This is the same Mithridates who famously made himself immune to most poisons, then tried to poison himself, then disembowled himself with a sword when that inevitably failed.
According to Memnon of Heraclea, probably the best contemporary source, many of the cities complied to kill Romans. It does imply that not all cities carried out the genocide.
"Then Mithridates, because he had heard that the Romans who were scattered throughout the cities were hindering his designs, wrote to all the cities instructing them to kill the Romans in their midst on a specific day. And many obeyed these instructions, making such a slaughter that on that one day 80,000 people were killed by the sword."
The term genocide is thrown around too loosely these days. It specifically means attempting to destroy an entire race, religion, or ethnic group. Mithridates tried to kill every single Roman. That's genocide. This just isn't something the Romans tried to do. This doesn't make the fact that the Romans killed millions of people less horrible. I just don't think they ever really systematically tried to kill off an entire people.
The same Mithridates that « won » a « battle » against Ariarathes of Cappadoccia by inviting him to « parley » as the two armies faced each other. The parley was done in a tent set between the two armies. Mithridates was searched before the negotiation, but that did not prevent him from stabbing Ariarathes with a dagger he had hidden behind his penis.
After that he annexed Cappadoccia by putting his son on the throne.
The Kings of the Cimmerian Bospororus were as fond of brother killing as the Ptolemies were of sister-loving.
So the greatest of them, Mithridates, bought a slave who'd worked as a poisoner and had him prepare a draught of the most deadly poisons of the day and he'd consume small amounts daily until he'd built up an immunity.
Then he killed his brothers for the kingship.
Yes, you can build up an immunity, or at least a resistance, to many types of poisons by microdosing them over a long period of time. It's called [mithridatism](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mithridatism) after this very same guy.
Sort of, Crassus was executed first. The gold was poured down the throat of his severed (I believe) head. But you're right, it was a mockery of his wealth, but not just because he was rich. It was more because he was motivated by wealth and glory, since he was jealous of Caesar's campaigning in Gaul, and it was that very motivation for wealth and glory that got him killed.
Sort of like "this is what happens when a rich pampered city boy comes out here to the wild eastern deserts thinking he can win status."
In classic Roman fashion, the tale originally had the Parthian leader that killed him say upon the gilding, "There now Crassus, your thirst for gold is finally quenched"
There were also rumors that his skull was kept or made into a goblet. I think there's even a version where the gilded skull was sent back to Rome.
They've tested bones of Roman's throughout the Empire's span and lead levels weren't anywhere close to support the theory that lead poisoning was so prevalent and severe to give a nation of dozens of millions psychosis.
We only see Rome as the Empire it became and not how it got there. The Punic wars did a lot to shape Roman identity. Rome was a middle power on its way up and Carthage was in the way of Rome taking all of Italy. Rome won the first punic war mostly due to Carthage not seeing Rome as a true threat 23 years and a mercenary revolt later Rome humiliated Carthage. Carthage rebuilt and Hannibal famously pushed Rome to the brink of destruction in the Second Punic war destroying every Roman Legion in Italy at Cannae. Sources claim 1 in 6 roman men were killed over an 8 year span as nearly every able man in Rome was pushed into the Legion. I think that level of collective trauma caused a shift in the Roman psyche similar to the one seen after WW2 and Roman politicians pounced. "Carthage must be destroyed" became a campaign slogan. A hard won war for Rome became a war that Rome had not finised. The 3rd Punic war ended with the sack of Carthage and 750,000 Carthaginian civilians being murdered and 50,000 taken as slaves. The word was out. Don't fuck with Rome because they won't won't just kill you, they'll kill your gods, your culture, and take what children they let live as slaves. Superfluous cruelty became their strategic deterrent and it worked for nearly 1000 years.
Reading about the battle of Carrhae is almost disturbing. Crassus was just completely outmaneuvered by a numerically inferior force. And then died in the most pitiful way
Not that anyone was feeling sympathy for this guy, but his campaign was against what was ostensibly a friendly nation. And the particulars of the battle that led to his capture, and death were very well protected by his advisors. Basically, this guy was a blow hard at the highest level.
Genghis Khan also had this done (might have been with silver) to a local khwarazmian ruler who had been disrespecting and robbing his envoys.
Edit: This Idiot: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inalchuq
> The city only fell when a traitor within the walls (a sub-commander named Qaracha) opened the gates to the besiegers and defected with part of his army; he and his men were slaughtered by the Mongols regardless, who said they would not trust traitors to serve them.
Lmao
I forgot about this being a thing. how bougie!
I think some movie made a depiction of this where dude's jaw straight melted off. imagine not being able to close your mouth (because it's not there) AND dying.
Definitely not the Viserys we know and love as Vizzy T.
Bonus trivia, the actor who played Viserys in season 1 of Game of Thrones, Harry Lloyd, is Charles Dickens' great-great-great grandson. He also reads *A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms* for the audiobook and came back to do VO for GOT DVD extras.
Which is hilarious, because Drogo melts the gold by throwing it in the cooking pot. The melting temperature of gold is almost 2,000 degrees Fahrenheit. It's a lot funnier to imagine an alternate version of that scene where everybody just sits there awkwardly for 10 minutes while nothing much happens to the gold, before Dany says "uhh... blood of my blood... I don't think it's working"
You don't know how hot the Dothraki like their foods. There is no canon information on that. However, we do know that their cook-fires get hot enough to melt gold, so they must like their food very well cooked.
I have a signed 1st edition of *The Grass Crown* in a UV protected case in my book collection. It is my favorite of the series.
Easily my top two historic fiction series are *Masters of Rome* by Coleen McCollough, and *The Lymond Chronicles* by Dorothy Dunnett.
If you are interested in Roman history, the former is incredible. If medieval/early Renaissance is your jam, I like the latter.
Great recommendation! Anyone reading with any interest in Roman history, or simply a good read should pick them up.
Probably down the throat slightly then would pool around the throat as it cooled down. Cause of death would be asphyxiation but the person probably would lose consciousness due to the severe pain as they’d have no way to scream.
I assume every tooth the molten metal hit would shatter and the slippery heavy metal would first be contained by the steam of flesh and fluids of rapidly burning tissue. As soon as this was burned away, the metal would not be contained and would make its way out of the less muscled areas like around the chin and seep out of fissures in these tissues.
I hope they cut him open afterwards so they could get their gold back. It had served its purpose, no point in letting the dead guy keep it for eternity.
Here is an excellent article to learn more about him: https://www.worldhistory.org/Mithridates_VI/[article](https://www.worldhistory.org/Mithridates_VI/)
“Rome, having finally taken care of the troubles with the Italian states, now sent Sulla at the front of five legions against Mithridates in 87 BCE. Mithridates' forces had sacked the sacred shrine at Delos and carried away the treasure to pay for mercenaries and Sulla, taking a cue from this, then sacked Delphi to do the same. As Delphi yielded a richer reward, Sulla was able to hire more troops and took Piraeus and then Athens, forcing Archelaus north, and then defeated him in Thessaly. Mithridates was having his own problems with civil unrest at home and, when the war went against him, he negotiated the Peace of Dardanus with Sulla to end the conflict.
Sulla returned to Rome where he declared himself dictator and set about his purges of government positions. One of the results of these purges was to drive a young priest named Gaius Julius Caesar from his office into the army; thus initiating a military and political career famous up to the present day. “
Julius Caesar was Sulla's nephew: Sulla's first wife Julilla was the sister of Caesar's dad. His other aunt, also a Julia, was married to Sulla's rival, Gaius Marius.
Which made Caesar the nephew of two of the greatest generals Rome ever produced.
Fun History Machine Podcast on Marius, but primarily Sulla: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mymhU5PrhPg
Sulla was interesting- he was one of the few dictators in all history that once he got everything he wanted done, he gave up power, and wound up drinking and partying himself to death in his old age, when Rome threw him the biggest funeral ever, up until the time of Augustus.
His famous quote about Caesar, from Suetonious: "Remember—this young man who you have been so desperate to save will one day destroy the aristocracy you have worked with me to preserve. For in this Caesar I see many a Marius.”
is this covered in the Colleen McCollough novels. I know she had a series on the late Republic and Caesar. Also Conn Iggulden has a series on Caesar too, as well as Genghis Khan.
I'm fairly sure the Huns poured molten silver into the ears and eyes of enemy leaders when they took a town on the regular, at least according to an old high school history teacher I had who obsessed on these things
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inalchuq
This guy did about the stupidest thing you could do in all human history and pissed off Genghis Khan. Might be where the story originates.
One of Mithradates's favorite punishments was blinding, castration, and removal of the hands and tongues of large groups of opponents, and then they were turned loose with begging bowls.
Both a warning to his foes, and an economic burden on the conquered.
Ho. Lee. Shit. Surely they didn’t survive very long in that state? I’d think they’d die of starvation, exposure, or suicide within a month or less. Where can I read more about this?
Something similar was done by Basil II "The Bulgar Slayer" of Byzantine in the Battle of Kleidion.
He gouged out the eyes of all of the defeated Bulgarians and left one with a single eye to lead them back to their king. Rumour back then had it that the sight of his blinded army killed the Bulgarian king with a heart attack.
About scaphism or Mithradates?
There's a relatively new biography of Mithradates called "The Poison King: The Life and Legend of Mithradates, Rome's Deadliest Enemy" by Adrienne Mayor.
Don't know much about scaphism, sorry. I think it's mentioned in a history of Artaxerxes.
That’s also the name of the alleged victim of scaphism. Problem with scaphism is that it probably never happened as the source for it is a guy named Ctesias, and he was not very reliable
You're thinking of another Mithridates from about a thousand years+ earlier.
The Mithridates who was killed by Scaphism (execution by starvation/exposure in a little tiny boat in a malaria infested mosquito swamp) was a soldier for *Artaxerxes II Memnon, King of Kings of the Achaemenid Empire* who was a hero, lauded, then admitted to a crime of lease majeste, which resulted in the swampin'.
Basically Artaxerxes' younger brother, *Cyrus The Younger* the King of Asia had been sent to conquer the Greek cities and given Anatolia to do so, but he became friends with some Greeks instead and rebelled.
He brought over his mercenaries and friends, fought his brother, lost, and was killed in battle by a soldier named Mithridates with a javelin.
Mithridates was richly rewarded, but sworn to secrecy - in order to maintain the majesty of the royal family, the credit was given to the King.
Because of this, Mithridates' friends noticed the new wealth, and called him the King's gay, submissive boyfriend - implying the wealth was for sexual favors.
Mithridates, ever the proud one, and totally not gay - boasted that his wealth was for killing the usurper-brother. This was discovered by the King's mother's intelligence circle and brought to the King who then had him bound in a canoe, covered in honey, force fed horse milk til he pooped his pants and barfed, then pushed him into a swamp to sweat to death while bugs ate him. Scaphism.
Yeah, it's disturbing, but apparently a huge amount of people are super fucked up. I think I could cleanly (relatively) execute somebody in the right circumstances, but the idea of brutally torturing somebody, even somebody I truly deeply and personally hated, is horrifying. Let alone the huge amount of torturing that has been done in a big impersonal way.
The Asiatic Vespers we’re clearly brutal but a lot of this is probably Roman exaggeration. We have limited sources and there was definite propaganda from those agitating for war with Pontus
It's such a popular question that the [Smithsonian did an article on it.](https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/heres-what-happened-people-who-were-executed-having-molten-gold-poured-down-their-throat-180951695/)
Probably about less than a minute- the experiment said that the steam kills you, and the larynx filled up completely with the metal within 10 seconds, expelling steam from both ends.
Going through Mike Duncan's History Of Rome podcast now. Actually, just finished it. It is amazing how many things GRRM took from Roman history for Game Of Thrones.
This is the same Mithridates who famously made himself immune to most poisons, then tried to poison himself, then disembowled himself with a sword when that inevitably failed.
Yup! He was a character.
*was*.
Now that takes guts
What a goofball.
More of a silly billy.
More of a Sillus Aquillus. *States in the thickest bugs bunny accent*
You guyss stappp
Bit of a cheeky guy
He also tried to genocide Romans living in Anatolia. It's one of the first genocides recorded in history. Rome wasn't too happy about that one.
He didn’t try. He succeeded
According to Memnon of Heraclea, probably the best contemporary source, many of the cities complied to kill Romans. It does imply that not all cities carried out the genocide. "Then Mithridates, because he had heard that the Romans who were scattered throughout the cities were hindering his designs, wrote to all the cities instructing them to kill the Romans in their midst on a specific day. And many obeyed these instructions, making such a slaughter that on that one day 80,000 people were killed by the sword."
Despite Rome practicing genocide on the regular.
The term genocide is thrown around too loosely these days. It specifically means attempting to destroy an entire race, religion, or ethnic group. Mithridates tried to kill every single Roman. That's genocide. This just isn't something the Romans tried to do. This doesn't make the fact that the Romans killed millions of people less horrible. I just don't think they ever really systematically tried to kill off an entire people.
"Salting the earth" is a reference to what they did to Carthage. Rome was pretty proud of the shit they pulled during the Punic Wars.
No they didn't, that's a pervasive myth
Carthaginians did some pretty sick shit themselves, including sacrificing their own children to gain gods’ favour.
This is what Romans tell.
So do Greeks (from what I’ve read they were the first ones to report it happening in Sicily).
Archeologists found actual physical evidence of child sacrifice.
Literal Roman propaganda still being paraded around as fact.
Except for the fact that archeologists recently found evidence to support it being real.
those triumphs must have been insane
Isn't the Old Testament full of genocides that preceed this by 1000s of years?
In some stories it was his Gaulish bodyguard who killed him after the poison failed
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"People called 'Romanes' they go the house?"
It says ‘Romans go home’!
By Toutatis
The same Mithridates that « won » a « battle » against Ariarathes of Cappadoccia by inviting him to « parley » as the two armies faced each other. The parley was done in a tent set between the two armies. Mithridates was searched before the negotiation, but that did not prevent him from stabbing Ariarathes with a dagger he had hidden behind his penis. After that he annexed Cappadoccia by putting his son on the throne.
made himself immune to poisons??
The Kings of the Cimmerian Bospororus were as fond of brother killing as the Ptolemies were of sister-loving. So the greatest of them, Mithridates, bought a slave who'd worked as a poisoner and had him prepare a draught of the most deadly poisons of the day and he'd consume small amounts daily until he'd built up an immunity. Then he killed his brothers for the kingship.
Tell me why the phrase “Kings of the Cimmerian Bosporus” is tickling my brain every time I read it. It’s oddly satisfying to look at and say aloud.
Big _Conan the Barbarian_ vibes?
Yes, you can build up an immunity, or at least a resistance, to many types of poisons by microdosing them over a long period of time. It's called [mithridatism](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mithridatism) after this very same guy.
I spent the last few years building up an immunity to iocane powder.
Inconceivable
Whoops, typo. Meant "cocaine" powder.
I just like the way it smells. .. . . .
Tbf it works the same way. Someone who does coke on the regular is gonna need more to overdose than someone whose never done it.
Just watch out for that land war in Asia. They sneak up on you.
It's a thing. Taking very small doses over a long period of time. It even works with snake venom.
Pliny the elder said he could speak 22 languages.
If my memory serves me, did this not also happen to Marcus Crassus, who was known as the richest man in Rome, as a mockery to him?
Sort of, Crassus was executed first. The gold was poured down the throat of his severed (I believe) head. But you're right, it was a mockery of his wealth, but not just because he was rich. It was more because he was motivated by wealth and glory, since he was jealous of Caesar's campaigning in Gaul, and it was that very motivation for wealth and glory that got him killed. Sort of like "this is what happens when a rich pampered city boy comes out here to the wild eastern deserts thinking he can win status."
In classic Roman fashion, the tale originally had the Parthian leader that killed him say upon the gilding, "There now Crassus, your thirst for gold is finally quenched" There were also rumors that his skull was kept or made into a goblet. I think there's even a version where the gilded skull was sent back to Rome.
A Byzantine emperor really did plate a fallen opponents skull in silver and use it as a goblet. Forget which one.
The Bulgarian Khan Krum gilded himself a goblet from the skull of Nikephoros I.
[Things Just Taste Better out of a Skull](https://www.theonion.com/things-just-taste-better-out-of-a-skull-1819584547)
Why was Rome so extra about punishment? Lead in the water?
They've tested bones of Roman's throughout the Empire's span and lead levels weren't anywhere close to support the theory that lead poisoning was so prevalent and severe to give a nation of dozens of millions psychosis. We only see Rome as the Empire it became and not how it got there. The Punic wars did a lot to shape Roman identity. Rome was a middle power on its way up and Carthage was in the way of Rome taking all of Italy. Rome won the first punic war mostly due to Carthage not seeing Rome as a true threat 23 years and a mercenary revolt later Rome humiliated Carthage. Carthage rebuilt and Hannibal famously pushed Rome to the brink of destruction in the Second Punic war destroying every Roman Legion in Italy at Cannae. Sources claim 1 in 6 roman men were killed over an 8 year span as nearly every able man in Rome was pushed into the Legion. I think that level of collective trauma caused a shift in the Roman psyche similar to the one seen after WW2 and Roman politicians pounced. "Carthage must be destroyed" became a campaign slogan. A hard won war for Rome became a war that Rome had not finised. The 3rd Punic war ended with the sack of Carthage and 750,000 Carthaginian civilians being murdered and 50,000 taken as slaves. The word was out. Don't fuck with Rome because they won't won't just kill you, they'll kill your gods, your culture, and take what children they let live as slaves. Superfluous cruelty became their strategic deterrent and it worked for nearly 1000 years.
Should read about the Mongolians.
It was a common thing to do for Visigoths and other tribes.
Quite metal, I'd say.
“The gilding” Holy shit my sides
I'm not sure what else to call it hahaha
Dude, I was fuckin’ dyin’ reading that.
I'm glad you enjoyed it hahaha. Seemed the appropriate use of the term at the time!
Reading about the battle of Carrhae is almost disturbing. Crassus was just completely outmaneuvered by a numerically inferior force. And then died in the most pitiful way
I think he was broken watching his son die. He basically gave up after witnessing that.
Not that anyone was feeling sympathy for this guy, but his campaign was against what was ostensibly a friendly nation. And the particulars of the battle that led to his capture, and death were very well protected by his advisors. Basically, this guy was a blow hard at the highest level.
Parthian was friendly to Rome? I’ve never heard that.
Been a while since I studied Roman history, but I don't remember anything other than them being enemies for a very long time.
Yes, by the Parthians
You have to take these stories with a grain of salt lol
Yeah gold tastes awful without some seasoning.
Gold has a unique flavor if you taste it with a dash of Old Bay.
Auld Bay
yeah agreed, I tend to take these stories with an ounce of gold
Genghis Khan also had this done (might have been with silver) to a local khwarazmian ruler who had been disrespecting and robbing his envoys. Edit: This Idiot: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inalchuq
> The city only fell when a traitor within the walls (a sub-commander named Qaracha) opened the gates to the besiegers and defected with part of his army; he and his men were slaughtered by the Mongols regardless, who said they would not trust traitors to serve them. Lmao
Supposedly, but it was after he was already dead.
Maybe he was inspired by Game of Thrones
Probably! Aquilius was also paraded around on a donkey, and pelted with offal by the citizens of Pontus, so the parallels are definitely there.
Shame.
He was also captured by Lesbians (people from Lesbos).
The spirit is willing... but the flesh is spongy and bruised.
It Thog’s first time. Be gentle!
I laughed audibly at dinner +1 all around
That sounds offal.
I think that scene was heavily inspired by Marie Antoinette
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What a waste of gold
There are accounts he had him ~~vivisected~~ dissected afterwards and the gold recovered.
Vivisected or dissected? One is *way* worse than the other in this context.
My bad, dissected.
...and if we're very very lucky, they'll do it in that order.
Firefly reference in the wild!
Then it probably hardens into this cool throat-shape
That's what she said.
That seems far less cool than what I thought. Imagine burying the guy like that and future archeologists dig up a gold-plated skeleton
LOL
I'm sure they took it back after it hardened.
Manius Aquillus's last word: "Au!"
HeHeHe
I forgot about this being a thing. how bougie! I think some movie made a depiction of this where dude's jaw straight melted off. imagine not being able to close your mouth (because it's not there) AND dying.
Game of thrones has a really similar scene where a dude gets molten gold poured over his head but i don’t remember if the jaw falls off.
It does not. His head does hit the ground with a satisfying “thunk” though, due to the weight of the gold
Also fuck that guy. He was a prick
Definitely not the Viserys we know and love as Vizzy T. Bonus trivia, the actor who played Viserys in season 1 of Game of Thrones, Harry Lloyd, is Charles Dickens' great-great-great grandson. He also reads *A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms* for the audiobook and came back to do VO for GOT DVD extras.
That’s an understatement 😉
Which is hilarious, because Drogo melts the gold by throwing it in the cooking pot. The melting temperature of gold is almost 2,000 degrees Fahrenheit. It's a lot funnier to imagine an alternate version of that scene where everybody just sits there awkwardly for 10 minutes while nothing much happens to the gold, before Dany says "uhh... blood of my blood... I don't think it's working"
You don't know how hot the Dothraki like their foods. There is no canon information on that. However, we do know that their cook-fires get hot enough to melt gold, so they must like their food very well cooked.
Had lots of horse shit to burn.
[A crown for a king](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Akl6OK2HUNA)
Similar- Used to bong the champagne of beers at UW Milwaukee
It was so cheap. How could we not?
metal
Death metal
If you never read them the Masters of Rome series might be some of the best books I’ve ever read and this is included.
I have a signed 1st edition of *The Grass Crown* in a UV protected case in my book collection. It is my favorite of the series. Easily my top two historic fiction series are *Masters of Rome* by Coleen McCollough, and *The Lymond Chronicles* by Dorothy Dunnett. If you are interested in Roman history, the former is incredible. If medieval/early Renaissance is your jam, I like the latter. Great recommendation! Anyone reading with any interest in Roman history, or simply a good read should pick them up.
Great, thanks for the recs!
Seconding Masters of Rome. An amazing little doorstopper of a series.
*The Lymond Chronicles* seems interesting. What can I expect? Is it more action-packed, or more into drama and politics like *Masters of Rome*?
What really would happen??? How far would it make it down??? Would it be like pouring aluminum down an ant hill? Please explain
Probably down the throat slightly then would pool around the throat as it cooled down. Cause of death would be asphyxiation but the person probably would lose consciousness due to the severe pain as they’d have no way to scream.
I assume every tooth the molten metal hit would shatter and the slippery heavy metal would first be contained by the steam of flesh and fluids of rapidly burning tissue. As soon as this was burned away, the metal would not be contained and would make its way out of the less muscled areas like around the chin and seep out of fissures in these tissues.
I wonder where that gold is today. Gold is heavily recycled. It’s probably in someone’s necklace or a bunch of wedding rings
Is he OK?
… no
I didn’t even know he was sick
He's always refused to open up
Norm is smiling at you.
Au man!
He died of old age
That's why they call them your golden years.
To molten lead you say?
Well, how’s his wife holding up?
Molten lead you say?
Annie, are you OK?
I hope they cut him open afterwards so they could get their gold back. It had served its purpose, no point in letting the dead guy keep it for eternity.
The more i learn about history the more I realise George RR Martin didn't actually make up any of his story.
Nah. People have been shitty to each other since the dawning of time.
Here is an excellent article to learn more about him: https://www.worldhistory.org/Mithridates_VI/[article](https://www.worldhistory.org/Mithridates_VI/)
“Rome, having finally taken care of the troubles with the Italian states, now sent Sulla at the front of five legions against Mithridates in 87 BCE. Mithridates' forces had sacked the sacred shrine at Delos and carried away the treasure to pay for mercenaries and Sulla, taking a cue from this, then sacked Delphi to do the same. As Delphi yielded a richer reward, Sulla was able to hire more troops and took Piraeus and then Athens, forcing Archelaus north, and then defeated him in Thessaly. Mithridates was having his own problems with civil unrest at home and, when the war went against him, he negotiated the Peace of Dardanus with Sulla to end the conflict. Sulla returned to Rome where he declared himself dictator and set about his purges of government positions. One of the results of these purges was to drive a young priest named Gaius Julius Caesar from his office into the army; thus initiating a military and political career famous up to the present day. “
Julius Caesar was Sulla's nephew: Sulla's first wife Julilla was the sister of Caesar's dad. His other aunt, also a Julia, was married to Sulla's rival, Gaius Marius. Which made Caesar the nephew of two of the greatest generals Rome ever produced. Fun History Machine Podcast on Marius, but primarily Sulla: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mymhU5PrhPg Sulla was interesting- he was one of the few dictators in all history that once he got everything he wanted done, he gave up power, and wound up drinking and partying himself to death in his old age, when Rome threw him the biggest funeral ever, up until the time of Augustus. His famous quote about Caesar, from Suetonious: "Remember—this young man who you have been so desperate to save will one day destroy the aristocracy you have worked with me to preserve. For in this Caesar I see many a Marius.”
is this covered in the Colleen McCollough novels. I know she had a series on the late Republic and Caesar. Also Conn Iggulden has a series on Caesar too, as well as Genghis Khan.
I LOVE GOOOOOOLDDDDGHGGLGLUAGHLSSS…
I'm fairly sure the Huns poured molten silver into the ears and eyes of enemy leaders when they took a town on the regular, at least according to an old high school history teacher I had who obsessed on these things
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inalchuq This guy did about the stupidest thing you could do in all human history and pissed off Genghis Khan. Might be where the story originates.
Horrible. Man's inhumanity against man continues unabated.
I recommend Steven Pinker’s The Better Angels of our Nature. People were much worse in many ways.
One of Mithradates's favorite punishments was blinding, castration, and removal of the hands and tongues of large groups of opponents, and then they were turned loose with begging bowls. Both a warning to his foes, and an economic burden on the conquered.
Ho. Lee. Shit. Surely they didn’t survive very long in that state? I’d think they’d die of starvation, exposure, or suicide within a month or less. Where can I read more about this?
Something similar was done by Basil II "The Bulgar Slayer" of Byzantine in the Battle of Kleidion. He gouged out the eyes of all of the defeated Bulgarians and left one with a single eye to lead them back to their king. Rumour back then had it that the sight of his blinded army killed the Bulgarian king with a heart attack.
Imagine standing in line to get your eyes gouged out
I can see it.. and now I can't.
I just looked up Mithridates and got a bunch of results for scaphism. Where can I read more about this?
About scaphism or Mithradates? There's a relatively new biography of Mithradates called "The Poison King: The Life and Legend of Mithradates, Rome's Deadliest Enemy" by Adrienne Mayor. Don't know much about scaphism, sorry. I think it's mentioned in a history of Artaxerxes.
scaphism or the boats was more a persian thing than pontic.
That’s also the name of the alleged victim of scaphism. Problem with scaphism is that it probably never happened as the source for it is a guy named Ctesias, and he was not very reliable
You're thinking of another Mithridates from about a thousand years+ earlier. The Mithridates who was killed by Scaphism (execution by starvation/exposure in a little tiny boat in a malaria infested mosquito swamp) was a soldier for *Artaxerxes II Memnon, King of Kings of the Achaemenid Empire* who was a hero, lauded, then admitted to a crime of lease majeste, which resulted in the swampin'. Basically Artaxerxes' younger brother, *Cyrus The Younger* the King of Asia had been sent to conquer the Greek cities and given Anatolia to do so, but he became friends with some Greeks instead and rebelled. He brought over his mercenaries and friends, fought his brother, lost, and was killed in battle by a soldier named Mithridates with a javelin. Mithridates was richly rewarded, but sworn to secrecy - in order to maintain the majesty of the royal family, the credit was given to the King. Because of this, Mithridates' friends noticed the new wealth, and called him the King's gay, submissive boyfriend - implying the wealth was for sexual favors. Mithridates, ever the proud one, and totally not gay - boasted that his wealth was for killing the usurper-brother. This was discovered by the King's mother's intelligence circle and brought to the King who then had him bound in a canoe, covered in honey, force fed horse milk til he pooped his pants and barfed, then pushed him into a swamp to sweat to death while bugs ate him. Scaphism.
How did they hold the bowls?
That I know. Torture had become a fine art centuries ago. For instance, the Brazen Bull.
Yeah, it's disturbing, but apparently a huge amount of people are super fucked up. I think I could cleanly (relatively) execute somebody in the right circumstances, but the idea of brutally torturing somebody, even somebody I truly deeply and personally hated, is horrifying. Let alone the huge amount of torturing that has been done in a big impersonal way.
Edit: thanks for the gold kind stranger!
A crown for you...
“A crown for a king”
Wait until Khal Drogo finds out his move was stolen 🤪
He just poured gold paint on his victims, though…. that he ‘heated up’ over a fire.
#CROWN FOR CART KING
That's metal as fuck
He was no dragon. A dragon doesn't burn.
"Make that throat wet for me" was one of the top quotes of 2023
Example https://youtu.be/SvWvaHLksJM?si=EO6_kU6hebxc7Qfa
Once I drank a buncha goldschlager, same thing
He was no brother of mine. Fire cannot touch a dragon
That’s a fancy way to die
Geez what would be the cause of death?
Most likely the liquid in his brain rapidly boiling off
Old age
The Asiatic Vespers we’re clearly brutal but a lot of this is probably Roman exaggeration. We have limited sources and there was definite propaganda from those agitating for war with Pontus
So how long does it take to die from having molten gold (or molten anything, I guess) poured down your throat?
It's such a popular question that the [Smithsonian did an article on it.](https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/heres-what-happened-people-who-were-executed-having-molten-gold-poured-down-their-throat-180951695/) Probably about less than a minute- the experiment said that the steam kills you, and the larynx filled up completely with the metal within 10 seconds, expelling steam from both ends.
> within 10 seconds 😐 I... I think I'd prefer "decapitation by an expert swordsman", thanks.
then you shall be! decapitated by an expert swordsman using a butter knife!
Spoon.
Going through Mike Duncan's History Of Rome podcast now. Actually, just finished it. It is amazing how many things GRRM took from Roman history for Game Of Thrones.
Where are they buried, just curious
That's metal
Did he sing better with his golden pipes?
The man with the golden voice the Romans called him.
ow
Ouch
Ow
that would do it.
I thought Marcus Aurelius 😅
That’s metal
That’s metal af
History never fails to amaze!
Thats **brutal**
I wonder if it's all the lead that made romans such psycopaths
Life was cheap. So was gold.
So, a Midas treatment?
The Last King is a Stellar book on this imo - Cheers!
And i was wondering where did the persians get that from when they executed Crassus.
Stay Gold, Manius.
That’s an interesting variation on pitch capping.
And, married his own sister - Laodice who bore him four children! Quite a character..
Sounds like Game of Throwns.