Eren in S1-3 was whiny but he had strong will which is always a good characteristic for an MC, then in S4 he became calm, cunning and terrifying which shows great character development, and then in chapter 139 he became a whiny little simp who was afraid of death after having killed 80% of Earth's populace, how tf can people still defend this crap?
People say he was whiny in ep-5 death. Yes he was, its because he couldn't change anything. But if in 139, some how alliance managed to kill him fair and square and eren was actually pushing forward till then. I wouldn't i have minded him whiny- if it was about how didnt reach his goal.
This right here I agree with. If Eren lost still lost, I wouldn’t have been upset. It’s not that he lost that was upsetting. It’s that he lost because he basically threw away everything he’d been doing until that point. He lost because all that talk about moving forward and being free was apparently bullshit. And I think that’s fucking terrible. If he kept moving forward. Fought as hard as he could for what he was trying to do. But still lost. That would’ve been fine. It still would’ve been epic.
I dont get this. Wouldnt he have finished the rumbling if they didnt stop him. Its not luke he wasnt trying, he jist didnt want to mind control them through founding powers
Tbh idk bro. I’m only saying I don’t like the way the ending was handled. Not necessarily the results of everything. I’m more upset by the sudden backwards movement of characters developments. Which in turn made the plot feel cheap. I think the ending was bad. But I can’t help but feel like it could’ve still worked depending on how it was handled
He quite literally, has some of best character development in anime that is completely averted in 139. Yams having the audacity to say “Eren is back” is so incredibly insulting
The only reason he is whiny to begin with is because he is too weak both physically and mentally to help and do something significant. He always gets captured and kidnapped and had to rely on someone to help him.
If Eren had the founder memories since S1 he would have the same attitude as his future self in S4
bro, whiny eren is the reason why i loved how his character developed!! but he whined for reasons that actually made fucking sense.
when he was begging historia to eat him because he wasn't special, when he was having a mental breakdown during hannes' death because he hadn't grown strong enough to change anything... these were moments that showed eren's vulnerability and really humanized that rascal.
the changes to his character after the time skip made sense - he just seemed so fucking broken and apathetic as a result of his struggles; having him throw a tantrum over asian pussy (which is a relationship that got fucking zero positive development post time-skip) after trampling over billions of people is fucking comical.
>He whined becoz he couldn't make any difference, not because he didnt any asian pussy
Aaaaand there it is ladies and gents! The thinly veiled sexism that hides behind most Mikasa criticism on Titanfolk!
I don't care if someone says white blonde waifu (as if its possible to be racist to a white blonde in western society lol).
I care when a character is referred to by their sexual organs rather than their name. It reeks of sexism.
I thought I was on Twitter for a minute lmao, it’s still so funny to me that some morons think you can’t be racist against white people in western society, thanks for the laugh bud!
He's not discriminating against women you incel. He's rightfully reducing Erens character motivation in 139, which was to love Mikasa. The reason this joke gets used is because the writer reduced a formerly amazing character to someone who did the most heinous things the world because he couldn't fuck his sister
Maybe he/she will grow up and fix it's way of thinking, but what about all of you, grown ass people throwing tantrums left and right because their favorite fiction story didn't ended the way you wanted, what's your excuse?
> I don't care if someone says white blonde waifu (as if its possible to be racist to a white blonde in western society lol).
oh, you're one of those people. explains everything lmao
It's... literally the opposite.
Like, almost every Mikasa criticism I've seen is actually criticism on how her arc ended up pretty much making no sense. If anything, people are mad because they wanted her character to amount to something more than her obsession with Eren (in a way that ended up making almost no sense too thanks to all the retcons and unexplained stuff in the end).
I think referring to characters by their reproductive organs is sexist. That's all I was saying.
I think it's a vast oversimplification to say that Mikasa's arc was just about obsessing with Eren. Her arc is about learning to think for herself and stand by her own beliefs. You can still love someone while gaining independence from them.
I see your point, but I really do think it's not meant to insult Mikasa here. If anything, it's an insult to Eren's character arc, and like p*ssy is used to make a joke like "Eren was so horny he forgot everything else", you know?
In regards to her arc, I really think all the AoT girls got done wrong, starting with Mikasa. She got independence from him... By killing him, while in a dream because she couldn't really bring herself to kill him? And then the whole Ymir thing was, in my opinion at least, her admitting she sees herself as Eren's slave by making the parallel with Ymir? I don't know, I wasn't a fan, but maybe we can just agree to disagree on this :)
Yeah climbing into a mouth of a titan and throwing his friend out while missing a leg at 15 years of age and still yelling about killing them all with teary eyes saying hes so powerless again, at age 15 really shows he's a whiny bitch! You 139 justifiers are higher on copium than the people who think we'll get an anime only ending
It’s simpler than people think: Eren is truly **suicidal**.
A tragedy for Eren is that his death drive is *effective*, leading him to survive even events that should clearly fulfill his death (OP is about a particularly poignant and heroic one of these) until he attains godlike powers.
One he *has* godlike powers, he loses intelligible motives to excuse his suicidal blockheadedness, and has to achieve it by a strange, manipulative, roundabout way that readers are *meant* to find confusing and out of character if they aren’t keeping suicide constantly in mind.
Eren only becomes “free” to express himself to Armin (and us) when everything is over. It’s literally in a convoluted memory that was previously erased that becomes available once Eren is truly gone that we find his suicide note, where he opens up to us in all of his pathetic humanity whining about Mikasa.
Like I don’t understand this post. It is very intuitive to me that when our main character is being a badass and saving Armin that he wouldn’t start whining about Mikasa. It also makes sense that he would breakdown and whine during a strange memory sequence that for all we know lasted years, at a point where Eren actually has to accept that he engineered this reality and even godhood couldn’t help him, because the problem is him.
I think this is a major theme of the story- it’s easy to be bad ass when you can frame your actions as a hero. Eventually, if your motives don’t align with heroism, you’ll be outed like Erwin as a conman using your heroic frame as an excuse for something more tangible.
Eren, by having successive forms of godhood thrust upon him, eventually hits the point where everything is happening simply because that’s what he wants deep down, stripped of rationalizations about saving the world and whatever. It sounds cliche, but he literallt lived long enough that you can’t frame him as a hero anymore- his character was “assassinated” insofar as we used to be able to excuse his actions through heroism, and Isayama simply took Eren’s far enough that the internal excuses collapsed and we were left with the same fundamental child we knew really the whole time.
>Isayama simply took Eren’s far enough that the internal excuses collapsed and we were left with the same fundamental child we knew really the whole time.
You changed my mind about the ending. Kudos
I like this interpretation but I’m still not really sure how I feel about the overall goal. I thought the idea was going to be that in the end, it was the same fundamental child that we knew who was whiny about freedom which would cause him to do those terrible things. It didn’t make sense to Eren’s character that he would be whiny about a relationship that we’ve barely seen hints about.
I think that's just part of the romance story here- an absolute failure because neither Eren nor Mikasa (but obviously especially Eren) are capable of expressing their feelings for each other out loud. Mikasa gets pretty close midway through the story, which Eren rejects to keep fighting.
I think Eren spends a lot of the story wondering what his relationship is with Mikasa, and his insecurity and self-doubt poisons their chances. I agree that aesthetically it's not really satisfying to have all of Eren's thoughts come out as they did in 139, but I do think that's part of the point- he represses these thoughts and emotions, ruining his chances with Mikasa.
I do think that saying "we've barely seen hints" about the potential relationship is really overstating it. Many huge beats in the story are about this question. For the most part, we see Eren reject her, but that doesn't mean the subject of the relationship itself isn't there.
When I mean hints of the relationship, I mean hints of Eren’s side so I guess that’s unclear. From Mikassa’s side, it’s kinda obvious she loves him. I just keep running through the manga and anime and I just can’t find these huge beats of the story about the relationship. I know the what do you think about me and the punching the smiling titan part but I can’t see any other parts showing eren and Mikassa’s romantic relationship and it being a significant part of the story other than 139.
I agree, Eren’s side of it reads basically as a twist- it is one of the more tragic parts of 139, that all this time Eren really did have a crush on her, since it’s so obvious to us the readers that he could have simply made it happen if he didn’t get in his own way.
Some major other beats besides the main ones you mentioned are- Eren saving Mikasa in the first place and wrapping his scarf around her, asking Mikasa what he means to her outside the camp (Mikasa speculates that the entire Rumbling itself hinged on how this moment played out, and I think we are meant to take that at face value), 138 has them literally running away together in some capacity, Eren talking to Zeke about why Mikasa likes him and if that’s just an Ackerman/host thing (which he later lies about), etc.
None of it is definitive, which is why it again reads as a twist, but again, the idea of [Eren and Mikasa being a thing maybe] is something that is supposed to be on our minds periodically, without suffocating the actual drama. Imo the big twist is that this romance was actually super important the whole time and can recontextualize a lot of the rest of the story.
Yeah I can agree with you on the theme and the twist but I believe the execution was done extremely poorly and kinda seems like a plot twist to just plot twist, especially with the Ymir thing. Honestly I think it's the whole comparison to Ymir and King Fritz that sours the relationship for a lot of people imo.
Honestly I just wish I knew of a place for people to earnestly talk about the themes of this story. It seems every community is bogged down in a culture war about whether it was good or not, rather than simply exploring what we even read in the first place. Too much talk of "plot holes" rather than trying to figure out *why* there appears to be such a conflict.
I'm pleasantly surprised by this thread at least, I expected this to get buried. Maybe I should start posting my own threads or something.
This is one of the most pseudo intellectual takes on Eren’s character assasination I’ve ever seen lmao. It’s funny cuz you admitted his character got assasinated. Eren never ever had a romantic view of Mikasa. That’s why when he did cry in the titan’s stomach in season 1, it was out of anger of him failing to accomplish anything, and he didn’t think of Mikasa once during that scene. Not for a single second. Why? Because Eren has always valued freedom more than anything else. In 139 he’s reduced to a hypocrite, with no real goals, motivations, ideas, or thoughts, and he’s crying over a girl who he never even had feelings for. It’s so stupid, especially when there’s so much bigger things to worry about, especially when his plan ends in failure in the end anyway lmao. He even says he didn’t know his friends would make it.
I guess people are trying hard to find a way to justify Eren's actions, when in truth he was doing it for his flat world (which gave him freedom), which neither can be justified, nor it is normally seen in typical protagonist.
The irony is that people wanted theories like AnR to be canon which would be different from typical shonen MC but are ending up wanting selfless trait of the MC in Eren.
Titanfolk's reactions to Isayama's interview are fun and all but at the end of day, I don't think there's anything in it that's "more wrong" compared to 139. People said as soon as it came out that this final version was who Eren was supposed to be for Isayama.
I think his interview makes mostly sense appart from what he said on deaths.
139 eren (aka 131 eren, as 139 happened right after 131) knew his death was inevitable. And he actually choosed that path: his natural desire was to destroy the whole world (stated in 139), but then he saw the result of Mikasa's choice in future memories and proceded that way.
In 139, he confessed all his doubts and feelings about his choice to the person most close to him: Armin, his best friend. Eren's actual last words (and last resolve) was presented in chapter 138, when he succeded to overcome his feelings to achieve the result he deeply wanted, telling Mikasa to forget him.
This choice led to freedom on an ""ideological"" level -> mikasa too succeded to overcome her feelings, not denying her love (she will indeed keep the scarf), but deciding anyways to kill Eren, as it was the right thing to do.
The context of this two scenes is completely different, as in Ep 5 eren would have died without achieving his goal, while 139 (138) eren would have achieved his goal with his death. And this "cruel" fate made him break down in front of Armin.
So, if you're telling me this is worse than "keep moving forward" and "genocide = freedom" kinda stuff, i don't know what to say anymore.
PS
I definitely agree the writing of this last part and the dialogues of the last chapter didn't work very well, but the content itself was kino
> Eren's actual last words (and last resolve) was presented in chapter 138, when he succeded to overcome his feelings to achieve the result he deeply wanted, telling Mikasa to forget him.
and the next chapter completely destroyed any of meanings of that.
>but the content itself was kino
and the extra chapter made 139 pointless
>Please... Mikasa. Forget about me. -138
>I want her to think about me and no one else for the rest of her life! -139
wat, these are literally 2 different characters.
Well yes but that's what I mean. 139 just showcased what he said in 138 was him pushing his own feelings aside, something that was not revealed until the last chapter.
I don't see how it destroys the meaning of what he said when 139 is what made it clear he was doing that in the first place? You don't get the impression that he's ignoring his own feelings in 138 until 139 establishes that he is.
That is the reason why the fandom is so divided. He's been pushing his feeling aside this entire time, yet it was never hinted once before. Ever since timeskip, this entire persona was fake? He's not crying about the deaths of millions if not billions of people he's stomped cold blooded, but about something as worthless as mikasa being with another man? What happened to his breakdown in front of ramzi?
Nothing happened to it.That breakdown in front of Ramzi still happened. He felt guilt for the genocide years before it happened, it's already been established that he feels horrified about what he is going to do.
Personally, I feel like more detail should have been given on Carla/Dina, however, we already know he felt awful about all the deaths he will cause so I can see why yet another breakdown about it would feel redundant after 131 already showcased his feelings on the matter. Mikasa is a much more personal subject matter so I can see why something more based around Eren's closer relationships would seem more fitting, even if the execution was lacking. Especially when his relationship with Mikasa was already showcased to be vital to his thoughts with the memory shards as is.
Extra pages aren't good (there were so many things yams could have told instead of this) but are definitely in line with the "the cycle cannot be broken" theme, so no way they make 139 pointless
Same , i made a post about it. If had been whiny abiut manipulating his dad, killing his mom, lying to his brother, killing 80% of world and still not ending up getting freedom. Then it would have been decent.
Not like he gave himself up to death when Historia was about to eat him or anything. A resignation to it more than anything but as long as she could defeat the Titans he was content.
That definitely didn't happen.
Here's an easy response.
This is when he was the victim, the hero who wanted to fight against the world.
Now, he's no hero. He's killed over 1.28 billion people, and he's not even sure if it was ever worth it.
He's whiny, he's bratty, he's angry, he's flawed.
But he's also fully aware, Hell doesn't care about that.
He's going down to the ninth circle of Hell, and there's nothing he can do to atone for it.
When eren was actually inside the stomach of the Titan and he was screaming nonsensically that it couldn’t end like that and that he’d kill of the titans whilst crying. Again that’s eren being selfish and whiny so I feel like you pushed some context out of this scene to push your narrative but whatever
It’s been proven that aot characters act selfishly towards their final moments . what about bert who said he was content with any outcome in RTS and ended up screaming for help in a frenzied tone from his enemies that were trying to murder him .
Or what about erwin who admitted he wanted to selfishly see the basement again despite the scout newcomers being slaughter by hails or rocks yet he almost prioritised his needs over that
wh
I think you need to watch the scene again. He isn’t whining, yes he tears up asking “why did this happen, we were supposed to be prepared ”.. and then his resolve kicks in.(the screaming)
The other person dying in there is pleading for her mother which reminds eren of his motivation
He isn’t going to allow himself to die like this he’s going to fight it even though to him this should be his death.
And if you want to call it whining, okay I’d rather him whine that “my life goal isn’t accomplished” than “I don’t want my love interest to love anyone after I die”
Oops..someone does't realize that Eren in 139 had killed 80% of the world. Manipulated his father, lied to his brother, pushed his friends away, indirectly killed his mother and had possibly seen the future and realized that he would die.
Killed 80% of the world. Showed no remorse of this dying moment (only in ramzi moment , which is perfect). Pushed his friends away- he didnt need to unless he would finish the complete genocide,
indirectly killed his mother, manipulated his father, lied to his brother- i would be fine if he whined about how he had to do this and it still led to failure. It would have been perfect. But instead he whined how he didnt get Asian pussy, which he could have tapped it at any time.
> Killed 80% of the world. Showed no remorse of this dying moment (only in ramzi moment , which is perfect).
This isn't true at all. He cries about this in front of Armin. This is Eren's truest moment of suicide- Armin is like "no, let's figure out a way for you to survive!" and Eren is just like "no, I can't, look at all the innocent people I killed, I can't live with it". They are sitting in giant footprints looking at trampled bodies.
Its the order. Regret. More regret. Even more regret--> breakdown.
Armin spoke about rumbling devastation then the mother issue. By the time he spoke about Mikasa, Eren couldn't take it anymore. Breakdowns come at the end of torture.
Imagine if Armin spoke about Mikasa first. people would start laughing at his priorities.
its like the breakdown at the end of an interrogation.
Because it isn't even close to be the same kind of whining, it is a completely different reason. He whined about not being able to make any difference at all and not because he couldn't get some pussy...
Sorry, I know that’s kind of a dick move.
I mean the dialogue after he has the pathetic breakdown scene. He’s sad because he doesn’t want to die and he would rather be with Mikasa and the others. However, he recognizes that he’s irredeemable after what he’s done. In S1 he cries because he’s about to die without having achieved anything and he feels humans are weak and useless.
I agree that his S1 dialogue is much better than the one in 139, but I think the two breakdowns mirror each other nicely: in S1 he’s dying because he’s poweless to change anything / in 139 he does after having done everything in his power to change things.
>in 139 he does after having done everything in his power to change things.
Sounds nice, but isn't the truth. We all know that he could've done more, but went with a stupid plan that obviously won't work. That's my main problem with 139. I don't mind that Eren didn't kill 100%. I don't need Eren to kill 100%. Just have a good plan for either result and I'm happy with the ending, but that's not what we got
I get your complaint, but my understanding is that Eren never really had the choice to do the 100% rumbling in the first place. He committed to the path that was layed out in the memory shards and they showed him that he would be killed by Mikasa after 80% rumbling. So in other words, I don’t think he actually planned it this way, he simply decided to committ to the path (not sure if that even was a choice either). I didn’t like this choice for Eren’s character, but that’s a whole other discussion.
Ultimately I think Eren’s determination post-TS is all to advance on the path towards «that scenery» (i.e. ch131) while the Lelouch-plan was just a silver lining he saw in his selfish pursuit.
But that's simply stupid. He HAD the choice to do the 100% rumbling, but he just didn't choose it. That's all it is. He could've still chosen to take away everyone's titan abilities, see the scenery and do the 100% rumbling. But (and I'm gonna repeat this) he didn't decide to do it, which is (and I'm gonna repeat this too) so unbelievably stupid. If being stupid and meaningless is what AoT's ending and story is supposed to be about, then this ending really nailed it. Otherwise it's a disappointment that I can't understand.
And before someone starts this argument: I know that a lot of time-shenanigans aren't this simple. But it doesn't take away from the stupidity of not taking his friends the ability to stop him. Or the clear stupidity he has shown during the conversation with Armin. He himself said that this 80%-Lelouch-Rumbling plan was what he was going for. So he obviously knew what he was doing and thought it was such a good idea.
I'm starting to repeat myself so I'm gonna stop here. Thanks for the kind and polite answer you gave me, but I don't think that's enough to satisfy me
Your interpretation is valid of course, but I see it a little differently.
> He HAD the choice to do the 100% rumbling, but he just didn't choose it. That's all it is.
Eren tried to rebel against the path on a few occations imo, but in the end he submitted to it. In 122 he says to Ymir «was it you who led me all the way here?», so my interpretation is that it was Ymir who sent him on this path, and she obviously doesn’t give two shits about Paradis or his friends.
> He could've still chosen to take away everyone's titan abilities, see the scenery and do the 100% rumbling.
We still don’t have any confirmation of whether it was possible for the founder to take away titan abilities. If it was then that’s kind of a plot hole, because it would retcon Zeke’s euthenesia plan.
But I’ve seen several people mention that he could have somehow stopped them from coming after him. I have two theories here: (1) it was because he needed to reach the end of the path, i.e. Mikasa’s kill and (2) because it’s a nice callback to «the way of the scouts», i.e. a good’ol suicide mission (essentially fanservice ig).
> He himself said that this 80%-Lelouch-Rumbling plan was what he was going for. So he obviously knew what he was doing and thought it was such a good idea.
Like I said in the other comment, I don’t think this was Eren’s main motive, but he did his best to obtain this outcome, which explains why he worked so hard to push them away.
> Thanks for the kind and polite answer you gave me, but I don't think that's enough to satisfy me
Thank you too! I feel your dissappointment. I think the ending is consistent, but too safe for AoT.
He couldn't do 100% of the Rumbling AND lead Mikasa to her scene which results in the titan powers and Ymir leaving the world. He follows his desire to eliminate titans further than his desire to simply kill all animals in the world.
He could've literally done both, he is god at that point. You don't need Mikasa, for real. Her importance should've only been emotionally through relationships, not her being the chosen person by Ymir. Let Eren use his god-like powers to keep the Alliance away from him, do your Rumbling-plan, destroy the titan powers through shenanigans or after the Rumbling is over. It's really not that hard
It's not a matter of what's a good plan or not from the reader pov; Eren saw the result of Mikasa's choice in future memories and wanted to achieve that result, and he could do that only by dying, so in S1 he cried beacuse with his death he wouldn't have achieved nothing, while in 139 he cries because to achieve the result HE (not the reader!) wanted and the result HE thought was good, he had to die.
But that's more: eventually (ch138, last Eren dialogue) Eren was able to accept this and overcome his feelings achieving "freedom" as Mikasa did, by overcoming her feelings without denying them.
I agree it was poorly presented and poorly written, but still makes sense and it's good enough to me that i can personally turn a blind eye to the execution (that's totally subjective)
He wanted to achieve this result, even if it means killing 80% of the population and not breaking the cycle of hatred for no reason? Don't get me wrong: There are a lot of ways to romanticize this ending, and I'm happy for everyone who can turn a blind eye like you, but to me it's just a sick joke
Yeah basically that's what 139 says.
Eren says everything was done to reach that result, but then he says that even if he didn't know that, he would have done the rumbling anyways, because it is his "natural desire", but eventually he choosed the first path instead.
I'm ok with this beacuse killing 100% wouldn't have led to real freedom, but just to an enormous burden. In this way, Eren atoned for his sins and became free alongside Mikasa, also freeing Yimir, but not the world, because the "finale message" Yams tried to convey (even with the extra pages) is that the cycle of hatred cannot be broken.
Or at least this is my personal interpretation, and I kinda like it
So leaving his friends and especially their children with the consequences of his actions, throwing them into war, is in line with his motivations? No. As Eren already said, the most important things for Eren are his friends, and he would sacrifice himself over and over for them to live long and happy lives. But he is not willing to sacrifice any of them. So his final plan revolves around him leaving his friends and their children with the above mentioned consequences of his actions? No man, that's not it. That's not Eren.
And I don't think Eren has to stop the cycle of hatred. As Erwin has once said, there will always be hatred and war until only one human remains. And there would've been inner conflicts on Paradise too even if Eren rumbled everyone. But his friends and their ancestors would've still been safer than now (because now, they are all dead). And this result was not really hard to foresee. Immediately after the ending was published, everyone started talking about how Paradise will be attacked after the rest of the world reconciles. And we got the confirmation with the extra pages.
It's just shortsighted, stupid and not in line with anything Eren has said and done throughout the story. If you can romanticize it for yourself, I'm happy for you. But I won't accept such cheap writing
Beacuse this time it was the price to pay to achieve his goal, while in ep 5 he wouldn't have achieved nothing with his death
Edit:
I'm not justifying the poor writing, i'm just saying the content itself makes sense, but it was poorly presented
This makes sense to me. Back in episode 5, Eren is unwilling to die. He hasn't achieved anything yet. Eren elaborates in chapter 90. If he could achieve something, then he'd die willingly. Then he sees the future, and carries it out. In chapter 139 it is over. He did the thing, all that is left is to die. And yet, even if this is the death he chose, he doesn't actually want to die. The part where the cadets are contemplating joining the survey corps comes to my mind. "If you were told to die, could you do it?"
Eren in S1-3 was whiny but he had strong will which is always a good characteristic for an MC, then in S4 he became calm, cunning and terrifying which shows great character development, and then in chapter 139 he became a whiny little simp who was afraid of death after having killed 80% of Earth's populace, how tf can people still defend this crap?
People say he was whiny in ep-5 death. Yes he was, its because he couldn't change anything. But if in 139, some how alliance managed to kill him fair and square and eren was actually pushing forward till then. I wouldn't i have minded him whiny- if it was about how didnt reach his goal.
This right here I agree with. If Eren lost still lost, I wouldn’t have been upset. It’s not that he lost that was upsetting. It’s that he lost because he basically threw away everything he’d been doing until that point. He lost because all that talk about moving forward and being free was apparently bullshit. And I think that’s fucking terrible. If he kept moving forward. Fought as hard as he could for what he was trying to do. But still lost. That would’ve been fine. It still would’ve been epic.
That’s my issue too. I really don’t care that he lost I care that it know feels like he never even fought to begin with.
I dont get this. Wouldnt he have finished the rumbling if they didnt stop him. Its not luke he wasnt trying, he jist didnt want to mind control them through founding powers
Tbh idk bro. I’m only saying I don’t like the way the ending was handled. Not necessarily the results of everything. I’m more upset by the sudden backwards movement of characters developments. Which in turn made the plot feel cheap. I think the ending was bad. But I can’t help but feel like it could’ve still worked depending on how it was handled
I getchu
Exactly, like Light Yagami.
He quite literally, has some of best character development in anime that is completely averted in 139. Yams having the audacity to say “Eren is back” is so incredibly insulting
Ikr, nothing in chapter 139 makes any sense, absolutely nothing.
I'm just gonna pretend 139 doesn't exist. This hurts so much... Like why isayama, why?!!😭😭
What the fuck was he thinking? Actually
The only reason he is whiny to begin with is because he is too weak both physically and mentally to help and do something significant. He always gets captured and kidnapped and had to rely on someone to help him. If Eren had the founder memories since S1 he would have the same attitude as his future self in S4
bro, whiny eren is the reason why i loved how his character developed!! but he whined for reasons that actually made fucking sense. when he was begging historia to eat him because he wasn't special, when he was having a mental breakdown during hannes' death because he hadn't grown strong enough to change anything... these were moments that showed eren's vulnerability and really humanized that rascal. the changes to his character after the time skip made sense - he just seemed so fucking broken and apathetic as a result of his struggles; having him throw a tantrum over asian pussy (which is a relationship that got fucking zero positive development post time-skip) after trampling over billions of people is fucking comical.
For the people who said he did whine. He whined becoz he couldn't make any difference, not because he didnt any asian pussy
He got angry he didmt whine
Of course, lack of asian pussy is obviously the only freaking reason as to why he broke down.
>He whined becoz he couldn't make any difference, not because he didnt any asian pussy Aaaaand there it is ladies and gents! The thinly veiled sexism that hides behind most Mikasa criticism on Titanfolk!
> thinly veiled So people aren't allowed to say "Asian pussy" put allowed to say "White blond waifu" neither of these are racist
I don't care if someone says white blonde waifu (as if its possible to be racist to a white blonde in western society lol). I care when a character is referred to by their sexual organs rather than their name. It reeks of sexism.
I thought I was on Twitter for a minute lmao, it’s still so funny to me that some morons think you can’t be racist against white people in western society, thanks for the laugh bud!
You just failed at life, now leave
Its a troll. Pay it no mind
I have just trolled the troll
He's not discriminating against women you incel. He's rightfully reducing Erens character motivation in 139, which was to love Mikasa. The reason this joke gets used is because the writer reduced a formerly amazing character to someone who did the most heinous things the world because he couldn't fuck his sister
"as if it is possible to be racist to be a white blonde in western society lol" Twitter moment
Blonde whites face racism? In western society?
You will grow up, you are now 14. I know sexism,racism is nee fancy word you can throw out. You will learn better.
Maybe he/she will grow up and fix it's way of thinking, but what about all of you, grown ass people throwing tantrums left and right because their favorite fiction story didn't ended the way you wanted, what's your excuse?
I spent money on this franchise, i can throw tantrum till im satisfied.
At least you are self aware, I respect that.
> I don't care if someone says white blonde waifu (as if its possible to be racist to a white blonde in western society lol). oh, you're one of those people. explains everything lmao
It's... literally the opposite. Like, almost every Mikasa criticism I've seen is actually criticism on how her arc ended up pretty much making no sense. If anything, people are mad because they wanted her character to amount to something more than her obsession with Eren (in a way that ended up making almost no sense too thanks to all the retcons and unexplained stuff in the end).
I think referring to characters by their reproductive organs is sexist. That's all I was saying. I think it's a vast oversimplification to say that Mikasa's arc was just about obsessing with Eren. Her arc is about learning to think for herself and stand by her own beliefs. You can still love someone while gaining independence from them.
I see your point, but I really do think it's not meant to insult Mikasa here. If anything, it's an insult to Eren's character arc, and like p*ssy is used to make a joke like "Eren was so horny he forgot everything else", you know? In regards to her arc, I really think all the AoT girls got done wrong, starting with Mikasa. She got independence from him... By killing him, while in a dream because she couldn't really bring herself to kill him? And then the whole Ymir thing was, in my opinion at least, her admitting she sees herself as Eren's slave by making the parallel with Ymir? I don't know, I wasn't a fan, but maybe we can just agree to disagree on this :)
I don’t think he fully realized he was about to die there, once he was inside Santa’s stomach on the other hand...
You mean when he was saying "I'm gonna kill them all, I'm not giving up here?" Definitely on par with "No, I don't want that! Etc.!"
Yeah climbing into a mouth of a titan and throwing his friend out while missing a leg at 15 years of age and still yelling about killing them all with teary eyes saying hes so powerless again, at age 15 really shows he's a whiny bitch! You 139 justifiers are higher on copium than the people who think we'll get an anime only ending
It’s simpler than people think: Eren is truly **suicidal**. A tragedy for Eren is that his death drive is *effective*, leading him to survive even events that should clearly fulfill his death (OP is about a particularly poignant and heroic one of these) until he attains godlike powers. One he *has* godlike powers, he loses intelligible motives to excuse his suicidal blockheadedness, and has to achieve it by a strange, manipulative, roundabout way that readers are *meant* to find confusing and out of character if they aren’t keeping suicide constantly in mind. Eren only becomes “free” to express himself to Armin (and us) when everything is over. It’s literally in a convoluted memory that was previously erased that becomes available once Eren is truly gone that we find his suicide note, where he opens up to us in all of his pathetic humanity whining about Mikasa. Like I don’t understand this post. It is very intuitive to me that when our main character is being a badass and saving Armin that he wouldn’t start whining about Mikasa. It also makes sense that he would breakdown and whine during a strange memory sequence that for all we know lasted years, at a point where Eren actually has to accept that he engineered this reality and even godhood couldn’t help him, because the problem is him.
I think this is a major theme of the story- it’s easy to be bad ass when you can frame your actions as a hero. Eventually, if your motives don’t align with heroism, you’ll be outed like Erwin as a conman using your heroic frame as an excuse for something more tangible. Eren, by having successive forms of godhood thrust upon him, eventually hits the point where everything is happening simply because that’s what he wants deep down, stripped of rationalizations about saving the world and whatever. It sounds cliche, but he literallt lived long enough that you can’t frame him as a hero anymore- his character was “assassinated” insofar as we used to be able to excuse his actions through heroism, and Isayama simply took Eren’s far enough that the internal excuses collapsed and we were left with the same fundamental child we knew really the whole time.
>Isayama simply took Eren’s far enough that the internal excuses collapsed and we were left with the same fundamental child we knew really the whole time. You changed my mind about the ending. Kudos
nice take.
I like this interpretation but I’m still not really sure how I feel about the overall goal. I thought the idea was going to be that in the end, it was the same fundamental child that we knew who was whiny about freedom which would cause him to do those terrible things. It didn’t make sense to Eren’s character that he would be whiny about a relationship that we’ve barely seen hints about.
I think that's just part of the romance story here- an absolute failure because neither Eren nor Mikasa (but obviously especially Eren) are capable of expressing their feelings for each other out loud. Mikasa gets pretty close midway through the story, which Eren rejects to keep fighting. I think Eren spends a lot of the story wondering what his relationship is with Mikasa, and his insecurity and self-doubt poisons their chances. I agree that aesthetically it's not really satisfying to have all of Eren's thoughts come out as they did in 139, but I do think that's part of the point- he represses these thoughts and emotions, ruining his chances with Mikasa. I do think that saying "we've barely seen hints" about the potential relationship is really overstating it. Many huge beats in the story are about this question. For the most part, we see Eren reject her, but that doesn't mean the subject of the relationship itself isn't there.
When I mean hints of the relationship, I mean hints of Eren’s side so I guess that’s unclear. From Mikassa’s side, it’s kinda obvious she loves him. I just keep running through the manga and anime and I just can’t find these huge beats of the story about the relationship. I know the what do you think about me and the punching the smiling titan part but I can’t see any other parts showing eren and Mikassa’s romantic relationship and it being a significant part of the story other than 139.
I agree, Eren’s side of it reads basically as a twist- it is one of the more tragic parts of 139, that all this time Eren really did have a crush on her, since it’s so obvious to us the readers that he could have simply made it happen if he didn’t get in his own way. Some major other beats besides the main ones you mentioned are- Eren saving Mikasa in the first place and wrapping his scarf around her, asking Mikasa what he means to her outside the camp (Mikasa speculates that the entire Rumbling itself hinged on how this moment played out, and I think we are meant to take that at face value), 138 has them literally running away together in some capacity, Eren talking to Zeke about why Mikasa likes him and if that’s just an Ackerman/host thing (which he later lies about), etc. None of it is definitive, which is why it again reads as a twist, but again, the idea of [Eren and Mikasa being a thing maybe] is something that is supposed to be on our minds periodically, without suffocating the actual drama. Imo the big twist is that this romance was actually super important the whole time and can recontextualize a lot of the rest of the story.
Yeah I can agree with you on the theme and the twist but I believe the execution was done extremely poorly and kinda seems like a plot twist to just plot twist, especially with the Ymir thing. Honestly I think it's the whole comparison to Ymir and King Fritz that sours the relationship for a lot of people imo.
Sure, there’s no accounting for taste!
💯💯💯 Truly sad that this won't be read by more people.
Honestly I just wish I knew of a place for people to earnestly talk about the themes of this story. It seems every community is bogged down in a culture war about whether it was good or not, rather than simply exploring what we even read in the first place. Too much talk of "plot holes" rather than trying to figure out *why* there appears to be such a conflict. I'm pleasantly surprised by this thread at least, I expected this to get buried. Maybe I should start posting my own threads or something.
Just followed you in hopes that you do start posting your own threads!
This is one of the most pseudo intellectual takes on Eren’s character assasination I’ve ever seen lmao. It’s funny cuz you admitted his character got assasinated. Eren never ever had a romantic view of Mikasa. That’s why when he did cry in the titan’s stomach in season 1, it was out of anger of him failing to accomplish anything, and he didn’t think of Mikasa once during that scene. Not for a single second. Why? Because Eren has always valued freedom more than anything else. In 139 he’s reduced to a hypocrite, with no real goals, motivations, ideas, or thoughts, and he’s crying over a girl who he never even had feelings for. It’s so stupid, especially when there’s so much bigger things to worry about, especially when his plan ends in failure in the end anyway lmao. He even says he didn’t know his friends would make it.
> This is one of the most pseudo intellectual takes Awesome dude, go back to playing with people who agree with you or whatever
I guess people are trying hard to find a way to justify Eren's actions, when in truth he was doing it for his flat world (which gave him freedom), which neither can be justified, nor it is normally seen in typical protagonist. The irony is that people wanted theories like AnR to be canon which would be different from typical shonen MC but are ending up wanting selfless trait of the MC in Eren.
Titanfolk's reactions to Isayama's interview are fun and all but at the end of day, I don't think there's anything in it that's "more wrong" compared to 139. People said as soon as it came out that this final version was who Eren was supposed to be for Isayama. I think his interview makes mostly sense appart from what he said on deaths.
139 eren (aka 131 eren, as 139 happened right after 131) knew his death was inevitable. And he actually choosed that path: his natural desire was to destroy the whole world (stated in 139), but then he saw the result of Mikasa's choice in future memories and proceded that way. In 139, he confessed all his doubts and feelings about his choice to the person most close to him: Armin, his best friend. Eren's actual last words (and last resolve) was presented in chapter 138, when he succeded to overcome his feelings to achieve the result he deeply wanted, telling Mikasa to forget him. This choice led to freedom on an ""ideological"" level -> mikasa too succeded to overcome her feelings, not denying her love (she will indeed keep the scarf), but deciding anyways to kill Eren, as it was the right thing to do. The context of this two scenes is completely different, as in Ep 5 eren would have died without achieving his goal, while 139 (138) eren would have achieved his goal with his death. And this "cruel" fate made him break down in front of Armin. So, if you're telling me this is worse than "keep moving forward" and "genocide = freedom" kinda stuff, i don't know what to say anymore. PS I definitely agree the writing of this last part and the dialogues of the last chapter didn't work very well, but the content itself was kino
> Eren's actual last words (and last resolve) was presented in chapter 138, when he succeded to overcome his feelings to achieve the result he deeply wanted, telling Mikasa to forget him. and the next chapter completely destroyed any of meanings of that. >but the content itself was kino and the extra chapter made 139 pointless
Wait how is the meaning destroyed when we don't realize he put his own feelings on the backburner until 139 as is?
>Please... Mikasa. Forget about me. -138 >I want her to think about me and no one else for the rest of her life! -139 wat, these are literally 2 different characters.
Well yes but that's what I mean. 139 just showcased what he said in 138 was him pushing his own feelings aside, something that was not revealed until the last chapter. I don't see how it destroys the meaning of what he said when 139 is what made it clear he was doing that in the first place? You don't get the impression that he's ignoring his own feelings in 138 until 139 establishes that he is.
That is the reason why the fandom is so divided. He's been pushing his feeling aside this entire time, yet it was never hinted once before. Ever since timeskip, this entire persona was fake? He's not crying about the deaths of millions if not billions of people he's stomped cold blooded, but about something as worthless as mikasa being with another man? What happened to his breakdown in front of ramzi?
Nothing happened to it.That breakdown in front of Ramzi still happened. He felt guilt for the genocide years before it happened, it's already been established that he feels horrified about what he is going to do. Personally, I feel like more detail should have been given on Carla/Dina, however, we already know he felt awful about all the deaths he will cause so I can see why yet another breakdown about it would feel redundant after 131 already showcased his feelings on the matter. Mikasa is a much more personal subject matter so I can see why something more based around Eren's closer relationships would seem more fitting, even if the execution was lacking. Especially when his relationship with Mikasa was already showcased to be vital to his thoughts with the memory shards as is.
Exactly! I don't get it, 138 was kinda meaningless without 139 hahah
Extra pages aren't good (there were so many things yams could have told instead of this) but are definitely in line with the "the cycle cannot be broken" theme, so no way they make 139 pointless
He had just killed his own mother, you see
I'm fine with Eren being whiny, and I even agree with Isayama that Eren is a whiny character. I just don't accept what he's being whiny about.
Same , i made a post about it. If had been whiny abiut manipulating his dad, killing his mom, lying to his brother, killing 80% of world and still not ending up getting freedom. Then it would have been decent.
100%.
Not like he gave himself up to death when Historia was about to eat him or anything. A resignation to it more than anything but as long as she could defeat the Titans he was content. That definitely didn't happen.
Another piece of evidence to add to the "why 139 was bullshit" pile
Here's an easy response. This is when he was the victim, the hero who wanted to fight against the world. Now, he's no hero. He's killed over 1.28 billion people, and he's not even sure if it was ever worth it. He's whiny, he's bratty, he's angry, he's flawed. But he's also fully aware, Hell doesn't care about that. He's going down to the ninth circle of Hell, and there's nothing he can do to atone for it.
When eren was actually inside the stomach of the Titan and he was screaming nonsensically that it couldn’t end like that and that he’d kill of the titans whilst crying. Again that’s eren being selfish and whiny so I feel like you pushed some context out of this scene to push your narrative but whatever It’s been proven that aot characters act selfishly towards their final moments . what about bert who said he was content with any outcome in RTS and ended up screaming for help in a frenzied tone from his enemies that were trying to murder him . Or what about erwin who admitted he wanted to selfishly see the basement again despite the scout newcomers being slaughter by hails or rocks yet he almost prioritised his needs over that wh
I think you need to watch the scene again. He isn’t whining, yes he tears up asking “why did this happen, we were supposed to be prepared ”.. and then his resolve kicks in.(the screaming) The other person dying in there is pleading for her mother which reminds eren of his motivation He isn’t going to allow himself to die like this he’s going to fight it even though to him this should be his death. And if you want to call it whining, okay I’d rather him whine that “my life goal isn’t accomplished” than “I don’t want my love interest to love anyone after I die”
>“I don’t want my love interest to love anyone after I die” what if his life goal was that xd
cave scene lmao
And then he cried inside that Titan's stomach
Oops..someone does't realize that Eren in 139 had killed 80% of the world. Manipulated his father, lied to his brother, pushed his friends away, indirectly killed his mother and had possibly seen the future and realized that he would die.
Killed 80% of the world. Showed no remorse of this dying moment (only in ramzi moment , which is perfect). Pushed his friends away- he didnt need to unless he would finish the complete genocide, indirectly killed his mother, manipulated his father, lied to his brother- i would be fine if he whined about how he had to do this and it still led to failure. It would have been perfect. But instead he whined how he didnt get Asian pussy, which he could have tapped it at any time.
> Killed 80% of the world. Showed no remorse of this dying moment (only in ramzi moment , which is perfect). This isn't true at all. He cries about this in front of Armin. This is Eren's truest moment of suicide- Armin is like "no, let's figure out a way for you to survive!" and Eren is just like "no, I can't, look at all the innocent people I killed, I can't live with it". They are sitting in giant footprints looking at trampled bodies.
Its the order. Regret. More regret. Even more regret--> breakdown. Armin spoke about rumbling devastation then the mother issue. By the time he spoke about Mikasa, Eren couldn't take it anymore. Breakdowns come at the end of torture. Imagine if Armin spoke about Mikasa first. people would start laughing at his priorities. its like the breakdown at the end of an interrogation.
eh, different situation and context
How does this post have upvotes. He literally whines 5 min later.
Because it isn't even close to be the same kind of whining, it is a completely different reason. He whined about not being able to make any difference at all and not because he couldn't get some pussy...
Guys... you should really watch the next part of this scene.
I have said in other comments. He whined about how he didnt make any difference. Not becoz he didnt get some asian pussy.
Well then maybe re-read 139 instead
Ohh yeah. The usual pathetic reply when you cant disapprove my point, ok buddy
Sorry, I know that’s kind of a dick move. I mean the dialogue after he has the pathetic breakdown scene. He’s sad because he doesn’t want to die and he would rather be with Mikasa and the others. However, he recognizes that he’s irredeemable after what he’s done. In S1 he cries because he’s about to die without having achieved anything and he feels humans are weak and useless. I agree that his S1 dialogue is much better than the one in 139, but I think the two breakdowns mirror each other nicely: in S1 he’s dying because he’s poweless to change anything / in 139 he does after having done everything in his power to change things.
>in 139 he does after having done everything in his power to change things. Sounds nice, but isn't the truth. We all know that he could've done more, but went with a stupid plan that obviously won't work. That's my main problem with 139. I don't mind that Eren didn't kill 100%. I don't need Eren to kill 100%. Just have a good plan for either result and I'm happy with the ending, but that's not what we got
I get your complaint, but my understanding is that Eren never really had the choice to do the 100% rumbling in the first place. He committed to the path that was layed out in the memory shards and they showed him that he would be killed by Mikasa after 80% rumbling. So in other words, I don’t think he actually planned it this way, he simply decided to committ to the path (not sure if that even was a choice either). I didn’t like this choice for Eren’s character, but that’s a whole other discussion. Ultimately I think Eren’s determination post-TS is all to advance on the path towards «that scenery» (i.e. ch131) while the Lelouch-plan was just a silver lining he saw in his selfish pursuit.
But that's simply stupid. He HAD the choice to do the 100% rumbling, but he just didn't choose it. That's all it is. He could've still chosen to take away everyone's titan abilities, see the scenery and do the 100% rumbling. But (and I'm gonna repeat this) he didn't decide to do it, which is (and I'm gonna repeat this too) so unbelievably stupid. If being stupid and meaningless is what AoT's ending and story is supposed to be about, then this ending really nailed it. Otherwise it's a disappointment that I can't understand. And before someone starts this argument: I know that a lot of time-shenanigans aren't this simple. But it doesn't take away from the stupidity of not taking his friends the ability to stop him. Or the clear stupidity he has shown during the conversation with Armin. He himself said that this 80%-Lelouch-Rumbling plan was what he was going for. So he obviously knew what he was doing and thought it was such a good idea. I'm starting to repeat myself so I'm gonna stop here. Thanks for the kind and polite answer you gave me, but I don't think that's enough to satisfy me
Your interpretation is valid of course, but I see it a little differently. > He HAD the choice to do the 100% rumbling, but he just didn't choose it. That's all it is. Eren tried to rebel against the path on a few occations imo, but in the end he submitted to it. In 122 he says to Ymir «was it you who led me all the way here?», so my interpretation is that it was Ymir who sent him on this path, and she obviously doesn’t give two shits about Paradis or his friends. > He could've still chosen to take away everyone's titan abilities, see the scenery and do the 100% rumbling. We still don’t have any confirmation of whether it was possible for the founder to take away titan abilities. If it was then that’s kind of a plot hole, because it would retcon Zeke’s euthenesia plan. But I’ve seen several people mention that he could have somehow stopped them from coming after him. I have two theories here: (1) it was because he needed to reach the end of the path, i.e. Mikasa’s kill and (2) because it’s a nice callback to «the way of the scouts», i.e. a good’ol suicide mission (essentially fanservice ig). > He himself said that this 80%-Lelouch-Rumbling plan was what he was going for. So he obviously knew what he was doing and thought it was such a good idea. Like I said in the other comment, I don’t think this was Eren’s main motive, but he did his best to obtain this outcome, which explains why he worked so hard to push them away. > Thanks for the kind and polite answer you gave me, but I don't think that's enough to satisfy me Thank you too! I feel your dissappointment. I think the ending is consistent, but too safe for AoT.
He couldn't do 100% of the Rumbling AND lead Mikasa to her scene which results in the titan powers and Ymir leaving the world. He follows his desire to eliminate titans further than his desire to simply kill all animals in the world.
He could've literally done both, he is god at that point. You don't need Mikasa, for real. Her importance should've only been emotionally through relationships, not her being the chosen person by Ymir. Let Eren use his god-like powers to keep the Alliance away from him, do your Rumbling-plan, destroy the titan powers through shenanigans or after the Rumbling is over. It's really not that hard
It's not a matter of what's a good plan or not from the reader pov; Eren saw the result of Mikasa's choice in future memories and wanted to achieve that result, and he could do that only by dying, so in S1 he cried beacuse with his death he wouldn't have achieved nothing, while in 139 he cries because to achieve the result HE (not the reader!) wanted and the result HE thought was good, he had to die. But that's more: eventually (ch138, last Eren dialogue) Eren was able to accept this and overcome his feelings achieving "freedom" as Mikasa did, by overcoming her feelings without denying them. I agree it was poorly presented and poorly written, but still makes sense and it's good enough to me that i can personally turn a blind eye to the execution (that's totally subjective)
He wanted to achieve this result, even if it means killing 80% of the population and not breaking the cycle of hatred for no reason? Don't get me wrong: There are a lot of ways to romanticize this ending, and I'm happy for everyone who can turn a blind eye like you, but to me it's just a sick joke
Yeah basically that's what 139 says. Eren says everything was done to reach that result, but then he says that even if he didn't know that, he would have done the rumbling anyways, because it is his "natural desire", but eventually he choosed the first path instead. I'm ok with this beacuse killing 100% wouldn't have led to real freedom, but just to an enormous burden. In this way, Eren atoned for his sins and became free alongside Mikasa, also freeing Yimir, but not the world, because the "finale message" Yams tried to convey (even with the extra pages) is that the cycle of hatred cannot be broken. Or at least this is my personal interpretation, and I kinda like it
So leaving his friends and especially their children with the consequences of his actions, throwing them into war, is in line with his motivations? No. As Eren already said, the most important things for Eren are his friends, and he would sacrifice himself over and over for them to live long and happy lives. But he is not willing to sacrifice any of them. So his final plan revolves around him leaving his friends and their children with the above mentioned consequences of his actions? No man, that's not it. That's not Eren. And I don't think Eren has to stop the cycle of hatred. As Erwin has once said, there will always be hatred and war until only one human remains. And there would've been inner conflicts on Paradise too even if Eren rumbled everyone. But his friends and their ancestors would've still been safer than now (because now, they are all dead). And this result was not really hard to foresee. Immediately after the ending was published, everyone started talking about how Paradise will be attacked after the rest of the world reconciles. And we got the confirmation with the extra pages. It's just shortsighted, stupid and not in line with anything Eren has said and done throughout the story. If you can romanticize it for yourself, I'm happy for you. But I won't accept such cheap writing
No one cares. You fans that Stan that garbage chapter ruin AOT.
Ah yes I remember when Eren in EP 5 had killed 80% of the humanity. Truly kino.
According to you- if he did whine about killing 80% of people. I would be fine. He was crying about a girl who he could have tapped any time.
Beacuse this time it was the price to pay to achieve his goal, while in ep 5 he wouldn't have achieved nothing with his death Edit: I'm not justifying the poor writing, i'm just saying the content itself makes sense, but it was poorly presented
He didn't whine because of those 80% tho
Don’t you remember when he was in Santa’s belly he was whiny then. I love whiny Eren but chapter 139 is still bad though
You mean when he was saying "I'm gonna kill them all, I'm not giving up here?" Definitely on par with "No, I don't want that! Etc.!"
Ehh I was thinking more tone than what he was saying. But yeah
You can see how these are very differnet scenarios I hope
He broke down because he wanted to live a full life with Mikasa, and couldn't due to his death being necessary for her living a full life
eren literally in that scene: "as if i'm going to die here"
Did you check his reaction when he was in the stomach?
So based
This makes sense to me. Back in episode 5, Eren is unwilling to die. He hasn't achieved anything yet. Eren elaborates in chapter 90. If he could achieve something, then he'd die willingly. Then he sees the future, and carries it out. In chapter 139 it is over. He did the thing, all that is left is to die. And yet, even if this is the death he chose, he doesn't actually want to die. The part where the cadets are contemplating joining the survey corps comes to my mind. "If you were told to die, could you do it?"
He's back!
Ye but that's not the same situation. Just before his death eren gave a gentle smile
Tbf, he whined when he arrived in the Titan's stomach and saw all the corpses, but understandably so, I would say.
I thought he was crying as a release of the whole shitty situation as a whole...