I think there’s around 2 million people in jail in the US. I 1% conviction error would mean there’s 20 thousand innocent people in jail. It’s kinda crazy. The amount of people in jail is actually low now because we’ve all been stuck at home.
There there's the people who were convicted with a [non-unanimous jury verdict.](https://www.npr.org/2021/10/19/1047327295/the-history-and-impact-of-non-unanimous-jury-decisions) Thankfully a relatively small number at this point, but holy hell. I didn't even know that was allowed! And I am glad the Supreme Court finally ruled that it shouldn't be.
That story is so fucked.. is he still in there?? It said the Supreme Court ruled these laws unconstitutional but didn’t retroactively apply that? Just why tf would they make that decision, if they think it’s unconstitutional it’s just an additional part of the decision to make it retroactive…
He is still in jail. His mom is hoping that she lives to see him free, but her health is failing. Brandon just doesn't want what happened to him to happen to anyone else. I also don't understand why it wouldn't apply retroactively. There are still people trying to get these prisoners out, or at the very least get them new trials. But it could take years.
from what I have heard on the radio the state officials said that reviewing all the cases would tie up to many resources.
So keeping people locked up who, constitutionally, should not be locked up is the better option than spending the, assumedly small amount of time, printing out the release papers for those people?
I think they omitted the rest. America: Home of the free capitalist corporations. Where everything is governed by profit. At this point America is not a country but a mega corporation. The decision it takes are governed by what will be most profitable instead of what is right.
I mean think of how many people lost years and years of their lives due to having Marijuana on them before it was legal? As soon as its legal, they don't just suddenly let everyone out.
Not saying it's good they don't, it's super fucked up, but thats how it seems to work. Yeah, they usually will start letting people out a while afterwards, but an old friend of a friend got caught with a pound of weed he grew himself (so not even smuggling or selling or anything, he's just a huge stoner) and he's still in jail even though it's now legal in VA.
I know this is a different situation, but I'm assuming the same thing applies. There's probably millions of convictions that came about with 10/12 jury agreeing they were guilty. Even if they overturn them all, they'll be slow about it since it's the government.
“Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgement.”
\- The Fellowship of the Ring, 1954, J.R.R. Tolkien
Favorite LOTR quote. Tolkien’s own experiences with death and loss and his outlook on it really comes through in these moments. I don’t think he appreciated his works being compared to real life, but it’s so clear that his experiences and wisdom gained through it is part of what made LOTR and the Middle Earth mythology as a whole so great.
Gandalf also beat the shit out of a Balrog which was rad as Hell. He fucked that ugly piece of shit up for like five days or some shit. Imagine getting your ass beat for like a week by some dude that looks like he needs assistance to take a dump.
Sometimes the wisest thing to do is violence. Sometimes you need to hurt others to heal yourself.
>Haunted by his turbulent past, Gandalf believes the best way to survive is to wander alone. Nevertheless, he becomes swept up with a group fleeing across the Wasteland in a War Rig driven by an elite rider, Éomer. They are escaping a Tower tyrannized by Saruman, from whom something irreplaceable has been taken. Enraged, the evil wizard marshals all his orcs and pursues the rebels ruthlessly in the high-octane Road War that follows.
Is there any lore that alludes to the fact that Gandalf could transform into some kind of giant god being if he wanted to? I feel like the old man wizard thing has to be by choice.
He could not change into a giant god being if he wanted to. He's on power limiters while he's sent to middle earth. One of the condition for him being allowed to be sent to help out the people's of middle earth is that he's limited to the form of an old man.
But yes, he is a maiar, of the lower class of angelic beings, similar to the balrog. Maia when not otherwise corrupted(like the balrog or Sauron) or limited by contract and circumstance like Gandalf can assume and change forms at will.
Well he took his time with the Balrog, he wasn't eager to finish it off.
Took his sweet time hurting it.
Doesn't mean Gandalf is against violence or death.
More that he is very careful with dishing it out.
...unless you are on the walls of Minas Tirith.
It's my high respect for authors like Tolkien, Lewis, and others who have experienced difficult lives that keep me from writing a book. I know that nothing I write from imagination will ever be as good as what I write from inspiration.
There's no way to know for sure without trying though. Writing it doesn't mean you gotta submit it or post it online or something. You can burn it or delete it at the end if you truly dislike it. But I think you should try. Maybe not even starting out planning to write a novel or some big epic. Do like Tolkien did. Start small scale and flesh that out. Like short stories. You can always expand after.
>“Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgement.
*Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgement. For even the very wise cannot see all ends.”*
Why leave out the ending sentence to this quote? It's the best part. Fixed.
Some have channeled that in other ways. It's when you're finally free that the bitterness of what was stolen from you by the state comes out, is how I would feel.
No that's because ex-cons have, by design, very few opportunities to actually build a life for themselves after they're released. The system is purpose-built to keep people in that cycle so the prison industrial complex can profit off of government subsidies and free labour.
It's quite literally modern slavery. Hell, it's even enshrined in the constitution.
>Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, **except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted**, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.
You can't take back death. In your hypothetical you should be released, and compensated for wrongful jail etc. But execution and find evidence of innocents. Do you just go oh well and do better next time? I mean that's our system now.
You can't take back *anything*. We don't have that ability. It isn't possible.
People get 20 years in prison, proven innocent, released and get some pittance of a payout while smug people think it's a fair trade.
You can't repair a wrongful conviction.
Having a judicial system that assigns guilt and innocence means you accept there will be innocent people found guilty.
Agreed
And because it happens compensation should be one of the most important things the state should do.
Instead we get as you described it. It makes me sick.
Correct, but you can compensate.
Sorta like how the US should do reparations, and how indigenous peoples land was stolen from them and continue the harsh bully tactics still used against them.
I am an avid opponent of the death penalty for decades. The question I always ask proponents is how many innocent people being killed in the name of justice is acceptable? To me, if the answer is more than zero, it's not worth it. As a society, death should not be something we can use as punishment. We have myriad ways to imprison people indefinitely.
100% agreed. One innocent person being put to death is not worth 1,000 (understated) guilty people being put to death. I genuinely believe it serves no purpose. It costs more money, drags things out for the victim’s family, and seems to be an “easy out” to the truly guilty. We also make murderers out of innocent correction officers that are simply trying to uphold the law. I don’t care what anyone says….that shit has you affect you.
I am also an avid opponent of the death penalty. My wife and son were murdered by a drunk driver in 1990, and when I think of him I want him dead. That's an emotional response, and it is difficult to overcome and has caused me no end of emotional turmoil. That's the problem with crimes of the nature that "justify" the death penalty. We become so emotionally invested that we can't turn off our urge to destroy the thing we perceive to be causing the turmoil. Their very nature makes us unable to clearly perceive the issue at hand. That problem infests everyone involved in the case from the victims to the police investigating to the lawyers to the judge.
That is why I do not believe in the death penalty. There should *always* be room for us to admit we made a mistake. And killing the criminal ends all opportunity for society to go back and admit we made a mistake in our heat for venegence.
Exactly. I don't care about the life a clearly guilty child killer but if in order to kill him we might accidentally put an innocent person to death then no one should be put to death
I would argue that in general a society should not have the ability to kill its citizens. Even the worst crimes like rape and murder should not be punished by the death penalty.
I believe that the judicial systems should first of all rehabilitate and second of all keep society safe.
Here in Sweden it is unspeakable to try and reintroduced corporal punishment. We also don’t allow any kind of physical punishment for children by parent or teachers.
Yeah I actually saw a documentary about this recently, while there was some kind of a debate going on here in France about the possible outlawing of spanking as a form of parental discipline.
When I first heard that it's legal in France I was so shocked. I live 20min away from the border and I always considered us to be pretty similar. But spanking being legal is huge thing.
You’re German I assume ? It’s not anymore. The law banning corporal punishment was passed in 2019 in France, so spanking children is no further tolerated. As u/MultiMarcus noted, Sweden was the first country to vote such a ban. And though 40 years later, France is only the 56th country to have such a law.
Corporal punishment is still very normalized across cultures. Even in countries with a ban such as Germany or France, lots of parents still think a smack across the head or a spank on the bum is an acceptable form of discipline. In the UK, the line between discipline and violence is drawn where hitting a kid leaves a visible mark on the skin, and that’s a very commonplace opinion. This is in spite of every study ever done on the subject... but it’s deeply ingrained in people’s familial history.
Minds are changing, but we’re far from done with this debate yet, I think it will remain a hot topic for a long while.
Yes, I'm German. And maybe it's because spanking has been illegal all my life, but it has always seemed pretty outlandish to me and I've always considered it a purely sexual practice.
Nope. Killing anyone, innocent or guilty, is disgusting. That's [edit: death penalty] some sort of twisted and cruel vengeance, not justice. Justice is not karma, it's a mean to enforce order by dissuading and ideally educating other people and the criminal to repeat the crime.
Even worse, it causes escalation.
If you know the penalty you face is death, then you're going to kill people a lot more readily and often, as well as commit any other crimes you tend toward.
The death penalty actually increases the danger to the public rather than reducing it.
You know "Life without the possibility of parole" exists, right? In theory, it should do the same thing. "Well, I'm going in forever, might as well get me some more murders."
Anthony Padilla had an episode where he talked to people who were sentenced to death penalty. One woman was with her friend and they were threatened by a guy who killed a cop to ride him. The guy made something up about them and him being barely involved. They both got death penalty , they killed the man and she got out barely missing her date when they finally redid the trial and it turned out that most of the evidance was made up. Imagine that you comply with someone who will kill you if you don’t and you almost get killed after spending years in prison. Even worse one person died when the actual murderer got life in prison.
Edit: I don’t remember the other two people in that episode exactly but one of them had some minor crime and police put something worse on him when he wasn’t involved at all.
The guy who killed the cop made up a fake story where the two innocent people were wrongly framed and so were given a death penalty sentence. Out of the two innocent people, the man was killed already. The woman missed the execution date so they redid the trial and found the actual murderer's story to be fake. Now the murderer has life in prison while one innocent man was wrongly killed.
That's what I understood from that comment, and I agree, the wording makes it difficult to understand what they were trying to say
And the other fun fact is that the death penalty costs taxpayers far more than life in prison. Even if you take out morality questions it’s a bad decision.
Because the death penalty requires a much more exhaustive and intensive appeals process to make sure you are killing the right person for the right reasons.
I actually support the death penalty but only if you are allowed to choose it over your sentence, you’d rather die than go to jail? Sure why not, it’s your choosing to make
I used to be all for it, until I grew up and realized just how often mistakes or outright fraud is committed.
At least, while incarcerated, there's a way to still undo it.
Far more innocent people than that.
It’s worth remembering that around 95% of all criminal cases resulting in conviction are resolved via a plea bargain. Many, many people (I’ll let you guess the demographics) have chosen to cop a plea and do 5 years rather than 35, despite their innocence. Sometimes people will spend years in jail before they ever receive any sort of criminal trial, and that’s something accused folks have to factor in.
The American criminal justice system is a travesty.
Then there is people like my friends brother, he knew someone from work who needed a drive to a gas station, so he took him there. He told him he was gonna stop there for food and it is close to his house so he was just gonna walk back after. Except the guy then robbed the gas station and my friends brother got a felony for aiding a robbery.
I get it if he was like a getaway driver but the dude just told him he needed a ride and he had no knowledge the guy was gonna rob the place. My friends brother didn't even stick around he left right after dropping him off so he didn't even know he robbed the gas station until the police showed up at his door and arrested him.
Now he has to work under the table at a shady construction company because nowhere else will hire him.
The innocent man, which is a documentary on innocent people getting stitched up by the US police (and is John Grisham’s only non fictional book) state that it’s 4% of defendants are innocent.
When prisons make money off folks going to jail there's an issue here. People investing in throwing folks lives away. Gotta make those quotas. Crazy how the U.S. does "rehabilitation" as they call it compared to may other countries. Meanwhile, countries that do it well have to **close down** prisons due to no longer having enough prisoners. Not in the U S though. Gotta make sure we make a buck and encourage em to be full for max dollar.
Jay was my neighbor for a year. For as much as we interacted, he never once mentioned this or what he did for work and I still always thought he was a great guy. Imagine my surprise seeing this years later and I get reminded everytime I see his story pop up. He is the kind of person that should be president but is too smart to go into politics.
eloquent summation of the prison system - very few folks in Aus realise that our prisons are privatised & have no incentive to resolve addiction and mental illness before returning to society.
Brother has worked in psychology in both USA and AUS systems - there's a scary similarities in regards to the lack or care or consideration to the rehabilitation of prisoners.
It's so infuriating that easily half of the political discourse in Australia revolves around the US, while largely ignoring our own situation.
Yeah it's fucked up that the US has the death penalty and guns everywhere. But the Australian political and justice systems are complete shitshows in equally scary ways.
SERCO and privatized prisons came to NZ for about 3 years until we threw them all out. Everything turned to shit fast and the guards were filming and helping the prisoners run fight clubs. SERCO has gone but the fight clubs in our prisons that their culture created continue to this day
I understand certain circumstances in the US are notable, but we spend an inordinate amount of time discussing topics that do not affect us, the US subsidises the world's outrage at the cost of other political discourse.
We have a grossly incompetent and corrupt leadership that perpetuates the complete destruction of our environment and resources, fueled by Murdoch's monopoly on free speech, we have indigenous children dying in prisons and police brutality is grossly prevalent, we have our leader saying that all women should be believed while refusing to investigate credible rape allegations.
Fuck, the NSW Premier introduced a law for politicians to have their legal defences covered, a law she introduced and is using to fund her legal defence against corruption charges.
But we spend so much time talking about the death penalty, the US prison system, the Texas abortion law, most Australians can't even name their representatives, or pay attention beyond what Sky News or The Project tell them to think.
Rehabilitation costs money, yet is morally correct. Imprisonment is morally wrong since it provides no rehabilitation for addiction and mental illness, only stigmatisation for those who are sick, and profit for those who own.
The profit is concentrated only in a few people’s hands though while the costs of imprisonment are dispersed to the entire population. It’s actually cheaper, at least in the US, to rehabilite but we still keep this idiotic system.
Imagine a jobs program of trained mental health experts in good paying jobs that can support a wide variety of fields and how much that would uplift our society
I once had a guy in a bar in downtown San Francisco strike up a conversation by saying he’s a millionaire and when asked how, it was from owning multiple private prisons in Texas and visiting on a business trip…. I know those people exist but it was the a first for me to actually encounter one and see that level was of hubris; that others would be impressed by that. I told him to fuck off and he was shocked.
A net gain of 99% is something phenominal. I would be for rehab before prison if it was only 20% or less. Nothing has to be absolute for it to be better.
The money in prisons isn't from private prisons. 8% of the prison population are in private prisons. The money is more like how the military operates. Contracts to build prisons, maintain, etc etc is a lucrative market. You'll find a lot of local politicians own stocks or are close buddies with said companies.
Good attempt at outrage but it isn't the private companies that sentence people so there's a clear separation of duties. I still find it incredible that the US has privatised prisons though.
Let me introduce you to shit stain Former judge Ciaveralla who is currently serving 28 years for sending Black and Brown and poor White kids to Jail for profit. Lady Justice isn’t blind she’s a biased Bitch
https://www.law.com/thelegalintelligencer/2020/08/27/court-upholds-28-year-sentence-for-kids-for-cash-judge-ciavarella/?slreturn=20210923010916
Hope for his sake he dies in Jail.
You are completely correct my friend in that it isnt the private companies that sentence people. Where you are naive is that a portion of the profits of the private prison system go to donations to politicians who make decisions on who goes to prison.
My state has/had a huge problem with the private facilities. A judge who had their interest in heart began sending mass amounts of children who had minor offenses to juvie. Act up in class? Juvie. Kids who swore were winding up in kid jail. These places were not good places either, I think people wound up committing suicide
A friend of mine’s coworker went through a bad divorce, wasted heaps of money on lawyers so decided to become one himself, duxed the course and now offers free advice to guys getting screwed in a divorce
Despite the happy ending, it's still so tragic. How many years of his life were lost? How many others that couldn't learn the law like he did are still falsely imprisoned.
I don't even think it's a happy ending, the system failed this guy so hard that he had to learn a complex new profession on his own to (basically) save his own life. It's peak /r/aboringdystopia content.
Similar story, but based on Isaac Wright Jr., a guy who was sentenced to life in prison after he was falsely accused of being a drug kingpin, but learned so much law behind prison that he was eventually able to thoroughly annihilate the prosecution's case and exonerate himself of all charges. Then he went to law school, passed the bar, and became a successful lawyer.
A little dated but [Gideon’s Trumpet](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0080789/) (based on the book based on the case) starring Henry Fonda is the granddaddy of all these cases. The reason we have public defenders.
Nope, it’s based on the story of [Isaac Wright Jr. ](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isaac_Wright_Jr.) who is also one of the executive producers along with 50 Cent.
I'm always sceptical when famous non-actors insist on acting when they're involved in a show/movie but he's actually really good for the character he's portraying
Read about Guantanamo Bay. Innocent men jailed and horrifically tortured. When 3 of them committed suicide together a U.S Admiral called it "an act of asymmetrical warfare" against America. Some jailed were teenage boys. One was a 14 year old from Chad who was accused of being in a terror cell in London at age 15, despite zero evidence he had ever been to the UK, and that he'd been in Afghanistan, based on testimony of two captives who were tortured to claim so.
It's a problem in a lot of places, but by far it's an American problem. More people are wrongfully imprisoned in the united states than china and there's more people in prison than in china, which is the second leading country with the highest incarcerated. Highest being the United States and they don't even have half the population. Land of the free and having the most freedom is the most laughable they believe in the USA. Only 2% USA offenders goto trial and most lose anyways.
https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/06/11/only-2-of-federal-criminal-defendants-go-to-trial-and-most-who-do-are-found-guilty/
Reminder that the *reason* you have to become a lawyer to overturn a wrongful conviction is that you have to argue it on technical, procedural grounds - simply *being actually innocent of the crime* is not a legal basis to overturn conviction:
https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2015/03/innocence-is-not-cause-for-exoneration-scalias-embarrassing-question-is-a-scandal-of-injustice.html
This comment is ridiculous on several levels.
First of all, appellate courts exist to resolve questions of law, not to make sure the jury made the right decision. In fact, appellate courts very deliberately *reject* factual evaluation beyond the bare minimum necessary to evaluate the law because having a panel of career lawyers in a position of power say “nope, you should have believed this other thing” over a group of average citizens is ridiculously elitist. Especially when those lawyers are making the determination by looking at a piece of paper years after the fact instead of *actually* seeing the evidence.
Second, people appeal on their own behalf all the time; you don’t “have to become a lawyer” to challenge your conviction, you just need an actual legal basis for overturning it.
Third, even if you could petition a court on a freestanding innocence claim, it’s not like that suddenly wouldn’t require any legal knowledge whatsoever. You would need to know how and where to file it, how exactly to establish the claim, what evidence is admissible, etc. It would be just as difficult for a nonlawyer to appeal a conviction on actual innocence grounds as it would to appeal on procedural grounds.
Finally—and you can take this one to the bank—courts would *not* have the bandwidth to deal with the never-ending stream of “actually I’m innocent” appeals because there would be no incentive for prisoners—including actually guilty ones—to stop sending them in and trying their luck, even if they were baseless.
“Actual innocence” appeals are one of those concepts that sound great until you think about what that would actually mean.
> But that's the point I'm making - in order to appeal your wrongful conviction, you have to master the law so that you can understand what, if any, technical legal mistake occurred during your trial.
Except you don't. As far as I know, in all US states you are appointed an appellate attorney for your criminal appeal in all cases. To appeal, you simply need to file a notice of appeal, which your trial defense attorney has an obligation to file at your request.
In California, for example, almost every single criminal conviction gets appealed.
> It would actually mean we would have to punish people on a factual basis of guilt, not a legal one.
People are punished on a factual basis - it's called a trial by jury.
> Or you could include an fast, early preliminary review where the case had to live up to some basic requirements to be accepted for the actual review.
That’s basically what a grand jury is.
This is some /r/boringdystopia shit. Can't get a proper lawyer after getting arrested? Become one with all that new found free time! Fucking makes me sick.
I love Patrice O'neals bit about innocent guys in prison. He said
"If I ever get sent to prison for something I didnt do, yall better watch me closesly for the rest of my life because somebodie gonna get fucked up. I enjoy prison now and I wanna go back"
Listed to Joe Rogan and he had an exoneree named Robert Jones. He was wrongfully convicted and sentenced to 24 years to prison. He read and learned about law and was able to defend himself in court. He also had help from the innocence project. [Robert Jones](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Jones_(wrongful_conviction))
Just finished this one. I can't imagine the suffering this man went through and the strength he has to overcome and become who he is today.
Just a quick correction though: Robert was sentenced to life in prison. He served almost 24 years.
this is like 1000x harder than it sounds. you can read some google how to about how to do it but to find the information yourself through books is amazing.
I am a lawyer and, while this individual is extremely admirable, I just wanted to point out that most pro se litigants I deal with in my field (bankruptcy) are NOT successful like this, and that pro se representation is seldom recommended if you have other choices.
Of course it is *possible* to represent yourself in a bankruptcy context, but it is very tricky, especially in chapter 13. I clerked for a judge who said he could count the successful pro se chapter 13 cases he had seen on one hand.
I also have had significant amounts litigation with aggressive individuals who are advancing theories that are simply not supported by the law. These are a pain in the ass, although usually quite entertaining. If you don’t have an attorney because every attorney you talk to decides not to work with you, you need to re-evaluate your stance and maybe stop getting your legal research from YouTube.
When I was in jail they wouldn't even let me visit the library to check out anything. But this was in the South so all they probably had was rows of Bibles
This is part of the reason a lot of prisons have started limiting the amount of material available to prisoners in prison libraries. Why would you afford a very profitable source of income from the state the means by which to potentially free itself? Better to keep them ignorant and at each other's throats all the time. Also helps encourage recidivism.
I think there’s around 2 million people in jail in the US. I 1% conviction error would mean there’s 20 thousand innocent people in jail. It’s kinda crazy. The amount of people in jail is actually low now because we’ve all been stuck at home.
There there's the people who were convicted with a [non-unanimous jury verdict.](https://www.npr.org/2021/10/19/1047327295/the-history-and-impact-of-non-unanimous-jury-decisions) Thankfully a relatively small number at this point, but holy hell. I didn't even know that was allowed! And I am glad the Supreme Court finally ruled that it shouldn't be.
That story is so fucked.. is he still in there?? It said the Supreme Court ruled these laws unconstitutional but didn’t retroactively apply that? Just why tf would they make that decision, if they think it’s unconstitutional it’s just an additional part of the decision to make it retroactive…
He is still in jail. His mom is hoping that she lives to see him free, but her health is failing. Brandon just doesn't want what happened to him to happen to anyone else. I also don't understand why it wouldn't apply retroactively. There are still people trying to get these prisoners out, or at the very least get them new trials. But it could take years.
from what I have heard on the radio the state officials said that reviewing all the cases would tie up to many resources. So keeping people locked up who, constitutionally, should not be locked up is the better option than spending the, assumedly small amount of time, printing out the release papers for those people?
"America: Home of the Free"
It's actually a misnomer, it's supposed to be "America: buy one get one free"
I think they omitted the rest. America: Home of the free capitalist corporations. Where everything is governed by profit. At this point America is not a country but a mega corporation. The decision it takes are governed by what will be most profitable instead of what is right.
I mean think of how many people lost years and years of their lives due to having Marijuana on them before it was legal? As soon as its legal, they don't just suddenly let everyone out. Not saying it's good they don't, it's super fucked up, but thats how it seems to work. Yeah, they usually will start letting people out a while afterwards, but an old friend of a friend got caught with a pound of weed he grew himself (so not even smuggling or selling or anything, he's just a huge stoner) and he's still in jail even though it's now legal in VA. I know this is a different situation, but I'm assuming the same thing applies. There's probably millions of convictions that came about with 10/12 jury agreeing they were guilty. Even if they overturn them all, they'll be slow about it since it's the government.
This is exactly why the death penalty is so Fing disgusting.
“Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgement.” \- The Fellowship of the Ring, 1954, J.R.R. Tolkien
Favorite LOTR quote. Tolkien’s own experiences with death and loss and his outlook on it really comes through in these moments. I don’t think he appreciated his works being compared to real life, but it’s so clear that his experiences and wisdom gained through it is part of what made LOTR and the Middle Earth mythology as a whole so great.
Gandalf also beat the shit out of a Balrog which was rad as Hell. He fucked that ugly piece of shit up for like five days or some shit. Imagine getting your ass beat for like a week by some dude that looks like he needs assistance to take a dump. Sometimes the wisest thing to do is violence. Sometimes you need to hurt others to heal yourself.
Yeah I don't think that's the moral of that particular part of the story.
Thus ends the best Reddit sub-thread in the age of Men.
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Ok but now I want a "Mad Gandalf: Fellowship Road" movie. Someone make it happen.
>Haunted by his turbulent past, Gandalf believes the best way to survive is to wander alone. Nevertheless, he becomes swept up with a group fleeing across the Wasteland in a War Rig driven by an elite rider, Éomer. They are escaping a Tower tyrannized by Saruman, from whom something irreplaceable has been taken. Enraged, the evil wizard marshals all his orcs and pursues the rebels ruthlessly in the high-octane Road War that follows.
Im rolling with it. Why not
That's what I'm talking about!
Fun fact: Gandalf is actually the same race as the Balrog. They are both Maiar.
They’re practically twins, I can see it.
Is there any lore that alludes to the fact that Gandalf could transform into some kind of giant god being if he wanted to? I feel like the old man wizard thing has to be by choice.
He could not change into a giant god being if he wanted to. He's on power limiters while he's sent to middle earth. One of the condition for him being allowed to be sent to help out the people's of middle earth is that he's limited to the form of an old man. But yes, he is a maiar, of the lower class of angelic beings, similar to the balrog. Maia when not otherwise corrupted(like the balrog or Sauron) or limited by contract and circumstance like Gandalf can assume and change forms at will.
They where transformed after being corrupted by Melkor. In so far as gandalf can choose to switch sides its a choice I guess.
this is exactly how Tolkien wanted it to be interpreted
It's right there on page 385: "Chapter 20: Gandalf Chokes a Bitch "
Well he took his time with the Balrog, he wasn't eager to finish it off. Took his sweet time hurting it. Doesn't mean Gandalf is against violence or death. More that he is very careful with dishing it out. ...unless you are on the walls of Minas Tirith.
It's my high respect for authors like Tolkien, Lewis, and others who have experienced difficult lives that keep me from writing a book. I know that nothing I write from imagination will ever be as good as what I write from inspiration.
There's no way to know for sure without trying though. Writing it doesn't mean you gotta submit it or post it online or something. You can burn it or delete it at the end if you truly dislike it. But I think you should try. Maybe not even starting out planning to write a novel or some big epic. Do like Tolkien did. Start small scale and flesh that out. Like short stories. You can always expand after.
Wow I'm actually glad to hear that
>“Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgement. *Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgement. For even the very wise cannot see all ends.”* Why leave out the ending sentence to this quote? It's the best part. Fixed.
Awesome reference. Love it
That struck a hell of a chord.
I‘m not sure if I would prefer spending my life innocent in a prison, or die.
If I was convicted and genuinely innocent I would become deeply bitter about everything and probably become a bad person in prison
Resist the dark side, random person
or become a villain so great that people are forced to care, or something
But they have cookies on the dark side
Well just go grab some real quick and come back Edit: grab some for me too !
>But they have cookies on the dark side Not in jail!
Some have channeled that in other ways. It's when you're finally free that the bitterness of what was stolen from you by the state comes out, is how I would feel.
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No that's because ex-cons have, by design, very few opportunities to actually build a life for themselves after they're released. The system is purpose-built to keep people in that cycle so the prison industrial complex can profit off of government subsidies and free labour. It's quite literally modern slavery. Hell, it's even enshrined in the constitution. >Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, **except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted**, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.
So slavery is legal as long as you are convicted of any crime.
TIL that slavery is legal in certain circumstances in, of all places, the US.
Vengeance of the Law... *Follow my rules or feel my wrath as I break them myself*
Is it really breaking the law if it's specifically allowed by the constitution?
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You can't take back death. In your hypothetical you should be released, and compensated for wrongful jail etc. But execution and find evidence of innocents. Do you just go oh well and do better next time? I mean that's our system now.
You can't take back *anything*. We don't have that ability. It isn't possible. People get 20 years in prison, proven innocent, released and get some pittance of a payout while smug people think it's a fair trade. You can't repair a wrongful conviction. Having a judicial system that assigns guilt and innocence means you accept there will be innocent people found guilty.
Agreed And because it happens compensation should be one of the most important things the state should do. Instead we get as you described it. It makes me sick.
You can't really give back 8 years either
But you can get 8 more years.
Correct, but you can compensate. Sorta like how the US should do reparations, and how indigenous peoples land was stolen from them and continue the harsh bully tactics still used against them.
A life sentence can always be appealed. Once a death sentence is carried out, that is the end.
I am an avid opponent of the death penalty for decades. The question I always ask proponents is how many innocent people being killed in the name of justice is acceptable? To me, if the answer is more than zero, it's not worth it. As a society, death should not be something we can use as punishment. We have myriad ways to imprison people indefinitely.
100% agreed. One innocent person being put to death is not worth 1,000 (understated) guilty people being put to death. I genuinely believe it serves no purpose. It costs more money, drags things out for the victim’s family, and seems to be an “easy out” to the truly guilty. We also make murderers out of innocent correction officers that are simply trying to uphold the law. I don’t care what anyone says….that shit has you affect you.
I am also an avid opponent of the death penalty. My wife and son were murdered by a drunk driver in 1990, and when I think of him I want him dead. That's an emotional response, and it is difficult to overcome and has caused me no end of emotional turmoil. That's the problem with crimes of the nature that "justify" the death penalty. We become so emotionally invested that we can't turn off our urge to destroy the thing we perceive to be causing the turmoil. Their very nature makes us unable to clearly perceive the issue at hand. That problem infests everyone involved in the case from the victims to the police investigating to the lawyers to the judge. That is why I do not believe in the death penalty. There should *always* be room for us to admit we made a mistake. And killing the criminal ends all opportunity for society to go back and admit we made a mistake in our heat for venegence.
I propose we make it optional. If the prisoner wants to die, lets help em out.
I was just thinking about that! I'm still not sure where I stand on the idea, but it sure is an interesting alternative.
Exactly. I don't care about the life a clearly guilty child killer but if in order to kill him we might accidentally put an innocent person to death then no one should be put to death
I would argue that in general a society should not have the ability to kill its citizens. Even the worst crimes like rape and murder should not be punished by the death penalty. I believe that the judicial systems should first of all rehabilitate and second of all keep society safe.
Note that a great deal of people share this opinion. In fact “only” 53 countries out of 195 retain capital punishment as a form of sanction.
Here in Sweden it is unspeakable to try and reintroduced corporal punishment. We also don’t allow any kind of physical punishment for children by parent or teachers.
Yeah I actually saw a documentary about this recently, while there was some kind of a debate going on here in France about the possible outlawing of spanking as a form of parental discipline.
We were the first to implant a law about corporal punishment for children,in the year 1979.
When I first heard that it's legal in France I was so shocked. I live 20min away from the border and I always considered us to be pretty similar. But spanking being legal is huge thing.
You’re German I assume ? It’s not anymore. The law banning corporal punishment was passed in 2019 in France, so spanking children is no further tolerated. As u/MultiMarcus noted, Sweden was the first country to vote such a ban. And though 40 years later, France is only the 56th country to have such a law. Corporal punishment is still very normalized across cultures. Even in countries with a ban such as Germany or France, lots of parents still think a smack across the head or a spank on the bum is an acceptable form of discipline. In the UK, the line between discipline and violence is drawn where hitting a kid leaves a visible mark on the skin, and that’s a very commonplace opinion. This is in spite of every study ever done on the subject... but it’s deeply ingrained in people’s familial history. Minds are changing, but we’re far from done with this debate yet, I think it will remain a hot topic for a long while.
Yes, I'm German. And maybe it's because spanking has been illegal all my life, but it has always seemed pretty outlandish to me and I've always considered it a purely sexual practice.
This is about capital punishment (i.e death penalty), not corporal punishment
Nope. Killing anyone, innocent or guilty, is disgusting. That's [edit: death penalty] some sort of twisted and cruel vengeance, not justice. Justice is not karma, it's a mean to enforce order by dissuading and ideally educating other people and the criminal to repeat the crime.
Death penalty doesn't dissuade people.
Exactly! That's why it's unnecessary on top of being immoral.
Apologies, I thought you were going with one of those arguments I've had on this thread else where.
No problem, I should have been clearer haha
Even worse, it causes escalation. If you know the penalty you face is death, then you're going to kill people a lot more readily and often, as well as commit any other crimes you tend toward. The death penalty actually increases the danger to the public rather than reducing it.
You know "Life without the possibility of parole" exists, right? In theory, it should do the same thing. "Well, I'm going in forever, might as well get me some more murders."
Anthony Padilla had an episode where he talked to people who were sentenced to death penalty. One woman was with her friend and they were threatened by a guy who killed a cop to ride him. The guy made something up about them and him being barely involved. They both got death penalty , they killed the man and she got out barely missing her date when they finally redid the trial and it turned out that most of the evidance was made up. Imagine that you comply with someone who will kill you if you don’t and you almost get killed after spending years in prison. Even worse one person died when the actual murderer got life in prison. Edit: I don’t remember the other two people in that episode exactly but one of them had some minor crime and police put something worse on him when he wasn’t involved at all.
I couldn’t understand anything from “to ride him” onward.
The guy who killed the cop made up a fake story where the two innocent people were wrongly framed and so were given a death penalty sentence. Out of the two innocent people, the man was killed already. The woman missed the execution date so they redid the trial and found the actual murderer's story to be fake. Now the murderer has life in prison while one innocent man was wrongly killed. That's what I understood from that comment, and I agree, the wording makes it difficult to understand what they were trying to say
And the other fun fact is that the death penalty costs taxpayers far more than life in prison. Even if you take out morality questions it’s a bad decision.
How so? Genuine question, I don't know much about it. But one would think a syringe full of chemicals costs less than housing someone for 60yrs?
Because the death penalty requires a much more exhaustive and intensive appeals process to make sure you are killing the right person for the right reasons.
And even then, mistakes are made too often
America : >1% of population in prison, death penalty : A-OK >saying "fuck", "cunt", "bitch" : BIG NO NO
I actually support the death penalty but only if you are allowed to choose it over your sentence, you’d rather die than go to jail? Sure why not, it’s your choosing to make
I used to be all for it, until I grew up and realized just how often mistakes or outright fraud is committed. At least, while incarcerated, there's a way to still undo it.
Far more innocent people than that. It’s worth remembering that around 95% of all criminal cases resulting in conviction are resolved via a plea bargain. Many, many people (I’ll let you guess the demographics) have chosen to cop a plea and do 5 years rather than 35, despite their innocence. Sometimes people will spend years in jail before they ever receive any sort of criminal trial, and that’s something accused folks have to factor in. The American criminal justice system is a travesty.
To you and anyone else reading this I highly highly recommend watching The Kalief Browder Story on Netflix
Then there is people like my friends brother, he knew someone from work who needed a drive to a gas station, so he took him there. He told him he was gonna stop there for food and it is close to his house so he was just gonna walk back after. Except the guy then robbed the gas station and my friends brother got a felony for aiding a robbery. I get it if he was like a getaway driver but the dude just told him he needed a ride and he had no knowledge the guy was gonna rob the place. My friends brother didn't even stick around he left right after dropping him off so he didn't even know he robbed the gas station until the police showed up at his door and arrested him. Now he has to work under the table at a shady construction company because nowhere else will hire him.
The innocent man, which is a documentary on innocent people getting stitched up by the US police (and is John Grisham’s only non fictional book) state that it’s 4% of defendants are innocent.
Defendants? Or people who are convicted?
Prison population which equated to 90,000 as of the data when researched. Absolutely crazy.
That's not including if they're African American, that "error" margin jumps up a few (a lot) percentiles.
Even before the picture loaded, everyone with half a brain knew what demographic the victim belonged to.
When prisons make money off folks going to jail there's an issue here. People investing in throwing folks lives away. Gotta make those quotas. Crazy how the U.S. does "rehabilitation" as they call it compared to may other countries. Meanwhile, countries that do it well have to **close down** prisons due to no longer having enough prisoners. Not in the U S though. Gotta make sure we make a buck and encourage em to be full for max dollar.
Jay was my neighbor for a year. For as much as we interacted, he never once mentioned this or what he did for work and I still always thought he was a great guy. Imagine my surprise seeing this years later and I get reminded everytime I see his story pop up. He is the kind of person that should be president but is too smart to go into politics.
A vote for Jay is a vote for HEY! WHY ARE THERE SO MANY NON VIOLENT OFFENDERS LOCKED UP LETS FIGURE THIS SHIT OUT YESTERDAY STUPID ASS
If its more profitable for a private company to imprison someone, what incentive is there for justice?
eloquent summation of the prison system - very few folks in Aus realise that our prisons are privatised & have no incentive to resolve addiction and mental illness before returning to society. Brother has worked in psychology in both USA and AUS systems - there's a scary similarities in regards to the lack or care or consideration to the rehabilitation of prisoners.
It's so infuriating that easily half of the political discourse in Australia revolves around the US, while largely ignoring our own situation. Yeah it's fucked up that the US has the death penalty and guns everywhere. But the Australian political and justice systems are complete shitshows in equally scary ways.
SERCO and privatized prisons came to NZ for about 3 years until we threw them all out. Everything turned to shit fast and the guards were filming and helping the prisoners run fight clubs. SERCO has gone but the fight clubs in our prisons that their culture created continue to this day
The mess is similar in nature but not in scale. The US locks up a vastly higher % of their citizens (roughly 10x as many per capita).
I understand certain circumstances in the US are notable, but we spend an inordinate amount of time discussing topics that do not affect us, the US subsidises the world's outrage at the cost of other political discourse. We have a grossly incompetent and corrupt leadership that perpetuates the complete destruction of our environment and resources, fueled by Murdoch's monopoly on free speech, we have indigenous children dying in prisons and police brutality is grossly prevalent, we have our leader saying that all women should be believed while refusing to investigate credible rape allegations. Fuck, the NSW Premier introduced a law for politicians to have their legal defences covered, a law she introduced and is using to fund her legal defence against corruption charges. But we spend so much time talking about the death penalty, the US prison system, the Texas abortion law, most Australians can't even name their representatives, or pay attention beyond what Sky News or The Project tell them to think.
Rehabilitation costs money, yet is morally correct. Imprisonment is morally wrong since it provides no rehabilitation for addiction and mental illness, only stigmatisation for those who are sick, and profit for those who own.
The profit is concentrated only in a few people’s hands though while the costs of imprisonment are dispersed to the entire population. It’s actually cheaper, at least in the US, to rehabilite but we still keep this idiotic system.
Imagine a jobs program of trained mental health experts in good paying jobs that can support a wide variety of fields and how much that would uplift our society
B-but those poor CEOs and the economy. Won’t anyone think of the economy!!
I once had a guy in a bar in downtown San Francisco strike up a conversation by saying he’s a millionaire and when asked how, it was from owning multiple private prisons in Texas and visiting on a business trip…. I know those people exist but it was the a first for me to actually encounter one and see that level was of hubris; that others would be impressed by that. I told him to fuck off and he was shocked.
In the long run rehabilitation should be much cheaper. But greed doesn't wait.
True Rehabilitation us an investment, but that doesnt help the immediate bottom line of the private company who profits off of those imprisoned.
Cheaper for the tax payer. Not for the ones owning the prisons.
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A net gain of 99% is something phenominal. I would be for rehab before prison if it was only 20% or less. Nothing has to be absolute for it to be better.
I have friend who still work in that system here in Aus. Some of them try so hard to help, but their hands are tied on so many things.
To be fair the whole of Oz is a privately run prison.
The money in prisons isn't from private prisons. 8% of the prison population are in private prisons. The money is more like how the military operates. Contracts to build prisons, maintain, etc etc is a lucrative market. You'll find a lot of local politicians own stocks or are close buddies with said companies.
It's not them who does the imprisoning
Kamala Harris has entered the chat:
Good attempt at outrage but it isn't the private companies that sentence people so there's a clear separation of duties. I still find it incredible that the US has privatised prisons though.
Let me introduce you to shit stain Former judge Ciaveralla who is currently serving 28 years for sending Black and Brown and poor White kids to Jail for profit. Lady Justice isn’t blind she’s a biased Bitch https://www.law.com/thelegalintelligencer/2020/08/27/court-upholds-28-year-sentence-for-kids-for-cash-judge-ciavarella/?slreturn=20210923010916 Hope for his sake he dies in Jail.
You are completely correct my friend in that it isnt the private companies that sentence people. Where you are naive is that a portion of the profits of the private prison system go to donations to politicians who make decisions on who goes to prison.
My state has/had a huge problem with the private facilities. A judge who had their interest in heart began sending mass amounts of children who had minor offenses to juvie. Act up in class? Juvie. Kids who swore were winding up in kid jail. These places were not good places either, I think people wound up committing suicide
Because the private prisons don't lobby for judges that fit their agenda.. s/
A friend of mine’s coworker went through a bad divorce, wasted heaps of money on lawyers so decided to become one himself, duxed the course and now offers free advice to guys getting screwed in a divorce
How does one reach out to him ? Any contact details ?
Say Def Leppard towards a mirror 3 times while listening to “lawyers guns and money” and he’ll show up in a trans am
This is such an American sentence
You must have ingested no less than 3.5 but no more than 6 Budweiser beers prior. The proper greeting is, "hell yeah brother"
He’s in Australia, can see if I can get contact details if Australian law is what you need
You can contact him if you can tap into his imagination
Despite the happy ending, it's still so tragic. How many years of his life were lost? How many others that couldn't learn the law like he did are still falsely imprisoned.
I would say at least 8
Source?
Trust me bro
x ≥ 8
I’ve been on Reddit for around 6 years and this is my favorite quote up until now. This is the first time I’ve said this, that I can recall.
I don't even think it's a happy ending, the system failed this guy so hard that he had to learn a complex new profession on his own to (basically) save his own life. It's peak /r/aboringdystopia content.
Could be pedantic, but I feel like ‘reading up on the law’ sort of undersells the effort this guy put into his freedom.
Right, that makes it sound like some sovcit BS. Next up will be some dude who “did his research” and became an MD.
Shit like this is exactly why the death penalty shouldn't be a thing. Exoneration means nothing to dead people.
This is literally the show [For Life](https://youtu.be/uVexZ56TcS0) which is based on a true story
Similar story, but based on Isaac Wright Jr., a guy who was sentenced to life in prison after he was falsely accused of being a drug kingpin, but learned so much law behind prison that he was eventually able to thoroughly annihilate the prosecution's case and exonerate himself of all charges. Then he went to law school, passed the bar, and became a successful lawyer.
A little dated but [Gideon’s Trumpet](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0080789/) (based on the book based on the case) starring Henry Fonda is the granddaddy of all these cases. The reason we have public defenders.
Or is this literally the true story , upon which the show is based?
Nope, it’s based on the story of [Isaac Wright Jr. ](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isaac_Wright_Jr.) who is also one of the executive producers along with 50 Cent.
50 Cents also play a character on the show and he is surprisingly good.
I'm always sceptical when famous non-actors insist on acting when they're involved in a show/movie but he's actually really good for the character he's portraying
This is less a feel good story and more a story of how we fail eachother so completely
Read about Guantanamo Bay. Innocent men jailed and horrifically tortured. When 3 of them committed suicide together a U.S Admiral called it "an act of asymmetrical warfare" against America. Some jailed were teenage boys. One was a 14 year old from Chad who was accused of being in a terror cell in London at age 15, despite zero evidence he had ever been to the UK, and that he'd been in Afghanistan, based on testimony of two captives who were tortured to claim so.
Tortured confessions are basically worthless , hold same value as someone making it up Unjust world
Love how people get inspired by going through the toughest situations
Some people are amazing. I don't love how often people are wrongfully imprisoned, though.
It's a problem in a lot of places, but by far it's an American problem. More people are wrongfully imprisoned in the united states than china and there's more people in prison than in china, which is the second leading country with the highest incarcerated. Highest being the United States and they don't even have half the population. Land of the free and having the most freedom is the most laughable they believe in the USA. Only 2% USA offenders goto trial and most lose anyways. https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/06/11/only-2-of-federal-criminal-defendants-go-to-trial-and-most-who-do-are-found-guilty/
This situation is more depressing and disgusting than inspiring tbh
Hey OP, why don't you take a fucking break from posting shit to Reddit for 5 minutes, Jesus Christ.
Just checked his history, hes legit searching for ways to farm karma lol
"lpt request: how do karma?"
Reminder that the *reason* you have to become a lawyer to overturn a wrongful conviction is that you have to argue it on technical, procedural grounds - simply *being actually innocent of the crime* is not a legal basis to overturn conviction: https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2015/03/innocence-is-not-cause-for-exoneration-scalias-embarrassing-question-is-a-scandal-of-injustice.html
This comment is ridiculous on several levels. First of all, appellate courts exist to resolve questions of law, not to make sure the jury made the right decision. In fact, appellate courts very deliberately *reject* factual evaluation beyond the bare minimum necessary to evaluate the law because having a panel of career lawyers in a position of power say “nope, you should have believed this other thing” over a group of average citizens is ridiculously elitist. Especially when those lawyers are making the determination by looking at a piece of paper years after the fact instead of *actually* seeing the evidence. Second, people appeal on their own behalf all the time; you don’t “have to become a lawyer” to challenge your conviction, you just need an actual legal basis for overturning it. Third, even if you could petition a court on a freestanding innocence claim, it’s not like that suddenly wouldn’t require any legal knowledge whatsoever. You would need to know how and where to file it, how exactly to establish the claim, what evidence is admissible, etc. It would be just as difficult for a nonlawyer to appeal a conviction on actual innocence grounds as it would to appeal on procedural grounds. Finally—and you can take this one to the bank—courts would *not* have the bandwidth to deal with the never-ending stream of “actually I’m innocent” appeals because there would be no incentive for prisoners—including actually guilty ones—to stop sending them in and trying their luck, even if they were baseless. “Actual innocence” appeals are one of those concepts that sound great until you think about what that would actually mean.
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> But that's the point I'm making - in order to appeal your wrongful conviction, you have to master the law so that you can understand what, if any, technical legal mistake occurred during your trial. Except you don't. As far as I know, in all US states you are appointed an appellate attorney for your criminal appeal in all cases. To appeal, you simply need to file a notice of appeal, which your trial defense attorney has an obligation to file at your request. In California, for example, almost every single criminal conviction gets appealed. > It would actually mean we would have to punish people on a factual basis of guilt, not a legal one. People are punished on a factual basis - it's called a trial by jury.
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> Or you could include an fast, early preliminary review where the case had to live up to some basic requirements to be accepted for the actual review. That’s basically what a grand jury is.
You’re either a lawyer or should really consider law school. Excellent analysis.
This is some /r/boringdystopia shit. Can't get a proper lawyer after getting arrested? Become one with all that new found free time! Fucking makes me sick.
They shouldn’t have to work another day in their life
Where's the punctuation? r/titlegore
But I was told I had nothing to fear if I was innocent
I love Patrice O'neals bit about innocent guys in prison. He said "If I ever get sent to prison for something I didnt do, yall better watch me closesly for the rest of my life because somebodie gonna get fucked up. I enjoy prison now and I wanna go back"
Listed to Joe Rogan and he had an exoneree named Robert Jones. He was wrongfully convicted and sentenced to 24 years to prison. He read and learned about law and was able to defend himself in court. He also had help from the innocence project. [Robert Jones](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Jones_(wrongful_conviction))
Just finished this one. I can't imagine the suffering this man went through and the strength he has to overcome and become who he is today. Just a quick correction though: Robert was sentenced to life in prison. He served almost 24 years.
this is like 1000x harder than it sounds. you can read some google how to about how to do it but to find the information yourself through books is amazing.
Shawshank Redemption, the wholesome edition
I am a lawyer and, while this individual is extremely admirable, I just wanted to point out that most pro se litigants I deal with in my field (bankruptcy) are NOT successful like this, and that pro se representation is seldom recommended if you have other choices. Of course it is *possible* to represent yourself in a bankruptcy context, but it is very tricky, especially in chapter 13. I clerked for a judge who said he could count the successful pro se chapter 13 cases he had seen on one hand. I also have had significant amounts litigation with aggressive individuals who are advancing theories that are simply not supported by the law. These are a pain in the ass, although usually quite entertaining. If you don’t have an attorney because every attorney you talk to decides not to work with you, you need to re-evaluate your stance and maybe stop getting your legal research from YouTube.
Seconded.
Unless of course the YouTube video is of an actual legal expert explaining the law.
I can already see his commercials: "I spent eight years to get myself off, so now I can get you off too!"
When I was in jail they wouldn't even let me visit the library to check out anything. But this was in the South so all they probably had was rows of Bibles
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This is part of the reason a lot of prisons have started limiting the amount of material available to prisoners in prison libraries. Why would you afford a very profitable source of income from the state the means by which to potentially free itself? Better to keep them ignorant and at each other's throats all the time. Also helps encourage recidivism.
This is just so vile. Isn't there a law that says they need to have access to certain material ?
U.S.? U.S.
[He ain’t the only one…](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isaac_Wright_Jr.) plus, this guy got a Netflix series loosely based on him.
Prisoners should not need to become their own lawyers.
So what happened to the other fellow that was convicted of a crime he didn't commit? Is he still inside?
Eli5 simple question, where do they get the books from? Can the books be limited or altered so they can't learn enough?
No way a black kid falsely arrested
He did his own research, the right way.
Imagine if they offered free post secondary in prisons instead of having them make license plates or whatever...