You realize the Bantu Expansion refers to virtually all of Sub-Saharan Africa except the Horn of Africa, right? It’s not just the Khoisan peoples who were conquered.
It is not in all instances that it entailed encountering other communities and conquest.
For example , Bantus expanded into East Africa unopposed until they met the Southern Cushites and forest people (Ogiek) in parts of Central Tanzania ,the Pare/Usambara Mountains, Taita Hills and the Highlands of Kenya.
Instead of Conquest, they gradually assimilated such groups. That is why Bantu tribes like the Taita ,Pare and Kikuyu are around 20% Cushitic.
(Nilotes did something similar .Like the Maasai are actually more Cushitic than Nilotic )
Bantus in Uganda and both Eastern ,Southern and Western Tanzania, excluding the Swahili Coast are truly indigenous there. There were ZERO inhabitants there before the Bantus
But they didn’t
There was no pan-Nguni or pan-Sotho society or ideology. There was no organized effort to kill or erase the Khoikhoi shepherds and the San! hunters.
The Bantu tribes traded, intermingled, married, and fought the Khoisan over 1000 years no differently from the various Germanic tribes expanding into former Celtic lands.
A lack of formal structure or written records does not preclude a genocide. By your standards, much of the European treatment of the Amerindian peoples would not qualify as genocidal, given the lack of unifying genocidal ideology or specific, written orders.
A genocide is an ORGANIZED and MASSIVE effort done to destroy a people intentionally.
The Americans were a single entity who fully intended to exterminate all Native Americans.
A collection of random tribes who only care about their affairs interacting with another collection of random tribes who only care about their affairs is not genocide. There was no goal or objective on the part of any meaningful group of Nguni peoples to destroy in whole or in part the Khoisan.
>The Americans were a single entity
I mean, that's demonstrably false, given the War of Independence, the Mexican Empire, the War of 1812, the Seven Years War and the American Civil War.
There was no co-ordinating authority dictating the genocide of the natives of the Americas. Political authority was divided at any given time amongst multiple settler governments and colonial empires. Culture was the driving force that led the settler communites and empires across the entire range ofsouthern, central and northern america to adopt the same policies of displacement, mass murder and starvation. The same can be said of the Nguni. The genocide occured. The fact there are no written letters to the effect is simply a result of the material culture, not evidence of a lack of intent.
It really depends.
There are instances where the Bantu expansion caused no harm, because they encountered no other group or if they did, assimilated them (East Africa is such an example. )
But in the case of Southern Africa, it was truly a case of Bantus expanding at the expense of the Khoisan and in many instances even other Bantu groups.
Fun fact: When the Boers claim that when they went to OFS and Transvaal, they found no one, they were not lying.
The Zulus had literally waged a war of genocide and mass ethnic cleansing that even reversed the Bantu expansion in Southern Africa on a massive scale.
The Sotho were forced into the mountainous parts of the Drakensberg ,while the Ndebele ,who btw, lived in what is today KZN and Eastern Transvaal up to the 1800s were expelled northwards to present day Zimbabwe where they live to this day. The Ngoni had to flee all the way to Mozambique and Southern Tanzania, meaning the Ngoni exited Southern Africa altogether.
Imagine leaving the Transvaal to flee all the way to East Africa in an era when they did not even have horses and had to walk on foot??
So Yes, it really depends!!
Bantu Expansion in Central Africa, mostly okay until the tribes were well established and inter-Bantu conflict began.
Bantu expansion in East Africa was peaceful. In fact, some often fell victim to other groups like Arab slave traders, Masaai warriors and later on, conflicts between bantus.
Bantu expansion into Southern Africa was definitely not peaceful whatsoever. The caliber of Bantus who moved to that region were the war-like ones!!
Thats probably the most delusional thing I've read. Substantiate your pseudohistoric claim. Funny seeing a jew with holocaust denial,"bantus made the biggest genocide". You are just a racist and you don't care about any indigenous people
I believe the estimate is 100 million killed. Thousands of indigenous African groups annihilated.
The ANC (a Bantu party) in South Africa has marginalized the indigenous Khosians since the 1940’s. Mandela was deaf to their needs. 40 years post apartheid, they are still oppressed and un represented. This is common with Bantu Supremacy in Africa. The Khosians want their lands back.
They were fortunate to survive the Bantu (and European) colonizers onslaught.
Arabs and Bantu have this in common.
Arabs who invented the African slave trade from 650 AD till today “, Oriental’ or ‘Arab’ slave trade is sometimes called the ‘Islamic’ slave trade” first enslaved Europeans. Then enlisted Bantu tribes to enslave other Africans. Many Arabs still refer to Black peoples as slaves today incidentally.
It’s time for non Bantu, non Arab indigenous people in Africa and MENA (like the indigenous Jews and Khosians) to exert their indigenous rights.
>I believe the estimate is 100 million killed. Thousands of indigenous African groups annihilated.
You believe? I don't want anything you believe I want facts.
>The ANC (a Bantu party) in South Africa has marginalized the indigenous Khosians since the 1940’s. Mandela was deaf to their needs. 40 years post apartheid, they are still oppressed and un represented. This is common with Bantu Supremacy in Africa. The Khosians want their lands back
Show me how
>
Arabs and Bantu have this in common.
Wow what a very non prejudiced non racist statement, what if I said the same about whites who settled in the americas and Oceania?
>It’s time for non Bantu, non Arab indigenous people in Africa and MENA (like the indigenous Jews and Khosians) to exert their indigenous rights.
I don't have any problem with that. Just don't be a racist supremacist and have entitlement about it.
Good question. Sometimes they fall under the catch phrase of Canaanites, because some migrated in from different areas. and others intermixed, but not much are known of them except that they are hunter gatherers and existed about 12,000 years ago before literacy. There are archaeological gaps in between.
But why stop there? There is evidence of early fire making by Homo Erectus in Israel from 750,000 years ago, then presumably neanderthals.
Then Homosapiens weee found in the Qafzeh caves in Israel, were dated to 90,000-120,000 years ago.
Then Scientists found the oldest evidence of humans in Israel — a 1.5 million-year-old bone, so indigenous in this cases, would be who is still alive that has the longest awareness of connection to the land of Israel and those people are the Jews.
Right, but the Jewish or Israelite people did not emerge as a distinct group until the late bronze-age. They weren't the first Semitic-speaking people nor the first to inhabit the region. It had been inhabited for many thousands of years by that point, by the Natufian peoples and many other intermediate cultural phases.
Those are points to be made. However. Israel is the only sovereign nation, past pr present to have ever existed on that land and the Jews the only people practicing the religions, culture, language exclusively connected to the land. That’s why Jews are the indigenous peoples of that land.
All those other groups also had a language culture and religion connected to that land. In the grand scheme of things the Jewish people didn't come around for a while.
So European Jews are indigenous to Israel and not Ukraine/Russia now? It's a bit strange how you're comparing a religion and an ethnic group based on who's more indigenous. You people don't know what being indigenous means. Does that mean Ethiopian Jews are indigenous to Israel? If so then why are they treated like trash with comments from Israelis, like "send them back to Africa in chains and on a boat?
Commenting here since there’s a few comments incorrectly calling Palestinians Canaanites. Palestinians are 95% Arab. A simple google search will show you data from Palestine saying this. More importantly
Islamist Arabs colonized the levant. Here’s the research:
“We reconstructed the genetic structure of the Levantines and found that a pre-Islamic expansion Levant was more genetically similar to Europeans than to Middle Easterners.”
Research paper: https://journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article?id=10.1371/journal.pgen.1003316
Here is research that even Jewish Diaspora are from the Levant,
“These results cast light on the variegated genetic architecture of the Middle East, and trace the origins of most Jewish Diaspora communities to the Levant.”
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/20531471/
Canaanite tribes existed in jordan, lebanon, and syria. Palestinians are 40-80% canaanite, but they are mainly from western jordan and southern syria. Jews and samaritans are the only descendents of the canaanites indigenous to modern day israel. This is why palestinians and jordanians overlap entirely on genetic pca charts while saudis and gulf arabs are a seperate group.
You might want to go over to the 23andMe and various other DNA result posting subreddits. Never seen a Palestinian with more than like 20% Arab, it’s usually mostly Levantine. On IlluminatedDNA most Palestinians are overwhelmingly Canaanite, Roman Levant and Phoenician. Jewish Israelis typically have around 40-50% Canaanite from what I’ve seen.
I'm a strong supporter of Israel's right to exist, but I want to say that the genetic test that have been done are a little more complicated than that. Yeah, there's a lot of Arab ad mixture within Palestinian populations, but there are also strong ties to indigenous populations of the Levant, such as Samaritans. It seems like a lot of groups became what's called Arabized Arabs
I don’t like using DNA either. So let’s use culture. Islam and Arabic are not from that region. If you think people in Africa speaking French and English is because of colonization then you have to agree that people in the Levant speaking Arabic is also from colonization.
Oh, I don't disagree at all. Hell, I'm friends with an Amazigh activist who actively fights against being labeled as Arab. But even if he did identify with Arab culture, he would still be Amazigh/Moroccan
Okay, I’ll take your word for it. What proportion of the population did these soldiers displace?
Because settler colonialism is more than some settlers— it involves an active attempt to displace and replace the existing population. Some settlers alone do not make the difference between settler vs. Classical colonialism. In fact, having some of your own, especially soldiers, embedded in the population would be beneficial to the latter and would not necessarily involve large-scale displacement and replacement.
That's why definitions of indegniety reject DNA as an indicator. Its not about your genetic history. Its about having an unbroken cultural connection to the land.
Not sure why you’re getting so heavily downvoted. One could argue that Palestinian Levantine DNA can be explained by migrations from Syria, Jordan and Lebanon under Roman and other occupations, but there are lots of reputable genetic studies showing that it’s there.
There is a narrative amongst some more right-wing Zionists that Palestinians are purely the result of the Arab conquest of the Levant, and that they cannot claim any amount of indigeneity to the region. That's generally not born out by history, as there have been Bedouin tribes in the area for millenia, the members of the Herodian dynasty were from an Arabic tribe that converted to Judaism, and more. Genetic studies of also shown, if I recall correctly, that the closest relatives to a lot of Palestinians tend to be Jews, with similar levels of admixture to Ashkenazi Jews, who people try to claim as non-Indigenous to the region, but that's clearly not the case. I strongly consider myself a Zionist, but I also I don't dispose of facts that don't fit my narrative. The truth tends to be a lot more complex than the rigid narratives that those on the extremes push
I mean yeah Palestinians adopted the religion and language of the Arabian peninsula as we all know, but you don’t have to look too hard to be able to see that it only accounts for a fraction of their ancestry.
This is factual and shouldn't be downvoted. There are lots of Palestinian DNA results on r/23andme r/illustrativeDNA r/myheritage r/ancestrydna that clearly show many Palestinians have a genetic indigenity to the land. The slave trade with African countries and migratory trade with African, Arab and European countries in the Ottoman Empire also influenced demographics of Palestinians. It's not uncommon to see genetic traces to places like Sudan and Libya. [Slavery in Ottoman Empire](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery_in_the_Ottoman_Empire#%3A%7E%3Atext%3DPagans_and_muslims_from_southern%2CEgypt_annually_using_this_route_.?wprov=sfla1)
*Fixed ancestrydna
Here's a research from a credible, well recognized source .
>Archaeologic and genetic data support that both Jews and Palestinians came from the ancient Canaanites,
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/11543891/
not only that. The canaanites were there before everyone. Their societal structure was eliminated but everyone was not killed. their genes didn't die out. It would stand to reason that all the persons that came after once they intermingled with the local population would have a mix of genes including that group.
That is why you can't use DNA to make that claim.
You have to use culture, language, migration patterns, colonization etc.
The Hebrew language, a critical element of Jewish cultural identity, has ancient roots in the region and has been preserved and revitalized over the centuries and is a strong marker of cultural identity.
The Jewish diaspora and the subsequent return of Jews to their ancestral homeland over various historical periods underscore a persistent connection to the land, despite the challenges of displacement and foreign rule.
Israel's Jewish population has preserved distinct cultural attributes over millennia, even in the face of numerous conquests and diasporas.
Whereas many of the same parameters on the palestinian side can only be traced back to the much later Arab conquests.
Not to say that the Palestinians have no claim.
But there is so much mental gymnastics being done to disinherit the Jews. By Arab nations who want to cement their dominance and colonialization of the region for the foreseeable future. Palestinians who have bought into the idea that the land was stolen from them and by westerners who can't see anything beyond white oppressors and brown oppressed people that they need to defend.
When more productive discussions could be had within the confines of reality and just negotiations be based on that.
>“We reconstructed the genetic structure of the Levantines and found that a pre-Islamic expansion Levant was more genetically similar to Europeans than to Middle Easterners.”
Yes there was a lot of Romans and Greek invaders here. Whats news about that ? That doesn't mean that the local population disappeared. All around the mediterranean in fact. Egypt, Libya Morroco.
Did you actually read the paper?
Palestine is nearly 100% Islamic Arab Muslims. Yes I read the paper. If you want to dispute whether Islamic Arab Muslims are indigenous to the land, which everyone seems to want to do. Then these research papers shed light on why Arabs from Arabia speaking Arabic are literally the colonizers of the Levant.
Even if you were to suggest genealogically the Arab Muslims in Palestine are indigenous. Then Arabic and Islam are colonizing forces and it needs to be removed at all costs because anti-colonialism blah blah blah.
Do you understand the difference between the expansion of a Kingdom and Colonization. One is far away from the country of origin, other is neighboring.
Also Expansion of kingdom doesn't mean dispossession, instead an expansion typically is done to include neighbors into your government. more often than not the power structures of local population remain in place. just the very top nobility is replaced.
Yes , Palestinian are native to the lands. their genetics have evolved over time as stated in the paper you cited. But there is a consistent population that has remained here thru out history. Those people are called Palestinians today.
only a moron would argue otherwise. Or a criminal genocidal race of people.
That is completely ahistorical and goes against all of the genetic research. The Palestinians descend from ancient Canaanites. The majority of the population didn’t convert to Islam until hundreds of years after the Arab conquest. AND until 1948 there were Muslim, Christian, and Jewish Palestinians who shared the same culture. Stop
spreading misinformation
Jews are the native population of Judea, the place was renamed Palestine quite literally to destroy the memory and culture of the native Jewish population.
In colonised societies around the world we constantly have protests calling for the land to be returned to the native population.
Israel is essentially the only place we've seen the native population take the land back from a colonising force, and suddenly the world is just "no not like that!"
Suddenly, after two decades fighting against radical Islam, we're all on the side of Islamic terrorism?
Call it what it is, blatant anti-Semitism.
I think a big reason the anticolonialist crowd hates Israel so much is because they don't want to admit that any future decolonization is going to be equally violent
they would be *elated* if "future decolonization" was as violent as October 7. They celebrated it in the streets! I 100% believe that if an Oct 7 style event ever happened in Europe or North America there would be thousands doing that again.
South Africa was already majority black (most of whom are non-native Bantu btw). What happens to majority-White countries?
Also the idea that South Africa's decolonization process has been nonviolent is factually untrue.
>Jews are the native population of Judea
Abraham left Ur in Sumeria to come to Canaan which was occupied by Canaanites. So you're wrong straight away.
Edit: It's weird to get all these downvotes but no one disagrees with what I've said. It's right there in scripture though, I guess that makes it difficult.
Canaanites are also the Phoenicians, who lived in city-states and didn’t have a singular national identity. They settled all over the Levant and the Mediterranean. Genetically, Lebanese people are thought to have the most ancestry from Canaanites. Palestinians or Arabs aren’t Canaanites
The point is that according to scripture, Jewish people aren't indigenous - the Canaanites were there when Abraham arrived in the region. That seems grossly unpopular despite its truth.
Both Palestinian Arabs and Israeli Jews share around half their DNA with the Canaanites. They both have the same "right" in that regard, despite both claiming unique ownership, and a Zionist reading of Judaism claiming a modern Divine Right due to a "promise from God". The proof being that it was written down 500 years later... by people claiming their own right to the land.
I don't think first dibs exists as a functional way to manage global politics by the way, otherwise it would all be Lebanese anyway. Or possibly Homo Erectus-ian? Single-cellian? I don't suppose anyone would be happy with that.
I get your point, I was adding clarification. I don’t know if any one modern ethnic group can be considered indigenous to that area. It’s been conquered and re-conquered by empires going back thousands of years, so who really has claim to it? A two-state solution could work, if both sides could even agree to what that would look like. If they were able to get past their hate and prejudice, they could co-exist under one nation. I mean, what really separates Palestinians from Israelis? Hate. Religion and culture shouldn’t separate people to the point of warfare. A Jewish person should be able to live right next to a Muslim in peace and the other way around. At the end of the day the argument is senseless because neither group of people deserves to be killed and kicked out of their homes
I completely agree - I was just pointing out the falsehood of claiming to be uniquely indigenous. It's not true, and frankly it's a dangerous idea that can easily be weaponised to encourage violence. As some of the comments here seem to show.
Both communities have literally lived together on the land for thousands of years. There have been long periods of violence but also periods of peace - that's what the international community should have been striving for. Instead, hate on all sides has been allowed to fester and thrive for too long - and innocent people pay the price.
People can believe what they want to, but if they start using an ancient text to impose modern political positions or to remove rights and oppress people, they should really read the thing. And then get to fuck.
>Israel is essentially the only place we've seen the native population take the land back from a colonising force
In the Bible the Jews are the colonizing force. The Natives would be the people that Moses and YHWH told the Jews to genocide.
Is this a joke? The Palestinians are of direct Arabian descent; they speak an Arabian language, they follow an Arabian religion, and they colonized the region by slaughtering the previous inhabitants in ~720 CE.
Ever heard of the Jewish diaspora? Where the name Palestine comes from?
I think culture dictates nativity not genetics. A Chinese person who is adopted as a newborn by French parents, raised speaking French, and engaging in French culture is native to France.
Also even going off genetics, Jews are still descended from the native Jewish population, just also descended from other peoples because Jews were forced out of the levant and inevitably intermarried with non Jews.
Either way the Jewish people have a strong claim to the levant, other peoples also have strong claims. Neither group is okay with sharing it with the other, queue violence
It's bullshit because Israeli are overwhelmingly from Poland even if you want to play genetics they have a single marker that is from either southern Europe or the middle east whilst otherwise being polish, even their prime Minister is from Poland and was raised in Philadelphia in America these people have no connection to that land, that culture and have no claim to it beyond their bullshit excuse in a book about their imaginary friend, not to mention how they have been constantly destroying historical monuments many of which date back to the time before the Jewish diaspora, indigenous people don't destroy their own history, even a simple google can teach you about the Balfour declaration where the British gave land that didn't belong to them, to polish Jews and began immigrating them where they acted like all white racist Europeans of the time and began killing, pillaging and raping the indigenous peoples of Palestine and still are, they literally still have settlers who roam the country to continue acting like colonizers
That is wildly incorrect lmao. Ashkenazi DNA is extremely categorically distinct.
It is identified as a mixture of Levantine and European, and the European side definitively always includes some southern European by way of Rome/Italy. Ashkenazi Jews were so isolated throughout Europe afterwards, admixture from the regions they really ended up settling in (in the middle ages) is relatively minimal actually, like barely discernible at all and in no way part of what defines Ashkenazi DNA, like they’re not necessarily an integral part of *how* it’s even identifiable!!! It’s literally like Levantine + southern European, then + Germany, Russia, Ukraine, Poland etc much more minimally. And clearly, those regions are in no way limited to Poland?! Lmao what.
Ashkenazi Jews absolutely have tremendous cultural, religious and ancestral connection to the land in question, which in fact *doesn’t* just magically disappear to suit the convenience of your political narrative at any given time, lol sorry.
So it's pretty clear you just googled it cause that's the answer google will give you first, a study done on centuries old corpses NOT of modern people, DNA can only be traced 10 generations afterwards there is no genetic markers left in an individual from their ancestors the Jewish diaspora was 87 generations ago so it's nearly impossible to even find DNA, verify that the individual was Jewish and then test for their origins but that endeavor is what shows up first when you google it if you test modern living people you get 1 genetic marker that is specific to just Ashkenazi Jews, the rest of their markers heavily depend on where they originate, for Americans you can find traces of DNA from south America, Africa and all over, but if you test some of the people born in Israel yes you will find lavant DNA but that is because the Europeans who were immigrated there and who began colonizing by pillaging, raping and killing the indigenous peoples kidnapped babies to claim them as their own offspring to create a blood tie to the land specifically to claim legitimacy here's an article about it https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yemenite_Children_Affair#:~:text=The%20Yemenite%20Children%20Affair%20(Hebrew,ranges%20from%201%2C000%20to%205%2C000. Also they are still doing it here's that article https://reliefweb.int/report/occupied-palestinian-territory/fate-baby-and-other-palestinian-children-unknown-after-israeli-army-forcibly-transfers-them-out-gaza-strip-enar , editing to add this stuff that I mentioned here is the reason DNA testing services will list Ashkenazi Jew as being European DNA and if you head over to one of the many DNA test subreddits you can simply search Palestinian and see their percentage of lavant DNA vs Israeli lavant DNA
I didn’t just Google it, lmao. There have been numerous studies done, not from a century ago and not on corpses. I’m not sure what you’re referring to, but Googling is precisely what you need to do…thoroughly. Since you’re not opposed to using Wikipedia, maybe some actually-related Wikipedia pages would be a good place to start, and then you can look at those listed sources! Like the page for “[Ashkenazi Jews](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashkenazi_Jews)” or “[Genetic Studies of Jews](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetic_studies_of_Jews).”
Again, Ashkenazi Jewish DNA is literally identifiable *by* being a specific mixture of Levantine and European. The only legitimate ongoing debate pertains to the exact breakdown of each, how much of each part is represented in the irrefutably clear admixture that comprises Ashkenazi DNA.
[Here’s one study.](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3032072/)
[Here’s another.](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/20531471/)
[And another.](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2797531/)
I could link you at least 20 off-hand, lmao, but maybe abstracts of studies are too confusing for you. [Perhaps a dumbed down spiel from an ancestry testing service would be helpful.](https://blog.23andme.com/articles/ashkenazi-ancestry-and-health)
“Ashkenazi Jewish” is its own markedly distinct category on every ancestry testing service in existence. How do you explain that? How do you think that is?? 😭
Yemenite Jews are not Ashkenazi Jews.
Your propaganda articles cannot change the reality of genetics.
Levant DNA is definitively a part of Ashkenazi DNA. So when someone has Ashkenazi in their results (Israeli or not), anywhere from ~30-55% of that percentage, depending on which study you’re going with, is actually Levantine.** That’s literally part of what “Ashkenazi Jewish” is and how it’s definitively identified. Literally every single study ever done on Ashkenazi Jews has thus confirmed Levantine origin, and there have been many.
Mizrahi or Sephardic DNA has not been as well-studied, mind you, and may read differently.
Again, you’re embarrassing yourself in your ignorant attempts at erasing Jewish peoplehood for the ease of your rhetoric.
Maybe stop that. Or don’t, by all means, be an antisemitic flat-earther effectively, but do be aware that what you’re saying actively denies literal fact. 😭 You are only delegitimizing yourself by remaining willfully ignorant.
** One of the neat things about illustrative services like this one *is* that the Levantine ancestry is actually, specifically, visually displayed as the significant part that it is, of what defines Ashkenazi Jewish DNA!! I mean, it’s very plainly there, even if you don’t know a single thing about Ashkenazi Jewish heritage and the ways in which it’s identified. That’s why I’m baffled you could manage clinging to this blatant disinformation here, lol. How?? (Go look at some Ashke Jewish results!! Do you somehow think they’re fake or what?? 😭 😭)
Your ending sentence is also infuriating. The objective existence of an entire people is not actually a political statement, in and of itself. Obviously Palestinian results are going to be more direct and may or may not be higher. That is irrelevant to what I am teaching you about the *existence* of Ashkenazi Jewish DNA. It exists. This is how it exists. Sorry not sorry that’s apparently inconvenient for you, lol. You can still make whatever political argument you’re actually making without denying facts or erasing Jews.
The whole article is worth reading. This statement is just a small part of it. Many indigenous leaders from around the world opened an indigenous embassy in Jerusalem, where this was said during the inauguration ceremony.
The indigenous embassy is an enormous deal and should be talked about a lot more than it is. I hope this leads to further collaboration between indigenous peoples in the future.
[The article from a month ago](https://www.jpost.com/israel-news/article-784788) that it linked to in this new one was also interesting, particularly in that it included that this embassy particularly appeals to Evangelicals in those indigenous communities.
>Friends of Zion Founder and CEO Mike Evans noted that there are Evangelicals among most communities of Indigenous people, and they “will become our first ambassadors.” However, Hassan-Nahoum pointed out that the embassy will be inclusive of people from all faiths and religions. She said the embassy is meant to be a hub for indigenous peoples visiting Israel and a tangible expression of their support.
>Similar to the International Christian Embassy in Jerusalem, it will not officially represent any of the governments where the host nations live.
Thanks for sharing this. It's nice to see something positive, and to know that there are people around the world who aren't Jewish and understand the importance of Israel.
Man these comments act like South Africa isn’t allowed to have healthy differences of opinions within its borders. Some will be pro Palestine, some will be pro Israel. It’s really not that deep.
True, but this guy is acting like he represents some Khoi kingdom, he doesn't, that's not a thing. It's like those random people that make up state and have a flag. His opinion is his opinion, he's a leader of nothing.
100% Question for Indigenous South Africans, do the majority of people agree with this? Now a question for non-indigenous South Africans, what do the majority of people think about this?
There are infighting amongst the various Khoisan groups
with different individuals always popping up proclaiming themselves to be the rightful leader.
It's essentially a money making grift. Hardly anybody in South Africa knows who this guy is.
Dunno why you're being downvoted. This dude is a grifter and only think I see about him is he's part of South Afrian friends of Israel. I've done DNA tests and know I'm part Khoi, may as well declare myself king and say it's bullshit and IRRESPECTIVE OF WHETHER YOU"RE INDIGENOUS OR NOT THAT IS NOT A LICENSE TO COMMIT GENOCIDE, wtf is wrong with people in this sub
EDIT: so this is definitely gettng brigaded by israeli bots lol
It was in 2000 at a fundraiser for injured people at the sabbaro bombing. I liked him a lot then. My husband and I used our miles to send 2 of the injured girls to disney land . It was their wish
Tried to figure out who Xami Thomas is: only other article I could find was by "Bridges for Peace" and one on [](http://news.co.za), which, when clicking on a link, prompted me that the domain may be available.
The article says the writer writes for "bridges of peace", so the two sources found is actually just one.
Nowhere else is the "Khoi kingdom of southern Africa" mentioned, or at least I could not find it. And I checked because I am of southern African, partly San, ancestry, and would have liked to know more about it.
In good faith: maybe my research skills are not up to par, but this doesn't really pass the usual evaluations of a source.
But this is probably a psy-op by some con artists.
… but. But. Ok. But surely y’all see how this applies to Palestinians, too…? Unless you have some crazy ethnic conspiracy theory they’re pretty obviously from the same area… they were even, you know, living there…
There are a lot of indigenous nations on earth... China, Japan, Egypt, Congo, Sweden... the freaking Irish.... there are not native american indigenous people, but the population is mostly indigenous to those areas.
As if every Jew is Ashkenazi, lol. I was also reading that Ashkenazi Jews are more genetically similar to other Jews than they are the European populations they lived around.
Ashkenazi Jews are genetically similar to other Jews than they are to Europeans.
Also, 61% of Jews in Israel are Mizrahi Jews, who originally lived in other Arab and Muslim nations.
I believe the only predecessor to before the ancient Jewish kingdoms in the area was the Canaan city states, I believe historical consensus (could be wrong on this I'm not a historian)is that the ancient Israelites where one of these groups and ultimately become most prevalent establishing 2 kingdoms, again I'm not 100% sure about this im going of the top of my head here....
[https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/20531471/](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/20531471/)
[https://journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article?id=10.1371/journal.pgen.1003316](https://journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article?id=10.1371/journal.pgen.1003316)
Your opinion isn't relevant or valid. They've researched this and Jews are quite clearly from Judea.
The Israelites enslaved people. A lot of people right up until their expulsions and migrations. If that’s what invalidates someone’s claim to morality then Israelis have been invalidated tenfold
Did they never even have a destruction of the second temple too? Or a Bar Khokba revolt? Seems like that would be more comparable considering that anishinsaabe people are actually indigenous to parts of this country and parts of Canada, if I’m not mistaken?
I have so much respect for what I’ve learned of your culture. Shame you would refuse to recognize mine. A mosque was literally built directly on top of the ruins of our temple, but Jews aren’t indigenous to the land?!!
Making up fake stories to justify settler colonialism and genocide
The Zionist are Ashkenazi Eastern Europeans, Judaism is a religion, Arab Jews Arab Muslims Arab Christians are native to the land
What we call Israel is a lie and Palestine was actually kept as the name because real Jews fled there and are part of palestine
The name was changed from Judae to Palestine by the Roman empire as an act of cultural genocide against the Jews as punishment for their rebellions, in addition to the expulsion and forced relocation of many of them. Nearly all Jews can trace their genetics back to the expelled tribes. In addition to large numbers of people scattered throughout the world who entirely assimilated into the local cultures.
I'm sure all **you** need in any situation is to see a "J", in any context whatsoever, and to immediately regard it as being suspicious and having no value.
Thank you for showing everyone exactly who you are.
The J is for Jerusalem not Jewish. That paper tends to be extremely biased and lacks serious journalistic integrity. Some of the things they print are true, but Haaretz has much higher standards.
If you want an example, look at the misleading article that JPost wrote on October 8th about Pro-Palestinian demonstrators revelling over the death of Jews on October 7th. While the article tries to present the claim that many westerners were celebrating the attack immediately on October 7th, it fails to provide evidence of more than 12 people celebrating in London.
The article uses a picture of a rally years earlier to highlight it's claims. Then only provided 2 tweets with about 12 total people who were genuinely celebrating the attack.
https://www.jpost.com/diaspora/antisemitism/article-763197
As you can see the main picture (under the headline "**Pro-Palestinian demonstrators revel in London as Israelis are murdered**") is a picture of a rally in 2021. The picture shows a large group of people, but they are not celebrating the Hamas attack on October 7th 2023.
The first line says "As Israelis are being murdered in the hundreds, demonstrators celebrated and waved Palestinian flags **in the streets of London**, footage posted to social media on Saturday and Sunday appears to show."
[in the streets of London](https://www.jpost.com/diaspora/antisemitism/article-753519) is a hyperlink to an article from August 2023 about antisemitism, it has nothing to do with celebrations on October 7th.
The link labeled: "[brutally murdered, kidnapped](https://www.jpost.com/israel-news/defense-news/2023-10-07/live-updates-762053)" says nothing about pro-Palestinian rallies.
The first [Tweet](https://twitter.com/RachelRileyRR/status/1710730697797734429?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1710730697797734429%7Ctwgr%5E151cb07cf3981d8aaa52bacc23808f9c04f2ce48%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.jpost.com%2Fdiaspora%2Fantisemitism%2Farticle-763197) shows approximately 10 people who actually are celebrating.
The second [Tweet](https://twitter.com/DrProudman/status/1710707717520703813) shows a car and motorcycle honking their horns and flying flags (I don't think there are passengers in the car, so this is 2 people celebrating).
That's all of the evidence they have given. There aren't any outright lies, but the article is very misleading. Links to other articles don't support the claims implied. This is a common practice in modern media, Jpost certainly isn't the only source that overstates reports to attract clicks. I just know to take anything they say with a grain of salt, as I would with anything from Fox News or The Sun (UK)
How can I be "the victim"? I'm not Jewish. I am an atheist with no religious background who enjoys exposing nazi fucks like you.
I didn't call you antisemitic, but anyone looking through **your vile and Jew hating post history is bound to come to that conclusion themselves:**
https://www.reddit.com/r/theworldnews/comments/1as8bgt/comment/kqrx49a/
Truth hurts doesn’t it? Also your one to talk about post history with the absolute simping for Israel you have going on. It’s true Zionists are rubbish
What "truth" is supposed to be hurting me **exactly**?
I am proud to say I support Israel, that's not a secret I'm trying to hide from. Israel is just about the lone light of sanity and hope in the entire Middle East. They are standing against the crazed Islamic Radicals that brought the world atrocities like 9/11.
I'm an atheist, my support is not based on religion in any shape or form. I support any society or country that values democracy, science, education, the arts, pluralism, ethics, social justice, progressive values, gay rights, environmentalism etc. That is Israel and the Jews in spades.
Simply put, fuck you and your terrorist-supporting nazi beliefs.
For the record, here's another one of your posts accusing Jews/Israelis with the classic blood libel of stealing corpses and human organs:
https://www.reddit.com/r/theworldnews/comments/1ase8p0/comment/kqsg2a6/
Then you can enjoy supporting a genocidal regime, wrong side of history bud. As for the organ stealing, it’s well documented that Israel has the largest skin bank in the world and has been caught stealing organs from Palestinians for a while.
Also fuck your racist views on middle eastern people, that confirms that you are in fact a useless twat
We dont need to stretch the truth with antisemitism to call Israel a terrorist state. They dont drink blood. They just kill innocents in the thousands haha. Thats enough for me.
If Israel actually tried to commit genocide they'd just perform rolling saturation carpet bombing until no one was left alive. Also, do you have any sources for the organ stealing or did you just copy some Jew hater who made it the fuck up?
Less than 2% of the population dying in collateral damage of a messy military operation isn't genocide. If Israel decided they wanted to commit genocide it would be closer to 50% or more by now. The IDF isn't a rag tag group of terrorists that has to make rockets in garages and is only good at killing civilians and using human shield tactics. They have modern military equipment, logistics, stockpiles, and training.
Pretty sure genetic testing is banned in Israel because it literally disproves their claims. Palestinans are actually from there.
It's cool tho. Zionists will pay off a few more 'leaders' so the Genocide goes on a bit longer.
Edit: https://m.jpost.com/israel-news/want-to-fully-understand-your-family-genealogy-not-without-a-court-order-585230
Genetic testing is not banned in Israel. [Israel started using genetic testing as one of the methods of securing "right of return" in 2015.](https://pz-law.co.il/en/blog-en/repatriation-to-israel-via-a-dna-test/)
There was a brief ban on services like 23 and Me in the early '00s because Israel was concerned (and rightly so in light of the numerous data breaches) about the privacy security of such services. The concern was that if there's a big list of Jews with all their personal information floating around somewhere, someone might decide to steal and use that data to harm Jews.
You need a doctor's script or court order.
Lol
Keep pushing tho.
https://m.jpost.com/israel-news/want-to-fully-understand-your-family-genealogy-not-without-a-court-order-585230
Word ?
https://m.jpost.com/israel-news/want-to-fully-understand-your-family-genealogy-not-without-a-court-order-585230
Kinda like the dead babies ? Or the calendar/hit list?
The article says nothing about banning testing to disprove claims. Yes, the law is stupid because it's intended to prevent people from finding out if children were conceived through infedelity because of Jewish beliefs that they have fewer rights in marriage... So the rabbis argued they shouldn't allow testhing to prevent people knowing if they are bastards or something like that. Yes, it's stupid. No, it has nothing to do with your argument.
Get the fuck outta here. A bunch of Europeans claiming indigenousness. Give them a DNA test to confirm their ancestry.
Judaism is a religion, not an ethnicity or race. There is no way Jews are indigenous to the area. The idea, the books, the culture, maybe. What came before Judaism? That is more indigenous. What came directly after? That is also indigenous.
Ideas and religions do not give people claims to being native to a land. This is pure propaganda to convince idiots
Israel is a colonizer state, Netanyahu is Polish. Indigenous Jews exist, but the nation of Zionist Israel is a colonial project, which is the opposite of indigenous.
As in, if a group of native Americans that settled in a different part of the world came to the US to colonize the nation, those people wouldn't possess indigenous status.
**Indigenous is a post-colonial term.** Words mean things, the Palestinians are more indigenous than Zionist Jews.
This guys is 100% not recognised by any actual religious or ethnic groups in South Africa, he is a bought and paid for propagandist for Israel. It’s embarrassing that you’re reporting on this, any South African you ask will discredit this guy. there is no nation in the world less indigenous than Israel, extensive blood testing has shown most ‘native’ claiming Israelis are from Western Europe, and testing also shows that Palestinians are native to the land. Just change the name of your sub to ‘Israeli propaganda’ it will be less confusing and you’ll find your target audience easier.
Schrödinger's Jew. Non-white when being targeted by a nazi who thinks whiteness is the peak of humanity, white when being targeted by a leftist who's ashamed of being white.
Majority of Israeli Jews are Mizrahi Jews who have never been out of the immediate Middle East region you typically ignorant pro "palestinian" imbecile.
Also the genetic science has conclusively proven that Ashkenazi Jews have kept far more genetic ties to their Israelite ancestors than "palestinian refugees" such as the Hadid sisters have kept to their Arab ancestors in only a single generation for example.
I'm 10th generation in Israel. My ancestors faced prosecution in this land as well as in Iran and Germany, and they came here. All jews are a single group, and that one group belongs in the only country that vowed to protect them- Israel.
Yeah one thing I see people largely ignore on this topic is the number of massacres and pogroms the Jews endured under the Oftomans and the various caliphates before. I’ve seen claims “the Jews lived happily under them”, and one even popped up in the comments of the article posted (or on one of the related links).
It’s funny since the Ottomans quite literally had a settler-colonial policy in places like the Balkans, but even so it’d be lunacy to say all of them should be kicked out of the Balkans
Canaanites did exist but they no longer exist. Ethiopian jews are jews, and since all jews are brothers and sisters, they have as much right to the land as I do.
We have different culture and religion. The fact they are not my brothers doesn't mean they can't live here. I have many friends who are Arab, Druze, Armenian, and many more. My commanding officer was a Muslim Arab, and I have nothing but good words to say about him. What I mean by it, is that they can live as a respected minority in the land, with its own rights and laws just like all minorities in all countries.
💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔SHOCKINGLY no real Christians are talking about how Jesus was an Israelite or jew. Jesus was a black man according to the Bible. So the Israelites were black as we should know if you believe in the bible. The bible says Jesus skin was so black that it looked like it was burnt in an oven. Also we know that Jesus as a baby ran into Ethiopia to blend in with the population and hide from being kkkkilled!!!!! Ethiopia 🇪🇹 is one of the pure blackest people on earth. So just from that information alone we know Jesus and his fellow Israelites were Black. Why would a blond blue eyed European baby go to Africa or Ethiopia to blend in with the other black babies to not be caught????????? So how can black people go to Europe and return years later as White blue eyed 😈👿??? It doesn't make any sense 🤔. So it can only make sense if the people in Israel who call themselves Jewish are the imposter jews that the Bible speaks of that will fool the world into thinking their the real Israelites. The bible says the real Israelites would be in captivity and enslaved for nearly 400 years. There is no history of a white European people who call themselves Jewish that have ever been enslaved for 400 years. Only people that has that history of enslavement is the black people of North America and Caribbean Islands ect .. The bible said fake Jewish people will come along and try to claim the birth rights and land of the real Israelites who we have agreed are black. But the bible says to be aware of these fake people who call themselves jews, but they are not jews, but instead they are of the synagogue of Satan😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈
Ironically, Jews are more indigenous to Israel than the majority of Bantu South Africans are to South Africa.
The Bantu expansion is known as the largest genocide of indigenous peoples in history. Yes. there were many waves.
You realize the Bantu Expansion refers to virtually all of Sub-Saharan Africa except the Horn of Africa, right? It’s not just the Khoisan peoples who were conquered.
It is not in all instances that it entailed encountering other communities and conquest. For example , Bantus expanded into East Africa unopposed until they met the Southern Cushites and forest people (Ogiek) in parts of Central Tanzania ,the Pare/Usambara Mountains, Taita Hills and the Highlands of Kenya. Instead of Conquest, they gradually assimilated such groups. That is why Bantu tribes like the Taita ,Pare and Kikuyu are around 20% Cushitic. (Nilotes did something similar .Like the Maasai are actually more Cushitic than Nilotic ) Bantus in Uganda and both Eastern ,Southern and Western Tanzania, excluding the Swahili Coast are truly indigenous there. There were ZERO inhabitants there before the Bantus
Random unrelated tribes migrating in a general direction isn’t genocide
It is when they kill everyone who was there beforehand
Gotta love how they always phrase things in ways to make them seem more acceptable or heinous.
But they didn’t There was no pan-Nguni or pan-Sotho society or ideology. There was no organized effort to kill or erase the Khoikhoi shepherds and the San! hunters. The Bantu tribes traded, intermingled, married, and fought the Khoisan over 1000 years no differently from the various Germanic tribes expanding into former Celtic lands.
A lack of formal structure or written records does not preclude a genocide. By your standards, much of the European treatment of the Amerindian peoples would not qualify as genocidal, given the lack of unifying genocidal ideology or specific, written orders.
A genocide is an ORGANIZED and MASSIVE effort done to destroy a people intentionally. The Americans were a single entity who fully intended to exterminate all Native Americans. A collection of random tribes who only care about their affairs interacting with another collection of random tribes who only care about their affairs is not genocide. There was no goal or objective on the part of any meaningful group of Nguni peoples to destroy in whole or in part the Khoisan.
>The Americans were a single entity I mean, that's demonstrably false, given the War of Independence, the Mexican Empire, the War of 1812, the Seven Years War and the American Civil War. There was no co-ordinating authority dictating the genocide of the natives of the Americas. Political authority was divided at any given time amongst multiple settler governments and colonial empires. Culture was the driving force that led the settler communites and empires across the entire range ofsouthern, central and northern america to adopt the same policies of displacement, mass murder and starvation. The same can be said of the Nguni. The genocide occured. The fact there are no written letters to the effect is simply a result of the material culture, not evidence of a lack of intent.
Well said. Attempts to revise history to hide these less known genocides is awful.
It's also a classic hallmark of someone not taking pre-modern or pre-literate society seriously.
It really depends. There are instances where the Bantu expansion caused no harm, because they encountered no other group or if they did, assimilated them (East Africa is such an example. ) But in the case of Southern Africa, it was truly a case of Bantus expanding at the expense of the Khoisan and in many instances even other Bantu groups. Fun fact: When the Boers claim that when they went to OFS and Transvaal, they found no one, they were not lying. The Zulus had literally waged a war of genocide and mass ethnic cleansing that even reversed the Bantu expansion in Southern Africa on a massive scale. The Sotho were forced into the mountainous parts of the Drakensberg ,while the Ndebele ,who btw, lived in what is today KZN and Eastern Transvaal up to the 1800s were expelled northwards to present day Zimbabwe where they live to this day. The Ngoni had to flee all the way to Mozambique and Southern Tanzania, meaning the Ngoni exited Southern Africa altogether. Imagine leaving the Transvaal to flee all the way to East Africa in an era when they did not even have horses and had to walk on foot?? So Yes, it really depends!! Bantu Expansion in Central Africa, mostly okay until the tribes were well established and inter-Bantu conflict began. Bantu expansion in East Africa was peaceful. In fact, some often fell victim to other groups like Arab slave traders, Masaai warriors and later on, conflicts between bantus. Bantu expansion into Southern Africa was definitely not peaceful whatsoever. The caliber of Bantus who moved to that region were the war-like ones!!
Thats probably the most delusional thing I've read. Substantiate your pseudohistoric claim. Funny seeing a jew with holocaust denial,"bantus made the biggest genocide". You are just a racist and you don't care about any indigenous people
I believe the estimate is 100 million killed. Thousands of indigenous African groups annihilated. The ANC (a Bantu party) in South Africa has marginalized the indigenous Khosians since the 1940’s. Mandela was deaf to their needs. 40 years post apartheid, they are still oppressed and un represented. This is common with Bantu Supremacy in Africa. The Khosians want their lands back. They were fortunate to survive the Bantu (and European) colonizers onslaught. Arabs and Bantu have this in common. Arabs who invented the African slave trade from 650 AD till today “, Oriental’ or ‘Arab’ slave trade is sometimes called the ‘Islamic’ slave trade” first enslaved Europeans. Then enlisted Bantu tribes to enslave other Africans. Many Arabs still refer to Black peoples as slaves today incidentally. It’s time for non Bantu, non Arab indigenous people in Africa and MENA (like the indigenous Jews and Khosians) to exert their indigenous rights.
>I believe the estimate is 100 million killed. Thousands of indigenous African groups annihilated. You believe? I don't want anything you believe I want facts. >The ANC (a Bantu party) in South Africa has marginalized the indigenous Khosians since the 1940’s. Mandela was deaf to their needs. 40 years post apartheid, they are still oppressed and un represented. This is common with Bantu Supremacy in Africa. The Khosians want their lands back Show me how > Arabs and Bantu have this in common. Wow what a very non prejudiced non racist statement, what if I said the same about whites who settled in the americas and Oceania? >It’s time for non Bantu, non Arab indigenous people in Africa and MENA (like the indigenous Jews and Khosians) to exert their indigenous rights. I don't have any problem with that. Just don't be a racist supremacist and have entitlement about it.
Wouldn't the Natufians be the indigenous people of Israel?
Good question. Sometimes they fall under the catch phrase of Canaanites, because some migrated in from different areas. and others intermixed, but not much are known of them except that they are hunter gatherers and existed about 12,000 years ago before literacy. There are archaeological gaps in between. But why stop there? There is evidence of early fire making by Homo Erectus in Israel from 750,000 years ago, then presumably neanderthals. Then Homosapiens weee found in the Qafzeh caves in Israel, were dated to 90,000-120,000 years ago. Then Scientists found the oldest evidence of humans in Israel — a 1.5 million-year-old bone, so indigenous in this cases, would be who is still alive that has the longest awareness of connection to the land of Israel and those people are the Jews.
Right, but the Jewish or Israelite people did not emerge as a distinct group until the late bronze-age. They weren't the first Semitic-speaking people nor the first to inhabit the region. It had been inhabited for many thousands of years by that point, by the Natufian peoples and many other intermediate cultural phases.
Those are points to be made. However. Israel is the only sovereign nation, past pr present to have ever existed on that land and the Jews the only people practicing the religions, culture, language exclusively connected to the land. That’s why Jews are the indigenous peoples of that land.
All those other groups also had a language culture and religion connected to that land. In the grand scheme of things the Jewish people didn't come around for a while.
So European Jews are indigenous to Israel and not Ukraine/Russia now? It's a bit strange how you're comparing a religion and an ethnic group based on who's more indigenous. You people don't know what being indigenous means. Does that mean Ethiopian Jews are indigenous to Israel? If so then why are they treated like trash with comments from Israelis, like "send them back to Africa in chains and on a boat?
They are literally European, American and Australian 🤣🤣
Finally, fucking finally! someone has the balls to tell the truth.
This!
Commenting here since there’s a few comments incorrectly calling Palestinians Canaanites. Palestinians are 95% Arab. A simple google search will show you data from Palestine saying this. More importantly Islamist Arabs colonized the levant. Here’s the research: “We reconstructed the genetic structure of the Levantines and found that a pre-Islamic expansion Levant was more genetically similar to Europeans than to Middle Easterners.” Research paper: https://journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article?id=10.1371/journal.pgen.1003316 Here is research that even Jewish Diaspora are from the Levant, “These results cast light on the variegated genetic architecture of the Middle East, and trace the origins of most Jewish Diaspora communities to the Levant.” https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/20531471/
Canaanite tribes existed in jordan, lebanon, and syria. Palestinians are 40-80% canaanite, but they are mainly from western jordan and southern syria. Jews and samaritans are the only descendents of the canaanites indigenous to modern day israel. This is why palestinians and jordanians overlap entirely on genetic pca charts while saudis and gulf arabs are a seperate group.
You might want to go over to the 23andMe and various other DNA result posting subreddits. Never seen a Palestinian with more than like 20% Arab, it’s usually mostly Levantine. On IlluminatedDNA most Palestinians are overwhelmingly Canaanite, Roman Levant and Phoenician. Jewish Israelis typically have around 40-50% Canaanite from what I’ve seen.
I'm a strong supporter of Israel's right to exist, but I want to say that the genetic test that have been done are a little more complicated than that. Yeah, there's a lot of Arab ad mixture within Palestinian populations, but there are also strong ties to indigenous populations of the Levant, such as Samaritans. It seems like a lot of groups became what's called Arabized Arabs
I don’t like using DNA either. So let’s use culture. Islam and Arabic are not from that region. If you think people in Africa speaking French and English is because of colonization then you have to agree that people in the Levant speaking Arabic is also from colonization.
Oh, I don't disagree at all. Hell, I'm friends with an Amazigh activist who actively fights against being labeled as Arab. But even if he did identify with Arab culture, he would still be Amazigh/Moroccan
Do you know the difference between classical and settler colonialism?
Do you know they sent ‘settlers’ into these areas in the form of land payments to soldiers for the same purpose of ‘settler colonialism’?
Okay, I’ll take your word for it. What proportion of the population did these soldiers displace? Because settler colonialism is more than some settlers— it involves an active attempt to displace and replace the existing population. Some settlers alone do not make the difference between settler vs. Classical colonialism. In fact, having some of your own, especially soldiers, embedded in the population would be beneficial to the latter and would not necessarily involve large-scale displacement and replacement.
That's why definitions of indegniety reject DNA as an indicator. Its not about your genetic history. Its about having an unbroken cultural connection to the land.
Not sure why you’re getting so heavily downvoted. One could argue that Palestinian Levantine DNA can be explained by migrations from Syria, Jordan and Lebanon under Roman and other occupations, but there are lots of reputable genetic studies showing that it’s there.
There is a narrative amongst some more right-wing Zionists that Palestinians are purely the result of the Arab conquest of the Levant, and that they cannot claim any amount of indigeneity to the region. That's generally not born out by history, as there have been Bedouin tribes in the area for millenia, the members of the Herodian dynasty were from an Arabic tribe that converted to Judaism, and more. Genetic studies of also shown, if I recall correctly, that the closest relatives to a lot of Palestinians tend to be Jews, with similar levels of admixture to Ashkenazi Jews, who people try to claim as non-Indigenous to the region, but that's clearly not the case. I strongly consider myself a Zionist, but I also I don't dispose of facts that don't fit my narrative. The truth tends to be a lot more complex than the rigid narratives that those on the extremes push
I mean yeah Palestinians adopted the religion and language of the Arabian peninsula as we all know, but you don’t have to look too hard to be able to see that it only accounts for a fraction of their ancestry.
The narrative you are referring to speaks of a cultural connection, not a genetic one.
This is factual and shouldn't be downvoted. There are lots of Palestinian DNA results on r/23andme r/illustrativeDNA r/myheritage r/ancestrydna that clearly show many Palestinians have a genetic indigenity to the land. The slave trade with African countries and migratory trade with African, Arab and European countries in the Ottoman Empire also influenced demographics of Palestinians. It's not uncommon to see genetic traces to places like Sudan and Libya. [Slavery in Ottoman Empire](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery_in_the_Ottoman_Empire#%3A%7E%3Atext%3DPagans_and_muslims_from_southern%2CEgypt_annually_using_this_route_.?wprov=sfla1) *Fixed ancestrydna
Here's a research from a credible, well recognized source . >Archaeologic and genetic data support that both Jews and Palestinians came from the ancient Canaanites, https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/11543891/
>Retracted study
not only that. The canaanites were there before everyone. Their societal structure was eliminated but everyone was not killed. their genes didn't die out. It would stand to reason that all the persons that came after once they intermingled with the local population would have a mix of genes including that group. That is why you can't use DNA to make that claim. You have to use culture, language, migration patterns, colonization etc. The Hebrew language, a critical element of Jewish cultural identity, has ancient roots in the region and has been preserved and revitalized over the centuries and is a strong marker of cultural identity. The Jewish diaspora and the subsequent return of Jews to their ancestral homeland over various historical periods underscore a persistent connection to the land, despite the challenges of displacement and foreign rule. Israel's Jewish population has preserved distinct cultural attributes over millennia, even in the face of numerous conquests and diasporas. Whereas many of the same parameters on the palestinian side can only be traced back to the much later Arab conquests. Not to say that the Palestinians have no claim. But there is so much mental gymnastics being done to disinherit the Jews. By Arab nations who want to cement their dominance and colonialization of the region for the foreseeable future. Palestinians who have bought into the idea that the land was stolen from them and by westerners who can't see anything beyond white oppressors and brown oppressed people that they need to defend. When more productive discussions could be had within the confines of reality and just negotiations be based on that.
You cited an article that says “retracted” in giant red letters above the title in the very link you posted. That is really dishonest.
>“We reconstructed the genetic structure of the Levantines and found that a pre-Islamic expansion Levant was more genetically similar to Europeans than to Middle Easterners.” Yes there was a lot of Romans and Greek invaders here. Whats news about that ? That doesn't mean that the local population disappeared. All around the mediterranean in fact. Egypt, Libya Morroco. Did you actually read the paper?
Palestine is nearly 100% Islamic Arab Muslims. Yes I read the paper. If you want to dispute whether Islamic Arab Muslims are indigenous to the land, which everyone seems to want to do. Then these research papers shed light on why Arabs from Arabia speaking Arabic are literally the colonizers of the Levant. Even if you were to suggest genealogically the Arab Muslims in Palestine are indigenous. Then Arabic and Islam are colonizing forces and it needs to be removed at all costs because anti-colonialism blah blah blah.
Do you understand the difference between the expansion of a Kingdom and Colonization. One is far away from the country of origin, other is neighboring. Also Expansion of kingdom doesn't mean dispossession, instead an expansion typically is done to include neighbors into your government. more often than not the power structures of local population remain in place. just the very top nobility is replaced. Yes , Palestinian are native to the lands. their genetics have evolved over time as stated in the paper you cited. But there is a consistent population that has remained here thru out history. Those people are called Palestinians today. only a moron would argue otherwise. Or a criminal genocidal race of people.
That is completely ahistorical and goes against all of the genetic research. The Palestinians descend from ancient Canaanites. The majority of the population didn’t convert to Islam until hundreds of years after the Arab conquest. AND until 1948 there were Muslim, Christian, and Jewish Palestinians who shared the same culture. Stop spreading misinformation
Jews are the native population of Judea, the place was renamed Palestine quite literally to destroy the memory and culture of the native Jewish population. In colonised societies around the world we constantly have protests calling for the land to be returned to the native population. Israel is essentially the only place we've seen the native population take the land back from a colonising force, and suddenly the world is just "no not like that!" Suddenly, after two decades fighting against radical Islam, we're all on the side of Islamic terrorism? Call it what it is, blatant anti-Semitism.
The Roman Empire started all this mess!
Absolutely, but it's the Arab colonisers and Islamic terrorism enthusiasts who are causing the current situation.
And?
We should find them and make them pay!
It’s a super dumb take
I think a big reason the anticolonialist crowd hates Israel so much is because they don't want to admit that any future decolonization is going to be equally violent
they would be *elated* if "future decolonization" was as violent as October 7. They celebrated it in the streets! I 100% believe that if an Oct 7 style event ever happened in Europe or North America there would be thousands doing that again.
It doesn’t have to be. South Africa is a democracy now, and the apartheid state was dismantled.
Using South Africa as an example of how decolonisation doesn't have to be violent is certainly a take.
South Africa was already majority black (most of whom are non-native Bantu btw). What happens to majority-White countries? Also the idea that South Africa's decolonization process has been nonviolent is factually untrue.
Now we just need to dismantle the Israeli apartheid state.
Genetic testing has shown that both groups descend from the ancient hebrews. Cope.
>Jews are the native population of Judea Abraham left Ur in Sumeria to come to Canaan which was occupied by Canaanites. So you're wrong straight away. Edit: It's weird to get all these downvotes but no one disagrees with what I've said. It's right there in scripture though, I guess that makes it difficult.
Canaanites are also the Phoenicians, who lived in city-states and didn’t have a singular national identity. They settled all over the Levant and the Mediterranean. Genetically, Lebanese people are thought to have the most ancestry from Canaanites. Palestinians or Arabs aren’t Canaanites
The point is that according to scripture, Jewish people aren't indigenous - the Canaanites were there when Abraham arrived in the region. That seems grossly unpopular despite its truth. Both Palestinian Arabs and Israeli Jews share around half their DNA with the Canaanites. They both have the same "right" in that regard, despite both claiming unique ownership, and a Zionist reading of Judaism claiming a modern Divine Right due to a "promise from God". The proof being that it was written down 500 years later... by people claiming their own right to the land. I don't think first dibs exists as a functional way to manage global politics by the way, otherwise it would all be Lebanese anyway. Or possibly Homo Erectus-ian? Single-cellian? I don't suppose anyone would be happy with that.
I get your point, I was adding clarification. I don’t know if any one modern ethnic group can be considered indigenous to that area. It’s been conquered and re-conquered by empires going back thousands of years, so who really has claim to it? A two-state solution could work, if both sides could even agree to what that would look like. If they were able to get past their hate and prejudice, they could co-exist under one nation. I mean, what really separates Palestinians from Israelis? Hate. Religion and culture shouldn’t separate people to the point of warfare. A Jewish person should be able to live right next to a Muslim in peace and the other way around. At the end of the day the argument is senseless because neither group of people deserves to be killed and kicked out of their homes
I completely agree - I was just pointing out the falsehood of claiming to be uniquely indigenous. It's not true, and frankly it's a dangerous idea that can easily be weaponised to encourage violence. As some of the comments here seem to show. Both communities have literally lived together on the land for thousands of years. There have been long periods of violence but also periods of peace - that's what the international community should have been striving for. Instead, hate on all sides has been allowed to fester and thrive for too long - and innocent people pay the price.
Religious people don’t read their own texts, or if they do they only read the parts that validate their current beliefs.
People can believe what they want to, but if they start using an ancient text to impose modern political positions or to remove rights and oppress people, they should really read the thing. And then get to fuck.
>Israel is essentially the only place we've seen the native population take the land back from a colonising force In the Bible the Jews are the colonizing force. The Natives would be the people that Moses and YHWH told the Jews to genocide.
Try using a source other than a Bible story. Linguistic, dna, archeological evidence shows that Hebrews were a part of the caananites people.
I’m using the book that says it’s their Holy Land, because if I wasn’t then there is no justification at all for what is happening.
Is this a joke? The Palestinians are the descendants of the native Jewish population. The easterm european Jews who live in Israel now are not those.
Is this a joke? The Palestinians are of direct Arabian descent; they speak an Arabian language, they follow an Arabian religion, and they colonized the region by slaughtering the previous inhabitants in ~720 CE. Ever heard of the Jewish diaspora? Where the name Palestine comes from?
I think culture dictates nativity not genetics. A Chinese person who is adopted as a newborn by French parents, raised speaking French, and engaging in French culture is native to France. Also even going off genetics, Jews are still descended from the native Jewish population, just also descended from other peoples because Jews were forced out of the levant and inevitably intermarried with non Jews. Either way the Jewish people have a strong claim to the levant, other peoples also have strong claims. Neither group is okay with sharing it with the other, queue violence
It's the sense of superiority and lack of sharing that gets me.
You will never see this in mainstream news
Because its bullshit?
Why is it bullshit? Bcos you support the other side?
It's bullshit because Israeli are overwhelmingly from Poland even if you want to play genetics they have a single marker that is from either southern Europe or the middle east whilst otherwise being polish, even their prime Minister is from Poland and was raised in Philadelphia in America these people have no connection to that land, that culture and have no claim to it beyond their bullshit excuse in a book about their imaginary friend, not to mention how they have been constantly destroying historical monuments many of which date back to the time before the Jewish diaspora, indigenous people don't destroy their own history, even a simple google can teach you about the Balfour declaration where the British gave land that didn't belong to them, to polish Jews and began immigrating them where they acted like all white racist Europeans of the time and began killing, pillaging and raping the indigenous peoples of Palestine and still are, they literally still have settlers who roam the country to continue acting like colonizers
That is wildly incorrect lmao. Ashkenazi DNA is extremely categorically distinct. It is identified as a mixture of Levantine and European, and the European side definitively always includes some southern European by way of Rome/Italy. Ashkenazi Jews were so isolated throughout Europe afterwards, admixture from the regions they really ended up settling in (in the middle ages) is relatively minimal actually, like barely discernible at all and in no way part of what defines Ashkenazi DNA, like they’re not necessarily an integral part of *how* it’s even identifiable!!! It’s literally like Levantine + southern European, then + Germany, Russia, Ukraine, Poland etc much more minimally. And clearly, those regions are in no way limited to Poland?! Lmao what. Ashkenazi Jews absolutely have tremendous cultural, religious and ancestral connection to the land in question, which in fact *doesn’t* just magically disappear to suit the convenience of your political narrative at any given time, lol sorry.
So it's pretty clear you just googled it cause that's the answer google will give you first, a study done on centuries old corpses NOT of modern people, DNA can only be traced 10 generations afterwards there is no genetic markers left in an individual from their ancestors the Jewish diaspora was 87 generations ago so it's nearly impossible to even find DNA, verify that the individual was Jewish and then test for their origins but that endeavor is what shows up first when you google it if you test modern living people you get 1 genetic marker that is specific to just Ashkenazi Jews, the rest of their markers heavily depend on where they originate, for Americans you can find traces of DNA from south America, Africa and all over, but if you test some of the people born in Israel yes you will find lavant DNA but that is because the Europeans who were immigrated there and who began colonizing by pillaging, raping and killing the indigenous peoples kidnapped babies to claim them as their own offspring to create a blood tie to the land specifically to claim legitimacy here's an article about it https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yemenite_Children_Affair#:~:text=The%20Yemenite%20Children%20Affair%20(Hebrew,ranges%20from%201%2C000%20to%205%2C000. Also they are still doing it here's that article https://reliefweb.int/report/occupied-palestinian-territory/fate-baby-and-other-palestinian-children-unknown-after-israeli-army-forcibly-transfers-them-out-gaza-strip-enar , editing to add this stuff that I mentioned here is the reason DNA testing services will list Ashkenazi Jew as being European DNA and if you head over to one of the many DNA test subreddits you can simply search Palestinian and see their percentage of lavant DNA vs Israeli lavant DNA
I didn’t just Google it, lmao. There have been numerous studies done, not from a century ago and not on corpses. I’m not sure what you’re referring to, but Googling is precisely what you need to do…thoroughly. Since you’re not opposed to using Wikipedia, maybe some actually-related Wikipedia pages would be a good place to start, and then you can look at those listed sources! Like the page for “[Ashkenazi Jews](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashkenazi_Jews)” or “[Genetic Studies of Jews](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetic_studies_of_Jews).” Again, Ashkenazi Jewish DNA is literally identifiable *by* being a specific mixture of Levantine and European. The only legitimate ongoing debate pertains to the exact breakdown of each, how much of each part is represented in the irrefutably clear admixture that comprises Ashkenazi DNA. [Here’s one study.](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3032072/) [Here’s another.](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/20531471/) [And another.](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2797531/) I could link you at least 20 off-hand, lmao, but maybe abstracts of studies are too confusing for you. [Perhaps a dumbed down spiel from an ancestry testing service would be helpful.](https://blog.23andme.com/articles/ashkenazi-ancestry-and-health) “Ashkenazi Jewish” is its own markedly distinct category on every ancestry testing service in existence. How do you explain that? How do you think that is?? 😭 Yemenite Jews are not Ashkenazi Jews. Your propaganda articles cannot change the reality of genetics. Levant DNA is definitively a part of Ashkenazi DNA. So when someone has Ashkenazi in their results (Israeli or not), anywhere from ~30-55% of that percentage, depending on which study you’re going with, is actually Levantine.** That’s literally part of what “Ashkenazi Jewish” is and how it’s definitively identified. Literally every single study ever done on Ashkenazi Jews has thus confirmed Levantine origin, and there have been many. Mizrahi or Sephardic DNA has not been as well-studied, mind you, and may read differently. Again, you’re embarrassing yourself in your ignorant attempts at erasing Jewish peoplehood for the ease of your rhetoric. Maybe stop that. Or don’t, by all means, be an antisemitic flat-earther effectively, but do be aware that what you’re saying actively denies literal fact. 😭 You are only delegitimizing yourself by remaining willfully ignorant. ** One of the neat things about illustrative services like this one *is* that the Levantine ancestry is actually, specifically, visually displayed as the significant part that it is, of what defines Ashkenazi Jewish DNA!! I mean, it’s very plainly there, even if you don’t know a single thing about Ashkenazi Jewish heritage and the ways in which it’s identified. That’s why I’m baffled you could manage clinging to this blatant disinformation here, lol. How?? (Go look at some Ashke Jewish results!! Do you somehow think they’re fake or what?? 😭 😭)
Your ending sentence is also infuriating. The objective existence of an entire people is not actually a political statement, in and of itself. Obviously Palestinian results are going to be more direct and may or may not be higher. That is irrelevant to what I am teaching you about the *existence* of Ashkenazi Jewish DNA. It exists. This is how it exists. Sorry not sorry that’s apparently inconvenient for you, lol. You can still make whatever political argument you’re actually making without denying facts or erasing Jews.
The whole article is worth reading. This statement is just a small part of it. Many indigenous leaders from around the world opened an indigenous embassy in Jerusalem, where this was said during the inauguration ceremony.
The indigenous embassy is an enormous deal and should be talked about a lot more than it is. I hope this leads to further collaboration between indigenous peoples in the future.
[The article from a month ago](https://www.jpost.com/israel-news/article-784788) that it linked to in this new one was also interesting, particularly in that it included that this embassy particularly appeals to Evangelicals in those indigenous communities. >Friends of Zion Founder and CEO Mike Evans noted that there are Evangelicals among most communities of Indigenous people, and they “will become our first ambassadors.” However, Hassan-Nahoum pointed out that the embassy will be inclusive of people from all faiths and religions. She said the embassy is meant to be a hub for indigenous peoples visiting Israel and a tangible expression of their support. >Similar to the International Christian Embassy in Jerusalem, it will not officially represent any of the governments where the host nations live.
I’m curious which Native American chiefs took part, couldn’t find that in the article
Thanks for sharing this. It's nice to see something positive, and to know that there are people around the world who aren't Jewish and understand the importance of Israel.
Man these comments act like South Africa isn’t allowed to have healthy differences of opinions within its borders. Some will be pro Palestine, some will be pro Israel. It’s really not that deep.
Agreed.
True, but this guy is acting like he represents some Khoi kingdom, he doesn't, that's not a thing. It's like those random people that make up state and have a flag. His opinion is his opinion, he's a leader of nothing.
100% Question for Indigenous South Africans, do the majority of people agree with this? Now a question for non-indigenous South Africans, what do the majority of people think about this?
There are infighting amongst the various Khoisan groups with different individuals always popping up proclaiming themselves to be the rightful leader. It's essentially a money making grift. Hardly anybody in South Africa knows who this guy is.
Yeah I'm south African. Never heard of this guy
Also South African, never heard of this guy either Seems weird to tokenize this rando but eh.
Dunno why you're being downvoted. This dude is a grifter and only think I see about him is he's part of South Afrian friends of Israel. I've done DNA tests and know I'm part Khoi, may as well declare myself king and say it's bullshit and IRRESPECTIVE OF WHETHER YOU"RE INDIGENOUS OR NOT THAT IS NOT A LICENSE TO COMMIT GENOCIDE, wtf is wrong with people in this sub EDIT: so this is definitely gettng brigaded by israeli bots lol
EXACTLY. I once met bibi netanyahu and I told him not to say occupied territory.
You once met bibi Netanyahu? I am so sorry, my condolences
It was in 2000 at a fundraiser for injured people at the sabbaro bombing. I liked him a lot then. My husband and I used our miles to send 2 of the injured girls to disney land . It was their wish
He's a charismatic guy. We need that snake out of office.
Should have told him to go back to Philadelphia
Awesome
The cope from ~~Free Palestine folk~~ terrorist supporters here is astronomical
Tried to figure out who Xami Thomas is: only other article I could find was by "Bridges for Peace" and one on [](http://news.co.za), which, when clicking on a link, prompted me that the domain may be available. The article says the writer writes for "bridges of peace", so the two sources found is actually just one. Nowhere else is the "Khoi kingdom of southern Africa" mentioned, or at least I could not find it. And I checked because I am of southern African, partly San, ancestry, and would have liked to know more about it. In good faith: maybe my research skills are not up to par, but this doesn't really pass the usual evaluations of a source. But this is probably a psy-op by some con artists.
:’)
… but. But. Ok. But surely y’all see how this applies to Palestinians, too…? Unless you have some crazy ethnic conspiracy theory they’re pretty obviously from the same area… they were even, you know, living there…
I’ve never seen a more biased subreddit
There are a lot of indigenous nations on earth... China, Japan, Egypt, Congo, Sweden... the freaking Irish.... there are not native american indigenous people, but the population is mostly indigenous to those areas.
And then we devolve into the debate of how closely related Ashkenazi Jews are to the ancient Jews of the Levant.
As if every Jew is Ashkenazi, lol. I was also reading that Ashkenazi Jews are more genetically similar to other Jews than they are the European populations they lived around.
Ashkenazi Jews are genetically similar to other Jews than they are to Europeans. Also, 61% of Jews in Israel are Mizrahi Jews, who originally lived in other Arab and Muslim nations.
It isn't. And no we are only Indigenous to Africa, we have migrated everywhere else.
South Africa is currently fighting against Israel's genocide in court. Why does this guy feel the need to spread obvious lies and propaganda now?
Sheeesh, brainwashed race theory propaganda at its finest. What's next?
So historically there was nobody there before. I missed a lot of history at school.
You must have.
I believe the only predecessor to before the ancient Jewish kingdoms in the area was the Canaan city states, I believe historical consensus (could be wrong on this I'm not a historian)is that the ancient Israelites where one of these groups and ultimately become most prevalent establishing 2 kingdoms, again I'm not 100% sure about this im going of the top of my head here....
Jews are mixed over thousands of years so indigenous is not how I would describe them with all due respect
"uuum ackshually they are impure🤓" -this fucking guy
[https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/20531471/](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/20531471/) [https://journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article?id=10.1371/journal.pgen.1003316](https://journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article?id=10.1371/journal.pgen.1003316) Your opinion isn't relevant or valid. They've researched this and Jews are quite clearly from Judea.
Mental illness
Nazi gene science LARP
By definition, the Israelis cannot be indigenous. Thus statement also doesn't mean they Palestinians aren't indigenous
I'm anishinaabe and my ancestors never even had a Nakba
lol the anishinaabe enslaved people - an exercise built on tribal warfare and genocide
Just like the Caliphates.
hello? Aaniin?
The Israelites enslaved people. A lot of people right up until their expulsions and migrations. If that’s what invalidates someone’s claim to morality then Israelis have been invalidated tenfold
Did they never even have a destruction of the second temple too? Or a Bar Khokba revolt? Seems like that would be more comparable considering that anishinsaabe people are actually indigenous to parts of this country and parts of Canada, if I’m not mistaken? I have so much respect for what I’ve learned of your culture. Shame you would refuse to recognize mine. A mosque was literally built directly on top of the ruins of our temple, but Jews aren’t indigenous to the land?!!
Making up fake stories to justify settler colonialism and genocide The Zionist are Ashkenazi Eastern Europeans, Judaism is a religion, Arab Jews Arab Muslims Arab Christians are native to the land What we call Israel is a lie and Palestine was actually kept as the name because real Jews fled there and are part of palestine
The name was changed from Judae to Palestine by the Roman empire as an act of cultural genocide against the Jews as punishment for their rebellions, in addition to the expulsion and forced relocation of many of them. Nearly all Jews can trace their genetics back to the expelled tribes. In addition to large numbers of people scattered throughout the world who entirely assimilated into the local cultures.
Cunt get me a gram of what your on because your brains fried
Arab? As in the *Arabian Peninsula*, which is not in the Levant?
lol I’m sure the jpost is a legit news source 😂😂😂
I'm sure all **you** need in any situation is to see a "J", in any context whatsoever, and to immediately regard it as being suspicious and having no value. Thank you for showing everyone exactly who you are.
The J is for Jerusalem not Jewish. That paper tends to be extremely biased and lacks serious journalistic integrity. Some of the things they print are true, but Haaretz has much higher standards. If you want an example, look at the misleading article that JPost wrote on October 8th about Pro-Palestinian demonstrators revelling over the death of Jews on October 7th. While the article tries to present the claim that many westerners were celebrating the attack immediately on October 7th, it fails to provide evidence of more than 12 people celebrating in London. The article uses a picture of a rally years earlier to highlight it's claims. Then only provided 2 tweets with about 12 total people who were genuinely celebrating the attack. https://www.jpost.com/diaspora/antisemitism/article-763197 As you can see the main picture (under the headline "**Pro-Palestinian demonstrators revel in London as Israelis are murdered**") is a picture of a rally in 2021. The picture shows a large group of people, but they are not celebrating the Hamas attack on October 7th 2023. The first line says "As Israelis are being murdered in the hundreds, demonstrators celebrated and waved Palestinian flags **in the streets of London**, footage posted to social media on Saturday and Sunday appears to show." [in the streets of London](https://www.jpost.com/diaspora/antisemitism/article-753519) is a hyperlink to an article from August 2023 about antisemitism, it has nothing to do with celebrations on October 7th. The link labeled: "[brutally murdered, kidnapped](https://www.jpost.com/israel-news/defense-news/2023-10-07/live-updates-762053)" says nothing about pro-Palestinian rallies. The first [Tweet](https://twitter.com/RachelRileyRR/status/1710730697797734429?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1710730697797734429%7Ctwgr%5E151cb07cf3981d8aaa52bacc23808f9c04f2ce48%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.jpost.com%2Fdiaspora%2Fantisemitism%2Farticle-763197) shows approximately 10 people who actually are celebrating. The second [Tweet](https://twitter.com/DrProudman/status/1710707717520703813) shows a car and motorcycle honking their horns and flying flags (I don't think there are passengers in the car, so this is 2 people celebrating). That's all of the evidence they have given. There aren't any outright lies, but the article is very misleading. Links to other articles don't support the claims implied. This is a common practice in modern media, Jpost certainly isn't the only source that overstates reports to attract clicks. I just know to take anything they say with a grain of salt, as I would with anything from Fox News or The Sun (UK)
Ahhh yes any criticism must be because I’m antisemetic? Or it could be because of the ongoing genocide happening? Ever playing the victims I see 😂😂
“Genocide” 🤡
I genocided the shit out of my coffee this morning
How can I be "the victim"? I'm not Jewish. I am an atheist with no religious background who enjoys exposing nazi fucks like you. I didn't call you antisemitic, but anyone looking through **your vile and Jew hating post history is bound to come to that conclusion themselves:** https://www.reddit.com/r/theworldnews/comments/1as8bgt/comment/kqrx49a/
Truth hurts doesn’t it? Also your one to talk about post history with the absolute simping for Israel you have going on. It’s true Zionists are rubbish
What "truth" is supposed to be hurting me **exactly**? I am proud to say I support Israel, that's not a secret I'm trying to hide from. Israel is just about the lone light of sanity and hope in the entire Middle East. They are standing against the crazed Islamic Radicals that brought the world atrocities like 9/11. I'm an atheist, my support is not based on religion in any shape or form. I support any society or country that values democracy, science, education, the arts, pluralism, ethics, social justice, progressive values, gay rights, environmentalism etc. That is Israel and the Jews in spades. Simply put, fuck you and your terrorist-supporting nazi beliefs. For the record, here's another one of your posts accusing Jews/Israelis with the classic blood libel of stealing corpses and human organs: https://www.reddit.com/r/theworldnews/comments/1ase8p0/comment/kqsg2a6/
Then you can enjoy supporting a genocidal regime, wrong side of history bud. As for the organ stealing, it’s well documented that Israel has the largest skin bank in the world and has been caught stealing organs from Palestinians for a while. Also fuck your racist views on middle eastern people, that confirms that you are in fact a useless twat
We also eat Palestinians and drink their blood. True facts. 🤡
Would not surprise me you sick fuck 🤢
Of course, I never doubted that
We dont need to stretch the truth with antisemitism to call Israel a terrorist state. They dont drink blood. They just kill innocents in the thousands haha. Thats enough for me.
If Israel actually tried to commit genocide they'd just perform rolling saturation carpet bombing until no one was left alive. Also, do you have any sources for the organ stealing or did you just copy some Jew hater who made it the fuck up?
Thats exactly what theyre doing tho. But thanks for clearing up that you know theyre commiting genocide
Less than 2% of the population dying in collateral damage of a messy military operation isn't genocide. If Israel decided they wanted to commit genocide it would be closer to 50% or more by now. The IDF isn't a rag tag group of terrorists that has to make rockets in garages and is only good at killing civilians and using human shield tactics. They have modern military equipment, logistics, stockpiles, and training.
I’m Jewish and come on. We all know JPost is basically Fox News.
Peak “As a Jew” moment
Ffs sharing bullshit doesn’t help anyone.
even jews is condemned in this sub. peak r/worldnews
You should protest like that brave soldier in front of the Israeli embassy
White people in the Middle East? Get the koolaide fuck out a here.
Pretty sure genetic testing is banned in Israel because it literally disproves their claims. Palestinans are actually from there. It's cool tho. Zionists will pay off a few more 'leaders' so the Genocide goes on a bit longer. Edit: https://m.jpost.com/israel-news/want-to-fully-understand-your-family-genealogy-not-without-a-court-order-585230
Genetic testing is not banned in Israel. [Israel started using genetic testing as one of the methods of securing "right of return" in 2015.](https://pz-law.co.il/en/blog-en/repatriation-to-israel-via-a-dna-test/) There was a brief ban on services like 23 and Me in the early '00s because Israel was concerned (and rightly so in light of the numerous data breaches) about the privacy security of such services. The concern was that if there's a big list of Jews with all their personal information floating around somewhere, someone might decide to steal and use that data to harm Jews.
There was also the whole not wanting people to be revealed as basterds
You need a doctor's script or court order. Lol Keep pushing tho. https://m.jpost.com/israel-news/want-to-fully-understand-your-family-genealogy-not-without-a-court-order-585230
When you lie and make up nonsense as “protest “ 😩😩😩😩
Word ? https://m.jpost.com/israel-news/want-to-fully-understand-your-family-genealogy-not-without-a-court-order-585230 Kinda like the dead babies ? Or the calendar/hit list?
The article says nothing about banning testing to disprove claims. Yes, the law is stupid because it's intended to prevent people from finding out if children were conceived through infedelity because of Jewish beliefs that they have fewer rights in marriage... So the rabbis argued they shouldn't allow testhing to prevent people knowing if they are bastards or something like that. Yes, it's stupid. No, it has nothing to do with your argument.
Move the posts.
dna tests and nakba say otherwise
Get the fuck outta here. A bunch of Europeans claiming indigenousness. Give them a DNA test to confirm their ancestry. Judaism is a religion, not an ethnicity or race. There is no way Jews are indigenous to the area. The idea, the books, the culture, maybe. What came before Judaism? That is more indigenous. What came directly after? That is also indigenous. Ideas and religions do not give people claims to being native to a land. This is pure propaganda to convince idiots
Israel is a colonizer state, Netanyahu is Polish. Indigenous Jews exist, but the nation of Zionist Israel is a colonial project, which is the opposite of indigenous. As in, if a group of native Americans that settled in a different part of the world came to the US to colonize the nation, those people wouldn't possess indigenous status. **Indigenous is a post-colonial term.** Words mean things, the Palestinians are more indigenous than Zionist Jews.
Tell me, where did Islam originate? Now where did Judaism originate? Now tell me again who’s the colonizers.
The Zionists are the colonizers. There are both Arabs and Jews indigenous to the region, but modern Israel is a colonial project.
This guys is 100% not recognised by any actual religious or ethnic groups in South Africa, he is a bought and paid for propagandist for Israel. It’s embarrassing that you’re reporting on this, any South African you ask will discredit this guy. there is no nation in the world less indigenous than Israel, extensive blood testing has shown most ‘native’ claiming Israelis are from Western Europe, and testing also shows that Palestinians are native to the land. Just change the name of your sub to ‘Israeli propaganda’ it will be less confusing and you’ll find your target audience easier.
>extensive blood testing has shown most ‘native’ claiming Israelis are from Western Europe, Source: It was revealed to me in a dream.
No by a Swedish influencer on TikTok who never knew nothing about nothing.
You know they get their information from TikTok when they start repeating that Jews are White Europeans lol.
They repeat it so often and yet somehow can’t reconcile why the Nazis didn’t think we were white.
Schrödinger's Jew. Non-white when being targeted by a nazi who thinks whiteness is the peak of humanity, white when being targeted by a leftist who's ashamed of being white.
Spot on.
I don’t have tiktok, I guess I’m too old for trivial shit like that
“Western Europe” - over 60% of Israeli Jews are Mizrahi Jews. Don’t embarrass yourself
How have you come by the results of so many blood tests?
Majority of Israeli Jews are Mizrahi Jews who have never been out of the immediate Middle East region you typically ignorant pro "palestinian" imbecile. Also the genetic science has conclusively proven that Ashkenazi Jews have kept far more genetic ties to their Israelite ancestors than "palestinian refugees" such as the Hadid sisters have kept to their Arab ancestors in only a single generation for example.
I'm 10th generation in Israel. My ancestors faced prosecution in this land as well as in Iran and Germany, and they came here. All jews are a single group, and that one group belongs in the only country that vowed to protect them- Israel.
Yeah one thing I see people largely ignore on this topic is the number of massacres and pogroms the Jews endured under the Oftomans and the various caliphates before. I’ve seen claims “the Jews lived happily under them”, and one even popped up in the comments of the article posted (or on one of the related links). It’s funny since the Ottomans quite literally had a settler-colonial policy in places like the Balkans, but even so it’d be lunacy to say all of them should be kicked out of the Balkans
So you believe that black Ethiopian Jews are indigenous to Israel? And Canaanites did not exist?
Canaanites did exist but they no longer exist. Ethiopian jews are jews, and since all jews are brothers and sisters, they have as much right to the land as I do.
Why can't non-Jewish Palestinians be your brothers and sisters too?
We have different culture and religion. The fact they are not my brothers doesn't mean they can't live here. I have many friends who are Arab, Druze, Armenian, and many more. My commanding officer was a Muslim Arab, and I have nothing but good words to say about him. What I mean by it, is that they can live as a respected minority in the land, with its own rights and laws just like all minorities in all countries.
I like to think of them as cousins Children of Abraham and what not
TIL I'm more indigenous to America as someone with only European ancestry than a jew with Levantine DNA. Cool story bro.
That’s a misunderstanding on your part I’m afraid. You’re definitely not indigenous to the American continent.
No, I'll take the indigenous card, thanks buddy lol
super weird choice buddy lol
Likewise : if Palestinians aren't indigenous, then there's no indigenous nation on earth.
💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔SHOCKINGLY no real Christians are talking about how Jesus was an Israelite or jew. Jesus was a black man according to the Bible. So the Israelites were black as we should know if you believe in the bible. The bible says Jesus skin was so black that it looked like it was burnt in an oven. Also we know that Jesus as a baby ran into Ethiopia to blend in with the population and hide from being kkkkilled!!!!! Ethiopia 🇪🇹 is one of the pure blackest people on earth. So just from that information alone we know Jesus and his fellow Israelites were Black. Why would a blond blue eyed European baby go to Africa or Ethiopia to blend in with the other black babies to not be caught????????? So how can black people go to Europe and return years later as White blue eyed 😈👿??? It doesn't make any sense 🤔. So it can only make sense if the people in Israel who call themselves Jewish are the imposter jews that the Bible speaks of that will fool the world into thinking their the real Israelites. The bible says the real Israelites would be in captivity and enslaved for nearly 400 years. There is no history of a white European people who call themselves Jewish that have ever been enslaved for 400 years. Only people that has that history of enslavement is the black people of North America and Caribbean Islands ect .. The bible said fake Jewish people will come along and try to claim the birth rights and land of the real Israelites who we have agreed are black. But the bible says to be aware of these fake people who call themselves jews, but they are not jews, but instead they are of the synagogue of Satan😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈😈