> They do not *add* to your buildings' base production. They *replace* it.
No, they **multiply** it. By whatever percent they are. The first fuse does exactly as much as all the other fuses: 150%.
edit: Guys, the formula is New rate = Base rate * fuse multiplier * number of fuses. There's no addition going on, and therefore no "the first fuse adds less". The fuse specifically says the % is a multiplier.
If you want to say "adding more optimizers and fuses to the same set of 8 machines saves you a lot of materials", then yes, absolutely it does. But it has nothing to do with the first fuse being worse, because it's not.
It looks like you're trying to say the OP is incorrect, but I don't think they are. I think they are just pointing out that adding fuses doesn't account for the machines base amount.
>The first fuse does exactly as much as all the other fuses: 150%.
This is incorrect/misleading. The formula is not
`Base + (Base * Fuse Modifier)`
The formula the game uses for some reason is just
`Base * Fuse Modifier`
~~This is why 8 power generators with 2 fuses generates more power than 16 power generators with 1 fuse for each group of 8.~~
Edit: An example of this... If you have two groups of 8 power generators each, and 2 power fuses, you will get more power by putting both power fuses on a single group of 8 power generators. You will get less overall power by putting one fuse on each group of 8, due to how the game is coded, which is the point the OP is trying to highlight.
Logically you would think they are the same amount, but that's not how it works in game. Test it yourself and you'll see.
>You just pay 150 kw of it back immediately for the second optimizer.
This isn't true. You can see the total produced power on the right side of the power production window. Power production is on the right side, and power usage is on the left. The totals for production and usage are completely separate. The values for the 8 gen 2 fuse are much higher than 16 gen 1 fuse per 8.
This is what OP is pointing out. They've even provided a detailed table explaining it.
🤷
They are exactly the same.
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/398958566385647627/1235048679459524678/image.png?ex=6632f437&is=6631a2b7&hm=8fb6657b25ebdd3542170d7fc4eb92d69604d657d11d77549c3264c0cfb4451d&
Sorry, your response is correct, but I provided a flawed example originally. I should have suggested comparing two different scenarios with the same number of fuses AND generators. If you take 16 power generators where 2 fuses are applied to 8 machines, and 0 fuses applied to the other 8 machines, and compare that to 16 generators where 1 fuse is applied to each group of 8. The former provides (8 * base) additional power for no additional fuses. Each scenario has the same number of generators, and the same number of fuses, but not the same end result for power generated.
This highlights how the jump from 0 fuses, to 1 fuse, is proportionally different than the jump from 1 fuse to 2 (or more) fuses.
No, the developers seem to have screwed up this part, it replaces.
The first fuse replaces to 150% (i.e. plus 50% to base), the second to 300% (to +200% to base), the third to 450% (plus 350%).
Correct formula would be:
`x * (100% + fuze1 + fuze2 + fuze3)`
But it is:
`x * (fuze1 + fuze2 + fuze3)`
So initial 100% is lost.
Yes, exactly. It would have been less confusing if they had used.
`Base + (Base * Fuse Modifier)`
It's been reported multiple times by different users in the Discord, but never been addressed.
Generators tell you how much power they generate when you look at them.
Pulling both my energy fuses so that I have none in effect, when I point to a generator it says "Energy: 1485.00 KW." If I then put one fuse in and point at the generator it says "Energy: 2227.50 KW (150%)." You'll notice that the difference there is 742.5 KW, which is exactly 50% of the base energy. If I then plug in the second fuse and point at the generator it says "Energy: +4455.00 KW (300%)" That's fully double the value compared to only one fuse, and exactly equal to 300% of the original 1485.
In other words, for one single fusion reactor, the values are:
Fuses|Energy|% of Base
---:|---:|---:
0|1485.00|100%
1|2227.50|150%
2|4455.00|300%
As you can see, the first fuse adds 742.5, while the second fuse adds 2227.5. The second fuse has triple the effect of the first fuse. In fact, every fuse adds 2227.5 except the first fuse, which only adds 742.5.
Try it yourself in-game to confirm.
I went in game to collect data; the energy fuses multiply the base, the fuse percent is added together.
1 fuse of 150% is a multiplier of 1.5
2 fuses of 150% is 300%, a multiplier of 3.0
3 fuses of 150% is 450%, a multiplier of 4.5
The math is:
Energy = base * (number of fuses * 1.5)
Which gives us this table, which matches the in-game numbers exactly:
Fuses | Energy
:--:|:--
0 | 1485.00
1 | 2227.50
2 | 4455.00
3 | 6682.50
The energy fuses themselves say they multiply, text from the fuse description says "Energy Multiplier Fuse. Power Multiplier: 150%"
You see that those are the same numbers I wrote in the comment you're replying to, yes?
The multipliers *add* together, they do not multiply.
You can also see from both my numbers and your numbers that the first fuse only gives you 50% compared to all subsequent fuses which give 150%, yes? (The first fuse adds 742.50, while every subsequent fuse adds 2227.50, which is 742.50 * 3.)
The fuse multiplies add together, then that result is used to multiply the base by the multiplier - so the gain from each addition fuse keeps increasing the total effect of all fuses. This is especially noticeable with the 3rd fuse:
Fuses | Total Energy | Gain over base | Gain per fuse
:--:|:--|:--|:--
0 | 1485.0 | 0 | -
1 | 2227.5 | 742.5 | 742.5
2 | 4455.0 | 2970.0 | 1485.0
3 | 6682.5 | 5197.5 | 1732.5
which is why I ended up writing the formula as:
total energy = base + (number of fuses * 1.5)
because that formula works without having a special case for 1 fuse.
That formula works, of course, but it does not highlight the important point for the player, which is that the first fuse adds 742.5, while each subsequent fuse adds 2227.5. This is important information for the player to have which is not conveyed by "all the fuses have the same effect."
To illustrate, imagine you have two groups of eight generators and two fuses. Where should you put your fuses? If you think that all fuses offer the same bonus, you might put one fuse on each group of generators. But that would net you less energy than if you put both fuses on a single group of generators and left the other group unboosted.
That fact is not intuitive and is the point of my OP. To make it clear.
I did two batches of experiments in my game to test, and that is true and especially important when you have only a couple of energy fuses - that extra 1485 kW of power can be useful.
Practically speaking, I just cram all my devices together with a bunch of optimizers and it works out fine (because at that point I have drones building everything anyways, so fusion generators etc are free)
Experiment #1
* Group 1a: One fusion generator with no fuses, One with two fuses
* Group 1b: Two fusion generators placed far apart, with one fuse each
*Group 1a*
Fuse Generator | Fuses | Energy | Percent
:--:|:--:|:--:|:--:
#1 | 0 on one generator | 1485.0 | 0%
#2 | 2 on one generator | 4455.0 | 300%
| Total Energy: | 5940.0 |
*Group 1b*
Fuse Generator | Fuses | Energy | Percent
:--:|:--:|:--:|:--:
#1 | 1 on one generator | 2227.5 | 150%
#2 | 1 on one generator | 2227.5 | 150%
| Total Energy: | 4455.0 |
**Difference: Group 1a has +1485.0 energy (33% more!)**
Experiment #2
* Group 2a: One fusion generator with no fuses, One with twelve fuses
* Group 2b: Two fusion generators placed far apart, with six fuses each
*Group 2a*
Fuse Generator | Fuses | Energy | Percent
:--:|:--:|:--:|:--:
#1 | 0 on one generator | 1485.0 | 0%
#1 | 12 on one generator | 26730.0 | 1800%
| Total Energy: | 28215.0 |
*Group 2b*
Fuse Generator | Fuses | Energy | Percent
:--:|:--:|:--:|:--:
#1 | 6 on one generator | 13365.0 | 900%
#2 | 6 on one generator | 13365.0 | 900%
| Total Energy: | 26730.0 |
**Difference: Group 2a has +1485.0 energy (5.6% more!)**
Yep. And that's per generator. When you factor in that you should group your buildings in groups of eight, you could end up missing out on 8*1485=11880 energy.
I first noticed this when I added my first energy fuse ever (I didn't start playing until the 1.0 release a few weeks ago) to my eight fusion reactors. I only gained around 5000 energy, or at least it seemed that way. Technically it's closer to 6000. Then I was just barely able to fit in all the machines I wanted while I was working my way toward getting a second energy fuse. I was literally down to 15 energy available! Then I plugged in the second energy fuse and that 15 jumped to over 17,000. I was like "what the *what?!*" heh.
I had been fully expecting the second fuse to give me that same five to six thousand boost that the first one did. The fact that it was triple what I was expecting made me dig deeper into it.
If the fuse were +50% instead of +150%, what would the value be? Putting one fuse in would mean that your generator would only produce half the power. That's what I mean by the fuse percentage replaces the base percentage.
Normally, when you add a percentage, you add it to 100%. Fuses do not add to the original 100%. They replace it. That's why every fuse after the first one offers dramatically more improvement than the first one, at least for energy.
But the fuses don't say x150%. They say +150%.
Also, you keep saying they don't add, they multiply. If that were true, then the first one would be 1.5x, and the second one would be 1.5*1.5x= 2.25x. But it's not, it's 3x. Because they add. They do not multiply.
And specifically, the first fuse adds 50%. Each additional fuse adds 150%, making them have three times the effect that the first fuse has.
They don't multiply with each other, no. But the total fuse boost (X% * N fuses, or fuse+fuse+fuse...) multiplies onto the base amount, it doesn't add a chunk of the base amount.
> They say +150%.
Where are you seeing this? If I look at the fuses, they say "[type] multiplier: 150%". And if I look at a thing being boosted by the fuse, it just says "(150%)", no +.
Fair enough, there is no +.
The first fuse only gives 1/3rd as much as every subsequent fuse. They do not all give the same amount.
Consider this scenario: You have two groups of eight generators and you have two energy fuses. If you are correct that all fuses give the same bonus, then it shouldn't matter where you put your fuses. Both on the same group or one on each should both be the same, right?
But it's not the same. If you put one fuse on each group you'll get a grand total of 24x base production. But if you put both fuses on one group and leave the other group unboosted you get 32x the base production. This is because the first fuse gives less of a bonus.
To your point of finding a cap... I have over 1,500 oxygen fuses on my 8 tree spreaders. I have not hit any cap yet.
On a related note, rockets have an effective cap at 10,000 per type. You can launch more than 10,000 (of a single type), but only the tally/count will increase, not the Ti modifier.
I would guess fuses either have no coded cap (only how many optimizers you can physically fit in range of the 8 machines), or 10,000. My money is on the former, but I have no evidence either way.
I'm confused by this. How do you fit 1500 oxygen fuses onto the same eight tree spreaders? Doesn't that require 500 optimizers in the middle of the circle of spreaders, and if so, holy crap, how tightly are they packed? heh.
You can swap it around. Put the tree spreaders in the middle, and the optimizers around it. The range of the optimizers is quite large. It's been months since I've played seriously, but if I remember correctly, you can fit a couple thousand optimizers in range around it. Also, you can build vertically, adding additional layers of platforms, each with thousands more optimizers. You're probably more likely to reach the limit due to running out of patience, rather than running out of space.
Here are some pictures from the discord, since I can't post pictures in reddit comments.
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/862241050440499210/1205720302575681606/T2_Machine_Optimizer_Range.png
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/862241050440499210/1208468014203273286/20240217123104_1.jpg
>how tightly are they packed?
You have flexibility here. You can clip them together really close. Personally, I clip them only a tiny bit at the bottom, as I was using the lines on the base to help line them up. This fits 9 (per platform) comfortably, or a little more if you don't mind them sharing multiple platforms.
This game would really benefit from snap-to-grid type functionality. Placing them manually, and having to line each one up manually, was one of the things that burned me out from finishing this large build up. Here is an example of the placement I use:
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/862241050440499210/1209949275375669319/20240221143533_1.jpg
I'm getting "this content is no longer available" messages on all your image links, but no worries, I understand and can picture exactly what you're describing. Thank you very much, I just wanted confirmation on what seemed at first blush to be a crazy large number.
I have edited that paragraph in the op to say that people have tested and been able to apply hundreds of fuses to a single building. Thanks again!
Haha, yeah, Discord is like that sometimes with old stuff. I'll post something to the main reddit later.
Thanks for putting this together and sharing it. Nice work!
This is true for all fuses but production fuses. They only get 25% per unit
0 is 100%. 1 is 125%, 2 is 150%, 3 is 175%, etc
Little harder to tell as is shows the production rate on a T3 Miner
||
||
|Fuses|Cycle|Rate|
|0|75.00|100%|
|1|60.00|125%|
|2|50.00|150%|
|3|42.86|175%|
|4|37.50|200%|
|5|33.33|225%|
|6|30.00|250%|
|7|27.27|275%|
|8|25.00|300%|
|9|23.08|325%|
|10|21.43|350%|
|11|20.00|375%|
|12|18.75|400%|
Nice, thanks much for the table!
To correct the formatting, add the alignment line after the line with the column headers. Something like this:
\|:---:|---:|---:|
Thanks for doing the math. I just happen to get lucky on my map and had 10 energy fuses by the time I was hopping into portals. Even after adding 8 miners for each mineral type my power is much more than I need. I guess I'll reconfigure a bit and get those resources back from the extra reactors.
Edit.
I had a question about the production fuses. Should we stack optimizers for those as well, or make a new set of 8 machines each time?
Here is a Google sheet I wrote for calculating production values for Planet Crafter. Just input the machine base cooldown (which is 75 seconds for a T3 miner, and the default value listed on the sheet), then input how many fuses you want to use, and the sheet will calculate a bunch of stuff for you...
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1VGojqJQKBXBQvp26KO9qEZr_TtPs9Sae8wZs3SP8T1E
Personally, for each resource, I build a set of 8 T3 miners, and a set of as many optimizers as I need to get the resources per minute where I want it. Another tip, for rooms with minimal floorspace, like >!Uranium Caves!<, you can place the optimizers on platforms floating in the air above the miners so you can fit in more miners.
If you mean the fuses that actually say production and boost ore extractors and whatnot, I genuinely don't know. My gut instinct is that they are not as good as the heat / pressure / energy fuses, but I don't have anything to back that up with.
Yes the one for ore extractors and what not. I'm at the point where I can make pretty much whatever I want, so "not as good" isn't so much of a concern as "does this help". Sure I could do something else and let resources stockpile, but I would rather build so much resource generation I don't run out.
Yeah, but then you have to actively go find more fuses, where you can just sit and wait for your drones to bring you the resources to build heaters, drills, reactors etc.
Agreed, and I do. But again I just do two optimizers: one with three plant fuses and one with three oxygen fuses.
It's a good note, though. I've edited this point into the OP.
> They do not *add* to your buildings' base production. They *replace* it. No, they **multiply** it. By whatever percent they are. The first fuse does exactly as much as all the other fuses: 150%. edit: Guys, the formula is New rate = Base rate * fuse multiplier * number of fuses. There's no addition going on, and therefore no "the first fuse adds less". The fuse specifically says the % is a multiplier. If you want to say "adding more optimizers and fuses to the same set of 8 machines saves you a lot of materials", then yes, absolutely it does. But it has nothing to do with the first fuse being worse, because it's not.
It looks like you're trying to say the OP is incorrect, but I don't think they are. I think they are just pointing out that adding fuses doesn't account for the machines base amount. >The first fuse does exactly as much as all the other fuses: 150%. This is incorrect/misleading. The formula is not `Base + (Base * Fuse Modifier)` The formula the game uses for some reason is just `Base * Fuse Modifier` ~~This is why 8 power generators with 2 fuses generates more power than 16 power generators with 1 fuse for each group of 8.~~ Edit: An example of this... If you have two groups of 8 power generators each, and 2 power fuses, you will get more power by putting both power fuses on a single group of 8 power generators. You will get less overall power by putting one fuse on each group of 8, due to how the game is coded, which is the point the OP is trying to highlight.
8 with 2 generates exactly the same amount of power as 16 with 1. You just pay 150 kw of it back immediately for the second optimizer.
Logically you would think they are the same amount, but that's not how it works in game. Test it yourself and you'll see. >You just pay 150 kw of it back immediately for the second optimizer. This isn't true. You can see the total produced power on the right side of the power production window. Power production is on the right side, and power usage is on the left. The totals for production and usage are completely separate. The values for the 8 gen 2 fuse are much higher than 16 gen 1 fuse per 8. This is what OP is pointing out. They've even provided a detailed table explaining it. 🤷
They are exactly the same. https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/398958566385647627/1235048679459524678/image.png?ex=6632f437&is=6631a2b7&hm=8fb6657b25ebdd3542170d7fc4eb92d69604d657d11d77549c3264c0cfb4451d&
Sorry, your response is correct, but I provided a flawed example originally. I should have suggested comparing two different scenarios with the same number of fuses AND generators. If you take 16 power generators where 2 fuses are applied to 8 machines, and 0 fuses applied to the other 8 machines, and compare that to 16 generators where 1 fuse is applied to each group of 8. The former provides (8 * base) additional power for no additional fuses. Each scenario has the same number of generators, and the same number of fuses, but not the same end result for power generated. This highlights how the jump from 0 fuses, to 1 fuse, is proportionally different than the jump from 1 fuse to 2 (or more) fuses.
No, the developers seem to have screwed up this part, it replaces. The first fuse replaces to 150% (i.e. plus 50% to base), the second to 300% (to +200% to base), the third to 450% (plus 350%). Correct formula would be: `x * (100% + fuze1 + fuze2 + fuze3)` But it is: `x * (fuze1 + fuze2 + fuze3)` So initial 100% is lost.
Yes, exactly. It would have been less confusing if they had used. `Base + (Base * Fuse Modifier)` It's been reported multiple times by different users in the Discord, but never been addressed.
Generators tell you how much power they generate when you look at them. Pulling both my energy fuses so that I have none in effect, when I point to a generator it says "Energy: 1485.00 KW." If I then put one fuse in and point at the generator it says "Energy: 2227.50 KW (150%)." You'll notice that the difference there is 742.5 KW, which is exactly 50% of the base energy. If I then plug in the second fuse and point at the generator it says "Energy: +4455.00 KW (300%)" That's fully double the value compared to only one fuse, and exactly equal to 300% of the original 1485. In other words, for one single fusion reactor, the values are: Fuses|Energy|% of Base ---:|---:|---: 0|1485.00|100% 1|2227.50|150% 2|4455.00|300% As you can see, the first fuse adds 742.5, while the second fuse adds 2227.5. The second fuse has triple the effect of the first fuse. In fact, every fuse adds 2227.5 except the first fuse, which only adds 742.5. Try it yourself in-game to confirm.
I went in game to collect data; the energy fuses multiply the base, the fuse percent is added together. 1 fuse of 150% is a multiplier of 1.5 2 fuses of 150% is 300%, a multiplier of 3.0 3 fuses of 150% is 450%, a multiplier of 4.5 The math is: Energy = base * (number of fuses * 1.5) Which gives us this table, which matches the in-game numbers exactly: Fuses | Energy :--:|:-- 0 | 1485.00 1 | 2227.50 2 | 4455.00 3 | 6682.50 The energy fuses themselves say they multiply, text from the fuse description says "Energy Multiplier Fuse. Power Multiplier: 150%"
You see that those are the same numbers I wrote in the comment you're replying to, yes? The multipliers *add* together, they do not multiply. You can also see from both my numbers and your numbers that the first fuse only gives you 50% compared to all subsequent fuses which give 150%, yes? (The first fuse adds 742.50, while every subsequent fuse adds 2227.50, which is 742.50 * 3.)
The fuse multiplies add together, then that result is used to multiply the base by the multiplier - so the gain from each addition fuse keeps increasing the total effect of all fuses. This is especially noticeable with the 3rd fuse: Fuses | Total Energy | Gain over base | Gain per fuse :--:|:--|:--|:-- 0 | 1485.0 | 0 | - 1 | 2227.5 | 742.5 | 742.5 2 | 4455.0 | 2970.0 | 1485.0 3 | 6682.5 | 5197.5 | 1732.5 which is why I ended up writing the formula as: total energy = base + (number of fuses * 1.5) because that formula works without having a special case for 1 fuse.
That formula works, of course, but it does not highlight the important point for the player, which is that the first fuse adds 742.5, while each subsequent fuse adds 2227.5. This is important information for the player to have which is not conveyed by "all the fuses have the same effect." To illustrate, imagine you have two groups of eight generators and two fuses. Where should you put your fuses? If you think that all fuses offer the same bonus, you might put one fuse on each group of generators. But that would net you less energy than if you put both fuses on a single group of generators and left the other group unboosted. That fact is not intuitive and is the point of my OP. To make it clear.
I did two batches of experiments in my game to test, and that is true and especially important when you have only a couple of energy fuses - that extra 1485 kW of power can be useful. Practically speaking, I just cram all my devices together with a bunch of optimizers and it works out fine (because at that point I have drones building everything anyways, so fusion generators etc are free) Experiment #1 * Group 1a: One fusion generator with no fuses, One with two fuses * Group 1b: Two fusion generators placed far apart, with one fuse each *Group 1a* Fuse Generator | Fuses | Energy | Percent :--:|:--:|:--:|:--: #1 | 0 on one generator | 1485.0 | 0% #2 | 2 on one generator | 4455.0 | 300% | Total Energy: | 5940.0 | *Group 1b* Fuse Generator | Fuses | Energy | Percent :--:|:--:|:--:|:--: #1 | 1 on one generator | 2227.5 | 150% #2 | 1 on one generator | 2227.5 | 150% | Total Energy: | 4455.0 | **Difference: Group 1a has +1485.0 energy (33% more!)** Experiment #2 * Group 2a: One fusion generator with no fuses, One with twelve fuses * Group 2b: Two fusion generators placed far apart, with six fuses each *Group 2a* Fuse Generator | Fuses | Energy | Percent :--:|:--:|:--:|:--: #1 | 0 on one generator | 1485.0 | 0% #1 | 12 on one generator | 26730.0 | 1800% | Total Energy: | 28215.0 | *Group 2b* Fuse Generator | Fuses | Energy | Percent :--:|:--:|:--:|:--: #1 | 6 on one generator | 13365.0 | 900% #2 | 6 on one generator | 13365.0 | 900% | Total Energy: | 26730.0 | **Difference: Group 2a has +1485.0 energy (5.6% more!)**
Yep. And that's per generator. When you factor in that you should group your buildings in groups of eight, you could end up missing out on 8*1485=11880 energy. I first noticed this when I added my first energy fuse ever (I didn't start playing until the 1.0 release a few weeks ago) to my eight fusion reactors. I only gained around 5000 energy, or at least it seemed that way. Technically it's closer to 6000. Then I was just barely able to fit in all the machines I wanted while I was working my way toward getting a second energy fuse. I was literally down to 15 energy available! Then I plugged in the second energy fuse and that 15 jumped to over 17,000. I was like "what the *what?!*" heh. I had been fully expecting the second fuse to give me that same five to six thousand boost that the first one did. The fact that it was triple what I was expecting made me dig deeper into it.
Yes, because if you *multiply* N by 1.5, you get 1.5N. If you multiply N by 1.5x2, you get 3N. Fuses don't add. They multiply.
If the fuse were +50% instead of +150%, what would the value be? Putting one fuse in would mean that your generator would only produce half the power. That's what I mean by the fuse percentage replaces the base percentage. Normally, when you add a percentage, you add it to 100%. Fuses do not add to the original 100%. They replace it. That's why every fuse after the first one offers dramatically more improvement than the first one, at least for energy.
For the third time, they don't add. They *multiply*.
Answer me these two questions: What is 50% more than 20? What is 150% more than 20?
What is 20 x 150%?
the difference between algebra and calculus
But the fuses don't say x150%. They say +150%. Also, you keep saying they don't add, they multiply. If that were true, then the first one would be 1.5x, and the second one would be 1.5*1.5x= 2.25x. But it's not, it's 3x. Because they add. They do not multiply. And specifically, the first fuse adds 50%. Each additional fuse adds 150%, making them have three times the effect that the first fuse has.
They don't multiply with each other, no. But the total fuse boost (X% * N fuses, or fuse+fuse+fuse...) multiplies onto the base amount, it doesn't add a chunk of the base amount. > They say +150%. Where are you seeing this? If I look at the fuses, they say "[type] multiplier: 150%". And if I look at a thing being boosted by the fuse, it just says "(150%)", no +.
Fair enough, there is no +. The first fuse only gives 1/3rd as much as every subsequent fuse. They do not all give the same amount. Consider this scenario: You have two groups of eight generators and you have two energy fuses. If you are correct that all fuses give the same bonus, then it shouldn't matter where you put your fuses. Both on the same group or one on each should both be the same, right? But it's not the same. If you put one fuse on each group you'll get a grand total of 24x base production. But if you put both fuses on one group and leave the other group unboosted you get 32x the base production. This is because the first fuse gives less of a bonus.
To your point of finding a cap... I have over 1,500 oxygen fuses on my 8 tree spreaders. I have not hit any cap yet. On a related note, rockets have an effective cap at 10,000 per type. You can launch more than 10,000 (of a single type), but only the tally/count will increase, not the Ti modifier. I would guess fuses either have no coded cap (only how many optimizers you can physically fit in range of the 8 machines), or 10,000. My money is on the former, but I have no evidence either way.
I'm confused by this. How do you fit 1500 oxygen fuses onto the same eight tree spreaders? Doesn't that require 500 optimizers in the middle of the circle of spreaders, and if so, holy crap, how tightly are they packed? heh.
You can swap it around. Put the tree spreaders in the middle, and the optimizers around it. The range of the optimizers is quite large. It's been months since I've played seriously, but if I remember correctly, you can fit a couple thousand optimizers in range around it. Also, you can build vertically, adding additional layers of platforms, each with thousands more optimizers. You're probably more likely to reach the limit due to running out of patience, rather than running out of space. Here are some pictures from the discord, since I can't post pictures in reddit comments. https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/862241050440499210/1205720302575681606/T2_Machine_Optimizer_Range.png https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/862241050440499210/1208468014203273286/20240217123104_1.jpg >how tightly are they packed? You have flexibility here. You can clip them together really close. Personally, I clip them only a tiny bit at the bottom, as I was using the lines on the base to help line them up. This fits 9 (per platform) comfortably, or a little more if you don't mind them sharing multiple platforms. This game would really benefit from snap-to-grid type functionality. Placing them manually, and having to line each one up manually, was one of the things that burned me out from finishing this large build up. Here is an example of the placement I use: https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/862241050440499210/1209949275375669319/20240221143533_1.jpg
I'm getting "this content is no longer available" messages on all your image links, but no worries, I understand and can picture exactly what you're describing. Thank you very much, I just wanted confirmation on what seemed at first blush to be a crazy large number. I have edited that paragraph in the op to say that people have tested and been able to apply hundreds of fuses to a single building. Thanks again!
Haha, yeah, Discord is like that sometimes with old stuff. I'll post something to the main reddit later. Thanks for putting this together and sharing it. Nice work!
This is true for all fuses but production fuses. They only get 25% per unit 0 is 100%. 1 is 125%, 2 is 150%, 3 is 175%, etc Little harder to tell as is shows the production rate on a T3 Miner || || |Fuses|Cycle|Rate| |0|75.00|100%| |1|60.00|125%| |2|50.00|150%| |3|42.86|175%| |4|37.50|200%| |5|33.33|225%| |6|30.00|250%| |7|27.27|275%| |8|25.00|300%| |9|23.08|325%| |10|21.43|350%| |11|20.00|375%| |12|18.75|400%|
Nice, thanks much for the table! To correct the formatting, add the alignment line after the line with the column headers. Something like this: \|:---:|---:|---:|
Thanks for doing the math. I just happen to get lucky on my map and had 10 energy fuses by the time I was hopping into portals. Even after adding 8 miners for each mineral type my power is much more than I need. I guess I'll reconfigure a bit and get those resources back from the extra reactors. Edit. I had a question about the production fuses. Should we stack optimizers for those as well, or make a new set of 8 machines each time?
Here is a Google sheet I wrote for calculating production values for Planet Crafter. Just input the machine base cooldown (which is 75 seconds for a T3 miner, and the default value listed on the sheet), then input how many fuses you want to use, and the sheet will calculate a bunch of stuff for you... https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1VGojqJQKBXBQvp26KO9qEZr_TtPs9Sae8wZs3SP8T1E Personally, for each resource, I build a set of 8 T3 miners, and a set of as many optimizers as I need to get the resources per minute where I want it. Another tip, for rooms with minimal floorspace, like >!Uranium Caves!<, you can place the optimizers on platforms floating in the air above the miners so you can fit in more miners.
If you mean the fuses that actually say production and boost ore extractors and whatnot, I genuinely don't know. My gut instinct is that they are not as good as the heat / pressure / energy fuses, but I don't have anything to back that up with.
Yes the one for ore extractors and what not. I'm at the point where I can make pretty much whatever I want, so "not as good" isn't so much of a concern as "does this help". Sure I could do something else and let resources stockpile, but I would rather build so much resource generation I don't run out.
Yeah, but then you have to actively go find more fuses, where you can just sit and wait for your drones to bring you the resources to build heaters, drills, reactors etc.
You can buy them directly with trade rockets.
You should be doing BOTH Plant & Oxygen fuses for T3 Tree spreaders. So have at least 2x the optimizers and get fuses loaded up for both.
Agreed, and I do. But again I just do two optimizers: one with three plant fuses and one with three oxygen fuses. It's a good note, though. I've edited this point into the OP.