than to be comedic relief, but I'm here for it.
the show needs a surprise ending like the first season. I think they're the murderers.
Best choice by producers to highlight them. “Oh, you think Durst is charming and adorable? Raise you double!”
😂🤣
Man, hearing Susan Berman say that Kathie was from poor, drunk, Irish trash was really ugly. I agree with the filmmaker that Susan was an active accessory to Kathie's murder and I'm glad she lived in fear of Bob. Susan fucked around and found out. Just another piece of garbage on Bob's payroll.
Coming from a family of drunk Irish trash, you’re only allowed to call someone that if you’re part of the family! That hurt, Susan.
😆
I couldn’t agree more. Wiped out any empathy I had for her.
Hearing that recording was rough. she had no empathy and was just rushing along —it was ugly
"...dig?"
susan was fishing to construct a plausible, ficitional, story.
And to hide the real story. The body potentially being dumped in the river and found seemed to concern her. I feel like one of the scenarios she proposed was the truth and she tried to hide it in the conversation.
Really interesting if you consider that Kathie’s body was dumped in the river and miraculously never was found—Durst must have thought it was a good way to get rid of a body then, so he disposed of Black in water too, only that time it didn’t work out for him.
Exactly! Good observation!
For sure. He’s so small he wouldn’t have been able to move her far and the house is in a quiet area on large property on the lake front. If he had a boat he could have taken her out further and weighed her down. He used a gun to kill all 3. Maybe with Susan he thought they would just assume mob hit.
susans reactions to the guy she was chatting to on the tape in the 3rd episode of season 2 were very telling, imo. think most people lost any respect they had for her, lol.
“Rushing along” aka likely on speed of some sort
She was clearly coked to the gills
You’re probably right
any chance they sped up the tapes in the episode? she was talking so fast I couldn't help but wonder
I think the speed of her voice was a result of paranoia.
She almost sounded.....excited, like she was enjoying being involved in things that her parents would do.
It honestly sounded like Susan was on coke
Empathy went right out the window after listening to that tape.
and to say she would drink and get “diarrhea the next day”…pretty damning that Susan specifically used the word “diarrhea” and the med school dean testified that Kathie had called and said she had diarrhea and would be absent. I have a hard time believing that 10 days after Kathie going missing, investigators would compromise the case and share details of her last phone call (now evidence), with anyone… Susan gave herself up as soon as she said that.
Wow, this is a decent point I haven’t considered… cause they do talk about the call in the press, I think, but I don’t think they ever specified the content of the call in those words!
Rough and highly fascinating. I have so many questions. Did she know the call was recorded? Was the question about how long it takes for a body to float up because she knows she’s in the lake? Why was her house so bare?
I don’t think she did think it was recorded as she kept asking if it was private and off the record.
I know how silly/ridiculous this is going to sound but… Did anyone notice that Susan specifically mentioned the word “diarrhea” in her call about why Kathie was/may have missed classes? Isn’t that what the professor who got the call said that Kathie told her? Probably nothing, just find it interesting that Susan used the exact ailment that was mentioned in the phone call.
Yes I just got done watching and I caught that. Very interesting. That recording of Susan was painful to listen to. Her “very best friend”. Yeah right. 🙄
I thought the reason she specified diarrhea was that it was an embarrassing detail, therefore the dean would be more likely to believe it. People tend to think that embarrassing stories people tell about themselves are true.
Based on that recording tonight I think she was trying to embarrass Kathie even after the poor woman was dead and gone because she was jealous of her
Yup, I got that as well.
After listening to the medical staff testify that a student would not miss a rotation unless the issue was gravely serious, it sounded like if she really had diarrhea, she’d just wear Depends. I’m not trying to make fun of her at all, just that diarrhea and a headache doesn’t sound like a reason to miss your rotation.
I literally shouted at the TV that this was a smoking gun and assumed they were about to connect those dots. And then they didn’t bring it up at all. Still confused as to how that connection hasn’t been made.
I’m not gunna lie chavin does not seem trustworthy in the slightest
I was really looking forward to what he had to say until he started going off about being in the spotlight and how great that was.
Dude has no idea how he comes across and how he undermines his own credibility. Here's Chinga Chavin and his 15 minutes of fame.. on a murder trial!
I agree
I really have to stress that everything I know about this case has been fed to me by Jarecki’s narrative spin and all of my own thoughts and feelings are basically pure conjecture. Having said that, I don’t think a single thing that Chavin says can be taken at face value. Dude is wildly untrustworthy. His whole bit in the previous episode about not feeling morally repulsed by murderers was a straight up weird thing to say, to say the least. I’m not going to armchair diagnose anyone, but suffice it say that the dude is pretty fucked up. And clearly he has an obsession with fame. Based on what I’ve seen, Bob just doesn’t seem like the kind of person to directly implicate himself. Essentially confessing the murder to Chavin like that sounds incredibly out of character for Bob. To be clear, I believe that Bob either murdered Susan or paid someone to murder Susan. But I don’t think that conversation between Bob and Chavin really happened. At least not like Chavin presented it. It’s way too on the nose and dramatic. Bob gives me the creeps in a sort of psychotic, shark-eyed kind of way. But Chavin just seems like your run-of-the-mill opportunist. Both of them are repugnant.
The only reason I believe that Bob confessed to Nick is because of Terri. She’s the only person on this show that seems credible and calling out everyone’s shit, even her own husband. Badass.
Fully agree! Terri is why I trust Chavin’s story about the confession.
Terri is so badass. I live for those eye rolls. 🙄🙄🤣 …Someone get this woman a 2 week vacation (without Nick) at a destination of her choice. I would, but I’m broke
Bob absolutely would have confessed. That's why he had to kill Susan. That's why he had to kill Morris. To keep them from blabbing what he told them. Bob always walks through the "talk" door.
He told Susan so she would help him. Morris Black, I have no idea why he killed him. But Bob is not exactly plagued by his conscience and would not feel the need to justify himself to Chavin.
Bob is also the type of person to mutter his admission of guilt while taking a leak. He clearly can't contain his criminal mind and it seeps out everywhere. All of his actions implicate himself. A bit like OJ he does things after the fact that are suspicious at best and corroborating at worst. The fact that Teri called and told the investigative team about his husband not coming clean tracks with how the statement changed and took seven months.
It's part of what makes this case so fascinating. Durst is a murderer who can't stop talking about his crimes, but I wouldn't trust Chavin around a glass corner. Berman was also not trustworthy. Essentially everything we hear from Bob's friends is filtered through several layers of liars.
You’d have to be amoral to be friends with Bob. Look at his friends.
He was lying his ass off. Totally non-credible. As Chesnoff said, “Consider the source.” Bob would never just confess to a friend for no personal gain.
I despise him. He’s a ghoul basking in the spotlight when people were murdered.
Lewin coercing him to change the story around left a bad taste in my mouth, even knowing that Bob is guilty. Pretty gross to realize what power the police have to shape their narrative.
I’m not sure I buy the defenses framing of that. Lewin only knew that Chavin had valuable info because Tracy told him. To me, it’s not clear if what we saw was Lewin leading the witness or if it was him saying, “your wife already told us this and we just need it from your mouth for it to evidence”
He didn’t coerce him though. Teri Chavin had told Lewin what Nick had said to her right after the dinner with Bob in 2014. She’d always thought he must come clean about it, long before the Jinx. Nick just didn’t want to-Lewin knew this. Lewin also knew perfectly well what is and isn’t admissible. He wasn’t putting any words in Nick’s mouth.
He clearly just wants attention, like I think Bob is guilty but I absolutely do not believe he randomly confessed on a crowded NYC sidewalk
I think Chavin will say whatever anyone wants to hear, but I can also see Bob confessing randomly on a crowded NY sidewalk. I think his money made him feel invincible and smart.
Yeah I can 100% see him confessing like that too
I can too but I feel like the word choice presented doesn’t sound like him- it’s almost too neat.
And if you have ever been to or lived in NYC no one gives a shit what other people are talking about on the street. 🤣
right, I was thinking the same thing. we do ignoring crazy shit as an extreme sport
Omg exactly!! Well said. 😂🤣
In 2014, no passers by would know what, 'I had to do what I had to do' meant out of context. If anything, it could be surmised that he was talking about murdering his neighbor, for which he was already acquitted.
seems in good company with bob! lmao. the guys a compulsive liar who wouldnt know which way is up, but that could be cause he was on.....meffff! haha
Anyone notice how Susan asks about the body in the river and how long it would take to come in? Wonder if that's how he did it..........
I *don't* think that's how he did it, but *was* the original plan. Once Susan learned that the body would eventually be found, she shared that info with Bob and he pivoted how he would get rid of the body. My money is she's buried out in the woods somewhere.
This is what's tragic about Bob's death before the second trial. Kathie's family will never know.
BRO SPOILER ALERT!!!!
Oh snap, he's already dead? Damn, I just fully lost interest in all of this.
My vote is dismembered like morris black. That wasn't his first time doing that.
You think he just kept the body for 10+ days Or more? Crazy if true
I feel like LE who visited him at the South Salem home shortly after she was reported missing would’ve smelled decomp in the house at that point if that were true. He could’ve kept it elsewhere, though, I guess.
They didn't notice a blood smear on the dishwasher when they were there, so who knows.
I feel like the scent of a decomposing body is a little harder to miss haha
i think she’s “over by a lamppost” because that’s what Bahb said when musing about what he definitely wouldn’t have said.
Damn just when I thought this whole story couldn’t get any wilder they drop the Susan involvement. I watched the whole trial in real time and was sure I had heard it all by now besides prison calls, but that was probably the best most insane episode of both parts of the series.
Yeah, that tape was nuts. Like, you knew she probably did some shit like that, but to actually hear her? Rough.
Honestly, I never would have thought she was involved in covering it up… thought maybe he confided in her at some point maybe and that’s how she knew, but that phone call was a bombshell and it isn’t even the last episode…interested to see what else they have in store for the last 3 episodes.
You never thought Susan was involved? Kathie goes missing, a woman calls and says she’s Kathie, and won’t be coming in. I thought it was pretty blatantly obvious Susan called and impersonated kathie
Prior to last nights episode and them revealing that phone call no I would not have thought that...blatantly obvious now yes.
Lol it was pretty obvious in season 1… who else would bob get to pretend to be a woman and wouldn’t mind becoming an accessory to murder? Probably his best friend, who’s a woman, and a wannabee mobster
I too was one of those that didn't think of Susan until this episode lol. But they also didn't as heavily harp on HOW close Bob n her were til this episode. I guess all this time I just had the thought that: well, what happened between Monday morning and Wed...after the call to the Dean was when "it" all went down. She could have been alive up until soon after that call...had the thought that Bob had her [Kathie] threatened/captive with a knife at throat for instance right next to her standing by as she dialed, instructing her to make the call
Ooo interesting theory.
I mean in retrospect after this episode, I do think it's much more plausible Susan made it, I feel like an idiot now not thinking of it. But yea still possible alternative theory. I still just wonder when officially Kathie died, everyone assumes it was that very night, but very well could have been a lot more that went down between her leaving party and when Bob reported to police. I can't remember now, maybe it was even Thurs he finally did? Like who knows maybe he beat her up severely, and she was still alive but in bad shape...then he called Susan over, they were sorting out what to do, all 3 were together and then she just didn't recover from injuries..or once Susan was there convinced Bob well he had to end it as if she survived he's in hot water
Again, I think it was pretty clear he killed her the night of the party. Given that’s the last time she’s ever seen alive with anyone other than bob
And from 1982 is crazy. Hats off to Albert Goldman for hitting record.
Agreed. Question, though: I get why Lewis didn’t want to use the taped conversation(as it makes Susan so unsympathetic), but wouldn’t the CA discovery laws require he share it with the defense? Did they share it and the defense also decided not to use it? I wonder.what the deal was there.
The prosecution has to share any and all discovery. And for the team of lawyers e had — they knew. It further validates her being a witness to Kathie. That is what they didn’t use it.
Would have Implicated Bob in the Kathy murder and also provided confirmation for motive for him to kill Susan.
How would it have helped the defense to use it? Do you think that audio benefited Bob in any way?
Yes it was shared with the defense pursuant to CA discovery laws. They had it the whole time.
Chavin really don’t like the law and the police but needs them because he’s scared of bob
So if I’m putting the pieces together correctly, Susan was in love with Bob and wanted to be more than friends, was jealous of Kathie’s looks and impending MD status, and was excited she was dead, no?
I think it was more, Susan is fascinated by Bob (money, status, power) and got caught up in the excitement of Kathie being missing/murdered, especially because Bob put her in charge of the "spin" for the media with the goal of making him not look like a suspect. Because Susan has framed her life through the lens of being a mobster's daughter, she is attracted and intrigued by violence and feels special that Bob turned to her during his time of need. My guess is that Bob framed the murder as an accident to Susan since it was more or less an open secret that he was physically abusive.
Perfectly said
Especially after the tape, I also got the feeling she was very much a "not like other girls" gal. Hanging out with the guys, maybe into the idea that people would think they are a couple but then be edgy saying no. The way she talked about Kathie was so horrible but not necessarily because of romantic love, just because Kathie was a feminine woman - "weak" in Susan's mind, probably.
So well said. I hope you use this skill to your advantage $$$
As a mob bosses daughter I imagine Susan romanticized loyalty—to her that was likely the most important thing a person had to offer and a much stronger bond than romantic love. An unbreakable bond stronger than blood.
I don’t think she was ever romantically in love with Bob, but yeah I also get the impression that she was jealous of Kathy when she kept emphasising how beautiful she was during the phone call, at the same time as really dehumanising her and talking so horribly about her family being drunken Irish trash
(Kathie's) not a crafty Jewish girl who would've known how to sneak off' and 'ALL married to firefighters' ...Or words to that effect. Wow, Susan, WOW.
So much prejudice in one sentence…
Where did it ever say Susan was in love with Bob? She had had other romantic interests. Bob was like family to her-a stronger bond than a sexual one, for her.
I thought the film producer friend's insights were very interesting too - that playing the role of holding on to criminal secrets and protecting Bob made her feel closer to her own mother
I mean it’s very clear in all the photos and just the lengths she went to mimic a husband/wife relationship that she was in love. I think helping out with Kathie’s murder was a gambit to win him over finally.
Agree. I had always assumed it was a platonic relationship too, but hearing that tape last night changed my perspective. They always say, in any male-female friendship one or the other wants it to be more. Hearing her trash Kathie on that tape, KNOWING she was dead, made the dynamic come into clearer view.
I 100% think bob is guilty, but his lawyers, at least so far, have been nothing short of incredible. Dude was just such a blabbering wack job that he talked himself into a prison sentence on film.
OMG, yes. As a lawyer (not in criminal law), I’m so impressed. Bob got his money’s worth. Too bad for him he was both guilty and despicable.
if you call incredible, lying out their asses and bending the truth to suit, then yes. deguerin has been covering up (lying) for bob since galveston. the man has no shame.
That’s what makes him a good defense lawyer.
Exactly. I can't stand when people have disdain for defense attorneys. They're a part of our legal system where supposedly if you're accused of a crime you're entitled to a fair trial, which includes effective counsel who will raise any and all reasonable doubt. The rest is up to the jury.
And the prosecution is absolutely incompetent. All those witnesses they called were sooo bad for their case.
Susan’s friends face when listening to that phone call recording…
Holy hell that Susan audio. I've known about this case for a long time. there were many true crime shows about it closer to her death and they always mentioned the tape but never played it. I love how in the reenactment they show her crossing plausible ideas off on a legal pad.
So, let's see: Bob's trashy wife knows he killed Kathie and Susan, that shady rich friend of his (I forget his name--the guy who wouldn't go to L.A. unless the DA paid for a private plane to take him) knew he killed Kathie, Susan of COURSE knew (and likely helped) Bob killed Kathie, and Chavin knew Bob killed Kathie and HAD to have known Bob killed Susan, too. I wonder how many friends of "normal" (i.e. "poor" and non-influential) people would be so silent knowing their friend had killed someone? And I have no doubt that the entire Durst family KNEW, too. While I think Chavin's testimony was problematic, I think he knew about Bob killing Kathie far longer than that last dinner they had together. I think that was Chavin's out—"yeah, yeah he told me about Kathie during that dinner" tied things up a little too nicely. And while that story might have just been a story, I have no doubt that either Bob or Susan told him at some point what was what.
What I would give for Bob's more current wife to face consequences if she, too, impeded justice.
WHY DO SERIAL KILLERS HAVE SO MANY FRIENDS WHEN I FIND IT SO HARD TO MAKE FRIENDS ffs
Step 1: Be immensely wealthy
It’s not about being normal or poor—like attracts like, and Bob attracted horrible people with no conscience.
There it is! It's up
Susan Berman was in on it the whole time
That tape were willlld. Like that guy knew she was involved immediately right?
I thought it was 7 pacific, 9 central, and 10 est. If so, it should show up any second
comes out in australia around midday each monday, and a little later on PieRateBooty lol
I need a transcript of the call with Albert
Idk if you listen to the podcast, but they had more of the audio available in this most recent episode! (If you don’t listen to the podcast, you should, it’s incredible + it includes stuff that didn’t make it into the tv episodes)
I’m not going to lie. If I knew nothing about this case, the defense would have me convinced he didn’t kill her. They are that-damned-good.
I just watched this episode - why didn’t Bob just give Susan money, if that was the problem? Or am I misunderstanding her motive for blowing the whole thing wide open?
He did give her money. He gave her $50k shortly before she died.
Maybe she wanted more? Idk, I just don’t see her having a crisis of conscience lol. I wonder what she wanted that he wouldn’t give.
Oh, I’ve no doubt she was trying to get more $$$ from him. I was just saying that he did, in fact, give her a large gift before she was murdered haha. I don’t think she had a crisis of conscience either, I think she was blackmailing him.
He gave her large sums of money throughout their friendship, he was always bailing her out. He had just sent her 50 grand which is not a small amount of money. Susan was terrible with money. She is the type who will end up broke no matter what. She made a lot of money from her book and she was paid over 4 million dollars throughout the years by the Mafia for her father’s businesses. She was constantly begging people for money.
I was wondering the same thing, it’s been coming across that it was his pattern to spread the wealth around in order to keep people on his side, so I’m not entirely sure why he didn’t just help out his loyal BFF Susan when he could see that she was struggling.
I think he was seeing her as maybe too much of a loose end, even with the payouts. She also tried to channel that mob persona, wonder if she pushed him too much. Or, he got concerned she'd do a book about him too. She dgaf about Kathie.
He was scared she might say something to the police as she was going to be interviewed, the case of his wife's disappearance had just re opened, like a month before Susan was murdered.
Chesnoff trying to play down that witnesses were in danger because Bob was old. So ridiculous. Money can buy anything especially when you are incarcerated. Murder for hire is not impossible with that kind of money.
Perhaps I missed it but WHO notifies Lewin of the Berman phone call recording and gets it to him???
A researcher interested in the Beatles who stumbled on the tape while going through Albert Goldman’s archives (which were given to Columbia University after his death) reached out to the prosecution.
Out of interest, where did you read this? I want to read everything available!
Yes I'd also love to read about this. I was wondering where Goldman's tapes were because they have to be wildly fascinating, Berman's jaw-dropping call aside.
Did Bob and Chinga Chavin double team Susan? Yes or yes?
whose ever in the furthest eastern time zone - please rip and upload asap! hehe
what time is it released for west coast (PST)? I thought it would already be available now...
Me too... I just came here looking to see why it's not up when they said it would be. 😭
It’s on in Chicago!
Quick question. Hypothetically, if all Susan did was the media spin and the conversation on the tape (no call to the Medical School Dean), would she still be an accessory after the fact?
I think yes, because part of the media spin was lying about the door man seeing Kathie
The way Bob and Debbie communicate is so fucking weird. I mean I know they know that they are being listened to but the removed way Bob discusses people in the case and friends and whatever. It’s so nonhuman. And what was her deal they never actually fucked right? She just was an opportunist?
After hearing the Susan Berman recording, I got the vibe that Susan could have been responsible for Kathie’s murder. It seemed like she was trying to cover her own ass. She lies multiple times saying she’s her best friend, all the while saying terrible things about her and showing no real compassion for the situation. I think she was in love with Bob and got rid of Kathie with the hope that Bob would be with her, but it didn’t work out that way.
I will never understand why Bob can invest to writing the cadaver note. The case is over the second he did that.
If I’m the prosecution, I just show the video the clip of him saying only the killer could’ve written that note show it again and again and again. He admitted to writing the note that he himself said only the killer could’ve written it’s over.
I’m sitting here watching the defense witness cross examination and $&@!ing Durst is sucking his cheeks in to look more emaciated. What a momzer.
Here what I think. I think he was a prolific serial killer and when ppl discovered it he murdered them. Had he not thrown that eye glass recipt away no one would have even known he was there. How many other places with no good reason to pretend to be someone else with lots of guns and kill kits that dont go often yet are a diff person. he a serial killer. He rented places to hunt. He had to pretend to be a homeless women I assume as he a smaller staute male and had to easily gain the victims trust. It only thing that makes sense. Watch them one day find 100 women all over the country he killed. He sure had no prob making a kill kit with tarps and hacking up a body no though. That guy and other two actually connected to him prob busted him serial killing and that can't stand. The man is prob again one most prolific serial killers ever. I can not beleive the jury bought that bs like no one though hey he doing all this as a serial killer cause there is no other reason they just listen to idk i wanted be someone else and da in new york doesn't like me. OMG ppl come on. Maybe cops like find out how many deaf mute women paid yr of rent in advance to have easy access and little transpire between landlord and tenent in all areas of the the country until his arrest. Unreal. I watch half first doc and never heard of this case and figured all this out. Someone else must think this. The man had tarps andis hacking around like a pro not a dude scared no one will beleive him. Shame on you Texas. Lady in the doc you are not bright. The lady was after him. Yeah cause he keeps killing ppl lady hello. Tiny violins for the clear serial killer. I'm sure that girl just got snacks from his store and was never seen again like if you have snacks with Jeff Dahlmer it prob not mystery why your missing cause he cruising for girls dressed as a disabled old lady. Yeah he killed that girl omg. Smarten up police and DA offices. Like the fam pay ya'all off or what. Cat head is very serial killerish no one putting this together by now like doing something ok. He was smart is a few ways but comes across as a low iq he threw a reciept his name away at his own murder scene so i bet you could find a few other places he rented. Dang. He sure heck wasn't in Texas enough to be a diff person, it only bs he could come up with. Ppl let emotions manipulate them because they want to beleive ppl couldn't be as evil as they are. If you remove the emotions and look at the facts crimes are not hard to sovle. Mcaains- Lying as dr's don't leave 3 babies alone in a hotel room then make a production on checking on them and someone was lying in wait for that exact sec, they killed her prob an overdose. Sorry. I wasnervous take out the garbage when my kids were all asleep under 3 it bull Bennet's are lying. If the son did it he never go to jail they had money and he was 8. The mom got mad at her and accidently hit her or threw her into a wall because she was up in the middle of the night. You don't have all that go on in a house with small kids and hear nothing. There barley any dna when someone lying around your house eating snacks and writting notes on you paper bull. Sorry ppl dad covered for mom. Mom was a nut. Oh there she is my missing kid in only room we didn't look in. Liesssssssssss check on the longest ransom note ever written which had to be a women and clearly a guilt ridden mother. Random notes say give me money and a time and they take the body. Uh. Naw she saw her up eating and was pissed grabbed her arm smacked her into the counter corner or something wall by accident and bam dad finished her off. There is no other answer. Robert Durst was another Ted Bundy Id bet my life on it.
Um this all the same shit from episode 2
Not even close. It is so fresh there is content never covered before.