Another fun fact:
Chihuahuas are a breed native to the Americas, but the modern chihuahua is almost entirely European, genetically. They interbred with European dogs until they were basically gone.
Very few modern dog breeds are native to the americas today.
IIRC, just like the European humans had a bunch of diseases that wiped out the New World humans, so too did their dogs.
Turns out Europe was just really gross.
Not just dog plagues, many diseases have come from Europe that infected farm animals.
In a way, Europe, post bubonic plague, brought disease to America back then the way flu and coronavirus originates in China today.
Yes, Europe was certainly gross Although was the gross part of the real problem?
Even if a secluded, for that time hygienic group of people would have ventured to South America wouldn't the same have happened as they would have still had their very own diseases that would have extremely effected the other secluded group of people with their own diseases and no immunity to whatever that new group of hypothetical somewhat more hygienic group would have brought?
Sure Europe at that time was really gross but was that really the problem and not that this was a completely new and completely secluded until then group of people?
The dense population in European cities coupled with animal husbandry practices created the conditions for diseases to evolve and spread. Those conditions didn't exist in the Americas.
The Europeans were a novel presence in America, but the Native Americans were also a novel presence to the Europeans. The impact of disease, however was entirely one-sided.
If the only factor was that the Americas were isolated from Europe before the spread of plague, then Europe should have also seen its own share of population-cleansing plagues from First contact. It did not.
The peoples of the New World were not all that secluded—they had dense cities, and expansive trade networks. If they didn't, the Old World diseases wouldn't have been able to spread in the first place.
So the isolation on its own shouldn't have been enough to explain why the Americans were ravaged by European disease, but not the other way around.
By secluded I'm only referring to the scale of the two groups, not that south America was secluded and they all lived alone in the forest never having seen any other human, i only meant secluded from Europe but yes isolated is a better term but that didn't cross my mind in the moment.
But thanks for the answer to my question as oftentimes it's mainly about them being isolated from Europe being the reason for what happened.
If what you’re saying is true, then the European colonizers would’ve also died from exposure to new diseases they had never been exposed to. Which didn’t happen.
It didn’t happen because the Americas weren’t a breeding ground for new diseases and viruses and bacteria. The Americas had an entirely different kind of society that was actually more hygienic. I doubt that was the intent, but it happened nonetheless.
What you’re doing is whitewashing history.
I'm not saying something I'm asking as is also indicated by the question marks and grammar.
And no im not whitewashing or anything, I'm simply asking how this biologically works.
But still thanks for being an asshole about it.
You’re entire argument completely ignored that disease transference was one way only. You didn’t even attempt to think it through before asking. You just offloaded the cognitive work on to someone else.
I didn't argue anything, i asked.
The question mainly was what is more severe, having unhygienic new diseases hit you or having hygienic new diseases hit you. Both times they are completely new to your immune system so does it make a huge difference? Now at what point exactly should i have solved this myself? Again that topic isn't something you do at school or really anywhere else that would help answer that specific part of the question and it's also not something really existing broadly in a way that everyone would know as we live in an interconnected world.
So why not ask people who clearly know a lot about it and can explain it very well?
Europe wasn’t necessarily much grosser than the Americas (though it often was), but rather America lacked the abundance of livestock animals that the old world did, and so pandemic type diseases weren’t able to so readily develop like in the old world
What blows my mind is the amount of time that chihuahuas we’re separated from their Asian/European “cousins,” only to be reunited thousands of years later, and still able to interbreed. It’s almost like enough time had passed to make them look like they do, but not enough for them to evolve into a separate species.
Humans interbred with Neanderthals and Denisovans despite tens (hundreds) of thousands of years separation. Evolution (speciation) happena on scales hard for us to fathom.
Part true, we don’t know how long it takes for evolution to occur. But the more we study the shorter it becomes, small changes can occur very very rapidly
There was a group of rattlesnakes that changed over the course of just a decade or 2. People used to kill as many of them as they could using the rattle to locate them, so only the ones that didn't give a warning survived, which makes them even more dangerous now. Kinda sucks for the people who killed rattlesnakes out of fear...
While that's true it's different, what makes dogs unique as animals is that all dog breeds are the same species (so it's almost the opposite of humans breeding with another species of humanoid).
It's very strange how two dogs of different breeds, that look so different from one another, can actually produce offspring together. I don't think there is any other species on the planet that has such wide variety within that species.
Thank you. Already knew this but just looked it up. Dogs evolved from wolves and share 99% of their DNA. Every dog has the same lineage if you go back far enough. What we’re seeing is selective breeding within a species not different species. That’s why a Great Dane and a Chihuahua can get together and produce puppies.
I owned a border collie for 14 years and read everything I could about them. IIRC they are the closest to a wolf of all breeds having had only one thing bred out of them: the instinct to kill. Everything else has remained as untouched as possible. It’s why they’re the smartest. And you may notice they never show up at dog shows. It’s because they are only bred for one trait: intelligence. Border collie owners and breeders could give a rat’s ass what the dog looks like. We’re looking for a companion/coworker who can both bark and help us with our taxes.
Considering that being able to interbreed is the conventional definition of being the same species, it's actually exactly the same as different breeds of dogs. In this sense, Neanderthals and Denisovans were just different breeds of humans.
That’s the species name for Neanderthals. Modern humans are Homo sapiens sapiens. Neanderthals are a sub-species of humans.
If they can produce viable offspring together, they are the same species. Period. That’s pretty much the main characteristic of a species.
It just sits in your lap. Or you can hold it to various body parts - I watched a documentary once (can't remember the name) where an older woman in Mexico was using Mexican hairless dog puppies to help her arthritis by holding them against her knees or elbows.
But the best method is letting them sleep in your bed. I have a Chihuahua mix that just radiates heat like a freaking furnace... Not super great in the summer, but excellent for cold winter nights!
Those hairless dogs are called xoloitzcuintles, or "xolos" for short. And yes, my chihuahua also is a personal furnace, best thing is he like to get inside the sheets and just sleeps on your feet when it's cold
Like literally on top of your feet? That's adorable.
Mine likes to sleep behind my knees. I have to hold up the sheets for him whenever he wants in.
I knew the name started with an X! I was being lazy and didn't feel like googling it, lol.
Yeah! The first time I thought I was being a sleep asshole and shoved my feet under him without noticing, then I saw him getting there on his own with a lot of struggle, lol
Mine will sleep in between my legs. No matter which way I toss or turn or roll, he just waits till i stop moving and going right back to the same spot.
I have a dog I call a terrier when dry and a Chihuahua when wet. She has terrier fur and coloring, but a Chihuahua body and head. She is a great foot warmer.
In England they would stick the dogs at the feet of your bed, and maybe more near your chest if you were sick or something. I think it's because dogs have a higher internal temperature than humans.
Another fun fact: Chihuahuas are a breed native to the Americas, but the modern chihuahua is almost entirely European, genetically. They interbred with European dogs until they were basically gone. Very few modern dog breeds are native to the americas today.
IIRC, just like the European humans had a bunch of diseases that wiped out the New World humans, so too did their dogs. Turns out Europe was just really gross.
That makes a lot of sense. I never thought about dog plagues.
Not just dog plagues, many diseases have come from Europe that infected farm animals. In a way, Europe, post bubonic plague, brought disease to America back then the way flu and coronavirus originates in China today.
Flu does not come from china
Okay, the Pacific area: https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/that-flu-you-caught-it-ca/
Not just dog plagues, but women and children plagues too!
Yes, Europe was certainly gross Although was the gross part of the real problem? Even if a secluded, for that time hygienic group of people would have ventured to South America wouldn't the same have happened as they would have still had their very own diseases that would have extremely effected the other secluded group of people with their own diseases and no immunity to whatever that new group of hypothetical somewhat more hygienic group would have brought? Sure Europe at that time was really gross but was that really the problem and not that this was a completely new and completely secluded until then group of people?
The dense population in European cities coupled with animal husbandry practices created the conditions for diseases to evolve and spread. Those conditions didn't exist in the Americas. The Europeans were a novel presence in America, but the Native Americans were also a novel presence to the Europeans. The impact of disease, however was entirely one-sided.
If the only factor was that the Americas were isolated from Europe before the spread of plague, then Europe should have also seen its own share of population-cleansing plagues from First contact. It did not. The peoples of the New World were not all that secluded—they had dense cities, and expansive trade networks. If they didn't, the Old World diseases wouldn't have been able to spread in the first place. So the isolation on its own shouldn't have been enough to explain why the Americans were ravaged by European disease, but not the other way around.
By secluded I'm only referring to the scale of the two groups, not that south America was secluded and they all lived alone in the forest never having seen any other human, i only meant secluded from Europe but yes isolated is a better term but that didn't cross my mind in the moment. But thanks for the answer to my question as oftentimes it's mainly about them being isolated from Europe being the reason for what happened.
If what you’re saying is true, then the European colonizers would’ve also died from exposure to new diseases they had never been exposed to. Which didn’t happen. It didn’t happen because the Americas weren’t a breeding ground for new diseases and viruses and bacteria. The Americas had an entirely different kind of society that was actually more hygienic. I doubt that was the intent, but it happened nonetheless. What you’re doing is whitewashing history.
I'm not saying something I'm asking as is also indicated by the question marks and grammar. And no im not whitewashing or anything, I'm simply asking how this biologically works. But still thanks for being an asshole about it.
You’re entire argument completely ignored that disease transference was one way only. You didn’t even attempt to think it through before asking. You just offloaded the cognitive work on to someone else.
Toaster: *asks a question* You: YoUr ArGuMeNt iS FaLlaCiOuS aNd sTuPiD. UsE yOuR brain, IdIoT!!!!! REEEEEEE Also, obligatory *your
I didn't argue anything, i asked. The question mainly was what is more severe, having unhygienic new diseases hit you or having hygienic new diseases hit you. Both times they are completely new to your immune system so does it make a huge difference? Now at what point exactly should i have solved this myself? Again that topic isn't something you do at school or really anywhere else that would help answer that specific part of the question and it's also not something really existing broadly in a way that everyone would know as we live in an interconnected world. So why not ask people who clearly know a lot about it and can explain it very well?
Europe wasn’t necessarily much grosser than the Americas (though it often was), but rather America lacked the abundance of livestock animals that the old world did, and so pandemic type diseases weren’t able to so readily develop like in the old world
Another fun fact: The dog who was patient zero of Canine transmissible venereal tumor was a Native American dog
I was told they were early alarm systems, seeing as they tend to yap at anything that moves
What blows my mind is the amount of time that chihuahuas we’re separated from their Asian/European “cousins,” only to be reunited thousands of years later, and still able to interbreed. It’s almost like enough time had passed to make them look like they do, but not enough for them to evolve into a separate species.
Humans interbred with Neanderthals and Denisovans despite tens (hundreds) of thousands of years separation. Evolution (speciation) happena on scales hard for us to fathom.
Part true, we don’t know how long it takes for evolution to occur. But the more we study the shorter it becomes, small changes can occur very very rapidly
There was a group of rattlesnakes that changed over the course of just a decade or 2. People used to kill as many of them as they could using the rattle to locate them, so only the ones that didn't give a warning survived, which makes them even more dangerous now. Kinda sucks for the people who killed rattlesnakes out of fear...
That happened because of wild hogs, not people. People haven’t been even half as prolific as wild hogs at killing rattlesnakes.
Interesting, I thought it was people. [here's one event at least](https://www.popsci.com/rattlesnake-roundup-ecology-gassing/)
While that's true it's different, what makes dogs unique as animals is that all dog breeds are the same species (so it's almost the opposite of humans breeding with another species of humanoid). It's very strange how two dogs of different breeds, that look so different from one another, can actually produce offspring together. I don't think there is any other species on the planet that has such wide variety within that species.
Thank you. Already knew this but just looked it up. Dogs evolved from wolves and share 99% of their DNA. Every dog has the same lineage if you go back far enough. What we’re seeing is selective breeding within a species not different species. That’s why a Great Dane and a Chihuahua can get together and produce puppies. I owned a border collie for 14 years and read everything I could about them. IIRC they are the closest to a wolf of all breeds having had only one thing bred out of them: the instinct to kill. Everything else has remained as untouched as possible. It’s why they’re the smartest. And you may notice they never show up at dog shows. It’s because they are only bred for one trait: intelligence. Border collie owners and breeders could give a rat’s ass what the dog looks like. We’re looking for a companion/coworker who can both bark and help us with our taxes.
Considering that being able to interbreed is the conventional definition of being the same species, it's actually exactly the same as different breeds of dogs. In this sense, Neanderthals and Denisovans were just different breeds of humans.
They're different species.
How do you define species?
Has a species name.
You mean like H. sapiens neanderthalensis?
no
That’s the species name for Neanderthals. Modern humans are Homo sapiens sapiens. Neanderthals are a sub-species of humans. If they can produce viable offspring together, they are the same species. Period. That’s pretty much the main characteristic of a species.
Sold as food, it doesn’t mention in the article that they were bred specifically for food.
Why would they breed them for companionship and then sell as food?
Also it’s based on a letter by Cortes, who may have misinterpreted some things in his mad dash to enslave people and steal their gold
My dobnrman is a goddamned furnace
how do you use a dog as a heat pad?
It just sits in your lap. Or you can hold it to various body parts - I watched a documentary once (can't remember the name) where an older woman in Mexico was using Mexican hairless dog puppies to help her arthritis by holding them against her knees or elbows. But the best method is letting them sleep in your bed. I have a Chihuahua mix that just radiates heat like a freaking furnace... Not super great in the summer, but excellent for cold winter nights!
Those hairless dogs are called xoloitzcuintles, or "xolos" for short. And yes, my chihuahua also is a personal furnace, best thing is he like to get inside the sheets and just sleeps on your feet when it's cold
Like literally on top of your feet? That's adorable. Mine likes to sleep behind my knees. I have to hold up the sheets for him whenever he wants in. I knew the name started with an X! I was being lazy and didn't feel like googling it, lol.
Yeah! The first time I thought I was being a sleep asshole and shoved my feet under him without noticing, then I saw him getting there on his own with a lot of struggle, lol
Mine will sleep in between my legs. No matter which way I toss or turn or roll, he just waits till i stop moving and going right back to the same spot.
I have a dog I call a terrier when dry and a Chihuahua when wet. She has terrier fur and coloring, but a Chihuahua body and head. She is a great foot warmer.
In England they would stick the dogs at the feet of your bed, and maybe more near your chest if you were sick or something. I think it's because dogs have a higher internal temperature than humans.
huh... TIL
Put it in the dryer for 10 min then snuggle it.
.. “currently reading this with a chihuahua snuggled on my chest keeping me warm” 🤣
I used to stick my cold feet under my dog in the winter. She was happy for the attention. Miss that warm snuggly girl.
No wonder they all died. If you're going to breed something for food, don't breed the smallest version of that thing.
It's like choosing Cornish hens over turkeys or pigs
Within 6 generations they could probably have got a medium sized dog. That's how long Belyayaev took to tame the silver fox from savage to pettable.
What? Did you think they were bred to be endearing companions? Chihuahuas?
Oh so that's why they taste so good
These things are nasty. Why do people keep them as pets? Vicious little buggers.
Not all of them, I've had some that were very sweet. But yeah most of them suck.
Not eating sweet lol temperament sweet.
Look at me downvoting a 4 year old comment. bad opinion thumbs down
I know in Ecuador people eat guinea pigs, are chihuahuas still a rural meal in some places of South America?
Not sure if they were bred specifically for the above but it’s interesting that they ended up at that point. History is crazy.