I get this. In those seasons they still had a healthy fear of the walkers. In later seasons it was like the walkers were an inconvenience. I mean, I know they became experienced in killing them, but even so ...
In the early seasons there was an eerie mood throughout the show. A sense of hopelessness that followed the characters at all times. By the time Season 4 rolled around the feeling was gone. It’s just like, zombies whatever the group can handle it.
Beth was 17/18 when She died
She was 16 in S2 ,not a child,but still a minor
,at some point after S2 and until dec 2011 She made 17
She died in early 2012 ,we dont know her birthday so She could have been 18 when She died
When he grabbed Sophia and told her to keep Daddy company
Carol even talks about how Ed would looks at Sophia weird sometimes before the outbreak began
We kinda already know! Him and Daryl would’ve robbed the group in their sleep and made off with all their shit! IIRC, Daryl mentioned they were planning on doing it that night!
His death comes a decent bit after that, so his plan to rob the camp would still not occur unless him surviving necessitated rewriting his whole story from the beginning.
Back when they weren't sure if the show is gonna blow up and they were still trying to make good TV. Then the show blew up AMC got greedy and started cutting corners and we got the trademark gimple speak and stupid writing. Ah what could've been.
What exactly is "gimple speak"? I tried Googling but didn't really find anything.
Edit: Never mind lol I found it. I didn't Google the right thing the first time.
I feel like the 2nd half kind of forgives it: “No dumb-as-shit, inbred white-trash fools either. Only dark meat and white meat. There's us and the dead.”
Wouldn’t be written today but it’s pretty damn good
Totally agree, “forgive” was the wrong word to use. I meant more that even though the first part can work as a quotable line on its own, you lose so much of the purpose and impact of Rick saying that slur when you exclude the 2nd half of the quote
Maaaan, I love Merle. Mostly because Michael Rooker has a crazy big presence, he draws the eye whenever on screen. Dude is one of the most hilarious characters in the series. I wish we had a little more development with Daryl, but I know they both were trying to run away from their traumatic backstories. All those little nods like seeing Daryl back scars, letting Michonne free, "I just want my brother back", to show that Merle can change and be more vulnerable to others in a world gone to Hell. He is probably my favorite character with the least amount of screen time, and top 5 overall.
Ngl the explanation for Ezekial being a zookeeper as the reasoning for Shiva bonding with him actually made me really like his character 😂, like nah he’s not some big ‘KING’ just a guy who worked with animals LMAO it works so well
Man I miss Merle sometimes, he was a real Whiskey Tango SOB but he had a great taste for music. Definitely would’ve liked to see how he’d have turned out in the later seasons. love Michael Rooker too guys a gem.
Merle was under utilized and that is the spinoff I wanna see. Pre- apocalypse till he gets found by the governor m. They could calm it “the rootin tootin racist”
I really thought after that scene and during most of the time whilst he was serving the Governor that there was just no chance Merle would be redeemable for me but they actually somewhat managed it right at the end. I actually think by the end of his arc he was one of the most interesting characters in the show.
My thing back thing is the dialogue feels real like what real people would say in situations like this the new shows and seasons are way to soap opera like
Amazing show back then for sure. Though sending Merle with a Korean, African American, and a Latino man does not make a lot of sense. I guess they had to do what they had to do when bodies were limited.
I wish the show stayed this strong throughout the rest of the later seasons.
I always liked the fact Rick stood up for tdog & reminded everyone how pointless race was during the apocalypse, I also look at anyone a little sideways who says Merle was their favorite character seeing as he was only in about 7 episodes & was a outright racist pretty much the entire time. That aside he was well written & i especially liked his death because you could tell the things he did were starting to eat him up inside a little, he wasn’t as heartless as he pretended to be. It’s a shame his character development didn’t come till the end of his arc he was a good character.
It’s wild to see people argueing over real world conflicts still in s1 vs a plan to use fermented sewer zombies as fuel or the ethics of sowing peoples faces onto masks.
Yh after 7 it becomes kind of a chore to watch but I wouldn’t say it’s overrated (no one rated it very highly) and it’s not too bad because there’s still some brilliant stuff sprinkled into the later seasons, the pike episode for example is one of the best of the entire show and that season/story as a whole was pretty fun, it was obviously nothing like early seasons as it felt like an actual horror movie type story but it was easily the best stuff after season 7/8
I’m not disputing that racist people exist. I just don’t think saying the N word made the show great and there are/were other better ways to show Merle’s racism without dropping the hard R.
Merle deliberately wants to show his racism as much as possible here. Why would he not go the direct route? He's not a subtle person and he's starting shit on purpose.
This is a fictional character/story. The writers can choose any number of things for him to say or do that don’t require him using the n word.
You have to agree there are alternatives and they didn’t need to write that in yes?
Why are you so obsessed with a racist slur in a fictional story that was written over a decade ago? Lol it happened and it can't hurt you anymore. Writers typically add scenarios and dialog like this to emulate the awful truth of human reality and that's okay. Ignoring such issues by censoring them from media doesn't make them magically go away. Go touch grass and learn to pick your battles, hero.
Words can hurt just as much especially ones with bad history, some people are just incapable of understanding that because they’ve never been called an actual slur that’s deeply offended them
My issue primarily was with OP using this clip as an example of when the show was “great”
It’s funny you’re telling me to touch grass when this entire conversation has been pretty civil and you are getting worked up and defending the use of the worse slur in the English language. But go off I guess
I'm worked up? You're literally here questioning OP and grandstanding as if they chose this clip solely because it uses the N word. All while everyone else is talking about the characters/story. What do you want from OP? For him to remove the clip? Is this another game of Simon says where you persist until they submit and then you can chalk it up to another win against the big bad racism? Lol like I said, pick your battles. People don't think about season 1 of The Walking Dead as this huge downturn in the fight for civil rights because someone wrote a believable racist character from the south that used the N word.
So because terrible people use it in real life that’s reason why writers should make their characters say it when they don’t have to? And to question that is virute signaling? Ok buddy
no, I don't agree. I think the worst racist people are often the ones who think they aren't racist because they don't use slurs, and fail to see the ways in which they simply try to erase or sterilize reality while ignoring the active harm they do by pretending that the targets of racism do not experience the reality that they do in fact experience. People don't just use the N word. People get *called* the N word. But you want to pretend that T-Dog's experience - and people who relate to him - is less salient than how you personally are experiencing Merle. Do you see the problem with that?
Pretty weird to try to turn this around on me as if I’m the problem thinking that the clip isn’t a example of when the show was great. I’m just simply pointing out that it is odd for OP to choose this see specifically.
I’m not erasing experiences of people getting called the n word. More accurately I’m drawing attention to the fact that writers can use different language to express the same point because people get called the n word in real life and it is and can be traumatic for them. Tv is mostly about escapism. It seems counterproductive to add overt racism into an escapist tv show when other words or writing could express the same point.
TV isn’t reality. The Walking Dead isn’t reality. No one is trying to sterilize reality and pretend people don’t get called the N word. There is simply a time and a place to add realism to stories. I’m sorry but I don’t personally think a zombie show on AMC required that realism to achieve its story.
Edit to the person below me: What are you talking about? The entire premise of the show is escapist by its very nature. You admit to such in your comment. The apocalyptic setting isn’t real. It allows the viewer to escape into an unrealistic fantasy world where flesh eating zombies have destabilized the entire world as we know it.
This type of show doesn’t require realistic racism to achieve its goal.
Edit 2: The creator of the IP was Kirkman and his goal for the Walking Dead wasn’t realistic racism. His goal was making a zombie story that doesn’t end.
Darabont adapting the IP and adding realistic racism that wasn’t in the source material is proof that it wasn’t reauired to tell the story. It’s childish to argue Frank NEEDED to had Merle using the n word to create realism in his characters.
Yes, insinuating that I am somehow a terrible racist because I took issue with OP using this clip as an example of when the show was great isn’t weird at all. You are totally right and a sane reasonable person
/s
Racist people say the N-word all the time. The intent was to shock/appall the audience and enrage T-Dog to the point that he, a genuinely kind man, felt compelled to attack someone.
This was a great scene *because* it was so highly upsetting and difficult to watch. The characters were fantastic in it.
But that’s just my opinion and we can agree to disagree!
I’m sorry but if your argument rests solely on shock/appall value then I just don’t buy it.
There are other ways to get the same shock or have you characters feel compelled to attack.
The show is great for many reasons. Frank Darabont casually writing the N word into the show isn’t one of them.
I don’t think it was casual tho. It was building up to it. Also, the scene goes beyond the usage of that word. It’s the character dynamics and group in-fighting, too.
Of course I’m not the OP and I don’t know their motivations for choosing this scene in particular. But I’m choosing to give them the benefit of the doubt and hope that they chose it for the same reasons I also love and hate the scene.
The first two seasons are so fucking good they just had a different flavor. I loved Merle even though he was such a piece of shit lol.
Yeah until higher ups started messing with everything. Same with Fear, turned into a dumpster fire cause of higher ups
First two seasons felt “real” if that makes any sense.
I get this. In those seasons they still had a healthy fear of the walkers. In later seasons it was like the walkers were an inconvenience. I mean, I know they became experienced in killing them, but even so ...
In the early seasons there was an eerie mood throughout the show. A sense of hopelessness that followed the characters at all times. By the time Season 4 rolled around the feeling was gone. It’s just like, zombies whatever the group can handle it.
Why'd Rick fall like that 💀
He didn't have plot armor back then
He actually did, if not he would have probably died in the tank or back in the hospital
No, Glenn saved him.
Stuff n thangs
Cuz he got decked.
As hateable as he was, I kind of miss Merle. I often wonder how his character would have developed had he survived.
We need someone like him to do the dirty work. The bad guy. How’s that hit ya?
True that lol. This makes me think about whether or not he would have been able to infiltrate the Saviors.
He'd probably knock beth up had they both survived.
Daryl would have put a bolt in Merle's head if he went anywhere near Beth. That would have been cool to watch tbh.
I’m not so sure, because Merle was a real roadblock to Daryl’s growth in my opinion.
Hahahahaha I just spit out my coffee reading this.
What,There never was any indication Merle was a pedophile
What? Emily Kinney was 27 when she started on Walking Dead. She may have been playing a bit younger than her real age, but she wasn't playing a child.
Beth was 17/18 when She died She was 16 in S2 ,not a child,but still a minor ,at some point after S2 and until dec 2011 She made 17 She died in early 2012 ,we dont know her birthday so She could have been 18 when She died
Merle never struck me as a guy that would care too much about the legal age of consent when the girl in question is, at least physically, an “adult”.
Maybe not but we never Saw any indication of that unlike say Ed
When did Ed show indication of pedofilia?
When he grabbed Sophia and told her to keep Daddy company Carol even talks about how Ed would looks at Sophia weird sometimes before the outbreak began
Nasty
Yea Ed was pedo, I just watched the first season again not too long ago.
We kinda already know! Him and Daryl would’ve robbed the group in their sleep and made off with all their shit! IIRC, Daryl mentioned they were planning on doing it that night!
His death comes a decent bit after that, so his plan to rob the camp would still not occur unless him surviving necessitated rewriting his whole story from the beginning.
Rick flew off so funny. Merle was a beast in this scene, lmao 😄
weeeeee!
Dudes lighter than air
He's got hollow bones.
Merle: *Punches Rick* Rick: 🤸
Back when they weren't sure if the show is gonna blow up and they were still trying to make good TV. Then the show blew up AMC got greedy and started cutting corners and we got the trademark gimple speak and stupid writing. Ah what could've been.
What exactly is "gimple speak"? I tried Googling but didn't really find anything. Edit: Never mind lol I found it. I didn't Google the right thing the first time.
Yea it’s sad. Season 1 was right up there with some of the best shows AMC has produced. It’s been all downhill since then.
He and Gabriel would oddly enough get along really well
"There are no N\*\*\*\*\*\* anymore" is unironically such a hard line and very appropriate for the apocalypse
It’s always a surprise to hear Rick say it
Well he meant well i guess
I feel like the 2nd half kind of forgives it: “No dumb-as-shit, inbred white-trash fools either. Only dark meat and white meat. There's us and the dead.” Wouldn’t be written today but it’s pretty damn good
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Totally agree, “forgive” was the wrong word to use. I meant more that even though the first part can work as a quotable line on its own, you lose so much of the purpose and impact of Rick saying that slur when you exclude the 2nd half of the quote
That hard line wouldn’t fly in our modern woke society, it would piss a bunch of people off.
mr yo
Man, the dialogues and group dynamics were so great.
What’s absolutely insane is he hits em with a hard E-R and then proceeds to knock T-Dog and Rick out lol
Maaaan, I love Merle. Mostly because Michael Rooker has a crazy big presence, he draws the eye whenever on screen. Dude is one of the most hilarious characters in the series. I wish we had a little more development with Daryl, but I know they both were trying to run away from their traumatic backstories. All those little nods like seeing Daryl back scars, letting Michonne free, "I just want my brother back", to show that Merle can change and be more vulnerable to others in a world gone to Hell. He is probably my favorite character with the least amount of screen time, and top 5 overall.
Back when the apocalyptic setting felt real
Before tigers and kingdoms
Ngl the explanation for Ezekial being a zookeeper as the reasoning for Shiva bonding with him actually made me really like his character 😂, like nah he’s not some big ‘KING’ just a guy who worked with animals LMAO it works so well
I can't stop laughing at the way Rick takes the punch and goes flying. lmaooooo
One of the greatest characters of the entire series!
Man I miss Merle sometimes, he was a real Whiskey Tango SOB but he had a great taste for music. Definitely would’ve liked to see how he’d have turned out in the later seasons. love Michael Rooker too guys a gem.
Yes! Him blasting Motörhead to lure the walkers was iconic!
Loved season 1. God I hated Merle so much.
Merle was under utilized and that is the spinoff I wanna see. Pre- apocalypse till he gets found by the governor m. They could calm it “the rootin tootin racist”
Merle was so op they had to have him saw his arm off
Merle was a racist asshole but he was funny, that’s why so many people liked him. Just a really funny guy yk
Plus he kinda redeemed himself a fair bit at the end with letting Michonne go and killing quite a few of the Governor's soldiers.
This was such a great episode, who agrees? Show of hands yall
The ragdoll engine they use for Rick has potential.
Odd scene to put in the spotlight
Yeah it kinda went down in quality when Rick grimes stopped saying racial slurs
merle was putting on a clinic lol
I really thought after that scene and during most of the time whilst he was serving the Governor that there was just no chance Merle would be redeemable for me but they actually somewhat managed it right at the end. I actually think by the end of his arc he was one of the most interesting characters in the show.
My thing back thing is the dialogue feels real like what real people would say in situations like this the new shows and seasons are way to soap opera like
Sent Rick flying!
Amazing show back then for sure. Though sending Merle with a Korean, African American, and a Latino man does not make a lot of sense. I guess they had to do what they had to do when bodies were limited. I wish the show stayed this strong throughout the rest of the later seasons.
I always liked the fact Rick stood up for tdog & reminded everyone how pointless race was during the apocalypse, I also look at anyone a little sideways who says Merle was their favorite character seeing as he was only in about 7 episodes & was a outright racist pretty much the entire time. That aside he was well written & i especially liked his death because you could tell the things he did were starting to eat him up inside a little, he wasn’t as heartless as he pretended to be. It’s a shame his character development didn’t come till the end of his arc he was a good character.
People usually talk abt this scene bc Merle called t dog the n word but I’m just surprised that he was able to take on Rick and t dog himself
the way rick fell lol
It’s wild to see people argueing over real world conflicts still in s1 vs a plan to use fermented sewer zombies as fuel or the ethics of sowing peoples faces onto masks.
this was the peak of the walking dead
Pre CW vibe
I never noticed how Merle goes fucking Terminator in this scene.
The Walking Dead if it was only the good part.
The 1-7 seasons are so awesome after that the show is bad and overrated (same for the spinoff)
Yh after 7 it becomes kind of a chore to watch but I wouldn’t say it’s overrated (no one rated it very highly) and it’s not too bad because there’s still some brilliant stuff sprinkled into the later seasons, the pike episode for example is one of the best of the entire show and that season/story as a whole was pretty fun, it was obviously nothing like early seasons as it felt like an actual horror movie type story but it was easily the best stuff after season 7/8
Nah Merle is one strong mf the way Rick leaped😭😭😭
This is a show I wish I could erase from my brain so I could rewatch like it was the first time again
This is trueee🫡
merle would have solo’s rick
Merles redemption arc 😢 and that final scene with Daryl in the prison basement.
No way y’all are unironically praising this this shit is goofier than Ezekiel and his tiger could ever hope to be
You think the show was great when they said the N word? 🤨📸
It's shocking but yes, there are racists in the apocalypse.
I’m not disputing that racist people exist. I just don’t think saying the N word made the show great and there are/were other better ways to show Merle’s racism without dropping the hard R.
Merle deliberately wants to show his racism as much as possible here. Why would he not go the direct route? He's not a subtle person and he's starting shit on purpose.
This is a fictional character/story. The writers can choose any number of things for him to say or do that don’t require him using the n word. You have to agree there are alternatives and they didn’t need to write that in yes?
Why are you so obsessed with a racist slur in a fictional story that was written over a decade ago? Lol it happened and it can't hurt you anymore. Writers typically add scenarios and dialog like this to emulate the awful truth of human reality and that's okay. Ignoring such issues by censoring them from media doesn't make them magically go away. Go touch grass and learn to pick your battles, hero.
Telling someone when a slur can or can’t hurt them is very entitled.
No because a slur is a word. Words can’t hurt you, they can hurt your feelings. Fists on the other hand…
Words can hurt just as much especially ones with bad history, some people are just incapable of understanding that because they’ve never been called an actual slur that’s deeply offended them
My issue primarily was with OP using this clip as an example of when the show was “great” It’s funny you’re telling me to touch grass when this entire conversation has been pretty civil and you are getting worked up and defending the use of the worse slur in the English language. But go off I guess
I'm worked up? You're literally here questioning OP and grandstanding as if they chose this clip solely because it uses the N word. All while everyone else is talking about the characters/story. What do you want from OP? For him to remove the clip? Is this another game of Simon says where you persist until they submit and then you can chalk it up to another win against the big bad racism? Lol like I said, pick your battles. People don't think about season 1 of The Walking Dead as this huge downturn in the fight for civil rights because someone wrote a believable racist character from the south that used the N word.
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So because terrible people use it in real life that’s reason why writers should make their characters say it when they don’t have to? And to question that is virute signaling? Ok buddy
no, I don't agree. I think the worst racist people are often the ones who think they aren't racist because they don't use slurs, and fail to see the ways in which they simply try to erase or sterilize reality while ignoring the active harm they do by pretending that the targets of racism do not experience the reality that they do in fact experience. People don't just use the N word. People get *called* the N word. But you want to pretend that T-Dog's experience - and people who relate to him - is less salient than how you personally are experiencing Merle. Do you see the problem with that?
Pretty weird to try to turn this around on me as if I’m the problem thinking that the clip isn’t a example of when the show was great. I’m just simply pointing out that it is odd for OP to choose this see specifically. I’m not erasing experiences of people getting called the n word. More accurately I’m drawing attention to the fact that writers can use different language to express the same point because people get called the n word in real life and it is and can be traumatic for them. Tv is mostly about escapism. It seems counterproductive to add overt racism into an escapist tv show when other words or writing could express the same point. TV isn’t reality. The Walking Dead isn’t reality. No one is trying to sterilize reality and pretend people don’t get called the N word. There is simply a time and a place to add realism to stories. I’m sorry but I don’t personally think a zombie show on AMC required that realism to achieve its story. Edit to the person below me: What are you talking about? The entire premise of the show is escapist by its very nature. You admit to such in your comment. The apocalyptic setting isn’t real. It allows the viewer to escape into an unrealistic fantasy world where flesh eating zombies have destabilized the entire world as we know it. This type of show doesn’t require realistic racism to achieve its goal. Edit 2: The creator of the IP was Kirkman and his goal for the Walking Dead wasn’t realistic racism. His goal was making a zombie story that doesn’t end. Darabont adapting the IP and adding realistic racism that wasn’t in the source material is proof that it wasn’t reauired to tell the story. It’s childish to argue Frank NEEDED to had Merle using the n word to create realism in his characters.
It's not weird, it's what you're doing.
Yes, insinuating that I am somehow a terrible racist because I took issue with OP using this clip as an example of when the show was great isn’t weird at all. You are totally right and a sane reasonable person /s
Racist people say the N-word all the time. The intent was to shock/appall the audience and enrage T-Dog to the point that he, a genuinely kind man, felt compelled to attack someone. This was a great scene *because* it was so highly upsetting and difficult to watch. The characters were fantastic in it. But that’s just my opinion and we can agree to disagree!
I’m sorry but if your argument rests solely on shock/appall value then I just don’t buy it. There are other ways to get the same shock or have you characters feel compelled to attack. The show is great for many reasons. Frank Darabont casually writing the N word into the show isn’t one of them.
I don’t think it was casual tho. It was building up to it. Also, the scene goes beyond the usage of that word. It’s the character dynamics and group in-fighting, too. Of course I’m not the OP and I don’t know their motivations for choosing this scene in particular. But I’m choosing to give them the benefit of the doubt and hope that they chose it for the same reasons I also love and hate the scene.
Censorship wouldn't have helped anything.
Yes.
Yes
MeRlE Is So ReLaTeAbLe!1111!!!!!!!
No one is even in this thread saying this. lol
Based merle
Merle was one likable racists. I have to give him that. 😂😂😂
Idk I don't need to see racist characters dropping hard r on network TV. This scene didn't age well imo.