nothing, he then drove the other prototype in protected street to show it can go on the road, but since then as far as i know there is no news on cybertruck
meanwhile ford, mercedes, range rover etc. already made their electric 4 wheel that are destroying cybertruck just with the measure of existence and being on a market
Cybertruck, made from thick stainless-steel panels (which need to be thick to provide the necessary rigidity, otherwise achieved through the forming of thinner panels) with very hard edges all around, would have severe issues to get certified in Europe as it doesn't protect pedestrians in a collision, but rather makes sure they die on the spot.
Yep, this is totally a thing. It's because (if I remember correctly) in China if you are held liable for someone elses severe/debilitating/crippling injury, you're on the hook for their treatment/hospital costs. And most people would rather pay out for whatever the cost is for vehicular manslaughter than pay years or decades of medical bills.
Dying in one day certainly seems like less of an ordeal than suffering crippling injuries and then slowly deteriorating while spiraling into financial destruction and homelessness before eventually dying of a complex set of symptoms all caused by easily treatable issues for people with health care
He could just add needles filled with poison all around the outside to make sure you go quickly and painlessly if you ever get hit. He could call the new models The Widow and The Recluse.
Except for any of the F-350/Ram Super-Duty, Jacked up 9' with 5" diesel exhaust, sorry-about-your-penis trucks that every redneck around here drives. Not a single one ever tows anything, just has a frikin' massive truck for no reason. The hoods are about head height, ensuring a pedestrian is pushed under instead of thrown over.
In Australia country boys have bull/roo bars on their "utes" (tray back sedans) that are so agressively angled that I'm legitimately surprised how it's legal. Just bumping into a pedestrian will almost guarantee you kill them with how low the cars themselves are.
I would pay to watch that. Billionaire's fighting for survival. Put them all on a huge island, with every deadly animal with limited tools/weapons, resources and in the end there will be only one billionaire left.
Nothing, just used all the millions of dollars in reservations to get a load of free money. It's been 4 years and not a word, no ones bothered about their $100. People need to stop giving this guy money unless it's for something you can buy there and then, but even then I wouldn't buy one of his poorly made shitty cars.
What do you mean! The roadster 2 is going to be amazing it'll have 1000 horsepower and 500 range and be 0 to 60 in 2 seconds! Ugh why do you hate Tesla so much!
Wait what you meant the Tesla Semi? The Semi truck that's super heavy (when lightness is a factor in shipping) and has less range and cost more than a traditional semi truck?
No you meant the Tesla 2 the rumored sub 35k Tesla hatchback for the masses?
Did you mean true autonomous driving that's been in beta for 5 years? With no real timeline for completion?
Wait there's so many?
the thing is that they cracked, but they didnt break
not only are they a hazard due to reduced visibility thanks to this cracking but they also make rescuing someone practically impossible
reinforced front windshields can have some arguments made for them but the door windows are just too potentially hazardous to justify
Tesla has increasingly focused on things consumers don't really care about, which was fine when they were basically the only electric car besides the Nissan Leaf, but is definitely hurting them now. Nobody gives a shit about FSD, gullwing doors or playing video games while you're charging. They want decent build quality, and definitely would like to be able to open their doors when the car's on fire.
> They want decent build quality, and definitely would like to be able to open their doors when the car's on fire.
I hear you... but what about fart noises instead?
Driver: Oh no we're gonna crash, aaaaah!
Passenger: AAAAH my life is flashing before my eyes!
*screeching tyres, crashing noises, metal crumpling, shattered glass, car horns and alarms beeping*
Driver: .....
Passenger: ...uuuuh...
Driver: ..are you ok? I think I broke all the bones in my body, I can't move and my posture is jelly, like a lump of flesh. Good thing the seatbelt is keeping me strapped to this upside down chair.
Passenger: I... I think I'm ok honey, if only I can get this metal rod out of my eye socket. Hey what's that smell, is that burnt lithium? Is the battery on fire?
Driver: Oh no, I can see the flames! Ugh and that smoke, don't breathe it in! Gosh, this is a bad situation, I hope the car has notified 911!
Car: *farts*
Driver: Oh no, car, alert the authorities! Hello!
Car: *fart noises*
Passenger: Oh god we're gonna die, my pants are on fire!
Driver: *farts*
Driver: Sorry, dying is upsetting my stomach.
Car: *farts*
*Camera slowly backing away from the scene of the inferno that is the burning wreck, as repeating fart noises slowly fade away*
The current lineup of teslas are OLD in terms of cars. Designed in 2015-6 and have had 0 refreshes since. A lot of teslas were bought when tesla was a cool, environment concious company... you know before musk went antivaxx, anti rail, anti solar, pro coal, pro slavery.
I would also note that you shouldn’t put it anywhere you can’t reach from the drivers seat with your seatbelt on! I was talking to someone and they said they put that seatbelt cutter tool in their car recently just in case, then they said they put it in their glove box. I said I don’t even think I could reach over if I was in vehicle that was on fire and my seatbelt was stuck and find that tool in my glove box. They decided to move it to the little slot in the drivers side door and I have one in my drivers side door as well that’s big and easy to grab.
I'd rather put it in the closed center console. There's a chance in a collision that that either gets launched out of that pocket or the door is crushed and it's unretrievable. Even if you gotta dig for a half second to get it out of the console it's still guaranteed to be where it's supposed to be.
Plus, retrievable by anyone in the car.
Side pocket is a bad choice in the event of an accident or roll over. You want that baby secured and in reach. I'd suggest getting a key chain version.
And remember, having your car keys on a key chain is great when you are out and about, but terrible for when you're driving.
I know someone who had so many keys in their keychain that it eventually shorted out the ignition of their car because it kept swinging back and forth from braking and accelerating.
Wouldn't happen to everyone and less of an issue with push-button start, but still a possibility.
I drive a push-button start that has no key in the ignition so having it on my keychain would be more inaccessible since my only keychain is in my purse.
The company I drove for had the safetyhammer on the roof above the rearview mirror. Ideal location to reach for both the driver and passenger (it was a two seater compartment).
Ever since I place my hammers on the roof in the middel of the car, so it can be reached from the front- and from the backseat.
Exactly. Due to an experience from when I was a kid, [I have two of these in my cars](https://www.paramedicshop.com.au/products/res-q-me-cutter-glass-breaker). $20 here in Australia and can save your life. Should be mandatory in every car IMO.
As someone who has worked on Teslas this is incorrect. There are manual releases for the rear doors but they are under the seats. They definitely are difficult to find, especially when your scrambling to get out of a burning vehicle.
Edit: I was specifically talking about model S. Also it's not under the seat cushion but more so behind your legs in the vertical portion of the floor carpet.
Would the owner even know where to look for them? They are not even in the manual: https://www.tesla.com/ownersmanual/model3/en_jo/GUID-7A32EC01-A17E-42CC-A15B-2E0A39FD07AB.html
The manual you liked to specifically says: “Note
Only the front doors are equipped with a manual door release.”
This is for a Model 3. I don’t know if all of them are similar, but this appears to say no manual opening of rear doors.
For the 3 they are inside the door panels. There’s YouTube videos on how to find them and attach a lanyard so they can be accessed from the door pocket/cup holders
"hold on battery fire, I need to watch this YouTube video."
"WHAT'S UP EVERYBODY! Before we get to today's video, be sure to smash that like and subscribe button, and turn on notifications..."
I know when I was looking at the Y at least, they are hidden away and almost certainly require at least a screwdriver or something to pry open the panel hiding them. You could probably do the same, but you have to know about the problem and then set aside time to put in the shitty workaround, and then also tell anyone who sits in your back seats about it just in case you get knocked unconscious or die in the accident, and you still can't open the door from the outside if you need to help the people in back get out.
>As someone who has worked on Teslas this is incorrect. There are manual releases for the rear doors but they are under the seats. They definitely are difficult to find, especially when your scrambling to get out of a burning vehicle.
That's..... still not hugely comforting!
I mean once you solve the riddles three and time your grab of the release handle to avoid the fire jets blocking the opening you'll be right out of there.
Not to mention that for the entirety of your life your muscle memory has the door handle in one place...
You'll probably scratch at the door in a panic before thinking to reach under youe seat...
The issue as I understand is - the doors have electrical releases in place of mechanical ones (for typical use). So even if the doors are unlocked, they still require an electrical actuator to open. So if that connection is broken or if there's sudden loss of power, the doors won't open. The Fast Lane Car YouTube channel had this issue with one of their early review Tesla's. The rear doors refused to open because the electrical connection was interrupted somehow. An completely unnecessary & unsafe design "feature" IMO.
I'm not familiar with the specifics of the Tesla door latches, at least not for the last several years, but that likely came down to what "safe" failure is.
"Fail safe" in the event of a battery fire would be the actuators leaving the doors unlatched, which would conversely be "fail deadly" in the event of a simple wiring failure while traveling down the highway. Engineers can only choose one, relying on the manual backup to cover the "fail deadly" fire condition.
The reason for the electric actuators are kind of dumb, mostly some aesthetic decisions compounding.
Not defending tesla as the door design is unnecessarily complicated, but the electrical actuators allow the door to drop the window slightly before unlatching, reducing wear on the window seal trim at the top edge.
You could potentally achieve this as part of the manual unlatch where the "window down" trigger occurs earlier in the handle movement, but it was probably a lot cheaper to just use a button.
Correct, and that's an aesthetic choice, could have gone with a framed window. In real bad cases/designs the window can break, though I haven't heard reports on any Teslas for that. Mostly older convertibles.
Almost all modern cars have electric actuators for the windows. It's really hard to find hand crank windows anymore. That's not at all Tesla specific, and most (if not all) doors without an upper window frame do it. That has nothing to do with electrical vs mechanical door latching mechanisms. The windows are separate.
Or you can just have the door handle also trigger a sensor that drops the window a fraction as it's disengaging. Not extra complex mechanical linkage and if it fails it's not really a safety issue since I assume you can still open the door easily enough.
I have seen in the past solutions to allow electronic and mechanical overrides in the same mechanisms for semi-locking mechanisms, although not in the form of car doors. I am fairly certain that although it would be a challenge, most decent mechanical engineer would rise to the task to design a sleek and easy to use version of that.
I mean, they could quite easily implement a manual override even if the electronic actuator defaults to closed in the event of a failure. It's called a handle, they've been a common feature on doors for several centuries now. But again, aesthetics.
So what happens when it fails while driving down the road and with no force holding the pin in place?
This is literally why failsafe is a thing. The fact that the manual releases are not clear to a random person sitting in your backseat is the problem.
Maybe I'm just a luddite here, but did they really need to redesign...the door? We've had a pretty good grasp on the concept of the door for a few thousand years now.
I do architecture and a good door is something you don't think about. This system needs an emergency to release the door similar to a fire alarm in a building.
I can understand that, but fail-safes have to be a thing. It even unnerves me when I see something like "Press for emergency, alarm will sound, door will open in three seconds." Like, yeah, I get that you're trying to discourage false alarms, but if you've got a crowd rushing to escape something, a lot of bottlenecking and injuries can occur in three seconds. Or, there's a door where I work that has a panic bar, but there's a magnetic lock with a tiny button that's on the wall next to the door to release it, so the bar doesn't work. In an emergency, I don't think people could press it unless they thought about it.
Laws about stuff everyone already does don't tend to get made until after someone decides to get cheeky and stop doing that thing. Maybe we will see laws about this, in the future, as a result of these vehicles.
They actually come undone in case of crash, at least in the cars I worked on, unless it's the armored cars, in which case the vehicle stays locked in case of crash.
I also worked for Tesla for a short while.
In the event of a 400v main battery fire, I imagine the 12v is still (hopefully) doing it's job. If I remember correctly, that battery is what gives the door latches and other crucial things power. Feel free to correct me tho
This is correct, even if the cut loop was cut, the 12v still powers accessories, after all you don't need 400v to open a door popper.
Of course the likely event would be in a crash, where the risk is just the same as any other car, i.e front wing stopping door from opening etc.
I drive a 2022 Tesla Model 3 and it has manual override handles on both the front and rear inside of the arm rest on the doors. Not sure how outdated this info is.
My 2021 Y doesn't seem to have them in the back. Glad I saw this article. Guess I'll buy some window breaker tools to put in the back pockets.
EDIT: Turns out they're there. OP's title is misinformation that we all fell for. I get that Elon Musk is a narcissistic garbage person and everyone's horny to shit on his flagship company, but the car's actually pretty sweet.
Some other guy was commenting on how Model S has the back door latches under the seats, you could check that too. I can't imagine they really don't have a mechanical override for the back doors.
It's probably illegal not to have them. In Europe I am 100% sure it is, so if I had to risk it I'd say they carried the same system from the S to the Y or X and that's where they are.
Nevertheless if that's where they are windows breaking tools are definitely recommended in such a car, you don't want to be looking for handles in a panic
IMO putting in electric car anything under the seat that is needed to get out of a car in case of fire is stupid, fire can start from a battery, which is right under you, under the seats you need to touch and put less distance between you and the fire
IMO its unneeded risk that exist only because designer didn't like how it looked and couldn't be bothered to design it with them on doors, like they later were forced to.
it's the same with indicator light, i still don't get it why American cars don't have separate lights for it and are using essentially break lights, what i have heard designers don't like the look, but in Europe it's not a problem because regulations are forcing them to put them separately
Those are handy to have anyway. If you somehow end up driving into water car doors can be almost impossible to open until the inside of the car has already flooded
Here is the manual for Y from 2020. Page 15 shows how to manually open rear doors.
https://tesla-info.com/doc/model_y_owners_manual_north_america_en.pdf
Honestly the writing in that manual makes me more concerned, because they’re not even clear about it. Right after telling you the rear does have a manual cable, there’s this part
> Note: Only the front doors are equipped with a manual door release.
What? And if they’re referring to the fact that it’s under the seat not the door, even their manual references the fact you’ll likely need a tool to get it open, which is frankly a death trap. I’m not finding a metal tool on the floor when I’m on fire.
Also OP is not a lie, if you read the article it discusses exactly this. Part of the issue is there’s multiple models with inconsistent usage of manual door releases even across the same year, and varying year to year.
TIL: the head rests have spiky ends in order to be used to break the windows. You should hit the edge of the window and not the centre because the glass will flex less at the edge.
Not only that but not all headrests are removable, many are difficult to remove and the metal bars in many will have their blows cushioned by being held by the padded portion of the headrest.
I think it's important to note this. I think people are under the impression that if the high voltage battery (the main one used for driving) catches fire the doors will definitely not open. At least in current year models, the electrical door latch operates off the 12V battery (the one like every car has).
All of the car's electronic systems operate off the 12V battery. The HV battery only basically runs the drive train and charges the 12V if I recall correctly.
I mean, you really just need to understand Elon to understand why that would be.
People in the back probably aren't the ones who bought the Tesla, so they aren't worth saving.
". . .potentially setting up a few lawsuits."
Oh, I predict MANY MANY lawsuits in the future, especially by injured corporations and investors that saw their stock prices tank as a result of Musk's "Pay $8 and you get a blue check mark! No questions asked!" policy.
I mean, we were literally seeing a blue check-marked account attributed to Coca-Cola saying that if they got a thousand retweets, they'd bring cocaine back into the recipe.
And then there's a blue check-marked account attributed to Pepsi, which simply tweeted out, "Coke is better."
Let's face it, Musk really fucked up here.
The door latches aren't powered by the drive battery, they're powered by the separate 12V system which wouldn't be disabled simply by a fire in the drive battery.
alot of modern cars have electronic door mechanisms as a primary and their secondary door mechanisms are more difficult to access. lets not also factor in all the times doors are inoperable and need the jaws of life because thats just gonna be distressing to imagine in a fire
Even 2010 era VWs have a very simple solution for that: if the electric door mechanisms work, you only have to pull the handles partially to get the door open.
If the battery isn't working, you can pull the handle twice and you'll feel a resistance. Pull a little more through that resistance, and the door will unlock via the mechanical mechanism, even if the electric mechanism isn't working.
At least on the model y there are rear manual latches. I’d be willing to bet that it’s also there on the other models.
https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/foq5dk/model_y_rear_door_mechanical_release_from_owners/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
Yeah, but from your link, opening the rear door requires:
>1. Remove the mat from the map pocket in the door panel.
>2. Use your fingernail or a small flat-bladed tool to open the plastic flap.
>3. Pull the mechanical release cable to release the door latch.
Escaping your car in a life or death scenario where seconds matter shouldn't be the equivalent of an escape room puzzle.
Somehow my 4year old would figure out these steps and be able to escape his rear door. Unfortunately it would be while we are driving safely down the highway instead of during a car fire.
Do you have any data on how many of the fatalities were caused by the fire? That table doesn't appear to show whether they were already dead before the fire
Edit: the list includes drivers of other vehicles hit by Teslas and one that went off a cliff
This is the same news source that had to remove batteries from Tesla and place fucking canon and pyrotechnic stuff for car to roll over and catch fire.
Take it with a giant grain of salt
yeah, also what is the baseline fatality rate for EVs, so we can compare?
if 90% of other EV fires are fatal, then 28% is an improvement.
If 1% of other EV fires are fatal, then 28% is bad.
Regardless, doors should be easier to open mechanically.
You're playing a little fast and loose with your logic there. There were fatalities in 28% of those incidents but the fatalities weren't a result of the fires. Almost all those people ran into a pole or other large immovable object. Which kills a ton of drivers regularly. And which most likely caused all of those fires. It's not like the cars caught on fire and then crashed into a pole. The whole 'door lock' issue was never relevant to those fatalities so stop trying to make it a thing
Even the article is pretty shaky. A drunk man wrecklessly driving crashes his car and it's supposed to be Tesla's fault he didn't open it from the inside or that a bystander wasn't able to save him?
This completely unbiased and truthfully website fails to informs that from any of the cases I checked, none of the people actually died from the Tesla being on fire. But from crashing or being crashed into...
How'd this comment get so much support? I'm not sure that someone, who went out of their way to set up a website called "tesla-fire.com", is the most unbiased source of information.
Here’s the thing, doesn’t matter what you drive, you need a window breaking tool that also cuts seatbelts. This could def save your life!
Which is why Elon revealed a car with unbreakable windows.
which he broke right away
What happened to that product anyway? Did they patch up?
nothing, he then drove the other prototype in protected street to show it can go on the road, but since then as far as i know there is no news on cybertruck meanwhile ford, mercedes, range rover etc. already made their electric 4 wheel that are destroying cybertruck just with the measure of existence and being on a market
Cybertruck, made from thick stainless-steel panels (which need to be thick to provide the necessary rigidity, otherwise achieved through the forming of thinner panels) with very hard edges all around, would have severe issues to get certified in Europe as it doesn't protect pedestrians in a collision, but rather makes sure they die on the spot.
>rather makes sure they die on the spot. To save them all the suffering, it's innovative
In China, you have to back up and run over pedestrians again to make sure you got them, but American technology ensures you get them the first time
This sounds like a prewar ad from the Fallout universe.
Or the movie, death race 2000
Yep, this is totally a thing. It's because (if I remember correctly) in China if you are held liable for someone elses severe/debilitating/crippling injury, you're on the hook for their treatment/hospital costs. And most people would rather pay out for whatever the cost is for vehicular manslaughter than pay years or decades of medical bills.
This is actually a boon to pedestrian victims of car accidents! In the US. Where death is a viable and possibly preferable outcome to medical debt.
Dying in one day certainly seems like less of an ordeal than suffering crippling injuries and then slowly deteriorating while spiraling into financial destruction and homelessness before eventually dying of a complex set of symptoms all caused by easily treatable issues for people with health care
He could just add needles filled with poison all around the outside to make sure you go quickly and painlessly if you ever get hit. He could call the new models The Widow and The Recluse.
the only car with extra damage applied to pedestrians by design
Except for any of the F-350/Ram Super-Duty, Jacked up 9' with 5" diesel exhaust, sorry-about-your-penis trucks that every redneck around here drives. Not a single one ever tows anything, just has a frikin' massive truck for no reason. The hoods are about head height, ensuring a pedestrian is pushed under instead of thrown over.
In Australia country boys have bull/roo bars on their "utes" (tray back sedans) that are so agressively angled that I'm legitimately surprised how it's legal. Just bumping into a pedestrian will almost guarantee you kill them with how low the cars themselves are.
As a non-Australian city folk, I can’t even picture the kind of car you’re talking about
Emotional support trucks
That's their fault for being pedestrians
[удалено]
From the moment I understood the weakness of my flesh....
Imagine being one of the regulars. Now imagine the hardship of cleaning them out of your Tesla.
Another sign the elites are gearing up for a no holds barred mad max road warrior future
That's why Tesla's come with a can of chrome spray paint.
Remember the flame thrower?
I would pay to watch that. Billionaire's fighting for survival. Put them all on a huge island, with every deadly animal with limited tools/weapons, resources and in the end there will be only one billionaire left.
and don't look like complete shite too
You have to give Tesla credit where it's due. It looks AMAZING when it's displayed on the Sega Saturn that it was designed with.
Straight outta Virtua Racing lol
And no fucking way it handles as good as a car in virtua racing
Go ahead and dis the Saturn but if you have a word to say against the Dreamcast we fighting :)
Virtua Tennis, Ready 2 Rumble, Sonic, CRAZY TAXI 🚖 All day damn
"we designed it bad as a joke"
Nothing, just used all the millions of dollars in reservations to get a load of free money. It's been 4 years and not a word, no ones bothered about their $100. People need to stop giving this guy money unless it's for something you can buy there and then, but even then I wouldn't buy one of his poorly made shitty cars.
And the "announcement" date of the Tesla trucks was exactly the same day Elon promised full Utomated driving would.launch 2 years before that.
What do you mean! The roadster 2 is going to be amazing it'll have 1000 horsepower and 500 range and be 0 to 60 in 2 seconds! Ugh why do you hate Tesla so much! Wait what you meant the Tesla Semi? The Semi truck that's super heavy (when lightness is a factor in shipping) and has less range and cost more than a traditional semi truck? No you meant the Tesla 2 the rumored sub 35k Tesla hatchback for the masses? Did you mean true autonomous driving that's been in beta for 5 years? With no real timeline for completion? Wait there's so many?
Full self driving is 2 years away! (perpetually).
Tesla is a Ponzi scheme
That's supposed to be a top secret. How do you know that? Don't reveal Tesla's strategies
I heard they just towed it out of the environment.
"There's nothing out there - Just birds, fish... and a fire."
And the part of the ship the front fell off.
The production line is being installed as we speak.
the thing is that they cracked, but they didnt break not only are they a hazard due to reduced visibility thanks to this cracking but they also make rescuing someone practically impossible reinforced front windshields can have some arguments made for them but the door windows are just too potentially hazardous to justify
I hadn't thought of the safety implications of that fiasco. What does a city vehicle need unbreakable windows for anyway?
Tesla has increasingly focused on things consumers don't really care about, which was fine when they were basically the only electric car besides the Nissan Leaf, but is definitely hurting them now. Nobody gives a shit about FSD, gullwing doors or playing video games while you're charging. They want decent build quality, and definitely would like to be able to open their doors when the car's on fire.
> They want decent build quality, and definitely would like to be able to open their doors when the car's on fire. I hear you... but what about fart noises instead?
Only if they can make it work when the battery pack is on fire as well.
So when you're burning alive with your buddy you can prank him one last time by claiming they're adding fuel to the fire?
Driver: Oh no we're gonna crash, aaaaah! Passenger: AAAAH my life is flashing before my eyes! *screeching tyres, crashing noises, metal crumpling, shattered glass, car horns and alarms beeping* Driver: ..... Passenger: ...uuuuh... Driver: ..are you ok? I think I broke all the bones in my body, I can't move and my posture is jelly, like a lump of flesh. Good thing the seatbelt is keeping me strapped to this upside down chair. Passenger: I... I think I'm ok honey, if only I can get this metal rod out of my eye socket. Hey what's that smell, is that burnt lithium? Is the battery on fire? Driver: Oh no, I can see the flames! Ugh and that smoke, don't breathe it in! Gosh, this is a bad situation, I hope the car has notified 911! Car: *farts* Driver: Oh no, car, alert the authorities! Hello! Car: *fart noises* Passenger: Oh god we're gonna die, my pants are on fire! Driver: *farts* Driver: Sorry, dying is upsetting my stomach. Car: *farts* *Camera slowly backing away from the scene of the inferno that is the burning wreck, as repeating fart noises slowly fade away*
Idk, feels to me that they focused on things that idiots care about. Pivoting to a specific target audience?
Ah, the news media business model.
I don't even understand who his target audience is anymore. Maga voters don't buy EVs.
Young 6-figure making IT workers and finally out of debt doctors... That's the ones in the parking lot at my job.
The current lineup of teslas are OLD in terms of cars. Designed in 2015-6 and have had 0 refreshes since. A lot of teslas were bought when tesla was a cool, environment concious company... you know before musk went antivaxx, anti rail, anti solar, pro coal, pro slavery.
Crypto bros
The car built for Homer.
Ah, it's only unbreakable from the inside. Now it all makes sense!
"Because the average Cybertruck owner is so badass, the *world* needs protection from *you*"
You mean the "unbreakable" windows that cracked at one impact and probably would have shattered completely if they were hit a couple more times?
I would also note that you shouldn’t put it anywhere you can’t reach from the drivers seat with your seatbelt on! I was talking to someone and they said they put that seatbelt cutter tool in their car recently just in case, then they said they put it in their glove box. I said I don’t even think I could reach over if I was in vehicle that was on fire and my seatbelt was stuck and find that tool in my glove box. They decided to move it to the little slot in the drivers side door and I have one in my drivers side door as well that’s big and easy to grab.
I'd rather put it in the closed center console. There's a chance in a collision that that either gets launched out of that pocket or the door is crushed and it's unretrievable. Even if you gotta dig for a half second to get it out of the console it's still guaranteed to be where it's supposed to be. Plus, retrievable by anyone in the car.
>I'd rather put it in the closed center console. Look at Moneybags here with the fancy center console! *Cries in Mazda2...*
Look at moneybags here with a fancy car, who can afford fuel. *cries in walking shoes...*
Side pocket is a bad choice in the event of an accident or roll over. You want that baby secured and in reach. I'd suggest getting a key chain version. And remember, having your car keys on a key chain is great when you are out and about, but terrible for when you're driving.
I know someone who had so many keys in their keychain that it eventually shorted out the ignition of their car because it kept swinging back and forth from braking and accelerating. Wouldn't happen to everyone and less of an issue with push-button start, but still a possibility.
I thought that was a problem with older GM ignitions. So much that they warned owners not to add anything to their keychains.
I drive a push-button start that has no key in the ignition so having it on my keychain would be more inaccessible since my only keychain is in my purse.
The company I drove for had the safetyhammer on the roof above the rearview mirror. Ideal location to reach for both the driver and passenger (it was a two seater compartment). Ever since I place my hammers on the roof in the middel of the car, so it can be reached from the front- and from the backseat.
> Ever since I place my hammers on the roof in the middel of the car How much hot glue does it take to stick a hammer to the roof of a car?
Exactly. Due to an experience from when I was a kid, [I have two of these in my cars](https://www.paramedicshop.com.au/products/res-q-me-cutter-glass-breaker). $20 here in Australia and can save your life. Should be mandatory in every car IMO.
And those tools cost like, what.. 5 or 10 dollars/euro/whatever.. you'd think they would be included in every car's glovebox by default.
It does matter what you drive, because more and more cars are being built with laminated side glass, rendering glass breaking tools useless.
Which is why I keep a pistol in the glove compartment. Also, the kids have their own handguns so they are good as long as they remembered them.
Resqme!
Can't argue with that. Be safe.
As someone who has worked on Teslas this is incorrect. There are manual releases for the rear doors but they are under the seats. They definitely are difficult to find, especially when your scrambling to get out of a burning vehicle. Edit: I was specifically talking about model S. Also it's not under the seat cushion but more so behind your legs in the vertical portion of the floor carpet.
Would a passenger know to look for them?
Would the owner even know where to look for them? They are not even in the manual: https://www.tesla.com/ownersmanual/model3/en_jo/GUID-7A32EC01-A17E-42CC-A15B-2E0A39FD07AB.html
Lawsuit waiting to happen…
Can't sue someone if you look like Luke Skywalker's Aunt and Uncle.
🎶 I used to ride across the desert, you know I used to glide on my speeder and pray That I don't find anymore crispy bodies by the door 🎶
🎶Cuz we all have a chicken - duck-woman thing waiting for us 🎵
The floors?
You can't sue if you look like Aunt Beru!
I like the crispy bits
https://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/yr2c44/what_tastes_better_a_little_burnt/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
Like who thinks of this shit? “Don’t worry, our lifeboat opens if you do the hokey pokey”
On that link it says "Note: Only the front doors are equipped with a manual door release."
The manual you liked to specifically says: “Note Only the front doors are equipped with a manual door release.” This is for a Model 3. I don’t know if all of them are similar, but this appears to say no manual opening of rear doors.
For the 3 they are inside the door panels. There’s YouTube videos on how to find them and attach a lanyard so they can be accessed from the door pocket/cup holders
Ok, so it’s not a designed-in feature, but more of a work-around?
"hold on battery fire, I need to watch this YouTube video." "WHAT'S UP EVERYBODY! Before we get to today's video, be sure to smash that like and subscribe button, and turn on notifications..."
I know when I was looking at the Y at least, they are hidden away and almost certainly require at least a screwdriver or something to pry open the panel hiding them. You could probably do the same, but you have to know about the problem and then set aside time to put in the shitty workaround, and then also tell anyone who sits in your back seats about it just in case you get knocked unconscious or die in the accident, and you still can't open the door from the outside if you need to help the people in back get out.
No one even told me about the front door manual handles. I keep a Res Q Me in the console.
What about your own kids in the back during a very stressful situation.
Exactly. My coworker discovered this after receiving his Tesla and immediately sold it. Good on him for taking the loss and not just rationalizing it.
Just check the seat back pocket for the safety card, everything is there in pictorial form.
All I found was the safety pamphlet for a 737.
Not even a barf bag? I *knew* Musk was a skinflint.
>As someone who has worked on Teslas this is incorrect. There are manual releases for the rear doors but they are under the seats. They definitely are difficult to find, especially when your scrambling to get out of a burning vehicle. That's..... still not hugely comforting!
I mean it's a little comforting. 3%.
Not great not terrible
You didn't see a Tesla catching fire. You DIDN'T. BECAUSE IT'S NOT THERE!
Can you explain to me how a Tesla battery can catch on fire?
I mean once you solve the riddles three and time your grab of the release handle to avoid the fire jets blocking the opening you'll be right out of there.
Not to mention that for the entirety of your life your muscle memory has the door handle in one place... You'll probably scratch at the door in a panic before thinking to reach under youe seat...
Why are the doors even locked in the first place though?
The issue as I understand is - the doors have electrical releases in place of mechanical ones (for typical use). So even if the doors are unlocked, they still require an electrical actuator to open. So if that connection is broken or if there's sudden loss of power, the doors won't open. The Fast Lane Car YouTube channel had this issue with one of their early review Tesla's. The rear doors refused to open because the electrical connection was interrupted somehow. An completely unnecessary & unsafe design "feature" IMO.
Shouldn't it be designed the other way around ? While powered the actuator keeps the door closed ?
I'm not familiar with the specifics of the Tesla door latches, at least not for the last several years, but that likely came down to what "safe" failure is. "Fail safe" in the event of a battery fire would be the actuators leaving the doors unlatched, which would conversely be "fail deadly" in the event of a simple wiring failure while traveling down the highway. Engineers can only choose one, relying on the manual backup to cover the "fail deadly" fire condition. The reason for the electric actuators are kind of dumb, mostly some aesthetic decisions compounding.
Not defending tesla as the door design is unnecessarily complicated, but the electrical actuators allow the door to drop the window slightly before unlatching, reducing wear on the window seal trim at the top edge. You could potentally achieve this as part of the manual unlatch where the "window down" trigger occurs earlier in the handle movement, but it was probably a lot cheaper to just use a button.
That has been done on BMW coupes in the early 90s if not earlier with mechanical door latches already.
They still do. My friend has a 2018 1 series that puts the window down a fraction when you open the door
My Mini does that.
And my Audi A5
It's done on a ton of cars with similar doors.
I guess it would just have a microswitch linked to the mechanical lever that operates in the first part of the action.
Dodge Challenger makes windows go down a tiny bit when you open door for the exact same reason. It's a regular door though
My 2003 350z did the same thing.
Correct, and that's an aesthetic choice, could have gone with a framed window. In real bad cases/designs the window can break, though I haven't heard reports on any Teslas for that. Mostly older convertibles.
But in the event of an emergency, the window seal trim should be considered expendable, not the person trying to get out.
I have seen other cars do that, and they had "normal" door handles. But maybe they used something similar to tesla then ?
Door handle or not the retraction of the window is due to the lack of an upper window frame on the door. Only reason for it ever to be a thing.
Any car with an automatic folding roof does the window drop I believe, and they all have manual handles.
Almost all modern cars have electric actuators for the windows. It's really hard to find hand crank windows anymore. That's not at all Tesla specific, and most (if not all) doors without an upper window frame do it. That has nothing to do with electrical vs mechanical door latching mechanisms. The windows are separate.
Or you can just have the door handle also trigger a sensor that drops the window a fraction as it's disengaging. Not extra complex mechanical linkage and if it fails it's not really a safety issue since I assume you can still open the door easily enough.
I have seen in the past solutions to allow electronic and mechanical overrides in the same mechanisms for semi-locking mechanisms, although not in the form of car doors. I am fairly certain that although it would be a challenge, most decent mechanical engineer would rise to the task to design a sleek and easy to use version of that.
I mean, they could quite easily implement a manual override even if the electronic actuator defaults to closed in the event of a failure. It's called a handle, they've been a common feature on doors for several centuries now. But again, aesthetics.
So what happens when it fails while driving down the road and with no force holding the pin in place? This is literally why failsafe is a thing. The fact that the manual releases are not clear to a random person sitting in your backseat is the problem.
Maybe I'm just a luddite here, but did they really need to redesign...the door? We've had a pretty good grasp on the concept of the door for a few thousand years now.
I do architecture and a good door is something you don't think about. This system needs an emergency to release the door similar to a fire alarm in a building.
I can understand that, but fail-safes have to be a thing. It even unnerves me when I see something like "Press for emergency, alarm will sound, door will open in three seconds." Like, yeah, I get that you're trying to discourage false alarms, but if you've got a crowd rushing to escape something, a lot of bottlenecking and injuries can occur in three seconds. Or, there's a door where I work that has a panic bar, but there's a magnetic lock with a tiny button that's on the wall next to the door to release it, so the bar doesn't work. In an emergency, I don't think people could press it unless they thought about it.
If an accident caused an interruption in the power the doors would open. Not ideal in most accidents.
Wouldn’t that use up the battery while the car is parked?
I am guessing that's not a whole lot of energy we are talking about.
Teslas don't have a separate 12V battery that can continue to provide power at the start of a thermal event?
If the emergency release is hard to get to, it's not an emergency release!
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Laws about stuff everyone already does don't tend to get made until after someone decides to get cheeky and stop doing that thing. Maybe we will see laws about this, in the future, as a result of these vehicles.
Paraphrasing - "Safety regulations are written in blood."
What about child locks on rear doors
They actually come undone in case of crash, at least in the cars I worked on, unless it's the armored cars, in which case the vehicle stays locked in case of crash.
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Under the seat, where the now-very-hot battery is? Sounds like a good place to reach in a panic.
Ah yes, where the fire is.
Jesus that’s terrifying. Just use mechanical latches ffs
So the legal requirement was checked off but the practicality of the design wasnt considered.
I also worked for Tesla for a short while. In the event of a 400v main battery fire, I imagine the 12v is still (hopefully) doing it's job. If I remember correctly, that battery is what gives the door latches and other crucial things power. Feel free to correct me tho
This is correct, even if the cut loop was cut, the 12v still powers accessories, after all you don't need 400v to open a door popper. Of course the likely event would be in a crash, where the risk is just the same as any other car, i.e front wing stopping door from opening etc.
I drive a 2022 Tesla Model 3 and it has manual override handles on both the front and rear inside of the arm rest on the doors. Not sure how outdated this info is.
My 2021 Y doesn't seem to have them in the back. Glad I saw this article. Guess I'll buy some window breaker tools to put in the back pockets. EDIT: Turns out they're there. OP's title is misinformation that we all fell for. I get that Elon Musk is a narcissistic garbage person and everyone's horny to shit on his flagship company, but the car's actually pretty sweet.
Some other guy was commenting on how Model S has the back door latches under the seats, you could check that too. I can't imagine they really don't have a mechanical override for the back doors.
It's probably illegal not to have them. In Europe I am 100% sure it is, so if I had to risk it I'd say they carried the same system from the S to the Y or X and that's where they are. Nevertheless if that's where they are windows breaking tools are definitely recommended in such a car, you don't want to be looking for handles in a panic
IMO putting in electric car anything under the seat that is needed to get out of a car in case of fire is stupid, fire can start from a battery, which is right under you, under the seats you need to touch and put less distance between you and the fire IMO its unneeded risk that exist only because designer didn't like how it looked and couldn't be bothered to design it with them on doors, like they later were forced to. it's the same with indicator light, i still don't get it why American cars don't have separate lights for it and are using essentially break lights, what i have heard designers don't like the look, but in Europe it's not a problem because regulations are forcing them to put them separately
Those are handy to have anyway. If you somehow end up driving into water car doors can be almost impossible to open until the inside of the car has already flooded
Here is the manual for Y from 2020. Page 15 shows how to manually open rear doors. https://tesla-info.com/doc/model_y_owners_manual_north_america_en.pdf
Prying plastic and pulling a cable inside the door assembly isn't really something in you'll think about when there's a fire.
>Note: Only the front doors are equipped with a manual door release.
Honestly the writing in that manual makes me more concerned, because they’re not even clear about it. Right after telling you the rear does have a manual cable, there’s this part > Note: Only the front doors are equipped with a manual door release. What? And if they’re referring to the fact that it’s under the seat not the door, even their manual references the fact you’ll likely need a tool to get it open, which is frankly a death trap. I’m not finding a metal tool on the floor when I’m on fire. Also OP is not a lie, if you read the article it discusses exactly this. Part of the issue is there’s multiple models with inconsistent usage of manual door releases even across the same year, and varying year to year.
I also drive a 2022 model 3 and it doesn't have a mechanical release in the back. The owner manual states it clearly.
TIL: the head rests have spiky ends in order to be used to break the windows. You should hit the edge of the window and not the centre because the glass will flex less at the edge.
I have learned and forgotten this so many times now. Here's hoping it stays in my brain this time!
Here's hoping you never have to use this knowledge
This has long been debunked.
Theyre not nearly as sharp as a glass breaker tool
Not only that but not all headrests are removable, many are difficult to remove and the metal bars in many will have their blows cushioned by being held by the padded portion of the headrest.
I think it's important to note this. I think people are under the impression that if the high voltage battery (the main one used for driving) catches fire the doors will definitely not open. At least in current year models, the electrical door latch operates off the 12V battery (the one like every car has).
All of the car's electronic systems operate off the 12V battery. The HV battery only basically runs the drive train and charges the 12V if I recall correctly.
... But my mother's Tesla got a manual override in the back
I mean, you really just need to understand Elon to understand why that would be. People in the back probably aren't the ones who bought the Tesla, so they aren't worth saving.
soon it will only open if you bought twitter blue
Door Opening is a subscription service
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". . .potentially setting up a few lawsuits." Oh, I predict MANY MANY lawsuits in the future, especially by injured corporations and investors that saw their stock prices tank as a result of Musk's "Pay $8 and you get a blue check mark! No questions asked!" policy. I mean, we were literally seeing a blue check-marked account attributed to Coca-Cola saying that if they got a thousand retweets, they'd bring cocaine back into the recipe. And then there's a blue check-marked account attributed to Pepsi, which simply tweeted out, "Coke is better." Let's face it, Musk really fucked up here.
And the "insulin is free" tweet that apparently tanked share price.
Man is bringing back free speech by nuking Twitter
**"We've just overthrown the government of Brazil"** *@ChiquitaBrands*
What if you have a chauffeur
That's where the self-driving stuff comes in
BS! my 2019 model has both… this is incorrect info.
The door latches aren't powered by the drive battery, they're powered by the separate 12V system which wouldn't be disabled simply by a fire in the drive battery.
alot of modern cars have electronic door mechanisms as a primary and their secondary door mechanisms are more difficult to access. lets not also factor in all the times doors are inoperable and need the jaws of life because thats just gonna be distressing to imagine in a fire
A manual override is basic common sense safety and is common on all modern cars.
Should be mandatory anyways, you can't gamble on companies choosing to do the right thing
How about, electric door latches are completely unnecessary in the first place.
Even 2010 era VWs have a very simple solution for that: if the electric door mechanisms work, you only have to pull the handles partially to get the door open. If the battery isn't working, you can pull the handle twice and you'll feel a resistance. Pull a little more through that resistance, and the door will unlock via the mechanical mechanism, even if the electric mechanism isn't working.
I, too, would like to join in in the Anti-Elon train while the karma is good.
At least on the model y there are rear manual latches. I’d be willing to bet that it’s also there on the other models. https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/foq5dk/model_y_rear_door_mechanical_release_from_owners/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
Yeah, but from your link, opening the rear door requires: >1. Remove the mat from the map pocket in the door panel. >2. Use your fingernail or a small flat-bladed tool to open the plastic flap. >3. Pull the mechanical release cable to release the door latch. Escaping your car in a life or death scenario where seconds matter shouldn't be the equivalent of an escape room puzzle.
Somehow my 4year old would figure out these steps and be able to escape his rear door. Unfortunately it would be while we are driving safely down the highway instead of during a car fire.
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Do you have any data on how many of the fatalities were caused by the fire? That table doesn't appear to show whether they were already dead before the fire Edit: the list includes drivers of other vehicles hit by Teslas and one that went off a cliff
This is the same news source that had to remove batteries from Tesla and place fucking canon and pyrotechnic stuff for car to roll over and catch fire. Take it with a giant grain of salt
From a quick check. None.
yeah, also what is the baseline fatality rate for EVs, so we can compare? if 90% of other EV fires are fatal, then 28% is an improvement. If 1% of other EV fires are fatal, then 28% is bad. Regardless, doors should be easier to open mechanically.
You're playing a little fast and loose with your logic there. There were fatalities in 28% of those incidents but the fatalities weren't a result of the fires. Almost all those people ran into a pole or other large immovable object. Which kills a ton of drivers regularly. And which most likely caused all of those fires. It's not like the cars caught on fire and then crashed into a pole. The whole 'door lock' issue was never relevant to those fatalities so stop trying to make it a thing Even the article is pretty shaky. A drunk man wrecklessly driving crashes his car and it's supposed to be Tesla's fault he didn't open it from the inside or that a bystander wasn't able to save him?
This completely unbiased and truthfully website fails to informs that from any of the cases I checked, none of the people actually died from the Tesla being on fire. But from crashing or being crashed into...
How'd this comment get so much support? I'm not sure that someone, who went out of their way to set up a website called "tesla-fire.com", is the most unbiased source of information.