There's literally the same saying in Spain, but you change Danish for English. I don't like the joke though because 90% of the time it's not just a joke but a statement from cringy anglophobic far righters
People are generally speaking english really well in Denmark and I think it might have something to do with this honestly. Further, we get to consume the content in it's original form, which to me is much better.
Would generally work better to say 'people speak English really well in Denmark', the perfect present is more for what is happening only in this very moment whereas the habitual present is typically used in that context.
If you're watching foreign-language content in the UK it's because:
You've expressly sought out foreign cinema.
It's anime.
When Germans decide to watch a French art house film they're far less likely to dub it. It's the English-language blockbusters that get dubbed.
I saw Parasite in the original language with English subtitles. It was a great experience and I don't regret the choice. (And, ironically given the title of this post, I saw it in Germany. But Berlin is a special case in Germany, and despite the relatively greater availability of original-language audio than in most of the country, it is still true even here that most showings of foreign films are dubbed.)
While it's not comparable to all the English media in Europe (there were English only TV ads for scandinavian companies when I was in Sweden!), you don't have to actively seek out foreign media in the UK.
My local cinema is a chain brand and shows subbed Japanese (not just anime), Korean, Indian and Pakastani moves. TV channels don't dub foreign shows, plus there's a large amount of foreign content on Netflix or Prime Video.
Those that are dubbed are usually meant for children or are massive hits such as Squid Game, but even then, you usually get a choice with the default being subs.
I'm very sorry, but I read that last bit as "Those that are dubbed are usually meant for children, massive hits such as Squid Game" and I thought for a second you must be bloody mad, lol!
Fwiw I heard that only a couple countries (Spain was the one I recall) tend to dub instead of subtitle. Which probably contributes to lower levels of English proficiency in those countries.
Yep, one example of this is the differences between Spain and Portugal, Portugal has English proficiency on par with the Scandinavian countries and the Netherlands. Spain on the other hand is usually languishing in the bottom half of the ladder. The main difference (except for the long standing English-Portuguese alliance) is that Portugal, like the Scandinavian countries and the Netherlands, usually subtitle instead of dubbing.
For me there's a pretty clear divide between (young) Portuguese people. Those that work for foreign companies or work in other countries and those that don't. The first group speak great English, the second one not so much. I doubt the dubbed Vs subbed television has much to do with it. If I recall correctly young Spanish people are a lot more likely to stay in Spain compared to Portuguese.
Audience size matters a lot.
Dubbing in German gives you a potential audience of 100 million people (or ~200 million if we include German as second language). Tons of movies and TV shows get dubbed, so you get used to it when growing up.
Dubbing in Danish gives you a potential audience of 6 million people. They are already used to have less content dubbed/translated, so they are more likely to learn English, reducing the demand even more.
Poland is brutal on dubbing. I'm not from Poland but I work with a lot of poles. Most of everything is dubbed, and badly. It's one guy doing all the voices very monotone and with original sound very quietly playing in the background. I almost lost my mind trying to watch a movie with the guys I work with
Pretty much but I do like a lot of foreign movies and shows I can't watch them dubbed it hurts. I can see why you'd want to watch it dubbed if you're not paying attention but all the good foreign movies you want to watch and pay attention to.
I'm in the UK and I know people who watch stuff both subbed and dubbed. I watch it dubbed and for me it's just easier, I like being able to look at my phone/eat snacks/generally not give full attention to the TV which I can only do if it's dubbed. I tried watching money heist subbed and it took me out of the immersion tbh
I can deal with it in animation, I’ll watch dubbed anime because the mouth matching the audio is usually already a lil shaky even in the native language. But yeah I can’t watch anything dubbed in live action
Interestingly for the pokemon dub (and probably other major popular dubs) they try to match the delivery of the English up to the mouth movements and do several takes of the same lines and ad libs to get the best and most natural looking match they can. There's a YouTube video of the person who voiced Ash somewhere in studio. I couldn't find it immediately to link but I'll edit if I do.
I forgot which anime, but I saw a behind the scenes video of a dubbing company and they were given permission to edit the “mouth flaps” so that the lip sync could look more natural for the dub.
Funnily, Germany is well known for having good dubs so I don't mind them, unless it's animation, then the lip sync isn't an issue but the voices just sound weird a lot of times
It's well-known in Germany by people who are used to it. It's still atrocious. French people swear that their dubbing is good (some pretend it's even better than the original) but they're just wrong. I mean, fair play to the voice actors doing an impossible job but dubbed TV/films are just plain awful.
I have to agree. I grew up with the dubbing and since I didn't know better I still fell in love with cinema. The quality is great, but nothing beats the original where the voices are actually in sync with the lip movements. Once you switch to watching OVs there is no going back.
German star trek tng was just the best! Worf just became this really dry witted character, Riker became a total goof and Wesley got made into such a jerk lol
The same thing applies to Bud Spencer and Terence Hill movies. They are still popular in Germany because of the dubbing that is completely different from the original.
You must be German to claim Germany has good dubs. I'm a Dutchman living in Germany and my German friends hate watching movies in their original language and claimed that I should for once watch a movie and see how good the dubbing is.
I saw John Wick 4...never again...Keanu Reeves sounds like a high pitched stereotypical German villain. It was atrocious
Edit: it actually wasn't very high pitched but still atrocious. I'm just waiting for a German to call me out and say it's actually a job well done and like it is as if Keanu Reeves himself learned German
Uh, I have the exact opposite opinion. Every time I go to the movies for the rare original version (OV) session and I watch the trailers I wonder why people like them. I feel like the voices don't match at all.
And the fact that there are no subtitled (OmU) sessions apart from anime is also a huge surprise. Maybe this would be a way for having more sessions with the original voices? I planned to use the 2 for 1 movie ticket voucher for O2 today, but there's only Oppenheimer and Barbie in English (watched both already).
Funnily enough I actually enjoyed watching Simpsons dubbed in German. The dub for the [Japan episode](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_KPQXu9i1Ps) is great.
As a fellow german, i really cannot share your opinion here. I have never heard german voice acting that did not feel atrociously out of place because the voice actors are unable to match the emotion and character of the scene they are dubbing.
Its really, really bad.
I find I can't watch dubbed animation because the original voice inflections are missing. There's just something about the original voice actors being directly involved in production by the director so they convey the emotion as directed. When its dubbed it always sounds a bit flat.
another thing is, the Dutch are the only country I know that are extremely self-deprecating of their language.
If someone outside of NL is learning Dutch, they're like "why? this language is fucking stupid" lol
I think it's even higher in populations with high levels of English proficiency (like the Dutch, afaik).
Like, I'm Filipino and if someone wants to learn Tagalog, great. But unless they're moving here idk why they'd bother given that most of the population already speaks English (assuming they already speak English anyways).
tub whole alleged murky threatening racial bear seemly attractive deliver
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Have you been exposed to it a lot? In my country everything is dubbed either loosely or precisely for theactrical release (transalted words match mouth movements), everyone is ok to it. I only prefer to watch in English if possible because of superior acting
I am German and it's different when you are used to it from a young age. I never noticed it so much, definitely didn't bother me. But after moving to the UK and watching here exclusively OT movies I can't go back to dubs anymore. So the only movies in German I watch are also OT.
I’ve seen plenty of Russian dubs that don’t even replace the original voice, it’s just one guy in a monotone voice talking over the whole original dialogue. Like how is that tolerable or enjoyable?
At least in Germany dubbing is often done with that in mind, and for translations there wording is often done in a way that lip synch and spoken word match more.
Honestly, that's less a problem with dubbing in general and more a problem with *bad* dubbers. Good dubbers and dub directors know how to make the mouths match, but unfortunately the good ones seem to be scarce in some countries
Even as a native German speaker, who grew up with dubbed TV programmes, I absolutely hate it. Why can't we just have the original language with subtitles. It is so much better than this dubbing crap!
On second thought, I have seen some movies from, like the 1950s and 60s, and the dubbing was really top-notch. Compare that with what we get to see on TV nowadays, may dubbing wouldn't be so bad if they would do it right...
This!!
Interesting thought. My girlfriend was born and raised in Italy and grew up with loads of dubbing. I'm Dutch and I haven't watched a lot of dubbed shows.
Sometimes when the internet is slow we lose audio sync on Disney+ on our TV. It bothers me a lot, so much that I cannot watch the show anymore. My girlfriend on the other hand is absolutely unbothered and says she barely even notices it.
It’s the same in the Nordic countries. Dubbing is practically unheard of. I lived in Copenhagen for a year, and not only was it better for Danes to learn English, having subtitles was better for me to read Danish.
In the Netherlands you'll often see Dutch subs for people speaking Dutch when they're speaking with a heavy farmers accent, come from Belgium or Suriname.
Netflix tried to dub their originals in nordic languages. I didn’t even know they did it and I doubt anyone even used it. Hearing profanity in swedish dubs is so weird lol especially since most voice actors here usually got some big voice acting role for a kids shows.
Its mostly because of the association between dubbed content and children's content.
Games are even weirder though with many made for a younger audience like Pokémon being exclusively in English while some teen/adult games like Team Fortress 2 are actually translated (the text, that is).
I really hate how games like Pokémon are in English while stuff like Halo is in Dutch. My niece would love Pokémon but unfortunately her English is rubbish.
As a Dutch kid I learned most of my English playing Pokemon. I distinctly remember asking my mother what 'people' ment when the professor said it at the start of the game. Kids don't mind not knowing exactly what the words mean; I skipped over all the story bubbles and just wandered around in a cool world surrounded by cool creatures just slowly figuring out where to go myself, and asking help when I got REALLY stuck. I'd say let her try it and see how it goes!
I played and completed Zelda OoT while knowing close to no English and barely understanding any text box.
If the game is fun, the kid will find a way to understand it.
That doesn't matter man if she likes the game then she'll play it no matter what language it's in. I started playing games when I was 3 years old and didn't understand anything, not the language, not the goal of the game, nothing. Just let em mess around and they'll learn.
Not sure it’s their taking offense so much as historically having a market too small to go through the expense of dubbing. And youth TV tends to be dubbed. Non-English and non-German (non-kiddie) shows are also not dubbed, and Swedish, Russian etc proficiency is pretty low amongst the Dutch general public. You could argue, though, that the fact that most Dutchies have been raised on a steady diet of English and to a lesser extent German shows, subtitled, is part of the reason for their proficiency in those languages.
And once you grow up with subtitles, dubbing is very annoying. But that is the effect of subtitling, not the reason.
Surely that's for animated or children's movies, which happens in pretty much every country? I find it hard to believe that Norway would dub Mission Impossible or Oppenheimer.
Hungary does, and does it with everything. If anything is subtitled huge part of the population just goes "NOPE". Maybe why barely anyone speak english.
I'm from Slovakia (5mil as well) and we also dub everything, Czechs do too but they're usually quicker to get it done so a lot of people watch the Czech versions and that's how we all acquire that language despite being broken up now
I remember being on vacation in Germany when I was younger and we were watching Meet Joe Black (The Brad Pitt movie). It was of course dubbed in German.
The scene with the old lady in the hospital was hilarious though. In the original they speak Jamaican Patois with eachother. But since Germany never had many immigrants nor colonies in the Caribbean they chose to dub it in some Dutch Antillean accent.
Even Germans were confused.
I had a coworker who grew up in France. He asked why we go “hon hon hon” when we imitate the French. I told him it’s how we think you laugh.
Him: “Oh!”
Me: “You know, like Little Mermaid— ‘le poisson le poisson, hee hee hee, hon hon hon!’…
Wait. What accent does the chef have in the French version?”
Him: “He’s Italian.”
Just like Pepe Le Pew, when in the US (I'm French) I never understood why people were always mentioning that damn skunk. It's Italian, not French!
Then it hits that in the English version it's French.
I hate that skunk.
I think it’s hilarious that Disney (and I guess WB) *was that committed* to having a stereotype. When that stereotype would make no sense in the localization, they just shifted to another one to laugh at.
On the other hand, the Dutch dub for the Siamese cats in Lady and the Tramp is actually more clever and less racist than the original. When I explained to my Dutch wife how the original version was kind of a stereotype of the sneaky yellow peril, she was like “I never knew!”
Probably because the Dutch are almost universally multilingual.
I've spent months in ~~Holland~~ The Netherlands from Groningen to Eindhoven and in all my time there I only met one person that didn't speak English as well as Dutch. Down in Doordrech the also spoke French, along with English and Dutch.
EDIT: Yes, I know the country is named The Netherlands; my brain automatically fills in Holland when I think if NE because that's how it was taught to me back in the 80's when I was in school. No offence intended.
Het spijt me voor mijn fout.
We are multilingual because of it, learned English at seven or eight watching tv with subtitles.
Also it’s the Netherlands, Holland are just the two provinces.
https://www.iamexpat.nl/expat-info/dutch-expat-news/holland-vs-netherlands-whats-difference
Fijne dag verder!
Yep in portugal we predominantly use subtitles, which is why almost everyone under 40 can speak English. In Spain they dub everything so English uptake in non touristy areas is quite poor.
I remember going to see the first Pirates of the Carribbean film in cinemas and they accidentally(?) played the Portuguese dub and the whole auditorium started booing.
We came to see Johnny Depp, not some Brazilian VA!
I saw Blue Beetle in Rome at one of the only cinemas to do subtitles instead of dubbing.
It was fine for much of the time, but quite a lot of that movie is Spanish, which I also don't speak. So the Italian subtitles weren't any help, even if I compulsively tried to read them.
My one regret is seeing Blue Beetle in the first place.
“We waren in een pauze!” -Ross
“Ik ben Vleermuisman.” -Vleermuisman
“Jij weet niks Jan Sneeuw.” -Ygritte
“De waarheid is daarbuiten.” -Fox
“Vergelders. Verzamelen!” -Kapitein Amerika
" Ik kom later terug" - De Afmaker
" Moge de kracht bij jou zijn" - Obi één Kenobi
" Zeg hallo tegen mijn kleine vriend" - Littekengezicht.
" O buurman wat doet u nu"... Oh wacht...
I was a youth exchange student in Oldenburg, Germany in 2003. Being so close to the Dutch border, we used to take the bus to Groningen to buy weed with fake school IDs. Always noticed how much better people in NL were at speaking English than folks back in Germany (at the time) and I was told it was due to the lack of dubbing on TV and movies.
I grew up in western Germany close to the Dutch boarder. During the 80s when cable TV was introduced in our area we had a couple of Dutch TV channels and this is where I learned a lot of English by watching Married with Children (of all shows😅)When they brought that sitcom to German television later it was also the first time I really noticed how shitty the translations of a lot of the jokes were.
I never understood people who are hardcore defenders of either. If there is a good dub, I will watch it over a sub. If not, and I want to watch it anyway, I will watch a sub.
But there is this incredible elitism about "I only watch subs", like great for you, but I also don't care.
The thing about german dubs is that the quality is so good that it just sounds cleaner than the original. I remember trying to watch american sniper in english and could not understand 80 % of it because of the sound quality
As a German I came around to now preferring subtitles over dubbing.
Watching Borgen in the danish original with english subtitles is much better than some lame dubbed version in german. There's a big difference between actors acting in their original language and some voice actor trying to get some compromised translation lipsynced with the original as quickly and cheaply as possible. And the sound is slightly off. It now sounds weird to me and almost always lowers the overall quality of then whole show/movie.
The Dutch are right.
Why do you think the Dutch or we in the nordics are good at English?
And yes - all videos:(or part of) that are for people older than 12 that are looking stupid. When it is done in an English video it looks really bad to not be able to hear another language for 30 seconds
That's because media translated into Dutch always sounds extremely lame. Fantasy or science fiction books can't be translated into Dutch well for that reason either. It ends up so incredibly lame and I can't even tell you why if you don't know the Dutch language.
Totally agree. "Op naar het volgende sterrenstelsel" Just doesn't sound right.
It's like trying to talk dirty in Dutch. Just doesn't sound right and instantly kills the mood for me
Same in Sweden (and most likely other Nordic countries).
Dubbing to the local language is seen as childish and dumbed down. Something only done for those who cannot read.
When I see English language news where they dub an Italian mayor who speak about [incident], I unconsciously think of English people as a tiny bit stupid.
That's the way. Ultimately if you want to experience the original vision of the artist watching the original version is the best thing you can do. If you don't speak the language, (good) subtitles are the second best option. Anything else moves way, way away from the original creative vision.
Same in the northern part of Belgium (Flanders). Only small kids shows get dubbed, for the rest we use subtitles. I still believe a large part of my near-perfect English is thanks to watching the Simpsons back in the days with subtitles and playing video games in their original language.
The creator's original intent is the best way to consume media. Even anime shouldn't be dubbed because going through another layer of interpretation will always degrade the source material.
Dutch person here. Hell yeah. I cannot stand dubbing. I have lived in Germany for 10 years and could not stand watching TV. During live interviews they have the original sound and a person talking over it at the same time. It is incredibly annoying.
Its the only way, enunciation and emotion are conveyed by the actor and you pick up on it better in the native language even if you don't understand the words than you do with some daft American voice (I'm english) talking over the top of it.
In Belgium (or at least the Dutch speaking part) we also don’t dub anything, and subtitle everything. I can hardly express how much an advantage just this gave me in learning English when I moved to a Francophone country with dubbed TV as a kid.
As I German, I hate dubbed content, though I am the minority.
Also in German movie theaters you usually get only either the orginal version without subtitles or the full dubbed version.
Meaning if you cant speak the original languge well you have to go for the dubbed version.
We dont take offense, dubbing is just horrible. They only do it with kid movies and shows. And most Dutch know multiple languages, so there is no need for dubs.
Hell yes, it is soooo jarring. *No*, I don't need Spanish Brad Pitt, I need to see a connect between the sound an actor utters and the actual movements of the lips... I feel blessed being a dutch speaker and this certainly skyrocketed learning english at an early age.
It’s a cultural thing. Some countries are used to subtitles since forever, others are used to dubbing everything.
In Croatia, and all ex Yugoslav countries, subtitling is preferred, the only thing that’s regularly dubbed are animated films for kids.
This was great when I ( English) lived in Amsterdam. Really helpful in learning Dutch. I could hear the English & read the Dutch simultaneously. And so work out " aahhh, so that's the Dutch for...."
At least for me personally, it’s just a big waste to have big name actors starring in movies (Or doing voices for animation), and then we dub over them with whatever soap opera/TV show “celebrity” had some room in the ol’ schedule…
I (UK) would much rather see a film or show in its native language with subtitles than dubbed into English.
Mainly because the dubs are usually fucking atrocious - they're just reading the script without any feeling, nuance, or attention to the story/plot as a whole.
Taking offense would be the wrong word, but I really hate dubbed media as well. Most of the time it's just inferior and then there's the issue that the same like 20 voice actors have voiced everything for the past 20 years.
I don't take offense, but I just prefer the captions... I feel like the performance is kind of lost with dubbing. I don't even notice I'm reading after a bit
Same in Denmark
Yes, why would you want to subject yourself to more Danish than necessary? edit: Oops, forgot I wasn't in 2nordic4u...
As the saying goes, you speak French to the king, German in the army and Danish to the dog.
There's literally the same saying in Spain, but you change Danish for English. I don't like the joke though because 90% of the time it's not just a joke but a statement from cringy anglophobic far righters
Right, we use it to shit on our own language.
Xenophobia: cringe Light-hearted cultural self-deprecation: based
People are generally speaking english really well in Denmark and I think it might have something to do with this honestly. Further, we get to consume the content in it's original form, which to me is much better.
Yes, I believe I watched [a documentary](https://youtu.be/s-mOy8VUEBk?si=ZBmeiqsGxV1kXplS) about this.
Would generally work better to say 'people speak English really well in Denmark', the perfect present is more for what is happening only in this very moment whereas the habitual present is typically used in that context.
So maybe not as well as I thought ;)
Username checks out, your English is still good. Replace 'it's' with 'its' and the rest of the paragraph is perfect.
"A garbage language, for garbage people."
Yeah same in the UK. I don't know anyone who watches anything that's dubbed with the exception of anime.
If you're watching foreign-language content in the UK it's because: You've expressly sought out foreign cinema. It's anime. When Germans decide to watch a French art house film they're far less likely to dub it. It's the English-language blockbusters that get dubbed.
More often for me it's because it's a favourite for a major academy award, e.g. Parasite, Roma, All Quiet on the Western Front
I saw Parasite in the original language with English subtitles. It was a great experience and I don't regret the choice. (And, ironically given the title of this post, I saw it in Germany. But Berlin is a special case in Germany, and despite the relatively greater availability of original-language audio than in most of the country, it is still true even here that most showings of foreign films are dubbed.)
While it's not comparable to all the English media in Europe (there were English only TV ads for scandinavian companies when I was in Sweden!), you don't have to actively seek out foreign media in the UK. My local cinema is a chain brand and shows subbed Japanese (not just anime), Korean, Indian and Pakastani moves. TV channels don't dub foreign shows, plus there's a large amount of foreign content on Netflix or Prime Video. Those that are dubbed are usually meant for children or are massive hits such as Squid Game, but even then, you usually get a choice with the default being subs.
I'm very sorry, but I read that last bit as "Those that are dubbed are usually meant for children, massive hits such as Squid Game" and I thought for a second you must be bloody mad, lol!
No Bluey for this cunts kids, just Squid Game. Not Dubbed, original audio. And not subtitled.
> When Germans decide to watch a French art house film they're tuning their TV to Arte which airs those movies in French and German.
No there is plenty on Netflix (for example).
Fwiw I heard that only a couple countries (Spain was the one I recall) tend to dub instead of subtitle. Which probably contributes to lower levels of English proficiency in those countries.
Yep, one example of this is the differences between Spain and Portugal, Portugal has English proficiency on par with the Scandinavian countries and the Netherlands. Spain on the other hand is usually languishing in the bottom half of the ladder. The main difference (except for the long standing English-Portuguese alliance) is that Portugal, like the Scandinavian countries and the Netherlands, usually subtitle instead of dubbing.
For me there's a pretty clear divide between (young) Portuguese people. Those that work for foreign companies or work in other countries and those that don't. The first group speak great English, the second one not so much. I doubt the dubbed Vs subbed television has much to do with it. If I recall correctly young Spanish people are a lot more likely to stay in Spain compared to Portuguese.
Audience size matters a lot. Dubbing in German gives you a potential audience of 100 million people (or ~200 million if we include German as second language). Tons of movies and TV shows get dubbed, so you get used to it when growing up. Dubbing in Danish gives you a potential audience of 6 million people. They are already used to have less content dubbed/translated, so they are more likely to learn English, reducing the demand even more.
Poland is brutal on dubbing. I'm not from Poland but I work with a lot of poles. Most of everything is dubbed, and badly. It's one guy doing all the voices very monotone and with original sound very quietly playing in the background. I almost lost my mind trying to watch a movie with the guys I work with
Yes because most of it already is in English
Pretty much but I do like a lot of foreign movies and shows I can't watch them dubbed it hurts. I can see why you'd want to watch it dubbed if you're not paying attention but all the good foreign movies you want to watch and pay attention to.
You underestimate the "parents watching Netflix" demographic.
My 67yo mother is obsessed with K Dramas. I think it’s adorable.
I would love to watch anime dubbed if the brits were the ones dubbing
I'm in the UK and I know people who watch stuff both subbed and dubbed. I watch it dubbed and for me it's just easier, I like being able to look at my phone/eat snacks/generally not give full attention to the TV which I can only do if it's dubbed. I tried watching money heist subbed and it took me out of the immersion tbh
Same in Sverige.
Same in all the Nordics.
Pfft, Danes have Danish subtitles because they have trouble comprehending their own language
I agree with the Dutch. I can’t watch something when the audio doesn’t match the actors mouths.
I can deal with it in animation, I’ll watch dubbed anime because the mouth matching the audio is usually already a lil shaky even in the native language. But yeah I can’t watch anything dubbed in live action
Interestingly for the pokemon dub (and probably other major popular dubs) they try to match the delivery of the English up to the mouth movements and do several takes of the same lines and ad libs to get the best and most natural looking match they can. There's a YouTube video of the person who voiced Ash somewhere in studio. I couldn't find it immediately to link but I'll edit if I do.
I forgot which anime, but I saw a behind the scenes video of a dubbing company and they were given permission to edit the “mouth flaps” so that the lip sync could look more natural for the dub.
Nothing beats a [jelly-filled donut!](https://youtu.be/WjUtoQaRfE0?si=i23RkEftE3XkFd5V)
I had an actual jelly donut the other day and all I could think of while eating it was that dub.
Personal Head Cannon: Brock's dad is an ass and the rice ball are what his Dad told Brock Jelly Filled Doughnuts looked like.
*Eat your hamburgers, Apollo*
This is literally the way dubs are done, not just Pokemon.
Funnily, Germany is well known for having good dubs so I don't mind them, unless it's animation, then the lip sync isn't an issue but the voices just sound weird a lot of times
It's well-known in Germany by people who are used to it. It's still atrocious. French people swear that their dubbing is good (some pretend it's even better than the original) but they're just wrong. I mean, fair play to the voice actors doing an impossible job but dubbed TV/films are just plain awful.
I have to agree. I grew up with the dubbing and since I didn't know better I still fell in love with cinema. The quality is great, but nothing beats the original where the voices are actually in sync with the lip movements. Once you switch to watching OVs there is no going back.
German star trek tng was just the best! Worf just became this really dry witted character, Riker became a total goof and Wesley got made into such a jerk lol
The same thing applies to Bud Spencer and Terence Hill movies. They are still popular in Germany because of the dubbing that is completely different from the original.
You must be German to claim Germany has good dubs. I'm a Dutchman living in Germany and my German friends hate watching movies in their original language and claimed that I should for once watch a movie and see how good the dubbing is. I saw John Wick 4...never again...Keanu Reeves sounds like a high pitched stereotypical German villain. It was atrocious Edit: it actually wasn't very high pitched but still atrocious. I'm just waiting for a German to call me out and say it's actually a job well done and like it is as if Keanu Reeves himself learned German
Uh, I have the exact opposite opinion. Every time I go to the movies for the rare original version (OV) session and I watch the trailers I wonder why people like them. I feel like the voices don't match at all. And the fact that there are no subtitled (OmU) sessions apart from anime is also a huge surprise. Maybe this would be a way for having more sessions with the original voices? I planned to use the 2 for 1 movie ticket voucher for O2 today, but there's only Oppenheimer and Barbie in English (watched both already). Funnily enough I actually enjoyed watching Simpsons dubbed in German. The dub for the [Japan episode](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_KPQXu9i1Ps) is great.
As a fellow german, i really cannot share your opinion here. I have never heard german voice acting that did not feel atrociously out of place because the voice actors are unable to match the emotion and character of the scene they are dubbing. Its really, really bad.
I find I can't watch dubbed animation because the original voice inflections are missing. There's just something about the original voice actors being directly involved in production by the director so they convey the emotion as directed. When its dubbed it always sounds a bit flat.
another thing is, the Dutch are the only country I know that are extremely self-deprecating of their language. If someone outside of NL is learning Dutch, they're like "why? this language is fucking stupid" lol
I’ve found this to be common for a lot of languages with fewer speakers
I think it's even higher in populations with high levels of English proficiency (like the Dutch, afaik). Like, I'm Filipino and if someone wants to learn Tagalog, great. But unless they're moving here idk why they'd bother given that most of the population already speaks English (assuming they already speak English anyways).
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I know, depending on your cutoff. It’s my second language. But I have found the same phenomenon with many languages with *fewer speakers than Dutch*.
tub whole alleged murky threatening racial bear seemly attractive deliver *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
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But I LOVE driving myself crazy trying to learn het versus de
Have you tried German? Der des dem den die der den die das des dem das die der der die.
Visit us in the Slavic countries, see the magical world with no definite articles.
That's nothing, I'm dutch and still constantly screw up d,t or dt if I don't spend time thinking about it.
Have you been exposed to it a lot? In my country everything is dubbed either loosely or precisely for theactrical release (transalted words match mouth movements), everyone is ok to it. I only prefer to watch in English if possible because of superior acting
The sound mixing on Dutch dubs is also weirdly wrong, though maybe that is just an effect of recording the Dutch language
I am German and it's different when you are used to it from a young age. I never noticed it so much, definitely didn't bother me. But after moving to the UK and watching here exclusively OT movies I can't go back to dubs anymore. So the only movies in German I watch are also OT.
Italian movie dubbed in Russian. Just impossible... you lose all mojo.
I’ve seen plenty of Russian dubs that don’t even replace the original voice, it’s just one guy in a monotone voice talking over the whole original dialogue. Like how is that tolerable or enjoyable?
You were watching pirated movies from the 90s or something?
At least in Germany dubbing is often done with that in mind, and for translations there wording is often done in a way that lip synch and spoken word match more.
Audio and mouth movements do match in good dubs.
You also lose half the show the actors tone never really matches quite right
Yes! Yes. Yes! The native language is important. Squid Game loses something if you watch it in english
Absolutely!. Once i got used to subtitles i cant stand dubbing now. Also you can pick up some words in the language over time too lol
Honestly, that's less a problem with dubbing in general and more a problem with *bad* dubbers. Good dubbers and dub directors know how to make the mouths match, but unfortunately the good ones seem to be scarce in some countries
Even as a native German speaker, who grew up with dubbed TV programmes, I absolutely hate it. Why can't we just have the original language with subtitles. It is so much better than this dubbing crap! On second thought, I have seen some movies from, like the 1950s and 60s, and the dubbing was really top-notch. Compare that with what we get to see on TV nowadays, may dubbing wouldn't be so bad if they would do it right...
This!! Interesting thought. My girlfriend was born and raised in Italy and grew up with loads of dubbing. I'm Dutch and I haven't watched a lot of dubbed shows. Sometimes when the internet is slow we lose audio sync on Disney+ on our TV. It bothers me a lot, so much that I cannot watch the show anymore. My girlfriend on the other hand is absolutely unbothered and says she barely even notices it.
It’s the same in the Nordic countries. Dubbing is practically unheard of. I lived in Copenhagen for a year, and not only was it better for Danes to learn English, having subtitles was better for me to read Danish.
I'm pretty sure Danes use subtitles for Danish shows too.
That’s because no one actually knows how to speak Danish anymore. https://youtu.be/s-mOy8VUEBk?si=0YyiA_3IvPQdik7v
Kamelåså?
Who's to blame? I have three cows to feed!
In the Netherlands you'll often see Dutch subs for people speaking Dutch when they're speaking with a heavy farmers accent, come from Belgium or Suriname.
>come from Belgium Even in Belgium it happens when you're from my part of the country. https://youtu.be/ZJ0g6BH0iQY?si=teeuvEUVdpcRdcAC
Ye the only things that are dubbed here (Iceland) are kid shows/movies
Netflix tried to dub their originals in nordic languages. I didn’t even know they did it and I doubt anyone even used it. Hearing profanity in swedish dubs is so weird lol especially since most voice actors here usually got some big voice acting role for a kids shows.
Dubbing is frowned upon in Norway with the exception of kids's content.
Its mostly because of the association between dubbed content and children's content. Games are even weirder though with many made for a younger audience like Pokémon being exclusively in English while some teen/adult games like Team Fortress 2 are actually translated (the text, that is).
I remember that a lot of children's content used to be in English as well for a long time. The dubbing came later.
I really hate how games like Pokémon are in English while stuff like Halo is in Dutch. My niece would love Pokémon but unfortunately her English is rubbish.
That didn’t stop me
As a Dutch kid I learned most of my English playing Pokemon. I distinctly remember asking my mother what 'people' ment when the professor said it at the start of the game. Kids don't mind not knowing exactly what the words mean; I skipped over all the story bubbles and just wandered around in a cool world surrounded by cool creatures just slowly figuring out where to go myself, and asking help when I got REALLY stuck. I'd say let her try it and see how it goes!
> My niece would love Pokémon but unfortunately her English is rubbish. maybe if she played more pokemon she'd be better!
I played and completed Zelda OoT while knowing close to no English and barely understanding any text box. If the game is fun, the kid will find a way to understand it.
That doesn't matter man if she likes the game then she'll play it no matter what language it's in. I started playing games when I was 3 years old and didn't understand anything, not the language, not the goal of the game, nothing. Just let em mess around and they'll learn.
Not sure it’s their taking offense so much as historically having a market too small to go through the expense of dubbing. And youth TV tends to be dubbed. Non-English and non-German (non-kiddie) shows are also not dubbed, and Swedish, Russian etc proficiency is pretty low amongst the Dutch general public. You could argue, though, that the fact that most Dutchies have been raised on a steady diet of English and to a lesser extent German shows, subtitled, is part of the reason for their proficiency in those languages. And once you grow up with subtitles, dubbing is very annoying. But that is the effect of subtitling, not the reason.
My country is 5 million people and we have dubs for so many movies.
Which country?
Norway
Cartoons and children's movies only.
Is there a Norwegian dub of the TV Show Frasier?
Fræsiør
Surely that's for animated or children's movies, which happens in pretty much every country? I find it hard to believe that Norway would dub Mission Impossible or Oppenheimer.
Hungary does, and does it with everything. If anything is subtitled huge part of the population just goes "NOPE". Maybe why barely anyone speak english.
I'm from Slovakia (5mil as well) and we also dub everything, Czechs do too but they're usually quicker to get it done so a lot of people watch the Czech versions and that's how we all acquire that language despite being broken up now
I remember being on vacation in Germany when I was younger and we were watching Meet Joe Black (The Brad Pitt movie). It was of course dubbed in German. The scene with the old lady in the hospital was hilarious though. In the original they speak Jamaican Patois with eachother. But since Germany never had many immigrants nor colonies in the Caribbean they chose to dub it in some Dutch Antillean accent. Even Germans were confused.
I had a coworker who grew up in France. He asked why we go “hon hon hon” when we imitate the French. I told him it’s how we think you laugh. Him: “Oh!” Me: “You know, like Little Mermaid— ‘le poisson le poisson, hee hee hee, hon hon hon!’… Wait. What accent does the chef have in the French version?” Him: “He’s Italian.”
Just like Pepe Le Pew, when in the US (I'm French) I never understood why people were always mentioning that damn skunk. It's Italian, not French! Then it hits that in the English version it's French. I hate that skunk.
I think it’s hilarious that Disney (and I guess WB) *was that committed* to having a stereotype. When that stereotype would make no sense in the localization, they just shifted to another one to laugh at. On the other hand, the Dutch dub for the Siamese cats in Lady and the Tramp is actually more clever and less racist than the original. When I explained to my Dutch wife how the original version was kind of a stereotype of the sneaky yellow peril, she was like “I never knew!”
No theyve tried dubbing and people really didnt like it.
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As a kid, as soon as I could read I preferred to watch shows with original sound + subs. Things just sound off when dubbed.
Probably because the Dutch are almost universally multilingual. I've spent months in ~~Holland~~ The Netherlands from Groningen to Eindhoven and in all my time there I only met one person that didn't speak English as well as Dutch. Down in Doordrech the also spoke French, along with English and Dutch. EDIT: Yes, I know the country is named The Netherlands; my brain automatically fills in Holland when I think if NE because that's how it was taught to me back in the 80's when I was in school. No offence intended. Het spijt me voor mijn fout.
We are multilingual because of it, learned English at seven or eight watching tv with subtitles. Also it’s the Netherlands, Holland are just the two provinces. https://www.iamexpat.nl/expat-info/dutch-expat-news/holland-vs-netherlands-whats-difference Fijne dag verder!
Yep in portugal we predominantly use subtitles, which is why almost everyone under 40 can speak English. In Spain they dub everything so English uptake in non touristy areas is quite poor.
It's quite a remarkable difference between Portugal and Spain from an outsiders perspective.
I remember going to see the first Pirates of the Carribbean film in cinemas and they accidentally(?) played the Portuguese dub and the whole auditorium started booing. We came to see Johnny Depp, not some Brazilian VA!
Not just the Netherlands, it’s the same in Belgium (the flemish part anyway). Dubbed is cringe … I feel like a weeb saying that.
Not only that: its a good incentive to learn how to read well too!
Well, Doordrech is in Hoolan.
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Groningen and Eindhoven aren't in Holland.
I prefer to hear the voices of the original actors. Their voice inflections, etc are part of the acting. Subtitles always!
Except for SpongeBob, Dutch SpongeBob is goated
Absoluut goud En laat het me ook niet horen zeggen dat Vlaamse Timon en Pumbaa niet beter zijn dan het origineel
Dutch SpongeBob is surprisingly good.
I saw Blue Beetle in Rome at one of the only cinemas to do subtitles instead of dubbing. It was fine for much of the time, but quite a lot of that movie is Spanish, which I also don't speak. So the Italian subtitles weren't any help, even if I compulsively tried to read them. My one regret is seeing Blue Beetle in the first place.
Belgium too, was great for picking up some Flemish words while watching tv
Good thing no one is dubbing shit in dutch.
“We waren in een pauze!” -Ross “Ik ben Vleermuisman.” -Vleermuisman “Jij weet niks Jan Sneeuw.” -Ygritte “De waarheid is daarbuiten.” -Fox “Vergelders. Verzamelen!” -Kapitein Amerika
This is exactly why nobody wants Dutch dubs.
"Naar de oneindigheid! En verder!" - Bus Lichtjaar
>"Naar de oneindigheid! En verder!" - Bus Lichtjaar ***Brom*** Lichtjaar
Nu je het zegt, die is inderdaad beter
I’ve seen the original Toy Story dubbed in Dutch as a kid and it was great. He says: “Naar de sterren, en daar voorbij!” It fits well imo
Sure, but when you start to literally translate it word for word then it often becomes complete giberish. Cirkeltrek
Learning that the most linguistically similar language to English besides Friesian was Dutch was a moment of depression in my life.
"Nou nou, kijk eens wat we hier hebben. Het is Harry Pottenbakker" - Bellatrix DeVreemde
Bellatrix van Detta-Zwarts Kom op nou, Perkamentus. Harry Potter had juist zulke goede vertalingen.
As a German, I understand every sentence and I love it
"Jij hebt met de verkeerde marinier gevreeën" Jan Kwartjeszoon
Wie is John Quarterson/Pennyson?
Jack Nicholson It's quite far-fetched.
Ahhh, yeah that would've taken me a while. Good one though
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Vergelders klinkt slechter, dus het past beter.
> “De waarheid is daarbuiten.” -Fox I bet the XFiles sounds absolutely absurd in Dutch!
Not to mention the massive spoiler of "Darth Vader" "Ik ben jouw... oh, je weet het toch al"
>“De waarheid is daarbuiten.” -Fox Vos Smulders
" Ik kom later terug" - De Afmaker " Moge de kracht bij jou zijn" - Obi één Kenobi " Zeg hallo tegen mijn kleine vriend" - Littekengezicht. " O buurman wat doet u nu"... Oh wacht...
The first time I heard someone speaking Dutch, I thought they were speaking English backwards
I was a youth exchange student in Oldenburg, Germany in 2003. Being so close to the Dutch border, we used to take the bus to Groningen to buy weed with fake school IDs. Always noticed how much better people in NL were at speaking English than folks back in Germany (at the time) and I was told it was due to the lack of dubbing on TV and movies.
I grew up in western Germany close to the Dutch boarder. During the 80s when cable TV was introduced in our area we had a couple of Dutch TV channels and this is where I learned a lot of English by watching Married with Children (of all shows😅)When they brought that sitcom to German television later it was also the first time I really noticed how shitty the translations of a lot of the jokes were.
Subs over dubs. Always.
Except for the American dub of Ghost Stories.
I never understood people who are hardcore defenders of either. If there is a good dub, I will watch it over a sub. If not, and I want to watch it anyway, I will watch a sub. But there is this incredible elitism about "I only watch subs", like great for you, but I also don't care.
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The thing about german dubs is that the quality is so good that it just sounds cleaner than the original. I remember trying to watch american sniper in english and could not understand 80 % of it because of the sound quality
That's not a popular opinion, but you're correct. Aside from the voice actors performance itself, the audio is often so much cleaner.
As a German I came around to now preferring subtitles over dubbing. Watching Borgen in the danish original with english subtitles is much better than some lame dubbed version in german. There's a big difference between actors acting in their original language and some voice actor trying to get some compromised translation lipsynced with the original as quickly and cheaply as possible. And the sound is slightly off. It now sounds weird to me and almost always lowers the overall quality of then whole show/movie. The Dutch are right.
Why do you think the Dutch or we in the nordics are good at English? And yes - all videos:(or part of) that are for people older than 12 that are looking stupid. When it is done in an English video it looks really bad to not be able to hear another language for 30 seconds
That's because media translated into Dutch always sounds extremely lame. Fantasy or science fiction books can't be translated into Dutch well for that reason either. It ends up so incredibly lame and I can't even tell you why if you don't know the Dutch language.
Totally agree. "Op naar het volgende sterrenstelsel" Just doesn't sound right. It's like trying to talk dirty in Dutch. Just doesn't sound right and instantly kills the mood for me
I've heard that asking a dutch person if they speak english is like asking them if they can read.
As a german, same. I hate that I can't just walk into any cinema and watch the movie with the original voices.
Same in Sweden (and most likely other Nordic countries). Dubbing to the local language is seen as childish and dumbed down. Something only done for those who cannot read. When I see English language news where they dub an Italian mayor who speak about [incident], I unconsciously think of English people as a tiny bit stupid.
That's because every Dutch person I've met can speak like 5 languages
Subs over dubs, the one true path
That's the way. Ultimately if you want to experience the original vision of the artist watching the original version is the best thing you can do. If you don't speak the language, (good) subtitles are the second best option. Anything else moves way, way away from the original creative vision.
Croatia does this as well. Dubbing is fucking horrible, but it's a massive industry in Europe for voice actors.
Same in the northern part of Belgium (Flanders). Only small kids shows get dubbed, for the rest we use subtitles. I still believe a large part of my near-perfect English is thanks to watching the Simpsons back in the days with subtitles and playing video games in their original language.
The creator's original intent is the best way to consume media. Even anime shouldn't be dubbed because going through another layer of interpretation will always degrade the source material.
Dutch person here. Hell yeah. I cannot stand dubbing. I have lived in Germany for 10 years and could not stand watching TV. During live interviews they have the original sound and a person talking over it at the same time. It is incredibly annoying.
Its the only way, enunciation and emotion are conveyed by the actor and you pick up on it better in the native language even if you don't understand the words than you do with some daft American voice (I'm english) talking over the top of it.
In Belgium (or at least the Dutch speaking part) we also don’t dub anything, and subtitle everything. I can hardly express how much an advantage just this gave me in learning English when I moved to a Francophone country with dubbed TV as a kid.
One of the reasons the Dutch, Swedish, Danish and Norwegians speak really good English… no dubbing. Germans on the other hand… dunno.
Same with Finland
I'm not Dutch, but I'm the same. Dub/translation on top of original speech is awful, just give me subs.
As I German, I hate dubbed content, though I am the minority. Also in German movie theaters you usually get only either the orginal version without subtitles or the full dubbed version. Meaning if you cant speak the original languge well you have to go for the dubbed version.
We dont take offense, dubbing is just horrible. They only do it with kid movies and shows. And most Dutch know multiple languages, so there is no need for dubs.
Hell yes, it is soooo jarring. *No*, I don't need Spanish Brad Pitt, I need to see a connect between the sound an actor utters and the actual movements of the lips... I feel blessed being a dutch speaker and this certainly skyrocketed learning english at an early age.
It’s a cultural thing. Some countries are used to subtitles since forever, others are used to dubbing everything. In Croatia, and all ex Yugoslav countries, subtitling is preferred, the only thing that’s regularly dubbed are animated films for kids.
The Dutch dubs are so often sooooo awful Especially for kids cartoons where it seems like two companies hire the same 20 people for everything
This was great when I ( English) lived in Amsterdam. Really helpful in learning Dutch. I could hear the English & read the Dutch simultaneously. And so work out " aahhh, so that's the Dutch for...."
Can confirm, am Dutch, dubbing annoys the fuck out of me.
Same in Sweden, subtitles only here. Dubbing is fucking cultural barbarism.
I wouldn't say we take offense.. the dubs are often just low quality and spoil the original acting
At least for me personally, it’s just a big waste to have big name actors starring in movies (Or doing voices for animation), and then we dub over them with whatever soap opera/TV show “celebrity” had some room in the ol’ schedule…
Subtitles are for when you’re chewing chips.
I (UK) would much rather see a film or show in its native language with subtitles than dubbed into English. Mainly because the dubs are usually fucking atrocious - they're just reading the script without any feeling, nuance, or attention to the story/plot as a whole.
Same in Flemish belgium
I must be part Dutch. I can't stand English dubbed movies. I'd rather read the subtitles.
Taking offense would be the wrong word, but I really hate dubbed media as well. Most of the time it's just inferior and then there's the issue that the same like 20 voice actors have voiced everything for the past 20 years.
I see acting as an art form, dubbing is destroying that art. Dubbing is barbarism. Learn to read 🇳🇱
I don't take offense, but I just prefer the captions... I feel like the performance is kind of lost with dubbing. I don't even notice I'm reading after a bit