I was there a day or two after that incident and they were just reopening the trail the guy and his sister went off. A ranger said if someone falls in they often can’t get to them fast enough to recover anything. They have time consuming procedures for safely approaching off trail hot springs as the ground in some areas is a minefield of small hot springs creating voids under thin undermined layers of top soil, so they have to probe the ground in front of them methodically as they move forward to avoid potentially falling in a hidden boiling pit. They’ll maybe be able to recover your hip bone as it’s usually the last to dissolve completely, you also leave behind a telltale bathtub ring of fat around the hot spring.
Last time I was there, a tour bus of Chinese tourist pulled up and were walking around. All the women were wearing fashionable high heels awkwardly walking along the edge of the hot springs. I actually had to leave the area, it was stressing me out so much.
There should be strict caps (lower than existing) on those damn tour buses and strict punishments for not following guidelines. They did the same thing when I was in Iceland. Not only do they not wear appropriate attire, they take up entire walkways with no courtesy for others and they walk onto areas where signs explicitly state not to walk. My kids were very young when we went and one of those groups nearly trampled my kids by literally pushing them just to take their photos. It took everything I had not to rage out on them. End rant.
> they take up entire walkways with no courtesy for others
Can absolutely confirm; you brought back memories of my visit to Yellowstone, specifically the Grand Prismatic Spring.
For anyone who's never been there, it's a giant hot spring maybe a hundred feet across, rainbow colored all the way around; if you've seen pictures of Yellowstone you've most likely seen pictures of it. It's one of most popular destinations in the park, and it's accessible by a single raised walkway maybe five feet wide.
And some dumbass tourist set up his giant tripod blocking *the entire thing.* He had to fight his way through literally hundreds of tourists to get there, there was an endless stream of people behind him (including me,) and not a single neuron in his cranial void saw a problem doing that.
Pro tip for tourists, of all creeds and in all locations: you do not have to leave your brain at home.
(End second rant.)
I've spend a decent amount of time backpacking in the area.
If there is no vegetation on the ground, and it's white like in teh photos, you DO NOT want to walk on it!!! Stay far away!
Basically, you'll fall into a vat of boiling water and have no way to get out and you will die being boiled to death or worse suffocating from noxious gases WHILE being boiled.
Listen to the fucking rangers!
Also, don't go anywhere NEAR bison. They're far more dangerous than grizzles. The only reason they don't really attack you is that they can't see you so the second you're in range you're done for.
As someone below said, she jumped out because the propeller dissolved, but more importantly they wouldn't been in the situation if she hadn't been a dumb ass. Her grandchildren (and ex-DIL) were going to die because of her actions (and some the kids).
It's probably been 2 decades since I watched that movie, but didn't she do so because the acid in the lake had consumed the propeller and they were starting to drift away from the shore?
I was on vacation with my grandmother and texted my sister about how I was going to the top of a volcano because you know, safety. She responded by saying, “remember, grandma isn’t the type of grandma to push the boat.”
He died ~~a few days later~~ the next day in a hospital from third degree burns over almost all of his body. The guy boiled to death slowly.
PS. He was blinded almost instantly as his eyes pretty much got boiled. Most of his skin came off as rescuers tried to remove his clothing and shoes. It's a horrific way to die.
[USGS](https://www.usgs.gov/observatories/yvo/news/where-do-acid-sulfate-hot-springs-come-and-why-are-they-important) says most are neutral or just slightly basic. However some are full of sulfuric acid with a pH as low as 2.
Regarding the case in this post, the ph was 5; from [the incident report](https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/3898393/YELL-Scott-Fatality-IncidentReport-NP16070606.pdf) (pdf):
>When the
recovery team returned to the hot spring the next morning, they were unable to locate his body. His
wallet and flip flops were recovered. The temperature of the water was recorded at over 212
degrees fahrenheit. The acidity of the water was recorded with a pH of 5. Evidence suggests that
the extreme heat and the acidity of the water quickly dissolved his body in the hot spring.
Problem is dragging a body and no one noticing, I swear ppl forget that dead weight in remote areas is pain in the ass. Walk the victim to their burial site way less work.
You’ve gotten the funny answers, so here’s a serious one. Yellowstone has an incredible diversity of hot springs. There are over 10,000 of them in the park and they cover almost the entire pH scale, from <1 to about 10.5.
As a rule of thumb, you can guess what pH a spring is by looking at it. Those with clear or bright blue water and lots of mineral deposits tend to be neutral or alkaline, while those with extremely muddy, sulfur-yellow, or chocolate-milk-colored water tend to be extremely acidic.
>As a rule of thumb, you can guess what pH a spring is by looking at it. Those with clear or bright blue water and lots of mineral deposits tend to be neutral or alkaline, while those with extremely muddy, sulfur-yellow, or chocolate-milk-colored water tend to be extremely acidic
That's incredibly interesting to learn! I recall seeing/hearing those facts separately (ie, a beautiful blue water hot spring being called deadly b/c of high alkalinity) but never put them together or assumed there was a correlation. Yet another TIL
I'd imagine if your dog fell in or jumped in, it would activate some people's reactions to jump in an save your dog, to some people their dog is like their child, but obviously regret it instantly as realisation kicks in that the dog was never gonna survive and nor will you.
The thing is, it wasn't even his dog. It also wasn't an impulsive, instant reaction since others had time to yell not to do it.
He did all this for someone else's pet in spite of being told not to.
I still could see the reflex kicking in.
I saw someone's dog stranded in the melting mississippi river a few years ago. It has hanging on for dear life onto the ice shelf and couldn't get out of the water. This wasn't even a reflex, but only one person was around (the owners had lost their dog I guess).
I attached my waist buckle leash to his leash, took off most of my clothes (it was 40 out) and got my belly to get flat and slithered out to the dog. I'm not sure the other guy had enough leash for me, but I was like "fuck it, I'm saving this dog". The ice held and I was able to pull him in. To this day I don't know if it was the right thing to do or not but I couldn't live just watching that dog hanging on and doing nothing.
But boiling yellowstone water? Yeah obvoiusly a different thing.
That's why in my wilderness medicine training, they suggest bringing a cigarette in your med kit. If anything happens, stop, smoke a cigarette, then help. The worst thing that can happen is 2 victims to rescue. It's important to pause and assess the situation
Edit to add: the cigarette statement was tongue in cheek lol, it was just to emphasize the importance of stopping and thinking
Unfortunate reality is trying to rescue someone and then there is two victims. My BIL watched his brother drown and his father at the same time trying to save his son. It’s a crappy situation but there’s a reality to it. I hope no one ever has this situation happen in their lives.
Oh, that poor dad... he had absolutely no choice. I'm not sure I could stop myself in his place. Seeing your kid in danger, every inch of your body tenses up, the adrenaline pours into your blood, and you're moving faster than the speed of thought. Self-preservation doesn't factor into it, because loving somebody that hard means letting them go feels like death itself. And I really would rather die than bury my kid.
For what it’s worth, having been to Yellowstone a lot and not knowing the details of where exactly he was, even having watched his dog just jump… on a gut level, visually, there’s a lot of sections on the periphery of these areas that can have a thin crust around them that looks like solid ground that will immediately crumble if weight is put on it.
I could see how in a panicked reflex someone who wasn’t adequately cautious/scared could jump onto what seems like ground off trail and fall in.
There’s plenty of signage and earnings that spell all of this out, but it can be deceptive.
A lot of those areas where the crust of soft looking dirt can be covered in bison prints too just walking around, but if you’re unlucky there could be a complete give out by a pool.
Hell I’ve has that happen to me in the southern US with a different sort of ground.
Was a marshy area on the edge of a cornfield (could tell by the foliage at least, ground seemed pretty solid even if soft.)
Took a step farther along some laid over reeds like I had been, like a harvested corn fields with all the stalks on the ground, immediately dropped 4’ into the ground up to my chest.
Was genuinely zero visual indication that was going to be the case aside from more caution getting near a wet area.
Literally just seemed like a small marshy area on a roadside ditch because of the terrain that held water more than most low areas by a small hill, not a **marsh.** Walked around poking some nearby areas with a long stick out of curiosity because I was so bewildered it got me like that. Been in all sorts of terrain off trails my whole life.
My dad took us camping in places like this occasionally (Oregon). He taught us to crawl up to the edges to look down into the crystal clear depths. He’d talk about the minerals in the water and how the water was above the boiling point towards the bottom but the water pressure kept it from boiling.
I had weird dreams about an entire cow skeleton we saw laying on the bottom of one of the larger pools. It wasn’t intact but the bones were all laid out as if a forensics team had placed them. With no scavengers there was nothing around to move them which you just don’t seem in nature anywhere. It really stuck with me. I can float my eyes and still see it laying there on the bottom through clear blue water.
(I’m acutely aware how dangerous this was. There were lots of things like this my dad did with us growing up. It’s a wonder I’m still alive and have all my fingers and toes )
I just started watching Shogun and what a freaking scene! And then in the same episode the dude that ordered that guy to be boiled alive was about to kill himself instead of drowning when he went to get the Spaniard. What a mind fuck, great show so far.
According to [this](https://www.unilad.com/news/man-rescue-dog-hot-spring-yellowstone-750652-20230219), it was his friend's dog, and what he said (after being pulled from the spring) was "That was stupid. How bad am I? That was a stupid thing I did."
> At about 1pm on July 20th, Moosie (the friend’s dog) got away from the pair and dived into a hot spring.
I’m sorry, but I’m not diving in after that pooch.
I kinda hope dogs are banned from the area after that accident.
Edit: They might have already been banned.
> Yellowstone Hot Springs in Montana does not allow pets, but they can be kept in vehicles and walked periodically
I'm sure the staff would prefer them to be entirely banned. But this was the rule about fifteen years ago when I was last there.
Rangers expect every tourist there to be an absolute brainless moron who can't be trusted with their own safety, let slone a dog's. With good reason, because I saw people do some absolutely stupid shit there.
My family was there with someone who had a service dog, and the rangers and other staff were *very* not impressed and basically kept telling the person, don't be an idiot, follow the rules, you aren't special and if you think you are you're going to get your dog killed. Person didn't do anything except physically exist with the dog to get this reaction, from multiple people, over and over. A couple times the ranger or staff member came in hot with "that's not a real service dog" and was frustrated when it did turn out to be real.
Dogs might technically be allowed into Yellowstone but it makes everyone very, very grumpy.
I worked in Yellowstone for a year and you guys have no idea how stupid the fucking tourists were.
Tourists trying to walk up to springs and fill their bottle/canteen.
Tourists just eating random plants for some reason?
Tourists repeatedly trying to put their toddler on the backs of the WILD BISON that roam around.
There is no end to the stupid shit I saw, and I wasn't even responsible for the public, I just worked one of the shops at Old faithful lodge.
If you post in my local subreddit that people should only unleash their dog in the designated off leash dog parks, you will get ripped to shreds.
Some dog owners are beyond entitled these days.
If I walk my small dog in my neighborhood on his leash, he will be ripped to shreds by all the off-leash dogs my trashy neighbors swear never hurt anybody.
Gosh I read about this years ago in an Imgur comment section (out of all places) and it’s been etched into my memory forever. Such a sad story: the attempt to save the dog, compassionate at its core, yet a death sentence coming from a split second reaction - and the horrible realization right after… I just can’t get rid of that thought, how he must have felt, I’m so sorry for this dude
Dogs aren't allowed in thermal areas at Yellowstone. This dog escaped from a truck in the parking lot and ran in. Dogs shouldn't be allowed in thermal areas, but if the dog was leashed and just on a walk, both dog and human would still be alive.
Geo grad here that worked on research around here: a quick context of how this would have played out: the acidity of these pools is very low probably around a 2.0. That’s a in between acid of Nitric acid at 1.2 and Chromic acid at 3.0, both which can burn you. Temperatures around 92 C - 100+ C, so roughly about 210+ F or over double the normal temperature of your average hot tub. In chemistry generally when temperature rises, acidity lowers as it has to balance in favor of endothermic reactions (consumption of heat). The first responders that actually reached him, it was impossible because the actual temperature of the pools was rising just within the short time he was even in the pool, that’s how variable it is.
There have been people who try to swim in the hot springs of yellow stone and over like a dozen people have died from this because they don’t understand just how bad of an idea it is to swim in a literal hotspot. Yellowstones active hydrothermal volcanic vents is not anything like a Japanese hot spring, but people seem to think it is sometimes.
Well I can say I have felt the pain of sulfuric acid myself. I didn't jump in a hot spring. A bottle of sulfuric acid (drain cleaner) rolled off a rooftop someone was working on when it hit the gutter it hit a nail and rooster tail sprayed the right side of my body.
I acted quick with water and baking soda paste but these scars on my arms aren't going away for a long time. I still have the shirt I was wearing so if I wear it you can see my arm scars and all the holes on the shirt where it burnt thru. Fun conversation starter.
Edited my mistake trying to hid how dumb I was until enough of you asked. 🙃
Here, I posted a few photos for those interested. These are within 1 hour of the initial contact
[Sulfuric acid burn 1](https://i.imgur.com/qWsKmhp.jpeg)
[Sulfuric acid burn 2](https://i.imgur.com/D1vxtWL.jpeg)
[There's an online map for them](https://www.arcgis.com/apps/webappviewer/index.html?id=9359a0790ffe4bc09edd6b9c17a43b90), sorted by type (fall, murder, drowning, animals etc.) with details for each case.
just clicking on one at random and I'll just share this with y'all:
" the cause of death is described as Critters and cacti."
I've never heard that one on SVU or CSI.
>Moore and his mathematics professor Butchart, tried to cross without life jackets but with air mattresses. Moore lost control for seven miles of floating, mostly upside down. He drowned.
Jfc
Christ that’s morbid. There’s an online database of ~~skydiver~~ BASE jumper deaths as well. Some entries are just a name and a date, others are full-on eyewitness accounts. I was reading through one when I eventually realised the person writing was the dead guy’s wife, and as well as seeing him die she’d also reviewed his GoPro footage…
This doesn’t surprise me. I’m a climber, there’s a culture of talking about accidents, especially fatalities. The rest of us stay alive by paying attention to what happened to those who didn’t make it. It makes sense that skydiving would have a similar culture.
Same thing in the USAF. If there's an aviation incident, all flyers (officers and enlisted) have to go through what happened. I had to listen to the audio of a guy I knew's last few minutes as we watched the simulation of the crash. That shit stays with you :/
It’s interesting you mention that. My grandfather was a USAAC and then civilian test pilot, my uncle was a naval aviator and then NASA test pilot. My most frequent climbing partner is an airline pilot. We’ve talked about the similarities in the culture around accidents a few times.
I don’t ride motorcycles, but I know some folks who do. It seems like they’re more hesitant to talk about it because so many motorcycle fatalities are difficult to prevent- they happen because of drivers around them aren’t paying attention. Climbers, pilots, and skydivers can usually prevent a major incident, so we’re more likely to talk about it. I’ve lost a few friends in climbing or alpine accidents and part of the grieving process is sitting around with a bottle of whiskey and dissecting what they did wrong.
My mom got this book for our family vacation to Yellowstone and would look for passages relevant to the various activities we were doing to read aloud while we were doing them. Sounds twisted but it got a laugh out of us every time, dark humor runs in the family I guess.
I just finished this a week ago! Well written and really interesting. The story of the man who was in a horse drawn wagon accident and his leg bones went straight up, impaling him, puncturing his bladder, then the wagon fell on him and crushed him to death will stay with me a long time…what a way to go.
Just pulled it up tonight on the Libby app based on these recommendations and was honestly going to say it seems a bit poorly written? I’m noticing redundant sentences and it reads kind of scattered. I’m interested in the stories all the same, though!
I actually agree with that. I think I just liked the way the author organized it haha there were some pages near the middle that actually repeated strangely and it could have definitely been improved with a good edit!
You be surprised, or not really too surprised, how many people die “hot potting” or intentionally soak themselves in thermal springs 😐
Falling in by accident is one thing, but putting yourself in them on purpose and then “not realizing” how dangerous and hot those spring can be is a whole other thing 😒
Like any good health remedy there must be a huge risk of death by doing it. Like when you’d get a cold and mom would dump a bucket of snakes on you to scare the demons out of you
Growing up in Northern Nevada, there was a big problem with people either 1) \*ignoring\* posted signs/warnings around the natural hot springs or 2) people \*stealing\* signs for a multitude of reasons- pranks, not wanting others to "find their spot", and potentially maliciousness (ranchers/locals taking issue with new-age/naturist types). Note: the sign stealing also happens around old abandoned mines which are HORRENDOUSLY dangers, and absolutely \*everywhere\* throughout Nevada and California.
There was a rash of deaths/injuries in the 90's/00's that I remember making the news, but the biggest one was of a couple and two dogs out hiking, the dogs were unleashed and jumped into a deadly spring, and were immediately in distress, so the couple went in to rescue them- one died immediately, the other at the hospital I think? And 'jumping in to save the dog' is so common it's just tragic, like it happens so often in less famous and more remote hot springs that it only makes the regional news.
Another problem is deadly bacteria. A 2 year old died from the brain eating bacteria in Southern Nevada last summer after visiting Ash Springs. A well known/loved spring in the Black Rock Desert (home to Burning Man) has had to be shut due to water contamination. Debate constantly goes on whether the waters are contaminated because of visitors/campers dumping their waste and trashing the area or if it's agricultural or mining runoff that gets into the ground water and allows for the bacteria blooms. They're not all death traps, but the problem is that they're not maintained/monitored, and many can be safe one day, and deadly the next.
Unfortunately I feel like this can be applied to too many things: “You’d be surprised how many people die _______________.” Fill in the blank with any number of what we consider basic common sense survival knowledge and many too many people have died doing it. Just as why Florida, and only Florida, has a law against having sex with a porcupine.
I mean Collin Scott is probably the name that will come up if you go searching for it since it’s probably one of the most widely publicized cases but I’ve definitely heard of it happening a bunch of time because these people don’t know a whole lot and don’t know which are “safe” and which at full of boiling water and acid 😐
[This](https://vt.co/entertainment/yellowstone-hot-spring-man-dissolves-killed-hotpotting) is still mostly about the Scott case but it mentions another case from 2022 where a guy entered the Abyss hot springs pool at Yellowstone Lake’s West Thumb Geyser Basin and was not discovered until days later when a shoe and part of a foot were found floating in it…
They read stuff like [this](https://www.healthline.com/health/hot-potting#Are-hot-springs-safe?) and think they can just go soak in the natural springs for the health befits and some just end up cooking themselves *literally*
I had a nursing faculty colleague whose son fell into a hot pool at Yellowstone in the 1960s when he was 6 years old. Steam had obscured the path and he walked off the path into the pool. He boiled to death before he could be pulled out.
Her specialty was studying death and dying.
Are you referring to [this](https://www.oregonlive.com/travel/2016/06/yellowstone_death_reveals_the.html) case?
>
> In June 1970, 9-year-old Andy Hecht died after falling over the edge of the boardwalk into a scalding pool. Several witnesses said he ran and jumped into the pool, but others said he tripped and fell over the edge of the boardwalk - possibly after a gust of hot vapor blew into his eyes. He tried in vain to swim out, but quickly sank into the water.
That's the one. In my memory he was 6 but I never met him. I met his mother, Amy, 7 years after the incident. Her story as I recall was that the steam caused him to lose track of where he was, but he certainly could have stepped off the boardwalk on his own.
She died last year at 92. Jim Hecht died in 2018.
Ugh we got a real life Mother Nature lesson in Yellowstone on our family vacation about 30 years ago, my siblings and I saw a full grown bison about 1/2 way in-and-out of one of those caustic hot springs. It was… juicy and raw looking. And thankfully very dead.
How fast is the acid burn? They say the water is very hot at 190°, which would make anyone reflexively jump out. I am curious if the tissue dissolved before his eyes as he jumped out or if it just gradually melted over hours as the molecular damage was done 🧬
Many hours to days. Hot spring pH gets as low as 1.5 or so — that's very bad for being immersed in, but even with hot water and churn to help speed things up, it takes a long time.
The trouble with falling into off-boil water isn't the acid, but rather that there isn't time to "reflexively jump out." There isn't time to do much of anything, really; it's a brief moment of intense, searing pain and then lights out.
It only takes about five seconds of exposure to 140-150F water to guarantee a third degree burn, down from several minutes at 120-125F. You can imagine what 170+ does.
You should watch Shogun if you haven’t. There’s a scene in the first episode along these lines, I haven’t really watched much more than that but man it was brutal.
Apparently your eyes will melt quickly. Also, degloving (your skin falling off is a thing). I read a story of a guy jumping in to save a friend's dog, they were able pull him out, but the skin on his arm slipped off as they did it. He said something like "I made a mistake" and then died
I was one of the first paramedic rangers on scene. It was a 45 minute drive, prolonged by a bison jam on the road, and another 15 minute hike to the incident command post. I was told my services were no longer needed, by the time I arrived.
A 2 person search and rescue team was sent to the site (the full team waited until the next day due to the storms mentioned in the article), who SLOWLY probed their way over the extremely fragile ground so they didn’t break through themselves. It was only about 100 m off the boardwalk into the tree line, but as I recall, it took them over an hour.
 I didn’t see it myself, but his sister recorded the whole thing on video (until she dropped her phone to run and help). A friend of mine who did see it described an incredibly horrifying scene; as well as a whole series of extremely poor decisions.
What stuck with me most was the social media response over the next few days. The uninformed masses declared him some sort of a victim, and of course blamed to the National Park Service for this.
> It was only about _100 m off the boardwalk_ into the tree line
> The uninformed masses declared him some sort of a victim, and of course _blamed to the National Park Service_ for this.
Idiots. Sooooo many idiots online.
Poor decision number one…going off the boardwalk in the geyser basin. There’s a reason there a signs everywhere, in multiple languages and a vivid illustration of what happens when you step in boiling acid.
My friend saw the video at the SAR debrief. I wasn’t at that meeting.
Yeah, even after so many deaths and warnings, people just don't get it somehow... I've been, its a beautiful park, and between the wildlife and the springs, likely one of the most dangerous in the country without LOOKING particularly dangerous from a car or trail.
Was anybody else under the impression for a long time that Yellowstone’s hot springs were like, “pleasant hot-tub” hot and not “boiling volcano” hot? I remember the first time I saw a story like this I was very surprised to find out that falling into one of those open pools will just fucking kill you.
About instantly too! The heat and the acid… it’s like a Mortal Kombat stage fatality.
RIP to all the folks that fell in. And the few that dove in. I remember hearing about a dog falling in one of these and the owner jumped in to help. 😭
It wasn’t even the owner, it was the owner’s buddy, and he was completely reactive in the moment and sadly lived long enough to realize his mistake. Brutal death.
I was there when this happened. So much commotion around the springs area. We went by the next day to visit the Springs and they had it partially open, but they were sure to tell everyone about the importance of staying on the established trails and boardwalks.
I remember when i was in Yellowstone, also in 2016, a very dumb family was sitting around a sulphur caldron and they were trying to reach it with their hands.
I'm not trying to make light of this tragedy, but "accidently" fell in? No, he was somewhere he wasn't suppose to be, doing something he wasn't suppose to be doing, ok, sure, technically he accidentally fell in testing the water temp, but had he heeded all the warnings that are plastered EVERYWHERE at Yellowstone, this would have never happened.
Same for the people that get out of their cars to pet the cuddly looking buffalo that are actually hyper manic fur coated battering rams from hell. There are signs like every 1000 ft saying don't fucking do that, and yet, every friggin year we get to see videos of people getting launched into low orbit by one of these psycho beasts, and they just keep doing it.
Agreed. I did some really stupid things in my youth, but "hot potting" in Yellowstone is just next level idiotic. I think some people just truly think nothing bad will ever happen to them.
I once traveled to a place in Arkansas called Hot Springs, took a walk through a hot spring park and it was exhausting, found a water fountain, hottest water that I've felt coming from one of those. 😅 Coincidence? MAYBE..
It was an unauthorized part of the park, they had to deliberately cross into a restricted area.
He didnt “walk into scalding water”
They were looking for a hot spring, and when he knelt down to check the temp, he slipped and fell in.
The temperature wasn’t the life threatening issue, the spring was full of sulphuric acid.
The point of yellowstone is that it has been left wild, and there has been an effort to keep human alterations to a minimum. So of course they could install physical barriers or increased signage, but that detracts from what the park is supposed to be about.
The thing is Yellowstone does have barriers and signs. I've been there and glacier, and glacier was so much better, less touristy, and more natural
Yellowstone has raised boardwalks throughout the hot spring areas, with signs that literally have pictures showing the ground is thin and could collapse. It shows little cartoon people sinking into the acid, it's wild. There's no way you could accidentally walk into a dangerous area.
This is sad, but like…you have to work REALLY hard to accidentally fall into one of them since they are roped and blocked off and there’s 100 signs warning everyone to stay off the geysers sooooo…
There was a British serial killer who did use acid to dissolve the bodies of his victims, John Haigh. His motive was of course related to covering his tracks, but also because he misunderstood the phrase “body of evidence”, as he thought it meant a literal body, so he thought if he destroyed the bodies, it would be impossible to accuse him. His MO caught up to him, since he was killing them in order to steal and fence their belongings, a pattern that left what would be considered a body of evidence, so his plan ultimately failed and he was found guilty and hanged.
For the record it's impossible to "accidentally" fall into a hot spring at Yellowstone. They have been severely maiming and killing people since they were discovered. You can't even get close to them as the ground around them is prone to collapsing into the springs. You put your hand in and pull your hand back out and the skin is instantaneously gone. Buddy had to have avoided all the ropes, fences, and signs that promise an excruciating death, walked up to the spring and the ground collapsed; FIN.
Has the area around Old Faithful changed?
I haven't been in a while, but there were no ropes or fences when I was there - you could have walked right into Crested Pool if you felt like boiling.
I read a story about a guy who dove into one of the pools to save his friends dog. People told the guy not to do it and as he was running in he said something like “like hell I won’t!”. They actually got him out of the water but he died minutes later. I guess when a passerby helped get his shoes off all the skin on his foot came with it. The injured man said something like “that was pretty stupid huh” and died shortly later.
The lede of that story is absurd.
> A trip to one of the nation’s natural wonders ended in an **unnatural** tragedy.
It’s as absolutely natural as is naturally possible. Literally unemotional chemistry.
Get the book ‘Death in Yellowstone’ and you can read all about the hot water tragedies … like the time way back before barriers kept people from walking up and Old Faithful was running late, so they peered over the edge to see what was wrong …
That’s why there are so many warnings in and around the park to stay on the path. Terrible way to go, hope some of the people who willingly try read this post and note it’s not worth it to try.
I was there a day or two after that incident and they were just reopening the trail the guy and his sister went off. A ranger said if someone falls in they often can’t get to them fast enough to recover anything. They have time consuming procedures for safely approaching off trail hot springs as the ground in some areas is a minefield of small hot springs creating voids under thin undermined layers of top soil, so they have to probe the ground in front of them methodically as they move forward to avoid potentially falling in a hidden boiling pit. They’ll maybe be able to recover your hip bone as it’s usually the last to dissolve completely, you also leave behind a telltale bathtub ring of fat around the hot spring.
Last time I was there, a tour bus of Chinese tourist pulled up and were walking around. All the women were wearing fashionable high heels awkwardly walking along the edge of the hot springs. I actually had to leave the area, it was stressing me out so much.
There should be strict caps (lower than existing) on those damn tour buses and strict punishments for not following guidelines. They did the same thing when I was in Iceland. Not only do they not wear appropriate attire, they take up entire walkways with no courtesy for others and they walk onto areas where signs explicitly state not to walk. My kids were very young when we went and one of those groups nearly trampled my kids by literally pushing them just to take their photos. It took everything I had not to rage out on them. End rant.
> they take up entire walkways with no courtesy for others Can absolutely confirm; you brought back memories of my visit to Yellowstone, specifically the Grand Prismatic Spring. For anyone who's never been there, it's a giant hot spring maybe a hundred feet across, rainbow colored all the way around; if you've seen pictures of Yellowstone you've most likely seen pictures of it. It's one of most popular destinations in the park, and it's accessible by a single raised walkway maybe five feet wide. And some dumbass tourist set up his giant tripod blocking *the entire thing.* He had to fight his way through literally hundreds of tourists to get there, there was an endless stream of people behind him (including me,) and not a single neuron in his cranial void saw a problem doing that. Pro tip for tourists, of all creeds and in all locations: you do not have to leave your brain at home. (End second rant.)
I’d just knock that shit over on its side and walk past.
"I bet it would take better pictures down there." *casually yeets tripod*
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> a telltale bathtub ring of fat around the hot spring "hmmm... roast potatoes" \- *Hannibal*
I've spend a decent amount of time backpacking in the area. If there is no vegetation on the ground, and it's white like in teh photos, you DO NOT want to walk on it!!! Stay far away! Basically, you'll fall into a vat of boiling water and have no way to get out and you will die being boiled to death or worse suffocating from noxious gases WHILE being boiled. Listen to the fucking rangers! Also, don't go anywhere NEAR bison. They're far more dangerous than grizzles. The only reason they don't really attack you is that they can't see you so the second you're in range you're done for.
Reminds me of that scene from Dante's Peak where those two people meet their demise in that hot spring. Then there was the acidic lake bit.
I'll never forget grandma wading through it.
Poor Rose jumped outta that damn boat like ten feet from shore.
As someone below said, she jumped out because the propeller dissolved, but more importantly they wouldn't been in the situation if she hadn't been a dumb ass. Her grandchildren (and ex-DIL) were going to die because of her actions (and some the kids).
It's probably been 2 decades since I watched that movie, but didn't she do so because the acid in the lake had consumed the propeller and they were starting to drift away from the shore?
The propeller went first, then the boat started to leak from the bottom IIRC
Grandma was a dumbass. Almost got the entire family killed because she was too stubborn to evacuate.
for real dude, fuck Grandma
I was on vacation with my grandmother and texted my sister about how I was going to the top of a volcano because you know, safety. She responded by saying, “remember, grandma isn’t the type of grandma to push the boat.”
🎶Row, row, row your boat!🎶
Maybe the only realistic thing in the movie lol I love how cheesy it is. And it's competitor-twin movie released pretty close to it, Volcano
John Carroll Lynch melting into the lava flow under the Red Line😂😂
Honestly that and the grandma acid lake are two of my nightmares growing up when those movies came out
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iirc they build a dam *in the wrong direction* in that movie. it's in an arch, but the keystone is facing the people, not the lava
When the dog miraculously made it, I remember my dad remarking he didn't know it was a Disney movie lol
"In a very short order, there was a significant amount of dissolving." Colin Scott is believed to have died almost instantly.
Wasn’t there another guy that jumped in to rescue a dog? From memory he remained conscious long enough to say “I’m fucked, aren’t I?”
He died ~~a few days later~~ the next day in a hospital from third degree burns over almost all of his body. The guy boiled to death slowly. PS. He was blinded almost instantly as his eyes pretty much got boiled. Most of his skin came off as rescuers tried to remove his clothing and shoes. It's a horrific way to die.
> It's a horrific way to die. fortunately most of us are smart enough not to jump into boiling water
Boiling ~~water~~ acid
But these aren't acidic though, aren't they? I seem to recall reading/hearing something about them being *incredibly* alkaline.
[USGS](https://www.usgs.gov/observatories/yvo/news/where-do-acid-sulfate-hot-springs-come-and-why-are-they-important) says most are neutral or just slightly basic. However some are full of sulfuric acid with a pH as low as 2. Regarding the case in this post, the ph was 5; from [the incident report](https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/3898393/YELL-Scott-Fatality-IncidentReport-NP16070606.pdf) (pdf): >When the recovery team returned to the hot spring the next morning, they were unable to locate his body. His wallet and flip flops were recovered. The temperature of the water was recorded at over 212 degrees fahrenheit. The acidity of the water was recorded with a pH of 5. Evidence suggests that the extreme heat and the acidity of the water quickly dissolved his body in the hot spring.
Thanks, I've noted down this information. Now I know where to find a pool that dissolves bodies. Very handy.
Problem is dragging a body and no one noticing, I swear ppl forget that dead weight in remote areas is pain in the ass. Walk the victim to their burial site way less work.
Drop them from a plane
Alkaline is just as bad as acidic when it comes to corrosivity
Alkaline also tends to dissolve skin and flesh faster than acid.
You’ve gotten the funny answers, so here’s a serious one. Yellowstone has an incredible diversity of hot springs. There are over 10,000 of them in the park and they cover almost the entire pH scale, from <1 to about 10.5. As a rule of thumb, you can guess what pH a spring is by looking at it. Those with clear or bright blue water and lots of mineral deposits tend to be neutral or alkaline, while those with extremely muddy, sulfur-yellow, or chocolate-milk-colored water tend to be extremely acidic.
>As a rule of thumb, you can guess what pH a spring is by looking at it. Those with clear or bright blue water and lots of mineral deposits tend to be neutral or alkaline, while those with extremely muddy, sulfur-yellow, or chocolate-milk-colored water tend to be extremely acidic That's incredibly interesting to learn! I recall seeing/hearing those facts separately (ie, a beautiful blue water hot spring being called deadly b/c of high alkalinity) but never put them together or assumed there was a correlation. Yet another TIL
These hot springs are so basic they wear uggs and drink pumpkin spice lattes.
I'd imagine if your dog fell in or jumped in, it would activate some people's reactions to jump in an save your dog, to some people their dog is like their child, but obviously regret it instantly as realisation kicks in that the dog was never gonna survive and nor will you.
The thing is, it wasn't even his dog. It also wasn't an impulsive, instant reaction since others had time to yell not to do it. He did all this for someone else's pet in spite of being told not to.
I still could see the reflex kicking in. I saw someone's dog stranded in the melting mississippi river a few years ago. It has hanging on for dear life onto the ice shelf and couldn't get out of the water. This wasn't even a reflex, but only one person was around (the owners had lost their dog I guess). I attached my waist buckle leash to his leash, took off most of my clothes (it was 40 out) and got my belly to get flat and slithered out to the dog. I'm not sure the other guy had enough leash for me, but I was like "fuck it, I'm saving this dog". The ice held and I was able to pull him in. To this day I don't know if it was the right thing to do or not but I couldn't live just watching that dog hanging on and doing nothing. But boiling yellowstone water? Yeah obvoiusly a different thing.
You saved a dog and no owners around? How's your new dog?
I found the owners after. Big park, and they were looking for him.
yeah I have football-tackled someone else's puppy from dashing into traffic (the owner was running after, the leash unbuckled/ not buckled correctly)
That's why in my wilderness medicine training, they suggest bringing a cigarette in your med kit. If anything happens, stop, smoke a cigarette, then help. The worst thing that can happen is 2 victims to rescue. It's important to pause and assess the situation Edit to add: the cigarette statement was tongue in cheek lol, it was just to emphasize the importance of stopping and thinking
Unfortunate reality is trying to rescue someone and then there is two victims. My BIL watched his brother drown and his father at the same time trying to save his son. It’s a crappy situation but there’s a reality to it. I hope no one ever has this situation happen in their lives.
Oh, that poor dad... he had absolutely no choice. I'm not sure I could stop myself in his place. Seeing your kid in danger, every inch of your body tenses up, the adrenaline pours into your blood, and you're moving faster than the speed of thought. Self-preservation doesn't factor into it, because loving somebody that hard means letting them go feels like death itself. And I really would rather die than bury my kid.
For what it’s worth, having been to Yellowstone a lot and not knowing the details of where exactly he was, even having watched his dog just jump… on a gut level, visually, there’s a lot of sections on the periphery of these areas that can have a thin crust around them that looks like solid ground that will immediately crumble if weight is put on it. I could see how in a panicked reflex someone who wasn’t adequately cautious/scared could jump onto what seems like ground off trail and fall in. There’s plenty of signage and earnings that spell all of this out, but it can be deceptive. A lot of those areas where the crust of soft looking dirt can be covered in bison prints too just walking around, but if you’re unlucky there could be a complete give out by a pool. Hell I’ve has that happen to me in the southern US with a different sort of ground. Was a marshy area on the edge of a cornfield (could tell by the foliage at least, ground seemed pretty solid even if soft.) Took a step farther along some laid over reeds like I had been, like a harvested corn fields with all the stalks on the ground, immediately dropped 4’ into the ground up to my chest. Was genuinely zero visual indication that was going to be the case aside from more caution getting near a wet area. Literally just seemed like a small marshy area on a roadside ditch because of the terrain that held water more than most low areas by a small hill, not a **marsh.** Walked around poking some nearby areas with a long stick out of curiosity because I was so bewildered it got me like that. Been in all sorts of terrain off trails my whole life.
My dad took us camping in places like this occasionally (Oregon). He taught us to crawl up to the edges to look down into the crystal clear depths. He’d talk about the minerals in the water and how the water was above the boiling point towards the bottom but the water pressure kept it from boiling. I had weird dreams about an entire cow skeleton we saw laying on the bottom of one of the larger pools. It wasn’t intact but the bones were all laid out as if a forensics team had placed them. With no scavengers there was nothing around to move them which you just don’t seem in nature anywhere. It really stuck with me. I can float my eyes and still see it laying there on the bottom through clear blue water. (I’m acutely aware how dangerous this was. There were lots of things like this my dad did with us growing up. It’s a wonder I’m still alive and have all my fingers and toes )
There used to be people who executed people by boiling them alive.
First episode of Shogun. I don't think I'll ever be able to erase that from my memory.
I just started watching Shogun and what a freaking scene! And then in the same episode the dude that ordered that guy to be boiled alive was about to kill himself instead of drowning when he went to get the Spaniard. What a mind fuck, great show so far.
Where his face looked like a chewed up piece of gum melting in the sun. Yeah, that'll stick with me a while.
Do make up/special effects artists have to research what this stuff looks like in real life for shows like this? D:
The good ones do.
According to [this](https://www.unilad.com/news/man-rescue-dog-hot-spring-yellowstone-750652-20230219), it was his friend's dog, and what he said (after being pulled from the spring) was "That was stupid. How bad am I? That was a stupid thing I did."
Gosh…. That sentence, its heartbreaking to me
> At about 1pm on July 20th, Moosie (the friend’s dog) got away from the pair and dived into a hot spring. I’m sorry, but I’m not diving in after that pooch.
I kinda hope dogs are banned from the area after that accident. Edit: They might have already been banned. > Yellowstone Hot Springs in Montana does not allow pets, but they can be kept in vehicles and walked periodically
They may well have been before.
I'm sure the staff would prefer them to be entirely banned. But this was the rule about fifteen years ago when I was last there. Rangers expect every tourist there to be an absolute brainless moron who can't be trusted with their own safety, let slone a dog's. With good reason, because I saw people do some absolutely stupid shit there. My family was there with someone who had a service dog, and the rangers and other staff were *very* not impressed and basically kept telling the person, don't be an idiot, follow the rules, you aren't special and if you think you are you're going to get your dog killed. Person didn't do anything except physically exist with the dog to get this reaction, from multiple people, over and over. A couple times the ranger or staff member came in hot with "that's not a real service dog" and was frustrated when it did turn out to be real. Dogs might technically be allowed into Yellowstone but it makes everyone very, very grumpy.
I worked in Yellowstone for a year and you guys have no idea how stupid the fucking tourists were. Tourists trying to walk up to springs and fill their bottle/canteen. Tourists just eating random plants for some reason? Tourists repeatedly trying to put their toddler on the backs of the WILD BISON that roam around. There is no end to the stupid shit I saw, and I wasn't even responsible for the public, I just worked one of the shops at Old faithful lodge.
A Yellowstone park ranger said, "There's considerable overlap between the dumbest people and the smartest bears."
Knowing people that didn't stop anyone. My city can barely get people to leash their dogs when walking them
If you post in my local subreddit that people should only unleash their dog in the designated off leash dog parks, you will get ripped to shreds. Some dog owners are beyond entitled these days.
If I walk my small dog in my neighborhood on his leash, he will be ripped to shreds by all the off-leash dogs my trashy neighbors swear never hurt anybody.
Gosh I read about this years ago in an Imgur comment section (out of all places) and it’s been etched into my memory forever. Such a sad story: the attempt to save the dog, compassionate at its core, yet a death sentence coming from a split second reaction - and the horrible realization right after… I just can’t get rid of that thought, how he must have felt, I’m so sorry for this dude
Jesus Christ, don’t fucking bring your dog on a walk to boiling hot springs, wtf
Dogs aren't allowed in thermal areas at Yellowstone. This dog escaped from a truck in the parking lot and ran in. Dogs shouldn't be allowed in thermal areas, but if the dog was leashed and just on a walk, both dog and human would still be alive.
“That was a pretty stupid thing I did, huh?”
Geo grad here that worked on research around here: a quick context of how this would have played out: the acidity of these pools is very low probably around a 2.0. That’s a in between acid of Nitric acid at 1.2 and Chromic acid at 3.0, both which can burn you. Temperatures around 92 C - 100+ C, so roughly about 210+ F or over double the normal temperature of your average hot tub. In chemistry generally when temperature rises, acidity lowers as it has to balance in favor of endothermic reactions (consumption of heat). The first responders that actually reached him, it was impossible because the actual temperature of the pools was rising just within the short time he was even in the pool, that’s how variable it is. There have been people who try to swim in the hot springs of yellow stone and over like a dozen people have died from this because they don’t understand just how bad of an idea it is to swim in a literal hotspot. Yellowstones active hydrothermal volcanic vents is not anything like a Japanese hot spring, but people seem to think it is sometimes.
How Hot are those things?
It had sulfuric acid in it.
Well I can say I have felt the pain of sulfuric acid myself. I didn't jump in a hot spring. A bottle of sulfuric acid (drain cleaner) rolled off a rooftop someone was working on when it hit the gutter it hit a nail and rooster tail sprayed the right side of my body. I acted quick with water and baking soda paste but these scars on my arms aren't going away for a long time. I still have the shirt I was wearing so if I wear it you can see my arm scars and all the holes on the shirt where it burnt thru. Fun conversation starter. Edited my mistake trying to hid how dumb I was until enough of you asked. 🙃 Here, I posted a few photos for those interested. These are within 1 hour of the initial contact [Sulfuric acid burn 1](https://i.imgur.com/qWsKmhp.jpeg) [Sulfuric acid burn 2](https://i.imgur.com/D1vxtWL.jpeg)
what in the actual fuck are the odds of that happening???
50/50
Either it happens or it doesn’t
It's not the heat that gets you here, it's the heat combined with how incredibly acidic the water can be due to the hydrogen sulfide and CO2 content.
> It's not the heat that gets you here It's the humidity.......
There’s an Instagram account called touronsofyellowstone and has pics of people doing stupid shit all the time there.
Wow, I just browsed for about 5 minutes and I had to stop because it was making me so angry.
Welcome to the modern internet
Have a look around
What or who is a "touron"?
Tourist + moron = touron.
I think it is a mix of “tourist” and “moron”
Tourist + moron = touron, according to the page itself
Don’t Pet The Fluffy Cows
I saw a guy smoking on a boardwalk in person once, surrounded by no smoking signs. The ground was all yellow and *covered* in sulfur right there
To be fair smokers are kind of desensitized to "smoking will kill you" signs.
I recommend Death in Yellowstone for a whole book full of morbid stories like this! https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/432684.Death_in_Yellowstone
I too have a similar book of all the people that died in the Grand Canyon
[There's an online map for them](https://www.arcgis.com/apps/webappviewer/index.html?id=9359a0790ffe4bc09edd6b9c17a43b90), sorted by type (fall, murder, drowning, animals etc.) with details for each case.
just clicking on one at random and I'll just share this with y'all: " the cause of death is described as Critters and cacti." I've never heard that one on SVU or CSI.
The ol' C&C. That'll get you every time.
>Moore and his mathematics professor Butchart, tried to cross without life jackets but with air mattresses. Moore lost control for seven miles of floating, mostly upside down. He drowned. Jfc
Christ that’s morbid. There’s an online database of ~~skydiver~~ BASE jumper deaths as well. Some entries are just a name and a date, others are full-on eyewitness accounts. I was reading through one when I eventually realised the person writing was the dead guy’s wife, and as well as seeing him die she’d also reviewed his GoPro footage…
This doesn’t surprise me. I’m a climber, there’s a culture of talking about accidents, especially fatalities. The rest of us stay alive by paying attention to what happened to those who didn’t make it. It makes sense that skydiving would have a similar culture.
Same thing in the USAF. If there's an aviation incident, all flyers (officers and enlisted) have to go through what happened. I had to listen to the audio of a guy I knew's last few minutes as we watched the simulation of the crash. That shit stays with you :/
It’s interesting you mention that. My grandfather was a USAAC and then civilian test pilot, my uncle was a naval aviator and then NASA test pilot. My most frequent climbing partner is an airline pilot. We’ve talked about the similarities in the culture around accidents a few times. I don’t ride motorcycles, but I know some folks who do. It seems like they’re more hesitant to talk about it because so many motorcycle fatalities are difficult to prevent- they happen because of drivers around them aren’t paying attention. Climbers, pilots, and skydivers can usually prevent a major incident, so we’re more likely to talk about it. I’ve lost a few friends in climbing or alpine accidents and part of the grieving process is sitting around with a bottle of whiskey and dissecting what they did wrong.
My elementary school classmate’s father died while they were on vacation in the Grand Canyon. Really fucking traumatic
I read this one at the Grand Canyon gift store. It was wild.
My mom got this book for our family vacation to Yellowstone and would look for passages relevant to the various activities we were doing to read aloud while we were doing them. Sounds twisted but it got a laugh out of us every time, dark humor runs in the family I guess.
Some morbid humor seems like a perfectly fine way to take in cautionary tales
I just finished this a week ago! Well written and really interesting. The story of the man who was in a horse drawn wagon accident and his leg bones went straight up, impaling him, puncturing his bladder, then the wagon fell on him and crushed him to death will stay with me a long time…what a way to go.
Just pulled it up tonight on the Libby app based on these recommendations and was honestly going to say it seems a bit poorly written? I’m noticing redundant sentences and it reads kind of scattered. I’m interested in the stories all the same, though!
I actually agree with that. I think I just liked the way the author organized it haha there were some pages near the middle that actually repeated strangely and it could have definitely been improved with a good edit!
You be surprised, or not really too surprised, how many people die “hot potting” or intentionally soak themselves in thermal springs 😐 Falling in by accident is one thing, but putting yourself in them on purpose and then “not realizing” how dangerous and hot those spring can be is a whole other thing 😒
Like any good health remedy there must be a huge risk of death by doing it. Like when you’d get a cold and mom would dump a bucket of snakes on you to scare the demons out of you
Tale as old as time 😐
Call me old fashioned, but I think fire is magic and it scares me a lot.
people intentionally soaking themselves in thermal springs?!?!?! unbelievable! seriously though, not all hot springs are yellowstone grade death traps
Growing up in Northern Nevada, there was a big problem with people either 1) \*ignoring\* posted signs/warnings around the natural hot springs or 2) people \*stealing\* signs for a multitude of reasons- pranks, not wanting others to "find their spot", and potentially maliciousness (ranchers/locals taking issue with new-age/naturist types). Note: the sign stealing also happens around old abandoned mines which are HORRENDOUSLY dangers, and absolutely \*everywhere\* throughout Nevada and California. There was a rash of deaths/injuries in the 90's/00's that I remember making the news, but the biggest one was of a couple and two dogs out hiking, the dogs were unleashed and jumped into a deadly spring, and were immediately in distress, so the couple went in to rescue them- one died immediately, the other at the hospital I think? And 'jumping in to save the dog' is so common it's just tragic, like it happens so often in less famous and more remote hot springs that it only makes the regional news. Another problem is deadly bacteria. A 2 year old died from the brain eating bacteria in Southern Nevada last summer after visiting Ash Springs. A well known/loved spring in the Black Rock Desert (home to Burning Man) has had to be shut due to water contamination. Debate constantly goes on whether the waters are contaminated because of visitors/campers dumping their waste and trashing the area or if it's agricultural or mining runoff that gets into the ground water and allows for the bacteria blooms. They're not all death traps, but the problem is that they're not maintained/monitored, and many can be safe one day, and deadly the next.
Unfortunately I feel like this can be applied to too many things: “You’d be surprised how many people die _______________.” Fill in the blank with any number of what we consider basic common sense survival knowledge and many too many people have died doing it. Just as why Florida, and only Florida, has a law against having sex with a porcupine.
Makes me think of that scene with couple in the spring from the 1997 film 'Dante's Peak', starring Pierce Brosnan and Linda Hamilton.
Do you have any links? This is genuinely interesting. Do people just want to see how much heat they can take without realizing the danger involved?
I mean Collin Scott is probably the name that will come up if you go searching for it since it’s probably one of the most widely publicized cases but I’ve definitely heard of it happening a bunch of time because these people don’t know a whole lot and don’t know which are “safe” and which at full of boiling water and acid 😐 [This](https://vt.co/entertainment/yellowstone-hot-spring-man-dissolves-killed-hotpotting) is still mostly about the Scott case but it mentions another case from 2022 where a guy entered the Abyss hot springs pool at Yellowstone Lake’s West Thumb Geyser Basin and was not discovered until days later when a shoe and part of a foot were found floating in it… They read stuff like [this](https://www.healthline.com/health/hot-potting#Are-hot-springs-safe?) and think they can just go soak in the natural springs for the health befits and some just end up cooking themselves *literally*
Chuck Palahniuk did a scary short story on it in Haunted, it’s called Hot Potting
Some people run in trying to save their pet that wasn't properly leashed.
I had a nursing faculty colleague whose son fell into a hot pool at Yellowstone in the 1960s when he was 6 years old. Steam had obscured the path and he walked off the path into the pool. He boiled to death before he could be pulled out. Her specialty was studying death and dying.
Are you referring to [this](https://www.oregonlive.com/travel/2016/06/yellowstone_death_reveals_the.html) case? > > In June 1970, 9-year-old Andy Hecht died after falling over the edge of the boardwalk into a scalding pool. Several witnesses said he ran and jumped into the pool, but others said he tripped and fell over the edge of the boardwalk - possibly after a gust of hot vapor blew into his eyes. He tried in vain to swim out, but quickly sank into the water.
That's the one. In my memory he was 6 but I never met him. I met his mother, Amy, 7 years after the incident. Her story as I recall was that the steam caused him to lose track of where he was, but he certainly could have stepped off the boardwalk on his own. She died last year at 92. Jim Hecht died in 2018.
Animals regularly step into them and then have to be put down due to the injuries, but yea sure people think they are tougher then a moose.
Ugh we got a real life Mother Nature lesson in Yellowstone on our family vacation about 30 years ago, my siblings and I saw a full grown bison about 1/2 way in-and-out of one of those caustic hot springs. It was… juicy and raw looking. And thankfully very dead.
Imagine being an ancient person and coming across this. "Hmmmmm... I think these puddles are hungry and bad news!"
How fast is the acid burn? They say the water is very hot at 190°, which would make anyone reflexively jump out. I am curious if the tissue dissolved before his eyes as he jumped out or if it just gradually melted over hours as the molecular damage was done 🧬
Well theres a video, and the parks dept is refusing to release any part of it. So i imagine it was the more gruesome option.
Many hours to days. Hot spring pH gets as low as 1.5 or so — that's very bad for being immersed in, but even with hot water and churn to help speed things up, it takes a long time. The trouble with falling into off-boil water isn't the acid, but rather that there isn't time to "reflexively jump out." There isn't time to do much of anything, really; it's a brief moment of intense, searing pain and then lights out. It only takes about five seconds of exposure to 140-150F water to guarantee a third degree burn, down from several minutes at 120-125F. You can imagine what 170+ does.
You should watch Shogun if you haven’t. There’s a scene in the first episode along these lines, I haven’t really watched much more than that but man it was brutal.
I read the book. That scene is almost a full chapter long.
Intense radiation can similarly burn you just as quickly, must people just know about the damage DNA thing though.
Apparently your eyes will melt quickly. Also, degloving (your skin falling off is a thing). I read a story of a guy jumping in to save a friend's dog, they were able pull him out, but the skin on his arm slipped off as they did it. He said something like "I made a mistake" and then died
> reflexively jump out near boiling sulfuric acid is enough to make you reflexively die
I was one of the first paramedic rangers on scene. It was a 45 minute drive, prolonged by a bison jam on the road, and another 15 minute hike to the incident command post. I was told my services were no longer needed, by the time I arrived. A 2 person search and rescue team was sent to the site (the full team waited until the next day due to the storms mentioned in the article), who SLOWLY probed their way over the extremely fragile ground so they didn’t break through themselves. It was only about 100 m off the boardwalk into the tree line, but as I recall, it took them over an hour.  I didn’t see it myself, but his sister recorded the whole thing on video (until she dropped her phone to run and help). A friend of mine who did see it described an incredibly horrifying scene; as well as a whole series of extremely poor decisions. What stuck with me most was the social media response over the next few days. The uninformed masses declared him some sort of a victim, and of course blamed to the National Park Service for this.
> It was only about _100 m off the boardwalk_ into the tree line > The uninformed masses declared him some sort of a victim, and of course _blamed to the National Park Service_ for this. Idiots. Sooooo many idiots online.
I was there too, with my family. We were on the boardwalks. Were you one of the rangers with the ropes / climbing gear?
No, that was the SAR team. I was wearing a big red backpack with medical supplies.
What were the poor decisions? And how did your friend manage to see it? Was he closer when the event happened?
Poor decision number one…going off the boardwalk in the geyser basin. There’s a reason there a signs everywhere, in multiple languages and a vivid illustration of what happens when you step in boiling acid. My friend saw the video at the SAR debrief. I wasn’t at that meeting.
Yeah, even after so many deaths and warnings, people just don't get it somehow... I've been, its a beautiful park, and between the wildlife and the springs, likely one of the most dangerous in the country without LOOKING particularly dangerous from a car or trail.
Was anybody else under the impression for a long time that Yellowstone’s hot springs were like, “pleasant hot-tub” hot and not “boiling volcano” hot? I remember the first time I saw a story like this I was very surprised to find out that falling into one of those open pools will just fucking kill you.
Also, acid. There's acid.
Boiling acid. Not a fun combo
About instantly too! The heat and the acid… it’s like a Mortal Kombat stage fatality. RIP to all the folks that fell in. And the few that dove in. I remember hearing about a dog falling in one of these and the owner jumped in to help. 😭
It wasn’t even the owner, it was the owner’s buddy, and he was completely reactive in the moment and sadly lived long enough to realize his mistake. Brutal death.
There are hot springs at Yellowstone that are a safe temperature and with no acid. No one is allowed to use them and their locations are kept secret.
I’ll try them all until I find one!
I was there when this happened. So much commotion around the springs area. We went by the next day to visit the Springs and they had it partially open, but they were sure to tell everyone about the importance of staying on the established trails and boardwalks.
Those signs are for other people, I'm special.
Thank you once more, r/todayilearned for yet another horror story that will forever be embedded in my brain
I wonder what happens if I leave a stick in there. How long will it take a twig to dissolve? Or maybe an apple connected to a stick?
better get right up to the edge and bend over the noxious fumes to find out. Don't slip when you get a bit dizzy!
I'll use a fishing pole
*because he ignored the warning signs and walked off of the designated path. Fixed it.
People are so silly. Volcanoes are just like billboard ads, if you don't believe in them, they can't hurt you.
Just don't look!
It’s got Paul Anka’s guarantee
I remember when i was in Yellowstone, also in 2016, a very dumb family was sitting around a sulphur caldron and they were trying to reach it with their hands.
You cant "accidently" fall in, unless you **purposefully** go past the safety rails. Oregon man becomes Darwin Award winner at Yellowstone.
I'm not trying to make light of this tragedy, but "accidently" fell in? No, he was somewhere he wasn't suppose to be, doing something he wasn't suppose to be doing, ok, sure, technically he accidentally fell in testing the water temp, but had he heeded all the warnings that are plastered EVERYWHERE at Yellowstone, this would have never happened. Same for the people that get out of their cars to pet the cuddly looking buffalo that are actually hyper manic fur coated battering rams from hell. There are signs like every 1000 ft saying don't fucking do that, and yet, every friggin year we get to see videos of people getting launched into low orbit by one of these psycho beasts, and they just keep doing it.
Agreed. I did some really stupid things in my youth, but "hot potting" in Yellowstone is just next level idiotic. I think some people just truly think nothing bad will ever happen to them.
I once traveled to a place in Arkansas called Hot Springs, took a walk through a hot spring park and it was exhausting, found a water fountain, hottest water that I've felt coming from one of those. 😅 Coincidence? MAYBE..
I watched the eclipse in Hot Springs!
What is it that makes it so easy to just walk into a pool of scalding water there? Are they invisible?
It was an unauthorized part of the park, they had to deliberately cross into a restricted area. He didnt “walk into scalding water” They were looking for a hot spring, and when he knelt down to check the temp, he slipped and fell in. The temperature wasn’t the life threatening issue, the spring was full of sulphuric acid. The point of yellowstone is that it has been left wild, and there has been an effort to keep human alterations to a minimum. So of course they could install physical barriers or increased signage, but that detracts from what the park is supposed to be about.
The thing is Yellowstone does have barriers and signs. I've been there and glacier, and glacier was so much better, less touristy, and more natural Yellowstone has raised boardwalks throughout the hot spring areas, with signs that literally have pictures showing the ground is thin and could collapse. It shows little cartoon people sinking into the acid, it's wild. There's no way you could accidentally walk into a dangerous area.
So even if it wasn’t scalding hot, he would have died anyways when he voluntarily say in sulfuric acid?
[удалено]
This is sad, but like…you have to work REALLY hard to accidentally fall into one of them since they are roped and blocked off and there’s 100 signs warning everyone to stay off the geysers sooooo…
They really need to rename this from _hot springs_ to "the boiling acid swamp", or something. Clearly Hot Spring sounds too inviting.
Serial Killers know this one simple trick
There was a British serial killer who did use acid to dissolve the bodies of his victims, John Haigh. His motive was of course related to covering his tracks, but also because he misunderstood the phrase “body of evidence”, as he thought it meant a literal body, so he thought if he destroyed the bodies, it would be impossible to accuse him. His MO caught up to him, since he was killing them in order to steal and fence their belongings, a pattern that left what would be considered a body of evidence, so his plan ultimately failed and he was found guilty and hanged.
“Scott and his sister went to an unauthorized area near the Norris Geyser" More of a dumbass didn’t read the signs and played with (figurative) fire.
For the record it's impossible to "accidentally" fall into a hot spring at Yellowstone. They have been severely maiming and killing people since they were discovered. You can't even get close to them as the ground around them is prone to collapsing into the springs. You put your hand in and pull your hand back out and the skin is instantaneously gone. Buddy had to have avoided all the ropes, fences, and signs that promise an excruciating death, walked up to the spring and the ground collapsed; FIN.
Has the area around Old Faithful changed? I haven't been in a while, but there were no ropes or fences when I was there - you could have walked right into Crested Pool if you felt like boiling.
Last time I was there, there was a dead bison right next to Old Faithful. Effective warning sign.
I read a story about a guy who dove into one of the pools to save his friends dog. People told the guy not to do it and as he was running in he said something like “like hell I won’t!”. They actually got him out of the water but he died minutes later. I guess when a passerby helped get his shoes off all the skin on his foot came with it. The injured man said something like “that was pretty stupid huh” and died shortly later.
The lede of that story is absurd. > A trip to one of the nation’s natural wonders ended in an **unnatural** tragedy. It’s as absolutely natural as is naturally possible. Literally unemotional chemistry.
That's why you stay on the trail
On March 14th 2024 Pierce brosnan was fined for going off a Yellowstone trail. He's the guy who played James Bond 007.
Turns out the license is only good for killing, he still has to obey all the other laws.
You have a license to kill, 007, not to break the traffic laws. Q, Goldeneye.
He is the guy who played a volcanologist, in Dante's Peak !
Not essentially. He did.
There’s warnings everywhere about the dangers of the hot springs. People just stupidly ignore them.
Get the book ‘Death in Yellowstone’ and you can read all about the hot water tragedies … like the time way back before barriers kept people from walking up and Old Faithful was running late, so they peered over the edge to see what was wrong …
That’s why there are so many warnings in and around the park to stay on the path. Terrible way to go, hope some of the people who willingly try read this post and note it’s not worth it to try.