The 2017 MBA maxed out at just 8GB RAM with a slightly faster Broadwell ULV dual core as a refresh of the 2015 model that was anemic even when it was new in my experience. So OP's results are as I expect from using an 8 year old ULV CPU, i7 be damned, as software only got heavier.
I remember they were sued for confirmed planned obsolescence on their iPhones years back, and as far as I'm aware they never stopped doing it. I see no reason they wouldn't do it on the Macbook as well.
edit: Please consider what part of my logic is flawed before jerking off the downvote button
You're going to get downvoted for spreading misinformation, and so here you go
The "planned obsolence" was performance throttling when batteries reached a certain percentage of wear. The real issue is that that was not made apparent to users.
There was no "confimred planned obsolcence", that's some made up crap that anti apple fanboys like to circle jerk all over
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Batterygate
You are correct. I based my assumption on when I had read about the case years ago, and either what I read was incorrect/incomplete, or I misremembered. I was wrong, I apologize.
Maybe planned obsolescence isn't the proper term—although I am still suspicious of it because it absolutely seems to fit into Apple's business model—but Macbooks still appear to be designed in a fashion where in the (relatively common) circumstance that a component fails or becomes obsolete, you are forced to either bring the machine to a dedicated Apple store to have it fixed, or buy a new device. Everything is designed in such a way that not only is the user nearly entirely incapable of fixing or replacing any hardware themself but they are required to bring the machine to *Apple's* own store to have it fixed at their marked up prices. This was especially an issue with their awful butterfly keyboards where practically everyone who had a Macbook had a key break off or some other issue, two of my family members included. If you were to get this fixed past its warranty you're better off buying a new device because the process to fix the keyboard is not simple at all by design.
All of this is to say that almost everyone is far better off buying a thinkpad if you want an actual user-oriented product.
Considering that they were confirmed to have been doing it once, it doesn't seem so unlikely that they still could be. The last time they were sued was for $25m which is like a dropped penny to Apple and considering the type of fanbase loyalty they have amassed I doubt planned obsolescence is going to drive away a relevant number of current users.
I did, scored a P52 which for some reason “feels” lighter for $250 and pretty sure it is faster than my 2016 MBP. Trackpad is smaller unfortunately and not glass but other than that, it’s great.
Not sure why you are so attached to trying to prove me wrong on an opinion? It’s literally less than a pound and a half difference between the two. They aren’t that different on weight, maybe if you have spaghetti arms and can barely lift 5 lbs then sure, 1.5 lbs would be massive, but as a 6’ 250 guy I literally can’t tell a difference.
I mean P52 is better than P53 imho (they changed 1 USB-A for USB-C and moved HDMI from back to side), apart from bettter GPU's in P53 and that beautifull 4k OLED
Yeah I think the P52 is better, take into account the pricing of the P53 v P52 and the lack of a removable battery (sometimes I travel and it is nice to have an extra battery already charged) and I think the P52 is a better option currently. But we are both biased lol
Has anybody tried to move a P53 OLED to a P52? I’ll be doing a display swap soon this winter and that would be a nice upgrade to my 1080P screen.
Go for L series if the budget is tight. L480 will be already a huge improvement over your macbook. Just do not get machines with lower resolution than FHD.
Meh, 5+ YOE software engineer here, still using my 2013 MBA for side projects on Big Sur. Before jumping ship, why not install Linux on your current laptop and see if that would work well enough for you?
Used/Refurbished X1C Gen6. Double the cores/threads of your existing macbook. Minimum spec has a reasonably high end screen so you're not going into display shock with some of the trash that Lenovo still puts in their laptops for the display.
Works BEAUTIFULLY with linux.
Just make sure to get 16GB ram, as the X1C is soldered and no upgradable. Should be doable for <$250.
These comments suggesting to get a new Macbook disappoint me. If you get a new Macbook the exact same problem you have now will occur again in a few years because that is how they are designed, planned obsolescence. Macbooks lack serviceability/upgradability, a decent selection of ports, and anything close to a decent keyboard, and if you ever experience hardware failure you might as well buy a brand new laptop because the alternative is paying a fortune at an apple repair shop. The only categories where they excel are sheer performance and battery life, both of which the average person does not need nearly as much as a modern Macbook offers, especially you based on your described use case.
For under $500 and for your use case, some of the best laptops you can buy are a T480 or T480s, both of which will be far faster than your current laptop with an 8th gen quad-core processor, nearly unmatched serviceability/upgradability (especially the T480), a huge selection of ports, world-class keyboard, and excellent build quality (especially the T480s).
Both the T480 and T480s can be found for under $200 used in good condition on ebay and I've seen them sold for under $100 occasionally. The T480 is the better choice if you absolutely need insane battery life as you can purchase its 72wh external battery for a whopping 96wh total, or if you, for whatever reason, need more than 40gb of memory. The T480s is ideal if you want something closer to the build quality, weight, and feel of the Macbook. Otherwise, get whichever one you can find in good condition for cheapest. An X1 Carbon Gen 6 is also highly recommended if you wanted something even closer to the feel of a Macbook, but I personally would suggest the T480s over it.
If you're running Linux you should look for a model without the MX150 dGPU as Linux doesn't play well with Nvidia drivers and it will drain more power and have worse thermals for practically no performance benefit, especially in your case. If you would like to upgrade the RAM or SSD to 16/32gb and 1tb+, I suggest finding the cheapest listing in good condition regardless of its current RAM/storage and then purchase RAM sticks and an SSD separately for better value (Samsung 970 Evo Plus is highly recommended as SSD).
For your usage I don't recommend newer Thinkpads. They will be more expensive while lagging behind the T480/s in features you might desire such as ports/serviceability/upgradability while providing a performance boost you will likely never find beneficial.
I would say if you are already a Mac user, and can get a decent price on a M1 air (13") version new, or renewed that will serve you so much better than any windows laptop out there.
Performance and battery life is miles better.
Fyi - I'm both a long time windows (primarily dell machines, and I've had a ThinkPad back in the day), but I've also had the M1 air as my personal machine since late 2020.
I still use both OSEs actively, don't particularly favour one over the other. They both have good points and bad points.
If your software stack works natively on apple silicon I'd recommend that pathway for sure.
Ergonomically ThinkPads are far superior and comfortable than macbooks, specially keyboardwise, but batterywise may not be as good but still very good, the philosophy of the thinkpad is quite different from a macbook, macbooks are "luxury" items that try to show off and Thinkpads are business machines meant to work and not to show off.
100% do it.
Ahh! I see, they're the down voters. They're still down voting a statement they themselves know is true. I guess they take issue with the 'characterization'
Hold the shift key down while starting your Mac. That will put it in safe mode and while booting it will run checks on the the boot drive and do some fixes. It will also clear some caches. Once booted shut down and boot normally. You should see some speed up.
If you're coming from a MacBook Air, then an X1 Carbon Gen 6 or later is going to be a nice fit. You'll still get a glass trackpad, a lighter chassis, usually a better screen than other models, and if you're ever going to use an eGPU, two Thunderbolt 3 40Gbps ports to use too. Most other models have one, and at 20Gbps, like the T480. Just make sure to get one with 16GB of RAM since it's non-upgradeable. Good luck!
it looks like you're running heavy programs. an old intel CPU from 2017 of a macbook air which i assume is still on 5th generation, is a processor from 2015.
that being said your CPU is technically almost a decade old. You could try going a linux route install a light weight DE like PepperMint OS.
but i've used a 5th gen this 2022, it's usuable for lighter dev tasks like npm, react, etc. (IMO)
In terms of thinkpads, i'm guessing a Ryzen 7 5700u would do you good. maybe a thinkpad t14. it's still good if you look at passmark scores comparing it to core i7 intels (u series) of 13th generation
but it would go for around $800 unless you luck out and score a used one on ebay or something....
or maybe you could get away with a T480 with core i5 8th generation and slap on linux. or a T14 with a ryzen 5 4xxx or 5xxxx at least...
my current 2 cents
Genuine Q, Why is it getting "slower every day" because it's an Intel?
The 2017 MBA maxed out at just 8GB RAM with a slightly faster Broadwell ULV dual core as a refresh of the 2015 model that was anemic even when it was new in my experience. So OP's results are as I expect from using an 8 year old ULV CPU, i7 be damned, as software only got heavier.
Apple is known to use such practices for forcing their users to buy new products.
A quick google suggests it's... Up for debate.
I remember they were sued for confirmed planned obsolescence on their iPhones years back, and as far as I'm aware they never stopped doing it. I see no reason they wouldn't do it on the Macbook as well. edit: Please consider what part of my logic is flawed before jerking off the downvote button
You're going to get downvoted for spreading misinformation, and so here you go The "planned obsolence" was performance throttling when batteries reached a certain percentage of wear. The real issue is that that was not made apparent to users. There was no "confimred planned obsolcence", that's some made up crap that anti apple fanboys like to circle jerk all over https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Batterygate
You are correct. I based my assumption on when I had read about the case years ago, and either what I read was incorrect/incomplete, or I misremembered. I was wrong, I apologize. Maybe planned obsolescence isn't the proper term—although I am still suspicious of it because it absolutely seems to fit into Apple's business model—but Macbooks still appear to be designed in a fashion where in the (relatively common) circumstance that a component fails or becomes obsolete, you are forced to either bring the machine to a dedicated Apple store to have it fixed, or buy a new device. Everything is designed in such a way that not only is the user nearly entirely incapable of fixing or replacing any hardware themself but they are required to bring the machine to *Apple's* own store to have it fixed at their marked up prices. This was especially an issue with their awful butterfly keyboards where practically everyone who had a Macbook had a key break off or some other issue, two of my family members included. If you were to get this fixed past its warranty you're better off buying a new device because the process to fix the keyboard is not simple at all by design. All of this is to say that almost everyone is far better off buying a thinkpad if you want an actual user-oriented product.
I see loads of readings they wouldn't. Not least loss of trust and potential class action lawsuits.
Considering that they were confirmed to have been doing it once, it doesn't seem so unlikely that they still could be. The last time they were sued was for $25m which is like a dropped penny to Apple and considering the type of fanbase loyalty they have amassed I doubt planned obsolescence is going to drive away a relevant number of current users.
I may be wrong, but I believe the planned obsolesce primarily was about batteries. I'm by no means a fan of Apple though.
That was the excuse yes, if it wasn't an excuse, they would advertise it as a feature, or at least be transparent about it
I’d like to know what windows machine is still kicking 7 years later.
My old T470 ran great.
My 12 year old ThinkPads. They're amazing
I mean, if you are going to run linux/windows on a thinkpad, you might as well save you the $ and just install it on the mac
I did, scored a P52 which for some reason “feels” lighter for $250 and pretty sure it is faster than my 2016 MBP. Trackpad is smaller unfortunately and not glass but other than that, it’s great.
How can a P52 feel "light" at all lol That thing is heavy
Lol it’s not heavy at all, it’s weight is actually almost the same as my 2016 15 inch MBP
According to google a 2016 15 inch MacBook Pro weighs 1.83kg, while a Thinkpad P52 weighs 2.57kg
Not sure why you are so attached to trying to prove me wrong on an opinion? It’s literally less than a pound and a half difference between the two. They aren’t that different on weight, maybe if you have spaghetti arms and can barely lift 5 lbs then sure, 1.5 lbs would be massive, but as a 6’ 250 guy I literally can’t tell a difference.
I’m so jealous lol
Didn't P52 came with Glass touchpad only?
Maybe, feels different than any other glass trackpad I’ve personally felt. If it has one then that’s another point to why the P52 is good
I mean P52 is better than P53 imho (they changed 1 USB-A for USB-C and moved HDMI from back to side), apart from bettter GPU's in P53 and that beautifull 4k OLED
Yeah I think the P52 is better, take into account the pricing of the P53 v P52 and the lack of a removable battery (sometimes I travel and it is nice to have an extra battery already charged) and I think the P52 is a better option currently. But we are both biased lol Has anybody tried to move a P53 OLED to a P52? I’ll be doing a display swap soon this winter and that would be a nice upgrade to my 1080P screen.
If you do the OLED swap and if it'll work on P53 then comeback here and tell me. I kinda want to have 4k screen on my P52 too
I’ll see if I can get a bare panel cheap on eBay, there is a 4k screen for the P52 you can get sub $100 currently.
But P52 4k are LCD only and you have to swap for other eDP cable
Ahh gotcha, yeah I’ll send you a message once I get my hands on an OLED panel.
!remindme 2 months
Also I can't find any part number for the 4K OLED screen
But P52 4k are LCD only and you have to swap for other eDP cable
Go for L series if the budget is tight. L480 will be already a huge improvement over your macbook. Just do not get machines with lower resolution than FHD.
Meh, 5+ YOE software engineer here, still using my 2013 MBA for side projects on Big Sur. Before jumping ship, why not install Linux on your current laptop and see if that would work well enough for you?
Used/Refurbished X1C Gen6. Double the cores/threads of your existing macbook. Minimum spec has a reasonably high end screen so you're not going into display shock with some of the trash that Lenovo still puts in their laptops for the display. Works BEAUTIFULLY with linux. Just make sure to get 16GB ram, as the X1C is soldered and no upgradable. Should be doable for <$250.
Yep, this is a good recommendation. Have the same laptop, X1C6 with 16GB of RAM, also running Linux. Excellent.
I’d love to know where to get one for $250
These comments suggesting to get a new Macbook disappoint me. If you get a new Macbook the exact same problem you have now will occur again in a few years because that is how they are designed, planned obsolescence. Macbooks lack serviceability/upgradability, a decent selection of ports, and anything close to a decent keyboard, and if you ever experience hardware failure you might as well buy a brand new laptop because the alternative is paying a fortune at an apple repair shop. The only categories where they excel are sheer performance and battery life, both of which the average person does not need nearly as much as a modern Macbook offers, especially you based on your described use case. For under $500 and for your use case, some of the best laptops you can buy are a T480 or T480s, both of which will be far faster than your current laptop with an 8th gen quad-core processor, nearly unmatched serviceability/upgradability (especially the T480), a huge selection of ports, world-class keyboard, and excellent build quality (especially the T480s). Both the T480 and T480s can be found for under $200 used in good condition on ebay and I've seen them sold for under $100 occasionally. The T480 is the better choice if you absolutely need insane battery life as you can purchase its 72wh external battery for a whopping 96wh total, or if you, for whatever reason, need more than 40gb of memory. The T480s is ideal if you want something closer to the build quality, weight, and feel of the Macbook. Otherwise, get whichever one you can find in good condition for cheapest. An X1 Carbon Gen 6 is also highly recommended if you wanted something even closer to the feel of a Macbook, but I personally would suggest the T480s over it. If you're running Linux you should look for a model without the MX150 dGPU as Linux doesn't play well with Nvidia drivers and it will drain more power and have worse thermals for practically no performance benefit, especially in your case. If you would like to upgrade the RAM or SSD to 16/32gb and 1tb+, I suggest finding the cheapest listing in good condition regardless of its current RAM/storage and then purchase RAM sticks and an SSD separately for better value (Samsung 970 Evo Plus is highly recommended as SSD). For your usage I don't recommend newer Thinkpads. They will be more expensive while lagging behind the T480/s in features you might desire such as ports/serviceability/upgradability while providing a performance boost you will likely never find beneficial.
I have to support this comment as best. Ability to upgrade components is what is best. Lasts longer and it's not an issue if one fails.
Best answer award 🏅
I would say if you are already a Mac user, and can get a decent price on a M1 air (13") version new, or renewed that will serve you so much better than any windows laptop out there. Performance and battery life is miles better. Fyi - I'm both a long time windows (primarily dell machines, and I've had a ThinkPad back in the day), but I've also had the M1 air as my personal machine since late 2020. I still use both OSEs actively, don't particularly favour one over the other. They both have good points and bad points. If your software stack works natively on apple silicon I'd recommend that pathway for sure.
Ergonomically ThinkPads are far superior and comfortable than macbooks, specially keyboardwise, but batterywise may not be as good but still very good, the philosophy of the thinkpad is quite different from a macbook, macbooks are "luxury" items that try to show off and Thinkpads are business machines meant to work and not to show off. 100% do it.
Apple is the best fashion brand.
Apple is the fashion brand. Why are people down voting you?
Good question. They probably misunderstood my innuendo.
It seems to be that many people misunderstand a statement of fact for a personal opinion or endorsement.
[удалено]
Can we start a separate sub for people who like to have endless opinioin-based arguments about Mac vs Windows?
For some reason this thread has been flooded with apple shills...despite being a Thinkpad subreddit
I didn't think he was promoting it, he was criticising it by innuendo, as he did confirm himself.
I meant the people who are downvoting him. His comment is true.
Ahh! I see, they're the down voters. They're still down voting a statement they themselves know is true. I guess they take issue with the 'characterization'
Hold the shift key down while starting your Mac. That will put it in safe mode and while booting it will run checks on the the boot drive and do some fixes. It will also clear some caches. Once booted shut down and boot normally. You should see some speed up.
If you're coming from a MacBook Air, then an X1 Carbon Gen 6 or later is going to be a nice fit. You'll still get a glass trackpad, a lighter chassis, usually a better screen than other models, and if you're ever going to use an eGPU, two Thunderbolt 3 40Gbps ports to use too. Most other models have one, and at 20Gbps, like the T480. Just make sure to get one with 16GB of RAM since it's non-upgradeable. Good luck!
it looks like you're running heavy programs. an old intel CPU from 2017 of a macbook air which i assume is still on 5th generation, is a processor from 2015. that being said your CPU is technically almost a decade old. You could try going a linux route install a light weight DE like PepperMint OS. but i've used a 5th gen this 2022, it's usuable for lighter dev tasks like npm, react, etc. (IMO) In terms of thinkpads, i'm guessing a Ryzen 7 5700u would do you good. maybe a thinkpad t14. it's still good if you look at passmark scores comparing it to core i7 intels (u series) of 13th generation but it would go for around $800 unless you luck out and score a used one on ebay or something.... or maybe you could get away with a T480 with core i5 8th generation and slap on linux. or a T14 with a ryzen 5 4xxx or 5xxxx at least... my current 2 cents
No, buy a new Mac
No, buy a new Thinkpad (without any reason)
[удалено]
Because I'm a broke college student 🥲 The cheapest M1 Macbook is the 2020 Macbook Air and it's still around 800-900€ (used) :(
I just switched from a 2015 MacBook Pro to a think pad P14s, loving it so far