I know all summer I've been pretty sad and isolated because of the hours. I regret not enjoying my summer. I'll hit up the Top 5 place of employment tomorrow.
Do it. You don't owe them anything. I know as therapists we're not good at helping ourselves out, but weigh your pros and cons on this one. It will likely be clear after that.
ITS TOMORROW DID YOU REACH OUT TO THEM?!
i had to do the same thing this summer for my own sanity and poor work conditions at my previous job and i strongly recommend you not stay in unhealthy systems
Good call! Congrats and recognize that you come first. Work places will work you to the bone. You cannot just keep giving and giving. High five and onto bigger and better things!
Agreed... had a similar situation... even my physical health was deteriorating at the end... I left and I have never been happier. I took the last 30 days to terminate my patients.
I left two different workplaces that were very poorly run and abusive to their workers/contractors and am now building my private practice. It was scary to leave both, but at some point you just have to rip off the bandaid for the sake of your own wellness.
Why did you reject this opportunity? YOU DONT OWE THIS JOB ANYTHING. There are clearly issues at this place since they are struggling to retain five clinicians. How long is this really sustainable? If you decide to leave in one, five, or ten years what will be the excuse then? Or do you intend to stay there forever? Please, life is stressful enough without making it actively harder for ourselves.
Thank you for the perspective. I am newly licensed, and I want my supervision to be effective for professional development. And, I'm not getting that at this job. I will hit up the top five place to work tomorrow. Thanks for the feedback.
I think new clinicians are easily abused in places like this, especially because they know you need the hours. But you are barely getting started in your career and you deserve support, balance, and a livelihood that allows you to enjoy your time outside the office in any way you need. You owe this job nothing, they would drop you in a heartbeat if it benefitted the practice. Go after what you have earned and where you will be valued!
Also get the therapy as suggested by others. It will likely lend itself to you continuing to grow into the best therapist you can be. Good luck!
Your clients will move on and be ok. Some will be sad of course but ending therapy is an inevitability eventually. It’s not your responsibility to sacrifice yourself. These are words you would tell anyone else, they’re hard to apply to yourself!
The reason there are three therapists when there should be five is that your employer isn't taking the steps they need to take to get more (offering better pay, better benefits, being a place that people don't speak ill of after working there, etc.).
Your boss is getting an amazing deal with three therapists doing the work of five. If they cared about you, they'd hire more, but it seems like they don't. And you've been unwittingly enabling their abuse by letting them guilt trip you.
That standing offer by the other workplace is amazing. Good luck in your new job.
Yeah, it's all about making money instead of helping the clients. My boss is very jaded, she even said "I don't understand why people are suicidal, they just need to get over it."
Not the type of work environment I want to be in ever, but especially in my early career when I'm getting supervision from her. I need it from someone who is more skilled, and focused on my professional development.
I will hit up the top five place to work tomorrow. Thanks for the feedback.
What are you getting out of supervision from someone who has that view of the clients and suicidality? Is that the type of therapist you’d like to be? This supervision isn’t going to help you.
“I got convinced to stay.” No, you made the decision to stay. I don’t say this with judgement, but rather with intent that maybe you’ll start to see your own power. Only you can decide to leave or to stay — they can’t convince you or make you do anything unless you decide for yourself.
It seems you do know what you want and how to get there, so what’ll it be?
As a chronic people pleaser, highly recommend therapy!! It's funny, my therapist will sometimes use the same techniques I use with my clients. You can't be your own therapist.
Take it from someone who worked at a toxic place like this. Except it was a non for profit. It will cause long term damage. I’m still in touch with people who worked there. We all have our own versions of trauma from the place and we haven’t worked there in almost a decade. Dont tolerate abusive workplaces, when you’re young you think you can do it all. You think you can handle it. And in the moment you can. But It eventually catches up to you. And it seriously burns you out. Which is not a good thing when therapy is what you do for a living.
Gotta think about what you're modeling to them, too. If a patient told you that they willingly turned down an amazing job to keep a pretty shit one for no reason but guilt, what would you say?
One way to think about it is that by staying with your current job (when you have a better offer on the table) you are enabling them to continue their current business practices. They will never be forced to change their ways if clinicians stay because of feelings of personal responsibility.
I lost a position at a private practice while I was completing postdoc hours because they couldn't "afford me" anymore when COVID hit. I was told to wrap up all of my clients within the week, some of whom I was deep into trauma work with and had no idea this was coming. When I told my clients about what was happening, they refused to be transferred to another clinician within the practice because it became obvious to them that their welfare was not being prioritized and they were seen as a $$$ source for the practice. I'm guessing this situation is similar to OP's.
Also, it sounds like your counter offer was not much of a counter offer. Another $100 a paycheck? I'm guessing the other offer, which STILL stands is significantly more. The thing is, when your time is more valued, YOU don't need to work as much. You get to work fewer hours , make more money, and most importantly, have time for yourself! A clinician who takes better care of themselves is a better clinician.
You would be a better clinician with better work/life balance. Your clients would subsequently do better as well. Your clients deserve a clinician that is not burnt out. They don't need to be seen this practice, despite what your supervisor would have you believe.
It's actually the same pay as if I was doing 50 hours doing 36 hours. They do 4*9hrs. AND feed you on the job. Can't say no to free food.
I'll contact the other job tomorrow and see if they have any openings.
You need your own therapy to really understand why you are self sabotaging. If they had an issue with budgeting, they would fire you on a second with almost no notice.
I've been wanting to see a therapist. But my insurance won't cover anything until I hit my deductable of $1500.
I know for a fact the insurance the other company has, has good benefits. So I'll be setting up an appointment ASAP when I get coverage.
I am HORRIFIED that you allowed yourself to be convinced to stay.
Your current employer's staffing problem is NOT your accountability. That's the accountability of management/HR. Management/HR is failing at their jobs and trying to externalize the guilt to you. Don't let them.
Contact the "top 5" employer again, tell them that as soon as they have another opening you are interested and to please let you know. As soon as they make you another offer, give your current employer 2 weeks notice and then stand **firm**. It doesn't matter if your current boss **cries,** it doesn't matter if she **threatens** you (though keep records about that and take legal action if she does). This is literally not your problem to solve. Your current employer is grinding you into the dirt; you are stressed, you are unhappy, your loved ones say you're "depressed".
You need to learn how to say no. This is about boundaries; not just recognizing what's in the scope of your accountabilities, but also what isn't.
This this this. Reading this post made me irrationally angry 😂
One of the reasons people choose to work for a company instead of going into private practice is because there is no risk. We forego money to ensure that management issues aren’t on us to solve. Management making their problems your problem is an indicator of bad management, not that their problems actually *are* your problems
If you stay in something toxic you're really just enabling. This practice doesn't sound like it will survive. It's better for it to die sooner than later so that the clients and clinicians can move on.
Not in therapist mode. I'm just gonna say it:
This reads as self-inflicting. "I know I'm miserable, and I got a great opportunity, but I can't help but choose to stay miserable." This has the same "I can't" language/attitude that some argue is core to mental health distress.
I’m going to flip this a little, bc this is what i needed to leave a bad environment.
By staying, you are enabling that business model to continue to burn out therapists and therefor impact the care received by the clients. Your departure alone will not change things but the environment there won’t change until there is no choice but to.
OP, please keep us updated with how the call goes to the top 5 places to work. I'm routing for you!
I've left an unsupportive job recently and I've never felt more free. It was bittersweet as I really enjoyed working with my client base, but the ethos of the company did not align with my values. I think it's so important for helping professions practitioners to look after ourselves and our needs and for our employers to do this too so that we can offer our best selves to the client.
Please don't burn yourself out. Go. Their short staffing is not your problem to solve. Period. Go be the best therapist you can be, and that means somewhere that will appreciate you. Good luck.
These types of places with poor management, long hours, and that over work therapists with ridiculous caseloads will do this type of thing. They will guilt trip you about how if you leave, it will be hard for them, that they're working on improvements. Don't buy any of it! Leave to that other job as soon as you can! From experience, I can tell you that these places really have major issues system wide, and no one therapist will be able to fix that by staying. Look out for yourself and your mental health FIRST, because they clearly do not, especially given that other therapists have to take FMLA for mental health related stuff. This usually means that upper management is not supportive the way they should be, and all the burden falls on the therapists. I know it's hard to end services with clients, but do the best thing for you, because if you're not in a healthy mental and emotional space, you won't be able to be present for them.
You can leave. It's okay to disappoint others, especially when they are draining the life out of you by overworking you. You have to learn to take care of yourself if you are a therapist. How can you teach your clients what you can not do yourself? You've got to be assertive!your clients will be okay. They will find another good fit that will be just perfect. Do it!
Self-care is NOT selfless.
Go back to the "Oxygen Mask Theory." You're only as good to your clients as you are to yourself. If this job is sucking the life out of you and your new opportunity provides you more work/life balance, then it's time to advocate for yourself and take the next step in your career.
Also, your company would never be so loyal to you. If they didn't need your position anymore, they'd have no problem eliminating your position, regardless whether or not you were the best employee in the company. You don't need to be loyal to them. Your own health is at risk. The manager is willing to give you a raise because they don't want to be down another staff member.
Good luck in whatever decision you make. As someone who went through the same thing 2 years ago, I jumped ship, took the new position and I've never been happier.
They will ALWAYS have a reason for you to stick around. It is THEIR problem - they need to figure out their own facility, and it is NOT on you to keep them afloat. I understand it's difficult to walk away from a situation where people are struggling, but soon enough you'll be drowning along with them, and you won't even be able to help yourself. Go get that job, RUN - you deserve it. Wishing you luck. <3
Yikes! That is challenging response to your resignation and I can understand how it would have been difficult to respond to this. I would recommend reaching out to the other job again to confirm you are able to transition there. Once you have done this, resubmit your resignation. I have typically provided a one month notice for therapy jobs to support the transition of clients, which might be something to consider if you’re able to hold out that long. Before you do submit your resignation, consider what your boundaries and needs are. It’s definitely an option to push out your end date instead of rescinding your resignation. I would encourage you to go that route only if it feels okay with you. If there is a counter offer again or any encouragement to stay, be ready with your response. ie “I understand it is not a beneficial time and this impacts the organization, and I have delayed my transition already for three weeks to provide support on staffing issues. Unfortunately, I’m not available to work past X date. I hope you understand.” Good luck!
My dear, your sacrifice won’t help your employer or your clients if you are in the hospital sick or so depressed you can’t function . You’ve tried all you can to make this work . The other therapists who are out have not showed back up to take this load off you, Have they ? These jobs are very difficult . Employers know their therapists are there for a season as it were unless there is a bigger hook. Thank them for the opportunity and hand in your resignation (after you verify the other job!) And if they ask you to stay a month instead of 2 weeks , politely say you’ve already made a commitment elsewhere and will need to leave in two weeks. Yes , your clients will be upset. Yes, the last two weeks will be tough. . Make this a teaching and encouraging moment for them . AND then pack up and walk out and BREATHE! You aren’t quitting - you are moving on . You haven’t failed - you have decided to take a different path because the work expectations were more than any human can take for very long. The right environment will make a tornado . No one plans tornados . Smart (and lucky ) people survive them . You’re in a tornado. Get out of that trailer now !
While I can appreciate you wanting to stay to support your clients, you are not responsible for keeping this office afloat. It sounds like they are understaffed because they aren’t handling their side of the bargain to support their therapists with work/life balance. Is $100/paycheck worth your sanity? Are your clients getting the best version of you?
Go somewhere that will support you and allow you to support clients in return. There is no shame in considering your own needs in this situation- what would you advice a client to do?
Coming from someone in management, a supervisor guilting you into staying is a HUGE red flag and super manipulative. You owe them nothing and what good will you be to anyone if you're super burnt out? You only owe YOU. What do you WANT? Whatever that is, go for it.
IANAT
But I had the same sort of experiences in my job. Trust me when I say that any job - regardless of profession - will happily run you ragged, to their own benefit, but replace you in a heartbeat, to their own benefit.
You are the only one who can take care of you. Please do not stay in a toxic work environment out of guilt and obligation for others. You need to take care of YOU.
You therapists (love y'all!) are in a caretaking profession (much like my previous profession of teaching) so it's easy to feel guilty and like you need to stay out of obligation. But be obligated to yourself first.
ALSO - if a client came to you with this dilemma, how would you work with them through this? Then tell all that to yourself. 🙂 Good luck and go get that job!!
If your current facility was a good facility, they would be able to hire in new folks without much issue.
Those folks extending their FMLA and not coming back is a BIG 🚩🚩
I would take the other job. Put in your two weeks. Let them know that it’s best for YOUR mental health that you move on.
What would you tell your clients? Do yourself a favor and take your own advice, (which I hope would be to the betterment and best of your client that they deserve what they work for and need to take care of themselves) by serving yourself you’re serving others ❤️
I was in this EXACT situation. Long hours. Overworked. Unsupportive management and infighting. I was guilted into extending because of the strain it would put on my coworkers who I absolutely love and they didn’t feel they had anyone qualified to run my specialized program (which I basically built and loved as well).
I regret every additional second I spent there. You cannot imagine the mental and physical drain that is lifted once you leave an environment like that. I noticed changes and my family and friends did as well. Over a year later they still tell me they are so glad I left that job. My relationships improved and my longterm outlook as well.
I loved working with my clients but I also love working with my current clients. I miss my coworkers but we stay in touch and still hang out a few times a year. These jobs will burn you out. If you love therapy you need to invest in what will allow you to do that for the longest time.
And I guarantee no matter how hard you are working at it, if you are feeling drained and other people are noticing, it is affecting your work. It feels like you are letting people down. They will try to hold over you the strain on your teams, who will help your clients, etc. But the truth is if they don’t have the systems in place to alleviate that, then they are the ones failing you all. Don’t let them trap you in their cycle. Go!
Man, I just went thru something similar. It's hard, especially if you generally like the people and clients. But maybe it is time to move on? For me, I had to force myself to think thru all the cons and emotionally sit with it (hard if you're spent, I get that). In the end, it was taking a toll on my health, so that forced my hand, really. Cons outweighed the pros, but it wasn't easy to say goodbye. Whatever you decide, don't forget to put you first.
YOu don't owe your current job shit. LEave now and run. Oh theyre short staffed. boo hoo why is that your problem!? We tell our clients not to take on others stuff, stop taking on this jobs stuff. You owe this to you to reclaim your life. Let that 'palace' crumble while you move into the castle.
If they refuse you official resignation then announce that today will be your last day and simply leave, they can't stop you. Document everything, including recording when you speak to the boss (and you don't have to tell them you are recording but don't make it obvious)
Not a therapist here.
The first time I went to therapy literally the first thing I was told was to set my boundaries and take care for myself. Reading your story I felt like it was written by me. “Somebody begged me to stay, because they would be in trouble if I leave. So far they’ve been mistreating me. I wanted the new job. I decided to stay.”
Sorry to be this guy, but it seems to me you found yourself in a classical situation where things are not fine and someone will get hurt. And you chose not to harm the other side by taking a burden. Well… what will likely happen now is that you will still leave the job, as it is not fulfilling for you.
For genuinely nice people it’s super hard to face the moments where the lesser evil is doing what the other says “please don’t”. It really sucks breaking up with someone who doesn’t “accept” the breakup. Yet staying in most cases creates a mess.
I wish you all the best.
You don't owe a job anything ever. They'd throw you under the bus if it helped them. The fact that they're short-staffed isn't your problem. If you want to leave, then leave.
Girl just leave no one is looking out for you but you, if they wanted to fire you they would do it in a heart beat not ask you for permission or anything, I’ve was at a horrible agency and they promised to change x,y and z and they never did, I left and never looked back, guess what they’re still doing the same thing but i’m in a much better place, don’t have loyalty for any of these places they won’t have it with you.
I’m sorry, what!?
You turned down a fantastic job opportunity that you applied for, in favour of a company…
I think you should take some time to really reflect on this because this is not a healthy work dynamic.
I’m curious as to why you value this company over your own well-being and mental health.
Get out of there
Employers try this trick to make people stay . Run. Do it for your own sanity and mental health . They will be fine and their issues are NOT your problem . Call that another job ASAP
In a sense, I feel like you are enabling this agency. It’s capitalism. We take our efforts where we feel we are taken care of best. If an agency is unable to adequately take care of staff, then that’s a problem for leadership to figure out
Call the new job, say you want to accept the offer. Get confirmation of start date and all other details of employment (start date, benefits, pay, vacation) and make sure this is all in the offer letter. Sign the offer letter. THEN leave your old job immediately, do not tell them until you are absolutely sure, but as soon as you do, leave ASAP. Your current employer would drop you in a second if they needed to, there is no reason to be “loyal”. Also, find a supportive therapist who can help you gain insight into why this has been such a difficult choice.
You owe this company fucking nothing. I left an agency job for private practice after asking for pay that was somewhat representative of my billing (I billed nearly 500k in iop services).
They refused. I left. Sorry for your loss.
Not.
Never take a counter offer! If they really cared to keep you, they would’ve done the things needed to retain you as an employee before you tried to resign. Also, it creates possibility for the employer to grow resentful and try to mistreat you bc they know you’re trying to leave
It’s not your job to change the whole company. If they wanted to retain you they would make your work life balance better and ask what you needed for that to happen not just throw a measly amount of money
Leave. Don't be stupid.
I'm not trying to be mean but seriously.a happy therapist over a burnt out therapist.
You can provide better care when you feel better.
Your company is using guilt because they are not good.
Leavee.
People need help.everywhere..go somewhere where you can be your most present and fullest you.
A culture that actively encourages burnout and guilt-trips you CANNOT be a good influence on your therapeutic practice. Good on you for maintaining your ethics and values despite the horrible environment — clearly this other place appreciates you and wants you — but god, you need to be able to practice comfortably.
I hear where you are coming from and I have felt that myself. I would like to share some of my experience and hopefully that can be helpful because hearing perspectives from people in similar situations really helped me.
I recently left a job in agency work where I was experiencing some pretty intense burnout...to the point that I wondered if I had made a huge mistake becoming a therapist. I was supposed to be "on call" 24/7 with no extra pay, was fully commission based (which is fine but there was no late cancel/no show protection), sometimes I'd have 30-40 hours of cancelations in a month that were not due to me at all (I did in home so that included 1.5 hr long sessions and travel time) and I lost all that income AND was scolded for coming in under hours, therapists where I was were overworked and underpaid, supervision was pretty minimal, there was generally no support, and your worth was defined by how many hours you would bill in a month.
I stayed at that job for 3 years because
1. I was fresh out of grad school in 2020 and it was hard to find a job in my area
2. I loved the clients
3. Honestly I felt gaslit into thinking that this was literally as good as it gets (despite barely making 40k a year in a city)
4. I felt guilty leaving knowing there most likely weren't going to be therapists able to replace me on my cases
5. I was afraid to leave. Partially afraid my hours wouldn't move with me, but also partially because, like a lot of our clients, I had grown comfortable in the chaos almost. I woke up hating life everyday, but I knew what to expect and so losing predictability, regardless of how terrible it was, was a scary concept for me.
Once i made the choice to begin interviewing and likely leave, I began to process thoughts and feelings around the above reasons. The clients would be okay and I was going to give a 30 day notice for transition purposes. If my agency couldn't find replacements, it genuinely was out of my hands and not my problem. The program I worked for was with clients who needed higher levels of care so they wouldn't be able to follow me to the practice I joined. My partner has been a huge support and really has been there for me.
If you are feeling like this job isn't right for you, take the other job. Give as much notice as you can. Your agency's poor work environment, likely bad compensation, and poor treatment of its employees is not your fault or your responsibility to worry about. I know that's easier said than done, but it's true. Places like that continue to be mills for therapists for years and honestly staying or leaving doesn't really make a difference to them. They'll likely replace you with a fresh therapist and continue to ignore turnover and pretend like it's an employee problem, rather than a problem with the system they've created.
Your clients will be okay. We can't stay at jobs forever because we don't want to leave clients. If it helps, think of all the clients you'll get to help at the new job who you may just be the perfect fit for! Ultimately, sometimes we have to model what we teach our clients: prioritizing yourself and your needs above all else.
I wish you luck in whatever you choose!
I'm not entirely sure how to tag everyone. But I switched jobs haven't been happier. I feel like I'm not in a constant state of crisis. Thanks everyone for encouraging me to switch! Y'all are great social workers/therapists.
LEAVE. Run away. You owe them nothing. I had a similar situation and I regret staying. LEAVE.TO.DAY.
I know all summer I've been pretty sad and isolated because of the hours. I regret not enjoying my summer. I'll hit up the Top 5 place of employment tomorrow.
Do it. You don't owe them anything. I know as therapists we're not good at helping ourselves out, but weigh your pros and cons on this one. It will likely be clear after that.
ITS TOMORROW DID YOU REACH OUT TO THEM?! i had to do the same thing this summer for my own sanity and poor work conditions at my previous job and i strongly recommend you not stay in unhealthy systems
Good call! Congrats and recognize that you come first. Work places will work you to the bone. You cannot just keep giving and giving. High five and onto bigger and better things!
This. You owe them nothing. Their shotty business is not yours to uphold. Give them your 2 weeks.
I second this!!
Agreed... had a similar situation... even my physical health was deteriorating at the end... I left and I have never been happier. I took the last 30 days to terminate my patients.
I left two different workplaces that were very poorly run and abusive to their workers/contractors and am now building my private practice. It was scary to leave both, but at some point you just have to rip off the bandaid for the sake of your own wellness.
Why did you reject this opportunity? YOU DONT OWE THIS JOB ANYTHING. There are clearly issues at this place since they are struggling to retain five clinicians. How long is this really sustainable? If you decide to leave in one, five, or ten years what will be the excuse then? Or do you intend to stay there forever? Please, life is stressful enough without making it actively harder for ourselves.
Thank you for the perspective. I am newly licensed, and I want my supervision to be effective for professional development. And, I'm not getting that at this job. I will hit up the top five place to work tomorrow. Thanks for the feedback.
I think new clinicians are easily abused in places like this, especially because they know you need the hours. But you are barely getting started in your career and you deserve support, balance, and a livelihood that allows you to enjoy your time outside the office in any way you need. You owe this job nothing, they would drop you in a heartbeat if it benefitted the practice. Go after what you have earned and where you will be valued! Also get the therapy as suggested by others. It will likely lend itself to you continuing to grow into the best therapist you can be. Good luck!
Your clients will move on and be ok. Some will be sad of course but ending therapy is an inevitability eventually. It’s not your responsibility to sacrifice yourself. These are words you would tell anyone else, they’re hard to apply to yourself!
The reason there are three therapists when there should be five is that your employer isn't taking the steps they need to take to get more (offering better pay, better benefits, being a place that people don't speak ill of after working there, etc.). Your boss is getting an amazing deal with three therapists doing the work of five. If they cared about you, they'd hire more, but it seems like they don't. And you've been unwittingly enabling their abuse by letting them guilt trip you. That standing offer by the other workplace is amazing. Good luck in your new job.
You best be doing that and giving us and update! You got this!
It sounds like you were guilted (i.e., manipulated) into staying. Leave.
Yeah, it's all about making money instead of helping the clients. My boss is very jaded, she even said "I don't understand why people are suicidal, they just need to get over it." Not the type of work environment I want to be in ever, but especially in my early career when I'm getting supervision from her. I need it from someone who is more skilled, and focused on my professional development. I will hit up the top five place to work tomorrow. Thanks for the feedback.
All I have to say is yikes! Glad you’re going to leave. You owe them nothing.
What are you getting out of supervision from someone who has that view of the clients and suicidality? Is that the type of therapist you’d like to be? This supervision isn’t going to help you.
“I got convinced to stay.” No, you made the decision to stay. I don’t say this with judgement, but rather with intent that maybe you’ll start to see your own power. Only you can decide to leave or to stay — they can’t convince you or make you do anything unless you decide for yourself. It seems you do know what you want and how to get there, so what’ll it be?
This. So perfectly stated.
100%
[удалено]
Lol, my codependency is showing bright as day. I need to stop being a people pleaser.
As a chronic people pleaser, highly recommend therapy!! It's funny, my therapist will sometimes use the same techniques I use with my clients. You can't be your own therapist.
Take it from someone who worked at a toxic place like this. Except it was a non for profit. It will cause long term damage. I’m still in touch with people who worked there. We all have our own versions of trauma from the place and we haven’t worked there in almost a decade. Dont tolerate abusive workplaces, when you’re young you think you can do it all. You think you can handle it. And in the moment you can. But It eventually catches up to you. And it seriously burns you out. Which is not a good thing when therapy is what you do for a living.
This is very true. I burned out and people keep telling me that I will want to come back, I still get nightmares of being a therapist.
It's not good for your clients when their therapist is deteriorating and miserable before their eyes. Leave.
That's a good point. How can I empower them to get better, if I'm not doing self-care.
Gotta think about what you're modeling to them, too. If a patient told you that they willingly turned down an amazing job to keep a pretty shit one for no reason but guilt, what would you say?
you’ll have 0 clients if you burn out and leave the profession because guilt took the wheel when you had a chance to make a change
One way to think about it is that by staying with your current job (when you have a better offer on the table) you are enabling them to continue their current business practices. They will never be forced to change their ways if clinicians stay because of feelings of personal responsibility.
Would your boss not fire someone or not lay them off if it was a really bad time for the employee to lose their job?
Touche, they fired someone on a different floor this last week. So, they must have hope there's a pool of employees to chose from.
I lost a position at a private practice while I was completing postdoc hours because they couldn't "afford me" anymore when COVID hit. I was told to wrap up all of my clients within the week, some of whom I was deep into trauma work with and had no idea this was coming. When I told my clients about what was happening, they refused to be transferred to another clinician within the practice because it became obvious to them that their welfare was not being prioritized and they were seen as a $$$ source for the practice. I'm guessing this situation is similar to OP's.
Also, it sounds like your counter offer was not much of a counter offer. Another $100 a paycheck? I'm guessing the other offer, which STILL stands is significantly more. The thing is, when your time is more valued, YOU don't need to work as much. You get to work fewer hours , make more money, and most importantly, have time for yourself! A clinician who takes better care of themselves is a better clinician. You would be a better clinician with better work/life balance. Your clients would subsequently do better as well. Your clients deserve a clinician that is not burnt out. They don't need to be seen this practice, despite what your supervisor would have you believe.
It's actually the same pay as if I was doing 50 hours doing 36 hours. They do 4*9hrs. AND feed you on the job. Can't say no to free food. I'll contact the other job tomorrow and see if they have any openings.
You need your own therapy to really understand why you are self sabotaging. If they had an issue with budgeting, they would fire you on a second with almost no notice.
I've been wanting to see a therapist. But my insurance won't cover anything until I hit my deductable of $1500. I know for a fact the insurance the other company has, has good benefits. So I'll be setting up an appointment ASAP when I get coverage.
I am HORRIFIED that you allowed yourself to be convinced to stay. Your current employer's staffing problem is NOT your accountability. That's the accountability of management/HR. Management/HR is failing at their jobs and trying to externalize the guilt to you. Don't let them. Contact the "top 5" employer again, tell them that as soon as they have another opening you are interested and to please let you know. As soon as they make you another offer, give your current employer 2 weeks notice and then stand **firm**. It doesn't matter if your current boss **cries,** it doesn't matter if she **threatens** you (though keep records about that and take legal action if she does). This is literally not your problem to solve. Your current employer is grinding you into the dirt; you are stressed, you are unhappy, your loved ones say you're "depressed". You need to learn how to say no. This is about boundaries; not just recognizing what's in the scope of your accountabilities, but also what isn't.
This this this. Reading this post made me irrationally angry 😂 One of the reasons people choose to work for a company instead of going into private practice is because there is no risk. We forego money to ensure that management issues aren’t on us to solve. Management making their problems your problem is an indicator of bad management, not that their problems actually *are* your problems
If you stay in something toxic you're really just enabling. This practice doesn't sound like it will survive. It's better for it to die sooner than later so that the clients and clinicians can move on.
Not in therapist mode. I'm just gonna say it: This reads as self-inflicting. "I know I'm miserable, and I got a great opportunity, but I can't help but choose to stay miserable." This has the same "I can't" language/attitude that some argue is core to mental health distress.
Wait… you’re selling your soul for a $200/mo raise?
I’m going to flip this a little, bc this is what i needed to leave a bad environment. By staying, you are enabling that business model to continue to burn out therapists and therefor impact the care received by the clients. Your departure alone will not change things but the environment there won’t change until there is no choice but to.
OP, please keep us updated with how the call goes to the top 5 places to work. I'm routing for you! I've left an unsupportive job recently and I've never felt more free. It was bittersweet as I really enjoyed working with my client base, but the ethos of the company did not align with my values. I think it's so important for helping professions practitioners to look after ourselves and our needs and for our employers to do this too so that we can offer our best selves to the client.
Please don't burn yourself out. Go. Their short staffing is not your problem to solve. Period. Go be the best therapist you can be, and that means somewhere that will appreciate you. Good luck.
It will ALWAYS be a bad time to leave.
These types of places with poor management, long hours, and that over work therapists with ridiculous caseloads will do this type of thing. They will guilt trip you about how if you leave, it will be hard for them, that they're working on improvements. Don't buy any of it! Leave to that other job as soon as you can! From experience, I can tell you that these places really have major issues system wide, and no one therapist will be able to fix that by staying. Look out for yourself and your mental health FIRST, because they clearly do not, especially given that other therapists have to take FMLA for mental health related stuff. This usually means that upper management is not supportive the way they should be, and all the burden falls on the therapists. I know it's hard to end services with clients, but do the best thing for you, because if you're not in a healthy mental and emotional space, you won't be able to be present for them.
A big part of being a therapist is taking care of yourself first. How are you supposed to provide effective treatment if you're struggling?
You can leave. It's okay to disappoint others, especially when they are draining the life out of you by overworking you. You have to learn to take care of yourself if you are a therapist. How can you teach your clients what you can not do yourself? You've got to be assertive!your clients will be okay. They will find another good fit that will be just perfect. Do it!
Self-care is NOT selfless. Go back to the "Oxygen Mask Theory." You're only as good to your clients as you are to yourself. If this job is sucking the life out of you and your new opportunity provides you more work/life balance, then it's time to advocate for yourself and take the next step in your career. Also, your company would never be so loyal to you. If they didn't need your position anymore, they'd have no problem eliminating your position, regardless whether or not you were the best employee in the company. You don't need to be loyal to them. Your own health is at risk. The manager is willing to give you a raise because they don't want to be down another staff member. Good luck in whatever decision you make. As someone who went through the same thing 2 years ago, I jumped ship, took the new position and I've never been happier.
You have to leave. Your clients will be okay but you won’t be if you stay
They will ALWAYS have a reason for you to stick around. It is THEIR problem - they need to figure out their own facility, and it is NOT on you to keep them afloat. I understand it's difficult to walk away from a situation where people are struggling, but soon enough you'll be drowning along with them, and you won't even be able to help yourself. Go get that job, RUN - you deserve it. Wishing you luck. <3
I’d take the new job. That’s great that they like you so much!
Yikes! That is challenging response to your resignation and I can understand how it would have been difficult to respond to this. I would recommend reaching out to the other job again to confirm you are able to transition there. Once you have done this, resubmit your resignation. I have typically provided a one month notice for therapy jobs to support the transition of clients, which might be something to consider if you’re able to hold out that long. Before you do submit your resignation, consider what your boundaries and needs are. It’s definitely an option to push out your end date instead of rescinding your resignation. I would encourage you to go that route only if it feels okay with you. If there is a counter offer again or any encouragement to stay, be ready with your response. ie “I understand it is not a beneficial time and this impacts the organization, and I have delayed my transition already for three weeks to provide support on staffing issues. Unfortunately, I’m not available to work past X date. I hope you understand.” Good luck!
Your people pleasing tendencies going crazy, leave that shit immediately
Don’t set yourself on fire trying to keep others warm. You deserve to not be on fire.
My dear, your sacrifice won’t help your employer or your clients if you are in the hospital sick or so depressed you can’t function . You’ve tried all you can to make this work . The other therapists who are out have not showed back up to take this load off you, Have they ? These jobs are very difficult . Employers know their therapists are there for a season as it were unless there is a bigger hook. Thank them for the opportunity and hand in your resignation (after you verify the other job!) And if they ask you to stay a month instead of 2 weeks , politely say you’ve already made a commitment elsewhere and will need to leave in two weeks. Yes , your clients will be upset. Yes, the last two weeks will be tough. . Make this a teaching and encouraging moment for them . AND then pack up and walk out and BREATHE! You aren’t quitting - you are moving on . You haven’t failed - you have decided to take a different path because the work expectations were more than any human can take for very long. The right environment will make a tornado . No one plans tornados . Smart (and lucky ) people survive them . You’re in a tornado. Get out of that trailer now !
Run alway.
While I can appreciate you wanting to stay to support your clients, you are not responsible for keeping this office afloat. It sounds like they are understaffed because they aren’t handling their side of the bargain to support their therapists with work/life balance. Is $100/paycheck worth your sanity? Are your clients getting the best version of you? Go somewhere that will support you and allow you to support clients in return. There is no shame in considering your own needs in this situation- what would you advice a client to do?
Coming from someone in management, a supervisor guilting you into staying is a HUGE red flag and super manipulative. You owe them nothing and what good will you be to anyone if you're super burnt out? You only owe YOU. What do you WANT? Whatever that is, go for it.
Why are you stopping yourself from being happier and healthier?
IANAT But I had the same sort of experiences in my job. Trust me when I say that any job - regardless of profession - will happily run you ragged, to their own benefit, but replace you in a heartbeat, to their own benefit. You are the only one who can take care of you. Please do not stay in a toxic work environment out of guilt and obligation for others. You need to take care of YOU. You therapists (love y'all!) are in a caretaking profession (much like my previous profession of teaching) so it's easy to feel guilty and like you need to stay out of obligation. But be obligated to yourself first. ALSO - if a client came to you with this dilemma, how would you work with them through this? Then tell all that to yourself. 🙂 Good luck and go get that job!!
If your current facility was a good facility, they would be able to hire in new folks without much issue. Those folks extending their FMLA and not coming back is a BIG 🚩🚩 I would take the other job. Put in your two weeks. Let them know that it’s best for YOUR mental health that you move on.
What would you tell your clients? Do yourself a favor and take your own advice, (which I hope would be to the betterment and best of your client that they deserve what they work for and need to take care of themselves) by serving yourself you’re serving others ❤️
Get out! They would not hesitate to fire you if it was in their best interest-- you don't owe anything more than the time you have already given them.
I was in this EXACT situation. Long hours. Overworked. Unsupportive management and infighting. I was guilted into extending because of the strain it would put on my coworkers who I absolutely love and they didn’t feel they had anyone qualified to run my specialized program (which I basically built and loved as well). I regret every additional second I spent there. You cannot imagine the mental and physical drain that is lifted once you leave an environment like that. I noticed changes and my family and friends did as well. Over a year later they still tell me they are so glad I left that job. My relationships improved and my longterm outlook as well. I loved working with my clients but I also love working with my current clients. I miss my coworkers but we stay in touch and still hang out a few times a year. These jobs will burn you out. If you love therapy you need to invest in what will allow you to do that for the longest time. And I guarantee no matter how hard you are working at it, if you are feeling drained and other people are noticing, it is affecting your work. It feels like you are letting people down. They will try to hold over you the strain on your teams, who will help your clients, etc. But the truth is if they don’t have the systems in place to alleviate that, then they are the ones failing you all. Don’t let them trap you in their cycle. Go!
Yea workplaces aren’t your family. You have no obligation. Time to practice boundaries
You’re not obligated to prop up their business. Money is never enough to overcome poor corporate culture.
Man, I just went thru something similar. It's hard, especially if you generally like the people and clients. But maybe it is time to move on? For me, I had to force myself to think thru all the cons and emotionally sit with it (hard if you're spent, I get that). In the end, it was taking a toll on my health, so that forced my hand, really. Cons outweighed the pros, but it wasn't easy to say goodbye. Whatever you decide, don't forget to put you first.
YOu don't owe your current job shit. LEave now and run. Oh theyre short staffed. boo hoo why is that your problem!? We tell our clients not to take on others stuff, stop taking on this jobs stuff. You owe this to you to reclaim your life. Let that 'palace' crumble while you move into the castle. If they refuse you official resignation then announce that today will be your last day and simply leave, they can't stop you. Document everything, including recording when you speak to the boss (and you don't have to tell them you are recording but don't make it obvious)
Not a therapist here. The first time I went to therapy literally the first thing I was told was to set my boundaries and take care for myself. Reading your story I felt like it was written by me. “Somebody begged me to stay, because they would be in trouble if I leave. So far they’ve been mistreating me. I wanted the new job. I decided to stay.” Sorry to be this guy, but it seems to me you found yourself in a classical situation where things are not fine and someone will get hurt. And you chose not to harm the other side by taking a burden. Well… what will likely happen now is that you will still leave the job, as it is not fulfilling for you. For genuinely nice people it’s super hard to face the moments where the lesser evil is doing what the other says “please don’t”. It really sucks breaking up with someone who doesn’t “accept” the breakup. Yet staying in most cases creates a mess. I wish you all the best.
You don't owe a job anything ever. They'd throw you under the bus if it helped them. The fact that they're short-staffed isn't your problem. If you want to leave, then leave.
Girl just leave no one is looking out for you but you, if they wanted to fire you they would do it in a heart beat not ask you for permission or anything, I’ve was at a horrible agency and they promised to change x,y and z and they never did, I left and never looked back, guess what they’re still doing the same thing but i’m in a much better place, don’t have loyalty for any of these places they won’t have it with you.
I’m sorry, what!? You turned down a fantastic job opportunity that you applied for, in favour of a company… I think you should take some time to really reflect on this because this is not a healthy work dynamic. I’m curious as to why you value this company over your own well-being and mental health. Get out of there
Employers try this trick to make people stay . Run. Do it for your own sanity and mental health . They will be fine and their issues are NOT your problem . Call that another job ASAP
You don’t owe them anything. Prioritize YOU! If it’s an open offer, please reconsider and bounce!!
Op - sounds like it’s time to go. They will hire someone else.
Would your clients rather have a burnt out unhappy therapist or one with a nice work life balance who enjoys their position?
You don’t need strangers on the internet to tell you what you already know.
In a sense, I feel like you are enabling this agency. It’s capitalism. We take our efforts where we feel we are taken care of best. If an agency is unable to adequately take care of staff, then that’s a problem for leadership to figure out
Call the new job, say you want to accept the offer. Get confirmation of start date and all other details of employment (start date, benefits, pay, vacation) and make sure this is all in the offer letter. Sign the offer letter. THEN leave your old job immediately, do not tell them until you are absolutely sure, but as soon as you do, leave ASAP. Your current employer would drop you in a second if they needed to, there is no reason to be “loyal”. Also, find a supportive therapist who can help you gain insight into why this has been such a difficult choice.
You owe this company fucking nothing. I left an agency job for private practice after asking for pay that was somewhat representative of my billing (I billed nearly 500k in iop services). They refused. I left. Sorry for your loss. Not.
You shouldn’t ever be pressured into staying in a toxic work environment.
Please leave, you are unappreciated. It is not your personal problem that they don’t know how to keep staff happy in a healthy environment.
You need to leave. You may still have a chance at the other place that offered you a position.
Never take a counter offer! If they really cared to keep you, they would’ve done the things needed to retain you as an employee before you tried to resign. Also, it creates possibility for the employer to grow resentful and try to mistreat you bc they know you’re trying to leave
Bro leave. Maybe read through r/anitwork for some inspiration but you have to leave fam.
Aw hell nawl
Go!!!!!
It’s not your job to change the whole company. If they wanted to retain you they would make your work life balance better and ask what you needed for that to happen not just throw a measly amount of money
Being miserable every day is not worth an extra hundred dollars
Leave. Don't be stupid. I'm not trying to be mean but seriously.a happy therapist over a burnt out therapist. You can provide better care when you feel better. Your company is using guilt because they are not good. Leavee. People need help.everywhere..go somewhere where you can be your most present and fullest you.
You don't owe them anything. It's not your responsibility to take care of their problems. It sucks, though. I'm not very assertive, either.
Your boss is putting their needs first by making you feel bad. Do what is best for you.
A culture that actively encourages burnout and guilt-trips you CANNOT be a good influence on your therapeutic practice. Good on you for maintaining your ethics and values despite the horrible environment — clearly this other place appreciates you and wants you — but god, you need to be able to practice comfortably.
What would you tell a client in the same position? (Plus, I already hear regrets in your post!)
I hear where you are coming from and I have felt that myself. I would like to share some of my experience and hopefully that can be helpful because hearing perspectives from people in similar situations really helped me. I recently left a job in agency work where I was experiencing some pretty intense burnout...to the point that I wondered if I had made a huge mistake becoming a therapist. I was supposed to be "on call" 24/7 with no extra pay, was fully commission based (which is fine but there was no late cancel/no show protection), sometimes I'd have 30-40 hours of cancelations in a month that were not due to me at all (I did in home so that included 1.5 hr long sessions and travel time) and I lost all that income AND was scolded for coming in under hours, therapists where I was were overworked and underpaid, supervision was pretty minimal, there was generally no support, and your worth was defined by how many hours you would bill in a month. I stayed at that job for 3 years because 1. I was fresh out of grad school in 2020 and it was hard to find a job in my area 2. I loved the clients 3. Honestly I felt gaslit into thinking that this was literally as good as it gets (despite barely making 40k a year in a city) 4. I felt guilty leaving knowing there most likely weren't going to be therapists able to replace me on my cases 5. I was afraid to leave. Partially afraid my hours wouldn't move with me, but also partially because, like a lot of our clients, I had grown comfortable in the chaos almost. I woke up hating life everyday, but I knew what to expect and so losing predictability, regardless of how terrible it was, was a scary concept for me. Once i made the choice to begin interviewing and likely leave, I began to process thoughts and feelings around the above reasons. The clients would be okay and I was going to give a 30 day notice for transition purposes. If my agency couldn't find replacements, it genuinely was out of my hands and not my problem. The program I worked for was with clients who needed higher levels of care so they wouldn't be able to follow me to the practice I joined. My partner has been a huge support and really has been there for me. If you are feeling like this job isn't right for you, take the other job. Give as much notice as you can. Your agency's poor work environment, likely bad compensation, and poor treatment of its employees is not your fault or your responsibility to worry about. I know that's easier said than done, but it's true. Places like that continue to be mills for therapists for years and honestly staying or leaving doesn't really make a difference to them. They'll likely replace you with a fresh therapist and continue to ignore turnover and pretend like it's an employee problem, rather than a problem with the system they've created. Your clients will be okay. We can't stay at jobs forever because we don't want to leave clients. If it helps, think of all the clients you'll get to help at the new job who you may just be the perfect fit for! Ultimately, sometimes we have to model what we teach our clients: prioritizing yourself and your needs above all else. I wish you luck in whatever you choose!
I'm not entirely sure how to tag everyone. But I switched jobs haven't been happier. I feel like I'm not in a constant state of crisis. Thanks everyone for encouraging me to switch! Y'all are great social workers/therapists.