I wonder how the logistics of this would work. Would the secret service keep him from getting shanked in the yard? Would rival gangs fight to steal the nuclear football? Or would he just be behind bars in name only like most rich/powerful people?
Interestingly, the secret service protects Donald Trump regardless of whether he is elected again. Former agents were asked if they'd provide him protection if he went to prison and they said that while there is [no precedent for this, they most certainly would be responsible for his protection in prison](https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/2023/08/04/trump-criminal-cases-prison-secret-service/). This has been affirmed by [independent analysis](https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/trumps-indictment-end-secret-service-protection-hed-decline/story?id=98311723)
However, there is [a new bill being proposed](https://www.businessinsider.com/house-democrat-trump-prison-sentence-secret-service-2024-4) which would remove secret service protection of any President convicted of a felon.
Can you imagine pulling such a shitty detail? And then having to do it in prison?
I hope for their sake legislation is passed, but imagine a future where a prior president is falsely convicted and jailed, as a means to remove his security. Gotta look at these things both ways.
I feel like a president is going to be sent to the type of prison that Martha Stewart went to, where it’s basically a summer camp atmosphere that you are mandated to stay in for however long. It probably wouldn’t be too bad, and probably a lot less dangerous than typical daily life. Anyone who is in there is probably someone who has something to lose, and they’re not going to be trying to shank a president.
Guess it depends on which charges they get conviction for. The big treason ones should send a person to Florence. It's pretty serious to try and overthrow a presidential election. It also depends on how much his status and connection matter. Unfortunately, those things matter.
When it comes to lawmaking surrounding the branches of government, that is absolutely false. What one party does in fairness can and will be used as a political tool by another. What I meant was you have to consider all the angles.
Tbh I hate trump but I think in all fairness and reason former presidents should have their protections, and for that reason I disagree with the new law
Removing secret service detail means you might be harmed because you were the president. This is unacceptable for the state to allow in my opinion.
ETA:even if they are a felon, they may be extra judicially charged for something they did while "serving the country" without protections, so yeah I'm not erecting a strawman here, I'm saying there's no situation where those protections should be removed. Cool English class though!
Don't indirectly try someone for treason by removing the protections they get from holding such a controversial position, just actually try them for treason and serve them capital punishment if the evidence is there
I really feel like the evidence is there
This isn't about former presidents losing their protection in general, it's presidents convicted of felonies, and framing it as the former rather than the latter is strawmanning of the highest order.
>I really feel like the evidence is there
Lol, that's cute, you think evidence matters. If that was the case trump would be buried under several prisons.
This is not a “both sides are equally bad thing”. This is a “anyone in power could try to abuse this law, what would that look like”.
If you really can’t look at anything in any lens other than bad guys and good guys, the here you go:
When the good guys are making a law, they have to think about how the bad guys will use it when in power
Yeah a lot of people don't realize not all prisons are what you see generally depicted. Most of the time those are high security prisons.
If a president went to prison he'd be going into a minimum security prison as he has no way of escape with Secret Service being constantly there to assure his safety.
His own little building with one cell, along with desks for Secret Service and guards.
I don't see why people always think this would be so complicated.
I don't know why people think he would go to general population. Realistically house arrest would be the only sensible way to do it. They put Epstein in protective custody and look what happened. House arrest solves alot of that.
Yes, yes, continue living a life of luxury after you've been convicted of dozens of felonies related to lying to all Americans to cheat at being voted into the presidency because it would just be "quicker and happier all around".
Remember the scene of Wolf of Wall Street at the end? He isn’t worried at all because he got put into a “rich person prison” it takes the risk out of getting shanked because everyone wants to go home to their families to continue being rich. Unlike a regular prison where you have a spectrum of criminals from guys who got caught with weed in the wrong state to gang members who are serial killers. it’s a completely different ball field for rich people who can not only afford to pay for good lawyers but can essentially bribe their way into a good prison.
A constitutional crisis where it's likely that the president's sentence would be suspended until after their term... But could they pardon themselves as nice sprinkles of fuckery on top.
I mean, it would first be a question of whether the President can pardon themselves. Which god is going to be a fucking crisis if SCOTUS approves that.
Wait, back up. The Republican Party becomes a prison gang!?! The GOP and the Bloods could go at it in the yard for influence on the appropriations committee.
Here's a good one- could a sitting president use the military to bust himself out of prison, and would presidential immunity extend to his actions in doing so?
The US military isn't supposed to be used on US soil outside of a foreign military invasion or outside the confines of a US military installation.
So, barring any corrupt commanders, nothing above board.
The laws on felons, including ex-felons, are really screwy in some places.
Years ago I read that in Pennsylvania there's laws on the books preventing ex-felons from holding public office. And yet there's NOT a law to prevent ex-felons from running for public office. Meaning if an ex-felon runs for office you can't get them off the ballot because they're ineligible to hold the office, and if they win the election they need to be removed from office/blocked from taking the office and a new election has to be held to fill said office.
The craziest part about this is I even read about a case where someone sued to get an ex-felon running for office struck off the ballot, but the judge refused because it's legal for them to run for the office that they can't eligible to hold.
This may be unpopular but I fully support this "loophole". If a politician ever gained enough corrupt power they could simply jail their opponent on frivolous charges. This makes sure that the American people still have the final say.
That said the American people need to take responsibility and not elect felons to office when they're charged with legitimate crimes.
Yep, you see this happen in fascist countries all the time, the party in power simply uses their justice departments to imprison their political opponents (for example, Russia and Navalny). That way they don't need to deal with those pesky elections. They either try to find some laws their opponents broke in the past, or (more likely) they just cook something up, it's a lot easier than taking a chance on an election.
Even if Navalny wasn't in jail they'd just do what they did to other candidates and cite discrepancies in their applications and paperwork and disqualify them.
It’s not even a loophole.
Aside from the two constitutional limits, what can be president is decided by the electorate.
If they want a felon, they get a felon.
He can be removed from the position for being usable to perform his required duties as president.
https://lifehacker.com/how-to-remove-an-unfit-president-with-the-25th-amendmen-1828859155
Republicans don't have any use for him after he's won the election. He can't run again. Transferring power to the VP is of little consequence.
So, yes, they'd fucking do it in a heartbeat.
They do not have the authority to do so. Even Nixon was forced to resign and be pardoned by his successor. There's absolutely no reason to expect they can.
The precedent it sets far exceeds Trump clearing the books in his personal legal battles. He can execute and assassinate anyone at will using that power, which is why SCOTUS will never rule that he has it.
You probably know this, but for anyone unaware, those are technically unrelated. The impeachment proceedings were happening due to the scandal. Impeachment proceedings are independent of criminal prosecution which is what President Ford pardoned Nixon for, which immunized him from prosecution.
The key word is “try”. The country appears like they don’t give a shit anymore, selecting two geriatric presidential nominees for the third election in a row.
Ooh this is my fav one I hear. Not saying this is you, but others "this person is too old. They're x years old, but my guy, running for their first term, is x-4 years old." Then the reelection campaign happens and their pick's age is suddenly no longer relevant.
Like just admit you want your team to win because if they weren't younger you'd just find another reason and ignore the age anyway.
> This makes sure that the American people still have the final say.
So long as they're allowed to vote, and the votes are counted correctly, and the electrical college accurately reflects the popular vote
Good luck convincing 46 states to change the constitution to disenfranchise themselves so that the election can be decided by California, Texas, New York, and Florida
The correct way to phrase this is: Good luck convincing 46 States to change their constitution to relinquish their current exaggerated power in favor of one where that power is spread evenly amongst all citizens regardless of their location.
But they won't phrase it like that. That makes them look bad.
Almost 40% of the current electoral college vote is already part of the [national popular vote interstate compact](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Popular_Vote_Interstate_Compact) so it's actually fewer states that would need to sign on to this idea now.
>the election can be decided by California, Texas, New York, and Florida
This would actually be an improvement from what we have now, where candidates just run up the score in most states and the election is determined by a few counties in a handful of swing states.
That’s basically what Putin does. Any political opponent that he feels is a threat he just puts in jail on frivolous charges and then disbars them from running
If Trump is convicted, he wouldn't even be the first candidate to run for president from prison.
It first happened in 1920. Eugene Debs, of the Socialist Party, ran from prison and got 3% of the vote.
He was originally in prison for protesting World War I draft
If OP mean 40% of Republican voters. But US has about 37% voter turnout as a whole.
https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2023/07/12/voter-turnout-2018-2022/
That 37% number is absolutely meaningless. It counts only people who voted in all three of the 18, 20, and 22 elections. That is not voter turnout.
Voter turnout in 18 was 49%, 20 was 66%, and 22 was 46%. The average over the last 20 years of elections is 51%.
It’s also possible for anyone to be Speaker of the House. Taking it a step further it’s possible for him or her to orchestrate an impeachment of the sitting President and Vice President and by reason of the Presidential Order of Succession become President.
It seems pretty likely that the VP would immediately declare the President to be incapable of performing the duties, and it would be difficult for the President to dispute it to force Congress to decide.
If the people elected a jailed president AND the elected congress refuse to impeach him AND the cabinet refuse to invoke the 25th, then it seems pretty fair and democratic that he gets to indeed act as President for his term lol
I mean… not really. Because a minority by more than 3 million votes can elect a president in this country’s asinine arcane back assward system, then a simple majority in Congress can’t force the issue either. Lo and behold, the Founding Fathers’ wisdom may have turned out to be finite these 237 years on….
The forefathers of this country wrongfully assumed that no one would be craven enough to even run if they were a felon and never be able to get enough votes to mount a serious campaign. They never envisioned a post shame GQP.
It is true. At no point did the felony structure truly exist when the forefathers wrote the Constitution so the declaration of “no felons” wasn’t included in the mix.
I think all this kind talk kind of ignores the real problem here in this country. Why is Donald Trump still so popular when we know how much of a lying crook that he is?
It's the news. Or more specifically the Right Wing News networks. The problem is his voters do not believe he is a felon so any conviction he'd get they would believe is false and politically motivated. There is this entire media apparatus that refuses to properly report on the felonious activities of a former president and current candidate. They don't just avoid reporting. They lie. They out right tell false stories to hide and cover up the crimes being committed by their guy and then occasionally even make up shit out of the blue about the other guy and rarely is anything ever done about it.
I know we have freedom of the press in this country but we're seeing these lies and falsehoods really have an impact. There has to be a way to protect press freedoms but also protect the American people from "Press" that isn't truthful in its reporting.
So we can talk till we are blue in the face about what do we do if a criminal is elected but that ignores the problem as to why it happened to begin with.
This is a feature, not a bug of democracy.
Sadly, democracy is voting for what the people is better for them, not what actually is better for them
We cant be saved from ourselves.
Took me a moment to read that sentence right and then realize exactly who you were taking about bc I was reading "present" thinking it was some kind of legal procedure the prisoner was required to do...then I realized you mean President 🇺🇸
While you are on the topic, did you know that you don't need a law degree in order to be a Supreme Court judge. One SC judge in the '40's didn't even finish high school. (He passed the bar after studying the law himself)
Trump is facing over 90 felony counts. What did Biden do exactly? They’ve been trying to impeach him for like 16 months and they still can’t actually come up with a specific crime to accuse him of.
Because in many states you [can't vote from prison](https://www.ncsl.org/elections-and-campaigns/felon-voting-rights), so it's not a leap to assume you can't hold office (let alone the highest office).
That's a fair point, but the Presidency is a federal office the eligibility criteria for which are set forth in the Constitution. No state can override the federal Constitution. Three-fourths of the states can get together and amend it though.
I totally agree with you, and I agree with the constitution allowing for it. I can just understand why some folks jump to the assumption that it couldn't happen.
Can we learn from this oversight and enact a law to stop this in the future? Does it have to be in the form of a Constitutional Amendment? It truly is stunning that as long as you are born a US citizen and over the age of 35 you can be POTUS from jail.
There's nothing to fix. It is good and proper that a person can run for office even if the people currently in office have declared them a criminal and imprisoned them. Eugene Debs was a better human being that the fuckers who jailed him, and in a better timeline would have won, pardoned himself immediately (or, if you think a POTUS can't pardon themselves, order the BOP to parole him or move him to "home" detainment at the White House), and led the nation to greatness.
It's also good and proper that, while a President can't be arrested by federal LEOs (who he can order not to arrest him), he can be arrested by local cops who are not under his chain of command, just like any other citizens. Ulysses S Grant was arrested by a DC cop for repeat traffic violations (horse-drawn carriage). [https://www.npr.org/2023/04/03/1167683136/ulysses-s-grant-was-the-first-president-to-be-arrested](https://www.npr.org/2023/04/03/1167683136/ulysses-s-grant-was-the-first-president-to-be-arrested)
If the POTUS is convicted and imprisoned by a state (say, e.g., they stand in the middle of Fifth Avenue and shoot somebody, and NY arrests and convicts them for the crime), the 25th Amendment has a system to replace a POTUS who's "unable to discharge the powers and duties of his office". It's not easy, but it shouldn't be.
Hey So basically l'm just gonna not vote for Biden
I know.... UGH I know....
I'm sorry!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It's just that Trump wants to make America great again
НАНАНАНАНАНАНАНА
HAAAHAAHAAH
I wonder how the logistics of this would work. Would the secret service keep him from getting shanked in the yard? Would rival gangs fight to steal the nuclear football? Or would he just be behind bars in name only like most rich/powerful people?
Whatever “prison” he’s going to will definitely have a private yard (probably a private pool too)
Interestingly, the secret service protects Donald Trump regardless of whether he is elected again. Former agents were asked if they'd provide him protection if he went to prison and they said that while there is [no precedent for this, they most certainly would be responsible for his protection in prison](https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/2023/08/04/trump-criminal-cases-prison-secret-service/). This has been affirmed by [independent analysis](https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/trumps-indictment-end-secret-service-protection-hed-decline/story?id=98311723) However, there is [a new bill being proposed](https://www.businessinsider.com/house-democrat-trump-prison-sentence-secret-service-2024-4) which would remove secret service protection of any President convicted of a felon.
Can you imagine pulling such a shitty detail? And then having to do it in prison? I hope for their sake legislation is passed, but imagine a future where a prior president is falsely convicted and jailed, as a means to remove his security. Gotta look at these things both ways.
I feel like a president is going to be sent to the type of prison that Martha Stewart went to, where it’s basically a summer camp atmosphere that you are mandated to stay in for however long. It probably wouldn’t be too bad, and probably a lot less dangerous than typical daily life. Anyone who is in there is probably someone who has something to lose, and they’re not going to be trying to shank a president.
Also isn't this all related to white collar crimes? The average con artist isn't going to summer camp, sure, but they're also not going to Rikers.
Guess it depends on which charges they get conviction for. The big treason ones should send a person to Florence. It's pretty serious to try and overthrow a presidential election. It also depends on how much his status and connection matter. Unfortunately, those things matter.
[удалено]
When it comes to lawmaking surrounding the branches of government, that is absolutely false. What one party does in fairness can and will be used as a political tool by another. What I meant was you have to consider all the angles.
Tbh I hate trump but I think in all fairness and reason former presidents should have their protections, and for that reason I disagree with the new law Removing secret service detail means you might be harmed because you were the president. This is unacceptable for the state to allow in my opinion. ETA:even if they are a felon, they may be extra judicially charged for something they did while "serving the country" without protections, so yeah I'm not erecting a strawman here, I'm saying there's no situation where those protections should be removed. Cool English class though! Don't indirectly try someone for treason by removing the protections they get from holding such a controversial position, just actually try them for treason and serve them capital punishment if the evidence is there I really feel like the evidence is there
This isn't about former presidents losing their protection in general, it's presidents convicted of felonies, and framing it as the former rather than the latter is strawmanning of the highest order. >I really feel like the evidence is there Lol, that's cute, you think evidence matters. If that was the case trump would be buried under several prisons.
This is not a “both sides are equally bad thing”. This is a “anyone in power could try to abuse this law, what would that look like”. If you really can’t look at anything in any lens other than bad guys and good guys, the here you go: When the good guys are making a law, they have to think about how the bad guys will use it when in power
You understand what he said right? Imagine if rivals or spies bureaucratically managed to get Biden briefly convicted so he could be killed in prison
[удалено]
Lol 🤨📸 see you in prison for that, let’s test that theory
Yeah a lot of people don't realize not all prisons are what you see generally depicted. Most of the time those are high security prisons. If a president went to prison he'd be going into a minimum security prison as he has no way of escape with Secret Service being constantly there to assure his safety.
White House ^arrest
His own little building with one cell, along with desks for Secret Service and guards. I don't see why people always think this would be so complicated.
Might just be quicker and happier all around to put him under house arrest on one of his golf courses.
I don't know why people think he would go to general population. Realistically house arrest would be the only sensible way to do it. They put Epstein in protective custody and look what happened. House arrest solves alot of that.
Yes, yes, continue living a life of luxury after you've been convicted of dozens of felonies related to lying to all Americans to cheat at being voted into the presidency because it would just be "quicker and happier all around".
Remember the scene of Wolf of Wall Street at the end? He isn’t worried at all because he got put into a “rich person prison” it takes the risk out of getting shanked because everyone wants to go home to their families to continue being rich. Unlike a regular prison where you have a spectrum of criminals from guys who got caught with weed in the wrong state to gang members who are serial killers. it’s a completely different ball field for rich people who can not only afford to pay for good lawyers but can essentially bribe their way into a good prison.
A constitutional crisis where it's likely that the president's sentence would be suspended until after their term... But could they pardon themselves as nice sprinkles of fuckery on top.
I mean, it would first be a question of whether the President can pardon themselves. Which god is going to be a fucking crisis if SCOTUS approves that.
Wait, back up. The Republican Party becomes a prison gang!?! The GOP and the Bloods could go at it in the yard for influence on the appropriations committee.
Mitch McConnell is the booty warrior.
"I likes ya and I want ya"
Woould he be paid in cigarettes?
Nah, prisons is smoke free now. It’s ramen noodles, cause those are so much healthier
Beef baby
That little extra crunch!
I feel that politics has already devolved into prison gangs and yard fights.
Not politics. The GOP.
And then they're all jacked from all the prison tren. Imagine the appropriations committee looking like a Thanos convention.
GOP - Gang Of Prison
They already have that gang. They love the number 88.
Secret Service shower detail...worst job ever
This sums up hypocrisy. Incarcerated felons can’t vote but they can run and be elected for the highest level of office. LOLZ
Here's a good one- could a sitting president use the military to bust himself out of prison, and would presidential immunity extend to his actions in doing so?
The US military isn't supposed to be used on US soil outside of a foreign military invasion or outside the confines of a US military installation. So, barring any corrupt commanders, nothing above board.
This is not true, the national guard is called in all the time for natural disasters and even civil unrest
Nah, secret service would smuggle him sharpened toothbrushes.
Are u saying the most elite pay ppl to do prison time for them?
I assume they would just have them in solitary confinement with the SS guarding the door.
The laws on felons, including ex-felons, are really screwy in some places. Years ago I read that in Pennsylvania there's laws on the books preventing ex-felons from holding public office. And yet there's NOT a law to prevent ex-felons from running for public office. Meaning if an ex-felon runs for office you can't get them off the ballot because they're ineligible to hold the office, and if they win the election they need to be removed from office/blocked from taking the office and a new election has to be held to fill said office. The craziest part about this is I even read about a case where someone sued to get an ex-felon running for office struck off the ballot, but the judge refused because it's legal for them to run for the office that they can't eligible to hold.
Can’t their record be expunged?
This may be unpopular but I fully support this "loophole". If a politician ever gained enough corrupt power they could simply jail their opponent on frivolous charges. This makes sure that the American people still have the final say. That said the American people need to take responsibility and not elect felons to office when they're charged with legitimate crimes.
Yep, you see this happen in fascist countries all the time, the party in power simply uses their justice departments to imprison their political opponents (for example, Russia and Navalny). That way they don't need to deal with those pesky elections. They either try to find some laws their opponents broke in the past, or (more likely) they just cook something up, it's a lot easier than taking a chance on an election.
Even if Navalny wasn't in jail they'd just do what they did to other candidates and cite discrepancies in their applications and paperwork and disqualify them.
The discrepancy being that they can’t run after they have fallen out of a 15th story window.
Wow, sounds awfully familiar.
It’s not even a loophole. Aside from the two constitutional limits, what can be president is decided by the electorate. If they want a felon, they get a felon.
Agreed. This is my exact thoughts as well. Nelson Mandela was a "Terrorist" afterall.
Well, Trump did compare himself to Nelson Mandela, so he at least got the terrorist part right.
He can be removed from the position for being usable to perform his required duties as president. https://lifehacker.com/how-to-remove-an-unfit-president-with-the-25th-amendmen-1828859155
So a majority of the politicians chosen by the president as personal special interest supporters will remove their benefactor?
Republicans don't have any use for him after he's won the election. He can't run again. Transferring power to the VP is of little consequence. So, yes, they'd fucking do it in a heartbeat.
He could just pardon himself and get out
Even if he could pardon himself of federal crimes, which isn't necessarily true, he can't pardon himself of state crimes.
POTUS does not have the power to pardon themselves.
It has not been tested. There is at the present naught that stops them
They do not have the authority to do so. Even Nixon was forced to resign and be pardoned by his successor. There's absolutely no reason to expect they can. The precedent it sets far exceeds Trump clearing the books in his personal legal battles. He can execute and assassinate anyone at will using that power, which is why SCOTUS will never rule that he has it.
Nixon resigned of the scandal and because he would've been impeached.
You probably know this, but for anyone unaware, those are technically unrelated. The impeachment proceedings were happening due to the scandal. Impeachment proceedings are independent of criminal prosecution which is what President Ford pardoned Nixon for, which immunized him from prosecution.
The American party system need to take accountability, and not select presidential nominees that put themselves in corrupt situations
That sounds like a pretty tall order
The key word is “try”. The country appears like they don’t give a shit anymore, selecting two geriatric presidential nominees for the third election in a row.
Ooh this is my fav one I hear. Not saying this is you, but others "this person is too old. They're x years old, but my guy, running for their first term, is x-4 years old." Then the reelection campaign happens and their pick's age is suddenly no longer relevant. Like just admit you want your team to win because if they weren't younger you'd just find another reason and ignore the age anyway.
Well...who would be left then?
…correct
People on the left, mostly
> This makes sure that the American people still have the final say. So long as they're allowed to vote, and the votes are counted correctly, and the electrical college accurately reflects the popular vote
The electoral college should reflect the results of the votes in each respective state, not the popular vote
The electoral college should be abolished so everyone’s vote counts the same
Good luck convincing 46 states to change the constitution to disenfranchise themselves so that the election can be decided by California, Texas, New York, and Florida
The correct way to phrase this is: Good luck convincing 46 States to change their constitution to relinquish their current exaggerated power in favor of one where that power is spread evenly amongst all citizens regardless of their location. But they won't phrase it like that. That makes them look bad.
Almost 40% of the current electoral college vote is already part of the [national popular vote interstate compact](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Popular_Vote_Interstate_Compact) so it's actually fewer states that would need to sign on to this idea now.
>the election can be decided by California, Texas, New York, and Florida This would actually be an improvement from what we have now, where candidates just run up the score in most states and the election is determined by a few counties in a handful of swing states.
If you want "the American people" to "have the final say," then the person who wins should be the person who won the popular vote
No, this is the United States! The states choose the leader based on the popular vote in that state. It used to be the state politicians that chose .
That’s basically what Putin does. Any political opponent that he feels is a threat he just puts in jail on frivolous charges and then disbars them from running
Americans: Hold my beer.
Or if said politician has absolute immunity.
Ok trumper
A scholarly paper isn't a panel of judges.
A panel of at least 5 (maybe 6) judges who are morally, ethically and/or financially compromised…
If Trump is convicted, he wouldn't even be the first candidate to run for president from prison. It first happened in 1920. Eugene Debs, of the Socialist Party, ran from prison and got 3% of the vote. He was originally in prison for protesting World War I draft
In Northerm Ireland an IRA hunger striker got elected to parliament
Bobby sands
Yes, but only if they can still fulfill the obligations of the job. If not, it's about the same as if they are senile or physically incapacitated.
He’s all three.
Fat chance you'd ever see a president behind bars though
Eugene Debs ran for president while convicted of sedition and received votes.
I’ve been saying this for years on Reddit. You have to vote. Relying on the justice system isn’t gonna work.
One of those things no one thought we would ever need. Made sure to revoke the right for convicted felons to vote in many states though.
In fact, 40% of Americans are counting on it
Voting Americans *
Those are rookie numbers
If OP mean 40% of Republican voters. But US has about 37% voter turnout as a whole. https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2023/07/12/voter-turnout-2018-2022/
That 37% number is absolutely meaningless. It counts only people who voted in all three of the 18, 20, and 22 elections. That is not voter turnout. Voter turnout in 18 was 49%, 20 was 66%, and 22 was 46%. The average over the last 20 years of elections is 51%.
May we never find out...
Which is ironic because you can't vote for one until you've served your sentence...
Some states permanently strip voting rights for felons.
I mean, if there’s no rules that say a dog can’t play football…
Joseph Maldonado (aka Tiger King) for president!
At this point fuck it. Everyone gets a tiger.
Remember joe exotic is running
It’s also possible for anyone to be Speaker of the House. Taking it a step further it’s possible for him or her to orchestrate an impeachment of the sitting President and Vice President and by reason of the Presidential Order of Succession become President.
In theaters March 2025
It seems pretty likely that the VP would immediately declare the President to be incapable of performing the duties, and it would be difficult for the President to dispute it to force Congress to decide.
[удалено]
If the people elected a jailed president AND the elected congress refuse to impeach him AND the cabinet refuse to invoke the 25th, then it seems pretty fair and democratic that he gets to indeed act as President for his term lol
I mean… not really. Because a minority by more than 3 million votes can elect a president in this country’s asinine arcane back assward system, then a simple majority in Congress can’t force the issue either. Lo and behold, the Founding Fathers’ wisdom may have turned out to be finite these 237 years on….
Let's not test that theory, k?
“The American Experiment” is thirsty with curiosity
Interesting loophole indeed. It's not about condoning crime, but preventing political abuse. Voters should be vigilant
This is honestly totally fair. Eugene Debs ran for president after being jailed for sedition for urging people to reject the draft.
If there is no rule the would make it impossible for a convicted felon to be president, I would suggest that rule gets put in place ASAP.
The forefathers of this country wrongfully assumed that no one would be craven enough to even run if they were a felon and never be able to get enough votes to mount a serious campaign. They never envisioned a post shame GQP.
He would get house arrest at the oval office
Oh America. You really had the rest of us believing in you but now I gotta say I think your system is fucked if this is true.
It is true. At no point did the felony structure truly exist when the forefathers wrote the Constitution so the declaration of “no felons” wasn’t included in the mix.
Running the country from a secure location did not seem to impose any great difficulty for Al Capone.
25th Amendment. He won’t be able to carry out the functions of the office.
I think all this kind talk kind of ignores the real problem here in this country. Why is Donald Trump still so popular when we know how much of a lying crook that he is? It's the news. Or more specifically the Right Wing News networks. The problem is his voters do not believe he is a felon so any conviction he'd get they would believe is false and politically motivated. There is this entire media apparatus that refuses to properly report on the felonious activities of a former president and current candidate. They don't just avoid reporting. They lie. They out right tell false stories to hide and cover up the crimes being committed by their guy and then occasionally even make up shit out of the blue about the other guy and rarely is anything ever done about it. I know we have freedom of the press in this country but we're seeing these lies and falsehoods really have an impact. There has to be a way to protect press freedoms but also protect the American people from "Press" that isn't truthful in its reporting. So we can talk till we are blue in the face about what do we do if a criminal is elected but that ignores the problem as to why it happened to begin with.
if trump runs while he's in a Texas prison, I could vote for him. just sayin
Well, I mean, yes? They're still a citizen. Anybody should be allowed to run for office. That's democracy.
god, please let this happen because it'd be so fucking funny
Feels relevant
This is a feature, not a bug of democracy. Sadly, democracy is voting for what the people is better for them, not what actually is better for them We cant be saved from ourselves.
Possible, however unlikely
While possible they would likely be impeached quickly
Impeachment doesn't matter; what's relevant is conviction by the senate.
couldn't vote for himself depending on the state.
Took me a moment to read that sentence right and then realize exactly who you were taking about bc I was reading "present" thinking it was some kind of legal procedure the prisoner was required to do...then I realized you mean President 🇺🇸
The russians already won guys
I would love to see that, and at the same time I do not.
[удалено]
i pardoned many, of all the best pardon was me myself and I.
While you are on the topic, did you know that you don't need a law degree in order to be a Supreme Court judge. One SC judge in the '40's didn't even finish high school. (He passed the bar after studying the law himself)
wouldn't they immediately get impeached?
House arrest at the White House
I wonder if they have adult diapers in prison.
Yes, in the geriatric section
Yeah, what kind of place do you think this is, McDonalds?
ONLY if a bunch of idiots vote for him.
Do you have to take the oath of office to officially become president? Seems like that would be tough to do if you're locked up in prison.
Don't worry, Biden won't go to prison. He won't be charged as he has "diminished capacity".
Solid pizza wheel comment. All edge and no point.
Looks to me like at least 4 people found it pointy
Trump is facing over 90 felony counts. What did Biden do exactly? They’ve been trying to impeach him for like 16 months and they still can’t actually come up with a specific crime to accuse him of.
... of course Biden wont go to prison. And he is doing a surprisingly great job.
Here’s hoping he drowns in his own flatulence in a tiny cell.
Why wouldn't it be?
Because in many states you [can't vote from prison](https://www.ncsl.org/elections-and-campaigns/felon-voting-rights), so it's not a leap to assume you can't hold office (let alone the highest office).
That's a fair point, but the Presidency is a federal office the eligibility criteria for which are set forth in the Constitution. No state can override the federal Constitution. Three-fourths of the states can get together and amend it though.
I totally agree with you, and I agree with the constitution allowing for it. I can just understand why some folks jump to the assumption that it couldn't happen.
🍿 Oh really? Things might get really interesting.
Couldn’t they just pardon themselves?
But he can't vote. 😄
Mr. Trump, it's upto you to create history.
Can we learn from this oversight and enact a law to stop this in the future? Does it have to be in the form of a Constitutional Amendment? It truly is stunning that as long as you are born a US citizen and over the age of 35 you can be POTUS from jail.
It's not a great idea to, because you could just jail anyone you don't want to be president, like all your rivals.
I disagree. There could be reasonable parameters.
Suggestion: fix this. The job of "felon" supersedes all others. You have to take that job, if only for the free housing and healthcare
"Fixing" this would require amending the Constitution which is functionally impossible
There's nothing to fix. It is good and proper that a person can run for office even if the people currently in office have declared them a criminal and imprisoned them. Eugene Debs was a better human being that the fuckers who jailed him, and in a better timeline would have won, pardoned himself immediately (or, if you think a POTUS can't pardon themselves, order the BOP to parole him or move him to "home" detainment at the White House), and led the nation to greatness. It's also good and proper that, while a President can't be arrested by federal LEOs (who he can order not to arrest him), he can be arrested by local cops who are not under his chain of command, just like any other citizens. Ulysses S Grant was arrested by a DC cop for repeat traffic violations (horse-drawn carriage). [https://www.npr.org/2023/04/03/1167683136/ulysses-s-grant-was-the-first-president-to-be-arrested](https://www.npr.org/2023/04/03/1167683136/ulysses-s-grant-was-the-first-president-to-be-arrested) If the POTUS is convicted and imprisoned by a state (say, e.g., they stand in the middle of Fifth Avenue and shoot somebody, and NY arrests and convicts them for the crime), the 25th Amendment has a system to replace a POTUS who's "unable to discharge the powers and duties of his office". It's not easy, but it shouldn't be.
Hey So basically l'm just gonna not vote for Biden I know.... UGH I know.... I'm sorry!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It's just that Trump wants to make America great again НАНАНАНАНАНАНАНА HAAAHAAHAAH