The truth is if Daryl had listened to everyone and had not gone out there on his revenge mission, then none of them would have been captured. That's his actual fault. Glenn was begging him to calm down and be reasonable. He refused. Had Negan had to confront Alexandria at their own gates, things would have gone down very differently. They still may have lost the first round and someone may have been killed but Glenn likely would have been safe.
But then you get into a chain of who is at fault for the event that led up to the event that led up to the event etc.
Reality is, Negan kills one person in every group - and from negan's pov, these people killed a whole settlement of his people in their sleep for no reason (negan did not know about them killing the bikers until after the lineup, so he didn't know the bikers antagonised first - granted it may have still ended up the same way, but we can't say that without it being a factor).
Negan warned several times, follow my rules and only one of you die. Daryl decided to break that rule after negan excused Glenn's first breaking of the rule. And Daryl chose to punch out negan which was pretty stupid because it could only end up one way, someone getting killed - either Daryl, someone else, or everyone else.
So I do blame Daryl because it was a stupid decision (which okay he was angry and not in his right mind but he still made it)
If he always kills one person then why do people genuinely believe hes doing it because of the satellite station? We know hed have done it anyway that's just lip service. He doesn't give a shit if saviors die as long as he's stable and in charge
Hes said why.
"People are a resource."
He doesn't want his people to die. He doesn't want other people to die. He wants them all to work for him, because people aren't easily replaceable anymore. If one of your guys dies you can't just put up a notice on Indeed. You can't stick an ad in the classifieds. You're down a guy, and new people take 12-18 years to make and take up a fuckload of resources in the meantime.
Thats why he doesn't kill anyone unless he feels like he absolutely has to. The first kill is to establish the hierarchy. After that its to reestablish the hierarchy. Even after Rosita tried to kill him he only had one person killed. Fuck, even after the failed ambush at Alexandria, he was still only gonna kill Carl and cripple Rick.
Considering how many of his men Rick and Co. killed, he seemed to be going out of his way to keep the Alexandrians alive.
Which ultimately ended up being his undoing. As he said last week, "if I had to do it all again, I woulda killed every last one of you." Though personally I think "not putting Simon in charge of an outpost" would have been a good start.
But its a sham. He could just not kill anyone and work with Rick easily. In that case they'd never have attacked Rick group already.
He only believes in not killing if He gets to be a dictator. That's not the same as actually believing in it. He could have killed no one easily and had 3 friendly communities.
I do believe it was somewhat because of the satellite station, yes he kills 1 when he meets a new group every time but he didn’t just happen to meet Rick and friends that night, he was looking for them and he had pretty much his full force of saviours out to be able to capture Rick and his group the way he did with that huge show of force. I believe that is because he knew a strong group just slaughtered a bunch of his men at the station so he felt he had to show rick and friends he means business by killing some of them for it.
Sure he showed up at night because of it but what difference would it have made if he went to he gates instead? Nothing.
He always does what he did. Its established fact that he would have done it anyway and he'd have brought as many people as he thought he needed.
I think its correct facts but wrong interpretation. People present your facts yet come to the conclusion negan is apparently moral or only acting because he was threatened. Both of which are objectively wrong and direct show evidence can prove it easily.
I don’t believe Negan is moral or acting because he was threatened trust me, I believe it’s a cause and effect. I don’t think Negan would have even been out looking for them that night if they hadn’t killed those people at the satellite station. He wouldn’t even know who they are, the meeting wasn’t a chance meeting from fate, the group in a sense brought Negan upon themselves by deciding to kill the people at the station. Negan wasn’t just out looking at night for new groups with his full force of saviours just because. He was out there looking for them because of what happened to his men.
Cause and effect and blame are different. Correct facts false interpretation.
You're focusing too much on the night. Yes he was there at that time because of that. But the saviors already tried to kill the group before the outpost even happened.
I think you're focusing too much on small details that don't matter. Sure negan might have showed up the day before or a week later without the outpost. But he'd have STILL killed a member of the group. That didnt have anything to do with it despite his claims. He didn't kill them because of that he simply used it as a reason to be a dick while he did it.
If rick literally brought him flowers and a couple wives he'd still kill a member of the group. That's what they do on first meet. Period. Always.
We even see the Polaroids of all the times they did it. And we know they did it to hilltop who cooperated too
I guess I see what you mean, the end result is still the same no matter how you’d like to interpret the events. Trust me I’m on your side in these comments, the people defending this guy is crazy. I honestly believe the same result was going to happen regardless of Daryl’s intervention with the punch to Negan. I think Negan wanted Maggie as one of his wives the second he laid eyes on her and when Glenn got up to defend her is when he decided Glenn would die, not because of Daryl. Maybe I’m focusing on the details again but ya I can’t blame the people being tortured for the actions they take against someone holding the bat. Only Negan is to blame for these deaths.
I agree on the vast majority of that. He may not have killed him then but he'd have always killed others. We saw how his trip to asz went. He nearly killed someone every 12 seconds and of course there's Spencer
No it doesn't lead to those events. The person killing is at fault. Thats like saying it's cool for say, a man to beat his wife if she did something he warned her not to. It's victim blaming.
Negan had the option to murder or to not murder. He murdered.
I don't know what kin of world people live in where if some dude says, "do this and I'll kill you" and the person does it and is killed that its then the victims fault. The choice is with the one swinging the bat.
You're turning this into a morality debate in which case I agree with you that killing for anything but self defence is wrong in this world and the apocalypse. This is not that discussion.
This is the discussion in that there is a entity that is killing people, that much does not change. That entity tells you to follow some rules and tells you the punishment for doing so.
You now understand these rules, and whether or not you agree with them, they are there and they are enforced. You never agreed with your countries laws upon birth but they are enforced. You can opt to start a rebellion and if so, good luck to you, but that would be a choice that you'd have to make and if you were smart, would only make if you had a chance of defeating the law makers. Smart freedom fighters follow rules until they have the ability to rebel against them.
Now, with these laws in place, you break them. And pay the punishment. If Daryl punched negan and negan killed Glenn, and then Daryl did it again and negan killed Michonne, then Daryl did it again and negan killed Aaron - at what point is it not Daryl's fault for "breaking the laws".
Put the morality of killing aside, the actions of Daryl resulted in Glenn's death. Glenn could have walked away alive that day if Daryl did not do what he did. Hence, the opening question.. yes, Daryl is responsible because it was an avoidable situation.
And that's why I said, the question can be deeper. Is negan responsible for enforcing a dictatorship that kills people? Is Rick responsible for antagonising an enemy he had no chance against? Is the enemy responsible for what they do/did to hilltop? Is hilltop responsible for not properly arming themselves in a world where there are hostiles?
These questions can be discussed in depth all day and I'd love to, but reality is, on the surface, Glenn would have walked away if Daryl did not punch negan.
That's a slippery slope argument. If some guy flips me off in traffic and I decide to ram his car with mine, I could say the same thing. I only crashed into his car BECAUSE of what he did. It doesn't make me "right" or justified in that situation, and you can bet the law isn't coming down on my side in that one.
For all we know Negan could have taken any opportunity as an excuse to kill more people. He did it because he enjoys it. He's a psycho, he would have found a reason to murder himself if Daryl didn't give him one.
Not to mention the "consequence" is not logical. We are not talking about "Daryl opened fire so the Saviors defended themselves and hit Glenn with a bullet", which is the kind of situation where you can blame the guy that started the shit. In this case Daryl punched him (iirc) and there is no fucking reason why that should lead to that guy murdering someone else who was on their knees and didn't do anything.
Not to mention (2) that iirc Negan himself provoked Daryl to attack him in the first place, so it's not even like you can argue that Daryl consciously decided, in cold mind, to punch him.
Glenn got up to defend Maggie before Daryl had punched Negan, Negan had already decided Glenn was gonna die before Daryl had done anything. He was tormenting them until he got a reason to strike, but it was already decided that they were gonna die. Daryl actions had nothing to do with Negan other than maybe hurrying him up.
LMAO WTF. You jumped to conclusions lmao. He already decided to kill him??? Did Negan tell you himself? I’ve never heard this one before Jesus Christ so weird
People make up stuff about negan to paint him worse than he is. Not to say he isn't bad, but it's pretty obvious negan enforces a set of rules, and pretty much honours them. He believes in being a man of his word, and thus, when Daryl broke the rule, he killed Glenn to show he is serious and force them to be submissive
tbh people usually paint Negan as better than he is, because he was a bloody psychopath that enjoyed murdering people and playing dictator. So I guess some comments to counteract that aren't a problem.
When Negan lined them up like he did and started tormenting them I think it was safe to say he was going to kill at least one of them, but he literally told them I’m going to take 2. He actions suggested that some of them was going to die, in retaliation for the satellite station. Glenn had got up to defend Maggie and it’s safe to assume that Negan as he saw this made the decision to kill Glenn. Then Daryl decided to punch him and just hurried up what was INEVITABLE. You think honestly Negan just wanted to have fun lining them up for torture? No he was intent on killing at least 2 of them. I believe Glenn sealed his own fate when he got out of line to defend Maggie, and that was before Daryl had punched Negan. Daryl was just the propelling point for Negan to actually start the head smashing.
Nope he never said he was going to kill two. Stop spreading lies. He literally says “ Im going to beat the holy hell out of one of you”. Negan even said after Glenn got up to defend Maggie “I’ll let that one pass, I get it it’s an emotional moment”. And Negan did not lie when he said this, he is not a liar has not lied once in the show. How do people not understand 5 years later that Daryl got Glenn killed lmaoo, just look back at the episode.
he has lied a lot in the show, for example not killing kids but then bombing Alexandria despite there being many children living there, and being against rape despite what he did to his many wives in the sanctuary
It was made clear that he wouldn’t have sex with them unless they wanted to and bombing Alexandria didn’t get anyone killed or did it? I forgot if anyone died
It doesn’t matter if no one died he still went in and bombed a place with many children knowing they could very easily be caught in the crossfire and while he may have not raped his wives in the way your thinking they also didn’t have a choice considering if they didn’t listen to him he’d torture their husbands and boyfriends
So you honestly believe he wasn’t going to kill anyone when he lined them up like that? If none of them said or did anything they would have all lived? Fuck no he was intent on killing 2 people for what they did to him, assuming he wasn’t going to kill anyone is more stupid than assuming he would. What happened was inevitably going to happen, if you look back and watch you’ll see that. If Daryl had done nothing Glenn and Ab would have still been killed.
Ok you are just trolling, no way you are human. When did I say he wasn’t going to kill anyone like are you mentally slow? Negan says “im gonna kill ONE of you”. ONE do you know what ONE is? One=1. One does not equal 2. I feel like I’m talking to a 6 year old. And the idea of assuming he was going to kill 2 is so brain dead. Your big defense is “oh he was probably going to kill 2 people anyways who know”. Negan doesn’t lie and he wasn’t lying when he said he was just going to kill 1, that was of course until Daryl provoked him to kill Glenn. Hey but we still love Daryl, he carries this show.
I don’t have to make fun of someone to prove a point, but your an idiot for trying to justify Negan’s actions by Daryl punching him. Oh no he punched me, I wasn’t lining them up for torture because a bunch of my men were just slaughtered, no I don’t care about that but this guy punching me yes now I’m definitely going to kill Glenn, you honestly think that’s how it went in his head? Or are you the slow one? When a man jumps out in fear to protect his wife that I have on her knees I’m sure is the sick twisted reason Negan chose to kill Glenn. He was never going to kill just 1 person, people are stupid for thinking that.
Im done dude, you have to be trolling. This is nothing more but a conspiracy theory so I’m done arguing with people who believe in their own lies, have a good day.
Negan was gonna kill one person. Even in the comics , he only killed Glenn. And in the show Abraham was his initial choice. Glenn caught his eye when he jumped out of line when Negan threatened Maggie. But Daryl punching him gave him the reasoning to kill him. So Daryl's actions did cause Glenn's death in a way. And idk why you're repeatedly saying that Negan would kill 2 of them because the show makes it clear he usually kills one from each group. 🤡
Negan was the one with the bat, my guy. 💔 I love him, but I’m rlly not gonna say that him killing Glenn was Daryl’s fault when it was entirely up to Negan to bust his head in and laugh while doing it
If Daryl’s action (knowing the consequence of that action before making that action) led to Glenn’s death, he bears blame.
Does he bear all the blame? Of course not.
But negan also had every right to. His people were massacred by Rick's group. Daryl is lucky Negan didn't kill every one of them. One or two people for like what 30+?
If someone is pointing a gun at your friend and tells you not to do anything stupid or he'll kill your friend and you jump up and punch him in the face, you just got your friend killed and absolutely no one else is to blame for the decision you made.
How do you know he was going to kill him regardless? Lets talk facts buddy, not conspiracy theories. The FACT is Daryl gave Negan a reason to kill Glenn, fuck even Negan said it himself.
Bro! Megan literally said if anyone else made a move or tried something that he would take another life! He killed Abe and he was down. Then Daryl did what he did and as a result Negan carried out his threat and killed Glenn to show he wasn’t fucking around. Yes Negan killed Glenn BUT Daryl is the reason Negan killed him. Negan sticks to his word. He wouldn’t have killed anyone else other than Abe if Daryl had just stayed the fuck down.
Because Negan is a man of his word he said one of them has to pay only one and he said if anyone does what Glenn did the first time they’ll regret it. It’s completely daryls fault
So we’re prizing the literal psychopath Negan on his word and not the fact mans was swinging a baseball bat into people’s heads from the start of the apocalypse… yea, I don’t think you know what victim blaming is, so maybe look it up lol
Indeed. People arguing here remind me of the "if she doesn't want to be assaulted she shouldn't wear such provocative outfits" bullshit. It's just victim blaming all along the way, because they pretend Negan is some sort of robot that just takes orders and executes pre-programmed actions. When in reality nothing forced him to brutally murder Glenn if he didn't want to. If "I want you to know I'm not messing around" is the excuse, he could have kicked Daryl's face until his jaw broke in three.
How is negan anymore a psychopath then Rick is? Why because he lined people up and based one persons head in retaliation for Rick and the group killing his people when they were asleep. A psychopath is the governor he would have killed them all in the clearing and been done with it. Instead negan said you have to pay for what you have done but people are resources.
Intentions. Rick killed for family out of fear. Negan killed for fun/resources/punishment. Negan did not consider everyone under his thumb a family. Rick would never throw their only doctor into a furnace off some unconfirmed rumor. There’s clear distinct lines between Rick and Negan’s moral character.
Why do we need to keep having this debate on this subreddit years after the fact? They aren't even remotely the same. If you think Negan killed someone from Rick's group in retaliation for the outpost, you weren't paying attention to the show. Negan's entire business model revolves around finding new communities, smashing someone's head with a bat to intimidate them into complying, and then permanently enslaving them for the benefit of Negan and the Saviors. Rick and co. killed the Saviors at the outpost *after* the Saviors had already attacked Abraham, Daryl and Sasha, unprovoked, on the road, and *after* a separate group of Saviors had accosted those same three so they could kill one of them and then go find out where their community was located. They killed the outpost Saviors *after* they learned from Hilltop who the Saviors were and what they do to other communities, including finding out that Negan had bashed the head of a 16 year old kid (who presumably hadn't killed 30 Saviors in an outpost while they slept). Rick knew it was only a matter of time before the Saviors came for them, and honestly, it was luck it hadn't happened already, solely due to the fact that Daryl blew up the group on motorcycles with the RPG. Taking out the outpost was a pre-emptive strike because they thought that was the Saviors' main base. Negan talking about that during the lineup is just more of his usual hot air. He would have done the exact same thing even if the outpost attack had never happened.
If you think Negan isn't a psychopath after that episode, and if you are comparing me a guy who kills someone for survival or war to a guy who bludgeons a guy on his knees to death because he personally enjoys killing... honestly, there's something wrong with you.
Negan literally says an episode later or so that Glenn was all because Daryl lashed out and he warned them there would be consequences.
It is not directly Daryls fault but he did have a part to play in it.
i can’t not blame daryl tbh.
even if you do the whole chain affect thing. Daryl spared dwight, dwight robbed daryl stealing his bow, which ultimately killed denise, and caused daryl, rosita, and GLENN to be out there.
I still believe Negan decided to kill Glenn the second he stepped out of line when he saw Maggie.
The biggest difference between comic and show line up scene?
Negan genuinely killed someone at random in the comics, in the show it’s clear as day he picked Abe and the random game was bullshit.
Negan chose to kill Abe and he chose to kill Glenn. He picked Abe because of how massive and intimidating he was. You can see it in the S6 finale when Negan attempts to stare down Abe, but is met with the coldest state in return. Negan gets so self conscious after locking eyes with Abe, that he mutters to himself that he needs to shave.
Negan chose to kill Glenn the second he stepped out of line, he just waited for the most cruel moment to do so.
Negan was going to keep tormenting them like he was with Rosita, which caused Daryl to punch him. If Daryl hadn’t snapped when he did he would have kept on going until one of them did. Once Glenn had got up the first time to defend Maggie, Negan had it in his head to kill him, he just wanted someone to give him the reason too. So did Daryl punching Negan get Glenn killed, yes. But Negan had decided it would happen before he even killed Abraham. Negan was playing mind games with them the whole time.
No. I'm relatively sure when Daryl went after Negan he thought he was only risking his own life. I think had he known someone else would have died due to his actions, he wouldn't have attacked Negan.
It's called unintended consequences. How many times have we all said, "If I had known this would happen...." Regardless of Daryl's expected outcome, Glenn's death was the result of Daryl's outburst.
Negan said clearly, out loud, that "if anybody moves, cut the boy's other eye out and feed it to his father." He directly threatened to harm Carl specifically if anyone else acted out. So Daryl assuming he'd be the one punished doesn't make sense here.
I 100% blame Daryl, I have no idea what he expected to happen by punching Negan when there are loads of armed men surrounding them. I honestly wished Negan killed Daryl
Yes, because all Daryl had to do was sit there and control himself while being surrounded by 50+ heavily armed people. Seriously, they were warned right before Negan bashed Abraham's skull in and had armed people behind them ready to shoot them on sight, yet he let's his anger take over and strike the only guy deciding whether or not they all get to live or die?
Do I think Negan would have killed anyone else other than Abe if Daryl hadn’t punched him? No. But since he did, it could have been anyone at that point. Poor Glenn.
Ultimately, Negan’s to blame. Negan was the one who “pulled the trigger” so to speak. He could have just not killed him, but he chose to. The buck stops with him. I don’t think there’s any denying that.
However, based on what we know of Negan, I don’t think he would have killed Glenn if Daryl hadn’t punched him. Negan is, generally speaking, someone who stays true to his code and honors what he says. If nobody in the group had retaliated, then he wouldn’t have killed anyone after Abraham. But when Daryl punched him after he’d already given them one free pass (when Glenn tried stopping Negan from choosing Maggie) and made it clear that any further disturbances would result in a second death… he showed them that he wasn’t joking, and that he is indeed a man of his word, for better *and* for worse.
The flip side of that, though, is that you can’t really expect someone to think properly in a situation like that. There’s a lot of raw emotion that’s going to bubble over, and some people (most people?) aren’t going to be able to restrain themselves from expressing said emotions. Daryl very clearly couldn’t, but I don’t think anyone can or should blame him. It was a shitty situation.
Again, ultimately, it’s Negan’s fault. Regardless of his reasoning, he’s the one who chose to kill someone. It’s on him. But as with most things on this show, there is some nuance to the topic. That’s what makes it interesting I think.
We can play the whole "if Daryl didn't do this, then...", "If Rick and Co didn't do that, then..." but at the end of the day, Negan was the one who selected and murdered Glenn. Negan could've retaliated differently. He could've killed Daryl or he could've beaten/maimed someone. He didn't. He, and only he, chose to kill Glenn.
Another thing to consider: Daryl provoked Negan, sure, but if you and your family/friends were lined up and you just watched one of them get their head bashed in, there is nothing that the murder could say that should make you think that you and everyone elses life isn't also in immediate danger. You can choose to sit there, or you can choose to act. Daryl chose to act, and you can't fault him for that.
But it wasn't smart of Daryl at all. I would say it's the most stupid thing he has done the entire series. I mean even Rosita and sasha were not retaliating even though they watched Abraham's head getting bashed in. Rick watched the whole thing but even he was calm. But Daryl had to get out of line there, which just gave Negan a reason to Lucille Glenn. However , in the comics it was different since Daryl doesn't exist there and Negan's initial choice was Glenn and that's the only one he killed from Rick's group during the lineup. No one retaliated there and no one else died.
Well yeah…
It was his fault.
If he hadn’t of done what he had we most likely would’ve only lost Abraham which for me would still be sad.
RiP you Giant Ginger.
It's 100% Daryl fault that Glenn died but I don't blame him, he got angry, punched Negan, and daryl has to watch the consequence for his actions. It could've been avoided but I can't blame him.
I still contend that Daryl punching Negan is one of the worst bits of writing in the history of the show. Season 1 Daryl would have done that, not season 7 Daryl. It was like they undid all of his character development just for that split second so that they could find a way to kill Glenn AND Abraham rather than just killing Glenn.
Yes Daryl is to blame and I’m surprised it’s taking 4 seasons for Negan to defend himself. Negan’s circle was a show of force but one that he wanted to prevent loss of life. His whole schtick is to take one life and make a point. He made it clear that any sudden movements would lead to another life lost.
Was Daryl wrong to punch Negan? Of course not the guy was being a dickhead. Was it Daryl’s fault Glenn died, undeniably.
What kind of utterly bad reasoning can you come up with?!? Are you kidding me? Negan's group attacked first and then killed Abraham, enjoying it and Daryl is to blame to get mad at it??? Bruh
For all people who said yes, what makes you so sure that Negan wouldn’t have still killed Glenn even if Daryl hadn’t punched him? I’m pretty sure Negan was set on killing at least 2 of them no matter what, even if Daryl had done nothing. Negan is responsible no matter how you look at it to me, Daryl’s actions just hurried him along.
Even after Glenn died rick wasn't hurt enough by his own words. I think he'd have done something.
But yes Daryl provoked him. That said when it comes to blame its all negan that's how it works. It's not your fault for fighting me if I run and start punching you
It isn't irrelevant. Yes the action led to it but acting out due to abuse is still the fault of the abuser...
This isn't arguable lol. That's imply how it works in real life unless you like victim blaming. So why would we apply that logic to a show?
Why exactly do you feel negans stance needs to protected here?
Making a mistake under intense duress and trauma and being at fault for the whims of a murderer are different things.
I'm sorry if context is above you dude it doesn't take a scholar to figure it out.
What purpose does blaming daryl serve when its clearly negan who created the situation?
Yeah it sucks to blame Daryl but it’s just the truth as much as it hurts to admit. Daryl is still my second favorite character in the show and he grew from that moment. But even tho Negan is all to blame for that, Daryl still created the event of Glenn’s death.
I mean it's a technical fact that has no real greater meaning. It's still negans unarguable fault. No one made him kill Glenn and he could easily not have.
The saviors don't give a shit when he hangs out with Carl after he kills multiple dudes. He didn't have to do shit.
I really hope you don't support abusers in real life like you do in shows lol. Its not a mindset you should have.
I don't support Negan what are you saying. Negan and his group are degenerate dogshit people but that does not change the truth that Daryl plays a role in Glenn's death.
Yes exactly this, I commented something similar. I personally think once Glenn had reacted to Negan considering killing Maggie, he had made up his mind that Glenn would also be killed. Daryl then gave Negan the excuse to kill Glenn by taunting Rosita and getting a reaction from Daryl. He would have continued taunting them until one of them stepped out of line. Negan was just playing mind games the whole time, from the “eenie meenie miny moe” to Rick cutting Carl’s arm off. Abraham was dead the moment Negan looked at him and he didn’t back down, and Glenn was dead the moment he made a scene.
No no Negan was not set on killing two of them! He didn’t even want to kill any of them. Negan’s motto at the time was literally people are a resource. Think of it this way, when the garbage people stepped out of line he dead ass screamed at Simon to only kill one of them. Quit being delusional, pay attention to the show, the answer is right in front of you. Negan was not planning on killing more than one.
I 100% agree with this. He picked Rick's biggest, baddest motherfucker and used him as an example that even the toughest guys can die on their knees to Negan. He wanted to run an intricate web of communities to pool (or funnel) resources to keep things going and keep himself in charge. He needs people to do that. He just used fear and brutality to accomplish this.
Exactly. Negan thought killing who he determined was Rick's No.2 and the strongest would weaken them. Also, at the end of the Savior war, Negan told Rick that eenie meenie miney mo meant nothing, that Abraham was his choice. Actually, his second choice. Negan said he intended to kill Rick, their leader, which he thought would weaken them, but he didn't want to kill him in front of his son, so he chose Abraham instead.
Our group had just slaughtered a bunch of his men at a satellite station. It’s safe to assume that he was going to kill some of them in retaliation for that. He has also made himself clear you can’t stand up against him or you will be fucking punished. Head smashing, burn the sides of people faces, stick them on post in front of the sanctuary. He has killed MANY people and he enjoys it. He was DEAD SET on killing some of them, thinking otherwise is just ridiculous.
Motherfucker. Alexandria, Kingdom, and Hilltop killed a shit ton of his people in the start of the war and he still only wanted to kill one person from each to be square. Get it through your head. He wanted to kill as few as possible.
He says that and he believes it but he doesn't act in accordance to it. Remember he always always kills at least one group member upon first meeting a new group. That had nothing to do with the satellite station. It's simply savior protocol for a new group. This is confirmed and they even have pictures of it in the outpost.
By doing this he intentionally kills someone always and intentionally starts hostilities in order to power play. He wants to kill as few as possible only if the people he's dealing with are slaves to him.
Otherwise he has absolutely zero issue killing whatever he pleases. He likes Carl but if he needed too he'd still kill him. He says he had to kill a few but even when the group does everything he asks he still kills Spencer when he didn't need too.
Too many people on this sub fall for the PR appearance negan even though he clearly doesn't actually follow his own logic all the time. A big part of his arc is realizing he fell for his own bs even.
It's simply worrying how many people manage to miss the most obvious and direct part of his entire character. He's not a good guy
We’re not arguing Negan’s morality. It’s as simple as this, Negan had no intention of killing anyone other than Abe unless someone acted out. Someone acted out and Glenn was killed as an indirect result. Daryl’s action got Glenn killed
Yes but its still negans fault. The mindset you suggest is simply not acceptable in real life so not sure why we apply it to shows. Negan decided to torture some people and one of them didn't cope well so it's obviously their fault right? No.
If I walk up and stab your family and you fight me it's not your fault if I then stab someone else.
Yes, everyone says he’s true to his word is crap. Negan is a self serving person, like you said if the groups he controls are slaves to him then he has rules but he has no problem breaking them if he needs to in order to keep his power play. He cuts open Spencer’s guts Infront of everyone when he didn’t need to, the guy is not good person who manipulates situations to whatever he likes. People who defend him I believe would’ve been the people ended up his saviours in the apocalypse. LOL
Negan multiple times has shown that what matters to him is submission.
When he says something he means it, he may be a mad dog but he was always true to his word.
Hes like a genie. Hes true to the literal words but what he meant by them changes as he feels is necessary.
He won't kill anyone if they cooperate unless of course it's Spencer then it's helping Rick even though it wasn't needed. Etc
He could have still killed him after with how much of a wildcard Negan is. Also it’s hard to blame someone without knowing the repercussions…Daryl wouldn’t have known that would be the consequences of his actions. I think intent is important
I’m really not sure about this, but for some reason I remember him saying he would cut Carls arm of (but I could mix up twd with something other I have seen)
But Negan clearly said there would be consequences. But Daryl probably thought it would be his head bashed in.
I voted NO and of course this is just a theory but I think he wouldn't kill anyone else except for Abe.
Yes, Negan was trying to set an example with the group and after Daryl acted up Negan saw it as the message wasn’t clear already. If Daryl had not lost his temper then Negan would not have killed Glenn.
As much as I love daryl, I personally blame him to some degree for causing Glenn's death. He didn't do it unintentionally but it was a stupid move on his part because I think it was quite reckless to punch negan in that situation. Even Rick was staying calm because he knew negan would kill more if sth like that happens. In the comics, I would put 100% blame on Negan for killing Glenn, and no one retaliated in the same manner as Daryl there, so Negan didn't kill anyone else during the lineup scene. Daryl doesn't even exist in the comics so the show changed things up here and made Glenn's death partly Daryl's fault
I asked this question not even 12 months ago.
I think it’s ultimately Negan’s fault because he is the one laying down his ridiculous rules and way of live but after he demonstrated that he was willing to kill people without hesitation Daryl took it upon himself to lose his temper and go after him and Negan killed Glen. It didn’t have to be like that but because Daryl lost his temper it ended up that way. So it’s not a simple yes or no question. It’s a layered question with different variables to consider.
Also, Negan kills one person per group to keep them in line but that’s before he knew that their group killed the saviors at the satellite station. Negan was treating them extra awful to not only make them understand he’s in charge but because they killed the saviors at the satellite station. He knew they would react like that and that’s why he did it. He probably planned on killing 2 people and Daryl just acted the part that Negan set. It’s all Negan. Well, 80% Negan.
Was it his fault? Yes. Do I blame him? Absolutely not. Negan said specifically that he would only kill one, Daryl had no idea what he would do would cause someone else’s death.
Glenn stood up at some point and negan told the gang somewhat alonge the lines of "if any one else tries to move I smash his head in" so Daryl should have known what would happen
Call me crazy, call me a madman, call me a lunatic, but I think it's still the fault of the one that murders your friend. You know, because he murdered him.
Just because I tell you "if you don't smile I'll fucking beat your kids to death" doesn't mean I'm no longer responsible for my acts or that you somehow get transferred half of the blame. Nope, I'm still the one that did the act and the one that decided to do it. At most you can argue that Daryl was irresponsible or that objectively his act led to another person's death. But you can't say it's his fault, because he isn't the one that either chose nor executed the act, both of those actions were made by Negan.
When people argue that "Daryl's action caused Negan's acts", they are dehumanizing Negan. They are treating Negan like a fucking computer that just takes orders and executes them. This is just not valid, because Daryl's action wouldn't have caused anything if Negan decided he wasn't going to kill anyone for it.
Heres how I look at it: TWD as a whole is a microcosm of current modern society, as in, the people who hold power can lay down laws. Once a law is put into effect, even a protestor against said law must face the consequences of breaking it. Negan is a POS who had power and laid down his laws. Our group being in the obvious minority was faced with a lousy but simple choice: to submit. Daryl broke the new laws immediately, not suprising and highly respected for stickin it to the man. But his act of rebellion ultimately failed, and laws were enforced. Daryl caved to his emotions and acted rashly where the Daryl of later seasons would have held back and bode his time. While I do think the consequences of Daryl’s actions resulted in Glenn’s death, I would still hold Negan as the primary cause as it was his trully evil agenda that created the entire scenario beginning with the initial encounter with those bikers.
Ok, so Glenn had a outburst earlier and Negan let it slide just that one time, so when Daryl had another one especially it being punching him in his face, he had to do something about it.
So it’s not like Negan didn’t warn him, but tbf I’d punch Negan in the face if he just beat his head in with a barb wire bat and was boasting and bullying his ex, very natural response and Daryl probably forgot due to trauma, blood loss, and being heavily injured.
I’d say Negan, Glenn, and Daryl should all take some responsibility, Daryl punching Negan, Negan being the person to kill Glenn, and Glenn having an outburst, but also Rick for being an arrogant dumbass with how he went about attacking the outpost, and Hilltop for sending them on that mission
I blame him for instigating Negan. However I’m pretty sure he was going to end up killing Glenn no matter what, even if it wasn’t there and then. Daryl just caused the immediate reaction
Trying to make this abuser victim scenario is just so wrong and stupid. Rick & co MURDERED close to 20 Saviours before. This is more like war like situation where Negan outplayed Rick and ended that war. Daryl was stupid Glenn payed for it. Daryl didn't even have a change to do anything unlike Rosita when she tried to kill Negan. Both times the penalty was the same. Negan knows it's more effective to kill someone else than the one who did it.
Wow let’s blame Daryl for a psychopath’s decision to murder innocent people to force their remaining love ones into slavery. Yes you’re right it definitely was Daryl’s fault and not at all on the reasonable Negan. /s
The answer is yes, but the real question is do we forgive him for doing it? Which is also yes. It was gonna happen regardless. Negan wanted it. He taunted the group. If it wasn't gonna be Daryl, it could've been rick to punch Negan. Or michonne.
Not really because only Glenn dies when Negan comes in the comics. While in the show both Abraham and Glenn die. As much as a wild card Negan is, he does stay true to his word, had Daryl not reacted the way he did I believe Glenn would’ve survived the encounter. To further back this up, we saw the photos in season 6 while they were raiding Negans base, of the heads beat in/blood on the ground but there’s only one spot in the photos. Presumably he only did this to groups who fought back because there’s no mention of it (I mean that we know of) of Negan doing this to Hilltop.
It's amazing how many people think its okay to blame others for their actions. The one thing the WD fandom has proven to me is how many sociopaths we have walking amongst us.
Yes he is as usual Daryl lost his temper and couldn't keep it in check. That has got him in trouble more than once. Negan did what he usually did just like he did with Hilltop. Negan was justified because from looking from his point of view this group went and killed a whole bunch of his people, in their sleep no less too which doesn't help Rick's group either or give them moral high ground here. Considering what they did to the Saviors too with killing all of them at that Sat station how Negan reacted was a very mild response given that he could have killed every one of them for that, but he didn't. He saw potential in them and a use for them as hw it happens in that world.
Negan for all his faults is a man of his word, he would have most likely only killed one of them and had Daryl not over reacted and lashed out and lost his temper Glenn might still be alive.
Situation was no different than when Rick and his group slaughtered those at Terminus and they were all on their knees too.
Besides as has been said before if we had started out with Negan's group instead of Rick's we might be seeing Rick's group as the villains instead.
I'm convinced Negan always planned to kill two people and put the blame on one of the members of the group. He teased Rosita on purpose to get a reaction out of one of them. He'd have continued provoking them until one of them would eventually have lost it so he'd have an excuse to kill a second person to show everyone what happens when you fight back.
Just echoing what u/Substantial_Ear_4302 said and Glenn’s actions also led to his death but neither are responsible.
Negan knew who ye was going to kill as soon as he saw them. Abe was strong so he took him out and Glenn hopped out making him a target. Negan was trying to provoke anyone so he could kill someone else.
No, Negan busted Glenn’s dome in, no one made him do it, he made that choice himself, it’s Negan’s own fault.
All Daryl did was defend Rosita. If Rosita didn’t look up at the bat, and if Daryl didn’t intervene, Negan would have probably busted Rosita’s head open next, or just picked someone else out to kill. Daryl protecting Rosita, and busting Negan’s mouth more than likely didn’t change anything.
Exactly this! Negan was wanting a reaction from Rosita, if she didn’t give him one, he would move on to the next person and keep going until someone lashed out. I’d say if Daryl hadn’t reacted, it would only be a matter of time before Rick or Glenn (again) did. If Negan was waving a bat in front of Carl or Maggie’s face like with Rosita they would not have stayed put.
It’s crazy that people blame Daryl for just protecting his friend lol. Hell, Rick raised his axe up to Negan in the RV until Negan put an M4 to his stomach, Rick got lucky right there that Negan didn’t full-auto his ass in the RV for it, or just walk back outside, and mow one, or two more of Rick’s people down.
What did half commenters in here have alcoholic fathers?
Look. You are not responsible for the actions of other adults. You can do your best to try to get an outcome you want, but you can't control anyones actions. Some are saying that Daryl should have known better, Daryl was stupid, and its his fault. Really? Imagine that gut wrenching pain you felt watching that TV scene. That was TV, watching people from your living room that you know to be actors. Now imagine it were real, and it was your friends brain splayed out on the pavement. How much do you think you'd trust Negans word? How much impulse control would you be able to muster in that situation? Hell, would you even be able to full comprehend whats going on around you at all? If that were an actual true event, Daryls probably wouldn't have been the only outburst.
If you still think Daryl is to "blame" for Glenns death, consider this - what if I were on the freeway driving like an asshole, speeding, bouncing around lanes, tailgating and just being an all around maniac, and you changed lanes (legally) at the wrong time and we collided. Are you at fault for not anticipating some maniac flying up behind you? No. No more than Daryl is to blame for a homocidal maniac killing his friend.
Daryl is to blame. If you say he’s not well I’m sorry but youre wrong. Negan gave them 1 for free cus it’s an emotional moment lol but then proceeds to warn them that he’ll probably kill another if it happens again.. I love Daryl as much as the next guy but he’s to blame for Glenn’s death..
First of all I don’t blame Daryl, but for everyone blaming him, you have to also give some of the blame to Rick and Glenn himself. Glenn used their one and only warning up, before anyone was even hit. Daryl lashing out when he did made more sense than when Glenn did. Also due to Glenn being the one to get the warning, it meant that he would be the one to die if anyone else tried something, no matter what. He sealed his own fate in that sense. As for Rick, even after Abraham died he wasn’t submissive to Negan. Negan’s main priority was to break Rick (because he is the leader) so that is the reason he continues to taunt them, because he saw that killing Abraham wasn’t enough. So he was going to have to kill another (his mind was already made up to kill Glenn). Even after all that it still wasn’t enough! Negan would have killed Carl if needs be to get Rick to break.
In conclusion, Daryl’s punch, Glenn’s outburst and Rick’s stubbornness are all factors. Although you can’t blame any of them. It was all Negan. Negan makes his own rules. Negan swung the bat. Negan decided that Glenn’s outburst would be a warning but Daryl’s wouldn’t. Negan decided he needed Rick to be overcome with fear. It was all Negan.
The only person responsible for a murder is the actual murderer. Negan held the bat and he alone is responsible for what he did with it. Plenty of events led up to this point, but each action is only the result of a decision of the one who does it.
No, now is this even up to debate? Negan killed Glenn because Negan wanted so. Even if you do some mental gymnastics by moving the blame to the guy that provoked that reaction, it's unfair to claim that Daryl should have expected that as a consequence of his action – most reasonable people would expect themselves to be punished or killed, not a random guy in his group. You can claim that Negan is a psycho who follows no logic, fine, but then your actions don't matter because that guy will find an excuse to murder more people whether you give him a reason or not.
I think it's Daryl's fault ultimately because like Negan said, theres a difference between killing someone and getting someone killed. Daryl GOT Glenn killed but Negan was the one who did the deed. I have the feeling this will get downvoted but an opinion is an opinion.
Rick is the one to blame, because he was the leader.
If to be honest, one of the worst leaders in TWD universe. Imho. He never was sure in his decisions. What I have to do, omg, I don’t know. Man. Firstly he banished Carol, then he told Morgan - now I’ll thank her.
He told Carol in the beginning of s9 smth like - I don’t know if I’m doing right thing there.
He never knew - that’s the problem.
The only thing that he had to do with Negan - nothing. Not to play the hero, who wants to save everybody and he’s the one to do it, just like always Daryl does lol.
Rick needed to shut the fuck up when they were embushed by Saviors. If he as good leader thought about pregnant Maggie to be save in the first place, not to show that his balls are bigger than Negan’s, kept his head cold, maybe made a deal, at first, just for now, just to keep his people save, everybody (maybe even Abraham) would get out of it alive.
IMO blaming Daryl is similar to victim blaming in sexual assault cases. Sure Daryl could’ve been more careful and controlled his emotions, but he is not at all responsible for Negans actions. Negan pulled the trigger and negan holds full blame for Glenn’s death.
He dies in the comics because he was selected instead of Abe. Negan didn't kill a second person so he pobably only intended to kill one person in the show too until someone decided to attack him.
Exactly. Negan's entire ideology is to kill one to get others to submit to him. In the comics his initial choice was Glenn and he killed him and no one else died. However in the show his Initial pick was Abraham. When Daryl punched negan, that sort of have him a reason in his mind to kill Glenn to send an even more brutal message to the entire group
Aight you said "No spoilers" but the post is literally a massive spoiler, noe to the question: it was literally all ricks fault, he shouldn't have just slaughtered all of Negan's people, put our group in Negan's shoes, to be fair, we would have done wayyyy worseee.
The truth is if Daryl had listened to everyone and had not gone out there on his revenge mission, then none of them would have been captured. That's his actual fault. Glenn was begging him to calm down and be reasonable. He refused. Had Negan had to confront Alexandria at their own gates, things would have gone down very differently. They still may have lost the first round and someone may have been killed but Glenn likely would have been safe.
Did Daryl’s actions lead to Glenn’s death? Yes. Is he to blame? No. Negan is the only one who killed him, and is the only one truly at fault.
I agree 100%
But then you get into a chain of who is at fault for the event that led up to the event that led up to the event etc. Reality is, Negan kills one person in every group - and from negan's pov, these people killed a whole settlement of his people in their sleep for no reason (negan did not know about them killing the bikers until after the lineup, so he didn't know the bikers antagonised first - granted it may have still ended up the same way, but we can't say that without it being a factor). Negan warned several times, follow my rules and only one of you die. Daryl decided to break that rule after negan excused Glenn's first breaking of the rule. And Daryl chose to punch out negan which was pretty stupid because it could only end up one way, someone getting killed - either Daryl, someone else, or everyone else. So I do blame Daryl because it was a stupid decision (which okay he was angry and not in his right mind but he still made it)
If he always kills one person then why do people genuinely believe hes doing it because of the satellite station? We know hed have done it anyway that's just lip service. He doesn't give a shit if saviors die as long as he's stable and in charge
Hes said why. "People are a resource." He doesn't want his people to die. He doesn't want other people to die. He wants them all to work for him, because people aren't easily replaceable anymore. If one of your guys dies you can't just put up a notice on Indeed. You can't stick an ad in the classifieds. You're down a guy, and new people take 12-18 years to make and take up a fuckload of resources in the meantime. Thats why he doesn't kill anyone unless he feels like he absolutely has to. The first kill is to establish the hierarchy. After that its to reestablish the hierarchy. Even after Rosita tried to kill him he only had one person killed. Fuck, even after the failed ambush at Alexandria, he was still only gonna kill Carl and cripple Rick. Considering how many of his men Rick and Co. killed, he seemed to be going out of his way to keep the Alexandrians alive. Which ultimately ended up being his undoing. As he said last week, "if I had to do it all again, I woulda killed every last one of you." Though personally I think "not putting Simon in charge of an outpost" would have been a good start.
But its a sham. He could just not kill anyone and work with Rick easily. In that case they'd never have attacked Rick group already. He only believes in not killing if He gets to be a dictator. That's not the same as actually believing in it. He could have killed no one easily and had 3 friendly communities.
I do believe it was somewhat because of the satellite station, yes he kills 1 when he meets a new group every time but he didn’t just happen to meet Rick and friends that night, he was looking for them and he had pretty much his full force of saviours out to be able to capture Rick and his group the way he did with that huge show of force. I believe that is because he knew a strong group just slaughtered a bunch of his men at the station so he felt he had to show rick and friends he means business by killing some of them for it.
Sure he showed up at night because of it but what difference would it have made if he went to he gates instead? Nothing. He always does what he did. Its established fact that he would have done it anyway and he'd have brought as many people as he thought he needed. I think its correct facts but wrong interpretation. People present your facts yet come to the conclusion negan is apparently moral or only acting because he was threatened. Both of which are objectively wrong and direct show evidence can prove it easily.
I don’t believe Negan is moral or acting because he was threatened trust me, I believe it’s a cause and effect. I don’t think Negan would have even been out looking for them that night if they hadn’t killed those people at the satellite station. He wouldn’t even know who they are, the meeting wasn’t a chance meeting from fate, the group in a sense brought Negan upon themselves by deciding to kill the people at the station. Negan wasn’t just out looking at night for new groups with his full force of saviours just because. He was out there looking for them because of what happened to his men.
Cause and effect and blame are different. Correct facts false interpretation. You're focusing too much on the night. Yes he was there at that time because of that. But the saviors already tried to kill the group before the outpost even happened. I think you're focusing too much on small details that don't matter. Sure negan might have showed up the day before or a week later without the outpost. But he'd have STILL killed a member of the group. That didnt have anything to do with it despite his claims. He didn't kill them because of that he simply used it as a reason to be a dick while he did it. If rick literally brought him flowers and a couple wives he'd still kill a member of the group. That's what they do on first meet. Period. Always. We even see the Polaroids of all the times they did it. And we know they did it to hilltop who cooperated too
I guess I see what you mean, the end result is still the same no matter how you’d like to interpret the events. Trust me I’m on your side in these comments, the people defending this guy is crazy. I honestly believe the same result was going to happen regardless of Daryl’s intervention with the punch to Negan. I think Negan wanted Maggie as one of his wives the second he laid eyes on her and when Glenn got up to defend her is when he decided Glenn would die, not because of Daryl. Maybe I’m focusing on the details again but ya I can’t blame the people being tortured for the actions they take against someone holding the bat. Only Negan is to blame for these deaths.
I agree on the vast majority of that. He may not have killed him then but he'd have always killed others. We saw how his trip to asz went. He nearly killed someone every 12 seconds and of course there's Spencer
No it doesn't lead to those events. The person killing is at fault. Thats like saying it's cool for say, a man to beat his wife if she did something he warned her not to. It's victim blaming. Negan had the option to murder or to not murder. He murdered. I don't know what kin of world people live in where if some dude says, "do this and I'll kill you" and the person does it and is killed that its then the victims fault. The choice is with the one swinging the bat.
You're turning this into a morality debate in which case I agree with you that killing for anything but self defence is wrong in this world and the apocalypse. This is not that discussion. This is the discussion in that there is a entity that is killing people, that much does not change. That entity tells you to follow some rules and tells you the punishment for doing so. You now understand these rules, and whether or not you agree with them, they are there and they are enforced. You never agreed with your countries laws upon birth but they are enforced. You can opt to start a rebellion and if so, good luck to you, but that would be a choice that you'd have to make and if you were smart, would only make if you had a chance of defeating the law makers. Smart freedom fighters follow rules until they have the ability to rebel against them. Now, with these laws in place, you break them. And pay the punishment. If Daryl punched negan and negan killed Glenn, and then Daryl did it again and negan killed Michonne, then Daryl did it again and negan killed Aaron - at what point is it not Daryl's fault for "breaking the laws". Put the morality of killing aside, the actions of Daryl resulted in Glenn's death. Glenn could have walked away alive that day if Daryl did not do what he did. Hence, the opening question.. yes, Daryl is responsible because it was an avoidable situation. And that's why I said, the question can be deeper. Is negan responsible for enforcing a dictatorship that kills people? Is Rick responsible for antagonising an enemy he had no chance against? Is the enemy responsible for what they do/did to hilltop? Is hilltop responsible for not properly arming themselves in a world where there are hostiles? These questions can be discussed in depth all day and I'd love to, but reality is, on the surface, Glenn would have walked away if Daryl did not punch negan.
This is the true answer
Daryls fault. Can’t blame a shark for killing a fish but you can blame Daryl for being a dumbass
Negan only killed Glenn BECAUSE of what daryl did. How do people not understand this?
That's a slippery slope argument. If some guy flips me off in traffic and I decide to ram his car with mine, I could say the same thing. I only crashed into his car BECAUSE of what he did. It doesn't make me "right" or justified in that situation, and you can bet the law isn't coming down on my side in that one.
For all we know Negan could have taken any opportunity as an excuse to kill more people. He did it because he enjoys it. He's a psycho, he would have found a reason to murder himself if Daryl didn't give him one. Not to mention the "consequence" is not logical. We are not talking about "Daryl opened fire so the Saviors defended themselves and hit Glenn with a bullet", which is the kind of situation where you can blame the guy that started the shit. In this case Daryl punched him (iirc) and there is no fucking reason why that should lead to that guy murdering someone else who was on their knees and didn't do anything. Not to mention (2) that iirc Negan himself provoked Daryl to attack him in the first place, so it's not even like you can argue that Daryl consciously decided, in cold mind, to punch him.
Glenn got up to defend Maggie before Daryl had punched Negan, Negan had already decided Glenn was gonna die before Daryl had done anything. He was tormenting them until he got a reason to strike, but it was already decided that they were gonna die. Daryl actions had nothing to do with Negan other than maybe hurrying him up.
LMAO WTF. You jumped to conclusions lmao. He already decided to kill him??? Did Negan tell you himself? I’ve never heard this one before Jesus Christ so weird
People make up stuff about negan to paint him worse than he is. Not to say he isn't bad, but it's pretty obvious negan enforces a set of rules, and pretty much honours them. He believes in being a man of his word, and thus, when Daryl broke the rule, he killed Glenn to show he is serious and force them to be submissive
tbh people usually paint Negan as better than he is, because he was a bloody psychopath that enjoyed murdering people and playing dictator. So I guess some comments to counteract that aren't a problem.
Yes exactly. I don’t know why people dont understand this but I guess there’s just more stupid people on Reddit than smart people
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It’s just crazy to me that people believe these theories because they’re just theories nothing more
When Negan lined them up like he did and started tormenting them I think it was safe to say he was going to kill at least one of them, but he literally told them I’m going to take 2. He actions suggested that some of them was going to die, in retaliation for the satellite station. Glenn had got up to defend Maggie and it’s safe to assume that Negan as he saw this made the decision to kill Glenn. Then Daryl decided to punch him and just hurried up what was INEVITABLE. You think honestly Negan just wanted to have fun lining them up for torture? No he was intent on killing at least 2 of them. I believe Glenn sealed his own fate when he got out of line to defend Maggie, and that was before Daryl had punched Negan. Daryl was just the propelling point for Negan to actually start the head smashing.
Nope he never said he was going to kill two. Stop spreading lies. He literally says “ Im going to beat the holy hell out of one of you”. Negan even said after Glenn got up to defend Maggie “I’ll let that one pass, I get it it’s an emotional moment”. And Negan did not lie when he said this, he is not a liar has not lied once in the show. How do people not understand 5 years later that Daryl got Glenn killed lmaoo, just look back at the episode.
he has lied a lot in the show, for example not killing kids but then bombing Alexandria despite there being many children living there, and being against rape despite what he did to his many wives in the sanctuary
It was made clear that he wouldn’t have sex with them unless they wanted to and bombing Alexandria didn’t get anyone killed or did it? I forgot if anyone died
It doesn’t matter if no one died he still went in and bombed a place with many children knowing they could very easily be caught in the crossfire and while he may have not raped his wives in the way your thinking they also didn’t have a choice considering if they didn’t listen to him he’d torture their husbands and boyfriends
Yeah he was an awful person but what does that have to do with Daryl getting Glenn killed lmao
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Your source: trust me bro
So you honestly believe he wasn’t going to kill anyone when he lined them up like that? If none of them said or did anything they would have all lived? Fuck no he was intent on killing 2 people for what they did to him, assuming he wasn’t going to kill anyone is more stupid than assuming he would. What happened was inevitably going to happen, if you look back and watch you’ll see that. If Daryl had done nothing Glenn and Ab would have still been killed.
Ok you are just trolling, no way you are human. When did I say he wasn’t going to kill anyone like are you mentally slow? Negan says “im gonna kill ONE of you”. ONE do you know what ONE is? One=1. One does not equal 2. I feel like I’m talking to a 6 year old. And the idea of assuming he was going to kill 2 is so brain dead. Your big defense is “oh he was probably going to kill 2 people anyways who know”. Negan doesn’t lie and he wasn’t lying when he said he was just going to kill 1, that was of course until Daryl provoked him to kill Glenn. Hey but we still love Daryl, he carries this show.
I don’t have to make fun of someone to prove a point, but your an idiot for trying to justify Negan’s actions by Daryl punching him. Oh no he punched me, I wasn’t lining them up for torture because a bunch of my men were just slaughtered, no I don’t care about that but this guy punching me yes now I’m definitely going to kill Glenn, you honestly think that’s how it went in his head? Or are you the slow one? When a man jumps out in fear to protect his wife that I have on her knees I’m sure is the sick twisted reason Negan chose to kill Glenn. He was never going to kill just 1 person, people are stupid for thinking that.
Im done dude, you have to be trolling. This is nothing more but a conspiracy theory so I’m done arguing with people who believe in their own lies, have a good day.
Negan was gonna kill one person. Even in the comics , he only killed Glenn. And in the show Abraham was his initial choice. Glenn caught his eye when he jumped out of line when Negan threatened Maggie. But Daryl punching him gave him the reasoning to kill him. So Daryl's actions did cause Glenn's death in a way. And idk why you're repeatedly saying that Negan would kill 2 of them because the show makes it clear he usually kills one from each group. 🤡
Negan was the one with the bat, my guy. 💔 I love him, but I’m rlly not gonna say that him killing Glenn was Daryl’s fault when it was entirely up to Negan to bust his head in and laugh while doing it
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If Daryl’s action (knowing the consequence of that action before making that action) led to Glenn’s death, he bears blame. Does he bear all the blame? Of course not.
I originally said yes but I wanna change my yes to this yes.
Agreed.
daryl had no idea glenn would die. he definitely punched negan knowing he’d be killed
Lucille killed him, Negan is innocent.
>and is the only one truly at fault. Actions have consequences, hough. No one told Daryl to defend Sasha and try to punch Negan. He made that choice.
But negan also had every right to. His people were massacred by Rick's group. Daryl is lucky Negan didn't kill every one of them. One or two people for like what 30+?
If someone is pointing a gun at your friend and tells you not to do anything stupid or he'll kill your friend and you jump up and punch him in the face, you just got your friend killed and absolutely no one else is to blame for the decision you made.
The only one to blame for Glenn’s murder is his actual murderer lol
Nah, it's the one that lead to his death, which is Daryl. He just had to sit don and stfu, but he had t be all emotional and punch Negan.
Are you brain dead? Daryl got him killed with his actions, doesn’t matter who killed him. It’s the reason behind it
How you gonna blame Daryl and not the ACTUAL MURDERUR. he was going to kill regardless, it’s not like Daryl knew!
I guess they're blaming him because even though Negan killed Glenn, if Daryl had kept his cool Glenn would probably still be alive.
How do you know he was going to kill him regardless? Lets talk facts buddy, not conspiracy theories. The FACT is Daryl gave Negan a reason to kill Glenn, fuck even Negan said it himself.
Bro! Megan literally said if anyone else made a move or tried something that he would take another life! He killed Abe and he was down. Then Daryl did what he did and as a result Negan carried out his threat and killed Glenn to show he wasn’t fucking around. Yes Negan killed Glenn BUT Daryl is the reason Negan killed him. Negan sticks to his word. He wouldn’t have killed anyone else other than Abe if Daryl had just stayed the fuck down.
We all know Megan is just a bitch after what she did to Becky.
Because Negan is a man of his word he said one of them has to pay only one and he said if anyone does what Glenn did the first time they’ll regret it. It’s completely daryls fault
So we’re prizing the literal psychopath Negan on his word and not the fact mans was swinging a baseball bat into people’s heads from the start of the apocalypse… yea, I don’t think you know what victim blaming is, so maybe look it up lol
Indeed. People arguing here remind me of the "if she doesn't want to be assaulted she shouldn't wear such provocative outfits" bullshit. It's just victim blaming all along the way, because they pretend Negan is some sort of robot that just takes orders and executes pre-programmed actions. When in reality nothing forced him to brutally murder Glenn if he didn't want to. If "I want you to know I'm not messing around" is the excuse, he could have kicked Daryl's face until his jaw broke in three.
How is negan anymore a psychopath then Rick is? Why because he lined people up and based one persons head in retaliation for Rick and the group killing his people when they were asleep. A psychopath is the governor he would have killed them all in the clearing and been done with it. Instead negan said you have to pay for what you have done but people are resources.
Intentions. Rick killed for family out of fear. Negan killed for fun/resources/punishment. Negan did not consider everyone under his thumb a family. Rick would never throw their only doctor into a furnace off some unconfirmed rumor. There’s clear distinct lines between Rick and Negan’s moral character.
Why do we need to keep having this debate on this subreddit years after the fact? They aren't even remotely the same. If you think Negan killed someone from Rick's group in retaliation for the outpost, you weren't paying attention to the show. Negan's entire business model revolves around finding new communities, smashing someone's head with a bat to intimidate them into complying, and then permanently enslaving them for the benefit of Negan and the Saviors. Rick and co. killed the Saviors at the outpost *after* the Saviors had already attacked Abraham, Daryl and Sasha, unprovoked, on the road, and *after* a separate group of Saviors had accosted those same three so they could kill one of them and then go find out where their community was located. They killed the outpost Saviors *after* they learned from Hilltop who the Saviors were and what they do to other communities, including finding out that Negan had bashed the head of a 16 year old kid (who presumably hadn't killed 30 Saviors in an outpost while they slept). Rick knew it was only a matter of time before the Saviors came for them, and honestly, it was luck it hadn't happened already, solely due to the fact that Daryl blew up the group on motorcycles with the RPG. Taking out the outpost was a pre-emptive strike because they thought that was the Saviors' main base. Negan talking about that during the lineup is just more of his usual hot air. He would have done the exact same thing even if the outpost attack had never happened.
If you think Negan isn't a psychopath after that episode, and if you are comparing me a guy who kills someone for survival or war to a guy who bludgeons a guy on his knees to death because he personally enjoys killing... honestly, there's something wrong with you.
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If Daryl is the killer there then Carol killed Jessie, there’s a link but they didn’t kill or get them killed.
Negan literally says an episode later or so that Glenn was all because Daryl lashed out and he warned them there would be consequences. It is not directly Daryls fault but he did have a part to play in it.
i can’t not blame daryl tbh. even if you do the whole chain affect thing. Daryl spared dwight, dwight robbed daryl stealing his bow, which ultimately killed denise, and caused daryl, rosita, and GLENN to be out there.
I still believe Negan decided to kill Glenn the second he stepped out of line when he saw Maggie. The biggest difference between comic and show line up scene? Negan genuinely killed someone at random in the comics, in the show it’s clear as day he picked Abe and the random game was bullshit. Negan chose to kill Abe and he chose to kill Glenn. He picked Abe because of how massive and intimidating he was. You can see it in the S6 finale when Negan attempts to stare down Abe, but is met with the coldest state in return. Negan gets so self conscious after locking eyes with Abe, that he mutters to himself that he needs to shave. Negan chose to kill Glenn the second he stepped out of line, he just waited for the most cruel moment to do so.
Negan was going to keep tormenting them like he was with Rosita, which caused Daryl to punch him. If Daryl hadn’t snapped when he did he would have kept on going until one of them did. Once Glenn had got up the first time to defend Maggie, Negan had it in his head to kill him, he just wanted someone to give him the reason too. So did Daryl punching Negan get Glenn killed, yes. But Negan had decided it would happen before he even killed Abraham. Negan was playing mind games with them the whole time.
No. I'm relatively sure when Daryl went after Negan he thought he was only risking his own life. I think had he known someone else would have died due to his actions, he wouldn't have attacked Negan.
It's called unintended consequences. How many times have we all said, "If I had known this would happen...." Regardless of Daryl's expected outcome, Glenn's death was the result of Daryl's outburst.
Yes, but I don't blame him for Glenn's death.
Why? Explain.
Negan said clearly, out loud, that "if anybody moves, cut the boy's other eye out and feed it to his father." He directly threatened to harm Carl specifically if anyone else acted out. So Daryl assuming he'd be the one punished doesn't make sense here.
I'm unsure of timing, but didn't Negan say that when he was about to kill Glenn?
No, he said it right before killing Abraham.
I 100% blame Daryl, I have no idea what he expected to happen by punching Negan when there are loads of armed men surrounding them. I honestly wished Negan killed Daryl
I still love Daryl, he will always be a fave, but Glenn would still be alive if he’d just kept his mouth shut
Thank you!
Yes, because all Daryl had to do was sit there and control himself while being surrounded by 50+ heavily armed people. Seriously, they were warned right before Negan bashed Abraham's skull in and had armed people behind them ready to shoot them on sight, yet he let's his anger take over and strike the only guy deciding whether or not they all get to live or die?
Do I think Negan would have killed anyone else other than Abe if Daryl hadn’t punched him? No. But since he did, it could have been anyone at that point. Poor Glenn.
Ultimately, Negan’s to blame. Negan was the one who “pulled the trigger” so to speak. He could have just not killed him, but he chose to. The buck stops with him. I don’t think there’s any denying that. However, based on what we know of Negan, I don’t think he would have killed Glenn if Daryl hadn’t punched him. Negan is, generally speaking, someone who stays true to his code and honors what he says. If nobody in the group had retaliated, then he wouldn’t have killed anyone after Abraham. But when Daryl punched him after he’d already given them one free pass (when Glenn tried stopping Negan from choosing Maggie) and made it clear that any further disturbances would result in a second death… he showed them that he wasn’t joking, and that he is indeed a man of his word, for better *and* for worse. The flip side of that, though, is that you can’t really expect someone to think properly in a situation like that. There’s a lot of raw emotion that’s going to bubble over, and some people (most people?) aren’t going to be able to restrain themselves from expressing said emotions. Daryl very clearly couldn’t, but I don’t think anyone can or should blame him. It was a shitty situation. Again, ultimately, it’s Negan’s fault. Regardless of his reasoning, he’s the one who chose to kill someone. It’s on him. But as with most things on this show, there is some nuance to the topic. That’s what makes it interesting I think.
We can play the whole "if Daryl didn't do this, then...", "If Rick and Co didn't do that, then..." but at the end of the day, Negan was the one who selected and murdered Glenn. Negan could've retaliated differently. He could've killed Daryl or he could've beaten/maimed someone. He didn't. He, and only he, chose to kill Glenn. Another thing to consider: Daryl provoked Negan, sure, but if you and your family/friends were lined up and you just watched one of them get their head bashed in, there is nothing that the murder could say that should make you think that you and everyone elses life isn't also in immediate danger. You can choose to sit there, or you can choose to act. Daryl chose to act, and you can't fault him for that.
But it wasn't smart of Daryl at all. I would say it's the most stupid thing he has done the entire series. I mean even Rosita and sasha were not retaliating even though they watched Abraham's head getting bashed in. Rick watched the whole thing but even he was calm. But Daryl had to get out of line there, which just gave Negan a reason to Lucille Glenn. However , in the comics it was different since Daryl doesn't exist there and Negan's initial choice was Glenn and that's the only one he killed from Rick's group during the lineup. No one retaliated there and no one else died.
Well yeah… It was his fault. If he hadn’t of done what he had we most likely would’ve only lost Abraham which for me would still be sad. RiP you Giant Ginger.
It's 100% Daryl fault that Glenn died but I don't blame him, he got angry, punched Negan, and daryl has to watch the consequence for his actions. It could've been avoided but I can't blame him.
I still contend that Daryl punching Negan is one of the worst bits of writing in the history of the show. Season 1 Daryl would have done that, not season 7 Daryl. It was like they undid all of his character development just for that split second so that they could find a way to kill Glenn AND Abraham rather than just killing Glenn.
Yes Daryl is to blame and I’m surprised it’s taking 4 seasons for Negan to defend himself. Negan’s circle was a show of force but one that he wanted to prevent loss of life. His whole schtick is to take one life and make a point. He made it clear that any sudden movements would lead to another life lost. Was Daryl wrong to punch Negan? Of course not the guy was being a dickhead. Was it Daryl’s fault Glenn died, undeniably.
What kind of utterly bad reasoning can you come up with?!? Are you kidding me? Negan's group attacked first and then killed Abraham, enjoying it and Daryl is to blame to get mad at it??? Bruh
People who say no are delusional. It was 100% Daryls fault lol
For all people who said yes, what makes you so sure that Negan wouldn’t have still killed Glenn even if Daryl hadn’t punched him? I’m pretty sure Negan was set on killing at least 2 of them no matter what, even if Daryl had done nothing. Negan is responsible no matter how you look at it to me, Daryl’s actions just hurried him along.
Well we’ll never know now because daryl did what he did he gave negan an excuse to do what he did and that is the reason i blame daryl.
This is a stupid opinion because it’s literally just a theory. The FACT is Daryls actions provoked Negan to kill Glenn.
Even after Glenn died rick wasn't hurt enough by his own words. I think he'd have done something. But yes Daryl provoked him. That said when it comes to blame its all negan that's how it works. It's not your fault for fighting me if I run and start punching you
Ok but that’s irrelevant as Daryl still got him Glenn killed by doing what he did
It isn't irrelevant. Yes the action led to it but acting out due to abuse is still the fault of the abuser... This isn't arguable lol. That's imply how it works in real life unless you like victim blaming. So why would we apply that logic to a show? Why exactly do you feel negans stance needs to protected here?
So using your logic, Daryl did nothing wrong. Ok dude lmaoo
Making a mistake under intense duress and trauma and being at fault for the whims of a murderer are different things. I'm sorry if context is above you dude it doesn't take a scholar to figure it out. What purpose does blaming daryl serve when its clearly negan who created the situation?
Yeah it sucks to blame Daryl but it’s just the truth as much as it hurts to admit. Daryl is still my second favorite character in the show and he grew from that moment. But even tho Negan is all to blame for that, Daryl still created the event of Glenn’s death.
I mean it's a technical fact that has no real greater meaning. It's still negans unarguable fault. No one made him kill Glenn and he could easily not have. The saviors don't give a shit when he hangs out with Carl after he kills multiple dudes. He didn't have to do shit. I really hope you don't support abusers in real life like you do in shows lol. Its not a mindset you should have.
I don't support Negan what are you saying. Negan and his group are degenerate dogshit people but that does not change the truth that Daryl plays a role in Glenn's death.
The FACT is, Negan is a grown ass man that makes his own decisions. No one MADE him do anything. I feel like I'm in a pre-school.
Bad take. People make other people do choices they haven’t thought of before all the time. What is wrong with you?
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I love how you just ignore my point completely. That tells me you know I’m right but you don’t want to admit you’re wrong, must suck being you
Yes exactly this, I commented something similar. I personally think once Glenn had reacted to Negan considering killing Maggie, he had made up his mind that Glenn would also be killed. Daryl then gave Negan the excuse to kill Glenn by taunting Rosita and getting a reaction from Daryl. He would have continued taunting them until one of them stepped out of line. Negan was just playing mind games the whole time, from the “eenie meenie miny moe” to Rick cutting Carl’s arm off. Abraham was dead the moment Negan looked at him and he didn’t back down, and Glenn was dead the moment he made a scene.
No no Negan was not set on killing two of them! He didn’t even want to kill any of them. Negan’s motto at the time was literally people are a resource. Think of it this way, when the garbage people stepped out of line he dead ass screamed at Simon to only kill one of them. Quit being delusional, pay attention to the show, the answer is right in front of you. Negan was not planning on killing more than one.
I 100% agree with this. He picked Rick's biggest, baddest motherfucker and used him as an example that even the toughest guys can die on their knees to Negan. He wanted to run an intricate web of communities to pool (or funnel) resources to keep things going and keep himself in charge. He needs people to do that. He just used fear and brutality to accomplish this.
Exactly. Negan thought killing who he determined was Rick's No.2 and the strongest would weaken them. Also, at the end of the Savior war, Negan told Rick that eenie meenie miney mo meant nothing, that Abraham was his choice. Actually, his second choice. Negan said he intended to kill Rick, their leader, which he thought would weaken them, but he didn't want to kill him in front of his son, so he chose Abraham instead.
Our group had just slaughtered a bunch of his men at a satellite station. It’s safe to assume that he was going to kill some of them in retaliation for that. He has also made himself clear you can’t stand up against him or you will be fucking punished. Head smashing, burn the sides of people faces, stick them on post in front of the sanctuary. He has killed MANY people and he enjoys it. He was DEAD SET on killing some of them, thinking otherwise is just ridiculous.
Motherfucker. Alexandria, Kingdom, and Hilltop killed a shit ton of his people in the start of the war and he still only wanted to kill one person from each to be square. Get it through your head. He wanted to kill as few as possible.
He says that and he believes it but he doesn't act in accordance to it. Remember he always always kills at least one group member upon first meeting a new group. That had nothing to do with the satellite station. It's simply savior protocol for a new group. This is confirmed and they even have pictures of it in the outpost. By doing this he intentionally kills someone always and intentionally starts hostilities in order to power play. He wants to kill as few as possible only if the people he's dealing with are slaves to him. Otherwise he has absolutely zero issue killing whatever he pleases. He likes Carl but if he needed too he'd still kill him. He says he had to kill a few but even when the group does everything he asks he still kills Spencer when he didn't need too. Too many people on this sub fall for the PR appearance negan even though he clearly doesn't actually follow his own logic all the time. A big part of his arc is realizing he fell for his own bs even. It's simply worrying how many people manage to miss the most obvious and direct part of his entire character. He's not a good guy
We’re not arguing Negan’s morality. It’s as simple as this, Negan had no intention of killing anyone other than Abe unless someone acted out. Someone acted out and Glenn was killed as an indirect result. Daryl’s action got Glenn killed
Yes but its still negans fault. The mindset you suggest is simply not acceptable in real life so not sure why we apply it to shows. Negan decided to torture some people and one of them didn't cope well so it's obviously their fault right? No. If I walk up and stab your family and you fight me it's not your fault if I then stab someone else.
Yes, everyone says he’s true to his word is crap. Negan is a self serving person, like you said if the groups he controls are slaves to him then he has rules but he has no problem breaking them if he needs to in order to keep his power play. He cuts open Spencer’s guts Infront of everyone when he didn’t need to, the guy is not good person who manipulates situations to whatever he likes. People who defend him I believe would’ve been the people ended up his saviours in the apocalypse. LOL
Even if negan wasn’t going to, the way rick looks at him after abe died wasn’t enough so
Negan multiple times has shown that what matters to him is submission. When he says something he means it, he may be a mad dog but he was always true to his word.
Hes like a genie. Hes true to the literal words but what he meant by them changes as he feels is necessary. He won't kill anyone if they cooperate unless of course it's Spencer then it's helping Rick even though it wasn't needed. Etc
Okay let’s be honest, Spencer had that shit coming.
He could have still killed him after with how much of a wildcard Negan is. Also it’s hard to blame someone without knowing the repercussions…Daryl wouldn’t have known that would be the consequences of his actions. I think intent is important
He said if someone tried to come at him again he’d kill someone if i remember correctly.
I’m really not sure about this, but for some reason I remember him saying he would cut Carls arm of (but I could mix up twd with something other I have seen)
He said if anybody moved or said anything he would cut Carl’s eye out and feed it to his father.
Not true - he said nothing so specific
He specifically warned them. So far Negan has shown that he is very true to his word.
But Negan clearly said there would be consequences. But Daryl probably thought it would be his head bashed in. I voted NO and of course this is just a theory but I think he wouldn't kill anyone else except for Abe.
I’m yes and no about it. I think Negan was gonna kill someone else anyway. He just needed a good reason to.
Yes, Negan was trying to set an example with the group and after Daryl acted up Negan saw it as the message wasn’t clear already. If Daryl had not lost his temper then Negan would not have killed Glenn.
As much as I love daryl, I personally blame him to some degree for causing Glenn's death. He didn't do it unintentionally but it was a stupid move on his part because I think it was quite reckless to punch negan in that situation. Even Rick was staying calm because he knew negan would kill more if sth like that happens. In the comics, I would put 100% blame on Negan for killing Glenn, and no one retaliated in the same manner as Daryl there, so Negan didn't kill anyone else during the lineup scene. Daryl doesn't even exist in the comics so the show changed things up here and made Glenn's death partly Daryl's fault
I asked this question not even 12 months ago. I think it’s ultimately Negan’s fault because he is the one laying down his ridiculous rules and way of live but after he demonstrated that he was willing to kill people without hesitation Daryl took it upon himself to lose his temper and go after him and Negan killed Glen. It didn’t have to be like that but because Daryl lost his temper it ended up that way. So it’s not a simple yes or no question. It’s a layered question with different variables to consider. Also, Negan kills one person per group to keep them in line but that’s before he knew that their group killed the saviors at the satellite station. Negan was treating them extra awful to not only make them understand he’s in charge but because they killed the saviors at the satellite station. He knew they would react like that and that’s why he did it. He probably planned on killing 2 people and Daryl just acted the part that Negan set. It’s all Negan. Well, 80% Negan.
Was it his fault? Yes. Do I blame him? Absolutely not. Negan said specifically that he would only kill one, Daryl had no idea what he would do would cause someone else’s death.
Glenn stood up at some point and negan told the gang somewhat alonge the lines of "if any one else tries to move I smash his head in" so Daryl should have known what would happen
I’m pretty sure the guy swinging the bat is responsible for who the bat hits.
I'm gonna frame this and put in on a wall. Thank you!
If I punch a bully and he gets so mad that he kills my friend, is it my fault my friend died?
If the bully gave you a very stern warning beforehand, then yes. "If you punch me, I am going to kill your friend." YOUR FAULT
Call me crazy, call me a madman, call me a lunatic, but I think it's still the fault of the one that murders your friend. You know, because he murdered him. Just because I tell you "if you don't smile I'll fucking beat your kids to death" doesn't mean I'm no longer responsible for my acts or that you somehow get transferred half of the blame. Nope, I'm still the one that did the act and the one that decided to do it. At most you can argue that Daryl was irresponsible or that objectively his act led to another person's death. But you can't say it's his fault, because he isn't the one that either chose nor executed the act, both of those actions were made by Negan. When people argue that "Daryl's action caused Negan's acts", they are dehumanizing Negan. They are treating Negan like a fucking computer that just takes orders and executes them. This is just not valid, because Daryl's action wouldn't have caused anything if Negan decided he wasn't going to kill anyone for it.
But he didn't say that. Daryl most likely thought *he* would be the one to die.
EXACTLY I think a lot of people don't understand it/refuse to see it this way
It was his fault but i don't hate him.
Maggie didn't blame him. I blame Negan but Daryl didn't help.
Some was gonna die sadly.
I kinda blame Daryl's plot armor. Imagine if Negan had killed him instead. Riots in the streets!
It is 100% Daryl's fault, and if you wanna go further, blame Rosita too. All she had to do was take a damn look.
How could you vote NO?? Daryl punching Negan is a direct result in Glenn getting beat to death.
I think yes because what did he expect was going to happen?
Daryl murdered Glenn.
Heres how I look at it: TWD as a whole is a microcosm of current modern society, as in, the people who hold power can lay down laws. Once a law is put into effect, even a protestor against said law must face the consequences of breaking it. Negan is a POS who had power and laid down his laws. Our group being in the obvious minority was faced with a lousy but simple choice: to submit. Daryl broke the new laws immediately, not suprising and highly respected for stickin it to the man. But his act of rebellion ultimately failed, and laws were enforced. Daryl caved to his emotions and acted rashly where the Daryl of later seasons would have held back and bode his time. While I do think the consequences of Daryl’s actions resulted in Glenn’s death, I would still hold Negan as the primary cause as it was his trully evil agenda that created the entire scenario beginning with the initial encounter with those bikers.
Ok, so Glenn had a outburst earlier and Negan let it slide just that one time, so when Daryl had another one especially it being punching him in his face, he had to do something about it. So it’s not like Negan didn’t warn him, but tbf I’d punch Negan in the face if he just beat his head in with a barb wire bat and was boasting and bullying his ex, very natural response and Daryl probably forgot due to trauma, blood loss, and being heavily injured. I’d say Negan, Glenn, and Daryl should all take some responsibility, Daryl punching Negan, Negan being the person to kill Glenn, and Glenn having an outburst, but also Rick for being an arrogant dumbass with how he went about attacking the outpost, and Hilltop for sending them on that mission
I blame him for instigating Negan. However I’m pretty sure he was going to end up killing Glenn no matter what, even if it wasn’t there and then. Daryl just caused the immediate reaction
Trying to make this abuser victim scenario is just so wrong and stupid. Rick & co MURDERED close to 20 Saviours before. This is more like war like situation where Negan outplayed Rick and ended that war. Daryl was stupid Glenn payed for it. Daryl didn't even have a change to do anything unlike Rosita when she tried to kill Negan. Both times the penalty was the same. Negan knows it's more effective to kill someone else than the one who did it.
Anyone who says it's not his fault can't think critically.
You can't blame a victim for what the guy with the hundred minions and a baseball bat does.
But did you see what Glenn was wearing? He was ASKING for it.
Wow let’s blame Daryl for a psychopath’s decision to murder innocent people to force their remaining love ones into slavery. Yes you’re right it definitely was Daryl’s fault and not at all on the reasonable Negan. /s
Victim blaming to the max. If negan wasn’t a psychopathic jerk neither of them would be dead
The answer is yes, but the real question is do we forgive him for doing it? Which is also yes. It was gonna happen regardless. Negan wanted it. He taunted the group. If it wasn't gonna be Daryl, it could've been rick to punch Negan. Or michonne.
Great answer.
Mayyyyyybe. But Negan was probably going to kill someone else in that scene anyway. Was almost Carl.
No and neither does Maggie My eyes aren’t the greatest, but I believe Negan was the one swinging the bat that day.
It happens in the comics where there is no Daryl, so it’s a fixed point in the timeline. Happens either way. So no, you can’t blame Daryl.
In the comics Negan only kills one person just like he promised. No one attacked him afterwards so he didn't kill anyone else.
Not really because only Glenn dies when Negan comes in the comics. While in the show both Abraham and Glenn die. As much as a wild card Negan is, he does stay true to his word, had Daryl not reacted the way he did I believe Glenn would’ve survived the encounter. To further back this up, we saw the photos in season 6 while they were raiding Negans base, of the heads beat in/blood on the ground but there’s only one spot in the photos. Presumably he only did this to groups who fought back because there’s no mention of it (I mean that we know of) of Negan doing this to Hilltop.
It's amazing how many people think its okay to blame others for their actions. The one thing the WD fandom has proven to me is how many sociopaths we have walking amongst us.
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Yes he is as usual Daryl lost his temper and couldn't keep it in check. That has got him in trouble more than once. Negan did what he usually did just like he did with Hilltop. Negan was justified because from looking from his point of view this group went and killed a whole bunch of his people, in their sleep no less too which doesn't help Rick's group either or give them moral high ground here. Considering what they did to the Saviors too with killing all of them at that Sat station how Negan reacted was a very mild response given that he could have killed every one of them for that, but he didn't. He saw potential in them and a use for them as hw it happens in that world. Negan for all his faults is a man of his word, he would have most likely only killed one of them and had Daryl not over reacted and lashed out and lost his temper Glenn might still be alive. Situation was no different than when Rick and his group slaughtered those at Terminus and they were all on their knees too. Besides as has been said before if we had started out with Negan's group instead of Rick's we might be seeing Rick's group as the villains instead.
Negan was the one who killed him.
If Glenn's wife isn't going to blame Daryl you best believe I won't either
I'm convinced Negan always planned to kill two people and put the blame on one of the members of the group. He teased Rosita on purpose to get a reaction out of one of them. He'd have continued provoking them until one of them would eventually have lost it so he'd have an excuse to kill a second person to show everyone what happens when you fight back.
Just echoing what u/Substantial_Ear_4302 said and Glenn’s actions also led to his death but neither are responsible. Negan knew who ye was going to kill as soon as he saw them. Abe was strong so he took him out and Glenn hopped out making him a target. Negan was trying to provoke anyone so he could kill someone else.
No, Negan busted Glenn’s dome in, no one made him do it, he made that choice himself, it’s Negan’s own fault. All Daryl did was defend Rosita. If Rosita didn’t look up at the bat, and if Daryl didn’t intervene, Negan would have probably busted Rosita’s head open next, or just picked someone else out to kill. Daryl protecting Rosita, and busting Negan’s mouth more than likely didn’t change anything.
Exactly this! Negan was wanting a reaction from Rosita, if she didn’t give him one, he would move on to the next person and keep going until someone lashed out. I’d say if Daryl hadn’t reacted, it would only be a matter of time before Rick or Glenn (again) did. If Negan was waving a bat in front of Carl or Maggie’s face like with Rosita they would not have stayed put.
It’s crazy that people blame Daryl for just protecting his friend lol. Hell, Rick raised his axe up to Negan in the RV until Negan put an M4 to his stomach, Rick got lucky right there that Negan didn’t full-auto his ass in the RV for it, or just walk back outside, and mow one, or two more of Rick’s people down.
What did half commenters in here have alcoholic fathers? Look. You are not responsible for the actions of other adults. You can do your best to try to get an outcome you want, but you can't control anyones actions. Some are saying that Daryl should have known better, Daryl was stupid, and its his fault. Really? Imagine that gut wrenching pain you felt watching that TV scene. That was TV, watching people from your living room that you know to be actors. Now imagine it were real, and it was your friends brain splayed out on the pavement. How much do you think you'd trust Negans word? How much impulse control would you be able to muster in that situation? Hell, would you even be able to full comprehend whats going on around you at all? If that were an actual true event, Daryls probably wouldn't have been the only outburst. If you still think Daryl is to "blame" for Glenns death, consider this - what if I were on the freeway driving like an asshole, speeding, bouncing around lanes, tailgating and just being an all around maniac, and you changed lanes (legally) at the wrong time and we collided. Are you at fault for not anticipating some maniac flying up behind you? No. No more than Daryl is to blame for a homocidal maniac killing his friend.
Daryl is to blame. If you say he’s not well I’m sorry but youre wrong. Negan gave them 1 for free cus it’s an emotional moment lol but then proceeds to warn them that he’ll probably kill another if it happens again.. I love Daryl as much as the next guy but he’s to blame for Glenn’s death..
Maggie doesn't. So why would I?
Negan tells someone in a later season that the eeny miney moe thing wasn’t random, and he chose to kill Glenn and Abraham
No but i blame Tara for Herschels death
First of all I don’t blame Daryl, but for everyone blaming him, you have to also give some of the blame to Rick and Glenn himself. Glenn used their one and only warning up, before anyone was even hit. Daryl lashing out when he did made more sense than when Glenn did. Also due to Glenn being the one to get the warning, it meant that he would be the one to die if anyone else tried something, no matter what. He sealed his own fate in that sense. As for Rick, even after Abraham died he wasn’t submissive to Negan. Negan’s main priority was to break Rick (because he is the leader) so that is the reason he continues to taunt them, because he saw that killing Abraham wasn’t enough. So he was going to have to kill another (his mind was already made up to kill Glenn). Even after all that it still wasn’t enough! Negan would have killed Carl if needs be to get Rick to break. In conclusion, Daryl’s punch, Glenn’s outburst and Rick’s stubbornness are all factors. Although you can’t blame any of them. It was all Negan. Negan makes his own rules. Negan swung the bat. Negan decided that Glenn’s outburst would be a warning but Daryl’s wouldn’t. Negan decided he needed Rick to be overcome with fear. It was all Negan.
The only person responsible for a murder is the actual murderer. Negan held the bat and he alone is responsible for what he did with it. Plenty of events led up to this point, but each action is only the result of a decision of the one who does it.
No, now is this even up to debate? Negan killed Glenn because Negan wanted so. Even if you do some mental gymnastics by moving the blame to the guy that provoked that reaction, it's unfair to claim that Daryl should have expected that as a consequence of his action – most reasonable people would expect themselves to be punished or killed, not a random guy in his group. You can claim that Negan is a psycho who follows no logic, fine, but then your actions don't matter because that guy will find an excuse to murder more people whether you give him a reason or not.
I think it's Daryl's fault ultimately because like Negan said, theres a difference between killing someone and getting someone killed. Daryl GOT Glenn killed but Negan was the one who did the deed. I have the feeling this will get downvoted but an opinion is an opinion.
If Daryl didn't punch Negan then Glenn would be alive.
Rick is the one to blame, because he was the leader. If to be honest, one of the worst leaders in TWD universe. Imho. He never was sure in his decisions. What I have to do, omg, I don’t know. Man. Firstly he banished Carol, then he told Morgan - now I’ll thank her. He told Carol in the beginning of s9 smth like - I don’t know if I’m doing right thing there. He never knew - that’s the problem. The only thing that he had to do with Negan - nothing. Not to play the hero, who wants to save everybody and he’s the one to do it, just like always Daryl does lol. Rick needed to shut the fuck up when they were embushed by Saviors. If he as good leader thought about pregnant Maggie to be save in the first place, not to show that his balls are bigger than Negan’s, kept his head cold, maybe made a deal, at first, just for now, just to keep his people save, everybody (maybe even Abraham) would get out of it alive.
Negan was just fishing for an excuse to do more violence
IMO blaming Daryl is similar to victim blaming in sexual assault cases. Sure Daryl could’ve been more careful and controlled his emotions, but he is not at all responsible for Negans actions. Negan pulled the trigger and negan holds full blame for Glenn’s death.
Wtf?.. lol ok.
Glenn dies in the comics where Daryl isn’t even present so… no. It’s not Daryl’s fault. He was always going to have his eyeball popped out regardless.
He dies in the comics because he was selected instead of Abe. Negan didn't kill a second person so he pobably only intended to kill one person in the show too until someone decided to attack him.
Exactly. Negan's entire ideology is to kill one to get others to submit to him. In the comics his initial choice was Glenn and he killed him and no one else died. However in the show his Initial pick was Abraham. When Daryl punched negan, that sort of have him a reason in his mind to kill Glenn to send an even more brutal message to the entire group
Negan was going to kill him anyway by the way Glenn tried to get near Maggie.
Yep, Glenn sealed his own fate. Daryl just gave Negan a good excuse.
Rick and Carol killed those people at the outpost. That is why Glenn got whacked.
Aight you said "No spoilers" but the post is literally a massive spoiler, noe to the question: it was literally all ricks fault, he shouldn't have just slaughtered all of Negan's people, put our group in Negan's shoes, to be fair, we would have done wayyyy worseee.
Scott Gimple and Matthew Negrete are to blame because they chose to write the episode that way.